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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 12 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2300<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Scanners<BR>
Aki/Glisten (was re: Landgrab: Fornice)<BR>
re: Norris is still de man<BR>
Re: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
Re: Wars within the Imperium<BR>
Re: Planet III Software<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: Secrets of ACQ<BR>
Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
Re: Scale in Space<BR>
Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
RE: Peter Newman's Traveller Universe - evidence from the books<BR>
Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics) <BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: Boardgames<BR>
Re: An alternate TL definition (heresy warning)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 10:46:45 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 12 Apr 2000 04:39:47 -0800, Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> If comic book<BR>
> fans will buy the same comic twice with a different cover than<BR>
> logically so will Traveller fans.<BR>
<BR>
For us to understand your definition of "logic", could you please explain<BR>
the above preposterous statement?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Hit any user to continue.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 14:00:47 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: Scanners<BR>
<BR>
CT (at least, the stuff that I have) is pretty skimpy with types of<BR>
scanners.  LBB 3 lists radiation detectors, LI goggles, IR goggles,<BR>
binoculars, and perhaps magnetic compasses.  I have designed parabolic<BR>
microphones, magnetometers, sonar goggles, radar goggles, densitometers,<BR>
hearing enhancement muffs, "sniffers" (chemical detection), UV goggles,<BR>
seismometers, neutrino detectors, and white canes.  Plus still and motion<BR>
cameras, videos, holovids, and holographs.  Are there some other types of<BR>
scanners, or variations on these?  On the scanner topic, can someone tell<BR>
me how "motion detectors" work.  If you are feeling very energetic, I would<BR>
be interested in the proposed parameters for scanners: range, sensitivity,<BR>
resolution, mass and price of the unit, limitations, etc.  I use strictly<BR>
CT, but would be interested in designs from any system.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 14:02:15 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Aki/Glisten (was re: Landgrab: Fornice)<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
>-- except that, if I do, I'll probably ignore tht "As" allegiance code; <BR>
>it doesn't make any sense to me that Aslan Ihatei could somehow sneak <BR>
>onto a world with a population of over a billion, in sufficient numbers <BR>
>to effectively take it over, especially when it's *one parsec* from a <BR>
>subsector capital (Glisten) with a Naval base and Scout base(!).   Just <BR>
>how many million Ihatei are supposed to have moved in there? <BR>
<BR>
How about a thousand million?<BR>
<BR>
It's canon that there are Aslan citizens of the 3I, how about make<BR>
Aki a world orginally colonized by Aslan in the 400's, that joined<BR>
the Imperium - perhaps as a client state - when human colonization<BR>
spread around it?<BR>
<BR>
Now that the Ihatei problem is happening, the planet is torn between<BR>
trade and cultural links to the Imperium, and racial links to the <BR>
oncoming Aslan.  The human minority on Aki would also be in an <BR>
interesting position.<BR>
<BR>
Just a thought...<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:58:30 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Norris is still de man<BR>
<BR>
At 8:05 -0400 12/4/00, "Karen and Michael Hughes" <BR>
<kmhughes@dynamite.com.au> wrote:<BR>
> >Wah is not canonical cause it's DGP - But one of the last MT journals had a<BR>
> >celebrity interview with him. Who wrote that - they are a god. One of the<BR>
> >finest RPG magazine efforts around.<BR>
><BR>
>Arrival Vengeance is GDW not DGP.<BR>
>MT Journal is DGP.<BR>
>What's your point Vanessa?<BR>
<BR>
The original post was unclear (I read it that it was thought that <BR>
Arrival Vengeance was a DGP product).<BR>
Hence I commented that it wasn't.<BR>
<BR>
And I'm not called Vanessa.  Unless this is some surreal antipodean humour?<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 10:57:56 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>Barcode fonts are easily available. And if you don't mind spending a<BR>
>>few bucks, you can pick up bar code readers fairly cheap. This means<BR>
>>that if you have a computer handy, you can boggle the players by<BR>
>>"scanning in" info from handouts you gavce them about equipment or<BR>
>>whatever.<BR>
>><BR>
>>I have a bar code wand for my old 8-bit "notebook" computer and at one<BR>
>>time was considering using bardcodes to save "secret" info about magic<BR>
>>items on the cards I gave players when they got one.<BR>
><BR>
> Interesting idea! I hadn't thought of making the barcode functional.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah. My thought was to have the basic card have a description of the<BR>
"obvious" about the object, and the bar code contain details (3of9 code<BR>
probably, since that has 0-9, A-Z, plus some punctuation). <BR>
<BR>
So the card might have a bar code acroos the top (or back) and then<BR>
just say "short sword". With lots and lots of room for the player to<BR>
add info as he figures it out. <BR>
<BR>
>>The Andre Norton "Solar Queen" novels are good here. They are about the<BR>
>>crew of a free trader, and it usually takes contributions by several of<BR>
>>the crew to work things out. For example, at least *twice* their<BR>
>>medic's hobby of studying native "magic" has helped them out of a spot.<BR>
><BR>
> Good stuff. I'll have to check out some Solar Queen novels. They sound<BR>
> pretty nifty.<BR>
<BR>
There are a few recent ones, with some other author, and the 4<BR>
originals from the 60s & 70s. <BR>
<BR>
In order:<BR>
<BR>
Sargasso of Space<BR>
Plague ship<BR>
Voodoo Planet<BR>
Postmarked the Stars<BR>
<BR>
Redline the Stars(?)<BR>
(I can't recall the title)<BR>
A Mind for Trade<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 18:37:45 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Wars within the Imperium<BR>
<BR>
>Well, at the time a good part of the motive on *both* sides may have<BR>
>been the possibility of undersea oil deposits on the nearby<BR>
>"continental shelf".<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
To be perfectly honest,I think a greater motivator on both sides was the<BR>
'Let's Have A Nice War So The Populace Ignore All The Domestic Problems And<BR>
Get In Line Behind The Government' effect. Both sides were having economic<BR>
problems, if I remember correctly, and on both sides these were replaced on<BR>
the front page by the war coverage.<BR>
<BR>
Wars - they're great! Err, wait a minute there...<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 18:46:21 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Planet III Software<BR>
<BR>
I Think I've got copy of that stuff, assuming that the HD it's on<BR>
deigns to go. It's fuor seperate programs, one for each sector (at<BR>
least that's how I got it, I don't know what it looks like installed,<BR>
as I've never gotten round to it). E-mail me if want a copy and I'll<BR>
mail them to you, if they're not too large.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I'm told they've been posted up on downport.com, but they're about five megs<BR>
in total (which I didn't realise) so I'll have to wait to go back to uni<BR>
before I attempt to get them.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks anyway.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 18:52:51 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
>No, no you have the wrong department. You want the Department<BR>
>of Obsessive Compulsive Rules. You need to go out this door,<BR>
>turn 94 degrees clockwise, and proceed down the corridor, tracing<BR>
>the wood grain along the floor for 1,807 striations, look<BR>
>up and its the first door on your right as you face SSW.<BR>
>Open the door, realize that you got germs on your hands, return<BR>
>to the washroom, wash your hands 11 times with a new bar of<BR>
>soap, dry your hands 11 times, proceed back to the door<BR>
>and knock on it 6 times using a gloved hand. They will open the<BR>
>door and help you.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I have to forward that to my girlfriend. (She's a clinical psychology<BR>
student.)<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 18:52:58 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Secrets of ACQ<BR>
<BR>
>Beleive me, Doug, you really don't want to know..... (And I am not going<BR>
>to repeat the experiment. -  the consequences of failure would be too<BR>
>horrific to consider!)<BR>
><BR>
>Nowadays, if someone were to repeat the experiment, I would decline to<BR>
>choose one of the penguins. It is a far better thing to go without than to<BR>
>risk the effects of the red, blue or yellow (urgh).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
You can identify green penguins by the taste?<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 18:57:26 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
<BR>
>> Nick<BR>
>> +++<BR>
>> I sense some TNE heresy coming on. Eris - can I borrow your hat?<BR>
><BR>
>Looks more like treason to me... The old guard in the TNe list won't<BR>
>like this, you know :)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
So what? Under FFS2 rules, I've got cheaper (and so more) warships than<BR>
them.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
(Perhaps I should challenge the entire TNE-RCES list to Battle Rider By<BR>
Email, starting at dawn....)<BR>
(Except Jon Goff.)<BR>
(And Antti, actually.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:19:27 -0600<BR>
From: Dale Gyles <gyles@mtn-webtech.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Scale in Space<BR>
<BR>
At 10:35 PM 4/11/00 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
<snip><BR>
From Leonard Erickson<BR>
>Well, the (hoped for) mechanism of "bomb-pumped" x-ray lasers is rather<BR>
>like that of the old ruby lasers. You hit the rod with a bunch of<BR>
>energy some of which creates the population inversion needed by a<BR>
>laser. <BR>
><BR>
>It's still *possible* that such things can be built. We just don't know<BR>
>how yet.<BR>
<BR>
That's a good point.  As long as a technology doesn't violate the laws of<BR>
physics, I'm not overly concerned about the engineering details.  I'm<BR>
willing to accept Jump Drive, because some form of FTL is needed or<BR>
Traveller would be kinda dull.  The good folks who are gearheads will<BR>
happily provide all the details (and more!) an average guy like me can keep<BR>
straight.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Dale Gyles<BR>
Black Eagle, MT<BR>
gyles@mtn-webtech.com<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 19:20:17 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Alright. I'm going to do it.<BR>
<BR>
I bought the T4 rulebook from a bargain bin, and was surprised to find I<BR>
liked it. I've found some other modules available, but I know at least some<BR>
of them are dross.<BR>
<BR>
Which ones should I buy? We're probably looking at two or three, including<BR>
FFS2, at least for the first order.<BR>
<BR>
Advice needed, sophs!<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 10:27:31 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
<BR>
Bill Dunn <bdunn@epicsystems.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Then I guess Advanced Squad Leader, which has a random role rule, is a<BR>
> victim of extremely poor design, huh? <BR>
<BR>
I've never played ASL so I can't really say. The designers <BR>
may have felt that the random roll rule was needed because <BR>
the _other_ rules were too vague. I really could not<BR>
say but given the sheer mass of ASL material this is a very<BR>
real possibility.<BR>
<BR>
> Baloney. The random roll rule is there<BR>
> to prevent lengthy arguments over very subtle interpretations in the text,<BR>
> what I might also call obsessive exegesis. Kind of what we're doing here.<BR>
> It's a way to break the deadlock and get on with the game because that's the<BR>
> whole point of the rules. To play a GAME. <BR>
<BR>
The rule ensures that if any of the players are of that<BR>
subset of gamers who are weasels (approximately 20% of<BR>
local population) that no game will ever be finished. They<BR>
will argue about anything to win. Since my weasel detector<BR>
is not perfect and one of the reasons I play games is for<BR>
fun and stress relief I do not care to play games that have<BR>
the potential of encouraging weaseldom.<BR>
<BR>
> The rule enables gamers with<BR>
> different approaches to the rules (relaxed and flexible vs adhering narrow<BR>
> interpretations even in the face of evidence <BR>
<BR>
If you have a 50% chance of winning any argument by making<BR>
spurious arguments than it is to your game benefit make<BR>
a continual series of them on every point whatsoever.<BR>
If you are not personally a weasel player you will be much<BR>
more likely to loose as the weasel wins half of his ridiculous<BR>
arguments.<BR>
<BR>
In a game with a 50% rule you are likely to believe that your <BR>
opponent is deliberately making a spurious argument to win.<BR>
If the game does not have this rule you are less likely to<BR>
make this conclusion.<BR>
<BR>
> it serves its purpose in facilitating play. And the plays the<BR>
> thing...<BR>
<BR>
It is a good mechanism for resolving rare genuine debates, <BR>
however its presence in the rules is a guarantee that a<BR>
weasel will immediately generate 100 false arguments so<BR>
that he can win 50 of them.<BR>
<BR>
> >From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
<BR>
> >> I've seen wargames that include suggestions like "roll a die to<BR>
> >>  solve the current dispute <BR>
<BR>
> >This is _extremely_ poor board game design. <BR>
> >If any dispute over the rules can be settled by a random roll<BR>
> >then it is in the best interests of each player to deliberately<BR>
> >misunderstand each and every rule, reinterpret in a manner that<BR>
> >is advantageous to himself and then vehemently argue said point<BR>
> >hoping to provoke a random die roll in the hopes that the random <BR>
> >roll will be in his favor.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:32:46 -0600<BR>
From: Dale Gyles <gyles@mtn-webtech.com><BR>
Subject: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
<BR>
Are phased array lasers possible?  I was wondering if the elements of a<BR>
phased array radar were scaled down to optical wavelengths, could a laser<BR>
with the general characteristics of the radar be built?  No moving parts,<BR>
beam aiming & focusing done electronically, etc.<BR>
<BR>
If this were possible, and assuming weapon grade power levels were<BR>
feasible, this device could be its own beam pointer.  It could engage<BR>
several small targets at the same time, etc.<BR>
<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Dale Gyles<BR>
Black Eagle, MT<BR>
gyles@mtn-webtech.com<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:35:08 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/11/00 12:46 AM, pnewman@gci.net issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
>> So across 11,000 (eleven thousand) systems, this handful of ships are the<BR>
>> only "standard" craft in production? Absolutely ridiculous.<BR>
> <BR>
> The larger the Imperium is the less likely it is that a<BR>
> design will be standard across it. As the Imperium gets<BR>
> larger standardization becomes more valuable. It is<BR>
> the very size of the Imperium that makes the short list<BR>
> plausible. <BR>
<BR>
I am not following your reasoning here, the size of the Imperium means<BR>
greater variety in design requirements, as different systems and worlds have<BR>
a variety of environments and transportation/protection needs. Or are you<BR>
saying that few ships in the Imperium are "standard" designs?<BR>
<BR>
>> There is no way any game company would ever produce a full listing of<BR>
>> "standard" designs for ships in the 3I, as we would be inundated with tons<BR>
>> of material (if printed on paper), and that without any pics, deckplans, or<BR>
>> descriptions. Think about an exhaustive description of standard vehicles<BR>
>> from Terra circa now. Heck, restrict yourself to a single type like<BR>
>> aircraft, or seaships.<BR>
> <BR>
> Earth is not equal to the Third Imperium. It is much, much,<BR>
> much easier for a design to be standard across one planet<BR>
> then for it to be standard across 11,000+ planets.<BR>
> <BR>
It sounds to me like you are arguing /my/ position now. I brought up Earth<BR>
to point out that even a single world has more standard designs than listed<BR>
in the rules for the entire Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
In another post on this topic, you mentioned MT saying that these designs<BR>
are /the/ standard. This is quite different than these designs /are/<BR>
standard. My MT material went up in a barn fire, and so I cannot check the<BR>
wording, at least until I've translated my e-copy into a format I can read.<BR>
Does it really say /the/ standard?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:36:35 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Peter Newman's Traveller Universe - evidence from the books<BR>
<BR>
If Xboats, Xboat Tenders, Survey Ships, and Scout Cruisers are not<BR>
"standard" designs, why is there a seperate entry on the encounter tables<BR>
that include them for "nonstandard" designs (when, using your definitions,<BR>
they should fall under that classification)?  <BR>
Under your interpretation, you could roll "nonstandard" and substitute any<BR>
of the other table entries except the scout courier, making the table<BR>
largely useless.<BR>
<BR>
There is indeed nothing wrong with the idea that government ships may not be<BR>
produced at the same facilities as civilian vessels, but does that make them<BR>
nonstandard designs?  They are still "mass produced in shipyards throughout<BR>
the Imperium", even if it's at less or different shipyards than civilian<BR>
models.  <BR>
To exclude the various scout vessels from the "mass-produced in shipyards<BR>
throughout the Imperium" definition of "standard", they would have to either<BR>
not be mass-produced at all (unlikely, especially with respect to the<BR>
Xboats), manufactured in only one shipyard (extremely unlikely), or<BR>
manufactured in one particular area of the Imperium rather than throughout<BR>
it (the most likely possibility, but not really supported by any published<BR>
material).  <BR>
<BR>
Your rules quote is placing an emphasis on "here" that doesn't exist in the<BR>
text.<BR>
To match your interpretation, a much better wording would have been "The<BR>
designs listed here are the only standard designs...", or even just "The<BR>
designs listed here are the standard designs..."<BR>
As it stands now, the quote is not exclusive.  It merely states that the<BR>
designs listed in the Imperial Encyclopedia are standard, not that there are<BR>
no other standard designs.  The rule was not altered in any MT errata, so<BR>
the authors apparently felt no need to clarify or modify the quote in<BR>
question to match an exclusive interpretation.  <BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Peter Newman [mailto:pnewman@gci.net]<BR>
Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Second, the "Standard Designs" controversy:<BR>
<BR>
> The Scout ship encounter table shows <BR>
> 2: Xboat Tender, <BR>
> 3, 5-6: Scout Ship, <BR>
> 4: Non-standard, <BR>
> 7-10: Survey Ship, <BR>
> and 11-12: Scout Cruiser. <BR>
 <BR>
> There are no stats for Xboat Tenders, Survey Ships, and Scout Cruisers in<BR>
> the Imperial Encyclopedia (in the now-infamous "standard designs" list),<BR>
yet<BR>
> they are not considered "Non-standard" designs on this table (that's a<BR>
> seperate entry).<BR>
<BR>
> The Xboat Ship type table is similar:<BR>
> 2-3: Scout Courier<BR>
> 4: Non-standard<BR>
> 5-7: Xboat<BR>
> 8-11: Xboat Tender<BR>
> 12: Xboat + Tender<BR>
> Again, there are no stats for Xboats in the Imperial Encyclopedia, but<BR>
they<BR>
> are not a "Non-standard" design - that is a seperate entry on the table.<BR>
<BR>
No. "The designs listed _here_ are standard: that is each ship<BR>
type is mass-produced in shipyards throughout the Imperium." [MT<BR>
Impe Enc p76]<BR>
<BR>
Xboats, Xboat Tenders, Scout Survey Ships, and Scout Cruisers <BR>
do not appear on the subsequent list of standard ships (which <BR>
most people insist is a partial list and I insist is a complete <BR>
list).<BR>
<BR>
Therefore Xboats, Tenders, Survey Ships and Scout Cruisers<BR>
must not be mass produced throughout the Imperium. They are<BR>
common enough to appear in any system which suggests  that they <BR>
must be mass produced. But since they do not appear on the<BR>
'standard' list they must not be "mass produced in shipyards <BR>
throughout the Imperium." This would tend to suggest (to me) <BR>
that the Scout Service has their ships manufactured for them <BR>
at only a limited number of places (possibly only at A ports <BR>
with an attached Scout facility and Scout Facilites at A ports <BR>
are quite scarce) The Scout vessels are ubiqutous (and thus<BR>
appear on the encounter charts) because the Scout Service gets <BR>
around so much. But they are apparently not manufactured "in <BR>
shipyards throughout the Imperium." The Scout-Courier which does <BR>
appear on the list of standard ships must, therefore, be manufactured <BR>
at more places than other Scout ships.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:39:54 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
<BR>
Dale Gyles writes:<BR>
> Are phased array lasers possible?  I was wondering if the elements of a<BR>
> phased array radar were scaled down to optical wavelengths, could a laser<BR>
> with the general characteristics of the radar be built?  No moving parts,<BR>
> beam aiming & focusing done electronically, etc.<BR>
<BR>
Maybe.  I'm not convinced that you'd have no moving parts, however, or really<BR>
any significant improvement in capability.  Traveller lasers are already<BR>
wildly optimistic.<BR>
> <BR>
> If this were possible, and assuming weapon grade power levels were<BR>
> feasible, this device could be its own beam pointer.  It could engage<BR>
> several small targets at the same time, etc.<BR>
<BR>
How do these benefits arise from being a phased array?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 10:37:07 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics) <BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching <postmark.design@btinternet.com><BR>
<BR>
> Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >"James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote<BR>
> >>I've seen the opposite-- wargames that include suggestions like <BR>
> >>"roll a die to solve the current dispute<BR>
<BR>
> >This is _extremely_ poor board game design. Any board game that<BR>
> >includes this rule has a strong potential to degenerate into<BR>
> >nothing more than an endless series of arguments.<BR>
<BR>
> Nope, it's extremely poor playing.<BR>
> An example:<BR>
> Watching a game of Warhammer 40K, a dispute arose over one tank being able<BR>
> to fire past another and hit an alien, ie "was line of sight blocked?"<BR>
> [IMO it clearly was blocked, but the alien player* wanted to continue the<BR>
> game, so...]<BR>
> As per the rules, they rolled a die to decide.<BR>
> The marine player lost and couldn't fire his tank, so started arguing about<BR>
> the random die roll.<BR>
> As I said, that's not a bad game design, that's a bad player.<BR>
<BR>
AFAIK the WH40K (Remind me again, its called 40K because that's<BR>
how much you need to earn per year to afford GW minis, right?) <BR>
rules do not prohibit players from deliberately making spurious <BR>
arguments. Therefore their random die roll rule effectively permits, <BR>
and even encourages, players to cheat and get away with it 50% <BR>
of the time. If said player starts using loaded dice and you<BR>
complain about it he will point out that the letter of the rules<BR>
does not prohibit him from using loaded dice. When he rolls for<BR>
it, using his loaded dice of course, and wins cheating has just<BR>
been legalized. Other than quitting the game what can you do<BR>
about it?<BR>
<BR>
This is part of the reason I am unwilling to play said game.<BR>
<BR>
Moreover the 50% random roll rule is essentially unfair and<BR>
unjust. My correct interpretation of the rules has no more<BR>
chance of being upheld than my (hypothetical) differentially<BR>
sentient, perceptually challenged, hygiene impaired opponents<BR>
incorrect argument does.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 10:38:50 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> > If 101 Anal Retentive Rules is going to be published<BR>
> > by BITS, which is British, perhaps we need to change<BR>
> > the title to 101 Anal-Retentive rules as it is my understanding<BR>
> > that British custom is (or at least was) to hyphenate<BR>
> > compound words more frequently than Americans do.<BR>
<BR>
> When it is being used as a compound word, you are quite<BR>
> correct.  But, "retentive" is an adjective when describing a rule,<BR>
> and "anally" is an adverb, modifiy the adjective, which modifies<BR>
> the noun.  An "anally retentive" person can be, and often is,<BR>
> called an "anal-retentive," which takes the place of the noun.<BR>
> In the instant case, we have the noun present, so the anally<BR>
> retentive and un-hyphenated usage of adverb and adjective<BR>
> is appropriate.<BR>
<BR>
Note to self: Never discuss grammar with a lawyer.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 10:43:44 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> > If 101 Anal Retentive Rules is going to be published<BR>
> > by BITS, which is British, perhaps we need to change<BR>
> > the title to 101 Anal-Retentive rules as it is my understanding<BR>
> > that British custom is (or at least was) to hyphenate<BR>
> > compound words more frequently than Americans do.<BR>
<BR>
> just to stir the pot...  I'm half-English, and was taught to spell by my<BR>
> father.<BR>
<BR>
Ok then we will sell the version with your original half <BR>
English usage and spelling to the Canadian market, have the <BR>
BITS staff totally Anglicize it for the U.K. and foreign <BR>
markets and have an American editor revise it to 100%<BR>
American usage for the domestic market. This way collectors<BR>
will have to buy three versions, not just two, and Doug will<BR>
make three times as much money, which is presumably a good<BR>
thing.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 14:49:18 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
>The rule ensures that if any of the players are of that <BR>
>subset of gamers who are weasels (approximately 20% of <BR>
>local population) that no game will ever be finished. They <BR>
>will argue about anything to win. Since my weasel detector <BR>
>is not perfect and one of the reasons I play games is for <BR>
>fun and stress relief I do not care to play games that have <BR>
>the potential of encouraging weaseldom. <BR>
<BR>
Sounds like you should keep a game like this around. By your<BR>
logic, the mere presence of the die-roll rule should cause<BR>
every weasel in your game group to immediately reveal their<BR>
true colors, and do so in such an obnoxious fashion that even<BR>
your flawed weasel detector will find them.<BR>
<BR>
Peter again:<BR>
>It is a good mechanism for resolving rare genuine debates, <BR>
>however its presence in the rules is a guarantee that a <BR>
>weasel will immediately generate 100 false arguments so <BR>
>that he can win 50 of them. <BR>
<BR>
If this is your experience, I think you've got player problems,<BR>
not rule problems.  <BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:00:12 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: An alternate TL definition (heresy warning)<BR>
<BR>
Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Peter Newman writes:<BR>
> > How likely does it seem to you that income will approximately<BR>
> > double each TL between TL 3 and TL 7 and then remain at a<BR>
> > flat number from then on? As technology has progressed<BR>
> > to date it has made people wealthier, why will this stop?<BR>
<BR>
> Not very.  <BR>
> However, (a) the TL 7 person gets $1,000 CrImp, which is a <BR>
hell of a lot more than $1,000 in TL7 dollars.  <BR>
<BR>
Yes but unless CrImp 1 = $15 US then it is less than the<BR>
$25,000 1987 US dollars GURPS lists as basic starting wealth<BR>
for that TL. <BR>
<BR>
> (b) the whole point of my suggestion was to discard the standard <BR>
> TL structure, and make use of a realistic TL structure<BR>
> -- in which case low tech areas are low tech because they're <BR>
> poor, not poor because they're low tech (and, incidentally, <BR>
> a low tech world can have anything it can afford.  It just <BR>
> can't afford much)<BR>
<BR>
I understand what your point was I am simply suggesting<BR>
that:<BR>
(a) we ought not to throw out all past GURPS canon about<BR>
wealth at GTL's 3 and 7. Nor do I think we need to do so<BR>
as indicated by the income figures in my post.<BR>
<BR>
(b) any such rules muddy the distinction between the game<BR>
effects of the Primitive disadvantage and the Poor<BR>
disadvantage thereby requiring contemplation of changing<BR>
the costs of these disadvantages, something SJG is loath<BR>
to do.<BR>
<BR>
Why take Primitive -2 TL's [GTL 8 not GTL 10] for 10 points <BR>
when it will also reduce your starting wealth by 60%? You <BR>
can get the same 10 points by taking Struggling and loose<BR>
only 50% of your income and have no problems dealing w/<BR>
TL 10 equipment.<BR>
<BR>
RANT: Who has noticed that in GURPS Trav 2nd Ed the base TL<BR>
of the Imperium is GTL 10 (TTL 12). Anyone who knows how to <BR>
operate GTL 12 (TTL 15) equipment (i.e. any Imperial Naval or<BR>
Marine personnel as well as trillions of TL 12 world<BR>
inhabitants has to pay _50_ points (half their starting<BR>
point total) on the High Technology +2 Tl's advantage. Most<BR>
of the character templates in the book are useless to a<BR>
100 point charecter now because they include TL 12 skills<BR>
that will now require a 50 point advantage.<BR>
<BR>
This is completely nuts! It would have been much better to <BR>
define the basic TL as GTL 12 and simply note that many <BR>
people in the Imperium have 2 or more levels of the primitive<BR>
disadvantage.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2300<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2301</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 12 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2301<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: An alternate TL definition (heresy warning)<BR>
Re: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
Re: Landgrab: Fornice<BR>
Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics) <BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: An alternate TL definition (heresy warning)<BR>
re: Wars within the Imperium<BR>
Re: FFS1 Fuel Cells<BR>
Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
Re: Planet III Software<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:19:12 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: An alternate TL definition (heresy warning)<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman writes:<BR>
<BR>
> I understand what your point was I am simply suggesting<BR>
> that:<BR>
> (a) we ought not to throw out all past GURPS canon about<BR>
> wealth at GTL's 3 and 7. Nor do I think we need to do so<BR>
> as indicated by the income figures in my post.<BR>
<BR>
A TL 7 area on the modern earth is a first-world country.  A TL 7 area in<BR>
the Imperium is extremely poor.  As such, I have no problem with a TL 7<BR>
world in the imperium being clearly poorer than the United States or Europe.  <BR>
A nation with the capabilities of a modern first-world country, with access<BR>
to information about more advanced capabilities, would not stay TL 7 for<BR>
very long.  If it stays primitive, its obviously in bad shape to start with.<BR>
> <BR>
> (b) any such rules muddy the distinction between the game<BR>
> effects of the Primitive disadvantage and the Poor<BR>
> disadvantage thereby requiring contemplation of changing<BR>
> the costs of these disadvantages, something SJG is loath<BR>
> to do.<BR>
<BR>
No, you just take both.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:21:13 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/11/00 10:05 AM, Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> One of the players loves political intrigue, but the rest don't<BR>
> really get off on it. Another really enjoys psionics/magic, and<BR>
> having powers as an advantage over others. Yet another wants good<BR>
> roleplay ops. All of them enjoy the occasional fight scene, and<BR>
> rolling the dice.<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm. Here are some thoughts:<BR>
<BR>
Political Intrigue Player: This one can often provide a "hook" by embroiling<BR>
him or her into Imperial politics. The other players need not know where<BR>
this player gets the "missions" and such, to avoid turning them off.<BR>
<BR>
Psionic Dabbler: Well, there are psionics in Traveller. Depending on era,<BR>
this may tie in with the intrigue player.<BR>
<BR>
Role-Player: This one and the intrigue fan sound like the ones to focus on<BR>
to create adventure hooks. And the role-player should be well versed in<BR>
Library Data, both to help the others blend in, and give him or her some<BR>
baseline data from which to develop a character.<BR>
<BR>
The Rest: The key word is "occasional", isn't it? Not that a mercenary<BR>
campaign would be embraced? Altercations can occur in any campaign, no prob.<BR>
<BR>
I think a good idea might be a scout campaign. Probably detached duty called<BR>
in for trouble-shooting on occasion. That gives them some leeway and<BR>
guidance when needed.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:26:45 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Landgrab: Fornice<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Grant wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
> Maybe I'll do AKI/Glisten (SM 2035, B443987-9 Hi In Po  Amber 214As G6v<BR>
> M2D) [MT data]<BR>
> <BR>
>  -- except that, if I do, I'll probably ignore tht "As" allegiance code; it<BR>
> doesn't make any sense to me that Aslan Ihatei could somehow sneak onto a<BR>
> world with a population of over a billion, in sufficient numbers to<BR>
> effectively take it over, especially when it's *one parsec* from a<BR>
> subsector capital (Glisten) with a Naval base and Scout base(!).   Just how<BR>
> many million Ihatei are supposed to have moved in there?<BR>
<BR>
Remember: Ihatei don't necessarily invade militarily, or even<BR>
economically. They may well _buy_ land for themselves, off on a<BR>
continent that's being underutilized for some reason.<BR>
<BR>
Then they build their strength by buying at each other's stores, make<BR>
loans to more Ihatei, get some landless ones imported so they can make<BR>
their new clan branch, etc, etc. <BR>
<BR>
It won't be many years before they are effectively running the place,<BR>
all bloodless like, and the humans on the planet may well _like_ those<BR>
industrious Aslan, particularly if they've learned to not be too<BR>
exclusionary in commerce, so that the rising tide does float everyone's<BR>
boat.<BR>
<BR>
This is how Imperial aslan clans get started...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:29:28 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics) <BR>
<BR>
James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> > "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote<BR>
> > > Never seen one (a draconian RPG rule set, that is). <BR>
<BR>
> > SPI's Dragonquest is a prime example.<BR>
<BR>
> You can reread Walter's posts for my opinion on that statement.  I've<BR>
> played Dragonquest...<BR>
<BR>
I was referring to 1st Ed, not to 3rd Ed. First ed has none of <BR>
the text Walter mentioned but it does have some text which could<BR>
be interpreted in a similar manner. I've just finished one<BR>
canon argument and I did not want to start another, especially <BR>
about a game I don't care about.<BR>
<BR>
> > > Hell, I've even seen<BR>
> > > the opposite-- wargames that include suggestions like "roll a die to solve<BR>
> > > the current dispute and come up with your own rules after the game to<BR>
> > > handle future similar situations".<BR>
<BR>
> > This is _extremely_ poor board game design.<BR>
> Who said anything about *board* games?  The original wargames didn't use<BR>
> boards.  <BR>
<BR>
All right then let me rephrase myself: "This is extremely<BR>
poor game design, weather said game is board, war, RPG, card,<BR>
or of any other sort whatsoever." <BR>
<BR>
> Tabletop games, by their very nature, leave more room for<BR>
> situation interpretation.  I thank Bill ever so much for his points on<BR>
> ASL-- a game that most wargamers consider to be one of the best on the<BR>
> market.<BR>
<BR>
> > Any board game that<BR>
> > includes this rule has a strong potential to degenerate into<BR>
> > nothing more than an endless series of arguments.<BR>
<BR>
> *Strong* potential, huh?  Please...<BR>
<BR>
> People play games to have fun-- to have a good time.  I would humbly<BR>
> suggest that at least 99% of all gamers have this in mind when they crack<BR>
> open their D&D books, dig out their old copy of Sorry, or clear off the<BR>
> dining room table for a game of Warhammer Fantasy Battle.  That is the<BR>
> definition of "play".<BR>
<BR>
If that's what 99% of the gamers in your area are like you<BR>
are very fortunate. Where do you live?<BR>
<BR>
Here in Anchorage [Will can you confirm this one for me, please.]<BR>
Weasels are a significant minority of the local gaming population.<BR>
<BR>
It is perfectly possible to have a great game playing experience<BR>
with a weasel _if_ the game rules do not let him get away with<BR>
being a weasel.<BR>
<BR>
> True, some people's definition of "fun" is to win, win, WIN.  That <1% is<BR>
> usually a very sad case indeed.  The type of gamers you describe above<BR>
> would be pretty lonely, since no one could stand playing with them for long<BR>
> (unless they met up with others of their kind, and even then it is highly<BR>
> unlikely that they would be willing to put up with each *other's* ramblings<BR>
> for long).<BR>
<BR>
Sadly my local experiences do not support this theory.<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> > If any dispute over the rules can be settled by a random roll<BR>
> > then it is in the best interests of each player to deliberately<BR>
> > misunderstand each and every rule, reinterpret in a manner that<BR>
> > is advantageous to himself and then vehemently argue said point<BR>
> > hoping to provoke a random die roll in the hopes that the random <BR>
> > roll will be in his favor.<BR>
> <BR>
> Again, you seem to think that many people play games for the *sole* purpose<BR>
> of winning-- WHATEVER THE COST.  <BR>
<BR>
Many people (20-25%) of the people I have encountered do just <BR>
that. (On the other hand I may be falsely assuming some of them<BR>
are weasels when the reality is that they are simply stupid; I<BR>
don't think so however.)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> By that, I mean that you seem to think<BR>
> that such a person would be willing to risk his personal relationship with<BR>
> his opponent (friend or stranger) just to win the game.  You don't keep<BR>
> friends long with the "deliberately misinterpreting" tactic you suggest.<BR>
> Strangers may react even worse.  In tournament play, such a player would<BR>
> soon be ejected based on the fact that he is nothing more than a<BR>
> troublemaker-- not interested one bit in what the spirit of wargaming is<BR>
> all about.<BR>
<BR>
Don't you have a referee in tournament play to make the 50%<BR>
roll rule unnecessary?<BR>
<BR>
If the 50% role rule is canon then said player is not cheating<BR>
unless the game rules themselves forbid 'trouble making' and<BR>
adequately define it in all situations. I have not seen any<BR>
such game rules, have you?<BR>
<BR>
> > In any game where this rule exists game theory gives a positive<BR>
> > rules benefit to being a munchkin weasel. I do not care to <BR>
> > play games of that sort. The arguments come to overwhelm<BR>
> > the play. I want to know that anytime I get into a rules<BR>
> > discussion it is only because the rules are sufficiently <BR>
> > ambiguous that the other player is legitimately capable of <BR>
> > misinterpretation.<BR>
> <BR>
> You seem to have come to the conclusion that this "roll a die to solve the<BR>
> problem" rule would be used frequently.  Since you have never obviously<BR>
> used such a rule (and I have),<BR>
<BR>
Yes I have and I really wish you would stop presuming<BR>
what I have or have not "obviously" done or not done.  <BR>
<BR>
> you'll have to take my word for it that it<BR>
> a) doesn't happen that frequently, b) speeds up play, and c) doesn't<BR>
> detract from the enjoyment of the game.<BR>
<BR>
And you will have to take my word for it that in every single<BR>
session of every single game I have ever played that had such<BR>
a rule it was invoked at least 5 times, more than 50% of<BR>
which were (at least in my opinion spurious), increased play<BR>
time, and greatly detracted from the enjoyment of the game<BR>
to the point where some players wanted to walk out. In one<BR>
such session the weasel informed them that they could not walk <BR>
out as the rules did not permit it and wanted to roll a 50% die<BR>
to see if they could.<BR>
<BR>
[Will: Could you please give an example of Mr. Spricks playing<BR>
style so that they will believe me.]<BR>
<BR>
> In some cases this "rule" is referred to as the "fog of war".  Perhaps the<BR>
> sun shining off of polished metal on the battlefield distracts a squad long<BR>
> enough that they hesitate for a moment.  Perhaps drifting smoke on the<BR>
> battlefield obscures the target just enough to break the line-of-sight for<BR>
> a few critical seconds.  Etc.<BR>
> <BR>
> > In any board game system where the rules give a positive game<BR>
> > benefit (a 50% chance of the random roll establishing that<BR>
> > you are right) to deliberate misinterpretation of the rules than<BR>
> > that is what munchkins will do. Moreover said rule makes it far <BR>
> > more likely that a rules dispute will degenerate into a personal <BR>
> > argument, not a discussion.<BR>
<BR>
> I've got news for you: munchkins are a lot craftier than game designers.<BR>
> Where there is a will, there is a way.  As a published "game designer" now,<BR>
> I wouldn't waste my time attempting to foil their attempts by crafting<BR>
> draconian rules (that might put off non-munchkins).<BR>
<BR>
Why not simply leave out the random die roll rule?<BR>
<BR>
> > Case in point: A game that has the 'roll a die over a disputed<BR>
> > rule' rule.<BR>
<BR>
> > The rules state "Benefits of terrain cover are lost when<BR>
> > two forces occupy the same hex."<BR>
> > A situation arises when _three_ forces occupy the same hex.<BR>
> > My point of view is that if the designers had meant "Benefits<BR>
> > of terrain cover are lost when two _or_more_ forces occupy the<BR>
> > same hex." then that is what they would have written.<BR>
> > Your point of view is that since the rules do not say "Benefits<BR>
> > of terrain cover are lost when two _and_only_two_ forces occupy<BR>
> > the same hex." then terrain cover benefits do<BR>
> > not apply.<BR>
> > The third player will argue that three or more forces <BR>
> > can not occupy the same hex <BR>
<BR>
> > All three points of view are arguably legitimate by the letter of the<BR>
> > rules. But if the rules establish a game benefit for deliberate<BR>
> > use of spurious argument then the games will include more<BR>
> > spurious arguments, this is not a situation I care to play<BR>
> > in. This rule is also likely to put a strain on friendships as<BR>
> > the players now have to wonder if every rules debate is real or <BR>
> > if their opponent is simply presenting a false argument to get<BR>
> > the 50% random roll. YMMV<BR>
<BR>
> Well put, except for one thing.  You did not bother to include any of the<BR>
> other "rules" that might have been referred to in this argument.  What is<BR>
> the definition of "forces"?  Where are the rules for moving forces, so that<BR>
> we can find the rule that says whether or not a third force can move into a<BR>
> hex already occupied by two (or more) other forces or not?<BR>
<BR>
Quite true but in all practicality I can not very well type<BR>
out multiple pages of game rules. Let us assume that the other<BR>
rules are also unclear.<BR>
<BR>
> In short, your example is far from accurate.  If *all* the rules in such a<BR>
> game were as poorly written as the one you wrote, I would agree that this<BR>
> ruleset would be a disaster waiting to happen.  This example, however, does<BR>
> *not* necessarily support your argument because of its limited scope.  My<BR>
> personal opinion?  Point #2 would be the correct point based on one simple<BR>
> thing: "common sense".<BR>
<BR>
I personally would argue the first point of view based on the <BR>
letter of the rules.<BR>
<BR>
If said game has no rules text requiring common sense than<BR>
weasels will say that the rules do not require that their<BR>
spurious arguments have common sense. Then they will pick<BR>
up those 50% random roll rule dice and hope to get lucky.<BR>
(Something that would never happen to most of them in real<BR>
life which is a highly probable explanation for said behavior<BR>
but that's another story altogether.)<BR>
<BR>
> Doug and I spent well over a year bouncing copies of ACQ back and forth<BR>
> over the internet.  I think we hit revision #11 before it was finally<BR>
> "officially" submitted to BITS, and even then further revisions were<BR>
> needed.  <BR>
> After staring at 48 pages for *that* length of time, your eyes tend to<BR>
> glaze over and you miss little rule misconceptions that we felt were<BR>
> painfully clear initially (ie: didn't need better wording).  These would be<BR>
> examples of a writer making an honest mistake-- <BR>
> Time is also of the essence.<BR>
> These are some of the realities of game design.  I suggest you design your<BR>
> own complete ruleset and submit it here for discussion. <BR>
<BR>
Not interested. There are already lots of adequate (if not<BR>
great) games systems out there. I prefer to spend my limited <BR>
writing time on variants and/or articles. I was working on a <BR>
SAGA system version of Traveller but I'm to busy to work on it <BR>
until the semester is over,<BR>
 <BR>
> Then we'll see how<BR>
> it is accepted.  Or you can order a copy (or two) of ACQ and tell me what<BR>
> you think :)<BR>
<BR>
I plan to buy ACQ.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:37:37 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Alright. I'm going to do it.<BR>
> <BR>
> I bought the T4 rulebook from a bargain bin, and was surprised to find I<BR>
> liked it. I've found some other modules available, but I know at least some<BR>
> of them are dross.<BR>
> <BR>
> Which ones should I buy? We're probably looking at two or three, including<BR>
> FFS2, at least for the first order.<BR>
<BR>
Get the Milieu 0 book if you can get it, lots of background on the<BR>
beginning of the Third Imperium. It will permanently color your opinion<BR>
of the August Founder Cleon I. <BR>
Pocket Empires is good, as is CSC (despite the completely different<BR>
vehicle design rules in there than FFS2...sigh. At least they're _good_<BR>
vehicle design rules)<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm...My own collection of T4 stuff didn't extend much beyond these.<BR>
Naval Architects Manual is supposed to be nearly useless, and Emperors<BR>
Arsenal is great if you don't mind a whole bunch of designs _without<BR>
stats_.<BR>
<BR>
Also, when you find FFS2, don't drop the book in shock..._all_ the<BR>
equations are screwed in the most astonishing fashion.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:48:48 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> > If comic book<BR>
> > fans will buy the same comic twice with a different cover than<BR>
> > logically so will Traveller fans.<BR>
<BR>
> For us to understand your definition of "logic", could you please explain<BR>
> the above preposterous statement?<BR>
<BR>
Marketing ploys which rely on the illogic on the customer are<BR>
not, in and of themselves, illogical. I will thank you<BR>
very much not to continue to call things preposterous<BR>
simply because you are unfamiliar with them.<BR>
<BR>
Comic book fans have been known to purchase multiple copies<BR>
of the same comic if said comic has multiple different<BR>
covers. Some comics have had 10 or more alternate covers. <BR>
This makes each cover scarcer. Next time you are in a comic<BR>
store ask to borrow their store copy of Wizard magazine,<BR>
then look up Gen13 for a particularly offensive example.<BR>
Each of issue #1's 12+ alternate covers was worth $25+<BR>
at one time (cover was $2.50). IIRC most of the covers<BR>
are now in the $10-$15 range.<BR>
<BR>
My (facetious) suggestion was that BITS begin the same <BR>
practice. That if they printed up half the copies of<BR>
the wook with the title 101 Anal Retentive Rules with<BR>
an American style cover illustration and half the copies <BR>
with the title 101 Anal-Retentive Rules and a British<BR>
style cover illustration that this would increase sales <BR>
as at least one Traveller fan would buy them both (despite<BR>
their contents being identical) so that he would have both <BR>
covers.<BR>
<BR>
To put in ACQ standards you could print 5 different<BR>
versions of the book each with a cover illustration of<BR>
a different type on penguins on the cover (use public<BR>
domain nature photographs so you don't have to pay<BR>
for 5 pieces of cover art).<BR>
<BR>
The fact that this marketing ploy is one that you are<BR>
apparently unfamiliar with does not mean that it might<BR>
not work (although I agree that it is unlikely to given<BR>
that games are less 'collectible' cost more each and<BR>
sell to a somewhat different market.<BR>
<BR>
If you think that the basic idea of a collectible game is <BR>
implausible I suggest you do a little bit of reading on two <BR>
gentlemen called Richard Garfield and Peter Adkinson who have <BR>
each made a little bit of money (six or seven figures worth) <BR>
on just such a scheme.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:54:20 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: An alternate TL definition (heresy warning)<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> but unless CrImp 1 = $15 US then it is less than the<BR>
> $25,000 <BR>
<BR>
Sorry that's a typo, it should be $15,000.<BR>
<BR>
> 1987 US dollars GURPS lists as basic starting wealth<BR>
> for that TL.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 13:02:36 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re: Wars within the Imperium<BR>
<BR>
>From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
[deletions not marked]<BR>
>Hmm. Kind of a good way to piss off one of your cold war allies<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>And there is the small fact that the Falkland Islanders are<BR>
>British Subjects, with British passports <BR>
<BR>
>How would the US have responded to, say, Alaska being occupied<BR>
>by the Russians? Or Puerto Rico by <take your pick>?<BR>
<BR>
I'm not defending the Monroe Doctrine, actually.  It's an<BR>
arrogant statement of US dominance of the Americas, and has been<BR>
largely, if not entirely, ignored for a long time.  The Monroe<BR>
Doctrine accordinly suited President Reagan perfectly, and he<BR>
should have invoked it, if only to stay in character.<BR>
<BR>
>BTW I'm confused by your use of 'hegemony' here. My OED defines<BR>
>it as "Leadership. predominance of one state of a confederacy, <BR>
>orig.  Ancient Greece". Is there another meaning, or does North<BR>
>American  English use it differently to British English? <BR>
<BR>
I think American English and British English may have slightly<BR>
different meanings.  We often use hegemony to mean predominance<BR>
of one state over its neighbors, whether they are part of an<BR>
organization like a confederation or not.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:06:20 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: FFS1 Fuel Cells<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Fuel Cells in FFS1<BR>
> Would the paragraph at the start of the page in FFS1 which states "All power<BR>
> plants from tech level 7 and higher may be designed to burn LHyd instead of<BR>
> hydrocarbon distillates at no energy penalty" apply to fuel cells? If so<BR>
> then the fuel consumption figures on the fuel cells table should be<BR>
> tonnes/hour rather than kl/hour.<BR>
<BR>
For what it is worth, there was a post relating to this on<BR>
rec.arts.sf.science the other day. I emailed the poster asking if he<BR>
could point me at good references, but didn't get an answer.<BR>
<BR>
Apparently current state of the art is that hydrogen/oxygen fuel cells<BR>
are 80% efficient while those using various hydrocarbons are down<BR>
around 30-45% efficient. <BR>
<BR>
> The description of fuel cells in FFS1 says that they are open systems. This<BR>
> implies to me that they are drawing their oxygen from around them (ie life<BR>
> support) not really acceptable in a sealed environment. But then this makes<BR>
> them air breathing so again by perhaps again that section allowing modified<BR>
> fuel tankage can be utilised effectively doubling fuel consumption.<BR>
<BR>
Given the nature of fuel cells, it's pretty easy to switch from open to<BR>
closed systems. That's because the oxygen/air has to be "circulated"<BR>
thru them anyway. <BR>
<BR>
> So for example a 1kl TL 7 Fuel Cell produces 0.5Mw and consumes<BR>
> 0.3*0.5=0.15kl HGHydro Distillate per hour which is equivelant to 0.15<BR>
> tonnes of HGHydro Distillate per hours.<BR>
<BR>
There are a couple of companies producing fuel cells for *home* use<BR>
(they do things like increase the efficiency by using waste heat to<BR>
heat your hot water). Ballard Power Systems and Plug Power. They have<BR>
web sites, but I don't have the URL (nor a working web browser that can<BR>
handle anything but text). <BR>
<BR>
It might pay to check out their sites to get info regarding what<BR>
*current*, low cost sysems can do.<BR>
<BR>
> Assuming when LHyd is used the mass used is the same (so that the LHyd vol<BR>
> is the only penalty) the volume consumed in the same fuel cell would be<BR>
> 0.15/0.007=2.143 kl per hour in an open system and double this if oxygen is<BR>
> carried in half the tanks.<BR>
<BR>
Don't forget that the oxygen required for 1 ton (mass) of hydrogen<BR>
weighs *8* tons... I'm not sure how much denser lox is than LH2, but it<BR>
should be checked...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:20:56 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century<BR>
<BR>
In mail, traveller@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Not that I can find. However WTH does, and notes that for Cr50 per m^3 <BR>
> of fuel tankage you can arrange to have LHyd tanks rigged to accept O2 <BR>
> in half of their volume. This allows engines and fuel cells to operate <BR>
> outside of an oxygen atmosphere, at half normal endurance.<BR>
<BR>
Well, a simple glance at the tankage diagrams for various rockets<BR>
shows that the *volume* ratio of LOX/LH2 is more like 4-to-1. I<BR>
remember *that* much. But I don't recall which is the 4 and which is<BR>
the 1.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 21:04:17 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
>Get the Milieu 0 book if you can get it, lots of background on the<BR>
>beginning of the Third Imperium. It will permanently color your opinion<BR>
>of the August Founder Cleon I.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Well, I'm not so interested in the setting as using the rules for my<BR>
existing setting. But I'll bear it in mind.<BR>
<BR>
>Pocket Empires is good, as is CSC (despite the completely different<BR>
>vehicle design rules in there than FFS2...sigh. At least they're _good_<BR>
>vehicle design rules)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Pocket Empires maybe.  CSC more maybe. Does it have rules for designing<BR>
non-weapon, non-vehicle kit?<BR>
<BR>
>Naval Architects Manual is supposed to be nearly useless, and Emperors<BR>
>Arsenal is great if you don't mind a whole bunch of designs _without<BR>
>stats_.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, I got the NAM a while ago (hoping to use the deckplans for TNE). It<BR>
was what put me off buying anything else from IG.<BR>
<BR>
Emperor's Arsenal sounds like either a complete waste of space or a hundred<BR>
opportunities for design. Either way I'll give it a miss for the time being.<BR>
<BR>
>Also, when you find FFS2, don't drop the book in shock..._all_ the<BR>
>equations are screwed in the most astonishing fashion.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Well, that's what the errata's for. Err....there *is* errata, right?<BR>
<BR>
On the whole, it's looking not-too-bad at the moment. My FLGS is checking<BR>
suppliers out, and Mordor appear to have a bunch of stuff. Titan don't, and<BR>
I've only just mailed BITS. Esdevium don't seem to have a website, but I've<BR>
got their phone number.  I'm still trawling through DMOZ's listing of<BR>
retailers.<BR>
<BR>
Once again I'm grateful to the list. And thankyou, Bruce.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:10:22 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
<BR>
Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
<BR>
> pnewman@gci.net issued forth:<BR>
> > The larger the Imperium is the less likely it is that a<BR>
> > design will be standard across it. <BR>
> > the very size of the Imperium that makes the short list<BR>
> > plausible. <BR>
<BR>
> I am not following your reasoning here, the size of the Imperium means<BR>
> greater variety in design requirements, as different systems and worlds have<BR>
> a variety of environments and transportation/protection needs.<BR>
<BR>
Exactly they will have more designs so fewer of them will be<BR>
_standard_.<BR>
<BR>
Suppose you invent a nice ship. Fifty years later everyone<BR>
on your planet is using it. In fact your ship is so wonderful<BR>
that a thousand of them are made. Guess what, if your ship<BR>
goes from the Spinward Marches to the Solomani Rim the<BR>
yards there may not be making it. Therefore your ship will<BR>
not be made at shipyards across the Imperium as required for a <BR>
standard design.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> >> There is no way any game company would ever produce a full listing of<BR>
> >> "standard" designs for ships in the 3I, as we would be inundated with tons<BR>
> >> of material (if printed on paper), and that without any pics, deckplans, or<BR>
> >> descriptions. Think about an exhaustive description of standard vehicles<BR>
> >> from Terra circa now. Heck, restrict yourself to a single type like<BR>
> >> aircraft, or seaships.<BR>
> > <BR>
> > Earth is not equal to the Third Imperium. It is much, much,<BR>
> > much easier for a design to be standard across one planet<BR>
> > then for it to be standard across 11,000+ planets.<BR>
> > <BR>
> It sounds to me like you are arguing /my/ position now. I brought up Earth<BR>
> to point out that even a single world has more standard designs than listed<BR>
> in the rules for the entire Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Standard designs are on Terra are not all the same as standard <BR>
designs on Vland, or Rhylanor, or Antares, or Capitol, or Muan<BR>
Gui, or Sirim, or Depot/Corridor.<BR>
<BR>
Suppose that each High Pop type A port in the Imperium has a <BR>
list of 200 designs that are standard at their port. For a <BR>
ship to be standard across the Imperium the ship has to show<BR>
up on a _lot_ of lists across a large Imperium. What I am saying<BR>
is that it is reasonble to conclude that only a few ships would<BR>
be on that list.<BR>
<BR>
I also note that Tl variations on the standard designs will<BR>
greatly increase the range of 'standard' designs. <BR>
<BR>
> In another post on this topic, you mentioned MT saying that these designs<BR>
> are /the/ standard. This is quite different than these designs /are/<BR>
> standard. My MT material went up in a barn fire, and so I cannot check the<BR>
> wording, at least until I've translated my e-copy into a format I can read.<BR>
> Does it really say /the/ standard?<BR>
<BR>
I don't believe I ever quoted anything that said /the/<BR>
standard because that's not the letter of the text, which<BR>
says:<BR>
<BR>
"The designs listed here are standard: that is, each ship type <BR>
is mass-produced in shipyards throughout the Imperium, which<BR>
provides economies of scale and saves the fees of a ship architect."<BR>
[MT ImpEnc p 76]<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 16:12:18 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Planet III Software<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Nick Bradbeer <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
> I'm told they've been posted up on downport.com, but they're about five<BR>
megs<BR>
> in total (which I didn't realise) so I'll have to wait to go back to uni<BR>
> before I attempt to get them.<BR>
<BR>
Bryan gave me a single file that is over five and a half megs.  I put it in<BR>
the HIWG area:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.downport.com/hiwg/software/ibm/p3/deneb.ZIP<BR>
<BR>
This contains five .exe files: Deneb, Diaspora, Oldexpan, Reft and Spinward.<BR>
If anyone requires it, I can post the five files individually.<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 13:18:01 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:37:37 -0700, Bruce Johnson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> > <BR>
> > Alright. I'm going to do it.<BR>
> > <BR>
> > I bought the T4 rulebook from a bargain bin, and was surprised to find I<BR>
> > liked it. I've found some other modules available, but I know at least some<BR>
> > of them are dross.<BR>
> > <BR>
> > Which ones should I buy? We're probably looking at two or three, including<BR>
> > FFS2, at least for the first order.<BR>
> <BR>
> Get the Milieu 0 book if you can get it, lots of background on the<BR>
> beginning of the Third Imperium. It will permanently color your opinion<BR>
> of the August Founder Cleon I. <BR>
> Pocket Empires is good, as is CSC (despite the completely different<BR>
> vehicle design rules in there than FFS2...sigh. At least they're _good_<BR>
> vehicle design rules)<BR>
> <BR>
> Hmmm...My own collection of T4 stuff didn't extend much beyond these.<BR>
> Naval Architects Manual is supposed to be nearly useless, and Emperors<BR>
> Arsenal is great if you don't mind a whole bunch of designs _without<BR>
> stats_.<BR>
<BR>
I think you're confusing Leroy's favourite-- Emperor's Vehicles-- with Greg<BR>
Porter's Emperor's Arsenal.  The latter certainly contains stats for<BR>
weapons TL0-TL15.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Hit any user to continue.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2301<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 12 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2302<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Peter Newman's Traveller Universe - evidence from the books > <BR>
Re: Boardgames<BR>
Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
Re: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
re: Board Games<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Standard Starships (was Re: Basic Economics)<BR>
Re: Secrets of ACQ  :Getting wildly off topic now! (sorry)<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics) <BR>
Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics) <BR>
Re: Aki/Glisten<BR>
RE: Peter Newman's Traveller Universe - evidence from the books ><BR>
Re: An alternate TL definition<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:19:49 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Peter Newman's Traveller Universe - evidence from the books > <BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> If Xboats, Xboat Tenders, Survey Ships, and Scout Cruisers are not<BR>
> "standard" designs, why is there a seperate entry on the encounter tables<BR>
> that include them for "nonstandard" designs (when, using your definitions,<BR>
> they should fall under that classification)?  <BR>
> Under your interpretation, you could roll "nonstandard" and substitute any<BR>
> of the other table entries except the scout courier, making the table<BR>
> largely useless.<BR>
<BR>
No what it means is that of the numerous very common types of<BR>
Scout vessels which do not qualify as standard because they are <BR>
manufactured at too few places to qualify as "being manufactured<BR>
throughout the Imperium" as required by the definition of<BR>
standard of p. 76 of the ImpEnc that these types are sufficiently <BR>
common that they will be encountered often enough to deserve their<BR>
own lines on the table.<BR>
<BR>
If Scout vessels are manufactured (in mass quantities) at<BR>
a few ports there could be enough of them in space for them<BR>
to _need_ their own lines on the encounter table (unlike other<BR>
nonstandard designs which are much rarer).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 12:24:27 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames<BR>
<BR>
"Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> >The rule ensures that if any of the players are of that <BR>
> >subset of gamers who are weasels (approximately 20% of <BR>
> >local population) that no game will ever be finished. They <BR>
> >will argue about anything to win. Since my weasel detector <BR>
> >is not perfect and one of the reasons I play games is for <BR>
> >fun and stress relief I do not care to play games that have <BR>
> >the potential of encouraging weaseldom. <BR>
<BR>
> Sounds like you should keep a game like this around. By your<BR>
> logic, the mere presence of the die-roll rule should cause<BR>
> every weasel in your game group to immediately reveal their<BR>
> true colors, and do so in such an obnoxious fashion that even<BR>
> your flawed weasel detector will find them.<BR>
<BR>
By then we are already playing the game and have therefore<BR>
lost the opportunity to play a different game which would<BR>
not have permitted this behavior. Moreover I stop having<BR>
fun when this occurs. I find it illogical to risk this when<BR>
I can, instead, choose to play a game without this rule.<BR>
<BR>
> Peter again:<BR>
> >It is a good mechanism for resolving rare genuine debates, <BR>
> >however its presence in the rules is a guarantee that a <BR>
> >weasel will immediately generate 100 false arguments so <BR>
> >that he can win 50 of them. <BR>
<BR>
> If this is your experience, I think you've got player problems,<BR>
> not rule problems.  <BR>
<BR>
Had, not have, their is a reason I play far fewer board &<BR>
war games than I used to.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:05:39 -0400<BR>
From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
<BR>
Phased Array Transducers have no moving parts.  However, they deal with<BR>
sound instead of light.<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
 J-Man<BR>
 ICQ# 2843475<BR>
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
 Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
 Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Anthony Jackson" <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 2:39 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Dale Gyles writes:<BR>
> > Are phased array lasers possible?  I was wondering if the elements of a<BR>
> > phased array radar were scaled down to optical wavelengths, could a<BR>
laser<BR>
> > with the general characteristics of the radar be built?  No moving<BR>
parts,<BR>
> > beam aiming & focusing done electronically, etc.<BR>
><BR>
> Maybe.  I'm not convinced that you'd have no moving parts, however, or<BR>
really<BR>
> any significant improvement in capability.  Traveller lasers are already<BR>
> wildly optimistic.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > If this were possible, and assuming weapon grade power levels were<BR>
> > feasible, this device could be its own beam pointer.  It could engage<BR>
> > several small targets at the same time, etc.<BR>
><BR>
> How do these benefits arise from being a phased array?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 15:58:33 -0600 (CST)<BR>
From: "Jason Kemp" <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: Re: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com>, regarding my <BR>
group and trying to get them involved in a Traveller game:<BR>
<BR>
> Hmmm. Here are some thoughts:<BR>
> <BR>
> Political Intrigue Player: This one can often provide a "hook" by embroiling<BR>
> him or her into Imperial politics. The other players need not know where<BR>
> this player gets the "missions" and such, to avoid turning them off.<BR>
> <BR>
> Psionic Dabbler: Well, there are psionics in Traveller. Depending on era,<BR>
> this may tie in with the intrigue player.<BR>
> <BR>
> Role-Player: This one and the intrigue fan sound like the ones to focus on<BR>
> to create adventure hooks. And the role-player should be well versed in<BR>
> Library Data, both to help the others blend in, and give him or her some<BR>
> baseline data from which to develop a character.<BR>
> <BR>
> The Rest: The key word is "occasional", isn't it? Not that a mercenary<BR>
> campaign would be embraced? Altercations can occur in any campaign, no prob.<BR>
> <BR>
> I think a good idea might be a scout campaign. Probably detached duty called<BR>
> in for trouble-shooting on occasion. That gives them some leeway and<BR>
> guidance when needed.<BR>
<BR>
That's one of my two main thoughts of introducing the players to <BR>
Traveller currently. I figure that if the PCs work for IISS <BR>
Intelligence branch (or the IISS Rangers, Glenn St-Germain's <BR>
suggested variant IntOps agency for his campaign), then I can assign <BR>
them tasks, and slowly get them involved in the game that way.<BR>
<BR>
Start with a rescue operation of an important scientist or political <BR>
figure that was marooned somehow on a low-TL world. Due to certain <BR>
constraints, the PCs have to go in with low-TL weapons and equipment. <BR>
Basically a fantasy adventure in sci-fi clothing.<BR>
<BR>
Build from there, with an adventure focusing on different aspects of<BR>
the game milieu. Escorting someone from planet A to planet B can<BR>
cover space travel. Infiltrating a pirate band can be used to<BR>
introduce space combat. Introduce a terrorist-based psionic secret<BR>
society, bent on taking over the Imperium or something equally<BR>
nasty, and we've got psionic rules covered, and some "evil wizard"<BR>
enemies. Try a Fight Club scenario or a martial arts tournament ala <BR>
Bloodsport, and technology doesn't enter the picture adventure-wise, <BR>
even if it's transmitted live in 3D holography. If I treat pocket <BR>
empires like fantasy kingdoms, I think I can plug into that image and <BR>
help them deal with problems of scale. I don't know, but I'll try.<BR>
<BR>
One of my group actually talked to me yesterday about designing an SF <BR>
milieu together, to help get a clue of the adventure potential within <BR>
the game. He's my best friend, and knows I really want to play <BR>
Traveller, so he's trying to explore it as a GM to get an idea of <BR>
what he can do as a player. It doesn't even matter to him if we <BR>
end up not using it, so long as he gets an idea of adventuring <BR>
prospects and all the options open to him. Wish me luck. :)<BR>
<BR>
Thanks, All,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
=============================<BR>
Jason Kemp, ADS Programmer IV<BR>
(512)458-7111 ext. 1+3375<BR>
Internet Address:  jason.kemp@tdh.state.tx.us<BR>
<BR>
Most computer virus and email alerts are hoaxes.  For more info, check out:<BR>
http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/culture/beliefs/urbanlegends/library/blhoax.htm<BR>
==============================<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 16:59:48 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: re: Board Games<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
>And you will have to take my word for it that in every single <BR>
>session of every single game I have ever played that had such <BR>
>a rule it was invoked at least 5 times, more than 50% of <BR>
>which were (at least in my opinion spurious), increased play <BR>
>time, and greatly detracted from the enjoyment of the game <BR>
>to the point where some players wanted to walk out. In one <BR>
>such session the weasel informed them that they could not walk <BR>
>out as the rules did not permit it and wanted to roll a 50% die <BR>
>to see if they could. <BR>
<BR>
Whereupon, in every game group I've ever played in, this person<BR>
would have found himself making his claim (that the rules prohibited<BR>
others from walking out) to the backs of departing players.<BR>
<BR>
It boggles the mind that you could interpret such childishness as<BR>
a rule problem, by any stretch of the term.  No game I have ever<BR>
played was designed with an ass like that in mind, for the simple<BR>
reason that the game designers would not believe that anyone would<BR>
have the patience to game with such a person.<BR>
<BR>
I suppose it's a given that you play no overly complex games with<BR>
this person, and that you never let this person teach you a game?<BR>
<BR>
Then again, based on your method of reading rules, I suppose you<BR>
and this Mr. Spricks were made for each other...opposites<BR>
attracting, and all.  I'd think you would have driven such a <BR>
person as crazy as they drove you.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 22:59:31 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> I bought the T4 rulebook from a bargain bin, and was surprised to find I<BR>
> liked it. I've found some other modules available, but I know at least some<BR>
> of them are dross.<BR>
<BR>
I use T4 myself, but I've modified the rules a bit in a few places :-)<BR>
<BR>
> Which ones should I buy? We're probably looking at two or three, including<BR>
> FFS2, at least for the first order.<BR>
<BR>
Get FF&S2... and download the errata, the definite sensor rules, and some more<BR>
errata. Then it becomes really useful.<BR>
<BR>
CSC is great. Lots of useful equipment. It also includes a design system for<BR>
vehicles. The system is good, but not compatible with FF&S2. I have no problem<BR>
with using both, however.<BR>
<BR>
Emperor's Arsenal is good. Weapons from every TL, including stats.<BR>
<BR>
In addition to the above three books, Imperial Squadrons and Pocket Empires are<BR>
useful for running large-scale events (war and peace).<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:16:12 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Standard Starships (was Re: Basic Economics)<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman quoted:<BR>
>"The designs listed here are standard: that is, each ship type <BR>
>is mass-produced in shipyards throughout the Imperium, which <BR>
>provides economies of scale and saves the fees of a ship architect." <BR>
>[MT ImpEnc p 76] <BR>
<BR>
Semantics. I read it as "The designs listed here are [examples of <BR>
designs that are] standard", you read it as "The designs listed<BR>
here[, and only these,] are standard.  The former interpretation IMO<BR>
follows the intent of the rules as presented by the authors, the latter <BR>
if followed to the letter would even restrict the authors from adding<BR>
to their own creation.<BR>
<BR>
Add to this that the designs listed are presented as standard<BR>
performance parameters...a 200dtn ship, streamlined, capable of<BR>
Jump-1 and 1G, with these capacities for fuel, cargo and passengers,<BR>
is a Type A Free Trader...whether it was made by Makidhurun or<BR>
LSP, whether they used hatches or iris valves, whether it has a<BR>
forward-loaded cargo bay or a side-hatch one.  The Subsidized<BR>
Merchant design amortized in Old Expanses may very well look nothing<BR>
like the Sub Merchant design you can get for free at Rhylanor Down.<BR>
Sure, they build 100dtn Scouts at shipyards across the Imperium...but<BR>
are they building Suleiman, Improved Suleiman, Serpent, Intrepid,<BR>
or a class you've never seen before?<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 22:26:00 +0100<BR>
From: "Derrick Jones" <dojones.whitestar@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Secrets of ACQ  :Getting wildly off topic now! (sorry)<BR>
<BR>
Nick B wrote:<BR>
>You can identify green penguins by the taste?<BR>
<BR>
In 1997, some of my mates performed the experiment. They took the penguins<BR>
out of the wrapper and using a knife scratched the first letter of the colour of the<BR>
wrapper. The only one I liked was the green one. The others tasted vile....<BR>
I didn't know what colours they were, and this was in front of 4 witnesses.<BR>
(One of whom Dominic has met)<BR>
<BR>
Honest!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Derrick<BR>
<BR>
Derrick Jones<BR>
St Helens<BR>
Lancashire UK<BR>
http://www.btinternet.com/~dojones.whitestar<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 14:48:43 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:48:48 -0800, Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote<BR>
> <BR>
> > Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> > > If comic book<BR>
> > > fans will buy the same comic twice with a different cover than<BR>
> > > logically so will Traveller fans.<BR>
> <BR>
> > For us to understand your definition of "logic", could you please explain<BR>
> > the above preposterous statement?<BR>
> <BR>
> Marketing ploys which rely on the illogic on the customer are<BR>
> not, in and of themselves, illogical. I will thank you<BR>
> very much not to continue to call things preposterous<BR>
> simply because you are unfamiliar with them.<BR>
<BR>
You're not listening.  I asked you to provide the "logic" behind your<BR>
assumption that what's good for comic book collectors is good for Traveller<BR>
fans.  IOW, what is the *logic* behind your assumption that Traveller fans<BR>
would buy multiple products with different covers solely on the fact that<BR>
comic book collectors frequently do the same?  I'm not asking for an<BR>
opinion, I'm asking for logic.<BR>
<BR>
Your previous posts are chocked full of the terms "logic" and "logically",<BR>
yet you apparently do not know how to use these words in conversation.<BR>
That's the end of this thread, as far as I'm concerned...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Hit any user to continue.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 14:48:45 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics) <BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 12 Apr 2000 10:37:07 -0800, Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> AFAIK the WH40K<BR>
> rules do not prohibit players from deliberately making spurious <BR>
> arguments.<BR>
<BR>
I know of NO RPG or wargame that *specifically* prohibits "arguments".<BR>
<BR>
> Therefore their random die roll rule effectively permits, <BR>
> and even encourages, players to cheat and get away with it 50% <BR>
> of the time.<BR>
<BR>
It's been said before but I have to say it again: this is a *player*<BR>
problem, not a *game* problem.  You do not dis the games of basketball or<BR>
baseball because of the likes of Dennis Rodman or John Rocker.<BR>
<BR>
> If said player starts using loaded dice and you<BR>
> complain about it he will point out that the letter of the rules<BR>
> does not prohibit him from using loaded dice. When he rolls for<BR>
> it, using his loaded dice of course, and wins cheating has just<BR>
> been legalized. Other than quitting the game what can you do<BR>
> about it?<BR>
<BR>
This is assinine.  Again, I have never read anything specific in the text<BR>
of an RPG that bans cheating.  There is nothing in any of the versions of<BR>
Traveller that forbids you from using loaded dice.  Ergo, it is perfectly<BR>
acceptable to use loaded dice. (your "logic", not mine).<BR>
<BR>
> This is part of the reason I am unwilling to play said game.<BR>
> <BR>
> Moreover the 50% random roll rule is essentially unfair and<BR>
> unjust. My correct interpretation of the rules has no more<BR>
> chance of being upheld than my (hypothetical) differentially<BR>
> sentient, perceptually challenged, hygiene impaired opponents<BR>
> incorrect argument does.<BR>
<BR>
You obviously didn't read what I initially wrote on this subject.  The dice<BR>
rule for solving conflicts is *infrequently* used to address *unusual*<BR>
circumstances when the answer isn't cut & dry.  It is used to leap past the<BR>
problem so that it can be properly addressed during the postgame.  Properly<BR>
addressed, said problem shouldn't occur anymore because you have now<BR>
created a house rule to solve the problem in play.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Hit any user to continue.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 14:48:46 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics) <BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:29:28 -0800, Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote<BR>
> <BR>
> > People play games to have fun-- to have a good time.  I would humbly<BR>
> > suggest that at least 99% of all gamers have this in mind when they crack<BR>
> > open their D&D books, dig out their old copy of Sorry, or clear off the<BR>
> > dining room table for a game of Warhammer Fantasy Battle.  That is the<BR>
> > definition of "play".<BR>
> <BR>
> If that's what 99% of the gamers in your area are like you<BR>
> are very fortunate. Where do you live?<BR>
<BR>
See my sig...<BR>
<BR>
> Here in Anchorage [Will can you confirm this one for me, please.]<BR>
> Weasels are a significant minority of the local gaming population.<BR>
> <BR>
> It is perfectly possible to have a great game playing experience<BR>
> with a weasel _if_ the game rules do not let him get away with<BR>
> being a weasel.<BR>
<BR>
Possible, but a weasel (whatever that *really* means) that is driven to win<BR>
will eventually cheat to do so.  Either that, or he finds himself not<BR>
invited back.<BR>
<BR>
Case in point: Years ago we played a group game of Star Fleet Battles.  It<BR>
was pretty obvious at one point that one of the players was cheating, but<BR>
we decided to see things through to the end instead of getting into a big<BR>
fight over it.  He never did contribute much to that particular battle, and<BR>
we found out later that he never bothered to fill in his ship's energy<BR>
allotment form beyond some rudimentary numbers.  We never invited him back,<BR>
and now use him as an example to other potential new players.<BR>
<BR>
[snip]<BR>
<BR>
> > By that, I mean that you seem to think<BR>
> > that such a person would be willing to risk his personal relationship with<BR>
> > his opponent (friend or stranger) just to win the game.  You don't keep<BR>
> > friends long with the "deliberately misinterpreting" tactic you suggest.<BR>
> > Strangers may react even worse.  In tournament play, such a player would<BR>
> > soon be ejected based on the fact that he is nothing more than a<BR>
> > troublemaker-- not interested one bit in what the spirit of wargaming is<BR>
> > all about.<BR>
> <BR>
> Don't you have a referee in tournament play to make the 50%<BR>
> roll rule unnecessary?<BR>
<BR>
Possibly, but the 50% die roll rule would mean that he only really has to<BR>
be involved for the truly bizarre instances.  Less referee interaction<BR>
means that neither player can claim prejudicial treatment.<BR>
<BR>
> If the 50% role rule is canon then said player is not cheating<BR>
> unless the game rules themselves forbid 'trouble making' and<BR>
> adequately define it in all situations. I have not seen any<BR>
> such game rules, have you?<BR>
<BR>
Yup.  It's usually a *tournament* rule (unwritten or not), which supersedes<BR>
all *game* rules.<BR>
<BR>
> > > In any game where this rule exists game theory gives a positive<BR>
> > > rules benefit to being a munchkin weasel. I do not care to <BR>
> > > play games of that sort. The arguments come to overwhelm<BR>
> > > the play. I want to know that anytime I get into a rules<BR>
> > > discussion it is only because the rules are sufficiently <BR>
> > > ambiguous that the other player is legitimately capable of <BR>
> > > misinterpretation.<BR>
> > <BR>
> > You seem to have come to the conclusion that this "roll a die to solve the<BR>
> > problem" rule would be used frequently.  Since you have never obviously<BR>
> > used such a rule (and I have),<BR>
> <BR>
> Yes I have and I really wish you would stop presuming<BR>
> what I have or have not "obviously" done or not done.  <BR>
<BR>
Sorry, but your argument lead me to believe otherwise.  Personally, I've<BR>
only seen the rule used once or twice during trips to the local GW store<BR>
(years ago), and it has actually never been used within our own gaming<BR>
group.  See, the people I game with are also my friends, and we see little<BR>
point in arguing over a game.<BR>
<BR>
> > you'll have to take my word for it that it<BR>
> > a) doesn't happen that frequently, b) speeds up play, and c) doesn't<BR>
> > detract from the enjoyment of the game.<BR>
> <BR>
> And you will have to take my word for it that in every single<BR>
> session of every single game I have ever played that had such<BR>
> a rule it was invoked at least 5 times, more than 50% of<BR>
> which were (at least in my opinion spurious), increased play<BR>
> time, and greatly detracted from the enjoyment of the game<BR>
> to the point where some players wanted to walk out. In one<BR>
> such session the weasel informed them that they could not walk <BR>
> out as the rules did not permit it and wanted to roll a 50% die<BR>
> to see if they could.<BR>
> <BR>
> [Will: Could you please give an example of Mr. Spricks playing<BR>
> style so that they will believe me.]<BR>
<BR>
Well, if you have *one* player that feels that it is his duty to use this<BR>
rule to death, and he participates in a fair number of your games, I can<BR>
see how the numbers could be skewed that way.  Again, this is a glaring<BR>
*player* problem, not a rules problem.<BR>
<BR>
> > I've got news for you: munchkins are a lot craftier than game designers.<BR>
> > Where there is a will, there is a way.  As a published "game designer" now,<BR>
> > I wouldn't waste my time attempting to foil their attempts by crafting<BR>
> > draconian rules (that might put off non-munchkins).<BR>
> <BR>
> Why not simply leave out the random die roll rule?<BR>
<BR>
Because sometimes it is necessary.  GW example #1: "anything touched by the<BR>
template is hit".  Define "touching".  GW example #2: "anything more than<BR>
half covered by the template is hit".  How can you accurately measure<BR>
"half" of a miniature?  GW example #3: "anything completely under the<BR>
template is hit".  Damn... there's a millimeter of speartip protruding<BR>
outside of the template.  I guess that guy gets to live.<BR>
<BR>
You would need protractors and laser range finders to accurately place such<BR>
a template fairly, not to mention distinguishing which models are touching<BR>
from those that are b-a-r-e-l-y touching, etc. etc.  For some people, the<BR>
random die roll rule works here.  For others, human honesty works even<BR>
better.<BR>
<BR>
> > In short, your example is far from accurate.  If *all* the rules in such a<BR>
> > game were as poorly written as the one you wrote, I would agree that this<BR>
> > ruleset would be a disaster waiting to happen.  This example, however, does<BR>
> > *not* necessarily support your argument because of its limited scope.  My<BR>
> > personal opinion?  Point #2 would be the correct point based on one simple<BR>
> > thing: "common sense".<BR>
> <BR>
> I personally would argue the first point of view based on the <BR>
> letter of the rules.<BR>
<BR>
But you are arguing the "letter of the rules" based on what you acknowledge<BR>
as bad rules to begin with.<BR>
<BR>
> If said game has no rules text requiring common sense than<BR>
> weasels will say that the rules do not require that their<BR>
> spurious arguments have common sense.<BR>
<BR>
That's it.  I can't take this form of reasoning any more.  I'm outa here...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Hit any user to continue.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:06:22 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: Aki/Glisten<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson writes:<BR>
<BR>
>Glenn Grant wrote: <BR>
><BR>
>>Maybe I'll do AKI/Glisten (SM 2035, B443987-9 Hi In Po  Amber 214As G6v<BR>
>>M2D) [MT data]<BR>
>> <BR>
>>-- except that, if I do, I'll probably ignore tht "As" allegiance code; it<BR>
>>doesn't make any sense to me that Aslan Ihatei could somehow sneak onto a<BR>
>>world with a population of over a billion, in sufficient numbers to<BR>
>>effectively take it over, especially when it's *one parsec* from a<BR>
>>subsector capital (Glisten) with a Naval base and Scout base(!).   Just how<BR>
>>many million Ihatei are supposed to have moved in there?<BR>
> <BR>
>Remember: Ihatei don't necessarily invade militarily, or even<BR>
>economically. They may well _buy_ land for themselves, off on a<BR>
>continent that's being underutilized for some reason.<BR>
<BR>
Unfortunately there's an adventure in TD that shows the military invasion of<BR>
Aki by Aslans and also a TNS newsbrief or two about the Aslan-occupied Aki.<BR>
 <BR>
BTW, I agree 100% with Glenn about the unlikelihood that the Aslans would be<BR>
able to invade Aki successfully (I've had several heated debates on the<BR>
subject here on the TML ;-). Alas, unless Marc can be persuaded to change<BR>
it, it's canon. And rather well-supported canon at that. I suggest that<BR>
Glenn sets the writeup in 1116. That way he won't have to account for the<BR>
Aslans and the writeup is equally useful for the OTU and the GTU.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 16:06:46 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Peter Newman's Traveller Universe - evidence from the books ><BR>
<BR>
I don't think that scout vessels could be numerous enough to place on an<BR>
encounter table without being "mass-produced throughout the Imperium", but<BR>
that's a judgement call that involves getting involved in economics,<BR>
starport capacities, and so forth, so I won't argue it.<BR>
<BR>
Your interpretation still means that a "nonstandard" roll on either table<BR>
really means "any scout vessel except the Scout/Courier."<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Peter Newman [mailto:pnewman@gci.net]<BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 2:20 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Peter Newman's Traveller Universe - evidence from the books<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> If Xboats, Xboat Tenders, Survey Ships, and Scout Cruisers are not<BR>
> "standard" designs, why is there a seperate entry on the encounter tables<BR>
> that include them for "nonstandard" designs (when, using your definitions,<BR>
> they should fall under that classification)?  <BR>
> Under your interpretation, you could roll "nonstandard" and substitute any<BR>
> of the other table entries except the scout courier, making the table<BR>
> largely useless.<BR>
<BR>
No what it means is that of the numerous very common types of<BR>
Scout vessels which do not qualify as standard because they are <BR>
manufactured at too few places to qualify as "being manufactured<BR>
throughout the Imperium" as required by the definition of<BR>
standard of p. 76 of the ImpEnc that these types are sufficiently <BR>
common that they will be encountered often enough to deserve their<BR>
own lines on the table.<BR>
<BR>
If Scout vessels are manufactured (in mass quantities) at<BR>
a few ports there could be enough of them in space for them<BR>
to _need_ their own lines on the encounter table (unlike other<BR>
nonstandard designs which are much rarer).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:22:50 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: An alternate TL definition<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman writes:<BR>
<BR>
>Yes but unless CrImp 1 = $15 US then it is less than the<BR>
>$25,000 1987 US dollars GURPS lists as basic starting wealth<BR>
>for that TL. <BR>
<BR>
Both the Traveller credit and the GURPS $ was defined around the same time<BR>
and were both equal to 1 US$ at the time. So 1 Crimp should be roughly equal<BR>
to a GURPS $.<BR>
 <BR>
>Why take Primitive -2 TL's [GTL 8 not GTL 10] for 10 points <BR>
>when it will also reduce your starting wealth by 60%? You <BR>
>can get the same 10 points by taking Struggling and loose<BR>
>only 50% of your income and have no problems dealing w/<BR>
>TL 10 equipment.<BR>
> <BR>
>RANT: Who has noticed that in GURPS Trav 2nd Ed the base TL of the Imperium<BR>
>is GTL 10 (TTL 12). Anyone who knows how to operate GTL 12 (TTL 15)<BR>
>equipment (i.e. any Imperial Naval or Marine personnel as well as trillions<BR>
>of TL 12 world inhabitants has to pay _50_ points (half their starting<BR>
>point total) on the High Technology +2 Tl's advantage. Most of the<BR>
>character templates in the book are useless to a 100 point character now<BR>
>because they include TL 12 skills that will now require a 50 point advantage.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, the Imperium does not have a base TL. Campaigns have base TLs. GT<BR>
(IMO) makes the mistake of assuming that just because the average TL of the<BR>
Imperium is 10 (which it is, according to canon), the average campaign<BR>
should have a base TL equal to that. IMO any campaign dealing with the<BR>
comparatively small subset of the Imperial population that is its starfaring<BR>
community should have a base TL of 12 instead.<BR>
<BR>
So far the problem has been dealt with by ignoring TLs in GT character<BR>
writeups and leaving it up to the individual GMs how to implement them.<BR>
Not very satisfactory, but there it is. <BR>
<BR>
>This is completely nuts! It would have been much better to define the basic<BR>
>TL as GTL 12 and simply note that many people in the Imperium have 2 or more<BR>
>levels of the primitive disadvantage.<BR>
<BR>
Agreed. In addition I think that the standard TL minuses should be smaller in<BR>
a Traveller universe (maybe half standard rounded down) and the value of<BR>
the primitive disadvantage correspondingly smaller.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 22:23:14 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 12 Apr 2000 09:19:47, "Douglas E. Berry"<BR>
<gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> If 101 Anal Retentive Rules is going to be published<BR>
>> by BITS, which is British, perhaps we need to change<BR>
>> the title to 101 Anal-Retentive rules as it is my understanding<BR>
>> that British custom is (or at least was) to hyphenate<BR>
>> compound words more frequently than Americans do.<BR>
><BR>
>just to stir the pot...  I'm half-English, and was taught to spell by my<BR>
>father.<BR>
<BR>
Ugh! I can't believe I've been reading this whole thread. Doug! What<BR>
the hell have you started?!? <BR>
<BR>
You evil!<BR>
Evil man...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"Thoughts of sex distracted me and now I have to immolate myself to subdue the<BR>
 buzzing in my head!"                 -Tom Servo<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2302<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 12 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2303<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich ..."<BR>
Re: Just what is TL?<BR>
Re: My man Norris<BR>
Re: TML Archives<BR>
Re: GT-Q "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
re: Wars within the Imperium<BR>
RE: GT-Q "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century<BR>
RE: Astronomy in the 57th Century<BR>
Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich, ..."<BR>
Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
Logicrucible Software<BR>
Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
Re: Smart weapons<BR>
re:  Aki/Glisten<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: Boardgames <BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 19:17:00 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
<BR>
"James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>After staring at 48 pages for *that* length of time, your eyes tend to<BR>
>glaze over and you miss little rule misconceptions that we felt were<BR>
>painfully clear initially (ie: didn't need better wording).  These would be<BR>
>examples of a writer making an honest mistake-- an excuse I offered to the<BR>
>previous thread on more than one occasion.  We had only 48 pages at our<BR>
>disposal, and I often asked Andy or Dom later if we could include another<BR>
>example or two to clarify a few points.  The answer more often than not was<BR>
>"we simply don't have the room for any additional text".<BR>
<BR>
Some points - ACQ is actually 56 pages, but the centre 8 are a <BR>
separately numbered pull out booklet of all the key rules and tables, <BR>
and references back to their full details in the rules. Aim is to <BR>
save you all a lot of time. They laminate nicely. So the core rules <BR>
are 48 packed A5 pages.<BR>
<BR>
We intend to publish any questions answered as an FAQ on the BITS <BR>
site, and this has the scope for examples. If anyone wants to donate <BR>
a scenario or two we can use those and put them up too.<BR>
<BR>
Space was an issue, but somehow we got it all in (except Grav Pong).<BR>
<BR>
>Time is also of the essence.  From the moment a gaming company says "yes,<BR>
>we would be interested in a manuscript for your idea", you have a finite<BR>
>number of weeks/months to submit the final version.  Tough luck if you<BR>
>found problems with the final version after that date.<BR>
<BR>
We weren't quite that nasty to you ;-)<BR>
<BR>
>These are some of the realities of game design.  I suggest you design your<BR>
>own complete ruleset and submit it here for discussion.  Then we'll see how<BR>
>it is accepted.  Or you can order a copy (or two) of ACQ and tell me what<BR>
>you think :)<BR>
<BR>
I'd recommend ACQ having played it, but remember I'm biased and still <BR>
remember the first major revision / proof read I did which was done <BR>
on my Palm Pilot Pro on holiday in Malta!<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 08:29:26 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich ..."<BR>
<BR>
> Subject: Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich, ..."<BR>
><BR>
> Dalton Spence wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > "... but all I've got left is this lousy starship!"<BR>
> ><BR>
> > I want to create a GT character who was the favorite son of a *very*<BR>
> > wealthy family that gave him a Vanderbilt-class Yacht outright as a<BR>
> > birthday present, but later Disowned him when he married "beneath<BR>
> > himself." While the family was able to reclaim most of his income<BR>
> > producing assets, they were unable to touch the yacht itself or some<BR>
> > small (by their standards) cash reserves. Fortunately his new bride<BR>
> > used to be his "chauffeur" and has a valid Limited Master's licence.<BR>
> > Together they plan to recruit the wife's brother as their engineer<BR>
> > and turn the ship into an express cargo transport.<BR>
<BR>
Sounds like a remarkably good campaign hook. Just Do It, and point costs be<BR>
damned.<BR>
<BR>
> > 2.) To turn the yacht into a cargo vessel they want to rip out ten<BR>
> >     staterooms replacing them with 4 Life Support modules, thereby<BR>
> >     keeping life support and power slices the same and increasing<BR>
> >     the cargo area by 38 spaces. The owner and his wife will share<BR>
> >     the master suite, the lounge will be kept intact for use by any<BR>
> >     crew in the eight new bunks (at least three mechanics/engineers<BR>
> >     will be needed for routine daily maintenance), and the remaining<BR>
> >     stateroom will be used by the engineer/brother-in-law. How much<BR>
> >     time and money would be spent on this "disimprovement?" What is<BR>
> >     the salvage value could he get on the stripped luxury fittings?<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Ooooh, an expensive post-manufacture refit job ? Can they afford it ?<BR>
<BR>
And those wild and crazy guys at Auric Tech suggested ...<BR>
<BR>
> IMHO, you're better off converting the Spacedock and/or Vehicle Bay to<BR>
> cargo space, and keeping the Staterooms for passenger traffic.  While<BR>
> I'm not conversant with GT ship design, I do know that, in other design<BR>
> sequences (such as FF&S2 for T4), cargo spaces mass more than<BR>
> staterooms, per unit of volume.  Thus, replacing staterooms with cargo<BR>
> space will degrade Acceleration to some degree.<BR>
><BR>
> If you go with the passenger liner idea, keep the luxury fittings.  They<BR>
> may help attract a better class of passenger, with higher ticket prices.<BR>
<BR>
Hear hear.<BR>
<BR>
Me, I'd leave everything the way it is in the Vandy, and lease it out as a<BR>
high-speed luxury small liner, with a sideline in floating party wagon.<BR>
<BR>
Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:41:18 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: Just what is TL?<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
<BR>
>>You do need metalworking to use gunpowder as I pointed out. However, that's<BR>
>>by the way. In the TU you don't need anything except a mail order catalog<BR>
>>to discover any technology. TLs are, IMO, exclusively _application TL_, not<BR>
>>discovery TL.<BR>
> <BR>
>Excuse me? I seem to have missed the post where you show that<BR>
>metalworking is needed to use gunpowder? It'll make nice *bombs* in<BR>
>clay pots.<BR>
 <BR>
What I had said earlier was that you needed metalworking for anything other<BR>
than a petard.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:51:15 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: My man Norris<BR>
<BR>
Dom Mooney writes:<BR>
<BR>
>MT Journal is DGP.<BR>
 <BR>
But as I only just noticed a few weeks ago, MTJ3 and MTJ4 are copyright GDW.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 18:53:10 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: TML Archives<BR>
<BR>
It's at ftp.mpgn.com set your browser to that locale<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 01:02:10 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
<BR>
Dalton Spence writes:<BR>
<BR>
>I want to create a GT character who was the favorite son of a *very*<BR>
>wealthy family that gave him a Vanderbilt-class Yacht outright as a<BR>
>birthday present, but later Disowned him when he married "beneath<BR>
>himself." While the family was able to reclaim most of his income<BR>
>producing assets, they were unable to touch the yacht itself or some<BR>
>small (by their standards) cash reserves. Fortunately his new bride<BR>
>used to be his "chauffeur" and has a valid Limited Master's licence.<BR>
>Together they plan to recruit the wife's brother as their engineer<BR>
>and turn the ship into an express cargo transport.<BR>
> <BR>
>1.) According to GT:FT p.101 unless a character is filthy rich, the<BR>
>    maximum equity he can hold in his ship is MCr4.8 (which is much<BR>
>    less than a Vandy's MCr44.1 price tag), but Temporary Wealth<BR>
>    only goes up to the Wealthy level (which is exceeded by the Ship<BR>
>    Owners advantage anyway). According to CI p.77, "A starting<BR>
>    character who has just been Disowned has the starting wealth of<BR>
>    his old Wealth level and the income of his new Wealth level."<BR>
>    Does the Disowned disadvantage allow you to buy higher levels of<BR>
>    Wealth and treat them as Temporary? What if you want an income<BR>
>    class *other* than Average?<BR>
<BR>
I forget where it says so, but IIRC _FT_ gives the GM the option to just<BR>
give the PCs a ship and be done with it. Personally I consider that the<BR>
only fair way to do it. Why should one person be burdened with the cost<BR>
of a ship that is essential for the campaign? As for officer rank, if a<BR>
character can use his rank to get respect (ie. positive reaction modifiers)<BR>
from NPC strangers, then it is worth points. But if not, charging points<BR>
for them is simply a way to punish a player for having the character who<BR>
is the captain of the ship.<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 23:50:26 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
At 15:01 -0400 12/4/00, "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
>I bought the T4 rulebook from a bargain bin, and was surprised to find I<BR>
>liked it. I've found some other modules available, but I know at least some<BR>
>of them are dross.<BR>
><BR>
>Which ones should I buy? We're probably looking at two or three, including<BR>
>FFS2, at least for the first order.<BR>
><BR>
>Advice needed, sophs!<BR>
<BR>
Don't buy:<BR>
Starships - Broken designs and SSDS that needs errata. Get SSDS from <BR>
the Missouri archive and I can roll out a stack of designs if you <BR>
want standards using Rob Prior's QSDS.<BR>
Emperor's Vehicles - No TLs and lots of missing stuff.<BR>
The Annillik Run - D&D in space. Utter crap that has no resemblance <BR>
to the CORE proposal.<BR>
First Survey - broken data of limited use.<BR>
<BR>
If you are planning to run it buy:<BR>
Central Supply Catalog - Equipment<BR>
Emperor's Arsenal - Guns<BR>
<BR>
For Background material consider:<BR>
Milieu 0 Campaign (CORE - rather than Milieu 0 as it has 32 pages <BR>
extra plus First Survey)<BR>
Alien's Archive - usuable minor races stuff but printed in a large <BR>
font because it's small.<BR>
Imperial Squadrons - Navy campaigns, plus FFW rules.<BR>
Psionic Institutes (ex-CORE - nice stuff on using psionics in campaigns)<BR>
Long Way Home & Gateway (IG versions of the BITS adventure (OOP) 'The <BR>
Long Way Home')<BR>
<BR>
For rules stuff consider:<BR>
Pocket Empires (CORE) - economics rules and games for T4, plus <BR>
diplomat character<BR>
FFS2<BR>
<BR>
Maybes:<BR>
Naval Architect's Manual - Deckplans, but some not canon.<BR>
Mission's of State - 2 decent adventures in this, but one has already <BR>
been reprinted in full by BITS (The Khiidkar Incident) and has much <BR>
more to it than the original.<BR>
<BR>
Download -<BR>
QSDS 1.5 (bug fixed version at BITS)<BR>
RPSCS0.9 (also at BITS)<BR>
Combat Crib Sheet (EA and T4 integrated with corrected task levels at BITS)<BR>
There is a weapon design spreadsheet and PE spreadsheet by Andrew <BR>
Moffatt-Vallance there too.<BR>
Consider Mayday M4.1 for combat (BITS)<BR>
<BR>
And buy ACQ!<BR>
<BR>
Also - consider emailing Marc and asking for the T4.1 playtest if he <BR>
is still distributing it. And don't forget the IHTIT rule....<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 23:46:11 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Wars within the Imperium<BR>
<BR>
At 16:19 -0400 12/4/00, Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com> wrote:<BR>
>I'm not defending the Monroe Doctrine, actually.  It's an<BR>
>arrogant statement of US dominance of the Americas, and has been<BR>
>largely, if not entirely, ignored for a long time.  The Monroe<BR>
>Doctrine accordinly suited President Reagan perfectly, and he<BR>
>should have invoked it, if only to stay in character.<BR>
<BR>
Sure - I wasn't meaning that as an attack - it was trying to put it <BR>
in a context for a US perspective.<BR>
<BR>
>I think American English and British English may have slightly<BR>
>different meanings.  We often use hegemony to mean predominance<BR>
>of one state over its neighbors, whether they are part of an<BR>
>organization like a confederation or not.<BR>
<BR>
That's what I was starting to think.<BR>
<BR>
Cheers,<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:11:47 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: GT-Q "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
<BR>
On the other hand, if the character who owns the ship can give the PCs<BR>
orders or can direct the direction of the campaign by being the final word<BR>
on where his ship goes, it might be worth some points.  It's a definite<BR>
advantage in those cases.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen [mailto:rancke@diku.dk]<BR>
I forget where it says so, but IIRC _FT_ gives the GM the option to just<BR>
give the PCs a ship and be done with it. Personally I consider that the<BR>
only fair way to do it. Why should one person be burdened with the cost<BR>
of a ship that is essential for the campaign? As for officer rank, if a<BR>
character can use his rank to get respect (ie. positive reaction modifiers)<BR>
from NPC strangers, then it is worth points. But if not, charging points<BR>
for them is simply a way to punish a player for having the character who<BR>
is the captain of the ship.<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:05:22 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Leonard Erickson <shadow@krypton.rain.com><BR>
>Well, a simple glance at the tankage diagrams for various rockets<BR>
>shows that the *volume* ratio of LOX/LH2 is more like 4-to-1. I<BR>
>remember *that* much. But I don't recall which is the 4 and which is<BR>
>the 1.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Well the shuttle external tank is mainly LH2 with a smaller LOX tank in the<BR>
nose, so I would guess that the 4 would be LH2 and the 1 is LOX.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:19:55 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Astronomy in the 57th Century<BR>
<BR>
That makes sense since Oxygen is four times as dense as Hyrdogen.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Matthew Bond [mailto:mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk]<BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 5:05 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Leonard Erickson <shadow@krypton.rain.com><BR>
>Well, a simple glance at the tankage diagrams for various rockets<BR>
>shows that the *volume* ratio of LOX/LH2 is more like 4-to-1. I<BR>
>remember *that* much. But I don't recall which is the 4 and which is<BR>
>the 1.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Well the shuttle external tank is mainly LH2 with a smaller LOX tank in the<BR>
nose, so I would guess that the 4 would be LH2 and the 1 is LOX.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 16:42:31 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich, ..."<BR>
<BR>
As the bad commercials say 'Just Do It'...no need to rules-lawyer the<BR>
_background_ to your campaign.<BR>
<BR>
Besides, 'free' ships have a habit of sucking creds into the vaccuum no<BR>
matter what, right , Eris? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Dalton Spence wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> "... but all I've got left is this lousy starship!"<BR>
> <BR>
> I want to create a GT character who was the favorite son of a *very*<BR>
> wealthy family that gave him a Vanderbilt-class Yacht outright as a<BR>
> birthday present, but later Disowned him when he married "beneath<BR>
> himself." While the family was able to reclaim most of his income<BR>
> producing assets, they were unable to touch the yacht itself or some<BR>
> small (by their standards) cash reserves. Fortunately his new bride<BR>
> used to be his "chauffeur" and has a valid Limited Master's licence.<BR>
> Together they plan to recruit the wife's brother as their engineer<BR>
> and turn the ship into an express cargo transport.<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:46:24 -0600<BR>
From: Dale Gyles <gyles@mtn-webtech.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
<BR>
At 06:23 PM 4/12/00 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:05:39 -0400<BR>
>From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
><BR>
>Phased Array Transducers have no moving parts.  However, they deal with<BR>
>sound instead of light.<BR>
>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
>From: "Anthony Jackson" <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
><BR>
>> Dale Gyles writes:<BR>
>> > Are phased array lasers possible?  I was wondering if the elements of a<BR>
>> > phased array radar were scaled down to optical wavelengths, could a<BR>
>laser<BR>
>> > with the general characteristics of the radar be built?  No moving<BR>
>parts,<BR>
>> > beam aiming & focusing done electronically, etc.<BR>
>><BR>
>> Maybe.  I'm not convinced that you'd have no moving parts, however, or<BR>
>really<BR>
>> any significant improvement in capability.  Traveller lasers are already<BR>
>> wildly optimistic.<BR>
>> ><BR>
>> > If this were possible, and assuming weapon grade power levels were<BR>
>> > feasible, this device could be its own beam pointer.  It could engage<BR>
>> > several small targets at the same time, etc.<BR>
>><BR>
<BR>
>> How do these benefits arise from being a phased array?<BR>
<BR>
I think that a phased array radar can electronically segment itself into<BR>
smaller subarrays.  Some segments could be a beam pointers, others (larger)<BR>
could be weapons.  At least that's what I was wondering about, assuming my<BR>
initial assumptions about the radar are correct.  I used to play Harpoon a<BR>
lot, and read quite a bit about Aegis cruisers.  IIRC, an Aegis radar<BR>
system segments itself into beam pointers for terminal guidance.  That is<BR>
how it can handle the large number (classified I suppose) of targets it is<BR>
designed to kill.<BR>
<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Dale Gyles<BR>
Black Eagle, MT<BR>
gyles@mtn-webtech.com<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 18:45:56 -0500<BR>
From: "D. Smart" <dsmart@imagin.net><BR>
Subject: Logicrucible Software<BR>
<BR>
Greetings, all<BR>
<BR>
Has anyone on the list gotten their hands on a current<BR>
version of Logicrucible's Galaxy & World simulation<BR>
software?<BR>
<BR>
David<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:10:08 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
<BR>
Dale Gyles writes:<BR>
<BR>
> >> How do these benefits arise from being a phased array?<BR>
> <BR>
> I think that a phased array radar can electronically segment itself into<BR>
> smaller subarrays.  Some segments could be a beam pointers, others (larger)<BR>
> could be weapons.  At least that's what I was wondering about, assuming my<BR>
> initial assumptions about the radar are correct.  I used to play Harpoon a<BR>
> lot, and read quite a bit about Aegis cruisers.  IIRC, an Aegis radar<BR>
> system segments itself into beam pointers for terminal guidance.  That is<BR>
> how it can handle the large number (classified I suppose) of targets it is<BR>
> designed to kill.<BR>
<BR>
Well, I have no idea what a 'beam pointer' really is anyway; a rangefinder I<BR>
guess (FF&S doesn't state clearly).  Weapons-grade lasers are a poor choice <BR>
for that role -- you want something with a much broader beam.  Tracking multiple objects doesn't require a phased array.<BR>
<BR>
It might in principle be possible to split the beam from a phased array<BR>
laser to hit multiple targets, but I really can't imagine any situation in<BR>
which you would want to do so, and I don't think it would work for a grav<BR>
focus laser in any case.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:08:22 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons<BR>
<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
<BR>
>> Why make it a ring or wristband or whatever?  Why not make it<BR>
<BR>
>>an implant or something swallowed?  If it's swallowed, it will<BR>
<BR>
>>pass out of the body regularly for maintenance and can be <BR>
>>passed to another officer.  If it's an implant, it could be <BR>
>>anywhere -- in a tooth, in the mastoid sinus, whereever.  <BR>
><BR>
>The problem with your idea is that then the officer's gun can <BR>
>still be used to shoot hi, *Especially* during a struggle when <BR>
>the gun will be as close if not closer to his body as it is <BR>
>when in his normal firing posture. <BR>
>That's why they prefer a ring, but (currently) settle for a <BR>
>wristband. Because that way the gizmo is ony a few inches from <BR>
>the gun. Get the gun a foot or more away from the gizmo, and <BR>
>the gun won't fire. <BR>
<BR>
Good point.  What if we implant it in the lower part of the<BR>
radius, which is probably big enough to hold it?  Metacarpals<BR>
may be too small.  <BR>
<BR>
How about calibrating the gun to the firer's aura?  It would<BR>
only fire if he or she is in a calm and collected state, not<BR>
agitated, angry, or fearful.  (Yes, I am in Northern California<BR>
- -- Marin County at the moment, even.)<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:15:28 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Aki/Glisten<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
>Subject: Aki/Glisten (was re: Landgrab: Fornice)<BR>
><BR>
>Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
>>-- except that, if I do, I'll probably ignore tht "As"<BR>
>>allegiance code; it doesn't make any sense to me that Aslan <BR>
>>Ihatei could somehow sneak onto a world with a population of <BR>
>>over a billion, in sufficient numbers to effectively take it <BR>
>>over, especially when it's *one parsec* from a subsector <BR>
>>capital (Glisten) with a Naval base and Scout base(!).   Just <BR>
>>how many million Ihatei are supposed to have moved in there? <BR>
>>How about a thousand million?<BR>
<BR>
No, I didn't write that.  Someone else did.  I haven't been<BR>
participating in that discussion at all.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:21:05 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
>From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
<BR>
>Note to self: Never discuss grammar with a lawyer.<BR>
<BR>
You should've been at court with me yesterday.  Opposing counsel<BR>
and I got into an argument over a semicolon (among other<BR>
things).<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 17:33:02 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames <BR>
<BR>
>From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
>Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics) <BR>
>On Wed, 12 Apr 2000 10:37:07 -0800, Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
>> AFAIK the WH40K rules do not prohibit players from <BR>
>>deliberately making spurious arguments.<BR>
><BR>
>I know of NO RPG or wargame that *specifically* prohibits<BR>
>"arguments".<BR>
<BR>
Dad:  "You kids stop that arguing over the game right now!"<BR>
Younger Brother:  "But Daa-aad, we're not arguing!"<BR>
Older Brother:  "And in any case, even if we were arguing, we<BR>
weren't arguing over the game."<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
(No, that's not my family.  My brother and I never argued over games.)<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 20:40:38 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
"James W. Lindsay" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> On Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:48:48 -0800, Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> > James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote<BR>
> ><BR>
> > > Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> > > > If comic book<BR>
> > > > fans will buy the same comic twice with a different cover than<BR>
> > > > logically so will Traveller fans.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > > For us to understand your definition of "logic", could you please explain<BR>
> > > the above preposterous statement?<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Marketing ploys which rely on the illogic on the customer are<BR>
> > not, in and of themselves, illogical. I will thank you<BR>
> > very much not to continue to call things preposterous<BR>
> > simply because you are unfamiliar with them.<BR>
><BR>
> You're not listening.  I asked you to provide the "logic" behind your<BR>
> assumption that what's good for comic book collectors is good for Traveller<BR>
> fans.  IOW, what is the *logic* behind your assumption that Traveller fans<BR>
> would buy multiple products with different covers solely on the fact that<BR>
> comic book collectors frequently do the same?  I'm not asking for an<BR>
> opinion, I'm asking for logic.<BR>
><BR>
> Your previous posts are chocked full of the terms "logic" and "logically",<BR>
> yet you apparently do not know how to use these words in conversation.<BR>
> That's the end of this thread, as far as I'm concerned...<BR>
<BR>
Um . . someone missed the satire.<BR>
<BR>
You want the logic?  Because of the speculation market in comic<BR>
books, particularly for Issue #1's, milestones, special issues,<BR>
Death of Superman, etc., comic manufacturers found that they<BR>
could sell the same comic 4 times to the same person, who ordinarily<BR>
would buy only one.  These are marketed as special "collectible"<BR>
issues, with the implication that it would be worth something<BR>
more than a regular issue in the future (which is crap, since they<BR>
print more in the first place).  So, Joe Comicbuyer spends 4 times<BR>
his normal 'habit' for this 'special event'.  That goes so successfully<BR>
that it is soon time for another 'special event'.<BR>
<BR>
There is significant cross-over in the comic and sci-fi RPG buying<BR>
market.  Take the same sci-fi RPG book, change the cover a<BR>
few times (say one by Foss and one by Jesse, who will sell more?),<BR>
label them "special", and sell multiples of the 'ordinary' market.<BR>
<BR>
It works for Japanese language Pokemon cards.<BR>
Even TV Guide and Forbes (or was it Fortune) have gotten<BR>
into the act.<BR>
<BR>
But Peter was making a joke.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 20:47:21 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Alright. I'm going to do it.<BR>
><BR>
> I bought the T4 rulebook from a bargain bin, and was surprised to find I<BR>
> liked it. I've found some other modules available, but I know at least some<BR>
> of them are dross.<BR>
><BR>
> Which ones should I buy? We're probably looking at two or three, including<BR>
> FFS2, at least for the first order.<BR>
><BR>
> Advice needed, sophs!<BR>
><BR>
> Nick<BR>
<BR>
Pocket Empires!  Pocket Empires!  Pocket Empires!<BR>
<BR>
Sorry.  Just about my favorite supp. ever, even though I don't<BR>
use it much.<BR>
<BR>
If I could only have 3, they would be:<BR>
Pocket Empires, Imperial Squadrons, and Milieu 0.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 20:53:18 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
SD Mooney wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> And buy ACQ!<BR>
<BR>
Its ready for ordering?  Did I miss the annoucement?<BR>
I want my yesterday!!!<BR>
  SJGames doesn't list it yet.<BR>
<BR>
IwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantit!<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2303<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 13 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2304<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Far Frontiers Sector Data?<BR>
RE: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
RE: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
Re: Boardgames (and Rules-Weasels)<BR>
Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
More updates at Tavonni<BR>
Squad Leader<BR>
re: Wars within the Imperium<BR>
Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
Re: Landgrab: Aki<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: Secrets of ACQ<BR>
Re: Norris is still de man<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 18:02:50 -0700<BR>
From: Jim Cooper <tloql@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Far Frontiers Sector Data?<BR>
<BR>
As I do have only bits and pieces, it I would certainly be nice to get a<BR>
complete set,  preferably electronic,  but any way would be nice.<BR>
<BR>
Sword-Worlder wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I have a copy of the manuscript for the Far Frontiers Sector supplement,<BR>
> which was never published.  Is there a particular world or subsector you are<BR>
> looking for, or were you looking for a complete set?<BR>
><BR>
> BTW, is there any interest in seeing this stuff get published?  Print or<BR>
> electronic?<BR>
><BR>
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
> Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
> www.downport.com<BR>
> The Traveller Domain<BR>
><BR>
> ----- Original Message -----<BR>
> From: <Qstor@aol.com><BR>
> > Does anyone know of a write up of the UWP's for this sector? I didn't see<BR>
> on<BR>
> > on the CORE Web Site...Does any else know where they can be found?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 21:28:39 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
<BR>
Jason Kemp said:<BR>
<BR>
>Thanks, Everyone,<BR>
><BR>
>I've gotten some great advice on handout creation, introductory<BR>
>adventure ideas, GMing techniques to introduce players to the game,<BR>
>and some great leads on some GMing articles. I'd like to thank<BR>
>everyone who's given input so far, and the TML in general, for being<BR>
>so giving of your skills and experiences.<BR>
<BR>
No problem at all. Hope it helps! Good luck with running your campaign: May<BR>
you not find yourself burdened with rules lawyers, and may you be blessed<BR>
with considerate players who understand how much work goes into GMing.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 21:33:26 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson said (concerning barcodes):<BR>
<BR>
>Yeah. My thought was to have the basic card have a description of the<BR>
>"obvious" about the object, and the bar code contain details (3of9 code<BR>
>probably, since that has 0-9, A-Z, plus some punctuation).<BR>
><BR>
>So the card might have a bar code acroos the top (or back) and then<BR>
>just say "short sword". With lots and lots of room for the player to<BR>
>add info as he figures it out.<BR>
<BR>
This is a really good idea, even if the GM is technologically challenged (a<BR>
code number at the top of the card corresponds with a GM card with in-depth<BR>
information). I'm considering a return to running Gamma World, and this<BR>
could be pretty handy.<BR>
<BR>
>> Good stuff. I'll have to check out some Solar Queen novels. They sound<BR>
>> pretty nifty.<BR>
><BR>
>There are a few recent ones, with some other author, and the 4<BR>
>originals from the 60s & 70s.<BR>
><BR>
>In order:<BR>
><BR>
>Sargasso of Space<BR>
>Plague ship<BR>
>Voodoo Planet<BR>
>Postmarked the Stars<BR>
><BR>
>Redline the Stars(?)<BR>
>(I can't recall the title)<BR>
>A Mind for Trade<BR>
<BR>
Any suggestions, or should I just read them in order? (Not like I have time<BR>
to read, but my schedule should open up in the summer, I plan on doing a lot<BR>
of novel reading).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 18:32:20 -0700<BR>
From: "Kelly St.Clair" <kellys@efn.org><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (and Rules-Weasels)<BR>
<BR>
There is a saying in the text-based online roleplaying community (MUDs, <BR>
MUSHes, etc - predecessors to the current MMORPGs) which I am certain has <BR>
its equivalent in every field of game design:  "You can't solve player <BR>
problems with software."<BR>
<BR>
That is, you cannot solve meta-game issues like inappropriate behavior by <BR>
adding more in-game rules.  The former are, by definition, outside the <BR>
ability of the game to affect.  (Worse, most weasels are experts at <BR>
interpreting any possible rule to their own advantage, as seen in other <BR>
posts on this thread.)  Meta-game problems can only be dealt with in a <BR>
meta-game way.<BR>
<BR>
If someone in your group is being a weasel, your only real choices are (1) <BR>
get him to stop/change (perhaps impossible) and (2) tell him to leave the <BR>
game (sometimes difficult, but not impossible).  Period.<BR>
<BR>
Becoming a weasel/rules-lawyer/munchkin yourself in order to combat him is <BR>
not a solution; it just increases the overall weasel population.  See <BR>
Nietzche's quote about monsters and the abyss.<BR>
<BR>
- --------------<BR>
Kelly St.Clair    "You know, Brink, you've been acting funny ever since<BR>
kellys@efn.org     you came back from the dead.  (I can't believe I just<BR>
                    said that.)"    -- Commander Boston Low, THE DIG<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 20:36:09 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >> Nick<BR>
> >> +++<BR>
> >> I sense some TNE heresy coming on. Eris - can I borrow your hat?<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Looks more like treason to me... The old guard in the TNe list won't<BR>
> >like this, you know :)<BR>
<BR>
Hey, can I get charged with sedition, then? ;-)<BR>
> <BR>
> So what? Under FFS2 rules, I've got cheaper (and so more) warships than<BR>
> them.<BR>
<BR>
Besides, using FF&S2, you can always trot out the _Montana_ class, for<BR>
extra firepower.  If you feel the need for a more..._substantial_ ship,<BR>
I can forward the _Shiva_ class BB.  1 million dtons of carnage.  Lovely<BR>
(IMNSHO)!<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 11:45:44 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: More updates at Tavonni<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
(The Bonaventure jumps in-system, scans for bogeys and life signs... then raises<BR>
advertising hoardings, changing its transponder to match... ;-)<BR>
<BR>
I have finally uploaded all the vehicles made by _trendi_ to the Beowulf Down<BR>
site. These include:<BR>
     - a number of fast cars and speeders (ie. both wheeled and grav)<BR>
       based on the real-world Vector W2 TwinTurbo;<BR>
     - the Brunel combat command car;<BR>
     - the trendi AirCar.<BR>
<BR>
Go to Tavonni Specialities ==> trendi ==> Vehicles.<BR>
<BR>
BTW Doug, glad you liked the penguin link!<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson        Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>
http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw                       davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material & opinions contained within are solely those<BR>
of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>
position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 12:15:52 +1000<BR>
From: "The Roc" <roc@kewl.com.au><BR>
Subject: Squad Leader<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2000 4:27 AM<BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Bill Dunn <bdunn@epicsystems.com> wrote<BR>
><BR>
> > Then I guess Advanced Squad Leader, which has a random role rule, is a<BR>
> > victim of extremely poor design, huh?<BR>
><BR>
> I've never played ASL so I can't really say. The designers<BR>
> may have felt that the random roll rule was needed because<BR>
> the _other_ rules were too vague. I really could not<BR>
> say but given the sheer mass of ASL material this is a very<BR>
> real possibility.<BR>
<BR>
It has one of the most comprehensive set of award-winning rules for<BR>
"realistic" game results of any game I know of.<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> The rule ensures that if any of the players are of that<BR>
> subset of gamers who are weasels (approximately 20% of<BR>
> local population) that no game will ever be finished. They<BR>
> will argue about anything to win. Since my weasel detector<BR>
> is not perfect and one of the reasons I play games is for<BR>
> fun and stress relief I do not care to play games that have<BR>
> the potential of encouraging weaseldom.<BR>
<BR>
I'm sorry to hear you have so many poor gamers.  I have never encountered<BR>
abuse of this rule in Squad Leader before.  Once or twice there is a<BR>
situation on a gaming weekend, but usually it is with ambiguous wording of a<BR>
given rule, that once decided upon, works for both players.<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> If you have a 50% chance of winning any argument by making<BR>
> spurious arguments than it is to your game benefit make<BR>
> a continual series of them on every point whatsoever.<BR>
> If you are not personally a weasel player you will be much<BR>
> more likely to loose as the weasel wins half of his ridiculous<BR>
> arguments.<BR>
<BR>
You really need to find a new gaming group or something.  No-one here would<BR>
stand for any players that did this.  Your weasles would be out of the group<BR>
(possibly playing heads & tails with each other alone).<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> In a game with a 50% rule you are likely to believe that your<BR>
> opponent is deliberately making a spurious argument to win.<BR>
> If the game does not have this rule you are less likely to<BR>
> make this conclusion.<BR>
<BR>
Never had the problem with SL (which does have this rule), so it says a lot<BR>
about the people you must play with if it's as common as you believe.<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> > it serves its purpose in facilitating play. And the plays the<BR>
> > thing...<BR>
><BR>
> It is a good mechanism for resolving rare genuine debates,<BR>
> however its presence in the rules is a guarantee that a<BR>
> weasel will immediately generate 100 false arguments so<BR>
> that he can win 50 of them.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
1 or 2 per weekend that work for both players once resolved?  Our average is<BR>
good compared to yours.<BR>
<BR>
- -- The Roc<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 19:28:30 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re: Wars within the Imperium<BR>
<BR>
>From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
<BR>
>At 16:19 -0400 12/4/00, Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
wrote:<BR>
>>I'm not defending the Monroe Doctrine, actually.  It's an<BR>
<BR>
>Sure - I wasn't meaning that as an attack - it was trying to <BR>
>put it in a context for a US perspective.<BR>
<BR>
Nor did I take it as such.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 04:33:53 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma writes:<BR>
<BR>
>From: Hans Rancke-Madsen [mailto:rancke@diku.dk]<BR>
>>I forget where it says so, but IIRC _FT_ gives the GM the option to just<BR>
>>give the PCs a ship and be done with it. Personally I consider that the<BR>
>>only fair way to do it. Why should one person be burdened with the cost<BR>
>>of a ship that is essential for the campaign? As for officer rank, if a<BR>
>>character can use his rank to get respect (ie. positive reaction modifiers)<BR>
>>from NPC strangers, then it is worth points. But if not, charging points<BR>
>>for them is simply a way to punish a player for having the character who<BR>
>>is the captain of the ship.<BR>
><BR>
>On the other hand, if the character who owns the ship can give the PCs<BR>
>orders or can direct the direction of the campaign by being the final word<BR>
>on where his ship goes, it might be worth some points.  It's a definite<BR>
>advantage in those cases.<BR>
 <BR>
Sure, IF he can and, more importantly, IF he's actually going to do it. But<BR>
how many player groups have you known where the nominal superior is at best<BR>
the tie-breaker? And that only if the player who plays the superior happens<BR>
to be the dominant player in the group. In the naval campaign I once ran<BR>
the players were quite good about not pushing things too far, but it was<BR>
nevertheless mostly consensus decisions. A captain's rank may be useful<BR>
in interaction with NPCs, but in my experience it is seldomly worth much<BR>
in interaction with other PCs. YMMV.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "Even sub-lieutenants are God's creatures,<BR>
         though it is hard to believe it sometimes."<BR>
                        Commander Ted Walker<BR>
                   "Secret Water" by Arthur Ransome<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 20:41:23 -0600<BR>
From: Dale Gyles <gyles@mtn-webtech.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
<BR>
>From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
>> I think that a phased array radar can electronically segment itself into<BR>
>> smaller subarrays.  Some segments could be a beam pointers, others (larger)<BR>
>> could be weapons.  At least that's what I was wondering about, assuming my<BR>
>> initial assumptions about the radar are correct.<BR>
><BR>
>Well, I have no idea what a 'beam pointer' really is anyway; a rangefinder I<BR>
>guess (FF&S doesn't state clearly).  Weapons-grade lasers are a poor choice <BR>
>for that role -- you want something with a much broader beam.  Tracking<BR>
multiple objects doesn't require a phased array.<BR>
><BR>
IIRC, a beampointer is a laser that illuminates a target and provides range<BR>
info and velocity/accelleration data from measuring the frequency shift.  I<BR>
read about them in Challenge magazine in Chadwick & Nilsen's article on<BR>
lasers, IIRC, they went into a little more detail there.  In Full Thrust or<BR>
Harpoon, beam pointers would be called weapon directors.  Basically, I<BR>
think beam pointers are supposed to be the optical equivelent of fire<BR>
control radars.<BR>
<BR>
>It might in principle be possible to split the beam from a phased array<BR>
>laser to hit multiple targets, but I really can't imagine any situation in<BR>
>which you would want to do so, and I don't think it would work for a grav<BR>
>focus laser in any case.<BR>
<BR>
I was thinking of this as an alternative technology.  I don't know if it<BR>
would have as good a range performance as a grav focus laser.  I was<BR>
thinking it might make a good point defense system.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Dale Gyles<BR>
Black Eagle, MT<BR>
gyles@mtn-webtech.com<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 23:01:36 -0400<BR>
From: Glenn Grant <neo@total.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Landgrab: Aki<BR>
<BR>
Walter, Bruce, Hans: thanks for the responses on my Aki question.  I like<BR>
both Bruce's and Hans' suggestions, and will certainly go with Hans' idea<BR>
and set my writeup in 1116.<BR>
<BR>
Best,<BR>
<BR>
+ Not Glenn Goffin +<BR>
<BR>
               Glenn Grant  <neo@total.net><BR>
_Northern Suns: The New Anthology of Canadian Science Fiction_<BR>
          Edited by David Hartwell & Glenn Grant<BR>
  ++Now in trade paperback from Tor Books++<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 15:19:07 +1200<BR>
From: a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz<BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
On 12 Apr 00, at 19:20, Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Alright. I'm going to do it.<BR>
<BR>
> I bought the T4 rulebook from a bargain bin, and was surprised to find I<BR>
> liked it. I've found some other modules available, but I know at least some of<BR>
> them are dross.<BR>
<BR>
> Which ones should I buy? We're probably looking at two or three, including<BR>
> FFS2, at least for the first order.<BR>
<BR>
> Advice needed, sophs!<BR>
<BR>
Ahh, another comes to T4, soon when the stars are right...<BR>
<BR>
Okay, so here is my personal and biased opinion of the T4 range.<BR>
<BR>
T4 rulebook - Excellant system, but has a number of annoying errata. Get <BR>
the errata (Downport or Doug Berry's site has them) and QSDS v1.5 from <BR>
the Missouri Archive (to replace the broken v1.4 in the book).<BR>
<BR>
Starships - A prime candidate for "most useful as a mousemat". Most ship <BR>
designs are broken. Download SSDS from the Missouri Archive instead.<BR>
<BR>
Central Supply Cataloge - A good range of equipment from a wide range of <BR>
TLs. Has a good vehicle design system, unfortunately its not comptable <BR>
with any of the other (FFS, QDSS and SSDS). Despite that, I think its <BR>
worth its place on the bookshelf.<BR>
<BR>
Aliens Archive - Fairly good. Ignore The Controlled, but the rest are okay. <BR>
Some good stuff here if you like using Aliens<BR>
<BR>
Milieu 0 - Excellent sourcebook for the era but Milieu 0 Campaign is a little <BR>
better. If you're playing in M0 and can't get Milieu 0 Campaign this is a <BR>
must have. Otherwise just a good background read.<BR>
<BR>
First Survey - Another candidate mousemat. Every world's law level is the <BR>
same as its government, plus a number of other errors. Useable with a lot <BR>
of work.<BR>
<BR>
Milieu 0 Campaign - This is Milieu 0 plus 32 extra pages (but I think they <BR>
are available on the web somewhere) bundled with First Survey in a hard <BR>
cover binding. Comments on Milieu 0 apply here.<BR>
<BR>
Emperors Arsenal - A weapon for every occasion from TLs 0 to 15 and <BR>
beyond. Well worth having.<BR>
<BR>
Pocket Empires - Campaigning on the _Grand_ political scale. If your <BR>
players are running their own multi-world empire, you need this book. <BR>
Basically a wargame with a strong roleplaying element.<BR>
<BR>
Psionic Institutes - This book was long overdue in Traveller. It puts some <BR>
long overdue flesh on Travellers barebones detailing of psionics. If you use <BR>
psionics in your games you want this one.<BR>
<BR>
Anomolies - A group of pre-packaged adventures for M0. Some good, <BR>
some not so good. If you have trouble designing your own senarios its <BR>
useful.<BR>
<BR>
Fire, Fusion and Steel - Gearheads Paradise, but tragically damaged by <BR>
the incomprehisible mangling of the equations and a number of errata. If <BR>
you like designing things this book is for you, but make sure you get the <BR>
errata.<BR>
<BR>
Emperors Vehicles - Vehicles of all types. Unfortunately none of them have <BR>
a TL listed, which makes the book of only limited usefulness to say the <BR>
least. If you're like me and fudge things a lot its vaguely useful, but Rob <BR>
Prior's 102 vehicles (a free pdf on BITS) is much better.<BR>
<BR>
Naval Architects Manual - Deckplans. They are generic, intended to be <BR>
plugged together to make ships. Interesting, but there are lots of deckplans <BR>
available elsewere.<BR>
<BR>
Imperial Squadrons - Basically a wargame. Reproduces the tables and <BR>
charts from Fifth Frontier War. Useful with Pocket Empires.<BR>
<BR>
Missions of State - More pre-packaged adventures for M0. Same <BR>
comments as Anomolies apply here.<BR>
<BR>
Long Way Home/Gateway - A two part adventure campaign for M0. If you <BR>
ignore the massive cannon change the jump tunnels imply these two are <BR>
good, but they do rather drive a truck through one of the fundimental <BR>
assumptions of Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
Annallik Run - My winner in the "most useful as a mousemat" stakes. <BR>
Gamma World and D&D meets Traveller and Traveller losses. If you like <BR>
giant mutant space fungi this is the book for you, otherwise leave it to die <BR>
like the dog it is.<BR>
<BR>
Other things to get: The 101 books by BITS are useful, ask Bruce <BR>
Macintosh for a copy of MCS nicely, RPSCS from BITS, The Definitive <BR>
Sensor Rules by Bruce (available on a number of websites).<BR>
<BR>
Also use the "Its Harder Than I Thought"* rule from T5. Ask Marc Millar <BR>
nicely and he might send you a copy of the playtest files for T5, which is <BR>
basically an evolved bug fied version of T4<BR>
<BR>
* The Its Harder Than I Thougth Rule.<BR>
When attempting any task, if the skill level plus their Jack of All Trades <BR>
skill of the character attempting the task does not equal or exceed the <BR>
number of whole (not half) dice being rolled, the task difficulty increases by <BR>
two levels. NOTE JoT skill only applies in determining if the penalty <BR>
applies, it does not help with the actual roll.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 21:07:20 -0700<BR>
From: Kristian Miller <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
<BR>
Bill Dunn wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Then I guess Advanced Squad Leader, which has a random role rule, is a<BR>
> victim of extremely poor design, huh? Baloney. The random roll rule is there<BR>
> to prevent lengthy arguments over very subtle interpretations in the text,<BR>
<BR>
What!?  What rule number is that?  I'm rather doubtful that it exists;<BR>
but, ASL is so comprehensive and cross-referenced that if it does it<BR>
should be easy to find.<BR>
<BR>
I know the Warhammer series has such a rule.  But that is a rather brief<BR>
miniatures rules set in a strange environment so unusual situations<BR>
might arise.  ASL, I doubt it.<BR>
<BR>
Kristian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:20:04 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>  I bought the T4 rulebook from a bargain bin, and was surprised to find I<BR>
>  liked it. I've found some other modules available, but I know at least some<BR>
>  of them are dross.<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Which ones should I buy? We're probably looking at two or three, including<BR>
>  FFS2, at least for the first order.<BR>
<BR>
I have most of the T4 stuff: except for Psionic's Institutes.<BR>
<BR>
In approximately decreasing order of usefulness in my M:0 TU:<BR>
<BR>
Basic rule book<BR>
Milieu 0 campaign hardback<BR>
    (has Milieu 0 + First Survey + other stuff)<BR>
Pocket Empires<BR>
FF&S2<BR>
Imperial Squadrons<BR>
Referee's Screen<BR>
<BR>
GURPS<BR>
TNE<BR>
<BR>
Central Supply Catalog<BR>
Emperor's Arsenal<BR>
Alien's Archive.<BR>
<BR>
Scratch paper<BR>
<BR>
Anything else T4.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 21:26:55 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
<BR>
>Are phased array lasers possible?  I was wondering if the elements of a<BR>
>phased array radar were scaled down to optical wavelengths, could a laser<BR>
>with the general characteristics of the radar be built?  No moving parts,<BR>
>beam aiming & focusing done electronically, etc.<BR>
It certainly isn't possible at current tech levels. There's currently a<BR>
fundamental<BR>
difference between how we make radio waves for radar (by adjusting electric<BR>
currents, which allows you do all sorts of creative things like phased arrays)<BR>
compared to how we make visible light, even in lasers (basically by hitting<BR>
atoms with really tiny hammers.)<BR>
<BR>
At higher tech levels, it's harder to say, of course; some sort of fundamental<BR>
miraculous breakthrough might occur. I think it's implied in FFS1 that<BR>
something<BR>
like this has partially happened, so that you can adjust the phase of a beam<BR>
across a flat emitter to make it act as if it was launched by a curved lens.<BR>
<BR>
Steering the beam (as opposed to foccusing/condition it) on the other hand, is<BR>
probably impossibly hard with this technique. To steer a radar beam in a<BR>
phased array radar, you need to adjust the phase by hundreds of cycles -<BR>
roughly<BR>
equal to the size of the array divided by the wavelength.<BR>
<BR>
To steer a visible-light beam with similar techniques you'd be adjusting the<BR>
phase<BR>
by millions or hundreds of millions of cycles - with much less margin for<BR>
error.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 14:21:24 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
Steve wrote:<BR>
>IwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantit!<BR>
><BR>
>bloo<BR>
<BR>
Calm down, Steve, before we know ACQ is available, Dom has to send Doug and<BR>
James the secret message "The Penguins Are In Flight"...<BR>
<BR>
;-)<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson        Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>
http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw                       davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material & opinions contained within are solely those<BR>
of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>
position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 23:11:18 -0700<BR>
From: Evyn MacDude <wmacdude@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
Steve Daniels wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Evyn MacDude wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> > > We begin writing the Unabridged Annotated and Appendicied<BR>
> > > Anthology of 101 Anally Retentive Rules,<BR>
> ><BR>
> >  Was that going to be the expigated Edition? The one with out<BR>
> > the Gannet?<BR>
><BR>
> Whew!  That reference almost slipped by.<BR>
><BR>
> Isn't it awfully nice to have an appendix . . .<BR>
<BR>
Well at least until it gets Inflamed.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Evyn...<BR>
<BR>
C-Space home http://home.att.net/~wmacdude/<BR>
<BR>
Get six jolly cowboys to carry my coffin<BR>
Get six pretty maidens to bear up my pall<BR>
Bunches of roses all over my coffin<BR>
Roses to deaden the clods as they fall<BR>
 Laredo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 23:18:19 -0700<BR>
From: Evyn MacDude <wmacdude@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Secrets of ACQ<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >Beleive me, Doug, you really don't want to know..... (And I am not going<BR>
> >to repeat the experiment. -  the consequences of failure would be too<BR>
> >horrific to consider!)<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Nowadays, if someone were to repeat the experiment, I would decline to<BR>
> >choose one of the penguins. It is a far better thing to go without than to<BR>
> >risk the effects of the red, blue or yellow (urgh).<BR>
><BR>
> You can identify green penguins by the taste?<BR>
<BR>
No texture....<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Evyn...<BR>
<BR>
C-Space home http://home.att.net/~wmacdude/<BR>
<BR>
Get six jolly cowboys to carry my coffin<BR>
Get six pretty maidens to bear up my pall<BR>
Bunches of roses all over my coffin<BR>
Roses to deaden the clods as they fall<BR>
 Laredo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 23:21:30 -0700<BR>
From: Evyn MacDude <wmacdude@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Norris is still de man<BR>
<BR>
SD Mooney wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> And I'm not called Vanessa.  Unless this is some surreal antipodean humour?<BR>
<BR>
Isn't it all?<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Evyn...<BR>
<BR>
C-Space home http://home.att.net/~wmacdude/<BR>
<BR>
Get six jolly cowboys to carry my coffin<BR>
Get six pretty maidens to bear up my pall<BR>
Bunches of roses all over my coffin<BR>
Roses to deaden the clods as they fall<BR>
 Laredo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 23:52:30<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
At 02:21 PM 4/13/2000 +1000, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Steve wrote:<BR>
>>IwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantit!<BR>
<BR>
>Calm down, Steve, before we know ACQ is available, Dom has to send Doug and<BR>
>James the secret message "The Penguins Are In Flight"...<BR>
<BR>
"Climb Mt. Erebus"<BR>
<BR>
"Penguin, Penguin, Penguin!"<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2304<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2305</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	4/13/00 8:34:38 AM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
Sender:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 13 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2305<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Logicrucible Software<BR>
Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2304<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: Planet III Software<BR>
Re: Just what is TL?<BR>
Re: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
Re: Vancian Fantasy<BR>
Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
Re: Scanners<BR>
Re: Smart weapons<BR>
Emperors Vehicles - call for assistance<BR>
Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
Pocket Empires and Imperial Squadrons<BR>
re: Aki/Glisten<BR>
Re: Just what is TL?<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: Economics (was Re: An alternate TL definition)<BR>
RE: Norris is still de man<BR>
Re: GURPS TL's (was Re: An alternate TL definition)<BR>
Re: Smart weapons<BR>
The Health of Traveller<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 23:53:02<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Logicrucible Software<BR>
<BR>
At 06:45 PM 4/12/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Has anyone on the list gotten their hands on a current<BR>
>version of Logicrucible's Galaxy & World simulation<BR>
>software?<BR>
<BR>
Why yes I have.  Lot of fun too.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 23:59:25<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
<BR>
At 10:27 AM 4/12/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> Then I guess Advanced Squad Leader, which has a random role rule, is a<BR>
>> victim of extremely poor design, huh? <BR>
><BR>
>I've never played ASL so I can't really say. The designers <BR>
>may have felt that the random roll rule was needed because <BR>
>the _other_ rules were too vague.<BR>
<BR>
*gasp*  ROFTLMAO!! "Too vague"?  ASL has seperate breakdown rules for<BR>
different production yearsof the same light machine gun!  The rules alone<BR>
fill two very large binders on my games shelf.. <BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 01:46:30 -0600<BR>
From: Dale Gyles <gyles@mtn-webtech.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2304<BR>
<BR>
At 03:27 AM 4/13/00 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 21:26:55 -0700<BR>
>From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>>Are phased array lasers possible?  I was wondering if the elements of a<BR>
>>phased array radar were scaled down to optical wavelengths, could a laser<BR>
>>with the general characteristics of the radar be built?  No moving parts,<BR>
>>beam aiming & focusing done electronically, etc.<BR>
>It certainly isn't possible at current tech levels. There's currently a<BR>
>fundamental<BR>
>difference between how we make radio waves for radar (by adjusting electric<BR>
>currents, which allows you do all sorts of creative things like phased<BR>
arrays)<BR>
>compared to how we make visible light, even in lasers (basically by hitting<BR>
>atoms with really tiny hammers.)<BR>
><BR>
>At higher tech levels, it's harder to say, of course; some sort of<BR>
fundamental<BR>
>miraculous breakthrough might occur. I think it's implied in FFS1 that<BR>
>something<BR>
>like this has partially happened, so that you can adjust the phase of a beam<BR>
>across a flat emitter to make it act as if it was launched by a curved lens.<BR>
><BR>
>Steering the beam (as opposed to foccusing/condition it) on the other<BR>
hand, is<BR>
>probably impossibly hard with this technique. To steer a radar beam in a<BR>
>phased array radar, you need to adjust the phase by hundreds of cycles -<BR>
>roughly<BR>
>equal to the size of the array divided by the wavelength.<BR>
><BR>
>To steer a visible-light beam with similar techniques you'd be adjusting the<BR>
>phase<BR>
>by millions or hundreds of millions of cycles - with much less margin for<BR>
>error.<BR>
><BR>
Thanks, makes sense to me the way you explain it.  Maybe I'll use this idea<BR>
as an Ancient artifact sometime.  Perhaps this would be a way to explain<BR>
the beam from the pyramid in the adventure in the back of the Traveller<BR>
Book. (Shadows, was the title, IIRC)  I may run that adventure, since my<BR>
players are unfamiliar with ALL of the classic adventures.  Appreciate the<BR>
input, sir.<BR>
<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Dale Gyles<BR>
Black Eagle, MT<BR>
gyles@mtn-webtech.com<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 22:55:01 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, 13 Apr 2000 14:21:24 +1000, david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Dear Folks -<BR>
> <BR>
> Steve wrote:<BR>
> >IwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantit!<BR>
> ><BR>
> >bloo<BR>
> <BR>
> Calm down, Steve, before we know ACQ is available, Dom has to send Doug and<BR>
> James the secret message "The Penguins Are In Flight"...<BR>
<BR>
But penguins can't fl--<BR>
<BR>
Oh, I get it...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Hit any user to continue.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 03:57:40 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Planet III Software<BR>
<BR>
I am uploading the individual .exe files, which will be accessible at<BR>
<BR>
http://www.downport.com/hiwg/software/ibm/p3/<BR>
<BR>
when I am done.  Bryan also sent another program that will appear in that<BR>
directory.  Sorry, I'm not sure what it is, but the name is "msmasked.zip"<BR>
<BR>
Additionally, Bryan gave me some MT spreadsheets that will be in<BR>
<BR>
http://www.downport.com/hiwg/spreadsheets/<BR>
<BR>
after I get the others uploaded.  Enjoy.<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:42:42 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Just what is TL?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
><BR>
>>>You do need metalworking to use gunpowder as I pointed out. However, that's<BR>
>>>by the way. In the TU you don't need anything except a mail order catalog<BR>
>>>to discover any technology. TLs are, IMO, exclusively _application TL_, not<BR>
>>>discovery TL.<BR>
>> <BR>
>>Excuse me? I seem to have missed the post where you show that<BR>
>>metalworking is needed to use gunpowder? It'll make nice *bombs* in<BR>
>>clay pots.<BR>
>  <BR>
> What I had said earlier was that you needed metalworking for anything other<BR>
> than a petard.<BR>
<BR>
If you have bamboo or paper you can build rockets. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:44:40 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson said (concerning barcodes):<BR>
<BR>
>>> Good stuff. I'll have to check out some Solar Queen novels. They sound<BR>
>>> pretty nifty.<BR>
>><BR>
>>There are a few recent ones, with some other author, and the 4<BR>
>>originals from the 60s & 70s.<BR>
>><BR>
>>In order:<BR>
>><BR>
>>Sargasso of Space<BR>
>>Plague ship<BR>
>>Voodoo Planet<BR>
>>Postmarked the Stars<BR>
>><BR>
>>Redline the Stars(?)<BR>
>>(I can't recall the title)<BR>
>>A Mind for Trade<BR>
><BR>
> Any suggestions, or should I just read them in order? (Not like I have time<BR>
> to read, but my schedule should open up in the summer, I plan on doing a lot<BR>
> of novel reading).<BR>
<BR>
I'd go in order, since they do mention stuff about the previous books. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:45:50 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Vancian Fantasy<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Vancian Fantasy? I am not grokking the reference, could you clarify? I got<BR>
> the others.<BR>
<BR>
Jack Vance is an author of SF and some Fantasy. The D&D magic system is<BR>
supposedly based on the way magic worked in a serioesd of fantasy<BR>
stories he wrote.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:49:24 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Phased Array Lasers?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Are phased array lasers possible?  I was wondering if the elements of a<BR>
> phased array radar were scaled down to optical wavelengths, could a laser<BR>
> with the general characteristics of the radar be built?  No moving parts,<BR>
> beam aiming & focusing done electronically, etc.<BR>
<BR>
Well, you could get a phased array light emitter. But it might not be a<BR>
laser. Also, the emitters have to be *smaller* than a wavelength. Which<BR>
is the killer, since light waves are so small.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 00:56:42 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Scanners<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> scanners, or variations on these?  On the scanner topic, can someone tell<BR>
> me how "motion detectors" work.<BR>
<BR>
Sure. Most use ultrasound. The emitter sends a signal bouncing around<BR>
the room. Any moving object reflects the signal at a different<BR>
frequency (due to Doppler shift). The detector notes this and sounds<BR>
the alarm.<BR>
<BR>
Some (like the ones that open the doors at stores these days) use low<BR>
power microwaves.<BR>
<BR>
This means that you can detect the sensor before it detects you...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 01:02:56 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>> Why make it a ring or wristband or whatever?  Why not make it<BR>
>>>an implant or something swallowed?  If it's swallowed, it will<BR>
>>>pass out of the body regularly for maintenance and can be <BR>
>>>passed to another officer.  If it's an implant, it could be <BR>
>>>anywhere -- in a tooth, in the mastoid sinus, whereever.  <BR>
>><BR>
>>The problem with your idea is that then the officer's gun can <BR>
>>still be used to shoot hi, *Especially* during a struggle when <BR>
>>the gun will be as close if not closer to his body as it is <BR>
>>when in his normal firing posture. <BR>
>>That's why they prefer a ring, but (currently) settle for a <BR>
>>wristband. Because that way the gizmo is ony a few inches from <BR>
>>the gun. Get the gun a foot or more away from the gizmo, and <BR>
>>the gun won't fire. <BR>
><BR>
> Good point.  What if we implant it in the lower part of the<BR>
> radius, which is probably big enough to hold it?  Metacarpals<BR>
> may be too small.  <BR>
><BR>
> How about calibrating the gun to the firer's aura?  It would<BR>
> only fire if he or she is in a calm and collected state, not<BR>
> agitated, angry, or fearful.  (Yes, I am in Northern California<BR>
> -- Marin County at the moment, even.)<BR>
<BR>
Alas, if you are *defending* yourself from an attack, you are going to<BR>
be agitated, and possibly angry or fearful. <BR>
<BR>
I'm not up on the details of that shooting. But I *do* have a rough<BR>
idea of what the odds of geeting shot are if you are a cop... *way* too<BR>
high. And worse yet, many of the shootings occur with no warning. I<BR>
think we recently had a cop get shot when he stopped somebody for<BR>
expired plates...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 23:42:24 +1200<BR>
From: a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz<BR>
Subject: Emperors Vehicles - call for assistance<BR>
<BR>
Nick's question regarding T4 got me to drag out Emperors Vehicles and <BR>
actually have a good look at it again. What struck me was that if the TL <BR>
information was available it would actually be a reasonably useful book. To <BR>
that end I have decided to attempt to reverse engineer all the designs and <BR>
make the TLs available. However knowing that some of the people who <BR>
designed the vehicles for EV are still on the list, I thought I'd ask if any of <BR>
the designs were still available to save me some work. I'll post my first cut <BR>
at the design TLs on my website <http://www.downport.com/amv/> within <BR>
the next few days. This will be  a best guess based on the published stats <BR>
(eg those listed as being powered by fusion+ are probably TL12 etc).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 00:02:13 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
<BR>
On 12 Apr 00, at 18:57, Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >> Nick<BR>
> >> +++<BR>
> >> I sense some TNE heresy coming on. Eris - can I borrow your hat?<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Looks more like treason to me... The old guard in the TNe list won't like<BR>
> >this, you know :)<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> So what? Under FFS2 rules, I've got cheaper (and so more) warships than<BR>
> them.<BR>
> <BR>
> Nick<BR>
> +++<BR>
> (Perhaps I should challenge the entire TNE-RCES list to Battle Rider By<BR>
> Email, starting at dawn....) (Except Jon Goff.) (And Antti, actually.)<BR>
<BR>
You're just afraid of engineers. Oh, wait you are one. It a conspiracy, <BR>
that what it is. Besides you've alraedy shown signs that you'll cheat. <BR>
I can see it now "you must have FFS legal designs" says Nick. Later: "I <BR>
never said which FFS."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 00:02:13 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
<BR>
On 12 Apr 00, at 20:36, Black ICE wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> > <BR>
> > >> Nick<BR>
> > >> +++<BR>
> > >> I sense some TNE heresy coming on. Eris - can I borrow your hat?<BR>
> > ><BR>
> > >Looks more like treason to me... The old guard in the TNe list won't<BR>
> > >like this, you know :)<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> Hey, can I get charged with sedition, then? ;-)<BR>
> > <BR>
> > So what? Under FFS2 rules, I've got cheaper (and so more) warships than<BR>
> > them.<BR>
> <BR>
> Besides, using FF&S2, you can always trot out the _Montana_ class, for<BR>
> extra firepower.  If you feel the need for a more..._substantial_ ship, I<BR>
> can forward the _Shiva_ class BB.  1 million dtons of carnage.  Lovely<BR>
> (IMNSHO)!<BR>
<BR>
I used to have a million DT BB made in FFS1 somewhere. Maybe I'll have <BR>
to recreate her.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 08:49:00 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Les Howie <travgrognard@yahoo.ca><BR>
Subject: Pocket Empires and Imperial Squadrons<BR>
<BR>
What do those supplements cover, anyway? <BR>
<BR>
What will I be able to do that I could not without<BR>
them; would the two together make a "stand-alone"<BR>
strategic game?<BR>
<BR>
=====<BR>
Les Howie<BR>
Wargaming Gearhead Heretic<BR>
imtu 1.0: tc t4 ru- ge++ !3i c++ jt++ au+ ls++ pi+ ta-- he++<BR>
<BR>
_______________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 08:47:41 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: re: Aki/Glisten<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
>No, I didn't write that.  Someone else did.  I haven't been <BR>
>participating in that discussion at all. <BR>
<BR>
Oops. That should have read "Glenn Grant"...I'm using<BR>
webmail, and have to attribute by hand at the moment,<BR>
my error.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 09:25:35 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Just what is TL?<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
>If you have bamboo or paper you can build rockets. <BR>
<BR>
Am I the only one who keeps thinking of Captain Kirk vs the Gorn?<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 22:55:01 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, 13 Apr 2000 14:21:24 +1000, david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Dear Folks -<BR>
> <BR>
> Steve wrote:<BR>
> >IwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantitIwantit!<BR>
> ><BR>
> >bloo<BR>
> <BR>
> Calm down, Steve, before we know ACQ is available, Dom has to send Doug and<BR>
> James the secret message "The Penguins Are In Flight"...<BR>
<BR>
But penguins can't fl--<BR>
<BR>
Oh, I get it...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Hit any user to continue.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 06:11:48 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Economics (was Re: An alternate TL definition)<BR>
<BR>
Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Both the Traveller credit and the GURPS $ was defined around the same time<BR>
> and were both equal to 1 US$ at the time. So 1 Crimp should be roughly equal<BR>
> to a GURPS $.<BR>
<BR>
No. Because of Inflation these numbers are not equal.<BR>
<BR>
The CR 1 Imp was defined as being approximately equivalent<BR>
in purchasing power to 1 _1977_ US dollar. (Although using<BR>
CT or MT cost of living rules may suggest different figures)<BR>
and thus call into question the validity of said approximation<BR>
I'd prefer not to go there for right now.<BR>
<BR>
One GURPS dollar was defined as being $1 US as of the year <BR>
of publication of that version of GURPS. <BR>
<BR>
One GURPS 1st ed dollar = $1 1986 US dollar<BR>
<BR>
One GURPS 3rd ed Rev dollar = $1 1994 US dollar<BR>
<BR>
One 1977 US dollar = $0.53 '86, $0.39 '94, and $0.35 '99<BR>
(2000 stats not available yet) dollar.<BR>
<BR>
One 1986 US dollar = $ 1.89 '77, $0.75 '94, and $0.67 '99<BR>
dollar.<BR>
<BR>
One 1994 US dollar = $ 2.54 '77, $1.34 '86, and $0.89 '99<BR>
dollar.<BR>
<BR>
Calculations are based on the US CPI. (CPI is a measure of<BR>
purchasing power and is therefore IMO the most applicable <BR>
tool to use in discussing purchasing power in Traveller, even <BR>
though CPI is not a perfect concept) They were calculated <BR>
using		http://www.westegg.com/inflation/<BR>
which I recommend.<BR>
<BR>
Since the value of the Cr Imp has not changed since 1977<BR>
while the value of the dollar has declined Cr 1 Imp should<BR>
be equal to $2.85 US 1999 dollars or $2.54 GURPS 3rd Ed<BR>
Rev dollars. For sake so simplicity I conceptualize $1<BR>
US as being equal to $2.50 to $3.00 US. I'm not going to <BR>
discuss if Traveller price lists include sales taxes in <BR>
the prices, one of the simplifying assumptions in my TU.<BR>
(which I personally feel is suggested by canon but would<BR>
rather not debate) is that sales taxes should either<BR>
be ignored or assumed to be included in rule book prices. <BR>
<BR>
1999 US dollars can be used to buy things that no<BR>
number of 1977 US dollars could buy (Pentium PC's)<BR>
because they had not yet been invented. Similarly<BR>
CrImp's can buy things that no amount of 1999 US$'s<BR>
can buy (grav belts) because they have not yet been<BR>
invented. The effects are hard to quantify. <BR>
<BR>
Therefore if the economy of a GTL 3 planet in the Imperium was <BR>
exactly like the economy of any other GTL world from GURPS<BR>
canon (base TL 3 Starting Wealth = $1,000) then the base starting<BR>
wealth of someone from that planet would be 1000/2.54 or<BR>
CrImp $394. Similarly the GTL 7 starting wealth would be<BR>
CrImp 5,906.<BR>
<BR>
Obviously the economies are not the same. In the Imperium <BR>
the GTL 3 & 7 planets have to compete with imports,<BR>
while single planet societies do not. This will have a<BR>
drastic effect on those economies. I think that this change<BR>
would be better modeled in terms of GURPS system mechanics<BR>
not by altering the _base_ wealth for that TL but rather<BR>
by altering the perceived distribution of that wealth.<BR>
A GTL 7 planet in the Imperium will have a higher<BR>
percentage of people who have taken the Poor and Struggling<BR>
disadvantages than a GTL 7 one planet setting will.<BR>
This will lower the mean per capita income used in calculating<BR>
planetary GDP (perhaps it should be GPP) but will not<BR>
affect the _base_ starting wealth for that TL.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 15:01:00 +0100<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Norris is still de man<BR>
<BR>
While people are talking about Norris I have to ask:<BR>
<BR>
The illustration on p116 of GURPS Far Trader ... is  that  Norris<BR>
actively participating in a barroom brawl?<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 06:19:24 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS TL's (was Re: An alternate TL definition)<BR>
<BR>
Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> >RANT: Who has noticed that in GURPS Trav 2nd Ed the base TL of the Imperium<BR>
> >is GTL 10 (TTL 12). Anyone who knows how to operate GTL 12 (TTL 15)<BR>
> >equipment (i.e. any Imperial Naval or Marine personnel as well as trillions<BR>
> >of TL 12 world inhabitants has to pay _50_ points (half their starting<BR>
> >point total) on the High Technology +2 Tl's advantage. Most of the<BR>
> >character templates in the book are useless to a 100 point character now<BR>
> >because they include TL 12 skills that will now require a 50 point advantage.<BR>
<BR>
> Actually, the Imperium does not have a base TL. Campaigns have base TLs. GT<BR>
> (IMO) makes the mistake of assuming that just because the average TL of the<BR>
> Imperium is 10 (which it is, according to canon), the average campaign<BR>
> should have a base TL equal to that. IMO any campaign dealing with the<BR>
> comparatively small subset of the Imperial population that is its starfaring<BR>
> community should have a base TL of 12 instead.<BR>
<BR>
> So far the problem has been dealt with by ignoring TLs in GT character<BR>
> writeups and leaving it up to the individual GMs how to implement them.<BR>
> Not very satisfactory, but there it is. <BR>
<BR>
It shows poor design to require (in G:Trav 2ndEd a 50 point<BR>
advantage for trillions of Imperials. The point cost of all<BR>
GTL 12 detailed NPC's (Patrons, Allies, Contacts, Enemies,<BR>
etc) will all have to be reworked since they now are 50 point<BR>
higher characters).<BR>
<BR>
> >This is completely nuts! It would have been much better to define the basic<BR>
> >TL as GTL 12 and simply note that many people in the Imperium have 2 or more<BR>
> >levels of the primitive disadvantage.<BR>
> <BR>
> Agreed. In addition I think that the standard TL minuses should be smaller in<BR>
> a Traveller universe (maybe half standard rounded down) and the value of<BR>
> the primitive disadvantage correspondingly smaller.<BR>
<BR>
For all TL's or just up to GTL 12? I don't want use of<BR>
GTL 15 Ancient artifacts to be -8 to skill instead of -15.<BR>
<BR>
Previous Traveller rules [MT] gave listed tasks as being +1 Diff<BR>
for each TTL the equipment was greater than your own or<BR>
+1 Diff for each Tech band (High Stellar, Average Stellar,<BR>
Early Stellar) it was lower than the TL you were trained at.<BR>
This is a fairly heavy penalty and seems roughly congruent<BR>
to me to GURPS TL penalties although obviously given the<BR>
difference task system differences an exact comparison is<BR>
hard.<BR>
<BR>
My suggestion would be that (as stated in GURPS Ultra Tech) <BR>
that most high tech programs can emulate older lower tech <BR>
versions of the same program. In Traveller dynamically reconfigurable <BR>
controls should allow the same thing to be done with most <BR>
shipboard skills. So if you are from a GTL 10 planet and <BR>
you are trying to fly a GTL 12 ship you simply set its controls <BR>
to emulate the TL 10 controls you are used to and fly it at <BR>
full skill.<BR>
<BR>
Moreover if basic campaign TL is set as GTL 12 (TTL 15)<BR>
then anyone who has not taken the Primitive disadvantage<BR>
will, by definition, not have problems w/ TL 12 equipment.<BR>
The only people who will have problems with it will be those<BR>
with Primitive. Even then they will, because of reconfigurable<BR>
controls, have fewer problems than in most GURPS settings.<BR>
<BR>
This does however mean that characters with experience with <BR>
systems at a wide variety of TL's may end up buying the<BR>
same skill two or more times (off of default from the highest<BR>
current skill). This will make character creation a bit more<BR>
of a hassle (which is unfortunate) but will make the resulting<BR>
charecters more plausible<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 07:50:17 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons<BR>
<BR>
>>>> Why make it a ring or wristband or whatever?  Why not make it<BR>
>>>> an implant or something swallowed?  If it's swallowed, it will<BR>
>>>> pass out of the body regularly for maintenance and can be<BR>
>>>> passed to another officer.  If it's an implant, it could be<BR>
>>>> anywhere -- in a tooth, in the mastoid sinus, whereever.<BR>
>>> <BR>
>>> The problem with your idea is that then the officer's gun can<BR>
>>> still be used to shoot hi, *Especially* during a struggle when<BR>
>>> the gun will be as close if not closer to his body as it is<BR>
>>> when in his normal firing posture.<BR>
>>> That's why they prefer a ring, but (currently) settle for a<BR>
>>> wristband. Because that way the gizmo is ony a few inches from<BR>
>>> the gun. Get the gun a foot or more away from the gizmo, and<BR>
>>> the gun won't fire.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Good point.  What if we implant it in the lower part of the<BR>
>> radius, which is probably big enough to hold it?  Metacarpals<BR>
>> may be too small.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> How about calibrating the gun to the firer's aura?  It would<BR>
>> only fire if he or she is in a calm and collected state, not<BR>
>> agitated, angry, or fearful.  (Yes, I am in Northern California<BR>
>> -- Marin County at the moment, even.)<BR>
> <BR>
> Alas, if you are *defending* yourself from an attack, you are going to<BR>
> be agitated, and possibly angry or fearful.<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm not up on the details of that shooting. But I *do* have a rough<BR>
> idea of what the odds of geeting shot are if you are a cop... *way* too<BR>
> high. And worse yet, many of the shootings occur with no warning. I<BR>
> think we recently had a cop get shot when he stopped somebody for<BR>
> expired plates...<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
Does anyone really think the so called "smart guns" will really deter<BR>
criminal misuse of firearms? Look at cell phones.  It is relatively easy to<BR>
clone them using easily obtained equipment.  How long after smart gun common<BR>
will someone post the plans for a universal unlocker on the internet?<BR>
<BR>
Smart guns are a political solution, conceived by politicians with no<BR>
knowledge of firearms technology. But using buzz words like "smart gun" make<BR>
them sound like they are doing something--like they 'care'.<BR>
<BR>
As for me, I'll pass on the smart gun thing, at least until it been proven<BR>
100% by at least 10 years of field experience.  If I'm carrying a gun for<BR>
last ditch self defense, the last thing I need is another layer of<BR>
complexity--something else to break at the critical moment.<BR>
<BR>
In life and death confrontation, KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) is the order<BR>
of the day.<BR>
<BR>
Just my personal rant.  Ignore as required.<BR>
<BR>
Tod<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 11:11:48 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: The Health of Traveller<BR>
<BR>
This is a bit hard to do without sounding like I'm tooting my own horn, but<BR>
here goes.  For any of you interested in how well Traveller is doing these<BR>
days, you might want to take a look at the stats page for Downport.com<BR>
during the first week of April.  Remember that these stats include multiple<BR>
web sites, too.  Ignoring the bogus "Hits" category, do the math on the<BR>
"Impressions" and "Number of User Sessions" stats!  Also, the number of<BR>
"Unique Users" is amazing to me.  Perhaps some of you are better able to<BR>
parse this info than I, so comments are encouraged.  My interpretation of<BR>
the data is "Woo-hoo!  Traveller is king!", but I may be somewhat biased ;-)<BR>
<BR>
http://www.downport.com/stats<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2305<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 13 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2306<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Security Leak Magazine Returns<BR>
Re: Planet 3 Software<BR>
Re: The Health of Traveller<BR>
RE: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
Re: Pocket Empires and Imperial Squadrons<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
RE: Norris is still de man<BR>
Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
re: Far Frontiers Sector Data?<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: Peter Newman's Traveller Universe - evidence from the books<BR>
Re: The Health of Traveller<BR>
Re: Security Leak Magazine Returns<BR>
Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
Re: Emperors Vehicles - call for assistance<BR>
Re: Scanners<BR>
re: Planet Three Software<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
Re: Smart weapons<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 11:16:00 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Security Leak Magazine Returns<BR>
<BR>
I just got a note from Gregg Giles, the publisher of the mid-eighties<BR>
fan'zine "Security Leak".  He is starting the project up again in electronic<BR>
form.  As part of the effort he is scanning the back issues.  I'm excited<BR>
about it because that mag is one of the few things that I have never found<BR>
to add to my collection.  Fresh CT material! :-)<BR>
http://www.securityleak.net<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 11:59:34 EDT<BR>
From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Planet 3 Software<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/13/00 8:34:38 AM Pacific Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
>  Subject: Re: Planet III Software<BR>
>  <BR>
>  I am uploading the individual .exe files, which will be accessible at<BR>
>  <BR>
>  http://www.downport.com/hiwg/software/ibm/p3/<BR>
>  <BR>
>  when I am done.  Bryan also sent another program that will appear in that<BR>
>  directory.  Sorry, I'm not sure what it is, but the name is "msmasked.zip"<BR>
<BR>
That program is the Planet 3 Traveller Travel Calculator (I guess I just told <BR>
Roger that), it was their first freeware program. It calculates travel times. <BR>
It needs renaming to Travcalc.zip I guess.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>  Additionally, Bryan gave me some MT spreadsheets that will be in<BR>
>  http://www.downport.com/hiwg/spreadsheets/<BR>
>  <BR>
>  after I get the others uploaded.  Enjoy.<BR>
 <BR>
    The MT spreadsheets are design sheets for MegaTraveller Starships, <BR>
TL11-TL15, they include all known errata. They are in Lotus 123 format <BR>
however. If someone would care to update them to Excel '97 or later and <BR>
forward me copies that would be appreciated though (Quattro Pro format would <BR>
also be appreciated).<BR>
    BTW, there are no help files with these, but I recall that under Quattro <BR>
Pro (old DOS version) they were easy to use. I understand this doesn't hold <BR>
true under the newer software (Excel; so much for ease of use).<BR>
<BR>
Bryan<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 12:22:03 EDT<BR>
From: JLAROSEE@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: The Health of Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Hi-<BR>
  My best indicator of the health of Traveller..in the time since its release, here at the store I've sold 11 copies of Classic Reprint..half going to "kids" too young to fit the legacy audience. By way of comparision, most new covers sell 3-4 copies for me in that timeframe. There is interest! When's Book 2 coming out Marc?<BR>
  Jay<BR>
  <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 10:43:00 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, it does depend pretty much on your players as to whether such an<BR>
advantage will fly or not.  If it's not working, and he did pay points for<BR>
it, then the captain should probably just get a point refund (probably<BR>
outside of the other players' hearing).<BR>
<BR>
I have had a few military games where the players did follow the PC in<BR>
charge, even when they totally disagreed with the way he was doing things.<BR>
The prime example is a Battletech game I ran a little while ago.  The first<BR>
insane idea he had was to walk their 'mechs out onto the dropship wings to<BR>
provide more firepower against an escaping enemy.  Several PCs were nearly<BR>
killed when their 'mechs lost atmospheric integrity in various limbs (no one<BR>
got hit in the head, fortunately).<BR>
The second insane idea was doing a 'mech combat drop  into the middle of<BR>
Solaris city in order to destroy a particular crime lord's home (agian, no<BR>
one got killed, but it got a little dicey).<BR>
The third was on a world that had a sort of "Vietnam" situation going, where<BR>
after they were sniped at by a local inside an indig village, he ordered a<BR>
500m radius cleared around their barracks (destroying the homes of hundreds<BR>
of the natives - it did not go over well with them, and the Liao Death<BR>
Commandos who were training local resistance took exception to it as well).<BR>
<BR>
In all cases, the players moaned about it, but followed orders.  Latter they<BR>
agreed (using 20/20 hindsight) that they should have killed him and taken<BR>
over - court martial or no.<BR>
Why did they follow orders?  Because he had rank.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen [mailto:rancke@diku.dk]<BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 8:34 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma writes:<BR>
<BR>
>From: Hans Rancke-Madsen [mailto:rancke@diku.dk]<BR>
>>I forget where it says so, but IIRC _FT_ gives the GM the option to just<BR>
>>give the PCs a ship and be done with it. Personally I consider that the<BR>
>>only fair way to do it. Why should one person be burdened with the cost<BR>
>>of a ship that is essential for the campaign? As for officer rank, if a<BR>
>>character can use his rank to get respect (ie. positive reaction<BR>
modifiers)<BR>
>>from NPC strangers, then it is worth points. But if not, charging points<BR>
>>for them is simply a way to punish a player for having the character who<BR>
>>is the captain of the ship.<BR>
><BR>
>On the other hand, if the character who owns the ship can give the PCs<BR>
>orders or can direct the direction of the campaign by being the final word<BR>
>on where his ship goes, it might be worth some points.  It's a definite<BR>
>advantage in those cases.<BR>
 <BR>
Sure, IF he can and, more importantly, IF he's actually going to do it. But<BR>
how many player groups have you known where the nominal superior is at best<BR>
the tie-breaker? And that only if the player who plays the superior happens<BR>
to be the dominant player in the group. In the naval campaign I once ran<BR>
the players were quite good about not pushing things too far, but it was<BR>
nevertheless mostly consensus decisions. A captain's rank may be useful<BR>
in interaction with NPCs, but in my experience it is seldomly worth much<BR>
in interaction with other PCs. YMMV.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "Even sub-lieutenants are God's creatures,<BR>
         though it is hard to believe it sometimes."<BR>
                        Commander Ted Walker<BR>
                   "Secret Water" by Arthur Ransome<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 10:25:40<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Pocket Empires and Imperial Squadrons<BR>
<BR>
At 08:49 AM 4/13/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>What do those supplements cover, anyway? <BR>
<BR>
Pocket Empires allows the players to take the roles of competeting<BR>
interstellar states, attempting to grow and deal with their neighbors.  A<BR>
lot of fun, if you are an economy gearhead of any calibre.<BR>
<BR>
Imperial Squadrons expanded a bit on the concept, and also provided rules<BR>
for playing navy characters.  You don't really need IS, except for the<BR>
astonishingly wonderful ship descriptions.<BR>
<BR>
>What will I be able to do that I could not without<BR>
>them; would the two together make a "stand-alone"<BR>
>strategic game?<BR>
<BR>
PE makes for an excellent strategic game by itself.  It understands that<BR>
"it's the economy, stupid" that drives society.  PE includes an abstract<BR>
system to resolve combat, and was more than sufficient to the task.<BR>
<BR>
I've only held on to a few T4 books, and PE/IS were two of them.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
<BR>
TML Great Old One<BR>
Plague of the Traveller Riders of the Apocalypse<BR>
Chant "Gridlore" thrice to summon.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 10:42:22 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Emperors Vehicles - Vehicles of all types. Unfortunately none of them have<BR>
> a TL listed, which makes the book of only limited usefulness to say the<BR>
> least. If you're like me and fudge things a lot its vaguely useful, but Rob<BR>
> Prior's 102 vehicles (a free pdf on BITS) is much better.<BR>
<BR>
Better yet, get Rob's Infini-V software and make your own. Way cool<BR>
piece of work. You'll need a Real Computer (TM) (aka Mac) to use it<BR>
though :-P<BR>
<BR>
I have a bunch of vehicles done during testing of the product at:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.u.arizona.edu/~bjohnson/csc_page.html<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 10:38:18<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Norris is still de man<BR>
<BR>
At 03:01 PM 4/13/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>The illustration on p116 of GURPS Far Trader ... is  that  Norris<BR>
>actively participating in a barroom brawl?<BR>
<BR>
That is His Grace Norris, Duke Regina, pssing news to Admiral Lord<BR>
Santocheev that his services to the Emperor are no longer required.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 09:53:08 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Does anyone really think the so called "smart guns" will really deter<BR>
> criminal misuse of firearms? Look at cell phones.  It is relatively easy to<BR>
> clone them using easily obtained equipment.  How long after smart gun common<BR>
> will someone post the plans for a universal unlocker on the internet?<BR>
<BR>
I thought that the purpose of smart guns was to reduce the <BR>
ability of the underclass to commit crimes (liberals may replace <BR>
the phrase "commit crimes" with the phrase "vent their justifiable <BR>
rage over their maltreatment by our racist, class prejudiced<BR>
exploitive capitalist system" at this point) by further increasing <BR>
the trend to price guns out of the spending range of all but <BR>
the affluent. Moreover smart guns increase the ability of<BR>
gun manufacturers to sell new, more expensive (and therefore<BR>
higher profit) guns to people who would otherwise stick<BR>
with their old guns by duping them into believing they are<BR>
'safer'.<BR>
<BR>
Say you are a single mother living in a slum and supporting <BR>
2 kids on welfare or a job at McDonalds you are much more likely to have<BR>
$75 for a low quality .25 POS 'Saturday Night Special'<BR>
then you are to have $750 for a smart gun. While the<BR>
$75 is not much of a gun it is better than no gun at<BR>
stopping criminals from breaking in, raping, and killing<BR>
you and your family.<BR>
<BR>
To this woman a $750 gun is out of reach while a $75 gun<BR>
is attainable with careful budgeting.<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: Traveller rules should have "cheap" inferior<BR>
versions of guns just as GURPS does.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 09:54:11 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> >I've never played ASL so I can't really say. The designers <BR>
> >may have felt that the random roll rule was needed because <BR>
> >the _other_ rules were too vague.<BR>
<BR>
> *gasp*  ROFTLMAO!! "Too vague"?  ASL has seperate breakdown rules for<BR>
> different production years of the same light machine gun!  The rules alone<BR>
> fill two very large binders on my games shelf.. <BR>
<BR>
Yes I understand all that. The more rules a game has the<BR>
more ways they can intersect with each other. The more<BR>
current rules a game has the more likely that new rules<BR>
might or will conflict with old rules. If a new rule does not <BR>
make it crystal clear in what circumstances, if any, it replaces <BR>
or modifies any or all old rules than (in a game without a Referee <BR>
to decide these conflicts) the new rule is too vague.<BR>
<BR>
Doug, Would you have preferred that I said something along<BR>
the lines of:<BR>
<BR>
"ASL has a large number of tightly written<BR>
rules. Because of the large number of rules they can<BR>
intersect in a large number of ways. To avoid the<BR>
possibility of conflict each new rule must be carefully<BR>
approached to ensure it does not conflict with any new<BR>
rules. As I have not read said rules I can not say for<BR>
certain if this is a case. However I dislike the 50% random<BR>
role rule as I have seen it encourage mean spirited<BR>
weasel like play. Therefore the only possible reason I<BR>
can imagine for any game designers who are known for<BR>
writing tightly written rules is if they acknowledge<BR>
that said rules may, in certain circumstances, conflict<BR>
with one another in such a way that a single unambiguous<BR>
rules hierarchy can not be established in all circumstances."<BR>
<BR>
Instead I wrote "too vague". Would you have preferred that<BR>
I wrote "too complex" or "too long"? How would you express<BR>
the above sentiment in a short phrase. (I'm not asking you<BR>
to _agree_ with the above sentiment I am simply asking how<BR>
you would have phrased it. I attempted to convey the<BR>
concept in 2 words rather than 100+ words, perhaps this<BR>
was an error.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 20:16:34 +0100<BR>
From: Mark Watson <markw@antares.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: re: Far Frontiers Sector Data?<BR>
<BR>
Dom - actually I also have copies of both the full Far Frontiers work by Dale<BR>
Kemper and another piece that was commissioned by Gamelords from him and never<BR>
published, called an astrogators guide to the protectorate (this latter piece<BR>
later evolved into GURPS Space Atlas #3 but was originally written for<BR>
Traveller). I spoke to Dale afterwards and asked him if he'd be interested in<BR>
using a publisher such as BITS and he expressed an interest - you interested? <BR>
<BR>
M<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 10 Apr 2000, SD Mooney wrote:<BR>
>At 0:59 -0400 10/4/00, Qstor@aol.com wrote:<BR>
>>Does anyone know of a write up of the UWP's for this sector? I didn't see on<BR>
>>on the CORE Web Site...Does any else know where they can be found?<BR>
><BR>
>They aren't at http://www.core.org.uk/<BR>
><BR>
>Dom<BR>
>BITS / CORE Webmaster<BR>
><BR>
>----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
>"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
>can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
>http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR>
- -- <BR>
Mark Watson, markw@antares.demon.co.uk<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 19:25:16 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
At 3:27 -0400 13/4/00, a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz wrote:<BR>
>T4 rulebook - Excellant system, but has a number of annoying errata. Get<BR>
>the errata (Downport or Doug Berry's site has them) and QSDS v1.5 from<BR>
>the Missouri Archive (to replace the broken v1.4 in the book).<BR>
<BR>
Actually, get the version of QSDS from the BITS site (QSDS1.5e) as it <BR>
has the only known piece of errata fixed (fuel consumption for <BR>
HEPLAR).<BR>
<BR>
>Starships - A prime candidate for "most useful as a mousemat". Most ship<BR>
>designs are broken. Download SSDS from the Missouri Archive instead.<BR>
<BR>
Hey! That's my line. And I actually did it for a while.<BR>
<BR>
>Emperors Vehicles - Vehicles of all types. Unfortunately none of them have<BR>
>a TL listed, which makes the book of only limited usefulness to say the<BR>
>least. If you're like me and fudge things a lot its vaguely useful, but Rob<BR>
>Prior's 102 vehicles (a free pdf on BITS) is much better.<BR>
<BR>
I can't believe I forgot 102 Vehicles... they are designed using <BR>
Infini-V, which uses the CSC rules.<BR>
<BR>
>Imperial Squadrons - Basically a wargame. Reproduces the tables and<BR>
>charts from Fifth Frontier War. Useful with Pocket Empires.<BR>
<BR>
There are also notes on playing in an active navy campaign (RPG).<BR>
<BR>
>Long Way Home/Gateway - A two part adventure campaign for M0. If you<BR>
>ignore the massive cannon change the jump tunnels imply these two are<BR>
>good, but they do rather drive a truck through one of the fundimental<BR>
>assumptions of Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
This all depends if you take them as a one-off Ancient device akin to <BR>
the pocket universe tunnels. YMMV<BR>
<BR>
>Annallik Run - My winner in the "most useful as a mousemat" stakes.<BR>
>Gamma World and D&D meets Traveller and Traveller losses. If you like<BR>
>giant mutant space fungi this is the book for you, otherwise leave it to die<BR>
>like the dog it is.<BR>
<BR>
Seconded. James Ward destroyed the CORE proposal, and also doesn't <BR>
understand Traveller technology (ships meeting in jump IIRC).<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 11:44:32 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Peter Newman's Traveller Universe - evidence from the books<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/11/00 11:01 PM, pnewman@gci.net issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> For further (CT) text evidence of this position see Azhanti High<BR>
> Lighting and The Kinnunir. Both ships were made at only a limited<BR>
> number of ports.<BR>
<BR>
All ships are made at a limited number of ports, no design is implemented at<BR>
every shipyard. It is not required that a specific model be manufactured at<BR>
every starport for it to be standard. YMMV I suppose, but at a loss of<BR>
credibility IMNSHO.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 14:59:07 EDT<BR>
From: CardSharks@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: The Health of Traveller<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/13/00 11:26:08 AM Central Daylight Time, <BR>
JLAROSEE@aol.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< When's Book 2 coming out Marc? >><BR>
<BR>
May, 2000<BR>
<BR>
Marc<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 12:10:11 -0700<BR>
From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Security Leak Magazine Returns<BR>
<BR>
>I just got a note from Gregg Giles, the publisher of the mid-eighties<BR>
>fan'zine "Security Leak".  He is starting the project up again in electronic<BR>
>form.  As part of the effort he is scanning the back issues.  I'm excited<BR>
>about it because that mag is one of the few things that I have never found<BR>
>to add to my collection.  Fresh CT material! :-)<BR>
>http://www.securityleak.net<BR>
><BR>
>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
>Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
>www.downport.com<BR>
>The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
Looks terrific, but a word of warning for folks, if you're using Netscape,<BR>
especially Netscape 4.7/Mac you might need to go into your advanced<BR>
preferences and disable 'Style sheets'.  It was jumbled before I did this.<BR>
I sent Gregg a message on it, I'm not sure what the problem is.<BR>
<BR>
				Zane<BR>
| Zane H. Healy                    | UNIX Systems Adminstrator  |<BR>
| healyzh@aracnet.com (primary)    | Linux Enthusiast           |<BR>
| healyzh@holonet.net (alternate)  | Classic Computer Collector |<BR>
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+<BR>
|     Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing,    |<BR>
|                   and Zane's Computer Museum.                 |<BR>
|                 http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/              |<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 12:40:41 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/12/00 1:10 PM, pnewman@gci.net issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Suppose that each High Pop type A port in the Imperium has a<BR>
> list of 200 designs that are standard at their port. For a<BR>
> ship to be standard across the Imperium the ship has to show<BR>
> up on a _lot_ of lists across a large Imperium. What I am saying<BR>
> is that it is reasonble to conclude that only a few ships would<BR>
> be on that list.<BR>
<BR>
Ah ha! Yes, I see your point now I think. I think you may be on to something<BR>
if I am not misinterpreting your stand. You are saying these are the<BR>
Imperium-wide standards, and allow for regional standards? While I disagree<BR>
still, I do so less vehemently. IMTU /all/ standards except a few government<BR>
contracted models are only *regionally* standard. The X-Boat, Sulliman, and<BR>
most of the others listed are in the gov-contracted class, and can be found<BR>
across the Imperium. The small craft listed are for the most part only<BR>
regionally standard, being encountered mostly in the Marches. Same with the<BR>
Safari ship.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 14:41:22 -0500<BR>
From: "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
    Tod and Peter bring up relevant points.<BR>
<BR>
    Frank Herbert, creator of the Dune series, summed it up well: Liberals<BR>
are closet Aristocrats, and I have seen nothing, at least here in the U.S.,<BR>
to disprove that statement.<BR>
<BR>
    We see a two-pronged movement against civilian ownership of firearms: On<BR>
the Legal front, and on the Social front. The objective facts of the issue<BR>
offer no support of gun control. Smart gun technology is the sugar coating<BR>
they are giving to total firearm registration in the name of "safety". There<BR>
are legitimate uses for the Technology: 62% of officers in the U.S. shot in<BR>
the line of duty are shot with their own weapon. For the average gunowner,<BR>
it would be merely one more thing to have to remember in a crisis.<BR>
<BR>
    I've been involved in the firearms industry for two decades, and it is<BR>
more than a little surreal how lawyers have made an non-issue such an issue.<BR>
"Negligent Marketing" a term coined by spin doctors with no idea of what<BR>
personal freedom and security are. They skirt the central issue and blame a<BR>
device for crime, when they overlook the operator.<BR>
<BR>
    Enough of the rant, I just couldn't stand it any longer.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
    Let's not forget the most infamous gun control supporter: Adolph Hitler.<BR>
I find it ironic that<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Peter Newman" <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2000 12:53 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com> wrote<BR>
><BR>
> > Does anyone really think the so called "smart guns" will really deter<BR>
> > criminal misuse of firearms? Look at cell phones.  It is relatively easy<BR>
to<BR>
> > clone them using easily obtained equipment.  How long after smart gun<BR>
common<BR>
> > will someone post the plans for a universal unlocker on the internet?<BR>
><BR>
> I thought that the purpose of smart guns was to reduce the<BR>
> ability of the underclass to commit crimes (liberals may replace<BR>
> the phrase "commit crimes" with the phrase "vent their justifiable<BR>
> rage over their maltreatment by our racist, class prejudiced<BR>
> exploitive capitalist system" at this point) by further increasing<BR>
> the trend to price guns out of the spending range of all but<BR>
> the affluent. Moreover smart guns increase the ability of<BR>
> gun manufacturers to sell new, more expensive (and therefore<BR>
> higher profit) guns to people who would otherwise stick<BR>
> with their old guns by duping them into believing they are<BR>
> 'safer'.<BR>
><BR>
> Say you are a single mother living in a slum and supporting<BR>
> 2 kids on welfare or a job at McDonalds you are much more likely to have<BR>
> $75 for a low quality .25 POS 'Saturday Night Special'<BR>
> then you are to have $750 for a smart gun. While the<BR>
> $75 is not much of a gun it is better than no gun at<BR>
> stopping criminals from breaking in, raping, and killing<BR>
> you and your family.<BR>
><BR>
> To this woman a $750 gun is out of reach while a $75 gun<BR>
> is attainable with careful budgeting.<BR>
><BR>
> ObTrav: Traveller rules should have "cheap" inferior<BR>
> versions of guns just as GURPS does.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 15:50:31 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: William Prankard <cmdrx@magicnet.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Emperors Vehicles - call for assistance<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 23:42:24 +1200<BR>
From: a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz<BR>
<BR>
>Nick's question regarding T4 got me to drag out Emperors Vehicles and <BR>
>actually have a good look at it again. What struck me was that if the TL <BR>
>information was available it would actually be a reasonably useful book.<BR>
To <BR>
>that end I have decided to attempt to reverse engineer all the designs<BR>
and <BR>
>make the TLs available. However knowing that some of the people who <BR>
>designed the vehicles for EV are still on the list, I thought I'd ask if<BR>
any of <BR>
>the designs were still available to save me some work. I'll post my first<BR>
cut <BR>
>at the design TLs on my website <http://www.downport.com/amv/> within <BR>
>the next few days. This will be  a best guess based on the published<BR>
stats <BR>
>(eg those listed as being powered by fusion+ are probably TL12 etc).<BR>
<BR>
Yes, mine are on my website, http://www.magicnet.net/~cmdrx/xtek<BR>
Click the Subsidiaries button.  Then select Baron von Kringle Toys or<BR>
GravametriX<BR>
<BR>
In the toy section can be found the GravBoard and Icarus rocket assist<BR>
hang glider<BR>
GravametriX produces the "Gravabago" Grav RV, The Scout Gravcycle, and the<BR>
Bungii Grav Powered hang glider.<BR>
<BR>
I also have a few Space fighter's in the book.  I don't have those on<BR>
site, but they may be on disc somewhere.  For all intents and purposes<BR>
they are QSDS designs assimilated into FF&S2 stats with a few extra<BR>
features.<BR>
<BR>
\  // Commander X<BR>
 \//  CEO X-TEK Industries of Deneb, LIC<BR>
T E K  Starship Contractor & High Energy Weapons Research<BR>
 //\  http://www.magicnet.net/~cmdrx/xtek/xtek.htm<BR>
//  \ 0608 D557777-A kk- va+ so+ zh+ da+ A723<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 13:12:59 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Scanners<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/13/00 1:56 AM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
>> scanners, or variations on these?  On the scanner topic, can someone tell<BR>
>> me how "motion detectors" work.<BR>
> <BR>
> Sure. Most use ultrasound. The emitter sends a signal bouncing around<BR>
> the room. Any moving object reflects the signal at a different<BR>
> frequency (due to Doppler shift). The detector notes this and sounds<BR>
> the alarm.<BR>
> <BR>
> Some (like the ones that open the doors at stores these days) use low<BR>
> power microwaves.<BR>
> <BR>
> This means that you can detect the sensor before it detects you...<BR>
<BR>
Some use a selenium cell to detect variations in light, though I am sure<BR>
these are rather primitive compared to Leonard's examples. They have a<BR>
sensitivity setting, and probably won't work well at all in areas where the<BR>
lighting shifts like from swaying tree branches, etc. My grandmother's<BR>
outside lights use selenium cells.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 16:51:39 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: re: Planet Three Software<BR>
<BR>
On Tue, 11 Apr 2000 22:35:03 -0400 (EDT), SD Mooney<BR>
<dom@cybergoths.u-net.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>At 18:32 -0400 11/4/00, Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>>It turns out that I will _not_ be able to have a copy of the<BR>
>>software in question available _on_ Freelance Traveller; it's<BR>
>>just too damn large for my mirror site (sigh).  However, if<BR>
>>people send me URLs of where it can be downloaded from, it _will_<BR>
>>get appropriate links from Freelance Traveller's Computer<BR>
>>Connection.<BR>
<BR>
>How big is it? I could put it on the BITS archive.<BR>
<BR>
The combined zip file is upward of 5MB.  Each individual sector<BR>
installation file is around 1MB (there are five).<BR>
<BR>
I am informed that HIWG has a combined file at their Downport<BR>
site, and plans to make them available as separate sectors. (I<BR>
don't know whether once it's available as separate sectors, they<BR>
will also keep the combined archive.) Freelance Traveller will<BR>
probably link to those.  They're also on the HIWG CD-ROM, for<BR>
those who have it (\SOFTWARE\IBM\TRAV_NAV). But if you've got the<BR>
space, and are willing to donate it, I don't think anyone will<BR>
object to having them available at alternate locations.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 16:50:31 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
Matthew Helton said:<BR>
<BR>
>    Tod and Peter bring up relevant points.<BR>
<BR>
"Relevant" isn't exactly the term I would use in this situation.<BR>
<BR>
>    Frank Herbert, creator of the Dune series, summed it up well: Liberals<BR>
>are closet Aristocrats, and I have seen nothing, at least here in the U.S.,<BR>
>to disprove that statement.<BR>
<BR>
Good for Frank Herbert, and for you. Please note that I'm not subscribed to<BR>
this list to read your "personal rants" on the subject of gun control. In<BR>
fact, I've seen one too many of them here on the list. They start threads<BR>
that are annoying, that take a long time to die, and everybody gets their<BR>
panties in a bunch concerning the subject.<BR>
<BR>
Now, I don't have a problem with off topic posts in general, or even threads<BR>
which are off topic but which have some relevance to Traveller. I'd be<BR>
willing to bet that everybody here has either already made their minds up on<BR>
the subject of gun control in the U.S., or doesn't care. This forces me to<BR>
wonder what your motives were in posting such a message. Please take your<BR>
personal crusade elsewhere.<BR>
<BR>
The same goes doubly for Peter Newman (who I know has been here long enough<BR>
to know better).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 14:02:37 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons<BR>
<BR>
>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
<BR>
I had written:<BR>
>> How about calibrating the gun to the firer's aura?  It would<BR>
>> only fire if he or she is in a calm and collected state, not<BR>
>> agitated, angry, or fearful.  (Yes, I am in Northern <BR>
>> California -- Marin County at the moment, even.)<BR>
<BR>
You replied:<BR>
>Alas, if you are *defending* yourself from an attack, you are<BR>
>going to be agitated, and possibly angry or fearful. <BR>
<BR>
Well, some schools of thought say that a cool and disciplined<BR>
response will get better results.  That comes with training; the<BR>
natural response to attack is adrenaline coupled with emotions<BR>
like anger and fear.  Training can help one to use those<BR>
responses without becoming agitated and self-destructive.  At<BR>
least that's a martial arts perspective; maybe some of the LEOs<BR>
and soldiers on the list have a different perspective than I do.<BR>
 (Leonard, I've forgotten whether you work in law enforcement.) <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>I'm not up on the details of that shooting. But I *do* have a <BR>
>rough idea of what the odds of geeting shot are if you are a <BR>
>cop... *way* too high. <BR>
<BR>
What shooting?  I wasn't talking about a specific shooting.  My<BR>
limited reading suggests that you're right about the odds being<BR>
way too high.<BR>
<BR>
>And worse yet, many of the shootings occur with no warning. I<BR>
>think we recently had a cop get shot when he stopped somebody<BR>
>for expired plates...<BR>
<BR>
Then you don't have a chance to get too agitated.  If you<BR>
survive, react quickly and coolly.  Yeah, right.  It's easy to<BR>
say.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2306<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2307</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	4/13/00 7:13:57 PM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 13 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2307<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: Planet Three Software<BR>
RE: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
Re: Boardgames <BR>
Re: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: Smart weapons<BR>
Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
re: Planet Three Software<BR>
Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weaponsOT:<BR>
Re: Smart weapons<BR>
Re: Smart weapons<BR>
Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weaponsOT:<BR>
Re: Secrets of ACQ :Getting wildly off topic now! (sorry)<BR>
Re: Secrets of ACQ :Getting wildly off topic now! (sorry)<BR>
Re: Economics<BR>
re: Far Frontiers Sector Data?<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2305<BR>
Re Rules Lawyering<BR>
Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
Basic Starships (was Re: Basic Economics)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 13:58:06 -0700<BR>
From: "Tod Glenn" <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Planet Three Software<BR>
<BR>
I have plenty of space on my server as well, and am more than willing to<BR>
host it.<BR>
<BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2000 1:52 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: re: Planet Three Software<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
On Tue, 11 Apr 2000 22:35:03 -0400 (EDT), SD Mooney<BR>
<dom@cybergoths.u-net.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>At 18:32 -0400 11/4/00, Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>>It turns out that I will _not_ be able to have a copy of the<BR>
>>software in question available _on_ Freelance Traveller; it's<BR>
>>just too damn large for my mirror site (sigh).  However, if<BR>
>>people send me URLs of where it can be downloaded from, it _will_<BR>
>>get appropriate links from Freelance Traveller's Computer<BR>
>>Connection.<BR>
<BR>
>How big is it? I could put it on the BITS archive.<BR>
<BR>
The combined zip file is upward of 5MB.  Each individual sector<BR>
installation file is around 1MB (there are five).<BR>
<BR>
I am informed that HIWG has a combined file at their Downport<BR>
site, and plans to make them available as separate sectors. (I<BR>
don't know whether once it's available as separate sectors, they<BR>
will also keep the combined archive.) Freelance Traveller will<BR>
probably link to those.  They're also on the HIWG CD-ROM, for<BR>
those who have it (\SOFTWARE\IBM\TRAV_NAV). But if you've got the<BR>
space, and are willing to donate it, I don't think anyone will<BR>
object to having them available at alternate locations.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 14:23:51 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: RE: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
<BR>
>From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
<BR>
>In all cases, the players moaned about it, but followed<BR>
>orders.  Latter they agreed (using 20/20 hindsight) that they <BR>
>should have killed him and taken over - court martial or no.<BR>
>Why did they follow orders?  Because he had rank.<BR>
<BR>
Now that's what I call role-playing!<BR>
<BR>
"With all due respect, sir, this is the most fouled-up,<BR>
hare-brained, bass-ackwards approach to this mission that I, for<BR>
one, could ever have imagined, and it's likely to get some, if<BR>
not all, of us killed.  Sir."<BR>
<BR>
"Thank you, captain.  I appreciate your comments and tactical<BR>
expertise.  When will your company be ready to move out?"<BR>
<BR>
"0400, Sir!"<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 14:27:31 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Boardgames <BR>
<BR>
>From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
>Subject: Re: Boardgames (was Re:Basic Economics)<BR>
<BR>
>Yes I understand all that. The more rules a game has the more <BR>
>ways they can intersect with each other. The more current rules<BR>
<BR>
>a game has the more likely that new rules might or will <BR>
>conflict with old rules. If a new rule does not make it crystal<BR>
<BR>
>clear in what circumstances, if any, it replaces or modifies <BR>
>any or all old rules than (in a game without a Referee to <BR>
>decide these conflicts) the new rule is too vague.<BR>
<BR>
Funny how I'm the only one of my lawyer friends who has long<BR>
been an avid wargamer.  Your post could as easily be describing<BR>
litigation (we even have the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure,<BR>
and the rules of that game do change).<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 17:42:53 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Running A Sci-Fi Campaign<BR>
<BR>
I just finished a Mind for Trade and I LOVED it...It would make a great <BR>
game...espically if your players haven't read it....<BR>
<BR>
Mike<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 17:45:05 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/12/00 11:22:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>
a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< First Survey - Another candidate mousemat. Every world's law level is the <BR>
 same as its government, plus a number of other errors. Useable with a lot <BR>
 of work. >><BR>
is there an errata around somewhere? I couldn't locate one on the Web?<BR>
<BR>
Thanks<BR>
Mike McKeown<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 14:59:52 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 12 Apr 2000 01:44:09 PST, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> >>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
> ><BR>
> >>Actually, it seems cops are (somewhat) in *favor* of them. They<BR>
> ><BR>
> >>*know* how many officers get shot with their own weapon after <BR>
> >>it is taken away from them during a fight.<BR>
> >><BR>
> >>Of course, once the folks on the street find out whether it's <BR>
> >>the ring or wristband or <whatever> that enables firing, <BR>
> >>they'll just take that after disarming the officer. But it <BR>
> >>*will* make it harder to shoot the officer *during* the initial<BR>
> ><BR>
> >>struggle.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Why make it a ring or wristband or whatever?  Why not make it an<BR>
> > implant or something swallowed?  If it's swallowed, it will pass<BR>
> > out of the body regularly for maintenance and can be passed to<BR>
> > another officer.  If it's an implant, it could be anywhere -- in<BR>
> > a tooth, in the mastoid sinus, whereever.  <BR>
> <BR>
> The problem with your idea is that then the officer's gun can still be<BR>
> used to shoot hi, *Especially* during a struggle when the gun will be<BR>
> as close if not closer to his body as it is when in his normal firing<BR>
> posture. <BR>
> <BR>
> That's why they prefer a ring, but (currently) settle for a wristband.<BR>
> Because that way the gizmo is ony a few inches from the gun. Get the<BR>
> gun a foot or more away from the gizmo, and the gun won't fire. <BR>
<BR>
Provided the officer isn't lying on the ground with his arms raised,<BR>
instinctively attempting to defend himself from the criminal standing over<BR>
him with the gun pointed downwards.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
UFO's are real: the Air Force doesn't exist.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 23:39:22 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
At 17:02 -0400 13/4/00, "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<gun control rant snipped><BR>
<BR>
Hello. This is the *Traveller* Mailing List.<BR>
<BR>
It's only about two months since the last US gun control "debate".<BR>
<BR>
Not interested.<BR>
<BR>
Fed up of the thing.<BR>
<BR>
Been here, read it, watched the Digest flood with OT rubbish repeatedly.<BR>
<BR>
Fed up of the tenuous links to Traveller that support it.<BR>
<BR>
Let's FAQ it as something to be avoided. Please.<BR>
<BR>
Maybe we should do the things that used to happen here that were good <BR>
as well - such as product reviews. I notice that since T4 disappeared <BR>
no one really bothers aside from 'nice cover'. I'm relying on those <BR>
of you across the pond to give me a good heads up on what's worth <BR>
buying for Traveller. You're only doing it for films at the moment.<BR>
<BR>
Dom (bored of the Nth Gun Control Debate before it even starts in <BR>
Ernest, considering starting a discussion on something appropriately <BR>
OT for the UK readers - say either BMW/Rover or the NHS <gdr>)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 23:36:51 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Planet Three Software<BR>
<BR>
At 17:02 -0400 13/4/00, jzeitlin@cyburban.com wrote:<BR>
> >How big is it? I could put it on the BITS archive.<BR>
><BR>
>The combined zip file is upward of 5MB.  Each individual sector<BR>
>installation file is around 1MB (there are five).<BR>
><BR>
>I am informed that HIWG has a combined file at their Downport<BR>
>site, and plans to make them available as separate sectors. (I<BR>
>don't know whether once it's available as separate sectors, they<BR>
>will also keep the combined archive.) Freelance Traveller will<BR>
>probably link to those.  They're also on the HIWG CD-ROM, for<BR>
>those who have it (\SOFTWARE\IBM\TRAV_NAV). But if you've got the<BR>
>space, and are willing to donate it, I don't think anyone will<BR>
>object to having them available at alternate locations.<BR>
<BR>
I was thinking that FT and HIWG are both at Downport so it may be <BR>
worth putting up a second site on a different server. Will check my <BR>
ISP space and raid the HIWG CD for the files and put them at BITS.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 18:53:04 -0400<BR>
From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weaponsOT:<BR>
<BR>
Does this mean it's illegal for me to use my FGMP-15 at work in order to<BR>
influence my boss on the amount of my next raise I should get?<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
 J-Man<BR>
 ICQ# 2843475<BR>
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
 Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
 Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "SD Mooney" <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2000 6:39 PM<BR>
Subject: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weaponsOT:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> At 17:02 -0400 13/4/00, "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com><BR>
wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> <gun control rant snipped><BR>
><BR>
> Hello. This is the *Traveller* Mailing List.<BR>
><BR>
> It's only about two months since the last US gun control "debate".<BR>
><BR>
> Not interested.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 17:02:28 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Does anyone really think the so called "smart guns" will really deter<BR>
> criminal misuse of firearms? Look at cell phones.  It is relatively easy to<BR>
> clone them using easily obtained equipment.  How long after smart gun common<BR>
> will someone post the plans for a universal unlocker on the internet?<BR>
><BR>
> Smart guns are a political solution, conceived by politicians with no<BR>
> knowledge of firearms technology. But using buzz words like "smart gun" make<BR>
> them sound like they are doing something--like they 'care'.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, it's been suggested that the politicians want this because<BR>
many of the "better" technologies involved allow for a "universal<BR>
*locker*". <BR>
<BR>
Thus, at some point down the road, they could disable all the "smart<BR>
weapons" in an area by turning on a gizmo that blocked the signals from<BR>
the "keys". <BR>
<BR>
Sure, it's a paranoid idea. So is the idea that the state might require<BR>
registration, and then, later turn around and use the list as a basis<BR>
for confiscating the guns. Except that California is *doing* exactly<BR>
that. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 17:06:43 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
><BR>
> I had written:<BR>
>>> How about calibrating the gun to the firer's aura?  It would<BR>
>>> only fire if he or she is in a calm and collected state, not<BR>
>>> agitated, angry, or fearful.  (Yes, I am in Northern <BR>
>>> California -- Marin County at the moment, even.)<BR>
><BR>
> You replied:<BR>
>>Alas, if you are *defending* yourself from an attack, you are<BR>
>>going to be agitated, and possibly angry or fearful. <BR>
><BR>
> Well, some schools of thought say that a cool and disciplined<BR>
> response will get better results.  That comes with training; the<BR>
> natural response to attack is adrenaline coupled with emotions<BR>
> like anger and fear.  Training can help one to use those<BR>
> responses without becoming agitated and self-destructive.  At<BR>
> least that's a martial arts perspective; maybe some of the LEOs<BR>
> and soldiers on the list have a different perspective than I do.<BR>
>  (Leonard, I've forgotten whether you work in law enforcement.) <BR>
<BR>
Nope. I've known a few cops though. <BR>
<BR>
>>I'm not up on the details of that shooting. But I *do* have a <BR>
>>rough idea of what the odds of geeting shot are if you are a <BR>
>>cop... *way* too high. <BR>
><BR>
> What shooting?  I wasn't talking about a specific shooting.<BR>
<BR>
Sorry, there's shooting *someplace* that's been in the national news<BR>
the last couple of nights, and I thought you might be referring to it.<BR>
<BR>
> My<BR>
> limited reading suggests that you're right about the odds being<BR>
> way too high.<BR>
<BR>
>>And worse yet, many of the shootings occur with no warning. I<BR>
>>think we recently had a cop get shot when he stopped somebody<BR>
>>for expired plates...<BR>
><BR>
> Then you don't have a chance to get too agitated.  If you<BR>
> survive, react quickly and coolly.  Yeah, right.  It's easy to<BR>
> say.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, it's more along the lines of that sort of thing means that<BR>
cops *expect* to get shot every time they stop someone. So they are<BR>
more than a little tense every time they stop you. <BR>
<BR>
Folks just don't realize that a cop has no way to tell that you<BR>
*aren't* some crazed nut that'll snap at the sight of them. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 19:09:13 -0500<BR>
From: "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weaponsOT:<BR>
<BR>
Gee, calm down. Rant over. Pax.<BR>
<BR>
    Going back on topic, Smart guns need to thought out carefully. There are<BR>
places for them, and not. For Shipboard security use, and Law Enforcement in<BR>
Traveller, reality, where ever you might be, a Smart Gun would be great<BR>
idea.<BR>
<BR>
    Current implentations of the smart gun are, as with all  new concepts,<BR>
somewhat crude and narrowly-defined.<BR>
<BR>
    There are situations where an "early" smartgun could cause more problems<BR>
than it solves. Colt uses a Radio Transmitter on a wristband to effect the<BR>
smartgun safety. Not good if you break the wristband. More than a few<BR>
weapons are hit with gunfire in real life (An odd pheonomenon attributed to<BR>
the percieved threat of harm from the weapon). Of course, your batteries<BR>
going dead at a crucial moment could also ruin your whole day.<BR>
<BR>
    As I understand it, the gun receiver is sensitive to direction, so even<BR>
if the officer were "too close", it would not fire if pointed in the wrong<BR>
direction.<BR>
<BR>
    The Mag-Na-Trigger used on some revolvers currently is actually a pretty<BR>
decent way about the problem. You wear the ring on your firing hand ring<BR>
finger and a magnet trips a simple internal safety enabling the gun to be<BR>
fired.    I actually own one of these units, and can attest to its<BR>
effectiveness. True, the mechanical system is easier to get around, but then<BR>
again ther Cobalt-Samarium magnets they use in the rings are fairly hard to<BR>
come by.<BR>
<BR>
    Of course, with this, and Colt's system weak hand shooting is out of the<BR>
question.<BR>
<BR>
    So, yes I may be some gun nut, but I think I do have something for this<BR>
discussion.<BR>
<BR>
                                            Best,<BR>
<BR>
                                                        Matt Helton<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2000 5:53 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart<BR>
weaponsOT:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Does this mean it's illegal for me to use my FGMP-15 at work in order to<BR>
> influence my boss on the amount of my next raise I should get?<BR>
> ___________________________________________________________<BR>
>  J-Man<BR>
>  ICQ# 2843475<BR>
>  New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
>  Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
>  Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
> ___________________________________________________________<BR>
><BR>
> ----- Original Message -----<BR>
> From: "SD Mooney" <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
> To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
> Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2000 6:39 PM<BR>
> Subject: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart<BR>
weaponsOT:<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> > At 17:02 -0400 13/4/00, "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com><BR>
> wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > <gun control rant snipped><BR>
> ><BR>
> > Hello. This is the *Traveller* Mailing List.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > It's only about two months since the last US gun control "debate".<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Not interested.<BR>
> ><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:31:23 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Re: Secrets of ACQ :Getting wildly off topic now! (sorry)<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
Derrick wrote:<BR>
>In 1997, some of my mates performed the experiment. They took the penguins<BR>
>out of the wrapper and using a knife scratched the first letter of the colour<BR>
of the<BR>
>wrapper.<BR>
<BR>
"I will not buy this Penguin, it is scratched!"<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson        Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>
http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw                       davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material & opinions contained within are solely those<BR>
of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>
position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 20:45:37 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Secrets of ACQ :Getting wildly off topic now! (sorry)<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/13/00 8:37:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>
david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< In 1997, some of my mates performed the experiment. They took the penguins<BR>
 >out of the wrapper and using a knife scratched the first letter of the <BR>
colour<BR>
 of the<BR>
 >wrapper.<BR>
 <BR>
 "I will not buy this Penguin, it is scratched!" >><BR>
<BR>
It's bleeding deceased!!<BR>
<BR>
Mike<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:50:39 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Re: Economics<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
In replt to Hans, Peter Newman posted a review of the ImpCr to the US dollar:<BR>
>>So 1 Crimp should be roughly equal to a GURPS $.<BR>
><BR>
>Because of Inflation these numbers are not equal.<BR>
><BR>
>One 1977 US dollar = $0.53 '86, $0.39 '94, and $0.35 '99<BR>
>(2000 stats not available yet) dollar.<BR>
><BR>
>1999 US dollars can be used to buy things that no<BR>
>number of 1977 US dollars could buy...<BR>
>The effects are hard to quantify.<BR>
<BR>
You are probably better off looking at the beer standard (or bread standard,<BR>
pick a staple that is available in both eras). That is, I'll bet that US$1 in<BR>
1977 would buy you more beer than US$1 in 2000.<BR>
<BR>
*This* is the measure of the real value of the dollar, so perhaps you are<BR>
actually thinking the wrong way around. That is (going off the figures above), a<BR>
dollar in 1999 can only buy as much as 35 cents would have bought you in 1977...<BR>
<BR>
Another part of the analysis should look at wages then and now, and the relative<BR>
costs of basic items to income. Sure, a house AND land in Sydney cost $20,000 in<BR>
1970 (as opposed to $750,000 now) but you still paid it off over (at least) 20<BR>
years...<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson        Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>
http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw                       davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material & opinions contained within are solely those<BR>
of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>
position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 11:06:18 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: re: Far Frontiers Sector Data?<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
Mark Watson wrote:<BR>
>...I also have copies of the full Far Frontiers work<BR>
>by Dale Kemper and [snip] an astrogators guide...<BR>
<BR>
Is this version compatable with the Yiklerzdanz (sp?) sector?<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson        Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>
http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw                       davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material & opinions contained within are solely those<BR>
of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>
position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 21:32:58 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2305<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-13 11:34:38 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< The illustration on p116 of GURPS Far Trader ... is  that  Norris<BR>
 actively participating in a barroom brawl?<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
Nope. It's his evil twin.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 17:38:01 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Rules Lawyering<BR>
<BR>
>And you will have to take my word for it that in every single<BR>
>session of every single game I have ever played that had such<BR>
>a rule it was invoked at least 5 times, more than 50% of<BR>
>which were (at least in my opinion spurious), increased play<BR>
>time, and greatly detracted from the enjoyment of the game<BR>
>to the point where some players wanted to walk out. In one<BR>
>such session the weasel informed them that they could not walk<BR>
>out as the rules did not permit it and wanted to roll a 50% die<BR>
>to see if they could.<BR>
><BR>
>[Will: Could you please give an example of Mr. Spricks playing<BR>
>style so that they will believe me.]<BR>
><BR>
Mr. Sprick is at least as much flame bait as S.P.Ryan once was on both UUCP<BR>
and WWIV nets. Mr Sprick has argued that a rule (From Civilization, the<BR>
board game) that says that you must trade three or more cards per each<BR>
trade, tell the truth about how many, and also tell the truth about 2 of<BR>
them, that calamities (which arrive in the trade cards) do in fact count<BR>
towards the value traded at the number value of the stack they were drawn<BR>
from, even tho' the example clearly makes this a non-issue, and then claims<BR>
that examples are not rules unless numbered like rules.<BR>
<BR>
The problem, Peter, has been the arenas from which you've drawn board-games<BR>
players. Mssrs. Sprick, Robertson, and (drawing a blank on the third party,<BR>
whom you remain friends with and I have panic attacks at the mention of his<BR>
name) are all prone to rulemonger. Even more-so when in a truly competetive<BR>
style of gaming, like wargames.<BR>
<BR>
Having run SFB tourneys where rules questions are extremely common, I've<BR>
found that the only real solution is an univolved party. Namely, a referee.<BR>
That, and being able to find materials in rulebooks quickly. Hence a Table<BR>
of contents, a usefull and complete index, and preferably good examples<BR>
(with a separate index, if possible).<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 18:34:07 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> On 12 Apr 00, at 20:36, Black ICE wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
>> > <BR>
>> > >> Nick<BR>
>> > >> +++<BR>
>> > >> I sense some TNE heresy coming on. Eris - can I borrow your hat?<BR>
>> > ><BR>
>> > >Looks more like treason to me... The old guard in the TNe list won't<BR>
>> > >like this, you know :)<BR>
><BR>
>> Hey, can I get charged with sedition, then? ;-)<BR>
>> > <BR>
>> > So what? Under FFS2 rules, I've got cheaper (and so more) warships than<BR>
>> > them.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Besides, using FF&S2, you can always trot out the _Montana_ class, for<BR>
>> extra firepower.  If you feel the need for a more..._substantial_ ship, I<BR>
>> can forward the _Shiva_ class BB.  1 million dtons of carnage.  Lovely<BR>
>> (IMNSHO)!<BR>
><BR>
> I used to have a million DT BB made in FFS1 somewhere. Maybe I'll have <BR>
> to recreate her.<BR>
<BR>
I'm curious. Does any version od the rules allow ships *bigger* than a<BR>
million DT?<BR>
<BR>
And if any do, will they go as far as 40,000,000,000,000,000 DTs?<BR>
(Which is my "best guess" at the size of the "Skylark of Valeron")<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:05:40 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Basic Starships (was Re: Basic Economics)<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
>IMTU /all/ standards except a few government<BR>
>contracted models are only *regionally* standard.<BR>
<BR>
You can also point to the differences between the Milieu 0 designs and the<BR>
Classic 1100 designs to show how things have changed - over time, in this case,<BR>
as opposed to space.<BR>
<BR>
What are we looking at here? Around 10 ship designs? We have 3 merchants<BR>
(free/far/subs), 4 military ships (scout/patrol cruiser/happy fun ball/SDB), and<BR>
3 eccentrics (lab/safari/yacht). Plus a handful of small craft. We could<BR>
probably agree that a "corsair" is going to be non-standard. ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Personally, I think there's nothing wrong is allowing these few designs to be<BR>
available across the Imperium. (Wait for it...) ...*then* assume that there are<BR>
HEAPS of other designs, some with identical performances, some different. I even<BR>
assume that everything over 1000 tons (apart from Imp military ships, 'natch)<BR>
are non-std. For a classic eg of a regional design, look at Al Morai's 3000t<BR>
traders. They are std only _within the Marches_ (so Ben should be pleased!).<BR>
<BR>
One set of obvious in-game explanations is that the thousands of years of Vilani<BR>
influence leads starports to be somewhat conservative in outlook. While they are<BR>
prepared to build whatever design you can afford, they can fall back on the base<BR>
models for the majority of their work. You can say this is also influenced by<BR>
the big merchant lines, who find that costs are lower if they use standard parts<BR>
and don't have to constantly re-train their personnel every time they are<BR>
re-assigned to a new ship. And as Benjamin notes, the standardisation of govt<BR>
designs is easily believed, for much the same reasons.<BR>
<BR>
Note that there's no way starship repairers would have warehouses big enough to<BR>
stock all the parts required by all the weird and wonderful designs out there.<BR>
This means you must assume that starport repair areas are great at analysing<BR>
requirements and fabricating parts to fit all the ships they are called on to<BR>
maintain. As for parts for the std designs, either they are manufactured and<BR>
shipped within a region, or else 'ports are given the specs an they simply<BR>
fabricate *that* part (either way, its best to have std parts kept to a std<BR>
design - "No, no, not the red, cut the _blue_ wire, I tell you!!")<BR>
<BR>
BTW, Phillip McGregor included an interesting discussion of these sort of<BR>
compatability issues in _Dark Star #1_, for those who have it.<BR>
<BR>
'Bye now, I'm off to purchase GT:Starports - my FLGS re-ordered me a copy after<BR>
all the initial stock disappeared in the first 2 days!!<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson        Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>
http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw                       davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material & opinions contained within are solely those<BR>
of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>
position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2307<BR>
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Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #2307<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 14 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2308<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re Standard Designs<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2307<BR>
Weasels and rules<BR>
Re: Anal-retentive.<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
Re: Basic Starships<BR>
Re: The Health of Traveller<BR>
Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
Re: Pocket Empires and Imperial Squadrons<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
Signing off again<BR>
Re: GT-Q: Starport Construction Questions<BR>
Domain names available<BR>
Re: Economics<BR>
Re: Signing off again<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 17:58:00 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Standard Designs<BR>
<BR>
Just one key thought on the "Standard Designs" from MT:IE<BR>
<BR>
Many of them are not reproducable as written with the rules in MT:RM. And<BR>
many of these errors were not errattaed by DGP nor GDW.<BR>
<BR>
Not that I share Peter's limited view. I would consider X-Boats to be<BR>
standard. As well, several other types of craft would be standard.IMTU,<BR>
anything in Supp 7, Supp 9, MT (any book, including DGP books and<BR>
magazines) are standard designs, as are the type S1 (Serpent Class), the A1<BR>
and A2 types, and pure-cargo variants.<BR>
<BR>
The important issue for me is that standard designs have been promulgated<BR>
by the IISS, IN, and IMoT for a reason: they became ubiquitous in various<BR>
areas, and have since been made public domain (usually by paying the<BR>
architecht off, typically, IMTU, atthe full cost of said finished hull)<BR>
"for the Good of the Imperium." Becuase these designs were so good, and<BR>
have been promulgated so far, there is no doubt that they've also collected<BR>
lots of NoTSY's (Notice to Ship Yards), which cover for cost savings<BR>
measures.<BR>
<BR>
But you can bet that architechts will want the rights to "resell" any set<BR>
of plans they do. Cause if the same ship will serve for two different<BR>
customers, why, hell, that's a real quick bit of profit!<BR>
<BR>
Another thing, from MT:RM, the MT discount is 20% cost AND TIME. And gives<BR>
the example of the Gazelle class CE.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 19:42:18 -0700<BR>
From: william wheeler <wuffa@inetarena.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2307<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:50:39 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Re: Economics<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
In replt to Hans, Peter Newman posted a review of the ImpCr to the US dollar:<BR>
>>So 1 Crimp should be roughly equal to a GURPS $.<BR>
><BR>
>Because of Inflation these numbers are not equal.<BR>
><BR>
>One 1977 US dollar = $0.53 '86, $0.39 '94, and $0.35 '99<BR>
>(2000 stats not available yet) dollar.<BR>
><BR>
>1999 US dollars can be used to buy things that no<BR>
>number of 1977 US dollars could buy...<BR>
>The effects are hard to quantify.<BR>
<BR>
You are probably better off looking at the beer standard (or bread standard,<BR>
pick a staple that is available in both eras). That is, I'll bet that US$1 in<BR>
1977 would buy you more beer than US$1 in 2000.<BR>
<BR>
Wuffa: well a $1 got me a pint of beer in 1975, and i just went out today and a pint<BR>
still costs $1<BR>
granted not the Same Level of beer , in 75 it was very good beer, today just Coors (<BR>
very bad beer)<BR>
Bread is the same, but people tell me I am very good at Shopping<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
*This* is the measure of the real value of the dollar, so perhaps you are<BR>
actually thinking the wrong way around. That is (going off the figures above), a<BR>
dollar in 1999 can only buy as much as 35 cents would have bought you in 1977...<BR>
<BR>
Another part of the analysis should look at wages then and now, and the relative<BR>
costs of basic items to income. Sure, a house AND land in Sydney cost $20,000 in<BR>
1970 (as opposed to $750,000 now) but you still paid it off over (at least) 20<BR>
years...<BR>
- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson        Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>
http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw                       davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 21:48:35 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Weasels and rules<BR>
<BR>
Without re-stating/quoting all that has gone before on this subject, <BR>
I believe that weasels as a species (the furry, four-footed type) <BR>
have been seriously maligned here.<BR>
<BR>
Suggestion: Don't play with jerks.  No matter what your feelings are <BR>
about rules (canonical, or not), if a player is a twit, he's going to <BR>
behave like one, and no amount of rules will fix his personality.  (I <BR>
can think of several other things to try, but they probably wouldn't <BR>
do anything to fix the individual's personal problems, although they <BR>
might be fun for the rest of the group.)<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2000 21:49:06 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Anal-retentive.<BR>
<BR>
I believe that some of you are missing the point.  What matters is <BR>
not whether or not anal-retentive should have a hyphen in it.  What <BR>
matters is, having a hyphen, exactly how long should the hypen be? <BR>
And should it be measured in centimetres?  Millimetres?  Picas? <BR>
Pixels?<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 20:14:47 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
>Matthew Helton said:<BR>
><BR>
>  >    Tod and Peter bring up relevant points.<BR>
><BR>
>"Relevant" isn't exactly the term I would use in this situation.<BR>
><BR>
>  >    Frank Herbert, creator of the Dune series, summed it up well: Liberals<BR>
>  >are closet Aristocrats, and I have seen nothing, at least here in the U.S.,<BR>
>  >to disprove that statement.<BR>
><BR>
>Good for Frank Herbert, and for you. Please note that I'm not subscribed to<BR>
>this list to read your "personal rants" on the subject of gun control. In<BR>
>fact, I've seen one too many of them here on the list. They start threads<BR>
>that are annoying, that take a long time to die, and everybody gets their<BR>
>panties in a bunch concerning the subject.<BR>
><BR>
>Now, I don't have a problem with off topic posts in general, or even threads<BR>
>which are off topic but which have some relevance to Traveller. I'd be<BR>
>willing to bet that everybody here has either already made their minds up on<BR>
>the subject of gun control in the U.S., or doesn't care. This forces me to<BR>
>wonder what your motives were in posting such a message. Please take your<BR>
>personal crusade elsewhere.<BR>
><BR>
>The same goes doubly for Peter Newman (who I know has been here long enough<BR>
>to know better).<BR>
<BR>
You say you have nothing against off topic posts (i.e., penguins?). <BR>
So, it's just threads that you personally find annoying that are <BR>
taboo here?  Two messages make a crusade?<BR>
<BR>
Just trying to get the ground rules here, lest I commit some sort of <BR>
social faux pas.  I wouldn't want my "motives" questioned.<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 05:20:07 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Basic Starships<BR>
<BR>
david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au wrote:<BR>
> What are we looking at here? Around 10 ship designs? We have 3 merchants<BR>
> (free/far/subs), 4 military ships (scout/patrol cruiser/happy fun ball/SDB), and<BR>
> 3 eccentrics (lab/safari/yacht). Plus a handful of small craft. We could<BR>
> probably agree that a "corsair" is going to be non-standard. ;-)<BR>
<BR>
I would say that the SDB would not be a standard design. After all, it is<BR>
designed in so many different places, probably using different design<BR>
parameters (needs to be able to dock with our old spacestation, since we don't<BR>
have a gas giant streamlining won't be required, etc).<BR>
<BR>
> Note that there's no way starship repairers would have warehouses big enough to<BR>
> stock all the parts required by all the weird and wonderful designs out there.<BR>
<BR>
This is really another great reason to use standard ship models. Much easier to<BR>
get a trader repaired on a distant world if it is one of the three standard<BR>
models. Otherwise, you might get stuck a while.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 05:28:21 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: The Health of Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Marc wrote:<BR>
> << When's Book 2 coming out Marc? >><BR>
> <BR>
> May, 2000<BR>
<BR>
WHOOOOO ! WEEEEEEE !<BR>
<BR>
I didn't buy Book 1 since I already have a set of rules. Yes it's T4 (but I've<BR>
modified it a bit to make it work).<BR>
<BR>
However (IIRC), Book 2 is supposed to contain a lot of background material (and<BR>
adventures)...<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 05:32:26 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Vaya Con Dios class ship<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> I'm curious. Does any version od the rules allow ships *bigger* than a<BR>
> million DT?<BR>
> <BR>
> And if any do, will they go as far as 40,000,000,000,000,000 DTs?<BR>
> (Which is my "best guess" at the size of the "Skylark of Valeron")<BR>
<BR>
FF&S2 doesn't have a maximum size for designs.<BR>
<BR>
Someone speculated on recreating the Death Star, but I don't know if it was<BR>
actually done.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 23:44:44 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
Red wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>You say you have nothing against off topic posts (i.e., penguins?).<BR>
<BR>
That's correct. Discussions concerning penguins of all sorts have yet to<BR>
start a flamewar. In addition the subject of penguins is a running joke<BR>
that's been going on for some time. Penguins are inherently funny. Gun<BR>
control flamefests that pop up every few months are inherently stupid. Save<BR>
it for Usenet. We have our own brand of Traveller related pettiness here.<BR>
<BR>
>So, it's just threads that you personally find annoying that are<BR>
>taboo here?  Two messages make a crusade?<BR>
<BR>
Yes to the first. I've seen too many gun control flamewars, and I don't want<BR>
to see another one. No to the second, but an offensive message in support of<BR>
something wildly off-topic makes a crusade.<BR>
<BR>
>Just trying to get the ground rules here, lest I commit some sort of<BR>
>social faux pas.<BR>
<BR>
The ground rules are simple: Don't post inflammatory messages on<BR>
controversial subjects which also happen to be off-topic. Basic etiquette.<BR>
<BR>
>I wouldn't want my "motives" questioned.<BR>
<BR>
If you don't post inflammatory messages on controversial subjects which also<BR>
happen to be off-topic, you should be alright.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 23:53:04 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Pocket Empires and Imperial Squadrons<BR>
<BR>
Les Howie wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>  Subject: Pocket Empires and Imperial Squadrons<BR>
>  <BR>
>  What do those supplements cover, anyway? <BR>
>  <BR>
>  What will I be able to do that I could not without<BR>
>  them; would the two together make a "stand-alone"<BR>
>  strategic game?<BR>
<BR>
Pocket Empires:   <BR>
    1. Creating a ruling or noble family<BR>
    2. Creating world and empire statistics, including empire size, <BR>
self-determination level, military power, economic power, popularity, and <BR>
prestige, plus a few social characteristics.<BR>
    3. Generate an economic extension, which allows calculation of GWP, <BR>
Government budgets, overall civilian and military government expenses.<BR>
    4. rules for planetary development, including development of <BR>
infrastructure, starports,  Tech Level advance, and population change. <BR>
    5. Introduction of high-level meta-tasks with various things that can <BR>
affect interstellar relations.<BR>
    6. Rules for building a military establishment and conducting warfare on <BR>
a large scale.<BR>
<BR>
Imperial Squadrons<BR>
    1. Ruled for generating squadrons of a naval force.  Requires FF&S to <BR>
design the ships of the squadron according to the specifications and <BR>
constraints placed by IS on the squadron.  Deals more with combatants than <BR>
support vessels.<BR>
    2. Economic rules for developing military squadrons and conducting a <BR>
military campaign.  <BR>
    3) Information on Naval command structure, from fleet levels down to <BR>
individual ships<BR>
    4) a guide Naval standard operating procedures<BR>
    5) guids to special duty such as peacekeeping, Prisoners of War, <BR>
Piratical fleets, <BR>
    6) Material on extralegal operations: War materials and contraband, <BR>
Forage, Black Market, Fleet justice<BR>
    7) Sample NPCs and an adventure. <BR>
<BR>
Overall, PE is best for outlining the kinds of things rulers are concerned <BR>
about, such ass economic development, diplomacy, and governmental policy; <BR>
though I prefer role-playing the kinds of things it uses meta-tasks to <BR>
decide.  <BR>
IS is better for handling the mechanics of naval campaigns and detailing the <BR>
structure of the imperial military at an intermediate to low level.  <BR>
Unfortunately, the rules of the two for development of military <BR>
establishments and conduct of war are entirely different and incompatible. I <BR>
worked out some ideas for a rough conversion a year or so and posted them <BR>
here and got a little discussion, but I haven't seen anyone else try it. <BR>
GURPS: First In and Far Trader cover some of the same ground.  First In does <BR>
a better job on description of the world and Far Trader does a better job on <BR>
economics, but PE still works for noble families, interstellar relations, and <BR>
diplomacy, while IS handles the military better.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 21:23:12 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
Task: Detect Irony (easy, int, carousing)<BR>
Task: Behave in a Civil Manner (easy, int, carousing)<BR>
<BR>
Let's see the die rolls.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 21:46:37 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
>Red wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>You say you have nothing against off topic posts (i.e., penguins?).<BR>
><BR>
>That's correct. Discussions concerning penguins of all sorts have yet to<BR>
>start a flamewar. In addition the subject of penguins is a running joke<BR>
>that's been going on for some time. Penguins are inherently funny. Gun<BR>
>control flamefests that pop up every few months are inherently stupid. Save<BR>
>it for Usenet. We have our own brand of Traveller related pettiness here.<BR>
<BR>
I realise there may have been 'flamefests' (new word for me, but I <BR>
think I like it) in the past, and yes, I agree about their stupidity. <BR>
And penguins are  always on topic - even for Traveller (our group has <BR>
had issues in past games involving bad reactions to chemical <BR>
psi-shield and penguins).<BR>
<BR>
>  >So, it's just threads that you personally find annoying that are<BR>
>>taboo here?  Two messages make a crusade?<BR>
><BR>
>Yes to the first.<BR>
<BR>
Good, good.  I feel the same way.<BR>
<BR>
>I've seen too many gun control flamewars, and I don't want<BR>
>to see another one. No to the second, but an offensive message in support of<BR>
>something wildly off-topic makes a crusade.<BR>
<BR>
But there were no offensive remarks in the messages you objected to.<BR>
<BR>
>  >Just trying to get the ground rules here, lest I commit some sort of<BR>
>>social faux pas.<BR>
><BR>
>The ground rules are simple: Don't post inflammatory messages on<BR>
>controversial subjects which also happen to be off-topic. Basic etiquette.<BR>
><BR>
>>I wouldn't want my "motives" questioned.<BR>
><BR>
>If you don't post inflammatory messages on controversial subjects which also<BR>
>happen to be off-topic, you should be alright.<BR>
<BR>
My only complaint here is that questioning some one's motives is <BR>
somewhat harsh, and would require you using your powerful psionic <BR>
abilities.<BR>
<BR>
Now, where did I put that auto-injector...<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 21:58:11 -0700<BR>
From: Bill <beast@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
>>Red wrote:<BR>
>><BR>
>>>You say you have nothing against off topic posts (i.e., penguins?).<BR>
>><BR>
>>That's correct. Discussions concerning penguins of all sorts have yet to<BR>
>>start a flamewar. In addition the subject of penguins is a running joke<BR>
>>that's been going on for some time. Penguins are inherently funny. Gun<BR>
>>control flamefests that pop up every few months are inherently stupid. Save<BR>
>>it for Usenet. We have our own brand of Traveller related pettiness here.<BR>
><BR>
>I realise there may have been 'flamefests' (new word for me, but I <BR>
>think I like it) in the past, and yes, I agree about their <BR>
>stupidity. And penguins are  always on topic - even for Traveller <BR>
>(our group has had issues in past games involving bad reactions to <BR>
>chemical psi-shield and penguins).<BR>
><BR>
>> >So, it's just threads that you personally find annoying that are<BR>
>>>taboo here?  Two messages make a crusade?<BR>
>><BR>
>>Yes to the first.<BR>
><BR>
>Good, good.  I feel the same way.<BR>
><BR>
>>I've seen too many gun control flamewars, and I don't want<BR>
>>to see another one. No to the second, but an offensive message in support of<BR>
>>something wildly off-topic makes a crusade.<BR>
><BR>
>But there were no offensive remarks in the messages you objected to.<BR>
><BR>
>> >Just trying to get the ground rules here, lest I commit some sort of<BR>
>>>social faux pas.<BR>
>><BR>
>>The ground rules are simple: Don't post inflammatory messages on<BR>
>>controversial subjects which also happen to be off-topic. Basic etiquette.<BR>
>><BR>
>>>I wouldn't want my "motives" questioned.<BR>
>><BR>
>>If you don't post inflammatory messages on controversial subjects which also<BR>
>>happen to be off-topic, you should be alright.<BR>
><BR>
>My only complaint here is that questioning some one's motives is <BR>
>somewhat harsh, and would require you using your powerful psionic <BR>
>abilities.<BR>
><BR>
>Now, where did I put that auto-injector...<BR>
><BR>
>Red<BR>
<BR>
Red,<BR>
What is that penguin doing over there by the airlock?<BR>
And why does it have a power drill?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 22:19:52 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, 13 Apr 2000 23:44:44 -0400, Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Red wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >So, it's just threads that you personally find annoying that are<BR>
> >taboo here?  Two messages make a crusade?<BR>
> <BR>
> Yes to the first.<BR>
<BR>
People, please.<BR>
<BR>
Read that snippet over again, Chris.  As far as I know, this is not a<BR>
moderated list with Chris Seamans at the helm.<BR>
<BR>
There are better ways to stop a flame war than to "attack".<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
UFO's are real: the Air Force doesn't exist.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:40:05 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Signing off again<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
OK, signing off for my two-week holiday! In the sun. Hopefully. (Its pouring<BR>
outside in the ACT, hopefully Qld is going to be drier and sunnier.)<BR>
<BR>
With luck, the regular gun debate will be over by the time I pop in again later.<BR>
Bye!<BR>
<BR>
(Bonaventure powers up m-drive, heads for jump point, and jumps! Last pre-jump<BR>
message reads:<BR>
"My God, it's full of Penguins!!" ;-)<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson        Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>
http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw                       davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material & opinions contained within are solely those<BR>
of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>
position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 01:50:31 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Dalton Spence <dalton.spence@hwcn.org><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: Starport Construction Questions<BR>
<BR>
On Tue, 11 Apr 2000 22:59:30 -0700, "Christopher M. Dicely"<BR>
<cmdicely@ncal.verio.com> wrote;<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
> >1.) Commuting to and from a highport daily seems like a very tedious<BR>
> >business, and not really practical from a logistical point of view.<BR>
<BR>
> How so? Transport costs are virtually nil (you pay the operating cost of<BR>
> a boat from the surface to orbit, which is pretty darned small -- you<BR>
> aren't burning any LH2 or anything to get their). A launch takes about<BR>
> 20 seconds to reach orbit (sidebar, p. GT119), and about 50 seconds to<BR>
> land from orbit, and thats a fairly *slow* interface craft.<BR>
<BR>
Here are my calculations for the time it takes various common small<BR>
craft to achieve orbital velocity of a 1 G planet. The simplified<BR>
formula is T = 816.51 * @sqrt(g * r)/(A - g), where<BR>
<BR>
T = time to orbit in seconds            g = Local gravity in Gs<BR>
r = radius of planet in Earth radii     A = ship sAccel in Gs<BR>
<BR>
                        Passengers  sAccel  Time to Orbit<BR>
10-ton Launch               36      1.1 Gs  2 hrs 16 min 5.13 sec<BR>
10-ton Short Duration<BR>
    Lifeboat (GT:FT p.137)  72      1.69 Gs 19 min 43.35 sec<BR>
20-ton Gig                  24      2.1 Gs  12 min 22.29 sec<BR>
30-ton Ship's Boat          96      1.7 Gs  19 min 26.44 sec<BR>
40-ton Pinnace              96      4.9 Gs  3 min 29.36 sec<BR>
50-ton Modular Cutter<BR>
    with Passenger Module   48      2.4 Gs  9 min 43.22 sec<BR>
100-ton Orbital Shuttle    240      3.2 Gs  6 min 11.14 sec<BR>
<BR>
This time does not include travel between low and synchronous orbits<BR>
where most highports are parked, on/offloading passengers or traffic<BR>
control delays.<BR>
<BR>
> Probably the greatest cost of commuting is that it increases spacecraft<BR>
> traffic (and, therefore, traffic control burden) at the port. Weigh that<BR>
> against the fact that downport housing is less expensive and in many<BR>
> cases doesn't require expensive life-support measures, and I'd say<BR>
> that commuting is probably the way to go. Initially, this bothered me<BR>
> too, until I worked it out...<BR>
<BR>
I'm glad you brought up the issue of life support. In the GT modular<BR>
starship design system, total life support is *only* build into the<BR>
staterooms. GT Starports adds to that; office and habitat modules*<BR>
are equipped with full (but not total) life support, and bunkrooms<BR>
have total LS. (*Note: Farm modules are a special case: they can<BR>
produce full LS for 100 people, but are rarely found on starports.)<BR>
While the office/workarea module LS systems provide *some* excess<BR>
capacity (one module per ten employees means 6 person LS left over)<BR>
obviously a minimum amount of provisions and accomodations for the<BR>
passengers must be provided to fill in the gap. Unfortunately GT:<BR>
Starports missed this issue entirely. Any ideas?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
              @==================================================@<BR>
              | Dalton S. Spence, B.Sc. <dalton.spence@hwcn.org> |<BR>
              | Home Page: http://www.hwcn.org/~ag775/home.html  |<BR>
              |      Family Motto: Virtute Acquiritur Honos      |<BR>
              |    "Trade is the lifeblood of the Imperium."     |<BR>
              |   Cleon I, First Emperor of the Third Imperium   |<BR>
              |  Dilbert takes my kumquat and is distressed by   |<BR>
              |                  Austin. FNORD!                  |<BR>
              @==================================================@<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 00:44:28 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: Domain names available<BR>
<BR>
The last time that I checked, both zhodani.com and battlerider.com were<BR>
available. Others?<BR>
<BR>
It's tempting, but I already have two domains, and my wife has one, so it's<BR>
tough to justify one more.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 00:13:15 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Economics<BR>
<BR>
david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au wrote<BR>
<BR>
> In replt to Hans, Peter Newman posted a review of the ImpCr to the US dollar:<BR>
<BR>
> You are probably better off looking at the beer standard (or bread standard,<BR>
> pick a staple that is available in both eras). That is, I'll bet that US$1 in<BR>
> 1977 would buy you more beer than US$1 in 2000.<BR>
<BR>
In 1977 I was 11 years old, I suspect that it would have<BR>
been rather difficult for me to buy legally beer at any <BR>
price. If I bought beer illegally it might well have<BR>
cost me more: than it would have in 1999. if you mean consumers<BR>
in general rather than me, than yes.<BR>
<BR>
The Consumer Price Index (the CPI) is an attempt by the <BR>
government to measure the prices of typically purchased <BR>
goods. The prices of one commodity (beer) is a less valid<BR>
model than the values of a whole basket of goods and<BR>
services. When this commodity (alcohol) is subject to<BR>
government excise taxes use of the one commodity is<BR>
even more dubious. Moreover man does not live on beer<BR>
alone [5], therefore beer is an invalid model to use.<BR>
<BR>
> Another part of the analysis should look at wages then and now, and the <BR>
> relative costs of basic items to income. Sure, a house AND land in Sydney <BR>
> cost $20,000 in 1970 (as opposed to $750,000 now) but you still paid it off <BR>
> over (at least) 20 years...<BR>
<BR>
That's why we are using constant dollar figures in the first<BR>
place; so that we can ignore this sort of thing.<BR>
<BR>
Canon IMNSHO establishes that prices in the Imperium are<BR>
fairly constant. It also establishes that inflation is<BR>
low or non existent. For evidence of this see the starship<BR>
morgage rules.<BR>
<BR>
In Traveller standard starship morgages in the Imperium require <BR>
20% down. So a MCr 100 starship would require MCr 20 down. The <BR>
morgage principal would thus be MCr 80. However to pay off this <BR>
morgage (including interest) over 40 years will cost twice the <BR>
total price of the ship "Standard Terms involve the payment<BR>
of 1/240th of the cash price every month for 480 months."<BR>
[Ct Book2 p.7, quote is repeated almost word for word in most<BR>
other versions of Traveller] Or MCR 200). Thus the interest on <BR>
the loan is MCr 120, or 150% of the principal. Our starship<BR>
payments will be MCr 100/240 or Cr 416,667 per month (rounded<BR>
up to teh nearest whole credit)<BR>
<BR>
Using a morgage loan calculator<BR>
http://www.calcbuilder.com/cgi-bin/calcs/2.2d/HOM2.cgi/FinanCenterInc<BR>
<BR>
Plugging in the principal (MCr 80) ammount and the payment<BR>
ammount (Cr 416,667) and the morgage length (40 years)[1]<BR>
we learn that (assuming that starship loans do not include<BR>
any property taxes on starships [2] and assuming that starship<BR>
loans do not include any shipowners insurance premiums [3])<BR>
then the standard starship loan rate is 5.57428% which for<BR>
simplicity we will call 5.75%. (It also means that it you<BR>
could get a 30 year starship loan your payments would go<BR>
up by only about 10% anyway which begs teh question of why<BR>
starship loans are for 40 years anyway but that is anotehr<BR>
question entirely.)<BR>
<BR>
US Home loan rates have not been as low as 5.75% in quite<BR>
some time. Given that homes are significantly less mobile<BR>
than starships the bank is assuming a greater risk on<BR>
the starship loan . This risk premium suggests that home<BR>
loans in the Imperium will typically be for less than<BR>
5.75%. <BR>
<BR>
My suspicion would be that price levels in the Imperium<BR>
are fairly stable. I also note that Millieu 0 price levels<BR>
(from T4) are quite similar to Milieu 1100 price levels <BR>
(from CT).[4]<BR>
<BR>
[1] Assuming the Imeprium has a 12 month year which book 2,<BR>
by equating 480 payments to 40 years does.<BR>
<BR>
[2] Presumably no such tax exists or it would be listed <BR>
as a starship expense for paid off starships.<BR>
<BR>
[3] This assumption may be invalid but as shipowners insurance<BR>
is not listed anywhere I am aware of in Traveller rules it<BR>
is arguably correct.<BR>
<BR>
[4] Presumably in game terms because Marc Miller wrote both.<BR>
<BR>
[5] At least in general. If _you_ live on beer alone than<BR>
IMNSHO you have a drinking problem.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 19:09:49 +1000<BR>
From: "The Roc" <roc@kewl.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Signing off again<BR>
<BR>
Hey!  I'm off with my wife for hols on the Sunshine Coast for a week (Gold<BR>
Coast to the Sunshine Coast... hmmmm)!  Had I'd known you were coming, I'd<BR>
at least kept an eye for you... if I knew what you looked like :^)<BR>
<BR>
- -- The Roc<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: <david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au><BR>
To: <traveller@mpgn.com><BR>
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2000 3:40 PM<BR>
Subject: Signing off again<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Dear Folks -<BR>
><BR>
> OK, signing off for my two-week holiday! In the sun. Hopefully. (Its<BR>
pouring<BR>
> outside in the ACT, hopefully Qld is going to be drier and sunnier.)<BR>
><BR>
> With luck, the regular gun debate will be over by the time I pop in again<BR>
later.<BR>
> Bye!<BR>
><BR>
> (Bonaventure powers up m-drive, heads for jump point, and jumps! Last<BR>
pre-jump<BR>
> message reads:<BR>
> "My God, it's full of Penguins!!"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2308<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 14 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2309<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich ..."<BR>
Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weaponsOT:<BR>
Trying to get it on line again ... Was Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
OT Posts<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
Trav 2D starmaps in 3D presentation<BR>
RE: Smart weapons - in Traveller - Really!<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
Re: Economics<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: OT Posts<BR>
Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
RE: OT Posts<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: OT Posts<BR>
Norris' Evil Twin  was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2305<BR>
New Equipment Picture Posted<BR>
Re: OT Posts<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 10:17:58 +0100<BR>
From: Phil Kitching <postmark.design@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote:<BR>
>On Wed, 12 Apr 2000 11:48:48 -0800, Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote<BR>
>> <BR>
>> > Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
>> > > If comic book<BR>
>> > > fans will buy the same comic twice with a different cover than<BR>
>> > > logically so will Traveller fans.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> > For us to understand your definition of "logic", could you please explain<BR>
>> > the above preposterous statement?<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Marketing ploys which rely on the illogic on the customer are<BR>
>> not, in and of themselves, illogical. I will thank you<BR>
>> very much not to continue to call things preposterous<BR>
>> simply because you are unfamiliar with them.<BR>
><BR>
>You're not listening.  I asked you to provide the "logic" behind your<BR>
>assumption that what's good for comic book collectors is good for Traveller<BR>
>fans.  IOW, what is the *logic* behind your assumption that Traveller fans<BR>
>would buy multiple products with different covers solely on the fact that<BR>
>comic book collectors frequently do the same?  I'm not asking for an<BR>
>opinion, I'm asking for logic.<BR>
<BR>
Who needs a marketing ploy - I've been known to buy multiple copies of the<BR>
same book with the same cover - mostly due to bad memory. The downside is<BR>
that my collection has gaps due to the books I should have bought :-(<BR>
<BR>
The local record for such mispurchasing (as opposed to collecting variations)<BR>
is a friend with three copies of the AD&D book "Legends & Lore". No one knows<BR>
why, since it isn't the most essential book in that game.<BR>
<BR>
Core rulebooks are different, I'll often buy more than one copy if I want<BR>
to play a system that no one else in the group is collecting.<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching<BR>
- --<BR>
  http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>
  Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>
 "Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 2000 14:29:32 +0100<BR>
From: Phil Kitching <postmark.design@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich ..."<BR>
<BR>
Ian Whitchurch wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>Me, I'd leave everything the way it is in the Vandy, and lease it out as a<BR>
>high-speed luxury small liner, with a sideline in floating party wagon.<BR>
<BR>
As an added benefit, if you lease it out to an FS product launch, you'd<BR>
be half way towards gutting it and turning it into a cargo ship<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching<BR>
- --<BR>
  http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>
  Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>
 "Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 00:06:51 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weaponsOT:<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Gee, calm down. Rant over. Pax.<BR>
><BR>
>     Going back on topic, Smart guns need to thought out carefully. There are<BR>
> places for them, and not. For Shipboard security use, and Law Enforcement in<BR>
> Traveller, reality, where ever you might be, a Smart Gun would be great<BR>
> idea.<BR>
<BR>
Yep, that's one of the reasons I posted the original message to the<BR>
list. "Smart weapons" *should* be part of Traveller history, even if as<BR>
nothing other than a flawed concept. <BR>
<BR>
>     Current implentations of the smart gun are, as with all  new concepts,<BR>
> somewhat crude and narrowly-defined.<BR>
><BR>
>     There are situations where an "early" smartgun could cause more problems<BR>
> than it solves. Colt uses a Radio Transmitter on a wristband to effect the<BR>
> smartgun safety. Not good if you break the wristband. More than a few<BR>
> weapons are hit with gunfire in real life (An odd pheonomenon attributed to<BR>
> the percieved threat of harm from the weapon). Of course, your batteries<BR>
> going dead at a crucial moment could also ruin your whole day.<BR>
<BR>
Yep. And High law level world may be willing to go with slightly<BR>
"flawed" controls just to handle the situations where they "have to"<BR>
let someone carry...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 11:37:36 +0100<BR>
From: "Derrick Jones" <dojones.whitestar@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Trying to get it on line again ... Was Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
Dom wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Dom (bored of the Nth Gun Control Debate before it even starts in <BR>
>Ernest, considering starting a discussion on something appropriately <BR>
>OT for the UK readers - say either BMW/Rover or the NHS <gdr>)<BR>
<BR>
Seconded for the gun control debate. However, I don't think that the <BR>
BMW/Rover thing would be too off topic. (Megacorporations building<BR>
up the hopes of subsector wide industries, by doing the investing and<BR>
assisting thing. Only to find, in actual fact, they just wanted to get rid<BR>
of the competition. Would the subsector government be liable for letting<BR>
the deal go ahead, without full investigation? Would the subsector level<BR>
minister get shafted? Or would he duck and squirm like the slimy toerag<BR>
he really is*? How many back-handers went on? Should the Imperium<BR>
be called in to investigate? Would they promote a cover-up?<BR>
<BR>
ISTR the same thing happening when S&N bought out Higsons, Dom.<BR>
<BR>
Answers on the back of a postcard please...<BR>
<BR>
Derrick<BR>
Green Penguin Muncher Extraordinaire<BR>
<BR>
Derrick Jones<BR>
St Helens<BR>
Lancashire UK<BR>
http://www.btinternet.com/~dojones.whitestar<BR>
<BR>
*Note: I am in no way saying that Mr Beiers (sp?) is as described above.<BR>
Just the subsector minister. Honest..<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:19:03 +0100<BR>
From: "Derrick Jones" <dojones.whitestar@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: OT Posts<BR>
<BR>
>You say you have nothing against off topic posts (i.e., penguins?)<BR>
<BR>
Penguins? Off topic? What? Get a life, man! Gun control is a controversial<BR>
topic of conversation, with it's own merits and flaws , where people can <BR>
get harmed by the outcome of a decision. Never, ever, would I have <BR>
discussed penguins (green or otherwise) if I thought someone was going<BR>
to get killed y the outcome of a debate about them (besides my own <BR>
intolerance of the red, yellow and blue varieties). Having said that, I spose<BR>
They could be misused. (c.f. Batman Returns) <BR>
. <BR>
<BR>
Anyway, penguin buiscits are what we eat while playing Traveller. That's<BR>
on topic as far as I'm concerned! We don't brandish real weapons at each<BR>
other and don't debate our rights to do so. <BR>
<BR>
As regards firearms, I hate the things. I served in the army for 6 years and<BR>
if the truth be known, I only fired one when absolutely necessary and when<BR>
ordered to*. (I don't get too much of a kick out of cleaning rifles! - when my<BR>
mates were facing charges for having dirty rifles, mine was always gleaming!!!)<BR>
<BR>
I think I'd better lie down<BR>
<BR>
(*I know this might get me on the wrong side of some of you gun-types but that's <BR>
my opinion.)<BR>
<BR>
Derrick<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Derrick Jones<BR>
St Helens<BR>
Lancashire UK<BR>
http://www.btinternet.com/~dojones.whitestar<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 08:15:32 -0500<BR>
From: Shimmergloom <dragon@mhtc.net><BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
Due to a few package deals I have found and a slip-up on Ebay i have multiple<BR>
copies of more than a few books<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Core rulebooks are different, I'll often buy more than one copy if I want<BR>
> to play a system that no one else in the group is collecting.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
- -------------------------<BR>
Earth first!   We'll strip mine the other planets later...<BR>
<BR>
dragon@mhtc.net<BR>
http://www.mhtc.net/~dragon/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:13:12 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
James said:<BR>
<BR>
>People, please.<BR>
><BR>
>Read that snippet over again, Chris.  As far as I know, this is not a<BR>
>moderated list with Chris Seamans at the helm.<BR>
<BR>
You are correct. It is a moderated list with Rob Miracle at the helm. Still,<BR>
messages which I find personally annoying, which as I implied, boil down to<BR>
offensive and inflammatory off-topic posts, are indeed taboo here.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:13:13 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
Luther Martin said:<BR>
<BR>
>Task: Detect Irony (easy, int, carousing)<BR>
>Task: Behave in a Civil Manner (easy, int, carousing)<BR>
><BR>
>Let's see the die rolls.<BR>
<BR>
Task: Place Luther Martin in Killfile (easy, edu, computer)<BR>
<BR>
Ah, sweet success!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:16:27 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
Luther Martin said:<BR>
<BR>
>Task: Detect Irony (easy, int, carousing)<BR>
>Task: Behave in a Civil Manner (easy, int, carousing)<BR>
><BR>
>Let's see the die rolls.<BR>
<BR>
Task: Place Luther in Killfile (easy, edu, computer)<BR>
<plonk><BR>
Ah, sweet success! <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 16:20:33 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher & Regina Otto <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Trav 2D starmaps in 3D presentation<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
Hi!<BR>
<BR>
I posted this earlier, but maybe some of you lost it, so here it is<BR>
again:<BR>
<BR>
(The folowing refers to the article in Freelance Traveller, where a<BR>
proposal is made )<BR>
<BR>
As an illustration for my view at jump space physics, I have produced a<BR>
Chview file shows how the jump space structure might look like in Sol<BR>
and Dingir subsectors. It does this by using Chview routes for the<BR>
respective jump numbers (i.e., route-1 is for a jump-1 connection,<BR>
route-2 for j-2 etc.).<BR>
<BR>
If anyone is interested in this file, please email me. I'd welcome some<BR>
comments, especially on how to improve this file, the latter preferably<BR>
at the TML. (I do not have access to any canonical stellar data except<BR>
"real-world information" of that region, so there might still be<BR>
inconsistencies...)<BR>
<BR>
BTW: Chview can be dowloaded for free at <BR>
http://members.nova.org/~sol<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
Hiroshi.Estigarribia@gmx.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:42:24 -0500<BR>
From: "Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons - in Traveller - Really!<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: shadow@krypton.rain.com [mailto:shadow@krypton.rain.com]<BR>
 <BR>
> Yep, that's one of the reasons I posted the original message to the<BR>
> list. "Smart weapons" *should* be part of Traveller history, <BR>
> even if as<BR>
> nothing other than a flawed concept. <BR>
<BR>
In Traveller, we don't have the restrictions of today's technology.  I can easily see a smart weapon developed for on-board usage that is linked in with the starship's computer.<BR>
<BR>
Reading the SOM, there is description of the starship computer 'recognizing' someone and knowing if they are or are not allowed into a certain area of the ship.  It would be possible for a ship captain to allow only their crew to be armed during a flight, and only allowing them to use linked smart weapons.  <BR>
<BR>
If (say, during a hijacking) the computer (which is monitoring the entire ship) 'sees' someone not authorized to have the weapon try to fire it, it can turn the firearm off remotely.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, this could be gotten around, but that is the stuff of stories and adventures.  Nobles would be immune to such rules, being allowed to bear arms practically anywhere.<BR>
<BR>
> Yep. And High law level world may be willing to go with slightly<BR>
> "flawed" controls just to handle the situations where they "have to"<BR>
> let someone carry...<BR>
<BR>
With high tech worlds, such computer linked weapons would be more available and used.  Your police patrols weapons are linked to the squad car's computer which knows you and your partner (thus allowing either of you to use the others weapon).  Also, a safety unlock could be built in to disable the entire security system, for times where the police will be out of view of the squad car, etc.  Policeperson enters his secure-code into the weapon and it takes it off-net.<BR>
<BR>
Nobles are, IMTU, able to carry any weapon they want, anywhere they want, at any time they want.  Said 'smart-weapon' laws are no barrier.<BR>
<BR>
They are also, usually, no barrier to determined criminals and thugs.<BR>
<BR>
OT: It is interesting that while many people do seem enjoy the discussion of the interaction of society and technology, said enjoyment does, for many people, turn off at the merest mention of firearms.  No, actually, it usually ends at the mention of *privately owned* firearms, since I have never seen anyone on this list be annoyed at the discussion about the number FGMPs the Impy Marines have.<BR>
<BR>
vargr1                                                   UPP-8D9B85<BR>
- ---------------------------- Omnia dicta fortiora, si dicta latina.<BR>
Meyers-Briggs personality type: ENTJ                vargr1@jcn1*com<BR>
"...the ENTJ is not one to be trifled with."      dmoody@bridge*com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:36:10 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
You forgot to mention that both Behave in a Civil Manner and Detect Irony<BR>
are Hazardous tasks, although they're also "Unskilled Okay".<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Chris Seamans [mailto:semo@pil.net]<BR>
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2000 8:13 AM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Luther Martin said:<BR>
<BR>
>Task: Detect Irony (easy, int, carousing)<BR>
>Task: Behave in a Civil Manner (easy, int, carousing)<BR>
><BR>
>Let's see the die rolls.<BR>
<BR>
Task: Place Luther Martin in Killfile (easy, edu, computer)<BR>
<BR>
Ah, sweet success!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 09:52:53 -0700<BR>
From: Kristian Miller <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
Luther Martin wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Task: Detect Irony (easy, int, carousing)<BR>
> Task: Behave in a Civil Manner (easy, int, carousing)<BR>
> <BR>
> Let's see the die rolls.<BR>
<BR>
It's a ... 3! and a 2!  Oooh, now I have to behave like a flaming git! <BR>
;-)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:33:44 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Economics<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman writes:<BR>
<BR>
> US Home loan rates have not been as low as 5.75% in quite<BR>
> some time. Given that homes are significantly less mobile<BR>
> than starships the bank is assuming a greater risk on<BR>
> the starship loan . This risk premium suggests that home<BR>
> loans in the Imperium will typically be for less than<BR>
> 5.75%. <BR>
<BR>
In fact, it also assumes that starships are almost impossible to steal, lose,<BR>
break down catastrophically, etc.  Any significant loss rate for ship loans<BR>
and the bank will be losing money.<BR>
<BR>
This goes along with a general tendency in Traveller to make ships rather<BR>
expensive, but then have maintenance costs be very low.  Between insurance,<BR>
maintenance, registration fees, and loans, the total should probably be <BR>
10-20% of the cash price per year, not 5.1%.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:51:21<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
As an amusing aside, I wandered into the FNSLGS yesterday after my doctor's<BR>
appointment, and the only T4 stuff the had left was EV, AR, Anomolies, and<BR>
a lone copy of the IG Long Way Home.<BR>
<BR>
The manager told me that GURPS: Traveller stuff flies off the shelf.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry      gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
   http://gridlore.home.mondspring.com<BR>
<BR>
"A mrgs einu sinni hluti minn systir..."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 10:54:05<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT Posts<BR>
<BR>
At 12:19 PM 4/14/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>(*I know this might get me on the wrong side of some of you gun-types but<BR>
>that's my opinion.)<BR>
<BR>
As one of the gun types, I feel that you are entitled to you opinion.<BR>
Except about the green penguins.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 11:07:09 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> You forgot to mention that both Behave in a Civil Manner and Detect Irony<BR>
> are Hazardous tasks, although they're also "Unskilled Okay".<BR>
<BR>
I'm only a CT player, so I don't quite understand the subtleties of these<BR>
task rolls.<BR>
<BR>
Is there some sort of "spectacular failure" possibility also?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:13:58 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
That's what Hazardous means - if the person fails the task, the result is<BR>
sure to be bad.<BR>
The "Unskilled OK" qualifier means you can try the task even if you don't<BR>
have the skill.<BR>
<BR>
They're both from the MT rules.  If you want to get real technical, you<BR>
should also specify "Instant", since they don't take much time.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Luther Martin [mailto:martin@ksarul.com]<BR>
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2000 12:07 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons OT:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> You forgot to mention that both Behave in a Civil Manner and Detect Irony<BR>
> are Hazardous tasks, although they're also "Unskilled Okay".<BR>
<BR>
I'm only a CT player, so I don't quite understand the subtleties of these<BR>
task rolls.<BR>
<BR>
Is there some sort of "spectacular failure" possibility also?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 13:15:36 -0500<BR>
From: "Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com><BR>
Subject: RE: OT Posts<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Douglas E. Berry [mailto:gridlore@pop.mindspring.com]<BR>
<BR>
> As one of the gun types, I feel that you are entitled to you opinion.<BR>
> Except about the green penguins.<BR>
<BR>
Don't eat the green ones - they aren't ripe.  :-)<BR>
<BR>
 -- vargr1                                              UPP-8D9B85 --<BR>
The three principle virtues of a good programmer   | dmoody@bridge-dot-com<BR>
 are Laziness, Impatience, and Hubris.             | vargr1@jcn1-dot-com<BR>
             ** Omnia dicta fortiora, si dicta latina. **           <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:29:24 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> The manager told me that GURPS: Traveller stuff flies off the shelf.<BR>
<BR>
Heard the same in Boston and Dallas.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 11:40:26 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: OT Posts<BR>
<BR>
- --============_-1256384866==_ma============<BR>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"<BR>
<BR>
Derrick Jones said:<BR>
<BR>
>Penguins? Off topic? What? Get a life, man!<BR>
<BR>
Beg to differ - have life, am not a man, and I like penguins. <BR>
Especially the little Rock Hopper ones with the red eyes.<BR>
<BR>
>Gun control is a controversial<BR>
>topic of conversation, with it's own merits and flaws , where people can<BR>
>get harmed by the outcome of a decision. Never, ever, would I have<BR>
>discussed penguins (green or otherwise) if I thought someone was going<BR>
>to get killed y the outcome of a debate about them (besides my own<BR>
>intolerance of the red, yellow and blue varieties). Having said that, I spose<BR>
>They could be misused. (c.f. Batman Returns)<BR>
<BR>
I fail to see how a discussion could possibly result in "someone" <BR>
getting "killed".  Especially via e-mail.<BR>
<BR>
>Anyway, penguin buiscits are what we eat while playing Traveller. That's<BR>
>on topic as far as I'm concerned! We don't brandish real weapons at each<BR>
>other and don't debate our rights to do so.<BR>
<BR>
No one has suggested 'brandishing' anything.  And are the biscuits <BR>
made FOR penguins, or OF penguins?<BR>
<BR>
>As regards firearms, I hate the things. I served in the army for 6 years and<BR>
>if the truth be known, I only fired one when absolutely necessary and when<BR>
>ordered to*. (I don't get too much of a kick out of cleaning rifles! - when my<BR>
>mates were facing charges for having dirty rifles, mine was always <BR>
>gleaming!!!)<BR>
><BR>
>I think I'd better lie down<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Do have a rest, perhaps you'll calm down enough to notice that I have <BR>
not been part of the gun debate, I was merely concerned with some of <BR>
the reactions being a bit overboard (i.e., questioning someone's <BR>
motives), when a simple "Let's not get too far off topic, please" <BR>
would have sufficed.<BR>
<BR>
Any way, lest I be accused of contributing to the lengthy off-topic <BR>
thread involving people complaining about off-topic threads, I will <BR>
now cease to comment on it.  Except for the penguins.  Which I like.<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
- --============_-1256384866==_ma============<BR>
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<BR>
<!doctype html public "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN"><BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><head><style type="text/css"><!--<BR>
blockquote, dl, ul, ol, li { margin-top: 0 ; margin-bottom: 0 }<BR>
 --></style><title>Re: OT Posts</title></head><BR>
<div>Derrick Jones said:<BR>
</div><blockquote type="cite" cite>Penguins? Off topic? What? Get a life,man!</blockquote><div><BR>
</div><div>Beg to differ -<U> have</U> life, am<U> not</U> a man, and Ilike penguins. Especially the little Rock Hopper ones with the redeyes.</div><div><BR>
</div><blockquote type="cite" cite>Gun control is a controversial<BR>
topic of conversation, with it's own merits and flaws , where peoplecan<BR>
get harmed by the outcome of a decision. Never, ever, would I have<BR>
discussed penguins (green or otherwise) if I thought someone wasgoing<BR>
to get killed y the outcome of a debate about them (besides my own<BR>
intolerance of the red, yellow and blue varieties). Having said that,I spose</blockquote><blockquote type="cite" cite>They could be misused. (c.f. BatmanReturns)</blockquote><div><BR>
</div><div>I fail to see how a discussion could possibly result in &quot;someone&quot; getting &quot;killed&quot;.&nbsp; Especially viae-mail.&nbsp;&nbsp; </div><div><BR>
</div><blockquote type="cite" cite>Anyway, penguin buiscits are what we eatwhile playing Traveller. That's<BR>
on topic as far as I'm concerned! We don't brandish real weapons ateach</blockquote><blockquote type="cite" cite>other and don't debate our rights to doso.</blockquote><div><BR>
</div><div>No one has suggested 'brandishing' anything.&nbsp; And are the biscuits made FOR penguins, or OF penguins?</div><div><BR>
</div><blockquote type="cite" cite>As regards firearms, I hate the things.I served in the army for 6 years and<BR>
if the truth be known, I only fired one when absolutely necessary andwhen<BR>
ordered to*. (I don't get too much of a kick out of cleaning rifles!- - when my<BR>
mates were facing charges for having dirty rifles, mine was alwaysgleaming!!!)<BR>
</blockquote><blockquote type="cite" cite>I think I'd better lie down<BR>
</blockquote><div><BR>
</div><div>Do have a rest, perhaps you'll calm down enough to notice that I have not been part of the gun debate, I was merely concerned with some of the reactions being a bit overboard (i.e., questioning someone's motives), when a simple &quot;Let's not get too far offtopic, please&quot; would have sufficed.</div><div><BR>
</div><div>Any way, lest I be accused of contributing to the lengthy off-topic thread involving people complaining about off-topic threads, I will now cease to comment on it.&nbsp; Except for the penguins.&nbsp; Which I like. </div><div><BR>
</div><div>Red</div><BR>
- --============_-1256384866==_ma============--<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 11:45:05 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Norris' Evil Twin  was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2305<BR>
<BR>
Oh, lordy, Loren. Now you've gone and done it!<BR>
<BR>
"Psst, LOREN says Norris has an evil twin brother....pass it along"<BR>
<BR>
thus is canon created... Don't come whining to _us_ when some crazed fan<BR>
calls you at 3 AM asking for his detailed stats and family history...:-P<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> In a message dated 00-04-13 11:34:38 EDT, you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> << The illustration on p116 of GURPS Far Trader ... is  that  Norris<BR>
>  actively participating in a barroom brawl?<BR>
>   >><BR>
> <BR>
> Nope. It's his evil twin.<BR>
> <BR>
> LKW<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 11:55:43 -0700<BR>
From: "Mike Linsenmayer" <mlinsenmayer@symantec.com><BR>
Subject: New Equipment Picture Posted<BR>
<BR>
Introducing Gasbg's Tech A long range Laser Communicator. With secured<BR>
encrypted data ranges in excess of 500 kilometers in clear line of site.<BR>
Only 10,000cr!<BR>
<BR>
http://www.bigbailey.com/vspace/art/picture-d.htm<BR>
<BR>
This is from the world builders handbook / personal equipment / Page12<BR>
<BR>
Enjoy<BR>
<BR>
Mike<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 11:58:55 -0700<BR>
From: Bill <beast@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT Posts<BR>
<BR>
- --============_-1256383759==_ma============<BR>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"<BR>
<BR>
>Derrick Jones said:<BR>
><BR>
>>Penguins? Off topic? What? Get a life, man!<BR>
><BR>
>Beg to differ - have life, am not a man, and I like penguins. <BR>
>Especially the little Rock Hopper ones with the red eyes.<BR>
><BR>
>>Gun control is a controversial<BR>
>>topic of conversation, with it's own merits and flaws , where people can<BR>
>>get harmed by the outcome of a decision. Never, ever, would I have<BR>
>>discussed penguins (green or otherwise) if I thought someone was going<BR>
>>to get killed y the outcome of a debate about them (besides my own<BR>
>>intolerance of the red, yellow and blue varieties). Having said that, I spose<BR>
>>They could be misused. (c.f. Batman Returns)<BR>
><BR>
>I fail to see how a discussion could possibly result in "someone" <BR>
>getting "killed".  Especially via e-mail.<BR>
><BR>
>>Anyway, penguin buiscits are what we eat while playing Traveller. That's<BR>
>>on topic as far as I'm concerned! We don't brandish real weapons at each<BR>
>>other and don't debate our rights to do so.<BR>
><BR>
>No one has suggested 'brandishing' anything.  And are the biscuits <BR>
>made FOR penguins, or OF penguins?<BR>
><BR>
>>As regards firearms, I hate the things. I served in the army for 6 years and<BR>
>>if the truth be known, I only fired one when absolutely necessary and when<BR>
>>ordered to*. (I don't get too much of a kick out of cleaning <BR>
>>rifles! - when my<BR>
>>mates were facing charges for having dirty rifles, mine was always <BR>
>>gleaming!!!)<BR>
>><BR>
>>I think I'd better lie down<BR>
>><BR>
><BR>
>Do have a rest, perhaps you'll calm down enough to notice that I <BR>
>have not been part of the gun debate, I was merely concerned with <BR>
>some of the reactions being a bit overboard (i.e., questioning <BR>
>someone's motives), when a simple "Let's not get too far off topic, <BR>
>please" would have sufficed.<BR>
><BR>
>Any way, lest I be accused of contributing to the lengthy off-topic <BR>
>thread involving people complaining about off-topic threads, I will <BR>
>now cease to comment on it.  Except for the penguins.  Which I like.<BR>
><BR>
>Red<BR>
<BR>
Red...<BR>
Please don't look at the penguins... They are not really there...Really...<BR>
And the sun(s) have always risen in the west<BR>
<BR>
- --============_-1256383759==_ma============<BR>
Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii"<BR>
<BR>
<excerpt>Derrick Jones said:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<excerpt>Penguins? Off topic? What? Get a life, man!<BR>
<BR>
</excerpt><BR>
<BR>
Beg to differ -<underline> have</underline> life, am<underline><BR>
not</underline> a man, and I like penguins. Especially the little Rock<BR>
Hopper ones with the red eyes.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<excerpt>Gun control is a controversial<BR>
<BR>
topic of conversation, with it's own merits and flaws , where people<BR>
can<BR>
<BR>
get harmed by the outcome of a decision. Never, ever, would I have<BR>
<BR>
discussed penguins (green or otherwise) if I thought someone was going<BR>
<BR>
to get killed y the outcome of a debate about them (besides my own<BR>
<BR>
intolerance of the red, yellow and blue varieties). Having said that, I<BR>
spose<BR>
<BR>
They could be misused. (c.f. Batman Returns)<BR>
<BR>
</excerpt><BR>
<BR>
I fail to see how a discussion could possibly result in "someone"<BR>
getting "killed".  Especially via e-mail.  <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<excerpt>Anyway, penguin buiscits are what we eat while playing<BR>
Traveller. That's<BR>
<BR>
on topic as far as I'm concerned! We don't brandish real weapons at<BR>
each<BR>
<BR>
other and don't debate our rights to do so.<BR>
<BR>
</excerpt><BR>
<BR>
No one has suggested 'brandishing' anything.  And are the biscuits made<BR>
FOR penguins, or OF penguins?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<excerpt>As regards firearms, I hate the things. I served in the army<BR>
for 6 years and<BR>
<BR>
if the truth be known, I only fired one when absolutely necessary and<BR>
when<BR>
<BR>
ordered to*. (I don't get too much of a kick out of cleaning rifles! -<BR>
when my<BR>
<BR>
mates were facing charges for having dirty rifles, mine was always<BR>
gleaming!!!)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I think I'd better lie down<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
</excerpt><BR>
<BR>
Do have a rest, perhaps you'll calm down enough to notice that I have<BR>
not been part of the gun debate, I was merely concerned with some of<BR>
the reactions being a bit overboard (i.e., questioning someone's<BR>
motives), when a simple "Let's not get too far off topic, please" would<BR>
have sufficed.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Any way, lest I be accused of contributing to the lengthy off-topic<BR>
thread involving people complaining about off-topic threads, I will now<BR>
cease to comment on it.  Except for the penguins.  Which I like.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
</excerpt><BR>
<BR>
Red...<BR>
<BR>
Please don't look at the penguins... They are not really<BR>
there...Really...<BR>
<BR>
And the sun(s) have always risen in the west<BR>
<BR>
- --============_-1256383759==_ma============--<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2309<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 14 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2310<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Filk pages<BR>
Re: Filk pages<BR>
Re: Filk pages  <BR>
Re: Anal-retentive.<BR>
Re: Orders<BR>
Re loan rates<BR>
Re: Norris' Evil Twin <BR>
Re: Re loan rates<BR>
Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
"Mind for Trade" Author Question<BR>
Gun Types?<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: The Health of Traveller<BR>
[OT] Tekumel.com needs help<BR>
Re: Anal-retentive.<BR>
Re: Dulinor not busted by Ludowick Gambit?<BR>
P-p-p-penguins! (was Re: Re loan rates)<BR>
OT posts?<BR>
OT posts. (my last post on the topic - honest)<BR>
Re: GT-Q: Ground Penetrating Radar and other toys<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 11:07:18<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Filk pages<BR>
<BR>
The traveller filk page is starting to get a bit crowded, so I need folks<BR>
to go take a look and give me their opinions on what filks I should take<BR>
down to make room for newer entries.<BR>
<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/travfilk.html<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry      )+(      gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
    http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"Well, thanks to the Internet, I'm now bored with sex."<BR>
	                    - Fry, Futurama<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 14:50:47 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Filk pages<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> The traveller filk page is starting to get a bit crowded, so I need folks<BR>
> to go take a look and give me their opinions on what filks I should take<BR>
> down to make room for newer entries.<BR>
> <BR>
> http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/travfilk.html<BR>
<BR>
Well, I'll recuse myself from suggesting that my filk stay, and mention<BR>
three filks that you should keep:<BR>
<BR>
"The Lord High Executioner's Song (as sung by Lucan I)"<BR>
"Eneri the Eighth"<BR>
"The Old Destroyer Squadron"<BR>
<BR>
Most of the rest are also good, but these three are my "gotta keep"<BR>
short list.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:58:00 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Filk pages  <BR>
<BR>
Black Ice wrote:<BR>
>Well, I'll recuse myself from suggesting that my filk stay, and mention <BR>
>three filks that you should keep: <BR>
><BR>
>"The Lord High Executioner's Song (as sung by Lucan I)" <BR>
>"Eneri the Eighth" <BR>
>"The Old Destroyer Squadron" <BR>
><BR>
>Most of the rest are also good, but these three are my "gotta keep" <BR>
>short list. <BR>
<BR>
Glad you liked my rendition of that Navy tune.  Of course, I recuse<BR>
myself from recommending it or my other one...<BR>
<BR>
But I second the motion for "Eneri the Eighth" and "Lord High<BR>
Executioner...".  I'd also like to recommend "When I Was a Lad"<BR>
and "The Hiver Technical Academy Fight Song".<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:10:22 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Anal-retentive.<BR>
<BR>
>I believe that some of you are missing the point.  What matters is<BR>
>not whether or not anal-retentive should have a hyphen in it.  What<BR>
>matters is, having a hyphen, exactly how long should the hypen be?<BR>
>And should it be measured in centimetres?  Millimetres?  Picas?<BR>
>Pixels?<BR>
><BR>
>Red<BR>
<BR>
<snide mode><BR>
None of the above. It should be measured in frations of an M-square. That<BR>
way it scales properly.<BR>
</snide mode><BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:02:45 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Orders<BR>
<BR>
>>In all cases, the players moaned about it, but followed<BR>
>>orders.  Latter they agreed (using 20/20 hindsight) that they<BR>
>>should have killed him and taken over - court martial or no.<BR>
>>Why did they follow orders?  Because he had rank.<BR>
><BR>
>Now that's what I call role-playing!<BR>
<BR>
Here here!<BR>
<BR>
One fun thing I did with more than one Star Trek campaign was, while I<BR>
figured out experience, have the players write their log entries for the<BR>
mission. I later ran a court martial of the captain, using their own logs<BR>
as evidence against them. Those were some INTENSE sessions, especially<BR>
since I used "guest players" as the prosecuting officer and counsel for the<BR>
defense. I've not tried this in traveller, although the "Courtroom Drama"<BR>
makes for an interesting change of pace in a long-running traveller game;<BR>
I've done court-room drama in traveller... done right, it is a powerful and<BR>
memorable session or two.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:20:12 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re loan rates<BR>
<BR>
>[1] Assuming the Imeprium has a 12 month year which book 2,<BR>
>by equating 480 payments to 40 years does.<BR>
<BR>
Starship loans appear to be paid 12 of the 13 months of the imperial<BR>
calendar each year. This is implied (but not explicit) in The Traveller<BR>
Adventure. You apparently get an automatic 1 month deferrment without<BR>
interest.<BR>
<BR>
>[2] Presumably no such tax exists or it would be listed<BR>
>as a starship expense for paid off starships.<BR>
<BR>
ISTR some references to registration fees. Something about decade long<BR>
registrations. On the order of KCr1 per Td of hull.<BR>
<BR>
>[3] This assumption may be invalid but as shipowners insurance<BR>
>is not listed anywhere I am aware of in Traveller rules it<BR>
>is arguably correct.<BR>
<BR>
Perhaps the loan rate itself is more like 4%, and the additional is mortage<BR>
insurance? (Tis IMTU. Don't know of any cannon to support nor deny it that<BR>
way.)<BR>
<BR>
But, ITRW, many home loans require either mortage insurance OR<BR>
comprehensive homeowners insurance as part of the contract. Note, many, but<BR>
by no means all.<BR>
<BR>
>[5] At least in general. If _you_ live on beer alone than<BR>
>IMNSHO you have a drinking problem.<BR>
<BR>
And probably a liver and/or kidney problem, too! ;)<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:31:23 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Norris' Evil Twin <BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Oh, lordy, Loren. Now you've gone and done it!<BR>
> "Psst, LOREN says Norris has an evil twin brother....pass it along"<BR>
> thus is canon created...<BR>
<BR>
> GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> > << The illustration on p116 of GURPS Far Trader ... is  that  Norris<BR>
> >  actively participating in a barroom brawl?<BR>
> >   >><BR>
<BR>
> > Nope. It's his evil twin.<BR>
<BR>
Previous Traveller canon already implied that Norris had<BR>
an evil twin (clone), see MT and TNE information of nobles<BR>
having themselves cloned. <BR>
<BR>
Norris had his clones made at Regina only after he was already <BR>
a Duke because as the 2nd son he wasn't important enough<BR>
to clone when younger. Unfortunately at TL 12 Regina's technology<BR>
was not really up to 'force growing' clones which was needed<BR>
to make the clones age catch up to Norris's. The facility<BR>
was able to adjust the clones apparent biological age to<BR>
Duke Norris's but in the process they messed up the clones<BR>
brain so much that he is a sociopathic paranoid schitzophrentic <BR>
with a severe impulse control problem (i.e. evil). The clone<BR>
ended up killing a guard and escaping. Since the clone thinks <BR>
of himself as much more handsome than Norris he flies off the<BR>
handle and attacks anyone who comments on how much he looks<BR>
like the Duke; hence the barroom brawl.<BR>
<BR>
Upon learning of the news Norris gave up on the attempt<BR>
to have his clones force grown. Norris's next clone, Seldrian,<BR>
was allowed to mature at the normal rate.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:44:18 -0500<BR>
From: Jimmy Simpson <nimrod@santech.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Re loan rates<BR>
<BR>
At 12:20 PM 4/14/00 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
> >[1] Assuming the Imeprium has a 12 month year which book 2,<BR>
> >by equating 480 payments to 40 years does.<BR>
><BR>
>Starship loans appear to be paid 12 of the 13 months of the imperial<BR>
>calendar each year. This is implied (but not explicit) in The Traveller<BR>
>Adventure. You apparently get an automatic 1 month deferrment without<BR>
>interest.<BR>
I believe the Imperial calendar came out long after book 2 (?) which set <BR>
the 12 month year.  When someone was devising the calendar, with its <BR>
sequentially numbered dates, the easiest breakdown was to go with a 13 <BR>
month year, each of 4 weeks.  They probably didn't even think about the <BR>
starship financing listing a year as 12 months.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jimmy Simpson<BR>
      nimrodd@fastlane.net<BR>
<BR>
"The avalanche has already started.<BR>
It is too late for the pebbles to vote."<BR>
                       -Kosh Naranek (Babylon 5)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:04:03 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
This is regarding a post I've just made to a GT PBeM I'm in (see below)<BR>
<BR>
I'd just like to run it past some of you to double check my figures... I<BR>
*think* I've got it pretty well clear in my mind, but it is always worth<BR>
checking.<BR>
<BR>
A precis of the situation:<BR>
<BR>
We have misjumped after a missile hit while escaping a planet being attacked<BR>
by Vargr.<BR>
<BR>
Our m-drive is not functional, and we have insufficient fuel remaining to<BR>
jump, though we do have a little left.  We emerged from jump at the 100D<BR>
limit of an unstable star (Nirton/Spinward Marches)<BR>
<BR>
We have picked up a distress signal from another ship, and are going to try<BR>
and rendezvous. It is 5 days away at 0.1G.<BR>
<BR>
One of the options we are considering is using the remaining fuel as<BR>
reaction mass in an Ion drive, mainly my Idea...<BR>
<BR>
Other proposals that have been considered and discarded were fastening<BR>
missiles to the hull to use as thrusters, and manufacturing a Solar Sail.<BR>
<BR>
The formulae I've used to calculate my figures (using Excel 97) are:<BR>
<BR>
Distance in metres= (Initial Closing Speed=0) + 0.5*(9.81*G's)*((0.5*Time in<BR>
seconds)^2)<BR>
<BR>
This gets distance covered during constant acceleration for half the time.<BR>
The total distance is twice this, ie same distance travelled to decelerate.<BR>
<BR>
From this, I used:<BR>
<BR>
Mass of Ship(kg)*(G's*9.81m/s^2)*Total Distance(m) = 0.5*Reaction<BR>
Mass(kg)*(Exhaust Velocity(m/s))^2<BR>
<BR>
ie maD=1/2mv^2<BR>
<BR>
ie Newtonmeters=Joules<BR>
<BR>
Comments?<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Matthew Bond <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
>From: Matthew Bond <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
>>From: roy smith <trk_driver@yahoo.com><BR>
>>>[enri]<BR>
>>>nevil, look around in engineering and see if you can<BR>
>>>find enough parts to BUILD an ion engine. they arent<BR>
>>>that hard to make, really. ionioze the h2 with a high<BR>
>>>tension electric feild, and squirt it out through a<BR>
>>>magnetin field. steer with manuvering thrusters.<BR>
>>>ooc- scott, i saw the schematics for an ion drive<BR>
>>>engine is pop sci about a year ago, really, its just<BR>
>>>that simple! look it up.<BR>
>><BR>
>><BR>
>>[OOC]<BR>
>><BR>
>>I've rechecked my figures and think my WAG of the efficiency of an Ion<BR>
>drive<BR>
>>was a little 'optimistic'. I assumed an exhaust velocity of 0.001c was<BR>
>>reasonable... and perhaps it is at Gurps TL12 / CT TL15, but it is about<BR>
>100<BR>
>>times higher velocity than 'current' Ion drives, which have an exhaust<BR>
>>velocity in the order of 30km/s.  As the Kinetic Energy produced is based<BR>
>on<BR>
>>v^2, then my figures were about 10,000 times better than 1990's tech will<BR>
>>allow. I'll recalculate tonight and post a revised estimate later. I'll<BR>
>also<BR>
>>look up the figures for Ion drives in FFS1 & 2, and Gurps:Vehicles, and<BR>
>>Space. It would really help if I had the stats for the ship. Displacement,<BR>
>>Mass, Power Plant Output, TL, Remaining Fuel, etc<BR>
>><BR>
>><BR>
>>BTW, based on a 5 day round trip to the Sword at 0.1G, it is 12-g hours<BR>
>away<BR>
>>(ie 6 Ghours acc & 6 dec), not the six I posted earlier... forgot to add<BR>
in<BR>
>>the deceleration, Doh! This makes it ~90 million km, or ~0.6AU away.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>Gah! The distances I'd previously calculated (and not posted) were right,<BR>
>but I multiplied by two after I realised my G-Hour mistake. It is actually<BR>
>~45.77Mkm, or ~0.3AU to the Sword of Arbellatra based on a 5 day trip at<BR>
>0.1G<BR>
><BR>
>Right, some figures. I'm assuming that the Straight Flush is ~400DT (based<BR>
>on perceived size from no. of staterooms...) and masses 10t per DT. There<BR>
is<BR>
>less than 40DT of LH2 remaining (or we could Jump...<g>), and probably less<BR>
>than 4DT.<BR>
><BR>
>Acc(G)    Time(days)  Fuel(Tonnes)    Exhaust Velocity (km/s)<BR>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
- -<BR>
>--------<BR>
>0.1                      5       399110.4!!!!               30*<BR>
>0.00001         500                39.9**                 30<BR>
>0.000001    1581                    3.99                30<BR>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
- -<BR>
>--------<BR>
>0.001               50                 39.9                  300<BR>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
- -<BR>
>--------<BR>
>0.1                      5                 39.9                3000 (0.01c)<BR>
>0.01              15.8                    3.99***         3000<BR>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
- -<BR>
>--------<BR>
>*Slightly better than current tech<BR>
>**Just less than the fuel we would need to jump<BR>
>***Probably the optimum of Fuel/Time, providing Scott allows for the<BR>
>increased EV for being at much higher TL<BR>
><BR>
>As you can see, without improvement of Ion drives, they are slowwwww.<BR>
>However, current drives are power by solar cells in the low kW range...<BR>
~2kW<BR>
>and get an exhaust velocity of ~20km/s.  We can use a multi-*megawatt*<BR>
>fusion power plant to power the drive. Now if exhaust velocity is<BR>
>proportional to the *square root* of power input (and I don't *know* that<BR>
it<BR>
>is, but it makes a plausible handwave...) then ~45MW (the smallest starship<BR>
>power plant in TNE is ~150MW...) would give 3,000km/s.<BR>
><BR>
>Matt<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
>eLerts<BR>
>It's Easy. It's Fun. Best of All, it's Free!<BR>
>http://click.egroups.com/1/3080/6/_/469741/_/955742663/<BR>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
><BR>
>Traveller is a registered trade mark of Far-Future Enterprises<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:27:53 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: "Mind for Trade" Author Question<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/13/00 9:52:03 PM Central Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> I just finished a Mind for Trade and I LOVED it...It would make a great <BR>
>  game...espically if your players haven't read it....<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Mike<BR>
>  <BR>
Who's it by?<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 14:16:31 -0700<BR>
From: scharlto@ifsna.com<BR>
Subject: Gun Types?<BR>
<BR>
At 12:19 PM 4/14/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>(*I know this might get me on the wrong side of some of you<BR>
gun-types but<BR>
>that's my opinion.)<BR>
<BR>
I am a .45 ACP gun type.  Back in 1990, I was more of a .38<BR>
Special, but then I gained weight...<BR>
<BR>
Steven Charlton<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:55:08 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching writes:<BR>
<BR>
> The local record for such mispurchasing (as opposed to collecting <BR>
variations)<BR>
>  is a friend with three copies of the AD&D book "Legends & Lore". No one <BR>
> knows<BR>
>  why, since it isn't the most essential book in that game.<BR>
<BR>
The first printing of "Legends & Lore" stomped on H. P. Lovecraft's estate <BR>
copyright of the Cthulhu mythos and included a section giving stats on all of <BR>
the various ugglies, from the Mi-Go to Shub-Niggurath. Apparently TSR settled <BR>
with the Lovecraft estate and removed that section from all future printings <BR>
of the book, making the first print books collector's items. One of my <BR>
friends actually bought one for $150, and that's not the highest price I've <BR>
seen or heard paid for one.<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
(Crying that his great-grandmother burned both of his first print books, and <BR>
many, many others, in a misguided effort to save his soul from the <BR>
demon-worshipping AD&D cult.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:06:53 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Health of Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Freelance Traveller has a hit-o-meter on the portal page.  I've<BR>
generally asked people who want to keep links or<BR>
favorites/bookmarks to use the portal page, but I can't control<BR>
whether they do or not.  Nevertheless, since I started keeping<BR>
track, around three years ago, Freelance Traveller has had over<BR>
12,000 hits on that page (and who knows how many more direct to<BR>
inside pages), and the weekly average has been climbing - I'll<BR>
have to check my compiled stats (on the laptop), but I think it's<BR>
currently hovering right around 200, with peaks now over 300<BR>
(usually right after I announce an update). I don't know how much<BR>
of that is repeat business (probably a lot), but I do<BR>
occasionally get jeewizzes from new names about how they've been<BR>
out of Traveller for a long time, and hey, it's a neat site, and<BR>
how do I subscribe (!), and gee, it's a _really_ neat site, yada,<BR>
yada, yada.  So, I'd say offhand that Traveller is alive and<BR>
well, and living in Texas (GURPS home), and Illinois (FarFuture<BR>
home), and the UK (BITS home), and hundreds of other locations<BR>
(where the websites are).<BR>
<BR>
But, you know what?  Even if there was no GURPS Traveller, and<BR>
even if Marc couldn't have gotten FarFuture off the ground,<BR>
Traveller would still be alive and well.  Because as long as a<BR>
game system is still being played, and fans are creating new<BR>
material for it, and sharing that material around, the game is<BR>
still growing, and _can't_ be called dead.  And let me tell you -<BR>
Traveller has been growing, even suffering growing pains.<BR>
<BR>
I salute those of you who have done your part to keep Traveller<BR>
alive - each and every one of you that has _ever_ posted an idea<BR>
to this list, run a campaign, written for one or more of the<BR>
websites, or even just written letters of encouragement to Marc,<BR>
Loren, Steve, or anyone else who has had an influence on the<BR>
subculture we call Traveller. VIVAT TRAVELLER!<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:36:13 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: [OT] Tekumel.com needs help<BR>
<BR>
See the below message about the tekumel.com website needing assistance. It's<BR>
a good chance to learn more about Tekumel, which is a fantastic source of<BR>
alien beings, cultures, and technologies for use in a Traveller game.<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Bob Alberti <albatross@albatross.org><BR>
Newsgroups: alt.games.frp.tekumel<BR>
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2000 2:01 PM<BR>
Subject: Desperately Seeking Ssuyal<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> I'm still looking for anyone with Unix, Majordomo, or HTML skills who<BR>
would<BR>
> like to help out with Tekumel.com.  I can do a lot of this stuff alone but<BR>
> it's slow going.<BR>
><BR>
> Let me know!  I can't believe there isn't a single Tsolyani out there who<BR>
> knows how to make web pages..<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 15:59:33 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Anal-retentive.<BR>
<BR>
>From: red@europa.com<BR>
<BR>
>I believe that some of you are missing the point.  What matters<BR>
<BR>
>is  not whether or not anal-retentive should have a hyphen in <BR>
>it.  What  matters is, having a hyphen, exactly how long should<BR>
<BR>
>the hypen be?  And should it be measured in centimetres?  <BR>
>Millimetres?  Picas? Pixels?<BR>
<BR>
One of my friends uses the acronym AROC (pronounced Ay Rock) for<BR>
anal-retentive obsesssive-compulsive:  "Now _that_ is AROC<BR>
behavior, Glenn."<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:59:53 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Dulinor not busted by Ludowick Gambit?<BR>
<BR>
Ludowick@aol.com wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<<snip>><BR>
<BR>
>  >> Dulinor fleeing to Illelish: Busted!  No Rebellion, no Black War, No<BR>
>  >Virus!<BR>
>  ><BR>
>  >That's why Dulinor had to get the Illelish fleet (run by<BR>
>  >his brother) on his side either the fleet destroyed all<BR>
>  >these Scouts or Dulinor got to the Scout Base Commander<BR>
>  >at Capitol/Core and made sure the message was never sent.<BR>
> <BR>
> I was thinking that word of his misdeeds could get ahead of his ship, and<BR>
> he could be nabbed _before_ he even gets to Illelish sector.  Possible punish-<BR>
> ment:<BR>
> <BR>
> 1. Administer anagathics to prolong his life.<BR>
> <BR>
> 2. Insert would-be "reformer" in pain amplifier, for as long as he shall live.<BR>
>    Does anyone have Dulinor's UPP?  We could model his future.<BR>
> <BR>
> 3. Pipe screams through PA systems in Capital's cities, every Holiday.<BR>
<BR>
Amateurish.<BR>
<BR>
Personally, I prefer the idea of temporal exile:<BR>
<BR>
You place Dulinor in a low berth.  His titles and holdings pass on to<BR>
his heir(s).<BR>
<BR>
Then you thaw him out 150 years later.  He's now a free man.  With no<BR>
anchor in the society around him.  His best option is to attach himself<BR>
to some university's History department as an expert on his era.<BR>
<BR>
If you wish to show more cruelty, you thaw him out for one month at the<BR>
halfway point.  That way, he serves an an object lesson to the next<BR>
generation, and gets to spend the next 75 years of cold sleep dreaming<BR>
of his cultural disorientation.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:55:26 -0500<BR>
From: "Joseph R. Dietrich" <yikes@evansville.net><BR>
Subject: P-p-p-penguins! (was Re: Re loan rates)<BR>
<BR>
>[1] Assuming the Imeprium has a 12 month year which book 2,<BR>
>by equating 480 payments to 40 years does.<BR>
<BR>
I read this and thought it said "...equating 480 penguins to 40 years... ."<BR>
<BR>
I have failed my SAN check.<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: What, no SAN in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
Joseph R. Dietrich, yikes@evansville.net<BR>
http://www.evansville.net/~yikes/joespace.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:38:24 +0100<BR>
From: "Derrick Jones" <dojones.whitestar@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: OT posts?<BR>
<BR>
Red@europa.com wrote...<BR>
>Beg to differ - have life, am not a man, and I like penguins. <BR>
<BR>
1st, Sorry, I was not making an assumption, I was just using a turn of phrase.<BR>
Please do not be offended by that. The get a life was not intended to be offensive<BR>
either, just saying that Penguins are the be all and end all of my gaming sessions,<BR>
and if I continue to spread the word, maybe others will get the taste, maybe you<BR>
could join in too, and have 'real life!'. ;-)<BR>
<BR>
>I fail to see how a discussion could possibly result in "someone" <BR>
>getting "killed".  Especially via e-mail.<BR>
<BR>
I don't think I did say that e-mail discussions we are having about things like this<BR>
are the things that get people killed. It is the outcome of politicians' debates that<BR>
affect life. <BR>
<BR>
>No one has suggested 'brandishing' anything. <BR>
I know. I'm talking about biscuit eating being part of my group's gaming sessions, <BR>
and the concept of gun control not being part of it.<BR>
<BR>
>And are the biscuits, made FOR penguins, or OF penguins? <BR>
Neither. Penguin is a brand of chocolate covered biscuit with a chocolatey filling,<BR>
marketed by a company based in the UK. They are 'The choclatiest biscuits in<BR>
the world'. (did I say I like the green ones)<BR>
<BR>
>Do have a rest, perhaps you'll calm down enough to notice that I have <BR>
>not been part of the gun debate, I was merely concerned with some of <BR>
>the reactions being a bit overboard (i.e., questioning someone's <BR>
>motives), when a simple "Let's not get too far off topic, please" <BR>
>would have sufficed.<BR>
<BR>
Your post was in reply to somebody's request to take the OT thread away from<BR>
people who don't want to read it. You also pointed out that Penguin discussions<BR>
were not on topic. I begged to differ and showed how they were on topic IMO, and <BR>
that Gun Control topics weren't On topic for me.  I have not once needed to calm <BR>
down. I understand the importance of reading people's posts before replying, and<BR>
unfortunately my post could have been better worded. I never accused you of being<BR>
part of any debate, nor would I ever, since I don't know you, never have and prolly<BR>
never will (c.f. the first non-assumption). <BR>
<BR>
I have just seen the Gun Control debates cycle around and around so many times<BR>
in the past that they get frustrating, particularly to us people who live in places were<BR>
guns are not an issue (unless you're a criminal  or a serving military person). That's all.<BR>
<BR>
Please accept my apologies if I have offended you, or anybody else in my postings,<BR>
I can assure you it was not my intent.<BR>
<BR>
Yours cordially, (letting the discussion rest for a while)<BR>
<BR>
Derrick<BR>
<BR>
p.s. could I please ask that you turn off the html thing (or whatever it is) on your<BR>
mailer. I got your message twice, once in normal mode, and once with all sorts of<BR>
wierd headers and stuff.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Derrick Jones<BR>
St Helens<BR>
Lancashire UK<BR>
http://www.btinternet.com/~dojones.whitestar<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:47:15 +0100<BR>
From: "Derrick Jones" <dojones.whitestar@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: OT posts. (my last post on the topic - honest)<BR>
<BR>
Doug wrote:<BR>
>As one of the gun types, I feel that you are entitled to you opinion.<BR>
<BR>
And I, you yours!<BR>
<BR>
>Except about the green penguins.<BR>
To quote from the Book of Articles on Lancastrian Law (c1682)<BR>
(Page DLVII para V)<BR>
<BR>
"..... cursed be the man that imposeth strictures on another man's<BR>
choice of chocolate biscuit...."<BR>
<BR>
and in the Statutes of the Peoples Republic of South Lancashire (1994)<BR>
<BR>
"..... that man's choice of chocolate biscuit shall be his. The PRSL or its<BR>
representatives, agents and executors shall not have any right to deny <BR>
a comrade citizen's choice.... (particularly if he leaves me the red ones)."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
We'll see in August. You can make your choice then!<BR>
<BR>
Derrick<BR>
<BR>
Derrick Jones<BR>
St Helens<BR>
Lancashire UK<BR>
http://www.btinternet.com/~dojones.whitestar<BR>
<BR>
PS All this talk about Topics is getting me peckish. "What has a hazelnut in<BR>
ev-er-y bit? Topic! Thick milk chocolate for your delight? Topic! etc etc etc...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:40:54 -0400<BR>
From: "Daniel Phelps" <phelpsd@gate.net><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: Ground Penetrating Radar and other toys<BR>
<BR>
Regarding ground penetrating radar (GPR) it is a technique limited both by<BR>
physics and local conditions.  Regarding simple physics there is an inverse<BR>
relationship between frequency and penetration.  To put it in simple terms<BR>
the higher the freq the better the resolution the lower the penetration.<BR>
Pumping up the energy usually isn't very helpful past a certain point.  The<BR>
local conditions makes a great deal of difference as well.  It is my<BR>
understanding that GPR works best in arid conditions where the free water<BR>
aquifer is relatively deep.  It works best through fill cut into a more<BR>
consolidated strata or where the buried objects to be found are<BR>
substantially denser than the sediments they are buried in.  If the water<BR>
table is quite high you may find that the density contrast is insufficient<BR>
to resolve anything of interest indeed your strongest return will probably<BR>
be at the piezometric surface (top of the freewater aquifer).    If you are<BR>
trying to look through permafrost you will probably get a good return at its<BR>
surface and very little else.  So under the best of conditions using a<BR>
multispectrum approach you can expect only a meter or three of penetration<BR>
with any resolution with increasingly greater penetration and falling off<BR>
resolution to perhaps 5 to 10 meters.  In order to get data that can be<BR>
intrepreted the entire area in question will need to be surveyed with the<BR>
instrument.  Additionally the data will need to be processed, enhanced and<BR>
intrepreted after collection.   With higher TL than ours much of this can be<BR>
done as a relatively simple task by a computer which should be able to<BR>
provide a map showing relative thickness of surficial fill and possible<BR>
targets of interest.   Thus you could get a map showing the location,<BR>
general shape and depth of the target of interest.  There are several other<BR>
techniques which might be useful as well.<BR>
<BR>
Magnetometer:  If you use two sensors separated vertically by a fixed<BR>
difference and some knowledge of what you are looking for you should be able<BR>
to get a depth to the mag hit off the object previously identified by the<BR>
GPR survey.  You can run a mag survey independently and process the data<BR>
through a computer.  This should be able to map out targets of interest and<BR>
their probable depth of burial based on what you know about the target of<BR>
interest.   A mag survey should be able to "see" deeper than the GPR but<BR>
with more uncertanty regarding depth.  As would be expected the value of a<BR>
mag survey in an active built up area is problematic.<BR>
<BR>
Gravimetric:  You should be able to run a grav survey and have the computer,<BR>
based on some reasonable assumptions, produce a map indicating probable<BR>
depth to bed rock and delineate objects of interest as before.   If you know<BR>
what you are looking for you can probably get a good idea of depth of<BR>
burial.<BR>
<BR>
Seismic:  There are several existing techniques that might be of help but<BR>
they generally require more than one vehicle and the layout of lines of<BR>
phones to record the signal.<BR>
<BR>
Yes high tech will make a difference but unless you want to bend the laws of<BR>
physics you can only push a technique to its natural limits.<BR>
<BR>
Daniel C. Phelps, Professional Geologist,  formerly a marine survey/<BR>
exploration geophysicist.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2310<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2311</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 15 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2311<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Gun Types?<BR>
Re: Norris' Evil Twin <BR>
Re: OT posts. (my last post on the topic - honest)<BR>
Traveller Skills<BR>
Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weaponsOT:<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
Re: Smart weapons<BR>
RE: New Equipment Picture Posted<BR>
GC and the prospect of "ignoring it..."<BR>
Re: Filk pages<BR>
Re: Economics<BR>
Re: OT Posts<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Question on Cannon in area<BR>
Re: New Equipment Picture Posted<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
STL PLayers?<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
Re: STL PLayers?<BR>
Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Idle Traveller Musings<BR>
Gravitic Defenses<BR>
Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich, ..."<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:06:36<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Gun Types?<BR>
<BR>
At 02:16 PM 4/15/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I am a .45 ACP gun type.  Back in 1990, I was more of a .38<BR>
>Special, but then I gained weight...<BR>
<BR>
Under that standard, I'm a .22LR  Not too many men of my caliber out there.<BR>
<BR>
(Stop whining.  You all *knew* I was going there.)<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"Some days, you just can't get rid  of a bomb!"<BR>
                    -Adam West, as Batman <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:10:33<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Norris' Evil Twin <BR>
<BR>
At 12:31 PM 4/14/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Previous Traveller canon already implied that Norris had<BR>
>an evil twin (clone), see MT and TNE information of nobles<BR>
>having themselves cloned. <BR>
<BR>
Peter, it was a frigging *joke* fer christssake!  Loren has told us that<BR>
several items of canon came about from either him or Marc being woken from<BR>
a deep sleep to answer a question.  The off-hand answer becomes an<BR>
enshrined part of the Traveller Lore.<BR>
<BR>
If you were trying to be humorous, there was no difference between your<BR>
usual pedantic posts and this one.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:18:39<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT posts. (my last post on the topic - honest)<BR>
<BR>
At 12:47 AM 4/15/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>Doug wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>>Except about the green penguins.<BR>
<BR>
>"..... cursed be the man that imposeth strictures on another man's<BR>
>choice of chocolate biscuit...."<BR>
<BR>
>We'll see in August. You can make your choice then!<BR>
<BR>
I shall be bearing San Francisco Sourdough Bread.  You shall cringe in<BR>
terror and inquire about housing prices in the Bay Area.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
Alle preisen den Pinguinherrscher!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 19:30:55 -0500<BR>
From: Alex Ingram <ingram@airmail.net><BR>
Subject: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
If I were to increase the total number of skills during character<BR>
development would that have a negative,  positive or neutral effect on<BR>
game play. Example: Engineering broken down into Jump Drives, Maneuver<BR>
Drives, Anti-Gravity Drives (Gravitics) Power Plants/Generators,<BR>
Environmental/Life Support or Structural/Welding. Or, Navigation broken<BR>
down into JumpVector Navigation, Astro-Navigation (Astrogation), Aerial<BR>
Navigation, Land Navigation/Pathfinding or Ocean Navigation. Opinions<BR>
please.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 01:10:50 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Another GC rant heading wildly OT as ever WAS Re: Smart weaponsOT:<BR>
<BR>
At 22:09 -0400 13/4/00, "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com> wrote:<BR>
>Gee, calm down. Rant over. Pax.<BR>
<BR>
Accepted. Pax Lunar or Pax Imperium ;-)<BR>
<BR>
>    Going back on topic, Smart guns need to thought out carefully. There are<BR>
>places for them, and not. For Shipboard security use, and Law Enforcement in<BR>
>Traveller, reality, where ever you might be, a Smart Gun would be great<BR>
>idea.<BR>
<BR>
Agreed.<BR>
<BR>
>    So, yes I may be some gun nut, but I think I do have something for this<BR>
>discussion.<BR>
<BR>
I accept that, but the Gun Control comments were OT and the stuff <BR>
that starts a sporadic flamewar here as there are people who feel <BR>
strongly both ways. Note I didn't chip in until the discussion <BR>
started moving this way - I had no problems with the discussion of <BR>
smart weapons, but I did about the <rant> about US Gun Control issues.<BR>
<BR>
Dom (who thinks that Penguins are On-Topic because he has seen <BR>
licensed Traveller material with them in ;-) )<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:52:56 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
Alex Ingram writes:<BR>
> If I were to increase the total number of skills during character<BR>
> development would that have a negative,  positive or neutral effect on<BR>
> game play. Example: Engineering broken down into Jump Drives, Maneuver<BR>
> Drives, Anti-Gravity Drives (Gravitics) Power Plants/Generators,<BR>
> Environmental/Life Support or Structural/Welding. Or, Navigation broken<BR>
> down into JumpVector Navigation, Astro-Navigation (Astrogation), Aerial<BR>
> Navigation, Land Navigation/Pathfinding or Ocean Navigation. Opinions<BR>
> please.<BR>
<BR>
What character generation system?  The general effect would be to make<BR>
characters less competent overall.  It would also tend to magnify the <BR>
effects of good attributes.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 20:53:05 EDT<BR>
From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Smart weapons<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/13/00 3:21:57 PM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>
webmaster@travellercentral.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< As for me, I'll pass on the smart gun thing, at least until it been proven<BR>
 100% by at least 10 years of field experience.  If I'm carrying a gun for<BR>
 last ditch self defense, the last thing I need is another layer of<BR>
 complexity--something else to break at the critical moment.<BR>
 <BR>
 In life and death confrontation, KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) is the order<BR>
 of the day. >><BR>
<BR>
Right on! I'll trust my 30+ year old revolvers over this Colt smart gun crap <BR>
any day... G-d, I sound like a reactionary old fart...:-). I DO like the <BR>
Taurus (Smith and Wesson and Beretta clones made in Brazil, but still good <BR>
weapons...) integral key lock; just don't lose your keys....:-)<BR>
<BR>
Ob Trav: hmm; maybe this explains the magnum revolvers the nobles are fond of <BR>
carrying....?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:06:00 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: New Equipment Picture Posted<BR>
<BR>
Nice work as usual Mike!<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Mike<BR>
> Linsenmayer<BR>
> Sent: Friday, April 14, 2000 11:56 AM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: New Equipment Picture Posted<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> Introducing Gasbg's Tech A long range Laser Communicator. With secured<BR>
> encrypted data ranges in excess of 500 kilometers in clear line of site.<BR>
> Only 10,000cr!<BR>
> <BR>
> http://www.bigbailey.com/vspace/art/picture-d.htm<BR>
> <BR>
> This is from the world builders handbook / personal equipment / Page12<BR>
> <BR>
> Enjoy<BR>
> <BR>
> Mike<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:33:52 +1000<BR>
From: "The Roc" <roc@kewl.com.au><BR>
Subject: GC and the prospect of "ignoring it..."<BR>
<BR>
I think that if you don't like GC topics, that if everyone ignores it (pro<BR>
or con), then the original post will simply fade un-answered.  If the<BR>
original GC poster tries again - ignore again... the message has to get<BR>
across eventually, and in the end, if everyone ignores GC topics, they will<BR>
eventually die a death (eventually only new-comers with something to say<BR>
will answer, but if they are ALL ignored, then the message will get across<BR>
eventually.<BR>
<BR>
Pre-emptive flames are rude and perpetuate the topic, and make the poster's<BR>
of pre-emptive flames worse than the GC posters morally.  There was no call<BR>
for it when it could simply be ignored.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:36:24 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Filk pages<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
> The traveller filk page is starting to get a bit crowded, so I need folks<BR>
> to go take a look and give me their opinions on what filks I should take<BR>
> down to make room for newer entries.<BR>
<BR>
My first impulse is to ask if you can keep it all and loose<BR>
or move, something else instead, there are many Traveller<BR>
sites but AFAIK no other Traveller filk sites.<BR>
<BR>
If you must take something down I suggest removing:<BR>
<BR>
The Banana X-Boat Song<BR>
The .1 C Country/Western Song<BR>
Hiver Technical Academy Fight Song<BR>
Enir Hill<BR>
After teh FFW<BR>
<BR>
The ones I would say are the most worth keeping are:<BR>
<BR>
The Traveller Saga<BR>
When I was a Lad<BR>
Send the Marines<BR>
Traveller Rhapsody<BR>
<BR>
I also like The Executioners Song but modesty prevents me <BR>
from short listing it.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 18:46:41 -0700<BR>
From: "Kelly St.Clair" <kellys@efn.org><BR>
Subject: Re: Economics<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Moreover man does not live on beer<BR>
>alone [5], therefore beer is an invalid model to use.<BR>
<BR>
(snip)<BR>
<BR>
>[5] At least in general. If _you_ live on beer alone than<BR>
>IMNSHO you have a drinking problem.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not a beer drinker myself, but I've been informed that Guinness Stout <BR>
has substantial nutritional value.  Especially if you crack an egg into it.<BR>
<BR>
"GUINNESS - Part of this complete breakfast!"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --------------<BR>
Kelly St.Clair    "You know, Brink, you've been acting funny ever since<BR>
kellys@efn.org     you came back from the dead.  (I can't believe I just<BR>
                    said that.)"    -- Commander Boston Low, THE DIG<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 19:49:53 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT Posts<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 13:15:36 -0500, Moody, Danny M. wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> > -----Original Message-----<BR>
> > From: Douglas E. Berry [mailto:gridlore@pop.mindspring.com]<BR>
> <BR>
> > As one of the gun types, I feel that you are entitled to you opinion.<BR>
> > Except about the green penguins.<BR>
> <BR>
> Don't eat the green ones - they aren't ripe.  :-)<BR>
<BR>
But they are envious...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
The world is a cynic's playground.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 04:51:30 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Steve Daniels wrote:<BR>
> > The manager told me that GURPS: Traveller stuff flies off the shelf.<BR>
> <BR>
> Heard the same in Boston and Dallas.<BR>
<BR>
The last time I ordered RPGs (I have to order from another city in Sweden) was<BR>
one week after they had gotten their copies of GT:Starports. It was out of<BR>
stock. The store staff was surprised to see that happen.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 19:15:46 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
"Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> We have misjumped <BR>
> Our m-drive is not functional, and we have insufficient fuel remaining to<BR>
> jump, though we do have a little left. <BR>
> One of the options we are considering is using the remaining fuel as<BR>
> reaction mass in an Ion drive,<BR>
<BR>
You may want to consider using part of the ships atmosphere<BR>
as well. If you reduce the ships air pressure and/or<BR>
reduce part of the ship to vacuum you will be able to use<BR>
the air as fuel. OTOH your trip may well end up being long<BR>
enough that this is a bad idea.<BR>
 <BR>
> The formulae I've used to calculate my figures are:<BR>
<BR>
> Distance in metres= (Initial Closing Speed=0) + 0.5*(9.81*G's)*((0.5*Time in<BR>
> seconds)^2)<BR>
<BR>
In Traveller gravity is officially 10 meters per second, not<BR>
9.81 (which probably should be 9.826 or so anyway)<BR>
<BR>
> This gets distance covered during constant acceleration for half the time.<BR>
> The total distance is twice this, ie same distance travelled to decelerate.<BR>
<BR>
If you are low on fuel it might make more sense to not use<BR>
constant acceleration but rather to accelerate to a given speed<BR>
and then coast. It may be too difficult to burn your fuel<BR>
slowly enough to keep going for half the trip if you do<BR>
it this way then your time required will equal<BR>
(time to reach coasting speed x 2(  + (distance not covered<BR>
while accelerating and decelerating/coasting speed)<BR>
<BR>
> >From this, I used:<BR>
<BR>
> Mass of Ship(kg)*(G's*9.81m/s^2)*Total Distance(m) = 0.5*Reaction<BR>
> Mass(kg)*(Exhaust Velocity(m/s))^2<BR>
> <BR>
> ie maD=1/2mv^2<BR>
> <BR>
> ie Newtonmeters=Joules<BR>
> <BR>
> Comments?<BR>
<BR>
As you use fuel the mass of your ship will decrease. This<BR>
can probably be ignored in this situation but if you want to<BR>
be absolutely accurate you'll need a rocket type equation, for<BR>
which calculus will be required.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 15:35:18 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
> The first printing of "Legends & Lore" stomped on H. P.<BR>
> Lovecraft's estate copyright of the Cthulhu mythos and<BR>
> included a section giving stats on all of the various ugglies,<BR>
>  from the Mi-Go to Shub-Niggurath. Apparently  TSR settled<BR>
> with the Lovecraft estate and removed that section from all<BR>
> future printings of the book, making the first print books<BR>
> collector's items.<BR>
<BR>
That's the first edition "Deities & Demi-gods" that did that, not "Legends &<BR>
Lore".<BR>
<BR>
The 1st ed. Monster Manual also contained Elric mythos stuff, at that time<BR>
licensed to Chaosium, which was also removed in later editions.<BR>
<BR>
> One of my friends actually bought one for $150, and<BR>
> that's not the highest  price I've<BR>
> seen or heard paid for one.<BR>
<BR>
Bloody ridiculous if you ask me.<BR>
I'd probably sell mine immediately if someone offered me $150 for it<BR>
<BR>
But I wouldn't sell my 1st Ed Troll-Pak., Pavis, or Big Rubble.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 23:49:03 -0400<BR>
From: "John Toth" <jrtoth@bbtel.com><BR>
Subject: Question on Cannon in area<BR>
<BR>
A Quick Question for the Canonists.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Has anyone done publications or Work on the System 'Star410720'; Sub Sector<BR>
'F'; Sector 'Alpha Crucis'?<BR>
<BR>
I wish to start doing a History in that area (specifically that system).  I<BR>
wish not to:<BR>
	a) not step on anyone's work that the have done on this planet or immediate<BR>
area and<BR>
	b) read up so I possibly/may incorporate said info in the area at a later<BR>
date.<BR>
<BR>
I know Harold Hale has done some TNE work and I am aware of his stuff.<BR>
<BR>
My Plan is to start working at about 1100 then move up to 1120; as I move<BR>
forward work Harold's stuff in as  needed and as the timeline goes on.  This<BR>
will most likely be a GURPS setting, but (for now) be in T4 stats and<BR>
information.<BR>
<BR>
Any information would be greatly appreciated.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks,<BR>
John T<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 21:42:48 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: New Equipment Picture Posted<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/14/00 11:55 AM, mlinsenmayer@symantec.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Introducing Gasbg's Tech A long range Laser Communicator. With secured<BR>
> encrypted data ranges in excess of 500 kilometers in clear line of site.<BR>
> Only 10,000cr!<BR>
> <BR>
> http://www.bigbailey.com/vspace/art/picture-d.htm<BR>
> <BR>
> This is from the world builders handbook / personal equipment / Page12<BR>
> <BR>
> Enjoy<BR>
> <BR>
> Mike<BR>
<BR>
Great work Mike, but the url is:<BR>
http://www.bigbailey.com/vspace/art/picture-h.htm<BR>
<BR>
Picture "d" is Blue Moon, very nice as well, but a scout ship, not a LazCom.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 00:32:29 -0500<BR>
From: Jimmy Simpson <nimrod@santech.com><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
At 03:35 PM 4/15/00 +1200, Frankie wrote:<BR>
> > The first printing of "Legends & Lore" stomped on H. P.<BR>
> > Lovecraft's estate copyright of the Cthulhu mythos and<BR>
> > included a section giving stats on all of the various ugglies,<BR>
> >  from the Mi-Go to Shub-Niggurath. Apparently  TSR settled<BR>
> > with the Lovecraft estate and removed that section from all<BR>
> > future printings of the book, making the first print books<BR>
> > collector's items.<BR>
><BR>
>That's the first edition "Deities & Demi-gods" that did that, not "Legends &<BR>
>Lore".<BR>
><BR>
>The 1st ed. Monster Manual also contained Elric mythos stuff, at that time<BR>
>licensed to Chaosium, which was also removed in later editions.<BR>
No, it was the first edition of Dieties & Demigods that had both the <BR>
Melnibonean and Cthulu mythos.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jimmy Simpson<BR>
	nimrodd@fastlane.net<BR>
"Cannot say.<BR>
  Saying, I would know.<BR>
  Do not know.<BR>
  So cannot say."<BR>
		-Zathras (Babylon 5)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 01:59:14 -0500<BR>
From: John Littleton <litljohn71@stlnet.com><BR>
Subject: STL PLayers?<BR>
<BR>
A desperate plea... I'm a long-time Traveller fan (I got the LBBs for a birthday, I think my<BR>
10th), and I've played in AD&D, Shadowrun, Vampire, etc. (blah RPGs) for the lack of a true SF<BR>
(especially TRAVELLER!) campaign.  Is anyone on the list running (or are any of you aware of) a<BR>
Traveller group in the Saint Louis area?  Any incarnation is cool, CT!!, MT, TNE, whatever.<BR>
Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks, LJ.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 03:25:13 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
<BR>
Just say No to skill-list inflation!<BR>
<BR>
Chargen is one of my strongest interests.  WRT skills, I went<BR>
so far as to make lists of each Traveller setting's total skill<BR>
lists, including GT.  Its a mess.<BR>
<BR>
A friend of mine has developed a system that he and his<BR>
players use that has two skills:  combat and non-combat.<BR>
But that is too far in the other direction.<BR>
<BR>
The number of skills and their availbility is a core element<BR>
of your rpg system.  So you need to do some deep thinking<BR>
about the system overall.  While I see the reasoning behind<BR>
breaking more and more skills out, i.e., branching that tree<BR>
into a fractal maze, I think a functional approach is better.<BR>
For me the question is this:  Are Task X and Task Y<BR>
different enough to justify having a totally separate skill<BR>
(that has to be acquired separately)?<BR>
<BR>
A Trav. example:  Trader and Broker.<BR>
<BR>
Trader: identifying cargo for interstellar trade, estimate<BR>
resell value.  Allows 1 die of Actual Value Table to be<BR>
rolled in advance.  This skill permits a character to<BR>
predict where he will get the best price for his cargo.<BR>
Low skill risks taking a loss on cargo.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Broker: finding lower-price goods, locating buyers.<BR>
DM it Actual Value Table, 5% commission of final<BR>
sale price per skill level.  High broker skills gets a<BR>
better value on all cargos, and a commission<BR>
(though you can broker your own goods).  Low<BR>
broker skill needs to find a local broker.<BR>
<BR>
End result of both skills:  better prices for your goods.<BR>
Why have them as separate skills?  Why indeed?<BR>
I don't.  Certainly, they are different aspects of the<BR>
business of finding, buying and sellings goods.  But<BR>
are they different enough to effectively punish a character<BR>
who doesn't have both?  I don't think so.  You can<BR>
get the same effect by giving a penalty (negative DM)<BR>
for characters not familar with the market in which<BR>
the goods are being sold.  Gurps handles this better, IMO,<BR>
with Merchant and Area Knowledge.  Of course, Trav.<BR>
doesn't have anything like Area Knowledge, and it<BR>
doesn't need it, really.  You can do that in background<BR>
and through role-playing (you might have a mechanic<BR>
rule that allows a Merchant character familiarity with<BR>
one port for each year of service, or increasing<BR>
familiarity with fewer ports - or just use Soc).<BR>
<BR>
I have the same view, though I haven't done much<BR>
with it yet, about such areas as the sciences. In later<BR>
iterations of Trav, we have the standard modern<BR>
Earth liberal arts separation of academic disciplines<BR>
(History, Philosophy, Psychology, Physics, Chemistry,<BR>
etc.).  This fractured approach is recent in the history<BR>
of academics.  Once upon a time you studied such<BR>
things as "Natural Philosophy", which covered most<BR>
of the physical and abstract sciences.  Thats why for<BR>
Trav, I prefer Phys Sci, and Soc Sci.  IMHO, those<BR>
are different enough to break out, i.e., penalize a<BR>
char who doesn't have one in a relevant situation.<BR>
<BR>
And of course there is many-headed Hydra of interpersonal<BR>
communication:  Fast-Talk, Diplomacy, Liaison, Acting,<BR>
Persuasion, Bribery, Carousing, Intimidation, Interrogation.<BR>
All that is missing from the list is Chit Chat and Hot Air.<BR>
I think these are simply different aspects of the same<BR>
thing (with the possible exception of Interrogation and<BR>
Carousing), and that one thing is Social Engineering.<BR>
<BR>
The goal of each of these is to get a certain type of<BR>
reaction from an NPC.  I think that can be done with<BR>
one skill, and its relevant stat - Charisma [which we don't<BR>
have for humans, canonically anyway], and relevant<BR>
modifiers.  For instance, the only difference between<BR>
fast-talk and bribery is the exchange of money.<BR>
So why not simply allow the money to be a modifer<BR>
to the interaction?  Sure we can quibble that some<BR>
people are better at bribing people than others, but<BR>
is that difference significant enough to punish a character<BR>
that has a high skill in one and none in the other?<BR>
<BR>
So ask questions like this for your skills, and Trav<BR>
skills in general to see where you come down on<BR>
this issue.<BR>
<BR>
Are Jump, Manuever and Contra-grav drives<BR>
different enough to punish a character who<BR>
is familar with one but not the others?<BR>
How different are they?<BR>
Will making them a cascade skill get the result you<BR>
want?<BR>
<BR>
For example:<BR>
Engineering Drives: Jump, Manuever, Contra-Grav.  Skill in one<BR>
gives Skill-1 in the others, e.g., Jump Drives-3 gives Manuever-2,<BR>
Contra-Grav-2.  Or something like that?<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Alex Ingram wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> If I were to increase the total number of skills during character<BR>
> development would that have a negative,  positive or neutral effect on<BR>
> game play. Example: Engineering broken down into Jump Drives, Maneuver<BR>
> Drives, Anti-Gravity Drives (Gravitics) Power Plants/Generators,<BR>
> Environmental/Life Support or Structural/Welding. Or, Navigation broken<BR>
> down into JumpVector Navigation, Astro-Navigation (Astrogation), Aerial<BR>
> Navigation, Land Navigation/Pathfinding or Ocean Navigation. Opinions<BR>
> please.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 07:07:21 -0500<BR>
From: "Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net><BR>
Subject: Re: STL PLayers?<BR>
<BR>
not sure about in St Louis proper, but you might check with Jay <BR>
Larosee who runs the Medieval Starship accross the river in <BR>
O'Fallon Illinois, Jay also has what amounts to a Traveller shrine<BR>
going with a few neat artifacts, including  the original GDW office <BR>
sign. his store is also on the web at www.medievalstarship.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 07:20:44<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization atthe Imperial<BR>
level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and need the following translated<BR>
into legalese:<BR>
<BR>
When the Marshal is investigating an Imperial crime, do whatever he says or<BR>
your ass is toast.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
Egotist: a person more interested in himself than in me.<BR>
- -- Ambrose Bierce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 12:18:24 -0400<BR>
From: Martyn Wheeler <pixie@interpath.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Idle Traveller Musings<BR>
<BR>
I've used Norris as an NPC in my Mora Campaign.  Most of the time he<BR>
isn't onstage, but he walks in for a brief scene in<BR>
http://pixie.simplenet.com/gaming/mora/mora19.htm<BR>
<BR>
Martyn<BR>
 ----pixie@interpath.com----Martyn Wheeler----DoD #293----1kspt=25-----<BR>
"Touch me with your soul, Bless me with your smile        / traci lords<BR>
 Give to me all your love, Baby watch me fly, watch me fly!"<BR>
   "High and wide open, reaching forever, I fly into the blue" -- Moby<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 13:04:35 -0400<BR>
From: "John Toth" <jrtoth@bbtel.com><BR>
Subject: Gravitic Defenses<BR>
<BR>
I need something to smash stuff together...<BR>
<BR>
If I put 6 TL12 Gravitics (defenses) -100Kn Tract in a "sphere" pointing in,<BR>
Will this accomplish the Task of 'Smashing Stuff'? Also, what kind of PSI<BR>
could I expect?<BR>
<BR>
I have armored the Craft with Armour Rating of 100 (5cm Super dense), and<BR>
reinforced the Hull to withstand 8g's. This is to make sure the Gravitics do<BR>
not make the Ship Rip apart under the stress of the combined Pushing.<BR>
<BR>
Am I on the Right trace here or do I need to go another route?<BR>
<BR>
Thanks for your Help,<BR>
John T<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 22:34:27 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich, ..."<BR>
<BR>
On 04/12/00 at 04:42 PM,  Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> said:<BR>
<BR>
>As the bad commercials say 'Just Do It'...no need to rules-lawyer the<BR>
>_background_ to your campaign.<BR>
<BR>
>Besides, 'free' ships have a habit of sucking creds into the vaccuum no<BR>
>matter what, right , Eris? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
You bet! The quickest way to saddle PC's with debts is to *give* them a ship, especially one with "character"...if you get what I mean. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2000 17:43:41 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
On 04/12/00 at 12:37 PM,  Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> said:<BR>
<BR>
>Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Alright. I'm going to do it.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> I bought the T4 rulebook from a bargain bin, and was surprised to find I<BR>
>> liked it. I've found some other modules available, but I know at least some<BR>
>> of them are dross.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Which ones should I buy? We're probably looking at two or three, including<BR>
>> FFS2, at least for the first order.<BR>
<BR>
>Get the Milieu 0 book if you can get it, lots of background on the<BR>
>beginning of the Third Imperium. It will permanently color your opinion<BR>
>of the August Founder Cleon I. <BR>
<BR>
Nick, get the *hardback* version of Milieu 0. It is much better than the original paperback. It's got First Survey in it along with a couple dozen more pages of background material.<BR>
<BR>
>Pocket Empires is good, as is CSC (despite the completely different<BR>
>vehicle design rules in there than FFS2...sigh. At least they're _good_<BR>
>vehicle design rules)<BR>
<BR>
Pocket Empires is good for more abstract economic-type games, not strictly for roleplaying. It's good though.<BR>
<BR>
I like CSC and yes, it's design rules are good...except for the armor rules. They don't work with FFS or FFS2 and break if you layer armor.<BR>
<BR>
>Hmmm...My own collection of T4 stuff didn't extend much beyond these.<BR>
>Naval Architects Manual is supposed to be nearly useless, <BR>
<BR>
If you have a scanner and want pre-generated bits and pieces of stuff for deckplans then take a look. I was initially enthused, but cooled off quickly.<BR>
<BR>
>and Emperors Arsenal is great if you don't mind a whole bunch of designs >_without stats_.<BR>
<BR>
Well, the stats are there for T4, but the design info isn't.<BR>
<BR>
>Also, when you find FFS2, don't drop the book in shock..._all_ the<BR>
>equations are screwed in the most astonishing fashion.<BR>
<BR>
<sigh> Yes, that's true. The proper equations are on the web *someplace*...I can't say just where, though.<BR>
<BR>
Psionic Institutes is also supposed to be very good if you are into psionics. I can't speak from personal experience.<BR>
<BR>
Instead of buying Starships, I'd get the SSDS off the web (it's *got* to be out there). <BR>
<BR>
The Emperor's Vehicles has the flaw of having no TL levels for any of the vehicles. Otherwise, I think it's vehicle designs are okay...they didn't grab me, but nothing rises to my memory as being broken. Of course, I could just be supressing those memories. <g><BR>
<BR>
The adventures aren't worth buying. Get the BITS adventures instead.<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2311<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2312</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 15 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2312<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Gravitic Defenses<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
RE: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
RE:  STL players<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
RE: Traveller Skills<BR>
re:  Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
re: GC and the prospect of "ignoring it..."<BR>
Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
Re: OT posts?<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 19:49:44 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher & Regina Otto <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" schrieb:<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization atthe Imperial<BR>
> level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and need the following translated<BR>
> into legalese:<BR>
> <BR>
> When the Marshal is investigating an Imperial crime, do whatever he says or<BR>
> your ass is toast.<BR>
<BR>
Well, I can't trabslate it into Legalese, but:<BR>
Sounds much like an Imperial Warrant. Perhaps a minor version of it,<BR>
limited to certain levels of Imperial/local gouvernment?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
Hiroshi.Estigarribia@gmx.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 19:53:39 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Gravitic Defenses<BR>
<BR>
John Toth wrote:<BR>
> If I put 6 TL12 Gravitics (defenses) -100Kn Tract in a "sphere" pointing in,<BR>
> Will this accomplish the Task of 'Smashing Stuff'? Also, what kind of PSI<BR>
> could I expect?<BR>
<BR>
Putting said plates in the roof would, of course, give you PSIonic suppression.<BR>
<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
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| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 13:55:07 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
Alex Ingram writes:<BR>
<BR>
>  If I were to increase the total number of skills during character<BR>
>  development would that have a negative,  positive or neutral effect on<BR>
>  game play. Example: Engineering broken down into Jump Drives, Maneuver<BR>
>  Drives, Anti-Gravity Drives (Gravitics) Power Plants/Generators,<BR>
>  Environmental/Life Support or Structural/Welding. Or, Navigation broken<BR>
>  down into JumpVector Navigation, Astro-Navigation (Astrogation), Aerial<BR>
>  Navigation, Land Navigation/Pathfinding or Ocean Navigation. Opinions<BR>
>  please.<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
Consider the skill being broken down as a cascade skill (yeah, I'm an MT <BR>
fan), or have the main skill at regular level with a designated specialty <BR>
(J-Vector for Navigation, say) with the other sub-skill/specialties acting at <BR>
half the regular skill level, but can be improved at maybe half-cost. <BR>
<BR>
Let me explain: My PC has Engineering-4, with a specialty in Power Plants. If <BR>
he has to repair the jump drive or life support, his Engineering would only <BR>
rate as Eng-2. When it cam time to spend skill points, he wants to improve <BR>
that Jump Drive Engineering sub-skill, so he spends only half the points that <BR>
it would have taken to improve the general Engineering skill from level 2 to <BR>
level 3. Now he has Engineering-4 (Powerplant; Jump-3), that is, the general <BR>
skill Engineering at level 4 with specialty in Power Plants at that level, <BR>
Jump Drive Engineering at level 3, and every other subskill at level 2. <BR>
<BR>
You can improve every subskill like this up to the general skill's level, but <BR>
after one or two it becomes more economical to simply improve the general <BR>
skill by one or two points. I leave it up to the GM to decide whether to <BR>
round up or down when dealing with odd-number general skill levels.<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 13:40:34 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
You want to think of a few things if you really want to be technical.<BR>
See below.<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of<BR>
> Matthew Bond<BR>
> Sent: 14 April 2000 22:04<BR>
> To: TML<BR>
> Subject: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
><BR>
[snip]<BR>
><BR>
> We have picked up a distress signal from another ship, and<BR>
> are going to try<BR>
> and rendezvous. It is 5 days away at 0.1G.<BR>
><BR>
What is your existing velocity with resepect to the ship detected? If<BR>
you are already heading towards it, you can just drift at your<BR>
existing speed.<BR>
><BR>
> One of the options we are considering is using the remaining fuel as<BR>
> reaction mass in an Ion drive, mainly my Idea...<BR>
><BR>
Not very fast, efficient or even smart. You'd be better feeding fuel<BR>
into the fusion plant and venting the plasma stream from that through<BR>
your m-drive. Fusion is fast - but it would wreck the drive and I<BR>
doubt anyone would actually let you land for repairs.<BR>
><BR>
[snip]<BR>
><BR>
> The formulae I've used to calculate my figures (using Excel 97) are:<BR>
><BR>
> Distance in metres= (Initial Closing Speed=0) +<BR>
> 0.5*(9.81*G's)*((0.5*Time in<BR>
> seconds)^2)<BR>
><BR>
You need to consider the vector as well - your speed must include the<BR>
direction you travel in so, for example, if you are moving at 100 m/s<BR>
at an angle to the ship and can get a burst of speed at right angles<BR>
to your direction of travel of say 10 m/s then your velocity at the<BR>
new angle to the ship is square root of (100*100)+(10*10) or 100.5<BR>
m/s. With judicious calculation, you can adjust your velocity with<BR>
respect to the ship until you are heading directly for it at a speed<BR>
fairly close to your current speed. The only question is, how much<BR>
fuel does it take? Vector mechanics are a pain to calculate.<BR>
<BR>
With your current calculation, you don't consider the target ship<BR>
velocity either. If you aim for where it is now, then it won't be<BR>
there when you arrive. You need to aim for where it will be when you<BR>
get there and you need to be going at the same velocity as it when you<BR>
arrive - or damn close. The calculation will be awful.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 19:36:47 +0100<BR>
From: Martin Hardgrave <martin@deira.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
<BR>
In message <38F2CD79.109EBC34@gci.net>, Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
writes<BR>
><BR>
>I suggest sort of a Traveller Canon Miranda warning:<BR>
><BR>
As opposed to a Traveller Carmen Miranda warning:<BR>
<BR>
"You have the right to wear fruit - if your planet cannot afford a<BR>
farming industry one will be provided for you."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Martin Hardgrave<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 21:08:02 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
<BR>
Martin Hardgrave wrote:<BR>
> As opposed to a Traveller Carmen Miranda warning:<BR>
> <BR>
> "You have the right to wear fruit - if your planet cannot afford a<BR>
> farming industry one will be provided for you."<BR>
<BR>
Or the TML warning:<BR>
<BR>
"You have the right to be a fruitbat. If you are not, others will certainly<BR>
make up for it."<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 12:14:41 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: RE:  STL players<BR>
<BR>
>From: John Littleton <litljohn71@stlnet.com><BR>
>Subject: STL PLayers?<BR>
<BR>
>Traveller group in the Saint Louis area?<BR>
<BR>
And there we all thought you were setting up a campaign<BR>
involving ram jets, cold sleep, and generation ships (all<BR>
of which are Slower Than Light).<BR>
<BR>
Come visit us in the San Francisco area any time.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 12:28:41 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
Luther Martin's excellent essay on Dynamic Range has some<BR>
application to the present question.  Luther points out<BR>
that Traveller is a game with a very dynamic range of<BR>
scales, from fleet combat involving dozens of squadrons to<BR>
two persons fighting in a room, from management of<BR>
sector-spanning politics and economics to the life of one<BR>
spacer trying to make ends meet.  <BR>
<BR>
What skills are available depends in large part on the<BR>
range in which you're playing and the nature of the<BR>
campaign.  <BR>
<BR>
If the PCs are naval flag officers, differences between<BR>
ship tactics and fleet tactics are important.  You might<BR>
even break fleet tactics into:  Battleship Fleet Tactics,<BR>
Missile Frigate Fleet Tactics, Combined Fleet Tactics, etc.<BR>
 On the other hand, if the PCs are the crew of a warship,<BR>
Gunnery and Engineering, e.g., may well break down into<BR>
many components. <BR>
<BR>
In a mercantile campaign, differentiation between trader<BR>
and broker might be very important, whereas in a mercenary<BR>
campaign, it probably won't be.  On the other hand, the<BR>
mercenaries may make fine distinctions between fencing with<BR>
foil and fencing with rapier, or between skill at TL 7<BR>
light artillery versus TL 9.  <BR>
<BR>
The bottom line for me is that decisions about<BR>
fractalization of skills should take place when the referee<BR>
is setting up the campaign.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 15:52:26 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
Alex Ingram writes:<BR>
>If I were to increase the total number of skills during character<BR>
>development would that have a negative,  positive or neutral effect on<BR>
>game play. Example: Engineering broken down into Jump Drives, Maneuver<BR>
>Drives, Anti-Gravity Drives (Gravitics) Power Plants/Generators,<BR>
>Environmental/Life Support or Structural/Welding. Or, Navigation broken<BR>
>down into JumpVector Navigation, Astro-Navigation (Astrogation), Aerial<BR>
>Navigation, Land Navigation/Pathfinding or Ocean Navigation. Opinions<BR>
>please.<BR>
<BR>
	This would depend on how detailed you wish your game to be.  Most<BR>
	players that I have gamed with tend to get overwhelmed with too<BR>
	much detail.  It adds to book-keeping, makes it harder to remember<BR>
	what you can do, and begs questions like "If I can repair a radar,<BR>
	shouln't I be able to repair a radio?"<BR>
<BR>
	Also, the more skills that there are, the less you can do with<BR>
	each skill.  The number of skills that each character has would<BR>
	have to be increased to maintain the same capabilities.  Rules<BR>
	would have to be manufactured to deal with how good someone with<BR>
	"Jump Drives" is at repairing maneuver drives, power plants, etc.<BR>
	To some extent, such problems already exist, but increasing the<BR>
	number of skills would multiply the number of rule overlaps<BR>
	considerably.<BR>
<BR>
	I sometimes wish that the skills were more specific, more detailed,<BR>
	but overall I like the flexibility and simplicity of the more<BR>
	general skills.  It's a trade-off.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 12:52:19 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
><BR>
>I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization <BR>
>at the Imperial level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and <BR>
>need the following translated into legalese:<BR>
><BR>
>When the Marshal is investigating an Imperial crime, do <BR>
>whatever he says or your ass is toast.<BR>
<BR>
In law school, we often referred to our dictionary as<BR>
"Black's English-Law/Law-English Dictionary."<BR>
<BR>
Remember that Imperial Edict 34 goes on for, I forget,<BR>
40-odd pages.<BR>
<BR>
Imperial Edict 243<BR>
The Ministry of Justice is hereby directed to establish an<BR>
Imperial Marshalls Service and to promulgate regulations<BR>
for its operations.  The functions of the Imperial<BR>
Marshalls Service shall include the following:  [whatever]<BR>
<BR>
The Ministry of Justice is hereby directed to present its<BR>
proposed regulations regaring this matter to the Imperial<BR>
Court for review on or before [date].  <BR>
<BR>
243 IMoJ Regs sec. 842<BR>
Establishment of Imperial Marshalls Service<BR>
An Imperial Marshalls Service is hereby created for the<BR>
following purposes:<BR>
<BR>
[skipping several sections]<BR>
<BR>
243 IMoJ Regs sec. 861<BR>
Investigative functions and requirements of assistance<BR>
subsec 861.1<BR>
The Imperial Marshalls Service shall be empowered to<BR>
investigate [crimes of certain types or whatever]<BR>
[skip]<BR>
subsec 861.18<BR>
An Imperial Marshall engaged in an investigation under this<BR>
section has plenipotentiary Imperial powers.  All member<BR>
states of the Imperium are hereby directed to provide any<BR>
and all aid, assistance, information, equipment, funds,<BR>
materials, or any other thing or service requested by the<BR>
Imperial Marshall as expeditiously as possible under the<BR>
circumstances.  <BR>
Any member state of the Imperium that fails or refuses a<BR>
proper request under this subsection shall be subject to<BR>
Imperial sanctions pursuant to IMI [Imperial Ministry of<BR>
the Interior] Regulations section 262.  [Hyperlink to IMI<BR>
Regs sec 262:  Imperial sanctions for disobedience to<BR>
proper exercise of Imperial authority include, at the<BR>
discretion of the local ranking Imperial officer: <BR>
bombardment, partial or total; interdiction, partial or<BR>
total; and loss of local governance for a period not to<BR>
exceed 100 years.]<BR>
Any sophont within the Imperium who fails or refuses a<BR>
proper request under this subsection shall be subject to<BR>
Imperial sanctions pursuant to IMoJ Regs sec 101. <BR>
[Hyperlink to IMoJ Regs sec 101:  Imperial sanctions for<BR>
disobedience to proper exercise of Imperial authority<BR>
include the following, at the discretion of the local<BR>
ranking Imperial officer:  death; imprisonment for a period<BR>
up to the life of the sophont; assignment to an Imperial<BR>
colony; and incineration by toaster.]<BR>
<BR>
Commentator's Note:  These IMoJ and IMI regs largely follow<BR>
the tenor, if not the actual text, of Imperial Edict 34 and<BR>
its underlying regulatory scheme governing use of and the<BR>
powers of the bearer of Imperial Warrants.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 14:53:58 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
On 04/14/00 at 07:30 PM,  Alex Ingram <ingram@airmail.net> said:<BR>
<BR>
>If I were to increase the total number of skills during character<BR>
>development would that have a negative,  positive or neutral effect on<BR>
>game play. Example: Engineering broken down into Jump Drives, Maneuver<BR>
>Drives, Anti-Gravity Drives (Gravitics) Power Plants/Generators,<BR>
>Environmental/Life Support or Structural/Welding. Or, Navigation broken<BR>
>down into JumpVector Navigation, Astro-Navigation (Astrogation), Aerial<BR>
>Navigation, Land Navigation/Pathfinding or Ocean Navigation. Opinions<BR>
>please.<BR>
<BR>
The answer depends on whether you increase the number of skill<BR>
levels the PC gets during each term of their career.<BR>
<BR>
Traveller has undergone a transformation from having a few very<BR>
broad skills to having many more, more narrowly focused skills.  CT<BR>
started with fewer than 20 skills.  Over the years the number of<BR>
skills grew until by MT there were something like 125 unique skills<BR>
the character could acquire.  TNE stayed at about that level and T4<BR>
dropped back to around 100.  The skills available in a GURPS<BR>
Traveller game is certainly no less than was available in MT.  It's<BR>
my contention that when you make such drastic changes in the number<BR>
of available skills you need to re-balance the method of character<BR>
generation, the task system, the level of attributes, and many other<BR>
parts of the roleplaying system.<BR>
<BR>
It is a debatable issue whether it is better to use broad skills or<BR>
narrow skills.  IMO, either works *if* the rest of the system is<BR>
designed to work with the skill base chosen.  For example, if there<BR>
are only 20 very broad skills then a character having 4 or 5 skills<BR>
has competence in 20-25% of the tasks in a system, put a part of 5<BR>
together and you can cover almost all the tasks the party might run<BR>
into.  OTOH, when there are 120 narrow skills, having 4 or 5 skills<BR>
in a character's repertoire makes them unreasonably narrow...even<BR>
having 8 to 10 different skills gives a much narrower character, you<BR>
have to get up into the 20's in the number of skills.  BUT that is a<BR>
problem...<BR>
<BR>
The other half of this problem is how does the number of skills<BR>
*levels* affect the character's designed in a system.  When you have<BR>
more skills available and need more skills selected, then you must<BR>
provide more levels to distribute.  Unfortunately, now you have to<BR>
worry about the *distribution* of all those levels.<BR>
<BR>
When an average character has only a few skills, 4 or 5 let's say,<BR>
then getting 1 or 2 per four year term (say 6 terms at 1.5 giving 9<BR>
total) means that Sk-1 or Sk-2 is the norm..and that means competence<BR>
is 1 or 2 levels and being able to get *any* skill to 3 or 4 is very<BR>
hard.  This fits the 2d6 task system in CT well...but the creep of<BR>
skill inflation was starting to cause problems even before the ink<BR>
on B4 was dry.<BR>
<BR>
Now let's say our average PC has 15 skills from a set of around 100.<BR>
He must be earning 4 or 5 levels per term, say 30 levels in the 6<BR>
term career.  Now it becomes possible to produce a PC with most of<BR>
the skills at 1 or 2, easily having a few at 3 or 4...and here's the<BR>
*rub*....you might start running into skills at 6, 7, 8 or more!<BR>
This means mastery becomes more common, or tasks must become harder,<BR>
and when *any* Attribute level gets added to the mix the need to<BR>
reblance skill levels and task difficulties just gets greater.<BR>
<BR>
GURPS handles this distribution problem by having the cost of<BR>
levels increase in point cost.  This gives you diminishing returns<BR>
when you pile points into one or two skills, Traveller systems don't<BR>
do that.  Personally, I don't *like* the GURPS method in operation,<BR>
but I certainly understand why they need it at the mid-range in<BR>
skill levels.<BR>
<BR>
To be honest, I don't have an answer to this problem.  I like the<BR>
simple system you get with very broad skills, but I want more<BR>
detail.  OTOH, I don't like having a page *full* of skills to keep<BR>
track of or the baggage having narrow skills brings with it. <BR>
<BR>
Does anyone have a good answer for all this?<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 15:14:40 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
<BR>
On 04/15/00 at 03:25 AM,  Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
>For example:<BR>
>Engineering Drives: Jump, Manuever, Contra-Grav.  Skill in one gives<BR>
>Skill-1 in the others, e.g., Jump Drives-3 gives Manuever-2,<BR>
>Contra-Grav-2.  Or something like that?<BR>
<BR>
Precisely.  It's certainly not to everyone's taste, but the effect<BR>
on task systems and everything else gets screwed up with narrower<BR>
and narrower skills.<BR>
<BR>
Personally, I like having Trader and Broker as I think they are<BR>
different.  You could have someone who was very good at picking<BR>
"winners" but couldn't make a good deal, and someone who was a great<BR>
deal maker but always picked losers to make the deal on. <BR>
<BR>
I also think you need to break out drives and power systems in your<BR>
technical/engineering area.  This allows you to have a PC with<BR>
training in fusion power systems, but no service aboard ships, hence<BR>
no drive skills.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I'm tempted to have position/function cascades where you<BR>
get a skill in some moderately narrow skill and get some lesser<BR>
skill in all the related skills in that category.  Here's an<BR>
*example* of how you might break the skills down....<BR>
<BR>
Bridge Section<BR>
    Pilot<BR>
        Starship<BR>
        Ship's boat<BR>
        Air/raft<BR>
    Sensors<BR>
    Astrogation<BR>
    Comm    <BR>
    Ship Tactics<BR>
    <BR>
Engineering Section<BR>
    Drives<BR>
        Jump<BR>
        Maneuver<BR>
    Gravitics<BR>
    Power Systems<BR>
    Mechanics<BR>
    Electronics    <BR>
            <BR>
Gunnery Section<BR>
    Beam<BR>
        Laser<BR>
        PAWS<BR>
        Meson<BR>
    Missiles<BR>
    Sandcasters<BR>
    Fire Control<BR>
    Fwd Observer<BR>
    <BR>
Steward Section<BR>
    Life Support<BR>
    Cargo Handling<BR>
    Service<BR>
    Liaison<BR>
    Admin<BR>
    <BR>
Merchant Section<BR>
    Trader<BR>
    Broker    <BR>
    Admin<BR>
<BR>
etc...<BR>
<BR>
I don't know how well this would work, but I think it might work out<BR>
well.<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 16:30:16 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
>The first printing of "Legends & Lore" stomped on H. P. Lovecraft's estate<BR>
>copyright of the Cthulhu mythos and included a section giving stats on all<BR>
of<BR>
>the various ugglies, from the Mi-Go to Shub-Niggurath. Apparently TSR<BR>
settled<BR>
>with the Lovecraft estate and removed that section from all future<BR>
printings<BR>
>of the book, making the first print books collector's items. One of my<BR>
>friends actually bought one for $150, and that's not the highest price I've<BR>
>seen or heard paid for one.<BR>
><BR>
>Doug G.<BR>
>(Crying that his great-grandmother burned both of his first print books,<BR>
and<BR>
>many, many others, in a misguided effort to save his soul from the<BR>
>demon-worshipping AD&D cult.)<BR>
<BR>
Close. You're thinking of the early printings (not sure if it's just the<BR>
first printing) of the 1st Edition "Deities & Demigods". TSR got into a<BR>
brawl with Chaosium over the inclusion of the Cthulhu Mythos and the<BR>
Melnibonean <sp?> Mythos (from the "Elric" series). Chaosium produced games<BR>
based on both properties. Later printings of "Deities & Demigods" lacked the<BR>
gods and creatures from these two pantheons. When TSR redid all of the 1st<BR>
Edition hardback covers they changed "Deities & Demigods" to "Legends &<BR>
Lore", most likely due to the fact that the original title drew an amazing<BR>
amount of fire from Christian anti-D&D pamphlet publishers and community<BR>
activists. The interior of AD&D 1st edition's "Legends & Lore" is<BR>
functionally the same as later printings of "Deities & Demigods". When the<BR>
2nd Edition of AD&D was published, a completely new version of "Legends &<BR>
Lore" was produced.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 16:34:42 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
Frank Pitt wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>That's the first edition "Deities & Demi-gods" that did that, not "Legends<BR>
&<BR>
>Lore".<BR>
><BR>
>The 1st ed. Monster Manual also contained Elric mythos stuff, at that time<BR>
>licensed to Chaosium, which was also removed in later editions.<BR>
<BR>
No. The "Monster Manual" never included anything from the Melnibonean<BR>
Mythos. That was "Deities & Demigods" as well.<BR>
<BR>
>Bloody ridiculous if you ask me.<BR>
>I'd probably sell mine immediately if someone offered me $150 for it<BR>
<BR>
Put it up on E-Bay then. You'll probably get somewhere between $50 and $200,<BR>
depending on condition.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 22:42:11 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
At 13:28 -0400 15/4/00, "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote:<BR>
>I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization atthe Imperial<BR>
>level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and need the following translated<BR>
>into legalese:<BR>
><BR>
>When the Marshal is investigating an Imperial crime, do whatever he says or<BR>
>your ass is toast.<BR>
<BR>
Hmm. An early White Dwarf (well, Issue 70 Oct 1985) had an article on <BR>
Bounty Hunters (Dead or Alive by Diane and Richard John p26-27) in <BR>
it, and gave them a limited Imperial Warrent (Edict 97) to pursue <BR>
those wanted by Imperial Authorities.  This would have the above <BR>
effect.<BR>
<BR>
It also had a cool version of the Type S - the type H Hunter - which <BR>
would be a good ship to use for such characters. Do you want a copy <BR>
of this?<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 22:11:37 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: GC and the prospect of "ignoring it..."<BR>
<BR>
At 13:28 -0400 15/4/00, "The Roc" <roc@kewl.com.au> wrote:<BR>
>I think that if you don't like GC topics, that if everyone ignores it (pro<BR>
>or con), then the original post will simply fade un-answered.  If the<BR>
>original GC poster tries again - ignore again... the message has to get<BR>
>across eventually, and in the end, if everyone ignores GC topics, they will<BR>
>eventually die a death (eventually only new-comers with something to say<BR>
>will answer, but if they are ALL ignored, then the message will get across<BR>
>eventually.<BR>
<BR>
Sorry, but it has never worked like that when I've been here.<BR>
<BR>
And I didn't comment until the 'rant' about 'liberals' etc. I had <BR>
*no* issue with the discussion of the use of a smart gun - even as a <BR>
safety issue that could be linked to GC - nor really a discussion of <BR>
Gun Control with respect to the Third (or even 1st or 2nd) Imperium. <BR>
I have a really big problem with 'discussions' of the US politics of <BR>
gun control with tenuous ObTravs as a justification.<BR>
<BR>
>Pre-emptive flames are rude and perpetuate the topic, and make the poster's<BR>
>of pre-emptive flames worse than the GC posters morally.  There was no call<BR>
>for it when it could simply be ignored.<BR>
<BR>
I think you will find that both Chris and I posted when the <BR>
discussion moved from the smart gun / technology frame to the <rant> <BR>
and politics. This is my opinion is not a pre-emptive flame. Rather <BR>
an attempt to stop something before it does it's usual spiral out of <BR>
control.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
Apologies for wasted bandwidth.<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 22:44:46 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marc Miller's Traveller<BR>
<BR>
At 13:28 -0400 15/4/00, eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR>
>Instead of buying Starships, I'd get the SSDS off the web (it's <BR>
>*got* to be out there).<BR>
<BR>
ISTR that it's at the Missouri Archive.<BR>
<BR>
>The adventures aren't worth buying. Get the BITS adventures instead.<BR>
<BR>
'Long Way Home' and 'Gateway' are the IG version of 'The Long Way <BR>
Home' and are the only way you'll get a copy of the adventure now as <BR>
the BITS edition is OOP.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 14:48:54 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: OT posts?<BR>
<BR>
Derrick Jones wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>1st, Sorry, I was not making an assumption, I was just using a turn of phrase.<BR>
>Please do not be offended by that. The get a life was not intended <BR>
>to be offensive<BR>
>either, just saying that Penguins are the be all and end all of my <BR>
>gaming sessions,<BR>
>and if I continue to spread the word, maybe others will get the <BR>
>taste, maybe you<BR>
>could join in too, and have 'real life!'. ;-)<BR>
<BR>
No offense taken.  I am not easily offended, you have to actually work at it.<BR>
<BR>
>  >And are the biscuits, made FOR penguins, or OF penguins?<BR>
>Neither. Penguin is a brand of chocolate covered biscuit with a <BR>
>chocolatey filling,<BR>
>marketed by a company based in the UK. They are 'The choclatiest biscuits in<BR>
>the world'. (did I say I like the green ones)<BR>
<BR>
Damn.  I was afraid they'd be something that sounded very good but I <BR>
wouldn't be able to get here in Oregon.  Now I'll have to search them <BR>
out on the 'net!<BR>
<BR>
>Please accept my apologies if I have offended you, or anybody else <BR>
>in my postings,<BR>
>I can assure you it was not my intent.<BR>
<BR>
As I said, I am not easily offended, as I believe the intent is what <BR>
matters.  On the other hand, now I'm developing a craving for Penguin <BR>
biscuits...<BR>
<BR>
>p.s. could I please ask that you turn off the html thing (or <BR>
>whatever it is) on your<BR>
>mailer. I got your message twice, once in normal mode, and once with <BR>
>all sorts of<BR>
>wierd headers and stuff.<BR>
<BR>
Really?  How bizarre.  I have not had any other complaints, so this <BR>
is news to me.  Let me know if it happens again, and I will hunt down <BR>
the offending setting and fix it.  (If it does do it again, could you <BR>
e-mail me directly with a copy of the weird headers?  That might <BR>
help.)<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2312<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 15 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2313<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 1 of 3]<BR>
TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 2 of 3]<BR>
TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 3 of 3]<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2310<BR>
Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: STL players<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 17:07:04 -0500<BR>
From: "Pat Connaughton" <pconn@i1.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Douglas E. Berry <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2000 7:20 AM<BR>
Subject: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization atthe Imperial<BR>
> level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and need the following translated<BR>
> into legalese:<BR>
><BR>
> When the Marshal is investigating an Imperial crime, do whatever he says<BR>
or<BR>
> your ass is toast.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Unviversal jurisdiction with extra-ordinary and pletipotentiary powers.<BR>
This coupled with a very strong ethical and ideological bent would<BR>
make some fairly interesting characters.<BR>
<BR>
I'd light to what you work up. I've got my own set of Imperial Marshals<BR>
for MT. Let me know how your's come out.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks<BR>
Pat Connaughton<BR>
ICQ # 2535086<BR>
pconn@i1.net<BR>
"He who knows not how to dissemble knows not<BR>
how to reign"<BR>
Tiberius, Emperator and Princips of Rome<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:10:07 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
Mark Preston wrote:<BR>
>You need to consider the vector as well - your speed must include the<BR>
>direction you travel in so, for example, if you are moving at 100 m/s<BR>
>at an angle to the ship and can get a burst of speed at right angles<BR>
>to your direction of travel of say 10 m/s then your velocity at the<BR>
>new angle to the ship is square root of (100*100)+(10*10) or 100.5<BR>
>m/s. With judicious calculation, you can adjust your velocity with<BR>
>respect to the ship until you are heading directly for it at a speed<BR>
>fairly close to your current speed. The only question is, how much<BR>
>fuel does it take? Vector mechanics are a pain to calculate.<BR>
><BR>
>With your current calculation, you don't consider the target ship<BR>
>velocity either. If you aim for where it is now, then it won't be<BR>
>there when you arrive. You need to aim for where it will be when you<BR>
>get there and you need to be going at the same velocity as it when you<BR>
>arrive - or damn close. The calculation will be awful.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Oh, I agree the maths for rendezvousing two vessels in different orbits are<BR>
horrendous, however for the purposes of the *game* I'm assuming that the<BR>
referees statement (via NPC) that 0.1G acceleration will allow us to<BR>
rendezvous in 5 days already takes into account the factors you mention...<BR>
<BR>
My main concerns are that:<BR>
<BR>
a) my maths are reasonably accurate<BR>
<BR>
b) that my handwave of exhaust velocity from an ion drive is proportional to<BR>
the power applied. i.e. if currently 2kW can produce a 20km/s exhaust<BR>
velocity, could 45MW produce an exhaust velocity of 3000km/s (0.01c).  With<BR>
exhaust velocities of this order of magnitude, we need only a few tons of<BR>
reaction mass to rendezvous in a reasonable amount of time...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:13:53 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Matthew Bond <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 15 April 2000 23:12<BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Mark Preston wrote:<BR>
>>You need to consider the vector as well - your speed must include the<BR>
>>direction you travel in so, for example, if you are moving at 100 m/s<BR>
>>at an angle to the ship and can get a burst of speed at right angles<BR>
>>to your direction of travel of say 10 m/s then your velocity at the<BR>
>>new angle to the ship is square root of (100*100)+(10*10) or 100.5<BR>
>>m/s. With judicious calculation, you can adjust your velocity with<BR>
>>respect to the ship until you are heading directly for it at a speed<BR>
>>fairly close to your current speed. The only question is, how much<BR>
>>fuel does it take? Vector mechanics are a pain to calculate.<BR>
>><BR>
>>With your current calculation, you don't consider the target ship<BR>
>>velocity either. If you aim for where it is now, then it won't be<BR>
>>there when you arrive. You need to aim for where it will be when you<BR>
>>get there and you need to be going at the same velocity as it when you<BR>
>>arrive - or damn close. The calculation will be awful.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>Oh, I agree the maths for rendezvousing two vessels in different orbits are<BR>
>horrendous, however for the purposes of the *game* I'm assuming that the<BR>
>referees statement (via NPC) that 0.1G acceleration will allow us to<BR>
>rendezvous in 5 days already takes into account the factors you mention...<BR>
><BR>
>My main concerns are that:<BR>
><BR>
>a) my maths are reasonably accurate<BR>
><BR>
>b) that my handwave of exhaust velocity from an ion drive is proportional<BR>
to<BR>
<BR>
>the power applied. i.e. if currently 2kW can produce a 20km/s exhaust<BR>
>velocity, could 45MW produce an exhaust velocity of 3000km/s (0.01c).  With<BR>
>exhaust velocities of this order of magnitude, we need only a few tons of<BR>
>reaction mass to rendezvous in a reasonable amount of time...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Ooops. Meant to say 'proportional to the *square root* of the power applied'<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:33:26 +0100<BR>
From: John Wood <John@elvw.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 1 of 3]<BR>
<BR>
Well, my wife Alison is showing the first signs of labour, so I don't<BR>
expect I'll have much time for email over the next few days (weeks?).<BR>
<BR>
I'm posting what I've done on Prilissa so far to my website:<BR>
<BR>
        http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/Prilissa.html<BR>
<BR>
or, for those of you who prefer black on white:<BR>
<BR>
        http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/PrilissaWhite.html<BR>
<BR>
It's got a couple of maps up already - topology (in two sizes) and<BR>
system - so it's probably worth reading that version.<BR>
<BR>
Consider this a "work in progress" report - I was hoping to polish it up<BR>
before exposing it to the TML. I have a lot more in my head<BR>
(particularly to do with the cultures) and some on paper (such as port<BR>
designs made using GURPS Starports). It seems I'm not going to get it<BR>
typed up soon, so this is just something to be going on with.<BR>
<BR>
Design Notes:<BR>
<BR>
The main challenge was similar to Heya's. Prilissa was a TL 6, pop 5<BR>
world described as a "breadbasket" world. Furthermore it was tidelocked<BR>
(I later worked out it didn't have to be, but it made things interesting<BR>
and with that population there was no shortage of habitable land).<BR>
Although I decided not to tie myself to random rolls, the tech and law<BR>
profiles I generated (along with the government form and some of the<BR>
customs) sparked off ideas about the culture. This has slowly gelled,<BR>
but unfortunately not in time to type it up. I got GURPS Starports late<BR>
in the design process, and that has changed how I thought about the<BR>
world (the history so far reflects this change, the rest of the document<BR>
doesn't).<BR>
<BR>
Anyway, have fun with it; I hope the tables don't get too mashed in<BR>
transmission! I'm staying subscribed but may not respond for a while...<BR>
<BR>
John (who has never been a father before 8-)<BR>
<BR>
 <BR>
John G. Wood  |  john@elvw.demon.co.uk  |  Oxford, United Kingdom<BR>
IMTU tc+ tm+ tn t4(+) ru--(+) ge 3i+ jt au- st ls+ hi++ so- zh+ pi+ jd++<BR>
Traveller IS Forms, Gal2CC, etc: http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:32:05 +0100<BR>
From: John Wood <John@elvw.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 2 of 3]<BR>
<BR>
Prilissa/Trin's Veil/Spinward Marches<BR>
<BR>
Prilissa      3035 B985588-6    Ag Ni              510 Im K9 V<BR>
<BR>
REPORTS<BR>
=======<BR>
<BR>
Library Data<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
See GURPS Traveller: Behind the Claw, p. 121<BR>
<BR>
History<BR>
~~~~~~~<BR>
Prilissa was first surveyed in 233. The Agliande Company of ????/Deneb<BR>
read the report and, forecasting a key role for the world during the<BR>
expansion into the Marches, organised a colonisation effort. The first<BR>
settlers arrived in the 260s.<BR>
<BR>
All went well at first. The colony thrived and as the survey had<BR>
indicated the world proved ideal for agriculture. A vaccine was found<BR>
that protected the 0.6% of colonists allergic to being stung by local<BR>
pests; in 293 the first Kian were domesticated and Holiday 300 was<BR>
celebrated with the running of the inaugural Kian Challenge Cup. Soon<BR>
the Prilissan operation was turning a profit, providing food to the<BR>
surrounding worlds and especially Trin.<BR>
<BR>
Trade and the population grew throughout the 4th century, but all was<BR>
not well. Many of the grandchildren of the original workforce saw no<BR>
reason to work for the company and set off on their own to carve out new<BR>
areas of the planet for themselves. A distinct local culture had<BR>
developed and workers brought in to boost production found it hard to<BR>
fit in. The native life was also beginning to adapt to the imported<BR>
biologies; pesticides were being used more heavily to keep up yields.<BR>
<BR>
Raufu hault-Agliande took over the running of the company in 377. A<BR>
shrewd businessman with an eye for the longer term, he could see how<BR>
things were developing and resolved that his family would not suffer.<BR>
<BR>
Following extensive discussion control of the port was handed over to<BR>
the Scout Service's Civilian Starport Office in 398, on condition that<BR>
they upgrade it to cope with the ever-increasing demand; construction of<BR>
Prilissa Highport dates from this time.<BR>
<BR>
Then in 433, when Prilissa was at the height of its productivity, hault-<BR>
Agliande sold the operation to another firm for a large amount. Two<BR>
years later it was sold again, this time to Gromore, LIC.<BR>
<BR>
Gromore took a heavy-handed approach to the business. They tried cutting<BR>
prices paid to the farmers and then, as the situation continued to<BR>
worsen, sent in their own supervisors to organise things the "Gromore<BR>
way". It didn't help. Production was falling, costs were rising and now<BR>
the farmers were angry and upset. Transport workers staging sympathy<BR>
stoppages were fired.<BR>
<BR>
In 447 hault-Agliande published his controversial autobiography. In it<BR>
he apologised to the Prilissans for his part in the events that had led<BR>
to their current plight, lambasted the Gromore management and obliquely<BR>
criticised the Imperium for its laissez-faire attitude to workers'<BR>
rights. When the book reached Prilissa (despite Gromore's attempts to<BR>
stop it) the planet was already a powder-keg; the situation exploded as<BR>
the farmers took matters into their own hands. Stressed Gromore security<BR>
teams over-reacted, opening fire on and killing unarmed protesters<BR>
before being overrun.<BR>
<BR>
The Prilissans quickly set up a revolutionary council, aware that they<BR>
would need some body to represent them. The Imperium stepped in,<BR>
declaring martial law, but after long negotiations it was Gromore who<BR>
relinquished their claim on the world in an attempt to mitigate the<BR>
public relations disaster. The Prilissans had self-government.<BR>
<BR>
The council set up interim structures to keep things running while they<BR>
deliberated on the best system for a new Prilissa. Following the events<BR>
of the revolution one of the key debates was over firearms; one large<BR>
faction wanted to arm everybody, another to ban them altogether. The<BR>
disarmament supporters eventually won.  All the new government<BR>
structures were put into place during the 450s but the revolutionary<BR>
council officially handed over power in 461 on the 200th anniversary of<BR>
the first landing.<BR>
<BR>
[Development of current government/culture]<BR>
[Recently suffered minor recession.]<BR>
<BR>
[T.B.D.]<BR>
<BR>
Traveller's Guide<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
<BR>
"A dull, backwoods world full of dull, backward people leading miserable<BR>
lives beneath a dull orange sun"<BR>
 - Alison Berghaus, Memoirs of a Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Many travellers share Ms. Berghaus' opinion, but understandable though<BR>
it is they are quite wrong. Visitors arriving in-system are usually<BR>
directed to the largest port, Gelno Down (there are no orbital<BR>
facilities, though daily shuttles are available for unstreamlined<BR>
vessels). Following a bumpy ride by wheeled bus to the arrivals block<BR>
they are kept waiting while their papers are processed. The concourse is<BR>
shabby and draughty, smelling vaguely of animals and insect repellent.<BR>
Eventually they are sent through to the main concourse and can avail<BR>
themselves of the facilities, limited though they are for a Class IV<BR>
port. Travellers who wish to leave the port then have to undergo a<BR>
medical examination or fill out a waiver form; inoculations are given<BR>
using old-fashioned hypodermic syringes.<BR>
<BR>
The truth is that the Prilissans have little interest in casual<BR>
visitors; bulk haulage carriers are received with far more warmth and<BR>
their applications are always given priority. The locals only care about<BR>
people coming to their world if it is financially important; on Prilissa<BR>
that means trading in agricultural produce.<BR>
<BR>
The Bureaucracy:<BR>
<BR>
Agriculture:<BR>
<BR>
Industry:<BR>
<BR>
Wanderers:<BR>
<BR>
The Military:<BR>
<BR>
[T.B.D.]<BR>
<BR>
Interplanetary Relations:<BR>
<BR>
Food exported to Trin, Hammermium, Traltha, Edenelt, Dodds, Ramiva;<BR>
Trin the dominant trading partner;<BR>
Close links with Hammermium Corp (builds 400dT lighters);<BR>
Ramiva buys food with military trainers;<BR>
Skill exchange with Edenelt;<BR>
Supports revolution on Zephyr.<BR>
<BR>
[T.B.D.]<BR>
<BR>
Naturalist's Notebook<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
[T.B.D.]<BR>
<BR>
 <BR>
John G. Wood  |  john@elvw.demon.co.uk  |  Oxford, United Kingdom<BR>
IMTU tc+ tm+ tn t4(+) ru--(+) ge 3i+ jt au- st ls+ hi++ so- zh+ pi+ jd++<BR>
Traveller IS Forms, Gal2CC, etc: http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:29:05 +0100<BR>
From: John Wood <John@elvw.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 3 of 3]<BR>
<BR>
THE CHATHRA SYSTEM<BR>
==================<BR>
<BR>
Primary Star (Chathra)<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Temperature     4,000K<BR>
Luminosity      0.07<BR>
Size            0.00511<BR>
Mass            0.514<BR>
Lifespan        73.5 billion years<BR>
Age             8.5 billion years (disk population)<BR>
Inner limit     0.103<BR>
Life zone       0.251-0.344<BR>
Snow line       1.32<BR>
Outer limit     20.6<BR>
Appearance      .97 deg across, soft lighting, blurred shadows<BR>
<BR>
Planetary Orbits<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Bode's Law:     D 0.103         B 0.3<BR>
O. Rad: Name:           Ecc:    Incl:   Asc:    Peri:   O. Period:<BR>
0.103AU Talra           0.1042  0.242   131     335     16.84d  <BR>
0.411AU Prilissa        0.0567  0       0       0       134.24d <BR>
0.701AU Elta            0.0507  1.945   317     108     299.02d <BR>
1.29AU  Jesma           0.0023  0.724   165     302     746.46d <BR>
2.58AU  Ravda           0.0740  13.740  100     264     5.78y   <BR>
4.97AU  Somma           0.0026  2.163   87      147     15.45y  <BR>
9.85AU  Killgore        0.0378  0.640   187     257     43.12y  <BR>
19.2AU  The Belt        0.0840  0.475   61      333     117.35y <BR>
<BR>
World Summary<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Name:     Dia.: Dens.:  Mass:           Grav.:  Type:<BR>
Talra     1440  2.3     0.00250         0.0755  Silicate rockball<BR>
Prilissa  9130  5.6     1.55            1.166   Med-iron earthlike world<BR>
Elta      3310  4.0     0.0527          0.302   Low-iron rockball<BR>
Jesma     7460  4.7     0.710           0.799   Med-iron nitrogen world<BR>
 Tewhi    220   2.9     1.12e-5         0.00145 Silicate rockball moon<BR>
Ravda     11620 1.3     0.742           0.344   Silicate ammonia world<BR>
 Trokes   530   2.2     1.19e-4         0.0266  Silicate rockball moon<BR>
Somma     10750 1.3     0.587           0.319   Silicate ammonia world<BR>
 Vespase  10    2.8     1.02e-9         6.38e-4 Silicate rockball moon<BR>
 Cinruse  20    3.2     9.31e-9         1.46e-4 Low-iron rockball moon<BR>
Killgore  11290 1.4     0.733           0.360   Silicate ammonia world<BR>
Negera    3     2.9     2.80e-11        1.98e-4 Silicate rockball moon<BR>
Torrance  40    2.7     6.28e-8         0.00246 Silicate rockball moon<BR>
The Belt  100m/1000km n24 m29 c47, 0.5au (very scant resources)<BR>
<BR>
PLANETOLOGY<BR>
===========<BR>
<BR>
Size<BR>
~~~~<BR>
Diameter:               9,130 miles (14,690km)<BR>
Density:                5.6<BR>
Mass:                   1.55<BR>
Surface Gravity:        1.166G<BR>
Tidal Effect:           21<BR>
Rotation Period:        134.24d (Tide-Locked)<BR>
Axial Tilt:             0 deg<BR>
<BR>
Atmosphere<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Composition:            Oxygen-nitrogen <BR>
Pressure:               1.28 atm (dense)<BR>
Albedo:                 0.18<BR>
Greenhouse Effect:      0.165<BR>
Blackbody Temperature:  223.05K<BR>
Surface Temperature:    296.73K (Normal)<BR>
Weather Factor:         7<BR>
Biochemistry:           Compatible<BR>
Native Ecosphere:       Complex animals (IQ 5-)<BR>
<BR>
Hydrographics<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Composition:            Liquid Water/Ice<BR>
Surface Water:          47%<BR>
Continents:             1<BR>
Major Islands:          1<BR>
Archipelagoes:          3<BR>
Volcanoes:              None active<BR>
Mineral Resources:<BR>
 Gemstones/Crystals:    Almost absent<BR>
 Rare Minerals:         Almost absent<BR>
 Radioactives:          Almost absent<BR>
 Heavy Metals:          Almost absent<BR>
 Industrial Metals:     Scarce<BR>
 Light Metals:          Ample<BR>
 Organics:              Plentiful<BR>
<BR>
SOCIOLOGY<BR>
=========<BR>
<BR>
Population<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
<BR>
MSPR:                   9<BR>
Total Population:       470,000<BR>
Primary Settlements:<BR>
 Name:          Pop:    Port:<BR>
 Gelno:         7,900   Class IV starport<BR>
 New Dabadag:   7,100   Class III spaceport<BR>
 First Landing: 4,900   Class IV spaceport<BR>
 Easton:        4,800   Class II spaceport<BR>
 Senlu:         4,500   Class I spaceport<BR>
 Chireno:       3,100   Class II spaceport<BR>
<BR>
Social Parameters:<BR>
 Pluralism:     -2      Low (Monolithic)<BR>
 Toleration:    +1      Moderate<BR>
 Solidarity:    +2      High (Collectivistic)<BR>
 Tractability:  +2      High (Submissive)<BR>
 Aggression:    +2      High (Violent)<BR>
 Pragmatism:    +1      Moderate<BR>
 Innovation:    +1      Moderate<BR>
 Providence:    +1      Moderate<BR>
<BR>
Aspects of Culture:<BR>
 Voluntary joining of groups taking orders;<BR>
 Minimal distinctions of social class;<BR>
 People rarely move about;<BR>
 Mixed supernatural/rational worldview;<BR>
 Emotional display varied by gender;<BR>
 Legal equality of sexes;<BR>
 Wealth acquired by law, few rich, many poor;<BR>
 Privacy forbidden;<BR>
 Minimal attire required;<BR>
 Crimes of passion condoned, some animals protected;<BR>
 Extended family;<BR>
 Lip service to ethics;<BR>
 Work is an end to itself;<BR>
 Schedules are flexible.<BR>
<BR>
Customs:<BR>
 Communal polygamy;<BR>
 Polyandry practiced in certain geographical regions;<BR>
 Unusual beverages for certain political figures;<BR>
 Military figures live apart.<BR>
<BR>
Government<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Extended Government Profile: 889-8-E61A-L61A-JS612<BR>
<BR>
Political Type:         Bureaucracy<BR>
Unity of Government:    Global<BR>
Division of Power:      3-way division<BR>
Executive (dominant):   Large council, adoptive succession;<BR>
Legislative:            Large council, adoptive succession;<BR>
Judicial:               Multiple councils, hereditary succession.<BR>
<BR>
Characteristics:<BR>
 Corruption:            Low<BR>
 Talent:                Medium<BR>
 Cruelty:               High<BR>
 Aggression:            Moderate<BR>
 Paranoia:              Low<BR>
<BR>
Leader Talents:<BR>
 Administration:        Good<BR>
 Diplomacy:             Poor<BR>
 Intrigue:              Average<BR>
 Strategy:              Poor<BR>
 Tactics:               Poor<BR>
 Leadership:            Average<BR>
<BR>
Law<BR>
~~~<BR>
Uniformity: Territorial<BR>
Profile<BR>
 Public Safety          CR 5<BR>
 Economic Activity      CR 5<BR>
 Personal Freedom       CR 2<BR>
 Civil Law              CR 6<BR>
<BR>
Technology<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Physical Science:       TL 9<BR>
 Materials:             TL 6<BR>
 Energy:                TL 6<BR>
 Information:           TL 5<BR>
 Transport:             TL 6<BR>
 Weapons:               TL 3<BR>
Biological Science:     TL 9<BR>
 Medicine:              TL 6<BR>
 Environment:           TL 4<BR>
<BR>
Port (Gelno Down)<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Extended Starport Profile: B-BXD45R6577<BR>
Facilities:<BR>
 Orbital Port:          None.<BR>
 Bases:                 None.<BR>
 Extrality:             CR 0.<BR>
 Berths:                4d6 available.<BR>
 Traffic:               (2d6+2)&times;10%.<BR>
 Construction:          Spaceships only.<BR>
 Naval Architect:       Present.<BR>
 Refined Fuel:          Available.<BR>
 Unrefined Fuel:        Available.<BR>
 Search/Rescue:         Up to 10,000 tons/100 people.<BR>
 Major Repair:          Yes.<BR>
 Minor Repair:          Yes.<BR>
 Superficial Repair:    Yes.<BR>
 Overhaul:              Yes.<BR>
 Life Support:          Available.<BR>
 Lodging:               Available.<BR>
 Entertainment:         Available.<BR>
 Brokerage:             Available.<BR>
 Warehousing:           Available.<BR>
 Security:              Available.<BR>
 Berthing Costs:        Cr150.<BR>
 Shuttle Service:       Cargo Cr9/ton, Passengers Cr100, daily.<BR>
 Transport Terminal:    Present.<BR>
 TAS:                   Present.<BR>
<BR>
Trade:<BR>
 Partner        BTN     KCr/y   DTons/y Passengers/y<BR>
 Trin           8.5     900,000 96,000  3,400<BR>
 Hammermium     7.5     75,000  8,000   300<BR>
 Traltha        7.5     70,000  8,000   300<BR>
 Edenelt        7.5 / 8 50,000  6,000   800<BR>
 Dodds          7.5     60,000  7,000   150<BR>
 Ramiva         7       30,000  4,000   70<BR>
 Murchison      6.5     7,000   900     30<BR>
 Hazel          6.5     5,000   500     15<BR>
 Zyra           6       3,000   400     9<BR>
 Rest of Veil   varies  29,750  4065    136<BR>
 Long-Distance  varies  250     135     40<BR>
 TOTAL                  1.23GCr 135,000 5,250<BR>
  System                        90,000  2,500<BR>
  Transient                     45,000  2,750<BR>
<BR>
ECOLOGY<BR>
=======<BR>
<BR>
Encounter Tables<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
[T.B.D.]<BR>
<BR>
ADVENTURE SEEDS<BR>
===============<BR>
[T.B.D.]<BR>
<BR>
 <BR>
John G. Wood  |  john@elvw.demon.co.uk  |  Oxford, United Kingdom<BR>
IMTU tc+ tm+ tn t4(+) ru--(+) ge 3i+ jt au- st ls+ hi++ so- zh+ pi+ jd++<BR>
Traveller IS Forms, Gal2CC, etc: http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 18:49:43 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2310<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-14 20:00:04 EDT,  Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<< I salute those of you who have done your part to keep Traveller<BR>
 alive - each and every one of you that has _ever_ posted an idea<BR>
 to this list, run a campaign, written for one or more of the<BR>
 websites, or even just written letters of encouragement to Marc,<BR>
 Loren, Steve, or anyone else who has had an influence on the<BR>
 subculture we call Traveller. VIVAT TRAVELLER! >><BR>
<BR>
Anybody who buys a book, introduces a new player to the game, or talks an old <BR>
player into playing again is doing their part to keep Traveller alive. <BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 20:09:50 -0300<BR>
From: Brian Quirt <baqrt@mta.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> b) that my handwave of exhaust velocity from an ion drive is proportional to<BR>
> the power applied. i.e. if currently 2kW can produce a 20km/s exhaust<BR>
> velocity, could 45MW produce an exhaust velocity of 3000km/s (0.01c).  With<BR>
> exhaust velocities of this order of magnitude, we need only a few tons of<BR>
> reaction mass to rendezvous in a reasonable amount of time...<BR>
<BR>
	Generally correct, but I believe that there is a limit in this<BR>
direction for ion drives. Ion drives operate by (obviously) converting<BR>
atoms into ions, which are then repelled from each other, and thus<BR>
expand away from the ship, producing thrust in accordance with the<BR>
conservation of momentum. The problems (limits) come when you consider<BR>
trying to make the charged particles go in the right direction (that is<BR>
directly opposite your intended course). The more energy you put in, the<BR>
more you charge the reaction mass (that much works), but unfortunately,<BR>
the more charged it is, the more of it will tend to disperse to the side<BR>
instead of straight back (thus producing no net thrust). I don't know<BR>
where the limit is, but .5g may be pushing it, and 0.01c exhaust<BR>
velocity is probably pushing it. Of course, ion drives make up for their<BR>
low thrust by being efficient, but it sounds as if you're more<BR>
interested in travel time than efficiency here.<BR>
<BR>
- -Brian Quirt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 11:09:18 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
> >The 1st ed. Monster Manual also contained Elric mythos stuff, at<BR>
> that time<BR>
> >licensed to Chaosium, which was also removed in later editions.<BR>
> No, it was the first edition of Dieties & Demigods that had both the<BR>
> Melnibonean and Cthulu mythos.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, sorry, I knew that, typed "Monster Manual" instead of  "Dieties &<BR>
Demigods".<BR>
<BR>
Probably because that's how I think of "Dieties & Demigods", a "monster<BR>
manual".<BR>
<grin><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:28:08 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: STL players<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 15 April 2000 20:15<BR>
Subject: RE: STL players<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>>From: John Littleton <litljohn71@stlnet.com><BR>
>>Subject: STL PLayers?<BR>
><BR>
>>Traveller group in the Saint Louis area?<BR>
><BR>
>And there we all thought you were setting up a campaign<BR>
>involving ram jets, cold sleep, and generation ships (all<BR>
>of which are Slower Than Light).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
That was my first impression too... <g><BR>
<BR>
Now all we need is someone looking for players in Fort Lauderdale.... (FTL<BR>
Players...)<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 19:08:38 -0500<BR>
From: Jimmy Simpson <nimrod@santech.com><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
At 04:30 PM 4/15/00 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Close. You're thinking of the early printings (not sure if it's just the<BR>
>first printing) of the 1st Edition "Deities & Demigods". TSR got into a<BR>
>brawl with Chaosium over the inclusion of the Cthulhu Mythos and the<BR>
>Melnibonean <sp?> Mythos (from the "Elric" series). Chaosium produced games<BR>
>based on both properties. <snip><BR>
<BR>
Actually, I believe if you look in the credits on the Dieties & Demigods, <BR>
TSR thanks Chaosium for giving permission to print the Cthulu and <BR>
Melnibonean mythos.  The problem was that Chaosium had the rights to print <BR>
this stuff, but did not have the rights to give permission to other <BR>
companies.  Apparently Lovecraft's estate and Michael Moorcock both had <BR>
something to say to Chaosium about that and later editions of Dieties & <BR>
Demigods did not have Cthulu or Melnibonean mythos, although they still had <BR>
the 'thank you' on the credit page.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jimmy Simpson<BR>
      nimrodd@fastlane.net<BR>
<BR>
"The avalanche has already started.<BR>
It is too late for the pebbles to vote."<BR>
                       -Kosh Naranek (Babylon 5)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 01:28:12 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Brian Quirt <baqrt@mta.ca><BR>
<BR>
>Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
>><BR>
>> b) that my handwave of exhaust velocity from an ion drive is proportional<BR>
to<BR>
>> the power applied. i.e. if currently 2kW can produce a 20km/s exhaust<BR>
>> velocity, could 45MW produce an exhaust velocity of 3000km/s (0.01c).<BR>
With<BR>
>> exhaust velocities of this order of magnitude, we need only a few tons of<BR>
>> reaction mass to rendezvous in a reasonable amount of time...<BR>
><BR>
> Generally correct, but I believe that there is a limit in this<BR>
>direction for ion drives. Ion drives operate by (obviously) converting<BR>
>atoms into ions, which are then repelled from each other, and thus<BR>
>expand away from the ship, producing thrust in accordance with the<BR>
>conservation of momentum.<BR>
<BR>
No, they work by being accelerated out of the drive by a magnetic field,<BR>
after being ionised at one end of the drive. If they simply moved away from<BR>
each other, there would be no nett thrust, as they would be repelled in all<BR>
directions equally.<BR>
<BR>
>The problems (limits) come when you consider<BR>
>trying to make the charged particles go in the right direction (that is<BR>
>directly opposite your intended course). The more energy you put in, the<BR>
>more you charge the reaction mass (that much works), but unfortunately,<BR>
<BR>
>the more charged it is, the more of it will tend to disperse to the side<BR>
>instead of straight back (thus producing no net thrust). I don't know<BR>
>where the limit is, but .5g may be pushing it, and 0.01c exhaust<BR>
>velocity is probably pushing it. Of course, ion drives make up for their<BR>
>low thrust by being efficient, but it sounds as if you're more<BR>
>interested in travel time than efficiency here.<BR>
><BR>
>-Brian Quirt<BR>
<BR>
The charge on the reaction mass is the same. As we are using Hydrogen (in<BR>
the game, in real life a more massive atom is preferable), once ionised it<BR>
cannot increase in charge, as it only has one electron to lose.  What the<BR>
power is used for is to increase the magnetic field strength that<BR>
accelerates the ion out of the drive. Magnetic containment holds the<BR>
ionstream together prior to it leaving the drive, and what the ions do after<BR>
that is a separate action/reaction pair. i.e. they have already imparted<BR>
thrust to the drive, and subsequent dispersal is an action/reaction of<BR>
paired ions moving apart from each other, and has no effect on the initial<BR>
thrust they provided to the ship.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2313<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Sunday, April 16 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2314<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
Planetary data - help?<BR>
Re Skill focus<BR>
Re: Ion Drives<BR>
Re: Ion Drives<BR>
THUDDD 12 Page Now Up<BR>
Re: VIVAT TRAVELLER!<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
Babbage computer limits?<BR>
Double Sonic Booms<BR>
Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
Re: TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 1 of 3]<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
Re: Norris' Evil Twin <BR>
Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 12:28:08 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Steve Daniels<BR>
><BR>
> The number of skills and their availbility is a core element<BR>
> of your rpg system.  So you need to do some deep thinking<BR>
> about the system overall.<BR>
<BR>
I agree.<BR>
In fact I'd go as far as to say the skill creation, description and<BR>
resolution system determines the quality of the RPG from my point of view.<BR>
Combat is secondary, as it should really be just a specialization of the<BR>
general skill use resolution system.<BR>
<BR>
> While I see the reasoning behind<BR>
> breaking more and more skills out, i.e., branching that tree<BR>
> into a fractal maze, I think a functional approach is better.<BR>
> For me the question is this:  Are Task X and Task Y<BR>
> different enough to justify having a totally separate skill<BR>
> (that has to be acquired separately)?<BR>
<BR>
For me, the question is not related to function at all, it's :<BR>
<BR>
Does the player want his character to have a particular skill ?<BR>
<BR>
If so, and the skill does not already exist, we make it up on the spot.<BR>
<BR>
To me, skills are a means of detailing characters. Using them for game<BR>
mechanics is secondary to that, though it must work for both. Therefore I<BR>
consider guidelines on how to create new skills essential for a quality RPG.<BR>
<BR>
In most cases the skills people want are obscure specializations of existing<BR>
skills, or they want to explicitly limit their ability to a particular area.<BR>
IME, few players ( other than real munchkins, who as everyone knows, we<BR>
should ignore, and not try and design to control, that's the referee's job.)<BR>
actually try and design a skill that will give them the equivalent of five<BR>
other skills, or make them better than someone who has taken severasl<BR>
seperate skills.<BR>
<BR>
For instance, a pilot may want to explicitly only have piston-engined<BR>
fixed-wing piloting abilities.<BR>
(actually that one may already be there), in other words have no jet, rotary<BR>
or grav experience, or a "sailor" may want only kayaking experience.<BR>
<BR>
Or a character may want to be an expert on Fornice archaelogy, but not want<BR>
to know much at all about any other location, etc.<BR>
<BR>
Basically, they normally want a specialization or restriction of an existing<BR>
skill because the existing skills don't describe their character well<BR>
enough.<BR>
<BR>
I've always considered published skill lists to be just examples of what's<BR>
available, not a complete listing, and in some areas this is even<BR>
recognized. For instance, CT concentrates on listing technical and military<BR>
skills, pretty much ignoring crafts and non-technical trades, even<BR>
"Citizens" doesn't add much.<BR>
<BR>
If you happen to know anything about working with wood, you know there are<BR>
many differrent skills involved , and most wood-workers only learn a few of<BR>
them. For instance, a carpenter learns different things than a<BR>
cabinet-maker, and neither of them neccessarily know anything about turning<BR>
or carving. And let's not even start talking about parquet, fretting and<BR>
similar specializations.<BR>
<BR>
I don't expect a set of rules to provide this detail, but I do expect that a<BR>
GM will allow the introduction of such things should the player want to<BR>
detail their character, and assuming the skill itself does not unbalance the<BR>
game. (y'know, things like JoT <grin>). And I also expect that the skill<BR>
system will have been designbed to support addition or give guidelines on<BR>
adding skills.<BR>
<BR>
> A Trav. example:  Trader and Broker.<BR>
<snip><BR>
> End result of both skills:  better prices for your goods.<BR>
> Why have them as separate skills?  Why indeed?<BR>
> I don't.<BR>
<BR>
I would, if the _player_ wanted to make the distinction for their character<BR>
description.<BR>
In such a case there would be no need to invent any new mechanics to do with<BR>
using the skill, they would be functionally equivalent in almost all<BR>
circumstances.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Certainly, they are different aspects of the<BR>
> business of finding, buying and sellings goods.  But<BR>
> are they different enough to effectively punish a character<BR>
> who doesn't have both?  I don't think so.<BR>
<BR>
You're assuming that skills can't overlap. Not having Broker would not<BR>
_normally_ disdvantage a guy who only has Trader when he was trading. If<BR>
there was any disadvantage it would be primarily "social", in that the<BR>
Broker would know the insider lingo of the brokers, and who to deal with<BR>
from a broker's perspective, might be more likely to get rumours, clues or<BR>
leads from other brokers, more likely to realize something was wrong with a<BR>
broking operation, that sort of thing.<BR>
<BR>
> You can<BR>
> get the same effect by giving a penalty (negative DM)<BR>
> for characters not familar with the market in which<BR>
> the goods are being sold.<BR>
<BR>
This is really a different thing, IMO.<BR>
<BR>
> Gurps handles this better, IMO,<BR>
> with Merchant and Area Knowledge.  Of course, Trav.<BR>
> doesn't have anything like Area Knowledge, and it<BR>
> doesn't need it, really.<BR>
<BR>
Another way of handling it (from Daredevils) is the use of "culture" &<BR>
"subculture" skills.<BR>
"Area Knowledge" handles georaphically based knowledge, "subcultures" allow<BR>
for similarities between areas.<BR>
<BR>
The examples in  Daredevils include such things as "Criminal", "Law<BR>
Enforcement", "Academic", "Legal", and they talk about these being combined<BR>
with geographical "culture" skills "Arabian" "Japanese", etc.<BR>
<BR>
So, a person with Japanese Culture & Law Enforcement Subculture, will stand<BR>
a better chance of getting information from a Japanese policeman than<BR>
someone with only  Japanese Culture or only Law Enforcement Subculture. Of<BR>
course, they will also have to share some language !<BR>
<BR>
To go back to the Trader/Broker example, we could use "Broker Subculture" to<BR>
allow the player to model his broker, with "Trading" as the functional<BR>
skill.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
> And of course there is many-headed Hydra of interpersonal<BR>
> communication:  Fast-Talk, Diplomacy, Liaison, Acting,<BR>
> Persuasion, Bribery, Carousing, Intimidation, Interrogation.<BR>
> All that is missing from the list is Chit Chat and Hot Air.<BR>
> I think these are simply different aspects of the same<BR>
> thing (with the possible exception of Interrogation and<BR>
> Carousing), and that one thing is Social Engineering.<BR>
<BR>
I agree, but the differences are important to the characters.<BR>
<BR>
Someone who uses intimidation is a different type of person than the one who<BR>
is merely good at persuading people to their way of thinking, not to mention<BR>
that the means used has a great long term effect on the future relationship<BR>
between the character and the person being acted on.<BR>
<BR>
Also, persuasion and diplomacy take intelligence or at least cunning,<BR>
whereas one can intimidate with no brain at all, a piece of machinery can<BR>
intimidate, and so can your dull thug or noble with a high Soc.<BR>
<BR>
> The goal of each of these is to get a certain type of<BR>
> reaction from an NPC.  I think that can be done with<BR>
> one skill, and its relevant stat - Charisma [which we don't<BR>
> have for humans, canonically anyway], and relevant<BR>
> modifiers.<BR>
<BR>
"Charisma" really doesn't cut it.<BR>
I have met some extremely uncharasmatic individuals who were good at social<BR>
engineering.<BR>
And Henry Kissinger was considered a good diplomat, but he was definitely<BR>
not charismatuic. In fact, from what I've read,  most people who met him<BR>
didn't like him, though they may have respected his ability.<BR>
<BR>
> For instance, the only difference between<BR>
> fast-talk and bribery is the exchange of money.<BR>
> So why not simply allow the money to be a modifer<BR>
> to the interaction?<BR>
<BR>
BTW, Fast Talk really is not to do with money.<BR>
Fast Talk is doing the "these are not the droids you are interested in"<BR>
thing without psionics.<BR>
It's flashing a photo-drivers license at a crime scene and saying "FBI" and<BR>
getting away with it.<BR>
It's saying to your pursuers, "he went that way" and getting them to believe<BR>
you at least long enough to get away.<BR>
<BR>
I think all uses of Fast Talk should be modified by the character's<BR>
knowledge of the situation,<BR>
A person with the equivalent of the "Law Enforcement Subculture" I mentioned<BR>
above is more likely to get away with flashing a non-existent FBI ID, she's<BR>
more likely  to know what to say.<BR>
<BR>
Bribery is knowing who and how to bribe, something that can get you into a<BR>
lot of trouble if you approach the wrong person or do it too blatantly.<BR>
Again, this should be modified b appropriate culture skills.<BR>
<BR>
What one culture sees as bribes may be considered appropriate "tipping" in<BR>
another culture.<BR>
<BR>
> So ask questions like this for your skills, and Trav<BR>
> skills in general to see where you come down on<BR>
> this issue.<BR>
><BR>
> Are Jump, Manuever and Contra-grav drives<BR>
> different enough to punish a character who<BR>
> is familar with one but not the others?<BR>
> How different are they?<BR>
<BR>
To me, more important is not how _different_ are they, but are they likely<BR>
to be taught or learned together ?<BR>
<BR>
While contra-grav and jump technology may be completely different, if<BR>
technical training schools tend to teach them together, then it makes sense<BR>
for some one who has specialized in one to know something about the other.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, if it doesn't make sense to use "cascade" skills for this sort of<BR>
thing one can use "packages", "careers", combined with zero-level skills to<BR>
provide cascade-like effects.<BR>
<BR>
And is it something that is at all posible without some training ?<BR>
<BR>
For instance, written languages that have no shared alphabet are completely<BR>
impossible for someone without any knowledge to understand without the<BR>
application of cryptanalysis or other skills.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 17:39:41 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Planetary data - help?<BR>
<BR>
I am having major problems finding anything on Jenghe/Regina beyond <BR>
the basic planetary stats.  I have or have access to pretty much all <BR>
of the main CT books/supplements, along with the MegaTraveller and <BR>
GURPS Traveller, but so far not much luck.<BR>
<BR>
I have heard of, but have not seen the Imperial Survey material.  If <BR>
anyone can point me in the right direction (Survey or otherwise), it <BR>
would be greatly appreciated.  I am willing to provide payment in <BR>
baked goods for anyone within reasonable transport range (including <BR>
at Norwescon), or just my general gratitude and good will.<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
(aka Cheryl)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 16:54:18 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Skill focus<BR>
<BR>
Eris comenteth and querieth:<BR>
><BR>
>To be honest, I don't have an answer to this problem.  I like the<BR>
>simple system you get with very broad skills, but I want more<BR>
>detail.  OTOH, I don't like having a page *full* of skills to keep<BR>
>track of or the baggage having narrow skills brings with it.<BR>
><BR>
>Does anyone have a good answer for all this?<BR>
<BR>
In cases where it's an issue, I tend to treat broad skills as<BR>
"specializable"; to wit, if you want to specialize, fine, you get twice as<BR>
many levels, but NONE go to other than their designated specialty, and no<BR>
specialty can be more than twice the level of the base "broad skill" they<BR>
derive from. I've done this with MT and CT both.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 18:01:30 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drives<BR>
<BR>
>b) that my handwave of exhaust velocity from an ion drive is proportional to<BR>
>the power applied. i.e. if currently 2kW can produce a 20km/s exhaust<BR>
>velocity, could 45MW produce an exhaust velocity of 3000km/s (0.01c).  With<BR>
>exhaust velocities of this order of magnitude, we need only a few tons of<BR>
>reaction mass to rendezvous in a reasonable amount of time...<BR>
<BR>
Unfortunately, this part isn't true. Exhaust velocity is fixed by the<BR>
design (maximum voltages and suchlike); more power would allow more<BR>
thrust by increasing the rate you can pump ions out the back, but not<BR>
greater exhaust velocity/fuel efficiency.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 18:03:15 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drives<BR>
<BR>
>No, they work by being accelerated out of the drive by a magnetic field<BR>
<BR>
Most ion drives use an electric field rather than magnetic, which sets the<BR>
limitation to their exhaust velocity/energy per particle based on the<BR>
voltage used.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 20:08:44 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: THUDDD 12 Page Now Up<BR>
<BR>
THUDDD 12 is officially up on my site, at:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/colverber/thuddd12proposal.html<BR>
<BR>
(BTW, I'm still working on getting rid of the damned pop-ups.)<BR>
<BR>
Submissions may begin immediately, with a deadline of 21 May 2000 (when<BR>
I return from annual training).<BR>
<BR>
You can submit your entries via e-mail to wombat@premier.net.  Entries<BR>
should be either unformatted text or RTF.<BR>
<BR>
Good luck, and may the best ship win!<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/colverber/travler.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 21:44:06 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: VIVAT TRAVELLER!<BR>
<BR>
On Sat, 15 Apr 2000 20:29:15 -0400 (EDT), GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>In a message dated 00-04-14 20:00:04 EDT,  Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
><< I salute those of you who have done your part to keep Traveller<BR>
> alive - each and every one of you that has _ever_ posted an idea<BR>
> to this list, run a campaign, written for one or more of the<BR>
> websites, or even just written letters of encouragement to Marc,<BR>
> Loren, Steve, or anyone else who has had an influence on the<BR>
> subculture we call Traveller. VIVAT TRAVELLER! >><BR>
<BR>
>Anybody who buys a book, introduces a new player to the game, or talks an old <BR>
>player into playing again is doing their part to keep Traveller alive. <BR>
<BR>
Thank you; you are absolutely correct, and anyone who has done<BR>
any of these should consider themselves to be saluted no less<BR>
than those whose contributions were outlined in my original post<BR>
- - you have my most abject apologies for overlooking your equally<BR>
invaluable contributions to the continued existence of Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 21:45:32 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules<BR>
<BR>
Jimmy Simpson said:<BR>
<BR>
>Actually, I believe if you look in the credits on the Dieties & Demigods,<BR>
>TSR thanks Chaosium for giving permission to print the Cthulu and<BR>
>Melnibonean mythos.  The problem was that Chaosium had the rights to print<BR>
>this stuff, but did not have the rights to give permission to other<BR>
>companies.  Apparently Lovecraft's estate and Michael Moorcock both had<BR>
>something to say to Chaosium about that and later editions of Dieties &<BR>
>Demigods did not have Cthulu or Melnibonean mythos, although they still had<BR>
>the 'thank you' on the credit page.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, you would appear to be correct. The special credit to Chaosium is in my<BR>
copy (with the Cthulhu and Melnibonean Mythos). I had never noticed that<BR>
before, thanks for filling me in.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 18:52:32 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/15/00 2:42 PM, dom@cybergoths.u-net.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> It also had a cool version of the Type S - the type H Hunter - which<BR>
> would be a good ship to use for such characters. Do you want a copy<BR>
> of this?<BR>
<BR>
I do! And does the article you mentioned give an outline or quote Edict 97?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 21:59:20 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca><BR>
Subject: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
	I've been reading some interesting things recently about advances<BR>
in materials science and I came up with an idea (not original I'm sure,<BR>
but original to me) for a material that could make kinetic energy travel<BR>
"around corners".  The image in my mind is of a guy wearing a vest of this<BR>
stuff getting hit by a bullet: The energy of the round travels around his<BR>
body and causes a chunk of the armor to fly out the back with equivalent<BR>
KE to the round.  <BR>
	My question is this:  What TL is this stuff?  Not being a<BR>
physicist or engineer I can't really get a handle on whether this is "the<BR>
edge of tomorrow" or "indistinguishable from magic".  Opinions? <BR>
<BR>
Charles C.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 22:09:15 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca><BR>
Subject: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
<BR>
	I read recently about some folks who designed a "Babbage printer".<BR>
It seems that as well as designing the famous "Difference Engine" Babbage<BR>
also designed a printer for the thing.  It weighs about 2.5 tons, but it<BR>
works.<BR>
	So this got me thinking: Just how powerful could you make a<BR>
mechanical computer?  What are the practical limiting factors?  The image<BR>
in my mind is of PCs coming across a long-lost metal-poor colony which has<BR>
been getting along at industrial levels using entirely wooden computers of<BR>
immense size.  I picture them as looking like horrendous wooden<BR>
roller-coasters with triple-redundant systems all over the place and<BR>
swarms of carpenters checking them continuously for rotting beams and the<BR>
like.  They would have to be marvels of engineering to deal with expansion<BR>
and contraction of beams due to moisture and temperature.  Perhaps they<BR>
could be the equivalent of the great pyramids: Inspired by<BR>
religious/philosophical notions and a centerpoint of cultural pride. <BR>
<BR>
Charles C.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 22:14:55 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca><BR>
Subject: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
	I was discussing sonic booms with some friends recently and came<BR>
across the fact that the space shuttle makes a double sonic boom as it<BR>
enters the atmosphere.  That is, there are two booms about .5 secs apart.<BR>
It seems that all objects going supersonic produce such a double boom, one<BR>
originating fore and the other aft.  But most craft are small enough that<BR>
these are heard as one sound.  The shuttle, about 40 meters long, is just<BR>
big enough for you to distinguish between the two booms.<BR>
	Now picture this:  Some PCs are on a planet surface in potentially<BR>
hostile territory.  They see the glint of something entering the<BR>
atmosphere and hear "BOOM... [3 seconds pass] ...BOOM".  Whoops, time to<BR>
duck and cover! :-)<BR>
<BR>
Charles C.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 21:44:11 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
Charles Collin wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
>         I was discussing sonic booms with some friends recently and came<BR>
> across the fact that the space shuttle makes a double sonic boom as it<BR>
> enters the atmosphere.  That is, there are two booms about .5 secs apart.<BR>
> It seems that all objects going supersonic produce such a double boom, one<BR>
> originating fore and the other aft.  But most craft are small enough that<BR>
> these are heard as one sound.  The shuttle, about 40 meters long, is just<BR>
> big enough for you to distinguish between the two booms.<BR>
>         Now picture this:  Some PCs are on a planet surface in potentially<BR>
> hostile territory.  They see the glint of something entering the<BR>
> atmosphere and hear "BOOM... [3 seconds pass] ...BOOM".  Whoops, time to<BR>
> duck and cover! :-)<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm.  You must have missed my posting the _Montana_-class battleship<BR>
last month.  The pertinent data are as follows:<BR>
<BR>
AuricTech Shipyards MONTANA-class Battleship<BR>
<BR>
Tons: 500,000 std (SL Medium Rounded Cylinder Hypersonic) <BR>
Dimensions: 486.5 m x 140 m x 140 m<BR>
Volume: 7000000 m3<BR>
Mass (L/C): 7583971 t / 7355155 t<BR>
<BR>
Yes, I designed a ship massing over seven million metric tons, capable<BR>
of hypersonic atmospheric flight.  (This design feature is based on the<BR>
FF&S2 requirement that ships must have Streamlined or Airframe<BR>
Hypersonic configuration to be capable of gas-giant skimming for fuel.)<BR>
<BR>
Wonder what kind of sonic boom _Montana_ would make...?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 22:43:07 -0400<BR>
From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
Subject: Re: TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 1 of 3]<BR>
<BR>
CONGRATULATIONS!!!! I hope the delivery goes as well as yours did on this<BR>
article.<BR>
<BR>
Thom<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "John Wood" <John@elvw.demon.co.uk><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2000 6:33 PM<BR>
Subject: TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 1 of 3]<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Well, my wife Alison is showing the first signs of labour, so I don't<BR>
> expect I'll have much time for email over the next few days (weeks?).<BR>
><BR>
> I'm posting what I've done on Prilissa so far to my website:<BR>
><BR>
>         http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/Prilissa.html<BR>
><BR>
> or, for those of you who prefer black on white:<BR>
><BR>
>         http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/PrilissaWhite.html<BR>
><BR>
> Anyway, have fun with it; I hope the tables don't get too mashed in<BR>
> transmission! I'm staying subscribed but may not respond for a while...<BR>
><BR>
> John (who has never been a father before 8-)<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> John G. Wood  |  john@elvw.demon.co.uk  |  Oxford, United Kingdom<BR>
> IMTU tc+ tm+ tn t4(+) ru--(+) ge 3i+ jt au- st ls+ hi++ so- zh+ pi+ jd++<BR>
> Traveller IS Forms, Gal2CC, etc: http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 22:46:06 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" schrieb:<BR>
>><BR>
>> I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization atthe Imperial<BR>
>> level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and need the following translated<BR>
>> into legalese:<BR>
>><BR>
>> When the Marshal is investigating an Imperial crime, do whatever he says<BR>
or<BR>
>> your ass is toast.<BR>
><BR>
>Well, I can't trabslate it into Legalese, but:<BR>
>Sounds much like an Imperial Warrant. Perhaps a minor version of it,<BR>
>limited to certain levels of Imperial/local gouvernment?<BR>
<BR>
IMTU I have the Star Rangers. They report directly to the Archdukes and are<BR>
empowered with a ducal warrant (under Edict 3097), which gives them<BR>
far-reaching powers in that Domain. I'm structured it so that a single<BR>
Ranger acts as a troubleshooter for the Archduke. (S)He assembles a<BR>
crack(ed) team of PC's to assist in investigations. They operate out of a<BR>
modified Sulieman (obliqueness enough not to attract attention.) I'm hoping<BR>
the restricted jurisdiction of the warrant will allow me to introduce a "get<BR>
them before they reach the boarder" storyline. (After all the Duchess of<BR>
Ilelish, or one of her subjects might not be willing to cooperate with a law<BR>
enforcement officer from the Marches, just because Norris's agent things<BR>
it's a good idea. Especially if a locally Megacorp is involved, or an<BR>
Ilelish Noble.<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 22:48:05 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
> Charles Collin wrote:<BR>
> >         Now picture this:  Some PCs are on a planet surface in potentially<BR>
> > hostile territory.  They see the glint of something entering the<BR>
> > atmosphere and hear "BOOM... [3 seconds pass] ...BOOM".  Whoops, time to<BR>
> > duck and cover! :-)<BR>
> <BR>
> Hmmm.  You must have missed my posting the _Montana_-class battleship<BR>
> last month.  The pertinent data are as follows:<BR>
> <BR>
> AuricTech Shipyards MONTANA-class Battleship<BR>
> <BR>
> Tons: 500,000 std (SL Medium Rounded Cylinder Hypersonic) <BR>
> Wonder what kind of sonic boom _Montana_ would make...?<BR>
<BR>
Yup, I was off the list for a while so I missed this.  Fun design!  The<BR>
magnitude of sonic boom an object generates varies directly with size, so<BR>
I imagine the MONTANA would make a mighty impression! :-)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 19:55:42 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Norris' Evil Twin <BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> At 12:31 PM 4/14/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
> >Previous Traveller canon already implied that Norris had<BR>
> >an evil twin (clone), see MT and TNE information of nobles<BR>
> >having themselves cloned. <BR>
<BR>
> Peter, it was a frigging *joke* fer christssake!  Loren has told us that<BR>
> several items of canon came about from either him or Marc being woken from<BR>
> a deep sleep to answer a question.  The off-hand answer becomes an<BR>
> enshrined part of the Traveller Lore.<BR>
<BR>
I remember when Loren said this. I think the people who woke<BR>
them up were being jerks. I also think that off hand verbal<BR>
answers are not canon. However if the off hand answer later<BR>
enshrined in 'Traveller Lore' seemed wrong later they could have <BR>
always issued canonical statements in that area correcting<BR>
the fans misunderstanding.<BR>
 <BR>
> If you were trying to be humorous, there was no difference between your<BR>
> usual pedantic posts and this one.<BR>
<BR>
I thought that it was different, it had no quotations from canon,<BR>
no footnotes, no quotations from other sources and no math. Its <BR>
reference to past canon was vague. It then proceeded to make <BR>
up out of whole cloth major pieces of back story on a very important <BR>
person. This is not the typical style of my usual posts. My <BR>
usual posts, which I will concede are more pedantic than most <BR>
peoples and have been more pedantic that usual, even for me, <BR>
lately tend to take the specific wording of a canonical statement<BR>
and interpret it absolutely literally with little or no concern <BR>
for inherent plausibility.<BR>
<BR>
I was trying to suggest that anyone who thought that Lorens<BR>
(presumably facetious) Evil Twin idea was funny and that<BR>
anyone who wanted to take the joke and run with it could do so <BR>
without breaking canon. I think that games need humor but I<BR>
also think that it is better if silly Traveller ideas do not<BR>
mess with background. YMMV. In a sense all canon is pedantic<BR>
<BR>
Moreover to me the guy does not look enough like Norris to be <BR>
him, his evil twin [1], or his clone anyway. YMMV.<BR>
<BR>
[1] Why is there no Identical Twins Anti Defamation League<BR>
to stage protests when soap operas overuse the evil twins<BR>
plot idea? If other minority groups can protest when they<BR>
are stereotyped why can't twins?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:56:52 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
Charles Collin wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
>         I've been reading some interesting things recently about advances<BR>
> in materials science and I came up with an idea (not original I'm sure,<BR>
> but original to me) for a material that could make kinetic energy travel<BR>
> "around corners".  The image in my mind is of a guy wearing a vest of this<BR>
> stuff getting hit by a bullet: The energy of the round travels around his<BR>
> body and causes a chunk of the armor to fly out the back with equivalent<BR>
> KE to the round.<BR>
<BR>
Off the top of my head, I can see two _major_ problems with this:<BR>
<BR>
1.  The flying chunks of back armor are going to hit things, with plenty<BR>
of kinetic energy.  Sooner or later, some chunk of back armor will hit<BR>
something without enough armor to resist it.<BR>
<BR>
2.  Armor of this type will be vulnerable to cross-fire.  If every hit I<BR>
score on your front reduces your rear armor (what with chunks flying off<BR>
and all), sooner or later my buddy can whomp you from the rear.<BR>
<BR>
With armor, you're better off trying either to resist penetration (at<BR>
least from kinetic rounds) or to deflect the round, instead of<BR>
redirecting the energy in the manner described.<BR>
<BR>
>         My question is this:  What TL is this stuff?  Not being a<BR>
> physicist or engineer I can't really get a handle on whether this is "the<BR>
> edge of tomorrow" or "indistinguishable from magic".  Opinions?<BR>
<BR>
IMHO, TL of this kind of material is largely irrelevant, since I can't<BR>
see much practical use for this postulated material (at least as armor).<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:05:44 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
<BR>
Charles Collin wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
>         I read recently about some folks who designed a "Babbage printer".<BR>
> It seems that as well as designing the famous "Difference Engine" Babbage<BR>
> also designed a printer for the thing.  It weighs about 2.5 tons, but it<BR>
> works.<BR>
>         So this got me thinking: Just how powerful could you make a<BR>
> mechanical computer?  What are the practical limiting factors?  The image<BR>
> in my mind is of PCs coming across a long-lost metal-poor colony which has<BR>
> been getting along at industrial levels using entirely wooden computers of<BR>
> immense size.  I picture them as looking like horrendous wooden<BR>
> roller-coasters with triple-redundant systems all over the place and<BR>
> swarms of carpenters checking them continuously for rotting beams and the<BR>
> like.  They would have to be marvels of engineering to deal with expansion<BR>
> and contraction of beams due to moisture and temperature.  Perhaps they<BR>
> could be the equivalent of the great pyramids: Inspired by<BR>
> religious/philosophical notions and a centerpoint of cultural pride.<BR>
<BR>
Obviously such machines would be _much_ slower than electronic<BR>
computers.  OTOH, they would still be much faster than pencil-and-paper<BR>
calculations, so they would be useful.  Note that the main battery<BR>
analog fire-control mechanisms on the IOWA class battleships were<BR>
retained during their 1980s modernization.<BR>
<BR>
Also, I would think that a metal-poor society that would build a<BR>
mechanical computer would use stone or ceramics of some sort, rather<BR>
than wood, because of the variations in wood that you describe.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2314<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2315</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Sunday, April 16 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2315<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Roswell class Flying Saucer<BR>
Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
RE: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
Re: Re loan rates<BR>
Re: Re loan rates<BR>
Re: GT-Q: Ground Penetrating Radar and other toys<BR>
Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 01:20:12 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Roswell class Flying Saucer<BR>
<BR>
Now that I have a computer that can run Andy Akin's spreadsheet, I thought <BR>
I'd try<BR>
my hand at ship design. I'm a novice at this, so I'd appreciate a comment or <BR>
two.<BR>
<BR>
Garret<BR>
Roswell class Scout/Courier (FF&S v2)<BR>
Designed by:   Thad Coons<BR>
Using:          FF&S2 Design Worksheet by Andrew Akins<BR>
                                                                 <BR>
Statistics<BR>
     Tons: 100std ( SL Thin Disc Hypersonic)<BR>
     Volume: 1400m3<BR>
     Mass (L/C): 1584t/1146t<BR>
     Dimensions: 26.1m x 26.1m x 2.6m<BR>
     Size: 8<BR>
     Crew: 2/2<BR>
     Passengers High/Med: 0/4<BR>
     Passengers Low: 0<BR>
     Troops/Science: 0/0<BR>
     Frozen Watch: 0<BR>
     Cargo: 18std (1/0 /Hdl:1x10ton)<BR>
     Cost: 21.162 MCr<BR>
     Maintenance Points: 43<BR>
     Tech Level: 11<BR>
Electronics<BR>
     Controls: Dynamic, High automation. 2xComp (CM:1.0 CP:1.0). 1xFibComp <BR>
(CM:1.0 CP:1.0).      No bridge<BR>
.    Communications: 1xRadio (50,000km, 0.02MW). 1xLaser (1,000AU, 0MW).<BR>
     Sensors: 1xPEMS (12.5 [1.6mkm], 0MW). 1xAEMS (6, 0.02MW).<BR>
     Signatures: Vis:-0.5, IR:-0.5 (-1 at 8MW), Act:0.5, Neu:-1, Grav:-2<BR>
Weaponry: None<BR>
Performance<BR>
     2    Jump (10std/pc fuel)     <BR>
     0.9/1.2   Maneuver (/HEPlaR:70MW,10.7 G-hours)         <BR>
     0.9/1.2   Contra-grav (20MW)       <BR>
     1734kph/2331kph     Atmosphere (/Crus:1301kph/1748kph)      <BR>
     2    Power (/Fis:80MW,1yr )        <BR>
     35   Fuel (/Purif:20,1MW)          <BR>
     0/6/0/0/0 Accomodations       <BR>
     18   Life Sup. (/Ty:St,Ex /'St)         <BR>
     1    G-Comp <BR>
     1    Sandcasters ( /AV:5 /Cans:5)       <BR>
     0 [25]    Armor, 6 Structure       <BR>
                                   <BR>
Features<BR>
     1xAirlock<BR>
     1xShip's locker (0.05std ea.)<BR>
     1xOrdinary Galley (Cap:6)<BR>
Small Craft: none<BR>
Backups: none<BR>
                                   <BR>
Crew Details<BR>
     2xMnvr. <BR>
Notes:<BR>
     The Roswell class Scout/Courier was a late pre-imperial Sylean design <BR>
which appeared shortly before the transition to TL-12.  It saw use chiefly as <BR>
a government courier craft inside the Sylean Federation.  Since the smallest <BR>
fusion reactors at this TL were  too large for this size of ship, it was <BR>
powered by a fission reactor which required a large surface area, hence the <BR>
thin disk configuration.  The reactor did not have enough power to use its <BR>
main HEPlaR maneuver drive and its contragrav ascent/descent drive at the <BR>
same time, and when the ship was fully loaded, it was limited to worlds with <BR>
less than 1 g surface gravity.  The ship was unarmed but carried a mostly <BR>
useless sandcaster for defense.  One of the two crewmembers was usually <BR>
required to double as medic and sandcaster operator. <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 01:25:34 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
> > "around corners".  The image in my mind is of a guy wearing a vest of this<BR>
> > stuff getting hit by a bullet: The energy of the round travels around his<BR>
> > body and causes a chunk of the armor to fly out the back with equivalent<BR>
> > KE to the round.<BR>
> <BR>
> Off the top of my head, I can see two _major_ problems with this:<BR>
> <BR>
> 1.  The flying chunks of back armor are going to hit things, with plenty<BR>
> of kinetic energy.  Sooner or later, some chunk of back armor will hit<BR>
> something without enough armor to resist it.<BR>
> <BR>
> 2.  Armor of this type will be vulnerable to cross-fire.  If every hit I<BR>
> score on your front reduces your rear armor (what with chunks flying off<BR>
> and all), sooner or later my buddy can whomp you from the rear.<BR>
<BR>
Mmm...I suppose.  On a modern battlefield things are going to be pretty<BR>
spaced out, though, so I doubt your buddies will be in danger of being hit<BR>
by chunks of armor.  Another possibility is to have the armor "chunk" come<BR>
off instead as flakes or "confetti".  If there's any atmo these would<BR>
rapidly slow down.  <BR>
<BR>
As for cross-fire, if you're being hit from front and back, you're in big<BR>
doo-doo anyway.  Still, your point is well taken.  Maybe this would be<BR>
more useful as personal defence against assassinations and so on (assuming<BR>
the material is lighter or more flexible than ceramic or metal).<BR>
<BR>
> IMHO, TL of this kind of material is largely irrelevant, since I can't<BR>
> see much practical use for this postulated material (at least as armor).<BR>
<BR>
Actually, that brings up another question:  What would alternate uses of<BR>
this technology be?  I have a vague sense that it would have lots of<BR>
engineering uses but can't think of any specific examples off the top of<BR>
my head.<BR>
<BR>
Charles C.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 18:20:24 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
<BR>
>On Behalf Of Charles Collin<BR>
><BR>
> 	I read recently about some folks who designed a "Babbage printer".<BR>
> It seems that as well as designing the famous "Difference Engine" Babbage<BR>
> also designed a printer for the thing.  It weighs about 2.5 tons, but it<BR>
> works.<BR>
> 	So this got me thinking: Just how powerful could you make a<BR>
> mechanical computer?  What are the practical limiting factors?  The image<BR>
> in my mind is of PCs coming across a long-lost metal-poor colony which has<BR>
> been getting along at industrial levels using entirely wooden computers of<BR>
> immense size.<BR>
<BR>
If you haven't already, read William Gibson's "The Difference Engine".<BR>
<BR>
It's not a great book, but it portrays trhe "culture" around a working<BR>
difference engine well.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 03:16:31 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
<BR>
"Frank G. Pitt" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
[snip much.  I'm not going to get into arguments about<BR>
which skills are different and which are the same.  We<BR>
all have our views].<BR>
<BR>
> You're assuming that skills can't overlap.<BR>
<BR>
Not assuming, advocating. Well, as much as possible,<BR>
they shouldn't overlap.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Also, persuasion and diplomacy take intelligence or at least cunning,<BR>
<BR>
You haven't been to law school have you?  Are you saying that<BR>
"Cunning" should be an attribute?  Hmm.  I think I consider that<BR>
part of what Charisma comprises.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> whereas one can intimidate with no brain at all, a piece of machinery can<BR>
> intimidate, and so can your dull thug or noble with a high Soc.<BR>
<BR>
Great reasoning for Intimidation to be permanently removed<BR>
from a skill list.<BR>
<BR>
> "Charisma" really doesn't cut it.<BR>
> I have met some extremely uncharasmatic individuals who were good at social<BR>
> engineering.<BR>
<BR>
Naturally, high skill helps compensate for poor attributes.<BR>
<BR>
> To me, more important is not how _different_ are they, but are they likely<BR>
> to be taught or learned together ?<BR>
<BR>
Sounds like you to mirror an entire educational system and<BR>
process.  I see why you might want to do that. But I don't<BR>
want to.  At least not with that detail and complexity.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 05:17:41 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
If I were to increase the total number of skills during character<BR>
development would that have a negative,  positive or neutral effect on<BR>
game play. Example: Engineering broken down into Jump Drives, Maneuver<BR>
Drives, Anti-Gravity Drives (Gravitics) Power Plants/Generators,<BR>
Environmental/Life Support or Structural/Welding. Or, Navigation broken<BR>
down into JumpVector Navigation, Astro-Navigation (Astrogation), Aerial<BR>
Navigation, Land Navigation/Pathfinding or Ocean Navigation. Opinions<BR>
please.<BR>
<BR>
Alex Ingram<BR>
<BR>
I have the same problem myself - here's a possible way of handling it. If<BR>
you have one skill linked to others as above,  then let each skill 'serve<BR>
as' the others with a minus DM. This DM can be removed at the cost of half<BR>
the skill level difference (however for the Navigation aspect I would split<BR>
them into planetary and space first up).<BR>
<BR>
Eg I have a Jump Drive skill of 4 and all Engineering skills serve as the<BR>
others at (Jump Drive) minus 2. If I spend one skill level, I can raise a<BR>
'served as' skill to that of my Jump Drive skill (minus two divded by 2). So<BR>
the grand total cost to get Engineering covering all the above aspects at<BR>
level 4 is 9 (4 for initial skill and 1 each for the other others).<BR>
<BR>
How about that?<BR>
<BR>
Michael<BR>
<BR>
PS I split medical into 7 different catagories and this seemed to work out<BR>
okay.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 03:21:02 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization atthe Imperial<BR>
> level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and need the following translated<BR>
> into legalese:<BR>
<BR>
Are you looking over my shoulder?  Or snooping around on<BR>
my hard drive?<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 03:33:19 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Ingo Heinscher & Regina Otto wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Well, I can't trabslate it into Legalese, but:<BR>
> Sounds much like an Imperial Warrant. Perhaps a minor version of it,<BR>
> limited to certain levels of Imperial/local gouvernment?<BR>
<BR>
I think that is the right way to look at it.  An Imperial Warrant<BR>
is only limited by what the Emperor, Archduke, or Duke puts<BR>
into it (and thus by their authority).  So the example in GT from<BR>
Strephon is about as broad as possible.<BR>
<BR>
Compare Glenn's posting.  Under those provisions, an agent's<BR>
power to investigate, arrest, etc., is limited by the rest of the<BR>
document.  So, if an agent/marshall/sheriff/ranger is not<BR>
"engaged in an investigation" (at least officially), he can't<BR>
call on member world assistance and he doesn't have<BR>
"Plenipotentiary Imperial Powers" (which is pretty much<BR>
the same as the Emporer's power).<BR>
<BR>
[What happens if someone with a broad Imperial Warrant<BR>
and a Marshall engaged in an official investigation are in<BR>
opposition?  Irrestible force and immovable object.<BR>
Rebellion time?]<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 03:49:47 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Personally, I like having Trader and Broker as I think they are<BR>
> different.  You could have someone who was very good at picking<BR>
> "winners" but couldn't make a good deal, and someone who was a great<BR>
> deal maker but always picked losers to make the deal on.<BR>
<BR>
So, a Trader who finds diamonds in the rough, but can't move<BR>
them, and a Broker who can sell snow to Eskimos?  In that<BR>
sense, Trader seems more like Appraisal.  I say Feh!  Business<BR>
skill is business skill.  I think thats what dice are for.<BR>
<BR>
[Is it possible to be a heretic of The Heretic?]<BR>
<BR>
> I don't know how well this would work, but I think it might work out<BR>
> well.<BR>
<BR>
I think it might work.  But only in a well-defined game<BR>
universe.  I aspire to work more abstractly than that.<BR>
<BR>
Sort or reminds me of Cheryh's stuff, where the merchanter ships<BR>
have Helm, Nav, Com, Cargo, etc. I just finished Hellburner<BR>
and noted that there were several imporant statistical criteria<BR>
such as rank, priority and some things that weren't explained<BR>
well.  For instance, the Pollard character was a Tech/2<BR>
(something akin to a lieutenant), Priority 10 (security clearance).<BR>
The next highest security clearance on the Sol Two station<BR>
was 7A (which included a colonel).  The merchanter rank<BR>
system was simply number based, Nav1, Nav 2, etc., lower<BR>
rank better.  This was a position in command hierarchy,<BR>
actual military ranks co-existed with this: Lieutenant, J.G.,<BR>
Graff was Helm 1 or 2, but not 'command track', whatever<BR>
that means (one of the many annoyingly unexplained things<BR>
in Cheryh's books that I've read so far).<BR>
<BR>
[BTW, thanks to whoever recommended that author to me -<BR>
Dom maybe?  Great details and an excellent source of ideas -<BR>
though I'll spare you all my critique of the writing itself].<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 10:08:27 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher & Regina Otto <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Steve Daniels schrieb:<BR>
<BR>
[snip]<BR>
 <BR>
> [What happens if someone with a broad Imperial Warrant<BR>
> and a Marshall engaged in an official investigation are in<BR>
> opposition?  Irrestible force and immovable object.<BR>
> Rebellion time?]<BR>
<BR>
:-)<BR>
I'd say, the higher Warrant wins (Imperial against Archdukal etc.). If<BR>
they are of <BR>
the same level? <BR>
Well, in theory, since they are loyal servants to the Emperor, they will<BR>
come to the conclusion that one of them has a better reason for his<BR>
cause to be followed, since it is more urgent to the eyes of the Emperor<BR>
(I mean, would be if he knew). <BR>
Practically, the one who can get more assets on his side (especially<BR>
local authorities) will win. The uthorities are on the safe side anyway,<BR>
unless an abuse of the Warrant is obvious.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
Hiroshi.Estigarribia@gmx.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:27:18 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
>Subject: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
><BR>
>	I've been reading some interesting things recently about advances<BR>
>in materials science and I came up with an idea (not original I'm sure,<BR>
>but original to me) for a material that could make kinetic energy travel<BR>
>"around corners".  The image in my mind is of a guy wearing a vest of this<BR>
>stuff getting hit by a bullet: The energy of the round travels around his<BR>
>body and causes a chunk of the armor to fly out the back with equivalent<BR>
>KE to the round.<BR>
>	My question is this:  What TL is this stuff?  Not being a<BR>
>physicist or engineer I can't really get a handle on whether this is "the<BR>
>edge of tomorrow" or "indistinguishable from magic".  Opinions?<BR>
<BR>
I think it should be about TL 18-19, and draw power. By TL 22, drop the<BR>
external power source. Just an idea.<BR>
<BR>
BTW, CURRENT tech (late 8, by my estimation, BTW) allows for dynamic<BR>
materials. Some motorcycle seats, and certain other applications use<BR>
materials whose "Progressive give" is inversely proportional to energy<BR>
applied per unit time. IE, a slow and steady pressure allows it to<BR>
compress; a sudden impact (same total energy, just in much shorter time)<BR>
causes it to react as a rigid material. Several other materials exist which<BR>
change compressability with variable circumstances. Such materials would<BR>
allow spreading kinetic impacts over the whole chest, but not overly<BR>
restrict normal movements.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 04:59:12 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR>
<BR>
[snip]<BR>
<BR>
Well said.<BR>
<BR>
> Does anyone have a good answer for all this?<BR>
<BR>
Not an answer, but an approach, perhaps.  As you pointed<BR>
out, the skill inflation problem with CT began incrementally.<BR>
Advanced chargen and adding more and more careers started<BR>
to imbalance the mix.<BR>
<BR>
So start from scratch. Create a single skill-aquisition system<BR>
that applies to any and all careers.  Or a career creation system;<BR>
A method for anyone to create their own careers.  What I mean<BR>
is things like a maximum of X new skills per Y period of time.<BR>
<BR>
A big part of defining what is needed in a skill set is setting<BR>
out what default skills are available.  I think default skills<BR>
are often overlooked in these skill discussions.  These are<BR>
almost 'non-skills' because anyone can do them, so its<BR>
easy to think that any character without Ground Craft-1<BR>
on their sheet can't drive a car, or that anyone without<BR>
Brawling-2 can't win a fist fight.  Having more default skills,<BR>
decreases the need for lengthy skill lists.<BR>
<BR>
[thinking out loud here, so bear with me]<BR>
<BR>
One idea I'm playing with is General skills vs. Limited<BR>
skills.  An example:  Physical Science is a General skill,<BR>
Geology, Chemistry, Biology, Physics are Limited ones.<BR>
In chargen, only Physical Science would be listed. If you<BR>
want to take a more limited one, fine.  You'd even get<BR>
a bonus to the specialization.  But you do so at the expense<BR>
of the other limited skills (sort of as Frank suggested), though<BR>
some minor advantage might still be present, such as a skill-0<BR>
in the other limited skills (to reflect whatever cross-over of<BR>
knowledge, methodology, etc., that may exist).  So Phys<BR>
Sci-1 could be transformed into Geology-2, Rest-0.<BR>
<BR>
To take the Engineering example (assuming Engineering is<BR>
Drives, Gravitics, Power, Electronics, and Mechanics):<BR>
Engineering-1 would allow a character to take Drives-2.<BR>
Rest-0.  If Drives is a cascade, which I favor, then that<BR>
ultimately becomes: Jump Drive-2, Manuver Drive-1,<BR>
Gravitics-0, Power-0, Electronics-0, Mechanics-0.<BR>
So the character who is a competent Jump Drive Engineer<BR>
has a better chance of handling a Mechanics problem<BR>
than anyone without Mechanics, though its not a great chance.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not sure what to do if you don't take a limited skill,<BR>
but I don't want a system that mandates a character does.<BR>
Perhaps half the General Skill Level applies to all tasks<BR>
involving the Limited Skills it encompasses.  PS-2 would<BR>
be effectively the same as Geology-1, Chem-1, Bio-1, etc.<BR>
<BR>
This system would allow characters to be generalists or<BR>
specialists.  Comparing them side by side:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Generalist                Specialist<BR>
<BR>
PhySci-2<BR>
Biology-1                 Biology-3<BR>
Chemistry-1             Chemistry-0<BR>
Geology-1               Geology-0<BR>
Physics-1                 Physics-0<BR>
<BR>
SocSci-2<BR>
Archaeology-1        Archaeology-3<BR>
History-1                 History-0<BR>
Linguistics-1             Linguistics-0<BR>
Philosophy-1            Philosophy-0<BR>
Psychology-1           Psychology-0<BR>
<BR>
Engineering-2<BR>
Drives-1 (J-1, M-0)    Drives-3 (J-3, M-2)<BR>
Gravitics-1                  Gravitics-0<BR>
Power-1                     Power-0<BR>
Electronics-1               Electronics-0<BR>
Mechanics-1               Mechanics-0<BR>
<BR>
Of course, the grouping of 'General' and 'Limited' skills is<BR>
going to be important.  And some 'limited' skills will be<BR>
directly accessible.  I think the General and Limited approach<BR>
may work well were you're modelling an education or training<BR>
system, such as Eris posted recently.  Many of these skills<BR>
would be separately available in other careers, or phases<BR>
of the same career, and through direct study (such as a<BR>
hobbyist historian).<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 22:14:27 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re loan rates<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>[5] At least in general. If _you_ live on beer alone than<BR>
>>IMNSHO you have a drinking problem.<BR>
><BR>
> And probably a liver and/or kidney problem, too! ;)<BR>
<BR>
Beer/wine isn't as likely to do that as harder liquor. And in fact, in<BR>
many areas and periods beer (mostly "small beer") was what *everyone*<BR>
drank. Because the brewing process killed things in the water that made<BR>
it unsafe to drink.<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: keep the above in mind on low TL worlds. Sure, there are other<BR>
ways to purify the water, but frankly, small beer (what we call "near<BR>
beer") tastes better, and actually is a source of several vitamins<BR>
(B-complex as I recall).<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 22:21:07 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re loan rates<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 12:20 PM 4/14/00 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
>> >[1] Assuming the Imeprium has a 12 month year which book 2,<BR>
>> >by equating 480 payments to 40 years does.<BR>
>><BR>
>>Starship loans appear to be paid 12 of the 13 months of the imperial<BR>
>>calendar each year. This is implied (but not explicit) in The Traveller<BR>
>>Adventure. You apparently get an automatic 1 month deferrment without<BR>
>>interest.<BR>
> I believe the Imperial calendar came out long after book 2 (?) which set <BR>
> the 12 month year.  When someone was devising the calendar, with its <BR>
> sequentially numbered dates, the easiest breakdown was to go with a 13 <BR>
> month year, each of 4 weeks.  They probably didn't even think about the <BR>
> starship financing listing a year as 12 months.<BR>
<BR>
It's *possible* to do a 12 month year that otherwise conforms to<BR>
Traveller canon. Use the "World Calendar" (the "proper" Traveller<BR>
calendar is the "International Calendar"):<BR>
<BR>
                               THE WORLD CALENDAR<BR>
                          (Symmetrical and Invariable)<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
  |                             First Quarter                              |<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
  | January               |  February              |  March                |<BR>
  |  s  m  t  w  t  f  s  |   s  m  t  w  t  f  s  |   s  m  t  w  t  f  s |<BR>
  |  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  |            1  2  3  4  |                  1  2 |<BR>
  |  8  9 10 11 12 13 14  |   5  6  7  8  9 10 11  |   3  4  5  6  7  8  9 |<BR>
  | 15 16 17 18 19 20 21  |  12 13 14 15 16 17 18  |  10 11 12 13 14 15 16 |<BR>
  | 22 23 24 25 26 27 28  |  19 20 21 22 23 24 25  |  17 18 19 20 21 22 23 |<BR>
  | 29 30 31              |  26 27 28 29 30        |  24 25 26 27 28 29 30 |<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
  |                             Second Quarter                             |<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
  | April                 |  May                   |  June                 |<BR>
  |  s  m  t  w  t  f  s  |   s  m  t  w  t  f  s  |   s  m  t  w  t  f  s |<BR>
  |  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  |            1  2  3  4  |                  1  2 |<BR>
  |  8  9 10 11 12 13 14  |   5  6  7  8  9 10 11  |   3  4  5  6  7  8  9 |<BR>
  | 15 16 17 18 19 20 21  |  12 13 14 15 16 17 18  |  10 11 12 13 14 15 16 |<BR>
  | 22 23 24 25 26 27 28  |  19 20 21 22 23 24 25  |  17 18 19 20 21 22 23 |<BR>
  | 29 30 31              |  26 27 28 29 30        |  24 25 26 27 28 29 30 |<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
  |                               Leap Day*                                |<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
  |                             Third Quarter                              |<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
  | July                  |  August                |  September            |<BR>
  |  s  m  t  w  t  f  s  |   s  m  t  w  t  f  s  |   s  m  t  w  t  f  s |<BR>
  |  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  |            1  2  3  4  |                  1  2 |<BR>
  |  8  9 10 11 12 13 14  |   5  6  7  8  9 10 11  |   3  4  5  6  7  8  9 |<BR>
  | 15 16 17 18 19 20 21  |  12 13 14 15 16 17 18  |  10 11 12 13 14 15 16 |<BR>
  | 22 23 24 25 26 27 28  |  19 20 21 22 23 24 25  |  17 18 19 20 21 22 23 |<BR>
  | 29 30 31              |  26 27 28 29 30        |  24 25 26 27 28 29 30 |<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
  |                             Fourth Quarter                             |<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
  | October               |  November              |  December             |<BR>
  |  s  m  t  w  t  f  s  |   s  m  t  w  t  f  s  |   s  m  t  w  t  f  s |<BR>
  |  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  |            1  2  3  4  |                  1  2 |<BR>
  |  8  9 10 11 12 13 14  |   5  6  7  8  9 10 11  |   3  4  5  6  7  8  9 |<BR>
  | 15 16 17 18 19 20 21  |  12 13 14 15 16 17 18  |  10 11 12 13 14 15 16 |<BR>
  | 22 23 24 25 26 27 28  |  19 20 21 22 23 24 25  |  17 18 19 20 21 22 23 |<BR>
  | 29 30 31              |  26 27 28 29 30        |  24 25 26 27 28 29 30 |<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
  |                               Worldsday**                              |<BR>
  +------------------------------------------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
      * The Leap-Year World Holiday (366th day), falls outside the week.<BR>
      ** The Year-End World Holiday (365th day), falls outside the week.<BR>
<BR>
Note that each quarter has days laid out exactly the same.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:27:04 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: Ground Penetrating Radar and other toys<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Seismic:  There are several existing techniques that might be of help but<BR>
> they generally require more than one vehicle and the layout of lines of<BR>
> phones to record the signal.<BR>
<BR>
Any thoughts on how the ability to set of precisely calibrated and<BR>
positioned subsurface explosions via use of a small meson gun might<BR>
help with seismic surveys?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:31:33 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk> wrote<BR>
><BR>
>> We have misjumped <BR>
>> Our m-drive is not functional, and we have insufficient fuel remaining to<BR>
>> jump, though we do have a little left. <BR>
>> One of the options we are considering is using the remaining fuel as<BR>
>> reaction mass in an Ion drive,<BR>
><BR>
> You may want to consider using part of the ships atmosphere<BR>
> as well. If you reduce the ships air pressure and/or<BR>
> reduce part of the ship to vacuum you will be able to use<BR>
> the air as fuel. OTOH your trip may well end up being long<BR>
> enough that this is a bad idea.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, most ion drives seem to do better with *metal* ions. And they<BR>
don't use huge amounts of fuel anyway. But keep in mind that you can<BR>
ionize metal vapor (just requires a slightly higher temp), so you can<BR>
strip out unneeded partitions in the ship also.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 23:35:21 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> This is regarding a post I've just made to a GT PBeM I'm in (see below)<BR>
><BR>
> I'd just like to run it past some of you to double check my figures... I<BR>
> *think* I've got it pretty well clear in my mind, but it is always worth<BR>
> checking.<BR>
><BR>
> A precis of the situation:<BR>
><BR>
> We have misjumped after a missile hit while escaping a planet being attacked<BR>
> by Vargr.<BR>
><BR>
> Our m-drive is not functional, and we have insufficient fuel remaining to<BR>
> jump, though we do have a little left.  We emerged from jump at the 100D<BR>
> limit of an unstable star (Nirton/Spinward Marches)<BR>
><BR>
> We have picked up a distress signal from another ship, and are going to try<BR>
> and rendezvous. It is 5 days away at 0.1G.<BR>
><BR>
> One of the options we are considering is using the remaining fuel as<BR>
> reaction mass in an Ion drive, mainly my Idea...<BR>
><BR>
> Other proposals that have been considered and discarded were fastening<BR>
> missiles to the hull to use as thrusters, and manufacturing a Solar Sail.<BR>
><BR>
> The formulae I've used to calculate my figures (using Excel 97) are:<BR>
><BR>
> Distance in metres= (Initial Closing Speed=0) + 0.5*(9.81*G's)*((0.5*Time in<BR>
> seconds)^2)<BR>
><BR>
> This gets distance covered during constant acceleration for half the time.<BR>
> The total distance is twice this, ie same distance travelled to decelerate.<BR>
><BR>
> From this, I used:<BR>
><BR>
> Mass of Ship(kg)*(G's*9.81m/s^2)*Total Distance(m) = 0.5*Reaction<BR>
> Mass(kg)*(Exhaust Velocity(m/s))^2<BR>
><BR>
> ie maD=1/2mv^2<BR>
><BR>
> ie Newtonmeters=Joules<BR>
<BR>
The formula you want is:<BR>
<BR>
dV = Isp * ln(Mi/Mf)<BR>
dV = change of velocity<BR>
Isp = specific impulse<BR>
Mi = initial mass (ship plus fuel)<BR>
Mf = final mass (ship plus remaining fuel)<BR>
<BR>
Alas, getting a distance formula from this requires calculus...<BR>
<BR>
Isp = Ve * 9.81<BR>
Isp = thrust/((fuel flow rate)*9.81)<BR>
<BR>
Ve = exhaust velocity<BR>
<BR>
BTW, you'll be lucky to get 0.01 g with an ion drive. On the other<BR>
hand, you won't need a lot of fuel.<BR>
<BR>
Also, as pointed out in another message, you may want to use some<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:14:27 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
>> <BR>
>> b) that my handwave of exhaust velocity from an ion drive is proportional <BR>
> to<BR>
>> the power applied. i.e. if currently 2kW can produce a 20km/s exhaust<BR>
>> velocity, could 45MW produce an exhaust velocity of 3000km/s (0.01c).  With<BR>
>> exhaust velocities of this order of magnitude, we need only a few tons of<BR>
>> reaction mass to rendezvous in a reasonable amount of time...<BR>
><BR>
>         Generally correct, but I believe that there is a limit in this<BR>
> direction for ion drives. Ion drives operate by (obviously) converting<BR>
> atoms into ions, which are then repelled from each other, and thus<BR>
> expand away from the ship, producing thrust in accordance with the<BR>
> conservation of momentum.<BR>
<BR>
Nope. The repulsion of the ions for each other has no part in the thrust.<BR>
<BR>
> The problems (limits) come when you consider<BR>
> trying to make the charged particles go in the right direction (that is<BR>
> directly opposite your intended course). The more energy you put in, the<BR>
> more you charge the reaction mass (that much works), but unfortunately,<BR>
> the more charged it is, the more of it will tend to disperse to the side<BR>
> instead of straight back (thus producing no net thrust).<BR>
<BR>
The limit in charging is that an ion is an atom with electron's<BR>
stripped from it. And there are only so many you can strip. <BR>
<BR>
In actuality, ion drives don't bother stripping more than 1 electron<BR>
from the atom. That gives the ion a useful charge. The thrust comes<BR>
from using electical fields to accelerate the ions (usually a grid with<BR>
the opposite charge. The ions are attracted to the grid, but most miss<BR>
the wires and are going too fast to ever "fall back". <BR>
<BR>
The limits on an ion drive are due to the limits on the charge of the<BR>
grid and the distance between the ion emitter and the grid. <BR>
<BR>
As you've no doubt grasped by now, an ion drive is simply a single<BR>
stage particle accelerator. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2315<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2316</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	4/16/00 11:01:34 AM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Sunday, April 16 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2316<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
TML Landgrab - Ficant 1<BR>
Re: Lawyer Stuff Help<BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 1 of 3]<BR>
Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
OT: a little subtle humor and a Tall Tale<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Marshals (was Lawyer stuff help)<BR>
AD&D D&D<BR>
Re: Prilissa<BR>
Re: Sonic Booms<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:59:26 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>         I was discussing sonic booms with some friends recently and came<BR>
> across the fact that the space shuttle makes a double sonic boom as it<BR>
> enters the atmosphere.  That is, there are two booms about .5 secs apart.<BR>
> It seems that all objects going supersonic produce such a double boom, one<BR>
> originating fore and the other aft.  But most craft are small enough that<BR>
> these are heard as one sound.  The shuttle, about 40 meters long, is just<BR>
> big enough for you to distinguish between the two booms.<BR>
<BR>
It's also a matter of being *close* enough to hear them. The farther<BR>
away you are the more diffuse the shock cones are, and that means<BR>
they'll blend together if you are far enough away.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 01:07:49 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>         I read recently about some folks who designed a "Babbage printer".<BR>
> It seems that as well as designing the famous "Difference Engine" Babbage<BR>
> also designed a printer for the thing.  It weighs about 2.5 tons, but it<BR>
> works.<BR>
>         So this got me thinking: Just how powerful could you make a<BR>
> mechanical computer?  What are the practical limiting factors?  The image<BR>
> in my mind is of PCs coming across a long-lost metal-poor colony which has<BR>
> been getting along at industrial levels using entirely wooden computers of<BR>
> immense size.<BR>
<BR>
Not likely. The reason Babbage had so much trouble was that his designs<BR>
required higher precision machining than was available at the time. You<BR>
*won't* get the required accuracy with wood.<BR>
<BR>
Remember, since this is gear driven, the more "slop" there is, the<BR>
farther "out of line" things get after a few sets of gears. With metal,<BR>
you can keep the "slop" down to a small fraction of a tooth. With wood,<BR>
you'd be off by a tooth or more after only a few gears in series.<BR>
<BR>
Also, the teeth are exerting fairly large amounts of force. Wood will<BR>
splinter badly.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 00:25:34 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization atthe Imperial<BR>
> level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and need the following translated<BR>
> into legalese:<BR>
><BR>
> When the Marshal is investigating an Imperial crime, do whatever he says or<BR>
> your ass is toast.<BR>
<BR>
"Hello, I'm Judge Dredd."<BR>
<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 05:25:59 -0500<BR>
From: Alex Ingram <ingram@airmail.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
>  I split medical into 7 different catagories and this seemed to work out<BR>
> okay.<BR>
<BR>
  Michael,<BR>
<BR>
Explain please about Medical?<BR>
<BR>
Alex<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 05:32:47 -0500<BR>
From: Alex Ingram <ingram@airmail.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
- --------------C3B06FDEFF403AEBB913C93B<BR>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii<BR>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR>
<BR>
> Eris states:<BR>
<BR>
> Now let's say our average PC has 15 skills from a set of around 100.<BR>
> He must be earning 4 or 5 levels per term, say 30 levels in the 6<BR>
> term career.  Now it becomes possible to produce a PC with most of<BR>
> the skills at 1 or 2, easily having a few at 3 or 4...and here's the<BR>
> *rub*....you might start running into skills at 6, 7, 8 or more!<BR>
> This means mastery becomes more common, or tasks must become harder,<BR>
> and when *any* Attribute level gets added to the mix the need to<BR>
> reblance skill levels and task difficulties just gets greater.<BR>
<BR>
Couldn't I make a decision to limit the max skill level at 5 to prevent this<BR>
imbalance?<BR>
<BR>
Alex<BR>
<BR>
- --------------C3B06FDEFF403AEBB913C93B<BR>
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii<BR>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>Eris states:</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE><I>Now let's say our average PC has 15 skills from<BR>
a set of around 100.</I><BR>
<BR>
<I>He must be earning 4 or 5 levels per term, say 30 levels in the6</I><BR>
<I>term career.&nbsp; Now it becomes possible to produce a PC withmost of</I><BR>
<I>the skills at 1 or 2, easily having a few at 3 or 4...and here'sthe</I><BR>
<I>*rub*....you might start running into skills at 6, 7, 8 or more!</I><BR>
<I>This means mastery becomes more common, or tasks must become harder,</I><BR>
<I>and when *any* Attribute level gets added to the mix the need to</I><BR>
<I>reblance skill levels and task difficulties just gets greater.</I></BLOCKQUOTE>Couldn't I make a decision to limit the max skill level at 5 to preventthis imbalance?<BR>
Alex<BR>
<BR>
- --------------C3B06FDEFF403AEBB913C93B--<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 12:05:40 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
Hi all,<BR>
<BR>
Last night, I went to see 'Mission to Mars' with one of my RPG <BR>
friends as it had finally reached the UK. Besides from feeling that <BR>
the film was very much a clone of 2001, mixed with 2010 and a dash of <BR>
Contact and the Abyss, seasoned with Top Gun and sprinkled liberally <BR>
with enough cheesy dialogue and scenes to make a fondue, I actually <BR>
enjoyed it. I'd gone in expecting that the dialogue would be bad so <BR>
that didn't matter, and the film trundled along okay. I've seen a lot <BR>
worse Sci-Fi.<BR>
<BR>
Anyway, my question - I assume that the micro-meteorite scene <BR>
wouldn't be that viable for a Third Imperium situation as the <BR>
coherent superdense armour would just bounce them off? I vaguely <BR>
recall this being discussed but ignored it at the time to miss as <BR>
many spoilers as possible...<BR>
<BR>
Second question - what was the other, similar, film you folks <BR>
mentioned just after it?<BR>
<BR>
Cheers,<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 13:26:24 +0100<BR>
From: "MJ Dougherty" <martinjd@globalnet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
It's around Easter time, and some thoughts just struck me.<BR>
<BR>
17 years ago (at Easter) I met up with a new bunch of gamers. My previous<BR>
group - the first guys I gamed with - had disintegrated messily. We gamed<BR>
for several years before all going off to university.<BR>
<BR>
Sitting down and thinking about what happened to them, I find myself<BR>
wondering what happened to us.<BR>
And if this sort of thing is typical:<BR>
<BR>
Me: Writer<BR>
K: Archeologist<BR>
P: Works for a minatures company<BR>
MJ: Movie momorabilia expert<BR>
S: Computer game animator<BR>
B: Admiral in Startrek society<BR>
MW: Analyst/Programmer<BR>
<BR>
S and MJ are back in my circle of gamers, after much strangeness and many<BR>
adventures.<BR>
<BR>
I wonder... how many of the people you gamed with went on to have unusual<BR>
careers? How many just couldn't escape and became game industry<BR>
professionals.<BR>
<BR>
OBTrav (thinner than usual): Player characters are drawn from an<BR>
out-of-the-ordinary segment of the populace. How many of us are potential<BR>
PCs?<BR>
<BR>
MJD<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 01:29:58 +1200<BR>
From: a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz<BR>
Subject: TML Landgrab - Ficant 1<BR>
<BR>
Ficant 1417/Vilis E567353-5 Lo NiN 910 M0V MD<BR>
<BR>
System Details<BR>
Age: 2 Billion years<BR>
Primary: Netali M0V<BR>
Companion: Netali Bis Dwarf M orbiting at 10 AU (10% eccentricity)<BR>
0.35 AU: Terrestrial world - Ficant<BR>
0.75 AU: Terrestrial world - Netali II<BR>
1.15 AU: Terrestrial world - Netali III<BR>
1.95 AU: Terrestrial world - Netali IV<BR>
3.35  AU: Planetiod Belt<BR>
<BR>
World Details - Ficant<BR>
Moons: Nil<BR>
Orbital Eccentricity: 0.02<BR>
Diameter: 8,402 km (5,222 mls)<BR>
Density: 5.1g/cucm<BR>
Mass: 0.264 Earth<BR>
Gravity: 0.609g (5.97m/s/s)<BR>
Orbital Period: 106.954 Std days (35.651 local days)<BR>
Sidereal Day: 70.036 Standard hours<BR>
Local Day: 72.000 Standard hours<BR>
Axial Tilt: 5<BR>
Atmospheric Pressure: 1.1 Earth<BR>
Atmospheric Gasses: Nitrogen 76.5% Oxygen 22.7% Other 0.7%<BR>
Hydrosphere: 69%<BR>
Albedo: 0.250<BR>
Greenhouse Factor: 0.295<BR>
Temperature at 40: 5.277 C (41.169 F)<BR>
Temperature at Equator: 10.499 C (50.569 F)<BR>
Temperature at Poles: -43.026 C (-45.777 F)<BR>
Local Ecosystem: Simple Animals, compatible with Earth norm<BR>
Resources: Average (very poor in hydrocarbons)<BR>
<BR>
Ficant is a quiet border world on the frontier between the Imperium and the <BR>
Sword Worlds. The most remarkable thing about the system is that it is <BR>
only 2 billion years old. It is this fact that has prevented it from become <BR>
tidally locked to its primary. However it is expected that it will become <BR>
tidally locked within the next 500 million years, at which point its <BR>
atmospheres volatiles will freeze out on the night side and the planet will <BR>
die.<BR>
<BR>
Despite this, the world has evolved a thriving ecosystem with a wide range <BR>
of primitive flora and fauna (very roughly equivalent to Earths early <BR>
Carboniferous period) and is of considerable interest to biologists. As might <BR>
be expected, life on Ficant originated in the seas and they posses an rich <BR>
variety of life forms. However, the "invasion" of the land has only just begun <BR>
and Ficant has very few native land animals other than invertebrates. Most <BR>
of the planets landmass is covered with massive "forests" of tree sized <BR>
spore propagating plants (similar to terrestrial club-mosses, ferns and <BR>
horsetails). It is expected that the worlds combination of low gravity and <BR>
high atmospheric pressure will lead to the evolution of a wide variety of ariel <BR>
life, but as yet only a few species have taken to the air (mostly <BR>
invertebrates). This combination of low gravity and high pressure has also <BR>
lead to the evolution of triphibian animals.<BR>
<BR>
Physically the world is divided into five separate continents. Human <BR>
colonisation has been limited to one of the smaller continents straddling <BR>
the equator. The first human settlers are thought to have arrived around <BR>
450. It is not known were these settlers came from, as no records of any <BR>
organised colonisation effort have been found. This form of disorganised <BR>
settlement continued for the next 150 years and by 600 the population had <BR>
grown to around 1,000. It was during the First Frontier War that the world <BR>
first came to official notice. At this time a substantial proportion of the <BR>
population were of Sword Worlds decent and Imperial forces came to <BR>
regard it as a potential security threat. In response Grand Admiral <BR>
Plankwell ordered the annexation of Ficant and the world was absorbed in <BR>
596. With its annexation an official colonisation program was envisaged <BR>
and in 602 1,500 Imperial colonists arrived. It was intended that these were <BR>
to be just the first wave of an intensive colonisation program, but with the <BR>
outbreak of the Civil War this program was abandoned and no further official<BR>
colonisation was to ever take place. From this point onwards, Ficant <BR>
lapsed back into obscurity. Despite this official apathy, Ficants population <BR>
has continued to grow slowly and according to the census of 1120, it has a <BR>
population of 9,250.<BR>
<BR>
Even with less than 10,000 human inhabitants, settlement has had a <BR>
significant affect on the world. With human settlement came numerous off-<BR>
world plants and animals, most far more "advanced" than native life. These <BR>
imported species are rapidly replacing native species on the settled <BR>
continent, fundamentally changing the ecosystem. As yet, these imports <BR>
have not spread beyond this single continent, but a number of biologists <BR>
are concerned with the possibility of an ecological disaster if they do.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 14:58:13 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Wright" <nick@corlecca.freeserve.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer Stuff Help<BR>
<BR>
Douglas wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization atthe Imperial<BR>
>level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and need the following translated<BR>
>into legalese:<BR>
><BR>
>When the Marshal is investigating an Imperial crime, do whatever he says or<BR>
>your ass is toast.<BR>
<BR>
Here is my go based on two Earth documents<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I the Lord High Marshal of the Imperium<BR>
pursuant to the powers in that behalf vested<BR>
in me do hereby appoint<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Ebenezer Berry<BR>
<BR>
to be and officer of the Imperial Marshals Service<BR>
with full power and authority to do and perform<BR>
all such matters and things as are by any Imperial<BR>
Edict in force relating to the Imperial Court Service<BR>
or any other matter assigned to the Imperial<BR>
Marshal Service and hereby request and require<BR>
all and every member of the Imperial armed forces<BR>
or Scout Service and all others to aid and assist<BR>
the said<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Ebenezer Berry<BR>
<BR>
in all things and observe and obey all such orders,<BR>
instructions and directions as he may make<BR>
concerning any matter from time to time assigned<BR>
to the Imperial Marshal Service.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
There are no prizes, not even blue penguins, for guessing which two Earth<BR>
documents have been used.<BR>
<BR>
I remain etc, etc.<BR>
<BR>
Nick Wright<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 10:52:30 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
<BR>
In the novel difference engine by William Gibson and Bruce Sterling....There <BR>
are huge British Government databases powered by warehouse size engines that <BR>
hold vast amounts of information on the population of Britian and parts of <BR>
the world...Sort of like a steampunk version of the computers that the FBI <BR>
and IRS have now :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 08:47:29<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
<BR>
At 07:36 PM 4/15/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>In message <38F2CD79.109EBC34@gci.net>, Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
>writes<BR>
>><BR>
>>I suggest sort of a Traveller Canon Miranda warning:<BR>
>><BR>
>As opposed to a Traveller Carmen Miranda warning:<BR>
><BR>
>"You have the right to wear fruit - if your planet cannot afford a<BR>
>farming industry one will be provided for you."<BR>
<BR>
"Carmen's Miranda's ghost is haunting space station 3..."<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 08:52:16<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
At 10:42 PM 4/15/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Hmm. An early White Dwarf (well, Issue 70 Oct 1985) had an article on <BR>
>Bounty Hunters (Dead or Alive by Diane and Richard John p26-27) in <BR>
>it, and gave them a limited Imperial Warrent (Edict 97) to pursue <BR>
>those wanted by Imperial Authorities.  This would have the above <BR>
>effect.<BR>
><BR>
>It also had a cool version of the Type S - the type H Hunter - which <BR>
>would be a good ship to use for such characters. Do you want a copy <BR>
>of this?<BR>
<BR>
That would be very useful, yes.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 08:53:39<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
At 03:33 AM 4/16/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>[What happens if someone with a broad Imperial Warrant<BR>
>and a Marshall engaged in an official investigation are in<BR>
>opposition?  Irrestible force and immovable object.<BR>
>Rebellion time?]<BR>
<BR>
No, excellent adventure fodder!  (scribble, scribble, scribble..)<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 08:58:40<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: TML Landgrab: Prilissa [part 1 of 3]<BR>
<BR>
At 11:33 PM 4/15/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>Well, my wife Alison is showing the first signs of labour, so I don't<BR>
>expect I'll have much time for email over the next few days (weeks?).<BR>
<BR>
Months.<BR>
<BR>
Good job, now stop developing worlds and go devolp a kid!<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:31:08 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
I've just got a copy of Pohl's 'Gateway' ( a book that I had read <BR>
about 15 years ago ), and was wondering if anyone can explain how the <BR>
maneuver they pulled with the two ships to escape the singularity <BR>
worked in layman's terms. (I'm being cagey here as I enjoyed the book <BR>
and don't want to ruin it for anyone).<BR>
<BR>
Cheers,<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 11:41:41 -0500<BR>
From: "Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net><BR>
Subject: OT: a little subtle humor and a Tall Tale<BR>
<BR>
You can blame Jeff Zeitlin for suggesting I post this to the list<BR>
<BR>
this is a fairy tale, not a space story:<BR>
<BR>
Once upon a time there was a dragon...<BR>
he was your typical dragon, with your typical dragons diet<BR>
of fair maidens, knights and squires.... livestock..<BR>
Except once a month he ate a bard for lunch<BR>
<BR>
Now this monthly snack gave him no end of distress and <BR>
unsettledness...<BR>
and he couldnt figure out why, but it was his favorite treat<BR>
[He must have been a music critic]<BR>
and he wasnt willing to give it up.<BR>
<BR>
finally after several months of this, he waylays a high level<BR>
cleric to help cure him of this terrible illness...<BR>
the Cleric does some research and casts some spells<BR>
and comes back from town dragging a half barrel of Mydol<BR>
and he then tells the dragon "I have bad news"<BR>
"you can either quit your monthly snack, or you can eat this barrel<BR>
of pills, and that wont even cure the problem"<BR>
The Dragon Roars "Why NOT!!!!!"<BR>
to which the cleric replies "Because theres no known cure for <BR>
Minstrel Cramps"<BR>
<BR>
Shadowcat immediately dives for cover <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 10:02:03 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
Frighteningly,  I am still gaming with the same people I introduced to<BR>
Traveller 20 years ago, Despite moving to another state. Sure, a few of the<BR>
fringe players are gone, but the core remains.<BR>
<BR>
Demographics:<BR>
<BR>
ME: Computer Consultant<BR>
C:  ATF agent, My wife<BR>
J:  Respiratory Therapist<BR>
R:  Admin Asst<BR>
<BR>
Lost from the group:<BR>
<BR>
P:  Book and game seller<BR>
JW: Software engineer<BR>
<BR>
what does it all mean?<BR>
<BR>
> It's around Easter time, and some thoughts just struck me.<BR>
> <BR>
> 17 years ago (at Easter) I met up with a new bunch of gamers. My previous<BR>
> group - the first guys I gamed with - had disintegrated messily. We gamed<BR>
> for several years before all going off to university.<BR>
> <BR>
> Sitting down and thinking about what happened to them, I find myself<BR>
> wondering what happened to us.<BR>
> And if this sort of thing is typical:<BR>
> <BR>
> Me: Writer<BR>
> K: Archeologist<BR>
> P: Works for a minatures company<BR>
> MJ: Movie momorabilia expert<BR>
> S: Computer game animator<BR>
> B: Admiral in Startrek society<BR>
> MW: Analyst/Programmer<BR>
> <BR>
> S and MJ are back in my circle of gamers, after much strangeness and many<BR>
> adventures.<BR>
> <BR>
> I wonder... how many of the people you gamed with went on to have unusual<BR>
> careers? How many just couldn't escape and became game industry<BR>
> professionals.<BR>
> <BR>
> OBTrav (thinner than usual): Player characters are drawn from an<BR>
> out-of-the-ordinary segment of the populace. How many of us are potential<BR>
> PCs?<BR>
> <BR>
> MJD<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 10:28:17 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Marshals (was Lawyer stuff help)<BR>
<BR>
Here is an example of the text from a federal agent's credentials that might<BR>
make a good starting point for your Imperial Marshals.<BR>
<BR>
This is from an ATF ID, but you get the idea.<BR>
<BR>
UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY<BR>
This is to certify that]<BR>
[Name]<BR>
Whose signature and photograph appear below is duly assigned as<BR>
Senior Special Agent<BR>
in the<BR>
Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms<BR>
And is authorized to carry firearms, execute warrants,<BR>
and make arrests for offenses against the United States and to perform other<BR>
such duties as authorized by law.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"It takes a child to raze a village."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 13:31:07 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: AD&D D&D<BR>
<BR>
Frank G. Pitt writes:<BR>
<BR>
> > >The 1st ed. Monster Manual also contained Elric mythos stuff, at<BR>
>  > that time<BR>
>  > >licensed to Chaosium, which was also removed in later editions.<BR>
>  > No, it was the first edition of Dieties & Demigods that had both the<BR>
>  > Melnibonean and Cthulu mythos.<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Yeah, sorry, I knew that, typed "Monster Manual" instead of  "Dieties &<BR>
>  Demigods".<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Probably because that's how I think of "Dieties & Demigods", a "monster<BR>
>  manual".<BR>
>  <grin><BR>
>  <BR>
That's how a lot of DMs used it. How many AD&D groups do _you_ know that have <BR>
killed Odin, Thor, Mars and Yuan Ti? Before I joined, the group I used to <BR>
play with finally got a DM that realized that on a god's own turf the god was <BR>
invincible; before that they had worked about a quarter of the way through <BR>
the book. After I joined, they weren't much better. Reminded me a _great_ <BR>
deal of the Knights of the Dinner Table. It was one of the reasons I gave up <BR>
on AD&D for about three years. I found Traveller instead, so no complaints. :)<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 13:34:53 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Prilissa<BR>
<BR>
John Wood writes:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm posting what I've done on Prilissa so far to my website:<BR>
>  <BR>
>          http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/Prilissa.html<BR>
>  <BR>
>  or, for those of you who prefer black on white:<BR>
>  <BR>
>          http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/PrilissaWhite.html<BR>
>  <BR>
>  It's got a couple of maps up already - topology (in two sizes) and<BR>
>  system - so it's probably worth reading that version.<BR>
>  <BR>
Very nice work-up, I hope you get the time to complete it, but given that a <BR>
baby is due in the household, I doubt it. :)<BR>
<BR>
BTW, what did you use to make the planetary map? It's beautiful!<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 13:51:18 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
Charles C. writes:<BR>
<BR>
>   Now picture this:  Some PCs are on a planet surface in potentially<BR>
>  hostile territory.  They see the glint of something entering the<BR>
>  atmosphere and hear "BOOM... [3 seconds pass] ...BOOM".  Whoops, time to<BR>
>  duck and cover! :-)<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
"It's the'MONTANA!"<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 12:53:16 -0500<BR>
From: "Thomas Vickers" <redroach@flex.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
My core group is still together also after nearly 20 years.<BR>
Me: History Teacher<BR>
V: Lawyer<BR>
J. Computer Sales<BR>
D. Computer Sales<BR>
M. Programmer<BR>
T. Programmer<BR>
S. History Professor<BR>
R. ESL teacher<BR>
D2: Engineer for Motorola<BR>
<BR>
Pretty boring bunch really.<BR>
<BR>
TV<BR>
- ------------------------<BR>
"Never apologize, never explain."<BR>
                           Hunter S. Thompson<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Tod Glenn" <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2000 12:02 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Frighteningly,  I am still gaming with the same people I introduced to<BR>
> Traveller 20 years ago, Despite moving to another state. Sure, a few of<BR>
the<BR>
> fringe players are gone, but the core remains.<BR>
><BR>
> Demographics:<BR>
><BR>
> ME: Computer Consultant<BR>
> C:  ATF agent, My wife<BR>
> J:  Respiratory Therapist<BR>
> R:  Admin Asst<BR>
><BR>
> Lost from the group:<BR>
><BR>
> P:  Book and game seller<BR>
> JW: Software engineer<BR>
><BR>
> what does it all mean?<BR>
><BR>
> > It's around Easter time, and some thoughts just struck me.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > 17 years ago (at Easter) I met up with a new bunch of gamers. My<BR>
previous<BR>
> > group - the first guys I gamed with - had disintegrated messily. We<BR>
gamed<BR>
> > for several years before all going off to university.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Sitting down and thinking about what happened to them, I find myself<BR>
> > wondering what happened to us.<BR>
> > And if this sort of thing is typical:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Me: Writer<BR>
> > K: Archeologist<BR>
> > P: Works for a minatures company<BR>
> > MJ: Movie momorabilia expert<BR>
> > S: Computer game animator<BR>
> > B: Admiral in Startrek society<BR>
> > MW: Analyst/Programmer<BR>
> ><BR>
> > S and MJ are back in my circle of gamers, after much strangeness and<BR>
many<BR>
> > adventures.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > I wonder... how many of the people you gamed with went on to have<BR>
unusual<BR>
> > careers? How many just couldn't escape and became game industry<BR>
> > professionals.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > OBTrav (thinner than usual): Player characters are drawn from an<BR>
> > out-of-the-ordinary segment of the populace. How many of us are<BR>
potential<BR>
> > PCs?<BR>
> ><BR>
> > MJD<BR>
> ><BR>
> ><BR>
> ><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2316<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Monday, April 17 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2317<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Lawyer Stuff Help<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
RE: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 14:05:51 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
Charles Collin writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Actually, that brings up another question:  What would alternate uses of<BR>
>  this technology be?  I have a vague sense that it would have lots of<BR>
>  engineering uses but can't think of any specific examples off the top of<BR>
>  my head.<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
The first thing that comes to mind is satellite and spacecraft micrometeorite <BR>
protection, although on further thought it would be trading one fragment <BR>
flying around in orbit for many. Still, it would definitely be useful for <BR>
scout craft and survey satellites used in new territory where all the junk in <BR>
orbit, either natural or artificial, hasn't been catalogued. It would keep <BR>
that multimillion credit satellite running long enough to do it's job. It <BR>
would also be useful against non-energy based antisatellite weapons <BR>
("marblethrowers" or "shotgun" anti-sat weapons). <BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 14:19:35 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/16/00 1:01:23 PM Central Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> I've just got a copy of Pohl's 'Gateway' ( a book that I had read <BR>
>  about 15 years ago ), and was wondering if anyone can explain how the <BR>
>  maneuver they pulled with the two ships to escape the singularity <BR>
>  worked in layman's terms. (I'm being cagey here as I enjoyed the book <BR>
>  and don't want to ruin it for anyone).<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Cheers,<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Dom<BR>
<BR>
"For every action, there is an equal but opposite reaction." See also, <BR>
"Recoil."<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 12:28:09 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/15/00 11:14 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> ObTrav: keep the above in mind on low TL worlds. Sure, there are other<BR>
> ways to purify the water, but frankly, small beer (what we call "near<BR>
> beer") tastes better, and actually is a source of several vitamins<BR>
> (B-complex as I recall).<BR>
<BR>
Beer has vitamins? Or just small beer? BTW, the statement was "live on beer<BR>
/alone/", presumably nothing else allowed. You can't live on B-complex<BR>
alone. ;) I wonder what the degree of variation in nutritional value in beer<BR>
would be. Or wine for that matter.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 20:54:03 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
At 13:57 -0400 16/4/00, "Thomas Vickers" <redroach@flex.net> wrote:<BR>
>My core group is still together also after nearly 20 years.<BR>
<BR>
Mine has blown to the winds following our heading to university. I <BR>
have only got contact with one -<BR>
<BR>
Me: Project Engineer for Unilever (real), BITS person (otherwise)<BR>
M: Accountant, very rarely plays.<BR>
<BR>
My current group (last 5 years) is:<BR>
<BR>
R: IT systems<BR>
A: Admin assistant<BR>
A2: Push Cycle Shop Owner<BR>
C: Admin Assistant<BR>
C2: Marketing<BR>
K: Finance for Petrochemical company<BR>
K2: Science Teacher<BR>
S: Student (Ex Masquerade coordinator for region)<BR>
S2: Admin<BR>
D: IT support<BR>
<BR>
4 of the group are female.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 16:53:51 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 03:33 AM 4/16/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> >[What happens if someone with a broad Imperial Warrant<BR>
> >and a Marshall engaged in an official investigation are in<BR>
> >opposition?  Irrestible force and immovable object.<BR>
> >Rebellion time?]<BR>
><BR>
> No, excellent adventure fodder!  (scribble, scribble, scribble..)<BR>
<BR>
Well, I see the easy way out now:  the Warrant, having<BR>
no limitation except Strephon, cancels the investigation,<BR>
without which the Marshall is just a bureaucrat.<BR>
<BR>
But that would be too neat.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 16:56:35 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/15/00 11:14 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
> forth:<BR>
><BR>
> > ObTrav: keep the above in mind on low TL worlds. Sure, there are other<BR>
> > ways to purify the water, but frankly, small beer (what we call "near<BR>
> > beer") tastes better, and actually is a source of several vitamins<BR>
> > (B-complex as I recall).<BR>
><BR>
> Beer has vitamins? Or just small beer? BTW, the statement was "live on beer<BR>
> /alone/", presumably nothing else allowed. You can't live on B-complex<BR>
> alone. ;) I wonder what the degree of variation in nutritional value in beer<BR>
> would be. Or wine for that matter.<BR>
<BR>
The President of Guinness-Bass was on Fox News on St. Patty's day.<BR>
He actually said that Guinness is the single best thing a nursing mother<BR>
can drink because of all the iron, vitamins and minerals.<BR>
<BR>
So "Guiness is good for you" is true, and those of us who call it<BR>
"mother's milk" are closer than we thought.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:15:36 EDT<BR>
From: KenRoney@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
My group from the early to mid nineties has scattered out.  Most of still do a little gaming, but we're all much busier with work, school, and family<BR>
<BR>
Me-Accountant and law student-semi active gamer<BR>
B-Commercial Real Estate Sales-semi active gamer<BR>
BC-Museum Curator-active gamer<BR>
M-Hospital Donor Liason-not active<BR>
J-Public School Teacher-not active<BR>
JE-Computer Tech and law student-very active<BR>
T-Grocer-very active<BR>
K-Commercial Cleaner-very active<BR>
N-househuband-very active<BR>
J-Clerical and student-active<BR>
<BR>
We keep saying that we'll get back together, but I doubt if more than half can really do it, given our other commitments.<BR>
<BR>
Ken<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 15:22:16 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
On 04/16/00 at 01:26 PM,  "MJ Dougherty" <martinjd@globalnet.co.uk> said:<BR>
<BR>
>It's around Easter time, and some thoughts just struck me.<BR>
<BR>
>17 years ago (at Easter) I met up with a new bunch of gamers. My previous<BR>
>group - the first guys I gamed with - had disintegrated messily. We gamed<BR>
>for several years before all going off to university.<BR>
<BR>
>Sitting down and thinking about what happened to them, I find myself<BR>
>wondering what happened to us.<BR>
<BR>
Okay, I'm game. I'll go back ~20 years for my batch...<BR>
<BR>
E(me)   Professor at a Junior College<BR>
B       System Analyst for a local government agency<BR>
JT      Research Chemist with a big international corporation<BR>
JC      Geologist with an large oil company<BR>
S       Bureaucrat with state environmental agency<BR>
N       Pharmacist with a drugstore chain<BR>
JN      Middle manager with a light industry company<BR>
<BR>
...and I'm the only one still playing RPG's.  Well, not exactly, a<BR>
couple still do the CRPG thing from time to time.<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 15:44:12 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
<BR>
On 04/16/00 at 03:49 AM,  Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
>> Personally, I like having Trader and Broker as I think they are<BR>
>> different.  You could have someone who was very good at picking<BR>
>> "winners" but couldn't make a good deal, and someone who was a great<BR>
>> deal maker but always picked losers to make the deal on.<BR>
<BR>
>So, a Trader who finds diamonds in the rough, but can't move them, and a<BR>
>Broker who can sell snow to Eskimos?  In that<BR>
>sense, Trader seems more like Appraisal.  I say Feh!  Business skill is<BR>
>business skill.  I think thats what dice are for.<BR>
<BR>
Hee! Steve, it's clear *you* aren't a businessman. <g><BR>
<BR>
>[Is it possible to be a heretic of The Heretic?]<BR>
<BR>
Sure! <BR>
<BR>
How about we consider all the different firearm skills? Why not just have one? Shotgun can't be *that* different from rifle, or laser rifle, or SMG, or pistol?<BR>
<BR>
How about we consider the single Law skill? Why aren't there Corporate, Estate, Criminal, etc skills? Surely, not every single lawyer is equally good at each speciality?<BR>
<BR>
I *could* go with a combined merchant skill, but don't because breaking it into two pieces seems reasonable to me because finding cargos and selling them is integral to the merchant campaigns I run. I'm happy enough to have one Law skill (or even default it to Admin), because I don't run legal campaigns. I don't focus on combat that much, so having one skill for long arms and another for hand guns fits me just fine. <BR>
<BR>
What makes this heretical is beyond me, but seeing as I (and you) don't follow the letter of The Rules I suppose we are. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 16:14:17 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
On 04/16/00 at 05:32 AM,  Alex Ingram <ingram@airmail.net> said:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>> Eris states:<BR>
<BR>
>> Now let's say our average PC has 15 skills from a set of around 100.<BR>
>> He must be earning 4 or 5 levels per term, say 30 levels in the 6<BR>
>> term career.  Now it becomes possible to produce a PC with most of<BR>
>> the skills at 1 or 2, easily having a few at 3 or 4...and here's the<BR>
>> *rub*....you might start running into skills at 6, 7, 8 or more!<BR>
>> This means mastery becomes more common, or tasks must become harder,<BR>
>> and when *any* Attribute level gets added to the mix the need to<BR>
>> reblance skill levels and task difficulties just gets greater.<BR>
<BR>
>Couldn't I make a decision to limit the max skill level at 5 to prevent<BR>
>this imbalance?<BR>
<BR>
You could.  I'd rather not.  I don't like putting artifical limits<BR>
on what a character can aspire to.<BR>
<BR>
One approach is to make skill levels increasingly harder to reach.<BR>
GURPS does this by increasing the point cost as levels increase.  A<BR>
different approach that I'd like to suggest is to require a<BR>
successful roll to increase a skill.<BR>
<BR>
Let's say, for example, you must roll higher than the skill level<BR>
you are rising to on 2d6.  Going to skill 1 requires a roll of 2+,<BR>
going to 3 requires a 3+, etc.  If you don't mind the half dice you<BR>
might want to use 1d6+1d3 (1.5d6) or 2d3 to make raising even<BR>
harder.  Or if you want to get a bit more complex, you have to roll<BR>
higher than *twice* the level you are raising to, ie going to 1<BR>
needs a 2+, going 2 to needs a 4+, a 3 needs a 6+ and so on.  Still<BR>
more complex (but more realistic) would be to use a controlling<BR>
Characteristic as a factor in these rolls, thus a high DEX PC would<BR>
have a better chance of raising for Dex based skills than low DEX<BR>
PCs. <BR>
<BR>
               2d6       1.5d6       2d3<BR>
Raising     Chance of  Chance of  Chance of<BR>
to Skill     Success    Success    Success<BR>
   1           100%       100%       100%<BR>
1  2           100%       100%       100%<BR>
   3            97%        95%        89%<BR>
2  4            91%        84%        67%<BR>
   5            83%        67%        33%<BR>
3  6            72%        50%        11%<BR>
   7            58%        33%<BR>
4  8            42%        17%<BR>
   9            28%         6%<BR>
5 10            17%<BR>
  11             8%<BR>
6 12             3%<BR>
<BR>
You're adding another roll for each skill, but what's one more. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris,<BR>
    who has given this subject much too much thought.<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 14:51:03 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills (Long)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> rank better.  This was a position in command hierarchy,<BR>
> actual military ranks co-existed with this: Lieutenant, J.G.,<BR>
> Graff was Helm 1 or 2, but not 'command track', whatever<BR>
> that means (one of the many annoyingly unexplained things<BR>
> in Cheryh's books that I've read so far).<BR>
<BR>
I guess you aren't familar with the real world miltary concept of "line<BR>
officer". There are cases where a job deserves higher rank and pay, but<BR>
the job doesn't require command skills. One example of this is the USAF<BR>
"tech sergeant" ranks. And some militaries have a similar break in the<BR>
officers. <BR>
<BR>
The idea being that if you aren't a "line officer" (or "command<BR>
track"), you are subject to the chain of command, but not *part* of it.<BR>
<BR>
So, for example if the senior officer is a colonel who is *not* a line<BR>
officer (say a doctor), and the senior line officer is a captain, the<BR>
*captain* is the one who takes command. In fact, it's not *legal* for<BR>
the colonel to give commands outside his specialty!<BR>
<BR>
So, basicly, a "line" or "command" officer *always* outranks a<BR>
"non-line" officer in combat situations.<BR>
<BR>
In *some* organizations (Star Fleet is one, according to events in a<BR>
ST:TNG episode) "command" grade is seperate from rank, and is signified<BR>
by insignia or other uniform differences (in ST:TNG, it's Red tunics<BR>
apparently). <BR>
<BR>
In that sort of service, you can take the special training and/or tests<BR>
to be certified as command grade (the ST:TNG episode I mentioned was<BR>
about Dr. Crusher taking the exam). And if you pass, you change your<BR>
insignia/uniform. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 15:02:01 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Basic Economics (was Re: Astronomy in the 57th Century)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 07:36 PM 4/15/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>>In message <38F2CD79.109EBC34@gci.net>, Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
>>writes<BR>
>>><BR>
>>>I suggest sort of a Traveller Canon Miranda warning:<BR>
>>><BR>
>>As opposed to a Traveller Carmen Miranda warning:<BR>
>><BR>
>>"You have the right to wear fruit - if your planet cannot afford a<BR>
>>farming industry one will be provided for you."<BR>
><BR>
> "Carmen's Miranda's ghost is haunting space station 3..."<BR>
<BR>
"Patrick McGoohan's ghost is haunting space station 6..."<BR>
<BR>
Which reminds me. A "Prisoner" scenario would be a lovely thing to<BR>
throw at players for a convention game. They are doing something (bar<BR>
hopping?) and wake up in "The Village".<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 18:47:42 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 16 Apr 2000 01:05:40 -0400 (EDT), Black ICE<BR>
<wombat@premier.net> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Charles Collin wrote:<BR>
 <BR>
>>         I read recently about some folks who designed a "Babbage printer".<BR>
>> It seems that as well as designing the famous "Difference Engine" Babbage<BR>
>> also designed a printer for the thing.  It weighs about 2.5 tons, but it<BR>
>> works.<BR>
>>         So this got me thinking: Just how powerful could you make a<BR>
>> mechanical computer?  What are the practical limiting factors?  The image<BR>
>> in my mind is of PCs coming across a long-lost metal-poor colony which has<BR>
>> been getting along at industrial levels using entirely wooden computers of<BR>
>> immense size.  I picture them as looking like horrendous wooden<BR>
>> roller-coasters with triple-redundant systems all over the place and<BR>
>> swarms of carpenters checking them continuously for rotting beams and the<BR>
>> like.  They would have to be marvels of engineering to deal with expansion<BR>
>> and contraction of beams due to moisture and temperature.  Perhaps they<BR>
>> could be the equivalent of the great pyramids: Inspired by<BR>
>> religious/philosophical notions and a centerpoint of cultural pride.<BR>
<BR>
>Obviously such machines would be _much_ slower than electronic<BR>
>computers.  OTOH, they would still be much faster than pencil-and-paper<BR>
>calculations, so they would be useful.  Note that the main battery<BR>
>analog fire-control mechanisms on the IOWA class battleships were<BR>
>retained during their 1980s modernization.<BR>
<BR>
>Also, I would think that a metal-poor society that would build a<BR>
>mechanical computer would use stone or ceramics of some sort, rather<BR>
>than wood, because of the variations in wood that you describe.<BR>
<BR>
Possibly - but consider: stone and ceramic don't stand up well to<BR>
stress; they develop cracks.  Let water into a crack, and have<BR>
that water freeze, and you get bigger cracks, and eventually<BR>
breaks. Same thing happens with repeated stress over time. Stone<BR>
is also a lot heavier than either ceramic or wood.<BR>
<BR>
Either way, what are you going to use for _power_?  If you're not<BR>
building electronic - or electromechanical - computers because of<BR>
lack of metal, you're probably not going to have anything beyond<BR>
purely mechanical transmission of power. And you're going to need<BR>
a _lot_ of it, not least because of dissipation loss due to<BR>
friction and torque.<BR>
<BR>
Inertia is another factor - the heavier something is, the harder<BR>
it is to get it moving, even slowly, and the harder it is to<BR>
_stop_ it, once it gets moving.  Your humongous stone computer<BR>
may _not_ be faster than pen-and-paper, after all. Or, at the<BR>
very least, a skilled operator of an abacus might be able to<BR>
match it.<BR>
<BR>
Now, a different question: are these computers analog or digital?<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 15:06:14 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Anyway, my question - I assume that the micro-meteorite scene <BR>
> wouldn't be that viable for a Third Imperium situation as the <BR>
> coherent superdense armour would just bounce them off? I vaguely <BR>
> recall this being discussed but ignored it at the time to miss as <BR>
> many spoilers as possible...<BR>
<BR>
No, meteoroids[1] of whatever size *won't* "bounce off". They'll impact<BR>
and turn into plasma, and the resulting blast will crater the hull.<BR>
<BR>
Just take the relative velocity and the mass of the meteroid, and use:<BR>
<BR>
E = .5 * M * V^2<BR>
<BR>
to determine the impact energy. Then see what a hit of the sort does to<BR>
the hull. As a rule of thumb, at 3 km/sec, a projectile releases energy<BR>
equivalent to its own mass in TNT. As the speed inceases, the energy<BR>
(blast) goes up as the square of the velocity. So at 9 km/sec (3 times<BR>
the speed) you get a blast equivalent to 9 (3^2) times the impactor's<BR>
mass in TNT.<BR>
<BR>
At about 16 km/sec a *paint chip* made a thumbnail sized crater in a<BR>
Space Shuttle window (quartz glass).<BR>
<BR>
[1] out in space they are meteoroids. The glowing trail as they pass<BR>
through the atmosphere is a meteor. And what reaches the ground is a<BR>
meteorite. <BR>
<BR>
I except this to change if they ever become a *common* topic of<BR>
conversation. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 15:19:33 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer Stuff Help<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Douglas wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization atthe Imperial<BR>
>>level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and need the following translated<BR>
>>into legalese:<BR>
>><BR>
>>When the Marshal is investigating an Imperial crime, do whatever he says or<BR>
>>your ass is toast.<BR>
><BR>
> Here is my go based on two Earth documents<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> I the Lord High Marshal of the Imperium<BR>
> pursuant to the powers in that behalf vested<BR>
> in me do hereby appoint<BR>
><BR>
> Douglas Ebenezer Berry<BR>
><BR>
> to be and officer of the Imperial Marshals Service<BR>
> with full power and authority to do and perform<BR>
> all such matters and things as are by any Imperial<BR>
> Edict in force relating to the Imperial Court Service<BR>
> or any other matter assigned to the Imperial<BR>
> Marshal Service and hereby request and require<BR>
> all and every member of the Imperial armed forces<BR>
> or Scout Service and all others to aid and assist<BR>
> the said<BR>
><BR>
> Douglas Ebenezer Berry<BR>
><BR>
> in all things and observe and obey all such orders,<BR>
> instructions and directions as he may make<BR>
> concerning any matter from time to time assigned<BR>
> to the Imperial Marshal Service.<BR>
<BR>
Gee, why not just say "By my hand, and for the good of the State, what<BR>
the bearer has done has been done." :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:41:12 -0400<BR>
From: Glenn Grant <neo@total.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
"MJ Dougherty" <martinjd@globalnet.co.uk> asks,<BR>
<BR>
>I wonder... how many of the people you gamed with went on to have unusual<BR>
>careers? How many just couldn't escape and became game industry<BR>
>professionals.<BR>
<BR>
Ahh, the Forest City Gamers of London, Ont, ca. 1979-1984.  What a bunch of<BR>
weirdos...<BR>
<BR>
Me:  singer in punk bands, comic & SF 'zine publisher, escaped from gaming<BR>
but came back when T4 came out; now SF writer/editor/illustrator, currently<BR>
working for SJG;<BR>
<BR>
PB:  aircraft engineer in Cdn Armed Forces, now owns a London, Ont. games shop;<BR>
<BR>
B:   temporarily went insane due to mis-labeled prescription drugs, was<BR>
hospitalized, recovered successfully, became molecular biologist at U.<BR>
Waterloo;<BR>
<BR>
AR:  punked-out anarchist/activist, 'zine-publisher, studied Philosophy<BR>
(representing U. Waterloo at a Wittgenstein conference in Vienna wearing a<BR>
skirt, a Dead Kennedy's T-shirt, ear-rings and black lipstick); itenerant<BR>
backpacker, hiked all over Central & South America and Asia; don't know<BR>
where he is now;<BR>
<BR>
DS:  investment banker or something dull like that;<BR>
<BR>
MH: arrested for assaulting a paper boy (never found out why); last I've<BR>
heard of this<BR>
horrid individual and glad of it.<BR>
<BR>
SM:  photographic artist, 'zine publisher, travelled extensively, social<BR>
worker for the disabled;<BR>
<BR>
DK:  freaky hybrid punk/hippy, initially lived on government disability due<BR>
to neurological seizures (eventually diagnosed as an allergy to red meat!);<BR>
unsuccessful hack writer, sometime bar bouncer & male go-go dancer(!); now<BR>
works in (what else?) a comics shop;<BR>
<BR>
DW:  rejected by Canadian Armed Forces, joined the French Foreign Legion (I<BR>
kid you not), shipped off to guard European residences in the United Arab<BR>
Emirates during anti-Western street protests; illegally converted military<BR>
scrip to cash and hid proceeds in a Paris bank account, but while he was on<BR>
leave, was found out and the account was seized; fled back to Canada and<BR>
now cannot enter any French territory or will be arrested and<BR>
court-marshalled. Don't know what he's up to these days.<BR>
<BR>
RV:  ca.1985, in his late teens, drove to Lake Geneva with another gamer in<BR>
the other guy's mom's car (without asking her) with the pathetic hope of<BR>
landing jobs in the game biz; returned home, half-starved, several weeks<BR>
later; started a game company and frittered away $25,000 of his parents'<BR>
money without managing to publish anything; tried to hire a hit-man to have<BR>
his parents murdered(!), but the hit-man was an undercover cop; was<BR>
arrested; during trial proved that he was *not* trying to have his parents<BR>
killed, but was just *researching a game* about underworld types, and<BR>
wanted to know how the hit-man would go about doing it; his parents and<BR>
business partner backed him up and he was acquitted.  Don't know his<BR>
current whereabouts and don't want to.<BR>
<BR>
Having moved to Montreal, I no longer game with any of them, and probably<BR>
wouldn't choose to. Only one is still a friend.<BR>
<BR>
In retrospect, the *players* in that club were weirder than the characters<BR>
they played.<BR>
<BR>
Best,<BR>
<BR>
  + GMG +<BR>
<BR>
               Glenn Grant  <neo@total.net><BR>
_Northern Suns: The New Anthology of Canadian Science Fiction_<BR>
          Edited by David Hartwell & Glenn Grant<BR>
  ++Now in trade paperback from Tor Books++<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:13:50 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
> Ahh, the Forest City Gamers of London, Ont, ca. 1979-1984.<BR>
> What a bunch of weirdos...<BR>
<BR>
I hate to say this Glenn, but your post has just reinforced all the bad<BR>
stereotypes people have of gamers.<BR>
<grin><BR>
<BR>
> _Northern Suns: The New Anthology of Canadian Science Fiction_<BR>
>           Edited by David Hartwell & Glenn Grant<BR>
>   ++Now in trade paperback from Tor Books++<BR>
<BR>
BTW, do you know if this is likely to be available through Amazon ?<BR>
(It'd never get brought in down here commercially )<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:18:43 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 16 Apr 2000 12:05:40 +0100, SD Mooney wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Second question - what was the other, similar, film you folks <BR>
> mentioned just after it?<BR>
<BR>
I don't know about the list, but "Pitch Black" was another sci-fi film that<BR>
came out a couple of weeks before MtM.  It too had a micro meteorite<BR>
scene-- one that was a lot more catastrophic (and realistic, IMHO).<BR>
<BR>
Also IMHO, Pitch Black was the better of the two movies.  MtM had a lot of<BR>
hype and ended up with a Teletubbie-style ending.  Pitch Black (of the<BR>
horror genre) was refreshingly, well, "fresh".  By that, I mean that it<BR>
actually copied very little from previous sci-fi films.  MtM was typical<BR>
Hollywood-- "North", to be specific.  Pitch Black wasn't.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Do not disturb. Already disturbed!<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:17:52 +0100<BR>
From: Phil Kitching <postmark.design@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
"Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I have the same problem myself - here's a possible way of handling it. If<BR>
>you have one skill linked to others as above,  then let each skill 'serve<BR>
>as' the others with a minus DM. This DM can be removed at the cost of half<BR>
>the skill level difference (however for the Navigation aspect I would split<BR>
>them into planetary and space first up).<BR>
><BR>
>Eg I have a Jump Drive skill of 4 and all Engineering skills serve as the<BR>
>others at (Jump Drive) minus 2. If I spend one skill level, I can raise a<BR>
>'served as' skill to that of my Jump Drive skill (minus two divded by 2). So<BR>
>the grand total cost to get Engineering covering all the above aspects at<BR>
>level 4 is 9 (4 for initial skill and 1 each for the other others).<BR>
<BR>
No it isn't. The cost is 6.<BR>
<BR>
Unless you pay more points for higher levels, the cheapest way to get level<BR>
4 across engineering skills under this system is to get (eg) Jump Drive 6.<BR>
<BR>
Even if the skill only counted as others in the cascade at half value, the<BR>
optimal solution is still Jump Drive 8.<BR>
<BR>
With a two skill cascade, this sort of thing might work - certainly it would<BR>
make more sense than the almost pointless "ship's boat" skill in current Trav.<BR>
<BR>
With your seven skill medical cascade then it (paying for the difference)<BR>
really doesn't work at all.<BR>
<BR>
However, this is not (IMO) a problem. If the current chargen system that you<BR>
are using creates characters with lots of levels in engineering, then having<BR>
one aspect of engineering as a speciality with the rest as a few levels below<BR>
makes more sense to me than an Engineer 6+ with an across the board genius<BR>
score.<BR>
<BR>
You might want to add further specialisations at higher levels and so end up<BR>
with (eg) Jump Capacitors 8, Jump Drive 6, Engineering 3.<BR>
<BR>
[in this example, JD counts half levels as the engineering cascade until level<BR>
 4, then extra levels go into JC, which cascades half the 4 additional levels<BR>
 to JD, which cascades half its levels to engineering.]<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching<BR>
- --<BR>
  http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>
  Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>
 "Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2317<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Monday, April 17 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2318<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
Re: Sonic Booms<BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
A study in gamer demographics<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
New pictures.....repost with correct link<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Sonic Booms<BR>
RE: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
RE: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Cloning<BR>
RE: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Filk pages<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:29:05 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/15/00 11:14 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
> forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> ObTrav: keep the above in mind on low TL worlds. Sure, there are other<BR>
>> ways to purify the water, but frankly, small beer (what we call "near<BR>
>> beer") tastes better, and actually is a source of several vitamins<BR>
>> (B-complex as I recall).<BR>
><BR>
> Beer has vitamins? Or just small beer? BTW, the statement was "live on beer<BR>
> /alone/", presumably nothing else allowed. You can't live on B-complex<BR>
> alone. ;) I wonder what the degree of variation in nutritional value in beer<BR>
> would be. Or wine for that matter.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, I know it said beer alone. I was granting that *that* isn't going<BR>
to work. <BR>
<BR>
But beer that isn't "overly processed" will have a lot of stuff left<BR>
behind by the yeast *besides* the alcohol. <BR>
<BR>
As for wine, remember that in Greek and Roman times, the wine was made<BR>
*quite* strong *and* sweet (for the sweet wines). Damn near a syrup,<BR>
from the impression I get from some comments. They *never* drank it<BR>
straight. Instead, everyone drank "watered wine". Wine cut with water<BR>
to a greater or lesser extent. <BR>
<BR>
Of course the Romans didn't *need* any "disinfectant" effect, given<BR>
their water systems. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:34:55 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Charles C. writes:<BR>
><BR>
>>   Now picture this:  Some PCs are on a planet surface in potentially<BR>
>>  hostile territory.  They see the glint of something entering the<BR>
>>  atmosphere and hear "BOOM... [3 seconds pass] ...BOOM".  Whoops, time to<BR>
>>  duck and cover! :-)<BR>
><BR>
> "It's the'MONTANA!"<BR>
<BR>
Personally, I prefer the bit from "Battle Beyond the Stars". The bad<BR>
guy's ship enters atmosphere and passses overhead. And it gets *dark*<BR>
for a minute or so as it passes over....<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 16 Apr 2000 22:37:21 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> On Sun, 16 Apr 2000 01:05:40 -0400 (EDT), Black ICE<BR>
> <wombat@premier.net> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>Charles Collin wrote:<BR>
>  <BR>
>>>         I read recently about some folks who designed a "Babbage printer".<BR>
>>> It seems that as well as designing the famous "Difference Engine" Babbage<BR>
>>> also designed a printer for the thing.  It weighs about 2.5 tons, but it<BR>
>>> works.<BR>
>>>         So this got me thinking: Just how powerful could you make a<BR>
>>> mechanical computer?  What are the practical limiting factors?  The image<BR>
>>> in my mind is of PCs coming across a long-lost metal-poor colony which has<BR>
>>> been getting along at industrial levels using entirely wooden computers of<BR>
>>> immense size.  I picture them as looking like horrendous wooden<BR>
>>> roller-coasters with triple-redundant systems all over the place and<BR>
>>> swarms of carpenters checking them continuously for rotting beams and the<BR>
>>> like.  They would have to be marvels of engineering to deal with expansion<BR>
>>> and contraction of beams due to moisture and temperature.  Perhaps they<BR>
>>> could be the equivalent of the great pyramids: Inspired by<BR>
>>> religious/philosophical notions and a centerpoint of cultural pride.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
> Now, a different question: are these computers analog or digital?<BR>
<BR>
Babbage's stuff was *digital*. <BR>
<BR>
Want a mechanical analog computer? Buy a slide rule...<BR>
<BR>
Then there are nomographs/nomograms. I need to look into those a bit,<BR>
because I suspect that some of the weirder calculations in Traveller<BR>
might better be handled with a nomogram or two.<BR>
<BR>
Nomograms are those things you may haver seen with a scale across the<BR>
bottom, another scale across the side and a curve in the middle. To<BR>
determine the answr, you lay a straight edge between the approprioate<BR>
points on the side and bottom scales, and read the result as where it<BR>
intersects the curve.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 08:23:13 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Gee, why not just say "By my hand, and for the good of the State, what<BR>
>  the bearer has done has been done." :-)<BR>
<BR>
Nah, that's too easily understandable. No bureaucrat would write anything <BR>
that simple. There's no comfortable vagueness to it. :)<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:43:01 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> The President of Guinness-Bass was on Fox News on St. Patty's day.<BR>
> He actually said that Guinness is the single best thing a nursing mother<BR>
> can drink because of all the iron, vitamins and minerals.<BR>
> So "Guiness is good for you" is true, and those of us who call it<BR>
> "mother's milk" are closer than we thought.<BR>
<BR>
_No_!<BR>
<BR>
You and he may want to look into Fetal Alcohol Syndrome:<BR>
<BR>
"NOFAS is committed to raising public awareness of Fetal Alcohol Syndrome <BR>
(The leading known cause of mental retardation) In 1973, researchers in the<BR>
United States published a landmark report describing a pattern of birth<BR>
defects in children born to women who had consumed alcohol during their<BR>
pregnancy know as Fetal Alcohol Syndrome (FAS). FAS refers to a<BR>
constellation of physical, cognitive and behavioral abnormalities, which<BR>
can include, growth retardation, a distinct pattern of facial<BR>
dysmorphology, and mental retardation."<BR>
<BR>
"In 1991, The Journal of the American Medical Association reported that FAS<BR>
is the leading known cause of mental retardation. At least 5,000 infants are<BR>
born each year with FAS, or approximately one out of every 750 live births.<BR>
Thirty to forty percent of babies whose mothers drink heavily throughout<BR>
pregnancy have the Syndrome. FAS/FAE is a problem found in all races and<BR>
socio-economic groups. FAS and FAE are widely under diagnosed. Some experts<BR>
believe between one third and two-thirds of all children in special<BR>
education have been affected by alcohol in some way.<BR>
<BR>
FAS/FAE produces irreversible physical, mental and emotional effects.<BR>
Behavioral and mental problems of FAE children can be just as severe as<BR>
those of FAS children. Many children with FAS/FAE are not able to<BR>
understand cause and effect relationships and long-term consequences. The<BR>
institutional and medical costs for one child with FAS are $1.4 million<BR>
over a lifetime. <BR>
<BR>
What babies are "at risk" for FAS and FAE? <BR>
<BR>
Whenever a mother drinks, her baby is at risk for Fetal Alcohol Syndrome or<BR>
Fetal Alcohol Effect. When a pregnant women drinks alcohol, her baby does<BR>
too. It is not clear whether there is a threshold amount of alcohol that<BR>
must be consumed before damage to the baby occurs. There is also _no_ proof<BR>
that small amounts of alcohol are safe. <BR>
<BR>
Is there a cure for FAS? <BR>
<BR>
There is no cure for Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. Once the damage is done, it<BR>
cannot be undone. However, FAS is the only cause of birth defects that can<BR>
be completely prevented. <BR>
<BR>
How can FAS be prevented? <BR>
<BR>
The easiest way for a woman to prevent FAS is to not drink during<BR>
pregnancy. Communities, schools, and concerned individuals can help to prevent<BR>
FAS/FAE, through education and intervention." <BR>
<BR>
http://www.nofas.org/<BR>
<BR>
Sorry about the somewhat long & OTness, I thought it needed to be said.<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: Never let your sexually active female characters drink <BR>
alcohol (much less Scout Brew) unless the form of birth control <BR>
they are using is 100% reliable.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:20:13 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: A study in gamer demographics<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm...<BR>
<BR>
High School Group:<BR>
<BR>
Me: Computer system manager for a university<BR>
Kr: Graphic artist<BR>
Dbo: RIP due to someone else's DWI. :(<BR>
Da: Unknown<BR>
Wr: Manager at a printing company<BR>
Ww: HS Science and Math teacher<BR>
Dbe: US air force communications<BR>
<BR>
College Group:<BR>
Me: See above<BR>
Ka: Software designer<BR>
Mt: US Navy nuclear reactor operator<BR>
Md: Safety inspector of radioactive and radiation-producing objects<BR>
Mg: Database administrator<BR>
Ba: US Navy Seaman<BR>
Tv: US Air Force intelligence<BR>
Jj: Newspaper reporter<BR>
Cw: Computer help desk technician, after a stint with me running<BR>
a mail-order game store.<BR>
Jc (Now Jw, with above): Librarian<BR>
<BR>
Post-College Group: All still in college...I was the one post-college,<BR>
living in a college town.<BR>
<BR>
Current group: none...hope to start one again once children are bigger.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:42:35 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
>_No_! <BR>
><BR>
>You and he may want to look into Fetal Alcohol Syndrome: <BR>
<BR>
You may want to look at the original post again. He said "Nursing"<BR>
mothers, not "Expectant" mothers.<BR>
<BR>
I don't know if alcohol passes through breast milk, though.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 06:42:09 -0700<BR>
From: "Mike Linsenmayer" <mlinsenmayer@symantec.com><BR>
Subject: New pictures.....repost with correct link<BR>
<BR>
Damn... posted the wrong link..... can you all ever for give me...<BR>
<BR>
http://www.bigbailey.com/vspace/art/picture-h.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:46:07 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
<BR>
Frank Pitt writes:<BR>
>Yeah, sorry, I knew that, typed "Monster Manual" instead of  "Dieties &<BR>
>Demigods".<BR>
<snipped><BR>
<BR>
	I have been reading the TML for too long: for a moment, I thought<BR>
	that you wrote "Ditzie & Demigods."  That could be a scarey book.<BR>
<BR>
:)<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:59:04 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
<BR>
Steve Daniels writes:<BR>
>The President of Guinness-Bass was on Fox News on St. Patty's day.<BR>
>He actually said that Guinness is the single best thing a nursing mother<BR>
>can drink because of all the iron, vitamins and minerals.<BR>
<snipped><BR>
<BR>
	The President of Rothman's maintained that cigarettes are not<BR>
	addictive, do not cause cancer, etc.  It is true that beer must<BR>
	be made with sterile water (you only want certain yeast growing),<BR>
	so it is safe to drink even if the local water supply isn't.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 08:30:52<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
At 04:53 PM 4/16/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> No, excellent adventure fodder!  (scribble, scribble, scribble..)<BR>
><BR>
>Well, I see the easy way out now:  the Warrant, having<BR>
>no limitation except Strephon, cancels the investigation,<BR>
>without which the Marshall is just a bureaucrat.<BR>
<BR>
But what if the Marshal is investigating abuses by the warrant holder?<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 08:34:34<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
At 10:34 PM 4/16/2000 PST, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Personally, I prefer the bit from "Battle Beyond the Stars". The bad<BR>
>guy's ship enters atmosphere and passses overhead. And it gets *dark*<BR>
>for a minute or so as it passes over....<BR>
<BR>
"Into the Fire", Babylon 5.  While Londo and Vir are congratulating<BR>
themselves on removing the last traces of Shadow presence on Centauri<BR>
Prime, the Vorlon world-killer slides in front of the sun...<BR>
<BR>
Damn, I'm glad that Sci-Fi is going to run that series.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"Non possum existimare plus quemquem facini"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:13:14 +0100<BR>
From: Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Douglas E. Berry [mailto:gridlore@pop.mindspring.com]<BR>
> Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 9:31 AM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> At 04:53 PM 4/16/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >> No, excellent adventure fodder!  (scribble, scribble, scribble..)<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Well, I see the easy way out now:  the Warrant, having<BR>
> >no limitation except Strephon, cancels the investigation,<BR>
> >without which the Marshall is just a bureaucrat.<BR>
> <BR>
> But what if the Marshal is investigating abuses by the warrant holder?<BR>
<BR>
Well, given that only the Emperor (or whoever granted the abusers<BR>
warrant) can truly say that the warrant holder has abused his position,<BR>
either he's SoL or the marshals warrant must *expressly* state that it<BR>
supersedes the authority of the Imperial warrant he is investigating,<BR>
and must be signed by the original warrant issuer, or a higher ranking<BR>
noble.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 09:57:52 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
<BR>
Ian Ferguson wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Steve Daniels writes:<BR>
> >The President of Guinness-Bass was on Fox News on St. Patty's day.<BR>
> >He actually said that Guinness is the single best thing a nursing mother<BR>
> >can drink because of all the iron, vitamins and minerals.<BR>
> <snipped><BR>
> <BR>
>         The President of Rothman's maintained that cigarettes are not<BR>
>         addictive, do not cause cancer, etc.  It is true that beer must<BR>
>         be made with sterile water (you only want certain yeast growing),<BR>
>         so it is safe to drink even if the local water supply isn't.<BR>
<BR>
A recent (sometime in the last year or so) Scientific American had an<BR>
article on Alcohol through the Ages that discussed things like this.<BR>
Basically everyone drank beer, because the water wasn't drinkable. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:44:47 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
At 5:55 -0400 17/4/00, "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote:<BR>
> > Second question - what was the other, similar, film you folks<BR>
> > mentioned just after it?<BR>
><BR>
>I don't know about the list, but "Pitch Black" was another sci-fi film that<BR>
>came out a couple of weeks before MtM.  It too had a micro meteorite<BR>
>scene-- one that was a lot more catastrophic (and realistic, IMHO).<BR>
<BR>
That's not out here yet, but was the one I was thinking of.<BR>
<BR>
>Also IMHO, Pitch Black was the better of the two movies.  MtM had a lot of<BR>
>hype and ended up with a Teletubbie-style ending.  Pitch Black (of the<BR>
>horror genre) was refreshingly, well, "fresh".  By that, I mean that it<BR>
>actually copied very little from previous sci-fi films.  MtM was typical<BR>
>Hollywood-- "North", to be specific.  Pitch Black wasn't.<BR>
<BR>
Hmm. The bit that really annoyed me was when, faced with limited O2 <BR>
supplies, a base in an uncertain condition, a potential survivor to <BR>
find and no definite 02 generation capacity, they decide to take a <BR>
break and raise the flag from the dust.<BR>
<BR>
That bit didn't work for me...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:38:19 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
At 5:55 -0400 17/4/00, Damage169@cs.com wrote:<BR>
>"For every action, there is an equal but opposite reaction." See also,<BR>
>"Recoil."<BR>
<BR>
So the principle is that one ship with the two landers launches in <BR>
and throws the other ship the opposite way? They thus use the <BR>
reaction mass from both ships rather than one?<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:01:44 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
 <BR>
> It's also a matter of being *close* enough to hear them. The farther<BR>
> away you are the more diffuse the shock cones are, and that means<BR>
> they'll blend together if you are far enough away.<BR>
<BR>
This is actually good. The PC's hear a rumbling noise<BR>
<BR>
 'Booooooooooooo' Run for your lives! It's a Montana! 'ooooooommmmmm'<BR>
;-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:01:28 -0400<BR>
From: Glenn Grant <neo@total.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
"Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz> sez,<BR>
<BR>
>I hate to say this Glenn, but your post has just reinforced all the bad<BR>
>stereotypes people have of gamers.<BR>
><grin><BR>
<BR>
You can see why I got away from gaming for a while...<BR>
<BR>
>> _Northern Suns: The New Anthology of Canadian Science Fiction_<BR>
>>           Edited by David Hartwell & Glenn Grant<BR>
>>   ++Now in trade paperback from Tor Books++<BR>
><BR>
>BTW, do you know if this is likely to be available through Amazon ?<BR>
>(It'd never get brought in down here commercially )<BR>
<BR>
Actually, it's published in New York; Tor is one of the top SF publishers<BR>
in the US.  But it's true, our U.S. sales are not spectacular.<BR>
<BR>
Certainly, you can get it on Amazon, along with our first volume, _Northern<BR>
Stars_; you can also find several reviews of both books.<BR>
<BR>
Best,<BR>
<BR>
 +GMG+<BR>
<BR>
  "Another fertile source of ["moral insanity"] appears to be an undue<BR>
    indulgence in the perusal of the numerous works of fiction...with<BR>
the effect of vitiating the taste and corrupting the morals of the young.<BR>
 Parents cannot too cautiously guard their young daughters against this<BR>
pernicious practice." - Dr. W.H. Stokes, Scientific American, April 1849<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:11:38 -0400<BR>
From: Glenn Grant <neo@total.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
Whups!<BR>
<BR>
Re: _Northern Suns_, "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz> said,<BR>
<BR>
>BTW, do you know if this is likely to be available through Amazon ?<BR>
>(It'd never get brought in down here commercially )<BR>
<BR>
...and I made the mistake of thinking you were in the U.S., when you said<BR>
"brought in down here".  Of course you meant New Zealand.  You're right, as<BR>
far as I'm aware it's not available Down There.<BR>
<BR>
Sorry for the mix-up,<BR>
<BR>
 + GMG +<BR>
<BR>
                         Glenn Grant<BR>
                        neo@total.net<BR>
"A scholar is just a library's way of making another library"<BR>
                       --Daniel Dennet<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:11:38 -0400<BR>
From: Glenn Grant <neo@total.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
Whups!<BR>
<BR>
Re: _Northern Suns_, "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz> said,<BR>
<BR>
>BTW, do you know if this is likely to be available through Amazon ?<BR>
>(It'd never get brought in down here commercially )<BR>
<BR>
...and I made the mistake of thinking you were in the U.S., when you said<BR>
"brought in down here".  Of course you meant New Zealand.  You're right, as<BR>
far as I'm aware it's not available Down There.<BR>
<BR>
Sorry for the mix-up,<BR>
<BR>
 + GMG +<BR>
<BR>
                         Glenn Grant<BR>
                        neo@total.net<BR>
"A scholar is just a library's way of making another library"<BR>
                       --Daniel Dennet<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:22:33 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Cloning<BR>
<BR>
Here's a bit from a futurist:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.drtomorrow.com/press_release.html contains the press<BR>
release of one Frank Ogden of Canada, he's attempting to trademark his <BR>
own genetic code.<BR>
<BR>
It's an interesting question. If I leave a bunch of DNA samples<BR>
lying around in a public place - say, by simply using a cubicle at<BR>
a library for an afternoon of research - am I giving away my DNA?<BR>
If a company thinks that I'm the greatest physical specimen they've<BR>
ever seen, can they make a thousand of me?<BR>
<BR>
The OTU should have identity questions like this all the time, since<BR>
cloning exists and is in use.  Are "True Sons" and "True Daughters" real <BR>
people? Are they considered the children of their genetic model? Do they <BR>
inherit?  <BR>
<BR>
It's canon that parents of True Children can raise them as they choose - <BR>
_Arrival Vengeance_ seems to make a point that you raise a True Child<BR>
with experiences as similar to the genetic model as possible, so you<BR>
can send them elsewhere and they'll react as you would, thus being <BR>
good representatives in a commo-lagged universe.  What other rights<BR>
do True Children have or not have?<BR>
<BR>
How about this: A Megacorp officer is disgraced and cashiered. The<BR>
Megacorp had created True Children of this man, but now have a problem.<BR>
The whole point of TC's is to have people on the spot who will make<BR>
the same decisions under the same circumstances...and the Megacorp<BR>
has just decided that this man's decisions are not valuable.  You can't<BR>
just discard them, they cost a lot of money to create and raise...and<BR>
you can't chop them up for parts, or sell them...what do you do?<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:10:48<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
At 05:13 PM 4/17/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> But what if the Marshal is investigating abuses by the warrant holder?<BR>
><BR>
>Well, given that only the Emperor (or whoever granted the abusers<BR>
>warrant) can truly say that the warrant holder has abused his position,<BR>
>either he's SoL or the marshals warrant must *expressly* state that it<BR>
>supersedes the authority of the Imperial warrant he is investigating,<BR>
>and must be signed by the original warrant issuer, or a higher ranking<BR>
>noble.<BR>
<BR>
Let's try it this way.. you send the Marshal in undercover because the<BR>
Emperor believes that a Warrant holder is misusing it, but for political<BR>
reasons can't act openly.<BR>
<BR>
So a MoJ team acting as tramp merchants have to investigate, gather<BR>
evidence, and then take action as their mandate allows.  All of this while<BR>
avoiding a *very* powerful opponent.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry   Templar Agent at Large.<BR>
gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
<BR>
TravGeekCode: <BR>
tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>
ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>
         <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:12:22<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
<BR>
At 09:57 AM 4/17/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>A recent (sometime in the last year or so) Scientific American had an<BR>
>article on Alcohol through the Ages that discussed things like this.<BR>
>Basically everyone drank beer, because the water wasn't drinkable. <BR>
<BR>
But you have to wonder about the first time...<BR>
<BR>
"Hey!  Rain seeped into one of tbe grain jars!  The grain is ruined and<BR>
we've got this frothy, foul-smelling water now.  Anybody got a cup?"<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"Non possum existimare plus quemquem facini"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:29:09 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
<BR>
>From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
>>So, if an agent/marshall/sheriff/ranger is not<BR>
>>"engaged in an investigation" (at least officially), he <BR>
>>can't call on member world assistance and he doesn't have<BR>
>>"Plenipotentiary Imperial Powers" (which is pretty much<BR>
>>the same as the Emporer's power).<BR>
I replied:<BR>
>I intended it to be a step before Direct Imperial Power,<BR>
>which is what the Emperor personally enjoys in this<BR>
scheme.<BR>
<BR>
Someone else wrote:<BR>
>[What happens if someone with a broad Imperial Warrant<BR>
>and a Marshall engaged in an official investigation are in<BR>
>opposition?  Irrestible force and immovable object.<BR>
>Rebellion time?]<BR>
<BR>
That is what the United States courts, at least, call a<BR>
political question.  In the Imperium, which is a state<BR>
ruled by sophonts and not by laws, the political side of<BR>
the equation is even more important.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:37:36 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Filk pages<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
> <BR>
> > The traveller filk page is starting to get a bit crowded, so I need folks<BR>
> > to go take a look and give me their opinions on what filks I should take<BR>
> > down to make room for newer entries.<BR>
> <BR>
> My first impulse is to ask if you can keep it all and loose<BR>
> or move, something else instead, there are many Traveller<BR>
> sites but AFAIK no other Traveller filk sites.<BR>
> <BR>
> If you must take something down I suggest removing:<BR>
> <BR>
> The Banana X-Boat Song<BR>
<BR>
Nooooo!!! My Favorite Travfilk! <BR>
<BR>
> The .1 C Country/Western Song<BR>
> Hiver Technical Academy Fight Song<BR>
> Enir Hill<BR>
> After teh FFW<BR>
> <BR>
> The ones I would say are the most worth keeping are:<BR>
> <BR>
> The Traveller Saga<BR>
> When I was a Lad<BR>
> Send the Marines<BR>
> Traveller Rhapsody<BR>
> <BR>
> I also like The Executioners Song but modesty prevents me<BR>
> from short listing it.<BR>
<BR>
How much space do you need, there Doug? I'm sure that Downport or<BR>
Freelance Traveller would be able to take up the slack...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2318<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2319</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Monday, April 17 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2319<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
3D Starmap Tool Recommendation...<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
Re: Lawyer Stuff Help<BR>
Re: Filk pages<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
RE: Pohl's 'Gateway' (SPOILER)<BR>
RE: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
RE: Norris' Evil Twin <BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 12:40:05 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> At 09:57 AM 4/17/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >A recent (sometime in the last year or so) Scientific American had an<BR>
> >article on Alcohol through the Ages that discussed things like this.<BR>
> >Basically everyone drank beer, because the water wasn't drinkable.<BR>
> <BR>
> But you have to wonder about the first time...<BR>
> <BR>
> "Hey!  Rain seeped into one of tbe grain jars!  The grain is ruined and<BR>
> we've got this frothy, foul-smelling water now.  Anybody got a cup?"<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I've always thought that the _second_ time required more<BR>
courage:<BR>
<BR>
"Hey, what's up with Gilgamesh?"<BR>
<BR>
"Oh, he drank some of that water out of the grain jar, and now he's<BR>
stumbling around, slurring his speech, and giggling."<BR>
<BR>
"Really?  Let _me_ try some!"<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/colverber/travler.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:52:11 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
<BR>
Black Ice wrote:<BR>
>Actually, I've always thought that the _second_ time required more <BR>
>courage: <BR>
><BR>
>"Hey, what's up with Gilgamesh?" <BR>
><BR>
>"Oh, he drank some of that water out of the grain jar, and now he's <BR>
>stumbling around, slurring his speech, and giggling." <BR>
><BR>
>"Really?  Let _me_ try some!" <BR>
<BR>
It may have been something like this:<BR>
<BR>
"What's with Gilgamesh?"<BR>
<BR>
"He drank some of that water out of the grain jar."<BR>
<BR>
"Wow, he looks really messed up...I wouldn't drink any of that stuff."<BR>
<BR>
"Dare ya."<BR>
<BR>
An thus an entire industry is born.<BR>
<BR>
Similar exchanges are probably at the heart of such activities as<BR>
Bunjee Jumping, Body Piercing, and other extreme hobbies.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:05:55 -0500<BR>
From: Jason Kemp <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: 3D Starmap Tool Recommendation...<BR>
<BR>
Fellow Sophonts,<BR>
<BR>
If you are looking for a very cool tool to handle your 3D starmaps, please<BR>
check out Claus Bornich's "It's Full Of Stars" software application:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/7472/<BR>
<BR>
(Follow the link, then click on the It's Full of Star link in the lefthand<BR>
margin.)<BR>
<BR>
He's got the near star data available, but with this software, you can also<BR>
create random starmaps, plot routes, zoom in on star systems or individual<BR>
worlds with auto-generated physical data, store notes on systems and<BR>
planets, watch animation of orbiting bodies, and so much more. It's pretty<BR>
sweet, from looking at it initially. Some of the physical data needs to be<BR>
translated into Traveller units, but all in all, the software is an amazing<BR>
tool for keeping track of a 3D universe.<BR>
<BR>
Psst, Michel, please give this a glance, if you'd like, for your TNEC PBEMs.<BR>
<BR>
I hope you enjoy it.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:09:55 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
>But what if the Marshal is investigating abuses by the <BR>
>warrant holder?<BR>
<BR>
The only way to deal with an abusive holder of an Imperial<BR>
Warrant is for the Emperor to intervene.  <BR>
<BR>
The Emperor would do so by issuing a superseding Edict<BR>
which will say, the Warrant issued on date is this date<BR>
declared null and void and of no further force and effect. <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
The Emperor will commission a noble to find the abusing<BR>
holder of the voided Warrant and terminate his holder<BR>
status -- possibly with extreme prejudice.  The<BR>
commissioned noble would be authorized to bring a<BR>
military/naval unit of appropriate size.  The commissioned<BR>
noble may be issued a new Imperial Warrant, as well, should<BR>
circumstances so dictate.<BR>
<BR>
Investigation by an Imperial Marshall or whomever would<BR>
have the function of documenting abuses and bringing them<BR>
to the attention of the Emperor.  That would have to be<BR>
done, as a practical matter, without getting into direct<BR>
conflict with the warrant holder.  Inspector Columbo would<BR>
not be a good choice for an Imperial Marshall investigating<BR>
a Warrant holder.<BR>
<BR>
This could be a fun campaign.  <BR>
<BR>
Stage 1:  Collect evidence of abuses by the Warrant holder<BR>
and get the information back to Capital. ("I shall go to<BR>
Edo!" if you're a fan of samurai movies -- I can't remember<BR>
the title of that one, but it involved a samurai who had a<BR>
disagreement with his daimyo and had to take it to the<BR>
Emperor for resolution.)  Avoid various obstacles set up by<BR>
the Warrant holder.<BR>
<BR>
Stage 2:  Hearings before Emperor Strephon regarding the<BR>
alleged abuses.  <BR>
<BR>
Stage 3:  The Imperial Court.  Emperor Strephon's private<BR>
audience room.  <BR>
Door guard:  Duke Chakrapom and his retainers!<BR>
Strephon:  Let them enter.<BR>
Door guard:  His Imperial Highness orders you to enter and<BR>
kneel!<BR>
Duke and other PCs enter and kneel.<BR>
Strephon:  Ah, Chakropom, there you are.  Be at ease, and<BR>
your retainers.  Seats.  We have called you here upon a<BR>
matter of some urgency.  As you know, we issued our our<BR>
Warrant to Colonel Kurtz to carry out a campaign against<BR>
Zhodani forces who were threatening the Spinward Marches<BR>
from the Trojan Reach.  Kurtz has let his power go to his<BR>
head, and has set himself up as something of a god out<BR>
there.  We have this hour rescinded and voided his Warrant.<BR>
 We now commission you to go to the Trojan Reach, find<BR>
Colonel Kurtz, and terminate his Warrant.  With extreme<BR>
prejudice, you understand?  Now go; time is of the essence.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:12:39 -0500<BR>
From: Bill Dunn <bdunn@epicsystems.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
One of the quirky things about Fetal Alcohol Syndrome is that not all babies<BR>
of alcohol-drinking pregnant mothers get it. I'm not certain of the<BR>
percentage but the fact that not all get it suggests a very complex causal<BR>
relationship (if one exists at all beyond strong correlation).<BR>
On the other hand, FAS NEVER shows up in women who haven't consumed alcohol<BR>
while pregnant. So, better safe than sorry.<BR>
As far as nursing mothers, alcohol consumption isn't so problematic. Yes, it<BR>
collects in the breast milk but the mother can always pump and dump after<BR>
the alcohol's been metabolized and before nursing the baby. But that can<BR>
also apply to other things the mother ingests (our baby got horrible gas<BR>
pains, we think, when her mom ate broccoli and it got in the milk... now,<BR>
she loves broccoli. Go figure.) You'd be surprised how often you research<BR>
these things when you are expecting...<BR>
There are some anthropologists who believe beer has been around as long as<BR>
bread as a method of making grass seeds edible by humans as well as storage.<BR>
Though I belive it's commonly accepted that most beers would have been<BR>
fairly weak compared to modern ones.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 04:43:01 -0800<BR>
>From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
>Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
><BR>
>Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> wrote<BR>
><BR>
>> The President of Guinness-Bass was on Fox News on St. Patty's day.<BR>
>> He actually said that Guinness is the single best thing a nursing mother<BR>
>> can drink because of all the iron, vitamins and minerals.<BR>
>> So "Guiness is good for you" is true, and those of us who call it<BR>
>> "mother's milk" are closer than we thought.<BR>
><BR>
>_No_!<BR>
><BR>
>You and he may want to look into Fetal Alcohol Syndrome:<BR>
><BR>
>"NOFAS is committed to raising public awareness of Fetal Alcohol Syndrome <BR>
>(The leading known cause of mental retardation) In 1973, researchers in the<BR>
>United States published a landmark report describing a pattern of birth<BR>
>defects in children born to women who had consumed alcohol during their<BR>
>pregnancy know as Fetal Alcohol Syndrome (FAS). FAS refers to a<BR>
>constellation of physical, cognitive and behavioral abnormalities, which<BR>
>can include, growth retardation, a distinct pattern of facial<BR>
>dysmorphology, and mental retardation."<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 10:23:04 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu> wrote<BR>
 <BR>
> Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> >_No_! <BR>
> >You and he may want to look into Fetal Alcohol Syndrome: <BR>
<BR>
> You may want to look at the original post again. He said "Nursing"<BR>
> mothers, not "Expectant" mothers.<BR>
> I don't know if alcohol passes through breast milk, though.<BR>
<BR>
Yes it does. It does so in a manner that is, (at least according <BR>
to my lay understanding) similar to the way it is passed on to<BR>
the fetus. That's why I mentioned FAS, as an example of the<BR>
sort of risk a nursing mother who drinks may put her baby to.<BR>
Presumably the baby's risk is less than the fetus's risk both<BR>
because in's outside the womb and has a greater mass but it still<BR>
seems to me to be an unacceptable risk. (Of course since I<BR>
presumably will not ever nurse a baby my views of the risk may<BR>
be irrelevant).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:34:33 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson writes:<BR>
>A recent (sometime in the last year or so) Scientific American had an<BR>
>article on Alcohol through the Ages that discussed things like this.<BR>
>Basically everyone drank beer, because the water wasn't drinkable. <BR>
<BR>
	'Everyone' being people in heavily populated areas, presumably.<BR>
	Some things to keep in mind:<BR>
<BR>
		Making beer does not make water clean per se, but the<BR>
		water must be clean before you make beer with it.  If<BR>
		you can make beer, you can make clean water without beer.<BR>
		Once the beer is made, I presume that it will tend to<BR>
		resist contamination.<BR>
<BR>
		There are lots of places in the world today where<BR>
		population densities are high, water quality is low,<BR>
		and people do not get much of their water from beer (or<BR>
		any other fermented product).<BR>
<BR>
		Perhaps obviously, drinking beer is not a good way of<BR>
		hydrating yourself.  The contrary is more likely to<BR>
		happen (unless, perhaps, it is very weak beer).<BR>
<BR>
	So, what role would beer (or other drugs) play in various cultures?<BR>
	Is it safe to say that all human cultures would include some<BR>
	intoxicant?  What about Vargr?  Aslan?  K'kree?  Hiver?!<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:58:23 -0500<BR>
From: Eris Reddoch <eris@pcola.gulf.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
><BR>
> > It's also a matter of being *close* enough to hear them. The farther<BR>
> > away you are the more diffuse the shock cones are, and that means<BR>
> > they'll blend together if you are far enough away.<BR>
><BR>
> This is actually good. The PC's hear a rumbling noise<BR>
><BR>
>  'Booooooooooooo' Run for your lives! It's a Montana! 'ooooooommmmmm'<BR>
> ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I could have used this information a few days ago.  Now, I'll<BR>
have to rewrite history in a game. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 14:18:04 -0500<BR>
From: "Pat Connaughton" <pconn@i1.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer Stuff Help<BR>
<BR>
Touche' mon Cardinal!<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Leonard Erickson <shadow@krypton.rain.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2000 6:19 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer Stuff Help<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> > Douglas wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> >>I'm writing a piece about a law-enforcement organization atthe Imperial<BR>
> >>level, The Imperial Marshals Service, and need the following translated<BR>
> >>into legalese:<BR>
> >><BR>
> >>When the Marshal is investigating an Imperial crime, do whatever he says<BR>
or<BR>
> >>your ass is toast.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Here is my go based on two Earth documents<BR>
> ><BR>
> ><BR>
> ><BR>
> > I the Lord High Marshal of the Imperium<BR>
> > pursuant to the powers in that behalf vested<BR>
> > in me do hereby appoint<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Douglas Ebenezer Berry<BR>
> ><BR>
> > to be and officer of the Imperial Marshals Service<BR>
> > with full power and authority to do and perform<BR>
> > all such matters and things as are by any Imperial<BR>
> > Edict in force relating to the Imperial Court Service<BR>
> > or any other matter assigned to the Imperial<BR>
> > Marshal Service and hereby request and require<BR>
> > all and every member of the Imperial armed forces<BR>
> > or Scout Service and all others to aid and assist<BR>
> > the said<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Douglas Ebenezer Berry<BR>
> ><BR>
> > in all things and observe and obey all such orders,<BR>
> > instructions and directions as he may make<BR>
> > concerning any matter from time to time assigned<BR>
> > to the Imperial Marshal Service.<BR>
><BR>
> Gee, why not just say "By my hand, and for the good of the State, what<BR>
> the bearer has done has been done." :-)<BR>
><BR>
> --<BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
>  shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
> leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 11:56:15<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Filk pages<BR>
<BR>
At 10:37 AM 4/17/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>How much space do you need, there Doug? I'm sure that Downport or<BR>
>Freelance Traveller would be able to take up the slack...<BR>
<BR>
It's not so much a case of space, but the look of the page.  It was just<BR>
getting cluttered.<BR>
<BR>
But predictably, I have received impassioned pleas to both retain and<BR>
remove every single thing on the page.  So, I'm just going to try so<BR>
redesigns to open it up a little.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
<BR>
TML Great Old One<BR>
Plague of the Traveller Riders of the Apocalypse<BR>
Chant "Gridlore" thrice to summon.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:39:08 EDT<BR>
From: CardSharks@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/17/00 10:37:19 AM Central Daylight Time, <BR>
gridlore@pop.mindspring.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< <BR>
 But what if the Marshal is investigating abuses by the warrant holder?<BR>
  >><BR>
By definition there are no abuses (unless Strephon says so).<BR>
Then again, maybe he is investigating at Strephon's behest.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:22:12 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Pohl's 'Gateway' (SPOILER)<BR>
<BR>
Easy one Dom. Every force has an equal and opposite one (in the other<BR>
direction). The two ships are together, so anything pulling at them<BR>
pulls both. At the event horizon, they are in balance and nothing gets<BR>
past them, but if the two split up and one falls in towards the hole<BR>
then to keep the forces on the pair in balance the other must move in<BR>
the other direction with the same force. Since the force at the<BR>
horizon is f*!%ing big, the other ship moves away pretty sharply!<BR>
<BR>
Stephen Hawking has a great description of exactly this in "A Brief<BR>
History of Time".<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of<BR>
> SD Mooney<BR>
> Sent: 16 April 2000 17:31<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> I've just got a copy of Pohl's 'Gateway' ( a book that I had read<BR>
> about 15 years ago ), and was wondering if anyone can<BR>
> explain how the<BR>
> maneuver they pulled with the two ships to escape the singularity<BR>
> worked in layman's terms. (I'm being cagey here as I<BR>
> enjoyed the book<BR>
> and don't want to ruin it for anyone).<BR>
><BR>
> Cheers,<BR>
><BR>
> Dom<BR>
> ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
> "We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
> can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
> http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:14:01 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
<BR>
In **theory** (Turing: "Computation and computational devices") there<BR>
is no limit to the power of mechanical computers other than the limits<BR>
of computational theory (which is rather too complex to go into here).<BR>
Electronic computers are just **one** example of possible<BR>
computational devices - and even Alan Turing didn't think that<BR>
Colossus should have been electronic in the 1940s.<BR>
<BR>
Mechanical general purpose devices require several components that<BR>
**must** be there to work - a state recording system to identify the<BR>
current status of the process / device, a process control system (such<BR>
as the early punched weaving cards) to pass information into the<BR>
system, a process control record generation device (to change the<BR>
content of the control system) and a process management system to<BR>
check the current status, read the process control system next step,<BR>
change the status (if needed), move the process control backwards or<BR>
forwards by an amount determined by the current state and finally to<BR>
change / add / delete parts of the control process records. That is a<BR>
general description of a Turing Computational Device and it is<BR>
theoretically capable of carrying out **any** possible computation.<BR>
<BR>
Some of the things actually exist, although we use mostly von Neuman<BR>
Computational Devices these days - a special sort of limited Turing<BR>
device well suited to electronics. The limiting factor of Turing<BR>
engines is **always** the efficiency and speed with which the various<BR>
bits of it work - in your case, the mechanical capability of the<BR>
planet and its materials. You'd need to think about the engineering as<BR>
much as the computing, but I would say that the limits of wood would<BR>
make it unsuitable as well as too damn slow.<BR>
<BR>
There are wonderful real-life examples of such devices replacing<BR>
electronic computers here on Earth. My favourite is from the days when<BR>
the US and USSR first started to collaborate on space technology. The<BR>
first joint mission that involved astronauts linking ships in orbit<BR>
and moving between the two was an eye-opener for the States. At that<BR>
time, their orbital calculations computer cost several thousand pounds<BR>
and was a pig to work with - they had back-up on the ground to help in<BR>
case there were problems in orbit. When the Yank got into the Soyuz (I<BR>
think it was), they saw what appeared to be a 6" wide tin can in a box<BR>
with a spinning gyroscope and a piece of string whipping round in the<BR>
tin. Being helpful - and probably wanting to gloat a little - the<BR>
Soviets told the Yanks what it was at the end of the mission. Yup, it<BR>
was the Soviet orbital computer and cost maybe a hundred pounds. All<BR>
it could do was deal with the orbit, while the American one could do<BR>
much more - but the US has changed their system a lot since then and<BR>
the same tin-can system is still up there and working in the Mir<BR>
station.<BR>
<BR>
As a passing thought - did you know that back in the 40s when Colossus<BR>
was built one of the lady operators found a moth crushed in the<BR>
connections of one of the (mechanical) relays inside the machine?<BR>
Obviously, it stopped the system working properly, and ever since then<BR>
a computer problem has been known as a "bug".<BR>
<BR>
IMTU, there are mechanical computers all over the place - but they are<BR>
simple and limited in function. In my old CT campaign, Regina had<BR>
several of them, based around a crystal set, where a laser could be<BR>
used to knock out part of a crystal or encourage it to be filled in<BR>
from the surrounding liquid. The frequency that the crystals vibrated<BR>
at when a current was passed through them was used to measure the<BR>
system state. The lasers were fired by any current change along a<BR>
photo-electric current - so the devices were simple alarms that could<BR>
check for intrusion, but not be hacked from outside. Mechanical<BR>
computers do have their uses.<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Charles<BR>
> Collin<BR>
> Sent: 16 April 2000 03:09<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
><BR>
[snip]<BR>
><BR>
> 	So this got me thinking: Just how powerful could you make a<BR>
> mechanical computer?  What are the practical limiting<BR>
> factors?  The image<BR>
> in my mind is of PCs coming across a long-lost metal-poor<BR>
> colony which has<BR>
> been getting along at industrial levels using entirely<BR>
> wooden computers of<BR>
> immense size.<BR>
[snip]<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:52:43 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Norris' Evil Twin <BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Peter Newman [mailto:pnewman@gci.net]<BR>
<BR>
[1] Why is there no Identical Twins Anti Defamation League<BR>
to stage protests when soap operas overuse the evil twins<BR>
plot idea? If other minority groups can protest when they<BR>
are stereotyped why can't twins?><BR>
<BR>
There's no ITADL for the same reason that there's no highly-visible<BR>
Left-Hander's Union that strives to legislate changes on behalf of us<BR>
southpaws.  There's no protests that the English writing system is obviously<BR>
biased for righties (left to right writing leaves big ink/graphite smears on<BR>
us left handers - thank goodness keyboards are just as messed up for<BR>
righties).  There's no protests that most college desks are built with<BR>
righties in mind, or that there are never enough leftie scissors around, or<BR>
that guns tend to have the ejection port on the left side (giving us a<BR>
faceful of powder and maybe a shell), or that ergonomic mice tend to be<BR>
ergonomic for righties, or that cars are right-footed (as well as usually<BR>
having the gear shift on the right side), etc.  Instead of raising a stink,<BR>
we just knuckle down and deal with it (other minorities take note).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:17:58 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
<BR>
Mark Preston wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> As a passing thought - did you know that back in the 40s when Colossus<BR>
> was built one of the lady operators found a moth crushed in the<BR>
> connections of one of the (mechanical) relays inside the machine?<BR>
> Obviously, it stopped the system working properly, and ever since then<BR>
> a computer problem has been known as a "bug".<BR>
<BR>
Erm, it was Grace Hopper, the machine was the Mark II at Harvard, and<BR>
she taped the thing into the log book.<BR>
<BR>
But that wasn't the first reference to a 'bug' meaning flaw in a program<BR>
or machine.<BR>
<BR>
see:<BR>
<BR>
http://byte.com/art/9404/sec15/art1.htm<BR>
<BR>
here is a fragment of that log page:<BR>
<BR>
http://ei.cs.vt.edu/~history/Bug.GIF<BR>
<BR>
(I believe that the reference to 'First actual case of bug being found'<BR>
refers to that this is the first bug they found that, they knew were<BR>
shorting out and jamming their systems. They had suspected insects for<BR>
some time, but before this the corpses were either greasy black spots or<BR>
laying on the floor. This one was actually jammed into the relay)<BR>
<BR>
And while I'm gratuiously sraying url's around, a short biography of<BR>
Grace is here:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.agnesscott.edu/lriddle/women/hopper.htm<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:22:02 -0700<BR>
From: Cheryl <cheryl@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
<BR>
I once did a convention panel on an overview of what Law Enforcement in<BR>
space might look like. Here are some of my notes on the general topic.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
A. Special Conditions peculiar to periods of expansion:<BR>
1. Areas of sparse population. Colonies would probably initially be spread<BR>
widely on the most habitable worlds.<BR>
2. most populations would probably not be self supporting<BR>
initially<BR>
<BR>
B. Long distances between population centers create the following law<BR>
enforcement problems.<BR>
1. long communication lags in reporting crimes to authorities.<BR>
2. long response time by law enforcement to reported crimes.<BR>
3. lags between reporting of crime and enforcement response make flight by<BR>
the bad guys easier.<BR>
4.  inefficient communication between populations,  makes it easy to flee<BR>
and set up elsewhere, with the same scam or crime.<BR>
<BR>
C. Scarcity of resources- How would these affect attitudes and punishment<BR>
1. Food, water, air all valuable commodities in space. Traditional<BR>
incarceration expensive - makes lengthy adjudication undesirable.<BR>
2. Everyone is already living in a harsh environment<BR>
    a. personnel accustomed to scarce resources and cramped conditions will<BR>
not find modern forms incarceration particularly unpleasant.<BR>
b. people living in harsh unforgiving environments may tend to have less<BR>
sympathy for criminals.<BR>
<BR>
D. Personalities of pioneers- who goes into space?<BR>
1. forced emigration: overpopulation, prisoners, economic castoffs.<BR>
2.  voluntary emigration: adventurers, societal misfits, persons seeking<BR>
social/economic mobility, persons motivated by religious/intellectual<BR>
differences looking to found a new society.<BR>
3. personal character: adventurous, intelligent, willing to endure dangers<BR>
and hardships, independent, self-motivated, may be fleeing societal<BR>
restrictions.<BR>
<BR>
E. Cost of expansion into space may control the governmental type, including<BR>
law enforcement.<BR>
1. military personnel internally policed, subject to court marshal or<BR>
administrative punishment.<BR>
2. Company towns private security (modern trend-private security<BR>
increasing), possible civil punishment by contract (previously agreed to<BR>
terms).<BR>
3. government/punishment by consensus - citizens agree on legal forms, such<BR>
as trial by peers.<BR>
<BR>
Frontier law enforcement in history<BR>
A. Military  personnel internally policed, subject to court marshal or<BR>
administrative punishment.<BR>
B. Life boat/Naval law - power of the captain to take any action necessary<BR>
for the general safety of the vessel and its passengers.<BR>
C. Committee for Public Safety/Vigilantes - long historical tradition.<BR>
D. U.S. Marshal Service - modern functions: fugitives, enforcement arm of<BR>
federal courts, serve federal civil process, handle prisoners in federal<BR>
custody until they arrive at prison.<BR>
E. Mounties - integrated enforcement of all federal laws. Long "frontier"<BR>
history. <BR>
F. Bounty Hunters - low cost, efficient in pursuit.<BR>
<BR>
III.  Trends in Crime<BR>
A. Violent psychological crimes<BR>
B. White collar/Computer crimes<BR>
C. Organlegging for profit - rise of new crimes created by technological<BR>
advances. <BR>
<BR>
IV. Trends in Enforcement<BR>
A. Rise in private security<BR>
B. Return to "community policing"<BR>
C. Use of computers<BR>
D. New forensic techniques<BR>
E. Psychological profiling<BR>
F. Prevention/Treatment (possible)/Punishment- Will "crime" be preventable?<BR>
will rehabilitation be possible?<BR>
<BR>
V. As Seen in Movies<BR>
A. Blade Runner - variation on bounty hunter<BR>
B. Outland - government vs corporations, regional Marshal<BR>
C. Runaway, w/Tom Selek - local police as bounty hunters<BR>
D. Hang 'em High- Deputy U.S. Marshals (not in space, but very accurate<BR>
portrayal of how one might operate on a frontier.<BR>
<BR>
VI. As Seen in Books<BR>
A. Bova, Ben - Future Crime - short stories<BR>
B. Gibson, William Neuromancer -new crime (computer hacker)<BR>
C. Harrison, Harry - A Stainless Steel Rat is Born - traditional crime in<BR>
the future.<BR>
D. Heinlein, Robert - Time Enough for Love - Vigilantes, frontier justice.<BR>
E. Niven, Larry - The Long Arm of Gil Hamilton  Amalgamated Regional<BR>
Militia, ARM, new crime (organ legging)<BR>
F. Reynolds, Mack - Planetary Agent X - United Planets S/A.<BR>
G. Wilson, Colin - A Criminal History of Mankind Non-fiction, rise of<BR>
psychological crime.<BR>
<BR>
For sentimental reasons, as a former Deputy Marshal, I love the idea of<BR>
Marshals in space. However, Mounties in space would also be great. Our<BR>
Traveller game has used the IBI (Imperial Bureau of Investigation), which<BR>
shares many of the undesirable characteristics of the FBI. However, they are<BR>
far less charismatic than Marshals or Mounties.<BR>
<BR>
- -Cheryl Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:37:58<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
At 03:39 PM 4/17/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>By definition there are no abuses (unless Strephon says so).<BR>
>Then again, maybe he is investigating at Strephon's behest.<BR>
<BR>
Exactly.  Perhaps word has reached the Throne about some abuses by a<BR>
Warrant holder in in Ley, but there isn't enough evidence to be conclusive.<BR>
 So a Marshal is sent to investigate, with Warrant-like powers in<BR>
particular areas.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2319<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2320</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Monday, April 17 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2320<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
[none]<BR>
Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
RE: Pohl's 'Gateway' (SPOILER)<BR>
RE: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
RE: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
RE: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
RE: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
RE: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:42:10 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> At 09:57 AM 4/17/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >A recent (sometime in the last year or so) Scientific American had an<BR>
> >article on Alcohol through the Ages that discussed things like this.<BR>
> >Basically everyone drank beer, because the water wasn't drinkable.<BR>
> <BR>
> But you have to wonder about the first time...<BR>
> <BR>
> "Hey!  Rain seeped into one of tbe grain jars!  The grain is ruined and<BR>
> we've got this frothy, foul-smelling water now.  Anybody got a cup?"<BR>
<BR>
Try the Old Testament Text Adventure, and click on the "visit your<BR>
parents" option for details.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.princeton.edu/~ahutgoff/otadventure.html<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:38:54 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
>Sitting down and thinking about what happened to them, I find myself<BR>
>wondering what happened to us.<BR>
>And if this sort of thing is typical:<BR>
<BR>
Well, here's a look at the group I pulled together in 89 at the university<BR>
of AK:<BR>
Me: Substitute Teacher and Office/Clerical/ExecAsst for a Non-profit corp<BR>
SWJ: Still a sales clerk. Games with me off an on. Still in anchorage<BR>
JLJ: Stopped gaming, still a sales clerk, Married twice, divorced once, has<BR>
a 1yo child. Lives in a suburb of anchorage.<BR>
MM: Gamed with me off an on over the years. Asked to leave the group once.<BR>
Left once of his own accord. Married just over 2 years now. Still a college<BR>
student, at UAA.<BR>
RCM: Gamed with me up to about 2 years ago, when he left for the lower 48,<BR>
and became a telephone lineman.<BR>
R__: Can't remember his name, but he was in High school at the time. Now is<BR>
a techie  for a local (anchorage) ISP.<BR>
<BR>
My other group, from about 90<BR>
RGH: Got out of the Army NG, graduated from UAA, and is now a TC2 int the USCG.<BR>
RGP: Left alaska with his wife. Became a slum lord in Tennesee. Lost track<BR>
of him. (Padraig, where are you?)<BR>
SW: Left alaska in 95. Truck driver now, in the seattle area.<BR>
Creshnar: Still games (tho not with me), lives two blocks away. Retired US<BR>
Navy, sales clerk on the side.<BR>
Twisted: same as creshnar. (Same building even.) Manages said apartments<BR>
RCM and SWJ: Same two as above.<BR>
SJF: now has A&P cert. Haven't heard from himm since he passed his A&P<BR>
tests in summer 99.<BR>
TS: He's since become a bible-beater non-gamer. And finally got his<BR>
depression under control. Employed as a stock clerk, last I heard.<BR>
DH: Married (and later divorced) JLJ. Since turned to drugs and alchohol,<BR>
and got booted from the Army NG.<BR>
NSM: Been doing college and odd jobs since he graduated from high school.<BR>
Joind the army reserves, is currently away for 11mo on training.<BR>
Queball: Hasn't gamed much except MTG since he became a cook for AMF's<BR>
bowling alley. Now works for Wall-mart, as a greeter.<BR>
RK: Ummm, last I saw he was still gaming in town. Still doing inventory.<BR>
Jim: Last I heard, was doing the otaku thing... he's a Dr Who fanatical<BR>
fanboy. (His most memorable character was a thief-psionicist prentending to<BR>
be a cleric.<BR>
<BR>
and I've missed a couple. That group, with steady rotations amongst the<BR>
above lasted to about 93, and then morphed with the addition of the<BR>
following:<BR>
BWP: Last I heard, he'd left in 96, become an eco-sciences type.<BR>
RIR: Currently lost in California. El Cajon. Looking for traveller players.<BR>
Works for a XXX-video place.<BR>
DS: Still living with RIR. Still doing child care.<BR>
SM: Now finishing up a 1 year sentence for unlawful posession of a firearm<BR>
in Boston MA. Said firearm belogned to RCM.<BR>
SL: Divorced RCM. Gamed with my group for almost a year (Which included<BR>
RCM). Left for Arizona. CHanged her name, got remarried, started to game<BR>
again, lost touch. Was assistant instructor in a Dojo and also a Used Car<BR>
Salesperson.<BR>
<BR>
Naw, I don't think too many of my gamers have gone awry... and I've left<BR>
out the  97-98 additions.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:55:15 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: [none]<BR>
<BR>
>>> No, excellent adventure fodder!  (scribble, scribble, scribble..)<BR>
>><BR>
>>Well, I see the easy way out now:  the Warrant, having<BR>
>>no limitation except Strephon, cancels the investigation,<BR>
>>without which the Marshall is just a bureaucrat.<BR>
><BR>
>But what if the Marshal is investigating abuses by the warrant holder?<BR>
<BR>
THe marshal's a dead man. ;)<BR>
<BR>
Seriously, tho, the marshal will have NO AUTHORITY to investigate said<BR>
warrant holder, lest he be equally qualified with a warrant.<BR>
<BR>
You can't get much simpler that the text of imperial warrants:<BR>
<BR>
"Let it be known by these presents that one Xen Xanfired, scout, is acting<BR>
for the good of the Imperium and with the full confidence of His Imperial<BR>
Majesty, Strephon Alkhalikoi, and as such you shall render all available<BR>
aid to him at his request, persuiant to Edict number 97, until such time as<BR>
I should promulgate an expurgiation of this warrant.<BR>
<BR>
	[Signed] Strephon Alkhalikoi<BR>
		Strephen Alkhalikoi<BR>
		Emperor of the 3rd Imperium"<BR>
<BR>
If the marshal interferes at all, then  the warrant holder simply has the<BR>
marshal held for treason. Held in isolation, no less. Drugged and fed<BR>
through a tube, quite likely, and pumped full of psiono-suppressives. <Mr<BR>
Robinson's neighborhood mode> Can weez say "Thorazine Shuffle", boys and<BR>
Girls? I knews you could! </Mr Robinson's neighborhood mode><BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:10:22 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Frank Pitt writes:<BR>
>>Yeah, sorry, I knew that, typed "Monster Manual" instead of  "Dieties &<BR>
>>Demigods".<BR>
> <snipped><BR>
><BR>
>         I have been reading the TML for too long: for a moment, I thought<BR>
>         that you wrote "Ditzie & Demigods."  That could be a scarey book.<BR>
<BR>
In line with my book recommendation the other day, Ditzie and Telzey<BR>
would be a scary team. And if you throw in Trigger Argee (from the *nxt<BR>
book "TNT: Telzey & Trigger" due out in July) it just gets worse. :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:03:04 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> wrote<BR>
><BR>
>> The President of Guinness-Bass was on Fox News on St. Patty's day.<BR>
>> He actually said that Guinness is the single best thing a nursing mother<BR>
>> can drink because of all the iron, vitamins and minerals.<BR>
>> So "Guiness is good for you" is true, and those of us who call it<BR>
>> "mother's milk" are closer than we thought.<BR>
><BR>
> _No_!<BR>
><BR>
> You and he may want to look into Fetal Alcohol Syndrome:<BR>
<BR>
Re-read the above. He said *nursing* mother. That means the kid has<BR>
already been born. It also means that it's *damned* unlikely that she's<BR>
pregnant again.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:09:03 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
><BR>
>> Gee, why not just say "By my hand, and for the good of the State, what<BR>
>>  the bearer has done has been done." :-)<BR>
><BR>
> Nah, that's too easily understandable. No bureaucrat would write anything <BR>
> that simple. There's no comfortable vagueness to it. :)<BR>
<BR>
Oh really? I seem to recall a certain Cardinal bemoaning the one bit of<BR>
"vagueness" in it. :-)<BR>
<BR>
"Bearer" is *bad* choice of identifiers. <BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:39:39 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Pohl's 'Gateway' (SPOILER)<BR>
<BR>
At 16:39 -0400 17/4/00,  "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
>Easy one Dom. Every force has an equal and opposite one (in the other<BR>
>direction). The two ships are together, so anything pulling at them<BR>
>pulls both. At the event horizon, they are in balance and nothing gets<BR>
>past them, but if the two split up and one falls in towards the hole<BR>
>then to keep the forces on the pair in balance the other must move in<BR>
>the other direction with the same force. Since the force at the<BR>
>horizon is f*!%ing big, the other ship moves away pretty sharply!<BR>
<BR>
Check. Okay...<BR>
<BR>
So next question.<BR>
<BR>
The 'hero' believes that he has killed the other crew members during <BR>
separation. But the book is pretty clear that he was the one left in <BR>
the ship that was going to be dumped, or am I reading this wrong? Is <BR>
he just deranged, or did they just F*** it up big style as to which <BR>
ship was where?<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Stephen Hawking has a great description of exactly this in "A Brief<BR>
>History of Time".<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:41:18 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
<BR>
At 16:39 -0400 17/4/00, Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net> wrote:<BR>
>cars are right-footed (as well as usually<BR>
>having the gear shift on the right side), etc.  Instead of raising a stink,<BR>
>we just knuckle down and deal with it (other minorities take note).<BR>
<BR>
Nah, cars are usually left handed for the gear stick...<BR>
<BR>
Dom (*.uk)<BR>
<BR>
;-)<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 16:27:33 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
<BR>
Maybe I should have said "American cars."<BR>
The gas pedal is still on the right side, isn't it?<BR>
<BR>
Oh, looking over that post, it's the right side of a gun that usually has<BR>
the ejection port, not the left.  As a result I've had just about as much<BR>
practice shooting right handed as left (revolvers, on the other hand...)<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: SD Mooney [mailto:dom@cybergoths.u-net.com]<BR>
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 3:41 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: RE: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
At 16:39 -0400 17/4/00, Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net> wrote:<BR>
>cars are right-footed (as well as usually<BR>
>having the gear shift on the right side), etc.  Instead of raising a stink,<BR>
>we just knuckle down and deal with it (other minorities take note).<BR>
<BR>
Nah, cars are usually left handed for the gear stick...<BR>
<BR>
Dom (*.uk)<BR>
<BR>
;-)<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:31:38 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Ian Ferguson<BR>
> Sent: Tuesday, 18 April 2000 01:46<BR>
> To: traveller@mpgn.com<BR>
> Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> Frank Pitt writes:<BR>
> >Yeah, sorry, I knew that, typed "Monster Manual" instead of  "Dieties &<BR>
> >Demigods".<BR>
> <snipped><BR>
><BR>
> 	I have been reading the TML for too long: for a moment, I thought<BR>
> 	that you wrote "Ditzie & Demigods."  That could be a scarey book.<BR>
<BR>
Yaa!<BR>
<BR>
Multiple pages of Ditzie blasting various different demi-gods with a variety<BR>
of portable pieces of heavy ordnance, with underlining text extolling the<BR>
virtues of the particular piece of weaponry against this particular<BR>
pantheon.<BR>
<BR>
Sounds almost like a "Soldier of Fortune" calendar, though being good<BR>
citizens we would definitely be looking at the weapon and not the holder in<BR>
this case.<BR>
<BR>
Something for Jesse to work on when he's got nothing to do. <grin><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:37:38 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> wrote<BR>
><BR>
> > The President of Guinness-Bass was on Fox News on St. Patty's day.<BR>
> > He actually said that Guinness is the single best thing a nursing mother<BR>
> > can drink because of all the iron, vitamins and minerals.<BR>
> > So "Guiness is good for you" is true, and those of us who call it<BR>
> > "mother's milk" are closer than we thought.<BR>
><BR>
> _No_!<BR>
><BR>
> You and he may want to look into Fetal Alcohol Syndrome:<BR>
<BR>
Notice the word "nursing" in my post above?<BR>
<BR>
He didn't suggest drinking before or during nursing,<BR>
but afterwards to replace the iron.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:35:52 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Bruce Johnson<BR>
<BR>
> > It's also a matter of being *close* enough to hear them. The farther<BR>
> > away you are the more diffuse the shock cones are, and that means<BR>
> > they'll blend together if you are far enough away.<BR>
> <BR>
> This is actually good. The PC's hear a rumbling noise<BR>
> <BR>
>  'Booooooooooooo' Run for your lives! It's a Montana! 'ooooooommmmmm'<BR>
> ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Y'know, in New Zealand, Montana is a winery.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:35:52 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Bruce Johnson<BR>
<BR>
> > It's also a matter of being *close* enough to hear them. The farther<BR>
> > away you are the more diffuse the shock cones are, and that means<BR>
> > they'll blend together if you are far enough away.<BR>
> <BR>
> This is actually good. The PC's hear a rumbling noise<BR>
> <BR>
>  'Booooooooooooo' Run for your lives! It's a Montana! 'ooooooommmmmm'<BR>
> ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Y'know, in New Zealand, Montana is a winery.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:49:21 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 04:53 PM 4/16/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> >> No, excellent adventure fodder!  (scribble, scribble, scribble..)<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Well, I see the easy way out now:  the Warrant, having<BR>
> >no limitation except Strephon, cancels the investigation,<BR>
> >without which the Marshall is just a bureaucrat.<BR>
><BR>
> But what if the Marshal is investigating abuses by the warrant holder?<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Umm, corruption? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Easy answer:  Warrant issuer has to decide.  (Take an absent<BR>
Warrant issuer, and you've got a plausible legal backdrop<BR>
for rebellioun-type troubles, i.e., two factions, both with color<BR>
of authority and the resources to back it up).<BR>
<BR>
Actually, the Marshall better damn well have authority for the<BR>
investigation from a source superior to the the Warrant holder.<BR>
<BR>
Say Archduke X gives Sophont Y a Warrant with maximum<BR>
breadth.  Within X's domain, Sophont Y can trump any<BR>
investigation by a Marshall that originates in that domain's<BR>
jurisdiction.  So, if Marshalls need to investigate Y, they<BR>
need authorization for the investigation from the Emperor<BR>
(or that level of the Ministry, i.e., above the domain level<BR>
adminstration).<BR>
<BR>
But we can make this messier.  Say its Strephon.  He gives<BR>
Y a broad warrant, highest level of MoJ (presumably directly<BR>
responsible to Strephon and theorhetically the Moot) intiates<BR>
investigation of Y.  Making Strephon decide is the natural<BR>
choice here, but say he's gone?  Well, then I have only<BR>
two suggestions for Marshalls investigation Y:<BR>
<BR>
"Secrecy" and "Accidents Happen".<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:52:23 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >I intended it to be a step before Direct Imperial Power,<BR>
> >which is what the Emperor personally enjoys in this<BR>
> scheme.<BR>
<BR>
Then I ask:  "Whither the Moot?"  Is this constitution<BR>
meaningless?  Do you mean the Emperor can make<BR>
the law whatever he wants without the Moot?<BR>
Why . . . err . . . umm . . . MT anyone?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:54:22 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Strephon:  Ah, Chakropom, there you are.  Be at ease, and<BR>
> your retainers.  Seats.  We have called you here upon a<BR>
> matter of some urgency.  As you know, we issued our our<BR>
> Warrant to Colonel Kurtz to carry out a campaign against<BR>
> Zhodani forces who were threatening the Spinward Marches<BR>
> from the Trojan Reach.  Kurtz has let his power go to his<BR>
> head, and has set himself up as something of a god out<BR>
> there.  We have this hour rescinded and voided his Warrant.<BR>
>  We now commission you to go to the Trojan Reach, find<BR>
> Colonel Kurtz, and terminate his Warrant.  With extreme<BR>
> prejudice, you understand?  Now go; time is of the essence.<BR>
<BR>
I'm in!  Which chargen system do you want my character in?<BR>
<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:12:14 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Steve Daniels writes:<BR>
>>The President of Guinness-Bass was on Fox News on St. Patty's day.<BR>
>>He actually said that Guinness is the single best thing a nursing mother<BR>
>>can drink because of all the iron, vitamins and minerals.<BR>
> <snipped><BR>
><BR>
>         The President of Rothman's maintained that cigarettes are not<BR>
>         addictive, do not cause cancer, etc.  It is true that beer must<BR>
>         be made with sterile water (you only want certain yeast growing),<BR>
>         so it is safe to drink even if the local water supply isn't.<BR>
<BR>
More to the point, you *boil* the mix at one stage in the processing,<BR>
before you *add* the yeast.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:13:24 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food (OT)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 09:57 AM 4/17/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>A recent (sometime in the last year or so) Scientific American had an<BR>
>>article on Alcohol through the Ages that discussed things like this.<BR>
>>Basically everyone drank beer, because the water wasn't drinkable. <BR>
><BR>
> But you have to wonder about the first time...<BR>
><BR>
> "Hey!  Rain seeped into one of tbe grain jars!  The grain is ruined and<BR>
> we've got this frothy, foul-smelling water now.  Anybody got a cup?"<BR>
<BR>
More likely, they decided to eat the grain anyway (possibly because it<BR>
was all that was left) and got drunk on it!<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 15:20:54 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 5:55 -0400 17/4/00, Damage169@cs.com wrote:<BR>
>>"For every action, there is an equal but opposite reaction." See also,<BR>
>>"Recoil."<BR>
><BR>
> So the principle is that one ship with the two landers launches in <BR>
> and throws the other ship the opposite way? They thus use the <BR>
> reaction mass from both ships rather than one?<BR>
<BR>
They use one of the ships *as* reaction mass!<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:25:03 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> <BR>
> Stage 3:  The Imperial Court.  Emperor Strephon's private<BR>
> audience room.<BR>
> Door guard:  Duke Chakrapom and his retainers!<BR>
> Strephon:  Let them enter.<BR>
> Door guard:  His Imperial Highness orders you to enter and<BR>
> kneel!<BR>
> Duke and other PCs enter and kneel.<BR>
> Strephon:  Ah, Chakropom, there you are.  Be at ease, and<BR>
> your retainers.  Seats.  We have called you here upon a<BR>
> matter of some urgency.  As you know, we issued our our<BR>
> Warrant to Colonel Kurtz to carry out a campaign against<BR>
> Zhodani forces who were threatening the Spinward Marches<BR>
> from the Trojan Reach.  Kurtz has let his power go to his<BR>
> head, and has set himself up as something of a god out<BR>
> there.  We have this hour rescinded and voided his Warrant.<BR>
>  We now commission you to go to the Trojan Reach, find<BR>
> Colonel Kurtz, and terminate his Warrant.  With extreme<BR>
> prejudice, you understand?  Now go; time is of the essence.<BR>
<BR>
Why am I reminded of the "son of Santanocheev" thread of late December<BR>
1999?<BR>
<BR>
<<cue Martin Sheen:>><BR>
<BR>
"I wanted a mission, and for my sins they gave me one.  Brought it up to<BR>
me like room service.  It was a real choice mission, and when it was<BR>
over, I'd never want another."<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:49:53 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Mark Preston<BR>
<BR>
> In **theory** (Turing: "Computation and computational devices") there<BR>
> is no limit to the power of mechanical computers other than the limits<BR>
> of computational theory (which is rather too complex to go into here).<BR>
<BR>
The basic point is that anything that can be computed, can be be computed on<BR>
a universal Turing machine<BR>
The limit is that not eveyrthing is actually able to be computed.<BR>
<BR>
But one has to remember also that the Turing machine is not neccessarily the<BR>
best solution for a mechanical computer. For example, many NP-complete<BR>
problems, like the Traveling Salesman problem, are able to be computed much<BR>
more efficiently using a non-Turing mechanical computer.<BR>
<BR>
Hey, this just gave me an idea on solving the minimum jump distance problem,<BR>
which is basicaly just a variation on TSP. I'll simulate the mechanical<BR>
computer that solves this problem...but I'll have to brush up on my linear<BR>
algebra. Someone's probably done it before, but what the heck.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Mechanical general purpose devices require several components that<BR>
> **must** be there to work - a state recording system to identify the<BR>
> current status of the process / device, a process control system (such<BR>
> as the early punched weaving cards) to pass information into the<BR>
> system, a process control record generation device (to change the<BR>
> content of the control system) and a process management system to<BR>
> check the current status, read the process control system next step,<BR>
> change the status (if needed), move the process control backwards or<BR>
> forwards by an amount determined by the current state and finally to<BR>
> change / add / delete parts of the control process records. That is a<BR>
> general description of a Turing Computational Device and it is<BR>
> theoretically capable of carrying out **any** possible computation.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, it's not just theoretically capable of carrying out any possible<BR>
computation, it _is_ capable of carrying out any computation. The difficulty<BR>
is that the universal machine is itself a theoretical device, which can't be<BR>
built due to one part being infinite in size.<BR>
<BR>
A simpler description of the universal Turing machine is as follows, a<BR>
finite control process, an input "tape" divided into cells, and a tape head<BR>
that scans one cell at a time. The tape has a leftmost cell, but is infinite<BR>
to the right, like so :<BR>
<BR>
    ______________________________________<BR>
   |   |   |   |   |   |    |   |   |<BR>
   |___|___|___|___|___|____|___|___|______<BR>
                 ^<BR>
                 |<BR>
             ____|____<BR>
            |         |<BR>
            | Finite  |<BR>
            | Control |<BR>
            |_________|<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
The machine needs only to be able to perform three actions :<BR>
<BR>
1) change internal state between a finite, predefined set of states<BR>
2) print a symbol on a tape cell replacing what was was there<BR>
3) move it's reader head left or right one cell<BR>
<BR>
Unless people want a treatise on automata and Turing machines, ( I'll refer<BR>
those who are interested to "Introduction to Automata Theory, Languages &<BR>
Computation" by John Hopcroft and Jeffrey Ullman)<BR>
they'll just have to take my word for it that this "simple" system can<BR>
compute anything.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
> There are wonderful real-life examples of such devices replacing<BR>
> electronic computers here on Earth.<BR>
<BR>
One also has to remember there was a time before computers became portable<BR>
and cheap, and at that time mechanical computers were the only thing<BR>
available. Aircraft, for instance, didn't carry digital computers until the<BR>
late sixties at the earliest, and even now, many commercial aircraft still<BR>
carry simple mechanical computers as back-up for the fancy digital stuff.<BR>
<BR>
People only familiar with digital computers also need to be aware of analog<BR>
computers, as mechanical computers are more likely to be analogue than<BR>
digital.<BR>
<BR>
A good example is auto-pilots. An analog computer to fly a plane is _much_<BR>
easier to build than a digital one, precisely because all inputs and outputs<BR>
are themselves analog, so any digital system neccessarily requires two<BR>
conversion steps.<BR>
<BR>
The auto-pilots on pre-80's planes were anlogue computers, though some were<BR>
electro-mechanical analogue computers, such as the one on the Fokker F27<BR>
Friendship. The earlier ones were mechanical analogue computers.<BR>
<BR>
I have even worked on mechanical navigational computers and autopilots for<BR>
aircraft (the RNZAF had some very old planes <grin>). They primarily consist<BR>
of all the normal suck & blow intruments (mechanical pitot & static<BR>
instruments  used to determine airspeed, altitude, rate of descent/climb,<BR>
etc )providing analogue outputs via things like sextant gears, coupled up to<BR>
an air-driven gyroscope and a mechanical or servo-based feedback system<BR>
attached to the flight controls.<BR>
<BR>
> As a passing thought - did you know that back in the 40s when Colossus<BR>
> was built one of the lady operators found a moth crushed in the<BR>
> connections of one of the (mechanical) relays inside the machine?<BR>
> Obviously, it stopped the system working properly, and ever since then<BR>
> a computer problem has been known as a "bug".<BR>
<BR>
Just a point, the use of the term "bug" is reportedly older than that.<BR>
Specifically for computing, Ada Lovelace reportedly wrote about getting the<BR>
bugs out of the "programs" for the difference engine.<BR>
<BR>
I believe there are also earlier reference to similar concepts in<BR>
Shakespeare and perhaps even the Greeks.<BR>
<BR>
> Mechanical computers do have their uses.<BR>
<BR>
Most definitely. For TNE players, aircraft and starships can still have<BR>
auto-pilots for a start !<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2320<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2321</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Monday, April 17 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2321<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
The guy who designed those smart guns that sparked the flamefest<BR>
Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: OT Posts<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: OT posts?<BR>
Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
Re: Sonic Booms<BR>
Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
GT: Starports<BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
Re: Beer for food<BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Ditzie & Demigods<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Reavers Deep Sector<BR>
Re: <BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:26:04 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
<BR>
> From: Cheryl <BR>
> D. Personalities of pioneers- who goes into space?<BR>
> 1. forced emigration: overpopulation, prisoners, economic castoffs.<BR>
> 2.  voluntary emigration: adventurers, societal misfits, persons seeking<BR>
> social/economic mobility, persons motivated by religious/intellectual<BR>
> differences looking to found a new society.<BR>
> 3. personal character: adventurous, intelligent, willing to endure<BR>
dangers<BR>
> and hardships, independent, self-motivated, may be fleeing societal<BR>
> restrictions.<BR>
<BR>
I was working on a non-official Traveller setting recently.  Most of my<BR>
colonists tended to be super-patriotic conformists:  "the brightest and the<BR>
best" types, who were judged to be made of "the Right Stuff", and so on. <BR>
Untermenschen need not apply.  See _Lost In Space_ for further details...<BR>
<BR>
Of course this kind of thing would tend to break down after a couple of<BR>
generations, as the new migrants start to become outnumbered by the<BR>
native-born colonists.  But such native-born elements aren't necessarily<BR>
going to have any particular "frontier" characteristics, even though they<BR>
may have "frontier" skills.<BR>
<BR>
On general Law Enforcement IMTU:  my "Imperial Marshals" are IMOJ agents. <BR>
Most are grey-suited bureaucrats (FBI style), but some are very obvious<BR>
Darth Vader types, who come in with a large retinue of Combat Accountants<BR>
and review the performance of Imperial Warrant holders, planetary<BR>
governments, and other Very Dangerous People.  Of course, these people are<BR>
themselves nobles.  They don't go in until after the grey suits have proven<BR>
the need to do so.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:33:48 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
On films in general:  I enjoyed Galaxy Quest.  <BR>
<BR>
Its characters probably had more in common with most Traveller PC groups<BR>
than we would want to admit.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:31:25 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
<BR>
Scottish author Ken Macleod has a civilisation using nanotech Babbage<BR>
engines in one of his books.  This is a response to a bunch of AIs<BR>
("posthumans") on Jupiter sending out viruses that tend to mess up<BR>
electronics.  (Yes, there are affinities to TNE).  The book is called The<BR>
Cassini Division, and is quite cool.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:46:30 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: The guy who designed those smart guns that sparked the flamefest<BR>
<BR>
I was flicking through the April 1999 issue of Scientific American and<BR>
noticed that there was an article on the guy who designed those smart guns<BR>
that sparked the recent narrowly avoided g*n c*****l flamefest. <BR>
<BR>
It didn't go into the smart guns as such, but instead talked about the<BR>
electronic firing system that he uses.  Basically, it's electronic<BR>
triggering of a conventional propellant, which at the moment works better<BR>
than attempts to build gauss rifles.  <BR>
<BR>
I can't really give further details, because I don't have a copy of the mag<BR>
- - I found it in a local library - and I would sod up the details if I tried<BR>
to work from memory.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:20:54 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Skills<BR>
<BR>
>If I were to increase the total number of skills during character<BR>
>development would that have a negative,  positive or neutral effect on<BR>
>game play.<BR>
<BR>
Basically, you'll end up with either much more focussed characters, or<BR>
characters who are a whole lot less competant.<BR>
<BR>
Our original Scotty-type grease monkey might start with:<BR>
Engineering-4, Electronics-2, Mechanics-3<BR>
<BR>
and either end up as<BR>
Jump Drives-4, Transponder Systems-2, Welding-3<BR>
<BR>
or<BR>
Jump Drives-1, Manoevre Drives-1, Gravitics-1, Power Systems-1,<BR>
Sensor Systems-1, Comms Systems-1<BR>
Welding-1, Life-Support-2<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Personally, I'd say it had a negative effect. Now, the obvious counterstroke<BR>
would be to increase the number of skill levels available to characters<BR>
during the creation process. (That may have been included in what you<BR>
meant - I wasn't sure from the working of your post). This will give you<BR>
characters with much more detailed lists of skills - perhaps more realistic,<BR>
but it'll probably bog play down bit.<BR>
<BR>
But then, I feel the same way about the GURPS rule system. If you like<BR>
detailed rules, then it could be a good thing. If you subscribe more to the<BR>
'GM winging it' school of play (which ah do, sar) then it'll probably give<BR>
youmore detail than you want.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
Oh, you might want to consider the 'specialisation' approach. This has<BR>
varied from ruleset to ruleset, but the basic approach remains the same. You<BR>
keep the baseline skills, but allow optional specialisation, so your<BR>
engineer could have Engineer-3, or Engineer-2 (Gravitics-4). ISTR one system<BR>
gives you two additional levels in your specialist field for a cost of one<BR>
level outside of it (so Engineer-2 (Gravitics-5)), but how you do it's up to<BR>
each group.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:29:05 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
>Not very fast, efficient or even smart. You'd be better feeding fuel<BR>
>into the fusion plant and venting the plasma stream from that through<BR>
>your m-drive. Fusion is fast - but it would wreck the drive and I<BR>
>doubt anyone would actually let you land for repairs.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Uhh, isn't that what we call HEPlaR?<BR>
<BR>
And it either a) works great if your ship has HEPlaR chambers already, or b)<BR>
doesn't work at all if you use T plates, since there aren't any holes for<BR>
the Warm Hydrogen Products to come out of.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
Not really thinking straight - am very tired.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:34:25 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
>sanctions for disobedience to<BR>
>proper exercise of Imperial authority include, at the<BR>
>discretion of the local ranking Imperial officer:<BR>
>bombardment, partial or total; interdiction, partial or<BR>
>total; and loss of local governance for a period not to<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Sounds rather like a certain large primary-colour-flagged democratic nation<BR>
not a million miles from here (about 3000, actually), doesn't it?<BR>
<BR>
Please don't kill me - I'm only joking. I love America*.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
*To the security officer reading this - I'm only saying that so they let me<BR>
live. I love Britain really.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:00:53 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: OT Posts<BR>
<BR>
    Derrick Jones said:<BR>
<BR>
        Penguins? Off topic? What? Get a life, man!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
    Aargh - MIME!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:42:48 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
>Hmm. An early White Dwarf (well, Issue 70 Oct 1985) had an article on<BR>
>Bounty Hunters (Dead or Alive by Diane and Richard John p26-27) in<BR>
>it, and gave them a limited Imperial Warrent (Edict 97) to pursue<BR>
>those wanted by Imperial Authorities.  This would have the above<BR>
>effect.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I think I have an incomplete copy of this. I hadn't heard of Traveller in<BR>
1985 (or in fact any RPG except D&D - but I was only 5 so that's<BR>
forgiveable) (not for the first time, I feel really young on the list <g>)<BR>
but when I bought a second hand copy of MT it had a big pile of Phil Masters<BR>
articles and White Dwarf things in it as well.<BR>
<BR>
When I get back to Durham in a fortnight I'll have a scan through the stuff<BR>
and see if I still have it. I think I have the ship, but if I don't have the<BR>
Warrant then I might ask for a copy. Legalese is fun.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
Who makes a point of being nice to law students on the principle that it'll<BR>
probably pay off in the end.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:46:03 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: OT posts?<BR>
<BR>
>>marketed by a company based in the UK. They are 'The choclatiest biscuits<BR>
in<BR>
>>the world'. (did I say I like the green ones)<BR>
><BR>
>Damn.  I was afraid they'd be something that sounded very good but I<BR>
>wouldn't be able to get here in Oregon.  Now I'll have to search them<BR>
>out on the 'net!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Alright - I'm seeing a market here.<BR>
<BR>
The USA gets all the best RPGs, and gets them first. As well as things like<BR>
new series of Babylon 5, re-usable space launchers and suchlike.<BR>
<BR>
The UK has penguins.<BR>
<BR>
I'm willing to send consignments of Penguin biscuits to those of you in the<BR>
States who crave them, in return for any of the aforementioned items.<BR>
(Except a new series of Babylon 5. Season 5 was bad enough.) Particularly<BR>
FFS2, at the rate of success I'm having with the UKRPG industry...<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
Broker-5<BR>
Trader-4<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:52:51 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
>Tons: 500,000 std (SL Medium Rounded Cylinder Hypersonic)<BR>
>Dimensions: 486.5 m x 140 m x 140 m<BR>
>Volume: 7000000 m3<BR>
>Mass (L/C): 7583971 t / 7355155 t<BR>
><BR>
>Wonder what kind of sonic boom _Montana_ would make...?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
BOOM...<wait 1.62 seconds>...BOOM!<BR>
(On Earth, at RTP, anyway.)<BR>
<BR>
Other than that, can't say. Depends very much on the shape and the speed.<BR>
The supersonic regime is very very odd.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
NOT an aerospace engineer, but I have lived with two if that counts.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:37:55 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
>Off the top of my head, I can see two _major_ problems with this:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
But it does overcome a lot of problems with conventional armour.<BR>
<BR>
I take your points - it's not perfect, and it is ablative. But I think it's<BR>
still a good idea, if you could make it work.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, it strikes me that a close analogy would be explosive reactive<BR>
armour.<BR>
<BR>
(For the benefit of anyone who doesn't know what ERA is - apologies to all<BR>
you military nuts - it was discovered that a very effective defence against<BR>
shaped-charge warheads was a sloped block comprising steel plates with a<BR>
layer of explosive sandwiched between them. When the shaped charge hit this,<BR>
the penetrating jet of hot metal went through the outer plate and set of the<BR>
explosive filler, blowing the plates apart. Since the plates were sloped,<BR>
they moved across the line of the jet, presenting fresh metal to be burned<BR>
through and disrupting the jet. The Russians and Israelis went a bundle on<BR>
this, and their tanks were routinely festooned with these little sloping<BR>
boxes over the outside of their armour.)<BR>
<BR>
Anyway, the analogy.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, bits of armour fly off and might hit things. ERA was really really bad<BR>
for any infantry standing near or riding on the tank. But the tank probably<BR>
survived, and that was deemed more important. Besides, in an environment<BR>
where antitank missiles were flying around, there was every chance that<BR>
infantry riding on the tank were in big trouble anyway.<BR>
<BR>
So while bits of armour might hit things, the person wearing the armour is<BR>
probably okay, and that has to be the first thing a combat armour designer<BR>
has to worry about. (Though yes, it would be a major problem for police body<BR>
armour...) You;re worried about your squadmates? So buy suits of our armour<BR>
for everyone!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
And yes, eventually you'll wear my armour down. Tanks can run out of<BR>
reactive armour (and spraying them with HMG fire before firing your antitank<BR>
missile will do that nicely), but the point is that they'll have survived<BR>
those earlier attacks. If it takes two antitank missiles to kill my tank (or<BR>
I get five seconds warning from the machinegun fire - time enough to fire my<BR>
smoke launchers) then my tank's become a hell of a lot more survivable.<BR>
<BR>
So after maybe five or six chest shots you'll have cleared the armour off my<BR>
back. That's five or six direct hits in the torso that I've taken without<BR>
even inconveniencing me. If I'd been wearing ballistic weave I'd be on my<BR>
back now with a hell of a bruise collection. So maybe I still die. But it's<BR>
taken a lot more effort to kill me.  Besides, successive hits to<BR>
conventional armour will eventually batter their way through. Kevlar (and<BR>
presumeably ballistic cloth) is tough, but it takes damage.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>With armor, you're better off trying either to resist penetration (at<BR>
>least from kinetic rounds) or to deflect the round, instead of<BR>
>redirecting the energy in the manner described.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I suppose I'm making a bit of an assumption here - that this would, like<BR>
ERA, be layered over the top of some other protection.<BR>
<BR>
I'd happily sacrifice an AV point or two from battledress to gain this kind<BR>
of protection for the first half dozen shots or so,if 'twere possible. I<BR>
doubt I'd sacrifice by ballistic weave jumpsuit, but I'd take this as well<BR>
if such were an option.<BR>
<BR>
The advantage to deflecting the shot or resisting penetration is that the<BR>
protection lasts (although as mentioned above - still not for ever). On the<BR>
flip side, it won't stop blunt traumas, so you still get seriously<BR>
distracted (dammit!) when you get hit. Combining the two could get you the<BR>
best of both worlds.<BR>
<BR>
>>         My question is this:  What TL is this stuff?  Not being a<BR>
>> physicist or engineer I can't really get a handle on whether this is "the<BR>
>> edge of tomorrow" or "indistinguishable from magic".  Opinions?<BR>
><BR>
>IMHO, TL of this kind of material is largely irrelevant, since I can't<BR>
>see much practical use for this postulated material (at least as armor).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<wags finger>Tut tut. Don't be so narrow minded. Call yourself a gearhead?<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
P.S. - Tech Level? No idea  - but I don't think we're anywhere close. I'd be<BR>
tempted to say TL-16, which would explain why it hasn't appeared in canon<BR>
despite being a potentially useful technology. It would be fun to have as an<BR>
experimental material though.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:38:36 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits?<BR>
<BR>
>Obviously such machines would be _much_ slower than electronic<BR>
>computers.  OTOH, they would still be much faster than pencil-and-paper<BR>
>calculations, so they would be useful.<BR>
<BR>
Know anything about the Chinook?<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:47:05 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
>>   Now picture this:  Some PCs are on a planet surface in potentially<BR>
>>  hostile territory.  They see the glint of something entering the<BR>
>>  atmosphere and hear "BOOM... [3 seconds pass] ...BOOM".  Whoops, time to<BR>
>>  duck and cover! :-)<BR>
>><BR>
><BR>
>"It's the'MONTANA!"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Nah, it's just two Ramparts flying in line astern three seconds apart - but<BR>
we had ya worried, right?<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:50:28 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
>orbit, either natural or artificial, hasn't been catalogued. It would keep<BR>
>that multimillion credit satellite running long enough to do it's job. It<BR>
>would also be useful against non-energy based antisatellite weapons<BR>
>("marblethrowers" or "shotgun" anti-sat weapons).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I guess it would have to have an upper threshold on the kinetic energy it<BR>
could reroute (possibly related to thickness of armour), to prevent it from<BR>
becoming a game wrecking nukeproof invulnerability giver. (Like Plate Mail<BR>
+5...)  So you could pass-through rifle rounds (or maybe not even that), but<BR>
a tank main round would still spoil Mister Pongo's whole day.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 01:08:55 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: GT: Starports<BR>
<BR>
Just got my copy today (from Dungeons and Starships during an<BR>
hour-and-a-half layover in Birmingham - and even they didn't have FFS2 or<BR>
GURPS Vehicles...)<BR>
<BR>
I have looked upon it, and it is good.<BR>
<BR>
I don't play GURPS Trav, but the background information's easily up to the<BR>
standard of the other GURPS modules, and the artwork's excellent. (Well<BR>
done, Jesse.) Uhh - who is everyone on the cover, again?<BR>
<BR>
This book's proving useful at the moment, despite the fact that my current<BR>
project is detailing post-Collapse Ley Sector. Go figure....<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:14:30 -0300<BR>
From: Brian Quirt <baqrt@mta.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
<BR>
"Frank G. Pitt" wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Actually, it's not just theoretically capable of carrying out any possible<BR>
> computation, it _is_ capable of carrying out any computation. The difficulty<BR>
> is that the universal machine is itself a theoretical device, which can't be<BR>
> built due to one part being infinite in size.<BR>
> <BR>
> A simpler description of the universal Turing machine is as follows, a<BR>
> finite control process, an input "tape" divided into cells, and a tape head<BR>
> that scans one cell at a time. The tape has a leftmost cell, but is infinite<BR>
> to the right, like so :<BR>
> <BR>
>     ______________________________________<BR>
>    |   |   |   |   |   |    |   |   |<BR>
>    |___|___|___|___|___|____|___|___|______<BR>
>                  ^<BR>
>                  |<BR>
>              ____|____<BR>
>             |         |<BR>
>             | Finite  |<BR>
>             | Control |<BR>
>             |_________|<BR>
> <BR>
> The machine needs only to be able to perform three actions :<BR>
> <BR>
> 1) change internal state between a finite, predefined set of states<BR>
> 2) print a symbol on a tape cell replacing what was was there<BR>
> 3) move it's reader head left or right one cell<BR>
> <BR>
> Unless people want a treatise on automata and Turing machines, ( I'll refer<BR>
> those who are interested to "Introduction to Automata Theory, Languages &<BR>
> Computation" by John Hopcroft and Jeffrey Ullman)<BR>
> they'll just have to take my word for it that this "simple" system can<BR>
> compute anything.<BR>
<BR>
I hate to bring this up, but i think that it may have one more operation:<BR>
<BR>
0) Read the current location on the tape<BR>
<BR>
I might also change 1) to<BR>
<BR>
'change internal state...set of states BASED ON WHAT WAS READ IN STEP 0'<BR>
<BR>
- -Brian Quirt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:35:50 -0400<BR>
From: "Daniel Phelps" <phelpsd@gate.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Beer for food<BR>
<BR>
Was written:<BR>
<BR>
>As for wine, remember that in Greek and Roman times, the wine was made<BR>
>*quite* strong *and* sweet (for the sweet wines). Damn near a syrup,<BR>
>from the impression I get from some comments. They *never* drank it<BR>
>straight. Instead, everyone drank "watered wine". Wine cut with water<BR>
>to a greater or lesser extent.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Regarding wine is Classical Greece some where in my book case is a book<BR>
titled "The Road to Elysium" (sic).  It was written by a well know<BR>
ethno-botanist with the help of the Swiss biochemist who is credited with<BR>
the "discovery" of LSD.  To boil the text down they make the case for the<BR>
"Greek mystery" rites being connected not so much with alcohol but with an<BR>
alcoholic extraction of ergots "active ingredients" from tainted grains of<BR>
rye.  They make the case for the "type" and "strength" of wine mentioned in<BR>
classical Greek as being related to these practices.  My remembrance is that<BR>
they do an in depth analysis of the Homeric tale of of the Cyclops in the<BR>
Odyssey suggesting that there was more than just wine in that wine skin the<BR>
sailors gave old Mr.. One-eye.<BR>
<BR>
Regarding Roman wine making practices, several of the sources I have read<BR>
suggest that lead salts were added to some Roman wines as a "sweetener".<BR>
The works of Apicius, the first century author of "De Re Coquinaria" (On<BR>
Cookery) make abundant use of boiled down wine as an ingredient.   Regarding<BR>
drinking wine "straight" he has several recipes for spiced wines which are<BR>
not diluted.  Heated as a mulled wine to dilute the honey but not diluted<BR>
with water.   If any one wants I can proved the cites for several<BR>
translations of Apicius and possibly even a web site.<BR>
<BR>
Dan<BR>
<BR>
know in the SCA as Ld. Daniel Raoul le Vascon de Navarre'<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:28:24 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
<BR>
Neal Stephenson's book 'The Diamond Age' also uses nanotech babbage<BR>
machines. That is an interesting look at what pervasive nanotech does to<BR>
a society (or societies in that case) Definitely a good book, one of my<BR>
favorites of all the cyberpunk genre.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Scottish author Ken Macleod has a civilisation using nanotech Babbage<BR>
> engines in one of his books.  This is a response to a bunch of AIs<BR>
> ("posthumans") on Jupiter sending out viruses that tend to mess up<BR>
> electronics.  (Yes, there are affinities to TNE).  The book is called The<BR>
> Cassini Division, and is quite cool.<BR>
> <BR>
> Alan Bradley<BR>
> alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:34:49 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Steve Daniels wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> > Strephon:  Ah, Chakropom, there you are.  Be at ease, and<BR>
> > your retainers.  Seats.  We have called you here upon a<BR>
> > matter of some urgency.  As you know, we issued our our<BR>
> > Warrant to Colonel Kurtz <BR>
<BR>
> I'm in!  Which chargen system do you want my character in?<BR>
<BR>
You wake up, and look out the hotel window, bleary-eyed. <BR>
<BR>
"Capitol. Damn, I'm still only in Capitol..."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:13:19 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Ditzie & Demigods<BR>
<BR>
Ditzie (hero) - at age 10<BR>
<BR>
Armor Class: -8 (Battledress and Dex Bon)/ 4 Leather & Dex Bon<BR>
Move: 30" Battledress /15"<BR>
Hit Points: 80<BR>
Number of Attacks: 1 Battledress / 2<BR>
Damage: By Weapon type<BR>
Special Attacks: see below<BR>
Special Defenses: see below<BR>
Magic Resistance: Standard<BR>
Size: S (4'3")<BR>
Alignment: Chaotic Neutral<BR>
Worshipers Alignment: TML<BR>
Fighter: 7th Level<BR>
Thief: 4th Level<BR>
Monk: 5th Level<BR>
Bard: 8th level (only to talk about Guns)<BR>
Tinker (as Gnome): 18th Level + Special<BR>
Psionic Ability: VI + Special<BR>
S: 8 I: 20 W:4 D: 18 C: 17 CH: 16 (-7 to Pacifists)<BR>
<BR>
Ditzie is head of the High Energy Weapons Division<BR>
of Familium Spofulum.<BR>
<BR>
She possesses a variety of very powerful weapons typically <BR>
doing 5d10 - 20d10, although some of her weapons of mass <BR>
destruction may do millions od dice of damage. Ditzie is <BR>
specialized in the use of Big Guns and double specialized in <BR>
use of Really Big Guns and Unbelievably Big Guns. Ditzie is <BR>
proficient with all other weapons.  The Protection from Normal <BR>
Missiles spell is ineffective against any weapon created or <BR>
used by Ditzie. <BR>
<BR>
Ditzie possesses a Psionic talent for Telekinesis which gives <BR>
her STR 20 with respect to picking up and using Guns only.<BR>
<BR>
As a Tinker Ditzie is +10 Levels when making anything violent <BR>
and -10 levels when making anything nonviolent.<BR>
<BR>
Ditzie usually carries 1 Really Big or Unbelievably Big<BR>
Gun, 1d3 Big Guns, 1d3 Guns, 1 Knife, and 1d12 assorted<BR>
technological items she has invented. There is a 25% chance<BR>
that at any given time Ditzie has a (non magical but functionally<BR>
equivalent) random major relic. Ditzie will always carry<BR>
a communicator that functions as a Gate and has the ability<BR>
to Summon her patron, a mysterious demigod known only as<BR>
Uunncle Heenggie, 90% of the time.<BR>
<BR>
While Ditzie does not possess any clerical powers she is<BR>
worshiped as a Demigod by strange cultists who worship <BR>
the weapons she has created.<BR>
<BR>
Like many other Planar Powers Ditzie may be permanently slain <BR>
only on her home plane, an alternative Prime Material Plane <BR>
called the Third Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 02:17:17 +0100<BR>
From: "Derrick Jones" <dojones.whitestar@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
OK, I'm probably going to throw a spanner in the works here..<BR>
<BR>
My gaming group since early 80's<BR>
<BR>
Me	Contract Database Developer / IT Management*<BR>
IB	Chemical Engineer<BR>
PG	Royal Air Force A/F&P Engineer<BR>
DR	IR Taxation Investigator (dunno really, he won't tell me too much)<BR>
AA	Unemployed (Trainee IT Support)<BR>
IF	Electrician<BR>
NH	Unemployed (Ex Navy, Mech/Elec Engr)<BR>
PG	Electrician<BR>
AW	Librarian<BR>
BL	IR Taxation Officer<BR>
<BR>
and new to the group:<BR>
<BR>
DM	Project Engineer, BITS person (apparently)<BR>
<BR>
None of the group are female, but at least three of them regularly play female characters<BR>
(I'm getting worried about two of them!)  ;-)  (No offense is meant to anyone other than the<BR>
people I'm referring to, and they don't read this)<BR>
<BR>
So far I've not seen anybody else have unemployed people in their groups. If you count<BR>
myself who, as a freelance worker, only works occasionally (but gets well paid when work <BR>
comes in) then I have two long term and one regularly unemployed person in my group.<BR>
Maybe, it explains all the free time we have to organise gaming sessions...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Derrick<BR>
<BR>
Derrick Jones<BR>
St Helens<BR>
Lancashire UK<BR>
http://www.btinternet.com/~dojones.whitestar<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:51:56 -0400<BR>
From: "John Toth" <jrtoth@bbtel.com><BR>
Subject: Reavers Deep Sector<BR>
<BR>
Anyone know where I may find the Star data for the entire sector of Reavers<BR>
Deep?<BR>
<BR>
Any Milieu is alright, but the Year I will be pulling this into would be<BR>
1120.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks,<BR>
John T<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:52:23<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: <BR>
<BR>
At 01:55 PM 4/17/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>If the marshal interferes at all, then  the warrant holder simply has the<BR>
>marshal held for treason. Held in isolation, no less. Drugged and fed<BR>
>through a tube, quite likely, and pumped full of psiono-suppressives. <Mr<BR>
>Robinson's neighborhood mode> Can weez say "Thorazine Shuffle", boys and<BR>
>Girls? I knews you could! </Mr Robinson's neighborhood mode><BR>
<BR>
Ah, but here we enter the joys of feudal politics!<BR>
<BR>
Strephon, to the Minister of Justice and several military intel and scout<BR>
types.<BR>
<BR>
"Will no one rid me of this troublsome priest?"<BR>
<BR>
Sometimes, power cannot be used openly, and the Emperor has to keep smiling<BR>
as he plots his opponent's downfall.<BR>
<BR>
Remember, Dulinor was greeted as friend..<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2321<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Tuesday, April 18 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2322<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
Re: The guy who designed those ....(Longish and boorish Technophant)<BR>
Loving America (was: Re: Lawyer stuff help?)<BR>
Another Penguin Post<BR>
Re: Ditzie & Demigods<BR>
Re: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
Re: Filk pages<BR>
Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
Site Submission reminder<BR>
Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
Gauss Rifles (was The guy who designed those smart guns that sparked the flamefest)<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<no subject><BR>
Re: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Law Enforcement in Space<BR>
Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 18:53:15<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
<BR>
At 10:31 AM 4/18/2000 +1200, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Multiple pages of Ditzie blasting various different demi-gods with a variety<BR>
>of portable pieces of heavy ordnance, with underlining text extolling the<BR>
>virtues of the particular piece of weaponry against this particular<BR>
>pantheon.<BR>
<BR>
Sounds a bit like the latest Xxxeonphile...<BR>
><BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:08:06 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
>From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
> >I intended it to be a step before Direct Imperial Power,<BR>
> >which is what the Emperor personally enjoys in this<BR>
> >scheme.<BR>
You replied:<BR>
>Then I ask:  "Whither the Moot?"  Is this constitution<BR>
>meaningless?  Do you mean the Emperor can make the law <BR>
>whatever he wants without the Moot?<BR>
<BR>
I can immediately think of two likely responses:<BR>
<BR>
1) What constitution was that, counsellor?  We don't need<BR>
no stinking constitution.  We are the Imperial authorities.<BR>
 Are you talking treason? are you talking lese majeste? <BR>
You'd better watch yourself.  You're in the database now.<BR>
<BR>
2) The Moot's only power is to dissolve the Imperium.  As a<BR>
practical matter, the will of the Emperor and that of the<BR>
nobility check and balance each other somewhat, but if push<BR>
comes to shove ... see 1), supra.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 19:11:26 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
>From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
<BR>
>I'm in!  Which chargen system do you want my character in?<BR>
<BR>
Well, we have been talking about face to face actual<BR>
Traveller in San Francisco and San Jose for a while --<BR>
where are you located?<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:36:23 EDT<BR>
From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/17/00 8:24:19 PM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>
cheryl@travellercentral.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<<  Our<BR>
 Traveller game has used the IBI (Imperial Bureau of Investigation), which<BR>
 shares many of the undesirable characteristics of the FBI. >><BR>
<BR>
undesirable? How so? (I'm honestly curious; not trolling...)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:39:15 -0700<BR>
From: "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The guy who designed those ....(Longish and boorish Technophant)<BR>
<BR>
You may be referring to me...<BR>
<BR>
    Electro Static Discharge Ignition is nothing new in the firearms<BR>
industry. Most airborne cannon use electric priming systems (12-36 volt<BR>
power supplies) for safety and reliability.<BR>
<BR>
    As far back as 30 years ago, Smith and Wesson demonstrated a variant of<BR>
their M76 Submachinegun that used caseless ammunition that was electrically<BR>
primed. It used 6 volt lantern battery to power a coil type discharge<BR>
system. For a variety of reasons it was dropped, mostly due to the round<BR>
being too fragile.<BR>
<BR>
    About 18 years ago, a small German firm (Krico) did accomplish a first:<BR>
reliable electronic ignition using a conventionally primed round. The<BR>
KricoTronic was a .22 Caliber rifle that used a dual prong Cathode/Electrode<BR>
and a pair of 9 volt batteries to charge a capacitor to roughly 50,000<BR>
volts. The incident heat was enough to detonate the more sensitive priming<BR>
compound used in rimfire cartridges.<BR>
<BR>
    Through the years, a number of schemes were tried. In the late 70's<BR>
through the 80's the Army and Marine Corps toyed with a 7mm round that used<BR>
an electronic flashtube for a primer with mixed results. Remington was one<BR>
of the subcontractors.<BR>
<BR>
    In 1997, Remington showed a prototype rifle using electronic ignition<BR>
using a similar scheme as the Krico: what Remington was hoping for was to be<BR>
able to use conventionally primed centerfire rounds with this system. There<BR>
were problems with cold temperature ignition, and conductivity problems to<BR>
be overcome. In the end they designed a primer that would essentially jump a<BR>
gap to ignite the priming compound, instead of inducing spontaneous<BR>
combustion. Normal percussion (Boxer/Berdan) primers use lead styphnate,<BR>
which is fairly stable until subjected to shock. Remington isn't saying what<BR>
they are using, only saying that it is lead free, and stable across a wide<BR>
temperature range.  It is supposed to be within 10% of a conventional<BR>
primers burning characteristics.<BR>
<BR>
    The advantages of electric primers are many: no jolt of the striker to<BR>
upset the weapon...no waiting for the striker to hit the primer, etc...fewer<BR>
moving parts, and no complex mechanical trigger is required.<BR>
<BR>
    Electric trigger mechanisms have been around for more than 30 years:<BR>
they were used to trip a solenoid to release the striker. Hammerli of<BR>
Switzerland makes a piezo-electric trigger with a precision of  +/- .2<BR>
grams!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 4:46 PM<BR>
Subject: The guy who designed those smart guns that sparked the flamefest<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> I was flicking through the April 1999 issue of Scientific American and<BR>
> noticed that there was an article on the guy who designed those smart guns<BR>
> that sparked the recent narrowly avoided g*n c*****l flamefest.<BR>
><BR>
> It didn't go into the smart guns as such, but instead talked about the<BR>
> electronic firing system that he uses.  Basically, it's electronic<BR>
> triggering of a conventional propellant, which at the moment works better<BR>
> than attempts to build gauss rifles.<BR>
><BR>
> I can't really give further details, because I don't have a copy of the<BR>
mag<BR>
> - I found it in a local library - and I would sod up the details if I<BR>
tried<BR>
> to work from memory.<BR>
><BR>
> Alan Bradley<BR>
> alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:02:46 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Loving America (was: Re: Lawyer stuff help?)<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> <BR>
> Sounds rather like a certain large primary-colour-flagged democratic nation<BR>
> not a million miles from here (about 3000, actually), doesn't it?<BR>
> <BR>
> Please don't kill me - I'm only joking. I love America*.<BR>
> <BR>
> Nick<BR>
> +++<BR>
> *To the security officer reading this - I'm only saying that so they let me<BR>
> live. I love Britain really.<BR>
<BR>
Hey, if British historian John Keegan can say that he loves America<BR>
[_Fields of Battle_, (c) 1995], then you should be allowed to say the<BR>
same.<BR>
<BR>
BTW, I recommend Keegan's work to any TMLers who have an interest in<BR>
military history.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:08:33 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Another Penguin Post<BR>
<BR>
From ESPN's coverage of the Stanley Cup playoffs:<BR>
<BR>
http://espn.go.com/nhl/2000/20000417/recap/waspit.html<BR>
<BR>
The Pittsburgh Penguins, seeded #7 in the Eastern Conference, lead the<BR>
second-seeded Washington Capitals three games to none after tonight's<BR>
4-3 win.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:21:12 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Ditzie & Demigods<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Ditzie (hero) - at age 10<BR>
> <BR>
<<snips AD&D stats for Ditzie>><BR>
> <BR>
> Ditzie usually carries 1 Really Big or Unbelievably Big<BR>
> Gun, 1d3 Big Guns, 1d3 Guns, 1 Knife, and 1d12 assorted<BR>
> technological items she has invented. There is a 25% chance<BR>
> that at any given time Ditzie has a (non magical but functionally<BR>
> equivalent) random major relic. Ditzie will always carry<BR>
> a communicator that functions as a Gate and has the ability<BR>
> to Summon her patron, a mysterious demigod known only as<BR>
> Uunncle Heenggie, 90% of the time.<BR>
> <BR>
> While Ditzie does not possess any clerical powers she is<BR>
> worshiped as a Demigod by strange cultists who worship<BR>
> the weapons she has created.<BR>
<BR>
Note that Ditzie's worshippers include all employees of AuricTech<BR>
Shipyard's Design Bureau.  As a result, any failure to summon "Uunncle<BR>
Heenggie" may allow a 70% chance of summoning an AuricTech warship<BR>
[_Montana_-class: 30%; _St. Louis_-class: 20%; _Brooklyn_-class: 20%;<BR>
_Tuscaloosa_-class: 15%; _Gran Fenwick_-class: 10%; _Scandalous_-class:<BR>
5%].<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:54:56 -0700<BR>
From: Cheryl <cheryl@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
<BR>
on 4/17/00 7:36 PM, Sethkimmel@aol.com at Sethkimmel@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In a message dated 4/17/00 8:24:19 PM !!!First Boot!!!,<BR>
> cheryl@travellercentral.com writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> <<  Our<BR>
> Traveller game has used the IBI (Imperial Bureau of Investigation), which<BR>
> shares many of the undesirable characteristics of the FBI. >><BR>
> <BR>
> undesirable? How so? (I'm honestly curious; not trolling...)<BR>
> <BR>
If you were to survey local law enforcement officers or other federal law<BR>
enforcement agencies, you would learn that the FBI has the habit of taking<BR>
all the public credit for other peoples' work. Such as - local police<BR>
officers apprehend a bank robber after responding to a bank alarm and an<BR>
ensuing a high speed chase. The FBI, also notified of the bank robbery,<BR>
shows up at the local jail later in the day, and arrests the robber (who is<BR>
already in local custody) for federal charges of bank robbery, and then<BR>
announces to the press that the FBI has arrested the bad guy that robbed the<BR>
bank earlier that day. Although strictly true, it gives no credit to the<BR>
local guys that did all the real police work before the FBI arrived. The FBI<BR>
also takes all of the information that other agencies have on a case, and<BR>
then refuses to share their information with the other agency. The list of<BR>
ways in which "it's a one way street" just goes on and on.... But don't take<BR>
my work for it, ask a real street cop.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:11:56 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Filk pages<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 17 Apr 2000 13:35:35 -0400 (EDT), Bruce Johnson<BR>
<johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>How much space do you need, there Doug? I'm sure that Downport or<BR>
>Freelance Traveller would be able to take up the slack...<BR>
<BR>
I'm sure we could work something out...<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:00:54 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
Dom writes:<BR>
<BR>
>  At 5:55 -0400 17/4/00, Damage169@cs.com wrote:<BR>
>  >"For every action, there is an equal but opposite reaction." See also,<BR>
>  >"Recoil."<BR>
>  <BR>
>  So the principle is that one ship with the two landers launches in <BR>
>  and throws the other ship the opposite way? They thus use the <BR>
>  reaction mass from both ships rather than one?<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Dom<BR>
>  <BR>
That's it. And if the ship being sent outbound is significantly smaller than <BR>
the other ship, it should go significantly faster. I don't know the exact <BR>
math, but given an impulse to move a ship massing, say, 500 dtons one <BR>
direction at a speed of one should move a ship massing 250 dtons at a speed <BR>
of 2. Or is it 4 (halve the mass, quad the speed instead of double it)? <BR>
That's why they moved as much mass as possible into the inbound ship.<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:09:58 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Site Submission reminder<BR>
<BR>
I encourage all TML members who have web pages to list them with the<BR>
Netscape directory project<BR>
 http://dmoz.org/Games/Roleplaying/Systems/Traveller/ ].  Also, if you know<BR>
of any Traveller related sites or pages that are not listed there, please<BR>
take a minute or two to submit those, as well.  I am an editor of the<BR>
Traveller heading, but I do not have as much time as I'd like to scour the<BR>
web and enter URLs.  I am able to process submissions on a regular basis,<BR>
though, so please help me out.  I know there are many more than 92 sites to<BR>
be cataloged! :-)<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:59:11 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Double Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
Some Nameless Person and Nick Bradbeer write:<BR>
<BR>
>  >Tons: 500,000 std (SL Medium Rounded Cylinder Hypersonic)<BR>
>  >Dimensions: 486.5 m x 140 m x 140 m<BR>
>  >Volume: 7000000 m3<BR>
>  >Mass (L/C): 7583971 t / 7355155 t<BR>
>  ><BR>
>  >Wonder what kind of sonic boom _Montana_ would make...?<BR>
>  <BR>
>  <BR>
>  BOOM...<wait 1.62 seconds>...BOOM!<BR>
>  (On Earth, at RTP, anyway.)<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Other than that, can't say. Depends very much on the shape and the speed.<BR>
>  The supersonic regime is very very odd.<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
Given that (IIRC) the time stated as the period between sonic booms for the <BR>
40+ meter long space shuttle was about 0.5 seconds, and the "Montana" is over <BR>
12 times this length, the time between booms for the "Montana" would be more <BR>
along the lines of 6 seconds (notwithstanding additional sonic booms from <BR>
external fixtures, like barrels of weapon turrets, etc.)<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:10:43 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Gauss Rifles (was The guy who designed those smart guns that sparked the flamefest)<BR>
<BR>
> It didn't go into the smart guns as such, but instead talked about the<BR>
> electronic firing system that he uses.  Basically, it's electronic<BR>
> triggering of a conventional propellant, which at the moment works better<BR>
> than attempts to build gauss rifles.<BR>
> <BR>
> I can't really give further details, because I don't have a copy of the mag<BR>
> - I found it in a local library - and I would sod up the details if I tried<BR>
> to work from memory.<BR>
<BR>
Remington has an electrically fired version of their 700 series rifle, and<BR>
Voere sold a caseless electronic ignition system in the late 80s and early<BR>
90s.  The main advantage of electronic ignition is a reduction in 'lock<BR>
time', the time lag in a mechanical ignition system between the trigger<BR>
being pulled and primer detonating.  This lag can be detrimental to<BR>
precision accuracy, as the gun can wader off target minutely during the lock<BR>
time.  This is hardly and issue in military rifles where precision accuracy<BR>
is not require (we are speaking of general issue weapons, not sniper<BR>
rifles).<BR>
<BR>
Electronic ignition systems have no relationship with electromechanical<BR>
weapons.  These systems, generally divided into two broad categories--rail<BR>
or coil guns, use electromotive force to accelerate projectiles.  Their main<BR>
advatage over CPMs (Chemically Powered Munitions) is one of velocity.<BR>
Chemically power weapons are limited by the rate at which the propellant<BR>
gasses can expand, about 6000 f/s. EM guns have no such limit.<BR>
<BR>
Why is high velocity important?  For several compelling (to a small arms<BR>
designer) reasons.<BR>
    1. Flat trajectory.  At very high velocity, projectile have a very flat<BR>
ballistic arc at combat ranges.  This mean little or no need to correct<BR>
aiming for distance.<BR>
    2. More energy deliver to the target.  Energy increases linearly with<BR>
the mass of the projectile, but geometrically with the velocity.  Double the<BR>
velocity of a projectile and you get four times the energy.<BR>
    3. Hyper velocity projectiles produce radically more destructive wounds.<BR>
One a projectile passes the magic 1450 m/s (the speed of sound in tissue),<BR>
normally elastic tissue starts to behave like a solid.  Muscles and organs<BR>
'shatter', requiring new techniques of debridement and wound care.<BR>
    4. high speed high sectional density projectiles have superior<BR>
penetration.  Just the thing for dealing with ballistic armor.<BR>
<BR>
Off the subject a bit, but there is a promising gun technology that is<BR>
available now (or at least very near term) and essentially gives the kinetic<BR>
performance of the gauss rifle without the complex technology. Devoloped by<BR>
Hughes and a couple of competing aerospace firms, it is called CAP<BR>
(Combustion Augmented Plasma). It relies on the priciple that a plasma<BR>
stimulated working fluid (say water) can expand at a much faster rate than<BR>
conventional propellants.  And, because the current that generates the<BR>
plasma can be profiled, time/pressure curves can be optimized to fully<BR>
exploit the mechanical structure of a barrel.<BR>
<BR>
What does this mean? a test rifle based on a standard M-16 delivered double<BR>
the velocity with the same peak pressure as it's conventional parent.<BR>
That's about 1800 m/s, well above the threshold 1450 mentioned earlier.<BR>
Current technology requires a battery weighing about 5 lbs, but if current<BR>
trends continue, battery weight will drop by an order of magnitude in the<BR>
next decade or so.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, all this technology doesn't help the fact that the typical<BR>
infantryman (understandably)  can't hit the broad side of a barn when under<BR>
combat stress.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"It takes a child to raze a village.(matches help)."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:17:30 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
On 04/17/00 at 06:54 PM,  Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
>> Strephon:  Ah, Chakropom, there you are.  Be at ease, and<BR>
>> your retainers.  Seats.  We have called you here upon a<BR>
>> matter of some urgency.  As you know, we issued our our<BR>
>> Warrant to Colonel Kurtz to carry out a campaign against<BR>
>> Zhodani forces who were threatening the Spinward Marches<BR>
>> from the Trojan Reach.  Kurtz has let his power go to his<BR>
>> head, and has set himself up as something of a god out<BR>
>> there.  We have this hour rescinded and voided his Warrant.<BR>
>>  We now commission you to go to the Trojan Reach, find<BR>
>> Colonel Kurtz, and terminate his Warrant.  With extreme<BR>
>> prejudice, you understand?  Now go; time is of the essence.<BR>
<BR>
>I'm in!  Which chargen system do you want my character in?<BR>
<BR>
>:-)<BR>
<BR>
I thought the same thing. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:28:23 -0700<BR>
From: Scott Shafer <screamingjackass@earthlink.net><BR>
Subject: <no subject><BR>
<BR>
unsubscribe<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 02:16:42 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
<BR>
Sethkimmel@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In a message dated 4/17/00 8:24:19 PM !!!First Boot!!!,<BR>
> cheryl@travellercentral.com writes:<BR>
><BR>
> <<  Our<BR>
>  Traveller game has used the IBI (Imperial Bureau of Investigation), which<BR>
>  shares many of the undesirable characteristics of the FBI. >><BR>
><BR>
> undesirable? How so? (I'm honestly curious; not trolling...)<BR>
<BR>
It has all the problems of any sprawling federal bureaucracy:<BR>
mostly well-intentioned people, trapped in a red-tape nightmare,<BR>
underpaid, who lose their ideals from being bossed around by<BR>
power-hungry nincompoops who play politics to advance and<BR>
think they know better than everyone else. The visibilty of crime<BR>
magnifies the pressure, as does the tie to national politics<BR>
(and thus the political parties) from its position as a top executive<BR>
agency.<BR>
<BR>
Then we have the crazy-quilt of jurisdictions throughout the US.<BR>
Some districts are quite happy to have the FBI take care of<BR>
things, others are extremely hostile to it.  The problem is that<BR>
some people seem to care more about getting credit than for<BR>
the acting of solving or preventing crime, which can happen<BR>
at every level from dog catcher to Attorney General.  I've<BR>
worked with the US and District Attorney's Office, agents<BR>
of the FBI, DEA, Customs and US Marshall Service, as well<BR>
as officers of State, City, and County police.  Someone who<BR>
imported or smuggled illegal drugs into this country enters the<BR>
jurisdictional purview of ALL of those agencies.  And each<BR>
one wants to put the conviction on their own books.<BR>
<BR>
IMTU, once you get off a member world, things aren't<BR>
that complicated by half.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:45:06 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
><BR>
> Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
> > >I intended it to be a step before Direct Imperial Power,<BR>
> > >which is what the Emperor personally enjoys in this<BR>
> > >scheme.<BR>
> You replied:<BR>
> >Then I ask:  "Whither the Moot?"  Is this constitution<BR>
> >meaningless?  Do you mean the Emperor can make the law<BR>
> >whatever he wants without the Moot?<BR>
><BR>
> I can immediately think of two likely responses:<BR>
><BR>
> 1) What constitution was that, counsellor?  We don't need<BR>
> no stinking constitution.  We are the Imperial authorities.<BR>
>  Are you talking treason? are you talking lese majeste?<BR>
> You'd better watch yourself.  You're in the database now.<BR>
<BR>
I refer my learned brother to the Imperial Constitution [pp. 83-4,<BR>
Milieu 0 (Hard and soft covers)], often referred to by the title<BR>
"The Warrant of Restoration."<BR>
<BR>
> 2) The Moot's only power is to dissolve the Imperium.  As a<BR>
> practical matter, the will of the Emperor and that of the<BR>
> nobility check and balance each other somewhat, but if push<BR>
> comes to shove ... see 1), supra.<BR>
<BR>
I refer my learned brother to Article III of the Imperial Constitution,<BR>
which states in pertinent part:<BR>
"The recognized nobles of the Imperium [designated 'the Imperial<BR>
Moot'] shall provide their advice and counsel to the Emperor prior<BR>
to any legistlation or action by the Emperor."  [Quite a hamstring that<BR>
"prior" bit, if it were actually practiced].<BR>
<BR>
Intestingly, by the language of the document, the Moot needs<BR>
has no qualification on its power to dissolve the government.<BR>
By contrast, their power to disqualify Heirs Apparent requires<BR>
'just and proper cause'.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:45:41 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
><BR>
> >I'm in!  Which chargen system do you want my character in?<BR>
><BR>
> Well, we have been talking about face to face actual<BR>
> Traveller in San Francisco and San Jose for a while --<BR>
> where are you located?<BR>
<BR>
Boston, but I'm moving to SF soon, june/july.<BR>
<BR>
Though I am fond of the PBEM.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 23:15:36 -0700<BR>
From: "Trent Smith" <trentfs@ix.netcom.com><BR>
Subject: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
> >Sitting down and thinking about what happened to them, I find myself<BR>
> >wondering what happened to us.<BR>
> >And if this sort of thing is typical:<BR>
><BR>
Hmm.  Sounds like fun.  Let's see where all my former compatriots are from<BR>
my gaming group, ca. 1984-97:<BR>
<BR>
Me:  Living in Hollywood working low-end entertainment industry jobs.<BR>
Haven't played a game since summer of 97.<BR>
SG:  Physics doctoral student at Notre Dame.  Married.  Hasn't played since<BR>
97 (same game).<BR>
SB:  Considering returning to school to get an advanced degree in Turkish.<BR>
Living with a much older woman.  Hasn't played since 97 (same game).<BR>
JL:  Short-order cook, slum lord, part-time bookie, possible drug dealer.<BR>
Hasn't played since 97 (same game).<BR>
KA:  Perpetual undergraduate at Indiana University.  Hasn't played since 97<BR>
(or earlier).<BR>
DB:  Living in Bloomington, Indiana, but not as a student.  No direct<BR>
contact recently.  Presumably not still gaming.<BR>
TW:  Guitar teacher in Cincinnati, last I knew.  No contact since 97.<BR>
Presumably not still gaming.<BR>
BH:  Last I knew, History grad-student in St. Louis.  No contact in several<BR>
years.  Presumably not still gaming.<BR>
JF:  Last I knew, working as a Parole Officer in Worcester, MA.  No contact<BR>
in several years.  Presumably not still gaming.<BR>
MC:  Last I knew, working in a factory, possibly married.  No contact in<BR>
many years.  Presumably not still gaming.<BR>
<BR>
Most of these were people I went to Jr High/High school with.  The group<BR>
began to splinter after high-school graduation, but most of us still managed<BR>
to meet over summers and so forth, until I moved to L.A. full-time after<BR>
graduating college.  Towards the end gaming was mostly a pretext to get<BR>
together as a group of friends, which probably explains why, AFAIK, none of<BR>
us is still active with other groups.<BR>
<BR>
Trent<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 22:58:05 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> On films in general:  I enjoyed Galaxy Quest.  <BR>
> Its characters probably had more in common with most Traveller PC groups<BR>
> than we would want to admit.<BR>
<BR>
The alien characters, the actor characters, or both?<BR>
<BR>
I think that many Traveller PC's emulate both the pettiness<BR>
of the actors and the naivet of the aliens.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:13:30 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Law Enforcement in Space<BR>
<BR>
Cheryl wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>For sentimental reasons, as a former Deputy Marshal, I love the idea <BR>
>of Marshals in space. However, Mounties in space would also be <BR>
>great. Our Traveller game has used the IBI (Imperial Bureau of <BR>
>Investigation), which shares many of the undesirable characteristics <BR>
>of the FBI. However, they are far less charismatic than Marshals or <BR>
>Mounties.<BR>
<BR>
Bring in the Royal Imperial Mounted Police!  They'll chase their man <BR>
(woman/Vargr/Aslan/Hiver/unidentified multi-tentacled alien) wherever <BR>
they have to go, and they look cool in their dress uniforms.  And <BR>
they're polite.<BR>
<BR>
Now, transferring the Musical Ride into non-planetary space (i.e., a <BR>
ship) could be a bit tricky, but not impossible.<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
PS - My second choice would be for Marshalls though.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 00:26:56 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
<BR>
>Oh really? I seem to recall a certain Cardinal bemoaning the one bit of<BR>
>"vagueness" in it. :-)<BR>
><BR>
>"Bearer" is *bad* choice of identifiers.<BR>
<BR>
I concur.  "Bearer" is a potentially FATAL choice of identifiers. <BR>
You find out some one has one of these Imperial Warrants, kill him, <BR>
take the Warrant, and have the ability to justify killing the guy <BR>
under the conditions of the Warrant.  Not nice, but certainly <BR>
efficient.<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2322<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Tuesday, April 18 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2323<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Pohl's 'Gateway' (SPOILER)<BR>
Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
Re: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
RE: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
Re: Ditzie & Demigods<BR>
Re: Site Submission reminder<BR>
RE: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Re: Cloning<BR>
Skill Progression<BR>
Where are they now?<BR>
Trav Skills<BR>
FAS<BR>
Re: Law Enforcement in Space<BR>
Warrants<BR>
One mellion dollars<BR>
RE: OT posts?<BR>
Re: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics<BR>
Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Gauss Rifles (was The guy who designed those smart guns thatsparked the flamefest)<BR>
RE: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 02:08:17 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Pohl's 'Gateway' (SPOILER)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 16:39 -0400 17/4/00,  "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
>>Easy one Dom. Every force has an equal and opposite one (in the other<BR>
>>direction). The two ships are together, so anything pulling at them<BR>
>>pulls both. At the event horizon, they are in balance and nothing gets<BR>
>>past them, but if the two split up and one falls in towards the hole<BR>
>>then to keep the forces on the pair in balance the other must move in<BR>
>>the other direction with the same force. Since the force at the<BR>
>>horizon is f*!%ing big, the other ship moves away pretty sharply!<BR>
><BR>
> Check. Okay...<BR>
><BR>
> So next question.<BR>
><BR>
> The 'hero' believes that he has killed the other crew members during <BR>
> separation. But the book is pretty clear that he was the one left in <BR>
> the ship that was going to be dumped, or am I reading this wrong? Is <BR>
> he just deranged, or did they just F*** it up big style as to which <BR>
> ship was where?<BR>
<BR>
Action/reaction is *easy* to understand. Orbital mechanics *isn't*. <BR>
<BR>
If you are in orbit and shove something *hard* towards what you are<BR>
orbiting, the resulting orbits for *both* objects are rather less than<BR>
ideal for getting away. Things get weirder if you shove in various<BR>
other directions.<BR>
<BR>
So they may have *assumed* something and thus wound up in the wrong<BR>
orbit...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 02:17:22 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>Off the top of my head, I can see two _major_ problems with this:<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> But it does overcome a lot of problems with conventional armour.<BR>
><BR>
> I take your points - it's not perfect, and it is ablative. But I think it's<BR>
> still a good idea, if you could make it work.<BR>
<BR>
On the other hand, it's far *simpler* to have armor that has a<BR>
non-linear response. So shove slowly, it bends. Hit it with a high<BR>
speed projectile, and it's *rigid*.<BR>
<BR>
This means that you take the shock spread over your entire body. Which<BR>
means it'd take a *big* (or very, very fast) bullet to bruise you. <BR>
<BR>
Get hit by an anti-tank round and the sheer *shock* will kill you.<BR>
<BR>
So, the main differences between your idea and this is that the wearer<BR>
feels the shock (though greatly spread out) and that nothing flies off.<BR>
There's also the not so minor detail that materials required for this<BR>
are a lot more *possible*. <BR>
<BR>
While not being knocked down would be nice, it's not nice enough to<BR>
counter the other shortcomings... things like the pieces flying off<BR>
your armor cutting ammo belts or hitting other "carried" items.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 06:39:53 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net><BR>
Subject: Re: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
<BR>
Howdy!<BR>
<BR>
Dom noted:<BR>
> At 16:39 -0400 17/4/00, Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net> wrote:<BR>
> >cars are right-footed (as well as usually<BR>
> >having the gear shift on the right side), etc.  Instead of raising a stink,<BR>
> >we just knuckle down and deal with it (other minorities take note).<BR>
> <BR>
> Nah, cars are usually left handed for the gear stick...<BR>
> <BR>
When I visited England for a week last June and rented a car, I<BR>
discovered that the hardest thing to deal with was shifting wiht<BR>
my left hand. Everything else was straightforward, including which<BR>
side of the road to drive on (start by following the traffic).<BR>
The only other real wrinkle was giving directions: it settled down<BR>
to "left turn" = turn toward the driver's side. <BR>
<BR>
yours,<BR>
Michael<BR>
- -- <BR>
Michael and MJ Houghton   | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>
herveus@radix.net         | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>
Bowie, MD, USA            | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>
                          | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:25:21 +0100<BR>
From: Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Damage169@cs.com [mailto:Damage169@cs.com]<BR>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2000 5:01 AM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> Dom writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> >  At 5:55 -0400 17/4/00, Damage169@cs.com wrote:<BR>
> >  >"For every action, there is an equal but opposite <BR>
> reaction." See also,<BR>
> >  >"Recoil."<BR>
> >  <BR>
> >  So the principle is that one ship with the two landers launches in <BR>
> >  and throws the other ship the opposite way? They thus use the <BR>
> >  reaction mass from both ships rather than one?<BR>
> >  <BR>
> >  Dom<BR>
> >  <BR>
> That's it. And if the ship being sent outbound is <BR>
> significantly smaller than <BR>
> the other ship, it should go significantly faster. I don't <BR>
> know the exact <BR>
> math, but given an impulse to move a ship massing, say, 500 dtons one <BR>
> direction at a speed of one should move a ship massing 250 <BR>
> dtons at a speed <BR>
> of 2. Or is it 4 (halve the mass, quad the speed instead of <BR>
> double it)? <BR>
> That's why they moved as much mass as possible into the inbound ship.<BR>
> <BR>
> Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
I still don't understand how this is working...<BR>
<BR>
If the ships are attached then the gravity acts on them as a single<BR>
body, if they separate then the gravitational attraction on one has no<BR>
effect on the gravitational attraction on the other. Once they separate<BR>
they are two distinct bodies. The A/R of separation shouldn't be<BR>
affected by the prevailing gravity, as that was acting on each of them<BR>
equally.<BR>
<BR>
It's like saying that if I have two magnetic balls held together by<BR>
mutual attraction and I arrange them vertically held loosely by a pair<BR>
of scissors at the join. If I squeeze the scissors the balls separate<BR>
and one falls to the ground while the other flies off into space having<BR>
achieved escape velocity... <BR>
<BR>
it just doesn't make sense to me...<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:46:02 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Ditzie & Demigods<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> Ditzie (hero) - at age 10<BR>
<snip><BR>
> Alignment: Chaotic Neutral<BR>
> Worshipers Alignment: TML<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
LOL !<BR>
<BR>
I think that the alignment information could not be more correct. Chaotic<BR>
indeed...<BR>
<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:59:40 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Site Submission reminder<BR>
<BR>
Sword-Worlder wrote:<BR>
> I encourage all TML members who have web pages to list them with the<BR>
> Netscape directory project<BR>
>  http://dmoz.org/Games/Roleplaying/Systems/Traveller/ ].  Also, if you know<BR>
> of any Traveller related sites or pages that are not listed there, please<BR>
> take a minute or two to submit those, as well.  I am an editor of the<BR>
> Traveller heading, but I do not have as much time as I'd like to scour the<BR>
> web and enter URLs.  I am able to process submissions on a regular basis,<BR>
> though, so please help me out.  I know there are many more than 92 sites to<BR>
> be cataloged! :-)<BR>
<BR>
In the sub-category GURPS Traveller, shouldn't SJG's official page be a *-site?<BR>
<BR>
Seems logical to me...<BR>
<BR>
I have now submitted my own Traveller page.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 08:29:45 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
MJ Dougherty said:<BR>
<BR>
>I wonder... how many of the people you gamed with went on to have unusual<BR>
>careers? How many just couldn't escape and became game industry<BR>
>professionals.<BR>
<BR>
Let's see. No game industry professionals here. Plenty of unusual jobs<BR>
though:<BR>
<BR>
BE: Has gamed with me from the age of 9. He is currently a server, bartender<BR>
and brewery tour-guide at a high-class, high-price French restaurant.<BR>
<BR>
ES: My brother, got me into RPGs in the first place. Introduced me to CT at<BR>
a young, impressionable age. Currently a server at the flagship restaurant<BR>
of a major chain. Also does computer consultation for the local Vietnam<BR>
Veterans group. Also an aspiring writer, though he's in the process of going<BR>
back to college.<BR>
<BR>
J: Exterminator. He currently works with a number of gamers from another<BR>
group with whom I have had a little experience. He hangs out with a<BR>
different group with whom I have had some experience. I am currently<BR>
teaching him the dark arts of "old skool" DMing.<BR>
<BR>
JS: Administrative type person at the pest-control place mentioned above.<BR>
Due to a failed relationship with B, above, it is unlikely that she will<BR>
appear in my campaign. It's a shame, because she's a GM's dream as far as<BR>
players go.<BR>
<BR>
BE2: Doorman at a local strip club and last I heard was also working at an<BR>
art supply store.<BR>
<BR>
BF: Usually drops out of campaigns after the second or third session.<BR>
Minimum-wage slave at a local fast-food restaurant. Currently in search of a<BR>
dental plan.<BR>
<BR>
These folks are the members of my most recent group. There was group I<BR>
played in for a number of years in high-school (AD&D). I'm not sure what<BR>
happened to one of them (I consciously avoided him last time I saw him), but<BR>
as for the rest:<BR>
<BR>
ES: See above.<BR>
<BR>
SN: Stock broker. I keep trying to win him over to my new group, as he's an<BR>
excellent player, but he prefers AD&D.<BR>
<BR>
MT: Moved to Ireland got into some sort of serious trouble, then moved back<BR>
to America and headed out West. Last I heard he was a rock climbing guide<BR>
and had gotten married.<BR>
<BR>
GS: Last I heard he was back in college for some sort of business degree.<BR>
Haven't heard anything more, nor do I care to.<BR>
<BR>
I have played with other groups here and there, but listing all the players<BR>
I've ever played with is a task I'm not too sweet on. I'd prefer to forget<BR>
many of them (and I don't know what has become of most of them, anyway).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 22:39:28 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Cloning<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
> Subject: Cloning<BR>
> How about this: A Megacorp officer is disgraced and cashiered. The<BR>
> Megacorp had created True Children of this man, but now have a problem.<BR>
> The whole point of TC's is to have people on the spot who will make<BR>
> the same decisions under the same circumstances...and the Megacorp<BR>
> has just decided that this man's decisions are not valuable.  You can't<BR>
> just discard them, they cost a lot of money to create and raise...and<BR>
> you can't chop them up for parts, or sell them...what do you do?<BR>
<BR>
Lease them to FS.<BR>
<BR>
Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:06:52 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: Skill Progression<BR>
<BR>
Let's say, for example, you must roll higher than the skill level<BR>
you are rising to on 2d6.  Going to skill 1 requires a roll of 2+,<BR>
going to 3 requires a 3+, etc.  If you don't mind the half dice you<BR>
might want to use 1d6+1d3 (1.5d6) or 2d3 to make raising even<BR>
harder.  Or if you want to get a bit more complex, you have to roll<BR>
higher than *twice* the level you are raising to, ie going to 1<BR>
needs a 2+, going 2 to needs a 4+, a 3 needs a 6+ and so on.  Still<BR>
more complex (but more realistic) would be to use a controlling<BR>
Characteristic as a factor in these rolls, thus a high DEX PC would<BR>
have a better chance of raising for Dex based skills than low DEX<BR>
PCs.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
You're adding another roll for each skill, but what's one more. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
<BR>
- ----<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Eris, you sonofagun, that's so close to the house rule system I have been<BR>
using it's not funny. Okay here it is.<BR>
<BR>
Upon successful use of a skill that is of significance to the adventure, the<BR>
player places a check against that skill. At the end of the session, for<BR>
each checked skill, he/she rolls 2D6 and adds the skill's applicable stat<BR>
DMs*. If he/she gets equal or over  (current skill level plus 6) then he/she<BR>
gets experience points for that skill (1 exp if success by 0-1, 2 if success<BR>
by 2-3, 3 if success by 4-5 and 4 if success by 6 or more). A natural 12<BR>
means a minimum of 1 experience point.<BR>
<BR>
Once 10 exp is reached, they go up a level and experience goes back to zero.<BR>
<BR>
*In my system, stat bonuses are +1 every two points applicable<BR>
characteristic (or average of applicable characteristics if more than one)<BR>
is 7+, -1 for every point two points 7-.<BR>
<BR>
It's neat and it's just so easy (ring now).<BR>
<BR>
And of course, the thing is that those with high applicable stats will<BR>
progress faster than those without. Cool huh.<BR>
<BR>
Michael<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:12:03 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: Where are they now?<BR>
<BR>
>I wonder... how many of the people you gamed with went on to have unusual<BR>
>careers? How many just couldn't escape and became game industry<BR>
>professionals.<BR>
<BR>
In my current group, over half of us are in <ahem> the Men in Black Brigade*<BR>
<BR>
*I of course am the clerk who does nothing but move paper around**<BR>
<BR>
** Paperless office, my Aunt Fanny***<BR>
<BR>
*** English expression<BR>
<BR>
From my old group - one is a research biochemist (he has a tattooed pec),<BR>
one is a system administrator, one is a dental hygienist (girlfriend to the<BR>
biologist - she has a tattooed nipple) and one is an application programmer.<BR>
Is there a theme happening here or what?<BR>
<BR>
Michael<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:17:21 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: Trav Skills<BR>
<BR>
>Eg I have a Jump Drive skill of 4 and all Engineering skills serve as the<BR>
>others at (Jump Drive) minus 2. If I spend one skill level, I can raise a<BR>
>'served as' skill to that of my Jump Drive skill (minus two divded by 2).<BR>
So<BR>
>the grand total cost to get Engineering covering all the above aspects at<BR>
>level 4 is 9 (4 for initial skill and 1 each for the other others).<BR>
<BR>
No it isn't. The cost is 6.<BR>
<BR>
<inability to do maths shown to whole TML by phil k><BR>
<BR>
Good point - curse my weakness at maths. How about a 'can't go past level<BR>
four unless have two engineering skills at same level' or something.<BR>
<BR>
Michael (seriously considering just going to the letter M. It's simple and I<BR>
can copyright it*)<BR>
<BR>
*Joke<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:20:03 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: FAS<BR>
<BR>
FAS refers to a<BR>
constellation of physical, cognitive and behavioral abnormalities, which<BR>
can include, growth retardation, a distinct pattern of facial<BR>
dysmorphology, and mental retardation<BR>
<BR>
<snipped from phil><BR>
<BR>
I saw the acronym and thought someone was dissing the Federation of American<BR>
Scientists.<BR>
<BR>
I have been in the government for too long.<BR>
<BR>
M*<BR>
<BR>
*How cool is that, huh? huh?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 06:23:26 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Law Enforcement in Space<BR>
<BR>
Please note.<BR>
<BR>
Marshal has only one 'L'.<BR>
<BR>
Tod<BR>
<BR>
> Bring in the Royal Imperial Mounted Police!  They'll chase their man<BR>
> (woman/Vargr/Aslan/Hiver/unidentified multi-tentacled alien) wherever<BR>
> they have to go, and they look cool in their dress uniforms.  And<BR>
> they're polite.<BR>
> <BR>
> Now, transferring the Musical Ride into non-planetary space (i.e., a<BR>
> ship) could be a bit tricky, but not impossible.<BR>
> <BR>
> Red<BR>
> <BR>
> PS - My second choice would be for Marshalls though.<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:28:17 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: Warrants<BR>
<BR>
Pirate Warrant<BR>
<BR>
I, Thug Gorzon of Omega VII, have the power to seize anything or everything<BR>
on, and including, your ship. Please register any complaints, in person, to<BR>
the complaints office located through this Iris valve.<BR>
<BR>
<whooooosh><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
M<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:38:40 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: One mellion dollars<BR>
<BR>
There is nothing quite like surfing Traveller websites with a Dr Evil web<BR>
browser.<BR>
<BR>
'I've been an evil frikkin' Doctor for thirty frikkin' years'.<BR>
<BR>
Anyone got a Dr Evil-esq villain in a campaign? To quote a classic Oz movie,<BR>
he's 'going straight to the pool room'.*<BR>
<BR>
* Meaning; something that is an object of beauty; to be displayed.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:34:37 +0100<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: OT posts?<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> The USA gets all the best RPGs, and gets them first. As well as<BR>
> things like new series of Babylon 5, re-usable space launchers<BR>
> and suchlike.<BR>
><BR>
> The UK has penguins.<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm willing to send consignments of Penguin biscuits to those <BR>
> of you in the States who crave them, in return for any of the<BR>
> aforementioned items. (Except a new series of Babylon 5. Season<BR>
> 5 was bad enough.)  Particularly FFS2, at the rate of success<BR>
> I'm having with the UKRPG industry...<BR>
<BR>
Actually, we got a  better  deal  with  B5  ...  when  originally<BR>
released in the US (so I've read) the last  4  episodes  of  each<BR>
season were held back for 3 months due to some scheduling  SNAFU.<BR>
Although the UK run started later we had no such break and  would<BR>
actually see those last  four  episodes  *before*  the  US!  (All<BR>
except season 5, after TNT took over they insisted on a US  first<BR>
air.)  Also, we got  all  the  episodes  *in  the  right  order*,<BR>
something not true in some parts of the US *and*  very  important<BR>
for this show.<BR>
<BR>
Additionally, the UK has BITS (okay, so  now  BITS  products  are<BR>
also available in the US but that's a relatively recent thing).<BR>
<BR>
I say: defend your penguins, Nick.<BR>
Say "No" to penguin deportation!<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:23:31 EDT<BR>
From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Law Enforcement in Space (Long)<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/18/00 3:59:42 AM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>
cheryl@travellercentral.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<<  But don't take<BR>
 my work for it, ask a real street cop. >><BR>
<BR>
Ah yes; I was a street cop too. I remember the stories from the old timers (I <BR>
never got the pleasure of working with feebies...)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:01:21 +0100<BR>
From: "Peter  Scarrott" <peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics<BR>
<BR>
On 04/16/00 at 01:26 PM,  "MJ Dougherty" <martinjd@globalnet.co.uk> said:<BR>
<BR>
>It's around Easter time, and some thoughts just struck me.<BR>
>17 years ago (at Easter) I met up with a new bunch of gamers. My previous<BR>
>group - the first guys I gamed with - had disintegrated messily. We gamed<BR>
>for several years before all going off to university.<BR>
>Sitting down and thinking about what happened to them, I find myself<BR>
>wondering what happened to us.<BR>
<BR>
OK I'll give it a go, my original group from the early 80's is long gone,<BR>
but here's my present group.<BR>
Together since '95.<BR>
<BR>
Me : Retail Customer Services.<BR>
T : Retail Manager.<BR>
Si : Court IT Technician.<BR>
St : Production Line Technician.<BR>
G : Hospital IT support.<BR>
Sh : REME (Royal Electrical & Mechanical Engineers) Corporal.<BR>
R : University IT Technician.<BR>
B : Theatre Lighting, Explosives and Sound Engineer.<BR>
<BR>
Peter<BR>
http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
p.scarrott@btinternet.com<BR>
<BR>
IMTU: tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so  zh+<BR>
vi-<BR>
      And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR>
<BR>
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the<BR>
shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser<BR>
gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time to<BR>
die."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:32:28 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
> I guess it would have to have an upper threshold on the kinetic energy it<BR>
> could reroute (possibly related to thickness of armour), to prevent it from<BR>
> becoming a game wrecking nukeproof invulnerability giver. (Like Plate Mail<BR>
> +5...)  So you could pass-through rifle rounds (or maybe not even that), but<BR>
> a tank main round would still spoil Mister Pongo's whole day.<BR>
<BR>
Another way to put a limit on it is to stipulate that KERAM cannot send<BR>
out its "reactive fragments" with a greater velocity than the incoming<BR>
round (and that just feels right to me).  In that case, the armor could<BR>
only defeat rounds massing about half the armor's mass, assuming perfect<BR>
velocity transfer and assuming that only the side opposite the incoming<BR>
round can fragment effectively.<BR>
<BR>
To put a greater limit on it, reduce the velocity transfer efficiency.  If<BR>
the fragments can only fly out at 50% of the incoming round's velocity,<BR>
then the armor can only defeat rounds massing 1/8th its own mass (25% for<BR>
the velocity difference times 50% on the assumption that only the opposite<BR>
side can react).<BR>
<BR>
If the proportional speed of the fragments is very low, say 10%, then the<BR>
armor could only defeat rounds on the order of 1% the suit's mass.  For<BR>
2kg of armor, that means around 10 grams of bullet.  It could be that<BR>
KERAM is available at lower TLs, but with such low efficiency that it's<BR>
not useful.  It only becomes efficient enough to use around TL16-17. <BR>
<BR>
This all brings me to another point, which I was wondering about when I<BR>
sent the original KERAM post:  Doesn't this stuff violate conservation of<BR>
energy?  Someone suggested that it draw energy to work; that sounds<BR>
reasonable to me because of the vector changes.  On the other hand, the<BR>
net change in energy is 0, isn't it? <BR>
<BR>
Charles C.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:12:26 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 17 Apr 2000 17:44:47 +0100, SD Mooney wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Hmm. The bit that really annoyed me was when, faced with limited O2 <BR>
> supplies, a base in an uncertain condition, a potential survivor to <BR>
> find and no definite 02 generation capacity, they decide to take a <BR>
> break and raise the flag from the dust.<BR>
> <BR>
> That bit didn't work for me...<BR>
<BR>
I was mildly bothered by the lopsidedness of the micrometeorite incident.<BR>
The large habitable region of the ship suffers two punctures, while the<BR>
rest of the ship (which was mostly of the open-frame construction) suffered<BR>
scores and scores of them.  They were *lucky* to suffer just two strikes in<BR>
the habitat section...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Life would be easier if I had the source code.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:27:16 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Gauss Rifles (was The guy who designed those smart guns thatsparked the flamefest)<BR>
<BR>
Tod Glenn writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Off the subject a bit, but there is a promising gun technology that is<BR>
> available now (or at least very near term) and essentially gives the<BR>
> kinetic performance of the gauss rifle without the complex technology.<BR>
> Devoloped by Hughes and a couple of competing aerospace firms, it is called<BR>
> CAP (Combustion Augmented Plasma). It relies on the priciple that a plasma<BR>
> stimulated working fluid (say water) can expand at a much faster rate than<BR>
> conventional propellants.  And, because the current that generates the<BR>
> plasma can be profiled, time/pressure curves can be optimized to fully<BR>
> exploit the mechanical structure of a barrel.<BR>
<BR>
This sounds like what FF&S calls ETC (electro-thermal chemical) ammunition.  It<BR>
still doesn't have the velocities that a gauss rifle can in theory have, but<BR>
may be easier to construct.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:46:49 +0100<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
I can't claim to be in the same group I was with in high  school.<BR>
(I went to high school in Canada and now I'm  back  in  the  UK.)<BR>
But I do still keep in touch  with  them.  Meanwhile  my  current<BR>
group (for last several years) is as follows:<BR>
<BR>
Me - Computer  programmer/analyst  (specialising  in  minis   and<BR>
     mainframes for merchant banks)<BR>
R  - Building  Society  (UK  version  of  S&L)  mortgage  arrears<BR>
     manager (not  run-of-the-mill  reminders,  but  last  chance<BR>
     before they reposess your house)<BR>
S  - Small business auditor (book-keeping) (also he's my cousin)<BR>
G  - Government meat inspector (and member  of  Territorial  Army<BR>
     ... UK version of National Guard)<BR>
TB - PC support guy<BR>
TB2 - PC support guy<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
We did have a female in the group: the wife of  one  member,  but<BR>
she ran off with another member (now *not* in  our  group).  They<BR>
were:<BR>
<BR>
C  - High street bank clerk<BR>
F  - PC support guy<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> OBTrav (thinner than usual): Player characters are drawn from an<BR>
> out-of-the-ordinary segment of the populace. How many of us are<BR>
> potential PCs?<BR>
<BR>
I would say G as combat-type (for his TA experience),<BR>
            R as admin-type (and for his general chutzpah/moxie)<BR>
            Me as hacker-type (corp knowledge + pistol skill)<BR>
<BR>
(Although I'm not sure I have the self-confidence and temperament<BR>
for the PC lifestyle.)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:54:58 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
At 21:59 -0400 17/4/00, "Derrick Jones" <BR>
<dojones.whitestar@btinternet.com> wrote:<BR>
>So far I've not seen anybody else have unemployed people in their <BR>
>groups. If you count<BR>
>myself who, as a freelance worker, only works occasionally (but gets <BR>
>well paid when work<BR>
>comes in) then I have two long term and one regularly unemployed <BR>
>person in my group.<BR>
>Maybe, it explains all the free time we have to organise gaming sessions...<BR>
<BR>
Hmm. In my group until about two weeks ago, the student was <BR>
unemployed and one of the admin assistants was made redundant, but <BR>
got a temp contract a week later.<BR>
<BR>
Maybe it's a regional thing (FWIW Derrick and I live about 15-20 miles apart).<BR>
<BR>
Dom; BITS person, apparently.<BR>
<BR>
- ------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com--------<BR>
"Even in the most depressing dystopia, there's still the notion<BR>
that the future is something we build. It doesn't just happen.<BR>
You can't predict the future, but you can invent it. Build it." -<BR>
'Fallen Angels' Niven/Pournelle/Flynn ---All Rob Prior's<BR>
MacOS software @ http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2323<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2324</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Tuesday, April 18 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2324<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
RE: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
Re: OT posts?<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
RE: OT posts?<BR>
Ship Ownership in GURPS<BR>
RE: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Ship Ownership in GURPS<BR>
Re: Ship Ownership in GURPS<BR>
Re: Ditzie & Demigods<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Re: Ship Ownership in GURPS<BR>
Another favor<BR>
Re: Pohl's 'Gateway' (SPOILER)<BR>
Re: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
Alpha Crucis Sector<BR>
Action/Reaction (was Re: Pohl's 'Gateway')<BR>
Re: Law Enforcement in Space<BR>
Re: Ship ownership in GURPS<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:48:00 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
At 21:59 -0400 17/4/00,  "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
>I think I have an incomplete copy of this. I hadn't heard of Traveller in<BR>
>1985 (or in fact any RPG except D&D - but I was only 5 so that's<BR>
>forgiveable) (not for the first time, I feel really young on the list <g>)<BR>
>but when I bought a second hand copy of MT it had a big pile of Phil Masters<BR>
>articles and White Dwarf things in it as well.<BR>
<BR>
I was, er, 13.<BR>
<BR>
>When I get back to Durham in a fortnight I'll have a scan through the stuff<BR>
>and see if I still have it. I think I have the ship, but if I don't have the<BR>
>Warrant then I might ask for a copy. Legalese is fun.<BR>
<BR>
The article is two pages long, but doesn't have the text of the warrant.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:45:26 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Babbage computer limits? (OT)<BR>
<BR>
At 21:59 -0400 17/4/00, "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au> wrote:<BR>
>Scottish author Ken Macleod has a civilisation using nanotech Babbage<BR>
>engines in one of his books.<BR>
<BR>
Iain Banks and Ken Macleod are friends, and often travel for signings together.<BR>
<BR>
> This is a response to a bunch of AIs<BR>
>("posthumans") on Jupiter sending out viruses that tend to mess up<BR>
>electronics.  (Yes, there are affinities to TNE).  The book is called The<BR>
>Cassini Division, and is quite cool.<BR>
<BR>
The preceding books "The Star Fraction' and 'The Stone Canal' are <BR>
also very good. TSF if only because of the crash of the common global <BR>
operating system (DoorWaysTM) as a sub-plot. I'd recommend them all.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:42:32 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
At 21:59 -0400 17/4/00, "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au> wrote:<BR>
>On films in general:  I enjoyed Galaxy Quest.<BR>
><BR>
>Its characters probably had more in common with most Traveller PC groups<BR>
>than we would want to admit.<BR>
<BR>
Similarly Alien: Resurrection. I hated this as an Alien film, but <BR>
thought it was a great dramatisation of a Traveller PC group in <BR>
action.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:05:51 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
I haven't read the book, but from the posts I understand it has to do with<BR>
the tidal forces involved.  <BR>
While the two ships are locked together, the inner ship experiences a strong<BR>
"downward" (towards the singularity) pull while the outside ship experiences<BR>
a strong upward pull.  <BR>
The reason for this is that the center of gravity of the two ships is the<BR>
only spot that is traveling at the proper orbital velocity to get free-fall.<BR>
The upper ship is traveling at a faster speed then it's required orbital<BR>
velocity and the lower ship is travelling slower.  The effect becomes more<BR>
pronounced the further you are from the center of gravity of the two ships.<BR>
<BR>
The tidal effects are so strong because the 'gravity gradiant' around a<BR>
singularity is so strong.  When the two ships are released, the tidal forces<BR>
that were acting on the ships pulls the inner ship down while the outer ship<BR>
is flung away.<BR>
<BR>
Larry Niven's "Neutron Star" is a great story about tidal effects around a<BR>
dense mass (several characters in the first ship to approach a neutron star<BR>
are crushed to death in the nose of thier ship because of the tidal<BR>
effects).<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Matt Bond [mailto:MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk]<BR>
Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2000 4:25 AM<BR>
To: 'traveller@lists.imagiconline.com'<BR>
Subject: RE: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Damage169@cs.com [mailto:Damage169@cs.com]<BR>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2000 5:01 AM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> Dom writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> >  At 5:55 -0400 17/4/00, Damage169@cs.com wrote:<BR>
> >  >"For every action, there is an equal but opposite <BR>
> reaction." See also,<BR>
> >  >"Recoil."<BR>
> >  <BR>
> >  So the principle is that one ship with the two landers launches in <BR>
> >  and throws the other ship the opposite way? They thus use the <BR>
> >  reaction mass from both ships rather than one?<BR>
> >  <BR>
> >  Dom<BR>
> >  <BR>
> That's it. And if the ship being sent outbound is <BR>
> significantly smaller than <BR>
> the other ship, it should go significantly faster. I don't <BR>
> know the exact <BR>
> math, but given an impulse to move a ship massing, say, 500 dtons one <BR>
> direction at a speed of one should move a ship massing 250 <BR>
> dtons at a speed <BR>
> of 2. Or is it 4 (halve the mass, quad the speed instead of <BR>
> double it)? <BR>
> That's why they moved as much mass as possible into the inbound ship.<BR>
> <BR>
> Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
I still don't understand how this is working...<BR>
<BR>
If the ships are attached then the gravity acts on them as a single<BR>
body, if they separate then the gravitational attraction on one has no<BR>
effect on the gravitational attraction on the other. Once they separate<BR>
they are two distinct bodies. The A/R of separation shouldn't be<BR>
affected by the prevailing gravity, as that was acting on each of them<BR>
equally.<BR>
<BR>
It's like saying that if I have two magnetic balls held together by<BR>
mutual attraction and I arrange them vertically held loosely by a pair<BR>
of scissors at the join. If I squeeze the scissors the balls separate<BR>
and one falls to the ground while the other flies off into space having<BR>
achieved escape velocity... <BR>
<BR>
it just doesn't make sense to me...<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:26:42 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: OT posts?<BR>
<BR>
>Actually, we got a  better  deal  with  B5  ...  when  originally<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Well, I know that (and at the time got very smug with some US fans I know),<BR>
but I was really more after the T4 products, vital space-program items and<BR>
whatnot.<BR>
<BR>
>I say: defend your penguins, Nick.<BR>
>Say "No" to penguin deportation!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Good - that's one less rival exporter to worry about.<BR>
<BR>
So come on - anybody got any space copies of FFS2, CSC or an SRB around the<BR>
place?<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 09:51:20<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
At 10:45 PM 4/17/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> Well, we have been talking about face to face actual<BR>
>> Traveller in San Francisco and San Jose for a while --<BR>
>> where are you located?<BR>
><BR>
>Boston, but I'm moving to SF soon, june/july.<BR>
<BR>
*sigh*  I'll start working on it.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 10:49:57<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
At 05:42 PM 4/18/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Similarly Alien: Resurrection. I hated this as an Alien film, but <BR>
>thought it was a great dramatisation of a Traveller PC group in <BR>
>action.<BR>
<BR>
The best RPG movie of the last twenty years is "The Mummy."<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:49:23 +0100<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: OT posts?<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> So come on - anybody got any space copies of FFS2, CSC or an <BR>
> SRB around the place?<BR>
<BR>
"Space copies"?!!!  You mean the copy I have may *not*  be  rated<BR>
to survive exposure to vacuum?<BR>
<BR>
(Note to self: get 'space copies' of all Trav items  before  next<BR>
shuttle ride.  Also look into zero-G dice ... perhaps  magnetised<BR>
iron dice to roll against ship hull.)<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:44:44 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Ship Ownership in GURPS<BR>
<BR>
I've left my G:T rulebook in Durham. (Along with every other useful<BR>
possession...<sigh>)<BR>
<BR>
Does anybody have the details of how the Ship Patron and Ship Owner (mainly<BR>
the latter) advantages work? I believe the latter was resprayed in Far<BR>
Trader to allow for ownership of a business using exactly the same mechanic.<BR>
<BR>
But guess what - I've left Far Trader in Durham too...<BR>
Bum.<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:11:41 -0400<BR>
From: "VonRammen" <von_rammen@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>I still don't understand how this is working...<BR>
<BR>
>If the ships are attached then the gravity acts on them as a single<BR>
>body, if they separate then the gravitational attraction on one has no<BR>
>effect on the gravitational attraction on the other. Once they separate<BR>
>they are two distinct bodies. The A/R of separation shouldn't be<BR>
>affected by the prevailing gravity, as that was acting on each of them<BR>
>equally.<BR>
<BR>
Ah, but it's a question of vectors (at least to my layman's understanding).<BR>
<BR>
The ships are orbiting, or in a decaying orbit, around a black hole. This<BR>
means they are moving in a direction tangential to their orbit. The force of<BR>
gravitation on their combined mass is warping that motion in towards the<BR>
black hole.<BR>
<BR>
Now they release one of the landers. The remaining lander keeps its<BR>
momentum, tangential to the current orbit. However, it now weighs half of<BR>
what it did. The force of gravitaion is consequently less than what it was<BR>
when the other lander was attached. As a result, the remaining lander is now<BR>
moving faster than the black hole can pull it in, and so escapes.<BR>
<BR>
If I understand everything correctly, what makes this so dramatic in this<BR>
case is the extreme gravitational gradiant around the black hole. The inner<BR>
lander is close enough to the black hole that it gets pulled int (the<BR>
gravity is that much stronger), while the outer lander is just far enough<BR>
away. There are also tidal forces involved (The outer lander is actually<BR>
moving faster than the inner lander; normally, the length of the lander<BR>
wouldn't make this force noticable, but again the extreme gravity gradiant<BR>
magnifies the effect.) Cf. Niven's "Neutron Star."<BR>
<BR>
Fred Ramen<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:03:57 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
Nope.  Aliens is the best gamer movie of the last 20 years.  <BR>
Other candidates include the Terminator series, the Indiana Jones series,<BR>
the last two Star Wars movies (Empire and Jedi), Desperado, Highlander,<BR>
Bladerunner, etc.<BR>
<BR>
I'm afraid the Mummy falls far behind most of these in quality and plot.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Douglas E. Berry [mailto:gridlore@pop.mindspring.com]<BR>
Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2000 4:50 AM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
At 05:42 PM 4/18/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Similarly Alien: Resurrection. I hated this as an Alien film, but <BR>
>thought it was a great dramatisation of a Traveller PC group in <BR>
>action.<BR>
<BR>
The best RPG movie of the last twenty years is "The Mummy."<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:24:02 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Ship Ownership in GURPS<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: Nick Bradbeer <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
> I've left my G:T rulebook in Durham. (Along with every other useful<BR>
> possession...<sigh>)<BR>
> But guess what - I've left Far Trader in Durham too...<BR>
> Bum.<BR>
<BR>
I've looked all over Durham and can't find either of them ;-)<BR>
<BR>
- -Colin Michael<BR>
Durham, Maine<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:48:36 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Ship Ownership in GURPS<BR>
<BR>
>> But guess what - I've left Far Trader in Durham too...<BR>
>> Bum.<BR>
><BR>
>I've looked all over Durham and can't find either of them ;-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
How can you miss it? It's about eighty feet long, painted bright red with a<BR>
blue roll bar, and looks like a puking dog.<BR>
<BR>
And I thought losing my keys was embarrasing....<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:17:35 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Ditzie & Demigods<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 17 Apr 2000 21:59:53 -0400 (EDT), Peter Newman<BR>
<pnewman@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Ditzie (hero) - at age 10<BR>
<BR>
[etceterated for bandwidth]<BR>
<BR>
KEYBOARD!<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:19:24 -0500<BR>
From: tim@premier.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
> At 21:59 -0400 17/4/00, "Derrick Jones" <BR>
> <dojones.whitestar@btinternet.com> wrote:<BR>
> >So far I've not seen anybody else have unemployed people in their <BR>
> >groups. If you count<BR>
> >myself who, as a freelance worker, only works occasionally (but gets <BR>
> >well paid when work<BR>
> >comes in) then I have two long term and one regularly unemployed <BR>
> >person in my group.<BR>
> >Maybe, it explains all the free time we have to organise gaming sessions...<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In my group I am the unemployed since I am going for a dual <BR>
masters.  As for the rest of my group.<BR>
<BR>
This is my collage group of ten + years<BR>
<BR>
JA: Full Time EE consultant has masters in EE<BR>
JE  Full Time EE consultant but at a differeny company<BR>
JS  Full time Chemical Engineer at a chemical plant<BR>
JB  Works as a manager a book store<BR>
IG  Works for a Cable company may be recently unemployed I <BR>
have not talked to him in a couple of weeks<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Members who left<BR>
JB Working on a PHD in CE<BR>
CB/KB Are in Dallas CB working as an ME somewhere and KB is <BR>
a Librarian<BR>
T?/A? Both are still in school A? will start work on her masters of <BR>
Library and information science<BR>
<BR>
We have several others I have lost contact with.<BR>
Tim Reynolds<BR>
tim@premier.net <BR>
225-334-5063<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable <BR>
sexual disease.  It made you unsuitable for <BR>
a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.<BR>
<BR>
Terry Pratchett <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:22:20 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Ship Ownership in GURPS<BR>
<BR>
Since the word "durham" means "swamp on a hill" it has probably sunk out of<BR>
sight. :-p<BR>
<BR>
- -C<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Nick Bradbeer <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
> How can you miss it? It's about eighty feet long, painted bright red with<BR>
a<BR>
> blue roll bar, and looks like a puking dog.<BR>
><BR>
> And I thought losing my keys was embarrasing....<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:04:32 -0600<BR>
From: Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com><BR>
Subject: Another favor<BR>
<BR>
Being separated from my library has it's disadvantages:<BR>
<BR>
I need a kind soul to scan the maps from the Solomani Rim sector Booklet<BR>
(Supplement 10, _not_ Alien Module 6). and send them to me here at<BR>
lkw@io.com (or give me a pace I can FTP them from or make some other<BR>
arrangement to get them to me yesterday).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman<BR>
     Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>
     Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society  http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>
     SJ Games<BR>
     lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>
     (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>
     (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:50:22 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Pohl's 'Gateway' (SPOILER)<BR>
<BR>
At 12:56 -0400 18/4/00, shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) wrote:<BR>
> > The 'hero' believes that he has killed the other crew members during<BR>
> > separation. But the book is pretty clear that he was the one left in<BR>
> > the ship that was going to be dumped, or am I reading this wrong? Is<BR>
> > he just deranged, or did they just F*** it up big style as to which<BR>
> > ship was where?<BR>
><BR>
>Action/reaction is *easy* to understand. Orbital mechanics *isn't*.<BR>
><BR>
>If you are in orbit and shove something *hard* towards what you are<BR>
>orbiting, the resulting orbits for *both* objects are rather less than<BR>
>ideal for getting away. Things get weirder if you shove in various<BR>
>other directions.<BR>
><BR>
>So they may have *assumed* something and thus wound up in the wrong<BR>
>orbit...<BR>
<BR>
Is this like the loose height to gain speed thing?<BR>
<BR>
I think I'm going to have to read that copy of 'the fundamentals of <BR>
Astrodynamics' that is sitting on my shelf...<BR>
<BR>
Thanks,<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com--------<BR>
"Even in the most depressing dystopia, there's still the notion<BR>
that the future is something we build. It doesn't just happen.<BR>
You can't predict the future, but you can invent it. Build it." -<BR>
'Fallen Angels' Niven/Pournelle/Flynn ---All Rob Prior's<BR>
MacOS software @ http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:51:47 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
<BR>
At 12:56 -0400 18/4/00, Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net> wrote:<BR>
>When I visited England for a week last June and rented a car, I<BR>
>discovered that the hardest thing to deal with was shifting wiht<BR>
>my left hand. Everything else was straightforward, including which<BR>
>side of the road to drive on (start by following the traffic).<BR>
>The only other real wrinkle was giving directions: it settled down<BR>
>to "left turn" = turn toward the driver's side.<BR>
<BR>
US driver's side?<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:39:26 GMT<BR>
From: "Boris Cibic" <kafka47@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are they now? A study in gamer demographics.<BR>
<BR>
The voice of Generation-X speaks...ok, ok I do not believe in the Gen X <BR>
syndrome.  Where are we now?  Well, our group was intact until last year <BR>
when it imploded due not being able to keep the commitment alive for another <BR>
month (well, we had been playing since 1983 on and off).  Could it be <BR>
resurected?  Unlikely.  As the ref. I want to hand over the gloves but no <BR>
one was interested.<BR>
ME:  Quasi employed Library Clerk (going off to get my Masters so that I can <BR>
get a position of respect rather than a check in/out machine)<BR>
A:  Independent Business man (works only in summer...paints cottages, <BR>
boathouses, etc)<BR>
B: Unemployed psychatrist (just finished her PhD)<BR>
C:  Construction worker/brick layer/copy boy<BR>
D:  lawyer<BR>
E:  Library clerk (read:  full time check in/out machine)<BR>
   Pretty scary!!!!!! I guess there is some truth in the Coupland book or we <BR>
live in pretty dysfunctional times.<BR>
______________________________________________________<BR>
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 11:15:57 -1000<BR>
From: Lewis Roberts <lewis@mauigateway.net><BR>
Subject: Alpha Crucis Sector<BR>
<BR>
Hi,<BR>
<BR>
John Toth asked:<BR>
 <BR>
>Has anyone done publications or Work on the System 'Star410720'; Sub Sector 'F'; Sector 'Alpha Crucis'?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
The TNE list created the entire Alpha Crucis sector.  Stats are given for 1200<BR>
and 1117.  There were a fair number of world writeups.  We tried to use any<BR>
canon information we could find, but there wasn't much out there.  <BR>
<BR>
The sector is on the BARD pages at<BR>
http://www.downport.com/bard/bard/opal/opal10016.html<BR>
and the world writeups are at: http://www.downport.com/bard/bard/bardopal.html<BR>
<BR>
Subsector F is at: http://www.downport.com/bard/bard/opal/opal10005.html<BR>
<BR>
Lewis Roberts<BR>
- -------------------------------------------------<BR>
Q:What do prisoners use to call each other?<BR>
A:Cell phones.<BR>
<BR>
lewis@mauigateway.net  <BR>
- -------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:39:40 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Action/Reaction (was Re: Pohl's 'Gateway')<BR>
<BR>
Matt writes:<BR>
<BR>
> If the ships are attached then the gravity acts on them as a single<BR>
>  body, if they separate then the gravitational attraction on one has no<BR>
>  effect on the gravitational attraction on the other. Once they separate<BR>
>  they are two distinct bodies. The A/R of separation shouldn't be<BR>
>  affected by the prevailing gravity, as that was acting on each of them<BR>
>  equally.<BR>
>  <BR>
>  It's like saying that if I have two magnetic balls held together by<BR>
>  mutual attraction and I arrange them vertically held loosely by a pair<BR>
>  of scissors at the join. If I squeeze the scissors the balls separate<BR>
>  and one falls to the ground while the other flies off into space having<BR>
>  achieved escape velocity... <BR>
>  <BR>
>  it just doesn't make sense to me...<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Matt<BR>
>  <BR>
The problem with your example is that the force separating the two ships is <BR>
not external, it's a part of the ships. Okay, see if this will help. Get a <BR>
friend either much larger than you are or much smaller than you. Lock hands <BR>
then both push off at the same time. The heavier person will not move much, <BR>
while the lighter person might well have trouble keeping their feet under <BR>
them and will go flying backwards. It doesn't matter which person exerts the <BR>
greater force, the two forces are performing the same task (i.e., separating <BR>
two objects). Does this help any?<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:27:42 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Law Enforcement in Space<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Cheryl wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>For sentimental reasons, as a former Deputy Marshal, I love the idea <BR>
>>of Marshals in space. However, Mounties in space would also be <BR>
>>great. Our Traveller game has used the IBI (Imperial Bureau of <BR>
>>Investigation), which shares many of the undesirable characteristics <BR>
>>of the FBI. However, they are far less charismatic than Marshals or <BR>
>>Mounties.<BR>
><BR>
> Bring in the Royal Imperial Mounted Police!  They'll chase their man <BR>
> (woman/Vargr/Aslan/Hiver/unidentified multi-tentacled alien) wherever <BR>
> they have to go, and they look cool in their dress uniforms.  And <BR>
> they're polite.<BR>
<BR>
What about Scotland Yard?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:45:09 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Ship ownership in GURPS<BR>
<BR>
GT:FT says that if all the party is going to use the ship and it's needed for <BR>
the campaign make the point cost zero for the party....Its up to the GM but I <BR>
feel that's the easiest thing to do...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:54:26 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
>From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
<BR>
>I refer my learned brother to the Imperial Constitution <BR>
>[pp. 83-4, Milieu 0 (Hard and soft covers)], often <BR>
>referred to by the title "The Warrant of Restoration."<BR>
<BR>
I would refer my learned brother to Imperial history:  By<BR>
the late Imperial period, often called Milieu 1100, this<BR>
document is over 1,000 years old and is of little relevance<BR>
and less importance.  The original purpose of the Warrant<BR>
of Restoration was to legitimize Cleon's accession to<BR>
absolute power.  By the time of the Civil War it was<BR>
already essentially a dead letter.  Repeated reliance on<BR>
accession by right of assassination put a stake through its<BR>
heart.  Arbellatra, seeing the mood of the times, did not<BR>
try to turn back the clock and create a constitutional<BR>
polity.  Rather, her reforms served to concentrate more<BR>
power in the hands of the Emperor and the Imperial<BR>
Bureaucracy, and to dilute the power of the nobility at<BR>
levels above the local. <BR>
<BR>
>I refer my learned brother to Article III of the Imperial <BR>
>Constitution, which states in pertinent part:<BR>
>"The recognized nobles of the Imperium [designated 'the <BR>
>Imperial Moot'] shall provide their advice and counsel to <BR>
>the Emperor prior to any legistlation or action by the <BR>
>Emperor."  [Quite a hamstring that "prior" bit, if it were<BR>
<BR>
>actually practiced].<BR>
<BR>
First, see supra regarding the continued viability of the<BR>
Warrant of Restoration.  Second, advice and counsel are<BR>
much less than advice and consent.  The Emperor is free to<BR>
ignore any advice and counsel given.  Third, it is likely<BR>
that an Imperial edict has, in the intervening 1100+ years,<BR>
regulated the advice and consent clause out of existence. <BR>
For example, a requirement that advice and counsel be given<BR>
within a short time would vitiate this hamstring.  So, too,<BR>
would allowing the Emperor to set the deadline for advice<BR>
and counsel according to the needs of the Imperium.  <BR>
<BR>
>Intestingly, by the language of the document, the Moot <BR>
>needs has no qualification on its power to dissolve the <BR>
>government. By contrast, their power to disqualify Heirs <BR>
>Apparent requires 'just and proper cause'.<BR>
<BR>
I think this is a political compromise reached during the<BR>
establishment of the Imperium.  The Imperium functions<BR>
largely to benefit the nobility, and they should have the<BR>
power to dissolve it if it stops doing so.  Deciding who<BR>
sits on the Iridium Throne, however, is part of the day to<BR>
day governance of the Imperium, and not properly part of<BR>
the Moot's function.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2324<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2325</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	4/18/00 9:09:29 PM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 19 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2325<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
Re: Ship ownership in GURPS<BR>
Re: Law Enforcement in Space<BR>
Re: Ship ownership in GURPS<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Solomani Rim<BR>
Re: Action/Reaction (was Re: Pohl's 'Gateway')<BR>
Re: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
RE: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Warrants<BR>
Re: Marshals (was Lawyer stuff help)<BR>
Re: Post-humans<BR>
War References<BR>
Re: Another favor<BR>
Re: War References<BR>
CAP/ETC<BR>
Re Marshalls<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:58:11 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
>From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
<BR>
>Boston, but I'm moving to SF soon, june/july.Though I am <BR>
>fond of the PBEM.<BR>
<BR>
I never seem to have time for the PBEM, but let us know<BR>
when you're here.  There are rather a lot of us in the Bay<BR>
area.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:15:39 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
><BR>
>>Oh really? I seem to recall a certain Cardinal bemoaning the one bit of<BR>
>>"vagueness" in it. :-)<BR>
>><BR>
>>"Bearer" is *bad* choice of identifiers.<BR>
><BR>
> I concur.  "Bearer" is a potentially FATAL choice of identifiers. <BR>
> You find out some one has one of these Imperial Warrants, kill him, <BR>
> take the Warrant, and have the ability to justify killing the guy <BR>
> under the conditions of the Warrant.  Not nice, but certainly <BR>
> efficient.<BR>
<BR>
For what it's worth, I used to use the Cardinal as an example of<BR>
"lawful evil" to my D&D players. The defining moment being when<BR>
D'Artangan hands the Cardinnal the "warrant" and the Cardinal tears it<BR>
up. If he *wasn't* extremely "lawful", he could then have had the poor<BR>
boy executed. Instead, he honors the warrant and even gives him that<BR>
commision. <BR>
<BR>
"Villians" who have a code of honor are *far* more interesting to play<BR>
with. :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:19:37 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> This all brings me to another point, which I was wondering about when I<BR>
> sent the original KERAM post:  Doesn't this stuff violate conservation of<BR>
> energy?  Someone suggested that it draw energy to work; that sounds<BR>
> reasonable to me because of the vector changes.  On the other hand, the<BR>
> net change in energy is 0, isn't it? <BR>
<BR>
It doesn't violate conservation of energy, it violates *entropy*, by<BR>
taking the "diffuse" *heat* energy of a high speed impact and turning<BR>
it back into *directed* motion. <BR>
<BR>
It effectively "unscrambles the egg".<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:24:23 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I haven't read the book, but from the posts I understand it has to do with<BR>
> the tidal forces involved.  <BR>
> While the two ships are locked together, the inner ship experiences a strong<BR>
> "downward" (towards the singularity) pull while the outside ship experiences<BR>
> a strong upward pull.  <BR>
> The reason for this is that the center of gravity of the two ships is the<BR>
> only spot that is traveling at the proper orbital velocity to get free-fall.<BR>
> The upper ship is traveling at a faster speed then it's required orbital<BR>
> velocity and the lower ship is travelling slower.  The effect becomes more<BR>
> pronounced the further you are from the center of gravity of the two ships.<BR>
><BR>
> The tidal effects are so strong because the 'gravity gradiant' around a<BR>
> singularity is so strong.  When the two ships are released, the tidal forces<BR>
> that were acting on the ships pulls the inner ship down while the outer ship<BR>
> is flung away.<BR>
<BR>
A better way to put this is that tidal forces are the result of each<BR>
part of an *orbiting* body trying to follow the orbit which would be<BR>
appropriate for an object of its mass moving at its current velocity at<BR>
its current altitude.<BR>
<BR>
Around a black hole, the orbit of those two ships would be *very*<BR>
different if they weren't tied together. So when you cut the link, they<BR>
start *following* those different orbits. <BR>
<BR>
Parts of a body *closer* to the hole are moving *slower* than a freely<BR>
orbiting object at that distance would. Parts farther out are orbiting<BR>
*faster* than a freely orbiting body at that distance would.<BR>
<BR>
Now consider the fact that orbital velocity *decreases* as you go<BR>
outwards. Which is why when you cut the two ships loose from each<BR>
other, they don't necessarily move in the directions you'd expect.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:19:44 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Ship ownership in GURPS<BR>
<BR>
>GT:FT says that if all the party is going to use the ship and it's needed<BR>
for<BR>
>the campaign make the point cost zero for the party....Its up to the GM but<BR>
I<BR>
>feel that's the easiest thing to do...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I am aware of this. In this case it is not appropriate.<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:01:01 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Law Enforcement in Space<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >Our Traveller game has used the IBI (Imperial Bureau of<BR>
> >>Investigation), which shares many of the undesirable characteristics<BR>
> >>of the FBI. However, they are far less charismatic than Marshals or<BR>
> >>Mounties.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Bring in the Royal Imperial Mounted Police!<BR>
><BR>
> What about Scotland Yard?<BR>
<BR>
Why not all three?<BR>
<BR>
Marshalls, Mounties, and . . . what? . . . Inspectors?<BR>
Different in each Sector or Domain, to suit the tastes<BR>
of the Duke or Archduke.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:59:10 -0700<BR>
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Ship ownership in GURPS<BR>
<BR>
At 6:45 PM -0400 4/18/00, Qstor@aol.com wrote:<BR>
>GT:FT says that if all the party is going to use the ship and it's needed for<BR>
>the campaign make the point cost zero for the party....Its up to the GM but I<BR>
>feel that's the easiest thing to do...<BR>
<BR>
This works best for a "party" ship.  If one member of the<BR>
party gains some advantage for being the "owner" or captain<BR>
or such, then they probably should buy one of those advantages<BR>
or rank or something.  The premise of the advantages is that<BR>
the character has the ship and discretion on how to use it<BR>
(or gains profit from it or whatever).<BR>
<BR>
However, if the ship is part of the presumed setting of the<BR>
campaign, affects all player equally and gives the party<BR>
no advantage that hasn't already been factored in, then<BR>
yes, it is OK to give them a ship.  (That's the easy case,<BR>
the rules exists for the more difficult situations where<BR>
the GM wants to give players the option of buying a ship<BR>
and doesn't want to set the campaign around a certain ship)<BR>
<BR>
______________________________<BR>
summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>
(This is the net.  My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:03:59 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I would refer my learned brother to Imperial history:<BR>
<BR>
Aha!  Resorting to facts, are we?  "When you can't<BR>
win on the law, argue the facts."<BR>
<BR>
Don't bother me with facts!  I live in an Ivory Tower<BR>
on Ton Vorn, far above Sylea, and far removed from<BR>
the rest of the universe.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:25:09 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Solomani Rim<BR>
<BR>
Loren,<BR>
<BR>
JPEGs of Entire Rim sent (1.3 Mb data) separately.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:31:27 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net><BR>
Subject: Re: Action/Reaction (was Re: Pohl's 'Gateway')<BR>
<BR>
Howdy!<BR>
<BR>
> Matt writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> > If the ships are attached then the gravity acts on them as a single<BR>
> >  body, if they separate then the gravitational attraction on one has no<BR>
> >  effect on the gravitational attraction on the other. Once they separate<BR>
> >  they are two distinct bodies. The A/R of separation shouldn't be<BR>
> >  affected by the prevailing gravity, as that was acting on each of them<BR>
> >  equally.<BR>
> >  <BR>
Definitions:<BR>
<BR>
M - the "massive object"<BR>
A, B - the linked objects of "negligible" mass.<BR>
<BR>
M   A-B<BR>
<BR>
When arranged thus, object A is closer than B to M. Thus, the gravitational<BR>
force attracting A toward M is greater than that attracting B toward M. Being<BR>
of "negligible" mass, A and B barely attract one another - this component is<BR>
being ignored.<BR>
<BR>
Since A is being pulled to the left harder than B, there is stress on the link.<BR>
This link ensures that the A-B conjoined object orbits M as if it were a single<BR>
mass with the same center of mass.<BR>
<BR>
The presence of this stress means that, if the link were severed, the two<BR>
bodies would "fly apart". Body A would slow down and orbit closer, while<BR>
body B would speed up and orbit farther, with the total energy essentially<BR>
unchanged.<BR>
<BR>
If M is *really* massive, and the distance to A-B is relatively small, such that<BR>
the distance between A and B is a noticeable fraction of the distance between A <BR>
and B, then the stress could be considerable.<BR>
<BR>
In the case of low earth orbit (LEO), remember the tether experiment they did<BR>
with the shuttle? They let this ball out on a 10 mk string (more or less). <BR>
They did not have to have thrusters on the ball to get it to go. Once it got<BR>
a useful distance away (unsure on the specifics), the differential gravity<BR>
was sufficient to pull it further out.<BR>
<BR>
In addition, some satellites have been stabilized in a "face down" orientation<BR>
by means of a weight sutck out on a boom. Point the boom straight down and it<BR>
keeps the satellite's attitude reasonably stable.<BR>
<BR>
yours,<BR>
Michael<BR>
- -- <BR>
Michael and MJ Houghton   | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>
herveus@radix.net         | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>
Bowie, MD, USA            | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>
                          | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:54:29 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net><BR>
Subject: Re: Norris' Evil Twin<BR>
<BR>
Howdy!<BR>
<BR>
> At 12:56 -0400 18/4/00, Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net> wrote:<BR>
> >When I visited England for a week last June and rented a car, I<BR>
> >discovered that the hardest thing to deal with was shifting wiht<BR>
> >my left hand. Everything else was straightforward, including which<BR>
> >side of the road to drive on (start by following the traffic).<BR>
> >The only other real wrinkle was giving directions: it settled down<BR>
> >to "left turn" = turn toward the driver's side.<BR>
> <BR>
> US driver's side?<BR>
> <BR>
No, the side the driver is sitting on right now. That is to say,<BR>
turn left really meant turn right and vice versa. It was not nearly<BR>
as confusing as it may appear.<BR>
<BR>
yours,<BR>
Michael<BR>
- -- <BR>
Michael and MJ Houghton   | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>
herveus@radix.net         | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>
Bowie, MD, USA            | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>
                          | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:56:09 -0700<BR>
From: Bill <beast@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
<BR>
>Loren,<BR>
><BR>
>JPEGs of Entire Rim sent (1.3 Mb data) separately.<BR>
><BR>
>Dom<BR>
>----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
>"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
>can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
>http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR>
<BR>
Are we speaking of jpegs of the rim systems or a map of the rim <BR>
sectors or something entirely different??<BR>
<BR>
Bill<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:07:43 -0500<BR>
From: Richard Wilson <rtwilson@rollanet.org><BR>
Subject: RE: Pohl's 'Gateway'<BR>
<BR>
At 02:11 PM 4/18/00 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> >I still don't understand how this is working...<BR>
><BR>
> >If the ships are attached then the gravity acts on them as a single<BR>
> >body, if they separate then the gravitational attraction on one has no<BR>
> >effect on the gravitational attraction on the other. Once they separate<BR>
> >they are two distinct bodies. The A/R of separation shouldn't be<BR>
> >affected by the prevailing gravity, as that was acting on each of them<BR>
> >equally.<BR>
><BR>
>Ah, but it's a question of vectors (at least to my layman's understanding).<BR>
><BR>
>The ships are orbiting, or in a decaying orbit, around a black hole. This<BR>
>means they are moving in a direction tangential to their orbit. The force of<BR>
>gravitation on their combined mass is warping that motion in towards the<BR>
>black hole.<BR>
><BR>
>Now they release one of the landers. The remaining lander keeps its<BR>
>momentum, tangential to the current orbit. However, it now weighs half of<BR>
>what it did. The force of gravitaion is consequently less than what it was<BR>
>when the other lander was attached. As a result, the remaining lander is now<BR>
>moving faster than the black hole can pull it in, and so escapes.<BR>
><BR>
>If I understand everything correctly, what makes this so dramatic in this<BR>
>case is the extreme gravitational gradiant around the black hole. The inner<BR>
>lander is close enough to the black hole that it gets pulled int (the<BR>
>gravity is that much stronger), while the outer lander is just far enough<BR>
>away. There are also tidal forces involved (The outer lander is actually<BR>
>moving faster than the inner lander; normally, the length of the lander<BR>
>wouldn't make this force noticable, but again the extreme gravity gradiant<BR>
>magnifies the effect.) Cf. Niven's "Neutron Star."<BR>
><BR>
>Fred Ramen<BR>
<BR>
There was something similer in Niven's The Integral Trees.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Richard Wilson<BR>
<BR>
rtwilson@rollanet.org<BR>
<BR>
========================================================================<BR>
Humanity is not something we should aspire to. It is something we should<BR>
strive to overcome.<BR>
========================================================================<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:16:19 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
> >> Strephon:  Ah, Chakropom, there you are.  Be at ease, and<BR>
> >> your retainers.  Seats.  We have called you here upon a<BR>
> >> matter of some urgency.  As you know, we issued our our<BR>
> >> Warrant to Colonel Kurtz to carry out a campaign against<BR>
> >> Zhodani forces who were threatening the Spinward Marches<BR>
> >> from the Trojan Reach.  <BR>
<BR>
I see that someone else has been rereading Leviathan.<BR>
<BR>
Kurtz has let his power go to his<BR>
> >> head, and has set himself up as something of a god out<BR>
> >> there.  We have this hour rescinded and voided his Warrant.<BR>
> >>  We now commission you to go to the Trojan Reach, find<BR>
> >> Colonel Kurtz, and terminate his Warrant.  With extreme<BR>
> >> prejudice, you understand?  Now go; time is of the essence.<BR>
<BR>
> >I'm in!  Which chargen system do you want my character in?<BR>
> >:-)<BR>
<BR>
> I thought the same thing. <g><BR>
<BR>
For true Evil Genius (TM) Refereeing you could recruit two<BR>
groups of PC's: one for Chakropom's group and one for<BR>
Kurtz's group.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:39:46 -0700<BR>
From: Bill <beast@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
>eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote<BR>
><BR>
> > Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> said:<BR>
><BR>
> > >> Strephon:  Ah, Chakropom, there you are.  Be at ease, and<BR>
> > >> your retainers.  Seats.  We have called you here upon a<BR>
> > >> matter of some urgency.  As you know, we issued our our<BR>
> > >> Warrant to Colonel Kurtz to carry out a campaign against<BR>
> > >> Zhodani forces who were threatening the Spinward Marches<BR>
> > >> from the Trojan Reach.<BR>
><BR>
>I see that someone else has been rereading Leviathan.<BR>
><BR>
>Kurtz has let his power go to his<BR>
> > >> head, and has set himself up as something of a god out<BR>
> > >> there.  We have this hour rescinded and voided his Warrant.<BR>
> > >>  We now commission you to go to the Trojan Reach, find<BR>
> > >> Colonel Kurtz, and terminate his Warrant.  With extreme<BR>
> > >> prejudice, you understand?  Now go; time is of the essence.<BR>
><BR>
> > >I'm in!  Which chargen system do you want my character in?<BR>
> > >:-)<BR>
><BR>
> > I thought the same thing. <g><BR>
><BR>
>For true Evil Genius (TM) Refereeing you could recruit two<BR>
>groups of PC's: one for Chakropom's group and one for<BR>
>Kurtz's group.<BR>
<BR>
You want evil NPC's ?? read about Christopher Blaelock in our game notes.<BR>
Before Blaelok, was Evan Sontag, another genuinely evil NPC created <BR>
for our group. Sontag is the reason we have banned Tod from picking <BR>
up a peacock feather ever again.<BR>
<BR>
Bill<BR>
www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:48:33 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> For true Evil Genius (TM) Refereeing you could recruit two<BR>
> groups of PC's: one for Chakropom's group and one for<BR>
> Kurtz's group.<BR>
<BR>
Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it!<BR>
I wanna play it! I wanna! I wanna! I wanna! I wanna! I wanna!<BR>
<BR>
You might use two Evil Genius Refs who are conniving together.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:31:43<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
At 12:03 PM 4/18/2000 -0600, you wrote:<BR>
>Nope.  Aliens is the best gamer movie of the last 20 years.  <BR>
>Other candidates include the Terminator series, the Indiana Jones series,<BR>
>the last two Star Wars movies (Empire and Jedi), Desperado, Highlander,<BR>
>Bladerunner, etc.<BR>
><BR>
>I'm afraid the Mummy falls far behind most of these in quality and plot.<BR>
<BR>
I should have been more clear.  The Mummy *is* a RPG.  The characters are<BR>
ridiculous stereotypes, the villain is really, really nasty, and the<BR>
dialogue is stuff heard around gaming tables the world over.  I had no<BR>
trouble hearing the die rolls and the evil chuckles of the game master.<BR>
<BR>
I would never call Aliens a "gamer" movie, since all it is is a fight scene<BR>
stretched out to two hours.  Not that that's a bad thing mind you, but<BR>
imagine the gaming sessions.  "OK, a few more of you got scragged by the<BR>
Aliens in MedLab.. where are you falling back to now?"<BR>
- --<BR>
<BR>
Duugirashir Irebamenagiin  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
Inquisitor Maximus, Reformed Canon Church of Sylea<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:47:21 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: Warrants<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:28:17 +1000, "Karen and Michael Hughes"<BR>
<kmhughes@dynamite.com.au> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Pirate Warrant<BR>
><BR>
>I, Thug Gorzon of Omega VII, have the power to seize anything or everything<BR>
>on, and including, your ship. Please register any complaints, in person, to<BR>
>the complaints office located through this Iris valve.<BR>
><BR>
><whooooosh><BR>
<BR>
LOL That one's a keeper!<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"If a country is worth living in, it is worth fighting for."   -Manning Coles<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 02:48:34 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: Marshals (was Lawyer stuff help)<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 16 Apr 2000 10:28:17 -0700, Tod Glenn<BR>
<webmaster@travellercentral.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Here is an example of the text from a federal agent's credentials that might<BR>
>make a good starting point for your Imperial Marshals.<BR>
><BR>
>This is from an ATF ID, but you get the idea.<BR>
><BR>
>UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY<BR>
>This is to certify that]<BR>
>[Name]<BR>
>Whose signature and photograph appear below is duly assigned as<BR>
>Senior Special Agent<BR>
>in the<BR>
>Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms<BR>
>And is authorized to carry firearms, execute warrants,<BR>
>and make arrests for offenses against the United States and to perform other<BR>
>such duties as authorized by law.<BR>
><BR>
>--<BR>
>"It takes a child to raze a village."<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Hmmm...ATF... That fits.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"If a country is worth living in, it is worth fighting for."   -Manning Coles<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:25:39 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Post-humans<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>Scottish author Ken Macleod has a civilisation using nanotech Babbage<BR>
>engines in one of his books.  This is a response to a bunch of AIs<BR>
>("posthumans") on Jupiter sending out viruses that tend to mess up<BR>
>electronics.  (Yes, there are affinities to TNE).  The book is called The<BR>
>Cassini Division, and is quite cool.<BR>
<BR>
On the "posthuman score, there is a wonderful book entitled "The Bug Life<BR>
Chronicles" about human minds encapsulated into robotic bodies. Not very<BR>
travelleresque, but has massive potential for non-canonical campaigns.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 18:49:14 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: War References<BR>
<BR>
>Hey, if British historian John Keegan can say that he loves America<BR>
>[_Fields of Battle_, (c) 1995], then you should be allowed to say the<BR>
>same.<BR>
><BR>
>BTW, I recommend Keegan's work to any TMLers who have an interest in<BR>
>military history.<BR>
><BR>
Keegan is indeed a very informational read. I do disagree with many points<BR>
he made in _The Face of Battle_, especially calling The Somme a "Modern<BR>
Battle", especially in the face of the action in Iraq... But be warned, he<BR>
tends to be a tad dry. Very informational.<BR>
<BR>
OTOH, any collection of Student works from Sir Basil Henry Liddell-Hart is<BR>
also going to be a good source of ideas to steal from for traveller games;<BR>
BH collects short (10-30 page) essays from his  students into large works,<BR>
under his name. He does attribute the individual essays.<BR>
<BR>
Also good on warfare is Paul Avrich, although he tends to do more Russian<BR>
stuff than warfare.<BR>
<BR>
One other reference for traveller that I find flavors MTU: the Table of<BR>
Ranks from russian history. It equates military, civil service, and noble<BR>
ranks, much like CT Supp 4 and MT do. Basil Dmytryshyn's _Sourcebook for<BR>
Imperial Russian History_  includes this; check the local Univeristy<BR>
library for this one (unless you're really a russophile, most of it would<BR>
be dead weight, but it does show you the methods of a literate "Rule by<BR>
Decree" autocracy, and hwo russia barely avoided being constitutionally<BR>
focussed).<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:00:01 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Another favor<BR>
<BR>
> Being separated from my library has it's disadvantages:<BR>
> <BR>
> I need a kind soul to scan the maps from the Solomani Rim sector Booklet<BR>
> (Supplement 10, _not_ Alien Module 6). and send them to me here at<BR>
> lkw@io.com (or give me a pace I can FTP them from or make some other<BR>
> arrangement to get them to me yesterday).<BR>
> <BR>
That material is classified.  Please report to SolSec for reconditioning.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"It takes a child to raze a village."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:11:02 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: War References<BR>
<BR>
"William F. Hostman" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> One other reference for traveller that I find flavors MTU: the Table of<BR>
> Ranks from russian history. It equates military, civil service, and noble<BR>
> ranks, much like CT Supp 4 and MT do. Basil Dmytryshyn's _Sourcebook for<BR>
> Imperial Russian History_  includes this<BR>
<BR>
You're going to let that just hang there?   Spill it!<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 23:57:23 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: CAP/ETC<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-18 12:58:13 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< > Off the subject a bit, but there is a promising gun technology that is<BR>
 > available now (or at least very near term) and essentially gives the<BR>
 > kinetic performance of the gauss rifle without the complex technology.<BR>
 > Devoloped by Hughes and a couple of competing aerospace firms, it is called<BR>
 > CAP (Combustion Augmented Plasma). It relies on the priciple that a plasma<BR>
 > stimulated working fluid (say water) can expand at a much faster rate than<BR>
 > conventional propellants.  And, because the current that generates the<BR>
 > plasma can be profiled, time/pressure curves can be optimized to fully<BR>
 > exploit the mechanical structure of a barrel.<BR>
 <BR>
 This sounds like what FF&S calls ETC (electro-thermal chemical) ammunition.  <BR>
It<BR>
 still doesn't have the velocities that a gauss rifle can in theory have, but<BR>
 may be easier to construct. >><BR>
<BR>
Last time I was reading the tech stuff, CAP was what ETC was called when it <BR>
was in big guns, like MBT main guns and the like. ETC was what the process <BR>
was called for small arms, and we (GDW) decided to go with one term for <BR>
simplicity.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:11:12 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Marshalls<BR>
<BR>
>Please note.<BR>
><BR>
>Marshal has only one 'L'.<BR>
><BR>
>Tod<BR>
><BR>
Unless it be a name instead of a title.<BR>
<BR>
Or you look at some of the 1880's paperwork by the US Marshals.<BR>
<BR>
Remember, Boys and Girls, the Standard American English standard is NOT<BR>
that old... the move came in the 20th C. (IIRC, about 1920.) There was a<BR>
consolidation toawrds consistant spellings in the 1860-1900 period, but not<BR>
a formal standard.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2326</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 19 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2326<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
TMLer's as PC's<BR>
Re: Marshals (was Lawyer stuff help)<BR>
Re Free-fall<BR>
RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
RE: Starports<BR>
Re: War References<BR>
Re Tidal Forces<BR>
[none]<BR>
Re: Law Enforcement in Space<BR>
Re: <BR>
Boston TMLers<BR>
RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Action/Reaction (was Re: Pohl's 'Gateway')<BR>
Re: Marshals (was Lawyer stuff help)<BR>
Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
RE: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 19:19:14 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: TMLer's as PC's<BR>
<BR>
>> OBTrav (thinner than usual): Player characters are drawn from an<BR>
>> out-of-the-ordinary segment of the populace. How many of us are<BR>
>> potential PCs?<BR>
<BR>
I'd think I qualify, to a point:<BR>
	Opted for the Military, got booted for being "Too Violent" for the<BR>
Army. Went to college, learned to be a projectionist (and took a degree in<BR>
history). Worked in an Ice Cream plant, lasted two months before I found<BR>
out my boss was a tax-cheat, and had hired a 12 YO to work in the plant.<BR>
I've worked for the Feds (National Archives), quit becuase my boss had to<BR>
fire somebody. I've only been homeless for one week in my adult life, and<BR>
never as a child, but i still managed to meet mobsters, drug dealers, and<BR>
the like.<BR>
<BR>
	This really looks like a bad set of rolls on T4 Cgen, with a few<BR>
extra careers added. In CT, pre Supp 4, I'd definitely be an "Other".<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:12:51<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marshals (was Lawyer stuff help)<BR>
<BR>
At 02:48 AM 4/19/2000 GMT, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>>"It takes a child to raze a village."<BR>
>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
>Hmmm...ATF... That fits.<BR>
<BR>
Folks, some of us have attended the funerals of federal agents who died to<BR>
keep this country from becoming Columbia.  Keep the cheap shots to yourself.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 20:18:23 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Free-fall<BR>
<BR>
>I've got a question. While the ship is underweigh is it going to be<BR>
>weightless or is the acceleration from the ether propeller going to<BR>
>provide enough "gravity" to allow us to keep our "feet on the deck"? <g><BR>
><BR>
>Eris<BR>
<BR>
You'll be floating the whole way, at least the way I read it. Otherwise,<BR>
you'd be people-pancakes.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:38:50 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
<BR>
ROFLMAO!!!!!!!<BR>
<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Frank G.<BR>
> Pitt<BR>
> Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 3:32 PM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> > -----Original Message-----<BR>
> > From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> > [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Ian Ferguson<BR>
> > Sent: Tuesday, 18 April 2000 01:46<BR>
> > To: traveller@mpgn.com<BR>
> > Subject: RE: 101 Anal Retentive Rules (OT)<BR>
> ><BR>
> ><BR>
> > Frank Pitt writes:<BR>
> > >Yeah, sorry, I knew that, typed "Monster Manual" instead of  "Dieties &<BR>
> > >Demigods".<BR>
> > <snipped><BR>
> ><BR>
> > 	I have been reading the TML for too long: for a moment, I thought<BR>
> > 	that you wrote "Ditzie & Demigods."  That could be a scarey book.<BR>
><BR>
> Yaa!<BR>
><BR>
> Multiple pages of Ditzie blasting various different demi-gods<BR>
> with a variety<BR>
> of portable pieces of heavy ordnance, with underlining text extolling the<BR>
> virtues of the particular piece of weaponry against this particular<BR>
> pantheon.<BR>
><BR>
> Sounds almost like a "Soldier of Fortune" calendar, though being good<BR>
> citizens we would definitely be looking at the weapon and not the<BR>
> holder in<BR>
> this case.<BR>
><BR>
> Something for Jesse to work on when he's got nothing to do. <grin><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> Frankie<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:43:23 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Starports<BR>
<BR>
Sheesh, you'd think nobody ever listened ;)<BR>
<BR>
Far left, my buddy and airsoft team mate Evans Pang as the pilot in the<BR>
Marava bay.  My long time friend Pete Gotcher as the mechanic supervising<BR>
the welding bot.  BIT's own Sarah and Andy Lilly in the far background going<BR>
over paperwork.  Another long time friend and co-conspirator Tim Dougherty<BR>
as the walking mechanic.  Then it's your's truly as Lucky Credit crewman #1,<BR>
and Pete again as LC crewman #2.<BR>
<BR>
Enjoy!<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Nick<BR>
> Bradbeer<BR>
> Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 5:09 PM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: GT: Starports<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> Just got my copy today (from Dungeons and Starships during an<BR>
> hour-and-a-half layover in Birmingham - and even they didn't have FFS2 or<BR>
> GURPS Vehicles...)<BR>
><BR>
> I have looked upon it, and it is good.<BR>
><BR>
> I don't play GURPS Trav, but the background information's easily up to the<BR>
> standard of the other GURPS modules, and the artwork's excellent. (Well<BR>
> done, Jesse.) Uhh - who is everyone on the cover, again?<BR>
><BR>
> This book's proving useful at the moment, despite the fact that my current<BR>
> project is detailing post-Collapse Ley Sector. Go figure....<BR>
><BR>
> Nick<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:04:06 -0500<BR>
From: tim@premier.net<BR>
Subject: Re: War References<BR>
<BR>
> ><BR>
> Keegan is indeed a very informational read. I do disagree with many points<BR>
> he made in _The Face of Battle_, especially calling The Somme a "Modern<BR>
> Battle", especially in the face of the action in Iraq... But be warned, he<BR>
> tends to be a tad dry. Very informational.<BR>
> <BR>
I agree with most of what you say about Keegan.  Here are two <BR>
more writers I think the TML might like.<BR>
<BR>
George and Meredith Friedman  The Future of War<BR>
<BR>
Everett Dolman 'Geography in the Space Age: An Astropolitical <BR>
Analysis" in Geopolitics Geography and Strategy.  He also has a <BR>
book coming out soon (in book review) Astropoltics.<BR>
<BR>
Both these works deal with combat in Earth orbit.  The second is <BR>
more up to date and scientific.  The first focus on weapon systems. <BR>
Reading both gives an interesting picture.  If anybody wants them <BR>
Dolman has emailed me two chapters of his book, one is basically <BR>
the above mentioned article, so I can pass them on.  He has been <BR>
asked to edit a possible journal on space strategy...I hoping to get <BR>
a chance to write for it  (fingers and everything crossed)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Tim Reynolds<BR>
tim@premier.net <BR>
225-334-5063<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable <BR>
sexual disease.  It made you unsuitable for <BR>
a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.<BR>
<BR>
Terry Pratchett <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:04:36 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Tidal Forces<BR>
<BR>
Having seen several queries about "How can this work" in Re tidal forces:<BR>
<BR>
Gravity is funny stuff. It acts upon each atom individually, but when atoms<BR>
are bound together, you can, in regimes in which humans are comfortable,<BR>
treat the larger object as a single larger unit. However, when we get to<BR>
orbital dynamics, or very high gravitational forces, it can become<BR>
incredibly high. Remember, earths tides are the result of a TINY fraction<BR>
of a G of pull from the moon. (Lessee, .16 at 2000km, or so, over 300000km<BR>
or more, that's 0.16/(150^2), uh, somewhere in the nano-G range. this is a<BR>
mere from memory known-to-be-in-error, back of the envelope type calc here)<BR>
<BR>
Take a look at a slice from a typical gravity well, with a type S in it's field<BR>
<BR>
0.05                                    0.049999999<BR>
|.......................................|<BR>
        ^<BR>
       /A\<BR>
      /   \<BR>
     /  O  \<BR>
    /_;___:_\<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
We'll assume that the orbital center is at O (Actually, that's there for<BR>
the turret, but it works! <GD&R> ), and it's orbiting in direction O->A.<BR>
Since everybody is within a trivial (0.001 nano-G)orbital velocities will<BR>
be VERY close (nanometers/sec). Orbital speed is directly related to orbit<BR>
and gravity. At a given orbital height above a uniform body, a stable<BR>
circular orbit will have a specific speed.<BR>
<BR>
Now, let us look at the curve for a singluarity<BR>
20<BR>
|19.5<BR>
||19.0<BR>
|||18.5<BR>
||||18.0<BR>
|||||17.5<BR>
||||||17.0<BR>
|||||||16.5<BR>
||||||||16.0<BR>
|||||||||15.5<BR>
||||||||||15.0<BR>
|||||||||||<BR>
     ^<BR>
    /A\<BR>
   /   \<BR>
  /  O  \<BR>
 /_;___:_\<BR>
<BR>
Now, guys at A and at O are under 17.5G, and the orbital speed is based on<BR>
center of mass.Guys at A and O float nicely. Guys at the semi-colon (;)are<BR>
under 18.5 G, but with about 17.5 cancelled. so they experience a 1G pull<BR>
left.<BR>
Guys at the colon (:) are at about 16.5 G inward pull from gravity, and due<BR>
to the ship's orbital velocity, experience 17.5 G outward push (Centrifugal<BR>
force). So they are being shoved out at about 1G to the right.<BR>
<BR>
Also, the parts of the ship are all being stressed with 3-4 G "Outward"<BR>
stress on the structure.<BR>
<BR>
For purposes of orbital dynamics:<BR>
Centripital force is a factor gravity and distance (G/(D^2)<BR>
Centrifugal force is a factor of speed (and IIRC, Arm length of the<BR>
relationship)<BR>
Orbit is the case when the the centrifugal force on the BODY AS A WHOLE is<BR>
ballanced by the centripital force on the BODY AS A WHOLE<BR>
Tidal stress is the ammount of difference between the forces on the closest<BR>
and furthest points.<BR>
<BR>
The other neat thing, you will eventually acquire a tumble, and then wind<BR>
up heavy end down. Simply beacuase no gravitational field is ever perfect,<BR>
and no body ever totally uniform. This assumes you don't wind up coming<BR>
apart from tidal stresses. And the above doesn't even show the effects of<BR>
the log funtion.<BR>
<BR>
Back to that poor scout: He's already in trouble. He's under 4G peak tidal<BR>
stress. That frame is rated for 2-3 G's. If he goes in any further, the<BR>
stresses will climb. And since this is a section, the bands should get<BR>
narrower as you go in. Which means that the stresses will climb as he goes<BR>
inward. (gravity strength is inversely logarhythmic with distance)<BR>
<BR>
So, given 1E20 G at 1km(ie, 'surface' G on a neutron star, by some<BR>
estimates), at 1E3 km, at's 1E20/(1E3 * 1E3) = 1E20/1E6 = 1E14 G at 1E3 km.<BR>
At a whopping 1E9 km, we get 1E2 G (100 G). But, if at a suitable orbital<BR>
velocity, you'll still "float" Note that the "Individal Commitment Horizon"<BR>
is that point where you can no longer accellerate past the orbital velocity<BR>
required. The "Event Horizon" is that point where the speed of light is at<BR>
or below orbital speed, and therefore even photons get caught.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
This tableset is covering 100000 km distances from a central point<BR>
(900000km + or - 100000 km). Assuming you enter via hohman tranfer orbits,<BR>
you can actually take it to these extremes. Assuming you don't get hit by<BR>
anything. Realistically, almost nothing is going to enter this close, but<BR>
you should immediately see the implications. BTW, inboard is towards the<BR>
gravity source, and outboard is away from it. Oh, and 1000000 km (1e6)<BR>
pretty DAMNED close.<BR>
<BR>
                     A                  B               C<BR>
Gravity at 1 km      1.000000000E+20    1.000E+20       1.000E+20<BR>
Distance in km       8.000000000E+05    9.000E+05	1.000E+06<BR>
Arm length (in m)    5.0000000000       5.0000000000	5.0000000000<BR>
<BR>
A<BR>
Gravity - for orbit     156250000.0000000000000000 G<BR>
Gravity inboard	        156250001.9531250000000000 G<BR>
Gravity outboard        156249998.0468750000000000 G<BR>
Tidal stress (total)	        3.9062500000000000 G<BR>
<BR>
B<BR>
Gravity - for orbit     123456790.1234570000000000 G<BR>
Gravity inboard	        123456791.4951990000000000 G<BR>
Gravity outboard        123456788.7517150000000000 G<BR>
Tidal stress (total)	2.7434842288494100 G<BR>
<BR>
C (Lots of 0's trimmed right of decimals)<BR>
Gravity - for orbit     100000000. G<BR>
Gravity inboard	        100000001. G<BR>
Gravity outboard         99999999. G<BR>
Tidal stress (total)	        2. G<BR>
<BR>
(calcs done with Excell).<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 21:36:10 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: [none]<BR>
<BR>
>"William F. Hostman" wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> One other reference for traveller that I find flavors MTU: the Table of<BR>
>> Ranks from russian history. It equates military, civil service, and noble<BR>
>> ranks, much like CT Supp 4 and MT do. Basil Dmytryshyn's _Sourcebook for<BR>
>> Imperial Russian History_  includes this<BR>
><BR>
>You're going to let that just hang there?   Spill it!<BR>
><BR>
>bloo<BR>
<BR>
Steve: the missing words are "...Table and an explanation."<BR>
<BR>
Lessee here, I have to find my copy. <BRB, AFK><much thumping, banging, and<BR>
digging><BR>
Correction on citation:<BR>
Dmytryshyn, Basil, _Imperial Russia: A Sourcebook, 1700-1917", Harcourt<BR>
Brace Jovanovich Coolege Publishers, 1990.ISBN 0-03-033419-5<BR>
<BR>
the table of ranks (Specifically the military and civil service) are<BR>
presented on pages 19-20; the text elaboration (which includes nobility,<BR>
although the nobility are not per se on the table) is pages 20-21. This is<BR>
a translated copy of the document in toto, the commentary must have been in<BR>
the other text for the course. The table was generated originally upon<BR>
January 24, 1772 AD, Russian Calendar. It does, in the text (but not the<BR>
table) specify that the military was, in fact, a means of becomeing a<BR>
noble; should one rise to the rank of "Uber-officer" one became a nobleman.<BR>
It's more clear in the original russian, but hey, I don't have THAT handy.<BR>
<BR>
Imperial Russia was, in many ways, a great model for the 3I... Written<BR>
canons of law, but rule by written decree (Through Ukazi and Nakazi), to be<BR>
enforced by men, in accordance with the Imperial whim, as expressed in<BR>
written documents, but the final arbiter being the Imperial Ruler. An<BR>
imperial ruler advised by the Duma, which at one point was the council of<BR>
Boyars. Later, the Duma was an elctive body, but one which the Tsar sat on,<BR>
and was a voting membr of, and held the sole power to call them to meet.<BR>
Sounds awfully like the Moot.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 01:51:30 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Law Enforcement in Space<BR>
<BR>
- --============_-1255988201==_ma============<BR>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"<BR>
<BR>
>Please note.<BR>
><BR>
>Marshal has only one 'L'.<BR>
><BR>
>Tod<BR>
<BR>
It was a TYPO!  : P<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
- --============_-1255988201==_ma============<BR>
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"<BR>
<BR>
<!doctype html public "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN"><BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><head><style type="text/css"><!--<BR>
blockquote, dl, ul, ol, li { margin-top: 0 ; margin-bottom: 0 }<BR>
 --></style><title>Re: Law Enforcement in Space</title></head><BR>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Please note.<BR>
<BR>
Marshal has only one 'L'.<BR>
</blockquote><blockquote type="cite" cite>Tod</blockquote><div><BR>
</div><div>It was a TYPO!&nbsp;</FONT><FONT  SIZE=4 PTSIZE=12><B> : P</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B></div><div><B><BR>
</B></div><div>Red</div><BR>
- --============_-1255988201==_ma============--<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 05:15:27 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: <BR>
<BR>
"William F. Hostman" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> the table of ranks (Specifically the military and civil service) are<BR>
> presented on pages 19-20; the text elaboration (which includes nobility,<BR>
> although the nobility are not per se on the table) is pages 20-21.<BR>
<BR>
Oh man.  Now I have to go the library.  :-(<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 05:20:18 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Boston TMLers<BR>
<BR>
We have an excuse to get together.  Carlos Alos-Ferrer, TMLer<BR>
and master of all things Geonee, is coming to visit Boston all the<BR>
way from Vienna.  He'll be here next week.  He's off the TML<BR>
right now, so I'm posting this.  He'll be free from something<BR>
between the 27th and 30th.<BR>
<BR>
No need to clutter up the list with too much so email me<BR>
off list (stevedaniels@portcaddo.com) so we can coordinate,<BR>
if you're interested.<BR>
<BR>
Its probably the last chance I'll have to meet any of you<BR>
as well before I move to San Francisco.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:46:55 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
On Behalf Of Douglas E. Berry<BR>
> I should have been more clear.  The Mummy *is* a RPG.  The characters are<BR>
> ridiculous stereotypes, the villain is really, really nasty, and the<BR>
> dialogue is stuff heard around gaming tables the world over.  I had no<BR>
> trouble hearing the die rolls and the evil chuckles of the game master.<BR>
<BR>
I concur with that assesment.<BR>
But I still enjoyed it, it reminded me of Saturday morning matinees for the<BR>
kids back in the sixties.<BR>
Of course, I watched it on DVD, and we could replay the good bits a lot, so<BR>
I may be biased.<BR>
<BR>
> I would never call Aliens a "gamer" movie, since all it is is a<BR>
> fight scene stretched out to two hours.<BR>
<BR>
Alien is a horror movie<BR>
Aliens is a war movie<BR>
Alien 3 is an art movie<BR>
<BR>
Haven't bothered seeing Redemption yet.<BR>
<BR>
> Not that that's a bad thing mind you, but<BR>
> imagine the gaming sessions.  "OK, a few more of you got scragged by the<BR>
> Aliens in MedLab.. where are you falling back to now?"<BR>
<BR>
<grin> You should try this as a LARP. Works surprisingly well.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:21:39 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Action/Reaction (was Re: Pohl's 'Gateway')<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>> Matt writes:<BR>
>> <BR>
>>> If the ships are attached then the gravity acts on them as a single<BR>
>>> body, if they separate then the gravitational attraction on one has<BR>
>>> no effect on the gravitational attraction on the other. Once they<BR>
>>> separate they are two distinct bodies. The A/R of separation<BR>
>>> shouldn't be affected by the prevailing gravity, as that was acting<BR>
>>> on each of them equally.<BR>
  <BR>
> Definitions:<BR>
><BR>
> M - the "massive object"<BR>
> A, B - the linked objects of "negligible" mass.<BR>
><BR>
> M   A-B<BR>
><BR>
> When arranged thus, object A is closer than B to M. Thus, the<BR>
> gravitational force attracting A toward M is greater than that<BR>
> attracting B toward M. Being of "negligible" mass, A and B barely<BR>
> attract one another - this component is being ignored.<BR>
<BR>
> Since A is being pulled to the left harder than B, there is stress on<BR>
> the link.  This link ensures that the A-B conjoined object orbits M<BR>
> as if it were a single mass with the same center of mass.<BR>
<BR>
So far so good.<BR>
<BR>
> The presence of this stress means that, if the link were severed, the two<BR>
> bodies would "fly apart".<BR>
<BR>
Still ok.<BR>
<BR>
> Body A would slow down and orbit closer, while body B would speed up<BR>
> and orbit farther, with the total energy essentially unchanged.<BR>
<BR>
And here's where the counter-intuitive nature of orbital mechanics<BR>
rears it's ugly head. In orbit *slowing down* moves you *outward*. And<BR>
speeding up moves you *inward*. <BR>
<BR>
And I suspect that's how the folks in the story got themselves<BR>
screwed...<BR>
<BR>
> If M is *really* massive, and the distance to A-B is relatively<BR>
> small, such that the distance between A and B is a noticeable<BR>
> fraction of the distance between A and B, then the stress could be<BR>
> considerable.<BR>
<BR>
Huh? I think you wrote a B where you wanted an M...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 00:36:13 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Marshals (was Lawyer stuff help)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 02:48 AM 4/19/2000 GMT, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>>"It takes a child to raze a village."<BR>
>>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
>>Hmmm...ATF... That fits.<BR>
><BR>
> Folks, some of us have attended the funerals of federal agents who died to<BR>
> keep this country from becoming Columbia.  Keep the cheap shots to yourself.<BR>
<BR>
I was afraid something like this would happen as soon as I saw "ATF". <BR>
<BR>
There are a lot of good federal agents. There are also some bad apples.<BR>
And AS AN AGENCY the ATF seems to tend rather far in that direction. <BR>
<BR>
Let's try to keep in mind that even if the ATF as a whole seems to be<BR>
pretty bad, that doesn't mean they can't have honest, dedicated agents.<BR>
<BR>
So try to keep generalizations in perspective. <BR>
<BR>
> -- <BR>
><BR>
> Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
> http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
><BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:34:58 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
<BR>
Bill wrote:<BR>
> >JPEGs of Entire Rim sent (1.3 Mb data) separately.<BR>
> <BR>
> Are we speaking of jpegs of the rim systems or a map of the rim <BR>
> sectors or something entirely different??<BR>
<BR>
Probably a collection of holiday photos from Dom's trip around the Rim sector.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
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| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:22:42 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
<BR>
>> OBTrav (thinner than usual): Player characters are drawn from an<BR>
>> out-of-the-ordinary segment of the populace. How many of us are<BR>
>> potential PCs?<BR>
<BR>
OK, judge for yourself :<BR>
<BR>
I was the illegitimate son of a British Naval Intelligence Officer who at<BR>
the time of my conception was attending a Chinese language course, just<BR>
prior to going into Taiwan, after which my mother never heard from him<BR>
again. I was born<BR>
<BR>
Before I was twelve I had had two more fathers and lived in Bosham, Sussex<BR>
(England); Freemantle, Australia; Preston, Lancashire; Bishop's Stortford,<BR>
Herefordshire; and Porirua, New Zealand, and had visited Adelaide, Karachi,<BR>
Durban, Capetown, Canary Isles, Gibraltar, Pompei, and Port Said (travelling<BR>
through the Suez some weeks before it was closed in the Six Day War, my<BR>
mother and I travelling on camel-back alongside the canal while the boat<BR>
went through ) among other places.<BR>
<BR>
Arriving in New Zealand we lived in Porirua, Wellington's equivalent to<BR>
Watts, though with fewer guns.<BR>
<BR>
There, being a white boy in a overwhelmingly Maori neighbourhood (if you've<BR>
seen "Once were Warriors", that's the sort of environment) I became quite<BR>
adept at combat and evasion. I was arrested at 11 for beating up a guy on<BR>
someone else's front lawn on the way home from school, and later for<BR>
throwing a kid who ripped my jacket over three rows of desks in school. At<BR>
this time I also learned to cultivate the freindship of large stupid guys,<BR>
who could be used to reduce the number of times I had to fight.<BR>
<BR>
I was also arrested three or four times for shoplifting and other<BR>
misdeneanours before being sent to a high school out of the area by my<BR>
parents.<BR>
<BR>
Surprisingly, also during this time I worked my way up through the ranks of<BR>
the Boy Scout organization, and got a lot of training in bush survival, map<BR>
reading and the like, something I kept up for many years. I was forced to<BR>
resign as Troop Leader (sort of a RSM position, not an adult supervisory<BR>
one ) because one of the arrests finally led to a conviction. Luckily for me<BR>
the conviction was as a minor, and was thus wiped from my record<BR>
<BR>
Then we moved to a place called Levin, pretty much a hick town as far as I<BR>
was concerned. I took Tae Kwon Do lessons, and through my father's lawyer,<BR>
whom I sytrode the stage with while performing at the Avon Valley<BR>
semi-professional theatre, became involved with a guy known as 'Big K' one<BR>
of the main drug dealers in that area at the time. We used to sit at this<BR>
lawyer's place, drinking large quantities of gin, because he liked the shit<BR>
for some reason, and splitting up rubbish bags of dope into foil "deals".<BR>
Needless to say, I did not want for intoxicants.<BR>
<BR>
Later, through "friends" I got a job as a "pool hall attendant". What this<BR>
meant was that I was supposed to take money off the people hiring the<BR>
tables. Several times I had to use the sawn-off pool cue we kept for the<BR>
purpose to keep order. At the same time the pool hall owner was making a<BR>
book, so I took calls and bets for him, and ran a few numbers.<BR>
<BR>
Just to give you the sort of idea of my "standing" at this point, I was once<BR>
attacked by a local Maori thug of the now infmaous McDonald clan (called<BR>
Marshall BTW, ain't that a coincidence ?) at a dance for looking at him<BR>
funny (did I give a shit how he thought I looked at him ?) While the fight<BR>
was inconclusive ( he got more blood out of me, but that was a mere face<BR>
cut, I think I hurt him more with my kidney punches ), afterwards my boss,<BR>
Don,  heard about it, so he stirred a bit, and one of the komatua ( Maori<BR>
equivalent of "god-fathers" ) forced the guy to apologize to me !<BR>
<BR>
When I left high school, I got a job with a work scheme as a house painter,<BR>
while continuing my acting at Avon Valley, where I hooked up with the girl<BR>
who was later going to be my wife.<BR>
<BR>
After a few weeks, I got a job as a cleaner at the local psychopaedic<BR>
hospital, where I was introduced to the ways of nurses and sexually<BR>
frustrated female psychiatric patients. Indulged in a couple of nurses, but<BR>
not the patients, though I can tell you that fighting off a naked girl<BR>
trying to couple with you just because you were there and male, without<BR>
hurting her too severely, is no picnic.<BR>
<BR>
Then about a year later, my application to the Royal New Zealand Air Force<BR>
came through. I joined as an Avionics Technician, and remained there for<BR>
about eleven years. Shortly after joining my wife and I decided we couldn't<BR>
live apart for much longer so we got married (that way we'd get an RNZAF<BR>
house quicker ! )<BR>
<BR>
BTW, my wife's grandfather on her father's side was Governor of Atjeh<BR>
Province for the Dutch in Sumatran Indonesia, served time in a Japanese<BR>
concentration camp (there was a film donme on the camp recently) and her<BR>
father was also active in the Dutch resistance, so she has an interesting<BR>
family history too.<BR>
<BR>
The Air Force years were great, experience in hot-refuelling choppers on top<BR>
of mountains, lots of drinking, being on an aerobatic team, night-flying,<BR>
aeros, tented camps, etc.  I could go on for ages about this, but many of<BR>
you are familiar with the military life anyway.<BR>
<BR>
My wife and I had four sons, and after building computesrs from discrete TTL<BR>
components as a hobby, and finally buying a System 80 ( TRS80 clone from<BR>
Asia , known as a Video Genie in the UK ) I worked toward a Computer Science<BR>
degree at Canterbury University.<BR>
<BR>
Finally, I left the air force, and completed the final year of my BSC full<BR>
time, and did a post-graduate diploma as well.<BR>
<BR>
While I would have loved to stay in academia, and could have done so if I<BR>
wanted, it had not been a picnic living on a student alowance with four sons<BR>
(supplemented with casual computer consulting and bartering my<BR>
electrical/electronic skils in the local Green Dollar exchange), so I left<BR>
and got a real job as a software engineer at Tait Electronics, and wrote the<BR>
code for their MPT1327 trunked radio network. These were installed in (among<BR>
other places) the UK, Australia, the Philipines, China, and Cuba.<BR>
<BR>
My combination of software and hardware skills was a huge bonus to Tait's,<BR>
so I was involved in both software installs and hardware installs, being one<BR>
of the few software enginers with experience and training in radio<BR>
electronics as well, so I was introduced to the wonders of Chinese beer and<BR>
indoor toilets in multi-storey hotels...<BR>
<BR>
Finally, I was poached from Taits by IBM, where I worked on one of the<BR>
largest software projects mounted in New Zealand for IBM's<BR>
Telecommunications & Media division, where I worked for a short time with<BR>
Richard Helm.  I carefully avoided getting into management, and by the time<BR>
the project was cancelled, I was earning more than my manager anyway.<BR>
<BR>
Leaving IBM, I joined Software Education, a small consulting and education<BR>
firm, teaching C++, Java, JADE, OOAD, & Design Patterns where I remain today<BR>
(We had Steve Mellor at the last conference we organized, and Steve O'Connel<BR>
at the previous years)<BR>
<BR>
Over the last few years I have presented a retrospective of Neil Gaiman<BR>
(while he was there ), reached the dizzying heights of Primogen of the<BR>
Wellington Ventrue Directorate, and become a founding member of the NZ<BR>
Science Fiction Writers Association, though I have not yet been commercially<BR>
published<BR>
<BR>
I'm now looking at possibly going back into China again to teach JADE in Wu<BR>
Xhi.<BR>
<BR>
My eldest son is now studying computer science and computational biology at<BR>
Canterbury University.<BR>
<BR>
We (the family) are now a long way from those "mean streets", and we have<BR>
gone from barely surviving on a student allowance to my salary alone being<BR>
greater than that of a cabinet minister in our government in a space of ten<BR>
or so years. I am now "completely legit", and people find it hard to believe<BR>
some of the incidents in my past, and many are surprisd at my capacity for<BR>
drink and partying !<BR>
<BR>
Phew !, that was big, but it could have ben a lot bigger.<BR>
Maybe I should write a book...<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2326<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2327</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	4/19/00 10:11:47 AM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 19 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2327<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Action/Reaction (was Re: Pohl's 'Gateway')<BR>
RE: TMLer's as PC's<BR>
Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
Re: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
Re: Marshals<BR>
[OT] New gamer<BR>
GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
FFS1 Solar Cells<BR>
RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
X-TEK and the TML Landgrab<BR>
Re: FFS1 Solar Cells<BR>
Re: Peter's View of Traveller<BR>
Keith Supplements - Last Call!<BR>
Flame wars, part MCXXXIII<BR>
Re: Ditzie & Demigods<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
2313 Echiste/Lanth<BR>
Re: SETI@home tailchaser<BR>
RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:05:11 -0300<BR>
From: Brian Quirt <baqrt@mta.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Action/Reaction (was Re: Pohl's 'Gateway')<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> > Body A would slow down and orbit closer, while body B would speed up<BR>
> > and orbit farther, with the total energy essentially unchanged.<BR>
> <BR>
> And here's where the counter-intuitive nature of orbital mechanics<BR>
> rears it's ugly head. In orbit *slowing down* moves you *outward*. And<BR>
> speeding up moves you *inward*.<BR>
> <BR>
> And I suspect that's how the folks in the story got themselves<BR>
> screwed...<BR>
<BR>
	This part I disagree with, as it violates conservation of energy. What<BR>
I think you mean is that, if you move faster, you will now be moving<BR>
closer to tangentially to the mass than in a circular orbit, and you<BR>
will therefore gain altitude. As you gain altitude, you gain potential<BR>
energy, and in order for your total energy to remain constant, you must<BR>
lose kinetic energy. Eventually (unless you have achieved escape<BR>
velocity) you will reach an orbit where your (new) kinetic energy gives<BR>
you the correct orbital velocity for that orbit, and you'll stay there<BR>
(well, not quite, you'll be in an ellipse that peaks around there, but<BR>
close enough for an approximation).<BR>
	If you lose energy (go slower), you will find yourself at less than<BR>
orbital velocity, and you will tend to fall inwards (both of these can<BR>
be proven by a 12th grade analysis of circular motion, but that's<BR>
below). As you end up lower, you've lost potential energy, and to<BR>
conserve energy you gain kinetic energy, therefore you end up going<BR>
faster. Again, unless you've lost TOO much energy, you will eventually<BR>
stabilize in a new orbit.<BR>
<BR>
	Circular Motion Analysis:<BR>
<BR>
	For circular motion, the net force F must be directly towards the<BR>
centre of the circle, with F = mv^2/r, where v is your velocity, m is<BR>
your mass, and r is your radius. If you slow down, F is greater than<BR>
mv^2/r, and you will therefore fall inwards. As you do so, your velocity<BR>
will increase, until the equation is once again balanced (of course, the<BR>
equation may only be balanced when you're inside the object you're<BR>
orbiting, but that's what makes things interesting). If, on the other<BR>
hand, you increase your velocity, mv^2/r is greater than F, and you will<BR>
move outwards (and your velocity will decrease until you reach a new<BR>
stable point, unless you have escape velocity). The counter-intuitive<BR>
part of orbital mechanics is not that slowing down moves you outwards,<BR>
but that to speed up you HAVE to slow down (and therefore enter a lower<BR>
(faster) orbit. Likewise, you slow down by speeding up (and entering a<BR>
slower orbit).<BR>
<BR>
- -Brian Quirt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:05:18 +0100<BR>
From: Timothy.Collinson@solent.ac.uk<BR>
Subject: RE: TMLer's as PC's<BR>
<BR>
Frank wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Phew !, that was big, but it could have ben a lot bigger.<BR>
>Maybe I should write a book...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Yes please - let us know when we can buy it!<BR>
<BR>
Cheers<BR>
<BR>
tc<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:57:20 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
>For what it's worth, I used to use the Cardinal as an example of <BR>
>"lawful evil" to my D&D players. The defining moment being when <BR>
>D'Artangan hands the Cardinnal the "warrant" and the Cardinal tears it <BR>
>up. If he *wasn't* extremely "lawful", he could then have had the poor <BR>
>boy executed. Instead, he honors the warrant and even gives him that <BR>
>commision. <BR>
<BR>
My take on this: "Today's plan for the good of France has not come<BR>
out as planned. This boy is a determined servant of France. Killing<BR>
him now would serve no purpose, save vengeance. I'll reward him for<BR>
his courage, for someone with his courage and determination could<BR>
turn out to be a vital tool in the future. Besides, I can can always<BR>
kill him later."<BR>
<BR>
D'Artagnan will never betray France, or do anything dishonorable.<BR>
This makes him very predictable, and, if handled carefully, quite<BR>
controllable. As long as the Cardinal's goal is the good of France,<BR>
it is likely that the two will on occasion find common cause with<BR>
each other - the Cardinal just has to be careful that D'Artagnan<BR>
only gets involved with situations that are for the good of all<BR>
France, rather than for the good of the Cardinal's plans for France. <BR>
<BR>
>"Villians" who have a code of honor are *far* more interesting to play <BR>
>with. :-) <BR>
<BR>
Oh, certainly...but villains with a well-developed enlightened <BR>
self-interest can be fun as well. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 08:29:08 -0500 (CDT)<BR>
From: "Jason Kemp" <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: Re: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
<BR>
> OK, judge for yourself :<BR>
> <BR>
> I was the illegitimate son of a British Naval Intelligence Officer who at<BR>
> the time of my conception was attending a Chinese language course, just<BR>
> prior to going into Taiwan, after which my mother never heard from him<BR>
> again. I was born<BR>
<BR>
<<SNIP details of incredibly involved and sorted life.>><BR>
<BR>
> Phew !, that was big, but it could have ben a lot bigger.<BR>
> Maybe I should write a book...<BR>
<BR>
Frankie,<BR>
<BR>
I haven't had players give me a background anywhere near this <BR>
convoluted. And, unfortunately, if they had, I'd have rolled my eyes <BR>
and thought "Yeah, right. Oh, geez!" or words to that effect. A <BR>
character with this as a background history would probably have been <BR>
marginally let into the game, depending on the character sheet that <BR>
went with it.<BR>
<BR>
In other words, it's like they say, Truth _is_ stranger than Fiction! <BR>
Your life is almost _too_ out of the ordinary to make a good <BR>
character. :)<BR>
<BR>
But I can just imagine the NPC that you'd make as a Casual Encounter, <BR>
or as the reluctant target for a "recruiting drive" for IRIS, the <BR>
IISS Rangers, IBI, or some other variant Imperial Intelligence <BR>
Agency. Oooo, I think this is an adventure scenario just waiting to <BR>
happen. :)<BR>
<BR>
Thanks,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
=============================<BR>
Jason Kemp, ADS Programmer IV<BR>
(512)458-7111 ext. 1+3375<BR>
Internet Address:  jason.kemp@tdh.state.tx.us<BR>
<BR>
Most computer virus and email alerts are hoaxes.  For more info, check out:<BR>
http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/culture/beliefs/urbanlegends/library/blhoax.htm<BR>
==============================<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:34:16 EDT<BR>
From: GaryBartz@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Marshals<BR>
<BR>
hmmm...you have known some good guy agents who were killed, therefore we <BR>
cannot comment on Lon and those like him in federal service when they obey <BR>
very questionable orders and kill for political expedience?<BR>
<BR>
Given our every-three-monthly threads on guns/how evil America is to everyone <BR>
else/gayness, I think some comments on certain agencies willingness to kill <BR>
children are allowable.<BR>
<BR>
Gary<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/19/00 7:23:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< Folks, some of us have attended the funerals of federal agents who died to<BR>
 keep this country from becoming Columbia.  Keep the cheap shots to yourself. <BR>
>><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:56:32 +0100<BR>
From: John Wood <John@elvw.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: [OT] New gamer<BR>
<BR>
Following an unexpectedly problematic labour (including the classic 4am<BR>
dash across the city to the hospital with the mother on all fours on the<BR>
back seat of the car), our daughter May ?? Norwood [1] was delivered by<BR>
emergency caesarian section at 10:15am Monday. She weighed in at 6lb<BR>
13oz [2]. After a fairly rocky start, the baby is doing well (she has<BR>
just been released from the Special Care unit); her mother Alison is<BR>
recovering fast.<BR>
<BR>
Weak ObGURPS/Trav:<BR>
What will labour be like in the Far Future? Alison's a big fan of<BR>
Bujold's Miles Vorkosigan series, and she *still* thinks she'd rather<BR>
have a traditional, Barrayaran pregnancy than have the child grown in a<BR>
Betan incubator. So it's not just a matter of technology solving all the<BR>
problems (though perhaps the *right* technology could do so); there are<BR>
social and psychological aspects too.<BR>
<BR>
Notes:<BR>
[1] Middle name to be decided.<BR>
[2] In GURPS terms; 3.1kg for all other Traveller versions!<BR>
<BR>
All the best,<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
p.s. Thanks to everyone from both lists who sent their best wishes - I<BR>
haven't been online since Sunday lunchtime so I probably haven't seen<BR>
all of them yet! There's a bunch of great people on both the TML and<BR>
GURPSnet; while you're arguing about Democracy and Gun Control just<BR>
remember it's the people that really count.<BR>
<BR>
We keep the flame. Good luck. Communication ends.<BR>
<BR>
John G. Wood            <john@elvw.demon.co.uk><BR>
Oxford, United Kingdom  http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:50:55 CST6CDT<BR>
From: igor@truserve.com<BR>
Subject: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
Good day folks...<BR>
<BR>
This is a quasi-official announcement concerning the upcoming (later this year) <BR>
GURPS Traveller sourcebook Modular Cutter, of which I am a co-author. <BR>
Basically, if anyone out there has any requests, opinions, etc... on what they <BR>
would like to see in such a volume, please email me at igor@truserve.com.<BR>
<BR>
At the moment, elements in the book will include:<BR>
  * Overview of modular craft in general<BR>
  * Overview/history of cutter specifically<BR>
  * Rules specific to the cutter<BR>
  * Career templates for cutter pilots in various branches<BR>
  * Equipment useful for cutters<BR>
  * Vehicles used for the handling and transport of cutters and cutter modules<BR>
  * Several variations of the standard cutter, as well as several other ships <BR>
that can make use of the cutter's modules<BR>
  * Extensive library of cutter modules - commercial, military, scout, <BR>
scientific, station, and more...<BR>
  * A collection of deckplans for modules and vessels.<BR>
<BR>
- - NOTE: contents subject to change without notice.<BR>
<BR>
I'll also be pestering the net now and then for canonical references for this <BR>
work.<BR>
<BR>
Thank you,<BR>
  Andy Akins<BR>
 <BR>
igor@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________<BR>
True Communications Corporation Your Premier ISP.<BR>
"Hometown Service with Worldwide Connectivity"<BR>
http://www.truserve.com        info@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:58:45 CST6CDT<BR>
From: igor@truserve.com<BR>
Subject: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
<BR>
I'll group these all in one message - some of these I've asked before, but I <BR>
thought that I would re-ask them, to make sure I've got all my answers straight.<BR>
<BR>
1. What are all the canonical references to vessels carrying Cutters? My memory:<BR>
  Broadsword (x2)<BR>
  Donosev<BR>
  Many warships in Supplement 9: Fighting Ships<BR>
<BR>
2. What is the location of the Depot serving the Marches? I _believe_ its <BR>
Depot/Corridor...but I'm not sure. Also, the hex location and subsector name <BR>
would be cool.<BR>
<BR>
3. In the army/navy/marines, what is the "normal" rank of helicopter transport <BR>
pilots (UH-60 and the like)...I figure these indidividuals would be the closest <BR>
counterparts to military cutter pilots.<BR>
<BR>
4. Has there ever been _any_ mention in canonical texts of the history of the <BR>
Cutter design? IIRC, the only mention is in GT itself, which states that it is <BR>
a LSP design.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks,<BR>
<BR>
  Andy Akins<BR>
 <BR>
igor@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________<BR>
True Communications Corporation Your Premier ISP.<BR>
"Hometown Service with Worldwide Connectivity"<BR>
http://www.truserve.com        info@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:11:55 -0700<BR>
From: "Antony Farrell" <Skaran@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: FFS1 Solar Cells<BR>
<BR>
Can anyone help me. I need to design a solar folding array for an FFS1 (Mk1<BR>
Mod1) vessel capable of producing greater than 30MW (At TL12) in the<BR>
habitable zone, does anyone know whether the solar cell and collection panel<BR>
rules in the book are correct?<BR>
<BR>
What would the surface area of such an array when folded be? I have worked<BR>
out that when deployed it is huge! But there is no reference to a folded<BR>
size.<BR>
<BR>
Antony<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:32:33 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
Ah, that's different then.  I'll agree that the ludicrous dialogue and plot<BR>
twists do a fair job of approximating what goes on around a gamer table.<BR>
<BR>
I call Aliens the best gamer movie of the last 20 years because it's lines<BR>
are heard around my gamer table more than anything else, except maybe Monty<BR>
Python.  Hardly a session goes by where a player doesn't suggest that they<BR>
"take off and nuke the site from orbit - it's the only way to be sure," and<BR>
"Game over, man!  Game over!" is the universal "We're screwed!" call in my<BR>
group.  Other lines commonly heard "Maybe they don't show up on infra-red at<BR>
all", "Yeah man, but it's a dry heat", "What are we supposed to use, man,<BR>
harsh language?", and the ever-popular "You're dog-meat,pal!"<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Douglas E. Berry [mailto:gridlore@pop.mindspring.com]<BR>
Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2000 12:32 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
At 12:03 PM 4/18/2000 -0600, you wrote:<BR>
>Nope.  Aliens is the best gamer movie of the last 20 years.  <BR>
>Other candidates include the Terminator series, the Indiana Jones series,<BR>
>the last two Star Wars movies (Empire and Jedi), Desperado, Highlander,<BR>
>Bladerunner, etc.<BR>
><BR>
>I'm afraid the Mummy falls far behind most of these in quality and plot.<BR>
<BR>
I should have been more clear.  The Mummy *is* a RPG.  The characters are<BR>
ridiculous stereotypes, the villain is really, really nasty, and the<BR>
dialogue is stuff heard around gaming tables the world over.  I had no<BR>
trouble hearing the die rolls and the evil chuckles of the game master.<BR>
<BR>
I would never call Aliens a "gamer" movie, since all it is is a fight scene<BR>
stretched out to two hours.  Not that that's a bad thing mind you, but<BR>
imagine the gaming sessions.  "OK, a few more of you got scragged by the<BR>
Aliens in MedLab.. where are you falling back to now?"<BR>
- --<BR>
<BR>
Duugirashir Irebamenagiin  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
Inquisitor Maximus, Reformed Canon Church of Sylea<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:44:20 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: William Prankard <cmdrx@magicnet.net><BR>
Subject: X-TEK and the TML Landgrab<BR>
<BR>
X-TEK Corporate News Service<BR>
News Flash - 110-1120<BR>
X-TEK Claims 871-438 (Jewel/1510)<BR>
<BR>
In an unprecedented move today by X-TEK Corporate Division of Planetary<BR>
Acquisitions, the company has staked its claim on the world of 871-438 in<BR>
the Jewel subsector.<BR>
<BR>
871-438 (Jewel/1510) has long been observed by the IISS as little more<BR>
than 'a worthless iceball'.  The IISS maintains only a nav becon on the<BR>
planet giving it it's Class E (Class I to G:T) starport rating.<BR>
Technicaly it is still a barren and unincorporated world.<BR>
<BR>
When asked why X-TEK would want to lay claim to such a barren world with<BR>
no apparent profitable resources, The Commander (CEO of X-TEK) replied: <BR>
<BR>
"We needed a world where R&D could work on their projects in relative<BR>
safety to themselves and others.  The locals at HRD back in Deneb sector<BR>
were begining to get a bit testy, seeming how R&D's last blunder destroyed<BR>
Hangar 18 and cracked windows for miles around.  The legal compliants were<BR>
getting a bit hard on the corporate coffers.  We determined that 871-438<BR>
would be ideal for a weapons research and deployment testing facility.<BR>
Totaly barren, flat open ice plains and most of all outside Imperial<BR>
jurisdiction!"<BR>
<BR>
X-TEK intends to make a small corporate research facility on the world in<BR>
the comming years. Upgrading the starport to at least a Class D(Class II<BR>
G:T)<BR>
<BR>
The TAS intends to make the world an Amber Zone shortly after the creation<BR>
of said research facility due to the weapons testing and corporate<BR>
jurisdiction.<BR>
<BR>
This concludes this XTEK News Service Flash<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
\  // Commander X<BR>
 \//  CEO X-TEK Industries of Deneb, LIC<BR>
T E K  Starship Contractor & High Energy Weapons Research<BR>
 //\  http://www.magicnet.net/~cmdrx/xtek/xtek.htm<BR>
//  \ 0608 D557777-A kk- va+ so+ zh+ da+ A723<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:12:21 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: FFS1 Solar Cells<BR>
<BR>
Antony Farrell writes:<BR>
> Can anyone help me. I need to design a solar folding array for an FFS1 (Mk1<BR>
> Mod1) vessel capable of producing greater than 30MW (At TL12) in the<BR>
> habitable zone, does anyone know whether the solar cell and collection<BR>
> panel rules in the book are correct?<BR>
<BR>
I don't know.  With reasonably advanced efficiency assumptions it should be <BR>
around 30,000 square meters, and with structure, probably at least 300 tons<BR>
(and that's quite thin).<BR>
> <BR>
> What would the surface area of such an array when folded be? I have worked<BR>
> out that when deployed it is huge! But there is no reference to a folded<BR>
> size.<BR>
<BR>
It probably comes apart and goes into storage, rather than 'folding' per se.<BR>
As such, folded area isn't much different from the size of the mount points,<BR>
and would be fairly small.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:30:57 +0100<BR>
From: Timothy.Collinson@solent.ac.uk<BR>
Subject: Re: Peter's View of Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Bill Dunn <bdunn@epicsystems.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> I have to say that when I saw the list of canonical sources contructed in<BR>
> hierarchical order, I said, "This borders on obsessive-compulsive. The<BR>
> player must be a loon."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net> wrote on:11 Apr 2000<BR>
<BR>
>That's not obsessive compulsive, Obsessive compulsive<BR>
>would be to annotate 'The Traveller Bibliography'<BR>
>with a numerical listing, in order, the canonicity of each<BR>
>and every product. Obsessive compulsion would include<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I *knew* there was an index I was missing!!  ;-)<BR>
<BR>
(The thing has 5 already.  If anyone should step up to the plate to bat for<BR>
Obsessive compulsives, I suspect I might be on the team.)<BR>
<BR>
tc<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:34:23 -0700<BR>
From: "J. Paul Sanders" <timmon@primenet.com><BR>
Subject: Keith Supplements - Last Call!<BR>
<BR>
5...4... 3...  - yes folks - 3 sets left. If you want to reserve one, do it<BR>
while you can! Details at:<BR>
<http://www.primenet.com/~timmon/supplements.html>www.primenet.com/~timmon/s<BR>
upplements.html<BR>
<BR>
And yes...I *do* have a bottle of champaign iced and waiting :)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Cordially,<BR>
Paul<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:31:07 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: Flame wars, part MCXXXIII<BR>
<BR>
Do you set out to start flame wars?  Do you want to read that again and<BR>
reconsider?  Does anything you wrote have anything to do with Traveller, or<BR>
was it just to stir the pot?<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: GaryBartz@aol.com [mailto:GaryBartz@aol.com]<BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 19, 2000 7:34 AM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Marshals<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
hmmm...you have known some good guy agents who were killed, therefore we <BR>
cannot comment on Lon and those like him in federal service when they obey <BR>
very questionable orders and kill for political expedience?<BR>
<BR>
Given our every-three-monthly threads on guns/how evil America is to<BR>
everyone <BR>
else/gayness, I think some comments on certain agencies willingness to kill <BR>
children are allowable.<BR>
<BR>
Gary<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/19/00 7:23:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< Folks, some of us have attended the funerals of federal agents who died<BR>
to<BR>
 keep this country from becoming Columbia.  Keep the cheap shots to<BR>
yourself. <BR>
>><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:33:41 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: William Prankard <cmdrx@magicnet.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Ditzie & Demigods<BR>
<BR>
SPPPPPLLLLLUUUUUUTTTTT>>>>.....Fisssle, Crak, sputter...pllllppppp....<BR>
<BR>
Chalk up a confired keyboard kill for Mr.Newman.<BR>
Sir I salute you!<BR>
<BR>
This is almost as funy as the Onion's D&D stats for Bill Gates.<BR>
<BR>
\  // Commander X<BR>
 \//  CEO X-TEK Industries of Deneb, LIC<BR>
T E K  Starship Contractor & High Energy Weapons Research<BR>
 //\  http://www.magicnet.net/~cmdrx/xtek/xtek.htm<BR>
//  \ 0608 D557777-A kk- va+ so+ zh+ da+ A723<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:36:21 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> At 12:03 PM 4/18/2000 -0600, you wrote:<BR>
> >Nope.  Aliens is the best gamer movie of the last 20 years.<BR>
> >Other candidates include the Terminator series, the Indiana Jones series,<BR>
> >the last two Star Wars movies (Empire and Jedi), Desperado, Highlander,<BR>
> >Bladerunner, etc.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >I'm afraid the Mummy falls far behind most of these in quality and plot.<BR>
> <BR>
> I should have been more clear.  The Mummy *is* a RPG.  The characters are<BR>
> ridiculous stereotypes, the villain is really, really nasty, and the<BR>
> dialogue is stuff heard around gaming tables the world over.  I had no<BR>
> trouble hearing the die rolls and the evil chuckles of the game master.<BR>
<BR>
Hey, they even make it clear that Brendan Fraser is like second level or<BR>
something. He actually _checks_ for traps! ;-)<BR>
<BR>
My wife and I loved that movie for the same reason. We could smell the<BR>
pizza coming from the gaming table around the movie...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 07:45:56 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
<BR>
At 0:07 -0400 19/4/00, Bill <beast@aracnet.com> wrote:<BR>
> >JPEGs of Entire Rim sent (1.3 Mb data) separately.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
>Are we speaking of jpegs of the rim systems or a map of the rim<BR>
>sectors or something entirely different??<BR>
<BR>
JPEGs of the subsectors and sector map from Supplement 10 as <BR>
requested by Loren.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:36:42 +0300<BR>
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jussi_Kenkkil=E4?= <Jussi.Kenkkila@helsinki.fi><BR>
Subject: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
I have a question relating to this thread.<BR>
<BR>
> Ve = exhaust velocity<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
Where can I get Ve:s for different kinds of reaction drives? (H+O rockets, fission and fusion rockets, ion drives, etc)<BR>
Does anyone have some table handy?<BR>
<BR>
- -J2K<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:38:19 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net><BR>
Subject: Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
<BR>
Howdy!<BR>
<BR>
Walt wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> My take on this: "Today's plan for the good of France has not come<BR>
> out as planned. This boy is a determined servant of France. Killing<BR>
> him now would serve no purpose, save vengeance. I'll reward him for<BR>
> his courage, for someone with his courage and determination could<BR>
> turn out to be a vital tool in the future. Besides, I can can always<BR>
> kill him later."<BR>
> <BR>
> D'Artagnan will never betray France, or do anything dishonorable.<BR>
> This makes him very predictable, and, if handled carefully, quite<BR>
> controllable. As long as the Cardinal's goal is the good of France,<BR>
> it is likely that the two will on occasion find common cause with<BR>
> each other - the Cardinal just has to be careful that D'Artagnan<BR>
> only gets involved with situations that are for the good of all<BR>
> France, rather than for the good of the Cardinal's plans for France. <BR>
> <BR>
And this is very powerfully used in The Man in the Iron Mask (the book)...<BR>
<BR>
yours,<BR>
Michael<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Michael and MJ Houghton   | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>
herveus@radix.net         | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>
Bowie, MD, USA            | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>
                          | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:45:51 -0300<BR>
From: Brian Quirt <baqrt@mta.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
Jussi Kenkkil wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> I have a question relating to this thread.<BR>
> <BR>
> > Ve = exhaust velocity<BR>
> ><BR>
> <BR>
> Where can I get Ve:s for different kinds of reaction drives? (H+O rockets, fission and fusion rockets, ion drives, etc)<BR>
> Does anyone have some table handy?<BR>
> <BR>
> -J2K<BR>
<BR>
	Well, you might try Keith Watt's "Exodus Project" site. It has several<BR>
sections on various aspects of engines, complete with a java "engine<BR>
performance calculator." The main site is at<BR>
<http://www.ExodusProject.com> with the "realistic engines" site at<BR>
<http://www.exodusproject.com/Engines.htm>. Excellent resources, and<BR>
well worth looking at.<BR>
<BR>
- -Brian Quirt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:41:41 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: 2313 Echiste/Lanth<BR>
<BR>
Anyone noticed that the Xboat link mentioned in Adv 3 was never <BR>
completed in any later supplement for Traveller. There's a tale to <BR>
tell there. In Twilight's Peak the link is less than a year from <BR>
going live?<BR>
<BR>
So why did it die? A FFW casualty? But why not rebuild it? Politics?<BR>
<BR>
Maybe a nice adventure seed lies here...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:48:39 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: SETI@home tailchaser<BR>
<BR>
At 10:18 +0000 19/4/00, Gordon Horne <ghorne@home.com> wrote:<BR>
> >In a despairing attempt to up my rate I've started running the screen<BR>
> >saver version to get blank screen mode in MacOS. It definitely runs<BR>
> >faster this way. I reckon that my packet time is halved to around 30<BR>
> >hours!<BR>
> ><BR>
>I'd mock you, but us Mac users have to stick together 8) Besides i<BR>
>need to think of a suitable reward for "James Sterrett & Corinne<BR>
>Mahaffey" who have knocked me out of my long-held 5th position. Any<BR>
>thoughts? Evil or otherwise.<BR>
<BR>
Hmm. If you're going to be like that I'll go back to normal screen <BR>
and slower processing. I thought you'd like an extra two or three <BR>
packets a week...<BR>
<BR>
Buy a G4-500?<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:58:36 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
At 7:21 -0400 19/4/00, "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz> wrote:<BR>
> > Not that that's a bad thing mind you, but<BR>
> > imagine the gaming sessions.  "OK, a few more of you got scragged by the<BR>
> > Aliens in MedLab.. where are you falling back to now?"<BR>
><BR>
><grin> You should try this as a LARP. Works surprisingly well.<BR>
<BR>
I ran something similar about 9 years ago - I cloned Mission Arcturus <BR>
from 2300 when we ran a laser based LRP in  ruined school / <BR>
residential home. We had one small heavy weapons group, a light <BR>
advance landing team (approx 1/3 of group) and the 'enemy' (1/2 the <BR>
group). We told the advance group and heavy weapons team that they <BR>
would be scored as to when they needed to call the support team in. <BR>
landed the first group, then let them into the secret - they were <BR>
playing the Kafers too. So we staged (on the radio) the first teams' <BR>
massacre and set them all up, ready to meet the HW team.<BR>
<BR>
Boy where they surprised, rushing rescue the other team, the got into <BR>
the house quite easily, and tore through the defenses. They then <BR>
started encountering smoke bombs, thunder flashes, and flares, and <BR>
Loads more enemy than they expected. They had the autofire weapons so <BR>
could take down the Kafers quite well (they only had single shot <BR>
weapons) but the medic was in a lot of use, and actually was taken <BR>
out at one point. They'd have succeeded if they hadn't ended up in <BR>
room, and  got trapped.<BR>
<BR>
One of the other GMs still tries to get his own back on me...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2327<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 19 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2328<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
RE: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
Re: Flame wars, part MCXXXIII<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
Heart of Darkness (was Re: Lawyer stuff help?)<BR>
Heart of Darkness (was re: Lawyer stuff help?)<BR>
RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
re:  GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
Re: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
Re: Marshals<BR>
RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
Re: 2313 Echiste/Lanth<BR>
TML Landgrab...<BR>
First In - Type D stars<BR>
Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
Re: [OT] New gamer<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
re:  near-C rocks <BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:00:46 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
<BR>
At 7:21 -0400 19/4/00, Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se> wrote:<BR>
>Bill wrote:<BR>
> > >JPEGs of Entire Rim sent (1.3 Mb data) separately.<BR>
> > Are we speaking of jpegs of the rim systems or a map of the rim<BR>
> > sectors or something entirely different??<BR>
>Probably a collection of holiday photos from Dom's trip around the Rim sector.<BR>
<BR>
On that topic: Doug, I'm having difficulty sourcing a J6 courier for <BR>
the time you're over at BITS for GenCon, ACQ and Penguins. Hertz <BR>
aren't playing ball. We may have to make do with a car and the UK <BR>
rather than the whole Rim.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:06:13 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: RE: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
<BR>
At 7:21 -0400 19/4/00,  "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz> wrote:<BR>
>Before I was twelve I had had two more fathers and lived in Bosham, Sussex<BR>
>(England); Freemantle, Australia; Preston, Lancashire; Bishop's Stortford,<BR>
>Herefordshire;<BR>
<BR>
BITS Central is by Bishop Stortford!<BR>
>My wife and I had four sons, and after building computesrs from discrete TTL<BR>
>components as a hobby, and finally buying a System 80 ( TRS80 clone from<BR>
>Asia , known as a Video Genie in the UK ) I worked toward a Computer Science<BR>
>degree at Canterbury University.<BR>
<BR>
;-) Had one of those Video Genies... first computer I had.<BR>
<BR>
Interesting bio...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:52:29 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
=?iso-8859-1?Q?Jussi_Kenkkil=E4?= writes:<BR>
> I have a question relating to this thread.<BR>
> <BR>
> > Ve = exhaust velocity<BR>
> > <BR>
> <BR>
> Where can I get Ve:s for different kinds of reaction drives? (H+O rockets,<BR>
> fission and fusion rockets, ion drives, etc) Does anyone have some table<BR>
> handy? <BR>
<BR>
Multiply ISP by 9.8.  To determine ISP, divide thrust by the weight of fuel<BR>
consumed in one second.  Realistic H+O rockets have ISPs in the 400s, the <BR>
others depend heavily on design assumptions, though as a simple rule of thumb<BR>
the minimum power consumption for any non-chemical drive is (exhaust velocity)*<BR>
(thrust)*0.5 (in MKS, the units for that are meters/second, newtons, and watts)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:12:19 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Flame wars, part MCXXXIII<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma wrote:<BR>
>Do you set out to start flame wars?  Do you want to read that again and<BR>
>reconsider?  Does anything you wrote have anything to do with Traveller, or<BR>
>was it just to stir the pot?<BR>
<BR>
Amen.<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
PS - I will not dignify Mr. Bartz' 'posting' with a reply.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:13:15 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
>From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
>Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
>> I would refer my learned brother to Imperial history:<BR>
><BR>
>Aha!  Resorting to facts, are we?  "When you can't<BR>
>win on the law, argue the facts."<BR>
<BR>
and when you don't have the facts, bang your shoe on the<BR>
table and argue policy!<BR>
<BR>
I see that our legal educations were in the same paradigm.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:16:26 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Heart of Darkness (was Re: Lawyer stuff help?)<BR>
<BR>
>From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
<BR>
>For true Evil Genius (TM) Refereeing you could recruit two<BR>
>groups of PC's: one for Chakropom's group and one for <BR>
>Kurtz's group.<BR>
<BR>
A Zhodani spy in our midst!  With very high level<BR>
telepathy!<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:19:10 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Heart of Darkness (was re: Lawyer stuff help?)<BR>
<BR>
>From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
<BR>
>Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
>> For true Evil Genius (TM) Refereeing you could recruit<BR>
>>two groups of PC's: one for Chakropom's group and one for<BR>
>> Kurtz's group.<BR>
>Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do<BR>
>it! Do it!<BR>
>I wanna play it! I wanna! I wanna! I wanna! I wanna! I<BR>
>wanna!<BR>
>You might use two Evil Genius Refs who are conniving<BR>
>together.<BR>
<BR>
OK, maybe it's time for the SF/SJ groups to really get our<BR>
acts together and get something going in time for Steve's<BR>
arrival this summer.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:24:45 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
<BR>
>Alien is a horror movie<BR>
>Aliens is a war movie<BR>
>Alien 3 is an art movie<BR>
<BR>
Agreed -- and Alien 4 is role-playing game movie.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:37:23 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
igor@truserve.com [Andy Akins] wrote<BR>
<BR>
> This is a quasi-official announcement concerning the upcoming <BR>
> GURPS Traveller sourcebook Modular Cutter, of which I am a co-author. <BR>
> Basically, if anyone out there has any requests, opinions, etc... on what they <BR>
> would like to see in such a volume, please email me at igor@truserve.com.<BR>
<BR>
No offense intended but why exactly are they doing a whole <BR>
source book on Modular Cutters anyway? <BR>
<BR>
It seems to me to be a rather narrow topic to write a source book<BR>
on, which may suggest that it will have a correspondingly<BR>
narrow market. A modular cutter does not have a jump drive which<BR>
makes it unsuitable for a primary vehicle for any group that<BR>
is engaged in interstellar travel. In addition few of the<BR>
current typical PC small starships carry cutters so it won't<BR>
even be a typical secondary vehicle.<BR>
<BR>
> At the moment, elements in the book will include:<BR>
>   * Overview of modular craft in general<BR>
>   * Overview/history of cutter specifically<BR>
>   * Rules specific to the cutter<BR>
>   * Career templates for cutter pilots in various branches<BR>
>   * Equipment useful for cutters<BR>
<BR>
For cutters only? Most of the things useful for cutters<BR>
(winches, portable airlocks, emergency survival kits,<BR>
Swiss Army knives, etc) would be useful on most any<BR>
starship, non starship, or vehicle.<BR>
<BR>
>   * Vehicles used for the handling and transport of cutters and cutter modules<BR>
>   * Several variations of the standard cutter, as well as several other ships <BR>
> that can make use of the cutter's modules<BR>
<BR>
Variations at the same TL or GTL 10 and 12 variants<BR>
(to say nothing of GTL 9 & 11 if this comes out after<BR>
Starships)?<BR>
<BR>
>   * Extensive library of cutter modules - commercial, military, scout, <BR>
> scientific, station, and more...<BR>
>   * A collection of deckplans for modules and vessels.<BR>
<BR>
> I'll group these all in one message -<BR>
<BR>
> 2. What is the location of the Depot serving the Marches? I _believe_ its <BR>
> Depot/Corridor...but I'm not sure. Also, the hex location and subsector name <BR>
> would be cool.<BR>
<BR>
All Depots are called Depot/Sector Name, except for the<BR>
one Sector (Massilla ?) that has two Depots which are, IIRC<BR>
called Depot Alpha and Depot Beta.<BR>
<BR>
Depot/Corridor is at 1511 Corridor, in the Strand subsector.<BR>
Its UPP is A686354-F D Lo Ni   123 Im M4V<BR>
It is best described in DGP canon which SJG unfortunately<BR>
can not use [MT Journal #3 p74 as part of Greg Videll's<BR>
'Rapid Repo' adventure about a Scout Commando team raiding<BR>
the (then Vargr occupied) system for an experimental deep<BR>
radar system.<BR>
<BR>
However Depot/Deneb serves the Marches much more than Depot/<BR>
Corridor does. Deneb is closer and Corridor 's primary mission<BR>
is keeping the Vargr out. Moreover Depot/Deneb is detailed<BR>
in The Regency Sourcebook which is fair game for your use.<BR>
<BR>
Depot/Deneb is located at 1613 Deneb, in the Inar Subsector.<BR>
(1117 stats) A100644-G D   Na Ni Va   220 Im F9 II<BR>
"The actual name of the world itself is Sika'im, but following<BR>
Imperial convention the system as a whole is named Depot,<BR>
for the crucial facility located there" [Reg SB p 56]<BR>
<BR>
I also not that (in TNE canon) once Norris became Archduke<BR>
he arranged for the Spinward Marches to have its own Depot.<BR>
Logic suggests that in GURPS Traveller he may wish to make<BR>
the same choice. If you get approval to do so you may want<BR>
to think of mentioning an announcement that Macene/Spinward<BR>
Marches (2612) has just been designated as a Depot.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 11:40:47 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
<BR>
>From: igor@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
>1. What are all the canonical references to vessels <BR>
>carrying Cutters? <BR>
>My memory:<BR>
>  Broadsword (x2)  <BR>
>  Donosev  <BR>
>  Many warships in Supplement 9: Fighting Ships<BR>
<BR>
See also Supplement 7:  Traders and Gunboats for some<BR>
discussion of small craft including cutters.  I don't<BR>
recall any ships in that book actually carrying cutters.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:21:06<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
<BR>
At 09:58 AM 4/19/2000 CST6CDT, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>2. What is the location of the Depot serving the Marches? I _believe_ its <BR>
>Depot/Corridor...but I'm not sure. Also, the hex location and subsector name <BR>
>would be cool.<BR>
<BR>
Macene/Rhylanor (2612) shows as Depot on the subsector map (BTC 105-106)<BR>
><BR>
>3. In the army/navy/marines, what is the "normal" rank of helicopter<BR>
>transport pilots (UH-60 and the like)...I figure these indidividuals would <BR>
>be the closest counterparts to military cutter pilots.<BR>
<BR>
Depends.  The rule of thumb is the sexier the ride, the more likely that<BR>
the officers keep all the fun to themselves.<BR>
<BR>
In the Imperium, I'd see cutter pilots as being senior NCOs, like the RW<BR>
Navy people who handle landing craft and the like.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:25:16<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marshals<BR>
<BR>
At 09:34 AM 4/19/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
>hmmm...you have known some good guy agents who were killed, therefore we <BR>
>cannot comment on Lon and those like him in federal service when they obey <BR>
>very questionable orders and kill for political expedience?<BR>
<BR>
A friend of mine was a DEA agent who found the wrong meth lab in LA.  Every<BR>
try to tell a four year old that Daddy isn't ever coming home again, no<BR>
matter how much the child promises to be good?  <BR>
<BR>
Look, I understand that there are abuses, but this automatic attack against<BR>
LEO agencies sickens me.  If you want to see what happens when law and<BR>
order break down, look at Somalia, or the current situation in Zimbabwe.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:28:02<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
At 09:46 PM 4/19/2000 +1200, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> I would never call Aliens a "gamer" movie, since all it is is a<BR>
>> fight scene stretched out to two hours.<BR>
><BR>
>Alien is a horror movie<BR>
>Aliens is a war movie<BR>
>Alien 3 is an art movie<BR>
><BR>
>Haven't bothered seeing Redemption yet.<BR>
<BR>
Redemption actually comes close to beign a "gamer" movie, but falls apart<BR>
due to excessive cliches.<BR>
<BR>
>> Not that that's a bad thing mind you, but<BR>
>> imagine the gaming sessions.  "OK, a few more of you got scragged by the<BR>
>> Aliens in MedLab.. where are you falling back to now?"<BR>
><BR>
><grin> You should try this as a LARP. Works surprisingly well.<BR>
<BR>
I did it.  It's called the combined MOUT Facility at Ft. Polk.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:29:55<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
At 09:32 AM 4/19/2000 -0600, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I call Aliens the best gamer movie of the last 20 years because it's lines<BR>
>are heard around my gamer table more than anything else, except maybe Monty<BR>
>Python.  Hardly a session goes by where a player doesn't suggest that they<BR>
>"take off and nuke the site from orbit - it's the only way to be sure," and<BR>
>"Game over, man!  Game over!" is the universal "We're screwed!" call in my<BR>
>group.  Other lines commonly heard "Maybe they don't show up on infra-red at<BR>
>all", "Yeah man, but it's a dry heat", "What are we supposed to use, man,<BR>
>harsh language?", and the ever-popular "You're dog-meat,pal!"<BR>
<BR>
That's all language I heard in the Army.  The makers of _Aliens_ did a<BR>
wonderful job of making the Marines feel like real soldiers.  You forgor<BR>
the best one though:  "Somebody wake up Hicks."<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:38:47<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
<BR>
At 06:00 PM 4/19/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>On that topic: Doug, I'm having difficulty sourcing a J6 courier for <BR>
>the time you're over at BITS for GenCon, ACQ and Penguins. Hertz <BR>
>aren't playing ball. We may have to make do with a car and the UK <BR>
>rather than the whole Rim.<BR>
<BR>
That's not a problem, as the likely scenario will be something like this:<BR>
<BR>
(Day 1) Dom takes Doug to see a castle.<BR>
<BR>
(Day 14) Using plastic explosives, Dom finally gets Doug out of said castle.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 10:46:46 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: 2313 Echiste/Lanth<BR>
<BR>
SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Anyone noticed that the Xboat link mentioned in Adv 3 was never <BR>
> completed in any later supplement for Traveller. There's a tale to <BR>
> tell there. In Twilight's Peak the link is less than a year from <BR>
> going live?<BR>
> So why did it die? A FFW casualty? But why not rebuild it? Politics?<BR>
> Maybe a nice adventure seed lies here...<BR>
<BR>
IMTU Duchess Delphine had it stopped because she wanted<BR>
to hinder the development of Regina because of her political<BR>
rivalry with Duke Norris.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:28:53 CST6CDT<BR>
From: igor@truserve.com<BR>
Subject: TML Landgrab...<BR>
<BR>
Since my work load has lightened a smidgen...<BR>
<BR>
..I grab Bularia/Darrian (0430)<BR>
<BR>
Andy Akins<BR>
igor@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________<BR>
True Communications Corporation Your Premier ISP.<BR>
"Hometown Service with Worldwide Connectivity"<BR>
http://www.truserve.com        info@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:55:35 CST6CDT<BR>
From: igor@truserve.com<BR>
Subject: First In - Type D stars<BR>
<BR>
Anyone out there come up with, or find, First In compatable stats for Type D <BR>
stars?<BR>
<BR>
Specifically, a MD...<BR>
<BR>
Thanks...<BR>
<BR>
Andy<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________<BR>
True Communications Corporation Your Premier ISP.<BR>
"Hometown Service with Worldwide Connectivity"<BR>
http://www.truserve.com        info@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:49:13 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I have a question relating to this thread.<BR>
><BR>
>> Ve = exhaust velocity<BR>
><BR>
> Where can I get Ve:s for different kinds of reaction drives? (H+O rockets, <BR>
> fission and fusion rockets, ion drives, etc)<BR>
<BR>
Actually, what you want is Isp (specific impulse), as the Ve isn't<BR>
"really" the exhaust velocity, but rather the "effective exhaust<BR>
velocity". <BR>
<BR>
> Does anyone have some table handy?<BR>
<BR>
Some of the books should have tables listing Isp. And it's not *merely*<BR>
the fuel. It's the fuel and *engine*. For example, the Space Shuttle<BR>
main Engines have use LOX/LH2 and have an ISP of 423 or so. The F-1<BR>
engines on the Saturn 5 used the same fuel, but I doubt their Isp was<BR>
much above 380. <BR>
<BR>
The old NERVA project (solid core nuclear rocket) had an Isp of about<BR>
800. Ion drives have a *wide* range of Isps, from around 10,000 on up.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:26:25 -0500<BR>
From: Shimmergloom <dragon@mhtc.net><BR>
Subject: Re: [OT] New gamer<BR>
<BR>
Has she created a character yet?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
But seriously, Congratulations.<BR>
<BR>
My address is:<BR>
<BR>
Collier<BR>
box 352<BR>
argyle, wi 53504<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I expect one of those bubble gum cigars.<BR>
<BR>
:)<BR>
<BR>
John Wood wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Following an unexpectedly problematic labour (including the classic 4am<BR>
> dash across the city to the hospital with the mother on all fours on the<BR>
> back seat of the car), our daughter May ?? Norwood [1] was delivered by<BR>
> emergency caesarian section at 10:15am Monday. She weighed in at 6lb<BR>
> 13oz [2]. After a fairly rocky start, the baby is doing well (she has<BR>
> just been released from the Special Care unit); her mother Alison is<BR>
> recovering fast.<BR>
<BR>
- -------------------------<BR>
Earth first!   We'll strip mine the other planets later...<BR>
<BR>
dragon@mhtc.net<BR>
http://www.mhtc.net/~dragon/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:21:39<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
At 10:37 AM 4/19/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>No offense intended but why exactly are they doing a whole <BR>
>source book on Modular Cutters anyway? <BR>
<BR>
Because they think it can sell.<BR>
<BR>
>It seems to me to be a rather narrow topic to write a source book<BR>
>on, which may suggest that it will have a correspondingly<BR>
>narrow market. A modular cutter does not have a jump drive which<BR>
>makes it unsuitable for a primary vehicle for any group that<BR>
>is engaged in interstellar travel. In addition few of the<BR>
>current typical PC small starships carry cutters so it won't<BR>
>even be a typical secondary vehicle.<BR>
<BR>
The idea is that the modular cutter might be the "deuce and a half" of the<BR>
Imperium.  The bloody things are everywhere, and are seen in amazing<BR>
variations.<BR>
<BR>
To be honest, there wasn't that much in Starports (another narrow focus<BR>
book) that is going to be of immediate use to me and my campaign. But if I<BR>
ever need it, that information is there.  I suspect this will be the case<BR>
with the Cutter book.<BR>
<BR>
Not all campaigns have to be star-spanning epics.  I recall one Referee ran<BR>
a campaign that never left Regina.  All of the adventures were set on<BR>
Assinbola's moons and the other points in the system.  Ran for about a<BR>
year, IIRC.<BR>
<BR>
For example:  "Doug and Dom's EZ-transport service!"  Using the very old,<BR>
but almost space worthy cutter "Penguin Rex", the campaign focuses around<BR>
the odd jobs that need to be done in any Hi=Pop system.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry   Templar Agent at Large.<BR>
gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
<BR>
TravGeekCode: <BR>
tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>
ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>
         <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:38:18 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  near-C rocks <BR>
<BR>
>From: "DaveShayne" <daveshayne@email.msn.com><BR>
>Subject: near-C rocks (was Peter Newman's view of<BR>
>Traveller)<BR>
<BR>
>near-C rocks? I effing lovey those puppies. They've just<BR>
>got to be the bestestmost Vargr Glampunk band in the whole<BR>
<BR>
>of for ever. Expexially their first single "Meteor Shower <BR>
>Shampoo" B/W "It's Death to be Uncharismatic." Way more <BR>
>massively brilliant than "Female Aslan In Sensible Shoes."<BR>
<BR>
>Even if F.A.I.S.S. did headline the Marchespaloozatour of <BR>
>1113.<BR>
<BR>
That was a near splort which reminded me that I'm thirsty<BR>
and should go get something to drink (if I hadn't been<BR>
sitting here getting thirsty, it would've been a full<BR>
splort).  But first, a word from our sponsor:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Well, sophs, as if wrestling wasn't enough, Rrafroughz<BR>
scrounges us tickets for get it Near-C Rocks get it, a<BR>
Vargr "musiker" group playing at Peacefield -- scuse me,<BR>
that's "the Peacefield" -- in Startown.  The Peacefield was<BR>
the early human colonists' first big performance space, but<BR>
it's fallen into considerable disrepair and now has a<BR>
pleasant mustiness.  Long years ago, when I was only<BR>
Prithapon's age, I had a three day pass on Jesedipere and<BR>
spent all of it at the Peacefield listening and dancing to<BR>
The Windows, Thankless Life, Imijdrixhen, and, best of all,<BR>
Niploj Sinaj and her band, Wholly Owned Subsidiary.  Oh,<BR>
those were the days.  We thought they'd never end.<BR>
<BR>
Anyway that was long ago and far away and tonight the rain<BR>
has stopped but the red tape is still running on getting<BR>
our cargo offworld so we're standing in the cool damp night<BR>
with a really mixed crowd, lots of Vargr in bright colors<BR>
and big jewelry, young humans in brighter colors and bigger<BR>
jewelry, and even a bunch of Lellewellollies or whatever<BR>
they're called waving their fronds and looking damned<BR>
spooky despite generations of peaceful coexistence.  Police<BR>
and young criminals both look askance at our group of three<BR>
humans and a Vargr in a mix of spacer's gear and local<BR>
ultracazh or outback wear from a dozen different cultures<BR>
- -- Prithapon's irridescent green miniskirt and skintight<BR>
mock seabear camisole make her look positively fetching,<BR>
but the XO's baggy dun pocketpants just aren't working with<BR>
his snazzy white and yellow lounger from Efate, and I don't<BR>
know why Rraf and I are both wearing checquered head<BR>
scarves from the Menorbian desert people around our necks<BR>
- -- but we just look odd among a lot of other odd-looking<BR>
people, so we're left alone except for the occasional<BR>
whispered "paper, honor sir, just a bit of paper?" which we<BR>
ignore, tonkies being expected and ignored at any spectacle<BR>
in this part of the Marches.<BR>
<BR>
Soon we're at the head of the line to get it and there's<BR>
incense burning and little asteroid-shaped things to buy<BR>
and wear and the XO buys the ugliest concert shirt I've<BR>
ever seen while two Kforuz start a quick and nervous<BR>
conversation with Rraf, in Gvegh too fast for me to follow,<BR>
and there's too much noise for my translator to help. <BR>
We're pushing through a thick crowd into the bar -- as I<BR>
recall, you have to pass through the bar to get to your<BR>
seats -- and a positively oily young local leers at<BR>
Prithapon and makes a rude suggestion that gets very a cold<BR>
stare, followed, to my surprise, by a smile and laugh, but,<BR>
smiling and laughing, Prithapon moves on through the crowd<BR>
toward the dark doorway on the other side of which are<BR>
little booths and tables and chairs and then the XO and I<BR>
are out there with her, but we've lost track of Rraf, and a<BR>
Vargr in 44th Squadron colors asks me in Zdetl if I'd like<BR>
to sample some action out back during intermission, where<BR>
the gravsters are parked, a real nice young, he says, but I<BR>
can't tell if he means girl, boy, or pup, so I smile like<BR>
maybe I have no idea what he's saying and squeeze on in and<BR>
then I feel it in the base of my skull -- someone is<BR>
probing with telekinesis, touching like with a finger, to<BR>
try to find the switch to the psishield that englobes my<BR>
scalp and is held in place by my hair having grown through<BR>
it and this is going to be a more interesting show than I<BR>
thought.<BR>
<BR>
Prithapon is at our table with Oilyboy from the bar,<BR>
smiling and laughing with or at him I can't say, and the XO<BR>
has ordered a round of something in flimsy Florence bottles<BR>
with glass straws which tastes sweet and bitter is actually<BR>
the local poison that I grew so fond of while listening to<BR>
the Windows with those two students from the ag school<BR>
who'd travelled hours by air/raft to get there.  Solange<BR>
and Donatienne, I remember in a flash, thinking of the<BR>
hippocampal irrigation I'd gotten when we spent a week at<BR>
Rhylanor; that's really the only way to save your memory as<BR>
you age, trust me on the hippocampal irrigation.<BR>
<BR>
Lights down, up, down, audience gets noisy, then quiet as<BR>
the light show starts.  A hologram of a fat trader moves<BR>
slowly from left to right across the stage, as the familiar<BR>
(to us) sounds of its bridge -- ping! ping! blooweep<BR>
chitchitchit ping! -- fill the Peacefield.  Suddenly, steam<BR>
pours out of the trader, and a huge triangular ship with a<BR>
Vargr's mouth painted on the bow cruises up from below,<BR>
mouth first.  Ship sounds are going crazy with alarms --<BR>
did they record our own bridge a few weeks ago? -- and a<BR>
heavy drumbeat starts, with some other instrument -- what<BR>
is it? an oboe, yes, a divine oboe -- in the background. <BR>
Light beams in the steam indicate a battle underway, and<BR>
suddenly comes the sound of a ship's address system: <BR>
"Attention! Attention! Attention! this is the Captain<BR>
speaking.  Please remain calm.  Remember that pirates do<BR>
not exist.  They cannot exist."  The pirate ship vanishes,<BR>
the lights come up, and the warm up band, No No No,<BR>
continues their opening number, "Don't exist.  Please."<BR>
<BR>
Rraf stumbles to the table, one of the Kforuz in tow, and<BR>
says to me in Galanglic, "hey, they have some action out<BR>
back -- real nice young -- we may have a situation." <BR>
Odinsblod, I think, not a damsel in distress -- typical<BR>
Rraf to get involved in saving an underdog, so to speak,<BR>
and after years of doing that he's got charisma all over<BR>
two subsectors.  "Sitrep?" I ask, and he says, "None yet;<BR>
why don't you have Pritaphon follow me in ten?  Comm's on."<BR>
 "Yah," I say, and turn back to No No, who have started an<BR>
especially loud song whose title I couldn't hear.  The<BR>
words are flashing in the air above them in Galanglic and<BR>
Gvegh, though -- "I don't like Wundays, I don't like<BR>
Wundays" -- and I wonder why not but Pritaphon asks for a<BR>
sitrep and I tell her what I think is going down and she<BR>
looks at her comm and gets up to find Rraf.  I wait through<BR>
the beginning of the next song, a cover of The Plankwells'<BR>
"Bmm Hop" which was a stupid song when The Plankwells<BR>
somehow took it to gold in two subsectors but why<BR>
underestimate the musivid-buying population?  <BR>
<BR>
I stagger through the audience toward the side door, which<BR>
is open to the alley, as the Peacefield is getting hot and<BR>
smoky, and follow the beep of my comm along an alley where<BR>
a tonky is pleading for paper from a too tough buff boy in<BR>
sunglasses and an ImpMar teetop, but I go along toward the<BR>
parking structure, grav vehicles floating in rows overhead<BR>
and rows deep and there several rows away are Rraf and<BR>
Prithapon talking with two Vargr in Kforuzeng jackets and<BR>
smaller Vargr in just fur, looking down and being obviously<BR>
a character of no standing in his or probably her own eyes,<BR>
let alone the others'.<BR>
<BR>
OK what's next?  I pull some creds from a pocket as the<BR>
young human in gravparker livery approaches.  I see a bulge<BR>
where there shouldn't be, however, and he looks too<BR>
nervous, so I smile big and say, "hey, wher-redjoo parrk<BR>
that big-ol Iraref sportster, sport? Mah ol'lady wants it<BR>
reeel baad," but while he's trying to understand my<BR>
Emeraldene dialect I'm watching for Rraf to make a move and<BR>
then I hear it in the earpiece of my comm:  "Deal then" in<BR>
Rraf's voice, but it doesn't matter what he's said, what's<BR>
important is that he's transmitting, which means he's ready<BR>
for help.   The gravparker has his hand on my Cr100 note<BR>
and is noticing that it's actually two, but his venality<BR>
gets him as I kick low and hard and follow with a double<BR>
palm strike to his ears.  He's down, fell hard, and I'm<BR>
pulling a big honker out of his belt -- and I mean big,<BR>
Instellarms BFG14, a 14 mm revolver, weighs an effing tonne<BR>
 --  as I hear Pritaphon in my comm:  "Do you want to try a<BR>
human?  We're not like Vargr females, you know.  We're<BR>
_always_ in heat," which gets some responses in Gvegh but<BR>
then I'm down with parkerboy who's out but cold, stripping<BR>
off his commdots, and checking for other weapons, none.  I<BR>
didn't kill him outright so I suppose he'll live and then I<BR>
go quick and low between two parked limos, toward Rraf, but<BR>
a few rows to their right. <BR>
<BR>
Then I stop and go back.  What was it about parkerboy?  I<BR>
look at him close, open his mouth:  not enough teeth. <BR>
Makes it easier to speak Zdetl, I guess, but not my<BR>
problem.  I go back through the rows, keeping my head down.<BR>
 I look up at floating vehicles, but they didn't think to<BR>
put anyone above, oddly not as thorough as Kforuz should<BR>
be, but maybe they're tired after the war, and then I'm up<BR>
to them, Rraf in my earcomm, Gvegh with Galanglic overlay<BR>
by the translator "I think you'll like -- don't you have a<BR>
comfy limo nearby?" and I sneak a look around the corner of<BR>
a big gravlimo at the two Kforuz, one on either side of<BR>
Prithapon, back to me, her hands stroking their arms, Rraf<BR>
facing me on the other side of them, a proprietary arm<BR>
around the no-status naked female and I make a purring<BR>
sound in my mouth that they'll hear through their commdots<BR>
and Prithapon slips her thumb into the pressure point above<BR>
the elbow of the Kforuz on her right, lets go of the one on<BR>
her left, as I step up to him, putting my gun up to his<BR>
head. Rraf smiles a dopey Vargr smile as Pritaphon slams<BR>
her elbow into the right Kforuz's throat, don't kill him,<BR>
I'm thinking, we've still got to get off this rock, but he<BR>
drops, choking, and Rraf says in Gvegh, "tell you what.<BR>
We're not unreasonable. We'll take both females, but we'll<BR>
give you our seats.  I hear Near-C really rocks." <BR>
<BR>
Rraf is dragging the naked female Vargr as Pritaphon and I<BR>
cover the rear and the uninjured Kforuz helps the victim of<BR>
Pritaphon's elbow.  Parkerboy is nowhere in sight.  Once we<BR>
get into the air/raft and get it moving, I call the XO, and<BR>
he starts, "Accomplished?" which means he knew, already,<BR>
that this was an op, and somehow didn't think to tell me --<BR>
Fafnir and Brunhild! I really thought we were going to a<BR>
concert! "Yah," I say, "we got it."  "Good.  Point Option<BR>
in seventeen," meaning eight minutes from now we were<BR>
meeting somewhere and I look up "option" on my comm and<BR>
it's a warehouse not far from the starport gate.  I field<BR>
strip the BFG and wipe down and drop each part, one at a<BR>
time, over the side.  The cylinder is heavy and the bullets<BR>
dangerous, so I look for a good spot and there's some kind<BR>
of muddy water below so in they go splat splat splat.  <BR>
<BR>
We approach the warehouse from its roof entrance, and<BR>
there's practically a welcoming committee and I wish I<BR>
hadn't ditched the BFG but naked female Vargr is looking a<BR>
lot less scared and lonely and actually wiggling like a<BR>
puppy and I realize that she's really young, maybe 13 in<BR>
human years -- thousands of years of knowing the Vargr as a<BR>
sentient race and we still talk about dog years, which<BR>
actually refers to the apparent path of Sirius around<BR>
Terra's sky, and only a tiny fraction of humaniti has<BR>
actually ever seen Terra's sky, but the phrase came into<BR>
space with us, and we still talk about dog years and dog<BR>
days and dog tired.  The welcoming committee must be<BR>
family, there's an obvious patriarch and even more obvious<BR>
bodyguards with plenty of hardware, and the patriarch is<BR>
thanking Rraf in Gvegh and Rraf is apologizing for taking<BR>
so long and really talking up, like to his own father or<BR>
grandfather, but "ass-kissing" is not a pejorative in any<BR>
Vargr language.  We don't stay long, but female relatives<BR>
lick all of our palms and then we're off low through the<BR>
warehouse district to the regular starport gate and through<BR>
without a fuss.<BR>
<BR>
XO actually stayed for the whole concert, but got busted at<BR>
the extrality line trying to bring across the bootlegged<BR>
holovid he'd made.  Rraf told him he should've just passed<BR>
it to one of the Kforuzeng there, and he would've had a<BR>
dozen copies in the cargo before the bar closed.  XO told<BR>
Rraf that he should've seen the concert.  Near-C Rocks<BR>
rule, dude!<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2328<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2329</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 19 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2329<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2328<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: First In - Type D stars<BR>
Re: First In - Type D stars<BR>
re: near-C rocks<BR>
=?iso-8859-1?Q?re:__near-C_rocks_(with_Katana=B4s!!!)?=<BR>
Re: [OT] New gamer<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: Marshals<BR>
Re: near-C rocks (with =?iso-8859-1?Q?Katana=B4s=21=21=21?=)<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
=?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_near-C_rocks_(with_Katana=B4s!!!)?=<BR>
RE: RE: SETI@home tailchaser<BR>
Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
Re: 2313 Echiste/Lanth<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Plastique in a Spraycan<BR>
RE: [OT] New gamer<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:55:43 -0700<BR>
From: "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
I think the F-1 booster used LOX and Kerosene, if memory serves....The 2nd.<BR>
and 3rd stages were LOX/H2.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Leonard Erickson" <shadow@krypton.rain.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 19, 2000 1:49 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> > I have a question relating to this thread.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >> Ve = exhaust velocity<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Where can I get Ve:s for different kinds of reaction drives? (H+O<BR>
rockets,<BR>
> > fission and fusion rockets, ion drives, etc)<BR>
><BR>
> Actually, what you want is Isp (specific impulse), as the Ve isn't<BR>
> "really" the exhaust velocity, but rather the "effective exhaust<BR>
> velocity".<BR>
><BR>
> > Does anyone have some table handy?<BR>
><BR>
> Some of the books should have tables listing Isp. And it's not *merely*<BR>
> the fuel. It's the fuel and *engine*. For example, the Space Shuttle<BR>
> main Engines have use LOX/LH2 and have an ISP of 423 or so. The F-1<BR>
> engines on the Saturn 5 used the same fuel, but I doubt their Isp was<BR>
> much above 380.<BR>
><BR>
> The old NERVA project (solid core nuclear rocket) had an Isp of about<BR>
> 800. Ion drives have a *wide* range of Isps, from around 10,000 on up.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> --<BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
>  shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
> leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:02:35 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer stuff help?<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I see that our legal educations were in the same paradigm.<BR>
<BR>
LOL.  Archibald Cox was my Con Law professor!<BR>
<BR>
(Special prosecutor tasked with investigating Tricky<BR>
Dick Nixon, who Nixon then fired, for those of you<BR>
who don't know.  Which is sort of like the guy with<BR>
the Warrant trying to cancel the Marshall's investigation).<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:07:26 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Dixon" <cdixon@airfoiltech.com><BR>
Subject: unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR>
<BR>
unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:19:05 CST6CDT<BR>
From: igor@truserve.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2328<BR>
<BR>
> No offense intended but why exactly are they doing a whole <BR>
> source book on Modular Cutters anyway? <BR>
> <BR>
> It seems to me to be a rather narrow topic to write a source book<BR>
> on, which may suggest that it will have a correspondingly<BR>
> narrow market. A modular cutter does not have a jump drive which<BR>
> makes it unsuitable for a primary vehicle for any group that<BR>
> is engaged in interstellar travel. In addition few of the<BR>
> current typical PC small starships carry cutters so it won't<BR>
> even be a typical secondary vehicle.<BR>
<BR>
First of all, thanks for opinions, and the answers you provided. <BR>
<BR>
And no offence is taken - you're not the only one that has asked this question. <BR>
In fact, when I saw this title on the SJG wishlist, I asked myself this as well.<BR>
<BR>
Doug Berry hit the nail on the head - it is the plan to make the Cutter quite <BR>
common as an intra-system small craft - orbit to planet transports, customs <BR>
cutters, and in-system transports.<BR>
<BR>
Also, although you are correct that the typical PC vessels (Free Trader, Scout, <BR>
Far Trader, Fat Trader) don't have Cutters - it will become aparent that many <BR>
other ships do. Consider CT Supplement 9, Fighting Ships. Most of the larger <BR>
ships in that book have "assorted 50-ton craft" - I'm writing that up to be <BR>
primarily cutters.<BR>
<BR>
Also, the Scout Service is going to have a love affair with cutters - present <BR>
already in the Donosev. The utility and customization ability of cutters <BR>
appeals to the Scouts.<BR>
<BR>
The equipment listed in the book will be a mix - some designed specifically for <BR>
cutters, others for small craft in general.<BR>
<BR>
Finally (and this is an idea that originated in TNE) - the modules themselves. <BR>
Modules can be used to construct ground and/or orbital bases.<BR>
<BR>
Note also that while cutters are the primary topic - several cutter variants <BR>
(at various TLs, for various missions) and several starships that can utilize <BR>
the modules will be described.<BR>
<BR>
I have no problem building a book from this topic - there's lot that can be <BR>
done. It remains to be seen, of course, if it will be a popular book that <BR>
interests people. I can only hope :)<BR>
<BR>
Again, thanks for your comments...<BR>
<BR>
Andy<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________<BR>
True Communications Corporation Your Premier ISP.<BR>
"Hometown Service with Worldwide Connectivity"<BR>
http://www.truserve.com        info@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:41:50 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
To: 'traveller@lists.imagiconline.com' <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 19 April 2000 16:35<BR>
Subject: RE: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Ah, that's different then.  I'll agree that the ludicrous dialogue and plot<BR>
>twists do a fair job of approximating what goes on around a gamer table.<BR>
><BR>
>I call Aliens the best gamer movie of the last 20 years because it's lines<BR>
>are heard around my gamer table more than anything else, except maybe Monty<BR>
>Python.  Hardly a session goes by where a player doesn't suggest that they<BR>
>"take off and nuke the site from orbit - it's the only way to be sure," and<BR>
>"Game over, man!  Game over!" is the universal "We're screwed!" call in my<BR>
>group.  Other lines commonly heard "Maybe they don't show up on infra-red<BR>
at<BR>
>all", "Yeah man, but it's a dry heat", "What are we supposed to use, man,<BR>
>harsh language?", and the ever-popular "You're dog-meat,pal!"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I've always had a soft spot for "Marines - we are leaving!"<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:53:47 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: First In - Type D stars<BR>
<BR>
> Anyone out there come up with, or find, First In compatable stats for Type<BR>
D<BR>
> stars?<BR>
><BR>
> Specifically, a MD...<BR>
<BR>
CT Book 6 had this information.  Here it is: magnitude 15.9, luminosity<BR>
.00003, surface temperature 2700 Kelvin, radius .006, mass 1.11 solar<BR>
masses. Whole system is a big outer zone, life is unlikely anywhere.<BR>
<BR>
By the way, hello everybody. I'm new here...<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:55:39 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: First In - Type D stars<BR>
<BR>
igor@truserve.com wrote:<BR>
> Anyone out there come up with, or find, First In compatable stats for Type D <BR>
> stars?<BR>
> <BR>
> Specifically, a MD...<BR>
<BR>
I assume you mean a DM star ? That is a red dwarf. I have treated those stars<BR>
as main sequence. The numbers seem reasonable, although they might be a bit<BR>
off. If you have the real luminosity of the star, the First In formulas should<BR>
work out fine. The main part of the spectral type (M3 or whatever) indicates<BR>
temprature, the rest can be calculated.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:59:34 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<snip><BR>
> The Windows, Thankless Life, Imijdrixhen, and, best of all,<BR>
> Niploj Sinaj and her band, Wholly Owned Subsidiary.  Oh,<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
Nice writing, but I believe you mis-spelled the name of Nilpoj Sinaj.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:07:10 +0200<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?re:__near-C_rocks_(with_Katana=B4s!!!)?=<BR>
<BR>
<g><BR>
Hmm, this old topic again, uh?<BR>
<BR>
Ref: You are sitting in the pub, when suddenly, unexpectedly, the door opens.<BR>
P1: I grab my RoM PGMP-20.<BR>
P2: I already have mine in my hands.<BR>
P3: What do I see?<BR>
<BR>
Ref: You see two "rogue" rocks with leather jackets wildly waving their <BR>
arms and shouting something about everybody having to leave the system <BR>
immediately.<BR>
<BR>
P1: Did I ALREADY SAY I grab...<BR>
Ref: Yes!<BR>
<BR>
P3: I listen more carefully!<BR>
<BR>
Ref: They say a great danger is heading directly for the planet: Two near-C <BR>
female Aslan, armed with Katanas on a collision course with this planet. <BR>
They try to destabililze the 2-D Universe by destroying unstable planets by <BR>
crashing into them while slashing about wildly with their Katanas!<BR>
<BR>
P1-3: This world is domed (sic)! To the ship! Run away!<BR>
<BR>
Ref: When you leave the pub, you notice the rocks have loads of copied data <BR>
crystals with them.<BR>
<BR>
P2: Not possible, no form of piracy is possible in the Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Ref: Is too!<BR>
<BR>
P2: Is not!<BR>
<BR>
Ref: When I say it is, it is!<BR>
<BR>
P2 (pout)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Did i forget any neverending thread? Oh yes, guns should be banned and <BR>
A-Bombs are evil...<BR>
<BR>
</g><BR>
- ---<BR>
Volker A. Greimann<BR>
greimann@geocities.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:13:47 +0100<BR>
From: "Peter  Scarrott" <peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: [OT] New gamer<BR>
<BR>
Congratulations, best wishes to all three of you, may your lives be happy<BR>
and fulfilled.  If sleepless for the next 16 years or so!! :-)<BR>
<BR>
>John Wood wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Following an unexpectedly problematic labour (including the classic 4am<BR>
> dash across the city to the hospital with the mother on all fours on the<BR>
> back seat of the car), our daughter May ?? Norwood [1] was delivered by<BR>
> emergency caesarean section at 10:15am Monday. She weighed in at 6lb<BR>
> 13oz [2]. After a fairly rocky start, the baby is doing well (she has<BR>
> just been released from the Special Care unit); her mother Alison is<BR>
> recovering fast.<BR>
<BR>
Peter<BR>
http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
p.scarrott@btinternet.com<BR>
<BR>
IMTU: tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so  zh+<BR>
vi-<BR>
      And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR>
<BR>
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the<BR>
shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser<BR>
gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time to<BR>
die."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:08:05 +0100<BR>
From: "Peter  Scarrott" <peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
>SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>said<BR>
>Similarly Alien: Resurrection. I hated this as an Alien film, but<BR>
>thought it was a great dramatisation of a Traveller PC group in<BR>
>action.<BR>
>Dom<BR>
<BR>
Hands up who wanted to play that group,<BR>
<BR>
Me, Me, Me<BR>
<BR>
Hated film until I saw it a third time and watched it as a plain SF Film.<BR>
<BR>
Peter<BR>
http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
p.scarrott@btinternet.com<BR>
<BR>
IMTU: tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so  zh+<BR>
vi-<BR>
      And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR>
<BR>
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the<BR>
shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser<BR>
gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time to<BR>
die."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:10:40 +0100<BR>
From: "Peter  Scarrott" <peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Marshals<BR>
<BR>
>Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 09:25:16<BR>
>From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
>Subject: Re: Marshals<BR>
<BR>
>At 09:34 AM 4/19/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
>>hmmm...you have known some good guy agents who were killed, therefore we<BR>
>>cannot comment on Lon and those like him in federal service when they obey<BR>
>>very questionable orders and kill for political expedience?<BR>
<BR>
>A friend of mine was a DEA agent who found the wrong meth lab in LA.  Every<BR>
>try to tell a four year old that Daddy isn't ever coming home again, no<BR>
>matter how much the child promises to be good?<BR>
<BR>
>Look, I understand that there are abuses, but this automatic attack against<BR>
>LEO agencies sickens me.  If you want to see what happens when law and<BR>
>order break down, look at Somalia, or the current situation in Zimbabwe.<BR>
<BR>
>Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
Can we please kill this entire thresd now.  I know many of us have strong<BR>
feelings on these topics (both for and against) but this can come much too<BR>
close to home for many of us.  Personally I have friends and family in<BR>
Zimbabwe and my Sister-in-laws family disappeared soewhere over there today<BR>
(Thursday), so please can we get back to Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
Peter<BR>
http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
p.scarrott@btinternet.com<BR>
<BR>
IMTU: tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so  zh+<BR>
vi-<BR>
      And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR>
<BR>
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the<BR>
shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser<BR>
gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time to<BR>
die."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:27:54 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks (with =?iso-8859-1?Q?Katana=B4s=21=21=21?=)<BR>
<BR>
Volker Greimann wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> <BR>
> Did i forget any neverending thread?<BR>
<BR>
Don't forget that the authorities received warning of the near-C Aslan<BR>
via jump torpedo.... ;-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:35:07 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-19 00:09:29 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< That material is classified.  Please report to SolSec for reconditioning.  <BR>
>><BR>
<BR>
I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:33:45 +0200<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_near-C_rocks_(with_Katana=B4s!!!)?=<BR>
<BR>
At 00:27 20.04.00, you wrote:<BR>
>Volker Greimann wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
><<snip>><BR>
> ><BR>
> > Did i forget any neverending thread?<BR>
><BR>
>Don't forget that the authorities received warning of the near-C Aslan<BR>
>via jump torpedo.... ;-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Damn all 100000 Ancients! I knew i missed one.<BR>
<BR>
- ---<BR>
Volker A. Greimann<BR>
greimann@geocities.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:38:29 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: RE: RE: SETI@home tailchaser<BR>
<BR>
At 18:23 +0000 19/4/00, Minion@hell-labs.com  wrote:<BR>
> > Hmm. Maybe I'll look at the prices of these (do the Voodoo cards do<BR>
> > 3d acceleration and 2D video ram?)<BR>
>Voodoo2 cards do not.  Voodoo3 do.  I suggest the low-end voodoo3 <BR>
>unless you do 3d<BR>
>gaming.<BR>
<BR>
Cheers - they just (finally released) Voodoo 2, 3, 4 on MacOS.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:47:51 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
<BR>
At 16:38 -0400 19/4/00, "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote:<BR>
>That's not a problem, as the likely scenario will be something like this:<BR>
><BR>
>(Day 1) Dom takes Doug to see a castle.<BR>
><BR>
>(Day 14) Using plastic explosives, Dom finally gets Doug out of said castle.<BR>
<BR>
Take off and.....<BR>
<BR>
The only way to be sure...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:49:14 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: 2313 Echiste/Lanth<BR>
<BR>
At 16:38 -0400 19/4/00, Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
>IMTU Duchess Delphine had it stopped because she wanted<BR>
>to hinder the development of Regina because of her political<BR>
>rivalry with Duke Norris.<BR>
<BR>
Interesting - you could have an interesting scenario on how she gets <BR>
enough clout to stop the IISS completing a port they where working <BR>
on...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:51:05 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Douglas E. Berry <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
>At 09:46 PM 4/19/2000 +1200, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>> I would never call Aliens a "gamer" movie, since all it is is a<BR>
>>> fight scene stretched out to two hours.<BR>
>><BR>
>>Alien is a horror movie<BR>
>>Aliens is a war movie<BR>
>>Alien 3 is an art movie<BR>
>><BR>
>>Haven't bothered seeing Redemption yet.<BR>
><BR>
>Redemption actually comes close to beign a "gamer" movie, but falls apart<BR>
>due to excessive cliches.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Well most of my games *are* full of excessive clichs... ;-P<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:55:39 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Plastique in a Spraycan<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Douglas E. Berry <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>>On that topic: Doug, I'm having difficulty sourcing a J6 courier for<BR>
>>the time you're over at BITS for GenCon, ACQ and Penguins. Hertz<BR>
>>aren't playing ball. We may have to make do with a car and the UK<BR>
>>rather than the whole Rim.<BR>
><BR>
>That's not a problem, as the likely scenario will be something like this:<BR>
><BR>
>(Day 1) Dom takes Doug to see a castle.<BR>
><BR>
>(Day 14) Using plastic explosives, Dom finally gets Doug out of said<BR>
castle.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Speaking of plastic explosives, anyone have any thoughts on a set of<BR>
traveller (any version) stats for the "plastique in a spraycan" from near<BR>
the start of Barb Wire, (the only good thing in a *very* dire movie...)<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:03:32 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: [OT] New gamer<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of John Wood<BR>
> Following an unexpectedly problematic labour (including the classic 4am<BR>
> dash across the city to the hospital with the mother on all fours on the<BR>
> back seat of the car), our daughter May ?? Norwood [1] was delivered by<BR>
> emergency caesarian section at 10:15am Monday. She weighed in at 6lb<BR>
> 13oz [2]. After a fairly rocky start, the baby is doing well (she has<BR>
> just been released from the Special Care unit); her mother Alison is<BR>
> recovering fast.<BR>
<BR>
Congratulations, may she bring you & Allison much joy.<BR>
<BR>
> Weak ObGURPS/Trav:<BR>
> What will labour be like in the Far Future? Alison's a big fan of<BR>
> Bujold's Miles Vorkosigan series, and she *still* thinks she'd rather<BR>
> have a traditional, Barrayaran pregnancy than have the child grown in a<BR>
> Betan incubator. So it's not just a matter of technology solving all the<BR>
> problems (though perhaps the *right* technology could do so); there are<BR>
> social and psychological aspects too.<BR>
<BR>
Focused gravitics might help, or even just appropriate acceleration (vis<BR>
Lazarus Long's experience as a mid-wife ), though even then there would be<BR>
those who would push for "natural" birth.<BR>
<BR>
Regular birthing in water may also help, and technology for allowing helpers<BR>
to breathe under water easily would assist with this.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, "technology" has already helped in your case, Caesarians, while<BR>
having been around for a long time were not particularly survivable or nice<BR>
for the woman if she did survive until the advent of Dr. Lister.<BR>
<BR>
On the other hand, these days there are probably more Caesarians being<BR>
performed than are neccessary, some doctors seem to do them as a matter of<BR>
course, I had an argument outside the delivery room with one doctor who was<BR>
insisting on a Caesarian because the labour was taking too long, even though<BR>
my wife had had two children without Caesarian, and both were long labours.<BR>
Turned out he had a golf game to get to, in the end the mid-wife told him to<BR>
leave, she'd handle things, and she "didn't bother" getting him to come back<BR>
until after the baby was born. She was from Zimbabwe, and had birthed many<BR>
children without a doctor within fifty miles.<BR>
<BR>
I have noticed that many of the "problems" people have in pregnancy aren't<BR>
really problems with the child or mother, they're problems for the hospital<BR>
and it's staff.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Notes:<BR>
> [1] Middle name to be decided.<BR>
<BR>
I vote for Arbellatra ! <grin><BR>
<BR>
> p.s. Thanks to everyone from both lists who sent their best wishes - I<BR>
> haven't been online since Sunday lunchtime so I probably haven't seen<BR>
> all of them yet! There's a bunch of great people on both the TML and<BR>
> GURPSnet; while you're arguing about Democracy and Gun Control just<BR>
> remember it's the people that really count.<BR>
<BR>
Those arguing on both sides would probably say they are thinking of the<BR>
pople as they argue , but I agree with the sentiment.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:23:35 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/19/00 2:43:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time, pnewman@gci.net <BR>
writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< No offense intended but why exactly are they doing a whole <BR>
 source book on Modular Cutters anyway? <BR>
  >><BR>
I believe the book is on space craft a 100 tons and lower....<BR>
<BR>
Mike<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 15:32:53 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
> At 10:37 AM 4/19/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
> >No offense intended but why exactly are they doing a whole <BR>
> >source book on Modular Cutters anyway? <BR>
> <BR>
> Because they think it can sell.<BR>
<BR>
Why do they think it can sell well enough to be successful?<BR>
<BR>
> >It seems to me to be a rather narrow topic to write a source book<BR>
> >on, which may suggest that it will have a correspondingly<BR>
> >narrow market. A modular cutter does not have a jump drive which<BR>
> >makes it unsuitable for a primary vehicle for any group that<BR>
> >is engaged in interstellar travel. In addition few of the<BR>
> >current typical PC small starships carry cutters so it won't<BR>
> >even be a typical secondary vehicle.<BR>
<BR>
> The idea is that the modular cutter might be the "deuce and a half" of the<BR>
> Imperium.  The bloody things are everywhere, and are seen in amazing<BR>
> variations.<BR>
<BR>
This may make them worth an article but why does it make them<BR>
of sufficiently great interest to justify a whole book? For <BR>
example in most fantasy campaigns various types of mounts are <BR>
everywhere. This does not mean that an hypothetical AD&D Complete <BR>
Cart Horses Handbook would sell. On the other hand an AD&D<BR>
Complete Mounts Handbook might sell well. Similarly I think that<BR>
Modular Cutters is a narrow topic that may hurt the books sales.<BR>
<BR>
> To be honest, there wasn't that much in Starports (another narrow focus<BR>
> book) that is going to be of immediate use to me and my campaign. But if I<BR>
> ever need it, that information is there.  I suspect this will be the case<BR>
> with the Cutter book.<BR>
<BR>
The difference (at least in my mind) is that the Starports<BR>
book focuses on all types of ports while the Modular Cutter<BR>
book focuses on only one type of vehicle. To me the proper<BR>
comparison would not be to Starports but to a hypothetical<BR>
GURPS Class III Downports. Just as CLass II Downports would<BR>
focus on a narrow portion of all starports so does Modular<BR>
Cutter focus on a narrow portion of all vehicles. Moreover <BR>
it focuses on a non jump capable (and thus less popular with <BR>
most players and Ref's) vehicle. If GURPS Modular Cutter was <BR>
a 20 to 30 page section of a book featuring 20-30 pages each <BR>
on another 3-5 common ships or boats and their variants (Scout S<BR>
hip, Pinnace, air raft, etc) then it seems to me it would have <BR>
a larger audience.<BR>
<BR>
> Not all campaigns have to be star-spanning epics.  I recall one Referee ran<BR>
> a campaign that never left Regina.  All of the adventures were set on<BR>
> Assinbola's moons and the other points in the system.  Ran for about a<BR>
> year, IIRC.<BR>
<BR>
Of course campaigns don't have to be star-spanning epics but <BR>
many (most?) of them are. This narrows the potential market<BR>
for this product.<BR>
<BR>
> For example:  "Doug and Dom's EZ-transport service!"  Using the very old,<BR>
> but almost space worthy cutter "Penguin Rex", the campaign focuses around<BR>
> the odd jobs that need to be done in any Hi=Pop system.<BR>
<BR>
That sounds as if it would be a lot of fun to play in. The<BR>
question I was posing was not "What good is GURPS Modular<BR>
Cutter?" it was "Will enough people buy GURPS Modular Cutter<BR>
to make it worth SJG's while?" I'm not saying I don't see the <BR>
uses for the product what I'm saying is that I question how <BR>
many people will pay $19.95 US (or more) for it. I want every<BR>
GURPS Traveller book produced to sell well.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2329<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2330</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	4/19/00 9:26:46 PM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
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</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 20 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2330<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Marshals<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
GURPS Power Plants<BR>
Re: First In - Type D stars<BR>
Re: Cutter Book<BR>
Re: I _am_ SolSec<BR>
Re: GURPS Power Plants<BR>
Re: Cutter Book<BR>
Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
RE: RE: SETI@home tailchaser<BR>
Re: Cutter Book<BR>
Re: Cutter Book<BR>
Re Helo Pilots<BR>
Re Cutters<BR>
Re: Ditzie and Demigods<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
RE: Durham Definition<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
Re: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
Re: Marshals<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
RE: Durham Definition<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:07:27 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marshals<BR>
<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
>If you want to see what happens when law and order break<BR>
>down, look at Somalia, or the current situation in<BR>
>Zimbabwe.<BR>
<BR>
I was thinking of Heya when reading about Zimbabwe<BR>
recently.  The demographics are reversed, as the Vargr on<BR>
Heya are not only the impoverished and disenfranchised, but<BR>
also the minority by orders of magnitude.  Still, it's an<BR>
interesting direction to go.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:52:12 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
<BR>
>The difference (at least in my mind) is that the Starports<BR>
>book focuses on all types of ports while the Modular Cutter<BR>
>book focuses on only one type of vehicle. To me the proper<BR>
>comparison would not be to Starports but to a hypothetical<BR>
>GURPS Class III Downports. Just as CLass II Downports would<BR>
>focus on a narrow portion of all starports so does Modular<BR>
>Cutter focus on a narrow portion of all vehicles. Moreover<BR>
>it focuses on a non jump capable (and thus less popular with<BR>
>most players and Ref's) vehicle. If GURPS Modular Cutter was<BR>
>a 20 to 30 page section of a book featuring 20-30 pages each<BR>
>on another 3-5 common ships or boats and their variants (Scout S<BR>
>hip, Pinnace, air raft, etc) then it seems to me it would have<BR>
>a larger audience.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I agree.  I think a better title would be GT:Small Craft or GT:Ships Boats.<BR>
It could cover the main sub-100 DT craft in some detail yet still have space<BR>
for a more in depth analysis of Modular Cutters in particular. After all, is<BR>
a Pinnace,  Launch or Gig Pilot much different to a Cutter Pilot? Are their<BR>
maintenance requirements that different? etc. etc.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:03:19 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: GURPS Power Plants<BR>
<BR>
My recent question about Ion Drives brought to my attention the lack of<BR>
available information regarding the total amount of power output on GT<BR>
starships, as a result of the modular design philosophy. All the other<BR>
vehicles state the total output of the power plant (as they were obviously<BR>
designed using Vehicles) but I can't even find a reference to the size power<BR>
'slices' in the starship modules, so you can't even add up the slices to<BR>
determine the total power plant output.<BR>
<BR>
This is *very* annoying.<BR>
<BR>
After all, in the situation we found ourselves in during the GT PBeM in<BR>
question, our manoeuvre system was damaged and I was looking into alternate<BR>
systems to provide an emergency solution, but was crippled by the fact that<BR>
unless I reversed engineered all the bl**dy modules I had no idea as to how<BR>
much power we might be able to salvage... Grrr.<BR>
<BR>
Is this info available anywhere? I can't find it readily in my 1st printing<BR>
GT main book. I can find the mass, spaces, cost etc with no problem, but not<BR>
the power usage...<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:06:27 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: First In - Type D stars<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Matt Stevens <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>By the way, hello everybody. I'm new here...<BR>
><BR>
>Matt<BR>
<BR>
Hi Matt,<BR>
<BR>
Welcome to our wacky world. <BR>
<BR>
Trust no-one... <BR>
<BR>
Especially the Penguins...<BR>
<BR>
Matt <g><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:09:40 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Cutter Book<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-19 19:37:01 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< Why do they think it can sell well enough to be successful?  >><BR>
<BR>
My gut feeling -- and I think I have a fairly good track record at this sort <BR>
of thing -- When it comes out, take a look at it and if you don't want it, <BR>
don't buy it. <BR>
<BR>
Andy has not mentioned that he is co-authoring the book with me, and doing <BR>
the deckplans. I think enough fans will like it to make it a good seller.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:10:38 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: I _am_ SolSec<BR>
<BR>
GDWGAMES@aol.com [LKW] wrote<BR>
<BR>
> you write:<BR>
> << That material is classified.  Please report to SolSec for reconditioning.  <BR>
<BR>
> I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
> LKW<BR>
<BR>
This statement seems to fit in with the following ones<BR>
(not that there is anything wrong with that)<BR>
<BR>
"The state, it is me."<BR>
<BR>
"When the President does it that means it is not illegal."<BR>
<BR>
"I am the law."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:22:40 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Power Plants<BR>
<BR>
Matthew Bond writes:<BR>
> My recent question about Ion Drives brought to my attention the lack of<BR>
> available information regarding the total amount of power output on GT<BR>
> starships, as a result of the modular design philosophy. All the other<BR>
> vehicles state the total output of the power plant (as they were obviously<BR>
> designed using Vehicles) but I can't even find a reference to the size<BR>
> power 'slices' in the starship modules, so you can't even add up the<BR>
> slices to determine the total power plant output.<BR>
<BR>
1 megawatt per 10 tons manuever drive thrust, plus 10 megawatts per jump drive<BR>
module, plus 10 MW for a TL-10 laser or 18 MW for a TL-12 laser.  With the<BR>
exception of drives and weapons, all other power consumption is negligible.<BR>
<BR>
> Is this info available anywhere? I can't find it readily in my 1st printing<BR>
> GT main book. I can find the mass, spaces, cost etc with no problem, but<BR>
> not the power usage...<BR>
<BR>
It's relatively easy to reverse engineer.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:12:49 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Cutter Book<BR>
<BR>
Is this "Near Trader" and will it cover economics and perhaps a few<BR>
MegaCorps?  (Not that there is any chance that I won't buy it.  Hopeless<BR>
collectors like me will buy about anything if you paint it black and add a<BR>
red pinstripe :-p )<BR>
<BR>
- -Crusty<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: <GDWGAMES@aol.com><BR>
><BR>
> Andy has not mentioned that he is co-authoring the book with me, and doing<BR>
> the deckplans. I think enough fans will like it to make it a good seller.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:22:52 -0700<BR>
From: Bill <beast@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
<BR>
Is this a free service or is there a fee?<BR>
<BR>
>At 0:07 -0400 19/4/00, Bill <beast@aracnet.com> wrote:<BR>
>> >JPEGs of Entire Rim sent (1.3 Mb data) separately.<BR>
><BR>
><snip><BR>
><BR>
>>Are we speaking of jpegs of the rim systems or a map of the rim<BR>
>>sectors or something entirely different??<BR>
><BR>
>JPEGs of the subsectors and sector map from Supplement 10 as <BR>
>requested by Loren.<BR>
><BR>
>Dom<BR>
><BR>
>----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
>"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
>can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
>http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:29:08 -0700<BR>
From: Bill <beast@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: RE: RE: SETI@home tailchaser<BR>
<BR>
>At 18:23 +0000 19/4/00, Minion@hell-labs.com  wrote:<BR>
>> > Hmm. Maybe I'll look at the prices of these (do the Voodoo cards do<BR>
>> > 3d acceleration and 2D video ram?)<BR>
>>Voodoo2 cards do not.  Voodoo3 do.  I suggest the low-end voodoo3 <BR>
>>unless you do 3d<BR>
>>gaming.<BR>
><BR>
>Cheers - they just (finally released) Voodoo 2, 3, 4 on MacOS.<BR>
><BR>
>Dom<BR>
><BR>
>----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
>"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
>can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
>http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR>
<BR>
Whodoo Voodoo the way wedoo voodoo on G4doo (erk?!?)<BR>
<BR>
That had to hurt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:39:21 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Cutter Book<BR>
<BR>
>Is this "Near Trader" and will it cover economics and perhaps a few<BR>
>MegaCorps?  (Not that there is any chance that I won't buy it.  Hopeless<BR>
>collectors like me will buy about anything if you paint it black and add a<BR>
>red pinstripe :-p )<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Cha-CHING!<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
+++<BR>
Cynical? Me?*<BR>
+++<BR>
*Although I have to admit, so far the GURPS books have been damn good.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:42:53 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: Cutter Book<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:12:49 -0400, "Sword-Worlder"<BR>
<swordworlder@yahoo.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Is this "Near Trader" and will it cover economics and perhaps a few<BR>
>MegaCorps?  (Not that there is any chance that I won't buy it.  Hopeless<BR>
>collectors like me will buy about anything if you paint it black and add a<BR>
>red pinstripe :-p )<BR>
<BR>
Now I know how to get rid of my POS '87 Ford Escort.   ;-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"I was going to write myself in, but I was afraid I'd get shot."<BR>
                                       -Lincoln Kennedy, Oakland Raiders tackle, <BR>
                                        on his decision not to vote<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 16:55:22 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Helo Pilots<BR>
<BR>
>>3. In the army/navy/marines, what is the "normal" rank of helicopter<BR>
>>transport pilots (UH-60 and the like)...I figure these indidividuals would<BR>
>>be the closest counterparts to military cutter pilots.<BR>
><BR>
>Depends.  The rule of thumb is the sexier the ride, the more likely that<BR>
>the officers keep all the fun to themselves.<BR>
<BR>
Typically, most were Warrants a few years back (early 90's). Some were<BR>
LT's. Almost all crew-chiefs/Flight-engineers were NCO's.<BR>
<BR>
Locally, I've not seen any NCO's (army or airforce, nor even the coasties<BR>
who fly in a lot) with pilot's wings, only A/C wings.<BR>
<BR>
However, in Trav, we don't have warrants specified in canon, except for<BR>
Zhodani, and that only from AHL; they seem to be like the RN, where<BR>
warrants are senior NCO's, rather than an inbetween area ala Russian<BR>
Praporshiki.<BR>
However, I agree with Doug: the sexier (IE, more combat-capable and<BR>
high-performance), the more likely it's driven by a shmoe with a commision.<BR>
<BR>
IMTU, Cutters are flown by NCO's, and commanded by Senior NCO's or Junior<BR>
Officers, mission dependant.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 17:08:41 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Cutters<BR>
<BR>
Someone asked for opinions and desires for the Modular cutters book:<BR>
<BR>
1) Include at least one new designed ship which is reliant upon it's<BR>
cutters. For Example, a cargo hauler in the 500Td range, with 2 cuttters,<BR>
2J1, M1, and no streamlining at all. (This should keep costs down<BR>
somewhat). give it about 150-200 Td of cargo, and some passenger space. And<BR>
just make certain it carries two spare modules. Say, normal loadout of 2<BR>
cargo, 1 fuel, 1 passenger module. On the plans, the uctter modules should<BR>
open onto the main cargo bay.<BR>
<BR>
2) Include the other (non-modular) standards with deck-plans, like the<BR>
shuttle, and pinnace.<BR>
<BR>
3) include several prior ship-designs  which used cutters. And deck plans.<BR>
<BR>
See, the only reason I'd buy it is for deck plans and ship ideas.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:52:56 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Ditzie and Demigods<BR>
<BR>
Well, I'm off to do a solid week of SCA things at Rowany Festival, but I<BR>
just had to mention that I've been so impressed with the Ditzie and Demigods<BR>
posts.<BR>
<BR>
You guys do a heap of stuff to make my life more bearable.<BR>
<BR>
You are a great bunch of guys, and I'm proud to call you my friends.<BR>
<BR>
Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:19:14 -0500<BR>
From: William Barnett-Lewis <wlewis@mailbag.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
<BR>
SPLORK!<BR>
<BR>
Aw, damn Loren, score yourself a keyboard kill...<BR>
<BR>
Classic coffee through the nose kill I might add...<BR>
<BR>
- ------------------------------<BR>
> <BR>
> Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 18:35:07 EDT<BR>
> From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
> <BR>
> In a message dated 00-04-19 00:09:29 EDT, you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> << That material is classified.  Please report to SolSec for reconditioning.<BR>
>>> <BR>
> <BR>
> I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
> <BR>
> LKW<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
William<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Live without fear; your Creator loves you     | William Barnett-Lewis<BR>
as a mother. Go in peace to follow the good   | mailto://wlewis@mailbag.com<BR>
road and may God's blessing be with           |<BR>
you always.                                   |<BR>
St. Claire                                    |<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:13:08 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
<BR>
GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> In a message dated 00-04-19 00:09:29 EDT, you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> << That material is classified.  Please report to SolSec for reconditioning.<BR>
> >><BR>
> <BR>
> I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
<BR>
<tongue-in-cheek><BR>
<BR>
<<stands up>><BR>
<BR>
No, _I'm_ Spartac^h^h^h^h^h^h^h SolSec!<BR>
<BR>
</tongue-in-cheek><BR>
<BR>
> LKW<BR>
<BR>
Sorry, Loren, but I couldn't resist.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:13:33 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/18/00 12:22 PM, swordworlder@yahoo.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Since the word "durham" means "swamp on a hill" it has probably sunk out of<BR>
> sight. :-p<BR>
<BR>
Very funny, but I have to ask; how can a swamp be on a hill? I thought<BR>
swamps were always at a lower elevation than surrounding terrain. Is there a<BR>
geological term for this, I'd like to do a little research. Unless<BR>
subsequent replies sate my appetite for information, that is. That often<BR>
happens on this list.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:37:34 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Benyamene'<BR>
> ZeAbe' Akella<BR>
> Sent: Thursday, 20 April 2000 15:14<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/18/00 12:22 PM, swordworlder@yahoo.com issued<BR>
> forth:<BR>
><BR>
> > Since the word "durham" means "swamp on a hill" it has probably<BR>
> sunk out of<BR>
> > sight. :-p<BR>
><BR>
> Very funny, but I have to ask; how can a swamp be on a hill? I thought<BR>
> swamps were always at a lower elevation than surrounding terrain.<BR>
> Is there a<BR>
> geological term for this, I'd like to do a little research. Unless<BR>
> subsequent replies sate my appetite for information, that is. That often<BR>
> happens on this list.<BR>
<BR>
I've seen swamps on hills before.<BR>
<BR>
It's what happens when a tarn ( a pond on top of a hill or mountain) looses<BR>
most of it's water but not all of it.<BR>
<BR>
Basically the hill is made of a materiel that is not porous, and there is a<BR>
collection area of some form on top of it. It rains, or dew condenses, it<BR>
runs into the bowl, and it can't go anywhere until it either evapourates or<BR>
overflows the bowl.<BR>
<BR>
Volcano craters are a classic example of one way the bowl can form.<BR>
<BR>
Anyone else ever been swimming in a volcano ?<BR>
Actually I only paddled, and briefly, to warm my feet up a bit, but some of<BR>
the scientists went swimming. Purely for research purposes, of course.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:33:07 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
> > Since the word "durham" means "swamp on a hill" it has probably sunk out<BR>
of<BR>
> > sight. :-p<BR>
><BR>
> Very funny, but I have to ask; how can a swamp be on a hill? I thought<BR>
> swamps were always at a lower elevation than surrounding terrain. Is there<BR>
a<BR>
> geological term for this, I'd like to do a little research. Unless<BR>
> subsequent replies sate my appetite for information, that is. That often<BR>
> happens on this list.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not sure how it works, but it is quite obvious.  The elevation of the<BR>
town is mostly 30 to 70 feet above the Androscoggin River, yet large<BR>
portions of the acreage here is swamp.  Matter of fact, the main north-south<BR>
thoroughfare is named Swamp Road.  My guess is that granite bedrock several<BR>
meters below the soil hinders drainage.  Still, it seems very odd to go down<BR>
hill into the mostly dry towns on the banks of the river, then return back<BR>
up the hills to marsh grass and wet basements.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:53:14 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/19/00 4:22 AM, frankie@mundens.gen.nz issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Phew !, that was big, but it could have ben a lot bigger.<BR>
> Maybe I should write a book...<BR>
<BR>
Quite an interesting life you have had, I think a book would be a good idea.<BR>
I am very serious about that, it was extremely entertaining. Start writing.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:23:53<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Marshals<BR>
<BR>
At 05:07 PM 4/19/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I was thinking of Heya when reading about Zimbabwe<BR>
>recently.  The demographics are reversed, as the Vargr on<BR>
>Heya are not only the impoverished and disenfranchised, but<BR>
>also the minority by orders of magnitude.  Still, it's an<BR>
>interesting direction to go.<BR>
<BR>
I drew from several sources for the vargr on Heya, but one of the main ones<BR>
was the the experiences of the American Indians along the Trail of Tears.<BR>
<BR>
Forced from their homelands, pushed into places they weren't welcome...<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:29:25<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
<BR>
At 06:35 PM 4/19/2000 EDT, Loren wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
<BR>
Makes sense, since Craig and I long ago figured out that Marc Miller is a<BR>
Vilani spy.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 20:19:48<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
At 03:32 PM 4/19/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
>"Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
>> Because they think it can sell.<BR>
><BR>
>Why do they think it can sell well enough to be successful?<BR>
<BR>
Because they do this for a living, and depend upon these little books to<BR>
insure that their families will be fed and clothed.<BR>
<BR>
To this end, they look at trends, what has sold well, and what the fans like.<BR>
<BR>
In this case, Traveller fans have a love affair with ships.  A detailed<BR>
look at a non-starship is something that hasn't been done yet.<BR>
<BR>
At risk of shooting myself here.. how many people are likely to use Ground<BR>
Forces?  Not just buy it, but run active duty military campaigns, have<BR>
entire Lift Infantry Battalions figure in the game often enough that a<BR>
knowledge of the TO&E is required?<BR>
<BR>
I suspect that the majority of the buyers of the book will be looking for<BR>
two things.  Background information and weapons.  A minority will run<BR>
special-ops campaigns.  A tiny, tiny minority will run games using the<BR>
Inspector General's Office or one of the other alternates.<BR>
<BR>
Cutters may not be your cup of tea.  But I'm buying it on the chance that<BR>
sometime I made need it, or the information that it contains.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"But that's not the point!" raged Ford. "The point is that I am now a<BR>
perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of<BR>
limbs!"  - The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:05:05<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
At 11:33 PM 4/19/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I'm not sure how it works, but it is quite obvious.  The elevation of the<BR>
>town is mostly 30 to 70 feet above the Androscoggin River, yet large<BR>
>portions of the acreage here is swamp.  Matter of fact, the main north-south<BR>
>thoroughfare is named Swamp Road.  My guess is that granite bedrock several<BR>
>meters below the soil hinders drainage.  Still, it seems very odd to go down<BR>
>hill into the mostly dry towns on the banks of the river, then return back<BR>
>up the hills to marsh grass and wet basements.<BR>
<BR>
Check a topographical map.  I'm sure you'll find several glacial basins<BR>
over limestone or granite bedrock.  That retains enough water to create an<BR>
elevated swamp or marsh.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:09:00<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
At 03:37 PM 4/20/2000 +1200, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Anyone else ever been swimming in a volcano ?<BR>
<BR>
I did make an offering to Mother Pele in Hawaii.  If any of you ever go to<BR>
Hawaii, make sure to buget time for a side trip to the Big Island and<BR>
Volcano National Park.  It's like walking on an alien planet.<BR>
<BR>
OT: I just reread "The Lathe of Heaven" the other day, and got a chuckle<BR>
when LeGuin was describing the topography of the Pacific Northwest: "father<BR>
north, the perfect cones of St. Helens and Rainer..."<BR>
<BR>
Oops.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:26:01 -0400<BR>
From: "DaveShayne" <daveshayne@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
>Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 13:38:18 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
>From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
>Subject: re:  near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
<snip of way cool story><BR>
<BR>
>Near-C Rocks rule, dude!<BR>
<BR>
But in the words of Norris' 14 year old grand niece Wanda[1], "Why are<BR>
'dults<BR>
always so chronically unclued? The band is called near-C rocks, not<BR>
Near-C Rocks. Youlda thunka peoples hips fall off at eighteen. 'Dults!"<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>- --Glenn<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
BTW way cool writeup.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:24:54<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
At 12:26 AM 4/20/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>But in the words of Norris' 14 year old grand niece Wanda[1], "Why are<BR>
>'dults always so chronically unclued? The band is called near-C rocks, not<BR>
>Near-C Rocks. Youlda thunka peoples hips fall off at eighteen. 'Dults!"<BR>
<BR>
I didn't need that.  I've had my fill of heavy, exasperated sighs and<BR>
rolling eyes from kids who I used to give piggy-back rides way back when.<BR>
Evidently, I have become completely out of touch with the pounding pulse of<BR>
modern life.<BR>
<BR>
I will have you all know that Cheap Trick still rocks, listening to The Who<BR>
got me my first girlfriend, and the Stones got famous without being a cute<BR>
boy band..<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2330<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 20 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2331<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Filked again<BR>
re:  Plastique in a Spraycan<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
Re: SolSec<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
Vargr on Heya (was Re: Marshals)<BR>
Re: Filked again<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Cutter Book<BR>
Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Vargr on Heya (was Re: Marshals)<BR>
re:  Plastique in a Spraycan<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
Re: I _am_ SolSec<BR>
re Plastique in a Spraycan<BR>
SolSec was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
Re: Flying Saucer<BR>
RE: near-C rocks [warning: contains spur of the moment song parody]<BR>
Re Swamp on a hill<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:25:44 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
No one's quoted my favorite lines from Aliens:<BR>
<BR>
"F..k you Hicks!" <BR>
"Anytime anywhere!"<BR>
<BR>
and <BR>
<BR>
"You hear that? _He's_ coming inside."<BR>
"I feel safer already."<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 19:57:11 -0400<BR>
From: Glenn Grant <neo@total.net><BR>
Subject: Filked again<BR>
<BR>
THE RIM DURING WARTIME<BR>
(to the tune of "Life During Wartime,"<BR>
by David Byrne, from "Fear of Music", by Talking Heads)<BR>
<BR>
There's an air/raft that is loaded with weapons,<BR>
  packed up and ready to lift<BR>
There's alien gravesites, off of the X-routes,<BR>
  some planet near the Great Rift<BR>
The sound of gunfire, just down the hallway,<BR>
  I'm getting used to it now<BR>
Lived on Gladstone, lived on Zhongguo,<BR>
  I've lived all over Startown<BR>
<BR>
This ain't no Party, this ain't no Diplo<BR>
  this ain't no Scoutin' around<BR>
No time for tradin', or makin' money,<BR>
  I ain't got time for that now<BR>
<BR>
Transmit the X-mail, back to Headquarters,<BR>
   hope for an answer some day<BR>
After three starports, a few Exit Visas,<BR>
   I don't even know the world's name<BR>
High on the sky-side, the ships are loading,<BR>
   everything's ready to roll<BR>
I sleep in the low berth, I wake in a week's time,<BR>
   I might not ever get home<BR>
<BR>
This ain't no Party, this ain't no Depot,<BR>
   this ain't no Suleiman Down<BR>
This ain't no Brubeck's, or AstroBurger,<BR>
   I ain't got time for that now<BR>
<BR>
Heard about Junction? Heard about Dirac?<BR>
   Heard about Bajavanang?<BR>
You oughta know not to stare out the window,<BR>
   jumpspace will drive you insane<BR>
I got some Hi-Ex, some demo charges,<BR>
   to last a couple of days<BR>
But I ain't got no three-vee, ain't got no eyephones,<BR>
  ain't got no virtual games<BR>
<BR>
Why stay in college? Why Naval Flight School?<BR>
   Gonna skip out on the draft<BR>
Can't land on Terra, can't jump to Barnard,<BR>
   Can't even pilot this craft<BR>
This ain't no Party, this ain't no holo,<BR>
   this ain't no fuel-skimming run<BR>
I'd like to kiss you, I'd love you hold you,<BR>
   But you're not even human<BR>
<BR>
Trouble in transit, got past the Red Zone,<BR>
   crossed the Extrality Line<BR>
We got Comp-7, we're hacking comm-links,<BR>
   I know that this is a crime<BR>
We dress like Vegans, we dress like Aslan,<BR>
   or in a vacc suit outside<BR>
I changed my species, so many times now,<BR>
   I don't know what I look like!<BR>
Though you're a Hiver, and have no gender,<BR>
   we make a pretty good team<BR>
Don't get exhausted, I'll do some flying,<BR>
   you look unusually green<BR>
Spaced all my handcomps, what good are handcomps?<BR>
   They won't help me survive<BR>
My chest is aching, air scrubber's broken and<BR>
   I need to fix the jump drive<BR>
   (I'm just about to...)<BR>
<BR>
               Glenn Grant  <neo@total.net><BR>
_Northern Suns: The New Anthology of Canadian Science Fiction_<BR>
          Edited by David Hartwell & Glenn Grant<BR>
  ++Now in trade paperback from Tor Books++<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:29:47 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Plastique in a Spraycan<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
<BR>
>Speaking of plastic explosives, anyone have any thoughts <BR>
>on a set of traveller (any version) stats for the <BR>
>"plastique in a spraycan" from near the start of Barb <BR>
>Wire, (the only good thing in a *very* dire movie...)<BR>
<BR>
The only good thing?  I saw at least two other good things<BR>
in that movie.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:29:53 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
<BR>
On 04/19/00 at 08:29 PM,  "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
>At 06:35 PM 4/19/2000 EDT, Loren wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>>I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
<BR>
>Makes sense, since Craig and I long ago figured out that Marc Miller is a<BR>
>Vilani spy.<BR>
<BR>
No! No!  Marc, Frank, Loren and the boys are part of a top secret government project to "prepare" the public for the Imperium.  You see, it was after Roswell that....<BR>
<BR>
Eris,<BR>
    Fnord!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:35:52 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: SolSec<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/19/00 3:35 PM, GDWGAMES@aol.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> << That material is classified.  Please report to SolSec for reconditioning.<BR>
>>> <BR>
> <BR>
> I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
> <BR>
> LKW<BR>
<BR>
I'm dying of laughter here. And pleased as heck that this list can provide<BR>
such a wonderful service to the Traveller Elders. But mainly I'm dying of<BR>
laughter.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:41:14 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
<BR>
>Very funny, but I have to ask; how can a swamp be on a <BR>
>hill? I thought swamps were always at a lower elevation <BR>
>than surrounding terrain. Is there a geological term for <BR>
>this, I'd like to do a little research. <BR>
<BR>
You're right that swamps occur at lower elevation than<BR>
surrounding terrain, but that doesn't rule out a swamp on a<BR>
hill.  An extreme example, to make visualization easier, is<BR>
a volcano crater.  If you have a swamp in the crater, it is<BR>
lower than the surrounding terrain.  The surrounding<BR>
terrain is the rim of the crater.  Both rim and crater are<BR>
at the top of the hill.  <BR>
<BR>
You don't have to be that extreme, of course.  Suppose that<BR>
the top of the hill is pretty flat and that drainage isn't<BR>
very good.  The top of the hill could develop into a swamp<BR>
or lake even if it's just slightly dimpled.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:43:35 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
<BR>
>The elevation of the town is mostly 30 to 70 feet above <BR>
>the Androscoggin River, yet large portions of the acreage <BR>
>here is swamp.  <BR>
<BR>
Doesn't that drain into the Miskatonic?  That would explain<BR>
all sorts of odd and unexpected phenomena.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:46:11 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Vargr on Heya (was Re: Marshals)<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
>I drew from several sources for the vargr on Heya, but one<BR>
<BR>
>of the main ones was the the experiences of the American <BR>
>Indians along the Trail of Tears. <BR>
>Forced from their homelands, pushed into places they <BR>
>weren't welcome...<BR>
<BR>
The European DPs (displaced persons) after World War 2 had<BR>
similar experiences, especially the ones who immigrated to<BR>
the United States.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:49:22 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Filked again<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/19/00 4:57 PM, neo@total.net issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> THE RIM DURING WARTIME<BR>
> (to the tune of "Life During Wartime,"<BR>
> by David Byrne, from "Fear of Music", by Talking Heads)<BR>
<BR>
So cool. One of my faves, and now I have Traveller lyrics for the tune.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:53:21 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
From: "DaveShayne" <daveshayne@email.msn.com><BR>
<BR>
>But in the words of Norris' 14 year old grand niece Wanda<BR>
>[1], "Why are'dults always so chronically unclued? The <BR>
<BR>
>BTW way cool writeup.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks, and don't trust anyone over 15.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:59:27 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Cutter Book<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/19/00 5:09 PM, GDWGAMES@aol.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> << Why do they think it can sell well enough to be successful?  >><BR>
> <BR>
> My gut feeling -- and I think I have a fairly good track record at this sort<BR>
> of thing -- When it comes out, take a look at it and if you don't want it,<BR>
> don't buy it. <BR>
<BR>
Well, the Cutter is interesting to me as a general workhorse type craft, but<BR>
I would like to see other smallcraft addressed in this book. I hope you<BR>
consider expanding the scope of it a tad, but I'll likely buy it anyway.<BR>
<BR>
> Andy has not mentioned that he is co-authoring the book with me, and doing<BR>
> the deckplans. I think enough fans will like it to make it a good seller.<BR>
> <BR>
> LKW<BR>
<BR>
Deckplans? Darn, I've drooled all over my keyboard. Serves me right for<BR>
being so unsplortable.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:09:01 EDT<BR>
From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: MTM - Enough Cheese to make a Fondue<BR>
<BR>
"Peter  Scarrott" <peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk> sez:<BR>
<BR>
>>SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>said<BR>
>>Similarly Alien: Resurrection. I hated this as an Alien film, but<BR>
>>thought it was a great dramatisation of a Traveller PC group in<BR>
>>action.<BR>
>>Dom<BR>
><BR>
>Hands up who wanted to play that group,<BR>
><BR>
>Me, Me, Me<BR>
><BR>
>Hated film until I saw it a third time and watched it as a plain SF Film.<BR>
<BR>
 Actually, A:R is what makes A3 watchable for me. Had they stopped at the <BR>
trilogy, I would never have forgiven them.<BR>
<BR>
GC<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:10:04 -0700<BR>
From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
  Thus spake the fossil-saurus:<BR>
<BR>
>I will have you all know that Cheap Trick still rocks, listening to The Who<BR>
>got me my first girlfriend, and the Stones got famous without being a cute<BR>
>boy band..<BR>
<BR>
  What, you mean the New Kids on the Block? :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:11:34 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Vargr on Heya (was Re: Marshals)<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
> <BR>
> >I drew from several sources for the vargr on Heya, but one<BR>
> >of the main ones was the the experiences of the American<BR>
> >Indians along the Trail of Tears.<BR>
> >Forced from their homelands, pushed into places they<BR>
> >weren't welcome...<BR>
> <BR>
> The European DPs (displaced persons) after World War 2 had<BR>
> similar experiences, especially the ones who immigrated to<BR>
> the United States.<BR>
<BR>
Without trying to pull this into RL politics, the post-1948 history of<BR>
the Palestinians in Jordan and Lebanon may be a harbinger of things to<BR>
come on Heya, to the detriment of both refugees and Heya.<BR>
<BR>
[I prefer not to discuss my views on the whole Arab-Israeli conflict. <BR>
However, the presence of many Palestinian refugees in Jordan and Lebanon<BR>
_did_ contribute to civil unrest in those two contries during the<BR>
1970s.]<BR>
<BR>
For a _slightly_ less politicized example of the possible impact of<BR>
shipping multitudes of DPs to a planet unprepared to receive them, see<BR>
the examples of Hadley and Sparta in Jerry Pournelle's "Falkenberg's<BR>
Legion" novels (specifically, _Falkenberg's Legion_, _Go Tell the<BR>
Spartans_, and _Prince of Sparta_).<BR>
<BR>
Note that neither the RL examples mentioned above nor the Falkenberg<BR>
stories turn out well for the transportees....<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:21:44 -0700<BR>
From: Bill <beast@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Plastique in a Spraycan<BR>
<BR>
> >From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
><BR>
> >Speaking of plastic explosives, anyone have any thoughts<BR>
> >on a set of traveller (any version) stats for the<BR>
> >"plastique in a spraycan" from near the start of Barb<BR>
> >Wire, (the only good thing in a *very* dire movie...)<BR>
><BR>
>The only good thing?  I saw at least two other good things<BR>
>in that movie.<BR>
><BR>
>--Glenn<BR>
><BR>
>__________________________________________________<BR>
>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
>Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
>http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
Sorry to go OT here... I voted for Cleo for best actress in that movie.<BR>
<BR>
Bill<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:38:02 -0700<BR>
From: "Kelly St.Clair" <kellys@efn.org><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
I think what people are confused/annoyed by is that the working title of <BR>
this book implies a very narrow focus (which is probably not the case, <BR>
based on stuff that's been posted since by those working on the project).<BR>
<BR>
"GT Modular Cutter?  What's next, GT Pinnace?  GT Air/Raft?  GT Vacc Suit?"<BR>
<BR>
I strongly suggest a more general title, like "GT Small Craft" or some of <BR>
the other ideas that have been floated by readers.  Something that actually <BR>
/sounds/ like it can fill an entire sourcebook.  Even if the book is cool <BR>
enough to sell a thousand copies, you don't want it to be remembered for a <BR>
lame name.<BR>
<BR>
Or I could be all wrong, and fans will happily snatch up "GT Gauss <BR>
Rifle."  (Maybe if it contained instructions for building one...)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --------------<BR>
Kelly St.Clair    "You know, Brink, you've been acting funny ever since<BR>
kellys@efn.org     you came back from the dead.  (I can't believe I just<BR>
                    said that.)"    -- Commander Boston Low, THE DIG<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:56:28 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/19/00 10:38 PM, kellys@efn.org issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Or I could be all wrong, and fans will happily snatch up "GT Gauss<BR>
> Rifle."  (Maybe if it contained instructions for building one...)<BR>
<BR>
I want a copy! ;)<BR>
Seriously though, the rest of your post was great too, and I want to cast a<BR>
vote for some details on the Pinnace, Shuttle and Yacht. The last could have<BR>
a few more models, as this is a less utilitarian craft, and all about<BR>
status.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 07:18:47 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Solomani Rim<BR>
<BR>
At 0:24 -0400 20/4/00, Bill <beast@aracnet.com> wrote:<BR>
>Is this a free service or is there a fee?<BR>
<BR>
I scanned the images specifically for Loren after his request because <BR>
I suspect that he is editing 'Rim of Fire' (the Solomani Rim <BR>
sourcebook) and did not have them to hand. As ISTR that the second <BR>
book in the Clasic Traveller reprints series (due next month) is the <BR>
collected supplements, I do not intend to send or distribute this <BR>
material any further as it will violate FarFuture's intellectual <BR>
property. The material will shortly be back in print, either as GT <BR>
material or as CT material.<BR>
<BR>
So, you could argue that it was a limited time one off free service <BR>
for a specific customer <weg>...<BR>
<BR>
There is an ongoing Traveller project to scan all the old material <BR>
for distribution on CD- ISTR that Bryan from HIWG is working on it.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 07:11:04 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: I _am_ SolSec<BR>
<BR>
At 0:24 -0400 20/4/00, Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
> > I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
> > LKW<BR>
><BR>
>This statement seems to fit in with the following ones<BR>
>(not that there is anything wrong with that)<BR>
>"The state, it is me."<BR>
>"When the President does it that means it is not illegal."<BR>
>"I am the law."<BR>
<BR>
Loren is Judge Dredd?!<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 07:09:09 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re Plastique in a Spraycan<BR>
<BR>
At 19:34 -0400 19/4/00,  "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
>Speaking of plastic explosives, anyone have any thoughts on a set of<BR>
>traveller (any version) stats for the "plastique in a spraycan" from near<BR>
>the start of Barb Wire, (the only good thing in a *very* dire movie...)<BR>
<BR>
It's also used in _Blade_ if you want a slightly better reference.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 07:07:32 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: SolSec was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
<BR>
At 19:34 -0400 19/4/00, GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
>In a message dated 00-04-19 00:09:29 EDT, you write:<BR>
><< That material is classified.  Please report to SolSec for reconditioning.<BR>
> >><BR>
>I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
<BR>
Well, report to yourself then! ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:26:26 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Flying Saucer<BR>
<BR>
I guess no one had any comments, so I'll make one.  The design violated one <BR>
of MTU's rules, which is that the force generated by the contragrav almost <BR>
neutralizes the force due to gravity. An additional drive is needed to <BR>
actually accelerate.  I couldn't fit a fission reactor big enough to power <BR>
both drives on the ship, so I installed a 10 MW battery system, for use <BR>
during the launch/landing phase.  I also had to sacrifice reaction mass, and <BR>
a passenger, and the sandcaster and had to add an engineer.<BR>
<BR>
Also, FFS2 doesn't make it quite clear. Don't sandcasters have to go in a <BR>
weapons turret? How much good are they if you run across a Pir^h^h^h <BR>
ethically challenged captain with a weapons-grade laser, anyway?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 02:27:45 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: near-C rocks [warning: contains spur of the moment song parody]<BR>
<BR>
>I will have you all know that Cheap Trick still rocks, listening to The Who<BR>
>got me my first girlfriend, and the Stones got famous without being a cute<BR>
>boy band..<BR>
<BR>
Nah. The Stones *were* (inexplicably) a cute boy band. They did make the<BR>
teen magazines back in the day. They were the alternative for those girls<BR>
who were just a little too tough to listen to the Beatles (like my mother<BR>
who is still said to swoon every time she goes to see the Stones).<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: It's a little known fact that one of Strephon's clones went rogue<BR>
and started his own band, called (you guessed it) "The Emperor Penguins".<BR>
It's rumored in rundown, sleazy starport bars that the ersatz-Strephon<BR>
learned his "moves" by studying heavily degraded tapes of Mick Jagger. It's<BR>
rumored in even more rundown, and far sleazier starport bars that the tunes<BR>
were "borrowed" from the Stones. You be the judge:<BR>
<BR>
"Sympathy for Yaskodray"<BR>
<BR>
Please allow me to introduce myself,<BR>
I'm just a Droyne without a caste.[1]<BR>
I've been around for a long, long year,<BR>
And travellers look for my secret base.<BR>
<BR>
I was around when humaniti<BR>
Was still living in dark, dank caves.<BR>
Declared war on my children<BR>
After scattering them across known space.<BR>
<BR>
Pleased to meet you,<BR>
Hope you guess my name,<BR>
But what's puzzling you<BR>
Is the nature of my game.<BR>
<BR>
I hung around on Capital,<BR>
Then I saw it was a-time for a change.<BR>
Killed Strephon and his family,<BR>
and Ciencia screamed in vain.<BR>
<BR>
I drove a tank,<BR>
I held a general's rank,<BR>
When the Rebellion raged,<BR>
And the empire sank.<BR>
<BR>
Pleased to meet you,<BR>
Hope you guess my name. Oh yeah!<BR>
But what's puzzling you<BR>
Is the nature of my game. Oh yeah!<BR>
<BR>
I watched with glee<BR>
While the Vilani<BR>
Tried to make a stand<BR>
Against the Rule of Man.<BR>
<BR>
I shouted out<BR>
"Who killed poor Varian?"<BR>
When we really knew<BR>
That it was that bitch Lucan.<BR>
<BR>
Let me please introduce myself,<BR>
I'm a man of wealth and taste,<BR>
And I lay traps for player characters<BR>
Who get killed before they reach Efate.[2]<BR>
<BR>
Pleased to meet you,<BR>
Hope you guessed my name. Oh yeah!<BR>
But what's puzzling you<BR>
Is the nature of my game. Oh yeah!<BR>
[Get down, baby!]<BR>
<BR>
Pleased to meet you,<BR>
Hope you guessed my name. Oh yeah!<BR>
But what's confusing you,<BR>
Is just the nature of my game.<BR>
<BR>
Just as every cop is a criminal,<BR>
And all the sinners saints.<BR>
As heads is tails,<BR>
Just call me Grandfather,<BR>
'Cause I'm in need of some restraint!<BR>
<BR>
So if you meet me:<BR>
Have some courtesy,<BR>
Have some sympathy, and some taste.<BR>
Use all your well-learned Battledress,<BR>
Or I'll lay your group to waste. Ummmm yeah!<BR>
<BR>
Pleased to meet you,<BR>
Hope you guessed my name. Umm yeah<BR>
But what's puzzling you<BR>
Is the nature of my game. Um baby, get down<BR>
Woooo whoooo<BR>
Oh yeah, get on down<BR>
Oh yeah<BR>
Oh yeah!<BR>
<BR>
Tell me baby, what's my name?<BR>
Tell me honey, baby guess my name!<BR>
Tell me baby, what's my name?<BR>
Tell you one time, you're to blame!<BR>
<BR>
Woooo whoooo [etc]<BR>
<BR>
Footnotes:<BR>
<BR>
[1] Sometimes this is sung "I'm just a Droyne with a huge braincase."<BR>
[2] I pronounce it "Eff-ah-tay", which doesn't scan perfectly. It works as<BR>
"eh-FAYT" and "EH-fayt" as well, however.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 22:41:43 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Swamp on a hill<BR>
<BR>
>> Since the word "durham" means "swamp on a hill" it has probably sunk out of<BR>
>> sight. :-p<BR>
><BR>
>Very funny, but I have to ask; how can a swamp be on a hill? I thought<BR>
>swamps were always at a lower elevation than surrounding terrain. Is there a<BR>
>geological term for this, I'd like to do a little research. Unless<BR>
>subsequent replies sate my appetite for information, that is. That often<BR>
>happens on this list.<BR>
<BR>
Immediately, a crater filled in with swamp comes to mind. As long as the<BR>
rim is consistantly hirghr than the water level, you can get swamp. Also,<BR>
some soils don't drain well, so might be "swampy" but not a real swamp by<BR>
the modern terminology.<BR>
<BR>
Oh, and said crater could be either meteoric or volcanic, or possibly even<BR>
a sinkhole (although this last would require some REALLY odd geomorphology).<BR>
<BR>
BTW, here in Anchorage, there is a large area of swamp on the side of a<BR>
mountain: the aquifer fed further unp the hill goes under a layer of<BR>
bedrock, and then resurfaces further down the side. From the top going down<BR>
you get Alpine, alpine-forest, then the mixed forest and grass-lands<BR>
(including the input to the aquifer and the protected zone), then the<BR>
swamps, then more grass lands, then more swamps as you hit the basin.<BR>
(Anchorage is essentially built on reclaimed swamps and hills sprouting up<BR>
from them. At least we've been exempted from wetlands protections...)<BR>
<BR>
Ob Trav: Unusual geoforms can occur, and will tend to be in places where<BR>
people will want to be near them. Anchorage is extant because it's a<BR>
strategic port. Some city on the one plateau surrounded by swamp may be the<BR>
major port on a world simply because it's the only large stable flat spot<BR>
near the equator...<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2331<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2332</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 20 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2332<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Sympathy for Yaskodray<BR>
Re Swamp on a hill<BR>
Re: Filked again<BR>
Re: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
Re: Scans<BR>
Re: I _am_ SolSec<BR>
re:  Filked again<BR>
Re: I _am_ SolSec<BR>
RE: near-C rocks <BR>
RE: Filked again<BR>
RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
Yet Another Filk<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
CAP/ETC/PET<BR>
The Little Black Books<BR>
Transport Requirements<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
Re: Cutter Book<BR>
REQ: Bularia/Darrian info<BR>
Re: Lawyer Stuff Help<BR>
Re: The Little Black Books<BR>
Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
Re: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:53:20 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Sympathy for Yaskodray<BR>
<BR>
Thank god I seem so splort resistant, this is sure to score a kill or two.<BR>
Hypercleats is going to love this one I'm sure, I'll have to send it to him,<BR>
as he is off to his dads for Passover.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:01:10 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re Swamp on a hill<BR>
<BR>
>> subsequent replies sate my appetite for information<BR>
<BR>
Duh. Thanks folks, I seem to have been blinded to some obvious solutions.<BR>
Something to consider for mapping. I really like the Anchorage example<BR>
William. On the /side/ of a hill. And interesting ObTrav too.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 23:59:41<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Filked again<BR>
<BR>
At 07:57 PM 4/19/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>THE RIM DURING WARTIME<BR>
<BR>
Wonderful!  Now I have to go dig up "Stop Making Sense" and sing along!<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
There was once a time when the church controlled the government.<BR>
The laws of the church were the laws of the land. Belief in God <BR>
was strong, teachings of the church were rarely questioned.<BR>
This time was called The Dark Ages.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:31:22 -0700<BR>
From: Evyn MacDude <wmacdude@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In the Imperium, I'd see cutter pilots as being senior NCOs, like the RW<BR>
> Navy people who handle landing craft and the like.<BR>
<BR>
Edit that Doug.....  NCOs not seniors.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Evyn...<BR>
<BR>
C-Space home http://home.att.net/~wmacdude/<BR>
<BR>
Get six jolly cowboys to carry my coffin<BR>
Get six pretty maidens to bear up my pall<BR>
Bunches of roses all over my coffin<BR>
Roses to deaden the clods as they fall<BR>
 Laredo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:40:13 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Scans<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/19/00 11:18 PM, dom@cybergoths.u-net.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Dom<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
Hmm. I got an "undeliverable mail" trying to thank you off list by above<BR>
address. Anyway, thanks! Bounty hunter as a career path, so space opera,<BR>
must roll one up.<BR>
////////////////////////////////////////<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
It is by caffeine alone that I set my mind in motion,<BR>
By the beans of Java, my thoughts acquire speed,<BR>
The hands acquire the shakes, the shakes become a warning,<BR>
It is by caffeine alone that I set my mind in motion.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:50:51 -0700<BR>
From: Evyn MacDude <wmacdude@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: I _am_ SolSec<BR>
<BR>
SD Mooney wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 0:24 -0400 20/4/00, Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
> > > I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
> > > LKW<BR>
> ><BR>
> >This statement seems to fit in with the following ones<BR>
> >(not that there is anything wrong with that)<BR>
> >"The state, it is me."<BR>
> >"When the President does it that means it is not illegal."<BR>
> >"I am the law."<BR>
><BR>
> Loren is Judge Dredd?!<BR>
<BR>
Can't be he don't look that good in leather spandex....<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Evyn...<BR>
<BR>
C-Space home http://home.att.net/~wmacdude/<BR>
<BR>
Get six jolly cowboys to carry my coffin<BR>
Get six pretty maidens to bear up my pall<BR>
Bunches of roses all over my coffin<BR>
Roses to deaden the clods as they fall<BR>
 Laredo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:07:01 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Filked again<BR>
<BR>
>From: Glenn Grant <neo@total.net><BR>
<BR>
Bravo!! that song is one of my favorite inspirations for<BR>
Traveller adventures, and you've done a great job of<BR>
filking it. <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:07:23 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: I _am_ SolSec<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 12:50 AM, wmacdude@worldnet.att.net issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
>> Loren is Judge Dredd?!<BR>
> <BR>
> Can't be, he don't look that good in leather spandex....<BR>
<BR>
Now that is a matter of personal opinion. Not that I /want/ to see Loren in<BR>
spandex, I would rather see Oprah in such an outfit despite the jests using<BR>
her as a subject for orbital dynamics debates. I would think Orson Wells a<BR>
better canidate anyway, both as being more a sci-fi figure and having a last<BR>
name that is the plural of a common term for the warping of space/time by an<BR>
object of mass. YMMV though. ;)<BR>
<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 01:13:47 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: RE: near-C rocks <BR>
<BR>
>From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
<BR>
Another excellent filk!  In the same digest!  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:23:51 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Filked again<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> On Behalf Of Glenn Grant<BR>
> <BR>
> THE RIM DURING WARTIME<BR>
> (to the tune of "Life During Wartime,"<BR>
> by David Byrne, from "Fear of Music", by Talking Heads)<BR>
<BR>
Great !<BR>
<BR>
I always thought "Life During Wartime" was a gamers song.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:34:00 +0100<BR>
From: Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Black ICE [mailto:wombat@premier.net]<BR>
 <BR>
> GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
> > <BR>
> > In a message dated 00-04-19 00:09:29 EDT, you write:<BR>
> > <BR>
> > << That material is classified.  Please report to SolSec <BR>
> for reconditioning.<BR>
> > >><BR>
> > <BR>
> > I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
> <BR>
> <tongue-in-cheek><BR>
> <BR>
> <<stands up>><BR>
> <BR>
> No, _I'm_ Spartac^h^h^h^h^h^h^h SolSec!<BR>
> <BR>
> </tongue-in-cheek><BR>
 <BR>
"I'm SolSec, and so's my wife!"<BR>
<BR>
> > LKW<BR>
> <BR>
> Sorry, Loren, but I couldn't resist.<BR>
<BR>
Me neither. :)<BR>
<BR>
Matt <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 04:13:45 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
The past couple of filks (especially "Sympathy for Yaskodray") have<BR>
inspired my Muse (a rather competitive being) to have me submit this<BR>
filk to the Traveller corpus:<BR>
<BR>
"Lucan" (to the tune of "Levon", by Elton John)<BR>
<BR>
Lucan always lusted for the Crown<BR>
He killed his brother Varian<BR>
'Cause Lucan wanted fame<BR>
So he put his brother six feet in the ground<BR>
<BR>
Lucan, Lucan likes his power<BR>
He holds a lot they say<BR>
Spends his days counting<BR>
All the fleets that his word obey<BR>
<BR>
He was raised from nephew to the Crown on a bitter day<BR>
When the TNS said Strephon's dead <BR>
And a war's begun<BR>
Lucan is the nearest heir today<BR>
<BR>
And he shall be Lucan<BR>
And he shall be Emperor<BR>
And he shall be Lucan<BR>
Against assassin Dulinor<BR>
And he shall be Lucan<BR>
And he shall be Emperor<BR>
He shall be Lucan<BR>
<BR>
Lucan fights "pretenders to the Crown"<BR>
Tukera Lines must die<BR>
And so must "robot Strephon"<BR>
While Dulinor, Dulinor must fry<BR>
<BR>
But Norris, he isolates the Marches<BR>
Leaving Lucan far behind<BR>
'Cause Lucan released a Virus<BR>
And the Third Imperium slowly dies<BR>
<BR>
He was raised from nephew to the Crown on a bitter day<BR>
When the TNS said Strephon's dead <BR>
And a war's begun<BR>
Lucan is the nearest heir today<BR>
<BR>
And he shall be Lucan<BR>
And he shall be Emperor<BR>
And he shall be Lucan<BR>
Against assassin Dulinor<BR>
And he shall be Lucan<BR>
And he shall be Emperor<BR>
He shall be Lucan<BR>
<BR>
<<repeat>><BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:04:20 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
> <snip><BR>
>> The Windows, Thankless Life, Imijdrixhen, and, best of all,<BR>
>> Niploj Sinaj and her band, Wholly Owned Subsidiary.  Oh,<BR>
> <snip><BR>
><BR>
> Nice writing, but I believe you mis-spelled the name of Nilpoj Sinaj.<BR>
<BR>
Also, it's Imjidrixhen...<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:13:15 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/18/00 12:22 PM, swordworlder@yahoo.com issued<BR>
> forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> Since the word "durham" means "swamp on a hill" it has probably sunk out of<BR>
>> sight. :-p<BR>
><BR>
> Very funny, but I have to ask; how can a swamp be on a hill? I thought<BR>
> swamps were always at a lower elevation than surrounding terrain. Is there a<BR>
> geological term for this, I'd like to do a little research. Unless<BR>
> subsequent replies sate my appetite for information, that is. That often<BR>
> happens on this list.<BR>
<BR>
It *is* possible. I just requires lousy drainage...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 00:14:27 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>> Very funny, but I have to ask; how can a swamp be on a hill? I thought<BR>
>> swamps were always at a lower elevation than surrounding terrain.<BR>
>> Is there a<BR>
>> geological term for this, I'd like to do a little research. Unless<BR>
>> subsequent replies sate my appetite for information, that is. That often<BR>
>> happens on this list.<BR>
><BR>
> I've seen swamps on hills before.<BR>
><BR>
> It's what happens when a tarn ( a pond on top of a hill or mountain) looses<BR>
> most of it's water but not all of it.<BR>
><BR>
> Basically the hill is made of a materiel that is not porous, and there is a<BR>
> collection area of some form on top of it. It rains, or dew condenses, it<BR>
> runs into the bowl, and it can't go anywhere until it either evapourates or<BR>
> overflows the bowl.<BR>
><BR>
> Volcano craters are a classic example of one way the bowl can form.<BR>
><BR>
> Anyone else ever been swimming in a volcano ?<BR>
> Actually I only paddled, and briefly, to warm my feet up a bit, but some of<BR>
> the scientists went swimming. Purely for research purposes, of course.<BR>
<BR>
Sorry, the place I can think of nearby that fits is Crater Lake, and<BR>
from all accounts, the lake probably hasn't even *thawed* yet. And even<BR>
at the hieght of summer it'll be too damn *cold*. <BR>
<BR>
(For those not faimilar with it, Crater Lake's surface is at 6176 feet.<BR>
 And it's 1932 feet deep.)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:13:41 +0300<BR>
From: Antti Lahtinen <lahtinen@ee.tut.fi><BR>
Subject: CAP/ETC/PET<BR>
<BR>
Tod Glenn writes:<BR>
<BR>
 > ... CAP (Combustion Augmented Plasma)<BR>
<BR>
Tod Glenn writes:<BR>
<BR>
 > ... This sounds like what FF&S calls ETC (electro-thermal chemical)<BR>
 > ammunition.<BR>
<BR>
	The same technology is being used in anti-aircraft guns, and is<BR>
	called as "PET" or "Propellant/Electro-Thermal". An sketch of<BR>
	the system can be found in:<BR>
<BR>
	http://donatello.ee.tut.fi/ACR/ETC.jpg<BR>
<BR>
	There is at least one prototype of a 20 mm anti-material gun<BR>
	based on this technology. The ETC system is used to regulate<BR>
	the barrel pressure so that there is no pressure spikes.<BR>
	This allows the use of relatively light barrel and receiver,<BR>
	making the gun light enough to be carried and used by one man.<BR>
<BR>
	In Traveller terms, that kind of gun might be called as<BR>
	"Light Assault Gun".<BR>
- --<BR>
       Antti Lahtinen                lahtinen@ee.tut.fi<BR>
       Researcher, MSc (Eng)         http://www.ee.tut.fi/~lahtinen<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:49:57 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: The Little Black Books<BR>
<BR>
Can anyone who owns the set of LBBs describe carefully what they look like on<BR>
the outside? This might seem like an odd question, but it will be so much<BR>
clearer...<BR>
<BR>
In particular, is there anything written on the back of the books?<BR>
<BR>
Am I right in thinking that the books are very similiar to the BITS<BR>
supplements, but in different colors?<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 07:53:36 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Les Howie <travgrognard@yahoo.ca><BR>
Subject: Transport Requirements<BR>
<BR>
Has anyone out there done up, or seen references for,<BR>
the transport requirements (troops, yes, but mostly<BR>
cargo) for various sizes of imperial ground combat<BR>
formations such as a Lift Battalion?.<BR>
<BR>
=====<BR>
Les Howie<BR>
Wargaming Gearhead Heretic<BR>
imtu 1.0: tc t4 ru- ge++ !3i c++ jt++ au+ ls++ pi+ ta-- he++<BR>
<BR>
_______________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:13:55 -0500<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
"Kelly St.Clair" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Or I could be all wrong, and fans will happily snatch up "GT Gauss<BR>
> Rifle."  (Maybe if it contained instructions for building one...)<BR>
<BR>
    I'm just waiting for "GT: Ditzie's Workbench".  Gaussie-waussie Rifle,<BR>
indeed.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Stormhound<BR>
DNRC Ombudsman for Induhvidual Affairs, Holder of Past Knowledge<BR>
Come visit my web page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd<BR>
Or my new Amateur Radio web page at http://www.qsl.net/kc0ekv<BR>
Or my JN6 course design page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd/golfpage.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:15:09 CST6CDT<BR>
From: igor@truserve.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Cutter Book<BR>
<BR>
First of all, let me say that Loren and I appreciate all the comments that <BR>
people have offered - positive and negative.<BR>
<BR>
It is unlikely that the book will include the other, non-modular small craft - <BR>
a great portion of the book is devoted to a huge assortment of modules and <BR>
their deckplans. Thus, it makes little sense to rename the text GURPS Small <BR>
Craft. GURPS Modular Craft or Modular Ships might work - but the focus is on <BR>
the cutter. I expect the name will remain the same - but continue to offer you <BR>
opinions. I don't promise to follow your ideas, but I do promise to consider <BR>
every one.<BR>
<BR>
One thing that some people seem to have missed (and I apologize if I was <BR>
unclear) is that the book _does_ have more craft that just the cutter. Again, <BR>
the focus is on the modular cutter (mainly because it is the most common) - but <BR>
we're also going to have many other types of modular small craft, modular <BR>
vehicles, and modular starships - many with deckplans.<BR>
<BR>
Loren and I feel that this should be an excellent addition to the GURPS <BR>
Traveller line - otherwise we wouldn't want our names on it, and SJG wouldn't <BR>
want to publish it.<BR>
<BR>
Keep the ideas/comments coming...<BR>
<BR>
Andy<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________<BR>
True Communications Corporation Your Premier ISP.<BR>
"Hometown Service with Worldwide Connectivity"<BR>
http://www.truserve.com        info@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:16:59 CST6CDT<BR>
From: igor@truserve.com<BR>
Subject: REQ: Bularia/Darrian info<BR>
<BR>
To ensure that I don't step on any toes, I would entertain any canonical <BR>
references to this world.<BR>
<BR>
Is there a write up in the Regency Sourcebook? Hmmm...I'll need to check when I <BR>
get home...<BR>
<BR>
Thanks.<BR>
<BR>
Andy<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________<BR>
True Communications Corporation Your Premier ISP.<BR>
"Hometown Service with Worldwide Connectivity"<BR>
http://www.truserve.com        info@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 17:56:57 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: Lawyer Stuff Help<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
<BR>
>Gee, why not just say "By my hand, and for the good of the State, what<BR>
>the bearer has done has been done." :-)<BR>
 <BR>
Because that is not a warrant but a free pardon. It does not enable the<BR>
bearer to go down to Le Havre, commandeer a squadron of warships, and<BR>
attack England. It merely enables the bearer to escape her just deserts<BR>
should she be caught doing something she ought not to have done.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:17:42 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Little Black Books<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 4:49 AM, jenry023@student.liu.se issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Can anyone who owns the set of LBBs describe carefully what they look like on<BR>
> the outside? This might seem like an odd question, but it will be so much<BR>
> clearer...<BR>
<BR>
Odd query, yes, but a good excuse to fondle my lil' darlings.<BR>
<BR>
> In particular, is there anything written on the back of the books?<BR>
<BR>
A brief overview of the book, for example LBB4(Mercenary) says "In depth, a<BR>
treatment of all aspects of military adventures in the universe of<BR>
Traveller. Detailed character generation for mercenary characters, including<BR>
11 new skills and 12 advanced weapon types. Plus, rules for recruiting,<BR>
tickets, and the resolution of battles".<BR>
<BR>
Oh, and the pinstripe is not always red. It is on Mercs, but Scouts has it<BR>
as yellow and High Guard as light blue (almost cyan).<BR>
<BR>
> Am I right in thinking that the books are very similiar to the BITS<BR>
> supplements, but in different colors?<BR>
<BR>
Very, I wish the LBBs had that plastic jacket, it offers quite a bit of<BR>
protection from scuffing and even some splort defense.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:44:06 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: Marshal Stuff<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
<BR>
>For what it's worth, I used to use the Cardinal as an example of<BR>
>"lawful evil" to my D&D players. The defining moment being when<BR>
>D'Artangan hands the Cardinnal the "warrant" and the Cardinal tears it<BR>
>up. If he *wasn't* extremely "lawful", he could then have had the poor<BR>
>boy executed. Instead, he honors the warrant and even gives him that<BR>
>commision. <BR>
 <BR>
That's not how I interpret that scene at all. As I see it, the Cardinal had<BR>
been admiring d'Artagnan for years and tried to enlist his services. His<BR>
patience has finally run out and he is preparing to have him executed. When<BR>
d'Artagnan produces a pardon signed by the Cardinal himself, he propably has<BR>
a hard time keeping from laughing out loud; anyway, he decides that he just<BR>
can't kill someone like d'Artagnan now. It has nothing to do with his sense<BR>
of legalism and everything to do with his sense of humour.<BR>
<BR>
Just my opinion.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        'There was a man,'  remarked Captain Eliot, 'who was sentenced<BR>
    to death for stealing a horse from a common. He said to the judge,<BR>
    that  he  thought it hard to be hanged for stealing a horse from a<BR>
    common  and  the  judge  answered,  "You  are not to be hanged for<BR>
    stealing  a  horse  from  a common,  but that others may not steal<BR>
    horses from commons." '<BR>
        'And do you find,' asked Stephen, 'that in fact horses are not<BR>
    daily stolen from commons? You do not!'<BR>
<BR>
                        --- "The Mauritius Command" by Patrick O'Brian<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:58:49 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
"First I built a swamp, and then it sank into the hill. So I built<BR>
another one. It sank into the hill. I built a third one. It burned up,<BR>
then sank into the hill. But the fourth one stayed there!"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/18/00 12:22 PM, swordworlder@yahoo.com issued<BR>
> forth:<BR>
> <BR>
> > Since the word "durham" means "swamp on a hill" it has probably sunk out of<BR>
> > sight. :-p<BR>
> <BR>
> Very funny, but I have to ask; how can a swamp be on a hill? I thought<BR>
> swamps were always at a lower elevation than surrounding terrain. Is there a<BR>
> geological term for this, I'd like to do a little research. Unless<BR>
> subsequent replies sate my appetite for information, that is. That often<BR>
> happens on this list.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:38:31<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
<BR>
At 12:31 AM 4/20/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> In the Imperium, I'd see cutter pilots as being senior NCOs, like the RW<BR>
>> Navy people who handle landing craft and the like.<BR>
><BR>
>Edit that Doug.....  NCOs not seniors.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I meant senior NCOs.  I'd think that command pilot on a 50dt<BR>
cutter would be an E-7 slot at minimum.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
Alle preisen den Pinguinherrscher!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:49:59<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
At 12:04 AM 4/20/2000 PST, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> Nice writing, but I believe you mis-spelled the name of Nilpoj Sinaj.<BR>
><BR>
>Also, it's Imjidrixhen...<BR>
<BR>
I believe you are referring to the great left-handed guitarist<BR>
Iimikashiredan Ekhiimi.<BR>
<BR>
To be honest I prefer the improvisational style of Iiriikarag Iirii.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"But that's not the point!" raged Ford. "The point is that I am now a<BR>
perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of<BR>
limbs!"  - The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2332<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2333</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 20 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2333<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Transport Requirements<BR>
Re: near-C rocks [warning: contains spur of the moment song parody]<BR>
RE: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
Hellstrom's Hive<BR>
Legends...<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
Cardinal and villains in general<BR>
re: Legends<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
Re: Transport Requirements<BR>
Re: Cardinal and villains in general<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
"Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Chemistry Question...<BR>
Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
Re: Helo Pilots <BR>
Re: Cutter Book<BR>
(no subject)<BR>
RE: Helo Pilots <BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:51:39<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Transport Requirements<BR>
<BR>
At 07:53 AM 4/20/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>Has anyone out there done up, or seen references for,<BR>
>the transport requirements (troops, yes, but mostly<BR>
>cargo) for various sizes of imperial ground combat<BR>
>formations such as a Lift Battalion?.<BR>
<BR>
Why, yes I have.  It's a big part of Ground Forces.  Be patient,<BR>
grasshopper.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 10:08:08 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks [warning: contains spur of the moment song parody]<BR>
<BR>
Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> "Sympathy for Yaskodray"<BR>
> <BR>
> Please allow me to introduce myself,<BR>
> I'm just a Droyne without a caste.[1]<BR>
> I've been around for a long, long year,<BR>
> And travellers look for my secret base.<BR>
<BR>
WOW! I love it...this is my absolute all time favorite Stones song.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:36:20 -0400<BR>
From: "John Toth" <jrtoth@bbtel.com><BR>
Subject: RE: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
<BR>
Are not E-7's on up more Administrative in their Duties?<BR>
I spend 7 years on active duty and 4 in the Guard, I have never seen anyone<BR>
in an air crew above E-6.<BR>
<BR>
Warrant Officers on the other hand are numerous and are usually in<BR>
charge -even at the Expense of a Zero ...er Officer.<BR>
<BR>
my .02,<BR>
John T<BR>
<BR>
PS I was Airborne Infantry and Have flown/jumped in Huye's, Black hawk's,<BR>
$hithook's (Chinooks), Sky Crane in Honduras, C-130's, C-141's, (1) C-5.<BR>
When I was Leg (ick) Artillery I worked at DIVARTY HQ (Command Staff<BR>
Support) and Battery HQ<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Douglas E.<BR>
Berry<BR>
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2000 9:39 AM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
At 12:31 AM 4/20/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> In the Imperium, I'd see cutter pilots as being senior NCOs, like the RW<BR>
>> Navy people who handle landing craft and the like.<BR>
><BR>
>Edit that Doug.....  NCOs not seniors.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I meant senior NCOs.  I'd think that command pilot on a 50dt<BR>
cutter would be an E-7 slot at minimum.<BR>
- --<BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
Alle preisen den Pinguinherrscher!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:33:15 EDT<BR>
From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/20/00 5:43:51 AM !!!First Boot!!!, kellys@efn.org writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< Or I could be all wrong, and fans will happily snatch up "GT Gauss <BR>
 Rifle."  (Maybe if it contained instructions for building one...) >><BR>
<BR>
the BATF would love that one...:-)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:44:43 +0100<BR>
From: "Peter  Scarrott" <peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Hellstrom's Hive<BR>
<BR>
Just a thought has anyone based a world/scenario on the book "Hellstrom's<BR>
Hive" (by Herbert I believe).  For those who haven't read it it is about a<BR>
genetic/cloning experiment to try and convert humans into an insect type<BR>
species.  Much fun and games, think of several hundred thousand clones<BR>
following a hive mind.<BR>
<BR>
This could be a Virus Hobbyist infecting a cloning plant or even an Imperial<BR>
Research facility.<BR>
<BR>
Peter<BR>
http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
p.scarrott@btinternet.com<BR>
<BR>
IMTU:	tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so  zh+<BR>
vi-<BR>
     	And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR>
<BR>
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the<BR>
shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser<BR>
gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time to<BR>
die."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:14:55 -0400<BR>
From: Kurt Feltenberger <kurt@blazenet.net><BR>
Subject: Legends...<BR>
<BR>
In one of my current PBEMs, the characters have encountered something out <BR>
of Zhodani legend, their 'Devil' if you will...<BR>
<BR>
Begin passage:<BR>
<BR>
(The narrator is a Lieutenant in the Guards' Commandos)<BR>
<BR>
Taking a sip of water, Iela closes her eyes and almost instantly her <BR>
complexion changes for the better. Her breathing becomes regular and <BR>
rhythmic and she begins speaking in a low voice, causing the listeners <BR>
around the table to lean forward in their seats to hear what she has to <BR>
say.  When I was a little girl growing up on my parents estates on the <BR>
homeworld.  I was told the stories of Plenzzhaliantda, the Eshshati Orila. <BR>
Plen, as he is commonly known, was a combination of legend, myth, tall tale <BR>
and our people's fears all rolled into one being of supreme evil and <BR>
deceit.  I remember the stories scared me, and when I misbehaved as a <BR>
little girl my mother would say that if I did not behave properly and with <BR>
respect and honor, Plen would come in the night and take me to his fortress <BR>
built by his Ancient masters.  The most disturbing thing I remember about <BR>
Plen is that he could influence events by willpower alone.<BR>
<BR>
What is frightening about this, you might ask?  The answer is simple yet <BR>
in its simplicity it is complex.  We, my people and others that have the <BR>
training and talent, my travel between two points instantly and without <BR>
travelling the distance between them.  We simply disappear from one <BR>
location and appear at another.  The longer the range, the more skill is <BR>
required.<BR>
<BR>
Plen, in addition to being able to travel this way, was able to send just <BR>
hisIm searching for a word, his 'Eipr, his essence so to speak.  He <BR>
would remain safe at his fortress while he sent his Eipr out to kidnap <BR>
children and cause evil and corruption.  The stories also told that he had <BR>
a great machine that helped him enhance his powers and that it was a relic <BR>
from the days when the Ancients walked among us.<BR>
<BR>
In all my life I never expected to encounter Plen; he was after all just <BR>
a story told to frighten children.  I was wrong.<BR>
<BR>
:End Passage<BR>
<BR>
If you can use it in your games, please feel free.<BR>
<BR>
Kurt<BR>
(really bored here at work...)<BR>
<BR>
Kurt Feltenberger<BR>
<BR>
"To our Country! In her intercourse with foreign nations,<BR>
    may she always be in the right, but our country, right or wrong!"<BR>
      ~Stephen Decatur<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
mailto:kurt@blazenet.net<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:17:18 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 9:58 AM, johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu<BR>
issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> "First I built a swamp, and then it sank into the hill. So I built<BR>
> another one. It sank into the hill. I built a third one. It burned up,<BR>
> then sank into the hill. But the fourth one stayed there!"<BR>
<BR>
Oh my, such an enormous engineering project would require *huge* tracts of<BR>
land! ;)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:28:01 -0500<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
Subject: Cardinal and villains in general<BR>
<BR>
Hans Rancke-Madsen wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> That's not how I interpret that scene at all. As I see it, the Cardinal had<BR>
> been admiring d'Artagnan for years and tried to enlist his services. His<BR>
> patience has finally run out and he is preparing to have him executed. When<BR>
> d'Artagnan produces a pardon signed by the Cardinal himself, he propably has<BR>
> a hard time keeping from laughing out loud; anyway, he decides that he just<BR>
> can't kill someone like d'Artagnan now. It has nothing to do with his sense<BR>
> of legalism and everything to do with his sense of humour.<BR>
<BR>
    Actually, given that a clever villain like the Cardinal rarely has but a<BR>
single reason for doing anything, I'd say it's some of both with a healthy dash<BR>
of self-interest.<BR>
    Legally, it's his document, and if he doesn't honor it there will likely be<BR>
at least some negative consequences that he wouldn't desire to see.<BR>
    And since he's been hoist by his own petard, as the French say, then he<BR>
might as well accept the humor of the situation and see if there's some way to<BR>
turn it to his advantage in the future.  Loss of a single battle isn't loss of<BR>
the whole war, and he's got other things to worry about.<BR>
<BR>
    You have to love a villain with perspective and patience.  Personally, it's<BR>
more fun to GM with someone like this than the stereotypical "big bad guy"<BR>
type.  Tempt the PCs with the possibility of using *him* (or at least thinking<BR>
they are), and with thinking they can get away with something (or a lot of<BR>
things).  When the time is right, no need for a knockout blow...just annoy them<BR>
with paper cuts and sap their strength.  Win ruthlessly, lose gracefully, and<BR>
always play the game with style.<BR>
<BR>
    Then again, I'm fond of having subtle bad-guys be patrons of the PCs.<BR>
Simmer slowly to taste...(eg)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Stormhound<BR>
DNRC Ombudsman for Induhvidual Affairs, Holder of Past Knowledge<BR>
Come visit my web page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd<BR>
Or my new Amateur Radio web page at http://www.qsl.net/kc0ekv<BR>
Or my JN6 course design page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd/golfpage.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:39:19 -0400<BR>
From: "Walt Smith" <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: re: Legends<BR>
<BR>
Kurt Feltenberger quoted:<BR>
>"To our Country! In her intercourse with foreign <BR>
>nations, may she always be in the right, but our <BR>
>country, right or wrong!"<BR>
>      ~Stephen Decatur<BR>
<BR>
"Our country, right or wrong. When right, to be<BR>
kept right; when wrong, to be put right."<BR>
				- Carl Schurz <BR>
<BR>
Nice legend, by the way. :-)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:30:05 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
<BR>
>> No, _I'm_ Spartac^h^h^h^h^h^h^h SolSec!<BR>
>"I'm SolSec, and so's my wife!"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
He's not SolSec - he's a very naughty boy.<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:37:24 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Transport Requirements<BR>
<BR>
>Why, yes I have.  It's a big part of Ground Forces.  Be patient,<BR>
>grasshopper.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
So when does it hit playtest, Uncle Doug? When can we play?<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:48:10 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Cardinal and villains in general<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 11:28 AM, stormhnd@fidnet.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Win ruthlessly, lose gracefully, and<BR>
> always play the game with style.<BR>
<BR>
A wonderful NPC (or PC) quote.<BR>
<BR>
> Then again, I'm fond of having subtle bad-guys be patrons of the PCs.<BR>
> Simmer slowly to taste...(eg)<BR>
<BR>
Heh. In my long-running (seven or eight years) AD&D campaign, the players<BR>
were all in love or idolized the Mage NPC for his suave demeanor and dry<BR>
humor. Lacking alignments in the campaign, he was effectively neutral evil.<BR>
They know now, yet still rely on him for a lot, although they keep a very<BR>
close eye on him. Trust him? No way, as they suspect he is the cause of a<BR>
couple deaths, one being a companion, the other a former employer. Not to<BR>
mention the occasional disappearing item.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:00:24 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
<BR>
someone wrote:<BR>
>> Nice writing, but I believe you mis-spelled the name of <BR>
>>Nilpoj Sinaj.<BR>
you replied:<BR>
>Also, it's Imjidrixhen...<BR>
<BR>
You're quite right on Imjidrixhen; that was typographical<BR>
error that spell-check somehow missed.  Nilpoj Sinaj is,<BR>
however, correct.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:06:30 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
Someone wrote (correctly):<BR>
>>Also, it's Imjidrixhen...<BR>
<BR>
You replied:<BR>
>I believe you are referring to the great left-handed <BR>
>guitarist Iimikashiredan Ekhiimi.  To be honest I prefer<BR>
>the improvisational style of Iiriikarag Iirii.<BR>
<BR>
You are quite correct.  Imjidrixhen was Iimikashiredan<BR>
Ekhiimi's stage name, especially in areas where Galanglic<BR>
was the majority language.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:08:46 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
Well, I have finally decided where in the Imperium my upcoming campagn will<BR>
be set, and am working on a J6 Astrogation Map for Lanth. I will use a<BR>
variety of sources, primarily GT: BtC, and entries from the TML Landgrab. As<BR>
I recall there were a couple claims within that area. However, the maps from<BR>
the region I am working on (snagged off the web) either make no distinction<BR>
between Scout and Naval Bases, or indicate there are no Scout bases in the<BR>
area. I would appreciate it if somebody could check my notes. For now I have<BR>
applied the base as Naval, and have yet to drop the world icons in. Here is<BR>
the regions breakdown as I have it so far:<BR>
(it looked nice and orderly on my notepad file, phooey)<BR>
<BR>
SYSTEM/SUBSECTOR        LOCI: UWP Code        Bases    GG?<BR>
<BR>
LANTH/Lanth                1719: A879-533B        N        -<BR>
Rhise/Lanth                2317: C100-576A                -<BR>
Ivendo/Lanth            2319: B324-659A        N        Y<BR>
Quopist/Lanth            2215: B151-679A                Y<BR>
Ghandi/Lanth            1815: B211-455A        N        Y<BR>
Victoria/Lanth            1817: X697-7704                Y<BR>
Sonthert/Lanth            1918: X626-6AB3                Y<BR>
D'Ganzio/Lanth            1920: B121-410D        N        Y<BR>
Ylaven/Lanth            1916: X587-5524                Y<BR>
<BR>
Arba/Lunion                1721: C200-200C                -<BR>
Rabwhar/Lunion            1822: D544-8BA6        N        Y<BR>
Ianic/Lunion            1924: E360-6975                Y<BR>
Adabicci/Lunion            1824: A571-89BB        N        Y<BR>
Gorram/Lunion            2322: X554-2200                Y<BR>
Quiru/Lunion            2321: B365-3008                Y<BR>
<BR>
Mirriam/Vilis            1515: E472-3008        N        -<BR>
Calit/Vilis                1715: C334-8677                Y<BR>
FRENZIE/Vilis            1316: A200-436A        N        -<BR>
Arkadia/Vilis            1417: E446-8456                Y<BR>
Stellatio/Vilis            1416: D5A4-4204                -<BR>
Vilis/Vilis                1319: A593-933A                -<BR>
Tanoose/Vilis            1318: B978-868A        N        Y<BR>
Ficant/Vilis            1617: E567-3535                -<BR>
Saurus/Vilis            1520: D888-5887                -<BR>
Tavonni/Vilis            1720: E567-0000                Y<BR>
Asgard/Vilis            1719: X343-7C72                -<BR>
<BR>
DYRNWYN/Sword Worlds    1522: B958-412A                Y<BR>
Durendal/Sword Worlds    1523: B687-334B                Y<BR>
Hofud/Sword Worlds        1524: B666-553A                Y<BR>
<BR>
A rough draft of the map is at:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
<BR>
Much work to be done, but it's a start.<BR>
<BR>
/////////////////////////<BR>
<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:50:21 +0200<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
Subject: Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
Hmm, someone should really make a CD of Traveller-Filk songs, sung in tune <BR>
with the music!<BR>
- ---<BR>
Volker A. Greimann<BR>
greimann@geocities.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:03:24 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
<BR>
Does anybody have a handy GURPS rulebook?<BR>
<BR>
If so, would you mind posting me the cost and values from the 'Ship Owner'<BR>
(as opposed to Ship Patron) Advantage. The character in question has two<BR>
levels of Multimillionaire, so it ought to be fairly cheap to buy him a<BR>
yacht, but I can't remember exactly how it works.<BR>
<BR>
Cheers,<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:12:32 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer writes:<BR>
> Does anybody have a handy GURPS rulebook?<BR>
> <BR>
> If so, would you mind posting me the cost and values from the 'Ship Owner'<BR>
> (as opposed to Ship Patron) Advantage. The character in question has two<BR>
> levels of Multimillionaire, so it ought to be fairly cheap to buy him a<BR>
> yacht, but I can't remember exactly how it works.<BR>
<BR>
Well, if he has 2 levels of multimillionaire, he's got a net worth of <BR>
about 150 MCr, so just buy a yacht out of that cash.  No advantage required.<BR>
<BR>
The ship owner advantage was just a special case of wealth, IIRC.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:12:56 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 12:08 PM, xrp@sierratel.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Well, I have finally decided where in the Imperium my upcoming campagn will<BR>
> be set, and am working on a J6 Astrogation Map for Lanth<BR>
<BR>
Just some more thoughts on the campaign. It will focus on detached duty<BR>
scouts, perhaps with the inclusion of a retired IM as one of the local<BR>
players loves the commandos. I am thinking of doing it PBEM, my first, as<BR>
this avoids the transportation difficulties inherent in this county (my<BR>
driveway is 3 miles long with 3 gates and a creek). I may use a bounty<BR>
hunter NPC to mix up the push/pull motivation, and have yet to decide on<BR>
exact timeline or start date. Somewhen in the FFW era, perhaps with the war<BR>
itself being the character generation period, with T2k style generation<BR>
cut-off, only being the /end/ of the war instead of the beginning. I am<BR>
leaning towards including Strephons assasination, as I like the intrigue<BR>
aspects, although whether it is "current events" or "history" I have not<BR>
decided. I may not use it either, we'll see. I chose the Lanth region<BR>
because of the high number of red and amber zones, and Lanth's awkward<BR>
placement. Likely assignments will include diplomatic trouble-shooting,<BR>
exploration, survey, and perhaps some espionage. Feedback welcome.<BR>
/////////////////////////<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:38:41 CST6CDT<BR>
From: igor@truserve.com<BR>
Subject: Chemistry Question...<BR>
<BR>
Anyone know what the freezing point of liquid ammonia and methane are?<BR>
<BR>
I'm trying to figure out if a world has liquid or frozen oceans...<BR>
<BR>
Andy<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________<BR>
True Communications Corporation Your Premier ISP.<BR>
"Hometown Service with Worldwide Connectivity"<BR>
http://www.truserve.com        info@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:43:22 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 1:03 PM, nickb@ndirect.co.uk issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Does anybody have a handy GURPS rulebook?<BR>
<BR>
Far Trader, First In, and Behind the Claw...<BR>
 <BR>
> If so, would you mind posting me the cost and values from the 'Ship Owner'<BR>
> (as opposed to Ship Patron) Advantage. The character in question has two<BR>
> levels of Multimillionaire, so it ought to be fairly cheap to buy him a<BR>
> yacht, but I can't remember exactly how it works.<BR>
> <BR>
> Cheers,<BR>
> Nick<BR>
<BR>
>From Far Trader:<BR>
<BR>
Ship Owner - /Variable/<BR>
    Ship Owner is a variation on the theme of /trading points for equipment/<BR>
(p. CI-17), used when a character wishes to start with a starship. Unlike<BR>
points traded for equipment, Ship Owner is treated as an advantage that<BR>
remains on the character sheet. It is also far more efficient, which is<BR>
intended to reflect the fact that starships are large, hard to sell,<BR>
expensive to maintain, risky to operate and subject to strict regulations.<BR>
    This advantage differs from Ship Patron in that the character owns the<BR>
ship outright: they may sell it at any time(assuming they can find a buyer),<BR>
just like any other property, and recover their investment<BR>
<BR>
Further data gleaned:<BR>
Base cost depends on the characters wealth level:<BR>
15 points at Average or below.<BR>
10 points at Comfortable.<BR>
5 points at Wealthy.<BR>
0 points at Very Wealthy or above.<BR>
<BR>
    This gives him (or her) a basic Cr300,000 to put toward the purchase of<BR>
a starship /in lieu of/ - not in addition to - his (or her) starting wealth.<BR>
A maximum of 20% of this amount(Cr60,000) can be taken in cash as ordinary<BR>
starting wealth.<BR>
    Once the base cost is paid, /each/ additional point gives another<BR>
Cr150,000 investment in the ship. Starting characters may spend no more than<BR>
30 points (giving an additional Cr4,500,000) in this way. More equity can be<BR>
bought at the same rate in play, however.<BR>
    Filthy Rich characters multiply their investment in the ship by 5; each<BR>
level of Multimillionaire further multiplies this by 10. The amount that can<BR>
be taken in cash is still limited to Cr60,000.<BR>
<BR>
    Ship Owners receive a free level of Status, not cummulative with that<BR>
gained from Merchant Rank 5 (Captain) or Wealth. They also receive a free<BR>
Courtesy Rank 5 (Captain) or (Owner aboard). If they want real Merchant<BR>
Rank, they must pay the difference, treating their free Rank as if it were 5<BR>
points.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:44:39 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Helo Pilots <BR>
<BR>
"William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> >>3. In the army/navy/marines, what is the "normal" rank of helicopter<BR>
> >>transport pilots (UH-60 and the like)...I figure these indidividuals would<BR>
> >>be the closest counterparts to military cutter pilots.<BR>
<BR>
Perhaps we should look at Traveller character generation<BR>
rules for a clue. <BR>
<BR>
In CT Book 1 Navy Ship's Boat skill was available on the <BR>
'Service Skills' table but Pilot skill was only available on <BR>
the 'Advanced Education' Table, which required Education 8+. <BR>
This tends to suggest that more Educated characters<BR>
are more likely to have Pilot skill. However in the CT Navy<BR>
probability of Commission depends on SOC not on EDU [throw <BR>
10+ for Commission or throw 9+ if SOC 9+] (although probable <BR>
rate of promotion depends on EDU [throw 8+ or throw 7+ if<BR>
EDU 8+]. In the CT Book 5 Navy Ships Boat skill is available<BR>
(and equally probable) to Navy characters of all ranks<BR>
and branches who are serving on a ship and thus eligible to <BR>
roll on the 'Shipboard Life' table. Pilot skill is available,<BR>
and equally probable, on the 'Command Officer' table to <BR>
Commissioned Officers of any branch serving a Command Assignment.<BR>
(I guess if the Co wants to fly the ship the CO gets to fly<BR>
the ship...). However Pilot skill is available for Naval personnel <BR>
of _all ranks who serve in the 'Flight' branch of the Imperial<BR>
Navy or the subsector Navy (but not to those in a planetary<BR>
Navy). Therefore persons qualified to be Naval Pilots will consist <BR>
of officers from all branches and Flight Branch personnel<BR>
of all ranks.<BR>
<BR>
IMTU Flight branch enlisted personnel with Pilot skill have <BR>
typically pulled 3rd watch type Pilot assignments on a ship<BR>
with officers who are nice, lazy, understaffed, or want to have<BR>
a well trained crew. IMTU enlisted personnel with Pilot skill<BR>
may have learned much of their skill on simulations but have<BR>
flown a ship for real at least once or twice, if only to pass<BR>
the certification exam.<BR>
<BR>
In the CT Book 1 Marines and Army neither Ships Boat skill<BR>
nor Pilot skill was available although Vehicle skill was.<BR>
Book 4 made Ship's Boat, but not Pilot, skill available<BR>
to Marines (of any rank) who served Ship's Duty.<BR>
<BR>
> >Depends.  The rule of thumb is the sexier the ride, the more likely that<BR>
> >the officers keep all the fun to themselves.<BR>
<BR>
Does this mean that Jump Capable ships (needing Pilot) are<BR>
'sexier' than non jump capable ships requiring Ships Boat<BR>
skill?<BR>
<BR>
I would think that while jump capable ships are more responsibility<BR>
than non jump capable ships that flying a Ships Boat might well<BR>
be more fun than Piloting a jump ship since the Ships Boat<BR>
will not spend time in jump space (except as a carried craft)<BR>
where the Pilot has almost nothing to do.<BR>
<BR>
> Typically, most were Warrants a few years back (early 90's). Some were<BR>
> LT's. Almost all crew-chiefs/Flight-engineers were NCO's.<BR>
> Locally, I've not seen any NCO's (army or airforce, nor even the coasties<BR>
> who fly in a lot) with pilot's wings, only A/C wings.<BR>
> However, in Trav, we don't have warrants specified in canon, except for<BR>
> Zhodani, and that only from AHL; they seem to be like the RN, where<BR>
> warrants are senior NCO's, rather than an inbetween area ala Russian<BR>
> Praporshiki.<BR>
> However, I agree with Doug: the sexier (IE, more combat-capable and<BR>
> high-performance), the more likely it's driven by a shmoe with a commision.<BR>
> IMTU, Cutters are flown by NCO's, and commanded by Senior NCO's or Junior<BR>
> Officers, mission dependant.<BR>
<BR>
I agree with William and Doug (and the CT char gen rules) Pilots<BR>
are likely to be officers while Ships Boat Pilots are as likely to<BR>
be Enlisted or NCO's. However some enlisted personnel will know how <BR>
to be pilots. Their assignment as Pilots will depend on the<BR>
wishes of their CO's. I usually have them serve on the 3rd<BR>
watch and only then on ships where their will be a Command<BR>
Officer on the bridge, then when the ship actually goes into a<BR>
crisis the enlisted person stops serving as Pilot if and when<BR>
the officer who is the official Pilot makes it to the bridge.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:45:02 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Cutter Book<BR>
<BR>
GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote<BR>
<BR>
> In a message dated 00-04-19 19:37:01 EDT, you write:<BR>
> << Why do they think it can sell well enough to be successful?  >><BR>
<BR>
> My gut feeling -- and I think I have a fairly good track record at this sort <BR>
> of thing -- When it comes out, take a look at it and if you don't want it, <BR>
> don't buy it. <BR>
<BR>
Fair enough. I probably will buy it as I buy most GURPS products<BR>
(and all GURPS Traveller products to date). I just was not sure<BR>
how many other people would buy it.<BR>
<BR>
> Andy has not mentioned that he is co-authoring the book with me, and doing <BR>
> the deckplans. I think enough fans will like it to make it a good seller.<BR>
<BR>
Given the deckplans I can see why a number of people might<BR>
buy it.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 17:03:09 -0400<BR>
From: William Louis Cusick <maldeus@olg.com><BR>
Subject: (no subject)<BR>
<BR>
unsubscribe<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:08:48 -0500<BR>
From: "Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Helo Pilots <BR>
<BR>
> From: Peter Newman [mailto:pnewman@gci.net]<BR>
> Does this mean that Jump Capable ships (needing Pilot) are<BR>
> 'sexier' than non jump capable ships requiring Ships Boat<BR>
> skill?<BR>
<BR>
Yes.  In the navy: Bigger = better = commanded by higher rank.<BR>
<BR>
> I would think that while jump capable ships are more responsibility<BR>
> than non jump capable ships that flying a Ships Boat might well<BR>
> be more fun than Piloting a jump ship <BR>
<BR>
Shhh.  Keep it quiet.  If the ossifers learn that flying the 'boats is so fun, they'll want to keep 'em all to themselves. :-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> I agree with William and Doug (and the CT char gen rules) Pilots<BR>
> are likely to be officers while Ships Boat Pilots are as likely to<BR>
> be Enlisted or NCO's. However some enlisted personnel will know how <BR>
> to be pilots. <BR>
<BR>
There is also going to be quite a bit of 'informal cross training' going on between pilots and their flight crews.  My dad was a helo gunner in 'Nam, but the pilot of his helo taught him how to fly.  The pilot wanted someone to be able to get the helo back to base if something happened to him or the copilot.<BR>
<BR>
vargr1                                                   UPP-8D9B85<BR>
- ---------------------------- Omnia dicta fortiora, si dicta latina.<BR>
Meyers-Briggs personality type: ENTJ                vargr1@jcn1*com<BR>
"...the ENTJ is not one to be trifled with."      dmoody@bridge*com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2333<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 20 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2334<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
RE: Hellstrom's Hive<BR>
Re: Swamp on a Hill<BR>
Re: The Little Black Books<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
Re: Chemistry Question...<BR>
re:  Legends...<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
Modular Cutters & Modular Starships<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
Re: Re Swamp on a hill<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
Re: Modular Cutters & Modular Starships<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
Re: Helo Pilots <BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
GearHeads Up!<BR>
Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
Correction to GearHeads Up!<BR>
Re: GearHeads Up!<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Re: near-C rocks [warning: contains spur of the moment song parody]<BR>
Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
Re: Cardinal and villains in general<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:10:08 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Does anybody have a handy GURPS rulebook?<BR>
<BR>
FYI: this information comes from GT: Far Trader, page 101.<BR>
> <BR>
> If so, would you mind posting me the cost and values from the 'Ship Owner'<BR>
> (as opposed to Ship Patron) Advantage. The character in question has two<BR>
> levels of Multimillionaire, so it ought to be fairly cheap to buy him a<BR>
> yacht, but I can't remember exactly how it works.<BR>
<BR>
In this specific case, Ship Owner is free for the PC (0 points for Very<BR>
Wealthy or above), and would give the PC up to MCr 150 equity in a<BR>
starship, _in lieu of_ normal starting wealth.  As BZA pointed out, the<BR>
PC could take no more than Cr 60,000 in cash; since a standard yacht<BR>
(_Vanderbilt_ or _Lady of Shallot_ classes) in GT costs under MCr 50<BR>
(exclusive of custom furnishings), the PC might be better off just<BR>
buying a yacht out of starting wealth.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, if the PC wants a more expensive ship than starting wealth<BR>
would allow (such as a Broadsword or a custom yacht from FSY or<BR>
AuricTech*), then Ship Owner would make more sense.<BR>
<BR>
*Note that AuricTech has not yet designed any ships under GT rules.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:13:09 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Hellstrom's Hive<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Peter Scarrott<BR>
><BR>
> Just a thought has anyone based a world/scenario on the book "Hellstrom's<BR>
> Hive" (by Herbert I believe).<BR>
<BR>
Yep, Herbert. He does good stuff like this. "The Green Brain" would make a<BR>
good "aliens" scenario too.<BR>
<BR>
> For those who haven't read it it is about a<BR>
> genetic/cloning experiment to try and convert humans into an insect type<BR>
> species.  Much fun and games, think of several hundred thousand clones<BR>
> following a hive mind.<BR>
<BR>
From memory it's written like an X-Files episode (although long before<BR>
X-Files) with an FBI or similar team investigating the dissappearance of the<BR>
previous investigatory team.<BR>
<BR>
The "clones" weren't the real problem, it was how they were being produced.<BR>
He recycled the concept in later Dune books.<BR>
<BR>
> This could be a Virus Hobbyist infecting a cloning plant or even<BR>
> an Imperial Research facility.<BR>
<BR>
I'd like to think that even the Imperium would stop short of what Hellstrom<BR>
was doing.<BR>
Of course, they might not know what he was doing with their money,<BR>
especially if the oversight committee were the first people he "replaced".<BR>
<BR>
It makes a lot of sense for a Virus who had decided that humans were useful<BR>
for certain activities, and definitely for production of Berserker "good<BR>
life".<BR>
<BR>
Or have Hellstrom being an early Solomani colonist, of the "if I don't<BR>
emigrate now the authorities wil get me type"  with an entire colony or<BR>
colony ship built that way.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:13:22 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Swamp on a Hill<BR>
<BR>
If your definition of Swamp includes Moor then you could<BR>
consider much of Dartmoor, England to be a swamp. The<BR>
website for Dartmoor National Park<BR>
http://www.dartmoor-npa.gov.uk/dnp/factfile/habitats.pdf<BR>
has some good information, in PDF format, on Dartmoor<BR>
which might serve as a useful model of this sort of<BR>
place. If you prefer a more fictionalized Moor than<BR>
you may want to check out 'Hound of the Baskervilles'<BR>
(Arthur Conan Doyle) or even 'Jane Eyre' (Charlotte<BR>
Bronte).<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: There are a lot of late TL 4, early TL 5 worlds<BR>
out there.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:18:46 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: The Little Black Books<BR>
<BR>
See<BR>
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=311960538<BR>
for a scan of the front, but not back, covers of these.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 13:20:33 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
> Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
> Subject: Re:<BR>
> <BR>
> "First I built a swamp, and then it sank into the hill. So I built<BR>
> another one. It sank into the hill. I built a third one. It burned up,<BR>
> then sank into the hill. But the fourth one stayed there!"<BR>
<BR>
I thought everyone knew that the forth one vanished in a<BR>
temporal rift and that it was the fifth one that stayed<BR>
there.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:23:49 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Chemistry Question...<BR>
<BR>
igor@truserve.com wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Anyone know what the freezing point of liquid ammonia and methane are?<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm trying to figure out if a world has liquid or frozen oceans...<BR>
<BR>
According to:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.ch.ic.ac.uk/vchemlib/mol/simple/gases/ammoniasaf.html<BR>
<BR>
ammonia's melting point is -77.6 degrees Celsius (presumably at standard<BR>
pressure).<BR>
<BR>
Methane's melting point is -183.0 degrees Celsius:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.ch.ic.ac.uk/vchemlib/mol/simple/fuels/methanesaf.html<BR>
<BR>
Obviously, changes in atmospheric pressure will change these figures.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:30:35 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Legends...<BR>
<BR>
>From: Kurt Feltenberger <kurt@blazenet.net><BR>
<BR>
Nice piece!<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:11:35 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> In a message dated 4/20/00 5:43:51 AM !!!First Boot!!!, kellys@efn.org <BR>
> writes:<BR>
><BR>
> << Or I could be all wrong, and fans will happily snatch up "GT Gauss <BR>
>  Rifle."  (Maybe if it contained instructions for building one...) >><BR>
><BR>
> the BATF would love that one...:-)<BR>
<BR>
It's *not* a "firearm". And if you stick with a small one, at current<BR>
tech, they'd have to stretch to call it a "destructive device".<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:47:33 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
<BR>
>Ship Owner - /Variable/<BR>
<SNIP><BR>
<BR>
Thanks - that's very much appreciated. I was nearly going out of my mind.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 08:54:14 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Modular Cutters & Modular Starships<BR>
<BR>
I'm intrigued by the idea of a whole book on the Modular cutter.  I must say<BR>
my inclination is to agree with those who have questioned the viability of<BR>
the market for such a book, however how about taking the idea a little<BR>
further, as I did IMTU, namely Modular Starships!!<BR>
<BR>
Many years ago I designed a 1200 dton Modular Subsidised Merchant Freighter<BR>
using High Guard.  Basically the modular cutter was my inspiration for this.<BR>
As I remember it, I called it the Oberon Class.  Very recently I've been<BR>
redesigning the same ship using TNE:FF&S and T4:FF&S (principally as a means<BR>
of really getting to grips with the respective design systems, having not<BR>
touched my Traveller Campaign for over Two years.  BTW can anyone point me<BR>
in the direction of errata for T4:FF&S?).<BR>
<BR>
The basic premise behind the Ship Class is as follows:<BR>
<BR>
* Most trade goods today are shipped (where possible) in standard sized<BR>
containers (e.g. 20 foot ISO standard size).  Containerisation (at various<BR>
levels) is likely to be the case in the future.<BR>
* Spaceships (be they starships or not) would be optimised in design to cope<BR>
with this feature and would probably be modularised themselves, thus<BR>
allowing Cargo Modules to be passed from ship to ship in the same way that<BR>
ISO Containers are today.<BR>
* Subsidised Merchants in particular are likely to need to move lots of<BR>
'containerised' cargo and cargo Modules.<BR>
* To be a Subsidised Merchant it must be capable of operating off the major<BR>
trade routes (hence TL 12 and Jump 2).  IMTU I have always viewed the 400<BR>
dton Subsidised Merchant as essentially too small and usually use it as a<BR>
Tramp / Free Trader hull.<BR>
<BR>
IMTU I standardised on the following:<BR>
<BR>
* Standard ISO Container => 3m x 3m x 6m (i.e. 54 m3 which is approx. 4<BR>
dton)<BR>
* Standard Space Module => 100 dton.  It carries 24 standard containers (all<BR>
remaining volume / tonnage being taken up by the structure of the module<BR>
itself or being included in the small 'loose freight cargo hold' within each<BR>
module.  These 24 containers are configured within the 'large hold' in two<BR>
layers of 12 containers each.  Each layer being 4 (short side) x 3 (long<BR>
side) containers in configuration.<BR>
*Modules are unstreamlined 100 dton 'boxes' lifted into orbit by<BR>
'Mo-Lifters' or Tugs, basically streamlined spaceships designed to lift a<BR>
standard Module (or modules) into orbit within its 'Module Bay'.<BR>
* A Module is effectively a pressurised 100dton spaceship with basic<BR>
life-support, contragrav etc (without drives and only limited power<BR>
(provided by batteries)), which can sit independently in space for about 24<BR>
hours.  However it is normally attached to a Mo-Lifter or Starship and thus<BR>
usually gains all its power from this.<BR>
* Modules are stressed to cope with upto 3G accel.<BR>
* Modules have external grapples designed to 'grapple' another 100 dton<BR>
Module.  The mothership grapples the modules at each end of a module package<BR>
(a series of modules grappled together) and thus need two sets of 100dton<BR>
external grapples.<BR>
<BR>
The Oberon Class Freighter (as I remember it) was designed at TL 12 to move<BR>
8  Modules, up to Jump 2 and 2G accel and was the basic Subsidised Merchant<BR>
configuration IMTU.  It also carried its own Mo-Lifter (as a ships boat) and<BR>
was an unstreamlined 'box' with 6 turret hardpoints.  The beauty of the ship<BR>
was I could essentially reconfigure the same basic starship (and deckplan!)<BR>
to carry passengers, cargo, troops etc, etc, etc.  All I needed to do was<BR>
redesign appropriate Modules (and deck plans for these!).  Of course Modules<BR>
had all sorts of internal configurations (e.g. basic cargo, passenger<BR>
movement, troop movement, laboratories, bulk cargo (e.g. Grain silos, metal<BR>
ore movement, etc).  Provided the external structure stayed within the<BR>
standard the 'sky was the limit'.<BR>
<BR>
Now a book on this type of ship and its 1001 variations would be a real<BR>
seller!!!<BR>
<BR>
BTW I'm new to the TML.  Although introduced to CT in 1979 and having<BR>
collected large amounts of CT, MT, TNE, T4 and now GT stuff over the years,<BR>
it's been some time since I've played.  This is my first post to the TML, so<BR>
be kind to the newbie (Picture:  shy Princess Diana style peering from under<BR>
eyebrows).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:53:08 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
>It's *not* a "firearm". And if you stick with a small one, at current<BR>
>tech, they'd have to stretch to call it a "destructive device".<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I think (under UK law, at least) the same restrictions that apply to<BR>
crossbows and whotnot would apply to it.<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:37:00 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re Swamp on a hill<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Ob Trav: Unusual geoforms can occur, and will tend to be in places where<BR>
> people will want to be near them. Anchorage is extant because it's a<BR>
> strategic port. Some city on the one plateau surrounded by swamp may be the<BR>
> major port on a world simply because it's the only large stable flat spot<BR>
> near the equator...<BR>
<BR>
Also, land that looks "normal" on the surface can be anything *but*<BR>
once you check out the underlying strata.<BR>
<BR>
For example, downtown Portland is a layer of sediment over bedrock. Or<BR>
so they thought until the 60s when  a company greased some palms and<BR>
got the height limit on buildings rescined (it was later restored, but<BR>
they already had their permit by then). <BR>
<BR>
Anyway, because the building was so tall, they were driving the support<BR>
pilings extra deep. When all of a sudden, much of downtown started<BR>
shaking in time with the piledrivers!<BR>
<BR>
They stopped and drilled deeper cores than anybody had bothered with<BR>
before. And they found that the "bedrock" was actually a lava flow over<BR>
older sediments (an old lake, I think). These older sediments were the<BR>
kind that transmits shock in funny ways. <BR>
<BR>
So they wound up having to chop thru the lava layer in ways that didn't<BR>
set up the vibrations, and then run their pilings a *lot* deeper than<BR>
they'd expected (to get to the bottom of the *second* sediment layer).<BR>
<BR>
Of course, in recent times we've learned thatr there's a bunch of<BR>
*faults* under all this, too. So now things are even weirder.<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav should be obvious. Expanding a port, or just building one where<BR>
the geological site survey missed something...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:05:05 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-20 02:44:53 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< >I will have you all know that Cheap Trick still rocks, listening to The <BR>
Who<BR>
 >got me my first girlfriend, and the Stones got famous without being a cute<BR>
 >boy band.. >><BR>
<BR>
Not only do people's hips fall off at 18, but if you're a male, odds are your <BR>
hair will slide down off the top of your head and settle on your back, with a <BR>
little of it stopping in your ears on the way down.<BR>
<BR>
Loren (still not balding, but 7% loss of nerve function in left leg*) Wiseman<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:15:38 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 3:47 PM, nickb@ndirect.co.uk issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Thanks - that's very much appreciated. I was nearly going out of my mind.<BR>
> <BR>
> Nick<BR>
<BR>
No problem, after so much help from the TML, the least I can do is share,<BR>
eh? Just trying to give something back to the community, and I'd say I'm<BR>
still running deficit. Now that spring planting is over, I should get some<BR>
more time to update my website and take a lil' more active role in TML<BR>
threads etc. I hope I included all you need, I don't have Compendium I<BR>
(that's the ref, right?) but your query didn't seem to address that.<BR>
////////////////////////////////////////<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 16:22:51 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Modular Cutters & Modular Starships<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 3:54 PM, jbmee@bigpond.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Now a book on this type of ship and its 1001 variations would be a real<BR>
> seller!!!<BR>
<BR>
Well, I'll be happy with 101, or even a couple dozen. I've changed my mind<BR>
about the book as Andy and Loren have explained it's outline. I realy like<BR>
the idea of deckplans for an assortment of uses, and there sounds like<BR>
plenty more peripheral topics covered, like other ships that /use/ cutters,<BR>
hi-teck equipment, etc. BTW, nice post!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:25:24 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Nick Bradbeer <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 20 April 2000 19:48<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2325<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>>> No, _I'm_ Spartac^h^h^h^h^h^h^h SolSec!<BR>
>>"I'm SolSec, and so's my wife!"<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>He's not SolSec - he's a very naughty boy.<BR>
><BR>
>NB<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
"You're *all* SolSec"<BR>
"YES! WE *ARE* ALL SOLSEC!"<BR>
<pause><BR>
"Errr - I'm not"<BR>
<BR>
MB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 15:57:01 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Helo Pilots <BR>
<BR>
"Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> > From: Peter Newman [mailto:pnewman@gci.net]<BR>
> > Does this mean that Jump Capable ships (needing Pilot) are<BR>
> > 'sexier' than non jump capable ships requiring Ships Boat<BR>
> > skill?<BR>
> <BR>
> Yes.  In the navy: Bigger = better = commanded by higher rank.<BR>
<BR>
Commanded by is not equal to piloted by. I suspect that many <BR>
Naval ships are flown by relatively low ranking fight branch <BR>
officers but are commanded by much higher ranking line branch <BR>
officers.<BR>
<BR>
> > I would think that while jump capable ships are more responsibility<BR>
> > than non jump capable ships that flying a Ships Boat might well<BR>
> > be more fun than Piloting a jump ship <BR>
<BR>
> Shhh.  Keep it quiet.  If the ossifers learn that flying the 'boats is so fun,<BR>
> they'll want to keep 'em all to themselves. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Not if we convince them it's too much like actual work.<BR>
<BR>
> > I agree with William and Doug (and the CT char gen rules) Pilots<BR>
> > are likely to be officers while Ships Boat Pilots are as likely to<BR>
> > be Enlisted or NCO's. However some enlisted personnel will know how <BR>
> > to be pilots. <BR>
> <BR>
> There is also going to be quite a bit of 'informal cross training' going on<BR>
> between pilots and their flight crews.  My<BR>
> dad was a helo gunner in 'Nam, but the pilot of his helo taught him how to <BR>
> fly.  The pilot wanted someone to be able to<BR>
> get the helo back to base if something happened to him or the copilot.<BR>
<BR>
But helos are Piloted by the Vehicle skill which, unlike Pilot,<BR>
is readily available to Traveller characters of all ranks. A<BR>
helo is nowhere near 100 displacement tons. I suspect that few<BR>
non officers get to fly 100 dt Military vehicles these days.<BR>
Of course we do have rather fewer 100 dt flying vehicles than <BR>
Traveller militaries will.<BR>
<BR>
Are/were military blimp pilots typically officers?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 17:16:47 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
More thoughts on the region, species found there.<BR>
Sophonts: Solomani, Vilani, Saurians, Chirpers, Sontherti?, Jonkeereen.<BR>
Possible other canidates are that the natives of Ylaven are sufficiently<BR>
divergent from Solomani (apparent anscestery) to be a separate branch of<BR>
humaniti. And there is a reference in BtC to "Inthians" and "Payans" and a<BR>
"Payan disaster". In the Paya data it is not clear if these may or may not<BR>
be another branch of humaniti, or of what derivation. Other worlds such as<BR>
Mirriam and Asgard seem like potential branches of humaniti.<BR>
Animals: Kudebeck's gazelle, misc Terran fauna, Saurian fauna.<BR>
Plants: Valden plant, Balloon plants, agricultural crops.<BR>
<BR>
Still looking for other minor references.<BR>
<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:35:17 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: GearHeads Up!<BR>
<BR>
In case anyone cares, I just added a couple of things to my website,<BR>
including the rendering-and-deckplans version of my THUDDD entry.<BR>
<BR>
It's mostly stuff in a gear-heady vein (this is me, after all).<BR>
<BR>
o- Interim rendering for the Amazon-class SDB (mesh and textures for hull,<BR>
still needs detailing, weapons, comms aerials, etc) is up at<BR>
www.nickb.ndirect.co.uk/tneships/SDB_Ama2.html<BR>
<BR>
o- THUDDD Entry is up at www.nickb.ndirect.co.uk/tneships/crx12a.html<BR>
<BR>
o- The Deckplans page (www.nickb.ndirect.co.uk/tneships/deckplans.html ) has<BR>
been updated to Nearly Complete status.<BR>
<BR>
o- The Moorsyth Extravagant Guns 'Magnum Express Gold' uber-revolver ("For<BR>
when blowing it to shreds just isn't enough") is up, at<BR>
www.nickb.ndirect.co.uk/weapons/Magnum.html . No graphics yet, I'm afraid.<BR>
<BR>
Errr.....there's probably other things. And the What's New page is so out of<BR>
date I'm too confused to update it, if that makes sense. So please ignore<BR>
it.<BR>
<BR>
If, that is, you even decide to look.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:39:19 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: "Ship Owner" Advantage<BR>
<BR>
>No problem, after so much help from the TML, the least I can do is share,<BR>
>eh? Just trying to give something back to the community, and I'd say I'm<BR>
>still running deficit. Now that spring planting is over, I should get some<BR>
>more time to update my website and take a lil' more active role in TML<BR>
>threads etc. I hope I included all you need, I don't have Compendium I<BR>
>(that's the ref, right?) but your query didn't seem to address that.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Actually Comp I is one of the four GURPS books I have with me, but this is<BR>
one of about four advantages that's not in it.<BR>
<BR>
(And I'm in bad TML debt and getting worse. Maybe if do enough deckplans...)<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:48:38 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Correction to GearHeads Up!<BR>
<BR>
>o- The Deckplans page (www.nickb.ndirect.co.uk/tneships/deckplans.html )<BR>
has<BR>
>been updated to Nearly Complete status.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Dagnammit, there's always something. That *should* be:<BR>
www.nickb.ndirect.co.uk/tneships/deckplan.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:00:13 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GearHeads Up!<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 5:35 PM, nickb@ndirect.co.uk issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> In case anyone cares, I just added a couple of things to my website,<BR>
<BR>
Great renderings there. I must use those in my campaign. Really awesome<BR>
work, keep it up.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:05:30 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
Amendment: Scout base mentioned in BtC at Rabwhar, yet no Naval base<BR>
mentioned, I will revise the map draft to reflect this. I may put a Scout<BR>
base at Lanth, regardless of canon.<BR>
////////////////////////////////////////<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:30:43 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks [warning: contains spur of the moment song parody]<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> "Sympathy for Yaskodray"<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Please allow me to introduce myself,<BR>
>> I'm just a Droyne without a caste.[1]<BR>
>> I've been around for a long, long year,<BR>
>> And travellers look for my secret base.<BR>
><BR>
> WOW! I love it...this is my absolute all time favorite Stones song.<BR>
<BR>
I recall a DM using that song as background music while a dungeon party<BR>
was being briefed by a "mysterious patron". I wasn't in the game, and<BR>
when I heard that, I was glad of it. The poor fools playing didn't get<BR>
the hint...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:32:42 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> The past couple of filks (especially "Sympathy for Yaskodray") have<BR>
> inspired my Muse (a rather competitive being) to have me submit this<BR>
> filk to the Traveller corpus:<BR>
><BR>
> "Lucan" (to the tune of "Levon", by Elton John)<BR>
<BR>
Anybody try doing one to the tune of "Luka"? (Hello, my name is Luka...)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:37:05 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Cardinal and villains in general<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 11:28 AM, stormhnd@fidnet.com issued forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> Win ruthlessly, lose gracefully, and<BR>
>> always play the game with style.<BR>
><BR>
> A wonderful NPC (or PC) quote.<BR>
><BR>
>> Then again, I'm fond of having subtle bad-guys be patrons of the PCs.<BR>
>> Simmer slowly to taste...(eg)<BR>
><BR>
> Heh. In my long-running (seven or eight years) AD&D campaign, the players<BR>
> were all in love or idolized the Mage NPC for his suave demeanor and dry<BR>
> humor. Lacking alignments in the campaign, he was effectively neutral evil.<BR>
> They know now, yet still rely on him for a lot, although they keep a very<BR>
> close eye on him. Trust him? No way, as they suspect he is the cause of a<BR>
> couple deaths, one being a companion, the other a former employer. Not to<BR>
> mention the occasional disappearing item.<BR>
<BR>
In the campaigns I used to play in, most of us understood that it was<BR>
*far* easier to deal with a "lawful evil" party member than with a<BR>
"chaotic good" one.<BR>
<BR>
And due to a DM with a twisted sense of humor, I had a trio of<BR>
characters who could only run with newbies. You see, they were "neutral<BR>
neutral" *paladins* (yes, he allowed chaotic evil, and neutral neutral<BR>
ones as well as the standard "lawful good"). They each had a magic item<BR>
that was +5 holy. And worst of all, they not only served "the Cosmic<BR>
Balance" they had a bead of response, which meant they could *ask* what<BR>
was needed to "balance" a situation. <BR>
<BR>
Which meant that being in the same party as them was more dangerous<BR>
than juggling nitro or reading aloud a list of the names of high level<BR>
demons... <BR>
<BR>
But it was great when you just wanted to be silly.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 18:43:09 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> (it looked nice and orderly on my notepad file, phooey)<BR>
><BR>
> SYSTEM/SUBSECTOR        LOCI: UWP Code        Bases    GG?<BR>
><BR>
> LANTH/Lanth                1719: A879-533B        N        -<BR>
> Rhise/Lanth                2317: C100-576A                -<BR>
> Ivendo/Lanth            2319: B324-659A        N        Y<BR>
<BR>
Any "tabular" material you intend to post *must* be in a<BR>
*non*-proportional font. Courier 10 is a good choice.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2334<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2335</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 21 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2335<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
GT-Q: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
Re : Chemistry Question<BR>
Re: Cardinal and villains in general<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Re: Chemistry Question<BR>
Re: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: Legends<BR>
Re: Chemistry Question...<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Ship's Boat and Pilot Skill (was Re: Helo Pilots)<BR>
GT-Q: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
Re LBB's<BR>
Re Drivers<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
Airship pilots(was: Re: Re Drivers)<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2332<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
RE: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
RE: Helo Pilots <BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:10:05 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Dalton Spence <dalton.spence@hwcn.org><BR>
Subject: GT-Q: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
<BR>
If the 800-ton Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser (GT 139, deckplans<BR>
GT:SM 68-71) is *un*streamlined, why does it have *massive* landing<BR>
legs? Sure it could land only on airless worlds, but since those are<BR>
usually low gravity the legs could be much smaller. Where is the<BR>
eighth turret? I see four gunner stations on deck B, two on deck J,<BR>
and one [maybe] on deck I. And why does a military craft (even a<BR>
mercenary one) have only 100 DR armor and no stealth or emissions<BR>
cloaking?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
              @==================================================@<BR>
              | Dalton S. Spence, B.Sc. <dalton.spence@hwcn.org> |<BR>
              | Home Page: http://www.hwcn.org/~ag775/home.html  |<BR>
              |      Family Motto: Virtute Acquiritur Honos      |<BR>
              |    "Trade is the lifeblood of the Imperium."     |<BR>
              |   Cleon I, First Emperor of the Third Imperium   |<BR>
              |   The radioactive dictaphone buries the green    |<BR>
              |        tornado in the White House. FNORD!        |<BR>
              @==================================================@<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:16:21 +1000<BR>
From: "Robert O'Connor" <robocon@ozemail.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re : Chemistry Question<BR>
<BR>
Andy Akins wrote :-<BR>
> Anyone know what the freezing point of liquid ammonia and methane are?<BR>
             mp         bp<BR>
Ammonia      -78        -33<BR>
Methane      -183       -162<BR>
Temps in degrees C at one atmosphere ambient pressure.<BR>
<BR>
Don't forget eutectic mixtures. These are substances whose melting point<BR>
is lower than any of its ingredients.<BR>
<BR>
This effect is a consequence of freezing point depression - one of the<BR>
colligative properties of a solution. (Those properties depending on the<BR>
amount of substance dissolved in a solvent rather than the identity of<BR>
the solute - the others are boiling point elevation, vapour pressure<BR>
depression and osmotic pressure).<BR>
<BR>
An example : water's freezing point can be depressed by 1.86<BR>
degrees C per mole of substance added per kilogram of water.<BR>
Ammonia has a solubility of 480g ammonia per kilogram of water at 25<BR>
degrees C. The mass of one mole of ammonia is 17g (NH3) - so 480g is<BR>
28.2 moles. The freezing point of our saturated ammonia-water solution<BR>
is roughly -50 degrees Celsius!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor<BR>
Medico, Gamer<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:30:07 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Cardinal and villains in general<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 7:37 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> In the campaigns I used to play in, most of us understood that it was<BR>
> *far* easier to deal with a "lawful evil" party member than with a<BR>
> "chaotic good" one.<BR>
<BR>
Well, in /some/ ways, yeah, I'll agree. ;) situations may vary though.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 19:39:00 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 7:43 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Any "tabular" material you intend to post *must* be in a<BR>
> *non*-proportional font. Courier 10 is a good choice.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, I'm sort of aware of that, in that I know about proportional vs<BR>
nonproportional fonts. Not sure how to change it on my e-mail, I looked<BR>
under Character set, and found no Courier. I know I have the font, as I use<BR>
it often. I am scrapping the tabular format on my notes now that they are<BR>
becoming more detailed and textural in nature. Scout base on Rabwhar noted,<BR>
Naval base removed, doodled on my world icons, Thinking about including<BR>
steller data some how on the map.<BR>
<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
////////////////////////////////////////<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:45:17 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Chemistry Question<BR>
<BR>
T'was written:<BR>
<BR>
>  Anyone know what the freezing point of liquid ammonia and methane are?<BR>
>  <BR>
>  I'm trying to figure out if a world has liquid or frozen oceans...<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
Methane<BR>
    Melting point<BR>
        -296.46 degrees F<BR>
        -182.48 degrees C<BR>
           90.67 Kelvin<BR>
    Boiling Point<BR>
        -263.2 degrees F<BR>
        -164.0 degrees C<BR>
         109.15 Kelvin<BR>
Ammonia<BR>
    Melting point<BR>
        -107.9 degrees F<BR>
          -77.7 degrees C<BR>
         195.45 Kelvin<BR>
    Boiling Point<BR>
        -28.03 degrees F<BR>
        -33.35 degrees C<BR>
         239.8 Kelvin<BR>
<BR>
Note that these are for the pure compound at 1 standard atmosphere pressure. <BR>
Differences in atmospheric pressure will affect the boiling point much more <BR>
than the freezing point.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:00:28 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
<BR>
The Broadsword has always been a  fascinating craft.<BR>
A semi-military vehicle, it has no fuel purification plant.<BR>
Unstreamlined, it can still land on Garda-Vilis.<BR>
With a listed troop compliment of 31, the namesake of the class holds only<BR>
27, and 3 of those are noncombatant medics.<BR>
I will always wonder about the Broadsword...<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:15:00 -0500<BR>
From: "Thomas Vickers" <redroach@flex.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
, listening to The <BR>
> Who  >got me my first girlfriend, <BR>
<BR>
Then there is someone out there who can understand<BR>
the lengths I had to go to  in order to secure tickets<BR>
to this summer's who concert in Houston. <BR>
I didn't need that pesky soul anymore anyway :)<BR>
<BR>
TV<BR>
- ------------------------<BR>
"Never apologize, never explain."<BR>
                           Hunter S. Thompson<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:58:29 EDT<BR>
From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Legends<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/20/00 6:55:43 PM !!!First Boot!!!, smithw@hartwick.edu <BR>
writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< "Our country, right or wrong. When right, to be<BR>
 kept right; when wrong, to be put right."<BR>
                - Carl Schurz  >><BR>
<BR>
Interesting quote. It makes me think that he might have been a better general <BR>
than he was given credit for... For some strange reason I've always liked <BR>
him. I think of him as the patron saint of the German-American citizen <BR>
soldier, coming off of the boat to make sure the US doesn't end up like <BR>
Prussia in 1848...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:14:14 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Chemistry Question...<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> igor@truserve.com wrote:<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Anyone know what the freezing point of liquid ammonia and methane are?<BR>
>> <BR>
>> I'm trying to figure out if a world has liquid or frozen oceans...<BR>
><BR>
> According to:<BR>
><BR>
> http://www.ch.ic.ac.uk/vchemlib/mol/simple/gases/ammoniasaf.html<BR>
><BR>
> ammonia's melting point is -77.6 degrees Celsius (presumably at standard<BR>
> pressure).<BR>
<BR>
And the presence of water will result in freezing points all over the<BR>
place depending on the relative proportions of water and ammonia. I<BR>
seem to recall that the right mixture will have a melting point *lower*<BR>
than that of plain ammonia!<BR>
<BR>
Anybody know where I could find a phase diagram for water/ammonia<BR>
mixtures? <BR>
<BR>
Check out Hal Clement's "Star Light" for some of the things that can<BR>
happen if you have both water and ammonia available in quantity. Stuff<BR>
like a lake freezing because the temp went *up* (which caused enough<BR>
ammonia to evaporate that the remaining liquid was now below freezing...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:20:19 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 7:43 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
> forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> Any "tabular" material you intend to post *must* be in a<BR>
>> *non*-proportional font. Courier 10 is a good choice.<BR>
><BR>
> Yeah, I'm sort of aware of that, in that I know about proportional vs<BR>
> nonproportional fonts. Not sure how to change it on my e-mail, I looked<BR>
> under Character set, and found no Courier.<BR>
<BR>
I just checked. You have to use Wordpad, not notepad (under Win 95,<BR>
notepad uses the default desktop font). Wordpad, on my rather minimal<BR>
setup has "modem" available as a font, which is a non-proportional font.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:16:57 EDT<BR>
From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Modular Cutter Info<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/20/00 10:56:03 PM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>
shadow@krypton.rain.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< It's *not* a "firearm". And if you stick with a small one, at current<BR>
 tech, they'd have to stretch to call it a "destructive device".<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
Ask Steve Jackson about Federal A******s. All they care about is 1) can they <BR>
make some headlines, 2) can they justify their budget, and 3) can they lord <BR>
it over the untermenshen.... I'm sorry I'm bitter, but my wife just lost her <BR>
job today because her boss' company had to close their doors today due to <BR>
losing a rediculous lawsuit in Federal court. We were closing on our first <BR>
house in 6 weeks...:-(. I'm tempted to join a militia, but they're jerks....<BR>
<BR>
Ob Trav: Disgruntled NPCs and/or PCs who want revenge....<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:26:32 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 10:20 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> I just checked. You have to use Wordpad, not notepad (under Win 95,<BR>
> notepad uses the default desktop font). Wordpad, on my rather minimal<BR>
> setup has "modem" available as a font, which is a non-proportional font.<BR>
<BR>
Well, I'm on a Mac, and when I said "notepad" I should have said BBEdit<BR>
document. I have what looks like a pulldown menu at the top of the message<BR>
window, but it is greyed out. I can change the /color/ of the text just<BR>
fine! ;) As you can probably tell by now, computers are not my forte'. So<BR>
all you TMLers who are without webpages take note, as I am quite<BR>
computer-illiterate, and have found that html isn't all /that/ hard. Try it<BR>
out, you'll likely get hooked!<BR>
<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
The Galaxy itself contains a hundred million stars,<BR>
It's a hundred thousand light-years side-to-side,<BR>
It bulges in the middle, sixteen thousand light-years thick,<BR>
But out by us it's just three thousand light-years wide.<BR>
<BR>
We're thirty thousand light-years from Galactic Central Point,<BR>
We go 'round every two hundred million years,<BR>
And our Galaxy itself is one of millions of billions<BR>
In this amazing and expanding Universe!<BR>
<BR>
- ------- The Galaxy Song", Monty Python.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:49:00 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Ship's Boat and Pilot Skill (was Re: Helo Pilots)<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
>But helos are Piloted by the Vehicle skill which, unlike Pilot,<BR>
>is readily available to Traveller characters of all ranks. A<BR>
>helo is nowhere near 100 displacement tons. I suspect that few<BR>
>non officers get to fly 100 dt Military vehicles these days.<BR>
>Of course we do have rather fewer 100 dt flying vehicles than <BR>
>Traveller militaries will.<BR>
<BR>
I guess it would be silly at this point to mention that "Ship's Boat"<BR>
and "Pilot" skills specifically relate to spacecraft, not to the size<BR>
of the vehicle.  My brother in the Navy knows how to drive a<BR>
fast attack submarine and a missile sub, they're both bigger than<BR>
100dtns - but his skill is "Vehicle, Submersible" ("Large Submersible"?).<BR>
<BR>
ISTR one TML member happily claiming the honor of being the only<BR>
TML'er with Ship's Boat skill...apparently he'd helped build a simulator<BR>
for some NASA spaceship, and learned how to fly it in the process. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 01:54:17 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: GT-Q: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
<BR>
Dalton Spence wrote:<BR>
>If the 800-ton Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser (GT 139, deckplans<BR>
>GT:SM 68-71) is *un*streamlined, why does it have *massive* landing<BR>
>legs? Sure it could land only on airless worlds, but since those are<BR>
>usually low gravity the legs could be much smaller. <BR>
<BR>
A couple of reasons...<BR>
<BR>
The debarkation elevators are in those legs, so they need to be big<BR>
enough to hold them.<BR>
<BR>
If Broadsword lands on one of those airless rockballs her corp clients<BR>
like to settle their differences on, there's a chance it might be fired<BR>
upon. You want those legs to be as sturdy as the rest of the ship...<BR>
they're really extensions of the hull, rather than just landing legs.<BR>
<BR>
As to the others, I don't have the GT stuff...my CT _Broadsword_<BR>
adventure has all eight turrets, though.<BR>
<BR>
Perhaps the light armor and lack of cloaking is because it's a<BR>
paramilitary craft, rather than a military one? <BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 21:51:55 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re LBB's<BR>
<BR>
>Can anyone who owns the set of LBBs describe carefully what they look like on<BR>
>the outside? This might seem like an odd question, but it will be so much<BR>
>clearer...<BR>
><BR>
>In particular, is there anything written on the back of the books?<BR>
><BR>
>Am I right in thinking that the books are very similiar to the BITS<BR>
>supplements, but in different colors?<BR>
<BR>
Well, they are 5x8.5 inch saddle bound.<BR>
Books are black with a single mid-height stripe. 0-3 are red. 4 is orange.<BR>
5 is blue (almost sky, but not quite, and specific shade varies by<BR>
printing). 6 yellow. 7 purple. 8 was slightly purplish-red. Striker (all 3)<BR>
were yellow. AHL Rulesbook was red.<BR>
<BR>
Supplements have the narrow stripe, plus thick bars on top and bottom.<BR>
Colors of stripes varied (Sup 4 was blue; sup 5 was the same shade as the<BR>
AHL rulebook, a red).<BR>
<BR>
Adventures and Double Adventures added the words "For Referees Only" on the<BR>
upper color bar.<BR>
<BR>
On both Supps and Advs, "Game Designer's Workshop" appears in black on the<BR>
lower colored bar. Both the wide bars run to the edges.<BR>
<BR>
Except for Books 1-3, AHL Rulebook, Striker Books 1-3, and (IIRC) Supp 5,<BR>
all of them have a white text blurb on the back, typically with colored<BR>
text highlights so you can tell at a glance what it's about.<BR>
<BR>
CT Alien Modules were 8.5x11", saddle bound (often the cover is not bound<BR>
to the book), full color illos on front, with the single bar.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 22:05:46 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Drivers<BR>
<BR>
>Are/were military blimp pilots typically officers?<BR>
<BR>
USS Acron was helmed by a rating (NCO), but commanded by a Lt. Commander.<BR>
Ditto her sister ship.<BR>
<BR>
They were (in the US) part of the navy, and treated as ships, not aircraft.<BR>
<BR>
one other comment tho, on who flies small craft: If it's a combat mission,<BR>
you can bet at least on of the craft has an officer aboard, and probably<BR>
flying. Something about "Officers are required to authorize hostilities<BR>
except when fired upon... and often then, too!" [SFC Tuitt or SFC Shelton<BR>
(Can't remember clearly which), at Ft. Dix, in august 1987...]<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 02:14:07 -0400<BR>
From: "DaveShayne" <daveshayne@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
>Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 21:24:54<BR>
>From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
>Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
><BR>
>At 12:26 AM 4/20/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>But in the words of Norris' 14 year old grand niece Wanda[1], "Why are<BR>
>>'dults always so chronically unclued? The band is called near-C rocks, not<BR>
>>Near-C Rocks. Youlda thunka peoples hips fall off at eighteen. 'Dults!"<BR>
><BR>
>I didn't need that.  I've had my fill of heavy, exasperated sighs and<BR>
>rolling eyes from kids who I used to give piggy-back rides way back when.<BR>
>Evidently, I have become completely out of touch with the pounding pulse of<BR>
>modern life.<BR>
><BR>
>I will have you all know that Cheap Trick still rocks, listening to The Who<BR>
>got me my first girlfriend, and the Stones got famous without being a cute<BR>
>boy band..<BR>
><BR>
>- --<BR>
><BR>
>Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
I didn't mean to cause any pain honest. If it helps any I know what your<BR>
talking about. I got into an argument with a 15 y.o. the other day about<BR>
punk rock.<BR>
He kept saying I didn't know what punk music was about. And yet he'd never<BR>
heard of the Sex Pistols, or the Clash, or the Ramones (not sure if I<BR>
spelled that<BR>
correctly) or even Blondie. It was like trying to argue about landscape<BR>
paintings<BR>
with someone who was born blind.<BR>
<BR>
Dave Shayne<BR>
<BR>
"Now the workers have struck for fame<BR>
    cuz Lennon's on sale again." - David Bowie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 08:13:06 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher & Regina Otto <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Re: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
<BR>
"Samuel D. Weiss" schrieb:<BR>
> <BR>
> The Broadsword has always been a  fascinating craft.<BR>
> A semi-military vehicle, it has no fuel purification plant.<BR>
> Unstreamlined, it can still land on Garda-Vilis.<BR>
> With a listed troop compliment of 31, the namesake of the class holds only<BR>
> 27, and 3 of those are noncombatant medics.<BR>
> I will always wonder about the Broadsword...<BR>
<BR>
Well, if you have a lot of time and a powerful drive (for the<BR>
Broadsword: 3G IIRC, and under GT rules this is requiring no reaction<BR>
mass), you do not need to be streamlined. Just be a bit careful and<BR>
proram a safe landing course, always slow enough _relative to the<BR>
surrounding atmosphere_ not to uffer from the obviopus problems that<BR>
unstreamlined ships normally have. But it's probably cheaper and safer<BR>
to use the modular cutters.<BR>
<BR>
Fuel purification: It is a mercenary ship. Perhaps the Imperium does not<BR>
want them to be too valuable as a military ship. Same is true for DR.<BR>
<BR>
Finally, the troop contingent: Isn't it stated somewhere that this is<BR>
"hot-bunking?" At least I would suspect it.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 08:20:43 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher & Regina Otto <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Airship pilots(was: Re: Re Drivers)<BR>
<BR>
"William F. Hostman" schrieb:<BR>
> <BR>
> >Are/were military blimp pilots typically officers?<BR>
> <BR>
> USS Acron was helmed by a rating (NCO), but commanded by a Lt. Commander.<BR>
> Ditto her sister ship.<BR>
> <BR>
> They were (in the US) part of the navy, and treated as ships, not aircraft.<BR>
<BR>
I the German Imerial Navy, the Zeppelin bombers of WWI were each under<BR>
the command of a Kapitaenleutnant or Oberleutnant (Lieut. Comm. or<BR>
Lieut., sg). They had at least one second officer onboard, and various<BR>
crewmen and NCO's, responsible for maintenance of the gas cells, taking<BR>
care of the diesels, etc. There were two helmsmen: One for the altitude<BR>
rudder and one for the side rudder, both were AFAIK typically NCO's.<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
Hiroshi.Estigarribia@gmx.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:30:50 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 11:14 PM, daveshayne@email.msn.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> He kept saying I didn't know what punk music was about. And yet he'd never<BR>
> heard of the Sex Pistols, or the Clash, or the Ramones.<BR>
<BR>
How about Black Flag, Dead Kennedys, Circle Jerks, or GBH? Fifteen? And what<BR>
did he consider punk?<BR>
<BR>
Does it seem like a lot of these Trav bands are rock to anyone else? Is the<BR>
generation responsible for this material letting their cultural predjudices<BR>
come through? Not that I am against Rock-n-Roll Traveller, mind you...<BR>
<BR>
I am not discounting the exceptions, just noting what seems to be more<BR>
common. I've seen a lot of "Entertainment in Traveller" refs pass through<BR>
the TML and Trav Culture, has anyone bothered to keep them sorted? I've<BR>
flagged and archived some of my faves, there may be enough material to make<BR>
an interesting project.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 00:29:16 -0700<BR>
From: Evyn MacDude <wmacdude@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 12:31 AM 4/20/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> >Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> >> In the Imperium, I'd see cutter pilots as being senior NCOs, like the RW<BR>
> >> Navy people who handle landing craft and the like.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Edit that Doug.....  NCOs not seniors.<BR>
><BR>
> Actually, I meant senior NCOs.  I'd think that command pilot on a 50dt<BR>
> cutter would be an E-7 slot at minimum.<BR>
<BR>
Or max..... As an E5, I was CO of some fairly large craft. Mostly non-<BR>
combatants though. Even had the right to chew out Marine lieutenants if<BR>
the need was there. ( More than once.... Even had a Marine Colonel back<BR>
me up. )<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Evyn...<BR>
<BR>
C-Space home http://home.att.net/~wmacdude/<BR>
<BR>
Get six jolly cowboys to carry my coffin<BR>
Get six pretty maidens to bear up my pall<BR>
Bunches of roses all over my coffin<BR>
Roses to deaden the clods as they fall<BR>
 Laredo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:17:47 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2332<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-20 13:21:16 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< > Loren is Judge Dredd?!<BR>
 <BR>
 Can't be he don't look that good in leather spandex....<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
Hang on . . . I'll be AFK for a bit ...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, you're right. <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 08:48:48<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
At 07:05 PM 4/20/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Not only do people's hips fall off at 18, but if you're a male, odds are<BR>
>your hair will slide down off the top of your head and settle on your back, <BR>
>with a little of it stopping in your ears on the way down.<BR>
<BR>
Ah HA!  There is your mistake, my editorial friend.  One bizarre side<BR>
effect of Hodgkin's Lymphomia is that for some reason we don't get male<BR>
pattern baldness.  So while I may be dead a fifty, I'll leave a full head<BR>
of hair to heirs.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
Egotist: a person more interested in himself than in me.<BR>
- -- Ambrose Bierce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 08:52:07<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: GURPS Cutter Questions<BR>
<BR>
At 01:36 PM 4/20/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>Are not E-7's on up more Administrative in their Duties?<BR>
>I spend 7 years on active duty and 4 in the Guard, I have never seen anyone<BR>
>in an air crew above E-6.<BR>
<BR>
Change the image: think *Navy* about these things.  I don't think it would<BR>
be out order to have a Chief Petty Officer as command pilot.<BR>
<BR>
In my experience, US army infantry E-7s are platoon sergeants, which still<BR>
involves a great amount of field time.<BR>
<BR>
>PS I was Airborne Infantry<BR>
<BR>
Stand in the door...<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry      )+(      gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
    http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"Well, thanks to the Internet, I'm now bored with sex."<BR>
	                    - Fry, Futurama<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 08:57:14<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Helo Pilots <BR>
<BR>
At 04:08 PM 4/20/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Shhh.  Keep it quiet.  If the ossifers learn that flying the 'boats is so<BR>
fun, they'll want to keep 'em all to themselves. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Ever read about the USMC Flying Sergeants?  Between the wars, the Marines<BR>
let a number of NCOs become pilots, since the Corps was very small and no<BR>
officer wanted to lose his place in the very competitive race for<BR>
promotions and commands.  After Pearl Harbor, the Corps expanded quickly,<BR>
but it became obvious that Marine Aviation was going to be a major factor,<BR>
and even more of a promotion ladder.  So the best of the flying Sergeants<BR>
were suddenly commissioned, while the others became flight crew to<BR>
snot-nosed jerks with six hours in type.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
Embrace Fascism.    The uniforms look cool<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2335<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2336</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 21 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2336<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Ship's Boat and Pilot Skill (was Re: Helo Pilots)<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Transport Requirements<BR>
Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
Sympathy for Yaskodray<BR>
RE: Yet Another Filk<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
Re: GearHeads Up!<BR>
RE: GT-Q: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
RE: Yet Another Filk<BR>
Re: Transport Requirements<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Near C Rock Bands<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Ship's Boat and Pilot Skill (was Re: Helo Pilots)<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus  (done right)<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Filk - Playin' with the Traveller Book<BR>
Re Braodsword<BR>
Filk Fragment/Idea Cover of the T4 Book<BR>
Re: Filk - Playin' with the Traveller Book<BR>
Re: Re Braodsword<BR>
Color Question<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:09:24<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Ship's Boat and Pilot Skill (was Re: Helo Pilots)<BR>
<BR>
At 01:49 AM 4/21/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>ISTR one TML member happily claiming the honor of being the only<BR>
>TML'er with Ship's Boat skill...apparently he'd helped build a simulator<BR>
>for some NASA spaceship, and learned how to fly it in the process. :-)<BR>
<BR>
We had a friend who got to try the Shuttle Landing Simulator.  Only crashed<BR>
five or six times.<BR>
<BR>
I used to daydream about being a shuttle piot, and one of things I was<BR>
going to do was send Craig email from orbit:  "Please add Ship's Boat-1 to<BR>
my character sheet."<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:05:09<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
At 02:14 AM 4/21/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>He kept saying I didn't know what punk music was about. And yet he'd never<BR>
>heard of the Sex Pistols, or the Clash, or the Ramones (not sure if I<BR>
>spelled that correctly) or even Blondie. It was like trying to argue about <BR>
>landscape paintings with someone who was born blind.<BR>
<BR>
And what about Wendy O. Williams and the Plasmatics?  Here in SF, the case<BR>
of Jello Biafra v. The Dead Kennedys is going to trial soon.<BR>
<BR>
But you can get revenge..  at a weekly get together of SF fen the host's<BR>
daughter and her boyfriend walked in.  He was punked out.  Spiked collar,<BR>
spiked hair, ripped Ramones shirt, the whole nine yards.  He saw me looking<BR>
at him, and asked me if I had a problem.  "Well, yeah.. that outfit is<BR>
exactly what I was wearing twenty years ago! Where did you find it?"  Which<BR>
led to all of us thrifty somethings to begin reminiscing on sneaking into<BR>
the I-beam to see the Sex Pistols, or all-night drinking binges at<BR>
Lexington Reservoir...<BR>
<BR>
The lesson here is:  Rebellion doesn't work if it inspires nostalgia.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:10:04<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Transport Requirements<BR>
<BR>
At 06:37 PM 4/20/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>>Why, yes I have.  It's a big part of Ground Forces.  Be patient,<BR>
>>grasshopper.<BR>
><BR>
>So when does it hit playtest, Uncle Doug? When can we play?<BR>
<BR>
Ask Great Uncle Loren.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:13:01<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
At 04:50 PM 4/20/2000 +0200, you wrote:<BR>
>Hmm, someone should really make a CD of Traveller-Filk songs, sung in tune <BR>
>with the music!<BR>
<BR>
we'd never get the rights to use the orginal tunes.. Don MacLean has no<BR>
problem with people using American Pie, but some of the others are very<BR>
protective of their copyrights.<BR>
<BR>
Some artists have tried to stop people from just performing parodies at<BR>
filksings.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 09:13:48<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Sympathy for Yaskodray<BR>
<BR>
I've lost this.  Could somebody send me a copy?<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:49:14 -0400<BR>
From: "Walt Smith" <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: RE: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
So how does "Weird" Al Yankovic get away with it? <BR>
Does he get permission for each song he parodies<BR>
beforehand? And isn't such usage covered under<BR>
the parody variety of "fair use" anyway?<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Douglas E.<BR>
> Berry<BR>
> Sent: Friday, April 21, 2000 5:13 AM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> At 04:50 PM 4/20/2000 +0200, you wrote:<BR>
> >Hmm, someone should really make a CD of Traveller-Filk songs, <BR>
> sung in tune <BR>
> >with the music!<BR>
> <BR>
> we'd never get the rights to use the orginal tunes.. Don MacLean has no<BR>
> problem with people using American Pie, but some of the others are very<BR>
> protective of their copyrights.<BR>
> <BR>
> Some artists have tried to stop people from just performing parodies at<BR>
> filksings.<BR>
> -- <BR>
> <BR>
> Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
> http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:52:50 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 9:05 AM, gridlore@pop.mindspring.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Here in SF, the case of Jello Biafra v. The Dead Kennedys is going to trial<BR>
> soon.<BR>
<BR>
Ex-squeeze me? DK is in court? Why? Do you have a web ref?<BR>
<BR>
Now this thread really has me thinking. We all know Merc, trader, Scout,<BR>
type campaigns, a few have probably done Nobles and intrigue. What about<BR>
security detail for intersteller rock bands? Has anyone had a party that<BR>
resembled Buckaroo Banzai's? Musicians armed to the teeth and working for<BR>
ISS, IBIS, IRIS, MoJ, etc?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:07:48 -0500<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> So how does "Weird" Al Yankovic get away with it?<BR>
> Does he get permission for each song he parodies<BR>
> beforehand? And isn't such usage covered under<BR>
> the parody variety of "fair use" anyway?<BR>
<BR>
    You beat me to it...that's just the example I was going to bring up.<BR>
Courts in the US ruled several years ago that such use was okay (I don't<BR>
recall all the specifics, particularly of what crediting was required).<BR>
"Weird" Al does ask permission (and almost always gets it, with one notable<BR>
exception), but he does that out of politeness, not requirement.<BR>
    If I were actually writing up a program for a filkfest, I'd include the<BR>
artist attributions for the original songs.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Stormhound<BR>
DNRC Ombudsman for Induhvidual Affairs, Holder of Past Knowledge<BR>
Come visit my web page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd<BR>
Or my new Amateur Radio web page at http://www.qsl.net/kc0ekv<BR>
Or my JN6 course design page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd/golfpage.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:14:51 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: GearHeads Up!<BR>
<BR>
>Great renderings there. I must use those in my campaign. Really awesome<BR>
>work, keep it up.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Hey, instant gratification! Thankyoukindly....<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:35:42 -0400<BR>
From: "John Toth" <jrtoth@bbtel.com><BR>
Subject: RE: GT-Q: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
<BR>
It could be a Point of Legality.<BR>
<BR>
"Yes you can Armour the Heck out of it... No, you cannot have Cloaking. We<BR>
want to see you.", Chief Plans Inspector, Royal Ship Builders Licensing,<BR>
approving plans for the Ship.<BR>
<BR>
Also, cannot a Ship has Contra Grav land on any world? - It just cannot do<BR>
it Fast???<BR>
<BR>
In addition, in my opinion, It looks Streamlined to me - what it is not is<BR>
Airframe!!<BR>
<BR>
I cannot remember What LLB (8?) Merc's, of MT say - I will look it up<BR>
later..<BR>
<BR>
John T<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Walt Smith<BR>
Sent: Friday, April 21, 2000 1:54 AM<BR>
To: 'TML'<BR>
Subject: GT-Q: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Dalton Spence wrote:<BR>
>If the 800-ton Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser (GT 139, deckplans<BR>
>GT:SM 68-71) is *un*streamlined, why does it have *massive* landing<BR>
>legs? Sure it could land only on airless worlds, but since those are<BR>
>usually low gravity the legs could be much smaller.<BR>
<BR>
A couple of reasons...<BR>
<BR>
The debarkation elevators are in those legs, so they need to be big<BR>
enough to hold them.<BR>
<BR>
If Broadsword lands on one of those airless rockballs her corp clients<BR>
like to settle their differences on, there's a chance it might be fired<BR>
upon. You want those legs to be as sturdy as the rest of the ship...<BR>
they're really extensions of the hull, rather than just landing legs.<BR>
<BR>
As to the others, I don't have the GT stuff...my CT _Broadsword_<BR>
adventure has all eight turrets, though.<BR>
<BR>
Perhaps the light armor and lack of cloaking is because it's a<BR>
paramilitary craft, rather than a military one?<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:26:34<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
At 10:52 AM 4/21/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 9:05 AM, gridlore@pop.mindspring.com issued<BR>
>forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> Here in SF, the case of Jello Biafra v. The Dead Kennedys is going to<BR>
>>trial soon.<BR>
><BR>
>Ex-squeeze me? DK is in court? Why? Do you have a web ref?<BR>
<BR>
The DKs are suing Jello for royalties. He suing them over their desire to<BR>
sell "Holiday in Cambodia" for a Levi's ad. In other words, punk is dead<BR>
and the lawyers are fighting over the corpse.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/examiner/archive/2000/04/18/<BR>
NEWS5218.dtl<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:33:11<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
At 01:49 PM 4/21/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>So how does "Weird" Al Yankovic get away with it? <BR>
>Does he get permission for each song he parodies<BR>
>beforehand?<BR>
<BR>
Yep, he asks every artist, even the ones who get included in the polkas.<BR>
When he asked Kurt Cobain for the right to use "Smells like Teen Spirit",<BR>
all Kurt asked was "is it going to be about food?"  Mark Knoffler agreed to<BR>
let Al use "Money for Nothing:, but insisted on playing lead guitar!<BR>
<BR>
Al actually had a problem with "Amish Paradise" off "Bad Hair Day".  He<BR>
kept trying to reach Coolio for the rights, and finally got permission from<BR>
the record label.  Oops.  Coolio had said no, and an over-zealous record<BR>
exec overruled him.<BR>
<BR>
>And isn't such usage covered under the parody variety of "fair use" anyway?<BR>
<BR>
No, fair use won't cover what Al does.. he takes the entire song and its<BR>
music, and then alters them.  Fair use would be quoting a few lines from a<BR>
song in a review.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry      )+(      gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
    http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"Well, thanks to the Internet, I'm now bored with sex."<BR>
	                    - Fry, Futurama<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:28:28 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Transport Requirements<BR>
<BR>
>>So when does it hit playtest, Uncle Doug? When can we play?<BR>
>Ask Great Uncle Loren.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<bounces across to other side of porch, pokes sleeping Great Uncle<BR>
excitedly><BR>
<BR>
Unca' Loren? Unca' Loren? When does Unca' Doug's book hit playtest? I<BR>
waannaaa playyy...<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
I'll stop now, before I make anyone throw up.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 10:48:40 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
>you wrote:<BR>
> >Not only do people's hips fall off at 18, but if you're a male, odds are<BR>
> >your hair will slide down off the top of your head and settle on your back, <BR>
> >with a little of it stopping in your ears on the way down.<BR>
<BR>
> Ah HA!  There is your mistake, my editorial friend.  One bizarre side<BR>
> effect of Hodgkin's Lymphomia is that for some reason we don't get male<BR>
> pattern baldness.  So while I may be dead a fifty, <BR>
<BR>
I, and presumably the rest of the TML, hope not.<BR>
<BR>
> I'll leave a full head of hair to heirs.<BR>
<BR>
If you mean that you will pass on the genes for a full head<BR>
of hair to your heirs then I believe you are mistaken.<BR>
<BR>
The evidence indicates that male pattern baldness is carried<BR>
on the X chromosome. All of your male heirs will have<BR>
inherited your _Y_ chromosome and their mothers X chromosome.<BR>
(Half of them will have the X chromosone she got from her<BR>
mother and half of them will have the X chromosone she got<BR>
from her father). Therefore you would need to look at _her_<BR>
families history of baldness. <BR>
<BR>
Moreover even if baldness was carried on the male line your<BR>
cancer has not affected your genetic code (at least not in<BR>
the non cancerous cells). Environment and life events (such<BR>
as getting cancer) do not affect your genome, that would be <BR>
Lysenkoism. <BR>
<BR>
If you meant that when you died you would leave your full head <BR>
of hair to your heirs as part of your estate I suppose that<BR>
depends on the inheritance and mortuary laws of California <BR>
but somehow I suspect said laws do not permit your heirs to scalp<BR>
you and keep the scalp as part of the estate.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:59:37 -0500<BR>
From: "Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net><BR>
Subject: Near C Rock Bands<BR>
<BR>
the backup band for Tir Nan Og in CmrdX's "Roadshow" campaign <BR>
is an all female rock band/spokesmerc group, with a wide variety of<BR>
strange and useful talents.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:00:06 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 11:26 AM, gridlore@pop.mindspring.com<BR>
issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> The DKs are suing Jello for royalties. He suing them over their desire to<BR>
> sell "Holiday in Cambodia" for a Levi's ad. In other words, punk is dead<BR>
> and the lawyers are fighting over the corpse.<BR>
<BR>
This is terrible news, I am so bummed. I read the article and have a query<BR>
for you legal type TMLers. Here is an excerpt:<BR>
<BR>
Among those on the expert witness list is the band<BR>
Offspring's front man, Bryan "Dexter" Holland,<BR>
who will be paid $250 per hour for his testimony,<BR>
court records state.<BR>
<BR>
How can this be legal? Or is this just reimbursement for time lost paid by<BR>
the court?<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: Does the MoJ reimburse lost wages for time spent in court? I tend<BR>
towards no, but think it may depend on /who/ is involved.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 11:00:46 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Ship's Boat and Pilot Skill (was Re: Helo Pilots)<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> >But helos are Piloted by the Vehicle skill which, unlike Pilot,<BR>
> >is readily available to Traveller characters of all ranks. A<BR>
> >helo is nowhere near 100 displacement tons. I suspect that few<BR>
> >non officers get to _fly_<BR>
<BR>
Watercraft do not fly. This word establishes that I am discussing<BR>
only flight capable vehicles whether the Traveller skill to drive <BR>
them is Vehicle, Ships Boat, or Pilot.<BR>
<BR>
> 100 dt Military vehicles these days.<BR>
> >Of course we do have rather fewer 100 dt flying vehicles than <BR>
> >Traveller militaries will.<BR>
<BR>
> I guess it would be silly at this point to mention that "Ship's Boat"<BR>
> and "Pilot" skills specifically relate to spacecraft, not to the size<BR>
> of the vehicle.  <BR>
<BR>
Quite true, but most versions of Traveller establish a minimum 100 DT<BR>
size for jump capable ships. Jump capable ships use the Pilot<BR>
skill. Therefore Pilot skill consists of the ability to drive<BR>
ships only of 100 DT+. Ships boat skill does not relate to the<BR>
size of the craft (except for the 1,000,000 ton limitation) although<BR>
many (most?) people with Ships Boat skill probably have most<BR>
of their experience on craft of less than 1,000 DT's in my<BR>
perception of the official Traveller universe. YMMV.<BR>
<BR>
> My brother in the Navy knows how to drive a<BR>
> fast attack submarine and a missile sub, they're both bigger than<BR>
> 100dtns - but his skill is "Vehicle, Submersible" ("Large Submersible"?).<BR>
<BR>
In CT it would be Vehicle, Watercraft but some later versions<BR>
included Vehicle, Submersible. I'm not aware of any (save G:Trav)<BR>
that distinguished between large and small submersibles (although<BR>
said distinction is perfectly valid).<BR>
<BR>
> ISTR one TML member happily claiming the honor of being the only<BR>
> TML'er with Ship's Boat skill...apparently he'd helped build a simulator<BR>
> for some NASA spaceship, and learned how to fly it in the process. :-)<BR>
<BR>
But will his perspective employers care about his claim to<BR>
have Ships Boat skill absent an Imperial certification of <BR>
said skill? :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:36:49 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
> If you meant that when you died you would leave your full head<BR>
> of hair to your heirs as part of your estate I suppose that<BR>
> depends on the inheritance and mortuary laws of California<BR>
> but somehow I suspect said laws do not permit your heirs to scalp<BR>
> you and keep the scalp as part of the estate.<BR>
<BR>
"So we tanned his hide when he died, Clyde, and that's it hangin' on the<BR>
shed!"<BR>
<BR>
All together now...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:41:23 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
Sword Worlder wrote:<BR>
>"So we tanned his hide when he died, Clyde, and that's it hangin' on the <BR>
>shed!" <BR>
><BR>
>All together now... <BR>
<BR>
Tie me Penguin Boy, sport, tie me Penguin Boy down,<BR>
Tie me Penguin Boy, sport, tie me Penguin Boy down!<BR>
<BR>
<G><BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:44:16 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> If you meant that when you died you would leave your full head<BR>
> of hair to your heirs as part of your estate I suppose that<BR>
> depends on the inheritance and mortuary laws of California<BR>
> but somehow I suspect said laws do not permit your heirs to scalp<BR>
> you and keep the scalp as part of the estate.<BR>
<BR>
"It can only be regarded as an heirloom."  ;-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:54:47 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus  (done right)<BR>
<BR>
Sword Worlder wrote: <BR>
>"So we tanned his hide when he died, Clyde, and that's it hangin' on the <BR>
>shed!" <BR>
> <BR>
>All together now... <BR>
<BR>
Tie me Penguin Boy down, sport, tie me Penguin Boy down, <BR>
Tie me Penguin Boy down, sport, tie me Penguin Boy down! <BR>
<BR>
<G> <BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith <BR>
<BR>
  <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:01:32 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Smith, Walter <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
> Sword Worlder wrote:<BR>
> >"So we tanned his hide when he died, Clyde, and that's it hangin' on the<BR>
> >shed!"<BR>
> ><BR>
> >All together now...<BR>
><BR>
> Tie me Penguin Boy, sport, tie me Penguin Boy down,<BR>
> Tie me Penguin Boy, sport, tie me Penguin Boy down!<BR>
<BR>
ROtFLMBO!<BR>
<BR>
Blast.  Now I can't get that tune out of my head :-D<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:19:08 -0400<BR>
From: "Smith, Walter" <SmithW@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Filk - Playin' with the Traveller Book<BR>
<BR>
Playin' with the Traveller Book<BR>
(to the tune of "Under the Boardwalk, as sung by the Drifters)<BR>
<BR>
When the Far Trader lands, and the crew piles out the lock,<BR>
And I can grin and hit them with some startown culture shock,<BR>
Playin' with the Traveller Book,<BR>
Traveller, Cee Tee*..eeee...yeah,<BR>
With some tink'ring and house rules,<BR>
It's just right for me.<BR>
<BR>
In my pile I have some LBB's with the colored stripe,<BR>
A stack of sci-fi novels so I get the flavors right,<BR>
Playin' with the Traveller Book,<BR>
Traveller, Cee Tee..eeee...oh, yeah,<BR>
With some tink'ring and house rules,<BR>
It's just right for me.<BR>
<BR>
Did you buy MT?<BR>
     Just for those new task rules,<BR>
Did you buy TNE?<BR>
     I thought those vikings were cool,<BR>
Did you buy T4?<BR>
     It was the saddest one,<BR>
But will you buy more?<BR>
     As long as it's still fun,<BR>
But I use the Big Book...the Big Book!<BR>
<BR>
<Music interlude><BR>
<BR>
Playin' with the Traveller Book,<BR>
Traveller, Cee Tee..eeee...yeah,<BR>
With some tink'ring and house rules,<BR>
It's just right for me.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
Copyright 2000<BR>
<BR>
*CT = Classic Traveller<BR>
MT= MegaTraveller<BR>
TNE = Traveller, the New Era<BR>
T4 = Marc Miller's Traveller from Imperium Games<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:18:49 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Braodsword<BR>
<BR>
>If the 800-ton Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser (GT 139, deckplans<BR>
>GT:SM 68-71) is *un*streamlined, why does it have *massive* landing<BR>
>legs? Sure it could land only on airless worlds, but since those are<BR>
>usually low gravity the legs could be much smaller. Where is the<BR>
>eighth turret? I see four gunner stations on deck B, two on deck J,<BR>
>and one [maybe] on deck I. And why does a military craft (even a<BR>
>mercenary one) have only 100 DR armor and no stealth or emissions<BR>
>cloaking?<BR>
<BR>
Dunno bout the GURPS bits, but in real traveller editions, it's always been<BR>
"Partially Streamlined", in short, it can enter atmospheres, but boy,<BR>
howdy, take that descent SLOW. (Wouldn't work well in TNE...)<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:36:14 -0500<BR>
From: "Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net><BR>
Subject: Filk Fragment/Idea Cover of the T4 Book<BR>
<BR>
Not bad at all, although another filk comes to mind based on <BR>
Traveller cover art and Traveller art in general...<BR>
<BR>
anybody want to take a stab at a parody of Cover of the Rolling <BR>
Stone?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:33:10 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Filk - Playin' with the Traveller Book<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 1:19 PM, SmithW@hartwick.edu issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> In my pile I have some LBB's with the colored stripe,<BR>
> A stack of sci-fi novels so I get the flavors right,<BR>
<BR>
 Beautiful.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:37:22 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Re Braodsword<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Dunno bout the GURPS bits, but in real traveller editions, it's always been<BR>
> "Partially Streamlined", in short, it can enter atmospheres, but boy,<BR>
> howdy, take that descent SLOW. (Wouldn't work well in TNE...)<BR>
<BR>
That's basically what 'unstreamlined' means in GT.  Which doesn't account<BR>
for why merchants are streamlined, the various free and far traders would<BR>
be vastly superior designs if built unstreamlined with contragravity.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:37:28 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: Color Question<BR>
<BR>
I'm trying to decide what colors to use for the various interstellar powers<BR>
on a Traveller map I'm preparing.  I know that on the original CT alien<BR>
modules, each race had a color for it's title.  The one I have is the Vargr,<BR>
and their title is purple.<BR>
I know the Aslan were yellow.  What colors were used for the other alien<BR>
modules' titles?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:52:40<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
At 10:48 AM 4/21/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
>"Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
>> I'll leave a full head of hair to heirs.<BR>
><BR>
>If you mean that you will pass on the genes for a full head<BR>
>of hair to your heirs then I believe you are mistaken.<BR>
<BR>
nope.  I'm leaving *my* hair to someone.<BR>
<BR>
Though nobody in our family goes bals anyway.. my father had thick, black<BR>
hair almost to the day he died.<BR>
<BR>
>If you meant that when you died you would leave your full head <BR>
>of hair to your heirs as part of your estate I suppose that<BR>
>depends on the inheritance and mortuary laws of California <BR>
>but somehow I suspect said laws do not permit your heirs to scalp<BR>
>you and keep the scalp as part of the estate.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I could leave my skull to Kirsten if I wanted to.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2336<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 21 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2337<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Filk request<BR>
Re: Color Question<BR>
RE: Color Question<BR>
Re: Filk Fragment/Idea Cover of the T4 Book<BR>
Re: Color Question<BR>
RE: near-C rocks<BR>
More on Colors<BR>
On the Cover of the TNS (was Re: Filk Fragment/Idea Cover of the T4  Book)<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
RE: More on Colors<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Jump Space Jack Flash<BR>
RE: More on Colors<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: GT-Q "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich, ..."<BR>
RE: Yet Another Filk<BR>
RE: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:57:43<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
At 12:00 PM 4/21/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>How can this be legal? Or is this just reimbursement for time lost paid by<BR>
>the court?<BR>
<BR>
As long as his testimony is truthful, there is no reason why he shouldn't<BR>
be paid to provide his expert opinion.  If he had informatio relevant to<BR>
the case, he would have been subpoenaed.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:01:00<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
At 03:36 PM 4/21/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>"So we tanned his hide when he died, Clyde, and that's it hangin' on the<BR>
>shed!"<BR>
><BR>
>All together now...<BR>
<BR>
What shall we do with the body?<BR>
We can't just leave it here..<BR>
Charlie has got to go to someplace,<BR>
Have we suggestions here?<BR>
<BR>
The Freezer?<BR>
<BR>
We could put him in the freezer,<BR>
right beside the frozen peas<BR>
We could put him in the freezer,<BR>
If we cut off his knees!<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:09:44<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Filk request<BR>
<BR>
OK, I've updated the pages, and made some changes I hope people like.<BR>
<BR>
And now, a couple of requests.  If you have written a filk, and are<BR>
wondering why it isn't up yet, odds are I've just lost it.  Send me a copy.<BR>
 If I've gotten your name wrong, let me know.  If you want a mail link on<BR>
your song's page, likewise.<BR>
<BR>
In the future, if you write a song and want it put into the SD Filk page,<BR>
plese send me a copy at my home address.  That makes it much easier for me<BR>
to find the things when I revise the pages.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks!<BR>
<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/travfilk<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:13:28 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Color Question<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
> I'm trying to decide what colors to use for the various interstellar<BR>
powers<BR>
> on a Traveller map I'm preparing.  I know that on the original CT alien<BR>
> modules, each race had a color for it's title.  The one I have is the<BR>
Vargr,<BR>
> and their title is purple.<BR>
> I know the Aslan were yellow.  What colors were used for the other alien<BR>
> modules' titles?<BR>
<BR>
Okay, there are two color indicators we are working with here.  Hard to tell<BR>
if color are being associated with races, but here goes.<BR>
<BR>
Module 1, Aslan = Title is yellow/gold, stripe is medium blue<BR>
Module 2, K'kree = Title is cyan, stripe is bright red<BR>
Module 3, Vargr = Title is magenta, strip is violet<BR>
Module 4, Zhodani = Title is lt. blue, stripe is deep purple<BR>
Module 5, Droyne = Title is bright blue, stripe is paler blue<BR>
Module 6, Solomani = Title is fire red, stripe is purple<BR>
Module 7, Hivers = Title is pale blue, stripe is magenta<BR>
Module 8, Darrians = Title is red, stripe is red<BR>
<BR>
Good luck, eh?<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:21:10 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Color Question<BR>
<BR>
Hmm.  Maybe that won't be as helpful as I thought.  Awful lot of blue there.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Sword-Worlder [mailto:swordworlder@yahoo.com]<BR>
Sent: Friday, April 21, 2000 3:13 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Color Question<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
> I'm trying to decide what colors to use for the various interstellar<BR>
powers<BR>
> on a Traveller map I'm preparing.  I know that on the original CT alien<BR>
> modules, each race had a color for it's title.  The one I have is the<BR>
Vargr,<BR>
> and their title is purple.<BR>
> I know the Aslan were yellow.  What colors were used for the other alien<BR>
> modules' titles?<BR>
<BR>
Okay, there are two color indicators we are working with here.  Hard to tell<BR>
if color are being associated with races, but here goes.<BR>
<BR>
Module 1, Aslan = Title is yellow/gold, stripe is medium blue<BR>
Module 2, K'kree = Title is cyan, stripe is bright red<BR>
Module 3, Vargr = Title is magenta, strip is violet<BR>
Module 4, Zhodani = Title is lt. blue, stripe is deep purple<BR>
Module 5, Droyne = Title is bright blue, stripe is paler blue<BR>
Module 6, Solomani = Title is fire red, stripe is purple<BR>
Module 7, Hivers = Title is pale blue, stripe is magenta<BR>
Module 8, Darrians = Title is red, stripe is red<BR>
<BR>
Good luck, eh?<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:22:43<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Filk Fragment/Idea Cover of the T4 Book<BR>
<BR>
At 03:36 PM 4/21/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>anybody want to take a stab at a parody of Cover of the Rolling <BR>
>Stone?<BR>
<BR>
Since I have no shame, I start work tonight...<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:50:19 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Color Question<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 2:13 PM, swordworlder@yahoo.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Okay, there are two color indicators we are working with here.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, that gives more room for variation, Thanks for indicating which<BR>
color was title and which was stripe, that helps dertermine what might be<BR>
primary vs. secondary. I didn't ask the question, but I'm flagging the<BR>
answer! ;)<BR>
<BR>
On another topic, I've been cross reffing "The Imperial Fringe" UWP's and<BR>
Galactic data (sent to me offlist) and have found two discrepencies, both in<BR>
hydrographics, both a drop in Galactics data from 1 to 0. Quopist and<BR>
D'Ganzio. Just curious if anyone can verify it as errata, error, or<BR>
historical change or what-not. And I am thinking about dropping out the<BR>
highlight colors on the map to afford more slots for /other/ colors while<BR>
still leaving it at sixteen colors. I have extracted the legend off the map<BR>
and done this change to see what it would look like, and am somewhat<BR>
conflicted. It /does/ give me the option of more grays, and I kind of like<BR>
the Amber Zone. But it does look flatter, mostly with the red. Oh, and while<BR>
I was fiddling with that, I dropped in a couple meters for population and<BR>
tech level, shown at full. Actual height would depend on UWP. The TL meter<BR>
shows off the greater range of grey allowed, and the world icons were<BR>
changed. Feedback?<BR>
<BR>
Legend --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/LegendAlt.GIF<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:03:02 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
>I didn't mean to cause any pain honest. If it helps any I know what your<BR>
>talking about. I got into an argument with a 15 y.o. the other day about<BR>
>punk rock.<BR>
>He kept saying I didn't know what punk music was about.<BR>
<BR>
It's certainly possible that you don't. I do mean that *mostly* in jest, so<BR>
please don't take offense. :)<BR>
<BR>
What I mean is that what is called punk now is quite different from what was<BR>
called punk just five or six years ago, let alone what was called punk<BR>
twenty years ago. The name's the same, but the movement *is* different.<BR>
<BR>
> And yet he'd never heard of the Sex Pistols, or the Clash, or the Ramones<BR>
> (not sure if I spelled that correctly) or even Blondie.<BR>
<BR>
It's not necessary. He's living, breathing and making googly eyes today, not<BR>
twenty years ago. Knowledge of those bands is no longer important, at least<BR>
from inside today's punk looking out. This is why I said my comment above<BR>
was *mostly* in jest.<BR>
<BR>
To put it another way, one does not have to have knowledge of The Clash, The<BR>
Ramones or any one of the thousands of punk bands which have come before in<BR>
order to listen to and exist within a modern youth movement. This is what's<BR>
also known as "the generation gap". :)<BR>
<BR>
>It was like trying to argue about landscape paintings<BR>
>with someone who was born blind.<BR>
<BR>
It sounds more like trying to argue the finer points of French Neo-Classical<BR>
painting with a German Expressionist to me. You'd be talking at each other<BR>
from entirely different positions. :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:10:00 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
What does the TML think on establishing some standard colors for maps<BR>
(primarily for political powers)?  <BR>
<BR>
There are some obvious beginning choices:<BR>
<BR>
Third Imperium is Red.<BR>
Zhodani Consulate is Blue.<BR>
Aslan Hierate is Yellow.<BR>
<BR>
I would suggest shades of Purple (Violet) for the various Vargr states, and<BR>
Green for the K'Kree.  How about a light brown or orange for the Hivers?  <BR>
I'm not sure what color to use for the Solomani, though.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 14:25:32 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: On the Cover of the TNS (was Re: Filk Fragment/Idea Cover of the T4  Book)<BR>
<BR>
"Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Not bad at all, although another filk comes to mind based on <BR>
> Traveller cover art and Traveller art in general...<BR>
> anybody want to take a stab at a parody of Cover of the Rolling <BR>
> Stone?<BR>
<BR>
It's not cover art related but how about:<BR>
<BR>
On the Cover of TNS<BR>
by Peter Newman<BR>
A parody of Cover of the Rolling Stone<BR>
by Dr. Hook<BR>
from	http://gunther.simplenet.com/v/data/onthecov.htm<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Well we are big rock singers, we've got iridium fingers<BR>
And we're loved everywhere we go<BR>
We sing about beauty and we sing about truth<BR>
At ten Mega credits a show<BR>
We take all kind of pills to give us all kind of thrills<BR>
But the thrill that says success<BR>
Is the thrill that'll get you when you get your holo<BR>
On the cover of the TNS<BR>
<BR>
{Refrain}<BR>
TNS<BR>
    Wanna see my holo on the cover<BR>
TNS<BR>
    Wanna buy five copies for my mother<BR>
TNS<BR>
    Wanna see my smilin' face<BR>
    On the cover of the TNS<BR>
<BR>
I've got a freaky lady name o' Scout Brew Katy<BR>
Who'll tie me in a knot<BR>
I've got my poor old gray-haired Daddy<BR>
Pilotin' my fancy Yacht<BR>
Now it's all designed to free our minds<BR>
But our minds won't be free unless<BR>
We feel the freedom you get when you get your holo<BR>
On the cover of the TNS<BR>
<BR>
{Refrain}<BR>
<BR>
We got a lot of little blue-eyed, zero term, groupies<BR>
Who do anything we say<BR>
We got a genuine Zhodani guru<BR>
Who's teachin' us a better way<BR>
We got all the friends that credits can buy<BR>
So we never have to do with less<BR>
And we keep gettin' richer but we can't get our picture<BR>
On the cover of the TNS<BR>
<BR>
{Refrain}<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:46:03 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 3:10 PM, JasonP@i-link.net issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Third Imperium is Red.<BR>
<BR>
Ack! ;) OK, but I sort of like yellow/gold, however I see this clashes with<BR>
your Aslan choice.<BR>
<BR>
> Zhodani Consulate is Blue.<BR>
<BR>
No Prob, I vot for blue Zoddies too.<BR>
<BR>
> Aslan Hierate is Yellow.<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm. Besides wanting this for the Imperium, I guess I'll suggest orange.<BR>
<BR>
> I would suggest shades of Purple (Violet) for the various Vargr states,<BR>
<BR>
No contest here.<BR>
<BR>
> Green for the K'Kree.<BR>
<BR>
Sounds logical.<BR>
<BR>
>How about a light brown or orange for the Hivers?<BR>
<BR>
Shall we say tan?<BR>
<BR>
> I'm not sure what color to use for the Solomani, though.<BR>
<BR>
Black like their uniforms! Oh, space is black, we need to /see/ the rascals.<BR>
Grey? Cyan? Turquoise? Magenta? I don't know. ;)<BR>
<BR>
Legend --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/LegendAlt.GIF<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:02:35 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
Red for the Imperium and Blue for the Zhodani because those are the colors<BR>
that are on the Spinward Marches map.<BR>
A yellow-orange (amber?) would certainly work for the Aslan.<BR>
Tan is good for the Hiver.<BR>
Gray would work for the Solomani, but it's not very colorful on a black<BR>
background.  Cyan might be the way to go, but I'm thinking mostly primary<BR>
colors for major races.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella [mailto:xrp@sierratel.com]<BR>
Sent: Friday, April 21, 2000 4:46 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 3:10 PM, JasonP@i-link.net issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Third Imperium is Red.<BR>
<BR>
Ack! ;) OK, but I sort of like yellow/gold, however I see this clashes with<BR>
your Aslan choice.<BR>
<BR>
> Zhodani Consulate is Blue.<BR>
<BR>
No Prob, I vot for blue Zoddies too.<BR>
<BR>
> Aslan Hierate is Yellow.<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm. Besides wanting this for the Imperium, I guess I'll suggest orange.<BR>
<BR>
> I would suggest shades of Purple (Violet) for the various Vargr states,<BR>
<BR>
No contest here.<BR>
<BR>
> Green for the K'Kree.<BR>
<BR>
Sounds logical.<BR>
<BR>
>How about a light brown or orange for the Hivers?<BR>
<BR>
Shall we say tan?<BR>
<BR>
> I'm not sure what color to use for the Solomani, though.<BR>
<BR>
Black like their uniforms! Oh, space is black, we need to /see/ the rascals.<BR>
Grey? Cyan? Turquoise? Magenta? I don't know. ;)<BR>
<BR>
Legend --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/LegendAlt.GIF<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:06:56 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Red for the Imperium and Blue for the Zhodani because those are the colors<BR>
> that are on the Spinward Marches map.<BR>
> A yellow-orange (amber?) would certainly work for the Aslan.<BR>
> Tan is good for the Hiver.<BR>
> Gray would work for the Solomani, but it's not very colorful on a black<BR>
> background.  Cyan might be the way to go, but I'm thinking mostly primary<BR>
> colors for major races.<BR>
<BR>
I'd go with green for the Solomani (as in "The Green Hills of Earth").<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 15:06:57 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Jump Space Jack Flash<BR>
<BR>
Jump Space Jack Flash<BR>
<BR>
by Peter Newman<BR>
a parody of Jumping Jack Flash<BR>
by the Rolling Stones<BR>
from	http://pages.map.com/~freek/rstones.html<BR>
<BR>
Everybody seems to be ready, everybody ready<BR>
We're not sorry for the delay<BR>
The greatest rock and roll band in the Extents<BR>
The Howling Stones!<BR>
<BR>
(Watch it!)<BR>
I was born in a Jump Space hurricane<BR>
And I howled at my dam in the driving rain<BR>
But it's all right now, in fact, it's a gas<BR>
But it's all right<BR>
I'm Jump Space Jack Flash, it's a gas! Gas! Gas!<BR>
<BR>
I was raised by a toothless, tawny hag<BR>
I was schooled with a claw right across my back<BR>
But it's all right now, in fact, it's a gas<BR>
But it's all right<BR>
I'm Jump Space Jack Flash, it's a gas! Gas! Gas!<BR>
<BR>
I was spaced, I was thrown free and left for dead<BR>
I fell down to my paws and I licked my coat, yeah<BR>
I snarled at the crumbs of a bit of groat<BR>
Yeah, I was crowned with a spike right through my head<BR>
But it's all right now, in fact, it's a gas<BR>
But it's all right<BR>
I'm Jump Space Jack Flash, it's a gas! Gas! Gas!<BR>
<BR>
Oh yeah. Thank you kindly<BR>
I think I busted a button on my trousers<BR>
hope they don't fall down.<BR>
You don't want my trousers to fall down, now do ya?<BR>
<BR>
From a live performance on  309- 1111 at Aramanx/Aramis<BR>
by the Howling Stones, one of the first big crossover <BR>
Gvegh/Galanglic bands to became popular Behind the Claw<BR>
as part of the post Fifth Frontier War Vargr (musical) Invasion.<BR>
<BR>
Jump Space Jack Flash is believed to be a semi autobiographical<BR>
account of lead singer Nikh Gaegher's early life. Gaegher,<BR>
was born in jump space during a misjump following his parents, <BR>
who crewed a Sourz fighter, unfriendly breakup with (and hasty <BR>
escape in a 'borrowed' ship from) their associates in the <BR>
Voukae Gangfouz Aeghzaenrras Corsair group. Among the residents<BR>
of Aetskaekhoun/Gvurrdon where Gaegher was raised birth<BR>
during a misjump is believed to be unlucky, consequently<BR>
Nikh and his littermates (none of whom survived cubhood) were<BR>
bullied by the other pups. To survive Nikh developed his<BR>
formitable Charisma. Following his expulsion from the<BR>
Gvurrdon School of Economics Gaegher is believed to have<BR>
served briefly as a Corsair before becomeing an Entertainer.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:09:28 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
Hmm.  I had green picked out for the K'Kree (being vegetarians and all).<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Black ICE [mailto:wombat@premier.net]<BR>
Sent: Friday, April 21, 2000 5:07 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Red for the Imperium and Blue for the Zhodani because those are the colors<BR>
> that are on the Spinward Marches map.<BR>
> A yellow-orange (amber?) would certainly work for the Aslan.<BR>
> Tan is good for the Hiver.<BR>
> Gray would work for the Solomani, but it's not very colorful on a black<BR>
> background.  Cyan might be the way to go, but I'm thinking mostly primary<BR>
> colors for major races.<BR>
<BR>
I'd go with green for the Solomani (as in "The Green Hills of Earth").<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:08:20 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
>> you and keep the scalp as part of the estate.<BR>
>"It can only be regarded as an heirloom."  ;-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Surely an hairloom is the tool which would be used to preserve the hair in<BR>
an easily portable format for the deceased's estate?<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
I only just noticed the THUDDD deadline was 12th MAY. So I submitted a ship<BR>
a month ahead of schedule, dammit.<BR>
I may end up designing a second submission yet...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:35:53 -0700<BR>
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
<BR>
At 1:02 AM +0200 4/13/00, Hans Rancke-Madsen wrote:<BR>
>I forget where it says so, but IIRC _FT_ gives the GM the option to just<BR>
>give the PCs a ship and be done with it. Personally I consider that the<BR>
>only fair way to do it. Why should one person be burdened with the cost<BR>
>of a ship that is essential for the campaign?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
It sounds to me like the ship is an option the player is taking,<BR>
not a premise of the campaign....<BR>
<BR>
______________________________<BR>
summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>
(This is the net.  My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:36:24 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
And you can give the flippin' Fairies pink to go with their pointed ears!<BR>
<BR>
But be sure to save bronze for the Swords!<BR>
<BR>
(I still don't know how those imp-loving elves rated their own sourcebook,<BR>
phooey)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
> Hmm.  I had green picked out for the K'Kree (being vegetarians and all).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:39:24 -0700<BR>
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich"<BR>
<BR>
At 4:33 AM +0200 4/13/00, Hans Rancke-Madsen wrote:<BR>
>  >On the other hand, if the character who owns the ship can give the PCs<BR>
>  >orders or can direct the direction of the campaign by being the final word<BR>
>  >on where his ship goes, it might be worth some points.  It's a definite<BR>
>  >advantage in those cases.<BR>
<BR>
>Sure, IF he can and, more importantly, IF he's actually going to do it. But<BR>
>how many player groups have you known where the nominal superior is at best<BR>
>the tie-breaker? And that only if the player who plays the superior happens<BR>
>to be the dominant player in the group.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I've seen it a number of times, and not just where the player is naturally<BR>
dominant.  The idea that the owner of a ship simply won't take it <BR>
where he doesn't want to go has often been a significant advantage.<BR>
<BR>
In this case, the player is also hoping for the advantage of gaining<BR>
income from the ship (and may have more freedom to get where<BR>
he wants to, be able to leave a planet quickly with less fuss, etc.)<BR>
<BR>
______________________________<BR>
summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>
(This is the net.  My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:42:31 -0700<BR>
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: "I used to be filthy rich, ..."<BR>
<BR>
At 9:46 PM -0500 4/11/00, Black ICE wrote:<BR>
>Try this one out for size:<BR>
><BR>
>The PC has the ship as a Ship Patron (see GT 1st edition pgs. 84-85),<BR>
>with an additional 5-point Advantage: Cannot be Revoked.  That way, the<BR>
>PC can't _sell_ the ship (title reverts to the family), but the PC has<BR>
>lifetime use of the ship.<BR>
<BR>
The premise of the Ship Patron is that, for some reason, the ship<BR>
is not the players to sell or dispose of.  (It is mortaged, it<BR>
is on loan, etc.)  If the PC has a some sort of permanent loan<BR>
but the ship would revert to the family if he sold it, then it<BR>
would fit.<BR>
<BR>
______________________________<BR>
summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>
(This is the net.  My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:52:29 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
Stormhound wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>    You beat me to it...that's just the example I was going to bring up.<BR>
>Courts in the US ruled several years ago that such use was okay (I don't<BR>
>recall all the specifics, particularly of what crediting was required).<BR>
>"Weird" Al does ask permission (and almost always gets it, with one notable<BR>
>exception), but he does that out of politeness, not requirement.<BR>
<BR>
No. When somebody writes a song, they own the copyright. When somebody<BR>
records a song that someone else wrote, they have to get permission from the<BR>
copyright holder. In the U.S. most performers sign the rights to their songs<BR>
over to a music publishing company, for a number of reasons. Music<BR>
publishing companies will almost always give permission to performers to<BR>
record a song they own, since they make money in the process.<BR>
<BR>
"Weird Al", *without exception*, has gotten permission from the copyright<BR>
holders to record *every* song parody he has recorded. This is not<BR>
politeness, this is the law. If he didn't do this, it would be copyright<BR>
infringement, plain and simple. "Weird Al", with only one exception, has<BR>
gotten permission from the songwriter. This is politeness, he is not<BR>
required to do this unless the songwriter actually owns the copyright to the<BR>
song, which is an extremely rare situation in the music business.<BR>
<BR>
Basically, the "Coolio situation" was this: Yankovic's people got permission<BR>
from the music publisher who owned the copyright to the song he parodied.<BR>
Yankovic's people did not get "permission" from Coolio. This didn't matter,<BR>
because Coolio does not own the copyright to the song which was parodied.<BR>
This is why nobody got sued.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 11:52:02 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Chris Seamans<BR>
<BR>
> What I mean is that what is called punk now is quite different<BR>
> from what was<BR>
> called punk just five or six years ago, let alone what was called punk<BR>
> twenty years ago. The name's the same, but the movement *is* different.<BR>
><BR>
> > And yet he'd never heard of the Sex Pistols, or the Clash, or<BR>
> > the Ramones (not sure if I spelled that correctly) or even Blondie.<BR>
><BR>
> It's not necessary. He's living, breathing and making googly eyes<BR>
> today, not twenty years ago. Knowledge of those bands is no longer<BR>
> important, at least from inside today's punk looking out.<BR>
<BR>
Er, Chris, that's only if you accept that "today's punks" have the right to<BR>
usurp the name "punk" from punks of twenty years ago, many of whom are still<BR>
out there, still pogoing to<BR>
one note songs.<BR>
<BR>
You have to remember that punk is just another of the go-gang-like fads from<BR>
England, following on from the rockers and the mods, and that<BR>
inter-music-style violence was the whole point for many of it's adherents.<BR>
Punk caught on because it fit with the soccer-violence, National Front<BR>
crowd, and gave yet another outlet for aggression ( which would have been<BR>
better directed at the State, but that's a whole 'nother story)<BR>
<BR>
There are many in the UK still in that scene.<BR>
<BR>
Me, I'm disgusted at what the US called "punk", looked more like glam-rock<BR>
to those of us  from the UK.<BR>
<grin><BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
(Who used to pogo to disco music just to piss both sides off)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:51:39 -0700<BR>
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
>Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 3:10 PM, JasonP@i-link.net issued forth:<BR>
><BR>
>  > Third Imperium is Red.<BR>
><BR>
>Ack! ;) OK, but I sort of like yellow/gold, however I see this clashes with<BR>
>your Aslan choice.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
This imperium should be yellow (their symbol is a the starburst<BR>
after all).<BR>
<BR>
Then you have red available for the Vargr who I can't really<BR>
see using another color.<BR>
<BR>
>  > Aslan Hierate is Yellow.<BR>
><BR>
>Hmmm. Besides wanting this for the Imperium, I guess I'll suggest orange.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Or purple.  The color of "honor" (in a way).<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>  > I would suggest shades of Purple (Violet) for the various Vargr states,<BR>
><BR>
>No contest here.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Red.  I say Red....<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>  > Green for the K'Kree.<BR>
><BR>
>Sounds logical.<BR>
<BR>
I like green for Solomani (Earth and all that).<BR>
<BR>
______________________________<BR>
summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>
(This is the net.  My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2337<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2338</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 22 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2338<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
monospace (was Re: Lanth Region)<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2332<BR>
Re: Re Drivers<BR>
Re: Re Braodsword<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: Ammendment<BR>
RE: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: Full Thrust Site<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: near-c rocks<BR>
Bruce Macintosh's Military Combat System<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
Re: Re Braodsword<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: Monospaced?<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
RE: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:57:26 EDT<BR>
From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>
Subject: monospace (was Re: Lanth Region)<BR>
<BR>
"Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
<BR>
>> I just checked. You have to use Wordpad, not notepad (under Win 95,<BR>
>> notepad uses the default desktop font). Wordpad, on my rather minimal<BR>
>> setup has "modem" available as a font, which is a non-proportional font.<BR>
><BR>
>Well, I'm on a Mac, and when I said "notepad" I should have said BBEdit<BR>
>document. I have what looks like a pulldown menu at the top of the message<BR>
>window, but it is greyed out. I can change the /color/ of the text just<BR>
>fine! ;)<BR>
<BR>
 The default monospace fonts on a Mac are Monaco and Courier. There are also <BR>
plenty of others out there.<BR>
<BR>
 While it is a bit limiting for other word processing, I've found the <BR>
shareware program SaintEdit to be near perfect for email purposes. Its <BR>
default is monospace, and it just doesn't do any of that style stuff, so you <BR>
don't have the temptation to bombard the list with HTML-ized mail. Its only <BR>
real weakness is its lack of spell-checking...<BR>
<BR>
GC<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:59:05 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
IIRC, in Fifth Frontier War the Imperium was Red, the Zhodani were Blue, the<BR>
Vargr were Orange and the Sword Worlds were Green.<BR>
For the Imperium and Zhodani, central forces had Black print and colonial<BR>
forces had White. Imperial Marines were Red or Scarlet on White. Zhodani<BR>
Consular Guard were Black on Light Blue. Imperial Mercenaries were White on<BR>
Orange. Sword Worlds and Vargr were both Black print.<BR>
I never bought Invasion Earth and only played it once and don't remember the<BR>
Solomani colors.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:43:08 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 10:20 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
> forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> I just checked. You have to use Wordpad, not notepad (under Win 95,<BR>
>> notepad uses the default desktop font). Wordpad, on my rather minimal<BR>
>> setup has "modem" available as a font, which is a non-proportional font.<BR>
><BR>
> Well, I'm on a Mac, and when I said "notepad" I should have said BBEdit<BR>
> document. I have what looks like a pulldown menu at the top of the message<BR>
> window, but it is greyed out. I can change the /color/ of the text just<BR>
> fine! ;) As you can probably tell by now, computers are not my forte'. So<BR>
> all you TMLers who are without webpages take note, as I am quite<BR>
> computer-illiterate, and have found that html isn't all /that/ hard. Try it<BR>
> out, you'll likely get hooked!<BR>
<BR>
Sounds like you need to try something simpler, like TeachText. (Yes,<BR>
I've branched out into Macs, but I'm just a Novice).<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:55:29 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 07:05 PM 4/20/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>Not only do people's hips fall off at 18, but if you're a male, odds are<BR>
>>your hair will slide down off the top of your head and settle on your back, <BR>
>>with a little of it stopping in your ears on the way down.<BR>
><BR>
> Ah HA!  There is your mistake, my editorial friend.  One bizarre side<BR>
> effect of Hodgkin's Lymphomia is that for some reason we don't get male<BR>
> pattern baldness.  So while I may be dead a fifty, I'll leave a full head<BR>
> of hair to heirs.<BR>
<BR>
Male baldness is merely a symptom of advanced testosterone poisoning<BR>
(Really!) <BR>
<BR>
So either you have a higher resistance to the toxin, or, more likely,<BR>
you are producing less of it. :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:01:59 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2332<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> In a message dated 00-04-20 13:21:16 EDT, you write:<BR>
><BR>
> << > Loren is Judge Dredd?!<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Can't be he don't look that good in leather spandex....<BR>
>   >><BR>
><BR>
> Hang on . . . I'll be AFK for a bit ...<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> Yeah, you're right. <BR>
<BR>
(Psst...Loren... This PI "friend" happened to be hanging around when<BR>
you did that. How much are you willing to pay for the negatives? :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:52:49 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re Drivers<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>Are/were military blimp pilots typically officers?<BR>
><BR>
> USS Acron was helmed by a rating (NCO), but commanded by a Lt. Commander.<BR>
> Ditto her sister ship.<BR>
<BR>
Minor nit-pick... USS Akron (like "Akron, Ohio")<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:06:30 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Re Braodsword<BR>
<BR>
I always thought partially streamlined in CT meant landing only on planets<BR>
with Atmosphere 0 or 1? In MT, streamlining was likewise required for any<BR>
atmosphere above those. In CT, the Broadsword is partially streamlined, in<BR>
MT it is unstreamlined. Either way, it shouldn't have been landing on<BR>
Garda-Vilis in Adventure 8.<BR>
(I never went for TNE and I'd have to dig for me T4 stuff to see if it is<BR>
different in those.)<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:15:58 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 4:51 PM, summers@alum.mit.edu issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> This imperium should be yellow (their symbol is a the starburst<BR>
> after all).<BR>
<BR>
That was my reasoning.<BR>
<BR>
> Then you have red available for the Vargr who I can't really<BR>
> see using another color.<BR>
<BR>
Not even brown? I think brown is a good Doggie color. ;)<BR>
<BR>
Of course it would be nuts to try to assign a separate color to each<BR>
faction.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:17:44 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 4:52 PM, frankie@mundens.gen.nz issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Frankie<BR>
> (Who used to pogo to disco music just to piss both sides off)<BR>
<BR>
That is /so/ punk, it's uberpunk. ;)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:20:23 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> ><BR>
> > Ah HA!  There is your mistake, my editorial friend.  One bizarre side<BR>
> > effect of Hodgkin's Lymphomia is that for some reason we don't get male<BR>
> > pattern baldness.  So while I may be dead a fifty, I'll leave a full head<BR>
> > of hair to heirs.<BR>
> <BR>
> Male baldness is merely a symptom of advanced testosterone poisoning<BR>
> (Really!)<BR>
> <BR>
> So either you have a higher resistance to the toxin, or, more likely,<BR>
> you are producing less of it. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Remember, Doug's a paratrooper.  Therefore, he has better uses for his<BR>
testosterone than killing hair follicles.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:24:55 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 5:43 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Sounds like you need to try something simpler, like TeachText. (Yes,<BR>
> I've branched out into Macs, but I'm just a Novice).<BR>
<BR>
I have no problem changing fonts in BBEdit, it's IE by microstuff that did<BR>
that to the table. It looked fine in BBEdit.<BR>
<BR>
Legend --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/LegendAlt.GIF<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:29:54 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu> wrote<BR>
 <BR>
> The imperium should be yellow (their symbol is a the starburst<BR>
> after all).<BR>
<BR>
Yes but since most of the stars in the Imperium are class <BR>
M (which are red) then using this logic they should be red.<BR>
<BR>
If the Imperium is red, which was the color the US Military<BR>
used for Soviet units, does this mean that the Imperium<BR>
is the bad guys? After all Traveller was written in the <BR>
cold war era.<BR>
<BR>
Remember you can use the same color for more than one<BR>
race/nation as long as their units would not normally<BR>
touch.<BR>
<BR>
The five color theorem says that five colors should be<BR>
enough for any flat map. Maybe you should just pick<BR>
five colors and then assign them as needed. On the other <BR>
hand the Spinward Marches map in the MT box has six colors<BR>
so maybe we should use those six colors:<BR>
Blue, Red, Orange, Brown, Green, and Purple. <BR>
<BR>
Blue for the Imperium<BR>
Red for the Zhodani<BR>
Orange for the Darrians<BR>
Brown for the Sword Worlds<BR>
Green for the Federation of Arden<BR>
Purple for the Border Worlds<BR>
<BR>
On any non Spinward Marches maps we simply recycle the<BR>
colors for other polity's.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 17:35:02 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Ammendment<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 5:24 PM, xrp@sierratel.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> IE by microstuff<BR>
<BR>
I mean Outlook Express.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:40:51 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
Frank Pitt wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Er, Chris, that's only if you accept that "today's punks" have the right to<BR>
>usurp the name "punk" from punks of twenty years ago, many of whom are<BR>
still<BR>
>out there, still pogoing to<BR>
>one note songs.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I don't really care whether people who are living as they were 20<BR>
years ago - despite the changing social environment of the world of the late<BR>
20th century - believe that today's kids have the "right" to do anything. :)<BR>
<BR>
My point was simple: definitions of words, especially in the arena of<BR>
popular culture, change from month to month. To assume that a word means the<BR>
same thing today as it did 20 years ago is to neglect this simple fact. Even<BR>
the term "rock & roll", or simply "rock", has changed significantly. Buddy<BR>
Holly, Elvis, The Clash and The Doors have little in common... but they have<BR>
all been referred to as rock & roll at one point or another.<BR>
<BR>
To tie this back to Traveller:<BR>
<BR>
The speed at which terminology changes is astonishing, and how the<BR>
definitions are applied in different places varies widely. Twelve years ago,<BR>
what was called "techno" in Germany was called "industrial" in the U.S. What<BR>
was called "industrial" in the U.S. 12 years ago is nothing like the music<BR>
which is called "industrial" in 1994, which in turn is nothing like the<BR>
music which would be called "industrial" today. What was called punk in the<BR>
U.S. just six or seven years ago is quite different from what folks call<BR>
punk today. The same thing with labels like "metal", "rock", "rap", even<BR>
"jazz" and "blues". Of course, there are more implications here than simply<BR>
different labels: internal slang is wildly different, so are dances.<BR>
Sensibilities and underlying philosophies change as well. In 1965, in San<BR>
Francisco, a hippie was a disenfranchised college-age intellectual. In 1967,<BR>
in Philadelphia, a hippie was a long haired outcast. In 1968, across the<BR>
U.S., it was used to describe members of a mass movement in fashion and<BR>
popular culture.<BR>
<BR>
Things like this would certainly a huge problem for those in the<BR>
interstellar community. Those jumps are only seven days a piece, but they<BR>
*really* add up. To be a "gabbie" on Regina in 1011 might mean that you like<BR>
a certain style of music. To be a "gabbie" on Regina and 1013 might imply<BR>
that you have a level of identification with the Ine Givar.<BR>
<BR>
This would be hard to game, but could be fun.<BR>
<BR>
"Excuse me sir, could you step over here for a moment?"<BR>
"Sure. What's the problem?"<BR>
"You're in possession of a mohawk. I'm afraid we're going to have to take<BR>
you in."<BR>
<BR>
>Me, I'm disgusted at what the US called "punk", looked more like glam-rock<BR>
>to those of us  from the UK.<BR>
><grin><BR>
<BR>
Personally, I'm disgusted by all the guitarists the UK keeps sending over<BR>
here in the guise of "blues" musicians. <grinning broadly, ducking low and<BR>
running away fast><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:05:36 -0700<BR>
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
At 5:15 PM -0700 4/21/00, Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
>  > Then you have red available for the Vargr who I can't really<BR>
>  > see using another color.<BR>
><BR>
>Not even brown? I think brown is a good Doggie color. ;)<BR>
<BR>
Doggie!  You "anti-Vargr human scum"!  :-)<BR>
<BR>
______________________________<BR>
summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>
(This is the net.  My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:16:18 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Full Thrust Site<BR>
<BR>
I found a Full Thrust Site while browsing the web (on a totally different<BR>
search;)) and I know their are players of the game all over the TML. Has<BR>
rules for Star Wars, very nice layout. Here it is:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.bifrost.demon.co.uk/games/ft/index.html<BR>
<BR>
Legend --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/LegendAlt.GIF<BR>
 J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
 BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 18:19:59 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 6:05 PM, summers@alum.mit.edu issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
>> Not even brown? I think brown is a good Doggie color. ;)<BR>
> <BR>
> Doggie!  You "anti-Vargr human scum"!  :-)<BR>
<BR>
;)<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I like doggies more than I like skinmonkeys. Doggies be good<BR>
folks, and I have rarely met one I could not get along with. Never played a<BR>
Vargr, I should sometime.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 21:43:06 EDT<BR>
From: GaryBartz@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: near-c rocks<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/21/00 7:55:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< As long as his testimony is truthful, there is no reason why he shouldn't<BR>
 be paid to provide his expert opinion.  If he had informatio relevant to<BR>
 the case, he would have been subpoenaed. >><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
He is paid by the party for whom he is the expert. Experts fall into two <BR>
categories, the ones you consult with but do not use their stuff, that is <BR>
just a consult between the party and them and is not discoverable. <BR>
The other kind you have to turn over lots of stuff, like their reports and <BR>
findings and exactly what they plan on saying in court.<BR>
They are not part of the case, they are brought in for their knowledge of the <BR>
subject matter, and they get paid by the party who hired them. <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 21:50:22 EDT<BR>
From: Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Bruce Macintosh's Military Combat System<BR>
<BR>
Where can I get a copy of MCS?  I've looked on dozens of Trav WWW sites, <BR>
but no luck.  Is it a book for sale or a downloadable file (if so, is it <BR>
in ASCII, HTML, or PDF format)?  <BR>
<BR>
Does anyone have Mr. Macintosh's email address, so I can contact him?<BR>
<BR>
Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 22:17:50 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
> If the Imperium is red, which was the color the US Military<BR>
> used for Soviet units, does this mean that the Imperium<BR>
> is the bad guys? After all Traveller was written in the <BR>
> cold war era.<BR>
<BR>
This reminds me... I was planning to run a few CT adventures in <BR>
NYC and spoke to a potential player about it.  He said he felt <BR>
uncomfortable playing Traveller because the Imperium was <BR>
"a lot like Nazi Germany." Perplexed I asked him to explain, <BR>
and he observed it was the *Third* Imperium (like the 3rd <BR>
Reich, get it?) and it lasted for a thousand years<BR>
(like the Thousand-Year Reich, wink wink nudge nudge).<BR>
<BR>
Understand I'm not at all convinced by this argument, <BR>
which reminds me of old Woody Allen routines, but <BR>
I *would* like to recruit the player. So how can I respond <BR>
without a bitch-slap and a "get real"?<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:24:16 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
>> <BR>
> <<snip>><BR>
>> ><BR>
>> > Ah HA!  There is your mistake, my editorial friend.  One bizarre side<BR>
>> > effect of Hodgkin's Lymphomia is that for some reason we don't get male<BR>
>> > pattern baldness.  So while I may be dead a fifty, I'll leave a full head<BR>
>> > of hair to heirs.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Male baldness is merely a symptom of advanced testosterone poisoning<BR>
>> (Really!)<BR>
>> <BR>
>> So either you have a higher resistance to the toxin, or, more likely,<BR>
>> you are producing less of it. :-)<BR>
><BR>
> Remember, Doug's a paratrooper.  Therefore, he has better uses for his<BR>
> testosterone than killing hair follicles.<BR>
<BR>
Paratroopers don't *need* testosterone! <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:25:53 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 5:43 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
> forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> Sounds like you need to try something simpler, like TeachText. (Yes,<BR>
>> I've branched out into Macs, but I'm just a Novice).<BR>
><BR>
> I have no problem changing fonts in BBEdit, it's IE by microstuff that did<BR>
> that to the table. It looked fine in BBEdit.<BR>
<BR>
Sure, but you are missing the point. All IE did was post the<BR>
*characters* you used. In a *fixed pitch* font. I'm not even sure if<BR>
the Mac *has* any such as a default. Mainly because I seem to recall<BR>
Z-Term having to *install* one...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:31:20 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Stormhound wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>    You beat me to it...that's just the example I was going to bring up.<BR>
>>Courts in the US ruled several years ago that such use was okay (I don't<BR>
>>recall all the specifics, particularly of what crediting was required).<BR>
>>"Weird" Al does ask permission (and almost always gets it, with one notable<BR>
>>exception), but he does that out of politeness, not requirement.<BR>
><BR>
> No. When somebody writes a song, they own the copyright. When somebody<BR>
> records a song that someone else wrote, they have to get permission from the<BR>
> copyright holder.<BR>
<BR>
Nope. Permission is *automatic* (look up "mechanical license") with a<BR>
fixed royalty. <BR>
<BR>
> "Weird Al", *without exception*, has gotten permission from the copyright<BR>
> holders to record *every* song parody he has recorded. This is not<BR>
> politeness, this is the law. If he didn't do this, it would be copyright<BR>
> infringement, plain and simple. "Weird Al", with only one exception, has<BR>
> gotten permission from the songwriter. This is politeness, he is not<BR>
> required to do this unless the songwriter actually owns the copyright to the<BR>
> song, which is an extremely rare situation in the music business.<BR>
<BR>
Weird Al has gotten permission because you need the copyright holder's<BR>
permission to record a *derivative* work (that is, a work based on<BR>
anotherr work, in this case, a work that wouldn't make much sense if<BR>
the original work didn't exist).<BR>
<BR>
*However*, the courts *have* ruled that fair use *does* cover parodying<BR>
the song itself. The case revolved around a parody of "pretty woman".<BR>
Note that even so, you have to pay the standard royalty for the *tune*.<BR>
<BR>
Most of the stuff here would *not* qualify as that sort of parody. But<BR>
*would* fall under "derivative work", and thus require permission TO<BR>
RECORD. <BR>
<BR>
You see, there's an *old* case involving Mad magazine that ruled that<BR>
as long as you don't print the actual music, it's perfectly legal to<BR>
publish word with a note of "to the tune of XXX". The owner of the tune<BR>
has *no* rights in that case. <BR>
<BR>
But if you try to record the song, things can get ugly.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 19:38:27 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re Braodsword<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I always thought partially streamlined in CT meant landing only on planets<BR>
> with Atmosphere 0 or 1? In MT, streamlining was likewise required for any<BR>
> atmosphere above those. In CT, the Broadsword is partially streamlined, in<BR>
> MT it is unstreamlined. Either way, it shouldn't have been landing on<BR>
> Garda-Vilis in Adventure 8.<BR>
<BR>
Gurps uses different terminology. But I can't seem to find the post<BR>
where someone cross-referenced the terms.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:17:21 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 7:17 PM, mfs10@columbia.edu issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Understand I'm not at all convinced by this argument,<BR>
> which reminds me of old Woody Allen routines, but<BR>
> I *would* like to recruit the player. So how can I respond<BR>
<BR>
Well, I'd start by agreeing with these superficial similarities, and follow<BR>
with the line that the Solomani are more like Nazi's. But also point out the<BR>
major differences. And of course the K'kree are heck-bent on genocide, the<BR>
Hivers are devious little string-pullers, etc. Then point out the<BR>
relationship in time between the current* Traveller setting and modern<BR>
Earth. Perhaps you can agree to set the games in non-Imperial space, or<BR>
stress the individual worlds governments more (loose Imperium, not weak).<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm. Or how about a Sword Worlds Campaign?<BR>
<BR>
*Pick nearly /any/ common setting from Year Zero the thr FFW, it's /way/ far<BR>
in the future. Hypercleats even uses a much shorter timeline in his<BR>
campaign. ;) The more Trav material I get my hands on, the more I realize<BR>
how heretical that campaign was. Maybe that's why most of the books were<BR>
"For His Eyes Only", eh? ;)<BR>
////////////////////////////////////////<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:28:01 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Monospaced?<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 8:25 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Sure, but you are missing the point. All IE did was post the<BR>
> *characters* you used.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, I grok all that, but shouldn't I be able to select text in OE's<BR>
window, and /change/ the font then somehow? In a menu maybe? I know I have<BR>
Monaco, Courier, and quite a few other mono-spaced fonts. I use them all the<BR>
time. Just never in OE. Graphic Converter, Claris/Appleworks, BBEdit,<BR>
Simpletext, all fine. Never before needed to in OE. I've been looking for<BR>
the darn manual, but like most Mac folks I know, I've done tossed it in some<BR>
forgotton corner.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:54:45 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
On 04/21/00 at 03:36 PM,  "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>"So we tanned his hide when he died, Clyde, and that's it hangin' on the<BR>
>shed!"<BR>
<BR>
>All together now...<BR>
<BR>
"Tie me kangaroo down boys?"<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 02:04:24 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
Leonard wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Nope. Permission is *automatic* (look up "mechanical license") with a<BR>
>fixed royalty.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I have looked up mechanical license. A mechanical license is<BR>
simply a written authorization from the copyright holder to distribute a<BR>
recording of a musical composition. A compulsory mechanical license is what<BR>
you're talking about, still I stand corrected. I was confusing recording<BR>
with my memory of live performance with recorded performance. My apologies<BR>
for any confusion.<BR>
<BR>
Please note, however, that permission is *not* quite automatic. You still<BR>
have to comply with certain rules. If you don't comply with these rules,<BR>
then you're infringing on a copyright.<BR>
<BR>
>Weird Al has gotten permission because you need the copyright holder's<BR>
>permission to record a *derivative* work (that is, a work based on<BR>
>anotherr work, in this case, a work that wouldn't make much sense if<BR>
>the original work didn't exist).<BR>
<BR>
Yep, you're right. My apologies.<BR>
<BR>
>*However*, the courts *have* ruled that fair use *does* cover parodying<BR>
>the song itself. The case revolved around a parody of "pretty woman".<BR>
>Note that even so, you have to pay the standard royalty for the *tune*.<BR>
<BR>
Fair use has always covered "parody", in the sense of criticism. The simple<BR>
reason for this is that someone is not likely to give somebody the right to<BR>
make a derivative work which makes fun of them or their work. The court of<BR>
appeals ruled the use was unfair, due to the fact that the parody was a<BR>
commercial work, but the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that it was indeed fair.<BR>
There were a number of interesting factors in the Supreme Court's decision<BR>
and it was a very complex case.<BR>
<BR>
>Most of the stuff here would *not* qualify as that sort of parody. But<BR>
>*would* fall under "derivative work", and thus require permission TO<BR>
>RECORD.<BR>
<BR>
Yep. This was what was at issue.<BR>
<BR>
>You see, there's an *old* case involving Mad magazine that ruled that<BR>
>as long as you don't print the actual music, it's perfectly legal to<BR>
>publish word with a note of "to the tune of XXX". The owner of the tune<BR>
>has *no* rights in that case.<BR>
<BR>
This was never at issue, nor do I think I implied such. Keep in mind, I've<BR>
done three text parodies of songs now. :)<BR>
<BR>
>But if you try to record the song, things can get ugly.<BR>
<BR>
...or perform it.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2338<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 22 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2339<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Re: Monospaced?<BR>
AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
Re: Monospaced?<BR>
Re: Re Braodsword<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Camerone Day<BR>
Two filks<BR>
[OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ (and THUDDD 12)<BR>
Re : Ammonia/water mixtures (was : Chemistry question, longish)<BR>
Re: Monospaced?<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
It's a Zen thing man...<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Re: Two filks and another fragment for ya<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 02:11:28 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Matt Stevens wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>This reminds me... I was planning to run a few CT adventures in<BR>
>NYC and spoke to a potential player about it.  He said he felt<BR>
>uncomfortable playing Traveller because the Imperium was<BR>
>"a lot like Nazi Germany." Perplexed I asked him to explain,<BR>
>and he observed it was the *Third* Imperium (like the 3rd<BR>
>Reich, get it?) and it lasted for a thousand years<BR>
>(like the Thousand-Year Reich, wink wink nudge nudge).<BR>
><BR>
>Understand I'm not at all convinced by this argument,<BR>
>which reminds me of old Woody Allen routines, but<BR>
>I *would* like to recruit the player. So how can I respond<BR>
>without a bitch-slap and a "get real"?<BR>
<BR>
I'm not convinced either. While I do have certain problems with the friendly<BR>
free-market fascism (in the guise of friendly "free-market"<?!> feudalism)<BR>
background of the Imperium, to say that it's "a lot like Nazi Germany" is<BR>
pushing it quite a bit. He's drawing truly bizarre connections from the<BR>
flimsiest evidence. Honestly, I doubt that his real problem is the Third<BR>
Imperium setting. I suspect that this potential player simply doesn't want<BR>
to play Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
I think a bitch-slap, or at the very least a pimp-slap, is in order. :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 23:44:07 -0700<BR>
From: "Colin Paddock" <su_liam@mac.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Monospaced?<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
>To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
>Subject: Re: Monospaced?<BR>
>Date: Fri, Apr 21, 2000, 8:28 PM<BR>
><BR>
> Yeah, I grok all that, but shouldn't I be able to select text in OE's<BR>
> window, and /change/ the font then somehow? In a menu maybe? I know I have<BR>
> Monaco, Courier, and quite a few other mono-spaced fonts. I use them all the<BR>
> time. Just never in OE. Graphic Converter, Claris/Appleworks, BBEdit,<BR>
> Simpletext, all fine. Never before needed to in OE. I've been looking for<BR>
> the darn manual, but like most Mac folks I know, I've done tossed it in some<BR>
> forgotton corner.<BR>
><BR>
Look in preferences, under 'fonts.' They have separate fonts for<BR>
proportional, fixed width and list items.<BR>
<BR>
Ob Trav: none that I know of, sorry...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 01:53:18 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
Here's another nifty toy from AuricTech:<BR>
<BR>
**begin transmission**<BR>
<BR>
AuricTech Shipyards _Savage-class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
Design System:  FF&S2 (Akins spreadsheet ver 3.2, with correction of<BR>
G-comp power consumption [equivalent to ver 3.3])<BR>
<BR>
Tons: 100 std ( SL Wedge Hypersonic )<BR>
Dimensions: 35m x 24m x 10m<BR>
Volume: 1400 m3<BR>
Cargo: 1 std (1 x Small hatch) <BR>
Mass (L/C): 1400t/1364t<BR>
Maintenance Points: 49<BR>
Passengers High/Med/Low:  None <BR>
Crew: 3 / 4 <BR>
Frozen Watch: 0<BR>
Cost: 128.368 MCr <BR>
Tech Level: 15<BR>
Size: 8 <BR>
<BR>
Electronics<BR>
Controls: Holographic, Standard automation. 3xFltComp (CM:0.35 CP:2.86).<BR>
3xFibComp (CM:0.35 CP:2.86). Terrain following sensors (TF:570,<BR>
NOE:190). No bridge.<BR>
Communications: Communications: 1xRadio (1,000AU, 0.2MW). 2xLaser<BR>
(1,000AU, 0MW).<BR>
Sensors: 1xPEMS (13 [5mkm], 0MW). 1xAEMS (11 [.16mkm], 0.1MW). 1xLIDAR<BR>
(15 [2mkm], 2.5MW).<BR>
Survey/Science: None<BR>
ECM: 1 x Radio Jammer (1,000 AU, 0.4 MW)<BR>
Signatures: Vis:-1, IR:-0.5 (-1 at 76MW, -1 at 37MW), Act:-0.5, Neu:-1,<BR>
Grav:0<BR>
<BR>
Performance <BR>
2 Jump (10 std/pc fuel)<BR>
2 / 2 Maneuver (Thruster: 68 MW)<BR>
No Contra-grav <BR>
3247 kph/3328 kph Atmosphere Maximum <BR>
2435 kph/2496 kph Atmosphere Cruise <BR>
11 Power (Fusion: 370 MW,1yr) <BR>
0 Battery <BR>
22.6 Fuel (Scoop: 3/Purif: 10, 1 MW) <BR>
4/0/0/1 Accommodations (Small Stateroom/Large Stateroom/Low Berth/Emgy<BR>
Low Berth) <BR>
104 Life Sup. (Type: Extended, Good Food/Storage) <BR>
2 G-Comp <BR>
20 [58] Armor, 9 Structure <BR>
<BR>
Weapons:<BR>
1x 1056.25 MJ NPAW Light Spinal Mount (+6) 2/7-7-7-6<BR>
[1,100/231-231-231-162] (LR)<BR>
<BR>
Features:<BR>
1 x Airlock<BR>
1 x Armory (.14 std)<BR>
1 x Ordinary Galley (Cap: 4)<BR>
1 x Ship's locker (.05 std.) <BR>
<BR>
Small Craft:  None<BR>
<BR>
Backups <BR>
Drives: None <BR>
Screens: None<BR>
Communications: 1xRadio (500,000km). 2xLaser (1,000AU).<BR>
Sensors: 1xPEMS (12.5 [1.6mkm]). 1xAEMS (11 [.16mkm]). 2xLIDAR (14.5<BR>
[500kkm]).<BR>
ECM: None <BR>
Power & Fuel: None <BR>
<BR>
Crew Details: 2 x Maneuver. 1 x Engineer. 1 x Gunner. <BR>
<BR>
**end transmission**<BR>
<BR>
Designer's notes:  My primary goal with this ship was simply to cram the<BR>
largest possible NPAW into a Type S hullform, while maintaining the<BR>
basic performance (J2, 2G) of a standard Type S.  I think I succeeded. <BR>
The spinal mount on this puppy takes up 621 m^3 of a 1400 m^3 hull. <BR>
That's 44% of the hull volume dedicated to the gun.  If you gotta be a<BR>
one-trick pony, make sure the trick's a good one. ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Possible uses for this ship would be as small Q-ships, or light<BR>
jump-capable units in a planetary navy.  Obviously, the _Savage_ class<BR>
wouldn't work well as a p****e ship, unless the ethically-challenged<BR>
merchants had another ship nearby to collect whatever cargo remained on<BR>
the blasted wreck of the target.<BR>
<BR>
I also have an SDB version, capable of 5G acceleration.<BR>
<BR>
Hey, nothing exceeds like excess, right?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 23:58:56 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Monospaced?<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/20/00 11:44 PM, su_liam@mac.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Look in preferences, under 'fonts.' They have separate fonts for<BR>
> proportional, fixed width and list items.<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm, Palatino is chosen for both fixed-width and proportional, that can't<BR>
be right. Is that why what looks like a pull-down menu on my message window<BR>
doesn't pull down?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:24:08 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Re: Re Braodsword<BR>
<BR>
Anthony Jackson schrieb:<BR>
> <BR>
> William F. Hostman writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> > Dunno bout the GURPS bits, but in real traveller editions, it's always been<BR>
> > "Partially Streamlined", in short, it can enter atmospheres, but boy,<BR>
> > howdy, take that descent SLOW. (Wouldn't work well in TNE...)<BR>
> <BR>
> That's basically what 'unstreamlined' means in GT.  Which doesn't account<BR>
> for why merchants are streamlined, the various free and far traders would<BR>
> be vastly superior designs if built unstreamlined with contragravity.<BR>
<BR>
Probably because being a day or so faster than that other free trader is<BR>
the advantage to look for. In the end, those who have streamlined ships<BR>
may be cheaper to run. Of course, this is only for cargo that is<BR>
time-critical; so it's fair to assume that for cargo that is basically<BR>
not time-critical, there will be thousands of USL free trader ships in<BR>
the OTU.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
Hiroshi.Estigarribia@gmx.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:39:12 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Chris Seamans schrieb:<BR>
> <BR>
> Matt Stevens wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >This reminds me... I was planning to run a few CT adventures in<BR>
> >NYC and spoke to a potential player about it.  He said he felt<BR>
> >uncomfortable playing Traveller because the Imperium was<BR>
> >"a lot like Nazi Germany." Perplexed I asked him to explain,<BR>
> >and he observed it was the *Third* Imperium (like the 3rd<BR>
> >Reich, get it?) and it lasted for a thousand years<BR>
> >(like the Thousand-Year Reich, wink wink nudge nudge).<BR>
<BR>
The Thousand Year Reich lasted a thousand years? :-)<BR>
Not even close to that!<BR>
<BR>
> >Understand I'm not at all convinced by this argument,<BR>
> >which reminds me of old Woody Allen routines, but<BR>
> >I *would* like to recruit the player. So how can I respond<BR>
> >without a bitch-slap and a "get real"?<BR>
<BR>
[snip]<BR>
> Honestly, I doubt that his real problem is the Third<BR>
> Imperium setting. I suspect that this potential player simply doesn't want<BR>
> to play Traveller.<BR>
[snip]<BR>
<BR>
On the thousand years, remind him that the Imperium is constructed as<BR>
being capable of lasting a thousand years, which requires a lot more<BR>
reason than the Nazis used when they "governed" Germany for *twelve*<BR>
years (and after that, the country had fallen into ashes...). And the<BR>
Evil about the Nazis were not the number "three" and "thousand", but<BR>
their deeds. Things that are IMHO very likely to happen in the 3I, with<BR>
all than noblemen personal honor etc.<BR>
<BR>
I agree, this player just doesn't want to play Traveller. If he is an SF<BR>
player at all, one can only ask him what he desires from an SF campaign.<BR>
If it's force fields, light sabers and The Force, he is not going to be<BR>
an SF player for the next few years, I'd say. But if it is starships,<BR>
technology, rational solutions for any problem, then he can probably be<BR>
convinced of the OTU. (Since the rules do not seem to be a problem. If<BR>
they are, anyway, maybe propose GT?) Maybe he whants to play outside the<BR>
3I, in a small pocket empire (like the Sword Worlds, the Darrians, or,<BR>
my personal favorite, some pocket empire at the border between the<BR>
Solomani Confederation and the Hiver Federation.) or on a group of<BR>
non-aligned worlds?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
Hiroshi.Estigarribia@gmx.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:49:07 -0700<BR>
From: Evyn MacDude <wmacdude@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
Being as It is only a week away. I thought it would be nice to send out<BR>
a reminder. Next sunday is Camerone Day.<BR>
<BR>
Here is the text.<BR>
<BR>
from http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/3521/Hrecite.html<BR>
RECITATION OF THE BATTLE OF CAMERONE<BR>
This battle took place on the 30th of April 1863, during the campaign of<BR>
Mexico. It is celebrated each year, on the anniversary of this date, by all<BR>
the regiments of the French Foreign Legion.<BR>
History:<BR>
The French Army was besieging Puebla.<BR>
The mission of the Legion was to ensure the movement and safety of the<BR>
convoys, over an 80 mile distance. On the 29th of April 1863, Colonel<BR>
Jeanningros was informed that an important convoy was on its way to Puebla,<BR>
with a load of 3 million francs, and material and munitions for the seige.<BR>
Captain Danjou, his quartermaster, decided to send a company to escort the<BR>
convoy. The 3rd company of the Foreign Regiment was assigned to this<BR>
mission, but had no officers available. So Captain Danjou, himself, took the<BR>
command and 2nd lieutenants Maudet, company guide, and Vilain, the<BR>
paymaster, joined him voluntarily.<BR>
On the 30th of April, at 1 a.m., the 3rd company was on its way, with its 3<BR>
officers and 62 men. At 7 a.m., after a 15 mile march, it stopped at Palo<BR>
Verde in order to get some rest. At this very moment, the enemy showed up<BR>
and the battle began. Captain Danjou made the company take up a square<BR>
formation and, even though retreating, he victoriously drove back several<BR>
cavalry charges, inflicting the first heavy losses on the enemy .<BR>
By the inn of Camerone, a large building with a courtyard protected by a<BR>
wall 3 meters high, Danjou decided to stay, in order to keep the enemy and<BR>
so delay for as long as possible, any attacks on the convoy.<BR>
While the legionnaires were rapidly setting up the defense of the inn, a<BR>
Mexican officer demanded that Captain Danjou surrender, pointing out the<BR>
fact that the Mexican Army was greatly superior in number.<BR>
Danjou's answer was: "We have munitions. We will not surrender." Then, he<BR>
swore to fight to the death and made his men swear the same. It was 10 a.m.<BR>
Until 6 p.m., these 60 men who had had nothing to eat or drink since the day<BR>
before, in spite of the extreme heat, of the thirst and hunger, resisted<BR>
against 2,000 Mexicans: 800 cavalry and 1,200 infantry.<BR>
At noon, Captain Danjou was shot in the chest and died. At 2 p.m., 2nd<BR>
lieutenant Vilain was shot in the head. About this time, the Mexican colonel<BR>
succeeded in setting the inn on fire.<BR>
In spite of the heat and the smoke, the legionnaires resisted, but many of<BR>
them were killed or injured. By 5 p.m., only 12 men could still fight with<BR>
2nd lieutenant Maudet. At this time, the Mexican colonel gathered his<BR>
soldiers and told them what disgrace it would be if they were unable to<BR>
defeat such a small number of men. The Mexicans were about to give the<BR>
general assault through holes opened in the walls of the courtyard, but<BR>
Colonel Milan, who had previously asked 2nd lieutenant Maudet to surrender,<BR>
once again gave him the opportunity to. Maudet scornfully refused.<BR>
The final charge was given. Soon, only 5 men were left around Maudet;<BR>
Corporal Maine, legionnaires Catteau, Wensel, Constantin and Leonard. Each<BR>
had only one bullet left. In a corner of the courtyard, their back against<BR>
the wall, still facing the enemy, they fixed bayonets. When the signal was<BR>
given, they opened fire and fought with their bayonets. 2nd lieutenant<BR>
Maudet and 2 legionnaires fell, mortally wounded. Maine and his 2 remaining<BR>
companions were about to be slaughtered when a Mexican officer saved them.<BR>
He shouted: "Surrender"!<BR>
"We will only if you promise to allow us to carry and care for our injured<BR>
men and if you leave us our guns".<BR>
"Nothing can be refused to men like you"!, answered the officer.<BR>
Captain Danjou's men had kept their promise; for 11 hours, they had resisted<BR>
2,000 enemy troops. They had killed 300 of them and had injured as many.<BR>
Their sacrifice had saved the convoy and they had fulfilled their mission.<BR>
Emperor Napoleon the 3rd decided that the name of Camerone would be written<BR>
on the flag of the Foreign Regiment and the names of Danjou, Vilain and<BR>
Maudet would be engraved in golden letters on the walls of the Invalides, in<BR>
Paris.<BR>
Moreover, a monument was built in 1892, at the very place of the fight. The<BR>
following inscription can be read there :<BR>
HERE, THEY WERE LESS THAN SIXTY<BR>
AGAINST A WHOLE ARMY<BR>
ITS MASS CRUSHED THEM<BR>
BUT LIFE RATHER THAN COURAGE<BR>
ABANDONED THESE FRENCH SOLDIERS<BR>
THE 30TH OF APRIL 1863.<BR>
TO THEIR MEMORY THE NATION BUILT THIS MONUMENT.<BR>
Since then, when Mexican troops pass by the monument, they present arms.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Evyn...<BR>
<BR>
C-Space home http://home.att.net/~wmacdude/<BR>
<BR>
Get six jolly cowboys to carry my coffin<BR>
Get six pretty maidens to bear up my pall<BR>
Bunches of roses all over my coffin<BR>
Roses to deaden the clods as they fall<BR>
 Laredo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 00:45:09<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Two filks<BR>
<BR>
Cover of the Traveller Book<BR>
<BR>
TTTO: "Cover of the Rolling Stone" by Dr. Hook and Shel Silverstein<BR>
<BR>
Im an old-time player<BR>
Though my hairs getting grayer<BR>
I love everything about this game<BR>
I do merchant deals,<BR>
And I scout new worlds<BR>
Before heading home for the day.<BR>
Ive run great games<BR>
For all my friends <BR>
But Ive never known the look<BR>
Like the look that theyll give ya<BR>
When you get your name<BR>
On the cover of a Traveller Book<BR>
<BR>
Traveller Book...<BR>
Wanna see my name on the cover.<BR>
 Book...<BR>
Gonna sign a copy for my brother.<BR>
 Book...<BR>
Wanna see my family name<BR>
On the cover of a Traveller Book.<BR>
<BR>
I got three page adventure<BR>
In the IG Journal<BR>
Writing bout a labor strike.<BR>
Did ships for Imperial Squadrons,<BR>
But they didnt get em right<BR>
Done piece work all over the hobby,<BR>
But Ill still feel so sad and forsook<BR>
Until Loren says OK<BR>
And I get to see my name<BR>
On the cover of a Traveller Book.<BR>
<BR>
Traveller Book...<BR>
Wanna see my name on the cover.<BR>
 Book...<BR>
Gonna give a copy to my mother. (Like she'll understand...)<BR>
 Book...<BR>
Wanna see my family name<BR>
On the cover of a Traveller Book.<BR>
<BR>
Theres every piece of spreadsheet software<BR>
And I use it every day<BR>
Ive got a detailed campaign setting,<BR>
But no one has the time to play<BR>
Ive got every book, that money can buy<BR>
And tomorrow Im going to buy some more<BR>
So I just keep on writing <BR>
But I just cant get my name<BR>
On the cover of a Traveller Book.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
The Traveller Rover<BR>
<BR>
TTTO: "The Rambling Rover", by Andy Stewart<BR>
<BR>
CHORUS:<BR>
There's always new worlds to see, and the Vargr are always merry<BR>
There are worlds where man has never paused to raise his eyes to the sky<BR>
But to be a star-crossed Traveller, from now 'til ever-after,<BR>
With hope and joy and laughter, then together we'll roam the skies<BR>
<BR>
O there's many hold important that Imperial deportment<BR>
Believing in the vilani way that they should stay in place<BR>
They save and scrape and ponder while the rest go out and squander<BR>
See the stars, and rove and wander, and live life at a faster pace.<BR>
<BR>
(CH)<BR>
<BR>
I've flown through all the sectors, enjoying all their splendors<BR>
And I've sampled some exotic drinks, if my hosts were to be so kind<BR>
And when parting was no pleasure, I've drunk another measure<BR>
To the good friends that we treasure for they always are in our minds.<BR>
<BR>
(CH)<BR>
<BR>
There were cultures that I treasured, more than could be measured<BR>
And loved all the more for knowing they couldn't ever be mine;<BR>
'Cause life it keeps me wandering, I'll view tomorrow morning,<BR>
Underneath a brand-new sun, and heaven knows what I'll find!<BR>
<BR>
(CH)<BR>
<BR>
So when troubles do befall me, to the high port I do haul me<BR>
Crazy Traveler's what they call me, 'tis me blessing and me bane.<BR>
Though my comrades have been many, I'll take a drink with any<BR>
'Til I've spent me last wee credie, and life I'll not see again. <BR>
<BR>
(CH)<BR>
<BR>
If your urge to wander winds down, you find a piece of good ground<BR>
You can spend your waning days under the light of a single sun<BR>
You've been a man of action as you give up life's last fraction<BR>
You may gain some satisfaction sayin' "Always we had our fun!" <BR>
<BR>
(CH)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"Some days, you just can't get rid  of a bomb!"<BR>
                    -Adam West, as Batman <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 04:01:24 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
How about links instead of lengthy cut-n-pastes for<BR>
OT posts?<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 03:18:09 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ (and THUDDD 12)<BR>
<BR>
Black ICE wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Here's another nifty toy from AuricTech:<BR>
> <BR>
> AuricTech Shipyards _Savage-class Type SQ<BR>
> <BR>
<<snips ship design specs>><BR>
<BR>
A couple of more notes about this design:<BR>
<BR>
1.  While it doesn't meet the THUDDD 12 design specs (at least J4, with<BR>
useful cargo capacity, etc.), you _can_ buy *430* _Savages_ for the BCr<BR>
55.2 budgeted for each THUDDD 12 contestant.  Now _that_ could cause<BR>
some havoc in the shipping lanes!<BR>
<BR>
2.  With a 10% bulk discount, you can pick up four _Savages_ for the MCr<BR>
480 price tag of the Zhodani Patrol Corvette listed in the Military<BR>
Combat System rules.<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm.  If Nick Bradbeer enters another ship, I may well use the SDB<BR>
variant as an attack craft for a second AuricTech entry.  Would anyone<BR>
object if I did that?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:17:08 +1000<BR>
From: "Robert O'Connor" <robocon@ozemail.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re : Ammonia/water mixtures (was : Chemistry question, longish)<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote :-<BR>
> And the presence of water will result in freezing points all over the<BR>
> place depending on the relative proportions of water and ammonia.<BR>
<BR>
Yes ; in general, a mixture will have a 'phase diagram'* similar to<BR>
this, for any two compounds A and B :-<BR>
<BR>
       |                      |<BR>
  mp(A).                      |<BR>
       | .                    .mp(B)<BR>
       |   .      (1)        .|<BR>
Temp.  |     .              . |<BR>
       |       .           .  |<BR>
       |         .        .   |<BR>
       |  (2)      .     .    |<BR>
       |             .  . (3) |<BR>
       |---------------*------|<BR>
       |       (4)     E      |<BR>
       |______________________|     <BR>
<BR>
            Mole fraction<BR>
    A: 1 -------------------> 0<BR>
    B: 0 <------------------- 1<BR>
<BR>
Regions on the diagram :-<BR>
1. both substances liquid!<BR>
2. crystalline A + liquid mixture<BR>
3. crystalline B + liquid mixture<BR>
4. solid A and B<BR>
E - eutectic point<BR>
<BR>
* not the classical pressure-temp or pressure-volume curves of <BR>
thermodynamics.<BR>
<BR>
> Anybody know where I could find a phase diagram for water/ammonia<BR>
> mixtures? <BR>
I haven't had much luck with the Web. Ammonia-water working mixtures<BR>
are proposed for Kalina cycle engines and were thought about with OTEC.<BR>
<BR>
Hmm...<BR>
If we can't find one, we'll have to see if we can make one with the<BR>
information available.<BR>
<BR>
* The critical piece of information is the freezing point depression<BR>
coefficient of liquid ammonia.<BR>
The freezing point depression coefficient of water is 1.86K/mole solute<BR>
per kilogram of water.<BR>
<BR>
Liquid ammonia is relatively hard to find information on (beyond the<BR>
value of its density, 0.639kg/L).<BR>
<BR>
* For working purposes, I suppose we could compare dipole moments of<BR>
water and ammonia to obtain a crude value.<BR>
<BR>
Substance      Dipole moment [10^(-30)Cm]<BR>
Ammonia        4.9<BR>
Water          6.2<BR>
<BR>
Since electric charges obey Coulomb's law, we could assume that the<BR>
freezing point depression coefficient is given by :-<BR>
1.86*(mol mass NH3/mol mass H2O)*(dipole NH3/dipole H2O)^2 <BR>
<BR>
=1.86*(17/18)*(4.9/6.2)^2<BR>
=1.10K/mole solute/kg ammonia<BR>
<BR>
* One would assume that the eutectic point would be where the lines<BR>
representing freezing point with increasing solute concentration for<BR>
each substance cross.<BR>
<BR>
Ammonia : mp = 196.15 - 1.10[moles solute]<BR>
Water : mp = 273.15 - 1.86[moles solute]<BR>
(273.15-196.15) = [1.86-1.10]*(moles solute)<BR>
77=0.76*(moles solute)<BR>
~101(!!) moles solute/kg solvent (which confounds the identities of<BR>
'solute' and 'solvent' a bit, but...)<BR>
<BR>
Recall that a saturated solution of ammonia in water at 298K<BR>
contains 28 moles ammonia/litre ; NH3 should be much more soluble<BR>
as the temperature decreases.<BR>
<BR>
There are ~55.6 moles water/kg water, ~58.8 moles ammonia/kg ammonia.<BR>
<BR>
Referring to the diagram above, this gives us *two* eutectic points<BR>
at ~0.35 mole fraction water and ~0.36 mole fraction ammonia, at a<BR>
temperature of ca. 85K (?!)<BR>
<BR>
Now, what happens between these two values?<BR>
At mole fraction = 0.5,<BR>
mp water = 273.15 - 1.86(58.8) = 163.8 K<BR>
mp ammonia = 196.15 - 1.10(55.6) = 134.9 K<BR>
The mixture will behave like those in regions 2 and 3 of the diagram<BR>
above, depending on the temperature.<BR>
<BR>
Constructive criticism welcome - I'm sure there's something I've <BR>
overlooked.<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor<BR>
Medico, Gamer<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 23:39:19 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Monospaced?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 8:25 PM, shadow@krypton.rain.com issued<BR>
> forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> Sure, but you are missing the point. All IE did was post the<BR>
>> *characters* you used.<BR>
><BR>
> Yeah, I grok all that, but shouldn't I be able to select text in OE's<BR>
> window, and /change/ the font then somehow? In a menu maybe?<BR>
<BR>
That won't help on files you import that were originally laid out in a<BR>
*different* font. The problem is that in email all characters are the<BR>
same width, so if you create a file in a proportionally spaced font you<BR>
have to *edit* it after it gets converted to the monospaced font used<BR>
in email.<BR>
<BR>
The problem is having the wrong font selected when you *created* the<BR>
file, not when you *import* it.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> time. Just never in OE. Graphic Converter, Claris/Appleworks, BBEdit,<BR>
> Simpletext, all fine. Never before needed to in OE. I've been looking for<BR>
> the darn manual, but like most Mac folks I know, I've done tossed it in some<BR>
> forgotton corner.<BR>
<BR>
The problem *isn't* in OE. It's using a monospaced font, as it should. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 13:15:53 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Ingo Heinscher schrieb:<BR>
> Things that are IMHO very likely to happen in the 3I, with<BR>
> all than noblemen personal honor etc.<BR>
<BR>
I mean, NOT very likely, of course...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
Hiroshi.Estigarribia@gmx.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 08:45:28 -0400<BR>
From: Mark Urbin <urbin@bigfoot.com><BR>
Subject: It's a Zen thing man...<BR>
<BR>
Matt types:<BR>
>Understand I'm not at all convinced by this argument,<BR>
>which reminds me of old Woody Allen routines, but<BR>
>I *would* like to recruit the player. So how can I respond<BR>
>without a bitch-slap and a "get real"?<BR>
<BR>
When you want to enlighten the poor twit, it's not a 'bitch slap', it's a <BR>
'pathway to enlightenment.'<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
urbin@yahoo.com http://albore.homepage.com/  Opinions Mine!<BR>
"In 1991, [Vice President] Gore cited Bush's China policy as a reason he<BR>
should be defeated for reelection, charging Bush sent his emissaries to<BR>
toast the butchers of Tiananmen Square.'"<BR>
Deborah Orin in the New York Post, March 26, 1997, the day after Gore<BR>
drank champagne with Chinese Premier Li Peng, who helped plan the<BR>
Tiananmen massacre<BR>
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:01:21 -0400<BR>
From: "Eric & Diane Freitas" <ericfrei@gte.net><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
<BR>
>If it's force fields, light sabers and The Force, he is not going to be<BR>
>an SF player for the next few years, I'd say.<BR>
<BR>
Not to start a flame war, but Traveller does have force fields, and<BR>
psionics.<BR>
Granted we don't have light sabers, or any equivalent, but we do have<BR>
Famille Spofulam and their low orbit capable pogo sticks.<BR>
<BR>
On second thought, I'm sure that FS could come up with a suitable<BR>
replacement for a light saber. ;)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 08:54:08 -0500<BR>
From: "Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Two filks and another fragment for ya<BR>
<BR>
Bravo!!!!!<BR>
Bravo!!!!<BR>
Huzzzah!!!<BR>
Nicely done Doug<BR>
<BR>
I must admit to being partial to Ramblin Rover<BR>
and in return heres a parody of ramblin rover for ya<BR>
but this ones about our two favorite mad scientists<BR>
<BR>
TTTO: Ramblin Rover<BR>
untitlted <BR>
<BR>
Oh theres hunchbacks barely twenty<BR>
and lab assistants plenty<BR>
and some with IQ's nearly ninety<BR>
that may someday get the girl<BR>
give me my sidekick Pinkie<BR>
Although were kind of Dinky<BR>
from DC To Helsinki<BR>
tonight we'll rule the world..<BR>
<BR>
a couple more verses were written by the folks from #callahans IRC<BR>
but I seem to have lost them, this was a fragment originally posted <BR>
to rec.music.filk<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2339<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2340</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 22 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2340<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Re: [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Colors for Map<BR>
Penguins make appearance<BR>
Re: MCS<BR>
Re: MCS<BR>
Re: MCS<BR>
Re : Ammonia/water mixtures (was : Chemistry question, longish)<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Streamlining (was Re: Broadsword)<BR>
RE: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: near-C Rocks<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Personal Request - Dom!<BR>
Re: Personal Request - Dom!<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Re: Durham Definition<BR>
Re: The Little Black Books<BR>
re: Filked again<BR>
OT help req for German TML'ers<BR>
RE: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
Re: Very late response on GURPS Modular Cutter et. all (LONG)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:56:56 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
> I agree, this player just doesn't want to play Traveller. If he is an SF<BR>
> player at all, one can only ask him what he desires from an SF campaign.<BR>
> If it's force fields, light sabers and The Force, he is not going to be<BR>
> an SF player for the next few years, I'd say. But if it is starships,<BR>
> technology, rational solutions for any problem, then he can probably be<BR>
> convinced of the OTU.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I've talked to the player at some length, and he *is* interested in<BR>
a real science-fiction campaign, more than light sabers and Jabba the Hutt.<BR>
His politics are just a bit over-the-top. (For example I met him in a 7th Sea <BR>
game, where he was playing a 17th century anarchist. I'm not sure<BR>
there *were* any anarchists in the 17th century, outside the Diggers and <BR>
a few millenial cults perhaps.)<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm not convinced either. While I do have certain problems with the friendly<BR>
> free-market fascism (in the guise of friendly "free-market"<?!> feudalism)<BR>
> background of the Imperium, to say that it's "a lot like Nazi Germany" is<BR>
> pushing it quite a bit. <BR>
<BR>
I certainly agree. The Imperium *is* a "right wing" government<BR>
of sorts, with a more-or-less all-powerful Emperor and a hereditary nobility,<BR>
but it isn't a totalitarian regime by any means. If I run a Traveller<BR>
campaign, I'll portary the Imperium as a distant presence, more like a<BR>
force of nature than a government. The average citizen almost never<BR>
sees an Imperial official and could care less about the<BR>
day's news from Capital. It isn't democratic but at least it leaves<BR>
people alone.<BR>
<BR>
(By the way, I find it odd that CT Supplement 4 was called "Citizens<BR>
of the Imperium." Wouldn't "Subjects of the Imperium" make more<BR>
sense?)<BR>
> <BR>
> I think a bitch-slap, or at the very least a pimp-slap, is in order. :)<BR>
> <BR>
Or maybe just a really mean scolding...<BR>
<BR>
Thanks, everybody,<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 10:35:31 -0400<BR>
From: Bill Rutherford <worj@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
At 12:49 AM 04/22/2000 -0700, Evyn MacDude wrote:<BR>
>Being as It is only a week away. I thought it would be nice to send out<BR>
>a reminder. Next sunday is Camerone Day.<BR>
><BR>
>Here is the text.<BR>
><BR>
>from http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/3521/Hrecite.html<BR>
>RECITATION OF THE BATTLE OF CAMERONE<BR>
>This battle took place on the 30th of April 1863, during the campaign of<BR>
>Mexico. ...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
OBTRAV:  What examples are there of merc units supporting imperialist <BR>
interventions (e.g. in local planetary affairs) in the 3I making such <BR>
stands against the odds?  What would be an equivalent unit to the Foriegn <BR>
Legion in the 3I?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Bill Rutherford<BR>
worj@home.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 11:19:09 EDT<BR>
From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/22/00 6:53:10 AM Pacific Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
>  <BR>
>  How about links instead of lengthy cut-n-pastes for<BR>
>  OT posts?<BR>
<BR>
Actually this is the most useful Traveller item (besides one ship design) <BR>
that I've seen in days. Now one just needs to convert the setting and a few <BR>
other details into Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Bryan<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 11:23:21 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca><BR>
Subject: Colors for Map<BR>
<BR>
My intuition goes like this:<BR>
<BR>
Imperium:  Red,  because most empires have given themselves this color<BR>
througout history (England, Russia, Rome?) and because it is standard<BR>
practice in war games for the "good guys" to be red and the "bad guys" to<BR>
be blue, which brings us to...<BR>
<BR>
Zhodani:  Dark blue, for above reasons.<BR>
<BR>
Vargr:  Brown, because that's the color of their fur, mostly. Or make them<BR>
white with colored hatching to indicate different factions.<BR>
<BR>
K'Kree:  Light Grey, like their fur.  If grey is too dull, green works<BR>
too.<BR>
<BR>
Hivers:  Purple, just cuz it's the "weird" color.<BR>
<BR>
Solomani:  Light "UN" blue, because the RoM decended from the UN and light<BR>
blue is the color of earth from space.  Also, it means that both the<BR>
traditional Imperial enemies have blue.  Note that confusion between this<BR>
and the dark blue Zho territory is unlikely due to distance. <BR>
<BR>
Aslan: Yellow, like their fur.  Yellow for the Imperium doesn't work, IMO,<BR>
since the Sunburst is officially supposed to have no official color.<BR>
There's a story about that in G:T, IIRC. Also, IIRC, a yellow sunburst is<BR>
the scout symbol.<BR>
<BR>
Sword Worlds:  Dark Grey, it just fits their attitude.  Note that again<BR>
due to distance there isn't likely going to be confusion with K'Kree.<BR>
<BR>
Darrians:  I agree with "Swordworlder", give 'em pink! :-)  You can call<BR>
it "peach" or "salmon" to make in sound a bit better, but everyone will<BR>
know it's really pink...  More seriously, give them white if it's not<BR>
being used for Vargr, or orange otherwise, because it's the only major<BR>
color left. <BR>
<BR>
Ideally, you end up with colors arranged like this, I think:<BR>
<BR>
D.Blue        White/Brown<BR>
Pink & D.Grey Red         L.Grey/Green<BR>
Yellow        L.Blue      Purple<BR>
<BR>
Hope this helps,<BR>
Charles C.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 11:36:30 EDT<BR>
From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Penguins make appearance<BR>
<BR>
    Penguins are making an appearance at shockwave.com:<BR>
<BR>
Porno - Penguin pounding fun. <BR>
Premiering Sunday, April 23. <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 08:41:46 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: MCS<BR>
<BR>
That would be me - bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net<BR>
(I should note that the UCLA address that is out there is obsolete, and<BR>
forwards to my<BR>
current work email address, where requests for information about laser weapons<BR>
tend to<BR>
really confuse the security people.)<BR>
<BR>
MCS is a work in progress - where the rate of progress has been "zero" for a<BR>
long,<BR>
long time. I can forward drafts to people who are interested.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 08:42:13 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: MCS<BR>
<BR>
I should also note that I haven't been managing to keep up with the TML much<BR>
lately...<BR>
so I may miss requests sent just to the list.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 10:50:35 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: MCS<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Macintosh wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> MCS is a work in progress - where the rate of progress has been "zero" for a<BR>
> long,<BR>
> long time. I can forward drafts to people who are interested.<BR>
<BR>
May I post a copy as a download on my AuricTech page?<BR>
<BR>
I asked on-list a while back, and received no response.  I know that<BR>
Doug Berry also asked to host MCS on his Gridlore Technologies page.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 11:03:29 -0500<BR>
From: Bolie Williams IV <bolie@io.com><BR>
Subject: Re : Ammonia/water mixtures (was : Chemistry question, longish)<BR>
<BR>
You can find detailed information on Ammonia at the NIST<BR>
Chemistry Webbook:  http://webbook.nist.gov/chemistry/fluid/<BR>
<BR>
There is a lot of interesting chemistry and physics information<BR>
on this site.<BR>
<BR>
Bolie IV<BR>
- -- <BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Bolie Williams IV<BR>
bolie@io.com<BR>
http://www.io.com/~bolie/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 09:08:46 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/22/00 6:56 AM, mfs10@columbia.edu issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> (By the way, I find it odd that CT Supplement 4 was called "Citizens<BR>
> of the Imperium." Wouldn't "Subjects of the Imperium" make more<BR>
> sense?)<BR>
<BR>
Hey, you're right! Never thought of that. They might have thought that the<BR>
term "subjects" could be misinterpreted as "topics". I hope you can talk<BR>
your potential player out of his silly ideas. Or at least convince him that<BR>
the mere presence of an "Evil Empire" in the setting is no cause to dis the<BR>
game. I've been thinking about that, trying to figure out where he might get<BR>
the idea, as it is, as Chris pointed out, darn flimsey. I hope he doesn't<BR>
think the creators were Nazi-sympathizers, although that may be the easiest<BR>
to disprove.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 12:29:41 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Streamlining (was Re: Broadsword)<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman writes:<BR>
<BR>
> That's basically what 'unstreamlined' means in GT.  Which doesn't account<BR>
>  for why merchants are streamlined, the various free and far traders would<BR>
>  be vastly superior designs if built unstreamlined with contragravity.<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
I would suspect it would be for in case the CG gave out, you could still land <BR>
the ship without necessarily burning up on reentry. Also, some merchants may <BR>
not use CG, either because it would be just one more thing to maintain or <BR>
break down, or because it costs money (in fuel and energy costs) to use. <BR>
<BR>
Most probably, though, its because the designers are used to dealing with <BR>
moderately "aircraft-shaped" designs and just stuck with it, despite <BR>
technological capability that would allow other, more efficient, designs <BR>
(Vilani traditionalism at its best).<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 12:34:22 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Matt Stevens:<BR>
<BR>
>Actually, I've talked to the player at some length, and he *is* interested<BR>
in<BR>
>a real science-fiction campaign, more than light sabers and Jabba the Hutt.<BR>
>His politics are just a bit over-the-top. (For example I met him in a 7th<BR>
Sea<BR>
>game, where he was playing a 17th century anarchist. I'm not sure<BR>
>there *were* any anarchists in the 17th century, outside the Diggers and<BR>
>a few millenial cults perhaps.)<BR>
<BR>
For what it's worth, the very *word* anarchist first appeared in the late<BR>
17th century, although the "golden age" of anarchism came at the end of the<BR>
19th century and the beginning of the 20th. Still, there were plenty of<BR>
radical groups in 17th century England.<BR>
<BR>
I had a friend like this though. He played an anarchist revolutionary in a<BR>
Call of Cthulhu game I ran. Perhaps you could consider channeling his<BR>
dislike of the Imperial setting into "gamable" terms? There are Givarists in<BR>
the Marches (for example), and I'm sure that with the multitude of worlds in<BR>
the Imperium there are other similar groups. After 1116, it *is* possible to<BR>
fight against the "old regime".<BR>
<BR>
>Thanks, everybody,<BR>
<BR>
No problem.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 12:46:53 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/21/00 6:55:55 PM Central Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 16:10:00 -0600<BR>
>  From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
>  Subject: More on Colors<BR>
>  <BR>
>  What does the TML think on establishing some standard colors for maps<BR>
>  (primarily for political powers)?  <BR>
>  <BR>
>  There are some obvious beginning choices:<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Third Imperium is Red.<BR>
>  Zhodani Consulate is Blue.<BR>
>  Aslan Hierate is Yellow.<BR>
>  <BR>
>  I would suggest shades of Purple (Violet) for the various Vargr states, and<BR>
>  Green for the K'Kree.  How about a light brown or orange for the Hivers?  <BR>
>  I'm not sure what color to use for the Solomani, though.<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
The way I've done my maps is:<BR>
<BR>
Imperium (Gold, as per the Imperial Starburst insignia)<BR>
Zhodani (Lt. Blue/Cyan, for the bars of 'Expedition to Zhodane')<BR>
Aslan (Dark Orange)<BR>
Vargr (Purples and Blues, for their association with the Zhos)<BR>
K'Kree (Green, natch)<BR>
Hiver (Dark Blue, a nice subtle color)<BR>
Solomani (Red, they've always reminded me of the Nazis, and red was _their_ <BR>
flag's main color. Also red and gold make such a nice contrast on a battle <BR>
display)<BR>
<BR>
These are just my choices. YMMV.<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 12:57:19 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: near-C Rocks<BR>
<BR>
Chris Seamans writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Personally, I'm disgusted by all the guitarists the UK keeps sending over<BR>
>  here in the guise of "blues" musicians. <grinning broadly, ducking low and<BR>
>  running away fast><BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
Tell it to Peter Green (if you can find him, that is).<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 13:00:48 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
<BR>
> > Remember, Doug's a paratrooper.  Therefore, he has better uses for his<BR>
>  > testosterone than killing hair follicles.<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Paratroopers don't *need* testosterone! <BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
Ah, but they do look good in silk :)<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 13:04:18 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
Eris writes:<BR>
<BR>
> On 04/21/00 at 03:36 PM,  "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com> said:<BR>
>  <BR>
>  <BR>
>  >"So we tanned his hide when he died, Clyde, and that's it hangin' on the<BR>
>  >shed!"<BR>
>  <BR>
>  >All together now...<BR>
>  <BR>
>  "Tie me kangaroo down boys?"<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
Be more like "Tie me Jonkeereen down, boys."<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 14:30:48 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Personal Request - Dom!<BR>
<BR>
	Dom, could you please contact me off-list...  the address I have for you <BR>
is bouncing.  Thanks.<BR>
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-<BR>
	Michel R. Vaillancourt	misha@atlantic-online.ns.ca<BR>
				ICQ # 31172292<BR>
	"Reality Error in Progress....<BR>
			       ....Do Not Adjust Your Penguin"	<BR>
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-<BR>
	Cyberpunk:  	http://www.atlantic-online.ns.ca/cp2020<BR>
	Traveller:		http://www.atlantic-online.ns.ca/traveller<BR>
	AD&D:		http://www.atlantic-online.ns.ca/adnd_eurania<BR>
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-<BR>
	    ***REMEMBER - Always virus-check your emails ***<BR>
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 14:35:03 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Personal Request - Dom!<BR>
<BR>
At 02:30 PM 4/22/00, you wrote:<BR>
>         Dom, could you please contact me off-list...  the address I have <BR>
> for you is bouncing.  Thanks.<BR>
<BR>
         Duh, I meant "Don M"... not Dom.  Saaahhhhry.<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 13:40:24 -0400<BR>
From: "Josh W. Spencer" <macmanjws@earthlink.net><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> And what about Wendy O. Williams and the Plasmatics?  Here in SF, the case<BR>
> of Jello Biafra v. The Dead Kennedys is going to trial soon.<BR>
> <BR>
> But you can get revenge..  at a weekly get together of SF fen the host's<BR>
> daughter and her boyfriend walked in.  He was punked out.  Spiked collar,<BR>
> spiked hair, ripped Ramones shirt, the whole nine yards.  He saw me looking<BR>
> at him, and asked me if I had a problem.  "Well, yeah.. that outfit is<BR>
> exactly what I was wearing twenty years ago! Where did you find it?"  Which<BR>
> led to all of us thrifty somethings to begin reminiscing on sneaking into<BR>
> the I-beam to see the Sex Pistols, or all-night drinking binges at<BR>
> Lexington Reservoir...<BR>
> <BR>
> The lesson here is:  Rebellion doesn't work if it inspires nostalgia.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Josh W. Spencer (macmanjws@earthlink.net)<BR>
VILANI ALIAS: Iashir Rekiinikimas Uiagam<BR>
Ypsilanti, Michigan, North America, Terra<BR>
Sol Subsector, Solomani Rim Sector<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 19:00:14 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
At 2:04 -0400 22/4/00, shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) wrote:<BR>
>Sounds like you need to try something simpler, like TeachText. (Yes,<BR>
>I've branched out into Macs, but I'm just a Novice).<BR>
<BR>
TeachText is called SimpleText in MacOS 7.5+<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:38:20 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Durham Definition<BR>
<BR>
At 13:02 -0400 20/4/00, Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> wrote:<BR>
>"First I built a swamp, and then it sank into the hill. So I built<BR>
>another one. It sank into the hill. I built a third one. It burned up,<BR>
>then sank into the hill. But the fourth one stayed there!"<BR>
<BR>
Hmm, to support such castle building exploits in a feudal system <BR>
you'd need huge tracts of land....<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com--------<BR>
"Even in the most depressing dystopia, there's still the notion<BR>
that the future is something we build. It doesn't just happen.<BR>
You can't predict the future, but you can invent it. Build it." -<BR>
'Fallen Angels' Niven/Pournelle/Flynn ---All Rob Prior's<BR>
MacOS software @ http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:36:18 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Little Black Books<BR>
<BR>
At 13:02 -0400 20/4/00, "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com> wrote:<BR>
> > Am I right in thinking that the books are very similiar to the BITS<BR>
> > supplements, but in different colors?<BR>
<BR>
Gosh, I wonder where Andy got the inspiration for the 101 style books <BR>
look? <grin> They're our LWBs...<BR>
<BR>
>Very, I wish the LBBs had that plastic jacket, it offers quite a bit of<BR>
>protection from scuffing and even some splort defense.<BR>
<BR>
Interestingly (well, maybe) the plastic covers were originally used <BR>
as a cost saving measure! We have since had the opportunity to switch <BR>
to cardstock, but have decided to stay with the plastic covers <BR>
because we haven't had anything but good feedback on them from people <BR>
who bought them. We did get a little negative feedback from people <BR>
looking at them without buying, but we decided that the positive <BR>
feedback outweighed it. I'm glad you find it a useful decision.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"In the End I found beginnings, not a vision, a wake up call.<BR>
Raised from the dead by a beating heart and at last I can<BR>
   see it all. And my eyes were opened to the darkness.."<BR>
                   Fish /Raingods with Zippos/<BR>
Rob Prior's Mac software @ http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:24:13 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Filked again<BR>
<BR>
At 2:43 -0400 20/4/00, Glenn Grant <neo@total.net> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
Cool! One I actually know the original too.....<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 11:34:26 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: OT help req for German TML'ers<BR>
<BR>
Nearly completely OT, but can any of the German TML'ers out there contact me<BR>
off-list?  I'm trying to find full sets of condition *new* Bundeswehr (sp?)<BR>
camo and load-bearing gear.  The airsoft team I'm part of has adopted it,<BR>
and I'm looking for sources of all of the gear.  Most of what trickles to<BR>
the states that I've found to date is used, ranging from "almost new" (which<BR>
is fine) to "should be used as rags" (which is not).  It's also impossible<BR>
to find the German load-bearing kit here.<BR>
<BR>
The non-OT part would be that I'll probably use every bit of *NON*-U.S. camo<BR>
I can find for "Ground Forces" compositing and other projects.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks!<BR>
<BR>
Best,<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 11:42:43 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
Another twisted....er, great design!  Like it!<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Black ICE<BR>
> Sent: Friday, April 21, 2000 11:53 PM<BR>
> To: TML<BR>
> Subject: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> Here's another nifty toy from AuricTech:<BR>
> <BR>
> **begin transmission**<BR>
> <BR>
> AuricTech Shipyards _Savage-class Type SQ<BR>
> <BR>
> Design System:  FF&S2 (Akins spreadsheet ver 3.2, with correction of<BR>
> G-comp power consumption [equivalent to ver 3.3])<BR>
> <BR>
> Tons: 100 std ( SL Wedge Hypersonic )<BR>
> Dimensions: 35m x 24m x 10m<BR>
> Volume: 1400 m3<BR>
> Cargo: 1 std (1 x Small hatch) <BR>
> Mass (L/C): 1400t/1364t<BR>
> Maintenance Points: 49<BR>
> Passengers High/Med/Low:  None <BR>
> Crew: 3 / 4 <BR>
> Frozen Watch: 0<BR>
> Cost: 128.368 MCr <BR>
> Tech Level: 15<BR>
> Size: 8 <BR>
> <BR>
> Electronics<BR>
> Controls: Holographic, Standard automation. 3xFltComp (CM:0.35 CP:2.86).<BR>
> 3xFibComp (CM:0.35 CP:2.86). Terrain following sensors (TF:570,<BR>
> NOE:190). No bridge.<BR>
> Communications: Communications: 1xRadio (1,000AU, 0.2MW). 2xLaser<BR>
> (1,000AU, 0MW).<BR>
> Sensors: 1xPEMS (13 [5mkm], 0MW). 1xAEMS (11 [.16mkm], 0.1MW). 1xLIDAR<BR>
> (15 [2mkm], 2.5MW).<BR>
> Survey/Science: None<BR>
> ECM: 1 x Radio Jammer (1,000 AU, 0.4 MW)<BR>
> Signatures: Vis:-1, IR:-0.5 (-1 at 76MW, -1 at 37MW), Act:-0.5, Neu:-1,<BR>
> Grav:0<BR>
> <BR>
> Performance <BR>
> 2 Jump (10 std/pc fuel)<BR>
> 2 / 2 Maneuver (Thruster: 68 MW)<BR>
> No Contra-grav <BR>
> 3247 kph/3328 kph Atmosphere Maximum <BR>
> 2435 kph/2496 kph Atmosphere Cruise <BR>
> 11 Power (Fusion: 370 MW,1yr) <BR>
> 0 Battery <BR>
> 22.6 Fuel (Scoop: 3/Purif: 10, 1 MW) <BR>
> 4/0/0/1 Accommodations (Small Stateroom/Large Stateroom/Low Berth/Emgy<BR>
> Low Berth) <BR>
> 104 Life Sup. (Type: Extended, Good Food/Storage) <BR>
> 2 G-Comp <BR>
> 20 [58] Armor, 9 Structure <BR>
> <BR>
> Weapons:<BR>
> 1x 1056.25 MJ NPAW Light Spinal Mount (+6) 2/7-7-7-6<BR>
> [1,100/231-231-231-162] (LR)<BR>
> <BR>
> Features:<BR>
> 1 x Airlock<BR>
> 1 x Armory (.14 std)<BR>
> 1 x Ordinary Galley (Cap: 4)<BR>
> 1 x Ship's locker (.05 std.) <BR>
> <BR>
> Small Craft:  None<BR>
> <BR>
> Backups <BR>
> Drives: None <BR>
> Screens: None<BR>
> Communications: 1xRadio (500,000km). 2xLaser (1,000AU).<BR>
> Sensors: 1xPEMS (12.5 [1.6mkm]). 1xAEMS (11 [.16mkm]). 2xLIDAR (14.5<BR>
> [500kkm]).<BR>
> ECM: None <BR>
> Power & Fuel: None <BR>
> <BR>
> Crew Details: 2 x Maneuver. 1 x Engineer. 1 x Gunner. <BR>
> <BR>
> **end transmission**<BR>
> <BR>
> Designer's notes:  My primary goal with this ship was simply to cram the<BR>
> largest possible NPAW into a Type S hullform, while maintaining the<BR>
> basic performance (J2, 2G) of a standard Type S.  I think I succeeded. <BR>
> The spinal mount on this puppy takes up 621 m^3 of a 1400 m^3 hull. <BR>
> That's 44% of the hull volume dedicated to the gun.  If you gotta be a<BR>
> one-trick pony, make sure the trick's a good one. ;-)<BR>
> <BR>
> Possible uses for this ship would be as small Q-ships, or light<BR>
> jump-capable units in a planetary navy.  Obviously, the _Savage_ class<BR>
> wouldn't work well as a p****e ship, unless the ethically-challenged<BR>
> merchants had another ship nearby to collect whatever cargo remained on<BR>
> the blasted wreck of the target.<BR>
> <BR>
> I also have an SDB version, capable of 5G acceleration.<BR>
> <BR>
> Hey, nothing exceeds like excess, right?<BR>
> <BR>
> -- <BR>
> AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
> "Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
> Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
> <BR>
> http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 14:48:31 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Very late response on GURPS Modular Cutter et. all (LONG)<BR>
<BR>
Been busy the last few days so I'm a little behind. Here's my Cr.02 on the<BR>
whole modular cutter thing.<BR>
<BR>
Is a book devoted to a single type of non-jumpship worthwhile? Based on the<BR>
content, as listed by Andy Akins, and knowing Loren will be co-authoring,<BR>
I'd say yes. But lets go through it point-by-point:<BR>
<BR>
1:<BR>
  >* Overview of modular craft in general<BR>
<BR>
Certainly worthwhile, especially if it includes some SOM style details on<BR>
cutter systems, in line with GT:Starships of course.<BR>
<BR>
  >* Overview/history of cutter specifically<BR>
<BR>
Has the potential to give us more details on LSP and IN purchase practices<BR>
and how Megacorps license out products, maybe even some more specific detail<BR>
of GT version of the periods between the end of the Third Frontier War and<BR>
the post-FFW period.<BR>
<BR>
  >* Rules specific to the cutter<BR>
<BR>
I've always wondered how the modules on the Donosev are switched out in the<BR>
15-min time scale that the rules specify. Is the space module just released<BR>
into space, where the hull section links on to it? What about the other<BR>
section? Is that released and then pushed into place by workers in vac<BR>
suits? Or is there a system of cables and such to facilitate the evolution,<BR>
so that workers never have to suit up?<BR>
  >* Career templates for cutter pilots in various branches<BR>
<BR>
Discussed below in part 2.<BR>
<BR>
  >* Equipment useful for cutters<BR>
<BR>
A potential goldmine here. All kinds of equipment could go into this<BR>
section. Everything from a detailed examination of vac suits, (something not<BR>
really done up to this time,) to the above mentioned module handling<BR>
equipment, as well as the items necessary to use modules to set up a Class I<BR>
starport, portable weapon support equipment, etc.<BR>
<BR>
  * Vehicles used for the handling and transport of cutters and cutter<BR>
modules<BR>
<BR>
Should tie in with containerized cargo rules from GT:FT. I never have been<BR>
able to figure out how cutter modules and containers fit together. Basically<BR>
as far as I can figure out the smallest container 4D, at 10 x 10 x 10 ft, is<BR>
too large to be carried by a cutter module. From the module shown as part of<BR>
the Donosev in GT:FI the module is 7 x 16 1/2 x (an unspecified height) ft.<BR>
I suppose that cutter modules could themselves be containerized for<BR>
transport or stacked on a 60/8 pallet type container. Personally I always<BR>
thought that the cutter module should have been included in the system from<BR>
the start.<BR>
<BR>
  * Several variations of the standard cutter, as well as several other<BR>
ships<BR>
that can make use of the cutter's modules<BR>
<BR>
It would be nice to see a craft other than the Donosev that makes use of<BR>
cutter modules. A better design philosophy should be incorporated. Modules<BR>
should be able to be switched out of the hull section as it sits in its<BR>
cradle or vehicle bay, by some sort of automated handling equipment. This<BR>
would make the 15 min switch out time reasonable.<BR>
<BR>
  * Extensive library of cutter modules - commercial, military, scout,<BR>
scientific, station, and more...<BR>
<BR>
As long as a rehash of the many modules already covered in GT don't make up<BR>
the balance of this section.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
  * A collection of deckplans for modules and vessels.<BR>
<BR>
The real meat of the project. Should include more design than ever before<BR>
given in a GT book.<BR>
<BR>
2:<BR>
The pilot vs. boat driver. To discuss a subject like this by comparing it<BR>
the present day practices an understanding of the parameters involved is<BR>
necessary. Do we want to discuss spacecraft as compared to flying craft? Or<BR>
do we want to discuss spacecraft as compared to wet navy ships?<BR>
<BR>
Officers fly almost all military aircraft in the west. The U.S. Navy<BR>
requires that all Naval Aviators be Commissioned Officers. (Interestingly<BR>
they do not have to have a College degree, as it is possible for an enlisted<BR>
member to request assignment to flight school. If accepted they will be<BR>
commission and taught to fly. At a later point in their career they are sent<BR>
to college to complete a degree prior to advancement to senior officer.)<BR>
<BR>
The Air Force has a similar policy. The Army brings people in to fly helo's<BR>
and makes them Warrant Officers from the start. They also have regular<BR>
commissioned officers doing this job.<BR>
<BR>
It is also true that between the world wars the Army Air Corp had NCO's that<BR>
were pilots. This practice ended fifty years ago.<BR>
<BR>
The wet navy ship situation is quite different. Ships are driven by officers<BR>
almost exclusively. Wait you might say, that's not true I know that I've<BR>
seen guys in blue shirts turning that big wheel that controls the ships<BR>
course. Surprise he's not the driver. The driver is the guy(gal) who<BR>
controls where the ship goes. That is the Officer of the Deck. The guy at<BR>
the wheel just follows orders, most of the time based on degrees of rudder<BR>
angle or compass direction. This person (usually called the helmsman or helm<BR>
in this PC age) is specifically prohibited from making their own judgments<BR>
in terms of speed, direction, etc. By LAW the OOD is the one responsible,<BR>
even if the helm hits something because he (she) didn't follow the OOD's<BR>
orders. These people are drawn from the least trained, youngest group of<BR>
sailors on a ship, many not even out of their teens. They are taught to<BR>
watch the compass and the rudder indicators and not even look out the bridge<BR>
windows.<BR>
<BR>
This situation does not correspond well to the typical pilot skill as<BR>
conceived of in Traveller, where the pilot skill seems to relate more to the<BR>
skill and level of responsibility of the airline pilot rather than the<BR>
general rating commercial seaman (who acts as helm on merchant marine<BR>
ships.)<BR>
<BR>
Small craft in the Navy are quite a different story. Ships boats are command<BR>
by the coxswain, who is often a relatively low ranking petty officer,<BR>
sometimes as low as a Third Class Boswain's Mate. Sometime these boats also<BR>
have a Boat Officer, whose job is generally more to keep the passengers in<BR>
line, (These boats are usually used as liberty craft, which means a few<BR>
dozen liquored up sailors are likely to be onboard,) and to take<BR>
responsibility if something goes wrong, than to drive the boat.<BR>
<BR>
Landing craft, especially the older pre-LCAC, mike boats, are generally<BR>
commanded by senior petty officers, generally E-7's and above (see Adm.<BR>
Daniel Gallery's very hilarious "Cap't Fatso" for a very good PC like romp<BR>
by such a vessel around the Med during the height of the Cold War. Very<BR>
little war, a lot of Med Cruise mayhem, which gives a very good pre-sixties<BR>
view of the U.S. Navy.)<BR>
<BR>
As a side note to invalidate all I said previously about OOD's in the last<BR>
decade or so CPO's from the deck and operations branches have often been<BR>
allowed to qualify as Officer's of the Deck, at least on Frigates and<BR>
Destroyers. I know a one case where a First Class Quartermaster was allowed<BR>
to qualify. (He was one of only two Petty Officers in the Atlantic Fleet so<BR>
qualified, and made CPO the next cycle. QM's in the Navy deal with<BR>
navigation systems and maps and should not be confused with Quartermasters<BR>
in the Army who are supply guys(gals).)<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: Specifically as applies to CT and the upcoming GT:IN.: Military<BR>
starship pilots are generally officers, except that enlisted members of the<BR>
Flight Branch who may also qualify as pilots. Small craft pilots should<BR>
follow the wet navy pattern with most being enlisted, but with officers<BR>
sometimes assigned to command the mission. Officers always command fighters,<BR>
but a cutter with a weapons pod might have a senior NCO as the CO.<BR>
Generally, the more responsibility and independence granted to the pilot the<BR>
higher the rank necessary. So a cutter delivering supplies from orbit to<BR>
surface might have an E-5 as a CO/pilot. A cutter traveling to another world<BR>
across the system or to the outer belt would probably have at least a CPO or<BR>
above as CO. A cutter used with the fighter module might be under the direct<BR>
command of a CPO. An officer, who may or may not also be responsible for the<BR>
overall command of the cutter, would command the fighter.<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2340<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2341</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 22 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2341<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re:  Broadsword<BR>
Re: Monospaced?<BR>
[OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Re: Re Braodsword<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Re: Monospaced?<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Re: Colors for Map<BR>
Re: Monospaced?<BR>
Re: [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Azhanti High Lightning<BR>
Re: Sol Sec<BR>
Re: Very late response on GURPS Modular Cutter et. all (LONG)<BR>
Re: Chemistry Question...<BR>
Re: GT-Q: I used to be filthy rich.<BR>
Re: GT-Q: I used to be filthy rich.<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2338<BR>
Re: Fossilsaurus<BR>
Re: FS Lite-saber<BR>
Re: Songs<BR>
Re Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 14:59:30 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re:  Broadsword<BR>
<BR>
>Anthony Jackson schrieb:<BR>
>><BR>
>> William F. Hostman writes:<BR>
>><BR>
>> > Dunno bout the GURPS bits, but in real traveller editions, it's always<BR>
been<BR>
>> > "Partially Streamlined", in short, it can enter atmospheres, but boy,<BR>
>> > howdy, take that descent SLOW. (Wouldn't work well in TNE...)<BR>
>><BR>
>> That's basically what 'unstreamlined' means in GT.  Which doesn't account<BR>
>> for why merchants are streamlined, the various free and far traders would<BR>
>> be vastly superior designs if built unstreamlined with contragravity.<BR>
><BR>
>Probably because being a day or so faster than that other free trader is<BR>
>the advantage to look for. In the end, those who have streamlined ships<BR>
>may be cheaper to run. Of course, this is only for cargo that is<BR>
>time-critical; so it's fair to assume that for cargo that is basically<BR>
>not time-critical, there will be thousands of USL free trader ships in<BR>
>the OTU.<BR>
><BR>
I expect not. Subsidized Liners, Heavy Freighters, LASH tenders and Bulk<BR>
Freighters, not free traders, will carry cargo that is basically<BR>
non-critical. The time element is the only thing that makes free traders<BR>
solvent. That allows them to charge more than the normal going rate for<BR>
transport, which is the only thing that would allow a typical Beowulf-class<BR>
to be cost effective.<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 12:07:45 -0700<BR>
From: "Colin Paddock" <su_liam@mac.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Monospaced?<BR>
<BR>
- ----------<BR>
>From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
>To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
>Subject: Re: Monospaced?<BR>
>Date: Fri, Apr 21, 2000, 11:58 PM<BR>
><BR>
> Hmmm, Palatino is chosen for both fixed-width and proportional, that can't<BR>
> be right. Is that why what looks like a pull-down menu on my message window<BR>
> doesn't pull down?<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
    On my computer, Geneva is used for proportional and list items; Monaco<BR>
for fixed width. These seem to be default 'cause I haven't messed too much<BR>
with the appearance attributes of that program.<BR>
<BR>
    I'm not sure about the pull-down you're referring to. Does it say<BR>
anything? You know like File, Tools, Display subjects containing...<BR>
<BR>
    The only things I know of on OE that look like pull-downs but don't pull<BR>
down are the Subject, Date Sent and the other list headers. These are just<BR>
buttons that effect the order in which messages are displayed.<BR>
<BR>
    Sadly, all micros*** stuff on my computer came with the system, so I<BR>
have no instructions.<BR>
<BR>
Good Luck<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 15:14:45 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
>How about links instead of lengthy cut-n-pastes for<BR>
>OT posts?<BR>
><BR>
>bloo<BR>
<BR>
Hate to disagree Steve, but I would consider this more on topic than the<BR>
rather lengthy discussion of monospaced fonts or some of the other things<BR>
posted here. Especially since I see the IM as a descendent of the Legion, as<BR>
well as the USMC and Royal Marines and the Sylean Marines. At least IMTU<BR>
Camerone Day is right up there with the Emperor's Birthday. It's the day<BR>
that the IM celebrate in much the same way as the USMC does on the Corps<BR>
Birthday. The Youngest and the Eldest raise a toast to the Emperor and the<BR>
Corps and to all the Marines that have ever died in defense of the Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 05:12:34 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Re Braodsword<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Samuel D. Weiss <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>I always thought partially streamlined in CT meant landing only on planets<BR>
>with Atmosphere 0 or 1? In MT, streamlining was likewise required for any<BR>
>atmosphere above those. In CT, the Broadsword is partially streamlined, in<BR>
>MT it is unstreamlined. Either way, it shouldn't have been landing on<BR>
>Garda-Vilis in Adventure 8.<BR>
>(I never went for TNE and I'd have to dig for me T4 stuff to see if it is<BR>
>different in those.)<BR>
><BR>
>Sam<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
It's Sphere SL in TNE.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 15:26:42 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/22/00 6:56 AM, mfs10@columbia.edu issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> (By the way, I find it odd that CT Supplement 4 was called "Citizens<BR>
> of the Imperium." Wouldn't "Subjects of the Imperium" make more<BR>
> sense?)<BR>
<BR>
Why? The term Citizen indicates that the holder is possessed of a certain<BR>
number of rights under law, as were the citizens of Rome under the Roman<BR>
republic and later the Roman Empire. Subject indicates that all rights are<BR>
embodied in the sovereign. While the Emperor is very powerful in the 3I, the<BR>
Moot has the power to dissolve the 3I, on paper at least. They means he is<BR>
not all powerful. The Warrant of Restoration, and associated constitution<BR>
give citizens certain rights, among them some right to appeal to the<BR>
nobility for adjudication, the right to not be enslaved, etc.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 12:33:47 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Monospaced?<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 12:07 PM, su_liam@mac.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm not sure about the pull-down you're referring to. Does it say<BR>
> anything? You know like File, Tools, Display subjects containing...<BR>
<BR>
It says "Default Font" and is right next to the "Use HTML" button. But it is<BR>
greyed out, as is the text size one next to it, yet they both have little<BR>
arrows pointing down. But in the Menu Bar items I /can/ change font size,<BR>
and the default choice, and I have now. Hypercleats will likely change it<BR>
back when he returns, but then I can also ask him about all this. It isn't<BR>
really a problem, as I rarely post tabular data, I think that is the /only/<BR>
time I have ever done it in e-mail. If you like you can see a GIF of the<BR>
message window with red arrows pointing to the greyed out items I am<BR>
referring to at:<BR>
<BR>
OE GIF --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/OE.GIF<BR>
<BR>
Query: My posts are now in monospace, correct? I see them that way.<BR>
<BR>
World Icons --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/WorldsBZA.GIF<BR>
Legend --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/LegendAlt.GIF<BR>
J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 19:52:48 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
>Not to start a flame war, but Traveller does have force fields, and<BR>
>psionics.<BR>
>Granted we don't have light sabers, or any equivalent, but we do have<BR>
>Famille Spofulam and their low orbit capable pogo sticks.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Actually, we *do* have something similar. Antti Lahtinen's 'Laser Sword' is<BR>
a damn funky weapon which has been on BARD for quite some time.<BR>
<BR>
The basic principle is that you have a flashlight-sized handle, with a low<BR>
power laser rangefinder and a weapon-grade emitter on one end, a power<BR>
selector ring, a battery and a capacitor bank.<BR>
<BR>
You turn the weapon on, and the battery charges the capacitor. You swing it<BR>
like a sword with an imaginary blade, and when the laser rangefinder detects<BR>
that something has entered the space of the 'blade' (ie a cylinder about an<BR>
inch wide and four feet long) it fires the laser.<BR>
<BR>
At low power settings (with correspondingly low recharge times) this will<BR>
blow a line of holes across your target. At higher power settings it will<BR>
cause more damage but leave more distance between holes.<BR>
<BR>
I really REALLY wish I'd thought of it.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 19:55:36 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Colors for Map<BR>
<BR>
>Yellow for the Imperium doesn't work, IMO,<BR>
>since the Sunburst is officially supposed to have no official color.<BR>
>There's a story about that in G:T, IIRC. Also, IIRC, a yellow sunburst is<BR>
>the scout symbol.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Isn't it black for the Scouts, and yellow for the Navy?<BR>
<BR>
I quite like the starburst having no official colour - it's a nice oddity<BR>
which sort of sets it apart from most modern-day symbols of state.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 15:51:11 -0400<BR>
From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Monospaced?<BR>
<BR>
Yes, you are monospaced.  Your screen shot looks like Outlook Express except<BR>
for a few cosmetic differences.  You're on a Mac, right?<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
 J-Man<BR>
 ICQ# 2843475<BR>
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
 Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
 Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Saturday, April 22, 2000 3:33 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Monospaced?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 12:07 PM, su_liam@mac.com issued forth:<BR>
><BR>
> > I'm not sure about the pull-down you're referring to. Does it say<BR>
> > anything? You know like File, Tools, Display subjects containing...<BR>
><BR>
> It says "Default Font" and is right next to the "Use HTML" button. But it<BR>
is<BR>
> greyed out, as is the text size one next to it, yet they both have little<BR>
> arrows pointing down. But in the Menu Bar items I /can/ change font size,<BR>
> and the default choice, and I have now. Hypercleats will likely change it<BR>
> back when he returns, but then I can also ask him about all this. It isn't<BR>
> really a problem, as I rarely post tabular data, I think that is the<BR>
/only/<BR>
> time I have ever done it in e-mail. If you like you can see a GIF of the<BR>
> message window with red arrows pointing to the greyed out items I am<BR>
> referring to at:<BR>
><BR>
> OE GIF --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/OE.GIF<BR>
><BR>
> Query: My posts are now in monospace, correct? I see them that way.<BR>
><BR>
> World Icons --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/WorldsBZA.GIF<BR>
> Legend --> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/LegendAlt.GIF<BR>
> J6 Map/Lanth--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/IMGS/MAPS/J6mapLanth.GIF<BR>
> BZA's Traveller--> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/<BR>
> BZA's E-Mail--> xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 12:42:58 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/22/00 12:14 PM, carlino@home.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
>> How about links instead of lengthy cut-n-pastes for<BR>
>> OT posts?<BR>
>> <BR>
>> bloo<BR>
> <BR>
> Hate to disagree Steve, but I would consider this more on topic than the<BR>
> rather lengthy discussion of monospaced fonts or some of the other things<BR>
> posted here.<BR>
<BR>
I agree, and apologize to the list for allowing my ignorance to spawn a<BR>
computer operations lesson for a non-techno elf. If any want to continue,<BR>
let's move it to private mail. I have posted one other message on this that<BR>
should come through soon, I will post no more.<BR>
<BR>
BTW: I flagged the Camerone Day post, I thought it highly Traveller. YMMV<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 15:07:29 -0500<BR>
From: "Pat Connaughton" <pconn@i1.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
Evyn MacDude <BR>
Thanks for the reprise of Camerone. One of the <BR>
better synthesis of the this neat small action that<BR>
I've seen.<BR>
<BR>
Anyone written up any Traveller Small groups<BR>
actions like this that they'd care to post?<BR>
(Large group actions are ok too)<BR>
<BR>
These are the things that flesh out the canon and<BR>
make GMing fun.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks<BR>
Pat Connaughton <BR>
ICQ # 2535086<BR>
pconn@i1.net<BR>
"He who knows not how to dissemble knows not<BR>
how to reign"<BR>
Tiberius, Emperator and Princips of Rome<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 16:07:07 -0400<BR>
From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
Subject: Azhanti High Lightning<BR>
<BR>
A great big THANK YOU to:<BR>
<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I ordered a copy of the boxed set of AZH from Colin and received it today.<BR>
It is outstanding!!!! It's in better shape than I expected and the $69.00<BR>
price tag was more than $50.00 less than my highest bid for one on eBay<BR>
(which I didn't get). This is to let others know that Colin has good stuff.<BR>
You can track down some of those "harder to find" OOP Traveller books that<BR>
you read about on the TML without getting ripped off.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks again Colin!!!!!!<BR>
<BR>
Thom Harris<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 22:52:06 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: Sol Sec<BR>
<BR>
Loren writes:<BR>
<BR>
><< That material is classified.  Please report to SolSec for reconditioning.  <BR>
>>><BR>
> <BR>
>I _am_ SolSec, you clown!<BR>
 <BR>
Uh... Sorry sir, I didn't recognize you. Ah... I'll just go over there and<BR>
beat my head against the wall for a while. Have a nice day, sir.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 20:54:56 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Very late response on GURPS Modular Cutter et. all (LONG)<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Terry Carlino <carlino@home.com><BR>
<BR>
>  * Vehicles used for the handling and transport of cutters and cutter<BR>
>modules<BR>
><BR>
>Should tie in with containerized cargo rules from GT:FT. I never have been<BR>
>able to figure out how cutter modules and containers fit together.<BR>
Basically<BR>
>as far as I can figure out the smallest container 4D, at 10 x 10 x 10 ft,<BR>
is<BR>
>too large to be carried by a cutter module. From the module shown as part<BR>
of<BR>
>the Donosev in GT:FI the module is 7 x 16 1/2 x (an unspecified height) ft.<BR>
>I suppose that cutter modules could themselves be containerized for<BR>
>transport or stacked on a 60/8 pallet type container. Personally I always<BR>
>thought that the cutter module should have been included in the system from<BR>
>the start.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
The module shown in GT:FI appears to me to be 7 *yards* x 20 *yards*. As the<BR>
cutter is cylindrical, the module height should be the same as its diameter,<BR>
i.e. 7 yards. A total capacity of 3.14*(3.5^2)*20 = 769cu.yd or ~560m^3,<BR>
which is  ~40DT. If the diameter is actually 6 yards this falls to the<BR>
canonical 30DT for the module. Either way, you should be able to get several<BR>
standard cargo containers in a MC cargo module.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 17:30:35 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Chemistry Question...<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 21 Apr 2000 13:26:20 -0400 (EDT), shadow@krypton.rain.com<BR>
(Leonard Erickson) wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>> igor@truserve.com wrote:<BR>
 <BR>
>>> Anyone know what the freezing point of liquid ammonia and methane are?<BR>
<BR>
>>> I'm trying to figure out if a world has liquid or frozen oceans...<BR>
<BR>
>> According to:<BR>
<BR>
>> http://www.ch.ic.ac.uk/vchemlib/mol/simple/gases/ammoniasaf.html<BR>
<BR>
>> ammonia's melting point is -77.6 degrees Celsius (presumably at standard<BR>
>> pressure).<BR>
<BR>
>And the presence of water will result in freezing points all over the<BR>
>place depending on the relative proportions of water and ammonia. I<BR>
>seem to recall that the right mixture will have a melting point *lower*<BR>
>than that of plain ammonia!<BR>
<BR>
>Anybody know where I could find a phase diagram for water/ammonia<BR>
>mixtures? <BR>
<BR>
Yes - there's a book called "Rocheworld" by Robert L. Forward -<BR>
in the appendices, he has a _very_ good phase diagram for<BR>
water/ammonia mixtures, because that was the hydrosphere of the<BR>
Eau lobe of Rocheworld.  Great read.  Only problem is, the<BR>
atmospheric pressure of Rocheworld was only 0.2, so that's what<BR>
the phase diagram is calibrated for.<BR>
<BR>
(Yes, the same Robert L. Forward that's also known in the field<BR>
of theoretical physics.)<BR>
<BR>
>Check out Hal Clement's "Star Light" for some of the things that can<BR>
>happen if you have both water and ammonia available in quantity. Stuff<BR>
>like a lake freezing because the temp went *up* (which caused enough<BR>
>ammonia to evaporate that the remaining liquid was now below freezing...<BR>
<BR>
Also some good descriptions of this in Rocheworld.<BR>
<BR>
(N.B. "Rocheworld" is a somewhat expanded version of the story<BR>
originally published under the title "Flight of the Dragonfly".<BR>
"Rocheworld" is recommended due to the expanded material, but the<BR>
phase diagram can also be found in FotD.  Rocheworld, Robert L.<BR>
Forward. Baen Books, 1990. ISBN 0-671-69869-9. 470pp, ppb.)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:43:26 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: I used to be filthy rich.<BR>
<BR>
David P. Summers writes:<BR>
<BR>
>At 1:02 AM +0200 4/13/00, Hans Rancke-Madsen wrote:<BR>
>>I forget where it says so, but IIRC _FT_ gives the GM the option to just<BR>
>>give the PCs a ship and be done with it. Personally I consider that the<BR>
>>only fair way to do it. Why should one person be burdened with the cost<BR>
>>of a ship that is essential for the campaign? <BR>
><BR>
>It sounds to me like the ship is an option the player is taking,<BR>
>not a premise of the campaign....<BR>
<BR>
But that's the way it works for me. Certainly any campaign I ran for a group<BR>
with access to a ship would be very different than any campaign I ran for a<BR>
group without access to one. Or, to put it another way, if I were setting up<BR>
a new campaign, I would either require one of my players to have a ship or<BR>
prohibit any of them from having one. I most certainly wouldn't leave it to<BR>
fate (in a CT campaign) or player design (in a GT campaign) whether or not<BR>
they had a ship (Or two or three ;-). <BR>
<BR>
Or, to put it yet another way, the differences in how I would run a campaign<BR>
for players with a ship as opposed to a campaign for players without a ship<BR>
would affect all the players to a degree that would make it extremely unfair<BR>
to require only one of them to pay the price of the ship.<BR>
<BR>
David P. Summers writes:<BR>
<BR>
>At 4:33 AM +0200 4/13/00, Hans Rancke-Madsen wrote:<BR>
>>>On the other hand, if the character who owns the ship can give the PCs<BR>
>>>orders or can direct the direction of the campaign by being the final word<BR>
>>>on where his ship goes, it might be worth some points.  It's a definite<BR>
>>>advantage in those cases.<BR>
> <BR>
>>Sure, IF he can and, more importantly, IF he's actually going to do it. But<BR>
>>how many player groups have you known where the nominal superior is at best<BR>
>>the tie-breaker? And that only if the player who plays the superior happens<BR>
>>to be the dominant player in the group.<BR>
> <BR>
>I've seen it a number of times, and not just where the player is naturally<BR>
>dominant.  The idea that the owner of a ship simply won't take it <BR>
>where he doesn't want to go has often been a significant advantage.<BR>
<BR>
And I've never seen it. Our experiences obviously differ. As I said, most of<BR>
the decisions my players make are concensus decisions. If a ship owner<BR>
refused to take his ship where the rest of the crew wanted to go, they'd<BR>
propably all leave the ship at the next starport (Well, no, they propably<BR>
wouldn't, because I would propably find a way to get the campaign back on<BR>
track, but you get my drift).<BR>
 <BR>
>In this case, the player is also hoping for the advantage of gaining<BR>
>income from the ship (and may have more freedom to get where<BR>
>he wants to, be able to leave a planet quickly with less fuss, etc.)<BR>
 <BR>
OK, but what happens if you decide to run a _Far Trader_ campaign and all<BR>
the players refuse to buy a ship or even a ship rank? Do you make them the<BR>
grunts on a large trader and have half a dozen NPC officers running the<BR>
ship? And what happens if you have two players who both wants to own the<BR>
ship and won't share? Maybe you've been lucky enough to always have one and<BR>
only one player who were wiling and eager to pay for the ship and the<BR>
captaincy, but I can imagine player groups that are not quite so accomodating.<BR>
<BR>
Maybe things are different for you. And I admit that I can't claim that I've<BR>
tried running a _Far Trader_ campaign, but I strongly suspect that none of<BR>
my old players would want to play the ship owner.<BR>
<BR>
Come to that, how would you handle it if a group of PCs acquired title to a<BR>
ship in the course of a campaign (Not at all uncommon in a classic campaign)?<BR>
Stick one of them with the point cost of a ship and a captaincy? "Right,<BR>
Johnny, you won't be improving your character for the next 50 points. Have<BR>
a nice campaign!"<BR>
<BR>
>The premise of the Ship Patron is that, for some reason, the ship is not<BR>
>the players to sell or dispose of.  (It is mortaged, it is on loan, etc.)<BR>
<BR>
If I've spent a lot of time setting up a campaign that depends on the<BR>
players keeping their ship, the ship is damn well not the players' to<BR>
dispose of in practice, whatever the in-game legal position. It wouldn't<BR>
be enforced as such. I'd just tell the players ahead of time that the<BR>
owner wouldn't dream of parting with his precious ship, period.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 17:07:43 -0500<BR>
From: "Pat Connaughton" <pconn@i1.net><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: I used to be filthy rich.<BR>
<BR>
In re: runing a camapign with the players as ship owners<BR>
vs players as passengers.<BR>
<BR>
The vast majoroty of the campaigns that I've run<BR>
with the players as independents (ie not as willing/<BR>
unwilling cooptee's of some segment of the ruling<BR>
political/miliatary elite) have been as cooperative<BR>
ships' owners. In general they've either owned the<BR>
ship with equal shares and thus shared the burden<BR>
of ownership or had a PC recieve a ship as a<BR>
mustering out benefit and the other PC's have<BR>
purchased shares in the ship the limits of their<BR>
personal commitment and gone from their.<BR>
<BR>
I, personally, as a GM really like the campaigns<BR>
with the PC's not owning their own ship. I like the<BR>
degree of influence that it grants over direction<BR>
of the campaign<BR>
<BR>
Thanks<BR>
Pat Connaughton <BR>
ICQ # 2535086<BR>
pconn@i1.net<BR>
"He who knows not how to dissemble knows not<BR>
how to reign"<BR>
Tiberius, Emperator and Princips of Rome<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:08:10 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2338<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-22 02:06:57 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< (Psst...Loren... This PI "friend" happened to be hanging around when<BR>
 you did that. How much are you willing to pay for the negatives? :-)<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
Too late. Colin sold them to the Star already -- something about Bigfoot <BR>
joining a cult . . .<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:08:09 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Fossilsaurus<BR>
<BR>
<<samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
 Subject: Re: Broadsword-Class Mercenary Cruiser<BR>
 <BR>
 The Broadsword has always been a  fascinating craft.<BR>
 A semi-military vehicle, it has no fuel purification plant.<BR>
 Unstreamlined, it can still land on Garda-Vilis.<BR>
 With a listed troop compliment of 31, the namesake of the class holds only<BR>
 27, and 3 of those are noncombatant medics.<BR>
 I will always wonder about the Broadsword...>><BR>
<BR>
My advice is to try not to think about it so much.<BR>
<BR>
<<redroach@flex.net<BR>
 Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
 <BR>
 , listening to The <BR>
 > Who  >got me my first girlfriend, <BR>
 <BR>
 Then there is someone out there who can understand<BR>
 the lengths I had to go to  in order to secure tickets<BR>
 to this summer's who concert in Houston. >><BR>
<BR>
"I used to be with it. Then it changed -- what I'm with isn't it anymore and <BR>
what's it seems wierd and scarey to me. It'll happen to_you_!"<BR>
                                                  -- Abraham Simpson<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:08:12 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: FS Lite-saber<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-22 09:53:10 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< On second thought, I'm sure that FS could come up with a suitable<BR>
 replacement for a light saber. ;) >><BR>
<BR>
ANy bets on whether it would ignite the atmosphere?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:08:11 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Songs<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-22 02:06:57 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< >But if you try to record the song, things can get ugly.<BR>
  ...or perform it.  >><BR>
<BR>
This was the reason I was once given for why restaurants like TGI Friday's <BR>
have those stupid songs the waitstaff sings instead of _Happy Birthday_.<BR>
<BR>
But, as I understand it, _Happy Birthday_ entered public domain in 1996, <BR>
unless the recent finagling with copyright laws gave it an extension. <BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 14:00:41 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Yet Another Filk<BR>
<BR>
>So how does "Weird" Al Yankovic get away with it?<BR>
>Does he get permission for each song he parodies<BR>
>beforehand? And isn't such usage covered under<BR>
>the parody variety of "fair use" anyway?<BR>
><BR>
>Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
Yes and Maybe, in that order.<BR>
<BR>
Certain groups, like ASCAP, have certain rules on how to secure rights to<BR>
music registered through them. Once registered, essentially the composer no<BR>
longer controls who may perform it, ASCAP does, but the composer gets his<BR>
cut.<BR>
<BR>
Filking, however, is neither liscenced perfromace nor is it fair use (Which<BR>
in music is limited to 8 bars by US law. If you don't speak music, that's<BR>
about one phrase. As in, I can steal 8 bars of Coolio's music, and he can't<BR>
do anything. I can even repeat that 8 bars again and again. But if I use<BR>
more than those 8 bars, he owns the song I wrote unless I had permission.<BR>
Also, short blurbs from lyrics can be quoted in reviews.). Comedic<BR>
liscence, yes, but you still need the liscence to the music, and permission<BR>
to modify the piece (Almost automatic with liscence).<BR>
<BR>
Coolio tried to stop _almish paradise_. Al had, however, secured rights<BR>
through the Coolio's Label. (Coolio didn't know that HE doesn't control HIS<BR>
MUSIC once his label releases it... apparently he'd not read the contract.)<BR>
<BR>
Now, if you secure performance rights through a rights-liscencing group<BR>
like ASCAP, you can do your filk. But be careful, as they can still sue for<BR>
"Devaluation of Intellectual Property" in most areas, should they get bad<BR>
press over it (or you do).<BR>
<BR>
Now, from what I've read, performance in a non-commercial, non- or<BR>
semi-public, unpaid venue (IE, nobody is being charged to listen to it, no<BR>
one is getting paid to perform, and you're not broadcasting nor recording)<BR>
is generally considered fair use.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2341<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Sunday, April 23 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2342<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re Text-Mail<BR>
QUOTING<BR>
Where are the jump drives?<BR>
Re: Where are the jump drives?<BR>
Re: [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Re: GT-Q: I used to be filthy rich.<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
Re: Very late response on GURPS Modular Cutter et. all<BR>
RE: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Re: [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
St. George's Day and Heroic Stands<BR>
Light Saber?<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2332<BR>
Re : Chemistry Question (methane/ammonia, ammonia/water, etc.)<BR>
Re: Sonic Booms<BR>
RE: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
Re: Light Saber?<BR>
X-boat?<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: Azhanti High Lightning<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: Lanth6 Notes<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 14:14:15 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Text-Mail<BR>
<BR>
>>> I just checked. You have to use Wordpad, not notepad (under Win 95,<BR>
>>> notepad uses the default desktop font). Wordpad, on my rather minimal<BR>
>>> setup has "modem" available as a font, which is a non-proportional font.<BR>
>><BR>
>> Well, I'm on a Mac, and when I said "notepad" I should have said BBEdit<BR>
>> document. I have what looks like a pulldown menu at the top of the message<BR>
>> window, but it is greyed out. I can change the /color/ of the text just<BR>
>> fine! ;) As you can probably tell by now, computers are not my forte'. So<BR>
>> all you TMLers who are without webpages take note, as I am quite<BR>
>> computer-illiterate, and have found that html isn't all /that/ hard. Try it<BR>
>> out, you'll likely get hooked!<BR>
><BR>
>Sounds like you need to try something simpler, like TeachText. (Yes,<BR>
>I've branched out into Macs, but I'm just a Novice).<BR>
><BR>
Eudora light defaults to monospaced fonts. And is an email client in it's<BR>
own right. Works fine on both mac and windoze.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 14:38:34 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: QUOTING<BR>
<BR>
Damage169@cs.com misquoth me thusly:<BR>
>William F. Hostman writes:<BR>
><BR>
>> That's basically what 'unstreamlined' means in GT.  Which doesn't account<BR>
>>  for why merchants are streamlined, the various free and far traders would<BR>
>>  be vastly superior designs if built unstreamlined with contragravity.<BR>
>><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
I did NOT write the above; it was someone's response to my post (which was<BR>
in response to a previous post). I've been getting rather annoyed last few<BR>
weeks by people misattributing quoted sections. **PLEASE** check your<BR>
attributions. Carefully. If you aren't going to check, then don't attribute<BR>
the quotation.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 15:43:17 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Where are the jump drives?<BR>
<BR>
According to CT's The Spinward Marches Supplement (first <BR>
printing) TTL 7 is described as circa 1970 to 1989,<BR>
TL 8 is not on the chart, and TTL 9 is circa 1990 to 2000.<BR>
Therefore we are at late TTL 9 and will hit TTL 10 in less<BR>
than a year. [CT Sup 3 p. 39]<BR>
<BR>
I want the jump drives and the air rafts!<BR>
<BR>
Maybe we don't have air rafts yet since they are TTL 8 in <BR>
CT and TTL 8 apparently does not exist (Yes I'm kidding)<BR>
but since we are TTL 9 where are the jump drives? I want<BR>
to get a TTL 9 Scout courier and head for the rim, but<BR>
if I commission one today it won't be finished until next <BR>
year, which should make it TTL 10.<BR>
<BR>
If anyone on the list has a degree in Ancient Languages<BR>
and speaks fluent Sumerian please let me know so you<BR>
can come with me in case we encounter any Vilani. :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:57:13 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Where are the jump drives?<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> According to CT's The Spinward Marches Supplement (first<BR>
> printing) TTL 7 is described as circa 1970 to 1989,<BR>
> TL 8 is not on the chart, and TTL 9 is circa 1990 to 2000.<BR>
> Therefore we are at late TTL 9 and will hit TTL 10 in less<BR>
> than a year. [CT Sup 3 p. 39]<BR>
> <BR>
> I want the jump drives and the air rafts!<BR>
> <BR>
> Maybe we don't have air rafts yet since they are TTL 8 in<BR>
> CT and TTL 8 apparently does not exist (Yes I'm kidding)<BR>
> but since we are TTL 9 where are the jump drives? I want<BR>
> to get a TTL 9 Scout courier and head for the rim, but<BR>
> if I commission one today it won't be finished until next<BR>
> year, which should make it TTL 10.<BR>
<BR>
The _real_ problem is that they haven't invented the Imperial Credit<BR>
yet, nor will they for quite some time.  Therefore, nobody can _buy_ the<BR>
jump drives or air rafts.<BR>
<BR>
Maybe we should write Alan Greenspan and tell him to get cracking on<BR>
those CrImps.<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 10:34:27 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Terry Carlino" <BR>
> >How about links instead of lengthy cut-n-pastes for<BR>
> >OT posts?<BR>
> ><BR>
> >bloo<BR>
> <BR>
> Hate to disagree Steve, but I would consider this more on topic than the<BR>
> rather lengthy discussion of monospaced fonts or some of the other things<BR>
> posted here. Especially since I see the IM as a descendent of the Legion,<BR>
as<BR>
> well as the USMC and Royal Marines and the Sylean Marines. At least IMTU<BR>
> Camerone Day is right up there with the Emperor's Birthday. It's the day<BR>
> that the IM celebrate in much the same way as the USMC does on the Corps<BR>
> Birthday. The Youngest and the Eldest raise a toast to the Emperor and<BR>
the<BR>
> Corps and to all the Marines that have ever died in defense of the<BR>
Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Well, I'm in a funny situation in this case.  My response to the initial<BR>
post was *anger*.  I don't like the Legion, for reasons that are actually a<BR>
little more rational than the "3I=Third Reich" guy, but draw from similar<BR>
sentiments.  As well, I regard them as overrated - they've been beaten in<BR>
every war they've fought in, from Camerone/Mexico to Dienbienphu/Vietnam. <BR>
They've even been beaten by Australians.<BR>
<BR>
My buttons got pushed.  Still, it probably is somewhere closer to being on<BR>
topic than a lot of stuff that gets posted.  And IMTU, the Legion have long<BR>
since passed into deserved oblivion.  <BR>
<BR>
Bloo is probably right about sending links rather than whole articles about<BR>
OT subjects though.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:33:56 -0700<BR>
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: I used to be filthy rich.<BR>
<BR>
At 11:43 PM +0200 4/22/00, Hans Rancke-Madsen wrote:<BR>
>  >It sounds to me like the ship is an option the player is taking,<BR>
>  >not a premise of the campaign....<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>But that's the way it works for me. Certainly any campaign I ran for a group<BR>
>with access to a ship would be very different than any campaign I ran for a<BR>
>group without access to one. Or, to put it another way, if I were setting up<BR>
>a new campaign, I would either require one of my players to have a ship or<BR>
>prohibit any of them from having one. I most certainly wouldn't leave it to<BR>
>fate (in a CT campaign) or player design (in a GT campaign) whether or not<BR>
>they had a ship (Or two or three ;-).<BR>
<BR>
Then giving a ship for free would seem to be the way to go<BR>
for you...<BR>
<BR>
But that is not true in all cases and that is what the rules<BR>
are their for.  After all, a GM doesn't really need rules<BR>
on how to give PCs a ship for free....  :-)<BR>
<BR>
______________________________<BR>
summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>
(This is the net.  My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 18:06:58 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
><BR>
>> > Remember, Doug's a paratrooper.  Therefore, he has better uses for his<BR>
>>  > testosterone than killing hair follicles.<BR>
>>  <BR>
>>  Paratroopers don't *need* testosterone! <BR>
><BR>
> Ah, but they do look good in silk :)<BR>
<BR>
That's *not* what you are supposed to do with your parachute!<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 22:37:57 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Very late response on GURPS Modular Cutter et. all<BR>
<BR>
From: Terry Carlino <carlino@home.com><BR>
<BR>
>Basically<BR>
>>as far as I can figure out the smallest container 4D, at 10 x 10 x 10 ft,<BR>
>is<BR>
>>too large to be carried by a cutter module. From the module shown as part<BR>
>of<BR>
>>the Donosev in GT:FI the module is 7 x 16 1/2 x (an unspecified height)<BR>
ft.<BR>
>>I suppose that cutter modules could themselves be containerized for<BR>
>>transport or stacked on a 60/8 pallet type container. Personally I always<BR>
>>thought that the cutter module should have been included in the system<BR>
from<BR>
>>the start.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>The module shown in GT:FI appears to me to be 7 *yards* x 20 *yards*. As<BR>
the<BR>
>cutter is cylindrical, the module height should be the same as its<BR>
diameter,<BR>
><BR>
Now that I have once again proven my ability to fail to read the simplest<BR>
diagram I will go back to my highly technical job in sub-nuclear physics and<BR>
hope nobody notices.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 23:15:00 -0400<BR>
From: "John Toth" <jrtoth@bbtel.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
<BR>
True...<BR>
<BR>
But you must have missed the old PT shorts.  Back in the Late 80's, the<BR>
Troops in Division were issues these Polyester, Silky shorts. They were<BR>
Bright Mustard Yellow in Color with black piping.<BR>
<BR>
I always hated hearing my Sgt. yell out, "First Call! PT in 30 Min's - PT<BR>
uniform is Colors".<BR>
<BR>
So much for Macho.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
John T<BR>
C 2/504 PIR<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Leonard<BR>
Erickson<BR>
Sent: Saturday, April 22, 2000 10:07 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
><BR>
>> > Remember, Doug's a paratrooper.  Therefore, he has better uses for his<BR>
>>  > testosterone than killing hair follicles.<BR>
>><BR>
>>  Paratroopers don't *need* testosterone!<BR>
><BR>
> Ah, but they do look good in silk :)<BR>
<BR>
That's *not* what you are supposed to do with your parachute!<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 00:11:13 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
> > (By the way, I find it odd that CT Supplement 4 was called "Citizens<BR>
> > of the Imperium." Wouldn't "Subjects of the Imperium" make more<BR>
> > sense?)<BR>
><BR>
> Why? The term Citizen indicates that the holder is possessed of a certain<BR>
> number of rights under law, as were the citizens of Rome under the Roman<BR>
> republic and later the Roman Empire. Subject indicates that all rights are<BR>
> embodied in the sovereign. While the Emperor is very powerful in the 3I, the<BR>
> Moot has the power to dissolve the 3I, on paper at least. They means he is<BR>
> not all powerful. The Warrant of Restoration, and associated constitution<BR>
> give citizens certain rights, among them some right to appeal to the<BR>
> nobility for adjudication, the right to not be enslaved, etc.<BR>
<BR>
As I recall, in the United Kingdom they use the term "subjects" rather than<BR>
"citizens" (if any British contributors know I'm wrong, by all means, tell me!),<BR>
even though the UK is a democracy and subjects enjoy many of the same<BR>
liberal-democratic freedoms as American citizens (even if there's no<BR>
formal Bill of Rights like in the US). I believe that "subjects" is the standard<BR>
term in a constitutional monarchy, but again I'm no expert.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 00:11:20 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
> For what it's worth, the very *word* anarchist first appeared in the late<BR>
> 17th century, although the "golden age" of anarchism came at the end of the<BR>
> 19th century and the beginning of the 20th. Still, there were plenty of<BR>
> radical groups in 17th century England.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, you're right. I didn't know anarchism was a 17th-centry term, but<BR>
I *do* remember the Diggers and the Levellers, and wouldn't surprised<BR>
to hear of genuine anarchists on the fringes of the English Civil War.<BR>
My mistake.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 00:11:29 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
> I hope you can talk<BR>
> your potential player out of his silly ideas. Or at least convince him that<BR>
> the mere presence of an "Evil Empire" in the setting is no cause to dis the<BR>
> game. <BR>
<BR>
Actually, I just talked to him today.  To my surprise he just bought the<BR>
classic Traveller reprints and wants to run a CT campaign<BR>
of his own! Ghod knows what game *I'm* going to be running.... <BR>
<BR>
I just hope his Imperial officials won't have thick German accents.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 01:34:30 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: [OT] Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
Terry Carlino wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >How about links instead of lengthy cut-n-pastes for<BR>
> >OT posts?<BR>
> ><BR>
> >bloo<BR>
><BR>
> Hate to disagree Steve, but I would consider this more on topic than the<BR>
> rather lengthy discussion of monospaced fonts or some of the other things<BR>
> posted here.<BR>
<BR>
We can all debate whether its OT or not, but that wasn't the<BR>
thrust of my point.  My point was simply to encourage<BR>
the URL vs. the lengthy cut-n-paste of something from the URL.<BR>
<BR>
Subject headers like "monospaced" never get read by me in<BR>
the first place.  Or "near-c rocks", etc.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 01:55:01 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: St. George's Day and Heroic Stands<BR>
<BR>
I note that today is St. George's Day, as well as the 49th anniversary<BR>
of the Battle of Gloster Hill (Korea, 22-25 April 1951).  Those<BR>
interested in this battle can go to<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/~mspirit/korea/Imjin.html<BR>
<BR>
for a partial account of the battle.  More information can be found in<BR>
T.R. Fehrenbach's _This Kind of War: A Study in Unpreparedness_.<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav:  As with Camerone Day, accounts of desperate stands against a<BR>
superior foe can easily be adapted to Traveller.  One can also find in<BR>
military history some interesting traditions of long-standing regiments<BR>
(the FFL parading Captain Danjou's wooden hand [recovered from the<BR>
Mexicans] as a relic, or the Gloucestershire Regiment being the only<BR>
British regiment authorized to wear two cap ornaments [commemorating<BR>
their back-to-back stand stand against the Frence in the battle for the<BR>
Nile]).  IMTU (and IMHO), traditions such as these bring units "to<BR>
life."<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 09:02:32 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Light Saber?<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer schrieb:<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> Actually, we *do* have something similar. Antti Lahtinen's 'Laser Sword' is<BR>
> a damn funky weapon which has been on BARD for quite some time.<BR>
><BR>
> The basic principle is that you have a flashlight-sized handle, with a low<BR>
> power laser rangefinder and a weapon-grade emitter on one end, a power<BR>
> selector ring, a battery and a capacitor bank.<BR>
[snip] <BR>
<BR>
:-)<BR>
What would you pay for uch an "ingenious" device? And who would pay? A<BR>
few noble dandies?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
Hiroshi.Estigarribia@gmx.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 00:55:09 -0700<BR>
From: Evyn MacDude <wmacdude@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2332<BR>
<BR>
GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In a message dated 00-04-20 13:21:16 EDT, you write:<BR>
><BR>
> << > Loren is Judge Dredd?!<BR>
><BR>
>  Can't be he don't look that good in leather spandex....<BR>
>   >><BR>
><BR>
> Hang on . . . I'll be AFK for a bit ...<BR>
><BR>
> Yeah, you're right.<BR>
<BR>
 See......<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Evyn...<BR>
<BR>
C-Space home http://home.att.net/~wmacdude/<BR>
<BR>
Get six jolly cowboys to carry my coffin<BR>
Get six pretty maidens to bear up my pall<BR>
Bunches of roses all over my coffin<BR>
Roses to deaden the clods as they fall<BR>
 Laredo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:38:46 +1000<BR>
From: "Robert O'Connor" <robocon@ozemail.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re : Chemistry Question (methane/ammonia, ammonia/water, etc.)<BR>
<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin wrote :-<BR>
> >Anybody know where I could find a phase diagram for water/ammonia<BR>
> >mixtures? <BR>
> <BR>
> Yes - there's a book called "Rocheworld" by Robert L. Forward -<BR>
<snip><BR>
> Great read.  Only problem is, the<BR>
> atmospheric pressure of Rocheworld was only 0.2, so that's what<BR>
> the phase diagram is calibrated for.<BR>
<BR>
Cool ; I'll have to get a copy.<BR>
Extrapolating from the diagram shouldn't be a huge problem.<BR>
I assume we're operating well below the critical points of ammonia [405K<BR>
and ~11MPa] and water [647K and ~21MPa] in most situations.<BR>
<BR>
In the regime of extreme pressures and temperatures the following<BR>
article has a useful phase diagram :-<BR>
Cavazzoni C. et al. Superionic and Metallic States of Water and Ammonia<BR>
at Giant Planet Conditions. Science 283(5398) 1/1/99 p.44-46.<BR>
<BR>
Bolie Williams IV wrote :-<BR>
> You can find detailed information on Ammonia at the NIST<BR>
> Chemistry Webbook:  http://webbook.nist.gov/chemistry/fluid/<BR>
> <BR>
Thanks for the URL, but I had already looked there. It's a<BR>
pretty neat site - you can build phase diagrams (choose your units and<BR>
projection) involving any 2 out of 3 phases.<BR>
<BR>
Back to Andy Akin's original question :-<BR>
> Anyone know what the freezing point of liquid ammonia and methane are?<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm trying to figure out if a world has liquid or frozen oceans...<BR>
<BR>
The information we need to know is :-<BR>
How soluble is ammonia in methane?<BR>
     Methane isn't polar, so ammonia won't dissolve all that well in it.<BR>
     My gut feeling is that most of the ammonia will be frozen at the<BR>
     bottom of the methane lakes.<BR>
Will it have a freezing point depression effect?<BR>
If so, how much?<BR>
     Yes, but it will be small due to the poor solubility.<BR>
Unfortunately, I don't have any numbers to quantify this for you.<BR>
<BR>
Andy, the SF reference I can best recall is Steven Baxter's 'Titan' for<BR>
a description of the conditions of the world you're detailing. Lots of<BR>
tholin snow and ice, ethane lakes, etc.<BR>
<BR>
Sorry ; I got a little side-tracked.<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor<BR>
Medico, Gamer<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 10:11:15 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Sonic Booms<BR>
<BR>
At 02:51 PM 4/16/00, you wrote:<BR>
>Charles C. writes:<BR>
><BR>
> >   Now picture this:  Some PCs are on a planet surface in potentially<BR>
> >  hostile territory.  They see the glint of something entering the<BR>
> >  atmosphere and hear "BOOM... [3 seconds pass] ...BOOM".  Whoops, time to<BR>
> >  duck and cover! :-)<BR>
> ><BR>
><BR>
>"It's the'MONTANA!"<BR>
><BR>
>Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
         More like "WHERE"S MY AIR DEFENSE SYSTEM!  I PAID *MONEY* FOR THAT!"<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 09:21:20<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
<BR>
At 11:15 PM 4/22/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>But you must have missed the old PT shorts.  Back in the Late 80's, the<BR>
>Troops in Division were issues these Polyester, Silky shorts. They were<BR>
>Bright Mustard Yellow in Color with black piping.<BR>
<BR>
In the mid eighties we suffered through the banana suit.  Bright yellow<BR>
jogging pants and jacket.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 14:46:01 -0500<BR>
From: Shimmergloom <dragon@mhtc.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Saber?<BR>
<BR>
I've got 1500.00 US$ I'll give you for one...  Oh... wait a minute.  You<BR>
meant in game.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Ingo Heinscher wrote:<BR>
> Nick Bradbeer schrieb:<BR>
> > Actually, we *do* have something similar. Antti Lahtinen's 'Laser Sword' is<BR>
> > a damn funky weapon which has been on BARD for quite some time.<BR>
<BR>
SNIP<BR>
<BR>
> What would you pay for uch an "ingenious" device? And who would pay? A<BR>
> few noble dandies?<BR>
- -------------------------<BR>
Earth first!   We'll strip mine the other planets later...<BR>
<BR>
dragon@mhtc.net<BR>
http://www.mhtc.net/~dragon/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 14:42:00 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
Does the x-boat mailing list mentioned on the "welcome<BR>
to Traveller" message still exist?<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 15:45:33 -0600<BR>
From: Erwin Fritz <efritz@GLJA.com><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
Arthur Boff wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Does the x-boat mailing list mentioned on the "welcome<BR>
> to Traveller" message still exist?<BR>
<BR>
Nope, not for years now. It and the TML almalgamated into this list a<BR>
few years back.<BR>
- -- <BR>
Erwin Fritz<BR>
Gilbert Laustsen Jung Associates Ltd.<BR>
http://www.glja.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 17:49:28 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Azhanti High Lightning<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
<BR>
> A great big THANK YOU to:<BR>
<BR>
<blush> gosh </blush><BR>
<BR>
That reminds me, the other day I received a copy of the japanese version of<BR>
Azhanti High Lightning.  I was surprized to find that it looks completely<BR>
different than the GDW version.  The box is about 9x12 and is 2 inches<BR>
tall/deep.  It is black with a huge color drawing of an oncoming AHL and has<BR>
purple and red lettering.  The rules booklet and supplement 5 are in 8.5x11"<BR>
format and the deck plans are folded twice.  The plans are annotated in<BR>
japanese.  Included in the box is a little tray for storing/sorting the<BR>
counters (a la Invasion: Earth) and two little dice.  Interesting note about<BR>
the dice: the single pip side has a large red pip instead of a small black<BR>
one.  I wonder if japanese Traveller players think the official sun and cog<BR>
of the Imperium is red?  :-)<BR>
<BR>
I asked Marc how much of Traveller was licensed by Hobby Japan Co. Ltd, who<BR>
did this version of AHL.  He said that most of CT and at least the first<BR>
three books of MT were produced in japanese versions... cool!  A whole new<BR>
set of Traveller to collect!  Excuse me while I zip off to some japanese<BR>
hobby/game store web sites ;-)<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 18:09:45 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: "Erwin Fritz" <efritz@GLJA.com><BR>
<BR>
> Arthur Boff wrote:<BR>
> > <BR>
> > Does the x-boat mailing list mentioned on the "welcome<BR>
> > to Traveller" message still exist?<BR>
> <BR>
> Nope, not for years now. It and the TML almalgamated into this list a<BR>
> few years back.<BR>
<BR>
But we still sing the Banana X-boat Song :-)<BR>
<BR>
BTW, welcome to our worm hole, Arthur.  <BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 16:18:27 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth6 Notes<BR>
<BR>
Well, This is real rough, but navigable.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Lanth6/Main.html<BR>
<BR>
The old map will soon be deleted, the highlights are now gone, and the color<BR>
palette the later one with a greater grey scale. The frameset for Lanth6<BR>
main is minimal.<BR>
<BR>
Oh, and some* might be interested in....<BR>
<BR>
Hypercleats' Launch Page: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/index.html<BR>
<BR>
*especially Mac users.<BR>
////////////////////////////////////////<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2342<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2343</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	4/24/00 5:35:35 AM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Monday, April 24 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2343<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Light Saber?<BR>
Re: Light Saber?<BR>
Renderings<BR>
Re: Re : Chemistry Question (methane/ammonia, ammonia/water, etc.)<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
re: St. George's Day and Heroic Stands<BR>
Re: Grav powered floating cities<BR>
(no subject)<BR>
Armed Mail Ships (was re: No Subject)<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Nihonjin Traveller<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
Subjects V Citizens<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
Re: Very late response on GURPS Modular Cutter et. all<BR>
Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 15:15:57 -0400<BR>
From: "Daniel Phelps" <phelpsd@gate.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Saber?<BR>
<BR>
Was written:<BR>
<BR>
>> Actually, we *do* have something similar. Antti Lahtinen's 'Laser Sword'<BR>
is<BR>
>> a damn funky weapon which has been on BARD for quite some time.<BR>
>><BR>
>> The basic principle is that you have a flashlight-sized handle, with a<BR>
low<BR>
>> power laser rangefinder and a weapon-grade emitter on one end, a power<BR>
>> selector ring, a battery and a capacitor bank.<BR>
>[snip]<BR>
><BR>
>:-)<BR>
>What would you pay for uch an "ingenious" device? And who would pay? A<BR>
>few noble dandies?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
While this may dredge up an ancient debate way back when IMTU I did a tongue<BR>
in cheek design for a "light sword" that acted like the "light saber" out of<BR>
SW.  It involved massive hand waves, ....very massive hand waves.  It was<BR>
based on something called the "fountained particle beam effect" which was<BR>
originally used in asteroid mining applications.  As a hand held weapon what<BR>
it boils down to was a katana hilt sized particle beam emitter and focused<BR>
gravitic operated particle recycling unit.  Switched on it operated in the<BR>
following fashion.  After the particles have traveled  a sword length they<BR>
are pulled back down by a ring shaped focused grav field surrounding the<BR>
beam emitter in the hilt.  They required expensive materials ...very<BR>
expensive materials; specially tuned lanthium power cells, specially cut,<BR>
reputedly by psionic gem cutters no less, zocuicci (sic) crystals to focus<BR>
the systems, and some of that room temperature super conductor out of the<BR>
Fasa "Seven Pillars" adventure.   They were hand crafted high tech devices<BR>
specifically tuned to a particular "hand".   A noble's weapon requiring<BR>
special training to use, you had to have special authorization to own and<BR>
carry one and be at least an imperial knight.  A special "cult of the blade"<BR>
mystique went with it.  The power of the weapon  depended on the color of<BR>
the beam in a standard atmosphere at its max power.  The colors ascended in<BR>
power by a ROYGBIV progression.  Indigo blades were not available and violet<BR>
blades were only "theoretical".   I don't remember all the stats but a<BR>
medium power blade could slice half way through standard battle dress, that<BR>
is to say through the front half bisect the person inside and scour the BD<BR>
back on the inside.   They came in sets of two, a low power red "practice"<BR>
blade which could be set by the owner to a "hand" other than his own and a<BR>
second "true" blade.  When you were "allowed" to order a set they came out<BR>
of specific craftsman's shops with the "true" blade having been made and<BR>
"trued" by a master.  Certain master's blades were in higher demand than<BR>
others.  The "great masters" were often designated as "living imperial<BR>
treasures".   When buying you ordered the specific color you were<BR>
authorized.  If you ordered a green blade and it needed to be constructed<BR>
there was so much variability in the process the individual blade finally<BR>
produced might turn out to be yellow, green or blue.  If green you accepted<BR>
it,  if yellow you could reject it and if blue it went to someone who was<BR>
authorized to bear it.  As would be expected there was a market in older,<BR>
"historic" and "family" blades.  When someone died or could no longer use a<BR>
weapon due infirmity or more likely failure to maintain the required level<BR>
of skill through practice the blade was depending on the rank of the noble<BR>
held in trust as an legacy and passed on like a coat of arms for an<BR>
authorized user.<BR>
<BR>
Blades were charged like laser rifle power packs, the duration of a blade's<BR>
charge varied with the blade.  Turning the blade on a standard atmosphere<BR>
took a set percentage of the charge each time one was cycled up.<BR>
<BR>
The weapon was intended as up close and personal defense against heavy<BR>
armor.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 19:51:49 -0400<BR>
From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Saber?<BR>
<BR>
How about posting the stats on your Sabre?<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
 J-Man<BR>
 ICQ# 2843475<BR>
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
 Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
 Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Daniel Phelps" <phelpsd@gate.net><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Sunday, April 23, 2000 3:15 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Light Saber?<BR>
><BR>
> While this may dredge up an ancient debate way back when IMTU I did a<BR>
tongue<BR>
> in cheek design for a "light sword" that acted like the "light saber" out<BR>
of<BR>
> SW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 01:01:05 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Renderings<BR>
<BR>
Yet more shameless plugging...<BR>
<BR>
In case anyone's interested, renderings are now up on my site for:<BR>
Wyvern SDB: www.nickb.ndirect.co.uk/tneships/SDB_Wyve.html<BR>
Hammer Hvy Fighter: www.nickb.ndirect.co.uk/tneships/HT_Hamme.html<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 16:50:58 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re : Chemistry Question (methane/ammonia, ammonia/water, etc.)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Jeff Zeitlin wrote :-<BR>
>> >Anybody know where I could find a phase diagram for water/ammonia<BR>
>> >mixtures? <BR>
>> <BR>
>> Yes - there's a book called "Rocheworld" by Robert L. Forward -<BR>
> <snip><BR>
>> Great read.  Only problem is, the<BR>
>> atmospheric pressure of Rocheworld was only 0.2, so that's what<BR>
>> the phase diagram is calibrated for.<BR>
><BR>
> Cool ; I'll have to get a copy.<BR>
> Extrapolating from the diagram shouldn't be a huge problem.<BR>
> I assume we're operating well below the critical points of ammonia [405K<BR>
> and ~11MPa] and water [647K and ~21MPa] in most situations.<BR>
<BR>
Check out Clement's "Close to Critical" for a planet with a surface<BR>
near the critical point of water... <BR>
<BR>
> In the regime of extreme pressures and temperatures the following<BR>
> article has a useful phase diagram :-<BR>
> Cavazzoni C. et al. Superionic and Metallic States of Water and Ammonia<BR>
> at Giant Planet Conditions. Science 283(5398) 1/1/99 p.44-46.<BR>
<BR>
I somehow doubt that the players, or ever remote probes are going to<BR>
fare well under *those* conditions... :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 22:13:35 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
At 06:42 PM 4/23/00, you wrote:<BR>
>Does the x-boat mailing list mentioned on the "welcome<BR>
>to Traveller" message still exist?<BR>
<BR>
         Nope...  the closest things to it are the "Society of Classic <BR>
Traveller Architects" list on E-Groups (ship building, Striker list) and <BR>
the "Classic Traveller" list which I host that gets zero traffic.<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 18:36:30 -0700<BR>
From: "Kelly St.Clair" <kellys@efn.org><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 23 Apr 2000 18:09:45 -0400, "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
>From: "Erwin Fritz" <efritz@GLJA.com><BR>
><BR>
> > Arthur Boff wrote:<BR>
> > ><BR>
> > > Does the x-boat mailing list mentioned on the "welcome<BR>
> > > to Traveller" message still exist?<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Nope, not for years now. It and the TML almalgamated into this list a<BR>
> > few years back.<BR>
><BR>
>But we still sing the Banana X-boat Song :-)<BR>
<BR>
Deyo!  Deyyyo...<BR>
Virus come and it wrecka my home.<BR>
<BR>
(your humble author - blame the Gralyn-n-Grendel pocket empire list for <BR>
inspiring me :)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --------------<BR>
Kelly St.Clair    "You know, Brink, you've been acting funny ever since<BR>
kellys@efn.org     you came back from the dead.  (I can't believe I just<BR>
                    said that.)"    -- Commander Boston Low, THE DIG<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 21:50:06 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: re: St. George's Day and Heroic Stands<BR>
<BR>
Black Ice wrote:<BR>
>ObTrav:  As with Camerone Day, accounts of desperate stands against a<BR>
>superior foe can easily be adapted to Traveller.  <BR>
<BR>
Example: The defense of the _Bard Endeavor_, when Imperial Marines<BR>
and Imperial Navy personnel successfully defended the _Bard_ against<BR>
overwhelming odds, keeping the ship's advanced technology from<BR>
falling into Solomani hands.  The fact that Navy and Marines worked<BR>
together would make this event politically popular as well.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 23:12:02 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Grav powered floating cities<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 3/28/00 2:33:54 PM Mountain Standard Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
>  Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 12:59:00 -0800<BR>
>  From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
>  Subject: Re: Grav Powered Floating Cities<BR>
>  <BR>
>  How much do you suppose a typical city weighs? Even in the Traveller world<BR>
>  of abundant energy, it might take way too much energy to keep a grav <BR>
powered<BR>
>  city up, since you will need to overcome the gravity from the planet on a<BR>
>  7x24 basis (or whatever the local time units are). Since I'm at work now, I<BR>
>  don't have the time to do a calculation, but my intuition tells me that a<BR>
>  lot of energy will be required to keep one of these guys up. On the other<BR>
>  hand, it may provide a practical llimit to the size of a floating city.<BR>
>  <BR>
>  ------------------------------<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
Not really.  It takes no energy at all to sit at any given altitude, provided <BR>
you can generate the force to counteract gravitational attraction. Assuming <BR>
you have grav vield generators, you only need to compensate for losses in the <BR>
generators. (That's the big problem...all we have available are buoyant <BR>
forces, which require that you be lighter than air, and aerodynamic forces, <BR>
which require continous motion through a resisting medium with hideous losses <BR>
that the generators must compensate for.) <BR>
What would really take the energy is moving up. Likewise a controlled descent <BR>
would dump energy into the field generators.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 23:12:03 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: (no subject)<BR>
<BR>
In every version of Traveller, it is stated that ships that carry mail must <BR>
be armed<BR>
and carry a gunner. I don't fully understand the reasoning here...can someone <BR>
suggest a good reason?<BR>
1) Most commercial carriers, including those carrying mail, are more <BR>
interested in getting their cargo to its proper destination than in combat.  <BR>
If travel is dangerous enough that there is any need to go armed, most simply <BR>
won't go unless there is enough potential profit to balance the added risk.<BR>
2) Wouldn't merchants and mail carriers be just as well served by requiring <BR>
some kind of defenses like sandcasters? I would think they would want to <BR>
escape, rather than stay and slug it out with an attacker.<BR>
On the other side of the questions, there is the idea that the arms are like <BR>
locks. You can't stop a determined professional pirate (whether they exist or <BR>
not): the weapons are just to help honest people stay that way.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 23:30:49 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Armed Mail Ships (was re: No Subject)<BR>
<BR>
TOCoons wrote:<BR>
>In every version of Traveller, it is stated that ships that carry mail must <BR>
>be armed and carry a gunner. I don't fully understand the reasoning <BR>
>here...can someone suggest a good reason?<BR>
<BR>
To keep the riff-raff out.  A starship with a starship-grade laser is<BR>
pretty much immune to lots of minor threats, like someone threatening<BR>
to ram you with a remote-piloted launch, or a desperate Belter trying<BR>
to hijack you with his prospecting buggy and a mining laser.  It'll<BR>
even make a Pirate think twice, as a single hit can cost millions of<BR>
MCr to fix, and pirates probably don't have shipowner's insurance.<BR>
<BR>
Bottom line: A ship with an active weapon mount is more secure<BR>
secure than one without, even if the difference in security is minor<BR>
or more percieved than actual.  The more secure ship gets the mail<BR>
contract.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:21:04 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Matt Stevens Quoth and replied thusly to a person unnamed:<BR>
>> > (By the way, I find it odd that CT Supplement 4 was called "Citizens<BR>
>> > of the Imperium." Wouldn't "Subjects of the Imperium" make more<BR>
>> > sense?)<BR>
>><BR>
>As I recall, in the United Kingdom they use the term "subjects" rather than<BR>
>"citizens" (if any British contributors know I'm wrong, by all means, tell<BR>
>me!),<BR>
>even though the UK is a democracy and subjects enjoy many of the same<BR>
>liberal-democratic freedoms as American citizens (even if there's no<BR>
>formal Bill of Rights like in the US). I believe that "subjects" is the<BR>
>standard<BR>
>term in a constitutional monarchy, but again I'm no expert.<BR>
><BR>
To some of us out there, the fact that subjects made more sense for the<BR>
bulk of the population indicated to us that the careers from Supp 4 were<BR>
those non-military careers that got you Imperial Citizenship. Or were at<BR>
least likely to. And so IMTU, and several friends' TUs (but not Peter's TU)<BR>
there is a distiction between Imperial subject, and Imperial Citizen.<BR>
Despite the reference from a DGP product which sated "Any sapient being<BR>
within the imperium is a citizen, and thus a protected being." IMTU, that<BR>
quote is changed to subject. Citizens have established that they have been<BR>
either interplanetary types, citizens by being on an Imperial Protectorate<BR>
(thus barbarians), or have contributed to imperial governance as a member<BR>
of the academic, scientific, medical, military or impperial bureaucratic<BR>
communities. Then again, IMTU, a Corsair/Starmerc liscence makes your<BR>
vessel subject to recall with crew... and a merc liscence makes your unit<BR>
subject to imperialization as well.<BR>
<BR>
	Supp 4 MADE MTU, and MT refined it. Supps 7 and 9 had almost as<BR>
much impact, and Supps 8 & 11 gave me the history and neat ideas. But,<BR>
prior to about 6 years ago, I only owned 4 adventures (despite having all<BR>
the books and supplements): Beltstrike, The Traveller Adventure,  Adv 3 and<BR>
Adv 0.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 20:24:18 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Nihonjin Traveller<BR>
<BR>
>I asked Marc how much of Traveller was licensed by Hobby Japan Co. Ltd, who<BR>
>did this version of AHL.  He said that most of CT and at least the first<BR>
>three books of MT were produced in japanese versions... cool!  A whole new<BR>
>set of Traveller to collect!  Excuse me while I zip off to some japanese<BR>
>hobby/game store web sites ;-)<BR>
><BR>
AS of three years ago, Hobby Japan still listed them (The MT rules) on<BR>
their W-site as "In Print"<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 23:41:40 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
On 04/23/00 at 10:13 PM,  Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca> said:<BR>
<BR>
>At 06:42 PM 4/23/00, you wrote:<BR>
>>Does the x-boat mailing list mentioned on the "welcome<BR>
>>to Traveller" message still exist?<BR>
<BR>
>         Nope...  the closest things to it are the "Society of Classic <BR>
>Traveller Architects" list on E-Groups (ship building, Striker list) and <BR>
>the "Classic Traveller" list which I host that gets zero traffic.<BR>
<BR>
Michel, I tried to sign up for your Classic Traveller list a couple of weeks ago and wasn't able to. I concluded that it was dead. If it isn't I'd like to join, information would be appreciated.<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 00:58:01 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 11:53 PM, wombat@premier.net issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Designer's notes:  My primary goal with this ship was simply to cram the<BR>
> largest possible NPAW into a Type S hullform, while maintaining the<BR>
> basic performance (J2, 2G) of a standard Type S.<BR>
<BR>
If anyone designs deckplans for this or renderings, I'd love to get a copy.<BR>
I have this post flagged and plan to use this beauty in games, I love it!<BR>
<BR>
That SDB version, as in /still/ in a type S hull?!<BR>
<BR>
Nothing exceeds like excess. Great slogan.<BR>
////////////////////////////////////////<BR>
Lanth6(beta)-> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Lanth6/Main.html<BR>
BZAT---> http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/index.html<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 20:01:59 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Subjects V Citizens<BR>
<BR>
Re Matts text below:<BR>
<BR>
>>As I recall, in the United Kingdom they use the term "subjects" rather<BR>
than<BR>
>>"citizens" (if any British contributors know I'm wrong, by all means, tell<BR>
me!),<BR>
>>even though the UK is a democracy and subjects enjoy many of the same<BR>
>>liberal-democratic freedoms as American citizens (even if there's no<BR>
>>formal Bill of Rights like in the US). I believe that "subjects" is the<BR>
standard<BR>
>>term in a constitutional monarchy, but again I'm no expert.<BR>
<BR>
Absolutely correct ,citizens of the UK are technically 'Subjects' of Her<BR>
Majesty Queen Elizabeth II.  However, we are also citizens of our country,<BR>
in this case 'The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland'.<BR>
Technically all those Commonwealth States who have Queen Elizabeth II as<BR>
their Head of State are also "Subjects" (e.g. Australia, Canada, New-Zealand<BR>
etc).   Those Commonwealth States who are republics (e.g. Pakistan, South<BR>
Africa etc) are not 'subjects'.<BR>
<BR>
I wouldn't get too worked up over the semantics of all this, after all there<BR>
are plenty of declared republicans within the UK and Australia who would<BR>
take grave issue over being referred to as 'Subjects'.  Maybe the case in<BR>
the 3I is that the correct historical term is "Imperial Citizens", because<BR>
that's what they all were before the declaration of the Imperium!  (My<BR>
knowledge of Canon here is very rusty).<BR>
<BR>
There are a lot of terms in use today which started out referring to one<BR>
thing and then got used in a slightly different way until they eventually<BR>
meant something different, but that's how language develops / evolves (Those<BR>
discussing / defining varieties of music on the TML may wish to think on<BR>
this a bit!!).<BR>
<BR>
nuff said on this by me I think!<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 07:31:14 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
At 01:41 AM 4/24/00, you wrote:<BR>
>On 04/23/00 at 10:13 PM,  Michel Vaillancourt <BR>
><misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca> said:<BR>
><BR>
> >At 06:42 PM 4/23/00, you wrote:<BR>
> >>Does the x-boat mailing list mentioned on the "welcome<BR>
> >>to Traveller" message still exist?<BR>
><BR>
> >         Nope...  the closest things to it are the "Society of Classic<BR>
> >Traveller Architects" list on E-Groups (ship building, Striker list) and<BR>
> >the "Classic Traveller" list which I host that gets zero traffic.<BR>
><BR>
>Michel, I tried to sign up for your Classic Traveller list a couple of <BR>
>weeks ago and wasn't able to. I concluded that it was dead. If it isn't <BR>
>I'd like to join, information would be appreciated.<BR>
><BR>
>Eris<BR>
<BR>
         Send a message to "ClassicTraveller-request@atlantic-online.ns.ca" <BR>
with the word "subscribe" in the body.  That should do it.  Alternately, <BR>
send a message to "petidomo@atlantic-online.ns.ca" with just the word <BR>
"help" as the message body for full instructions on how to use the listserv.<BR>
         If you have any problems, mail me directly and let me know.<BR>
<BR>
         FYI -- Lists I Carry:<BR>
<BR>
agamerslife             public mailing list<BR>
         This list exists to give gamers of all preferences a place to<BR>
         discuss gaming life, not just game systems. Everything but flames are<BR>
         open for discussion, so long as it has something to do with RPGing.<BR>
         LARP, FTF, PBEM, whatever.<BR>
<BR>
pbem-logs               public mailing list<BR>
         The purpose of the _PBEM/IRC Logs Mailing List_<BR>
         is a) entertainment, b) idea-mining, c) GM critiques and<BR>
         comments on plot elements, etc. The list will not be restricted to<BR>
         Traveller only; however, I suspect that is all the initial traffic<BR>
         will be. Also, "tidied up" captures from PB-IRC games are also<BR>
         welcome.<BR>
<BR>
Trav3D  public mailing list<BR>
         "Traveller so real, it practically jumps out of the screen!"<BR>
<BR>
         The _TRAVELLER 3D Artwork Mailing List's_ purpose is to<BR>
         allow the best possible lines of communication within the<BR>
         3D Artist Community of TRAVELLER players.<BR>
<BR>
ClassicTraveller        public mailing list<BR>
         The CT Creed: "There is no Game but Traveller, and High Guard is <BR>
its Product"<BR>
                                         -- Komrade Hudson, 1999<BR>
         The _Classic Traveller Mailing List's_ purpose is to allow the best<BR>
         possible lines of communication within the Community of<BR>
         Classic TRAVELLER/ LLB players. It was created in response to a<BR>
         perceived need amongst CT/LBB players who wished to focus<BR>
         discussions on these rules and the milieu.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-<BR>
	Michel R. Vaillancourt	misha@atlantic-online.ns.ca<BR>
				ICQ # 31172292<BR>
	"Reality Error in Progress....<BR>
			       ....Do Not Adjust Your Penguin"	<BR>
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-<BR>
	Cyberpunk:  	http://www.atlantic-online.ns.ca/cp2020<BR>
	Traveller:		http://www.atlantic-online.ns.ca/traveller<BR>
	AD&D:		http://www.atlantic-online.ns.ca/adnd_eurania<BR>
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-<BR>
	    ***REMEMBER - Always virus-check your emails ***<BR>
	-+=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+-<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:34:47 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
<BR>
A question to the BITS people...<BR>
<BR>
Will it be possible to order ACQ from SJG ? I have some other books I want to<BR>
order from them, so I thought I would make a single order if possible.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 05:38:36 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 11:53 PM, wombat@premier.net issued forth:<BR>
> <BR>
> > Designer's notes:  My primary goal with this ship was simply to cram the<BR>
> > largest possible NPAW into a Type S hullform, while maintaining the<BR>
> > basic performance (J2, 2G) of a standard Type S.<BR>
> <BR>
> If anyone designs deckplans for this or renderings, I'd love to get a copy.<BR>
> I have this post flagged and plan to use this beauty in games, I love it!<BR>
<BR>
Thank you for your kind words, gentlebeing.<BR>
<BR>
If anyone needs more information to do a deckplan, I can forward<BR>
whatever you need (dimensions of the spinal mount NPAW being most<BR>
crucial, of course).<BR>
> <BR>
> That SDB version, as in /still/ in a type S hull?!<BR>
<BR>
Well neither version of the _Savage_ class is built on a _standard_ Type<BR>
S hull; not enough armor.  However, both versions are visually<BR>
indistinguishable from the Type S (at least at distances common in space<BR>
encounters).  Since both versions also include IR and neutrino masking,<BR>
they're also hard to distinguish by signature, at least without using<BR>
full milspec sensors.  It's just _under_ the skin that the differences<BR>
really show.<BR>
<BR>
Until it's too late. ;-)<BR>
> <BR>
> Nothing exceeds like excess. Great slogan.<BR>
<BR>
Isn't it, though?  First time I heard it, I knew that I would have to<BR>
find a use for it.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 07:59:55 EDT<BR>
From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Very late response on GURPS Modular Cutter et. all<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/23/00 4:22:27 PM Pacific Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
>  Subject: Re: Very late response on GURPS Modular Cutter et. all<BR>
>  <BR>
>  From: Terry Carlino <carlino@home.com><BR>
>  <BR>
>  >Basically<BR>
>  >>as far as I can figure out the smallest container 4D, at 10 x 10 x 10 ft,<BR>
>  >is<BR>
>  >>too large to be carried by a cutter module. From the module shown as part<BR>
>  >of<BR>
>  >>the Donosev in GT:FI the module is 7 x 16 1/2 x (an unspecified height)<BR>
>  ft.<BR>
>  >>I suppose that cutter modules could themselves be containerized for<BR>
>  >>transport or stacked on a 60/8 pallet type container. Personally I always<BR>
>  >>thought that the cutter module should have been included in the system<BR>
>  from<BR>
>  >>the start.<BR>
>  ><BR>
>  ><BR>
>  >The module shown in GT:FI appears to me to be 7 *yards* x 20 *yards*. As<BR>
>  the<BR>
>  >cutter is cylindrical, the module height should be the same as its<BR>
>  diameter,<BR>
>  ><BR>
>  Now that I have once again proven my ability to fail to read the simplest<BR>
>  diagram I will go back to my highly technical job in sub-nuclear physics <BR>
and<BR>
>  hope nobody notices.<BR>
<BR>
Don't worry, you where just obeying a natural law.........<BR>
<BR>
Bryan<BR>
<BR>
1. People can't read signs.<BR>
2. If they do read signs, they read the wrong one.<BR>
3. If they do read the right one, they read it the wrong way.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 08:04:57 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
<BR>
I won't answer for Dom and BITS about availability, but I would like to chip<BR>
in my two cents about ACQ.  I had a chance to study it carefully and play it<BR>
through a few times and I'm guessing that it will sell very well.  I know<BR>
the BITS folks are curious about how their first "rules" book will do, but<BR>
I'm confident that many of you will find the system to be just what the<BR>
(penguin) doctor ordered.  I'm a big fan of Snapshot and have used those<BR>
rules for many years.  If a crusty old fart like me can be lured away from<BR>
something CT then I think many others will be also :-)<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Jens Rydholm" <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
> A question to the BITS people...<BR>
><BR>
> Will it be possible to order ACQ from SJG ? I have some other books I want<BR>
to<BR>
> order from them, so I thought I would make a single order if possible.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 05:32:40 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
- --- Michel Vaillancourt<BR>
<misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca> wrote:<BR>
> At 06:42 PM 4/23/00, you wrote:<BR>
> >Does the x-boat mailing list mentioned on the<BR>
> "welcome<BR>
> >to Traveller" message still exist?<BR>
> <BR>
>          Nope...  the closest things to it are the<BR>
> "Society of Classic <BR>
> Traveller Architects" list on E-Groups (ship<BR>
> building, Striker list) and <BR>
> the "Classic Traveller" list which I host that gets<BR>
> zero traffic.<BR>
<BR>
Is it still OK to put posts about CT on this list?<BR>
<BR>
BTW: I recently got Classic Traveller in the new BFB<BR>
(Big Floppy Book) format. Personally I think it's<BR>
great and see no need to get a later version. Can we<BR>
assume that since it's been reprinted we can count it<BR>
among the "current" versions (since now brand new<BR>
players will start playing it) or is it still archaic<BR>
and outdated and not worth discussing? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2343<BR>
***********************************<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2344</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Monday, April 24 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2344<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: Grav powered floating cities<BR>
Megatraveller<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
Re: Armed Mail Ships (was re: No Subject)<BR>
Re:  Broadsword<BR>
Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
OT: Citizens and Subjects<BR>
Re: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
Re: Megatraveller<BR>
Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
Re: Subjects V Citizens<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2343<BR>
Re: near-C rocks<BR>
re:  Filk Fragment/Idea Cover of the T4 Book<BR>
re:  Jump Space Jack Flash<BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
Re: Expert Witness's<BR>
Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
Re: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 07:51:54 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
Arthur Boff wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> <BR>
> Is it still OK to put posts about CT on this list?<BR>
<BR>
Of course; the TML is dedicated to discussion of penguins in _all_<BR>
versions of Traveller.<BR>
> <BR>
> BTW: I recently got Classic Traveller in the new BFB<BR>
> (Big Floppy Book) format. Personally I think it's<BR>
> great and see no need to get a later version. Can we<BR>
> assume that since it's been reprinted we can count it<BR>
> among the "current" versions (since now brand new<BR>
> players will start playing it) or is it still archaic<BR>
> and outdated and not worth discussing? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
"No game is really obsolete in the hands of someone who will play it."<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 02:36:28 -0400<BR>
From: "Chauncey Smith" <csmith@ICDC.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Grav powered floating cities<BR>
<BR>
My .02 cr. says that we build floating cities like we build vechiles they<BR>
are just extremely large. so we look at a city like the one I live in. on<BR>
average one end of the city  to another is 10 miles (I know from how much it<BR>
has cost me to have tow trucks pick up my pos car). so we casider a disk<BR>
that will yeld a diameter of 10 miles  or metric equivalent. and build the<BR>
city in that volume. add centra grave and power plant and life support it.<BR>
the actual buildings will fit in the volume and really don't need to be<BR>
figured I'll work on actual numbers from ffs 1 and ffs2 later on...<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com <TOCoons@cs.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: Sunday, April 23, 2000 11:18 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Grav powered floating cities<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>In a message dated 3/28/00 2:33:54 PM Mountain Standard Time,<BR>
>owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
><BR>
>><BR>
>>  Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 12:59:00 -0800<BR>
>>  From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
>>  Subject: Re: Grav Powered Floating Cities<BR>
>><BR>
>>  How much do you suppose a typical city weighs? Even in the Traveller<BR>
world<BR>
>>  of abundant energy, it might take way too much energy to keep a grav<BR>
>powered<BR>
>>  city up, since you will need to overcome the gravity from the planet on<BR>
a<BR>
>>  7x24 basis (or whatever the local time units are). Since I'm at work<BR>
now, I<BR>
>>  don't have the time to do a calculation, but my intuition tells me that<BR>
a<BR>
>>  lot of energy will be required to keep one of these guys up. On the<BR>
other<BR>
>>  hand, it may provide a practical llimit to the size of a floating city.<BR>
>><BR>
>>  ------------------------------<BR>
>><BR>
><BR>
>Not really.  It takes no energy at all to sit at any given altitude,<BR>
provided<BR>
>you can generate the force to counteract gravitational attraction. Assuming<BR>
>you have grav vield generators, you only need to compensate for losses in<BR>
the<BR>
>generators. (That's the big problem...all we have available are buoyant<BR>
>forces, which require that you be lighter than air, and aerodynamic forces,<BR>
>which require continous motion through a resisting medium with hideous<BR>
losses<BR>
>that the generators must compensate for.)<BR>
>What would really take the energy is moving up. Likewise a controlled<BR>
descent<BR>
>would dump energy into the field generators.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:54:13 -0500<BR>
From: ehenry@newberlin.org (Eric Henry)<BR>
Subject: Megatraveller<BR>
<BR>
Hi.  i'm interested in Megatraveller.  It's my understanding there were two<BR>
printings of Megatraveller.  One which needed lots of errata and another<BR>
which didn't.<BR>
<BR>
If this is true, how can i tell the difference between printings?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:34:07 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/24/00 5:32 AM, ajboff@yahoo.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> BTW: I recently got Classic Traveller in the new BFB<BR>
> (Big Floppy Book) format. Personally I think it's<BR>
> great and see no need to get a later version. Can we<BR>
> assume that since it's been reprinted we can count it<BR>
> among the "current" versions (since now brand new<BR>
> players will start playing it) or is it still archaic<BR>
> and outdated and not worth discussing? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Of course we can count it among the "current" versions, but I would be<BR>
careful about stating that CT is archaic and out-dated, you're courting a<BR>
flamefest there. ;) Many folks on this list swear by CT, even refusing to<BR>
consider other editions "Traveller".<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:20:46 +0100<BR>
From: Martin Hardgrave <martin@deira.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: More on Colors<BR>
<BR>
In message <v0422080ab5269a09bd84@[128.102.186.102]>, "David P. Summers"<BR>
<summers@alum.mit.edu> writes<BR>
><BR>
>Then you have red available for the Vargr who I can't really<BR>
>see using another color.<BR>
<BR>
Hawaiian shirt colour?<BR>
- -- <BR>
Martin Hardgrave<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:42:22 EDT<BR>
From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
"Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com> requests:<BR>
<BR>
>Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 11:53 PM, wombat@premier.net issued forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> Designer's notes:  My primary goal with this ship was simply to cram the<BR>
>> largest possible NPAW into a Type S hullform, while maintaining the<BR>
>> basic performance (J2, 2G) of a standard Type S.<BR>
><BR>
>If anyone designs deckplans for this or renderings, I'd love to get a copy.<BR>
>I have this post flagged and plan to use this beauty in games, I love it!<BR>
><BR>
>That SDB version, as in /still/ in a type S hull?!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
 Could be amusing. With the tonnage breakdowns I'll try it. It looks roughly <BR>
like:<BR>
<BR>
 100 ton hull<BR>
 4 small staterooms (8 tons)<BR>
 1 Emergency Low Berth (2 tons)<BR>
 Fuel (22.6 tons)<BR>
 j-Drive (3 tons)<BR>
 M-Drive ?<BR>
 Power ?<BR>
 Da GUN (44.35 tons)<BR>
 3? workstations<BR>
<BR>
 And that's all my pre-work brain can come up with at the moment...<BR>
<BR>
GC<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:52:30 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Armed Mail Ships (was re: No Subject)<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith writes:<BR>
> TOCoons wrote:<BR>
> >In every version of Traveller, it is stated that ships that carry mail<BR>
> >must  be armed and carry a gunner. I don't fully understand the reasoning<BR>
> > here...can someone suggest a good reason?<BR>
> <BR>
> To keep the riff-raff out.  A starship with a starship-grade laser is<BR>
> pretty much immune to lots of minor threats, like someone threatening<BR>
> to ram you with a remote-piloted launch, or a desperate Belter trying<BR>
> to hijack you with his prospecting buggy and a mining laser.  It'll<BR>
> even make a Pirate think twice, as a single hit can cost millions of<BR>
> MCr to fix, and pirates probably don't have shipowner's insurance.<BR>
<BR>
Its also worth noting that mail contracts on merchant ships are for carrying<BR>
mail to/from backwater worlds.  Ships carrying mail between major worlds need<BR>
not be armed (Xboats aren't) but aren't generally merchants either.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:03:18 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re:  Broadsword<BR>
<BR>
Terry Carlino writes:<BR>
<BR>
> I expect not. Subsidized Liners, Heavy Freighters, LASH tenders and Bulk<BR>
> Freighters, not free traders, will carry cargo that is basically<BR>
> non-critical. The time element is the only thing that makes free traders<BR>
> solvent. That allows them to charge more than the normal going rate for<BR>
> transport, which is the only thing that would allow a typical Beowulf-class<BR>
> to be cost effective.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, the main thing that lets free traders survive is carrying off-main<BR>
goods, where bulk freighters are rare and the traders don't need to compete<BR>
with the bulk carriers, or carrying short-term contract goods, where the<BR>
sender doesn't have the time to reserve bulk carrier space 2+ weeks in<BR>
advance.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:27:30<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
<BR>
At 11:12 PM 4/23/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
>In every version of Traveller, it is stated that ships that carry mail must <BR>
>be armed and carry a gunner. I don't fully understand the reasoning<BR>
>here...can someone suggest a good reason?<BR>
<BR>
mail is governmental property, and has to be aggressively defended.  Mail<BR>
is often quite valuable, containing financial instruments, valuables, or<BR>
precious information.<BR>
<BR>
When I lived in East Palo Alto, thieves would steal anything that looked<BR>
like a governmental envelope, looking for SSI checks.  I finally had to<BR>
have my disability checks sent to my doctor's office.<BR>
<BR>
If you want to see one of the meanest federal LE agencies around, take a<BR>
look at the Postal Inspection Service <BR>
<BR>
http://www.usps.gov/websites/depart/inspect/aboutus.htm<BR>
<BR>
These guys have jurisdiction in anything that affects the US Mail.  Name<BR>
anything that couldn't be included in that definition.<BR>
<BR>
So the requirement that a mail carrier be armed is just to discourage the<BR>
casual thieves.  You can go for the mail, but it will cost you.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry   Templar Agent at Large.<BR>
gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
<BR>
TravGeekCode: <BR>
tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>
ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>
         <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:30:32 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
- --- Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
wrote:<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/24/00 5:32 AM,<BR>
> ajboff@yahoo.com issued forth:<BR>
> <BR>
> > BTW: I recently got Classic Traveller in the new<BR>
> BFB<BR>
> > (Big Floppy Book) format. Personally I think it's<BR>
> > great and see no need to get a later version. Can<BR>
> we<BR>
> > assume that since it's been reprinted we can count<BR>
> it<BR>
> > among the "current" versions (since now brand new<BR>
> > players will start playing it) or is it still<BR>
> archaic<BR>
> > and outdated and not worth discussing? ;-)<BR>
> <BR>
> Of course we can count it among the "current"<BR>
> versions, but I would be<BR>
> careful about stating that CT is archaic and<BR>
> out-dated, you're courting a<BR>
> flamefest there. ;) Many folks on this list swear by<BR>
> CT, even refusing to<BR>
> consider other editions "Traveller".<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, I swear by CT too. I was trying to determine<BR>
whether it was the general opinion that CT is archaic<BR>
and outdated - I don't believe it is myself.<BR>
<BR>
In other words: RTFP.<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:36:40 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Les Howie <travgrognard@yahoo.ca><BR>
Subject: OT: Citizens and Subjects<BR>
<BR>
>Technically all those Commonwealth States who have<BR>
>Queen Elizabeth II as their Head of State are also<BR>
>"Subjects" (e.g. Australia, Canada, New-Zealand<BR>
>etc).   Those Commonwealth States who are republics<BR>
>(e.g. Pakistan, South Africa etc) are not 'subjects'.<BR>
<BR>
This is no longer exactly true: a Canadian Citizen is<BR>
no longer a British subject (I was when I was born,<BR>
its in my first passport, but not my latest).  I<BR>
suppose I am a subject of the Queen directly, but I am<BR>
also a Candian Citizen.<BR>
<BR>
OBTrav?  Well, my parents were born as subjects of an<BR>
Empire.  I don't think they regret the loss.<BR>
<BR>
=====<BR>
Les Howie<BR>
Wargaming Gearhead Heretic<BR>
imtu 1.0: tc t4 ru- ge++ !3i c++ jt++ au+ ls++ pi+ ta-- he++<BR>
<BR>
_______________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Get your free @yahoo.ca address at http://mail.yahoo.ca<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:37:59 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> mail is governmental property, and has to be aggressively defended.  Mail<BR>
> is often quite valuable, containing financial instruments, valuables, or<BR>
> precious information.<BR>
<BR>
Are you suggesting that we should arm our postal workers??????<BR>
<BR>
> When I lived in East Palo Alto, thieves would steal anything that looked<BR>
> like a governmental envelope, looking for SSI checks.  I finally had to<BR>
> have my disability checks sent to my doctor's office.<BR>
<BR>
East PA? Wow. You are much braver than I am. I get scared just driving by<BR>
the East PA exit on 101.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:30:22<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Megatraveller<BR>
<BR>
At 10:54 AM 4/24/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
>Hi.  i'm interested in Megatraveller.  It's my understanding there were two<BR>
>printings of Megatraveller.  One which needed lots of errata and another<BR>
>which didn't.<BR>
<BR>
alas, bioth editions needed a great amount of errata.  The errata is<BR>
avalible on the web, some other kind souls will tell you where, since I<BR>
can't remember right now.<BR>
<BR>
>If this is true, how can i tell the difference between printings?<BR>
<BR>
The really screwed up version will be identified as first printing, 1987 on<BR>
the credits page.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:32:04<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
<BR>
At 08:04 AM 4/24/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>I won't answer for Dom and BITS about availability, but I would like to chip<BR>
>in my two cents about ACQ.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
Colin, you just made a really crappy day much, much better with those<BR>
comments.  Thanks.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:37:51<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Subjects V Citizens<BR>
<BR>
At 08:01 PM 4/24/2000 +1000, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>I wouldn't get too worked up over the semantics of all this, after all there<BR>
>are plenty of declared republicans within the UK and Australia who would<BR>
>take grave issue over being referred to as 'Subjects'.  Maybe the case in<BR>
>the 3I is that the correct historical term is "Imperial Citizens", because<BR>
>that's what they all were before the declaration of the Imperium!  (My<BR>
>knowledge of Canon here is very rusty).<BR>
<BR>
Since Supplement 4 was "Citizens of the Imperium", we have a big clue right<BR>
there..<BR>
<BR>
I think your comment about the nature of the Monarchy/Governmental<BR>
relationship in the British Empire is a good take.<BR>
<BR>
Fred is a Citizen of the Regina Republic.  He is also a Subject of His<BR>
Imperial Majesty, Strephon I.  Fred could care less about that except when<BR>
he gets a long weekend for the Emperor's Birthday.<BR>
<BR>
Since it isn't my strongest period, how did the member states of the Holy<BR>
Roman Empire view themselves?  More importantly, how did the citizens see<BR>
themselves?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
<BR>
TML Great Old One<BR>
Plague of the Traveller Riders of the Apocalypse<BR>
Chant "Gridlore" thrice to summon.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:41:06<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
At 05:32 AM 4/24/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Is it still OK to put posts about CT on this list?<BR>
<BR>
Yes, but first you must undergo the ritiual of the Dread Penguin.<BR>
<BR>
(Actually, and sort of Traveller discussion is welcome here.)<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"But that's not the point!" raged Ford. "The point is that I am now a<BR>
perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of<BR>
limbs!"  - The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:40:54<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
At 10:30 AM 4/24/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Yeah, I swear by CT too. I was trying to determine<BR>
>whether it was the general opinion that CT is archaic<BR>
>and outdated - I don't believe it is myself.<BR>
<BR>
Oddly I used to swear *at* CT.. "another bloody Pirate?!"<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:25:18 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
<BR>
>And there is a reference in BtC to "Inthians" and "Payans"<BR>
<BR>
>and a "Payan disaster". In the Paya data it is not clear <BR>
>if these may or may not be another branch of humaniti, or <BR>
>of what derivation. <BR>
<BR>
I think "Payan" is a geographic term, not a reference to<BR>
race or species (like "Alaskan").  The Paya disaster is set<BR>
forth in some early works, either DGP or GDW -- maybe<BR>
Spinward Marches Campaign? or Traveller Book?  I don't<BR>
recall.<BR>
<BR>
HIWG at one time organized all of the references to events<BR>
in the Spinward Marches by the world where the event took<BR>
place; I'll see if I have that.  I've been working on a<BR>
gazetteer of the Spinward Marches that collects every<BR>
reference to by world, but I think that I need a relational<BR>
database to do it right.  <BR>
<BR>
>Mirriam and Asgard seem like potential branches of <BR>
>humaniti.<BR>
<BR>
In my Traveller Universe, Asgard is both a historical and<BR>
religious center for many Sword Worlders -- and the fact<BR>
that the Imperium owns it and has interdicted it is a major<BR>
source of tension.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:26:15 -0700<BR>
From: Russell Bornschlegel <kaleja@estarcion.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2343<BR>
<BR>
Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
> Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
> <BR>
> Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Via electronic medium on 4/21/00 11:53 PM, wombat@premier.net issued forth:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > > Designer's notes:  My primary goal with this ship was simply to cram the<BR>
> > > largest possible NPAW into a Type S hullform, while maintaining the<BR>
> > > basic performance (J2, 2G) of a standard Type S.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > If anyone designs deckplans for this or renderings, I'd love to get a copy.<BR>
> > I have this post flagged and plan to use this beauty in games, I love it!<BR>
> <BR>
> Thank you for your kind words, gentlebeing.<BR>
> <BR>
> If anyone needs more information to do a deckplan, I can forward<BR>
> whatever you need (dimensions of the spinal mount NPAW being most<BR>
> crucial, of course).<BR>
<BR>
I'll be glad to do deckplans for this baby, but I have to confess I'm <BR>
FFS-impaired. If you could give me volume figures for all components<BR>
(or a copy of the completed spreadsheet) as well as dimensions for the <BR>
big gun, I'll take a stab at it. <BR>
<BR>
Heh. "Cap'n, there's something odd about that Scout. Do the cockpit windows<BR>
look off-center to you?"<BR>
<BR>
- -Russell B<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:39:33 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: near-C rocks<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
<BR>
>I read the article and have a query for you legal type <BR>
>TMLers. Here is an excerpt: Among those on the expert <BR>
>witness list is the band Offspring's front man, Bryan <BR>
>"Dexter" Holland, who will be paid $250 per hour for his <BR>
>testimony,court records state. <BR>
>How can this be legal? Or is this just reimbursement for <BR>
>time lost paid by the court?<BR>
<BR>
What's the problem?  An expert witness is someone hired by<BR>
a party to help explain something technical and complex to<BR>
the court and to give an opinion about it.  This is a<BR>
routine part of litigation.  Many people who have risen far<BR>
in their careers start making a large part of their<BR>
livelihood by being experts.  Engineers, scientists,<BR>
doctors, statisticians, securities professionals and so on<BR>
are commonly called as experts, but anyone who has<BR>
specialized knowledge can be hired as an expert.  $250 per<BR>
hour does not raise my eyebrows.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:43:57 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Filk Fragment/Idea Cover of the T4 Book<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net><BR>
<BR>
>Not bad at all, although another filk comes to mind based <BR>
>on  Traveller cover art and Traveller art in general...<BR>
>anybody want to take a stab at a parody of Cover of the <BR>
>Rolling Stone?<BR>
<BR>
I'd like to see my picture on the cover of the T-N-S<BR>
<BR>
- -scans ok, I guess, but <BR>
<BR>
I'd like to see my picture on the cover of the ol' Jay Tass<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:48:48 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Jump Space Jack Flash<BR>
<BR>
- --0-1804289383-956602128=:7232<BR>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii<BR>
<BR>
>From: Peter Newman <BR>
Brilliant!  I've adopted the liner notes for my Traveller universe.--Glenn <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ---------------------------------<BR>
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Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
- --0-1804289383-956602128=:7232<BR>
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii<BR>
<BR>
>From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
<BR>
Brilliant!  I've adopted the liner notes for my Traveller universe.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn <BR>
<BR>
<hr size=1><B>Do You Yahoo!?</B><BR>
Send online invitations with <A HREF="http://invites.yahoo.com/">Yahoo! Invites</A>.- --0-1804289383-956602128=:7232--------------------------------Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:56:23 -0700 (PDT)From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com>Subject: Subject: Re: More on Colors- --0-1315634022-956602583=:26217Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii>From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu>>>Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:>  > Then you have red available for the Vargr who I can't really>  > see using another color.>>Not even brown? I think brown is a good Doggie color. ;)>Doggie!  You "anti-Vargr human scum"!  :-)I was personally offended by your reference to "Doggie".  I'll thank you to take your racism and specism off the mailing list, Monkeyboy.- --Rrafroughz- ---------------------------------Do You Yahoo!?Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.- --0-1315634022-956602583=:26217Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii<BR>
&gt;From: &quot;David P. Summers&quot; &lt;<A HREF="http://us.f2.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Compose?To=summers@alum.mit.edu&YY=47049&order=down&sort=date&pos=0">summers@alum.mit.edu</A>&gt;<BR>
&gt;&gt;Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Then you have red available for the Vargr who I can't really<BR>
&gt;&nbsp; &gt; see using another color.<BR>
&gt;&gt;Not even brown? I think brown is a good Doggie color. ;)<BR>
&gt;Doggie!&nbsp; You &quot;anti-Vargr human scum&quot;!&nbsp; :-)<BR>
I was personally offended by your reference to &quot;Doggie&quot;.&nbsp; I'll thank you to take your racism and specism off the mailing list, Monkeyboy.<BR>
--Rrafroughz<BR>
<BR>
<hr size=1><B>Do You Yahoo!?</B><BR>
Send online invitations with <A HREF="http://invites.yahoo.com/">Yahoo! Invites</A>.- --0-1315634022-956602583=:26217--------------------------------Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:57:12 -0700From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com>Subject: Re: Expert Witness'sVia electronic medium on 4/24/00 11:39 AM, gmgoffin@yahoo.com issued forth:> What's the problem?  An expert witness is someone hired by> a party to help explain something technical and complex to> the court and to give an opinion about it.  This is a> routine part of litigation.I guess my main concern is /who/ is paying, and how the transaction takesplace. It was not at all the amount, but the circumstances.------------------------------Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:25:58 -0500From: Eris Reddoch <eris@pcola.gulf.net>Subject: Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:> >I won't answer for Dom and BITS about availability, but I would like to chip> >in my two cents about ACQ.> > <snip>> > Colin, you just made a really crappy day much, much better with those> comments.  Thanks.Well, dang it Doug, think how much better you'd feel if Jens, Swordy andI could be writing in to say we'd just *ordered* the darn book!! <g>Eris,	waiting *impatiently* for ACQ to appear for sale through SJG------------------------------Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:45:40From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com>Subject: Re: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))At 10:37 AM 4/24/2000 -0700, you wrote:>Douglas Berry wrote:>>> mail is governmental property, and has to be aggressively defended.  Mail>> is often quite valuable, containing financial instruments, valuables, or>> precious information.>>Are you suggesting that we should arm our postal workers??????At various times in history, they were armed.  Wells Frago & Co got richbecause they made their stagecoach men take marksmenship tests before beinghired.  Since Wells Fargo stages were such hard targets, they got the mailcontract.>> When I lived in East Palo Alto, thieves would steal anything that looked>> like a governmental envelope, looking for SSI checks.  I finally had to>> have my disability checks sent to my doctor's office.>>East PA? Wow. You are much braver than I am. I get scared just driving by>the East PA exit on 101.No, I am much *poorer* than you.  That was the only place we could affordand still be withing ambulance range of Stanford.- --Duugirashir Irebamenagiin  gridlore@mindspring.com  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.htmlInquisitor Maximus, Reformed Canon Church of Sylea------------------------------End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2344***********************************To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:unsubscribe traveller-digestin the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.imagiconline.com".If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail iscoming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append thataddress to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe"local-traveller":subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.netA non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; tosubscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"in the commands above with "traveller".Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#0f0f0f" BACK="#fffffe" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2345</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Monday, April 24 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2345<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Expert Witness's<BR>
Re: Broadsword<BR>
Re: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
[BITS] CONVENTION Dudley Bug Ball - 6 May 2000<BR>
re:Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Japanese Traveller (was Re: Azhanti High Lightning)<BR>
Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
Re: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
RE: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
RE: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium<BR>
Re armed mail ships<BR>
MT & erratta.<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
Re: Megatraveller<BR>
re:  Subject: Two filks<BR>
Re: Mail Carriers<BR>
Re: Broadsword<BR>
Re: Jump Space Jack Flash<BR>
Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
re:  expert witnesses<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:18:26<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Expert Witness's<BR>
<BR>
At 11:57 AM 4/24/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I guess my main concern is /who/ is paying, and how the transaction takes<BR>
>place. It was not at all the amount, but the circumstances.<BR>
<BR>
It's a straightforward affair.  You hire an expert to testify on an aspect<BR>
of the case.  I remember a murder case in SF back in the 80s.  The defense<BR>
brought in a forensics expert who trashed the physical evidence.<BR>
<BR>
The prosecutor then called the *35* experts the defence had consulted with,<BR>
and rejected because they didn't agree with the defence position.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:44:37 -0500<BR>
From: "Pat Connaughton" <pconn@i1.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Broadsword<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Monday, April 24, 2000 12:03 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Broadsword<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Terry Carlino writes:<BR>
><BR>
> > I expect not. Subsidized Liners, Heavy Freighters, LASH tenders and Bulk<BR>
> > Freighters, not free traders, will carry cargo that is basically<BR>
> > non-critical. The time element is the only thing that makes free traders<BR>
> > solvent. That allows them to charge more than the normal going rate for<BR>
> > transport, which is the only thing that would allow a typical<BR>
Beowulf-class<BR>
> > to be cost effective.<BR>
<BR>
I would think that other considerations than "time critical" cargo would be<BR>
a significant<BR>
factor. Consider breaking bulk and local re-deliveries within specific<BR>
zones. Or situations within less developed areas that local knowledge(by the<BR>
ship) that may<BR>
allow for flexibility within a given area. Tramp freighters and small bulk<BR>
cargo vessels<BR>
flourished for many years and continue to manage today with such activities.<BR>
<BR>
Any other thoughts?Thanks<BR>
Pat Connaughton<BR>
ICQ # 2535086<BR>
pconn@i1.net<BR>
"He who knows not how to dissemble knows not<BR>
how to reign"<BR>
Tiberius, Emperator and Princips of Rome<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
change rapidly.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:42:05 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >> mail is governmental property, and has to be aggressively defended.<BR>
Mail<BR>
> >> is often quite valuable, containing financial instruments, valuables,<BR>
or<BR>
> >> precious information.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Are you suggesting that we should arm our postal workers??????<BR>
><BR>
> At various times in history, they were armed.  Wells Frago & Co got rich<BR>
> because they made their stagecoach men take marksmenship tests before<BR>
being<BR>
> hired.  Since Wells Fargo stages were such hard targets, they got the mail<BR>
> contract.<BR>
<BR>
Aha, so you are really in favor of arming government *contractors* That<BR>
sounds much safer.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:08:31 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: [BITS] CONVENTION Dudley Bug Ball - 6 May 2000<BR>
<BR>
BITS - British Isles Traveller Support<BR>
http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR>
<BR>
Convention Alert! - BITS will be attending the Dudley Bug Ball <BR>
(sponsored by Brittannia Game Designs Ltd) again this year.<BR>
<BR>
Now in its fifth year, the annual Duggley Bug Ball will soon be <BR>
coming on the 6th  May 2000 at Rowley Regis College, at 9.30 AM until <BR>
8.30 PM.  This is the convention for the Midlands, at a new site with <BR>
more space for re-enactment and LRP stuff, in addition to all the <BR>
usual RPG events (including Traveller).<BR>
<BR>
CONTACT: Dudleybug@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
Map, admission fee (low), and other information at <BR>
http://members.aol.com/dudleybug<BR>
<BR>
RPGA Tournaments (open to all)<BR>
- - 10 am to 2 pm   Traveller Session One<BR>
- -  3 pm to 7 pm   Traveller Session Two<BR>
<BR>
See you there! Maybe for some ACQ and face to face gaming.<BR>
<BR>
Dom (BITS Websmaster)<BR>
- -------------Dom Mooney---webmaster@bits.org.uk----------------<BR>
                  BITS - British Isles Traveller Support.<BR>
  http://www.bits.org.uk/              mailto:bits@bits.org.uk<BR>
Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
GURPS is a registered trademark of Steve Jackson Games, Inc.<BR>
BITS and CORE are trademarks of BITS UK Limited.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 20:46:25 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re:Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
<BR>
At 8:32 -0400 24/4/00, Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se> wrote:<BR>
>A question to the BITS people...<BR>
><BR>
>Will it be possible to order ACQ from SJG ? I have some other books I want to<BR>
>order from them, so I thought I would make a single order if possible.<BR>
<BR>
I would anticipate that this would be the case. However, I can't give <BR>
you a formal 'yes' until we have the orders in full. Apologies for <BR>
being coy about this but I don't want to accidentally lie to you, nor <BR>
say anything that may put SJ Games in an awkward position. You'll <BR>
have to be patient for a few more days.<BR>
<BR>
Let's just say the talk is of numbers rather than of 'if'. I will <BR>
post here as soon as we dispatch an order containing ACQ and/or 101 <BR>
Patrons(*).<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
(*) Forthcoming.<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 20:36:13 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
At 19:18 -0400 23/4/00, "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu> wrote:<BR>
>As I recall, in the United Kingdom they use the term "subjects" rather than<BR>
>"citizens" (if any British contributors know I'm wrong, by all <BR>
>means, tell me!),<BR>
>even though the UK is a democracy and subjects enjoy many of the same<BR>
>liberal-democratic freedoms as American citizens (even if there's no<BR>
>formal Bill of Rights like in the US). I believe that "subjects" is <BR>
>the standard<BR>
>term in a constitutional monarchy, but again I'm no expert.<BR>
<BR>
This changed legally around 1983 when the Tory government of the time <BR>
passed laws to define citizenship. It was really part of a hardening <BR>
of immigration control against ex-colonies. The restrictions would <BR>
have originally also been applied to the Falkland Islands had another <BR>
small incident not happened at the same time....<BR>
<BR>
So although we are subjects of HM Queen Elizabeth II we are also citizens...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:40:29 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Japanese Traveller (was Re: Azhanti High Lightning)<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 23 Apr 2000 19:18:35 -0400 (EDT), "Sword-Worlder"<BR>
<swordworlder@yahoo.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I asked Marc how much of Traveller was licensed by Hobby Japan Co. Ltd, who<BR>
>did this version of AHL.  He said that most of CT and at least the first<BR>
>three books of MT were produced in japanese versions... cool!  A whole new<BR>
>set of Traveller to collect!  Excuse me while I zip off to some japanese<BR>
>hobby/game store web sites ;-)<BR>
<BR>
If someone can actually verify which items were actually<BR>
produced, I can properly update the Published Products pages of<BR>
Freelance Traveller - and I would like very much to do so (though<BR>
I'm _not_ about to start collecting a full set of Japanese<BR>
Traveller - I only get weird like that with Monopoly sets).<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:31:15 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
<BR>
At 15:27 -0400 24/4/00, "Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
>Well, dang it Doug, think how much better you'd feel if Jens, Swordy and<BR>
>I could be writing in to say we'd just *ordered* the darn book!! <g><BR>
<BR>
Swordy has one of the first 50 copies ever printed, as does Loren. <BR>
Effectively the pre-release copies for approval...<BR>
<BR>
But hey, please feel free to order extras for friends!<BR>
<BR>
>	waiting *impatiently* for ACQ to appear for sale through SJG<BR>
<BR>
Me too! ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:50:03<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
<BR>
At 12:42 PM 4/24/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Aha, so you are really in favor of arming government *contractors* That<BR>
>sounds much safer.<BR>
<BR>
The USPS is a semi-private organization.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:46:41 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In the mid eighties we suffered through the banana suit.  Bright yellow<BR>
> jogging pants and jacket.<BR>
<BR>
We had to do aerobics for PT. It was unbelievable. The whole point of the<BR>
military back then was to deter the agression of the Godless Commies by<BR>
making them think that we were tougher than they were. To do this, we got up<BR>
at 4 AM and danced around to music? We're lucky that we are still speaking<BR>
English.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:52:55 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Mail carriers (was: (no subject))<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> The USPS is a semi-private organization.<BR>
<BR>
Maybe in some technical sense. Try dealing with these guys on a business to<BR>
business level. You get the clear feeling that they are just another part of<BR>
the government.<BR>
<BR>
I will have to come to one of the TravellerinSF meetings one of these days,<BR>
drink a beer, and tell you stories about USPS people carrying guns.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:12:08 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium<BR>
<BR>
>From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
<BR>
>Chris Seamans schrieb:> <BR>
>> Matt Stevens wrote:<BR>
>>>This reminds me... I was planning to run a few CT <BR>
>>>adventures in NYC and spoke to a potential player about <BR>
>>>it.  He said he felt uncomfortable playing Traveller <BR>
>>>because the Imperium was "a lot like Nazi Germany." <BR>
><BR>
>On the thousand years, remind him that the Imperium is<BR>
>constructed as being capable of lasting a thousand years, <BR>
>which requires a lot more reason than the Nazis used when <BR>
>they "governed" Germany for *twelve* years (and after <BR>
>that, the country had fallen into ashes...). And the Evil <BR>
>about the Nazis were not the number "three" and thousand",<BR>
<BR>
>but their deeds. Things that are IMHO very likely to <BR>
>happen in the 3I, with all than noblemen personal honor<BR>
>etc.<BR>
<BR>
I agree that the Imperium isn't anything like Nazi Germany<BR>
- -- as you pointed it out, it can't be if it has lasted for<BR>
over 1,000 years.<BR>
<BR>
There are, however, two very disturbing issues in Imperial<BR>
history that are worth pointing out:  the psionics<BR>
suppressions and the Droyne question.  It seems that the<BR>
result of the psionics suppressions (about 400, I think?)<BR>
is that, 800 or so years later, Imperial citizens of every<BR>
species see psionics as dangerous and repulsive and would<BR>
be willing to lynch telepaths, at least, if not all other<BR>
psionicists.  At the same time, most of the Droyne (a<BR>
psionic race) live on interdicted planets -- not a long<BR>
step from living in ghettos.   <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:04:07 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re armed mail ships<BR>
<BR>
>In every version of Traveller, it is stated that ships that carry mail must<BR>
>be armed<BR>
>and carry a gunner. I don't fully understand the reasoning here...can someone<BR>
>suggest a good reason?<BR>
>1) Most commercial carriers, including those carrying mail, are more<BR>
>interested in getting their cargo to its proper destination than in combat.<BR>
>If travel is dangerous enough that there is any need to go armed, most simply<BR>
>won't go unless there is enough potential profit to balance the added risk.<BR>
<BR>
Since most ships in Traveller are armed, or at least capable of installing<BR>
armament into existing hardpoints, there is obviously some risk. Not all<BR>
that risk is of need piracy/privateering.<BR>
<BR>
>2) Wouldn't merchants and mail carriers be just as well served by requiring<BR>
>some kind of defenses like sandcasters? I would think they would want to<BR>
>escape, rather than stay and slug it out with an attacker.<BR>
>On the other side of the questions, there is the idea that the arms are like<BR>
>locks. You can't stop a determined professional pirate (whether they exist or<BR>
>not): the weapons are just to help honest people stay that way.<BR>
<BR>
Not quite. A sandcaster is not going to allow you to shoot hazards to<BR>
navigation effectively, and in itself creates a hazard to navigation.<BR>
<BR>
Also, if you accept there is some steady level of piracy &/or privateering<BR>
(as canon seems to imply), any deterrent is a good thing. And, under HG/MT<BR>
space combat rules, you might be able to seriously hurt a pirate. It takes<BR>
luck, but it can happen.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:09:15 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: MT & erratta.<BR>
<BR>
EHenry asks:<BR>
>Hi.  i'm interested in Megatraveller.  It's my understanding there were two<BR>
>printings of Megatraveller.  One which needed lots of errata and another<BR>
>which didn't.<BR>
><BR>
>If this is true, how can i tell the difference between printings?<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
It is sort of true. There are three distinct print-batches. All of them<BR>
need erratta. One of them is missing some maps on the inside cover of Ref's<BR>
Manual. Higher printing numbers are better. The saddle-bound player's<BR>
manuals are earlier. The total erratta runs to about 4 pages, in any case.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:21:41 -0400<BR>
From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
<BR>
Gavareeti tolkya dyla tebe, Komrad!   :)<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
 J-Man<BR>
 ICQ# 2843475<BR>
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
 Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
 Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Monday, April 24, 2000 4:46 PM<BR>
Subject: RE: Fossil-saurus silk<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Douglas Berry wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> > In the mid eighties we suffered through the banana suit.  Bright yellow<BR>
> > jogging pants and jacket.<BR>
><BR>
> We had to do aerobics for PT. It was unbelievable. The whole point of the<BR>
> military back then was to deter the agression of the Godless Commies by<BR>
> making them think that we were tougher than they were. To do this, we got<BR>
up<BR>
> at 4 AM and danced around to music? We're lucky that we are still speaking<BR>
> English.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:15:15 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Megatraveller<BR>
<BR>
ehenry@newberlin.org (Eric Henry) wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Hi.  i'm interested in Megatraveller.  It's my understanding there were two<BR>
> printings of Megatraveller.  One which needed lots of errata and another<BR>
> which didn't.<BR>
<BR>
> If this is true, how can i tell the difference between printings?<BR>
<BR>
The fastest way to tell the difference is to look at the<BR>
Players Handbook. In first printings the PM is staple<BR>
bound and in later printings it is perfect bound. I'm<BR>
not sure how non US copies are bound though.<BR>
<BR>
Peter - owner of 4 or 5 MT boxed sets.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:17:19 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Subject: Two filks<BR>
<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
Excellent work, Doug.  You obviously have too much time on<BR>
your hands.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:21:09 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Mail Carriers<BR>
<BR>
Another reason for Mail Carriers to be armed is that by<BR>
accepting a government contract to deliver mail you may<BR>
be subject to nationalization in times of war (in the TU<BR>
of a sufficiently evil Ref). Therefore you need to be armed<BR>
so you can have a chance of accomplishing whatever task<BR>
the government sets for you. (and of surviving the war<BR>
but the government may not care about that).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:28:01 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Broadsword<BR>
<BR>
Pat Connaughton writes:<BR>
<BR>
> I would think that other considerations than "time critical" cargo would be<BR>
> a significant<BR>
> factor. Consider breaking bulk and local re-deliveries within specific<BR>
> zones. Or situations within less developed areas that local knowledge(by<BR>
> the ship) that may<BR>
> allow for flexibility within a given area. Tramp freighters and small bulk<BR>
> cargo vessels<BR>
> flourished for many years and continue to manage today with such<BR>
> activities. <BR>
<BR>
I suggested two things: cargo going to places off-main (equivalent to local<BR>
redelivery and less developed areas) and short-term cargo.  Another category<BR>
is any cargo which is low-volume and requires special handling -- a small<BR>
trader is much more likely to be flexible about such things.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:24:18 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Jump Space Jack Flash<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> >From: Peter Newman <BR>
<BR>
> Brilliant!  I've adopted the liner notes for my Traveller universe.--Glenn <BR>
<BR>
Thank you. The liner notes, as always, took more effort<BR>
than the filk itself to ensure that they fit into canon.<BR>
I had to pull out my AM3 to get a proper Gveghization<BR>
for Mick Jagger and to properly name the Corsair band his<BR>
parents used to belong to.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:34:04 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Hi,<BR>
<BR>
I recently got the CT reprint of the main rulebooks. I<BR>
might have to run a Traveller game before I can get<BR>
the supplements reprint, though, so could I have a<BR>
quick summary of the various alien races in Traveller?<BR>
Just a description will do, I don't want rules as yet<BR>
- - I plan to give the players stories and rumours about<BR>
the aliens before I let them meet them.<BR>
<BR>
Arthur<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:36:44 -0500<BR>
From: Dan Roseberry <rosebee@troi.csw.net><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
>>Yes, but first you must undergo the ritiual of the Dread Penguin.<BR>
<BR>
Ok, I'll bite. Whats the ritual of the Dread Penguin?<BR>
<BR>
Dan Roseberry   Hot Springs, Arkansas<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:40:43 -0400<BR>
From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
Please see my notes below. He's talking about an SDB, not a Star Ship. If<BR>
you do decide to do a deck plan I would love to see it!!!!!<BR>
<BR>
Thom<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: <GypsyComet@aol.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Monday, April 24, 2000 12:42 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com> requests:<BR>
><BR>
>  Could be amusing. With the tonnage breakdowns I'll try it. It looks<BR>
roughly<BR>
> like:<BR>
><BR>
>  100 ton hull<BR>
>  4 small staterooms (8 tons)<BR>
>  1 Emergency Low Berth (2 tons)<BR>
>  Fuel (22.6 tons)<BR>
>  j-Drive (3 tons)<-----------------------------------No J-Drive (it's an<BR>
SDB)--Thom<BR>
>  M-Drive ?<------------------------------------------Big<BR>
M-Drive?------------------Thom<BR>
>  Power ?<BR>
>  Da GUN (44.35 tons)<BR>
>  3? workstations<BR>
><BR>
>  And that's all my pre-work brain can come up with at the moment...<BR>
><BR>
> GC<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:53:49<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
<BR>
At 09:31 PM 4/24/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Swordy has one of the first 50 copies ever printed, as does Loren. <BR>
>Effectively the pre-release copies for approval...<BR>
<BR>
But James and I have the only *signed* pre-release copies in the world.<BR>
<BR>
BTW: James, watch your mail. I'm sending you a McDonald's copupon for a<BR>
free order of McNuggets.  Never say I don't pay what I promise!<BR>
<BR>
>But hey, please feel free to order extras for friends!<BR>
<BR>
I'm going to order a few...<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:56:10 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
>Subject: Re: Expert Witness's<BR>
<BR>
>I guess my main concern is /who/ is paying, and how the <BR>
>transaction takes place. It was not at all the amount, but<BR>
<BR>
>the circumstances.<BR>
<BR>
The party who hires the expert witness pays.  In the United<BR>
States, the general rules is that the loser at trial pays<BR>
the costs of the winner.  Payment to the expert witness is<BR>
ordinarily a cost.  Typical costs include court filing fees<BR>
and payments to court reporters for preparing transcripts.)<BR>
 (Attorney's fees are not generally considered a cost.)<BR>
<BR>
The transaction usually takes place in the usual manner for<BR>
hiring a professional in litigation:  The expert and the<BR>
lawyer execute a contract for expert services at a certain<BR>
hourly rate plus expenses.  The expert sends the lawyer a<BR>
bill when appropriate (every month, after trial, whatever<BR>
they've agreed).  The lawyer sends the expert a check,<BR>
drawn on the lawyer's trust account (which is where the<BR>
lawyer has deposited the retainer from his client).<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:06:10 -0500<BR>
From: Eris Reddoch <eris@pcola.gulf.net><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
Arthur Boff wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Is it still OK to put posts about CT on this list?<BR>
<BR>
Absolutely! We do it all the time. <g>  Arthur, anything about Traveller<BR>
in any version is on topic here...and we are very good at steering most<BR>
anything *else* back to our favorite game.<BR>
 <BR>
> BTW: I recently got Classic Traveller in the new BFB<BR>
> (Big Floppy Book) format. Personally I think it's<BR>
> great and see no need to get a later version. Can we<BR>
> assume that since it's been reprinted we can count it<BR>
> among the "current" versions (since now brand new<BR>
> players will start playing it) or is it still archaic<BR>
> and outdated and not worth discussing? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Sounds good to me. Just about the only thing I'd add to CT is a Task<BR>
System, and the BITS one works for me ;) so I'm quite happy with CT. <BR>
<BR>
Of course, I also like MT/TNE/T4/T4.1/GT and all my little (and not so<BR>
little) tweaks. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:07:54 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/24/00 2:34 PM, ajboff@yahoo.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Hi,<BR>
> <BR>
> I recently got the CT reprint of the main rulebooks. I<BR>
> might have to run a Traveller game before I can get<BR>
> the supplements reprint, though, so could I have a<BR>
> quick summary of the various alien races in Traveller?<BR>
> Just a description will do, I don't want rules as yet<BR>
> - I plan to give the players stories and rumours about<BR>
> the aliens before I let them meet them.<BR>
> <BR>
> Arthur<BR>
<BR>
Well, Here's a short list:<BR>
<BR>
Vargr: Geneered canine hominids.<BR>
Aslan: Lion-like hominids.<BR>
Hiver: Very odd squat tentacular *aliens*. Way alien.<BR>
K'kree: Centaur like herbivores.<BR>
Chirpers: Devolved descendants of the Droyne.<BR>
Droyne: Descendants of the same genetic stock the Ancients came from.<BR>
<BR>
And then humaniti is divided into various branches, the most important three<BR>
being:<BR>
<BR>
Vilani: Very conservative founders of the First Imperium.<BR>
Zhodani: Telepathic rivals of the Vilani.<BR>
Solomani: Terran humans, considered by many to be up-starts.<BR>
<BR>
Then there are many minor human races, some transplanted to other worlds by<BR>
the Ancients, others descended from the above three majors. Of these, some<BR>
have been genetically engineered to adapt to hostile environments. A few I<BR>
know of:<BR>
<BR>
Genoee : They /claim/ to be the "real" Ancients.<BR>
Darrians: Wielders of the dreaded "Star Trigger".<BR>
Jonkeereen: Geneered desert dwellers.<BR>
<BR>
I have found quite a few pics on the web, e-mail me off-list for details.<BR>
More can be found at:<BR>
<BR>
Library Data: http://www.pcug.org.au/~davidjw/libdata/libframe.htm<BR>
Missouri Archives: http://www.mu.org/~joe/traveller/archive/<BR>
<BR>
And my page, although somewhat spare as of now, may hold something of<BR>
interest to you:<BR>
<BR>
BZAT: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/index.html<BR>
<BR>
BTW folks, finished starports and working on worlds:<BR>
Lanth6(beta): http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Lanth6/Main.html<BR>
<BR>
////////////////////////////////////////<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2345<BR>
***********************************<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2346</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Monday, April 24 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2346<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
RE: Streamlining (was Re: Broadsword)<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
Questions to the list...<BR>
Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
RE: Mail carriers <BR>
Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
re:  Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
re:  expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Modular Cutters & Modular Starships<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Re: Mail carriers <BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
Re: Modular Cutters & Modular Starships<BR>
RE: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:08:28 -0500<BR>
From: Eris Reddoch <eris@pcola.gulf.net><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
Michel Vaillancourt wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >Michel, I tried to sign up for your Classic Traveller list a couple of<BR>
> >weeks ago and wasn't able to. I concluded that it was dead. If it isn't<BR>
> >I'd like to join, information would be appreciated.<BR>
<BR>
>          Send a message to "ClassicTraveller-request@atlantic-online.ns.ca"<BR>
> with the word "subscribe" in the body.  That should do it.  Alternately,<BR>
> send a message to "petidomo@atlantic-online.ns.ca" with just the word<BR>
> "help" as the message body for full instructions on how to use the listserv.<BR>
>          If you have any problems, mail me directly and let me know.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks, Michel. I'll give it another try tonight when I get home.<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:15:03 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Streamlining (was Re: Broadsword)<BR>
<BR>
I had thought that streamlining was;<BR>
<BR>
A) For easier maneuvering and landings in an atmosphere.<BR>
<BR>
B) For gas-giant refuelling.<BR>
<BR>
Skimming a gas-giant for fuel sounds like something that would be helped by<BR>
streamlining.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com [mailto:Damage169@cs.com]<BR>
Sent: Saturday, April 22, 2000 10:30 AM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Streamlining (was Re: Broadsword)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman writes:<BR>
<BR>
> That's basically what 'unstreamlined' means in GT.  Which doesn't account<BR>
>  for why merchants are streamlined, the various free and far traders would<BR>
>  be vastly superior designs if built unstreamlined with contragravity.<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
I would suspect it would be for in case the CG gave out, you could still<BR>
land <BR>
the ship without necessarily burning up on reentry. Also, some merchants may<BR>
<BR>
not use CG, either because it would be just one more thing to maintain or <BR>
break down, or because it costs money (in fuel and energy costs) to use. <BR>
<BR>
Most probably, though, its because the designers are used to dealing with <BR>
moderately "aircraft-shaped" designs and just stuck with it, despite <BR>
technological capability that would allow other, more efficient, designs <BR>
(Vilani traditionalism at its best).<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:55:41 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
<BR>
Luther Martin wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Douglas Berry wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> > In the mid eighties we suffered through the banana suit.  Bright yellow<BR>
> > jogging pants and jacket.<BR>
> <BR>
> We had to do aerobics for PT. It was unbelievable. The whole point of the<BR>
> military back then was to deter the agression of the Godless Commies by<BR>
> making them think that we were tougher than they were. To do this, we got up<BR>
> at 4 AM and danced around to music? We're lucky that we are still speaking<BR>
> English.<BR>
<BR>
Yeesh, I thought it was the tanks, planes and aircraft carriers that<BR>
were supposed to fend off the Russkis...<BR>
<BR>
Just a point: the theory and practice of aerobic training as a means of<BR>
increasing endurance was _invented_ by military PT instructors, back in<BR>
the late 60's or early 70's.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:20:42 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
Thom Harris wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Please see my notes below. He's talking about an SDB, not a Star Ship. If<BR>
> you do decide to do a deck plan I would love to see it!!!!!<BR>
<BR>
Actually, the original _Savage_ class *is* a starship.  There is also an<BR>
SDB variant.  Both ships are 100 dton SL Wedge, designed to look<BR>
amazingly like a typical Type S...until the NPAW fires, and the<BR>
miscreant "sees the light."<BR>
<BR>
Must move toward the light in the tunnel....<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:37:24 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
GypsyComet@aol.com wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<<snip>><BR>
<BR>
**Note: The following annotations are for the original, J2 2G _Savage_. <BR>
SDB stats will follow**<BR>
> <BR>
>  Could be amusing. With the tonnage breakdowns I'll try it. It looks roughly<BR>
> like:<BR>
> <BR>
>  100 ton hull<BR>
>  4 small staterooms (8 tons)<BR>
>  1 Emergency Low Berth (2 tons)<BR>
>  Fuel (22.6 tons)<BR>
>  j-Drive (3 tons) <BR>
>  M-Drive ? **68.25 m^3**<BR>
>  Power ? **56.06 m^3, including the IR and neutrino masking systems**<BR>
>  Da GUN (44.35 tons)  **tunnel length 32.5 m, tunnel diameter 4.0625 m; total volume for system (including tunnel, beam pointer, MFD, and accumulators, but not workstation) is 621.113 m^3**<BR>
>  3 workstations<BR>
> <BR>
>  And that's all my pre-work brain can come up with at the moment...<BR>
<BR>
Other major items (at least 1 dton each):<BR>
<BR>
Avionics (including controls, sensors, commo, and ECM): 23.43 m^3<BR>
Fuel purification plant:  40 m^3<BR>
Cargo bay: 14 m^3<BR>
Life support (including Extended life support, airlock, food storage,<BR>
galley, and G-comp:  41.38 m^3<BR>
<BR>
Note that this design uses the "fuel storage in waste space" option.<BR>
<BR>
If anyone needs more details, I can send the Excel 5.0 spreadsheet<BR>
off-list (in .ZIP format unless specifically asked otherwise).<BR>
> <BR>
> GC<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:38:39 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
<BR>
J-Man wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Gavareeti tolkya dyla tebe, Komrad!   :)<BR>
<BR>
I tozhe dumayu chto oni ne znayut o chem govoryat. Osobenno iz za togo<BR>
chto est' mesti gde nikto ne znaet angliskij yazyk. Mozhno dumat' kogda<BR>
v tekhase ili v kalifornii chto ne v amerike, a yuzhnee...<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:46:34 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Questions to the list...<BR>
<BR>
Ok, as a preface I haven't been involved in Traveller since the playtest<BR>
of TTA (FFS2). I have a few of the T4 books, and the maps and counters<BR>
for Brilliant Lances. My questions are as follows:<BR>
<BR>
1. What the hell happened to T4/IG? I get back on the web and see "Final<BR>
sale of Traveller material..." on the IG website. What gives?<BR>
<BR>
2. I've seen a lot of sites devoted to CT/MT or even TNE, but very few<BR>
devoted to T4. Not wanting to start a flame war or rehash older<BR>
arguments, what are the differences between the versions, mechanically<BR>
speaking? Why does everyone seem to hate T4 so much?<BR>
<BR>
3. Since it looks like IG folded, is there going to be another version<BR>
coming out from a different company? If so, where can I find out about<BR>
it?<BR>
<BR>
4. Given that TNE was my first Traveller item I bought, is there<BR>
anywhere I can get an idea of the history of the game (a timeline, for<BR>
instance) so that I know what the hell people are talking about in<BR>
regards to people, places and events in the TU?<BR>
<BR>
Well, that should do it for now. Thanks for your help.<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:21:34 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
<BR>
Whooie, you missed a lot of fireworks...<BR>
<BR>
Veskrashen wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Ok, as a preface I haven't been involved in Traveller since the playtest<BR>
> of TTA (FFS2). I have a few of the T4 books, and the maps and counters<BR>
> for Brilliant Lances. My questions are as follows:<BR>
> <BR>
> 1. What the hell happened to T4/IG? I get back on the web and see "Final<BR>
> sale of Traveller material..." on the IG website. What gives?<BR>
<BR>
IG managed to screw everything up to the point where Marc Miller yanked<BR>
their license.  A bad episode in Traveller's history marked by a few<BR>
bright spots. The supplements were all over the place, quality-wise, and<BR>
by the end they were ripping of everyone in sight.<BR>
 <BR>
> 3. Since it looks like IG folded, is there going to be another version<BR>
> coming out from a different company? If so, where can I find out about<BR>
> it?<BR>
<BR>
http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman is the line editor. 'nuff said!<BR>
<BR>
GURPS rules, but the setting is pure CT. The Rebellion and Virus never<BR>
happened...<BR>
<BR>
Marc is working on another version of Traveller, but its publication<BR>
date is as yet unannounced. <BR>
 <BR>
And by the way...welcome to the list, and watch out for the<BR>
penguins...;-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:25:00 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
<BR>
Veskrashen writes:<BR>
<BR>
> 1. What the hell happened to T4/IG? I get back on the web and see "Final<BR>
> sale of Traveller material..." on the IG website. What gives?<BR>
<BR>
Gross financial mismanagement, and possibly worse.  In any case, IG went<BR>
belly-up in the worst way.<BR>
> <BR>
> 2. I've seen a lot of sites devoted to CT/MT or even TNE, but very few<BR>
> devoted to T4. Not wanting to start a flame war or rehash older<BR>
> arguments, what are the differences between the versions, mechanically<BR>
> speaking? Why does everyone seem to hate T4 so much?<BR>
<BR>
Because a lot of bad and poorly edited material was published by IG, and they<BR>
generally left a bad taste in people's mouths.<BR>
> <BR>
> 3. Since it looks like IG folded, is there going to be another version<BR>
> coming out from a different company? If so, where can I find out about<BR>
> it?<BR>
<BR>
There GURPS: Traveller out now.  Alternately, wait for T5, but I don't htink<BR>
there's a firm date on that.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:26:20 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Mail carriers <BR>
<BR>
>From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
<BR>
>I will have to come to one of the TravellerinSF meetings <BR>
>one of these days,drink a beer, and tell you stories about<BR>
<BR>
>USPS people carrying guns.<BR>
<BR>
Let me know when you go and I'll share some of my<BR>
experiences as a casual clerk about 15 years ago.  The<BR>
Scouts in my Traveller universe are modelled in no small<BR>
part on my experience of the USPS.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 01:26:06 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
To: Traveller Mailing List <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 25 April 2000 00:52<BR>
Subject: Questions to the list...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Ok, as a preface I haven't been involved in Traveller since the playtest<BR>
>of TTA (FFS2). I have a few of the T4 books, and the maps and counters<BR>
>for Brilliant Lances. My questions are as follows:<BR>
><BR>
>1. What the hell happened to T4/IG? I get back on the web and see "Final<BR>
>sale of Traveller material..." on the IG website. What gives?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
IG folded a couple of years ago ('97?), leaving a lot of unpaid bills<BR>
(especially to authors)<BR>
<BR>
>2. I've seen a lot of sites devoted to CT/MT or even TNE, but very few<BR>
>devoted to T4. Not wanting to start a flame war or rehash older<BR>
>arguments, what are the differences between the versions, mechanically<BR>
>speaking? Why does everyone seem to hate T4 so much?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
See above. Oh, and the horrendous proofreading. And the half-die. A lot of<BR>
people *like* the system, but it was only in print for a couple of years and<BR>
had problems. A revised version is being used as the basis for T5, being<BR>
produced by Marc Miller himself (through his Far Future Enterprises company,<BR>
publishers of the CT reprints that are out now) and hopefully to be released<BR>
late '00 or early '01, but don't quote me <g><BR>
<BR>
>3. Since it looks like IG folded, is there going to be another version<BR>
>coming out from a different company? If so, where can I find out about<BR>
>it?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
See above for info on T5 & CT. Also, Marc licences the Traveller universe to<BR>
SJG, so we now have Gurps:Traveller, first published late '98 IIRC, which is<BR>
selling like hotcakes and has spawned several supplements *very* usefull for<BR>
*all* versions of Traveller. The GT universe is an *official* variant, set c<BR>
1120, where Dulinor died in a shuttle *accident* on his way to the meeting<BR>
with Strephon. Thus Strephon Lives, Lucan is just about to enroll in the<BR>
Naval Academy, Norris *has* been elevated to Archduke, and the shattered<BR>
Imperium was all a bad dream...<BR>
<BR>
Oh yes, BITS (British Isles Traveller Support) produce several supplements<BR>
in the styles of the CT LBB, only in white, which are primarily T4 in<BR>
setting, but with conversion rules for all the other Traveller versions.<BR>
They are *very* good, and the latest book At Close Quarters has just been<BR>
released, and should be orderable in the States from SJG shortly.<BR>
<BR>
>4. Given that TNE was my first Traveller item I bought, is there<BR>
>anywhere I can get an idea of the history of the game (a timeline, for<BR>
>instance) so that I know what the hell people are talking about in<BR>
>regards to people, places and events in the TU?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I'm sure that someone else can give you a weblink to a definitive timeline,<BR>
but basically:<BR>
CT ~1105-1115<BR>
MT 1116-1130<BR>
TNE 1200+<BR>
T4 0-200ish<BR>
GT alternate 1116+<BR>
<BR>
>Well, that should do it for now. Thanks for your help.<BR>
><BR>
>-Ves.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
No problem.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:43:02 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
<BR>
You'll probably find a lot of information on the Traveller<BR>
Web Ring; it's worth a surf.  Contact articles in JTAS and<BR>
Imperial Encyclopedia will provide some good basic<BR>
information.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 20:47:03 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
I have a question on aliens.<BR>
Once we found out that the Centaurs called themselves K'kree, that became<BR>
the default way to refer to them. How come the Aslan are still called Aslan<BR>
all the time and not Fteirle?<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:49:04 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/24/00 4:46 PM, veskrashen@sprynet.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> 1. What the hell happened to T4/IG?<BR>
<BR>
<bones><BR>
It's dead Jim.<BR>
</bones><BR>
<BR>
T5 is apparently the thing to look forward to, however GURPs is putting out<BR>
a lot of material that is very good. I am buying nearly everything GT, and I<BR>
don't even like the system. But great background info, art, etc. I just wish<BR>
the handled Jesse DeGraff's work a little more gently. And CT is being<BR>
released, first volume out now, second coming soon. And BITS is putting out<BR>
wonderful stuff, easy to stick into any rule-set. As to the timeline<BR>
question, I have been working on one plundered from the web. I can't<BR>
remember where, maybe Michel's site. Somebody will remind us where. ;)<BR>
However, you can see mine at:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Time1.html<BR>
<BR>
Only problem is I have stripped out the references, as it is to be used in a<BR>
campaign, and cuts off at year Zero.<BR>
<BR>
BITS--> http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR>
SJG--> http://www.sjgames.com/<BR>
Jesse DeGraff's:<BR>
http://vision-forge-graphics.com/jesse/traveller/trav_welcome.htm<BR>
////////////////////////////////////////<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
BZAT: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/index.html<BR>
Lanth6(beta): http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Lanth6/Main.html<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:08:54 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: re:  expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
>>I guess my main concern is /who/ is paying, and how the<BR>
>>transaction takes place. It was not at all the amount, but<BR>
><BR>
>>the circumstances.<BR>
><BR>
>The party who hires the expert witness pays.  In the United<BR>
>States, the general rules is that the loser at trial pays<BR>
>the costs of the winner.  Payment to the expert witness is<BR>
>ordinarily a cost.  Typical costs include court filing fees<BR>
>and payments to court reporters for preparing transcripts.)<BR>
> (Attorney's fees are not generally considered a cost.)<BR>
><BR>
>The transaction usually takes place in the usual manner for<BR>
>hiring a professional in litigation:  The expert and the<BR>
>lawyer execute a contract for expert services at a certain<BR>
>hourly rate plus expenses.  The expert sends the lawyer a<BR>
>bill when appropriate (every month, after trial, whatever<BR>
>they've agreed).  The lawyer sends the expert a check,<BR>
>drawn on the lawyer's trust account (which is where the<BR>
>lawyer has deposited the retainer from his client).<BR>
><BR>
>- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
I would suspect that the problem is the one that most laymen have with the<BR>
system. Obviously a lawyer is not going to pay an expert to say his client<BR>
is guilty. So does the expert really believe what he says or is he only<BR>
saying what he is saying so he'll get paid? And then there is the case of<BR>
the dueling experts. The fifteen experts I pay to support my argument are<BR>
better than the fifteen experts you pay to support your argument. It just<BR>
leaves a bad taste in some people's mouth.<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: Is the 3I court system adversarial? What other kinds of successful<BR>
systems are there? What does Successful mean?<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:30:30 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Modular Cutters & Modular Starships<BR>
<BR>
Just received and read GT:FT.  Hadn't realised that so much work had been<BR>
done on containerisation by other people (BTW Good Supplement Guys, lots of<BR>
good GM ideas in this one).<BR>
<BR>
Just a few more thoughts on containerisation and modules with respect to the<BR>
Oberon Class Modular Freighter and the 'Standard' Modular Cutter:<BR>
<BR>
* Rectangular boxes are far more space efficient than cylinders when<BR>
collected together.  The Oberon Class was designed to carry freight and thus<BR>
was designed with a 'space efficient'  box configuration.  My guess is that<BR>
the modular cutter was originally designed as a cutter with a cylindrical<BR>
configuration and that 'modularization took place after the fact, with the<BR>
design of the various modules being constrained by the original ships basic<BR>
design specs.<BR>
<BR>
* IMTU the Mo-Lifter carried by the Oberon Class sits in external grapples.<BR>
I have always envisaged it as being something similar to Thunderbird 4 (Or<BR>
is it T2?  Anyway, you know, the one with the removable middle!).  In my<BR>
design I see the USL 'Oberon modules' being carried internally in a<BR>
'hanger'.  The Mo-Lifter itself should be SL or Airframe.  Being a CT fan<BR>
the original High Guard was SL.  Of course, whilst being carried 'piggy<BR>
back' he Mo-Lifter would be carried complete with a loaded module to make<BR>
best (most cost effective) use of the potential cargo space.<BR>
<BR>
*  When I originally designed the Oberon Class I regarded the Oberon Modules<BR>
(OM) as being an integral cost of the ship, as without them the ship would<BR>
not be very useful at all.  However, things moved on IMTU quite quickly<BR>
following the design of the Oberon Class, and I postulated that following<BR>
the success of such a design, OM would become very common indeed (very like<BR>
S Type scout variants within the Imperium).  Today I would design and price<BR>
both separately.<BR>
<BR>
* Once OM became widespread I would envisage other ships being designed to<BR>
take advantage of them (e.g. Other sizes of Modular Freighter and even<BR>
Modular Far / Fat Traders).  Maybe this is what is being envisaged with the<BR>
'Modular Cutter' book.<BR>
<BR>
* I can see no reason why, once modularization had been proved viable why OM<BR>
wouldn't come in a variety of sizes (Basic 100 dton, 200 dton (Doubles) and<BR>
even 300 dton (Triples)).  Of course the bigger variants would probably be<BR>
restricted to the Major trade routes, but think about all those other<BR>
routes.  (I can see the scenarios now: a) Badly damaged OM.  Need to find /<BR>
beg / hire / borrow a new one, b) Great opportunities for passenger<BR>
movement, little for freight, where can we hire a Passenger OM?  c) Merc<BR>
unit wishes to travel from A to B, and has specially configured OM (s) which<BR>
need moving, d) Modularised Space station / research station being built,<BR>
players contracted to assist as basic shippers, e) etc, etc, etc).  Again I<BR>
can now perhaps see where the Modular Cutter book may be going.<BR>
<BR>
* I would envisage trading companies buying 'fleets' of OM and<BR>
sub-contracting the movement of these to third parties.  A much cheaper way<BR>
to start out as a merchant than buying a starship.  Of course eventually you<BR>
may wish to cut out the additional middle man and collect all the profit<BR>
(assuming that the transporter is making a profit that is!)<BR>
<BR>
Comments???<BR>
<BR>
Best Wishes<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
(BTW: IMTU the Imperium doesn't exist, but the Two Kingdoms Empire plays a<BR>
similar (if smaller and thus more comprehensible) role.  Those familiar with<BR>
canon would probably recognise the place).<BR>
<BR>
(PS.  Can't seem to find the original Oberon design anywhere, guess I'll<BR>
just have to work it up from scratch).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 19:13:15 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
Monaco is fixed width on the mac, I believe.<BR>
<BR>
Tod<BR>
- --<BR>
"Everything I need to know, I learned from<BR>
killing smart people and eating their brains."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
> <BR>
> Sure, but you are missing the point. All IE did was post the<BR>
> *characters* you used. In a *fixed pitch* font. I'm not even sure if<BR>
> the Mac *has* any such as a default. Mainly because I seem to recall<BR>
> Z-Term having to *install* one...<BR>
> <BR>
> -- <BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
> shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
> leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:22:14 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Mail carriers <BR>
<BR>
>>Aha, so you are really in favor of arming government *contractors* That<BR>
>>sounds much safer.<BR>
><BR>
>The USPS is a semi-private organization.<BR>
<BR>
No, it's a wholly government owned corporation. Nothing private about it at<BR>
all.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 22:40:30 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
> >As I recall, in the United Kingdom they use the term "subjects" rather than<BR>
> >"citizens" (if any British contributors know I'm wrong, by all <BR>
> >means, tell me!),<BR>
><BR>
> This changed legally around 1983 when the Tory government of the time <BR>
> passed laws to define citizenship. It was really part of a hardening <BR>
> of immigration control against ex-colonies. The restrictions would <BR>
> have originally also been applied to the Falkland Islands had another <BR>
> small incident not happened at the same time....<BR>
> <BR>
> So although we are subjects of HM Queen Elizabeth II we are also citizens...<BR>
<BR>
Thanks for the clarification, Dom. I guess we could say that the average<BR>
Imperial is a subject of Emperor Strephon ... *and* a citizen of the Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:49:14 -0500<BR>
From: "Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Modular Cutters & Modular Starships<BR>
<BR>
I have been tinkering with a similar idea to the Oberon, inspired by <BR>
the Aurora from TNE, this is the O'Malley class Merchant War <BR>
Cruiser however. we at Maximus dont believe in subtle designs<BR>
so the O'Malley is a 30,000 ton ship, with 20,000 tons of cargo<BR>
space.<BR>
<BR>
its available on the Free Trader Beowulf pages, and will soon<BR>
be on the Traveller downport site as well. theres also a High Guard <BR>
Version.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:03:47 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Terry Carlino<BR>
> I would suspect that the problem is the one that most laymen have with the<BR>
> system. Obviously a lawyer is not going to pay an expert to say his client<BR>
> is guilty. So does the expert really believe what he says or is he only<BR>
> saying what he is saying so he'll get paid?<BR>
<BR>
The witness is still giving evidence under oath, therefore he either<BR>
believes what he is saying or is perjuring himself, which is illegal.<BR>
<BR>
Only "opinions" can really be bought, and there the witness, if giving an<BR>
opinion based purely on momey would probably quickly become discredited and<BR>
be unable to practice his profession. Thus in most cases, it is entirely<BR>
uneconmic for an expert<BR>
<BR>
> And then there is the case of<BR>
> the dueling experts. The fifteen experts I pay to support my argument are<BR>
> better than the fifteen experts you pay to support your argument.<BR>
<BR>
Not neccessarily. This sort of thing usually occurs where there is no simple<BR>
way of determining the truth, such as when deciding if a person is "insane".<BR>
<BR>
Frankly, I think this is a good thing in such cases.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, this would be simplified if we _removed_ the insanity, and<BR>
similar defences.<BR>
<BR>
The court should determine what happened, it should not be considering<BR>
"mitigating circumstances", because "mitigating crcumstances" do not affect<BR>
the facts.<BR>
<BR>
Where those sorts of things should be considered is in the _sentencing_, not<BR>
in determinig guilt or innocence. Unfortunately, people right laws were<BR>
there are set punishiments for certain crimes, including things such as<BR>
minimum and mandatory sentences.<BR>
<BR>
Because of this people are forcved to defend "crimes" that factually they<BR>
committed, because while the crime has been committed, it is apparrent to<BR>
all concerned that the person does not deserve the mandatory or minimum<BR>
sentence, so the judge to be "fair" must admit non-factual evidence to the<BR>
decision to allow an incorrect verdict to occur.<BR>
<BR>
Seperation of conviction and sentencing completely, with far more<BR>
flexibility on the sentencing side, with the ability to just appeal the<BR>
sentence rather than the verdict, would IMO, simplify things greatly.<BR>
<BR>
Of course lawyers hate anything that might simplify the law, as then they<BR>
wpould be unneccessary, and as most laws are made by lawyers or people being<BR>
advised by lawyers, often acting as a knee-jerk to some recent crime, it's<BR>
unlikely we'll ever get a good legal system.<BR>
<BR>
I could go on about the stupidity of the concept of "a jury of peers"<BR>
(how do you form a jury if the person is peerless, and doesn't that imply<BR>
that criminals should be judged by other criminals, not by law-abiding<BR>
citizens ?), but that would be another argument completely.<BR>
<BR>
> It just leaves a bad taste in some people's mouth.<BR>
<BR>
I don't see why.<BR>
<BR>
Experts are called to give opinions, facts, and simple explanations for<BR>
things the jury / judge in most cases don't know and/or don't  understand.<BR>
<BR>
Theer are a few ways of avoiding this, but they would all cost the tax-payer<BR>
more.<BR>
<BR>
One way would be to get rid of judges & jury's and have cases tried by<BR>
people who _are_ experts in the fields related to the case in question. In<BR>
that case, the jury fees would need to be significantly higher, as if they<BR>
were not almost all "experts" would refuse to sit on a jury, because it<BR>
would cost them too much to do so.<BR>
<BR>
Another, providing the expert witness through the court system would require<BR>
the court system costing a lot more _and_ raise the question of who gets to<BR>
choose the expert ?<BR>
<BR>
Perhaps this might be solved by selecting experts in the same way one<BR>
selects a jury. Though again the cost would be greater, due to an additional<BR>
"witness selection" part of the trial.<BR>
<BR>
> ObTrav: Is the 3I court system adversarial? What other kinds of successful<BR>
> systems are there? What does Successful mean?<BR>
<BR>
The French and Italian systems. (Inquisitorial?) The onus is in the "judge"<BR>
to discover the "truth" of the matter, with no specific interest in<BR>
determining "guilt" or "innocence", just what happened.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2346<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Tuesday, April 25 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2347<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Lanth Region<BR>
Expert Witness<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium<BR>
Penguins<BR>
Re: (no subject)<BR>
GT-Q: Modular Cutter Standards<BR>
San Jose Traveller Meet - 20 May<BR>
Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
Guarding the Mail<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Expert Witness<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
SETI@home Question<BR>
Questions to the list<BR>
[none]<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2344<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 20:18:29 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth Region<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/24/00 7:13 PM, webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Monaco is fixed width on the mac, I believe.<BR>
> <BR>
> Tod<BR>
<BR>
Yep. I'm up to speed now.;)<BR>
<BR>
I have finished roughing out the planet icons, stress on roughing. More<BR>
questions come to mind, some I can research on my own, but others are<BR>
somewhat matters of opinion. Like this; At what date were the Sword Worlds<BR>
at the heighth of power? A little more specifically, when did they hold the<BR>
most systems? What non-local (I know the residents) minor races would likely<BR>
be encountered in the Lanth region? And a little off the path, has anyone<BR>
ever used aliens from Renegade Legions or 2300AD?<BR>
<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
BZAT: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/index.html<BR>
Lanth6: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Lanth6/Main.html<BR>
E-mail: xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 22:31:05 -0500<BR>
From: Bolie Williams IV <bolie@io.com><BR>
Subject: Expert Witness<BR>
<BR>
At 11:39 AM -0700 4/24/00, Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
>>From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
><BR>
>>I read the article and have a query for you legal type<BR>
>>TMLers. Here is an excerpt: Among those on the expert<BR>
>>witness list is the band Offspring's front man, Bryan<BR>
>>"Dexter" Holland, who will be paid $250 per hour for his<BR>
>>testimony,court records state.<BR>
>>How can this be legal? Or is this just reimbursement for<BR>
>>time lost paid by the court?<BR>
><BR>
>What's the problem?  An expert witness is someone hired by<BR>
>a party to help explain something technical and complex to<BR>
>the court and to give an opinion about it.  This is a<BR>
>routine part of litigation.  Many people who have risen far<BR>
>in their careers start making a large part of their<BR>
>livelihood by being experts.  Engineers, scientists,<BR>
>doctors, statisticians, securities professionals and so on<BR>
>are commonly called as experts, but anyone who has<BR>
>specialized knowledge can be hired as an expert.  $250 per<BR>
>hour does not raise my eyebrows.<BR>
<BR>
Just to clarify, a paid expert witness is normally not<BR>
related to the case.  Anyone who is part of the case will<BR>
be subpoenaed and have to testify without compensation.<BR>
I'm sure there are rules about paying witnesses who are<BR>
involved.<BR>
<BR>
Bolie IV<BR>
- -- <BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Bolie Williams IV<BR>
bolie@io.com<BR>
http://www.io.com/~bolie/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 05:46:55 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin schrieb:<BR>
[snip]<BR>
<BR>
> >but their deeds. Things that are IMHO very likely to<BR>
> >happen in the 3I, with all than noblemen personal honor<BR>
> >etc.<BR>
> <BR>
> I agree that the Imperium isn't anything like Nazi Germany<BR>
> -- as you pointed it out, it can't be if it has lasted for<BR>
> over 1,000 years.<BR>
> <BR>
> There are, however, two very disturbing issues in Imperial<BR>
> history that are worth pointing out:  the psionics<BR>
> suppressions and the Droyne question.  It seems that the<BR>
> result of the psionics suppressions (about 400, I think?)<BR>
> is that, 800 or so years later, Imperial citizens of every<BR>
> species see psionics as dangerous and repulsive and would<BR>
> be willing to lynch telepaths, at least, if not all other<BR>
> psionicists.  At the same time, most of the Droyne (a<BR>
> psionic race) live on interdicted planets -- not a long<BR>
> step from living in ghettos.<BR>
<BR>
:-)<BR>
You are serious? Well, this parallel can be drawn to any nation in human<BR>
history;<BR>
The Imperium is the U.S., because they had a civil war, the Imperium is<BR>
Great Britain, because they Had a phase of aggressive colonization, etc.<BR>
Or on the gettos: The Imperium is the U.S., because Japanese were put in<BR>
getthos during WII. <BR>
<BR>
But until the second/final  civil war, there have been no true acts of<BR>
genocide sanctioned by the Imperial Gouvernment, AFAIK. To compare the<BR>
idea of the 3I with the Nazi Empire is only fair as far as humans<BR>
gouverned both (though one is only fictional).<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
Hiroshi.Estigarribia@gmx.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 20:49:48 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Penguins<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Yes, but first you must undergo the ritiual of the Dread Penguin.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
> Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
>   http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
><BR>
> "But that's not the point!" raged Ford. "The point is that I am now a<BR>
> perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of<BR>
> limbs!"  - The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy<BR>
<BR>
While slowly dealing with a six-month backlog of files from<BR>
alt.binaries.fonts, I came across a font called "FlyingPeguins". And<BR>
yes, it really *is* penguins with letters on them.<BR>
<BR>
Anybody want a copy?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 20:37:41 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: (no subject)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> In every version of Traveller, it is stated that ships that carry<BR>
> mail must be armed and carry a gunner. I don't fully understand the<BR>
> reasoning here...can someone suggest a good reason?<BR>
<BR>
> 1) Most commercial carriers, including those carrying mail, are more<BR>
> interested in getting their cargo to its proper destination than in<BR>
> combat.  If travel is dangerous enough that there is any need to go<BR>
> armed, most simply won't go unless there is enough potential profit<BR>
> to balance the added risk.<BR>
<BR>
It's not a matter of *travel* being dangerous. It's a matter of<BR>
carrying "the mail" being dangerous.<BR>
<BR>
Why? Same reason that stagecoaches and the mail cars on trains are such<BR>
prime targets... *money*.<BR>
<BR>
Since communication is limited to the speed of ships, credit cards are<BR>
simply *not* practical. Ditto for electronic fund transfers. So the<BR>
mail will include stuff like "bearer bonds" and actual "cash"<BR>
transfers. <BR>
<BR>
There *are* ways to secure these, but there are also ways of getting<BR>
around those if you are really determined.<BR>
<BR>
> 2) Wouldn't merchants and mail carriers be just as well served by<BR>
> requiring some kind of defenses like sandcasters? I would think they<BR>
> would want to escape, rather than stay and slug it out with an<BR>
> attacker.<BR>
<BR>
That assumes that you have a *choice*. If you jump in and get attacked,<BR>
you *can't* jump out. For one, most ships won't have the fuel. Also,<BR>
defensive weapons aren't going to *stop* an attacker. He can just<BR>
ignore them and close to point blank range. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 00:09:16 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Dalton Spence <dalton.spence@hwcn.org><BR>
Subject: GT-Q: Modular Cutter Standards<BR>
<BR>
There has been a lot of talk about the upcoming GT: Modular Cutter<BR>
book, so I thought I'd ask a few questions about the subject matter<BR>
itself.<BR>
<BR>
1.  Which version of the modular cutter is the official standard; a)<BR>
    GT p.142 with an Engineering module and 0.5 dton internal cargo<BR>
    space, or b) GT:FT p.137 with a Small-Craft Bridge Add-on and an<BR>
    External Cradle for the module?<BR>
<BR>
2.  Option b) above puts a load restriction of 125 stons on total<BR>
    module mass, which given the 24 ston tare weight of a TL10 shell<BR>
    allows for a maximum of 101 stons of cargo and components. What<BR>
    would be the effect of overloading the cradle, either by loading<BR>
    too much mass into the module or flying in a high-gravity field?<BR>
<BR>
3.  Module designs are based on the TL10 30-dton streamlined cargo<BR>
    shell, which masses 24 stons, costs MCr0.76 and holds 24 dtons<BR>
    components and cargo. How does this differ functionally and in<BR>
    terms of maintenance from a TL12 shell which would mass 10 stons<BR>
    and cost MCr0.616?<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
              @==================================================@<BR>
              | Dalton S. Spence, B.Sc. <dalton.spence@hwcn.org> |<BR>
              | Home Page: http://www.hwcn.org/~ag775/home.html  |<BR>
              |      Family Motto: Virtute Acquiritur Honos      |<BR>
              |    "Trade is the lifeblood of the Imperium."     |<BR>
              |   Cleon I, First Emperor of the Third Imperium   |<BR>
              |          The amethyst is opaque. FNORD!          |<BR>
              @==================================================@<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:38:33 -0700<BR>
From: Kristian Miller <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com><BR>
Subject: San Jose Traveller Meet - 20 May<BR>
<BR>
Hi All,<BR>
<BR>
The date for the next San Jose Traveller Meet will be May 20.  We'll<BR>
start at 11:00 and have the usual format.<BR>
<BR>
Games:  Battle Rider, Striker<BR>
Evening Game: Traveller RPG, assorted board games<BR>
<BR>
Pass the news on to anyone who is interested.  For more information<BR>
email me at:<BR>
travellerne@3rd-imperium.com<BR>
<BR>
Kristian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 00:56:07 EDT<BR>
From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
"Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net> types:<BR>
<BR>
>Please see my notes below. He's talking about an SDB, not a Star Ship. If<BR>
>you do decide to do a deck plan I would love to see it!!!!!<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
>  Fuel (22.6 tons)<BR>
>  j-Drive (3 tons)<--------------No J-Drive (it's an SDB)--Thom<BR>
>  M-Drive ?<-------------------Big M-Drive?----Thom<BR>
>  Power ?<BR>
<BR>
 Er. Maybe YOU are talking about the SDB version, refered to briefly at the <BR>
end of the original post, but I'm looking at the posted Jump-capable Savage.<BR>
<BR>
 Other design assumptions like the designated length of the NPAW would be <BR>
nice as well.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 02:35:51 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Guarding the Mail<BR>
<BR>
Thanks for all the responses on why mail needs guards.  I missed giving a <BR>
title to that thread.<BR>
    The idea that sandcasters create a navigational hazard hadn't occurred to <BR>
me, but it seems reasonable.   Hmm... debris from a large naval battle <BR>
clutters the system for decades to come... I hadn't though of lasers as a way <BR>
to get rid of navigational hazards, either...put a weapons grade laser on the <BR>
next shopping list, we'll keep it in the closet with the mop and the broom...<BR>
    I must admit that when it comes to people who commonly carry a gun on the <BR>
job, policemen and security guards come to mind before postal carriers. Mace <BR>
and pepper spray (for dogs, mostly) do come to mind.<BR>
<BR>
   On a somewhat different but related topic, I've been using GT:Far Trader, <BR>
and it appears that it, and GT:Starports, assumw a *peaceful* trade <BR>
enviroment. Last time I worked on my trade map of Core sector, just <BR>
considering the high-population worlds was giving me multiple heavy feeder <BR>
routes combining to major trade routes. That doesn't fit my impression of the <BR>
era of my campaign  (Late pre-Imperial M:0)   Trade with Vland in this period <BR>
ought to resemble Marco Polo on the Silk Road more than it does a busy <BR>
seaport or freeway.<BR>
    One factor that would reduce trade is that, since quite a few worlds with <BR>
a good starport and TL are listed as uninhabited in M:O and First Survey, <BR>
there must also be quite a few ghost ports that are now effectively a level <BR>
or two or three below the class listed for them.  Another is that all the <BR>
right conditions for piracy to flourish are present and few of the factors <BR>
that make it unprofitable as a career in the mature Imperium are operative.  <BR>
    Can any of the economics on the list suggest what economic impact <BR>
increasing risk or insurance costs would have on starship operations and how <BR>
much that should decrease the traffic on a given route? I've seen opinions on <BR>
the subject, but nothing I can use as correction to Far Trader.<BR>
    By the time of Strephon's Imperium, it appears that P****** is more the <BR>
stuff of ancient history and bad pseudo-historical romance. A lot of <BR>
merchants might regard the requirement for a weapon and a gunner as a bit of <BR>
ancient tradition that should have been revoked long ago.<BR>
<BR>
"The regs say we have to carry a laser and someone to operate it. Nothing <BR>
says it has to be functional, or that the gunner has to be able to hit a gas <BR>
giant at three thousand kilometers. Nobody's needed to use it on our regular <BR>
run in the past century, and if you think you have the time and the knowhow <BR>
to mess with it, I have a whole list of things that are a lot more pressing, <BR>
starting with that nasty whine on number three lift down in the cargo bay"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 22:57:59 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> I have a question on aliens.<BR>
> Once we found out that the Centaurs called themselves K'kree, that became<BR>
> the default way to refer to them. How come the Aslan are still called Aslan<BR>
> all the time and not Fteirle?<BR>
<BR>
Top 10 Answers<BR>
<BR>
10) The Centaurs = K'Kree change was made in CT and<BR>
the Aslan = Fteirle change was made in T4. Most Traveller<BR>
grognards are basically Whigs (just like the Vilani) and<BR>
do not accept post CT changes.<BR>
<BR>
9) The publication that made the Aslan's name for themselves<BR>
the Fteirle had a lower print run and came out more recently,<BR>
hence fewer Traveller fans are aware of it.<BR>
<BR>
8) The term K'Kree is used on the cover of G:Trav Aliens 2<BR>
while the term Fettle is on a sidebar on p. 35. <BR>
<BR>
7) Most Traveller fans unwilling to admit that they don't<BR>
know how to pronounce 'Fteirle'.<BR>
<BR>
9) Aslan not (barring CS Lewis) an English term but<BR>
Centaur is. Hence the word Centaur has cultural baggage<BR>
but the term Aslan does not (except perhaps in non<BR>
Christians who are CS Lewis fans).<BR>
<BR>
5) No Aslan in D&D = no name confusion. Centaurs in D&D<BR>
= name confusion<BR>
<BR>
4) If the Aslan get pissed at you for calling them the<BR>
wrong name they'll challenge you, fight to first blood<BR>
(probably yours) and be done with it.  The K'Kree are<BR>
already pissed at you over your diet & are unlikely to<BR>
change their minds.<BR>
<BR>
3) The Aslan don't care if you call them Aslan (as long<BR>
as you're polite about it). You are just a barbarian<BR>
talking in your barbarian jabber & your word for The<BR>
People is unimportant<BR>
<BR>
2) Who want half a ton of angry pot roast mad at you.<BR>
<BR>
1) It's all a Hiver plot.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 04:38:50 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Expert Witness<BR>
<BR>
Bolie Williams IV wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm sure there are rules about paying witnesses who are<BR>
> involved.<BR>
<BR>
Its the first or second question opposing counsel asks<BR>
an expert witness on cross-examination:<BR>
<BR>
"Prof. Eneri, how much are you being paid to testify<BR>
for X?"<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 04:37:29 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
"Frank G. Pitt" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Seperation of conviction and sentencing completely, with far more<BR>
> flexibility on the sentencing side, with the ability to just appeal the<BR>
> sentence rather than the verdict, would IMO, simplify things greatly.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not familiar with any US judicial systems that are NOT like<BR>
this.<BR>
<BR>
> Of course lawyers hate anything that might simplify the law, as then they<BR>
> would be unneccessary,<BR>
<BR>
Nope.  Most, if not all lawyers, would love simpler laws.<BR>
It would be easier to counsel clients, and cheaper for the<BR>
client as well.  In fact, in the areas of litigation and negotiation,<BR>
the persuasive ability of the lawyer becomes even more<BR>
important because there would presumably be much fewer<BR>
arguments about which laws are applicable and what they<BR>
are.<BR>
<BR>
Take laws that are poorly written by congressmen beholden<BR>
to special interest, and make it malpractice for a lawyer<BR>
NOT to defend zealously their client by finding and creating<BR>
loopholes anywhere they can, and you get a toxic combination.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> I could go on about the stupidity of the concept of "a jury of peers"<BR>
> (how do you form a jury if the person is peerless, and doesn't that imply<BR>
> that criminals should be judged by other criminals, not by law-abiding<BR>
> citizens ?), but that would be another argument completely.<BR>
<BR>
Well, in the US, where our government has tried to abolish<BR>
official caste systems, there is no such thing as "peerless."<BR>
<BR>
> Another, providing the expert witness through the court system would require<BR>
> the court system costing a lot more _and_ raise the question of who gets to<BR>
> choose the expert ?<BR>
<BR>
Courts can and do appoint "special masters" to give neutral assessments<BR>
and opinions on complex issues.  Usage varies by court, judge, subject<BR>
matter, and counsel's willingness.<BR>
<BR>
> > ObTrav: Is the 3I court system adversarial? What other kinds of successful<BR>
> > systems are there? What does Successful mean?<BR>
<BR>
"Successful" means they don't storm the Bastille.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:51:00 +0200<BR>
From: Holger Kadlez <paradin@gmx.de><BR>
Subject: SETI@home Question<BR>
<BR>
Hello friends,<BR>
<BR>
As SETI@home came up as a topic again, I just have to ask:<BR>
Is there a team on the TML and how to find it ?<BR>
<BR>
Best regards,<BR>
	Paradin<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
PS:<BR>
Just finished Nr. 200 that weekend, <BR>
and being no member of any team, by now<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:58:57 +0100<BR>
From: "Peter  Scarrott" <peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Questions to the list<BR>
<BR>
Original post<BR>
>Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:46:34 -1000<BR>
>From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
>Ok, as a preface I haven't been involved in Traveller since the playtest<BR>
>of TTA (FFS2). I have a few of the T4 books, and the maps and counters<BR>
>for Brilliant Lances. My questions are as follows:<BR>
<BR>
Welcome back to Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
>2. I've seen a lot of sites devoted to CT/MT or even TNE, but very few<BR>
>devoted to T4. Not wanting to start a flame war or rehash older<BR>
>arguments, what are the differences between the versions, mechanically<BR>
>speaking? Why does everyone seem to hate T4 so much?<BR>
<BR>
A major reason there is a lack of T4 sites is the short period it was in<BR>
print and the relatively small numbers of books sold. (IMO)<BR>
<BR>
>3. Since it looks like IG folded, is there going to be another version<BR>
>coming out from a different company? If so, where can I find out about<BR>
>it?<BR>
<BR>
Marc Millar will be releasing T5 sometime in the next few years (we hope).<BR>
Try his website ( http://members.aol.com/traveller/T000-00.html ) for more<BR>
information though I must admit there is not a lot there at the moment and<BR>
it gets updated very rarely.  Of course the CT reprints are now available, a<BR>
very useful resource available from the same site.<BR>
<BR>
>4. Given that TNE was my first Traveller item I bought, is there<BR>
>anywhere I can get an idea of the history of the game (a timeline, for<BR>
>instance) so that I know what the hell people are talking about in<BR>
>regards to people, places and events in the TU?<BR>
<BR>
IMO one of the best sites for Traveller TNE is the BARD site<BR>
http://www.downport.com/bard .  this is probably the largest TNE resource<BR>
available and includes all the TNE News service reports.  Please also note<BR>
that TNE timeline is no longer canon (nor is MT for that matter).  As the<BR>
current published Traveller (GURPS:T) is based on an alternate timeline.<BR>
Another resource for TNE and some other Traveller odds and sods is my site<BR>
(URL in sig).  Not much on the timeline, but I have several articles written<BR>
by various members of the Mailing lists archived there that may be of<BR>
interest.<BR>
<BR>
Another useful resource for Traveller TNE stuff is the TNE mailing list.  To<BR>
subscribe send an empty email to<BR>
tne-rces-subscribe@silent-tower.org<BR>
<BR>
>Well, that should do it for now. Thanks for your help.<BR>
That's ok we're all pretty helpful here (most of the time anyway).<BR>
<BR>
Quick question to the rest of the TML is it just me or has the Mailing list<BR>
grown a lot in the last 2 months or are people just subscribing more?  (This<BR>
would include me, I've been a lurker and very occasional poster for 18<BR>
months now).<BR>
<BR>
Peter<BR>
http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>
p.scarrott@btinternet.com<BR>
<BR>
IMTU:	tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so  zh+<BR>
vi-<BR>
     	And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR>
<BR>
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the<BR>
shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser<BR>
gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time to<BR>
die."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 03:14:01 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: [none]<BR>
<BR>
>Ok, as a preface I haven't been involved in Traveller since the playtest<BR>
>of TTA (FFS2). I have a few of the T4 books, and the maps and counters<BR>
>for Brilliant Lances. My questions are as follows:<BR>
<BR>
Careful about using TTA for FF&S/FF&S2... many fogies might confuse it with<BR>
"The Traveller Adventure" (CT era campaign book... the big red book)<BR>
<BR>
>1. What the hell happened to T4/IG? I get back on the web and see "Final<BR>
>sale of Traveller material..." on the IG website. What gives?<BR>
<BR>
MWM yanked their liscence.<BR>
<BR>
>2. I've seen a lot of sites devoted to CT/MT or even TNE, but very few<BR>
>devoted to T4. Not wanting to start a flame war or rehash older<BR>
>arguments, what are the differences between the versions, mechanically<BR>
>speaking? Why does everyone seem to hate T4 so much?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
CT: No real task system. Table-heavy combat rules (simple, but table<BR>
reliant). No special duty. 1-4 (+ rank and service skills) per term, mean<BR>
about 1.3 per term. Simple (can still do much of it in my head) ship design<BR>
systems (Bk2  and Bk5/HighGuard). Official setting was 1050-1107. Many<BR>
add-on games, some integrateable, some not: Striker (Mini's Rules 25/15mm,<BR>
vehicle and heavy weapons design sequences), Azahnti High Lightning<BR>
(Striker converted to gridded mechanics), Snapshot (Bk1 Combat on a grid,<BR>
with action points), Mayday (Bk2 space combat adapted to hex-grid),<BR>
Invasion Earth (Final battle of the solomani rim war, also a large scale<BR>
combat mechanism[regiment and up]), Fith Frontier War (Compatable with Dark<BR>
Nebula and Imperium, but not fully, from what little I've read of it),<BR>
Imperium (The Nth Interstellar War Period, move fleets on map, quik,<BR>
playable, extensible), Dark Nebula (Impies vs aslan variant of Imperium).<BR>
<BR>
MT: Integrated Striker (the mini's rules and vehicular design system) in a<BR>
severe (but recognizeable) variant. added special duty and bonus skills to<BR>
CharGen, and brought skills to a 1-7 skills (+R&S Skills) per term range,<BR>
with the mean about 1.7. similar mechanics in many places, and characters<BR>
directly useable (if more skilled or more broadly skilled) with CT. HG<BR>
designs can be used in MT, and MT space craft can be used (once rated)<BR>
under HG. Official setting was 1116-1128, the time of the Second Civil War<BR>
(AKA The Rebellion). Used pieces out of Striker, Supplement 5, and invasion<BR>
Earth, but failed to include the combat system from IE, for rating expected<BR>
troop strengths, etc. Included a good set of large-scale combat rules, but<BR>
no "Pregenerated Armies".<BR>
<BR>
TNE: Totally different set of rules for CGen and skill useage, used D20's.<BR>
Basically it's Twighlight 2000 mechanics. FF&S1 was the equipment design<BR>
system. (Striker 1 had only vehicle [except spacecraft] and weapons design.<BR>
MT Had only vehicles including spacecraft.) Several add-on games: Brilliant<BR>
Lances (Ship-to-ship combat), Battle Rider (Fleet Combat, diceless - card<BR>
based, adaptable to dice), Striker II (Command Decision ported to<BR>
traveller). Good support for a while, then GDW folded. Lots of people<BR>
disliked some or all of the setting, many newbies brought in by it, many<BR>
crossover players from CT and/or MT. Some of us still bitter about TNE.<BR>
Official setting was 1200-1230 or so, and was set in the fragmentary<BR>
remains of a no longer extant imperium. Some elements of the rules borrowed<BR>
from CT/MT (Like trade, encounters).<BR>
<BR>
T4: CT/MT based CGen. CT based combat system. Official setting in 1-100.<BR>
Decent (if typoed all to hell by IG) FF&S version. Lots of low quality<BR>
supplements (no offense, guys), and a few gems.<BR>
<BR>
GT: GURPS Traveller - Loren Wiseman's Adaptation of the traveller setting<BR>
to use the GURPS mechanics. Some love it, some hate it, many don't care.<BR>
Mechanically totally unrelated to any prior editions. Setting is a<BR>
non-rebellion 1116-onward. Many subtle changes, most only noticeable with<BR>
detailed analysis. Lots of support. In print. Major changes to approaches<BR>
to mechanics in some areas.<BR>
<BR>
>3. Since it looks like IG folded, is there going to be another version<BR>
>coming out from a different company? If so, where can I find out about<BR>
>it?<BR>
<BR>
CT is back in print. Reprint editions coming from Far Future Enterprises.<BR>
Should be in your FLGS by now with "The Books" (CT Books 0-8 in one US$20<BR>
volume).<BR>
<BR>
MWM is supposedly still working on T5.<BR>
<BR>
>4. Given that TNE was my first Traveller item I bought, is there<BR>
>anywhere I can get an idea of the history of the game (a timeline, for<BR>
>instance) so that I know what the hell people are talking about in<BR>
>regards to people, places and events in the TU?<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Find either of the following:<BR>
MegaTraveller Imperial Encyclopaedia<BR>
CT Supplements 8 & 11<BR>
GT rulebook<BR>
<BR>
and find Millieu 0 Campaign (T4)<BR>
<BR>
Also, you might want to try and find _Hard Times_ and _Survival Margin_<BR>
(both officially from the MT list, IIRC).<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 08:45:52 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2344<BR>
<BR>
 > Many folks on this list swear by CT, even refusing to<BR>
 > consider other editions "Traveller".<BR>
<BR>
Which implies that nothing I have written since 1987 is "Traveller." This <BR>
could bother me a little if I allowed it to.<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:03:04 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: William Prankard <cmdrx@magicnet.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
While X-TEK does not curently have 'light sabre' technology currently in<BR>
development,<BR>
we have been working with Darrian scientists on fire sculpture research.<BR>
It is believed the same technology could be used to produce an energy<BR>
blade.<BR>
<BR>
In the meantime, X-TEK R&D has produced a sword of such sufficiently<BR>
advanced technology that we have dubed it our "Excalibur" series.<BR>
<BR>
Excalibur type swords are hyperdense blades that incorporate<BR>
vibrotechnology and contragravity to      produce a truly deadly blade.<BR>
With the switch turned off, it is a heavy hyperdense browdsword, only the<BR>
very strong or battle dressed individual could wield such a massive weapon<BR>
with skill. Contragravity removes that encumbrance producing a sword that<BR>
feels as light as a feather. True to its namesake, it is like a magical<BR>
sword of ancient kings.<BR>
  <BR>
          Excalibur Broadsword TL-12<BR>
          Broadsword, Hyperdense Blade, Vibro, with CG lifter and rCell.<BR>
          Powered: Cut: sw+3d+1(10) ST=8<BR>
          Unpowered: Cut: sw+2d+1(10) ST=15<BR>
          cost: 3000cr Mass: 4lbs<BR>
<BR>
HTML file available at: <BR>
     http://magicnet.net/~cmdrx/xtek/subs/sword.htm<BR>
<BR>
Custom designs available as well in cutlass, rapier, and katana style<BR>
blades.<BR>
<BR>
\  // Commander X<BR>
 \//  CEO X-TEK Industries of Deneb, LIC<BR>
T E K  Starship Contractor & High Energy Weapons Research<BR>
 //\  http://www.magicnet.net/~cmdrx/xtek/xtek.htm<BR>
//  \ 0608 D557777-A kk- va+ so+ zh+ da+ A723<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:08:36 -0400<BR>
From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
Boy those are good drugs that the Doc gave me. Sorry about that, I read SDB<BR>
and my mind locked into it. I hope I didn't confuse the issue. I would still<BR>
like to see it when your done, please. I think it would most interesting. :)<BR>
<BR>
Thom<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: <GypsyComet@aol.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2000 12:56 AM<BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net> types:<BR>
><BR>
> >Please see my notes below. He's talking about an SDB, not a Star Ship. If<BR>
> >you do decide to do a deck plan I would love to see it!!!!!<BR>
> ><BR>
><BR>
> >  Fuel (22.6 tons)<BR>
> >  j-Drive (3 tons)<--------------No J-Drive (it's an SDB)--Thom<BR>
> >  M-Drive ?<-------------------Big M-Drive?----Thom<BR>
> >  Power ?<BR>
><BR>
>  Er. Maybe YOU are talking about the SDB version, refered to briefly at<BR>
the<BR>
> end of the original post, but I'm looking at the posted Jump-capable<BR>
Savage.<BR>
><BR>
>  Other design assumptions like the designated length of the NPAW would be<BR>
> nice as well.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2347<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2348</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Tuesday, April 25 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2348<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: GT-Q: Modular Cutter Standards<BR>
Re: St. George's Day and Heroic Stands<BR>
Zar-Tis, the Jedi of Traveller (was Re: Light Sabre)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
RE: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
ACQ review on JTAS<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
re:  expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium<BR>
Re: Expert Witness<BR>
One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium<BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
RE: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:15:42 CST6CDT<BR>
From: igor@truserve.com<BR>
Subject: Re: GT-Q: Modular Cutter Standards<BR>
<BR>
> There has been a lot of talk about the upcoming GT: Modular Cutter<BR>
> book, so I thought I'd ask a few questions about the subject matter<BR>
> itself.<BR>
<BR>
Being a co-author, I'll try to answer them. <BR>
<BR>
> 1.  Which version of the modular cutter is the official standard; a)<BR>
>     GT p.142 with an Engineering module and 0.5 dton internal cargo<BR>
>     space, or b) GT:FT p.137 with a Small-Craft Bridge Add-on and an<BR>
>     External Cradle for the module?<BR>
<BR>
Ummmm....neither. The problem is, as you pointed out, that as new books come <BR>
out, new features are available. The closest version would be the GT version. A <BR>
new version, hopefully the "final" version, will be described (in great detail) <BR>
in GT:C. <BR>
<BR>
So how do we handle the disparaties (sp)? Well, IMHO there cannot be _one_ <BR>
single type of cutter - different manufacturers would build slightly different <BR>
version. Both the GT and GT:FT remain valid - they simply are not the <BR>
LSP "standard" version. I realize that some people are gonna be upset by this - <BR>
but, unfortunately, this is what happens as a game world moves forward, and new <BR>
material is released.<BR>
<BR>
A key point when I designed the new cutters (yes, there's more than one - we've <BR>
got 7 non-starship designs) concerns the question of external grapples. One of <BR>
the problems with older cutter designs is the module: how is it carried? Static <BR>
electricity? It is obvious that some sort of grapple mechanism is necessary. <BR>
Which leads us to....<BR>
 <BR>
> 2.  Option b) above puts a load restriction of 125 stons on total<BR>
>     module mass, which given the 24 ston tare weight of a TL10 shell<BR>
>     allows for a maximum of 101 stons of cargo and components. What<BR>
>     would be the effect of overloading the cradle, either by loading<BR>
>     too much mass into the module or flying in a high-gravity field?<BR>
<BR>
..I wrestled with this for a while, and I will credit Loren with the solution. <BR>
In GT:C the cutters do not have grapples - the modules themselves do. <BR>
Basically, each module has enough grapples to support its own fully loaded <BR>
mass. This pretty much solves all the problems - otherwise I'd have to install <BR>
4 grapples on the base cutter hull (there are a couple modules that are _real_ <BR>
heavy). It makes more sense for a module to be responsible for attaching <BR>
itself. Granted, this does mean that the internal space available for the <BR>
cutter is reduced even beyond the streamlining, but that hasn't proven to be a <BR>
big problem so far...<BR>
<BR>
> 3.  Module designs are based on the TL10 30-dton streamlined cargo<BR>
>     shell, which masses 24 stons, costs MCr0.76 and holds 24 dtons<BR>
>     components and cargo. How does this differ functionally and in<BR>
>     terms of maintenance from a TL12 shell which would mass 10 stons<BR>
>     and cost MCr0.616?<BR>
<BR>
I'm not sure I understand the question...TL12 ones are cheaper and lighter. <BR>
Very true. And some modules _do_ use TL12 stuff...but most use TL10, since TL10 <BR>
is more common.<BR>
<BR>
I hope this answers your question, at least in general (I can't be real <BR>
specific, since the product is in development).<BR>
<BR>
Please feel free to comment or ask more questions...<BR>
<BR>
Andy Akins<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________<BR>
True Communications Corporation Your Premier ISP.<BR>
"Hometown Service with Worldwide Connectivity"<BR>
http://www.truserve.com        info@truserve.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:17:19 +0100<BR>
From: Martin Hardgrave <martin@deira.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: St. George's Day and Heroic Stands<BR>
<BR>
In message <39029E45.6CBD615B@premier.net>, Black ICE<BR>
<wombat@premier.net> writes<BR>
>I note that today is St. George's Day,<BR>
<BR>
Strictly speaking it isn't, as no saint's day takes precedence over<BR>
Easter Sunday, and next Sunday is in the Octave of Easter, so St<BR>
George's Day this year falls on Tuesday 2nd May IIRC.<BR>
- -- <BR>
Martin Hardgrave<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:40:33 -0500<BR>
From: Jason Kemp <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: Zar-Tis, the Jedi of Traveller (was Re: Light Sabre)<BR>
<BR>
From: William Prankard <cmdrx@magicnet.net><BR>
<BR>
> While X-TEK does not curently have 'light sabre' technology <BR>
> currently in<BR>
> development,<BR>
> we have been working with Darrian scientists on fire <BR>
> sculpture research.<BR>
> It is believed the same technology could be used to produce an energy<BR>
> blade.<BR>
<BR>
A pre-Maghiz Darrian philosophical warrior-cult called the Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
once used such technology. For more information on plasma brand (light<BR>
sabre) weapon stats and character generation, please consult the article on<BR>
Freelance Traveller:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/features/rules/zartis.html<BR>
<BR>
Although the character generation is MT, it can easily be converted to CT,<BR>
or expanded for T4. As the original author, if you wish, I can make those<BR>
adjustments and submit them for possible inclusion in the article. (If<BR>
that's okay with the editor of Freelance Traveller, that is.)<BR>
<BR>
Enjoy,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:59:42 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>10) The Centaurs = K'Kree change was made in CT and<BR>
the Aslan = Fteirle change was made in T4. Most Traveller<BR>
grognards are basically Whigs (just like the Vilani) and<BR>
do not accept post CT changes.<<BR>
<BR>
Actually in MT. Definitely in DGP Aslan and Solomani. (Right, not even on<BR>
the cover of that one.) Possibly earlier.<BR>
Otherwise pretty good points.<BR>
I'd actually go with #1 myself. Those Hivers are always up to something. Two<BR>
can play at that game however.<BR>
<BR>
*AHEM*<BR>
<BR>
"The Major Races are Humaniti, Vargr, K'Kree, Fteirle, Droyne and Hivers."<BR>
<BR>
M. Samwise<BR>
<BR>
:-P<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:44:31 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
>Experts are called to give opinions, facts, and simple explanations for<BR>
things the jury / judge in most cases don't know and/or don't  understand.<<BR>
<BR>
I had an interesting run in with an "expert witness. A doctor called in a<BR>
personal injury case.<BR>
He had no "opinion", no "diagnosis". He barely seemed to have observations.<BR>
He definitely did not convince the jury of anything other than he was<BR>
getting paid way too much to not tell us anything.<BR>
<BR>
>I could go on about the stupidity of the concept of "a jury of peers"<BR>
(how do you form a jury if the person is peerless, and doesn't that imply<BR>
that criminals should be judged by other criminals, not by law-abiding<BR>
citizens ?), but that would be another argument completely.<<BR>
<BR>
Historical note:<BR>
Technically, "peer" is used incorrectly in jury references these days. The<BR>
original use referred to a Peer of the Realm. That is, Barons and other<BR>
nobles had a right to be tried by other nobles. This has been extended  to<BR>
refer to people of the same general class, noble or commoner. While<BR>
theoretically it would mean that a convicted criminal should only be tried<BR>
by other convicted criminals, before then with our presumption of innocence<BR>
until guilt is proven means that anyone is a peer of someone not accused of<BR>
a crime in the U.S. Naturally, this may be different in other countries.<BR>
In the Imperium, the concept of a jury of peers could definitely have more<BR>
meaning.<BR>
<BR>
And of course, given the numerous aliens out there, the concept of<BR>
"testifying" can become even more strained than it is when allowing women to<BR>
do so here and now.<BR>
(Know what it means before you call me sexist please.)<BR>
<BR>
As for Traveller, how do people give assurance of telling the truth?<BR>
Quasi-religious oaths still or just assurances?<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 12:42:35 EDT<BR>
From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: AuricTech Shipyards _Savage_ class Type SQ<BR>
<BR>
"Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net> types:<BR>
<BR>
>Boy those are good drugs that the Doc gave me. Sorry about that, I read SDB<BR>
>and my mind locked into it. I hope I didn't confuse the issue. I would still<BR>
>like to see it when your done, please. I think it would most interesting. :)<BR>
<BR>
 Already under way. Not particularly fascinating due largely to the shape of <BR>
the Type S hull and the design needs of a _linear_ accelerator. The NPAWS is <BR>
already going to fill the upper and lower galleries (such as they are; the <BR>
old deckplans are flawed in respect to available space off the main deck if <BR>
you assume the featureless wedge) as well as most/all of the useable space <BR>
forward of the landing gear. With fuel taking up all the edge space (where <BR>
the hull is less than 2m deep) this leaves the old engineering spaces and the <BR>
rear commons and craft bay as the sole living spaces. As a layer of <BR>
camouflage I'm leaving the engineering space as was, with the extra <BR>
powerplant tonnage assumed to be above or below. So this leaves two compartmen<BR>
ts connected by a corridor in which to shoehorn four small staterooms, the <BR>
galley, one ton of cargo, the airlock, and a couple-three workstations <BR>
politely refered to as "The Bridge." I may shorten the NPAWS slightly to give <BR>
a small bit of space between the landing legs for the bridge (and add one <BR>
more layer to the camouflage).<BR>
<BR>
 One discovery I made last night that is that there does not seem to have <BR>
ever been a TNE/T4 (3-ton turret, 2m grid) version of the standard Type S <BR>
deckplan, so there isn't a base to work from. That's next...<BR>
<BR>
GC<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 08:17:38<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
<BR>
At 01:46 PM 4/24/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>We had to do aerobics for PT. It was unbelievable.<BR>
<BR>
We did a few times at the 3/7th INF.  Like you said.  An entire 800 man<BR>
infantry battalion dancing around for a handful of spandex clad airheads.<BR>
After the first battalion PT like that, our 1SG learned that he had best do<BR>
his workout *behind* the formation.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 08:22:55<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
At 10:57 PM 4/24/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
>Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
>10) The Centaurs = K'Kree change was made in CT and<BR>
>the Aslan = Fteirle change was made in T4.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, the name Fteirle appeared in AM1.<BR>
<BR>
>1) It's all a Hiver plot.<BR>
<BR>
well, of course it is...<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 08:34:35<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
At 04:36 PM 4/24/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
>>>Yes, but first you must undergo the ritiual of the Dread Penguin.<BR>
><BR>
>Ok, I'll bite. Whats the ritual of the Dread Penguin?<BR>
<BR>
Meet me at McMurdo Station on Thursday.  Bring a raincoat, a medical<BR>
release, three gallons of cherry syrup and a Yak.<BR>
<BR>
Don't forget the consent form for the Yak.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"I am the penguin bold! We sailed the sea, to tringalee,<BR>
in search of spanish gold" - The Magic Pudding - Norman Lindsay<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:02:10<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: ACQ review on JTAS<BR>
<BR>
ACQ is reviewed in today's release of JTAS.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
Alle preisen den Pinguinherrscher!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:03:49 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
> the Aslan = Fteirle change was made in T4. Most Traveller<BR>
><BR>
> Actually in MT. Definitely in DGP Aslan and Solomani. (Right, not even on<BR>
> the cover of that one.) Possibly earlier.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, earlier.  In 1988, the Referee's Companion has a small dictionary of<BR>
Aslan words.  Fteirle is how they refer to "people", when meaning their own<BR>
kind.  There are names for each of the major races.<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:19:07 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
<BR>
>Once we found out that the Centaurs called themselves <BR>
>K'kree, that became the default way to refer to them. How <BR>
>come the Aslan are still called Aslan all the time and not<BR>
<BR>
>Fteirle?<BR>
<BR>
It's probably because "K'kree" is easier for native<BR>
speakers of Galanglic to pronounce more or less correctly<BR>
than "Fteirle".<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:24:55 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
You, sir, speaketh heresy!  Unless you can provide chapter and verse to<BR>
support your assertion, I demand you retract that accusation and apologize<BR>
to all CT purists.  Failure to comply is grounds for flogging (with a rubber<BR>
penguin).<BR>
<BR>
- -Crusty<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
> Actually, the name Fteirle appeared in AM1.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:27:53 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
<BR>
>I would suspect that the problem is the one that most<BR>
[deletion]<BR>
>It just leaves a bad taste in some people's mouth.<BR>
<BR>
The adversarial system is one of our major protections<BR>
against government tyranny, but it is certainly less than<BR>
perfect.<BR>
<BR>
>ObTrav: Is the 3I court system adversarial? <BR>
<BR>
The Imperial Judicial Courts in my Traveller universe are<BR>
not adversarial, but inquisitorial.  Imperial judges are<BR>
fairly high nobles and are able to inquire into whatever<BR>
they want, without regard to the positions of the<BR>
litigants.  <BR>
<BR>
>What other kinds of successful systems are there? What <BR>
>does Successful mean?<BR>
<BR>
The second of these questions is the more interesting.  Is<BR>
success just longevity? or does it mean that it contributes<BR>
to the advancement of the state? and what is advancement?<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:30:42 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin writes:<BR>
> >From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
> <BR>
> >Once we found out that the Centaurs called themselves <BR>
> >K'kree, that became the default way to refer to them. How <BR>
> >come the Aslan are still called Aslan all the time and not<BR>
> <BR>
> >Fteirle?<BR>
> <BR>
> It's probably because "K'kree" is easier for native<BR>
> speakers of Galanglic to pronounce more or less correctly<BR>
> than "Fteirle".<BR>
<BR>
Or else the K'kree objected loudly and the Aslan didn't.  <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:40:52 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
How is removing the mass going to help you wield the sword?  You can pick it<BR>
up now, sure, but it still has all the sword's inertia behind a swing.  If<BR>
you hit your target you're probably okay, but I can see someone picking it<BR>
up, taking a swing, and whirling around three times before falling to the<BR>
ground in confusion.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: William Prankard [mailto:cmdrx@magicnet.net]<BR>
Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2000 7:03 AM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
While X-TEK does not curently have 'light sabre' technology currently in<BR>
development,<BR>
we have been working with Darrian scientists on fire sculpture research.<BR>
It is believed the same technology could be used to produce an energy<BR>
blade.<BR>
<BR>
In the meantime, X-TEK R&D has produced a sword of such sufficiently<BR>
advanced technology that we have dubed it our "Excalibur" series.<BR>
<BR>
Excalibur type swords are hyperdense blades that incorporate<BR>
vibrotechnology and contragravity to      produce a truly deadly blade.<BR>
With the switch turned off, it is a heavy hyperdense browdsword, only the<BR>
very strong or battle dressed individual could wield such a massive weapon<BR>
with skill. Contragravity removes that encumbrance producing a sword that<BR>
feels as light as a feather. True to its namesake, it is like a magical<BR>
sword of ancient kings.<BR>
  <BR>
          Excalibur Broadsword TL-12<BR>
          Broadsword, Hyperdense Blade, Vibro, with CG lifter and rCell.<BR>
          Powered: Cut: sw+3d+1(10) ST=8<BR>
          Unpowered: Cut: sw+2d+1(10) ST=15<BR>
          cost: 3000cr Mass: 4lbs<BR>
<BR>
HTML file available at: <BR>
     http://magicnet.net/~cmdrx/xtek/subs/sword.htm<BR>
<BR>
Custom designs available as well in cutlass, rapier, and katana style<BR>
blades.<BR>
<BR>
\  // Commander X<BR>
 \//  CEO X-TEK Industries of Deneb, LIC<BR>
T E K  Starship Contractor & High Energy Weapons Research<BR>
 //\  http://www.magicnet.net/~cmdrx/xtek/xtek.htm<BR>
//  \ 0608 D557777-A kk- va+ so+ zh+ da+ A723<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:44:06 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium<BR>
<BR>
>From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin schrieb:[snip]<BR>
<BR>
>> I agree that the Imperium isn't anything like Nazi<BR>
>>Germany -- as you pointed it out, it can't be if it has <BR>
>>lasted for over 1,000 years.<BR>
>><BR>
>> There are, however, two very disturbing issues in<BR>
>>Imperial history that are worth pointing out:  <BR>
<BR>
You replied:<BR>
>You are serious? Well, this parallel can be drawn to any <BR>
>nation in human history; The Imperium is the U.S., because<BR>
<BR>
>they had a civil war, the Imperium is Great Britain, <BR>
>because they Had a phase of aggressive colonization, etc.<BR>
<BR>
You did read my post, didn't you?  I stated explicitly, "I<BR>
agree that the Imperium isn't anything like Nazi Germany."<BR>
<BR>
The two disturbing issues I raised are of interest in large<BR>
part because of the conflicts between the facts of thoses<BR>
cases and the perception of a generally fair and just<BR>
Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 10:49:46 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Expert Witness<BR>
<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
<BR>
>Its the first or second question opposing counsel asks<BR>
>an expert witness on cross-examination: "Prof. Eneri, how <BR>
>much are you being paid to testify for X?"<BR>
<BR>
"I'm not being paid anything to testify for X.  X has paid<BR>
me to marshall and review the facts developped in this<BR>
matter, to analyze them, and to provide my opinion based on<BR>
my 25 years of experience in this field.  That's what I'm<BR>
being paid for."<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 19:47:27 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
Hi!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I'm writing some pages about the Imperial Navy, and while thinking about<BR>
fighters, I suddenly started to ask myself: Why are ships allowed only<BR>
one turret/mount for every full 100dtons, except for craft smaller than<BR>
100 dtons? What was the original intension for GWD, and what are common<BR>
(or -to you- reasonable) in-universe explanations?<BR>
<BR>
Thanks, <BR>
<BR>
Ingo<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 19:54:34 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin schrieb:<BR>
<BR>
> You replied:<BR>
> >You are serious? Well, this parallel can be drawn to any<BR>
> >nation in human history; The Imperium is the U.S., because<BR>
> <BR>
> >they had a civil war, the Imperium is Great Britain,<BR>
> >because they Had a phase of aggressive colonization, etc.<BR>
> <BR>
> You did read my post, didn't you?  I stated explicitly, "I<BR>
> agree that the Imperium isn't anything like Nazi Germany."<BR>
<BR>
I did read it; though I obviously overlooked one or to sentences. I<BR>
apologize.<BR>
 <BR>
> The two disturbing issues I raised are of interest in large<BR>
> part because of the conflicts between the facts of thoses<BR>
> cases and the perception of a generally fair and just<BR>
> Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Hm. The Imperium is IMHO not very "fair and just", and that was not what<BR>
I intended when I wrote "things like the Nazis did can't happen in the<BR>
3I". It is just that there are *somehow* evil guys and... *really* evil<BR>
guys. IMTU, the Imperium is very much a dictatorship, but it intends to<BR>
keep the economy running, and thus gives some freedom to the people. If<BR>
it hinders economy (i.e.,the Megacorps' buisiness), freedom is removed<BR>
from the disturbing subject/citizen (whatever you prefer).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Ingo Heinscher:<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@gno.de<BR>
Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de<BR>
Hiroshi.Estigarribia@gmx.de<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:08:58 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
Ingo Heinscher writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm writing some pages about the Imperial Navy, and while thinking about<BR>
> fighters, I suddenly started to ask myself: Why are ships allowed only<BR>
> one turret/mount for every full 100dtons, except for craft smaller than<BR>
> 100 dtons? What was the original intension for GWD, and what are common<BR>
> (or -to you- reasonable) in-universe explanations?<BR>
<BR>
It was presumably a deliberate decision to force a certain style of ship<BR>
design.  Certainly there's no terribly good reason for it (for warships at<BR>
least), and the limitation isn't there in TNE or T4 (I don't know about MT);<BR>
in GT its an artifact of the starship design system and is not required by<BR>
the general vehicle design system.  If you want to lift that rule, its best<BR>
to go to a design sequence which keeps some track of surface area, since<BR>
otherwise you can wind up with rather silly designs -- for GT I'd go with<BR>
a max of one hardpoint per 2,000 sf (instead of 1 hardpoint per 100dT).<BR>
That will actually reduce turret armaments on heavy vehicles (above 10,000 dT)<BR>
but that's probably OK.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:12:24 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma writes:<BR>
> How is removing the mass going to help you wield the sword?  You can pick<BR>
> it up now, sure, but it still has all the sword's inertia behind a swing. <BR>
> If you hit your target you're probably okay, but I can see someone picking<BR>
> it up, taking a swing, and whirling around three times before falling to the<BR>
> ground in confusion.<BR>
<BR>
Removing the mass would be perfectly useful (and would remove the inertia as<BR>
well).  However, CG removes the weight, not the mass.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 12:14:53 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
Hey, my degree's in English, not Physics.<BR>
<BR>
How is removing the weight going to help you wield the sword, then?<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson [mailto:ajackson@molly.iii.com]<BR>
Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2000 12:12 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma writes:<BR>
> How is removing the mass going to help you wield the sword?  You can pick<BR>
> it up now, sure, but it still has all the sword's inertia behind a swing. <BR>
> If you hit your target you're probably okay, but I can see someone picking<BR>
> it up, taking a swing, and whirling around three times before falling to<BR>
the<BR>
> ground in confusion.<BR>
<BR>
Removing the mass would be perfectly useful (and would remove the inertia as<BR>
well).  However, CG removes the weight, not the mass.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:31:37 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Hey, my degree's in English, not Physics.<BR>
> <BR>
> How is removing the weight going to help you wield the sword, then?<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Now you can pick it up and wield it. <BR>
<BR>
Dealing with the inertia is a matter of training and technique, which is<BR>
why an unskilled person will pick it up, swing it, spin around three<BR>
times, fall down and chop off their foot. A skilled wielder will tend to<BR>
orbit himself around the sword to change directions a lot. Either that<BR>
or they'll be built on the order of Little John, and just swing the<BR>
thing like a sword..._that's_ someone you want on your side, not the<BR>
other.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
A friend of mine used to practice his kendo moves using a broken-off<BR>
piece of drill rod (about 1-1 1/4 inches in diameter...he was a<BR>
geologist working in the mines then) of the right length. Damn good<BR>
weight training. He'd work out with that, than pick up his regular kendo<BR>
stick and really whip it around. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:34:04 +0200<BR>
From: Michael Koehne <kraehe@copyleft.de><BR>
Subject: Re: KERAM (Kinetic Energy Redirecting Armor Material)<BR>
<BR>
Moin Leonard Erickson,<BR>
<BR>
> On the other hand, it's far *simpler* to have armor that has a<BR>
> non-linear response. So shove slowly, it bends. Hit it with a high<BR>
> speed projectile, and it's *rigid*.<BR>
<BR>
  this is nothing more than a slightly improved bullet-proved vest.<BR>
<BR>
Moin Charles Collin,<BR>
<BR>
> Another way to put a limit on it is to stipulate that KERAM cannot send<BR>
> out its "reactive fragments" with a greater velocity than the incoming<BR>
> round (and that just feels right to me).  In that case, the armor could<BR>
> only defeat rounds massing about half the armor's mass, assuming perfect<BR>
> velocity transfer and assuming that only the side opposite the incoming<BR>
> round can fragment effectively.<BR>
<BR>
  I think the best limit to it and to preserve canon, would be to make<BR>
  it TL:F and big, so common ways like black/white globe are more<BR>
  price efficent at the next techlevel.<BR>
<BR>
Bye Michael<BR>
- -- <BR>
  mailto:kraehe@copyleft.de             UNA:+.? 'CED+2+:::Linux:2.2:14'UNZ+1'<BR>
  http://www.xml-edifact.org/           CETERUM CENSEO MSDOS ESSE DELENDAM<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2348<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2349</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Tuesday, April 25 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2349<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Citizens of the Empire<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: Expert Witness<BR>
Re Turret Limits<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Unsubscribe<BR>
Excalibur Broadsword TL-12<BR>
Interstellar Economic Analysis - Spinward Marches<BR>
Re: Timeline (was: Questions to the list...)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
re:  One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Interstellar Economic Analysis - Spinward Marches<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:52:59 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 8:34 AM, gridlore@pop.mindspring.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Meet me at McMurdo Station on Thursday.  Bring a raincoat, a medical<BR>
> release, three gallons of cherry syrup and a Yak.<BR>
> <BR>
> Don't forget the consent form for the Yak.<BR>
<BR>
Where's the penguin, or will you bring that?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:59:42 -0400<BR>
From: Roger Barr <RBarr@gatepetro.com><BR>
Subject: Citizens of the Empire<BR>
<BR>
Since it isn't my strongest period, how did the member states of the Holy<BR>
Roman Empire view themselves?  More importantly, how did the citizens see<BR>
themselves?<BR>
<BR>
I do know that a citizen of the Roman empire could appeal a lower court's<BR>
legal decision directly to be judged by caesar. It was a good threat at<BR>
times, depending on who was talking...<BR>
<BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:57:40 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 8:44 AM, samwise1@email.msn.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> And of course, given the numerous aliens out there, the concept of<BR>
> "testifying" can become even more strained than it is when allowing women to<BR>
> do so here and now.<BR>
> (Know what it means before you call me sexist please.)<BR>
<BR>
One of the things I love about the TML, most here have a fantastic sense of<BR>
humor. Subtle, dry, slightly nutty, often quite obscure.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:07:45 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> The Imperial Judicial Courts in my Traveller universe are<BR>
> not adversarial, but inquisitorial.  Imperial judges are<BR>
> fairly high nobles and are able to inquire into whatever<BR>
> they want, without regard to the positions of the<BR>
> litigants.<BR>
<BR>
I've always wondered, Glenn, how many Imperial<BR>
nobles are there in your TU?  And do you differentiate<BR>
between honor, rank, and high nobles?  It just seems<BR>
to me that if you use high nobles, you quickly run out<BR>
of them, and most of them will be busy with other<BR>
things.  IMHO, making them rank nobles, with primarily<BR>
non-hereditary patents works fine though.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 19:48:55 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
>          Excalibur Broadsword TL-12<BR>
>          Broadsword, Hyperdense Blade, Vibro, with CG lifter and rCell.<BR>
>          Powered: Cut: sw+3d+1(10) ST=8<BR>
>          Unpowered: Cut: sw+2d+1(10) ST=15<BR>
>          cost: 3000cr Mass: 4lbs<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Is 4lb really beyond the abilities of normal people to swing? I think my<BR>
LARP sword weighs a good portion of that, and it's made largely of foam and<BR>
latex.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:09:26 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Expert Witness<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
><BR>
> >Its the first or second question opposing counsel asks<BR>
> >an expert witness on cross-examination: "Prof. Eneri, how<BR>
> >much are you being paid to testify for X?"<BR>
><BR>
> "I'm not being paid anything to testify for X.  X has paid<BR>
> me to marshall and review the facts developped in this<BR>
> matter, to analyze them, and to provide my opinion based on<BR>
> my 25 years of experience in this field.  That's what I'm<BR>
> being paid for."<BR>
<BR>
[Great answer, I've got to pass that along to my uncle,<BR>
a frequent expert witness]<BR>
<BR>
"But you're being paid for every hour that you testify<BR>
here today, aren't you, Professor?"<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 11:09:29 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Turret Limits<BR>
<BR>
Ingo Heinscher writes:<BR>
>> Why are ships allowed only<BR>
>> one turret/mount for every full 100dtons, except for craft smaller than<BR>
>> 100 dtons? What was the original intension for GWD, and what are common<BR>
>> (or -to you- reasonable) in-universe explanations?<BR>
<BR>
Anthony Jackson replies:<BR>
>It was presumably a deliberate decision to force a certain style of ship<BR>
>design.  Certainly there's no terribly good reason for it (for warships at<BR>
>least), and the limitation isn't there in TNE or T4 (I don't know about MT);<BR>
<BR>
In MT, you're limited to one hardpoint mount per 100Td, but you can mount<BR>
as many non-hardpoint (IE, non-space-combat weapons) as you can fit, in<BR>
addition to the hardpoint weapons, and many items (like bays, spinal<BR>
mounts, etc) require multiple hardpoints.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 12:10:23 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 10:40 AM, JasonP@i-link.net issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> How is removing the mass going to help you wield the sword?  You can pick it<BR>
> up now, sure, but it still has all the sword's inertia behind a swing.  If<BR>
> you hit your target you're probably okay, but I can see someone picking it<BR>
> up, taking a swing, and whirling around three times before falling to the<BR>
> ground in confusion.<BR>
<BR>
Interesting point, I suppose it may also be hard to maintain a grip. I would<BR>
think it might be a good idea to have a dead-man type switch on it, turns<BR>
off should it fly from your hand. The Star Wars role-playing game treats<BR>
lightsabres as one of the most difficult weapons, and dangerous to the<BR>
wielder if untrained. Perhaps the same could be applied here.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 18:21:13 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
<BR>
At 23:02 -0400 24/4/00,  "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
>Oh yes, BITS (British Isles Traveller Support) produce several supplements<BR>
>in the styles of the CT LBB, only in white, which are primarily T4 in<BR>
>setting, but with conversion rules for all the other Traveller versions.<BR>
>They are *very* good, and the latest book At Close Quarters has just been<BR>
>released, and should be orderable in the States from SJG shortly.<BR>
<BR>
Going all official for a moment.<BR>
<BR>
The 101 Series - 101 Plots, Cargos, Lifeforms, Travellers, <BR>
Rendezvous, Governments, Religions and the forthcoming Patrons - are <BR>
*all* written to be compatible with Traveller across the Milieu. The <BR>
stats (where there are any) are generally T4 based (which means easy <BR>
use in CT/MT and T4.x, slightly harder TNE and GT). However, the <BR>
general gist of the books is ideas. As to flavour, the 101 series are <BR>
more CT/MT in style (usually being set in an empire) but equally <BR>
usable in the GT and T4 backgrounds. Their use in TNE is most <BR>
applicable to the Regency, but you could use them in the Reformation <BR>
Coalition. The 101 books are best described as generic referee's <BR>
aides...<BR>
<BR>
The Adventures - The Khiidkar Incident and SpaceDogs! were both <BR>
originally set in M0, but have been made more generic and with a <BR>
little effort could be guided into other milieu. They contain T4 and <BR>
GT stats and the BITS task system, a freely available conversion <BR>
system between all Traveller rules versions to allow the use of tasks.<BR>
<BR>
The rulebook - At Close Quarters - is just released, and is written <BR>
for T4. However, I am certain that it could be used easily with CT <BR>
and MT. I am not certain how easy it would be to use with TNE <BR>
(someone care to comment) or GT (which already has an advanced combat <BR>
system). Again, the task system is included.<BR>
<BR>
> >4. Given that TNE was my first Traveller item I bought, is there<BR>
> >anywhere I can get an idea of the history of the game (a timeline, for<BR>
> >instance) so that I know what the hell people are talking about in<BR>
> >regards to people, places and events in the TU?<BR>
<BR>
Try http://members.aol.com/Traveller/ or http://www.bits.org.uk/ or <BR>
http://www.downport.com/ (and visit Freelance Traveller at the latter <BR>
site). The GURPS Traveller site (linked from BITS is worth a view <BR>
too).<BR>
<BR>
BTW, thanks Matt for the nice comments.<BR>
<BR>
Note that JTAS now has a review of ACQ.<BR>
<BR>
Dom (BITS webmaster)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>I'm sure that someone else can give you a weblink to a definitive timeline,<BR>
>but basically:<BR>
>CT ~1105-1115<BR>
>MT 1116-1130<BR>
>TNE 1200+<BR>
>T4 0-200ish<BR>
>GT alternate 1116+<BR>
><BR>
> >Well, that should do it for now. Thanks for your help.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >-Ves.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>No problem.<BR>
><BR>
>Matt<BR>
<BR>
- -------------Dom Mooney---webmaster@bits.org.uk----------------<BR>
                  BITS - British Isles Traveller Support.<BR>
  http://www.bits.org.uk/              mailto:bits@bits.org.uk<BR>
Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
GURPS is a registered trademark of Steve Jackson Games, Inc.<BR>
BITS and CORE are trademarks of BITS UK Limited.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 18:23:10 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
<BR>
At 23:02 -0400 24/4/00, "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com> wrote:<BR>
>As to the timeline<BR>
>question, I have been working on one plundered from the web. I can't<BR>
>remember where, maybe Michel's site. Somebody will remind us where. ;)<BR>
<BR>
Don Mckinney has the definitive timeline.<BR>
<BR>
Bryan Borich has the definitive history essays at his site.<BR>
<BR>
Can't remember the URLs of either though...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:25:58 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Damn good weight training. He'd work out with that, than pick up his<BR>
> regular kendo stick and really whip it around.<BR>
<BR>
After I do a few sets of curls with the 20lb dumbbells,<BR>
you should see how fast I whip the TV remote around!<BR>
It weighs almost nothing!  SWISHHH!  SWAASSSHH!<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:27:07 -0400<BR>
From: William Louis Cusick <maldeus@olg.com><BR>
Subject: Unsubscribe<BR>
<BR>
unsubscribe traveller<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:35:15 -0400<BR>
From: Mark Urbin <urbin@bigfoot.com><BR>
Subject: Excalibur Broadsword TL-12<BR>
<BR>
Are gearhead numbers behind the design available?<BR>
<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
urbin@bigfoot.com - Opinions should be yours too!<BR>
"Tension, apprehension and dissension have begun." -- Alfred Bester<BR>
http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:04:07 -0600<BR>
From: "Eric T. Holmes" <eholmes@lanl.gov><BR>
Subject: Interstellar Economic Analysis - Spinward Marches<BR>
<BR>
- --=====================_14304238==_.ALT<BR>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"<BR>
<BR>
Fellow TMLers:<BR>
<BR>
I am looking for the pages that were the "interstellar economic analysis for<BR>
the Spinward Marches<BR>
<BR>
They were at:  www.metronet.com/~washi/Tas/Survey/SpinwardM1100.html<BR>
<BR>
but this seems to have disappeared in the land of "Error 404."<BR>
<BR>
I cant seem to find them now?  Do they still exist?  I thought Rob Eaglestone<BR>
did them?<BR>
<BR>
Anyone with ideas?<BR>
<BR>
Eric<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --=====================_14304238==_.ALT<BR>
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=4 PTSIZE=12>Fellow TMLers:<BR>
<BR>
I am looking for the pages that were the &quot;interstellar economicanalysis for the Spinward Marches<BR>
<BR>
They were at:&nbsp;</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#0000ff" SIZE=4 PTSIZE=12><U>www.metronet.com/~washi/Tas/Survey/SpinwardM1100.html<BR>
<BR>
</U>but this seems to havedisappeared in the land of &quot;Error 404.&quot;<BR>
<BR>
I cant seem to find them now?&nbsp; Do they still exist?&nbsp; I thoughtRob Eaglestone did them?<BR>
<BR>
Anyone with ideas?<BR>
<BR>
Eric<BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
<BR>
- --=====================_14304238==_.ALT--<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:10:20 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Timeline (was: Questions to the list...)<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 10:23 AM, dom@cybergoths.u-net.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Don Mckinney has the definitive timeline<BR>
<BR>
Cool, the name helped narrow it down.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.prairienet.org/~dmckinne/timeline.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:13:44 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
<BR>
>"The Major Races are Humaniti, Vargr, K'Kree, Fteirle, <BR>
>Droyne and Hivers."<BR>
<BR>
have U ever notised that their are alwyas SIX major Races? <BR>
SIX -- Just like the DROYN!  They always have SIX of<BR>
everything.  Six Major Races. Six Casts.  6x6 coynes.  iT'S<BR>
clear that hte Droyn are behind the labelling of<BR>
Majro/Minor to try and confuse us.  But we know and their<BR>
is only ONE Major RAce -- the purebred Solomani who can<BR>
trace ALL of their ancestors right back to Earth! and don't<BR>
forget Who else uses the Number Six and has leather skin<BR>
and wings.  Why do the Droyne hide they're hornes? So don't<BR>
get fooled by the Droyne Plot to TAke over the Known<BR>
Universe for their Grandather.  <BR>
<BR>
yours sincerly,<BR>
<BR>
- --Raoul Gilgamesh Forsythe III<BR>
Solomani Party Delegate<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:23:40 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
<BR>
>As for Traveller, how do people give assurance of telling <BR>
>the truth? Quasi-religious oaths still or just assurances?<BR>
<BR>
"Do you swear on your family's honor to tell the truth in<BR>
this proceeding?" would work at least for noble humans in<BR>
the Imperium (and probably many other species).  Imperial<BR>
Judicial Courts don't have juries (in my Traveller<BR>
universe).  (Remember that the member states have their own<BR>
judicial systems -- 11,000 different approaches to law and<BR>
justice.)  Nobles on trial in Imperial Judicial Courts are<BR>
entitled to trial by their peers to the extent that their<BR>
judges must be of equal or higher noble rank.  A court may<BR>
have several judges hearing a single trial.<BR>
<BR>
(I distinguish between Imperial Judicial Courts and<BR>
Imperial Courts as follows:  Imperial Judicial Courts<BR>
control litigation and hear trials and appeals of civil and<BR>
criminal matters involving Imperial law.  Imperial Courts<BR>
are simply the manorial courts of Imperial nobles, and<BR>
include their households and management of their fiefs.)<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:27:40 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
><BR>
>Glenn Goffin writes:<BR>
>> It's probably because "K'kree" is easier for native<BR>
>> speakers of Galanglic to pronounce more or less<BR>
>>correctly than "Fteirle".<BR>
><BR>
>Or else the K'kree objected loudly and the Aslan didn't.  <BR>
<BR>
I'm kind of leaning toward the diplomat's explanation,<BR>
posted earlier:  The Aslan don't care much what you call<BR>
them, as long as you're polite and respectful.  The K'Kree<BR>
are already mad at you about your diet, so why make them<BR>
more mad?<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:27:16 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Raoul Forsythe violated several SOLSEC regulations by writing:<BR>
<BR>
> have U ever notised that their are alwyas SIX major Races?<BR>
> SIX -- Just like the DROYN!  They always have SIX of<BR>
> everything.  Six Major Races. Six Casts.  6x6 coynes.  iT'S<BR>
> clear that hte Droyn are behind the labelling of<BR>
> Majro/Minor to try and confuse us.  But we know and their<BR>
> is only ONE Major RAce -- the purebred Solomani who can<BR>
> trace ALL of their ancestors right back to Earth! and don't<BR>
> forget Who else uses the Number Six and has leather skin<BR>
> and wings.  Why do the Droyne hide they're hornes? So don't<BR>
> get fooled by the Droyne Plot to TAke over the Known<BR>
> Universe for their Grandather.<BR>
<BR>
You have missed the most obvious clue of all. With the natural<BR>
correspondence A->1, B->2, etc, for "VARGR" we have:<BR>
<BR>
V 22<BR>
A  1<BR>
R 18<BR>
G  7<BR>
R 18<BR>
- -----<BR>
  66<BR>
<BR>
Clearly indicating that they are truly "devil dogs."<BR>
<BR>
(What luck. I thought I would really have to stretch to find something. And<BR>
on the first try, too.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:29:11 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
<BR>
- --- Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com> wrote:<BR>
> Veskrashen writes:<BR>
> > 3. Since it looks like IG folded, is there going<BR>
> to be another version<BR>
> > coming out from a different company? If so, where<BR>
> can I find out about<BR>
> > it?<BR>
> <BR>
> There GURPS: Traveller out now.  Alternately, wait<BR>
> for T5, but I don't htink<BR>
> there's a firm date on that.<BR>
<BR>
Don't forget the CT reprints! If all goes well all the<BR>
CT material will be reprinted in Big Floppy Books.<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:31:41 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Questions to the list...<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "SD Mooney" <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
> Don Mckinney has the definitive timeline.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.prairienet.org/~dmckinne/timeline.html<BR>
<BR>
Also check out the 98 listings in the Traveller category of the Open<BR>
Directory<BR>
<BR>
http://dmoz.org/Games/Roleplaying/Systems/Traveller/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:37:31 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
>From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
<BR>
>Why are ships allowed only one turret/mount for every full<BR>
<BR>
>100dtons, except for craft smaller than 100 dtons? <BR>
<BR>
That slightly misstates the rule.  A ship of 100dt or more<BR>
may have one hardpoint per 100 dt.  A vessel of less than<BR>
100dt may have one hardpoint.  A ship of 1000dt or more may<BR>
have one bay per 1000dt or ten hardpoints per 1000dt (in<BR>
any combination).  A hardpoint may mount a turret or a<BR>
barbette.<BR>
<BR>
What's the basis for it?  I'm sure the gearheads will have<BR>
some even better answers, but I look at it this way:  <BR>
<BR>
(1) Every hardpoint (and bay) has a lot of wiring and<BR>
cables and stuff to support turret control, and the ship<BR>
will get too clogged up with that stuff if the hardpoint<BR>
density increases.  <BR>
<BR>
(2) Tonnage is a rough measure of computing power and<BR>
electricity.  The fire control computer and the power plant<BR>
can't support greater hardpoint density.  <BR>
<BR>
(3) Hardpoints and bays are structural items in the skin of<BR>
the ship -- that is, they are holes in the external hull. <BR>
The structural integrity of the ship's skin will be<BR>
compromised by putting more holes in it.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:39:44 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Interstellar Economic Analysis - Spinward Marches<BR>
<BR>
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR>
<BR>
- ------=_NextPart_000_00C3_01BFAED4.DC964A80<BR>
Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>
	charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR>
<BR>
Rob has put a lot of his older stuff on Downport.com, including the IMTU =<BR>
Code and his starport economics essay.  =<BR>
http://www.downport.com/eaglestone<BR>
<BR>
  ----- Original Message -----=20<BR>
  From: Eric T. Holmes=20<BR>
  I am looking for the pages that were the "interstellar economic =<BR>
analysis" for the Spinward Marches<BR>
<BR>
  They were at:  www.metronet.com/~washi/Tas/Survey/SpinwardM1100.html<BR>
<BR>
  but this seems to have disappeared in the land of "Error 404."<BR>
<BR>
  I can't seem to find them now?  Do they still exist?  I thought Rob =<BR>
Eaglestone did them?<BR>
<BR>
  Anyone with ideas?<BR>
<BR>
- ------=_NextPart_000_00C3_01BFAED4.DC964A80<BR>
Content-Type: text/html;<BR>
	charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR>
<BR>
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"><BR>
<HEAD><BR>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =<BR>
charset=3Diso-8859-1"><BR>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.3825.1300" name=3DGENERATOR><BR>
<STYLE></STYLE><BR>
</HEAD><BR>
<BR>
<DIV>Rob has put a lot of his older stuff on =<BR>
<BR>
Downport.com, including the IMTU Code and his starport economics =<BR>
essay.&nbsp; <A=20<BR>
href=3D"http://www.downport.com/eaglestone">http://www.downport.com/eagle=<BR>
stone</DIV><BR>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20<BR>
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =<BR>
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"><BR>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV><BR>
  <DIV=20<BR>
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =<BR>
black"><B>From:</B>=20<BR>
  <A HREF="3D">Eric T. =
Holmes</A>=20<BR>
  </DIV>I am looking for the =<BR>
pages that=20<BR>
  were the "interstellar economic analysis&#8221; for the Spinward =<BR>
Marches<BR>
<BR>
They=20  were at:&nbsp; <U><A=20  =href=3D"http://www.metronet.com/~washi/Tas/Survey/SpinwardM1100.html">www=.metronet.com/~washi/Tas/Survey/SpinwardM1100.html</U><BR>
<BR>
=<FONT=20  face=3D"Arial, Helvetica" size=3D4>but this seems to have disappeared =in the land=20  of "Error 404."<BR>
<BR>
I can&#8217;t seem to find them now?&nbsp; Do =they still=20  exist?&nbsp; I thought Rob Eaglestone did them?<BR>
<BR>
Anyone with=20  ideas?</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
- ------=_NextPart_000_00C3_01BFAED4.DC964A80--<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:43:22 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Thanks to everyone who provided information...<BR>
<BR>
By the way, I read on the "IMTU" article that the<BR>
Hivers are like the "puppeteers" in Larry Niven's<BR>
"Known Space" stories? Is this true? Because if it is<BR>
I'm well pleased. ;-)<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 13:55:46 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... er, Imperium<BR>
<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
<BR>
>Hm. The Imperium is IMHO not very "fair and just", and<BR>
>that was not what I intended when I wrote "things like the<BR>
<BR>
>Nazis did can't happen in the 3I". It is just that there <BR>
>are *somehow* evil guys and... *really* evil guys. IMTU, <BR>
>the Imperium is very much a dictatorship, but it intends<BR>
to<BR>
>keep the economy running, and thus gives some freedom to <BR>
>the people. If it hinders economy (i.e.,the Megacorps' <BR>
>buisiness), freedom is removed from the disturbing <BR>
>subject/citizen (whatever you prefer).<BR>
<BR>
I think our views of the Imperium are similar in some ways<BR>
and different in others, and I agree that there are bad<BR>
guys and bad guys (as the saying goes in the USA).  <BR>
<BR>
Dictatorship, the rule by one who speaks, is perhaps not<BR>
far from the Imperial model, but the Imperium isn't a very<BR>
effective dictatorship because of the scale involved. <BR>
Member worlds have nearly total autonomy in local affairs,<BR>
which is where the freedom is in my Traveller Imperium.  On<BR>
the other hand, member worlds have no power over Imperial<BR>
affairs (like interstellar trade and foreign policy).  <BR>
<BR>
Ordinary citizens have whatever freedom and civil rights<BR>
the world where they are born allows.  The Imperium<BR>
guarantees only that they shall not be enslaved and that<BR>
they can join an Imperial service if they are drafted or<BR>
are physically able to present themselves at the Imperial<BR>
offices to apply.  <BR>
<BR>
The Imperium does not practice genocide, but would it<BR>
intervene to prevent genocide within one of its member<BR>
worlds?  This sounds like a good adventure hook:  The<BR>
Heyans have decided that they will finally solve the Vargr<BR>
problem.  The Vargr were settled there by Imperial order. <BR>
Can a suspected Vargr corsair convince an Imperial Ministry<BR>
of Colonization official to petition the Subsector Duke to<BR>
send military assistance to protect the Vargr from the<BR>
Heyans?<BR>
<BR>
On a similar note, I've always thought that Heaven's Gate<BR>
would make an interesting adventure for Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2349<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2350</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Tuesday, April 25 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2350<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Expert Witness<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: X-Boat?<BR>
Psi-shields<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: Psi-shields<BR>
The Third Reich... er, Imperium (longish)<BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
[BITS] Calling Mark Watson<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
RE: X-Boat?<BR>
Terraforming<BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: X-Boat?<BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2347<BR>
Re: Expert Witness<BR>
Re: Zar-Tis, the Jedi of Traveller (was Re: Light Sabre)<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:11:38 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
>From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
<BR>
>Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
>> Imperial judges are fairly high nobles and are able to <BR>
><BR>
>I've always wondered, Glenn, how many Imperial nobles are<BR>
>there in your TU?  And do you differentiate between honor,<BR>
>rank, and high nobles?  It just seems to me that if you<BR>
>use high nobles, you quickly run out of them, and most of<BR>
>them will be busy with other things.  IMHO, making them<BR>
>rank nobles, with primarily non-hereditary patents works<BR>
>fine though.<BR>
<BR>
I used "high" loosely in that sentence.  I meant that<BR>
Imperial Judges are rank nobles of high rank, as you<BR>
described.  <BR>
<BR>
There are a lot of nobles in my Imperium; I don't know how<BR>
many.  I do distinguish among the three classes.  Rank and<BR>
high nobles of equal rank have essentially equal temporal<BR>
power.  (The titles of honor nobles give them no power;<BR>
it's usually equivalent to getting a medal.)  There are not<BR>
many high nobles of high rank.  There a lot of high barons,<BR>
however.  <BR>
<BR>
There are no other classes of nobility who can claim to be<BR>
acting with Imperial power.  "Local nobles" have acquired<BR>
their titles in some way but have never been made high<BR>
nobles.  They may have large amounts of power on an<BR>
individual world or worlds; the Imperium will not allow<BR>
them to maintain interstellar fleets.  Some local nobles<BR>
descend from the Terran military governors who occupied the<BR>
Ziru Sirka, and can press (anbd win) such claims in the<BR>
Imperial Court of Heraldry.  (The foregoing is all circa<BR>
1100 in my Traveller Universe.)<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:13:33 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Expert Witness<BR>
<BR>
>From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
<BR>
>[Great answer, I've got to pass that along to my uncle,<BR>
>a frequent expert witness]<BR>
<BR>
I think I first heard it from my uncle, who is also a<BR>
frequent expert witness.<BR>
<BR>
>"But you're being paid for every hour that you testify<BR>
>here today, aren't you, Professor?"<BR>
<BR>
"Just as you're being paid for every hour that you examine<BR>
me."<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:21:00 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
> Where's the penguin, or will you bring that?<BR>
<BR>
In a way, you will bring it yourself. You just don't know it yet...<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:20:08 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
<BR>
>You have missed the most obvious clue of all. With the <BR>
>natural correspondence A->1, B->2, etc, for "VARGR" we<BR>
>have:V 22A  1R 18G  7R 18- -----<BR>
>  66 Clearly indicating that they are truly "devil dogs."<BR>
<BR>
Brohter Luther (or Brother Martin?) has hit the nail on the<BR>
head!  The Vargr wer created by teh DROYN and their<BR>
numberology is 6 and 6!  And tha'ts one way that the DROYNe<BR>
have TWO races in the Major Six!  <BR>
<BR>
- --Raoul Gilgamesh Forsythe III<BR>
Solomani Party Delegate<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:23:04 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
<BR>
>Thanks to everyone who provided information...<BR>
>By the way, I read on the "IMTU" article that the Hivers <BR>
>are like the "puppeteers" in Larry Niven's "Known Space" <BR>
>stories? Is this true? Because if it isI'm well pleased. <BR>
<BR>
IMTU means In My Traveller Universe, so whatever that<BR>
person said is true -- in his or her Traveller universe. <BR>
The Hivers in the official Traveller universe (or OTU) are<BR>
not like the Puppeteers in any way (except their tendency<BR>
to manipulate others for their own benefit).<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:34:50 -0500<BR>
From: Dan Roseberry <rosebee@troi.csw.net><BR>
Subject: RE: X-Boat?<BR>
<BR>
>>Don't forget the consent form for the Yak.<BR>
:-(<BR>
My neuorologist wont let me go; still getting over the psi assault.<BR>
By the way, why is it that I always start speaking Vilani right<BR>
before I have a seizure? Is it really a Hiver plot, or do I just<BR>
like chocolate ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dan Roseberry (plop101)  Hot Springs, Arkansas<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:35:09 -0500<BR>
From: Dan Roseberry <rosebee@troi.csw.net><BR>
Subject: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
<BR>
Dan Roseberry (plop101)  Hot Springs, Arkansas<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:38:23 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 1:43 PM, ajboff@yahoo.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> By the way, I read on the "IMTU" article that the<BR>
> Hivers are like the "puppeteers" in Larry Niven's<BR>
> "Known Space" stories? Is this true? Because if it is<BR>
> I'm well pleased. ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Pschologically yes, to a degree. Not to say I wouldn't also insert<BR>
puppeteer's in some form as well IMTU, and of course they are quite<BR>
different in their physiology.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 15:04:53 -0700<BR>
From: "Tod Glenn" <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
IMTU I like to stack the deck against PSI.  It a useful, but very limited<BR>
skill.  I only have a couple of PCs with any psi abilities, and those are<BR>
limited.  In contrast, there are a wide variety of anti-psi devices.<BR>
electro-mechanical psi shield range from bulky helmets with an annoying buzz<BR>
(at lower tech) to the SolSec TL 15 model which makes a nice ear ring.  In<BR>
addition, there is a chemical psi shield which can be injected. It can have<BR>
very interesting side effects.<BR>
<BR>
See 'house rules: medical' at http://www.travellercentral.com for more<BR>
details.<BR>
<BR>
Tod<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Dan<BR>
Roseberry<BR>
Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2000 2:35 PM<BR>
To: Traveller Mailing List (TML)<BR>
Subject: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
<BR>
Dan Roseberry (plop101)  Hot Springs, Arkansas<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:05:07 GMT<BR>
From: "Boris Cibic" <kafka47@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: The Third Reich... er, Imperium (longish)<BR>
<BR>
   Reading these posts and the preceding posts which have dealt with the <BR>
Culture of the 3I.  I was wondering why no one has postulated the Braudelian <BR>
periodization hypothesis applies to the 3I.<BR>
  Simply put, the periodization hypothesis states:  "That in any given <BR>
period of real historical time.  Time may flow in 2 ways.  1) The History of <BR>
events (histore evenements) 2) The history of social structures (la longue <BR>
duree) which interact dialectical to produce total history [histore <BR>
totale]."  The social structures of the 3I have evolved in Historical Time, <BR>
as a result embody many contradictory aspects.<BR>
  (I know many may say that the 3I only controls the space.  As we see more <BR>
and more, this statement of cannon is becoming less and less true.  As many <BR>
more governmental institutions are being created to cope with galactic <BR>
governance.  It may well be in the early stages of colonization, the <BR>
Imperium appoints governors which then become part of the heredity nobility <BR>
later on, if a world does not opt for democratic  (or at least, <BR>
quasi-democratic) institutions).<BR>
  Having said all that is it not possible that periods of the 3I have been <BR>
more repressive then others.  Someone has already cited the Psionic <BR>
Suppressions.  Could there not even been a time which the 3I aspired to be <BR>
the Total State such as under Cleon the Mad.  MT shows us Lucan (and some <BR>
would argue Dulinor) what absolute power of the Emperor can wield. Fascism <BR>
or Nazism is a political project.  To deny its possibility is to deny <BR>
politics exists in the Imperium.<BR>
  IMTU, The Suppressions form the renewed basis for a Red Scare which forged <BR>
a political alliance between Conservative nobles and War hawks wanting to <BR>
mobile against the Zhodani Consulate (as it was the last large bastion of <BR>
Human Space not controlled Imperium). Whereas, other members of the polity <BR>
wanted to push for a democratic Imperium following the Zhodani model [ok, <BR>
ok...so they naive idealists not knowing the true nature of the consulate] <BR>
or at least push for a Constitutional Monarchy.  Then the Suppressions took <BR>
a whole new dimension as traditionally anti-psionic Vlani nobles saw the <BR>
campaign to advance their position.  The resulting conflict weakened the <BR>
Moot and the regions until the Solomani Rim War.<BR>
   Is then the 3I a Nazi State?  Well, the 3I is what you make it.  For me <BR>
under Stephon (my CT campaigns), it is not.  Does it have the potential?  <BR>
Well, that is up to every referee to decide.<BR>
________________________________________________________________________<BR>
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:25:53 CEST<BR>
From: "Patrik Holmstrm" <glappkaeft@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
>>Why are ships allowed only one turret/mount for every full 100dtons, <BR>
>> >>except for craft smaller than 100 dtons? What was the original <BR>
>> >>intension for GWD, and what are common (or -to you- reasonable) <BR>
>>in->>universe explanations?<BR>
><BR>
>If you want to lift that rule, its best to go to a design sequence >which <BR>
>keeps some track of surface area, since otherwise you can wind >up with <BR>
>rather silly designs -- for GT I'd go with a max of one >hardpoint per <BR>
>2,000 sf (instead of 1 hardpoint per 100dT). That will >actually reduce <BR>
>turret armaments on heavy vehicles (above 10,000 dT) >but that's probably <BR>
>OK.<BR>
<BR>
If you use this rule big ships will be even more superior to smaller ships, <BR>
as they will benefit from their area/volume ratio when calculating armour <BR>
but not be penalised when calculating area.<BR>
<BR>
As an exercise in gearheading I bring you _my_ Type S variant.<BR>
<BR>
FFS2 Type S variant design<BR>
100 dt Wedge<BR>
Vol 1400 m3<BR>
Area 561 m2<BR>
<BR>
In this hull we could install 33 3dt laser turrets before running out of <BR>
space.<BR>
<BR>
33x3dt laser turrets (42m3 and IIRC 10m2)<BR>
Vol 1386 m3<BR>
Area 330 m2<BR>
<BR>
So we have space for half a small stateroom for the captain. The gunners can <BR>
sleep in their crewstations. Now if only it was possible to squeeze a <BR>
manoeuvre drive and a powerplant into this hull there would be little <BR>
stopping this ship. *Siggghhh* Well, there is at least enough power in the <BR>
capacitors to fire once.<BR>
<BR>
By comparison Tigress (500kdt dreadnought - Area 176696m2) could be fitted <BR>
with only 17670 laser turrets (remaining volume 6'257'860 m3) which is 3.53 <BR>
turrets/100 dt. This is still more than the 5000 turrets allowed by the 100 <BR>
dt rule though.<BR>
<BR>
Patrik "who has done enough serious things today" Holmstrm<BR>
Lead Designer for Dimasqh Starships<BR>
________________________________________________________________________<BR>
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:38:05 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: [BITS] Calling Mark Watson<BR>
<BR>
Mark,<BR>
<BR>
Email me your snail mail address off list if you want your copy of <BR>
101 Patrons....<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:28:33 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>IMTU means In My Traveller Universe, so whatever that<BR>
>person said is true -- in his or her Traveller universe.<BR>
>The Hivers in the official Traveller universe (or OTU) are<BR>
>not like the Puppeteers in any way (except their tendency<BR>
>to manipulate others for their own benefit).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Or their unwillingness to take personal risks. And (in TNE) their slightly<BR>
superior vessels.<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:07:30<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
At 01:43 PM 4/25/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>By the way, I read on the "IMTU" article that the<BR>
>Hivers are like the "puppeteers" in Larry Niven's<BR>
>"Known Space" stories? Is this true? Because if it is<BR>
>I'm well pleased. ;-)<BR>
<BR>
They're like each other in the way that baseball and cricket are both ball<BR>
games that involve hitting a ball with a piece of wood.<BR>
<BR>
Niven's Puppeters are cowards.  The ones we've ever seen are dangerously<BR>
insane by their species' standards.  The manipulate the universe to improve<BR>
their own safety.  For example, encouraging the Man-Kzin Wars to weed out<BR>
overly aggresive Kzinti (is that an oxymoron?)<BR>
<BR>
The Hivers are not cowards.  They manipulate because it's fun.  It's also a<BR>
social thing among them, somewhere between winning an Olympic Medal and the<BR>
Nobel Prize.  They constantly manipulate themselves, their neighbors, their<BR>
clients..<BR>
- --<BR>
<BR>
Duugirashir Irebamenagiin  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
Inquisitor Maximus, Reformed Canon Church of Sylea<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:09:58<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
At 04:35 PM 4/25/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
>Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
>term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
>be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
<BR>
Why?  The field isn't touching the head, it's running through the shield<BR>
itself setting up an interference pattern.<BR>
<BR>
One thing I found interesting about the psi-shields was that it suggested<BR>
that psionics were an electromagnetic force, and could be sensed and<BR>
analyzed...<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:13:10<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
At 11:52 AM 4/25/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 8:34 AM, gridlore@pop.mindspring.com issued<BR>
>forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> Meet me at McMurdo Station on Thursday.  Bring a raincoat, a medical<BR>
>> release, three gallons of cherry syrup and a Yak.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Don't forget the consent form for the Yak.<BR>
><BR>
>Where's the penguin, or will you bring that?<BR>
<BR>
McMurdo Station is in Antartica.  There will be penguins, my boy, there<BR>
will be penguins that will chill your soul..<BR>
<BR>
(Sorry writing a Delta Green adventure for a friend, got a bit side<BR>
tracked..)<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry      gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
   http://gridlore.home.mondspring.com<BR>
<BR>
"A mrgs einu sinni hluti minn systir..."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:15:20<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: X-Boat?<BR>
<BR>
At 04:34 PM 4/25/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>My neuorologist wont let me go; still getting over the psi assault.<BR>
>By the way, why is it that I always start speaking Vilani right<BR>
>before I have a seizure? Is it really a Hiver plot, or do I just<BR>
>like chocolate ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Oddly, I speak Hiver *during* my seizures...<BR>
<BR>
Here's a sick thought.. a Hiver Third Base coach...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"But that's not the point!" raged Ford. "The point is that I am now a<BR>
perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of<BR>
limbs!"  - The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:29:38 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: Terraforming<BR>
<BR>
I'm doing Thanber for the Land Grab, and the atmosphere is troubling.<BR>
Following First In rules, Thanber has no possibility of a habitable<BR>
atmosphere (it's a 2,000-mile diameter, tidally-locked rockball there with<BR>
only .25G), but everything else says it has a thin oxy-nitrogen atmosphere.<BR>
<BR>
Does anyone have an idea of how much mass (in the form of icy asteroids and<BR>
commets, possibly aritificially created) would have to be added to give a<BR>
trace atmosphere a pressure of 0.5 Earth normal?  We don't need to make it<BR>
permanent - just add another commet or two every century to keep the<BR>
pressure up. <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 16:38:56 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
Patrik Holmstrm writes:<BR>
> >If you want to lift that rule, its best to go to a design sequence >which <BR>
> >keeps some track of surface area<BR>
<BR>
> If you use this rule big ships will be even more superior to smaller ships,<BR>
>  as they will benefit from their area/volume ratio when calculating armour<BR>
>  but not be penalised when calculating area.<BR>
<BR>
Huh?  A 100 dT ship would go from 1 hardpoint (tons/100) to 5 (area/2000).<BR>
A 500,000 dT ship would go from 5,000 hardpoints to 1,200.  How exactly<BR>
does this increase the advantage of a large ship?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:50:59 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Douglas E. Berry <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 26 April 2000 00:17<BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>At 04:35 PM 4/25/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
>>Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
>>term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
>>be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
><BR>
>Why?  The field isn't touching the head, it's running through the shield<BR>
>itself setting up an interference pattern.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, and the electric currents stay in the mobile phone too... No health<BR>
risks there <g><BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:53:00 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: X-Boat?<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Douglas E. Berry <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 26 April 2000 00:21<BR>
Subject: RE: X-Boat?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>At 04:34 PM 4/25/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>My neuorologist wont let me go; still getting over the psi assault.<BR>
>>By the way, why is it that I always start speaking Vilani right<BR>
>>before I have a seizure? Is it really a Hiver plot, or do I just<BR>
>>like chocolate ;-)<BR>
><BR>
>Oddly, I speak Hiver *during* my seizures...<BR>
><BR>
>Here's a sick thought.. a Hiver Third Base coach...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I always thought that Baseball was a Hiver manipulation... And they like<BR>
'corn-dogs'... <g><BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:54:38 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 26 April 2000 00:37<BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Patrik Holmstrm writes:<BR>
> >If you want to lift that rule, its best to go to a design sequence >which<BR>
> >keeps some track of surface area<BR>
<BR>
> If you use this rule big ships will be even more superior to smaller<BR>
ships,<BR>
>  as they will benefit from their area/volume ratio when calculating armour<BR>
>  but not be penalised when calculating area.<BR>
<BR>
Huh?  A 100 dT ship would go from 1 hardpoint (tons/100) to 5 (area/2000).<BR>
A 500,000 dT ship would go from 5,000 hardpoints to 1,200.  How exactly<BR>
does this increase the advantage of a large ship?<BR>
- -------------------------------<BR>
Surely it would depend on the shape of the hull?<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:07:42 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 24 Apr 2000 23:02:38 -0400 (EDT), "Samuel D. Weiss"<BR>
<samwise1@email.msn.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I have a question on aliens.<BR>
>Once we found out that the Centaurs called themselves K'kree, that became<BR>
>the default way to refer to them. How come the Aslan are still called Aslan<BR>
>all the time and not Fteirle?<BR>
<BR>
Well, _I_ refer to the Fteirle by their preferred name, but I<BR>
suspect that the lack in most human languages of an initial FT<BR>
sound makes it "harder" to pronounce, and thus most people will<BR>
just stick with what they know.<BR>
<BR>
Also, if you look at canonical materials, dating all the way back<BR>
to the Classic Alien Modules, you'll see that the K'kree were so<BR>
named early on, whereas even in the latest publications - GT<BR>
Alien Races 2 - the Fteirle are still referred to as Aslan.  So,<BR>
in some respect, "Aslan" and "K'kree" are "more official" than<BR>
"Fteirle" and "Centaurs".<BR>
<BR>
There may also be some subconscious association with the old A.E.<BR>
Van Vogt story, "Slan", as giving "Aslan" a more respectable<BR>
pedigree.<BR>
<BR>
Not to mention the association with C.S.Lewis's<BR>
_Chronicles_of_Narnia_...<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:07:39 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2347<BR>
<BR>
On Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:12:01 -0400 (EDT), GDWGAMES@aol.com (Loren<BR>
Wiseman - yes, _the_ Loren Wiseman) wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> > Many folks on this list swear by CT, even refusing to<BR>
> > consider other editions "Traveller".<BR>
<BR>
>Which implies that nothing I have written since 1987 is "Traveller." This <BR>
>could bother me a little if I allowed it to.<BR>
<BR>
's far as I'm concerned, it's _all_ Traveller.  Even (ick) Virus.<BR>
Even the stuff currently owned by (g-d forgive me) Roger <spit><BR>
Sanger.  Give those nothing-after-CT-is-Traveller types a big<BR>
razzberry, keep on writing, and don't let it bother you - not<BR>
even a little bit.  And that goes for the rest of you lot that<BR>
write - even as fen only - for Traveller!<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:07:46 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Expert Witness<BR>
<BR>
On Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:12:01 -0400 (EDT), Steve Daniels<BR>
<stevedaniels@portcaddo.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Bolie Williams IV wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> I'm sure there are rules about paying witnesses who are<BR>
>> involved.<BR>
<BR>
>Its the first or second question opposing counsel asks<BR>
>an expert witness on cross-examination:<BR>
<BR>
>"Prof. Eneri, how much are you being paid to testify<BR>
>for X?"<BR>
<BR>
To which the response will generally be semantically equivalent<BR>
to "I'm not being paid for my testimony, I'm being paid for my<BR>
time."  This is a very critical point that, although routine,<BR>
must be made clear, as it establishes a presumption that the<BR>
testimony is not "tainted".  If this presumption is not<BR>
established, the jury can presume that the witness is being paid<BR>
to testify in a certain way beneficial to the side paying him,<BR>
and discount the value of the testimony.<BR>
<BR>
(Note: In some jurisdictions, it may in fact be illegal to pay<BR>
for testimony (rather than time); there are nuances that were<BR>
simply not covered in a high-school civics class and mock-trial<BR>
club.)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 20:09:49 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Zar-Tis, the Jedi of Traveller (was Re: Light Sabre)<BR>
<BR>
On Tue, 25 Apr 2000 14:34:40 -0400 (EDT), Jason Kemp<BR>
<Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>A pre-Maghiz Darrian philosophical warrior-cult called the Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
>once used such technology. For more information on plasma brand (light<BR>
>sabre) weapon stats and character generation, please consult the article on<BR>
>Freelance Traveller:<BR>
<BR>
>http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/features/rules/zartis.html<BR>
<BR>
>Although the character generation is MT, it can easily be converted to CT,<BR>
>or expanded for T4. As the original author, if you wish, I can make those<BR>
>adjustments and submit them for possible inclusion in the article. (If<BR>
>that's okay with the editor of Freelance Traveller, that is.)<BR>
<BR>
Of course it's OK - it's your article, after all!  If you want to<BR>
do those corrections/additions, go right ahead - and I'll<BR>
schedule them for the earliest subsequent update.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture <BR>
Enterprises, 1977-2000.  Use of the trademark in <BR>
this notice and in the referenced materials is not <BR>
intended to infringe or devalue the trademark.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin, Editor<BR>
Freelance Traveller - The Electronic Fan-Supported Traveller Resource<BR>
http://come.to/FreelanceTraveller<BR>
http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/Default.htm<BR>
freelancetraveller@yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:03:22 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
> >term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
> >be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
><BR>
> Why?  The field isn't touching the head, it's running through the shield<BR>
> itself setting up an interference pattern.<BR>
<BR>
I really hate to start getting gearheaded about PSIONICS, but if you assume<BR>
that they are electromagnetic in nature, there are better ways to shild from<BR>
them than an active device like hinted at in Traveller. If you are worried<BR>
about an electric field, then any Faraday shield (a conductor, like a layer<BR>
of copper) will stop them dead. If they are magnetic in nature, however,<BR>
then it's much harder to stop them. It's particularly difficult to shield<BR>
from low-frequency magnetics. I built a device many years ago which used<BR>
superconductors (YBCO) for that very purpose. Shielding, that is, but not<BR>
from psionics. The big problem was that we had to keep it in liquid nitrogen<BR>
for it to work. It did shield REALLY well, however.<BR>
<BR>
I don't know what frequencies our brains produce, but they are probably<BR>
fairly low. I asked a neurologist about this a few years back, but he was<BR>
totally unprepared for the types of annoying questions an engineer would ask<BR>
him.<BR>
<BR>
> One thing I found interesting about the psi-shields was that it suggested<BR>
> that psionics were an electromagnetic force, and could be sensed and<BR>
> analyzed...<BR>
<BR>
And faked. Or this could allow communication between a person and a machine.<BR>
Or a machine could be used to zap people with those undesirable psionic<BR>
powers. Or...<BR>
<BR>
Adventures involving lots of psionics are incredibly cool. You can be<BR>
extremely innovative and creative with these powers.<BR>
<BR>
If I could only find my notes for my old Zhodani foray into the Imperium<BR>
adventure...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2350<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2351</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 26 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2351<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Terraforming<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
RE: X-Boat?<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: [BITS] Calling Mark Watson<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: Terraforming<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Carthesian (XYZ) coordinates for real world stars<BR>
Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re Jusice and Nobles<BR>
Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
re:  One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens <BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:17:33 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
Matthew Bond writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Surely it would depend on the shape of the hull?<BR>
<BR>
Sure.  Armor depends on the same thing.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:14:44 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Terraforming<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm doing Thanber for the Land Grab, and the atmosphere is troubling.<BR>
> Following First In rules, Thanber has no possibility of a habitable<BR>
> atmosphere (it's a 2,000-mile diameter, tidally-locked rockball there with<BR>
> only .25G), but everything else says it has a thin oxy-nitrogen<BR>
atmosphere.<BR>
><BR>
> Does anyone have an idea of how much mass (in the form of icy asteroids<BR>
and<BR>
> commets, possibly aritificially created) would have to be added to give a<BR>
> trace atmosphere a pressure of 0.5 Earth normal?  We don't need to make it<BR>
> permanent - just add another commet or two every century to keep the<BR>
> pressure up.<BR>
<BR>
My SWAG gives about 2e14 kg. Being an engineer rather than a scientist, I<BR>
rounded everything off to one decimal to do a quick estimate, so it may be<BR>
off by a factor of 2 or so.<BR>
<BR>
That sort of error doesn't bother engineers. Hey, it's only off by 3 dB.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:29:28 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
>The Hivers are not cowards.  They manipulate because it's <BR>
>fun.  It's also a social thing among them, somewhere <BR>
>between winning an Olympic Medal and the Nobel Prize. <BR>
>They constantly manipulate themselves, their neighbors,<BR>
>their clients..<BR>
<BR>
So you're saying the alien species most like Hivers would<BR>
be teen-aged girls?<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:30:51 -0700<BR>
From: Bill <beast@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
>-----Original Message-----<BR>
>From: Douglas E. Berry <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
>To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
>Date: 26 April 2000 00:17<BR>
>Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> >At 04:35 PM 4/25/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
> >>Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
> >>term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
> >>be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Why?  The field isn't touching the head, it's running through the shield<BR>
> >itself setting up an interference pattern.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>Yeah, and the electric currents stay in the mobile phone too... No health<BR>
>risks there <g><BR>
><BR>
>Matt<BR>
<BR>
Riiiight... Unless you happen to be cruising down the road yaking <BR>
your jaw off and not paying attention to the road and where you are <BR>
going.<BR>
<BR>
Does this mean that Psi's need to have a special drivers permit that <BR>
allows them to use their abilities while behind the wheel of a <BR>
vehicle?<BR>
<BR>
Bill<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:31:31 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: RE: X-Boat?<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> <BR>
<BR>
>Oddly, I speak Hiver *during* my seizures...<BR>
<BR>
Doug, just because you're thrashing around and waving your<BR>
hands and opening and closing your fingers, it doesn't mean<BR>
you're speaking Hiver.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:36:19 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
<BR>
>I really hate to start getting gearheaded about PSIONICS,<BR>
>but if you assume that they are electromagnetic in nature,<BR>
<BR>
>there are better ways to shild from them than an active <BR>
>device like hinted at in Traveller. If you are worried<BR>
>about an electric field, then any Faraday shield (a <BR>
>conductor, like a layer of copper) will stop them dead. <BR>
<BR>
See?  That aluminum foil hat really might keep the Thought<BR>
Police from reading your thoughts and implanting other<BR>
thoughts.<BR>
<BR>
>If I could only find my notes for my old Zhodani foray <BR>
>into the Imperium adventure...<BR>
<BR>
If only I could find the HIWG article on the nature of<BR>
psionics.  If I recall correctly, it postulated a new<BR>
subatomic particle, the psion...<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:38:43 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 5:17 PM, ajackson@molly.iii.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Matthew Bond writes:<BR>
> <BR>
>> Surely it would depend on the shape of the hull?<BR>
> <BR>
> Sure.  Armor depends on the same thing.<BR>
> <BR>
What about other external features like airlocks, sensor arrays and windows?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:44:14 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>The Hivers are not cowards.  They manipulate because it's fun.  It's also a<BR>
>social thing among them, somewhere between winning an Olympic Medal and the<BR>
>Nobel Prize.  They constantly manipulate themselves, their neighbors, their<BR>
>clients..<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
They're cowards in the same way that the Puppeteers are though - in that<BR>
they absolutely won't take any personal risks at all unless forced to. (This<BR>
is from the TNE background though - dunno if it's at odds with other canon.)<BR>
<BR>
Granted, the emphasis is more on the manipulation for the Hivers, and the<BR>
cowardice for the Puppeteers, but I think both elements are definitely there<BR>
in both.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 02:47:59 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: [BITS] Calling Mark Watson<BR>
<BR>
SD Mooney wrote to Mark:<BR>
> Email me your snail mail address off list if you want your copy of <BR>
> 101 Patrons....<BR>
<BR>
I assume that this is some kind of beta release?<BR>
<BR>
When will 101 Patrons be finished? Tomorrow? Next weekend?  *hopeful*<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:49:20 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
>I really hate to start getting gearheaded about PSIONICS, but if you assume<BR>
>that they are electromagnetic in nature, there are better ways to shild<BR>
from<BR>
>them than an active device like hinted at in Traveller. If you are worried<BR>
>about an electric field, then any Faraday shield (a conductor, like a layer<BR>
>of copper) will stop them dead.<BR>
<BR>
I know canon says that magnetic fields (like psi-shield helmets or power<BR>
stations) can interrupt psionic activity, but does it actually nail it down<BR>
any further than that? Presumeably if they bother building psi-shield<BR>
helmets a simple Faraday cage won't work?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>And faked. Or this could allow communication between a person and a<BR>
machine.<BR>
>Or a machine could be used to zap people with those undesirable psionic<BR>
>powers. Or...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Mmm....BECESR......<sigh><BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:49:52 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Terraforming<BR>
<BR>
>That sort of error doesn't bother engineers. Hey, it's only off by 3 dB.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Amen, brother.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:34:58 -0400<BR>
From: Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> The Hivers in the official Traveller universe (or OTU) are<BR>
> not like the Puppeteers in any way (except their tendency<BR>
> to manipulate others for their own benefit).<BR>
<BR>
The advantages of working at home for a day... I get to sit next<BR>
to my Traveller stuff for several hours in a row. Must...not...<BR>
read...modules...must...work!<BR>
<BR>
The similarities between Hivers and the Puppeteers is obvious...<BR>
so obvious that it's mentioned on page 46 of Alien Module 7:<BR>
<BR>
"There are two good analogies to the Hivers in the body of existing <BR>
science-fiction literature, both of them in the work of Larry Niven:<BR>
the Puppeteers and the Outsiders. ... Let us note, right away that <BR>
the Hivers are not Puppeteers (or Outsiders), and should not be treated<BR>
as such. The analogy is made to show a similar situation at work, but<BR>
the Hivers will do their manipulation and live their lives as Hivers,<BR>
unique to themselves."<BR>
<BR>
You can't get much more OTU canonical than that. :)<BR>
- --<BR>
Ethan Henry                                         egh@klg.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:35:53 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I think saying<BR>
"ff-tay-rl-eh"<BR>
is lot easier than trying to say,<BR>
"kuh-*gug*-creeee"<BR>
But that is me. And if you mispronounce them and don't include the<BR>
glottalstop in K'kree, it becomes even easier to let yourself off and just<BR>
say,<BR>
"fuh-tearl"<BR>
(But I'd avoid trying to get away with  "fur-tail")<BR>
<BR>
And I thought it was hidden somewhere in AM1, I just couldn't find it.<BR>
<BR>
And crossing over,<BR>
<BR>
>One of the things I love about the TML, most here have a fantastic sense of<BR>
humor. Subtle, dry, slightly nutty, often quite obscure.<<BR>
<BR>
Given some of the responses to my question, I can say I like knowing I am<BR>
not the only one with such a warped sense of humor. D&Ders are way too<BR>
straightlaced.<BR>
Now if I can just find a way to sneak in some of my favorite  "Stupid Player<BR>
tricks" stories...<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 03:37:15 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Carthesian (XYZ) coordinates for real world stars<BR>
<BR>
A while ago, some kind person posted this link here on the TML:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.scifi-az.com/astronomy/astrogators_handbook.htm<BR>
<BR>
I downloaded the FREE listing of stars within a 50ly cube centered on Earth,<BR>
and begun entering those stars in a program of my design. The problem is that I<BR>
have now reached 25ly out from Sol. The list is not finished, but after this<BR>
distance I will miss stars outside the cube, but closer to Sol than some stars<BR>
in the cube.<BR>
<BR>
I am considering purchasing the more complete version of the list (which would<BR>
allow me to continue out to 75ly without problems), but as I do not have<BR>
infinite resources (except for Internet access), I decided to look for<BR>
alternatives.<BR>
<BR>
IIRC, someone ran the Gliese catalogue through some kind of program and got XYZ<BR>
coordinates for lots of stars. I would like the resulting output very much,<BR>
along with the names (or Gliese codes, or whatever), luminosity, and spectral<BR>
types of the stars.<BR>
<BR>
If you happen to have that information, please mail it to me.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:53:20 EDT<BR>
From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/22/00 2:36:36 PM !!!First Boot!!!, worj@home.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<<  What would be an equivalent unit to the Foriegn <BR>
 Legion in the 3I? >><BR>
<BR>
The Duke's Huscarles? (and I've always wished Marc or Loren called him the <BR>
Black Duke because it sounds so cool...)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 18:54:22 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 6:34 PM, egh@klg.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> "There are two good analogies to the Hivers in the body of existing<BR>
> science-fiction literature, both of them in the work of Larry Niven:<BR>
> the Puppeteers and the Outsiders."<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm, I've never heard of the "Outsiders", but recently found a pic of one<BR>
on the web. What book(s) are they in? What are they like?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 17:52:23 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Jusice and Nobles<BR>
<BR>
>Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> The Imperial Judicial Courts in my Traveller universe are<BR>
>> not adversarial, but inquisitorial.  Imperial judges are<BR>
>> fairly high nobles and are able to inquire into whatever<BR>
>> they want, without regard to the positions of the<BR>
>> litigants.<BR>
<BR>
Bloo Wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>I've always wondered, Glenn, how many Imperial<BR>
>nobles are there in your TU?  And do you differentiate<BR>
>between honor, rank, and high nobles?  It just seems<BR>
>to me that if you use high nobles, you quickly run out<BR>
>of them, and most of them will be busy with other<BR>
>things.  IMHO, making them rank nobles, with primarily<BR>
>non-hereditary patents works fine though.<BR>
<BR>
While I'm not Glenn, like Glenn, MTU's Imperial Courts are inquisitorial,<BR>
save for military Courts-martial (which are both inquisitorial and<BR>
adversarial...). IMTU, many of the "High Nobles" are not actually seated<BR>
feif-holders, but instead subordinates who fill roles in the Courts of a<BR>
noble.<BR>
<BR>
ForEx, IMTU, the (Subsector) Duke of Regina has the following noble offices<BR>
below him:<BR>
Court-Duke of Regina: The duke who actively fills the local dukal role for<BR>
the duke as the Duke of Regina is the SubSector Duke, as well as the<BR>
rightful duke of Regina Proper. Hand-picked by the Duke of Regina, the<BR>
Court-Duke has a similar staff to command, but they're all a rank lower.<BR>
Duke-Adjutant: the Master of Ceremonies, and senior-most aide de camp of<BR>
the officers. Effectively the Seneschale and Castellan. Runs the social<BR>
events when the duke proper is unavailable.<BR>
Count-Magistrate: Handles all the civil court appeals<BR>
Count-Castellan: Handles all military affairs of the estate<BR>
Count-Justicar: The inquisitorial justice for active litigation in the<BR>
duke's purview, both civil and criminal.<BR>
Count-Exchequer: The money-man. Handles the Duke's finances.<BR>
Duke-Marshal: The duke in charge of the huscarls and also the liaison to<BR>
attached imperial forces.<BR>
Marquis-Scientiae: The senior sciences officer for the subsector government.<BR>
Marquis-Artistae: The senior arts officer for the subsector.<BR>
Maqruis-Commercial: The senior trade coordinator for the subsector.<BR>
Proxy-Duke: The Proxy duke is actually a count, but represents the Duke in<BR>
the moot.<BR>
<BR>
Each of these officers would have an adjutant, and possibly a couple of<BR>
deputies of 1 and two ranks lower, respectively, plus administrative<BR>
non-noble staff.<BR>
<BR>
So, there are plenty of offices to be filled; these would all be filled by<BR>
persons from the noble career. The reason promotions are so hard is that<BR>
most of these officers will serve until they resign or are promoted; in<BR>
many cases, this means that they are there until they retire.<BR>
<BR>
Also, one other thing: IMTU, any noble may express voice in the moot, but<BR>
only enfeoffed nobles actually have votes, and the Proxy-___ is the person<BR>
who holds the proxy. Enfeoffed Reward Nobility ALSO get votes, so long as<BR>
the feif is attached to the title, and may appoint a proxy...<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 19:17:34 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 24 Apr 2000 10:32:04, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 08:04 AM 4/24/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
> >I won't answer for Dom and BITS about availability, but I would like to chip<BR>
> >in my two cents about ACQ.<BR>
> <BR>
> <snip><BR>
> <BR>
> Colin, you just made a really crappy day much, much better with those<BR>
> comments.  Thanks.<BR>
<BR>
Same here.  Had a bad day today.  Very bad...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Don't ask me, I only work here.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 19:21:27 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:53:49, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 09:31 PM 4/24/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >Swordy has one of the first 50 copies ever printed, as does Loren. <BR>
> >Effectively the pre-release copies for approval...<BR>
> <BR>
> But James and I have the only *signed* pre-release copies in the world.<BR>
<BR>
Word up!<BR>
<BR>
> BTW: James, watch your mail. I'm sending you a McDonald's copupon for a<BR>
> free order of McNuggets.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, but is it only valid in the USA?  :)<BR>
<BR>
> Never say I don't pay what I promise!<BR>
<BR>
If I remember correctly, it was for *half* a six-pack of nuggets.  Since<BR>
ACQ was your idea, you got to keep the sauce.<BR>
<BR>
> >But hey, please feel free to order extras for friends!<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm going to order a few...<BR>
<BR>
I've got my two pre-release copies, but I'm probably gonna want at least<BR>
one more "official" release copy as well.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Don't ask me, I only work here.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:24:22 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
><<  What would be an equivalent unit to the Foriegn<BR>
 Legion in the 3I? >><BR>
<BR>
The Duke's Huscarles? (and I've always wished Marc or Loren called him the<BR>
Black Duke because it sounds so cool...)<<BR>
<BR>
A picked household guard equal to scum soldiers officered by snooty noble<BR>
military academy graduates?<BR>
I wouldn't think so.<BR>
Other than certain mercenary units, I don't think any unit has been<BR>
described that comes close to the FFL in the Imperium. I am not sure such a<BR>
unit would even be needed given the nature of the Imperium.  Who would be in<BR>
it? Exatriate Solomani? Fteirle outcasts? Omnivorous K'kree? Vargr corsairs<BR>
recruited for the moment? Anti-social Zhodani? A horde of Droyne<BR>
krinaytsoyni? A Hiver who manipulated himself? Even people from Imperial<BR>
allied Client States would likely just be invited to join the regular forces<BR>
if anything.<BR>
The FFL is an unusual artifact of a balkanized world at a particular point<BR>
in history. I think it would more likely appear in relation to individual<BR>
Imperial worlds especially those of French-Solomani descent and possibly<BR>
with Vargr. Other races within the Traveller canon do not seem likely to<BR>
support such a group for cultural reasons.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 22:26:39 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
>Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
>> Where's the penguin, or will you bring that?<BR>
><BR>
>In a way, you will bring it yourself. You just don't know it yet...<BR>
<BR>
<Vorlon mode><BR>
<BR>
We are all bringing penguins...<BR>
<BR>
</Vorlon Mode><BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:52:00 -0500<BR>
From: Bolie Williams IV <bolie@io.com><BR>
Subject: re:  One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
At 1:37 PM -0700 4/25/00, Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
>>From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
><BR>
>>Why are ships allowed only one turret/mount for every full<BR>
><BR>
>>100dtons, except for craft smaller than 100 dtons?<BR>
><BR>
>That slightly misstates the rule.  A ship of 100dt or more<BR>
>may have one hardpoint per 100 dt.  A vessel of less than<BR>
>100dt may have one hardpoint.  A ship of 1000dt or more may<BR>
>have one bay per 1000dt or ten hardpoints per 1000dt (in<BR>
>any combination).  A hardpoint may mount a turret or a<BR>
>barbette.<BR>
><BR>
>What's the basis for it?  I'm sure the gearheads will have<BR>
>some even better answers, but I look at it this way:<BR>
><BR>
>(1) Every hardpoint (and bay) has a lot of wiring and<BR>
>cables and stuff to support turret control, and the ship<BR>
>will get too clogged up with that stuff if the hardpoint<BR>
>density increases.<BR>
<BR>
This one is just weak.<BR>
<BR>
>(2) Tonnage is a rough measure of computing power and<BR>
>electricity.  The fire control computer and the power plant<BR>
>can't support greater hardpoint density.<BR>
<BR>
Then number of hardpoints should depend on computer and<BR>
powerplant power.<BR>
<BR>
>(3) Hardpoints and bays are structural items in the skin of<BR>
>the ship -- that is, they are holes in the external hull.<BR>
>The structural integrity of the ship's skin will be<BR>
>compromised by putting more holes in it.<BR>
<BR>
Then they should scale with the surface area, not the volume.<BR>
Also, no sci-fi roleplaying game I have ever seen really<BR>
addresses the structural stresses in any sort of realistic<BR>
manner.  This is primarily because it would be complicated.<BR>
Basically, as you scale your ships up, they become relatively<BR>
weaker, structurally as the inertia/mass goes up with the<BR>
cube of the length while the strength goes up with the<BR>
square.  This means that large ships would need proportionately<BR>
thicker/more structural supports for the same G rating.  If<BR>
you're going to worry about turrets weakening the hull,<BR>
then you should worry about this.<BR>
<BR>
Bolie IV<BR>
- -- <BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Bolie Williams IV<BR>
bolie@io.com<BR>
http://www.io.com/~bolie/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 21:54:58 -0500<BR>
From: Bolie Williams IV <bolie@io.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
At 12:50 AM +0100 4/26/00, Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
>-----Original Message-----<BR>
>From: Douglas E. Berry <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
>To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
>Date: 26 April 2000 00:17<BR>
>Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>>At 04:35 PM 4/25/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
>>>Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
>>>term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
>>>be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
>><BR>
>>Why?  The field isn't touching the head, it's running through the shield<BR>
>>itself setting up an interference pattern.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>Yeah, and the electric currents stay in the mobile phone too... No health<BR>
>risks there <g><BR>
<BR>
Are you referring to the ONE recorded case of a brain tumor in a cell<BR>
phone user?  That hardly implies a link.  The link between sunspots<BR>
and the party of congressmen in the US Congress is MUCH stronger.<BR>
<BR>
Bolie IV<BR>
- -- <BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Bolie Williams IV<BR>
bolie@io.com<BR>
http://www.io.com/~bolie/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:04:03 -0400<BR>
From: "Eric & Diane Freitas" <ericfrei@gte.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
I tend to think of Psionics as using hyperspace (point to point equivalence<BR>
with distances being much shorter ...blah ...blah).  I like the idea of the<BR>
hyper<BR>
missiles that David Weber uses in some of his novels.  In order to shield<BR>
against<BR>
a hyper missile, you would have to be able to shield multiple dimensions<BR>
(read<BR>
as energy levels..blah blah).  In effect its very difficult.  Think of it as<BR>
using a<BR>
spark gap generator in an attempt to jam a spread spectrum radio signal.<BR>
It is just very difficult.  You can shield some of the energy bands some of<BR>
the time<BR>
but not the majority all of the time.<BR>
<BR>
Using such a hyperspace would account for some of the strange aspects of<BR>
psionics such a seeing the future (don't remember if this is used in<BR>
Traveller).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 23:31:26 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens <BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> >From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
> >You have missed the most obvious clue of all. With the <BR>
> >natural correspondence A->1, B->2, etc, for "VARGR" we<BR>
> >have:V 22A  1R 18G  7R 18- -----<BR>
> >  66 Clearly indicating that they are truly "devil dogs."<BR>
<BR>
> Brohter Luther (or Brother Martin?) has hit the nail on the<BR>
> head!  The Vargr wer created by teh DROYN and their<BR>
> numberology is 6 and 6!  And tha'ts one way that the DROYNe<BR>
> have TWO races in the Major Six!  <BR>
> - --Raoul Gilgamesh Forsythe III<BR>
> Solomani Party Delegate<BR>
<BR>
"Brottah Forsythe hahv yew counsidderred thaat the juump draiv<BR>
ais up tuh saix parsex and a misjuump ais up tew thoirtysaix <BR>
parsex (6^6) witch clairly shews te eevil, aatheiistic, plotts<BR>
of them DROYNe haythans.<BR>
<BR>
Howeevah Aih must protesst yuir use uv the tehrm 'Mayjor Saix <BR>
Rayces' witch, as ahl rait thankin Solomani know ais a Vilani <BR>
(Yuh nootice saix letters thair in Vilani?) terrm. All truue<BR>
Solomani shud admit thayt the juump draiv wuz invented ohly<BR>
onze baih oah deevahn crayatur Y*sk*dr*y haimsalf, he thain<BR>
deescended frum haiven an gaiv the draiv to hais truu Choosen<BR>
chaldren, the Solomani. Thain the foahmost of Y*sk*dr*y;s<BR>
deevahn host, jeahlous of teh purrfactun uv weah Solomani,<BR>
stol the juump draiv und gaiv it tuh thu laissar rayces.<BR>
Praiz Y*sk*dr*y, AAmahyn!" -<BR>
<BR>
response of the Most Reverend Eminence Doctor Emile St. John<BR>
Prozlowski, head of the First Church of God, Ancient, (Luna<BR>
Synod)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2351<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2352</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 26 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2352<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: X-boat?<BR>
RE: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Imperial Heraldry<BR>
New & Old<BR>
Re: Psi-shields <BR>
Re: Terraforming<BR>
Re: Guarding the Mail<BR>
Re: Expert Witness<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
Re: X-boat?<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: Terraforming<BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: St. George's Day and Heroic Stands<BR>
Re: New & Old<BR>
Re: Imperial Heraldry<BR>
Re: Imperial Heraldry<BR>
Re : Re : Chemistry Question (methane/ammonia, ammonia/water, etc.)<BR>
Battle Debris Navigational Hazards (was Guarding the Mail)<BR>
First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris Navigational Hazards)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:41:34 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
> >> Meet me at McMurdo Station on Thursday.  Bring a raincoat, a medical<BR>
> >> release, three gallons of cherry syrup and a Yak.<BR>
> >> <BR>
> >> Don't forget the consent form for the Yak.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Where's the penguin, or will you bring that?<BR>
> <BR>
> McMurdo Station is in Antartica.  There will be penguins, my boy, there<BR>
> will be penguins that will chill your soul..<BR>
> <BR>
> (Sorry writing a Delta Green adventure for a friend, got a bit side<BR>
> tracked..)<BR>
<BR>
Aaargh!!! No!, it's all coming back !<BR>
<BR>
The Penguins ! The giant albino penguins !<BR>
<BR>
And Terry taking on the shoggoths with his flamethrower....<BR>
<BR>
Nah ftagn.. erk!<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:52:25 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
> That slightly misstates the rule.  A ship of 100dt or more<BR>
> may have one hardpoint per 100 dt.  A vessel of less than<BR>
> 100dt may have one hardpoint.  A ship of 1000dt or more may<BR>
> have one bay per 1000dt or ten hardpoints per 1000dt (in<BR>
> any combination).  A hardpoint may mount a turret or a<BR>
> barbette.<BR>
><BR>
> What's the basis for it?<BR>
<BR>
As far as I can tell, purely for game reasons.<BR>
<BR>
Answer these questions, how many DT is an A10 and how many hardpoints does<BR>
it have ?<BR>
<BR>
And how many DT is a T25 ?<BR>
(Which had, IIRC, five turrets)<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:10:45 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 6:34 PM, egh@klg.com issued forth:<BR>
><BR>
> > "There are two good analogies to the Hivers in the body of existing<BR>
> > science-fiction literature, both of them in the work of Larry Niven:<BR>
> > the Puppeteers and the Outsiders."<BR>
><BR>
> Hmmm, I've never heard of the "Outsiders", but recently found a pic of one<BR>
> on the web. What book(s) are they in? What are they like?<BR>
<BR>
They appear in several Known Space stories, the major effect they had human<BR>
civilization is that they "sold" the humans an FTL drive, when they were<BR>
still fighting wars with the Kzinti using STL ram-ships.<BR>
<BR>
They are a methane (chlorine?) breathing race, and as such do not have any<BR>
real reason to interact with humans and the other Known Space races, because<BR>
the solar systems they use aren't the same as ours.<BR>
<BR>
Frankly, I don't see that Hivers are _anything_ like Outsiders, because<BR>
Outsiders are really strange, whereas Hiver's aren't, and there are no<BR>
properties of Outsiders that tie in with Hivers. Of course, the Outsiders<BR>
_may_ be manipulating humanity, but it would be impossible to tell...<BR>
<BR>
Unless the Hivers are a "front" to allow the Jack Brennan-descended<BR>
Protectors to interact with humanity...( which might be the real reason the<BR>
Puppeteers are running away ! ).<BR>
<BR>
Niven has wonderful historical things, and I'd far rather use Known Space as<BR>
a background, Slaver artifacts are so much better than Ancient artifacts<BR>
<BR>
Then there's the Tnuctpin.... which would easily give Grandfather a run for<BR>
his money.<BR>
<BR>
I just love "Stage Trees", BTW.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:03:46 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Imperial Heraldry<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 26/04/00 20:57 you stated:<BR>
<BR>
<<  What would be an equivalent unit to the Foreign<BR>
 Legion in the 3I? >><BR>
<BR>
<<<The Duke's Huscarles? (and I've always wished Marc or Loren called him<BR>
the<BR>
Black Duke because it sounds so cool...)>>><BR>
<BR>
But of course they are the The Black Duke's Huscarles!!  I'm sure that<BR>
Encyclopaedia Regina has a copy of the Archdukes Coat of Arms in it, and if<BR>
memory serves correctly Black is the main colour, if you discount the<BR>
'twirly purple edging to the shield, the red imperial starburst and golden<BR>
corona around the eclipsed moon.<BR>
<BR>
Any other ideas on Imperial Heraldry?<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:10:08 +0300<BR>
From: "Ken J. Kazinski" <kjkazinski@ksaits.com><BR>
Subject: New & Old<BR>
<BR>
Hi,<BR>
<BR>
I have been out of traveller for a while.  What is ACQ?  I looked on the different web pages, but I am not sure what is what for the current version(s) of traveller.<BR>
<BR>
Could someone clue me in?<BR>
<BR>
Thanks<BR>
<BR>
Ken Kazinski<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:16:59 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields <BR>
<BR>
"Eric & Diane Freitas" <ericfrei@gte.net> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Using such a hyperspace would account for some of the strange aspects of<BR>
> psionics such a seeing the future (don't remember if this is used in<BR>
> Traveller).<BR>
<BR>
Precognition via Ancient artifact is canon in CT. Regular<BR>
Precognition may be allowed under Special at the Ref's<BR>
discretion.<BR>
<BR>
MT Precognition is much like CT<BR>
<BR>
Precognition in canon in TNE under Special Psionics in the TNE<BR>
rule book.<BR>
<BR>
IIRC Precognition is mentioned in T4's Psionics Institutions<BR>
book, but I've mislaid my copy. Class? Bueller?<BR>
<BR>
G:Trav 2nd ed does not allow Precognition. It lists all approved<BR>
Psi skills and Precognition (which in GURPS is under ESP) is<BR>
not mentioned.<BR>
<BR>
IMTU (using MT rules) Precognition's cost (in Psi points)<BR>
uses the Telepathy Range table with time in minutes into<BR>
the future = to range in meters. Precognition may occasionally<BR>
activate while the Precog is asleep (just like sleep walking)<BR>
especially in new or poorly trained Precogs (Roll Average<BR>
Precog Skill + END to avoid spontaneous activation of <BR>
Precog) Roll the easier of Difficult Determination or<BR>
Precog (skill only) to remember said Precognition. Usually<BR>
1d6 hours before waking up. It may go spontaneously while<BR>
awake as well, difficulty depends on events<BR>
<BR>
Base Difficulty depends on how important the future event is.<BR>
<BR>
Vital (I'm dead (possibly along with most of the neighborhood)<BR>
if we even consider doing something that stupid.)<BR>
Easy<BR>
<BR>
Critical (I'll be _seriously_ wounded.)<BR>
Average<BR>
<BR>
Important (I'll get wounded)<BR>
Difficult<BR>
<BR>
Unimportant (someone I know will get a serious wound).<BR>
Formidable<BR>
<BR>
Trivial (I'll wear the blue dress 2 weeks from Tuesday.)<BR>
Impossible <BR>
<BR>
Conscious activation is +1 (or occasionally 2) Diff<BR>
Events after your own death +1 Diff<BR>
In or out of Jump Space +1 Diff<BR>
Difficulty of Precognition in financial situations<BR>
depends on how much the character needs the money,<BR>
if they are broke its easier than if they are rich.<BR>
If the charecter is out of Psi Points the Precog won't<BR>
work, if the event is too far in the future (out of<BR>
range) the precog won't work, but may work later when<BR>
event is more imminent & Psi Cost would be lower.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:27:25 +0200<BR>
From: Holger Kadlez <paradin@gmx.de><BR>
Subject: Re: Terraforming<BR>
<BR>
Luther Martin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> My SWAG gives about 2e14 kg. Being an engineer rather than a scientist, I<BR>
> rounded everything off to one decimal to do a quick estimate, so it may be<BR>
> off by a factor of 2 or so.<BR>
> <BR>
> That sort of error doesn't bother engineers. Hey, it's only off by 3 dB.<BR>
<BR>
Sometimes;  in aerospace-engineering you mostly don't like that kind of error<BR>
<BR>
Bye,<BR>
Holger 'Paradin' Kadlez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:07:56 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Guarding the Mail<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>     The idea that sandcasters create a navigational hazard hadn't<BR>
> occurred to me, but it seems reasonable.   Hmm... debris from a large<BR>
> naval battle clutters the system for decades to come...<BR>
<BR>
Actually, at the speed most Traveller vessels attain, any debris will<BR>
leave the system in a fairly short time.<BR>
<BR>
For example, *System* escape velocity at Earth's distance from the sun<BR>
is less than 40 km/sec. Which is less than 67 minutes at 1g. And when<BR>
you consider that you are almost certain to be travelling near orbital<BR>
velocity for Earth, that means you are already moving at over 25<BR>
km/sec, so you only need 25 minutes at 1g to hit system escape. <BR>
<BR>
Now consider that turns in combat are 30 minutes and most ships can do<BR>
better than merely 1 g. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Debris is mainly a problem when it's in Planetary orbit. Anything<BR>
orbiting the star has *way* too much space to wander around in. And<BR>
it'll be *decades* between "close approaches" to the planet(s). <BR>
<BR>
BTW, this means that Traveller *should* have the occasional incident<BR>
similar to incident's in C.J. Cherryh's books. You are boosting at max<BR>
and dodging around to avoid an enemy, and your drive gets taken out.<BR>
You are moving on a trajectory that will take you out of the system. It<BR>
could take a while for someone to rendezvous with you. Maybe longer<BR>
than your life support is good for.<BR>
<BR>
And don't forget that it doesn't do any good to jump out to where<BR>
you'll be in a week. Any rescue ship has to not only be in the same<BR>
place as you, but also has to be moving at the right speed in the right<BR>
direction. <BR>
<BR>
> I hadn't though of lasers as a way to get rid of navigational<BR>
> hazards, either...put a weapons grade laser on the next shopping<BR>
> list, we'll keep it in the closet with the mop and the broom...<BR>
<BR>
You have to zap it hard enough to vaporize well enough that it won't<BR>
condense back into droplets big enough to be a problem (at these speeds<BR>
*dust* will damage some stuff)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:25:28 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Expert Witness<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
><BR>
>>Its the first or second question opposing counsel asks<BR>
>>an expert witness on cross-examination: "Prof. Eneri, how <BR>
>>much are you being paid to testify for X?"<BR>
><BR>
> "I'm not being paid anything to testify for X.  X has paid<BR>
> me to marshall and review the facts developped in this<BR>
> matter, to analyze them, and to provide my opinion based on<BR>
> my 25 years of experience in this field.  That's what I'm<BR>
> being paid for."<BR>
<BR>
"Your Honor, the witness is being unresponsive..."<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:27:22 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>> ObTrav: Is the 3I court system adversarial? What other kinds of <BR>
>>> successful<BR>
>>> systems are there? What does Successful mean?<BR>
><BR>
> "Successful" means they don't storm the Bastille.<BR>
<BR>
Somewhere, I recall reading that one of the *big* differences between<BR>
the English/US system and the Napoleonic system is that under the Code<BR>
Napoleon, the courts (and the prosecutor) are not to be "bothered" by<BR>
the police until *after* the police have an "iron-clad" case.<BR>
<BR>
So the reason behind the frequently heard "Guilty until proven<BR>
innocent" presumption at trial is because the courts aren't supposed to<BR>
be dealing with that end of things. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:34:43 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> And of course, given the numerous aliens out there, the concept of<BR>
> "testifying" can become even more strained than it is when allowing women to<BR>
> do so here and now.<BR>
> (Know what it means before you call me sexist please.)<BR>
<BR>
ROFL!<BR>
<BR>
I *do* know what it means. Same root as "testicle" and for good reason.<BR>
<BR>
For those of you looking puzzled, in Roman times you "testified" by<BR>
placing one hand on your crotch. Think of it as pledging that "If this<BR>
isn't true, castrate me..."<BR>
<BR>
> As for Traveller, how do people give assurance of telling the truth?<BR>
> Quasi-religious oaths still or just assurances?<BR>
<BR>
What's most *likely* to happen long before then is some sort of "lie<BR>
detector" that *works*. Alas, this screws up too many published<BR>
scenarios. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:40:11 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 01:46 PM 4/24/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>We had to do aerobics for PT. It was unbelievable.<BR>
><BR>
> We did a few times at the 3/7th INF.  Like you said.  An entire 800 man<BR>
> infantry battalion dancing around for a handful of spandex clad airheads.<BR>
<BR>
Huh? I think you are confusing "aerobics" which is a *class* or *type*<BR>
of excercise, not a specific *set* of excercises with something silly<BR>
like "aerobic dancing" or some such silliness.<BR>
<BR>
The *original* "aerobics" were the excercises in the RCAF excercise<BR>
book. Which had situps, and other "traditional" excercises, and running<BR>
in place or a *short* run. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:43:15 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: X-boat?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 11:52 AM 4/25/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>>Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 8:34 AM, gridlore@pop.mindspring.com is=<BR>
> sued<BR>
>>forth:<BR>
>><BR>
>>> Meet me at McMurdo Station on Thursday.  Bring a raincoat, a medical<BR>
>>> release, three gallons of cherry syrup and a Yak.<BR>
>>><BR>
>>> Don't forget the consent form for the Yak.<BR>
>><BR>
>>Where's the penguin, or will you bring that?<BR>
><BR>
> McMurdo Station is in Antartica.  There will be penguins, my boy, there<BR>
> will be penguins that will chill your soul..<BR>
><BR>
> (Sorry writing a Delta Green adventure for a friend, got a bit side<BR>
> tracked..)<BR>
<BR>
I rather like the "penguin whales" from "After Man".<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:15:08 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
> term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
> be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
<BR>
Why? Contrary to popular belief there's *no* conclusive evidence that<BR>
low level EM fields have any effects worth mentioning on humans. That's<BR>
*not* to say that it isn't *possible* that such effects exist, just<BR>
that with a lot of people looking fairly hard, the evidence isn't atr<BR>
all consistent.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:29:17 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Terraforming<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm doing Thanber for the Land Grab, and the atmosphere is troubling.<BR>
> Following First In rules, Thanber has no possibility of a habitable<BR>
> atmosphere (it's a 2,000-mile diameter, tidally-locked rockball there with<BR>
> only .25G), but everything else says it has a thin oxy-nitrogen atmosphere.<BR>
><BR>
> Does anyone have an idea of how much mass (in the form of icy asteroids and<BR>
> commets, possibly aritificially created) would have to be added to give a<BR>
> trace atmosphere a pressure of 0.5 Earth normal?  We don't need to make it<BR>
> permanent - just add another commet or two every century to keep the<BR>
> pressure up. <BR>
<BR>
It's actually an easy calculation.<BR>
<BR>
You want a surface pressure of .5 atm. One atm is close enough to 1 kgf<BR>
(kilogram *force*) per cm^2 for our purposes (in fact there's a unit<BR>
"atmosphere(tech) that *is* 1 kgf/cm^2 !!). 1 kgf = ~ 1 Newton.<BR>
<BR>
So, we want a surface pressure of 1 Newton per cm^2. At .25 gravities<BR>
(call it 2.5 m/s^2). F=ma, so:<BR>
<BR>
1 = m*2.5<BR>
1/2.5 = m<BR>
0.4 = m<BR>
<BR>
Which means that you need .4 kg of gas over every cm^2 of surface. Or 4<BR>
tonnes per m^2, or 4 million tonnes per km^2.<BR>
<BR>
Now, the world is 3200 km in diameter. Which gives a radius of 1600 km.<BR>
And a surface area of A=4*pi*r^2 or 32 million km^2.<BR>
<BR>
So you need around 128e12 tonnes of gases. <BR>
<BR>
Assuming a density of around 1, that takes about 128e12 m^3 of ice. So<BR>
a body around 31 km in radius would do the job. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 02:35:18 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Also, no sci-fi roleplaying game I have ever seen really<BR>
> addresses the structural stresses in any sort of realistic<BR>
> manner.  This is primarily because it would be complicated.<BR>
> Basically, as you scale your ships up, they become relatively<BR>
> weaker, structurally as the inertia/mass goes up with the<BR>
> cube of the length while the strength goes up with the<BR>
> square.  This means that large ships would need proportionately<BR>
> thicker/more structural supports for the same G rating.  If<BR>
> you're going to worry about turrets weakening the hull,<BR>
> then you should worry about this.<BR>
<BR>
Hell, no SF game (and damn few stories) deals with the problem of<BR>
disposing of waste heat! Most ships would fry in short order because of<BR>
waste heat buildup.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:18:49 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: St. George's Day and Heroic Stands<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> In message <39029E45.6CBD615B@premier.net>, Black ICE<BR>
> <wombat@premier.net> writes<BR>
>>I note that today is St. George's Day,<BR>
><BR>
> Strictly speaking it isn't, as no saint's day takes precedence over<BR>
> Easter Sunday, and next Sunday is in the Octave of Easter, so St<BR>
> George's Day this year falls on Tuesday 2nd May IIRC.<BR>
<BR>
I have a *long* set of notes regarding this from a Priest who was<BR>
aiding me in a project to properly calculate calendars that included<BR>
feast days and saint's days. <BR>
<BR>
From checking them, it should fall on *Monday* after "Low Sunday" (ie<BR>
the Octave of Easter). Or has some other feast been bumped to there?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:38:57 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: New & Old<BR>
<BR>
Ken J. Kazinski wrote:<BR>
> I have been out of traveller for a while.<BR>
<BR>
Welcome back!<BR>
<BR>
> What is ACQ?  I looked on the different web pages, but I am not sure what is<BR>
> what for the current version(s) of traveller.<BR>
> Could someone clue me in?<BR>
<BR>
ACQ is a set of alternative combat rules (for persons, not for starships). It<BR>
is not quite released yet, but it soon will be.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.bits.org.uk<BR>
<BR>
Click on "Products"<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
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| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
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+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 07:20:58 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Imperial Heraldry<BR>
<BR>
John Mee wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> But of course they are the The Black Duke's Huscarles!!  I'm sure that<BR>
> Encyclopaedia Regina has a copy of the Archdukes Coat of Arms in it, and if<BR>
> memory serves correctly Black is the main colour, if you discount the<BR>
> 'twirly purple edging to the shield, the red imperial starburst and golden<BR>
> corona around the eclipsed moon.<BR>
><BR>
> Any other ideas on Imperial Heraldry?<BR>
<BR>
I've been wondering the same thing lately.<BR>
<BR>
I just found an excellent heraldry site with pictures in their<BR>
gloassary of terms (which seems to be too difficult for<BR>
most heraldry sites<BR>
<BR>
http://digiserve.com/heraldry/<BR>
<BR>
The illustrated glossary is here:<BR>
http://www04.u-page.so-net.ne.jp/ta2/saitou/ie401/index.htm<BR>
<BR>
I think creating new elements for the 3I would be a good<BR>
start.  What I mean is adding things like:<BR>
the starbursts, planets, moons, galaxies, starships, battledress,<BR>
etc., with their particular meanings.<BR>
<BR>
We already have 12 from MT Ref's Manual:<BR>
Antares:  three equalateral triangles in a horizontal row<BR>
Aslan Aoriakhat:  four stars (three on the right, one on the left)<BR>
Daibei:  a rectangle divided into three equal parts by two<BR>
vertical lines.<BR>
Dulinor:  a two-armed spiral galaxy<BR>
Lucan's Imperium:  the starburst<BR>
Margaret:  a stylized bird with shield-shaped chest with<BR>
head facing right (dexter)<BR>
Norris:  the silhouette of a unicorn, facing left (sinister)<BR>
Solomani:  circle divided by a cross into four equal parts<BR>
Strephon: the starburst<BR>
Vargr:  a skull<BR>
Vland (Ziru Sirka):  a black circle containing a smaller<BR>
off-center white circle almost touching on the top<BR>
Zhodane (Zhodani Consulate):  three white circles,<BR>
overlapping the center of a larger black circle that contains<BR>
all.<BR>
<BR>
Starburst Colors:<BR>
Maroon - Imperial Marines<BR>
Red - Imperial Scouts<BR>
Yellow - Imperial Navy<BR>
Gold on Black - Emperor<BR>
<BR>
Needed:<BR>
The other domains:  Gateway, Ilelish, and Sylea (unless<BR>
you want it to also be a starburst)<BR>
Julian Protectorate<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 07:41:24 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Imperial Heraldry<BR>
<BR>
Here is one that might work for the Julian Protectorate:<BR>
http://www.geocities.co.jp/EpicureanTable/7566/m517a.gif<BR>
<BR>
It is the Cross of St. Julian<BR>
http://www04.u-page.so-net.ne.jp/ta2/saitou/ie401/Jpglosss.htm#517<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 21:37:39 +1000<BR>
From: "Robert O'Connor" <robocon@ozemail.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re : Re : Chemistry Question (methane/ammonia, ammonia/water, etc.)<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote :-<BR>
> > I assume we're operating well below the critical points of ammonia [405K<BR>
> > and ~11MPa] and water [647K and ~21MPa] in most situations.<BR>
> <BR>
> Check out Clement's "Close to Critical" for a planet with a surface<BR>
> near the critical point of water...<BR>
<BR>
A surface temperature approaching 647K, with a surface atmospheric<BR>
pressure of 210 atmospheres? Makes Venus look positively temperate.<BR>
The 'planetology' of the world would be very interesting.<BR>
 <BR>
> > In the regime of extreme pressures and temperatures the following<BR>
> > article has a useful phase diagram :-<BR>
<journal reference snipped> <BR>
> I somehow doubt that the players, or ever remote probes are going to<BR>
> fare well under *those* conditions... :-)<BR>
At the lower end of the isentrope, conditions aren't terribly dissimilar<BR>
to the mantle of an Earthlike planet (temperatures of a couple of<BR>
thousand K, pressures of tens to hundreds of gigapascals) ; so if<BR>
mantle swimming 'subterrenes' can exist, then SDBs in the deep layers<BR>
of a gas giant can too.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor<BR>
Medico, Gamer<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 07:53:04 -0400<BR>
From: Roger Barr <RBarr@gatepetro.com><BR>
Subject: Battle Debris Navigational Hazards (was Guarding the Mail)<BR>
<BR>
>From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
>Subject: Guarding the Mail<BR>
 >The idea that sandcasters create a navigational hazard hadn't occurred to <BR>
>me, but it seems reasonable.   Hmm... debris from a large naval battle <BR>
>clutters the system for decades to come... <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Think about the Regina and Efate systems post FFW and you begin to<BR>
understand how bad it can get.<BR>
<BR>
My first adventure I ever played in Traveller (as a player, not the GM) was<BR>
clearing the spacelanes in the Regina system of undetonated missiles after<BR>
the FFW. We were a poor salvage company, and the contract was a sweet deal.<BR>
Talk about sweating bullets in vacc suits...<BR>
<grin><BR>
<BR>
Can anyone else remember the plot from the first time they played Traveller?<BR>
Just curious.<BR>
<BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
TravelerGM@aol.com <---- preferred<BR>
rbarr@gatepetro.com <--- secondary<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 08:24:41 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris Navigational Hazards)<BR>
<BR>
Let's see... Fall of 1978, we went to a small planetoid of some sort, got in<BR>
a random pod, launched off into the unknown... Wound up exploring a ring<BR>
world and meeting a puppeteer.  You suppose that Ref (who called himself a<BR>
"TravelMaster" or TM for short) might have borrowed a bit of that material?<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Roger Barr" <RBarr@gatepetro.com><BR>
> My first adventure I ever played in Traveller (as a player, not the GM)<BR>
was<BR>
> clearing the spacelanes in the Regina system of undetonated missiles after<BR>
> the FFW. We were a poor salvage company, and the contract was a sweet<BR>
deal.<BR>
> Talk about sweating bullets in vacc suits...<BR>
> <grin><BR>
><BR>
> Can anyone else remember the plot from the first time they played<BR>
Traveller?<BR>
> Just curious.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2352<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2353</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 26 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2353<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus (etc)<BR>
French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations (was Re Camerone) (Long)<BR>
Re: Carthesian (XYZ) coordinates for real world stars<BR>
X-Sender: ian@vax2.concordia.ca<BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Lions and tigers and bears, oh my!<BR>
Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
Opinions Sought<BR>
RE: (Carrying the mail)<BR>
RE: Subjects V Citizens<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Carthesian (XYZ) coordinates for real world stars<BR>
Re: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
Re: New & Old<BR>
Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris Navigational Hazards)<BR>
RE: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:33:49 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus (etc)<BR>
<BR>
>> At 01:46 PM 4/24/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>><BR>
>>>We had to do aerobics for PT. It was unbelievable.<BR>
>><BR>
>> We did a few times at the 3/7th INF.  Like you said.  An entire 800 man<BR>
>> infantry battalion dancing around for a handful of spandex clad airheads.<BR>
<BR>
>Huh? I think you are confusing "aerobics" which is a *class* or *type*<BR>
>of exercise, not a specific *set* of exercises with something silly<BR>
>like "aerobic dancing" or some such silliness.<BR>
<BR>
>The *original* "aerobics" were the exercises in the RCAF exercise<BR>
>book. Which had sit-ups, and other "traditional" exercises, and running<BR>
>in place or a *short* run.<BR>
<BR>
Oh Yes!  It all comes flooding back like a nightmare now.  Lots and lots of<BR>
this stuff, all the time, for 'hours' (at least it always seemed that way).<BR>
This had a major propensity to make me stiff and sore for a week (Now, now<BR>
don't go there people!!)<BR>
<BR>
I wish it was all a bad dream, but I know what's on the program for next<BR>
week!!<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:15:34 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations (was Re Camerone) (Long)<BR>
<BR>
In relation to:<BR>
<BR>
>><<  What would be an equivalent unit to the Foreign<BR>
   Legion in the 3I? >><BR>
<BR>
>>The Duke's Huscarles? (and I've always wished Marc or Loren called him the<BR>
>>Black Duke because it sounds so cool...)<BR>
<BR>
in a message dated 26/04/00 12:30 Sam Weiss wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>A picked household guard equal to scum soldiers officered by snooty noble<BR>
>military academy graduates?<BR>
>I wouldn't think so.<BR>
>Other than certain mercenary units, I don't think any unit has been<BR>
>described that comes close to the FFL in the Imperium<BR>
<BR>
Maybe you're right that no unit within the OTU has yet been described that<BR>
equates to the FFL, at least as described above (as I've pointed out<BR>
elsewhere my knowledge of canon is very rusty).  However, I can see no real<BR>
reason why a picked household guard might not be selected from a larger<BR>
regiment / unit (used in its European / British meaning) of a FFL type.<BR>
Unusual, but not unbelievable!<BR>
<BR>
You only have to look at (human) military history to begin to identify all<BR>
sorts of units / regiments which have strange origins and traditions, and in<BR>
many ways I can see no reason why other races might not also have similar<BR>
organisations.  Here are a few Human examples of unusual regiments to start<BR>
off with:<BR>
<BR>
*The 'Penal' and 'Slave' Legions of Republican Rome<BR>
*The Penal Battalions of Germany (WW II)<BR>
*Virtually the whole of Wellingtons British Army was recruited from the<BR>
"scum of the earth" (even the "Royal Wagon Train" an ancient descendent of<BR>
the current Royal Logistic Corps was originally formed from a bunch<BR>
prisoners who were offered a choice - prison (death being common) or<BR>
deportation (ditto on the death front) or service in the army (need I say<BR>
more!!)), it was the main reason why the Regular Army of the time was almost<BR>
totally serving overseas, with home defence being a militia (volunteer,<BR>
part-time, citizen soldier responsibility).<BR>
*The Royal Navy of Nelson's day used the Press Gang as a major recruiting<BR>
technique.<BR>
*Spanish Foreign Legion (it still exists I believe, or at least its history<BR>
does within a current Spanish army regiment)<BR>
*Swiss Guards of the Vatican (now purely ceremonial, but in their day the<BR>
MM-F (please don't ask me to explain this one, work it out....) on the<BR>
European continent<BR>
<BR>
Many of these units were essentially just 'bad boys' or 'really bad boys'<BR>
(we're back to MM-F again!) who were recruited for this reason and then<BR>
bonded together by harsh discipline, very hard NCO's and good or at least<BR>
reasonable officers (often from some specific social background) to form<BR>
some mean 'units' with enviable reputations.  When we move onto other exotic<BR>
regiments the list is almost endless:<BR>
<BR>
*Jannisarries of the Ottoman Turkish Empire<BR>
*The Polish Lancers & Mamelukes of Napolean's army<BR>
*The Guerka's of the current British Army<BR>
*The Hannovarian Regiments of Wellingtons era<BR>
*The 60th Foot (a British Regiment consisting wholly of Americans serving<BR>
the 'Crown' throughout the Napoleonic and Anglo-American wars.<BR>
*etc<BR>
<BR>
>The FFL is an unusual artefact of a balkanised world at a particular point<BR>
>in history. I think it would more likely appear in relation to individual<BR>
>Imperial worlds especially those of French-Solomani descent and possibly<BR>
>with Vargr.<BR>
<BR>
'Colourful', but not unique or unusual.<BR>
<BR>
I think it is fair to say that the members of most military units,<BR>
particularly where they see a lot of operational service and have a chance<BR>
to build up an esprit de corps without being killed / destroyed, stop<BR>
thinking about the background or past of their colleagues and effectively<BR>
fight for each other. The British Army has always attempted to recruit<BR>
people from similar backgrounds into the same regiment because this<BR>
comradeship is easier to foster, whilst other units (e.g. the US Marines and<BR>
British Parachute Regiment) take people from anywhere, but ensure that they<BR>
all pass the same (unifying) entrance test.  Once you join a regiment, if<BR>
you get through the training, you become inculcated into the regimental<BR>
culture / ethos and become part of the family.  Colour, sex, sexuality and<BR>
other divisive issues become secondary to comradeship and their comrades<BR>
survival, once the bullets start flying and blood starts flowing!!<BR>
<BR>
As far as the FFL is concerned, because they have always been recruited from<BR>
Foreigners they have (to a degree) always been regarded by French<BR>
governments as 'expendable'.  Hence they are often placed in the hardest /<BR>
harshest operational theatres and have suffered accordingly.  That doesn't<BR>
mean that they aren't good fighting soldiers, just poorly used by the<BR>
generals.<BR>
<BR>
To get back to Traveller, the scope for unusual military units given the<BR>
number of different species, races and cultures would be even more varied<BR>
than on Terra. After all you can't get more 'balkanised' than the Imperium<BR>
given the independence of the 11,000 + planetary governments.  I can easily<BR>
imagine Imperial regiments consisting entirely of Aslan, Vargar, Human and<BR>
other species.  Others which draw individuals from a single cultural<BR>
background and still others that revel in the diversity of their soldiers<BR>
backgrounds, but have entrance tests of some sort.  The variation in the<BR>
"Colonial Forces" maybe even greater.  I can imagine that the best Mercenary<BR>
Units in the Imperium effectively retain their efficiency (and their people)<BR>
because they build on the basis of comradeship.<BR>
<BR>
Lots to think on here.<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 08:08:20 -0500<BR>
From: ehenry@newberlin.org (Eric Henry)<BR>
Subject: Re: Carthesian (XYZ) coordinates for real world stars<BR>
<BR>
I might have what your looking for.  I have the chview 150ly dataset in<BR>
formats for microsoft Excel 97, Microsoft Access 97, CSV text file, and tab<BR>
delimited text file.<BR>
<BR>
You can find them at http://www.crosswinds.net/~ehenry/dstars.htm<BR>
<BR>
While you're there you can also download my space naval combat project.<BR>
It's just been updated to 91 pages of pdf.<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Jens Rydholm" <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Carthesian (XYZ) coordinates for real world stars<BR>
<BR>
> IIRC, someone ran the Gliese catalogue through some kind of program and<BR>
got XYZ<BR>
> coordinates for lots of stars. I would like the resulting output very<BR>
much,<BR>
> along with the names (or Gliese codes, or whatever), luminosity, and<BR>
spectral<BR>
> types of the stars.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:26:56 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: X-Sender: ian@vax2.concordia.ca<BR>
<BR>
Dan Roseberry writes:<BR>
>Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
>term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
>be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
<BR>
	Even if there are health problems caused by exposure to<BR>
	electric fields (there may be, but it has not yet been<BR>
	demonstrated), I imagine that the strength of the field<BR>
	set up by a psi-shield is very low (similar to the field<BR>
	generated by an active brain).  Thus, I would expect the<BR>
	health consequences of wearing a psi-shield helmet to be<BR>
	minimal.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:30:05 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
Patrik Holmstrm writes:<BR>
>If you use this rule big ships will be even more superior to smaller ships, <BR>
<snipped><BR>
>As an exercise in gearheading I bring you _my_ Type S variant.<BR>
<snipped><BR>
>100 dt Wedge<BR>
>Vol 1400 m3<BR>
>Area 561 m2<BR>
>In this hull we could install 33 3dt laser turrets before running out of <BR>
>space.<BR>
<snipped><BR>
>By comparison Tigress (500kdt dreadnought - Area 176696m2) could be fitted <BR>
>with only 17670 laser turrets (remaining volume 6'257'860 m3) which is 3.53 <BR>
>turrets/100 dt. This is still more than the 5000 turrets allowed by the 100 <BR>
>dt rule though.<BR>
<BR>
	Yes, 3.53 per 100 tons is greater than 1 per 100 tons, but it is much<BR>
	less than the 33 per 100 tons that you had for the Type S variant.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:55:12 +0100<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: Lions and tigers and bears, oh my!<BR>
<BR>
Has anyone got a list of MT  stats  for  terran  animals  (lions,<BR>
tigers, bears, racoons, snakes, etc)?<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 15:02:10 +0100<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
<BR>
I seem to remember seeing on this list  recently  the  idea  that<BR>
missiles in Traveller were actually detonation lasers (as  they'd<BR>
do better damage than direct impact).  Simple question:  Would  a<BR>
detonation laser work in a gas giant  atmosphere?  (I'm  thinking<BR>
about what happens when SDBs ambush someone performing gas  giant<BR>
refuelling.)<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:21:48 -0600<BR>
From: Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com><BR>
Subject: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Gentlebeings,<BR>
<BR>
How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<BR>
This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but instead<BR>
of rules, it would be a "briefing booklet" on the background. We would have<BR>
it as a PDF on the website, and a printed version would be free for the<BR>
asking at stores, conventions, and through the mail. This would explain the<BR>
history of the Third Imperium and its neighbors, give thumbnail sketches of<BR>
the assorted milieu, and explain "what go what" (old GDW in-joke).<BR>
<BR>
It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman<BR>
     Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>
     Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society  http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>
     SJ Games<BR>
     lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>
     (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>
     (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:31:27 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: (Carrying the mail)<BR>
<BR>
There are several excellent reasons, all based on the very foundation<BR>
and raison d'etre of the Imperium itself.<BR>
<BR>
1. The Imperium is a commercial empire and is based on the value of<BR>
the Imperial Credit, which is established and controlled by the<BR>
Emperor / Imperial authorities. Anything threatening the value of the<BR>
Credit or its direct control of trade is a threat to the Imperium.<BR>
2. The fastest speed of transfer for funds of any sort is by courier<BR>
ship, and the Imperium-authorised couriers for such things are the<BR>
merchant vessels carrying the mail. Therefore, the mail must be<BR>
protected at all costs.<BR>
3. A basic rule of the Imperium is that you do everything you can to<BR>
stop piracy and smuggling. So any merchant acting directly for the<BR>
Imperium - such as by carrying the mail - must prove that they are<BR>
both willing _and able_ to defend themselves against piracy. That<BR>
means having a gun and a gunner.<BR>
4. Plus, of course, the mail will often contain notes of fund<BR>
transfer - money orders drawn on planetary banks - as well as<BR>
commercially sensitive and valuable information. The stuff is<BR>
genuinely worth stealing!<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of<BR>
> TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
> Sent: 24 April 2000 04:12<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: (no subject)<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> In every version of Traveller, it is stated that ships that<BR>
> carry mail must be armed and carry a gunner. I don't<BR>
> fully understand the reasoning here...can someone<BR>
> suggest a good reason?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:38:12 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Subjects V Citizens<BR>
<BR>
I don't think it would be a problem in the Imperium. After all, from<BR>
the very first (in the Warrant of Restoration) the Imperium claimed<BR>
that ALL members of a recognised sentient species on a planet that<BR>
joined the Imperium were Imperial citizens (like it or not) as was any<BR>
other who declared alliegance to the Imperium. Presumably, the only<BR>
time it could get called into question would be if a system left the<BR>
Imperium but some inhabitants still wanted to be citizens but could<BR>
not get in contact with the Imperium to declare personal alliegance.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:33:45 EDT<BR>
From: WriteFool@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
As someone who will be starting a G:T campaign later this year and will <BR>
probably have Traveller newbies I would have to say...<BR>
<BR>
YES!!!<BR>
<BR>
This would be wonderful!!!<BR>
<BR>
MB<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/26/00 10:24:02 AM Central Daylight Time, lkw@io.com <BR>
writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< Gentlebeings,<BR>
 <BR>
 How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
 <BR>
 This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but instead<BR>
 of rules, it would be a "briefing booklet" on the background. We would have<BR>
 it as a PDF on the website, and a printed version would be free for the<BR>
 asking at stores, conventions, and through the mail. This would explain the<BR>
 history of the Third Imperium and its neighbors, give thumbnail sketches of<BR>
 the assorted milieu, and explain "what go what" (old GDW in-joke).<BR>
 <BR>
 It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
 players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
 <BR>
 <BR>
 <BR>
 Loren Wiseman<BR>
      Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>
      Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society  http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>
      SJ Games<BR>
      lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>
      (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>
      (512) 447-1144 FAX >><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:37:07 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
>For those of you looking puzzled, in Roman times you "testified" by<BR>
placing one hand on your crotch. Think of it as pledging that "If this<BR>
isn't true, castrate me..."<<BR>
<BR>
:)<BR>
Would have some very interesting implications these days if adopted as the<BR>
penalty for lying.<BR>
It goes back further than that however. Check Genesis.<BR>
<BR>
>What's most *likely* to happen long before then is some sort of "lie<BR>
detector" that *works*. Alas, this screws up too many published<BR>
scenarios. <<BR>
<BR>
DGP made a court bailiff robot that could detect lies with its metabolic<BR>
scanner. They decided it wasn't trusted enough and its use was usually<BR>
rejected.<BR>
<BR>
>"Your Honor, the witness is being unresponsive..."<<BR>
<BR>
"Excuse me your Honor.<BR>
<to the lawyer><BR>
Nothing."<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:47:38 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Something on the order of the 8 page "History of the Imperium"<BR>
(GDW CC0205/R2)?  That would be excellent.<BR>
<BR>
2 suggestions:<BR>
 - Get Jesse to do a nice pic for the cover, and<BR>
 - Include a map of 'Known Space' (the one is GT is<BR>
fine, if you nix the "Touch Screen" crap).<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Gentlebeings,<BR>
><BR>
> How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
><BR>
> This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but instead<BR>
> of rules, it would be a "briefing booklet" on the background. We would have<BR>
> it as a PDF on the website, and a printed version would be free for the<BR>
> asking at stores, conventions, and through the mail. This would explain the<BR>
> history of the Third Imperium and its neighbors, give thumbnail sketches of<BR>
> the assorted milieu, and explain "what go what" (old GDW in-joke).<BR>
><BR>
> It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
> players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
><BR>
> Loren Wiseman<BR>
>      Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>
>      Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society  http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>
>      SJ Games<BR>
>      lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>
>      (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>
>      (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:42:07 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Considering recent discussions here, I'd say that it would be an excellent<BR>
idea, especially if the write up includes a small blurb on each of the major<BR>
races.<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Loren Wiseman" <lkw@io.com><BR>
> It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
> players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:53:27 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
"Samuel D. Weiss" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> "Excuse me your Honor.<BR>
> <to the lawyer><BR>
> Nothing."<BR>
<BR>
I'd like to see you cheeky guys on the stand.<BR>
Lawyers are professional smartasses.  Amateurs<BR>
should avoid it when on the stand, and worry<BR>
more about explaining things well to the jury.<BR>
Its the job of the lawyer who hired the expert<BR>
to make the cross-examining attorney look like<BR>
an ass, not the witness.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:04:01 -0700<BR>
From: Kristian Miller <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
> This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but instead<BR>
...<BR>
> It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
> players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
<BR>
It would probably go over like "Traveller: Book 0."<BR>
<BR>
Kristian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:01:10 CEST<BR>
From: "Patrik Holmstrm" <glappkaeft@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
>>>If you want to lift that rule, its best to go to a design sequence <BR>
>>> >>>which  keeps some track of surface area<BR>
><BR>
>>If you use this rule big ships will be even more superior to smaller <BR>
>> >>ships, as they will benefit from their area/volume ratio when <BR>
>> >>calculating armour but not be penalised when calculating area.<BR>
><BR>
>Huh?  A 100 dT ship would go from 1 hardpoint (tons/100) to 5 (area/2000). <BR>
>A 500,000 dT ship would go from 5,000 hardpoints to >1,200.  How exactly <BR>
>does this increase the advantage of a large ship?<BR>
<BR>
Sorry, my mistake. Even though I have G:V, G:T and G:Space (2nd and 3rd ed) <BR>
I have never actually used the design rules thus I mistook sf for cf.<BR>
<BR>
Patrik<BR>
<BR>
- ------------------------------<BR>
________________________________________________________________________<BR>
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:01:41 -0600<BR>
From: Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
At 10:04 AM -0600 4/26/0, Kristian Miller wrote:<BR>
>> This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but instead<BR>
>...<BR>
>> It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
>> players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
><BR>
>It would probably go over like "Traveller: Book 0."<BR>
<BR>
Is that good or bad?  :  )<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman<BR>
     Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>
     Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society  http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>
     SJ Games<BR>
     lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>
     (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>
     (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:11:09 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Carthesian (XYZ) coordinates for real world stars<BR>
<BR>
Jens Rydholm writes:<BR>
> A while ago, some kind person posted this link here on the TML:<BR>
> <BR>
> http://www.scifi-az.com/astronomy/astrogators_handbook.htm<BR>
> <BR>
> I downloaded the FREE listing of stars within a 50ly cube centered on<BR>
> Earth, and begun entering those stars in a program of my design. The<BR>
> problem is that I have now reached 25ly out from Sol. The list is not<BR>
> finished, but after this distance I will miss stars outside the cube, but<BR>
> closer to Sol than some stars in the cube.<BR>
<BR>
Note that hipparcos data (which is what most of this is based on) is not ideal<BR>
for making space maps beyond about 50 light-years, as hipparcos leaves out<BR>
all the really dim stars, which means that its missing a lot of stars (based <BR>
on star density, my best guess is that around half the stars within 150 ly <BR>
are missing.  All of them are dim red dwarves).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 08:41:39<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
<BR>
At 12:40 AM 4/26/2000 PST, you wrote:<BR>
>In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>> We did a few times at the 3/7th INF.  Like you said.  An entire 800 man<BR>
>> infantry battalion dancing around for a handful of spandex clad airheads.<BR>
><BR>
>Huh? I think you are confusing "aerobics" which is a *class* or *type*<BR>
>of excercise, not a specific *set* of excercises with something silly<BR>
>like "aerobic dancing" or some such silliness.<BR>
<BR>
That would be the exact silliness I experienced.  The best part was the<BR>
looks on these women's faces when they realized that there were eight<BR>
hundred horny young men staring at them.<BR>
<BR>
We smoked 'em out on the runs though..<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:14:49<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: New & Old<BR>
<BR>
At 12:10 PM 4/26/2000 +0300, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I have been out of traveller for a while.  What is ACQ?  I looked on the<BR>
different web pages, but I am not sure what is what for the current<BR>
version(s) of traveller.<BR>
<BR>
ACQ is _At Close Quarters_, a set of alternate combat rules in the spirit<BR>
of Snapshot and Azhanti High Lightning.  It is written by two utter<BR>
geniuses and will be available from Steve Jackson Games soon.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com/BITS_website/Productsfolder/prod_ACQ.html<BR>
<BR>
Other than that..<BR>
<BR>
Right now, the most active form of Traveller is the GURPS version.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/index.html<BR>
<BR>
GT has seen some phenomenal writing and art, and the Line Editor is Loren<BR>
Wiseman.  Even if you don't like GURPS, give the series a look.<BR>
<BR>
Marc Miller has released a reprint of the Classic "Little Black Books"<BR>
edition, which is being called the Big Floppy Book on the list.<BR>
<BR>
Marc also continues to work on Traveller's 5th edition.  No word on any<BR>
publisher or release date.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
<BR>
TML Great Old One<BR>
Plague of the Traveller Riders of the Apocalypse<BR>
Chant "Gridlore" thrice to summon.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 08:39:56<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris Navigational Hazards)<BR>
<BR>
At 08:24 AM 4/26/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>Let's see... Fall of 1978, we went to a small planetoid of some sort, got in<BR>
>a random pod, launched off into the unknown... Wound up exploring a ring<BR>
>world and meeting a puppeteer.  You suppose that Ref (who called himself a<BR>
>"TravelMaster" or TM for short) might have borrowed a bit of that material?<BR>
>:-)<BR>
<BR>
I see a trend... my first game was played on the SPI StarForce map.  I<BR>
played a Merchant named Beywolf Schaffer.  Craig ran the game, and I eneded<BR>
up being mind controlled by a Grog.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"Non possum existimare plus quemquem facini"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:08:40 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
<BR>
Trevor Peter wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I seem to remember seeing on this list  recently  the  idea  that<BR>
> missiles in Traveller were actually detonation lasers (as  they'd<BR>
> do better damage than direct impact).  Simple question:  Would  a<BR>
> detonation laser work in a gas giant  atmosphere?  (I'm  thinking<BR>
> about what happens when SDBs ambush someone performing gas  giant<BR>
> refuelling.)<BR>
<BR>
It depends on what you mean by "work." X-ray lasers, like the weapons in<BR>
Traveller, are strongly absorbed by the components of virtually any<BR>
atmosphere, gas giant or otherwise. The det laser will go off, but its range<BR>
will be extremely short. And if you do set one off, the plasma created along<BR>
the beam's path will probably be pretty spectactular. Better than the<BR>
fireworks at Disneyland. But more expensive.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:17:26 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Kiri Aradia Morgan <tiamat@tsoft.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 26 Apr 2000, Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Gentlebeings,<BR>
> <BR>
> How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
> <BR>
Go for it!  It would be a lot easier to interest new players if there were<BR>
a small, free packet of info like this.<BR>
<BR>
Kiri  =)<BR>
<BR>
******************************************************************************<BR>
Kiri Aradia Morgan                                  93!  Thou Art God<BR>
tiamat@tsoft.com<BR>
<BR>
"If time passes, everything turns into beauty<BR>
If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away<BR>
Everything starts wearing fresh colors<BR>
Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody<BR>
Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic<BR>
Desire is embraced in a dream..."              -- X-JAPAN<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:20:45 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
<BR>
Trevor, Peter writes:<BR>
> I seem to remember seeing on this list  recently  the  idea  that<BR>
> missiles in Traveller were actually detonation lasers (as  they'd<BR>
> do better damage than direct impact).  Simple question:  Would  a<BR>
> detonation laser work in a gas giant  atmosphere?  (I'm  thinking<BR>
> about what happens when SDBs ambush someone performing gas  giant<BR>
> refuelling.)<BR>
<BR>
Depends on the altitude; realistically x-ray lasers have terrible atmospheric<BR>
penetration (as in, functionally useless), but Traveller has always ignored<BR>
this problem.  However, a lot of gas giant skimming could occur in quite<BR>
thin atmosphere, which would make life easier for missiles.  Also, a gas<BR>
giant is _big_ -- most ambushes probably don't actually happen while skimming,<BR>
just while approaching the skimming site.<BR>
<BR>
Still, the preferred weapon for gas giant ambushes should be the meson gun.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2353<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 26 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2354<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Psi-shields <BR>
RE: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: X-Boat?<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: X-TEK Excalibur Sword<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
G:T Lite<BR>
RE: Penguins<BR>
RE: Opinions Sought<BR>
RE: Opinions Sought<BR>
French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris Navigational Hazards)<BR>
re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: St. George's Day and Heroic Stands<BR>
re: New & Old<BR>
Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
Re: [BITS] Calling Mark Watson<BR>
Re: Niven's Outsiders (was Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Vs: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:25:37 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields <BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman writes:<BR>
<BR>
> G:Trav 2nd ed does not allow Precognition. It lists all approved<BR>
> Psi skills and Precognition (which in GURPS is under ESP) is<BR>
> not mentioned.<BR>
<BR>
In AR1 it notes that other abilities are possible but very rare, and should<BR>
require a considerable unusual background cost if the GM chooses to allow them<BR>
at all.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:17:44 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Fossil-saurus        silk<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> > We did a few times at the 3/7th INF.  Like you said.  An entire 800 man<BR>
> > infantry battalion dancing around for a handful of spandex clad<BR>
> airheads.<BR>
><BR>
> Huh? I think you are confusing "aerobics" which is a *class* or *type*<BR>
> of excercise, not a specific *set* of excercises with something silly<BR>
> like "aerobic dancing" or some such silliness.<BR>
<BR>
No, I think that he got it right. We had to dance around. To music you could<BR>
barely hear. I even had to learn the routine and do it with the instructor.<BR>
That's why officers get paid more, you know. Sometimes they really earn it.<BR>
Fortunately, about the same time, the idea of breaking down a unit into<BR>
ability groups also came out, and a group of us who routinely maxed the PT<BR>
test were pretty much free to work out on our own, away from the dancing<BR>
hordes.<BR>
<BR>
This entire discussion is giving me really strange flashbacks.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:17:40<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
At 01:44 AM 4/26/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>>The Hivers are not cowards.  They manipulate because it's fun.  It's also a<BR>
>>social thing among them, somewhere between winning an Olympic Medal and the<BR>
>>Nobel Prize.  They constantly manipulate themselves, their neighbors, their<BR>
>>clients..<BR>
><BR>
>They're cowards in the same way that the Puppeteers are though - in that<BR>
>they absolutely won't take any personal risks at all unless forced to. (This<BR>
>is from the TNE background though - dunno if it's at odds with other canon.)<BR>
<BR>
Puppeteers moved their entire solar system out of the galaxy because of a<BR>
threat that would hit this area in 30,000 years.  That's cowardice.<BR>
<BR>
The hivers fought a ar against the K'Kree, and won.  Canon also states that<BR>
Hivers crew Federation warships, something a Pupeteer would never do.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
<BR>
Duugirashir Irebamenagiin  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
Inquisitor Maximus, Reformed Canon Church of Sylea<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:21:33<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: X-Boat?<BR>
<BR>
At 05:31 PM 4/25/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>>From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> <BR>
><BR>
>>Oddly, I speak Hiver *during* my seizures...<BR>
><BR>
>Doug, just because you're thrashing around and waving your<BR>
>hands and opening and closing your fingers, it doesn't mean<BR>
>you're speaking Hiver.<BR>
<BR>
Oh yeah?  Then how come I've got an invitation to visit Glea?<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:29:50 EDT<BR>
From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Superb idea, if you want to continue to bring players<BR>
into both GURPS and Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
Jon<BR>
JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:32:51 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: William Prankard <cmdrx@magicnet.net><BR>
Subject: Re: X-TEK Excalibur Sword<BR>
<BR>
A lot have commented on my latest design heresy, that being the Excalibur<BR>
broadsword for GT.<BR>
Here are my responses:<BR>
<BR>
From: Jason Kemp <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
<BR>
>A pre-Maghiz Darrian philosophical warrior-cult called the Order of<BR>
Zar-Tis<BR>
>once used such technology. For more information on plasma brand (light<BR>
>sabre) weapon stats and character generation, please consult the article<BR>
on<BR>
>Freelance Traveller:<BR>
<BR>
>http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/features/rules/zartis.html<BR>
<BR>
>Although the character generation is MT, it can easily be converted to<BR>
CT,<BR>
>or expanded for T4. As the original author, if you wish, I can make those<BR>
>adjustments and submit them for possible inclusion in the article. (If<BR>
>that's okay with the editor of Freelance Traveller, that is.)<BR>
<BR>
>Enjoy,<BR>
>Jason<BR>
<BR>
Wow! This sounds cool, might throw one of these at my IRC group next<BR>
sunday nite ;->.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
<BR>
>How is removing the mass(weight) going to help you wield the sword?  You<BR>
can pick it<BR>
>up now, sure, but it still has all the sword's inertia behind a swing.<BR>
If<BR>
>you hit your target you're probably okay, but I can see someone picking<BR>
it<BR>
>up, taking a swing, and whirling around three times before falling to the<BR>
>ground in confusion.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> answered this for me:<BR>
<BR>
>Now you can pick it up and wield it. <BR>
<BR>
>Dealing with the inertia is a matter of training and technique, which is<BR>
>why an unskilled person will pick it up, swing it, spin around three<BR>
>times, fall down and chop off their foot. A skilled wielder will tend to<BR>
>orbit himself around the sword to change directions a lot. Either that<BR>
>or they'll be built on the order of Little John, and just swing the<BR>
>thing like a sword..._that's_ someone you want on your side, not the<BR>
>other.<BR>
<BR>
And from "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com>:<BR>
<BR>
>Interesting point, I suppose it may also be hard to maintain a grip. I<BR>
would<BR>
>think it might be a good idea to have a dead-man type switch on it, turns<BR>
>off should it fly from your hand. The Star Wars role-playing game treats<BR>
>lightsabres as one of the most difficult weapons, and dangerous to the<BR>
>wielder if untrained. Perhaps the same could be applied here.<BR>
<BR>
Exactly what I was thinking, thanks guys.  Notice that in GURPS all<BR>
swinging weapons have a STR requirement.<BR>
This is not how strong you have to be to pick up the weapon, rather this<BR>
is an indication of the weildiness (or unweildiness) of the weapon.  You<BR>
must have this STR or suffer being 'unprepared' next round to swing the<BR>
weapon.  You must then 're-prepare' (not do anything but retain your<BR>
stance) all next round.  I think there's some hit penalty as well but cant<BR>
remember. Thats what books are for, which I do not have with me here at<BR>
the office.  Deadman switch would only turn off the vibro and the CG.<BR>
Either the ting would drop like a rock, or fly into someone.  A 4lb piece<BR>
of laser sharpened hyperdense flying into someone is still going to leave<BR>
a mark (Yech!)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
<BR>
>Is 4lb really beyond the abilities of normal people to swing? I think my<BR>
>LARP sword weighs a good portion of that, and it's made largely of foam<BR>
and<BR>
>latex.<BR>
<BR>
>Nick<BR>
<BR>
Read above.  STR requirement is how weildy the weapon is.<BR>
A normal Broadsword in GURPS weighs 3lbs and has a STR req of 10<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
From: Mark Urbin <urbin@bigfoot.com><BR>
<BR>
>Are gearhead numbers behind the design available?<BR>
<BR>
Thought I had those on disk here.  (I keep all designs on ZIP disk.  When<BR>
I go to the office, I work on them durring lunch and other lul perioids<BR>
<G>) Unfortuneately I do not have the exact specs.  I can tell you what I<BR>
did.  The Excalibur is the basic broadsword from GURPS with Hyperdence and<BR>
Vibro options added as per UltraTech2.  As I do not have the book here I<BR>
can only deduce a few things.  First Hyperdense blades are 1.5x as heavy<BR>
and add 1.5x to STR requirement.  They also add 2d to the damage and give<BR>
the whole thing a armour divisor of 10.  Vibro added to hyperdense simply<BR>
adds another 1d.  The CG and powercell I fudged a bit, I figured they'd be<BR>
so relatively small compaired with the rest of the weapon that I ignored<BR>
the stats.  Other things I left out was the solar recharge scabard.  The<BR>
sword has a 1hr duration powered, the scabbard is the recharger geting its<BR>
power from sunlight or by pluging the thing in an outlet.<BR>
<BR>
Now that this monstrosity has sparked an interest, I will produce complete<BR>
design specs for the swords.<BR>
As soon as I can get to my books! ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Whats next after this?  Who knows.  Maybe a line of hyperdense shields<BR>
using thermal superconducting armour?<BR>
<BR>
Why did I do this?  I wanted to create a Clarkesian world where 'magic' is<BR>
realy high technology.  Magic swords are like the Excalibur above,<BR>
fireball staves are realy plasma guns, etc... That, and I have a<BR>
reputation of an evil mad scientist/heretic to uphold! ;-><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
\  // Commander X<BR>
 \//  CEO X-TEK Industries of Deneb, LIC<BR>
T E K  Starship Contractor & High Energy Weapons Research<BR>
 //\  http://www.magicnet.net/~cmdrx/xtek/xtek.htm<BR>
//  \ 0608 D557777-A kk- va+ so+ zh+ da+ A723<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:46:33 -0500<BR>
From: "Pat Connaughton" <pconn@i1.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Not being a great player of G:T or G: anything for that<BR>
matter. Please accept this opinion with that caveat -<BR>
I think that anything which makes it easier to<BR>
entice unsuspecting, innocent ..... err new players<BR>
to this highly addictive hobby would be good.<BR>
<BR>
All Ahead Full, Sir!<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com><BR>
To: <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com>; <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2000 12:01 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> At 10:04 AM -0600 4/26/0, Kristian Miller wrote:<BR>
> >> This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but<BR>
instead<BR>
> >...<BR>
> >> It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting<BR>
new<BR>
> >> players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
> ><BR>
> >It would probably go over like "Traveller: Book 0."<BR>
><BR>
> Is that good or bad?  :  )<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> Loren Wiseman<BR>
>      Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>
>      Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society<BR>
http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>
>      SJ Games<BR>
>      lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>
>      (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>
>      (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 09:48:33 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/26/00 9:21 AM, lkw@io.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
> players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
<BR>
 I agree in general, but with the re-release of the CT books, and<BR>
(hopefully) the release of a T5, why would this be a "GT Lite"? It sounds<BR>
more like a briefing on the setting, not the rules.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:18:31 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca><BR>
Subject: G:T Lite<BR>
<BR>
I think this would be a wonderful idea (I suspect you'll get alot of<BR>
similar opinions from others too).  The universe of Traveller is so darn<BR>
BIG that it's hard to explain it all.  A brief synopsis for hand-out would<BR>
be extremely useful.  I wish to second the suggestions of a previous<BR>
poster that you<BR>
a) Get Jesse to do the cover (can the thing be in color?)<BR>
b) Put a known space map in there.<BR>
<BR>
I will also add my own suggestion that you put in a brief timeline. Don't<BR>
choke it up with all sorts of minor events, just Ancients -> 1st<BR>
Imp -> Terra -> 2nd Imp -> Long Night -> Third Imp, basically.  Also, make<BR>
sure you mention that Trav has been around for a while, otherwise they'll<BR>
think that you ripped off Fading Suns instead of the other way around (FS<BR>
fans calm down! I really like the game, but the whole 1st Republic -> 2nd<BR>
Republic -> Collapse thing is going to sound very similar to the<BR>
uninformed).<BR>
<BR>
Bottom line:  Make it look good and they will come.<BR>
<BR>
Charles C.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 09:58:08 +0100<BR>
From: Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Penguins<BR>
<BR>
> While slowly dealing with a six-month backlog of files from<BR>
> alt.binaries.fonts, I came across a font called "FlyingPeguins". And<BR>
> yes, it really *is* penguins with letters on them.<BR>
> <BR>
> Anybody want a copy?<BR>
> <BR>
> -- <BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
<BR>
OOH! Yes please!<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:26:00 +0100<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR>
> How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
> <BR>
> This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite)<BR>
> but instead of rules, it would be a "briefing booklet" on the<BR>
> background. <BR>
<BR>
Yes, that would be a good idea.  I already use one of my own when<BR>
starting new players who are unfamiliar with Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
However, 16-pages is too much.  If a new player  is  prepared  to<BR>
read 16 pages he can scan various sections of the main  books.  I<BR>
would say a page count between 4 and 6 would  be  a  more  easily<BR>
digestable chunk (depending on font size).  Since hardcopy prints<BR>
have to be a multiple of 4 pages "pad it out" to 8 pages  with  a<BR>
1-page map of the Imperium (use the original that appeared in the<BR>
LBBs which showed the other 'empires' around  the  Imperium)  and<BR>
some of  Jesse's  wonderful  art  (if  no  royalty  problems  for<BR>
freebie).<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:34:42 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
It would indeed be useful. <BR>
A map of Charted Space should be included, probably art showing each of the<BR>
major races and maybe a spaceship or two (Beowulf Free Trader and Scout?), a<BR>
concise history of the 3I and milleau-specific details, some info on the<BR>
major races, and maybe an overview of common Traveller campaign types?<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Loren Wiseman [mailto:lkw@io.com]<BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2000 10:22 AM<BR>
To: traveller@mpgn.com<BR>
Subject: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Gentlebeings,<BR>
<BR>
How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<BR>
This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but instead<BR>
of rules, it would be a "briefing booklet" on the background. We would have<BR>
it as a PDF on the website, and a printed version would be free for the<BR>
asking at stores, conventions, and through the mail. This would explain the<BR>
history of the Third Imperium and its neighbors, give thumbnail sketches of<BR>
the assorted milieu, and explain "what go what" (old GDW in-joke).<BR>
<BR>
It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman<BR>
     Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>
     Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society<BR>
http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>
     SJ Games<BR>
     lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>
     (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>
     (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:40:05 -0400<BR>
From: Roger Barr <RBarr@gatepetro.com><BR>
Subject: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
><<  What would be an equivalent unit to the Foriegn<BR>
 Legion in the 3I? >><BR>
<snip><BR>
The Duke's Huscarles? (and I've always wished Marc or Loren called him the<BR>
Black Duke because it sounds so cool...)<<BR>
<BR>
A picked household guard equal to scum soldiers officered by snooty noble<BR>
military academy graduates?<BR>
I wouldn't think so.<BR>
Other than certain mercenary units, I don't think any unit has been<BR>
described that comes close to the FFL in the Imperium. I am not sure such a<BR>
unit would even be needed given the nature of the Imperium.  Who would be in<BR>
it? Exatriate Solomani? Fteirle outcasts? Omnivorous K'kree? Vargr corsairs<BR>
recruited for the moment? Anti-social Zhodani? A horde of Droyne<BR>
krinaytsoyni? A Hiver who manipulated himself? Even people from Imperial<BR>
allied Client States would likely just be invited to join the regular forces<BR>
if anything.<BR>
The FFL is an unusual artifact of a balkanized world at a particular point<BR>
in history. I think it would more likely appear in relation to individual<BR>
Imperial worlds especially those of French-Solomani descent and possibly<BR>
with Vargr. Other races within the Traveller canon do not seem likely to<BR>
support such a group for cultural reasons.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<end snip><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I created an organization years ago for the 3i simply called the Imperial<BR>
Legion. They were primarily troops gathered from worlds willing to export<BR>
any criminals sentenced to life or death sentences.  They were issued<BR>
inexpensive armor and weapons, and used to assault fortifications that would<BR>
make marines nervous. They were not expected to live. They WERE expected to<BR>
soften up the resistance for the next wave of the imperial military units.<BR>
<BR>
A fun diversion upon occasion, and one that allowed players to take a<BR>
character into a mission knowing he probably wasn't going to make it out<BR>
alive. I had special equipment designed for them, (cheap and nasty) and the<BR>
few missions I ran were very rough. <BR>
<BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:31:52 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris Navigational Hazards)<BR>
<BR>
At 12:18 -0400 26/4/00, "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote:<BR>
>I see a trend... my first game was played on the SPI StarForce map.  I<BR>
>played a Merchant named Beywolf Schaffer.  Craig ran the game, and I eneded<BR>
>up being mind controlled by a Grog.<BR>
<BR>
I've been mind controlled by Grog too... ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:33:51 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
At 12:18 -0400 26/4/00, Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com> wrote:<BR>
>How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<BR>
Me!<BR>
<BR>
>This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but instead<BR>
>of rules, it would be a "briefing booklet" on the background. We would have<BR>
>it as a PDF on the website, and a printed version would be free for the<BR>
>asking at stores, conventions, and through the mail. This would explain the<BR>
>history of the Third Imperium and its neighbors, give thumbnail sketches of<BR>
>the assorted milieu, and explain "what go what" (old GDW in-joke).<BR>
><BR>
>It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
>players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
<BR>
Yes - we have a 1 page summary sheet on the BITS site that quickly <BR>
summarises Traveller, which always gets interest at conventions. A <BR>
booklet like that would be great with the background material... Just <BR>
the ticket to interest people and give to new players...<BR>
<BR>
Mind wanders: What would also be really nice would be a GT 2nd <BR>
printing hardback with GURPS Lite in.... ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:30:12 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
At 12:18 -0400 26/4/00, Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com> wrote:<BR>
> >It would probably go over like "Traveller: Book 0."<BR>
>Is that good or bad?  :  )<BR>
<BR>
Gosh, I wonder who wrote that one? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:24:05 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: St. George's Day and Heroic Stands<BR>
<BR>
At 8:25 -0400 26/4/00, shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) wrote:<BR>
> >>I note that today is St. George's Day,<BR>
> > Strictly speaking it isn't, as no saint's day takes precedence over<BR>
> > Easter Sunday, and next Sunday is in the Octave of Easter, so St<BR>
> > George's Day this year falls on Tuesday 2nd May IIRC.<BR>
>I have a *long* set of notes regarding this from a Priest who was<BR>
>aiding me in a project to properly calculate calendars that included<BR>
>feast days and saint's days.<BR>
><BR>
> >From checking them, it should fall on *Monday* after "Low Sunday" (ie<BR>
>the Octave of Easter). Or has some other feast been bumped to there?<BR>
<BR>
It's a movable feast this year. And I know that the Church of England <BR>
and Roman Catholic Church have moved it to different days, as has the <BR>
Scout Association ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:20:54 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: New & Old<BR>
<BR>
At 8:25 -0400 26/4/00,  "Ken J. Kazinski" <kjkazinski@ksaits.com> wrote:<BR>
>I have been out of traveller for a while.  What is ACQ?  I looked on <BR>
>the different web pages, but I am not sure what is what for the <BR>
>current version(s) of traveller.<BR>
<BR>
ACQ = At Close Quarters = a combat supplement for Traveller written <BR>
by Doug Berry & James Lindsay, and a cast of thousands of penguins.<BR>
<BR>
Which rules edition is it for? It is written for T4. The BITS task <BR>
system is included so it would be easy to convert to CT and MT, <BR>
slightly harder to convert to TNE (not sure how damage works - Matt, <BR>
have you looked at this), and I'm not sure of it's relevance to GT <BR>
bearing in mind that GURPS Basic has an Advanced combat system and <BR>
GURPS has wildly different stats...<BR>
<BR>
The other BITS products are pretty generic in use; aimed at er, <BR>
Traveller. Stats tend to be T4 or GT. The 101s are all T4 not GT as <BR>
Gt wasn't released then. 101 Lifeforms (and ACQ) actually have rules <BR>
for using animals in combat etc...<BR>
<BR>
You can see ACQ and others at BITS http://www.bits.org.uk/  on the <BR>
products page.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Could someone clue me in?<BR>
<BR>
That good enough?<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:13:29 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Order ACQ from SJG ?<BR>
<BR>
At 3:32 -0400 26/4/00, "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote:<BR>
>I've got my two pre-release copies, but I'm probably gonna want at least<BR>
>one more "official" release copy as well.<BR>
<BR>
Hmm. I suspect those first printing pre-release copies could become <BR>
collectors ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Hey, Tim, remember that we did this low volume run first when you <BR>
update the Bibliography;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:09:32 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: [BITS] Calling Mark Watson<BR>
<BR>
At 3:32 -0400 26/4/00, Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se> wrote:<BR>
>SD Mooney wrote to Mark:<BR>
> > Email me your snail mail address off list if you want your copy of<BR>
> > 101 Patrons....<BR>
>I assume that this is some kind of beta release?<BR>
<BR>
No.<BR>
<BR>
>When will 101 Patrons be finished? Tomorrow? Next weekend?  *hopeful*<BR>
<BR>
The draft was submitted End August 99. Modifications were made late <BR>
Nov 99. It was placed on hold because (1) producing sufficient copies <BR>
of The Khiidkar Incident and SpaceDogs to ship took priority and (2) <BR>
ACQ was, in our mind, higher priority after 18 months in the pipeline.<BR>
<BR>
Andy was trying to fit it all in to 56 pages at the weekend - problem <BR>
is this is substantially bigger than 101 Plots, and harder science...<BR>
<BR>
As to when it will be available, I refer you to my response on ACQ. <BR>
We want to ship them both together.<BR>
<BR>
Dom (who can't remember if the next two releases are Adventures after <BR>
101 Patrons)<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:57:25 -0700<BR>
From: Russell Bornschlegel <kaleja@estarcion.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Niven's Outsiders (was Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
<BR>
Frank G. Pitt wrote:<BR>
> Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
> > Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 6:34 PM, egh@klg.com issued forth:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > > "There are two good analogies to the Hivers in the body of existing<BR>
> > > science-fiction literature, both of them in the work of Larry Niven:<BR>
> > > the Puppeteers and the Outsiders."<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Hmmm, I've never heard of the "Outsiders", but recently found a pic of one<BR>
> > on the web. What book(s) are they in? What are they like?<BR>
> <BR>
> They appear in several Known Space stories, the major effect they had human<BR>
> civilization is that they "sold" the humans an FTL drive, when they were<BR>
> still fighting wars with the Kzinti using STL ram-ships.<BR>
> <BR>
> They are a methane (chlorine?) breathing race, and as such do not have any<BR>
> real reason to interact with humans and the other Known Space races, because<BR>
> the solar systems they use aren't the same as ours.<BR>
<BR>
I think you're conflating Outsiders with Trinocs. The Outsiders did sell <BR>
humaniti the hyperdrive, but Outsiders are fragile vacuum-dwellers. Trinocs<BR>
don't use the same planets as humans, but the Outsiders don't even need<BR>
planets. :)<BR>
<BR>
Niven describes them as looking like a cat-o-nine-tails. They put their <BR>
heads in shadow and their tails in light (or maybe vice versa) and gain <BR>
energy from the heat differential. <BR>
<BR>
They mainly trade in information. They have been around gathering knowledge <BR>
for a long time. I don't know enough about Hivers to know if that's the <BR>
parallel being alluded to, but if you have a good position in an information<BR>
economy, it's easy to manipulate others.<BR>
<BR>
The story "Flatlander" (IIRC - Beowulf Shaeffer and Elephant go to the "oddest <BR>
planet in known space") has what's probably the best description of the <BR>
Outsiders. The story "Flatlander" is not to be confused with the collection<BR>
_Flatlander_ (the Gil Hamilton stories) - it's collected in _Neutron Star_ and <BR>
_Crashlander_, and possibly other places. I believe the Outsiders also are<BR>
discussed in either _Ringworld_ or _Ringworld Engineers_. <BR>
<BR>
> Frankly, I don't see that Hivers are _anything_ like Outsiders, because<BR>
> Outsiders are really strange, whereas Hiver's aren't, <BR>
<BR>
Hivers aren't really strange?<BR>
<BR>
- -Russell B<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:12:36 +0000 (GMT)<BR>
From: Michel R Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 26 Apr 2000, Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Gentlebeings,<BR>
> <BR>
> How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
> <BR>
> This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but instead<BR>
> of rules, it would be a "briefing booklet" on the background. We would have<BR>
<BR>
	The sooner the better!  <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:44:34 +0300<BR>
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jussi_Kenkkil=E4?= <Jussi.Kenkkila@helsinki.fi><BR>
Subject: Vs: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: Frank G. Pitt <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 19, 2000 2:22 PM<BR>
Subject: RE: TMLer's as PC's (very long)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> OK, judge for yourself :<BR>
><BR>
Whoa, thats some life! If some of my players came up with such a background for a character I (as a GM) would hesitate a moment...<BR>
 <BR>
- --------------bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz--------------------------------<BR>
> <BR>
> Phew !, that was big, but it could have ben a lot bigger.<BR>
> Maybe I should write a book...<BR>
> <BR>
Definetly.<BR>
<BR>
- -J2K<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2354<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 26 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2355<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Vs: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
Vs: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
New blood<BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Terraforming<BR>
Re: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Terraforming (longish)<BR>
Re: GT Lite<BR>
Re: Citizens of the Empire<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: Terraforming (longish)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Terraforming<BR>
Re: <BR>
Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
re: Opinions Sought<BR>
CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 15:12:12 +0300<BR>
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jussi_Kenkkil=E4?= <Jussi.Kenkkila@helsinki.fi><BR>
Subject: Vs: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 19, 2000 7:52 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Multiply ISP by 9.8.  To determine ISP, divide thrust by the weight of fuel<BR>
> consumed in one second.  <BR>
<BR>
It's really that simple? I thought it involved more complex calculations...<BR>
<BR>
> Realistic H+O rockets have ISPs in the 400s, the <BR>
> others depend heavily on design assumptions, though as a simple rule of thumb<BR>
> the minimum power consumption for any non-chemical drive is (exhaust velocity)*<BR>
> (thrust)*0.5 (in MKS, the units for that are meters/second, newtons, and watts)<BR>
<BR>
Thanks.<BR>
<BR>
- -J2K<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 15:07:01 +0300<BR>
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jussi_Kenkkil=E4?= <Jussi.Kenkkila@helsinki.fi><BR>
Subject: Vs: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: Brian Quirt <baqrt@mta.ca><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 19, 2000 7:45 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Vs: Ion Drive - Technical Questions<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Well, you might try Keith Watt's "Exodus Project" site. It has several<BR>
> sections on various aspects of engines, complete with a java "engine<BR>
> performance calculator." The main site is at<BR>
> <http://www.ExodusProject.com> with the "realistic engines" site at<BR>
> <http://www.exodusproject.com/Engines.htm>. Excellent resources, and<BR>
> well worth looking at.<BR>
> <BR>
> -Brian Quirt<BR>
<BR>
Thanks a lot. I've been following the ion drive thread, as they will play a role in my next campaign.<BR>
<BR>
- -J2K<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:10:40 +0300<BR>
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jussi_Kenkkil=E4?= <Jussi.Kenkkila@helsinki.fi><BR>
Subject: New blood<BR>
<BR>
Last weekend I attended to our gaming association's 4-day camp at a local community camping centre (hope the concept translates). There I had an opportunity to introduce G:T to some new players. As this was my third G:T scenario, I was suprised to get a group of 9 players. No-one in our association had had played any Traveller for years. We had some older 1st generation gamers who used to play MT, but I haven't seen them for a few years. <BR>
<BR>
The group consisted of 2 GURPS-veterans, 3 younger players with some experience and 4 teenagers new to both GURPS and Traveller. 3 of the older players had been in my previous G:T game. The scenario begun as a routine exploration mission, with just some slight atmospheric anomalies to investigate. <BR>
The team was split up investigating the only habitable world in the system, and they came up with some indications of humans. After a lot of scouting through the woods, angering 1200 kg herbivores and climbing trees in a strorm to escape from a lone unseen predator, something unexpected happened.<BR>
<BR>
As most of the team was scattered in the woods, and only their aux pilot was lazing in their modular cutter's lab module's quarters, the cutter took off. Soon the group had assembled around the lake where the lab module had been dumped, wondering what had happened. <BR>
<BR>
Three day later they were contacted from their ship, and a strange voice told them that to get off-world they had to bring their astrogator to their previous landing-site. After getting there they saw their ship hovering above tree-tops, and someone started lowering a rope for getting them up. This was the moment their astrogator decided to make a run for it and vanished in the woods. <BR>
<BR>
Leaving the hijacker with the hostages (Team members who were in the ship when he came aboard, and he had fast-talked or intimidated to cooperation.) the rest of the team run after. They then encountered a band of shipwreckers, who told that they had misjumped into the system some 10 years ago. The team also learned that their hijacker used to be a member of the shipwreckers crew.<BR>
<BR>
After some furious planning to get aboard the team used fast-talking, a crossbow, 80 m or rope and a sack of stones to get their aux pilot (who had slept most of the scenario (very happily, he _was_ very lazy)) aboard the air/raft hangar. As he picked up the rest of the team and 2 of the shipwreckers from ground, the adventure turned into a chase with their ship to get back aboard before it flew too high, and ended in a short firefight in the main cargo hangar (some 36 shots and just 2 hits). Luckily no-one died, not even the hijacker, and everybody got home safely. <BR>
<BR>
The game lasted a total of 14 hours, including 1 hour break for night-time no-stars football, some food and sauna. <BR>
<BR>
During the camp I also had opportunity to participate in other games: "Winter War II" Twilight with Phoenix Command "I don't think we should take the recruits with us."; Vampire "Something rotten in Tampere", a scenario with 2 Gangrels and 2 Ventrue; AD&D in Mystara, playing the B12  "The dark queen's revenge" in which we held siege to a castle with 9 PC's and a gnomish siege-engine.<BR>
<BR>
And the soundtrack of the weekend varied from Tangerine Dream to Atari Teenage Riot, and from Manovar to Public Enemy.<BR>
<BR>
All in all a great gaming weekend.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:17:52 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
>square.  This means that large ships would need proportionately<BR>
>thicker/more structural supports for the same G rating.  If<BR>
>you're going to worry about turrets weakening the hull,<BR>
>then you should worry about this.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Do you either of the FFS books for design? I couldn't say off the top of my<BR>
head how the algorith for volume allocated to structural support works, but<BR>
I think it's taken care of.<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:28:33 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Terraforming<BR>
<BR>
>1 kgf = ~ 1 Newton.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Isn't 1kgf ~= 10 Newtons ?<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:40:30 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
<BR>
>I seem to remember seeing on this list  recently  the  idea  that<BR>
>missiles in Traveller were actually detonation lasers (as  they'd<BR>
>do better damage than direct impact).  Simple question:  Would  a<BR>
>detonation laser work in a gas giant  atmosphere?  (I'm  thinking<BR>
>about what happens when SDBs ambush someone performing gas  giant<BR>
>refuelling.)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Three possible scenarios occur to me:<BR>
<BR>
a) The gas giant's atmosphere attentuates both X-Ray (which missiles use)<BR>
and F-E (which most ships use) lasers to the point where their range is too<BR>
short for effective use. The missiles will work, because now you can get<BR>
them inside the nuclear blast radius without them being shot down (unless<BR>
the target has dampers).<BR>
<BR>
b) The atmosphere attenuates X-Ray beams but the F-E beams can be tuned to a<BR>
frequency which is not affected. This is going to force the missiles to come<BR>
a lot closer, and they'll be easier targets for PD fire.<BR>
<BR>
c) The attenuation effects on both beams are comparable and not severe, and<BR>
combat continues as normal, if at a slightly shorter range.<BR>
<BR>
My money's on c) being the norm, although different atmosphere compositions<BR>
and densities could give different effects.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:05:35 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>Puppeteers moved their entire solar system out of the galaxy because of a<BR>
>threat that would hit this area in 30,000 years.  That's cowardice.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Strangely, that's the one aspect of the Puppeteers' history that I wouldn't<BR>
describe as cowardice. They weren't running from a fight - they were running<BR>
from absolutely certain death. Just because the Galaxy Getting Eaten By A<BR>
Bunch Of Big Black Holes was further away than Humans would consider worth<BR>
thinking about doesn't make them cowards. I'd say it just made them more<BR>
far-sighted than most other races.<BR>
<BR>
>The hivers fought a ar against the K'Kree, and won.<BR>
Well, the Hive Federation fought a war. Most of the Federation's actual<BR>
fighting is done by non-Hiver races, isn't it?<BR>
<BR>
>Canon also states that<BR>
>Hivers crew Federation warships, something a Pupeteer would never do.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
True, there are differences of degree between the two races. The PP's would<BR>
rather pay any price Rich Mann cared to name than risk having a single<BR>
pirate ship loose in their star system. The Puppeteer race's only defence<BR>
policy is to hold the implicit threat of bankruptcy over any race who might<BR>
choose to fight them.<BR>
<BR>
By contrast, the Hivers have no problem with manning long-range missile<BR>
cruisers, although they still wouldn't go hand-to-hand with an enemy (that's<BR>
what the Ikthlur are for...). But they too would prefer to use manipulation<BR>
to win a war. I can't remember where I read it, and it may well not have<BR>
been canon - but according to the story I saw the Hiver/K'Kree war ended in<BR>
the mother of all double manipulations. The Hivers managed to perform a<BR>
quick-fix botch on a captured K'Kree colony (behaviour alteration, drugs and<BR>
whotnot) to turn the inhabitants carnivorous. They then used that to bluff<BR>
the rest of the K'Kree that they could do it to them all. The K'Kree, ever<BR>
concerned with racial purity, backed off and never messed with the Hivers<BR>
again.<BR>
<BR>
I agree - they're NOT the same race. I imagine Mr Niven would have been most<BR>
annoyed if they were. But I still maintain there are striking similarities<BR>
there.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:21:21 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Terraforming (longish)<BR>
<BR>
Hi, Jason,<BR>
<BR>
> I'm doing Thanber for the Land Grab, and the atmosphere is troubling.<BR>
> Following First In rules, Thanber has no possibility of a habitable<BR>
> atmosphere (it's a 2,000-mile diameter, tidally-locked rockball there with<BR>
> only .25G), but everything else says it has a thin oxy-nitrogen atmosphere.<BR>
><BR>
> Does anyone have an idea of how much mass (in the form of icy asteroids and<BR>
> commets, possibly aritificially created) would have to be added to give a<BR>
> trace atmosphere a pressure of 0.5 Earth normal?  We don't need to make it<BR>
> permanent - just add another commet or two every century to keep the<BR>
> pressure up.<BR>
><BR>
I should say that IMHO the First In rules assume that the relationship between<BR>
world size and atmospheric pressure is a lot stronger than it really is. I don't<BR>
think you could generate Titan's atmosphere (which is much denser than Earth's)<BR>
using the First In rules, for example.<BR>
<BR>
Still, even Titan is larger than Thanber, and one assumes that if Thanber<BR>
is habitable it must be much _warmer_ than Titan, so the minimum molecular<BR>
weight retained would be much higher. So I agree some kind of terraforming<BR>
would be necessary for short-term habitability.<BR>
<BR>
Still, you'd have to explain Thanber's *tainted* atmosphere, which according<BR>
to _Behind the Claw_ is tainted with _microbes_. Where did these<BR>
microbes come from? I assume they weren't put there by the terraformers.<BR>
After all, we've concluded that Thanber is too small and too warm to retain an<BR>
oxygen atmosphere over geological time, so I wouldn't see much point<BR>
to seeding the world with bacteria (or other organisms) for a long-term<BR>
terroforming project.<BR>
<BR>
My own explanation would run somewhat like this: Thanber is a very cold and<BR>
very dense (metallic) world, a little like Europa but with a much denser core<BR>
and quite a bit closer to the primary -- maybe a little bit outside the<BR>
habitable zone,<BR>
cold enough to keep the oceans permanently frozen on the surface but not so cold<BR>
that humans near the equator couldn't survive brief exposure.<BR>
<BR>
Thanber does liquid water, but only deep under the ice, near volcanic activity.<BR>
The world also has an equatic biosphere, possibly a very primtive one similar to<BR>
that near underwater voclanoes on Earth. A combination of microbes<BR>
and photodissociation of the oceans are responsible for the world's<BR>
original atmosphere (trace oxygen-nitrogen, or possibly just oxygen).<BR>
<BR>
This atmosphere was supplemented by terraformers, who added a bit more oxygen<BR>
to the atmosphere (and possibly raised the temperature a bit). However over the<BR>
past 500+ years a form of aerial microbe have evolved to take advantage of new<BR>
conditions on the planet. These microbes can be deadly humans, who thought<BR>
that life on Thanber was uncomfortable enough already.<BR>
<BR>
Well that would be my take on it. Would it work? I don't know, but feel free to<BR>
tell me<BR>
if it wouldn't! (I'm a political science PhD candidate, I admit I don't know<BR>
much<BR>
about planetology.)<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:24:30 -0400<BR>
From: Roger Barr <RBarr@gatepetro.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GT Lite<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
Subject: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Gentlebeings,<BR>
<BR>
How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman<BR>
<end snip><BR>
<BR>
Sounds Great!!<BR>
<BR>
My gaming group has recently been recruiting new gamers for Traveller. That<BR>
would be an ideal document.<BR>
<BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:31:35 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Citizens of the Empire<BR>
<BR>
Of course, you can be a Citizen and have less<BR>
political power than a Subject... as any Paranoia<BR>
player would know.<BR>
<BR>
People could call themselves "Citizens" but still be<BR>
more like than "Subjects", and vice versa.<BR>
<BR>
Arthur Boff<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:34:41 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
- --- Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
wrote:<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/25/00 1:43 PM,<BR>
> ajboff@yahoo.com issued forth:<BR>
> <BR>
> > By the way, I read on the "IMTU" article that the<BR>
> > Hivers are like the "puppeteers" in Larry Niven's<BR>
> > "Known Space" stories? Is this true? Because if it<BR>
> is<BR>
> > I'm well pleased. ;-)<BR>
> <BR>
> Pschologically yes, to a degree. Not to say I<BR>
> wouldn't also insert<BR>
> puppeteer's in some form as well IMTU, and of course<BR>
> they are quite<BR>
> different in their physiology.<BR>
<BR>
Not IMTU... which is going to look a lot like Known Space.<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:35:48 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Terraforming (longish)<BR>
<BR>
I've place Thanber in the life zone for it's primary (corrected to M0 V from<BR>
M9 V in the Regency Sourcebook), and it is very dense (but not out of the<BR>
realm of possibility) to get that .25 G, so those parts fit with your ideas.<BR>
Thanber is tidal-locked (it could hardly help it, being so small and so<BR>
close to its primary), so only the cold side is ice-covered.<BR>
<BR>
I had two thoughts about the microbe taint in the atmosphere.  First, that<BR>
the microbes were already there and took advantage of the improved<BR>
conditions the terraformers introduced (like you posted).<BR>
Second, that they went undetected in the comets the terraformers introduced<BR>
into the atmosphere and quickly grew out of control in the warm climate.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not sure which I'll end up with, but I believe the microbes will be more<BR>
irritating than dangerous - the natives are acclimated to them and visitors<BR>
that don't take precautions will only experience an allergic reaction<BR>
(severe in some cases) that is roughly the equivelant of a bad cold.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Matt Stevens [mailto:mfs10@columbia.edu]<BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2000 12:21 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Terraforming (longish)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Hi, Jason,<BR>
I should say that IMHO the First In rules assume that the relationship<BR>
between<BR>
world size and atmospheric pressure is a lot stronger than it really is. I<BR>
don't<BR>
think you could generate Titan's atmosphere (which is much denser than<BR>
Earth's)<BR>
using the First In rules, for example.<BR>
<BR>
Still, even Titan is larger than Thanber, and one assumes that if Thanber<BR>
is habitable it must be much _warmer_ than Titan, so the minimum molecular<BR>
weight retained would be much higher. So I agree some kind of terraforming<BR>
would be necessary for short-term habitability.<BR>
<BR>
Still, you'd have to explain Thanber's *tainted* atmosphere, which according<BR>
to _Behind the Claw_ is tainted with _microbes_. Where did these<BR>
microbes come from? I assume they weren't put there by the terraformers.<BR>
After all, we've concluded that Thanber is too small and too warm to retain<BR>
an<BR>
oxygen atmosphere over geological time, so I wouldn't see much point<BR>
to seeding the world with bacteria (or other organisms) for a long-term<BR>
terroforming project.<BR>
<BR>
My own explanation would run somewhat like this: Thanber is a very cold and<BR>
very dense (metallic) world, a little like Europa but with a much denser<BR>
core<BR>
and quite a bit closer to the primary -- maybe a little bit outside the<BR>
habitable zone,<BR>
cold enough to keep the oceans permanently frozen on the surface but not so<BR>
cold<BR>
that humans near the equator couldn't survive brief exposure.<BR>
<BR>
Thanber does liquid water, but only deep under the ice, near volcanic<BR>
activity.<BR>
The world also has an aquatic biosphere, possibly a very primtive one<BR>
similar to<BR>
that near underwater voclanoes on Earth. A combination of microbes<BR>
and photodissociation of the oceans are responsible for the world's<BR>
original atmosphere (trace oxygen-nitrogen, or possibly just oxygen).<BR>
<BR>
This atmosphere was supplemented by terraformers, who added a bit more<BR>
oxygen<BR>
to the atmosphere (and possibly raised the temperature a bit). However over<BR>
the<BR>
past 500+ years a form of aerial microbe have evolved to take advantage of<BR>
new<BR>
conditions on the planet. These microbes can be deadly humans, who thought<BR>
that life on Thanber was uncomfortable enough already.<BR>
<BR>
Well that would be my take on it. Would it work? I don't know, but feel free<BR>
to<BR>
tell me<BR>
if it wouldn't! (I'm a political science PhD candidate, I admit I don't know<BR>
much<BR>
about planetology.)<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:42:24 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Arthur Boff <ajboff@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
- --- Nick Bradbeer <nickb@ndirect.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
> >The Hivers are not cowards.  They manipulate<BR>
> because it's fun.  It's also a<BR>
> >social thing among them, somewhere between winning<BR>
> an Olympic Medal and the<BR>
> >Nobel Prize.  They constantly manipulate<BR>
> themselves, their neighbors, their<BR>
> >clients..<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> They're cowards in the same way that the Puppeteers<BR>
> are though - in that<BR>
> they absolutely won't take any personal risks at all<BR>
> unless forced to. (This<BR>
> is from the TNE background though - dunno if it's at<BR>
> odds with other canon.)<BR>
> <BR>
> Granted, the emphasis is more on the manipulation<BR>
> for the Hivers, and the<BR>
> cowardice for the Puppeteers, but I think both<BR>
> elements are definitely there<BR>
> in both.<BR>
<BR>
Ah, but maybe that's because the Puppeteers only let<BR>
us see the cowardice most of the time?<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:43:33 -0400<BR>
From: Brian Quirt <baqrt@mta.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Terraforming<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >1 kgf = ~ 1 Newton.<BR>
> <BR>
> Isn't 1kgf ~= 10 Newtons ?<BR>
<BR>
	I'm not sure what kgf is, but 1 N = 1 kg*m*s^-2. (1 kilogram meter per<BR>
second squared). Thus, the gravitational field constant is 9.8 N/kg<BR>
(newtons per kilogram), which translates to kg*m*s^-2*kg^-1 = m*s^-2<BR>
(meters per second squared, the unit of acceleration). I'm guessing this<BR>
was about units of force. Thus, on earth, a 1kg mass experiences a force<BR>
of 9.81N.<BR>
<BR>
Hope that helps,<BR>
	-Brian Quirt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:47:39 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: <BR>
<BR>
Ian Ferguson wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Dan Roseberry writes:<BR>
> >Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
> >term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
> >be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
> <BR>
>         Even if there are health problems caused by exposure to<BR>
>         electric fields (there may be, but it has not yet been<BR>
>         demonstrated), <BR>
<BR>
More to the point, the original study showing that exposure to<BR>
electromagnetic fields caused damage to cells in culture, (the one most<BR>
often cited in anti-powerline studies, and the genesis of millions and<BR>
millions of dollars in research lawsuits, etc) has been shown to be<BR>
fraudulent.<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: Fraudulent scientific studies (such as the famous separated<BR>
twins studies in England in the 50's, the aforementioned electric fields<BR>
studies, and others) often take many years to be exposed, particularly<BR>
if the author is a nominally well-respected expert in the field, moreso<BR>
if he or she is the leading expert. This on a world with a tradition of<BR>
more or less rigorous testing of scientific theory (to a point, there is<BR>
much that is dogmatic about science) and nearly instant communications.<BR>
<BR>
What about the 3I with weeks, months or even years between<BR>
cross-imperial communications, a vilani-based tradition of distrust of<BR>
the new or different, and the echoes of the Vilani patent system in<BR>
megacorp secrecy? I suspect that a LOT of research consists of wandering<BR>
around in blind alleys bumping into the walls. This will greatly slow<BR>
the pace of basic research, and thus of applied research.<BR>
<BR>
People could easily spend their entire careers; heck generations could<BR>
spend their careers working on the equivalent of the phlogiston theory<BR>
of whatever.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 11:55:35 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Do you either of the FFS books for design? I couldn't say off the top of my<BR>
> head how the algorith for volume allocated to structural support works, but<BR>
> I think it's taken care of.<BR>
<BR>
FFS2 does scale structural volume correctly (it's order 4/3 in volume) <BR>
assuming you can make heads or tails of the book, which is somewhat <BR>
challenging as it is appallingly edited and typeset.  FFS does not handle<BR>
structural volume correctly.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:06:13 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
Bolie Williams IV wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> At 12:50 AM +0100 4/26/00, Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >Yeah, and the electric currents stay in the mobile phone too... No health<BR>
> >risks there <g><BR>
> <BR>
> Are you referring to the ONE recorded case of a brain tumor in a cell<BR>
> phone user?  That hardly implies a link.  The link between sunspots<BR>
> and the party of congressmen in the US Congress is MUCH stronger.<BR>
<BR>
As an informative aside, we do, in fact know the cause of the dramatic<BR>
rise in brain tumors over the last 25-30 years: the invention,<BR>
perfection and commercialization of the CAT scanner. That's what's<BR>
causing them. :-p<BR>
<BR>
For the lost: this finally allowed non-invasive, detailed examonation of<BR>
the brain, finally allowing us to see these brain tumors before they<BR>
killed someone, and the death diagnosed as a cerebral hemorrage or<BR>
stroke, or they metastasized and the paitent died of 'that' cancer.<BR>
There is no hard evidence to support a rise in overall brain tumor<BR>
rates. There isn't, alas any hard evidence to support _any_ great<BR>
supposition about brain cancer rates; ask us again in 20 years. <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:06:19 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Gentlebeings,<BR>
> <BR>
> How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<BR>
Allow me to add my voive to the chorus of "Damn yes! That's fine idea!"<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:10:42<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
At 06:33 PM 4/26/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>At 12:18 -0400 26/4/00, Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com> wrote:<BR>
>>How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
><BR>
>Me!<BR>
<BR>
AOL!  And can I have it by May 26th?<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:24:53 -0500<BR>
From: Jason Kemp <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
<BR>
Greetings, All,<BR>
<BR>
Here's some suggested Character Generation tables for the Darrian psionic<BR>
martial artists known as the Order of Zar-Tis, using Classic Traveller (CT)<BR>
and Marc Miller's Traveller (T4). Any input would be appreciated. Also,<BR>
since I don't have my books here, I've had to guess as some of the skill<BR>
group names in T4. If I messed up something, please let me know. Once I've<BR>
gotten a little feedback, I'll ask Jeff Zeitlin to update the article with<BR>
this new information.<BR>
<BR>
Again, the original article is located at:<BR>
http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/features/rules/zartis.html<BR>
<BR>
I don't have TNE, so don't expect a translation into that method from me.<BR>
However, I do have GT, and will try to come up with a Zar-Tis template soon.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
* * * * *<BR>
Order of Zar-Tis Character Generation (CT)<BR>
* * * * *<BR>
<BR>
Enlistment:  10+ (DM+1 if Int A+, DM+2 if Psi 8+)<BR>
Draft:       N/A<BR>
Survival:     6+ (DM+2 if Dex 8+)<BR>
Commission:  10+ (DM+1 if Psi 9+)<BR>
Promotion:    8+ (DM+1 if Int A+)<BR>
Reenlistment: 5+<BR>
<BR>
Skill Tables<BR>
 <BR>
1. Physical Training<BR>
1 +1 Str<BR>
2 +1 Dex <BR>
3 +1 End<BR>
4 Sabre <BR>
5 Streetwise<BR>
6 Leadership <BR>
<BR>
2. Service Skills<BR>
<BR>
1 Gun Combat <BR>
2 Vehicle <BR>
3 Mechanics<BR>
4 Survival <BR>
5 Sabre <BR>
6 Psionics <BR>
<BR>
3. Education<BR>
<BR>
1 Pilot<BR>
2 Computer<BR>
3 Gravitics<BR>
4 Leadership <BR>
5 Admin<BR>
6 Psionics <BR>
<BR>
4. Advanced Education (must have Edu 8+)<BR>
<BR>
1 Instruction<BR>
2 Navigation<BR>
3 Engineering <BR>
4 Liaison <BR>
5 J-O-T <BR>
6 Psionics <BR>
 <BR>
Automatic Rank and Service Skills:<BR>
Enlistment: Sabre-1<BR>
Master, 1st Degree: Instruction-1<BR>
<BR>
Rank Table:<BR>
O1 Master, 1st Degree<BR>
O2 Master, 2nd Degree<BR>
O3 Master, 3rd Degree<BR>
O4 Master, 4th Degree<BR>
O5 High Master<BR>
O6 Grand Master<BR>
<BR>
Skill Eligibility:<BR>
2 skills per term<BR>
1 skill for commission<BR>
1 skill for promotion<BR>
<BR>
Benefits Tables:<BR>
See MT Generation method.<BR>
<BR>
* * * * *<BR>
Order of Zar-Tis Character Generation (T4)<BR>
* * * * *<BR>
<BR>
Enlistment:  4-; DM+1 if Int A+; DM+2 if Psi 8+  <BR>
Injury:  8-; DM+2 if Dex 8+  <BR>
Commission:  4-; DM+1 if Psi 9+  <BR>
Promotion:  6-; DM+1 if Int A+  <BR>
Continuance: 9- <BR>
<BR>
Skill Tables:<BR>
<BR>
1. Physical skills  <BR>
1 +1 Str<BR>
2 +1 Dex <BR>
3 +1 End<BR>
4 Sabre <BR>
5 Clandestine<BR>
6 Leadership <BR>
<BR>
2. Mental skills  <BR>
1 Academic<BR>
2 Spacecraft<BR>
3 Technical<BR>
4 First Aid   <BR>
5 Perception  <BR>
6 Psionics<BR>
<BR>
3. Educational skills  <BR>
1 Communication<BR>
2 Philosophy<BR>
3 Exploration<BR>
4 Technical  <BR>
5 Spacecraft  <BR>
6 Psionics<BR>
<BR>
4. Social skills  <BR>
1 Language  <BR>
2 Academic<BR>
3 Bureaucracy  <BR>
4 Clandestine  <BR>
5 Charisma   <BR>
6 Philosophy <BR>
<BR>
5. Career skills  <BR>
1 Stealth   <BR>
2 Technical<BR>
3 Gravitics<BR>
4 Leadership <BR>
5 Sabre<BR>
6 Psionics <BR>
<BR>
6. Background skills  <BR>
1 Gun Combat <BR>
2 Vehicle <BR>
3 Technical<BR>
4 Survival <BR>
5 Sabre <BR>
6 Psionics <BR>
<BR>
Automatic Rank and Service Skills:<BR>
Enlistment: Sabre-1<BR>
Master, 1st Degree: Instruction-1<BR>
<BR>
Rank Table:<BR>
E1 Dedicant<BR>
E2 Initiate<BR>
E3 Apprentice, 1st Degree<BR>
E4 Apprentice, 2nd Degree<BR>
E5 Apprentice, 3rd Degree<BR>
E6 Initiated Member of the Order<BR>
E7 Member of the Order<BR>
E8 Accomplished Member of the Order<BR>
E9 Advanced Member of the Order<BR>
O1 Master, 1st Degree<BR>
O2 Master, 2nd Degree<BR>
O3 Master, 3rd Degree<BR>
O4 Master, 4th Degree<BR>
O5 High Master<BR>
O6 Grand Master<BR>
<BR>
Skill Eligibility:<BR>
+1 skill per year  <BR>
+1 skill for commission<BR>
+1 skill for promotion<BR>
<BR>
Benefits Tables:<BR>
See MT Generation method.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2355<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2356</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 26 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2356<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Terraforming<BR>
Re: X-TEK Excalibur Sword<BR>
Re: Opinions sought<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re:  Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Puppeteer "cowardice" (was Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2355<BR>
RE: Psi-Shields<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re Hivers<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:41:22 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Terraforming<BR>
<BR>
Brian Quirt writes:<BR>
> Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> > <BR>
> > >1 kgf = ~ 1 Newton.<BR>
> > <BR>
> > Isn't 1kgf ~= 10 Newtons ?<BR>
> <BR>
>      I'm not sure what kgf is.<BR>
Kilogram-force.  Its the weight of a one kilogram object on earth AFAIK, and<BR>
is thus equal to 9.81 newtons.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:09:31 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: X-TEK Excalibur Sword<BR>
<BR>
William Prankard wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
> From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
> <BR>
> >Is 4lb really beyond the abilities of normal people to swing? I think my<BR>
> >LARP sword weighs a good portion of that, and it's made largely of foam<BR>
> and<BR>
> >latex.<BR>
> <BR>
> >Nick<BR>
> <BR>
> Read above.  STR requirement is how weildy the weapon is.<BR>
> A normal Broadsword in GURPS weighs 3lbs and has a STR req of 10<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm, I wrote my reply without remembering exactly how heavy the thing<BR>
is. I's all a question of balance, but 4 lbs is not at all out of line<BR>
for real swords, at least real ones of the bastard variety or larger.<BR>
The main thing is the balance. A 4 lb sword might get heavy after a<BR>
while, but a lot of that weight is going to be in the grip, where the<BR>
batteries are.<BR>
<BR>
Why then does the thing need CG at all? Good question. That'd cut the<BR>
wight down, too, by a pound or so, and make the thing perfectly<BR>
wieldable.<BR>
<BR>
Note: Gurps rules on the 'wiedliness' of swords is likely to be quite<BR>
wrong.<BR>
<BR>
Check out Museum Replicas for stats on real swords.<BR>
http://www.museumreplicas.com/<BR>
 (and cry when you see the swords, and prices...man, when I win the<BR>
lottery....;-)<BR>
<BR>
I _want_, nay , _need_ to own their two handed scottish claymore...a<BR>
verrah nice wee sword it is, too.<BR>
<BR>
At 5 pounds, it's one of, if not _the_ heaviest sword replica they sell.<BR>
They also sell the one that Mel Gibson used in 'Braveheart'.<BR>
<BR>
And actually, given the quality of their work (these are real,<BR>
functional swords, not merely display copies) the prices aren't all that<BR>
unreasonable.<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:07:24 EDT<BR>
From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions sought<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/26/00 12:24:17 PM Pacific Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:10:42<BR>
>  From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
>  Subject: re: Opinions Sought<BR>
>  <BR>
>  At 06:33 PM 4/26/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>  >At 12:18 -0400 26/4/00, Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com> wrote:<BR>
>  >>How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
>  ><BR>
>  >Me!<BR>
>  <BR>
>  AOL!  And can I have it by May 26th?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Just in time for my Birthday present?<BR>
<BR>
Bryan<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:29:29 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer said:<BR>
<BR>
>>Puppeteers moved their entire solar system out of the galaxy because of a<BR>
>>threat that would hit this area in 30,000 years.  That's cowardice.<BR>
><BR>
>Strangely, that's the one aspect of the Puppeteers' history that I wouldn't<BR>
>describe as cowardice. They weren't running from a fight - they were<BR>
running<BR>
>from absolutely certain death. Just because the Galaxy Getting Eaten By A<BR>
>Bunch Of Big Black Holes was further away than Humans would consider worth<BR>
>thinking about doesn't make them cowards. I'd say it just made them more<BR>
>far-sighted than most other races.<BR>
<BR>
Remember, you're talking to someone who lives in San Francisco and who is<BR>
not phased in the slightest that the majority of his state could slide off<BR>
into the ocean at any moment. :)<BR>
<BR>
>>The hivers fought a ar against the K'Kree, and won.<BR>
>Well, the Hive Federation fought a war. Most of the Federation's actual<BR>
>fighting is done by non-Hiver races, isn't it?<BR>
<BR>
Was it though? Canonically, the K'Kree were heavily demoralized by Ithklur<BR>
forces and their peculiar dietary habits. Hivers & Ithklur is quite vague<BR>
about how this came to be, and implies that this was a Hiver manipulation.<BR>
So yeah, maybe the Hiver don't fix bayonets and jab away or wrestle with the<BR>
K'Kree in the trenches (which would be a humorous sight, I imagine), but<BR>
they do fight in some sense of the word.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
>By contrast, the Hivers have no problem with manning long-range missile<BR>
>cruisers, although they still wouldn't go hand-to-hand with an enemy<BR>
(that's<BR>
>what the Ikthlur are for...). But they too would prefer to use manipulation<BR>
>to win a war.<BR>
<BR>
Is it really a preference? After all, the Hivers aren't really built for<BR>
hand-to-hand combat. I'm not saying this merely to point out that hivers<BR>
don't have "hands" (appendage-to-appendage combat), but that they just don't<BR>
appear to be built for the same sort of combat we're built for.<BR>
<BR>
They're aliens.<BR>
<BR>
They look differently, and more importantly think differently. It seems<BR>
absurd to map human concepts or emotional states, such as cowardice, onto<BR>
the Hivers. I think even the notion that the Hivers "prefer" not to engage<BR>
in close combat is a little bizarre. It seems to me to be like saying that<BR>
humans prefer not to fly without the aid of machinery. Consider the<BR>
following:<BR>
<BR>
- - Hivers appear as if they would be relatively ponderous and slow moving.<BR>
Depending on how slow they are, this makes running across a field avoiding<BR>
machinegun fire a bit more difficult. This would also make getting away from<BR>
an opponent in hand to hand combat very difficult.<BR>
<BR>
- - Hivers are ungainly. It would appear that it would be somewhat awkward in<BR>
turning. The placement of their manipulative appendages is such that it<BR>
could be very difficult for the poor critters the wheel around, to change<BR>
facing and direction. This is absolutely essential in both hand-to-hand and<BR>
ranged combat.<BR>
<BR>
- - Hivers are relatively big targets. They are effectively the same size from<BR>
all sides. Due to their bulk, finding appropriate cover could be difficult.<BR>
Humans can drop to the ground to reduce their profile in the face of missile<BR>
weapons. Hivers cannot.<BR>
<BR>
- - Hivers are mute. They cannot bark orders to each other. Humans can hear<BR>
somebody saying something as they look at or do something else. A human can<BR>
yell "Cover Me!" to his fellow soldiers, and even if they are otherwise<BR>
occupied, they can hear and respond. In order for a hiver to bark to his<BR>
comrades "cover me" it would have to use sign language, which would mean<BR>
that other hivers would have to look at it, which would mean that they<BR>
couldn't be doing anything else.<BR>
<BR>
Now, assuming that the Hivers *prefer* not to fight in close combat, can it<BR>
really be called cowardice? Cowardice is, after all, the lack of courage in<BR>
the face of danger. Assuming that Hivers have a notion such as courage in<BR>
the first place, which would be necessary for them to be considered cowards,<BR>
is such a preference unreasonable? They're not built for combat as we know<BR>
combat. For a hiver to engage in combat the way we understand it would not<BR>
necessarily be courage, but a certain form of stupidity, or some sort of<BR>
desire for self-destruction.<BR>
<BR>
If Hivers do indeed indeed have a concept akin to our concept of "courage",<BR>
is their complete inability to engage in combat (at least in the way that we<BR>
frequently use the term) cowardice? Entering into combat for your average<BR>
Hiver would be akin to a human jumping off the empire state building. If you<BR>
were to read in the paper tomorrow that somebody jumped off the Empire State<BR>
building, would you immediately think of how courageous he was?<BR>
<BR>
Of course, if they don't have an emotional state such as courage, it's<BR>
obviously a moot point because they are incapable of being cowards (they<BR>
would always be equally courageous, or equally cowardly).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:19:59 +0200<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
At 18:21 26.04.00, you wrote:<BR>
>Gentlebeings,<BR>
><BR>
>How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
><BR>
>This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but instead<BR>
>of rules, it would be a "briefing booklet" on the background. We would have<BR>
>it as a PDF on the website, and a printed version would be free for the<BR>
>asking at stores, conventions, and through the mail. This would explain the<BR>
>history of the Third Imperium and its neighbors, give thumbnail sketches of<BR>
>the assorted milieu, and explain "what go what" (old GDW in-joke).<BR>
><BR>
>It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
>players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
My feelings? Great idea!<BR>
<BR>
- ---<BR>
Volker A. Greimann<BR>
greimann@geocities.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:46:29 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
While I don't recall the exact refrences (probably Aliens of the Rim and the<BR>
first TNE novel are where I'm getting the idea), I do seem to recall Hivers<BR>
described as being psychologically averse to violence.  This means that they<BR>
avoid hand-to-hand combat because they are psychologically incapable of it,<BR>
not physiologically.  If they're manning (hivering?)automated weapons<BR>
stations firing at ships or entire cities, they are detatched enough from<BR>
their opponent to attack, but anything where they can see their enemy is too<BR>
much for them.  So they're a bit more capable of violence than a Pupeteer<BR>
is.<BR>
<BR>
Of course the Hivers don't call it cowardice.  They don't call the Ithklur<BR>
brave either.  They probably consider their attitude mature.  That doesn't<BR>
prevent humans from calling Hiver's cowards.<BR>
The Pupeteers didn't call their "healthy caution" cowardice either, but<BR>
general opinion among other sentients was that they were cowards.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Chris Seamans [mailto:semo@pil.net]<BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2000 2:29 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer said:<BR>
<BR>
>>Puppeteers moved their entire solar system out of the galaxy because of a<BR>
>>threat that would hit this area in 30,000 years.  That's cowardice.<BR>
><BR>
>Strangely, that's the one aspect of the Puppeteers' history that I wouldn't<BR>
>describe as cowardice. They weren't running from a fight - they were<BR>
running<BR>
>from absolutely certain death. Just because the Galaxy Getting Eaten By A<BR>
>Bunch Of Big Black Holes was further away than Humans would consider worth<BR>
>thinking about doesn't make them cowards. I'd say it just made them more<BR>
>far-sighted than most other races.<BR>
<BR>
Remember, you're talking to someone who lives in San Francisco and who is<BR>
not phased in the slightest that the majority of his state could slide off<BR>
into the ocean at any moment. :)<BR>
<BR>
>>The hivers fought a ar against the K'Kree, and won.<BR>
>Well, the Hive Federation fought a war. Most of the Federation's actual<BR>
>fighting is done by non-Hiver races, isn't it?<BR>
<BR>
Was it though? Canonically, the K'Kree were heavily demoralized by Ithklur<BR>
forces and their peculiar dietary habits. Hivers & Ithklur is quite vague<BR>
about how this came to be, and implies that this was a Hiver manipulation.<BR>
So yeah, maybe the Hiver don't fix bayonets and jab away or wrestle with the<BR>
K'Kree in the trenches (which would be a humorous sight, I imagine), but<BR>
they do fight in some sense of the word.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
>By contrast, the Hivers have no problem with manning long-range missile<BR>
>cruisers, although they still wouldn't go hand-to-hand with an enemy<BR>
(that's<BR>
>what the Ikthlur are for...). But they too would prefer to use manipulation<BR>
>to win a war.<BR>
<BR>
Is it really a preference? After all, the Hivers aren't really built for<BR>
hand-to-hand combat. I'm not saying this merely to point out that hivers<BR>
don't have "hands" (appendage-to-appendage combat), but that they just don't<BR>
appear to be built for the same sort of combat we're built for.<BR>
<BR>
They're aliens.<BR>
<BR>
They look differently, and more importantly think differently. It seems<BR>
absurd to map human concepts or emotional states, such as cowardice, onto<BR>
the Hivers. I think even the notion that the Hivers "prefer" not to engage<BR>
in close combat is a little bizarre. It seems to me to be like saying that<BR>
humans prefer not to fly without the aid of machinery. Consider the<BR>
following:<BR>
*snip*<BR>
Now, assuming that the Hivers *prefer* not to fight in close combat, can it<BR>
really be called cowardice? Cowardice is, after all, the lack of courage in<BR>
the face of danger. Assuming that Hivers have a notion such as courage in<BR>
the first place, which would be necessary for them to be considered cowards,<BR>
is such a preference unreasonable? They're not built for combat as we know<BR>
combat. For a hiver to engage in combat the way we understand it would not<BR>
necessarily be courage, but a certain form of stupidity, or some sort of<BR>
desire for self-destruction.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:48:39 GMT<BR>
From: "Boris Cibic" <kafka47@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re:  Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Loren,<BR>
   I think that a GT lite would go over really well.  If it concentrated on <BR>
cannon's background.  Whoa!  That is what GT already does...So how could it <BR>
be improved...<BR>
   I would agree with a previous respondent, who asked Jessie to illustrate <BR>
an original cover and include a map of Known Space.  A well illustrated <BR>
piece will always sell well (or at least lead to future) here in the Toronto <BR>
market.  So keep those Jessie works coming.<BR>
  To this I would add, have a quality piece of fiction introducing the <BR>
piece.  The website piece is great, but, it is best for the website.  A GT <BR>
lite has to emphasize adventure.  I really liked your intro to GT, as it <BR>
explained all possible campaigns.<BR>
  One thing thing (amongst many) that GDW did really well in MT was to write <BR>
those little fictionalized narrative blurbs which really set the mood (for a <BR>
chapter or sourcebook).  I know, GT does this with sidebars. But those GDW <BR>
wrote so fantastic that referees could just wade right in and complete the <BR>
story.  No offence, but many of those in GT [like in T4] sometimes seem <BR>
cartoonish.  Whereas GDW, partially due its milieu emphasised grittiness.**<BR>
  So in introducing those career types perhaps, have a storyline blurb <BR>
instead in a framed box?  Emphasis placed on the wonder, diversity, and the <BR>
expanse of the Traveller universe.<BR>
   We can assume that individuals will be able to reference Gurps Lite or <BR>
the main GT rulebook so include tempting snips from other sourcebooks which <BR>
help entice newbie into a cannon formation but at the same time firing their <BR>
imagination to create more.<BR>
   An integrated timeline showing other possible milieus, might also be <BR>
good, allowing players to make History by themselves.<BR>
[a personal note, I began playing Traveller with Starter Traveller <BR>
{82/83}...as you know that product is filled with little cannon history but <BR>
many allusions to it so I created an entire non-cannon universe around <BR>
concepts such as Imperium, Solomani,etc. and boy was I surprised by cannon.  <BR>
On one hand, I would urge to you to do the same with GT Lite but on the <BR>
other it is not a good idea as many do not as much free time as I did in <BR>
High School so emphasize the wonder].<BR>
<BR>
**grit<BR>
Function: noun<BR>
Text: Synonyms FORTITUDE, backbone, guts, intestinal fortitude, ||moxie, <BR>
nerve, sand, spunk<BR>
Contrasted Words faltering, hesitation, vacillation, wavering<BR>
Antonyms faintheartedness<BR>
OTHERWISE, the stuff that clings to Travellers and just keeps accumulating <BR>
with every adventure.<BR>
<BR>
Boris Cibic<BR>
<BR>
  "Smart people believe only half the things they hear.  Intelligent people <BR>
know which half."<BR>
<BR>
Contact:  kafka47@hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________________________<BR>
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:04:43 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/26/00 1:46 PM, JasonP@i-link.net issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> So they're a bit more capable of violence than a Puppeteer<BR>
> is.<BR>
<BR>
Hivers? They can't put their hind hoof through your chest (they don't have<BR>
one). I'm going to have to put a bit more on Hivers on my page, I see my<BR>
reference to Puppeteers may mislead those new to Traveller. First off I'll<BR>
have to put a picture up, and Chris, could I quote some of that last post of<BR>
yours? Those were some very good points. I don't know much about the Ithklur<BR>
except their relationship to the Hivers, Is there a picture on the web<BR>
somewhere?<BR>
<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
BZAT: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/index.html<BR>
Lanth6: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Lanth6/Main.html<BR>
E-mail: xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:08:22 -0700<BR>
From: Russell Bornschlegel <kaleja@estarcion.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Puppeteer "cowardice" (was Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> [Citation lost]<BR>
> >Puppeteers moved their entire solar system out of the galaxy because of a<BR>
> >threat that would hit this area in 30,000 years.  That's cowardice.<BR>
> <BR>
> Strangely, that's the one aspect of the Puppeteers' history that I wouldn't<BR>
> describe as cowardice. They weren't running from a fight - they were running<BR>
> from absolutely certain death. Just because the Galaxy Getting Eaten By A<BR>
> Bunch Of Big Black Holes was further away than Humans would consider worth<BR>
> thinking about doesn't make them cowards. I'd say it just made them more<BR>
> far-sighted than most other races.<BR>
<BR>
That's the punch line of the story, anyway: "Maybe it's men who are the <BR>
cowards -- at the core." Of course, if the Puppeteers found it possible to <BR>
start running within one generation, it seems reasonable for humans to wait<BR>
a few thousand years and see what sort of technological advances could make <BR>
the evacuation simpler or even unnecessary. <BR>
<BR>
Of course, there's all sorts of Niven-canonical and Niven-apocryphal rewriting<BR>
of this scenario in later stories and essays, implying that the Puppeteers <BR>
mightn't have been really running from the core explosion after all.<BR>
<BR>
All the _Neutron Star_ stories are so much fun, it's sad that they don't hold<BR>
up under more logical scrutiny and have to be retconned. *sigh* This is why I'm <BR>
afraid to write hard science fiction -- if not your contemporaries, then your <BR>
descendents will always be able to tear your science apart.<BR>
<BR>
- -Russell B<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:11:31 -0700<BR>
From: Russell Bornschlegel <kaleja@estarcion.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2355<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson wrote:<BR>
> ObTrav: Fraudulent scientific studies (such as the famous separated<BR>
> twins studies in England in the 50's, the aforementioned electric fields<BR>
> studies, and others) often take many years to be exposed, particularly<BR>
> if the author is a nominally well-respected expert in the field, moreso<BR>
> if he or she is the leading expert. This on a world with a tradition of<BR>
> more or less rigorous testing of scientific theory (to a point, there is<BR>
> much that is dogmatic about science) and nearly instant communications.<BR>
> <BR>
> What about the 3I with weeks, months or even years between<BR>
> cross-imperial communications, a vilani-based tradition of distrust of<BR>
> the new or different, and the echoes of the Vilani patent system in<BR>
> megacorp secrecy? I suspect that a LOT of research consists of wandering<BR>
> around in blind alleys bumping into the walls. This will greatly slow<BR>
> the pace of basic research, and thus of applied research.<BR>
> <BR>
> People could easily spend their entire careers; heck generations could<BR>
> spend their careers working on the equivalent of the phlogiston theory<BR>
> of whatever.<BR>
<BR>
Doesn't this go a long way toward explaining how humaniti's only gotten <BR>
to TL15, when we've leapt from TL5 to TL8.5 (+/- 1, because I'm not even<BR>
going to get into that argument again) in a century or so?<BR>
<BR>
- -Russell B<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:40:13 -0500<BR>
From: Dan Roseberry <rosebee@troi.csw.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Psi-Shields<BR>
<BR>
>Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
> term exposure to the helmets electrical field?<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
>>Why? Contrary to popular belief there's *no* conclusive evidence<BR>
that<BR>
>>low level EM fields have any effects worth mentioning on humans.<BR>
<BR>
Cool. Thats one less thing to worry about. :-)<BR>
(/exiting topic)<BR>
Dan Roseberry (plop101) Hot Springs, Arkansas<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:52:09 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma said:<BR>
<BR>
>While I don't recall the exact refrences (probably Aliens of the Rim and<BR>
the<BR>
>first TNE novel are where I'm getting the idea), I do seem to recall Hivers<BR>
>described as being psychologically averse to violence.<BR>
<BR>
I've seen it too, so it was probably in Aliens of the Rim at least. From<BR>
what I recall, the idea goes back quite a bit further.<BR>
<BR>
>This means that they avoid hand-to-hand combat because they are<BR>
psychologically<BR>
>incapable of it, not physiologically.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not sure what your point is here. Are you saying that obvious canonical<BR>
physiologically differences are mooted because canon says that they are<BR>
merely psychologically incapable of violence? Why would that be?<BR>
<BR>
It doesn't matter, really, since I said that they look different, and more<BR>
importantly think differently. I've said nothing at all which is<BR>
inconsistent with the notion that the Hivers are psychologically incapable<BR>
of combat. I've merely pointed out that Hivers are not built for the kind of<BR>
combat that we are built for. I would further offer that our understanding<BR>
of intimate ground combat comes from the way that we are built<BR>
physiologically.<BR>
<BR>
>If they're manning (hivering?)automated weapons<BR>
>stations firing at ships or entire cities, they are detatched enough from<BR>
>their opponent to attack, but anything where they can see their enemy is<BR>
too<BR>
>much for them.  So they're a bit more capable of violence than a Pupeteer<BR>
>is.<BR>
<BR>
Incidentally, note that if they are that detached in this fashion, they<BR>
fight via machinery which more than substitutes for their natural<BR>
physiological drawbacks with respect to combat.<BR>
<BR>
> Of course the Hivers don't call it cowardice. They don't call the Ithklur<BR>
>brave either. They probably consider their attitude mature.  That doesn't<BR>
>prevent humans from calling Hiver's cowards.<BR>
<BR>
You're right, with respect to how people and races might refer to each other<BR>
in the Traveller universe. I hope you're not surprised to discover that<BR>
we're not living in the Traveller universe. :)<BR>
<BR>
More importantly, what people in the Third Imperium think of the Hivers, or<BR>
call them, is unimportant. I wasn't talking cultural relativism. I wasn't<BR>
saying, "Oh we shouldn't call those poor Hivers cowards, because they don't<BR>
consider themselves cowards." What I was actually saying, and it seemed that<BR>
I was pretty clear on this, is that they are not cowards, which is very<BR>
different. It doesn't matter whether or not humans *can* call them cowards.<BR>
I can call a potato a carrot, but it doesn't change the fact that it's not a<BR>
carrot.<BR>
<BR>
We're talking about a race in the Traveller universe from outside that<BR>
universe, at least that's my understanding of where Nick and Doug were<BR>
coming from with respect to the Hivers. If somebody came onto the list and<BR>
said, "Aslan enjoy catnip, because they are cats," I would point out that<BR>
Aslan are not cats, they merely look sort of like cats. If somebody were to<BR>
say, "Grandfather has a big white beard and likes to sleep, because my<BR>
grandfather has a big white beard and likes to sleep," I would point out<BR>
that Yaskodray is not a person, but a Droyne. It was mentioned that the<BR>
Hivers are cowards. I merely pointed out that mapping human emotional states<BR>
and concepts onto an alien race strikes me as absurd.<BR>
<BR>
Cowardice is a very specific term, but very broad in application. To say<BR>
that Hivers are cowards means that they lack courage in the face of danger.<BR>
This is not necessarily true, although it may be. They do not engage in<BR>
intimate ground combat, which is quite a different from saying that they're<BR>
cowards.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:59:32 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Benyamene said:<BR>
<BR>
> First off I'll have to put a picture up, and Chris, could I quote some<BR>
> of that last post of yours? Those were some very good points.<BR>
<BR>
No problem, be my guest.<BR>
<BR>
>I don't know much about the Ithklur except their relationship to the<BR>
>Hivers, Is there a picture on the web somewhere?<BR>
<BR>
Not that I know of, but they look something like heavily muscled, bald,<BR>
saurian humanoids. Their culture is intentionally goofy, although I think<BR>
that there was something more going on behind the scenes with them. In the<BR>
TNE Hivers and Ithklur supplement, there was some ambiguity concerning who<BR>
was manipulating who, or at the least whether or not the Hivers were as good<BR>
at manipulation as everyone thought.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 15:03:27 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
<BR>
>I know canon says that magnetic fields (like psi-shield <BR>
>helmets or power stations) can interrupt psionic activity,<BR>
<BR>
>but does it actually nail it down any further than that? <BR>
>Presumeably if they bother building psi-shield helmets a <BR>
>simple Faraday cage won't work?<BR>
<BR>
Maybe a psi shield is a simple Faraday cage with good<BR>
marketing, good timing (during pre-war psi hysteria), and a<BR>
premium price for the extra gullible.  It seems to me that<BR>
the first (and maybe only) canon reference to psi shields<BR>
is an advertisement or a press release by the manufacturer.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send online invitations with Yahoo! Invites.<BR>
http://invites.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:15:25 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
I meant that the psychological factor is the primary factor for hivers not<BR>
engaging in physical combat, rather than a physical factor.<BR>
<BR>
It's true that their aversion to physical combat does not make them cowards,<BR>
but it could make good supporting evidence for someone arguing that point.<BR>
<BR>
What do you see as absurd about labeling aliens with human thought patterns?<BR>
(not saying you're wrong, just interested in your viewpoint on it)<BR>
<BR>
I find it rather useful sometimes.  For instance, I can say to my players<BR>
that the Vilani culture resembles a corporation - resistant to change and<BR>
interested in effeciency and keeping the workers in their place.  I can say<BR>
that Aslan culture resembles fuedal Japan in it's obsession with honor and<BR>
owning land, or that the Zhodani have vaugely russian-islamic overtones.  As<BR>
long as it's not taken to an extreme, it can be quite helpful in giving them<BR>
a some idea of what they're dealing with.<BR>
<BR>
We're not living in the Traveller universe?  I thought that was the whole<BR>
point of one of my earlier threads. :)<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Chris Seamans [mailto:semo@pil.net]<BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2000 3:52 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma said:<BR>
<BR>
>While I don't recall the exact refrences (probably Aliens of the Rim and<BR>
the<BR>
>first TNE novel are where I'm getting the idea), I do seem to recall Hivers<BR>
>described as being psychologically averse to violence.<BR>
<BR>
I've seen it too, so it was probably in Aliens of the Rim at least. From<BR>
what I recall, the idea goes back quite a bit further.<BR>
<BR>
>This means that they avoid hand-to-hand combat because they are<BR>
psychologically<BR>
>incapable of it, not physiologically.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not sure what your point is here. Are you saying that obvious canonical<BR>
physiologically differences are mooted because canon says that they are<BR>
merely psychologically incapable of violence? Why would that be?<BR>
<BR>
It doesn't matter, really, since I said that they look different, and more<BR>
importantly think differently. I've said nothing at all which is<BR>
inconsistent with the notion that the Hivers are psychologically incapable<BR>
of combat. I've merely pointed out that Hivers are not built for the kind of<BR>
combat that we are built for. I would further offer that our understanding<BR>
of intimate ground combat comes from the way that we are built<BR>
physiologically.<BR>
<BR>
>If they're manning (hivering?)automated weapons<BR>
>stations firing at ships or entire cities, they are detatched enough from<BR>
>their opponent to attack, but anything where they can see their enemy is<BR>
too<BR>
>much for them.  So they're a bit more capable of violence than a Pupeteer<BR>
>is.<BR>
<BR>
Incidentally, note that if they are that detached in this fashion, they<BR>
fight via machinery which more than substitutes for their natural<BR>
physiological drawbacks with respect to combat.<BR>
<BR>
> Of course the Hivers don't call it cowardice. They don't call the Ithklur<BR>
>brave either. They probably consider their attitude mature.  That doesn't<BR>
>prevent humans from calling Hiver's cowards.<BR>
<BR>
You're right, with respect to how people and races might refer to each other<BR>
in the Traveller universe. I hope you're not surprised to discover that<BR>
we're not living in the Traveller universe. :)<BR>
<BR>
More importantly, what people in the Third Imperium think of the Hivers, or<BR>
call them, is unimportant. I wasn't talking cultural relativism. I wasn't<BR>
saying, "Oh we shouldn't call those poor Hivers cowards, because they don't<BR>
consider themselves cowards." What I was actually saying, and it seemed that<BR>
I was pretty clear on this, is that they are not cowards, which is very<BR>
different. It doesn't matter whether or not humans *can* call them cowards.<BR>
I can call a potato a carrot, but it doesn't change the fact that it's not a<BR>
carrot.<BR>
<BR>
We're talking about a race in the Traveller universe from outside that<BR>
universe, at least that's my understanding of where Nick and Doug were<BR>
coming from with respect to the Hivers. If somebody came onto the list and<BR>
said, "Aslan enjoy catnip, because they are cats," I would point out that<BR>
Aslan are not cats, they merely look sort of like cats. If somebody were to<BR>
say, "Grandfather has a big white beard and likes to sleep, because my<BR>
grandfather has a big white beard and likes to sleep," I would point out<BR>
that Yaskodray is not a person, but a Droyne. It was mentioned that the<BR>
Hivers are cowards. I merely pointed out that mapping human emotional states<BR>
and concepts onto an alien race strikes me as absurd.<BR>
<BR>
Cowardice is a very specific term, but very broad in application. To say<BR>
that Hivers are cowards means that they lack courage in the face of danger.<BR>
This is not necessarily true, although it may be. They do not engage in<BR>
intimate ground combat, which is quite a different from saying that they're<BR>
cowards.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 02:33:50 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Hivers<BR>
<BR>
>>The Hivers are not cowards.  They manipulate because it's fun.  It's also a<BR>
>>social thing among them, somewhere between winning an Olympic Medal and the<BR>
>>Nobel Prize.  They constantly manipulate themselves, their neighbors, their<BR>
>>clients..<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>They're cowards in the same way that the Puppeteers are though - in that<BR>
>they absolutely won't take any personal risks at all unless forced to. (This<BR>
>is from the TNE background though - dunno if it's at odds with other canon.)<BR>
><BR>
it's as much hyperbole as anything else in H&I, and therefore about<BR>
useless. According to CT, Hivers have a disdain for personal combat. But<BR>
not for ranged combat. And unlike a Pierson's Puppeteer, hivers are<BR>
curiosity driven to TAKE RISKS; personal, social, and economic risks all<BR>
can be found.<BR>
<BR>
H&I really screwed the pooch on it's whole treatment of both species<BR>
covered: the author, upon his statement of something along the lines of<BR>
"Aliens in RPG's can never be more than the man-in-rubber-suit type, so why<BR>
bother?" in the preface. This whole attitude really peaved me at the time,<BR>
and still rubs me wrong, as it's about as foriegn to the methodology of the<BR>
CT Contact! articles and the CT alien modules as you can get without not<BR>
having non-humans. At least with the Ithklur, he'd naught but a one-line<BR>
reference to conflict with.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2356<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 26 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2357<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re Jusice and Nobles<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens <BR>
Re: New & Old<BR>
Re: Guarding the Mail<BR>
Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
Re: GT Lite<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens <BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
RE: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
re:  Opinions Sought<BR>
3rd Attempt at Unsubscribe<BR>
Re: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Opinions sought<BR>
Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 15:30:30 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re Jusice and Nobles<BR>
<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
<BR>
I think you have more nobles than I do; or maybe younger<BR>
sons and daughters of noble families in your Traveller<BR>
universe have more titles than in mine.  <BR>
<BR>
I also have proxies voting in the Moot.  These are<BR>
generally close relatives of the holder of the title that<BR>
holds a seat in the Moot.  <BR>
<BR>
Whether the proxy may also be a seat holder is a matter of<BR>
Moot procedure that swings back and forth historically. <BR>
(That is, the Duke of Regina holds a seat in the Moot; can<BR>
the Duke of Regina also be the proxy of the Duke of<BR>
Aramis?)<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:54:54 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens <BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
>Howeevah Aih must protesst yuir use uv the tehrm 'Mayjor Saix <BR>
>Rayces' witch, as ahl rait thankin Solomani know ais a Vilani <BR>
>(Yuh nootice saix letters thair in Vilani?) terrm. All truue<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Good job the Solomani dropped the 'Terran' tag then... <g><BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:42:31 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: New & Old<BR>
<BR>
>Which rules edition is it for? It is written for T4. The BITS task<BR>
>system is included so it would be easy to convert to CT and MT,<BR>
>slightly harder to convert to TNE (not sure how damage works - Matt,<BR>
>have you looked at this), and I'm not sure of it's relevance to GT<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I have, but only at a formative stage... RL (that's 'Real Life' Derrick...<BR>
<g>) keeps rearing it hydra-like head.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:05:27 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Guarding the Mail<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Leonard Erickson <shadow@krypton.rain.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 26 April 2000 11:06<BR>
Subject: Re: Guarding the Mail<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
>>     The idea that sandcasters create a navigational hazard hadn't<BR>
>> occurred to me, but it seems reasonable.   Hmm... debris from a large<BR>
>> naval battle clutters the system for decades to come...<BR>
><BR>
>Actually, at the speed most Traveller vessels attain, any debris will<BR>
>leave the system in a fairly short time.<BR>
><BR>
>For example, *System* escape velocity at Earth's distance from the sun<BR>
>is less than 40 km/sec. Which is less than 67 minutes at 1g. And when<BR>
>you consider that you are almost certain to be travelling near orbital<BR>
>velocity for Earth, that means you are already moving at over 25<BR>
>km/sec, so you only need 25 minutes at 1g to hit system escape.<BR>
><BR>
>Now consider that turns in combat are 30 minutes and most ships can do<BR>
>better than merely 1 g. :-)<BR>
><BR>
>Debris is mainly a problem when it's in Planetary orbit. Anything<BR>
>orbiting the star has *way* too much space to wander around in. And<BR>
>it'll be *decades* between "close approaches" to the planet(s).<BR>
><BR>
>BTW, this means that Traveller *should* have the occasional incident<BR>
>similar to incident's in C.J. Cherryh's books. You are boosting at max<BR>
>and dodging around to avoid an enemy, and your drive gets taken out.<BR>
>You are moving on a trajectory that will take you out of the system. It<BR>
>could take a while for someone to rendezvous with you. Maybe longer<BR>
>than your life support is good for.<BR>
><BR>
>And don't forget that it doesn't do any good to jump out to where<BR>
>you'll be in a week. Any rescue ship has to not only be in the same<BR>
>place as you, but also has to be moving at the right speed in the right<BR>
>direction.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Well as you stopped accelerating when you drive bought it, the rescue ship<BR>
jumps to where you will be in ten days time, and even with a longer than<BR>
average jump duration it will still have a couple of days of constant<BR>
acceleration to match vectors for an intercept...<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:43:20 +0200<BR>
From: "Julius Waller" <julius@xs4all.nl><BR>
Subject: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
<BR>
No dount this is a newbie question, but one thing which occupied my old<BR>
Traveller group a lot years ago were the coreward expeditions of the<BR>
Zhodani. (You know they have this artifact allowing them to plot a course to<BR>
the Galactic core). Unfortunately my group split before the referee got to<BR>
give us his view about what was Coreward of Zhdant (;-).<BR>
<BR>
Can anyone give me an idea of where the Zhodani got to in their<BR>
explorations. I hate to admit I even lack the oft mentioned reference from<BR>
Security Leak #5 that has most references to the Coreward expeditions 1-8 of<BR>
the Zhodani.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks<BR>
<BR>
Julius<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:55:41 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: GT Lite<BR>
<BR>
Count me in as another 'Yes Please!!!'<BR>
<BR>
I think 16 pages would be fine for home use, as you can hand them out to<BR>
players the week before your game for them to read at their leisure. For<BR>
conventions etc, the BITS 1 page sheet is better.<BR>
<BR>
As to comparisons with Bk0, that cost me hard 'earned' pocket money... A<BR>
free product will undoubtedly have a much larger circulation. After all,<BR>
imagine going to your FLGS as a newbie. You're not really sure what to buy,<BR>
but you pick up this free booklet... A week later you're back with a gleam<BR>
in your eye and GT or the BFB in your sights...<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:00:24 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:29:29 -0400, Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Is it really a preference? After all, the Hivers aren't really built for<BR>
> hand-to-hand combat. I'm not saying this merely to point out that hivers<BR>
> don't have "hands" (appendage-to-appendage combat), but that they just don't<BR>
> appear to be built for the same sort of combat we're built for.<BR>
> <BR>
> They're aliens.<BR>
<BR>
Aliens with ranged weapons that look like snowcones made by Ficher Price...<BR>
<BR>
> Consider the following:<BR>
> <BR>
> - Hivers appear as if they would be relatively ponderous and slow moving.<BR>
> Depending on how slow they are, this makes running across a field avoiding<BR>
> machinegun fire a bit more difficult. This would also make getting away from<BR>
> an opponent in hand to hand combat very difficult.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not too sure about that.  True, Hivers can't "run" according to canon.<BR>
However, they do possess the same movement rates when moving at a "walk" or<BR>
"trot" as most of the other races.  According to TNE anyway.<BR>
<BR>
> - Hivers are ungainly. It would appear that it would be somewhat awkward in<BR>
> turning. The placement of their manipulative appendages is such that it<BR>
> could be very difficult for the poor critters the wheel around, to change<BR>
> facing and direction. This is absolutely essential in both hand-to-hand and<BR>
> ranged combat.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not too sure about that either.  IIRC, Hiver limbs are more dexterous,<BR>
but not as strong as a human.  And I'd think that having six limbs with<BR>
more or less the same "function" would be a benefit, since you wouldn't<BR>
necessarily have to turn to attack an opponent on your flank or at your<BR>
rear.  Horses (and centaurs) don't.<BR>
<BR>
We had a similar discussion when it came to applying Hivers (and Centaurs)<BR>
to ACQ.  Exactly how does a Hiver climb a ladder between starship decks?<BR>
Can a Hiver even pass through an iris valve or hatch designed for humanoid<BR>
use?  Etc.<BR>
<BR>
> - Hivers are relatively big targets. They are effectively the same size from<BR>
> all sides. Due to their bulk, finding appropriate cover could be difficult.<BR>
> Humans can drop to the ground to reduce their profile in the face of missile<BR>
> weapons. Hivers cannot.<BR>
<BR>
They do have a lower center of gravity, however.<BR>
<BR>
> - Hivers are mute. They cannot bark orders to each other. Humans can hear<BR>
> somebody saying something as they look at or do something else. A human can<BR>
> yell "Cover Me!" to his fellow soldiers, and even if they are otherwise<BR>
> occupied, they can hear and respond. In order for a hiver to bark to his<BR>
> comrades "cover me" it would have to use sign language, which would mean<BR>
> that other hivers would have to look at it, which would mean that they<BR>
> couldn't be doing anything else.<BR>
<BR>
They could use technology to help them out here, perhaps a chest-mounted<BR>
apparatus that barks orders when the proper pheromones are released or when<BR>
manipulated via touch.  Slower than speaking, but still possible.<BR>
<BR>
I'm sure that over millions of years of evolution, Hivers have gotten just<BR>
as good as the rest of us at protecting themselves when it comes to combat.<BR>
Granted, that ability may be more slanted towards detecting such a conflict<BR>
before it actually happens.  I'll have to reread the Hiver AM...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Artificial Intelligence usually beats real stupidity.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:10:33 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens <BR>
<BR>
NOTE TO SELF:  Forward these emails to SolSec for review<BR>
and action recommendations.  Are these guys part of our<BR>
propaganda apparatus, or are they just plain nutso?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
<BR>
> head!  The Vargr wer created by teh DROYN and their<BR>
> numberology is 6 and 6!  And tha'ts one way that the<BR>
>DROYNe have TWO races in the Major Six!  <BR>
> --Raoul Gilgamesh Forsythe III<BR>
> Solomani Party Delegate<BR>
<BR>
>Thain the foahmost of Y*sk*dr*y;s deevahn host, jeahlous <BR>
>of teh purrfactun uv weah Solomani,stol the juump draiv <BR>
>und gaiv it tuh thu laissar rayces.<BR>
>Praiz Y*sk*dr*y, AAmahyn!" -<BR>
>response of the Most Reverend Eminence Doctor Emile St.<BR>
>John Prozlowski, head of the First Church of God, Ancient,<BR>
<BR>
>(LunaSynod)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:11:04 -0500<BR>
From: Michael Maley <mmaley@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
In my game I handled the psi shields (helmet or otherwise) by rating<BR>
them in much the way that psi powers are rated by level.   For example,<BR>
a level 5 psi shield could be beaten by a psi of 6 or better.  For a<BR>
shield built into a ship hull the level would be very high.  The<BR>
Imperial warships in my game have a hull psi shield rating starting at<BR>
25.  <BR>
<BR>
Any kind of mechanical psi shield device would have the possibility of<BR>
break down do to damage or lack of maintenance.  For psi shield drugs,<BR>
my feeling is they would probably have the same (or similar) side<BR>
effects that psi drugs have.<BR>
<BR>
darkhstarr<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
> <BR>
> >I know canon says that magnetic fields (like psi-shield<BR>
> >helmets or power stations) can interrupt psionic activity,<BR>
> <BR>
> >but does it actually nail it down any further than that?<BR>
> >Presumeably if they bother building psi-shield helmets a<BR>
> >simple Faraday cage won't work?<BR>
> <BR>
> Maybe a psi shield is a simple Faraday cage with good<BR>
> marketing, good timing (during pre-war psi hysteria), and a<BR>
> premium price for the extra gullible.  It seems to me that<BR>
> the first (and maybe only) canon reference to psi shields<BR>
> is an advertisement or a press release by the manufacturer.<BR>
> <BR>
> --Glenn<BR>
> <BR>
> __________________________________________________<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:25:56 -0700<BR>
From: "Tod Glenn" <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: RE: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
A picked household guard equal to scum soldiers officered by snooty noble<BR>
military academy graduates?<BR>
[snip]<BR>
The FFL is an unusual artifact of a balkanized world at a particular point<BR>
in history. I think it would more likely appear in relation to individual<BR>
Imperial worlds especially those of French-Solomani descent and possibly<BR>
with Vargr. Other races within the Traveller canon do not seem likely to<BR>
support such a group for cultural reasons.<BR>
<BR>
The foreign legion is more than 'scum led by gentlemen'  that quote is<BR>
usually attributed to the Duke of Wellington describing the British army, by<BR>
the way.<BR>
<BR>
The Legion, historically has been populated by defeated soldiers from the<BR>
last war, criminals, adventurers and those just wanting to disappear.  Not<BR>
to mention soldiers of conscience.  After WWII, the legion was often<BR>
described as being only as strong as its weakest German legionnaire.<BR>
Notable legionaries include poet Alan Seeger and Cole Porter to name a<BR>
couple.  When a legionnaire joins, he is granted a nom de guerre.  Family or<BR>
others looking for him will be turned away.  His legion identity begins when<BR>
he joins, and ends when he dies. The legion is a refuge for the 'lost' who<BR>
find a sense of belonging.  This is what makes the legionnaire such an<BR>
excellent fighter. Soldiers may claim to fight for an ideal, or a cause, but<BR>
studies show that morale depends on the forming of small, close knit groups,<BR>
and soldiers take part in the wretched business of combat for their buddies.<BR>
The legion merely removes the veneer.  Troopers swear an oath, not to<BR>
France, but to the legion, and fight for their fellow legionnaires.<BR>
<BR>
A legion in the Imperium?  perhaps not a foreign one, but certainly some<BR>
sort of all volunteer force with lots of history and romance, populated by<BR>
tough hombres and intellectuals banded together as brothers, and useful to<BR>
the Imperium or local Duke for there lack of connection to anyone outside<BR>
the legion.  An it may be used with little public outcry, for as one<BR>
legionnaire noted 'who will miss us?'  Just the thing for dirty little wars.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:53:09 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
>From: Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com><BR>
><BR>
>How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<BR>
I thought Book 0: Introduction to Traveller was very useful<BR>
for new players, and so was the little red and black<BR>
pamphlet that was an even more basic introduction.  So I'm<BR>
in favor of GT Lite.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:57:19 -0400<BR>
From: William Louis Cusick <maldeus@olg.com><BR>
Subject: 3rd Attempt at Unsubscribe<BR>
<BR>
Hi, could someone tell me the exact method of unsubscribing?  I've tried<BR>
twice now to no avail.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks,<BR>
Bill<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:00:50 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
<BR>
With only a 2 in 18 chance of rolling for more<BR>
Psionic skill, 3 in 24 if Edu8+, not a whole lot<BR>
of likelihood that these guys are too intimidating,<BR>
or even competent.<BR>
<BR>
With T4, 4 in 36 is still pretty weak for psionic<BR>
skills.<BR>
<BR>
Altogether, as constructed, its fairly likely that<BR>
most members of the Order will not have<BR>
Psionics at all, and not much Sabre either.<BR>
<BR>
Nice light saber . .  er plasma stick.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
[snip]<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:00:05<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
At 04:29 PM 4/26/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Remember, you're talking to someone who lives in San Francisco and who is<BR>
>not phased in the slightest that the majority of his state could slide off<BR>
>into the ocean at any moment. :)<BR>
<BR>
The San Andreas Fault runs west of where I live, and three miles out to<BR>
sea.  All the Big One on that fault line will do is rearrange LA.  The<BR>
Hayward Fault, on the other hand...<BR>
<BR>
>So yeah, maybe the Hiver don't fix bayonets and jab away or wrestle with the<BR>
>K'Kree in the trenches (which would be a humorous sight, I imagine), but<BR>
>they do fight in some sense of the word.<BR>
<BR>
Every reference stats that Hivers don't like to fight, but will.  We have<BR>
examples of Hiver weaponry after all.<BR>
<BR>
They're like Pat Buchanan, whip a war and then send somebody else to fight<BR>
it. :)<BR>
<BR>
>Is it really a preference? After all, the Hivers aren't really built for<BR>
>hand-to-hand combat. I'm not saying this merely to point out that hivers<BR>
>don't have "hands" (appendage-to-appendage combat), but that they just don't<BR>
>appear to be built for the same sort of combat we're built for.<BR>
<BR>
I don't know, a low to the ground, very stable creature that can strike in<BR>
any direction, and can see in a 360 circle?  I think that Hivers may be<BR>
better at "hand  to hand" that we might think.  <BR>
<BR>
>They're aliens.<BR>
><BR>
>They look differently, and more importantly think differently. It seems<BR>
>absurd to map human concepts or emotional states, such as cowardice, onto<BR>
>the Hivers. I think even the notion that the Hivers "prefer" not to engage<BR>
>in close combat is a little bizarre. It seems to me to be like saying that<BR>
>humans prefer not to fly without the aid of machinery. Consider the<BR>
>following:<BR>
><BR>
>- Hivers appear as if they would be relatively ponderous and slow moving.<BR>
<BR>
So does an alligator.  Ever see one run?<BR>
<BR>
>Depending on how slow they are, this makes running across a field avoiding<BR>
>machinegun fire a bit more difficult. This would also make getting away from<BR>
>an opponent in hand to hand combat very difficult.<BR>
<BR>
<ex-solidier>one does not run to avoid machinegun fire, one hugs dirt and<BR>
invents new religions to avoid machinegun fire.</ex-soldier><BR>
<BR>
I'm not saying that they'd be like human soldiers, but there early wars<BR>
would have been against fellow Hivers (if they had any), and the equipment,<BR>
tactics, ex cetera, would develop from their limitations and advantages.<BR>
<BR>
>- Hivers are ungainly. It would appear that it would be somewhat awkward in<BR>
>turning. The placement of their manipulative appendages is such that it<BR>
>could be very difficult for the poor critters the wheel around, to change<BR>
>facing and direction. This is absolutely essential in both hand-to-hand and<BR>
>ranged combat.<BR>
<BR>
As noted above, they have eyes on stalks for 360 vision, and have five<BR>
hands available for use.  I've never seen any statements that they are slow<BR>
or ungainly, in fact I don't recall them having a DEX penalty in character<BR>
generation.<BR>
<BR>
Where you see bulk, I see something akin to a Komodo Dragon.  These puppies<BR>
are sloth-slow, until they *need* to move quickly, and then they can move<BR>
like lightning.<BR>
<BR>
>- Hivers are relatively big targets. They are effectively the same size from<BR>
>all sides. Due to their bulk, finding appropriate cover could be difficult.<BR>
>Humans can drop to the ground to reduce their profile in the face of missile<BR>
>weapons. Hivers cannot.<BR>
<BR>
Hivers are already low to the ground, being only about a meter tall to<BR>
begin with.  Also, Hivers don't have to expose their brains to observe the<BR>
battlefield.  They just raise an eye or two.<BR>
><BR>
>- Hivers are mute. They cannot bark orders to each other. Humans can hear<BR>
>somebody saying something as they look at or do something else. A human can<BR>
>yell "Cover Me!" to his fellow soldiers, and even if they are otherwise<BR>
>occupied, they can hear and respond. In order for a hiver to bark to his<BR>
>comrades "cover me" it would have to use sign language, which would mean<BR>
>that other hivers would have to look at it, which would mean that they<BR>
>couldn't be doing anything else.<BR>
<BR>
Soldiers use hand signals.  I've done entire missions under complete<BR>
silence orders.  What you see as "mute" is just normal for Hivers.  Off the<BR>
top of my head, I'd imagine that Hiver infantry and armor relay heavily on<BR>
set battle tactics.  Then again, you have those six mobile eyes.  Spare a<BR>
couple to watch your squaddies, the rest to the front, except for the one<BR>
guarding the rear.<BR>
<BR>
>Now, assuming that the Hivers *prefer* not to fight in close combat, can it<BR>
>really be called cowardice? Cowardice is, after all, the lack of courage in<BR>
>the face of danger. Assuming that Hivers have a notion such as courage in<BR>
>the first place, which would be necessary for them to be considered cowards,<BR>
>is such a preference unreasonable? They're not built for combat as we know<BR>
>combat. For a hiver to engage in combat the way we understand it would not<BR>
>necessarily be courage, but a certain form of stupidity, or some sort of<BR>
>desire for self-destruction.<BR>
<BR>
Your letting your human perceptions overtake you.  Hivers have bladed<BR>
weapons, so they do fight.<BR>
<BR>
They just prefer to do it from a nice clean starship and leave the mucking<BR>
about in the mud and blood to the Ithklur.  Having been a PBI, I can't say<BR>
I blame them.<BR>
<BR>
>Of course, if they don't have an emotional state such as courage, it's<BR>
>obviously a moot point because they are incapable of being cowards (they<BR>
>would always be equally courageous, or equally cowardly).<BR>
<BR>
They're sentient creatures! Of course they have courage and cowardice.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry   Templar Agent at Large.<BR>
gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
<BR>
TravGeekCode: <BR>
tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>
ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>
         <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:01:41<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
At 02:46 PM 4/26/2000 -0600, you wrote:<BR>
>While I don't recall the exact refrences (probably Aliens of the Rim and the<BR>
>first TNE novel are where I'm getting the idea), I do seem to recall Hivers<BR>
>described as being psychologically averse to violence.  This means that they<BR>
>avoid hand-to-hand combat because they are psychologically incapable of it,<BR>
>not physiologically. <BR>
<BR>
Adverse does not mean unable.  Humans are have an adverse reaction to great<BR>
heights.  But the 82nd Airborne Division has over 10,000 people who make<BR>
their living jumping out of airplanes.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:29:40 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
On 04/25/00 at 11:44 AM,  "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
>As for Traveller, how do people give assurance of telling the truth?<BR>
>Quasi-religious oaths still or just assurances?<BR>
<BR>
"Just a little prick..."<BR>
<BR>
"Ah!"<BR>
<BR>
"The witness is ready to answer questions now your honor."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 17:04:25<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions sought<BR>
<BR>
At 04:07 PM 4/26/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>>  AOL!  And can I have it by May 26th?<BR>
><BR>
>Just in time for my Birthday present?<BR>
<BR>
Sure, come to the BayCon party, and you'll get one.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 10:36:42 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <BR>
> ><<  What would be an equivalent unit to the Foriegn<BR>
>  Legion in the 3I? >><BR>
> <BR>
> The Duke's Huscarles? (and I've always wished Marc or Loren called him<BR>
> the Black Duke because it sounds so cool...)<BR>
> <BR>
> A picked household guard equal to scum soldiers officered by snooty noble<BR>
> military academy graduates?<BR>
> I wouldn't think so.<BR>
<BR>
Think "Swiss Guard".<BR>
<BR>
> Other than certain mercenary units, I don't think any unit has been<BR>
> described that comes close to the FFL in the Imperium. I am not sure such<BR>
> a unit would even be needed given the nature of the Imperium.  Who would<BR>
> be in it? Exatriate Solomani? Fteirle outcasts? Omnivorous K'kree? Vargr<BR>
> corsairs recruited for the moment? Anti-social Zhodani? A horde of Droyne<BR>
> krinaytsoyni? A Hiver who manipulated himself? Even people from Imperial<BR>
> allied Client States would likely just be invited to join the regular<BR>
> forces if anything.<BR>
<BR>
Non-humans and humans aren't easy to mix into a single unit.  <BR>
<BR>
I suspect that each such unit will have its own story.  In some cases, they<BR>
may be the remnants of some destroyed Client State's army which has been<BR>
taken into Imperial service.  Or they may be the descendants of a mercenary<BR>
regiment raised for the Imperium in the Second Frontier War, who performed<BR>
so well that they were brought onto the regular payroll.  Perhaps a world<BR>
of pacifists raises mercenaries to serve the Imperium in place of their own<BR>
people.  Or...<BR>
<BR>
It could be that most such units are actually parts of world militaries,<BR>
rather than Imperial<BR>
forces, too.  The Imperial forces themselves have a little element of<BR>
"foreign" unit themselves, in that the Imperium is a remote institution,<BR>
with little direct influence on most of its subjects' lives.<BR>
<BR>
> The FFL is an unusual artifact of a balkanized world at a particular<BR>
> point in history. I think it would more likely appear in relation to<BR>
> individual Imperial worlds especially those of French-Solomani descent<BR>
> and possibly with Vargr. Other races within the Traveller canon do not<BR>
> seem likely to support such a group for cultural reasons.<BR>
<BR>
Even on Earth today, there are other "Regular Mercenary"/"Foreign" units: <BR>
the Papal Swiss Guard, and the Gurkhas, for example.  Other similar units<BR>
existed not so long ago:  Spain had a Foreign Legion (Franco served as an<BR>
officer in it), while Nazi Germany had a load of "foreign" SS Divisions.<BR>
<BR>
As far as other groups in Traveller canon using "foreign" troops:  I can't<BR>
see any reason why they shouldn't.  The Hivers use non-Hiver units all over<BR>
the place.  The whole Ithklur military is more or less the Hiver Foreign<BR>
Legion.  I suspect that the K'kree could use non-K'kree vehicle and fighter<BR>
crews recruited from the minor races within the Two Thousand Worlds, and<BR>
(rarely) even beyond.  Aslan clans might well have human subjects, and<BR>
there is no good reason why they might not hire human mercenaries, provided<BR>
the latter are willing to approximate the Aslan codes of honour.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:59:34 EDT<BR>
From: RvKsword@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/26/00 5:48:06 PM Central Daylight Time, julius@xs4all.nl <BR>
writes:<BR>
<BR>
> No dount this is a newbie question, but one thing which occupied my old<BR>
>  Traveller group a lot years ago were the coreward expeditions of the<BR>
>  Zhodani. (You know they have this artifact allowing them to plot a course <BR>
to<BR>
>  the Galactic core). Unfortunately my group split before the referee got to<BR>
>  give us his view about what was Coreward of Zhdant (;-).<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Can anyone give me an idea of where the Zhodani got to in their<BR>
>  explorations. I hate to admit I even lack the oft mentioned reference from<BR>
>  Security Leak #5 that has most references to the Coreward expeditions 1-8 <BR>
of<BR>
>  the Zhodani.<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
  Okay now I'm sure THIS qualifies as a newbie question but what exactly is <BR>
this "oft mentioned reference" from Security Leak #5?  (Hell whats "Security <BR>
Leak #5" for that matter?)<BR>
<BR>
Thanx<BR>
<BR>
RvK<BR>
v^v^v  "But...but...but..you SAID I could blow it up!  How was I to know the <BR>
client was still inside?"  v^v^v<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:24:45 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
On 04/26/00 at 09:17 AM,  "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
>Puppeteers moved their entire solar system out of the galaxy because of a<BR>
>threat that would hit this area in 30,000 years.  That's cowardice.<BR>
<BR>
No, that's foresight. <g>  <BR>
<BR>
I won't dispute that they are *precieved* as cowardly, though. But who are the models we have for that...admitedly *insane* Pupperteers. <g><BR>
<BR>
>The hivers fought a ar against the K'Kree, and won.  <BR>
<BR>
Um, well yes, but not a war in the conventional sense.  The Hiver version of war is highly psychological, and if it gets down to the "dirty bits" they have clients for that.<BR>
<BR>
>Canon also states<BR>
>that Hivers crew Federation warships, something a Pupeteer would never<BR>
>do.<BR>
<BR>
Not a sane one, no. <BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2357<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2358</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest     Wednesday, April 26 2000     Volume 1999 : Number 2358<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Niven's Outsiders (was Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
RE: GT Lite<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Speaking of Major Races....<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: SJG Lite<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
I've Seen the Economic Light<BR>
Re: expert witnesses (OT)<BR>
Re: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:28:21 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Niven's Outsiders (was Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
<BR>
On 04/26/00 at 10:57 AM,  Russell Bornschlegel <kaleja@estarcion.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
>> Frankly, I don't see that Hivers are _anything_ like Outsiders, because<BR>
>> Outsiders are really strange, whereas Hiver's aren't, <BR>
<BR>
>Hivers aren't really strange?<BR>
<BR>
Nah, HIvers are a lot like some Professors I know. <g><BR>
<BR>
OTOH, Outsiders *are* really strange. Thanks for reminding me about the Known Space stories. I haven't reread them for several years now, so I'll be able to enjoy them all over again when I pull them out this summer. <BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 20:32:23 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
On 04/26/00 at 07:05 PM,  "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk> said:<BR>
<BR>
> They then used that to bluff<BR>
>the rest of the K'Kree that they could do it to them all. The K'Kree,<BR>
>ever concerned with racial purity, backed off and never messed with the<BR>
>Hivers again.<BR>
<BR>
Who says it's a bluff? <g><BR>
<BR>
The Darrians are bluffing. The Hivers just provided  a small object lesson of what they *could* do.<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 21:35:25 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
<BR>
Point thy browser to yon www.securityleak.net !<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: <RvKsword@aol.com><BR>
>   Okay now I'm sure THIS qualifies as a newbie question but what exactly<BR>
is<BR>
> this "oft mentioned reference" from Security Leak #5?  (Hell whats<BR>
"Security<BR>
> Leak #5" for that matter?)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 18:41:46 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: GT Lite<BR>
<BR>
Just wanted to say "THANKS!!" to everyone that's said they wanted cover art<BR>
by me for the product.  That means a lot to me that a good deal of<BR>
respondents said that.<BR>
<BR>
I've said it before, and I'll say it again.  The TML's the best!<BR>
<BR>
Very Best,<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 21:35:44 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
Boy are there fans of the FFL around here.<BR>
:)<BR>
<BR>
>Maybe you're right that no unit within the OTU has yet been described that<BR>
equates to the FFL, at least as described above (as I've pointed out<BR>
elsewhere my knowledge of canon is very rusty).  However, I can see no real<BR>
reason why a picked household guard might not be selected from a larger<BR>
regiment / unit (used in its European / British meaning) of a FFL type.<BR>
Unusual, but not unbelievable!<<BR>
<BR>
My main point was I wouldn't pick my Household Guard from a group held  in<BR>
such low regard as the FFL is by the French. (If not the TML.) Comparing to<BR>
some of the examples you gave, the Roman and Byzantine Germanic and Norse<BR>
mercenaries were considered significantly more reliable than native units<BR>
and much less likely to try and revolt or murder the Emperor for whatever<BR>
reason. Even when they were slaves they were held in higher esteem. Likewise<BR>
with the Janissaries and Mamelukes  of the Ottomans. Compare this with the<BR>
Penal/Ost battalions of the Germans and similar groups used by the Soviets<BR>
in WW II. None of them were ever found guarding the heads of state.<BR>
Similarly, I don't the FFL or future versions of them being used to do so.<BR>
<BR>
>As far as the FFL is concerned, because they have always been recruited<BR>
from<BR>
Foreigners they have (to a degree) always been regarded by French<BR>
governments as 'expendable'.  Hence they are often placed in the hardest /<BR>
harshest operational theatres and have suffered accordingly.  That doesn't<BR>
mean that they aren't good fighting soldiers, just poorly used by the<BR>
generals.<<BR>
<BR>
It does mean that training beyond learning to do whatever their St. Cyr<BR>
officers tell them to do is not a major concern. And that does produce<BR>
inferior soldiers. This would be different from being individually effective<BR>
fighters and also separate from being superior warriors.<BR>
<BR>
>To get back to Traveller, the scope for unusual military units given the<BR>
number of different species, races and cultures would be even more varied<BR>
than on Terra<<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
I agree. I am just saying that I don't see the particular dynamics for a FFL<BR>
being in place. But Gurkha type units for example would be more than likely.<BR>
<BR>
>I created an organization years ago for the 3i simply called the Imperial<BR>
Legion.<<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
OK, but that technically isn't a Foreign legion. That is the main aspect I<BR>
find impossible.<BR>
<BR>
>The foreign legion is more than 'scum led by gentlemen'  that quote is<BR>
usually attributed to the Duke of Wellington describing the British army, by<BR>
the way.<<BR>
<BR>
*shrug*<BR>
I think we may be seeing a bit of a clash of romantic views here. See, I'm a<BR>
big fan of Kipling, so I say screw the officer and bring on Tommy Atkins. As<BR>
for the FFL, enough reruns of Beau Geste!<BR>
<BR>
>A legion in the Imperium?  perhaps not a foreign one, but certainly some<BR>
sort of all volunteer force with lots of history and romance, populated by<BR>
tough hombres and intellectuals banded together as brothers, and useful to<BR>
the Imperium or local Duke for there lack of connection to anyone outside<BR>
the legion.  An it may be used with little public outcry, for as one<BR>
legionnaire noted 'who will miss us?'  Just the thing for dirty little<BR>
wars.<<BR>
<BR>
A legion for the expendable scum no doubt. As for intellectuals wanting to<BR>
play games or Gentleman Rankers, I'd suggest merc units or the Regular Army.<BR>
<BR>
>Think "Swiss Guard".<<BR>
<BR>
I can't. The reason the Swiss Guard only gets to guard the Pope is the rest<BR>
of Europe was so damn afraid of them. These are the people who have the lion<BR>
sleeping by the pool because of their self control. A bunch of gaol<BR>
scrapings and remittance men? I don't think so.<BR>
<BR>
>As far as other groups in Traveller canon using "foreign" troops:  I can't<BR>
see any reason why they shouldn't.  The Hivers use non-Hiver units all over<BR>
the place.  The whole Ithklur military is more or less the Hiver Foreign<BR>
Legion.  I suspect that the K'kree could use non-K'kree vehicle and fighter<BR>
crews recruited from the minor races within the Two Thousand Worlds, and<BR>
(rarely) even beyond.  Aslan clans might well have human subjects, and<BR>
there is no good reason why they might not hire human mercenaries, provided<BR>
the latter are willing to approximate the Aslan codes of honour.<<BR>
<BR>
Hivers would build more robots.<BR>
K'kree wouldn't let others use weapons. (That may be canon.)<BR>
Fteirle wouldn't turn away from the criminal backgrounds of people like in<BR>
the FFL.<BR>
Vargr wouldn't notice the difference between their own units enough for it<BR>
to be worthy of comment.<BR>
Zhodani wouldn't period.<BR>
Droyne would though, I'll give you that. Once they go to war they would use<BR>
all assets available, including non-Droyne they could get to die for them.<BR>
Vilani would only when in decline. otherwise, their caste structure wouldn't<BR>
support such people being recognized at all.<BR>
Solomani would. Especially if it involved non party members.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 21:50:52 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>Cowardice is, after all, the lack of courage in the face of danger. <<BR>
<BR>
Cowardice is doing what is Wrong because it easier. Courage is doing what is<BR>
Right despite your fear. (Please note the use of capitals in the preceding.)<BR>
Simply lacking courage is not being cowardly. As well, recall that a<BR>
rational army would run away. (Even if I am forgetting who said that.<BR>
Anybody?) Indeed, I think if you ask any warrior if he LIKES to go into a<BR>
firefight he will give you a look as though you were less than sane. (Or<BR>
assume you are trying to be insulting. I assume no responsibility for any<BR>
field testing of this in such cases.)<BR>
I would say Hivers have come to the same conclusion I have regarding the<BR>
definition of a "Fair Fight". That is, any fight at the end of which nothing<BR>
on me hurts. If that means I get a nuke and a starship and you get to stand<BR>
naked on an asteroid the solution is for you to leave me in peace.Hivers<BR>
cowardly? No, just not caught up with silliness.<BR>
Now to a Fteirle who'd rather be dead, this seems like cowardice of the<BR>
worst sort.  The Hivers reciprocate by seeing the Fteirle as close to<BR>
hopeless for ever being civilized.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:11:56 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Speaking of Major Races....<BR>
<BR>
Here is a nicely warped thought.<BR>
We have the Fteirle being found out as not really being a Major Race. What<BR>
if some of the others were found out?<BR>
The Zhodani and Vilani both had definite Ancient artifacts all over their<BR>
homeworlds. The Vargr likewise.<BR>
The Solomani? Area 51 dudes, the Vilani and/or Vegans are already here!<BR>
The Droyne really got theirs from stuff Yaskoydray let them have. He really<BR>
wasn't a true Droyne anyway.<BR>
That leaves the K'Kree and the Hivers.<BR>
Suppose a Hiver Manipulator wanted his people to form an interstellar<BR>
government? He picks up one day and heads Coreward until he finds  a violent<BR>
race engaged in a genocidal war upon their neighbors in the solar system.<BR>
Knowing the basic stellar layout (telescopes can tell us where rifts are<BR>
even now) and knowing they will eventually expand towards Hiver space, he<BR>
seeds Jump technology among the soon to be extinct victims of their madness,<BR>
then heads home to record his future triumph.<BR>
Several hundred years later, the Hiver-K'kree War begins.<BR>
Which leaves only our radial friends, who we happen to know developed an<BR>
inferior Jump drive before making a true Jump Drive.<BR>
Indeed, let us go back to the Droyne and Yaskoydray. We know he made<BR>
teleporters and such and that the Droyne under him and his children and<BR>
grandchildren used many alternative technologies, perhaps he never even used<BR>
Jump Drive!<BR>
So that's the real secret of the Major Races. Hivers are the only true Major<BR>
Race. One of them gave it to the K'Kree. Yaskoydray used time travel to snag<BR>
it for the Droyne incidentally planting it for the Zhodani, Vilani and Vargr<BR>
to salvage. The Solomani got it from the Vilani and the Fteirle got it from<BR>
the Solomani.<BR>
I knew it!<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:18:16 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma said:<BR>
<BR>
>I meant that the psychological factor is the primary factor for hivers not<BR>
>engaging in physical combat, rather than a physical factor.<BR>
<BR>
Fair enough. It could be seen as a question of "which came first, the<BR>
chicken or the egg?".<BR>
<BR>
>It's true that their aversion to physical combat does not make them<BR>
cowards,<BR>
>but it could make good supporting evidence for someone arguing that point.<BR>
<BR>
Well it depends. I can certainly see them being characterized that way by<BR>
other sentients in known space.<BR>
<BR>
>What do you see as absurd about labeling aliens with human thought<BR>
patterns?<BR>
>(not saying you're wrong, just interested in your viewpoint on it)<BR>
<BR>
Because I find it absurd to map human emotional states on most people I<BR>
meet. :)<BR>
<BR>
Seriously though, this is largely because I've been introduced to the<BR>
writings of folks like Walter J. Ong, Eric A. Havelock, Lewis Mumford and<BR>
Neil Postman. Ong has written quite a bit on primary oral cultures (cultures<BR>
which communicate solely through vocalization), Havelock has written quite a<BR>
bit on the transition from orality to literacy, Mumford has written quite a<BR>
bit on the changes which "civilization" brings to societies and the way<BR>
people think about things and Postman has written extensively on the<BR>
transition from literacy to the electronic age. I've seen enough evidence to<BR>
convince me that human thought processes here on earth are anything but<BR>
stable.<BR>
<BR>
I honestly don't want to get into a discussion concerning this at the moment<BR>
(especially considering the fact that I've just finished a paper concerning<BR>
some of the above topics), but it should be sufficient to say that I don't<BR>
believe that all people at all times share the same way of thinking.<BR>
<BR>
>I find it rather useful sometimes.  For instance, I can say to my players<BR>
>that the Vilani culture resembles a corporation - resistant to change and<BR>
>interested in effeciency and keeping the workers in their place.  I can say<BR>
>that Aslan culture resembles fuedal Japan in it's obsession with honor and<BR>
>owning land, or that the Zhodani have vaugely russian-islamic overtones.<BR>
As<BR>
>long as it's not taken to an extreme, it can be quite helpful in giving<BR>
them<BR>
>a some idea of what they're dealing with.<BR>
<BR>
Such comparisons are certainly handy for a quick introduction to a society,<BR>
especially when this introduction is given to players. Such<BR>
characterizations may reflect the kind of things that folks in the Imperium<BR>
think about each other, similar to the kinds of things which East Coast<BR>
types think of folks in California, or Southerners think of Northerners, or<BR>
Germans of English, or whatever. These quick characterizations frequently<BR>
catch the spirit of a group, but are usually wrong in some very serious<BR>
ways.<BR>
<BR>
I don't think that the races themselves should be taken a little more<BR>
seriously. Many sci-fi books, films and television shows roll out a<BR>
stereotype for their aliens and simply leave it at that. Traveller has<BR>
always been different in this respect, and I happen to think that this<BR>
approach is superior. The reason is simple, I enjoy building and tweaking<BR>
cultures in my own Traveller campaigns, and I enjoy being able to experiment<BR>
with the process and attempting to figure out how alien cultures might<BR>
develop. The richness of the alien races (even in their short descriptions<BR>
in Contact) really shines, and this is what attracted me to Traveller in the<BR>
first place.<BR>
<BR>
>We're not living in the Traveller universe?  I thought that was the whole<BR>
>point of one of my earlier threads. :)<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, but the whole point of my earlier responses was that I disagree. :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:32:47 EDT<BR>
From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: SJG Lite<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/26/00 6:28:56 PM Pacific Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> >>  AOL!  And can I have it by May 26th?<BR>
>  ><BR>
>  >Just in time for my Birthday present?<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Sure, come to the BayCon party, and you'll get one.<BR>
<BR>
Actually I already have most of it, Clay's 'History of the Imperium'. About <BR>
the only thing that needs inclusion on it are the Major race descriptions and <BR>
a map.<BR>
<BR>
Regretfully SJG won't be able to use this material because of their copyright <BR>
problems.<BR>
<BR>
Bryan<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 14:34:49 +1200<BR>
From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" <a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
On 26 Apr 00, at 10:21, Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Gentlebeings,<BR>
<BR>
> How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<BR>
I'll take 3 and can I have them tommorrow?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:59:14 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
James W. Lindsay said:<BR>
<BR>
>> Is it really a preference? After all, the Hivers aren't really built for<BR>
>> hand-to-hand combat. I'm not saying this merely to point out that hivers<BR>
>> don't have "hands" (appendage-to-appendage combat), but that they just<BR>
don't<BR>
>> appear to be built for the same sort of combat we're built for.<BR>
>><BR>
>> They're aliens.<BR>
><BR>
>Aliens with ranged weapons that look like snowcones made by Ficher Price...<BR>
<BR>
Okay, fair enough. They do have ranged reapons. However, "Library Data<BR>
(A-M)", the MT "Imperial Encyclopedia", and the "Aliens for Traveller Draft<BR>
Material all contain the following statement:<BR>
<BR>
"The navy is the main instrument of military force. Hivers came late to the<BR>
concept of war and are more comfortable with high-technology, long-range<BR>
violence, disliking the personal approach of ground combat. When ground<BR>
forces are absolutely needed, other races of the Federation generally supply<BR>
the troops. Federation armed forces are essentially a deterrent force, and<BR>
are seldom used as an instrument of policy."<BR>
<BR>
I'm wondering why it is that the Hivers came late to the "concept of war".<BR>
Note that this is mentioned in the entry for the Federation Navy, which was<BR>
started *after* they discovered other races. I've always been under the<BR>
impression that ground combat was completely alien to them because, for<BR>
whatever reason, they never had a need for it. Even the way that the navy is<BR>
applied suggests to me that they still don't have much interest in war.<BR>
<BR>
>> Consider the following:<BR>
>><BR>
>> - Hivers appear as if they would be relatively ponderous and slow moving.<BR>
>> Depending on how slow they are, this makes running across a field<BR>
avoiding<BR>
>> machinegun fire a bit more difficult. This would also make getting away<BR>
from<BR>
>> an opponent in hand to hand combat very difficult.<BR>
><BR>
>I'm not too sure about that.  True, Hivers can't "run" according to canon.<BR>
>However, they do possess the same movement rates when moving at a "walk" or<BR>
>"trot" as most of the other races.  According to TNE anyway.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, but they still can't *run*, which means that when short bursts of<BR>
speed are required, they just don't have the ability, which is a major<BR>
problem. Someone moving at a trot is much easier to hit than someone moving<BR>
at a full sprint.<BR>
<BR>
>> - Hivers are ungainly. It would appear that it would be somewhat awkward<BR>
in<BR>
>> turning. The placement of their manipulative appendages is such that it<BR>
>> could be very difficult for the poor critters the wheel around, to change<BR>
>> facing and direction. This is absolutely essential in both hand-to-hand<BR>
and<BR>
>> ranged combat.<BR>
><BR>
>I'm not too sure about that either.  IIRC, Hiver limbs are more dexterous,<BR>
>but not as strong as a human.  And I'd think that having six limbs with<BR>
>more or less the same "function" would be a benefit, since you wouldn't<BR>
>necessarily have to turn to attack an opponent on your flank or at your<BR>
>rear.  Horses (and centaurs) don't.<BR>
<BR>
The limbs may be dextrous, but unless I see a Hiver in action, I won't be<BR>
convinced that they would not be awkward in combat. Just because the six<BR>
limbs can be used as arms or legs doesn't mean that this would be<BR>
comfortable or desirable. It appears that, for all intents and purposes,<BR>
they walk on four limbs (at least this is how they are always illustrated).<BR>
I'm trying to imagine *how* they would wield weapons, and it seems<BR>
difficult.<BR>
<BR>
The dexterity of hiver limbs is somewhat interesting too. If it reflects<BR>
fine motor skills, this would not be particularly useful in hand to hand<BR>
combat, if it reflects a certain sort of quickness with the tentacles, it<BR>
may or may not be useful in ranged combat, depending on the situation. I<BR>
suspect it doesn't reflect the quickness of the tentacles, as they can't<BR>
run, and they use the same limbs to do so.<BR>
<BR>
The best I can come up with is that they would use their "rear" hand (the<BR>
one opposite the head) to grip a weapon, but their lower strength and<BR>
bizarre form might make using such a weapon effectively somewhat difficult.<BR>
<BR>
>We had a similar discussion when it came to applying Hivers (and Centaurs)<BR>
>to ACQ.  Exactly how does a Hiver climb a ladder between starship decks?<BR>
>Can a Hiver even pass through an iris valve or hatch designed for humanoid<BR>
>use?  Etc.<BR>
<BR>
It makes sense that such things would come up.<BR>
<BR>
>> - Hivers are relatively big targets. They are effectively the same size<BR>
from<BR>
>> all sides. Due to their bulk, finding appropriate cover could be<BR>
difficult.<BR>
>> Humans can drop to the ground to reduce their profile in the face of<BR>
missile<BR>
>> weapons. Hivers cannot.<BR>
><BR>
>They do have a lower center of gravity, however.<BR>
<BR>
Fair enough. So they have something going for them. :)<BR>
<BR>
On the other hand, their central bulk is "solid". I'm not sure how well it<BR>
would stand up to impact.<BR>
<BR>
>> - Hivers are mute. They cannot bark orders to each other. Humans can hear<BR>
>> somebody saying something as they look at or do something else. A human<BR>
can<BR>
>> yell "Cover Me!" to his fellow soldiers, and even if they are otherwise<BR>
>> occupied, they can hear and respond. In order for a hiver to bark to his<BR>
>> comrades "cover me" it would have to use sign language, which would mean<BR>
>> that other hivers would have to look at it, which would mean that they<BR>
>> couldn't be doing anything else.<BR>
><BR>
>They could use technology to help them out here, perhaps a chest-mounted<BR>
>apparatus that barks orders when the proper pheromones are released or when<BR>
>manipulated via touch.  Slower than speaking, but still possible.<BR>
<BR>
They could do this after they develop such a technology, I wouldn't deny<BR>
that. However, it is a drawback.<BR>
<BR>
>I'm sure that over millions of years of evolution, Hivers have gotten just<BR>
>as good as the rest of us at protecting themselves when it comes to combat.<BR>
>Granted, that ability may be more slanted towards detecting such a conflict<BR>
>before it actually happens.  I'll have to reread the Hiver AM...<BR>
<BR>
I'm not sure about this. Everything I've read about seems to indicate that<BR>
they don't involve themselves in ground combat at all, and there is good<BR>
reason to believe that the entire concept of war was alien to them for a<BR>
huge chunk of their history. Further, the internal policy of the Hive<BR>
Federation is based around the (scientific) manipulation of the member<BR>
races, as well as their neighbors. Hivers defend themselves by making sure<BR>
that no one around them has an interest in beating the snot out of them.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:24:42 EDT<BR>
From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry writes:<BR>
<BR>
> McMurdo Station is in Antartica.  There will be penguins, my boy, there<BR>
>  will be penguins that will chill your soul..<BR>
>  <BR>
>  (Sorry writing a Delta Green adventure for a friend, got a bit side<BR>
>  tracked..)<BR>
>  <BR>
Penguin. Penguin! PENGUIN! Who needs this Hasta-whatsis?<BR>
<BR>
Doug G.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:23:09 -0700<BR>
From: Rob Eaglestone <downport@home.com><BR>
Subject: I've Seen the Economic Light<BR>
<BR>
Ah!  So many years have I been laboring, and now I have<BR>
seen the Beatific Vision of Traveller Economics... no,<BR>
I haven't bought Far Trader yet (I do have access to it<BR>
and I have glanced at it).  But if you've been on the<BR>
list long enough you know I've been hacking naively at<BR>
the trade distribution problem for many moons now.<BR>
<BR>
It's so simple, it's obvious, yet I never bothered to<BR>
consider it a worthy solution.  Many or most of you may<BR>
already know about it, but I tend to not see the forest<BR>
for all the trees, if you know what I mean.<BR>
<BR>
Here's my Traveller Trade Trinity: the starport class,<BR>
the trade classifications, and the X-Boat network.<BR>
<BR>
Whazzat?  Well, here it is.  It's not fully formed in<BR>
my mind yet, but lemme know if you think it's nifty.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
The X-Boat Network<BR>
==================<BR>
Resources are dumped onto the nearest X-Boat network and <BR>
shipped everywhere.  Worlds are the sources, the X-Boat <BR>
network is more or less the sink (of course, worlds are <BR>
really the sinks, but picture an X-Boat network so long <BR>
with such a demand that it's a buffer big enough to be <BR>
treated like a sink).  If your destination world isn't<BR>
within one jump, chances are the goods get dumped onto<BR>
the X-Boat Hub world before heading to their destination.<BR>
Yes, even if it's inefficient.  Ever know the Vilani to<BR>
prefer efficiency over bureaucratic control?<BR>
<BR>
Assumption (and this is IMTU so back off man!): Generic<BR>
Planet Z doesn't care where it gets its Canned Groat<BR>
Tonsils from.  It just wants them.  It's gonna get them<BR>
off the Interstellar Autobahn, the Space Rail, the REAL<BR>
long-distance truckers: the X-Boat route.<BR>
<BR>
So what??  WELL, divide your world's interstellar trade<BR>
by two things: (a) to neighbors within one (short) jump, <BR>
and (b) to the nearest X-Boat route hub.  Divide it how?<BR>
Well, how much do your neighbors need?  Maybe they'll<BR>
get half from your world.  Everything else goes to the <BR>
X-Boat network, which is where they get their stuff<BR>
from.  Or make it complicated: divide the distance to<BR>
the X-Boat hub in parsecs by 2, and that's the percentage <BR>
of goods they import from the X-Boat Network.  The rest<BR>
is local.  Or they have a serious lack.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
The Starport Class<BR>
==================<BR>
Well, what can I say about this?  I haven't really thought<BR>
about how this figures in, but of course it tells us if<BR>
the world's focus is inward or outward.<BR>
<BR>
By the bye, I SHOULD include a word about bases here.  A<BR>
base affects trade, in a fashion similar to the starport.<BR>
Okay, there's the word.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Trade Classification<BR>
====================<BR>
Okay, here's the beauty of the system.  Didja ever think<BR>
about those trade classifications?  Ever wonder how many<BR>
of them there are?  Sure, there are something like 15 <BR>
unique trade codes.  BUT, there are NOT 65,000 different<BR>
signatures out there.  Look at any starchart you have<BR>
handy.  You'll quickly see repetitions and patterns.<BR>
<BR>
There seem to be around 70 unique trade signatures.<BR>
That's it.  That is a quantifiable number.  That's a<BR>
manageable number.<BR>
<BR>
Okay, so what?<BR>
<BR>
Well, what you COULD do is make a l'il ol' table, 70 rows<BR>
large, one line per trade signature.  Or you could group<BR>
some of the more worthless and obscure codes together, and<BR>
list (in general, as a rough guideline only) what kind of<BR>
trade is going to and from that world.  And even how much<BR>
of it is going.  Use the population number if you like.<BR>
<BR>
For example:<BR>
<BR>
24471  Hi Na In            459   (0)<BR>
24930  Hi Na In Ic         39    (0)<BR>
25483  Hi Na In Va         657   (0)<BR>
26140  Hi Na In Va As      205   (0)<BR>
26345  Hi Na In Va Ic      15    (0)<BR>
<BR>
All of these worlds could be grouped into one category:<BR>
High population, Non-agricultural, Industrial.  Together <BR>
they might make up about 1% of the worlds in the Spinward <BR>
Marches.  Yet these are 5 of the 66 categories I came up <BR>
with by generating 10,000 random worlds (by the way, I <BR>
tried this on the Spinward Marches data, and the distribution<BR>
is correct).<BR>
<BR>
So what kind of trade would you see to/from this kind of<BR>
world?  Well, a little glance on the Traveller tables can<BR>
gave us an indication of stuff most likely to be moving.<BR>
Stick that short list into two columns, one for incoming<BR>
and one for outgoing.  Set some numbers too, based on <BR>
starport, starbase, and population: set the price of<BR>
the goods rather than the quantity... unless you'd rather<BR>
let the "Rich/Poor/Other" world classification + starport<BR>
class + TL set the price.  And then you're set.  Really<BR>
the table is probably less than 40 rows.  That fits on<BR>
a few HTML pages, and can be auto-generated.  At least,<BR>
that's what I hope to do in my copious free time...<BR>
sometime this year.<BR>
<BR>
Or you can approach it piecemeal:<BR>
<BR>
An Agricultural (Ag) world exports at least MCr20 worth<BR>
of food weekly, which is about MCr1000 per year.  That's <BR>
why it's rated Ag; because it contributes significantly<BR>
to interstellar trade.  It could be 20,000 dtons at Cr1000<BR>
per dton, or it could be 1,000,000 dtons at Cr20 per<BR>
dton (Yuck, why bother?  What is it, bottled water?).<BR>
<BR>
A Non-agricultural (Na) world imports at least MCr20<BR>
worth of food weekly.  That's what gives it its rating.<BR>
<BR>
Fine.  You get the picture.<BR>
<BR>
Okay, got any opinions to help me out with?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:30:26 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses (OT)<BR>
<BR>
Steve Daniels wrote:<BR>
>"Samuel D. Weiss" wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> "Excuse me your Honor.<BR>
>> <to the lawyer><BR>
>> Nothing."<BR>
><BR>
>I'd like to see you cheeky guys on the stand.<BR>
>Lawyers are professional smartasses.  Amateurs<BR>
>should avoid it when on the stand, and worry<BR>
>more about explaining things well to the jury.<BR>
>Its the job of the lawyer who hired the expert<BR>
>to make the cross-examining attorney look like<BR>
>an ass, not the witness.<BR>
<BR>
A relation of mine was called to be an expert witness.  His<BR>
conclusions somehow weren't what the lawyer who hired him<BR>
and prepped him expected, since the lawyer didn't really<BR>
understand the subject and didn't make it clear what information<BR>
was really being sought...my relation had the pleasure of having the<BR>
man who hired him ask the judge to allow him to be treated as a hostile <BR>
witness, which I don't completely understand but apparently it<BR>
isn't much fun.<BR>
<BR>
A threat of contempt of court charges came up.  My relation<BR>
tells me that the only thing that kept him out of jail was the<BR>
presence of mind not to inform all concerned that contempt<BR>
"didn't even begin to cover" what he felt for the court and all<BR>
involved at that point.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:42:26 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
<BR>
Anthony Jackson wrote:<BR>
>Depends on the altitude; realistically x-ray lasers have terrible atmospheric<BR>
>penetration (as in, functionally useless), but Traveller has always ignored<BR>
>this problem.  However, a lot of gas giant skimming could occur in quite<BR>
>thin atmosphere, which would make life easier for missiles.  Also, a gas<BR>
>giant is _big_ -- most ambushes probably don't actually happen while >skimming, just while approaching the skimming site.<BR>
<BR>
I've been noodling on this for a while.<BR>
<BR>
If lasers don't work in the gas giant atmosphere, but missiles do, we<BR>
have a possible setup for a starship's worst nightmare...a contact<BR>
missile hit.<BR>
<BR>
Especially if the effects of the gas giant atmosphere on sensors make<BR>
ships barely visible, but little things like missiles hard or impossible<BR>
to see.  I can smack a nuclear missile into the center of that fuzzy<BR>
blob on my sensor scope that I think is your ship, my tiny missile<BR>
won't even register through the snow on your point defense scanners. <BR>
<BR>
The variant High Guard stuff I've been putting together (but haven't<BR>
finished by a long shot) make gas giant atmospheres the great<BR>
equalizers. Basically, most of the advantages a big ship has over a<BR>
little one vanish.  Most shields don't work, spinal mounts are hard<BR>
or impossible to use, computer factors drop to effective zero for combat<BR>
purposes, agility goes to zero...basically, if you can see each other<BR>
you can hit each other.<BR>
<BR>
My stumbling block: rules for seeing each other.  Interception, skimming<BR>
under fire and skim escorts all come into play, but I need a good<BR>
mechanic for lurking SDB's inside the gas giant coming into contact<BR>
with hostiles.  I'm thinking of some simple abstraction, like "1% of the<BR>
SDB's within a gas giant can intercept any particular enemy ship<BR>
entering the gas giant atmosphere", or perhaps some difficult interception<BR>
roll for the defender to make that will allow X SDB's to intercept.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2358<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2359</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 27 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2359<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: I've Seen the Economic Light<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
RE: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
OT: Powerlines (was RE:)<BR>
Home gearheading<BR>
Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
Re: Camerone Day<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
RE: Opinions Sought<BR>
RE: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
Viva La Legion<BR>
GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
Re: Guarding the Mail<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Terraforming<BR>
Re: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
Re: Citizens of the Empire<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:57:59 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: I've Seen the Economic Light<BR>
<BR>
Rob Eaglestone wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Okay, got any opinions to help me out with?<BR>
<BR>
Yes.<BR>
<BR>
You should buy and read GT: Far Trader.<BR>
Chris, Jim and I could use the 20 cents a piece.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:18:33 -0500<BR>
From: Dan Roseberry <rosebee@troi.csw.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR>
> Gentlebeings,<BR>
> How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<BR>
I'll take two and I want them by Saturday!<BR>
(ooooorrrrrrrrrrr whenever ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dan Roseberry (plop101) Hot Springs, Arkansas<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:23:35 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: RE: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
Frank G. Pitt wrote:<BR>
>Answer these questions, how many DT is an A10 and how many <BR>
>hardpoints does it have ?<BR>
><BR>
>And how many DT is a T25 ?<BR>
>(Which had, IIRC, five turrets)<BR>
<BR>
"Turret" - especially vehicle-weapon "turret" - does not equal "hardpoint",<BR>
in the Traveller starship sense.  All those bombs and missiles slung<BR>
under an A-10 would be hard pressed to equal *one* Traveller missile<BR>
turret in firepower, especially a triple missile turret.<BR>
<BR>
I've seen a diagram of a Rampart fighter (from Challenge magazine?) - <BR>
it had missiles all over the underside.  These clusters of missiles<BR>
all together equalled one hardpoint.  If the Rampart were carrying<BR>
vehicle-grade munitions (cluster bombs, napalm, autocannon gun<BR>
pods) instead of starship-grade missiles, it would have more shots of<BR>
many different weapons to play with.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:28:45 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: OT: Powerlines (was RE:)<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson wrote:<BR>
>More to the point, the original study showing that exposure to<BR>
>electromagnetic fields caused damage to cells in culture, (the one most<BR>
>often cited in anti-powerline studies, and the genesis of millions and<BR>
>millions of dollars in research lawsuits, etc) has been shown to be<BR>
>fraudulent.<BR>
<BR>
Just to add to the fun, my father recently retired from the New York State<BR>
Electric & Gas company (a private utility that runs a good deal of the<BR>
rural and small city power grids in upstate New York).  He was involved<BR>
with several instances of powerline construction.<BR>
<BR>
His team measured electromagnetic fields, since the study hadn't yet<BR>
been shown to be fraudulent.  Yes, you could measure the EM field<BR>
from a powerline...as long as you were outside a house.  If you were<BR>
inside a house, the EM leaks from light switches and electrical<BR>
outlets would completely swamp anything from the power lines, they<BR>
were orders of magnitude more.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:48:13 -0500<BR>
From: Dan Roseberry <rosebee@troi.csw.net><BR>
Subject: Home gearheading<BR>
<BR>
Has any one created stats for a TL10-13 (GT TL 9) house for<BR>
the average household?  Or, put differently:<BR>
<BR>
Wanted:  3bedroom, 2bathroom, subburban home with 30 min<BR>
driving distance of Regina down Starport. Am willing to spend<BR>
up to Cr120,000, or finance on reasonable terms (chortl!).<BR>
Land size and value should be included with house cost.<BR>
Contact: <snip><BR>
<BR>
Yes, I know. Im too wimpy to do it myself 8-X<BR>
Dan Roseberry (plop101) Hot Springs, Arkansas<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:22:08 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 21:35:25 -0400, Sword-Worlder wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Point thy browser to yon www.securityleak.net !<BR>
<BR>
Thank you Colin.  I wanna have your baby :)<BR>
<BR>
In all my years (not that I'm old like Leonard or anything), but I've never<BR>
heard of Security Leak magazine until today.  I was downloading and saving<BR>
the individual images from the Zhodani Core Exploration issue faster than I<BR>
can read it (which I'll probably do tomorrow).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Artificial Intelligence usually beats real stupidity.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 01:30:07 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Camerone Day<BR>
<BR>
> ><<  What would be an equivalent unit to the Foriegn<BR>
>  Legion in the 3I? >><BR>
><BR>
> The Duke's Huscarles? (and I've always wished Marc or Loren called him<BR>
> the Black Duke because it sounds so cool...)<BR>
><BR>
> A picked household guard equal to scum soldiers officered by snooty noble<BR>
> military academy graduates?<BR>
> I wouldn't think so.<BR>
<BR>
> Other than certain mercenary units, I don't think any unit has been<BR>
> described that comes close to the FFL in the Imperium. I am not sure such<BR>
> a unit would even be needed given the nature of the Imperium.  Who would<BR>
> be in it? Exatriate Solomani? Fteirle outcasts? Omnivorous K'kree? Vargr<BR>
> corsairs recruited for the moment? Anti-social Zhodani? A horde of Droyne<BR>
> krinaytsoyni? A Hiver who manipulated himself? Even people from Imperial<BR>
> allied Client States would likely just be invited to join the regular<BR>
> forces if anything.<BR>
<BR>
What about the Aslan regiment of the Imperial guard? Aren't they an Imperial<BR>
equivalent of the FFL or at least the Swiss Guard?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:42:03 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com> wrote<BR>
><BR>
>> >From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
>> >You have missed the most obvious clue of all. With the <BR>
>> >natural correspondence A->1, B->2, etc, for "VARGR" we<BR>
>> >have:V 22A  1R 18G  7R 18- -----<BR>
>> >  66 Clearly indicating that they are truly "devil dogs."<BR>
><BR>
>> Brohter Luther (or Brother Martin?) has hit the nail on the<BR>
>> head!  The Vargr wer created by teh DROYN and their<BR>
>> numberology is 6 and 6!  And tha'ts one way that the DROYNe<BR>
>> have TWO races in the Major Six!  <BR>
>> - --Raoul Gilgamesh Forsythe III<BR>
>> Solomani Party Delegate<BR>
><BR>
> "Brottah Forsythe hahv yew counsidderred thaat the juump draiv<BR>
> ais up tuh saix parsex and a misjuump ais up tew thoirtysaix <BR>
> parsex (6^6) witch clairly shews te eevil, aatheiistic, plotts<BR>
> of them DROYNe haythans.<BR>
<BR>
Excuse me... 6^6 is 46656 parsecs... or about halfway across the galaxy.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:30:43 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
 <BR>
> Excuse me... 6^6 is 46656 parsecs... or about halfway across the galaxy.<BR>
<BR>
Unless you're a C programmer. Then it's not very far at all.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:37:39 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
<BR>
I'm just starting the process of creating an ADC2 version of Fifth Frontier<BR>
War. As a first step, I created a version of Mayday, both to learn the<BR>
map/symbol editors and the mechanics of playing an ADC2 game. Now that I<BR>
have a crude version of Mayday, I am in search of playtesting volunteers.<BR>
<BR>
Any volunteers here?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:49:02 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
> How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<snip><BR>
> It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
> players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
<BR>
I say go for it !<BR>
<BR>
This, IMO, is one of the reasons White Wolf Games do well, they always<BR>
release very nicely produced freebies like this, making a storyteller's job<BR>
that much easier.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:57:40 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
> > This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite)<BR>
> > but instead<BR>
> ...<BR>
> > It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in<BR>
> > getting new players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
><BR>
> It would probably go over like "Traveller: Book 0."<BR>
<BR>
Book 0 was pretty much a waste of time, and had no redeeming qualities.<BR>
<BR>
If Loren is proposing something like Gurps Lite, or the White Wolf freebies,<BR>
in other words, good production quality, and actually conatininjg the basic<BR>
character generation rules and background information, it would be received<BR>
much better than Book 0.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:01:24 -0700<BR>
From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
<BR>
>I'm just starting the process of creating an ADC2 version of Fifth Frontier<BR>
>War. As a first step, I created a version of Mayday, both to learn the<BR>
>map/symbol editors and the mechanics of playing an ADC2 game. Now that I<BR>
>have a crude version of Mayday, I am in search of playtesting volunteers.<BR>
><BR>
>Any volunteers here?<BR>
<BR>
Might help if you mention what ADC2 is, it sounds interesting.<BR>
<BR>
			Zane<BR>
| Zane H. Healy                    | UNIX Systems Adminstrator  |<BR>
| healyzh@aracnet.com (primary)    | Linux Enthusiast           |<BR>
| healyzh@holonet.net (alternate)  | Classic Computer Collector |<BR>
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+<BR>
|     Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing,    |<BR>
|                   and Zane's Computer Museum.                 |<BR>
|                 http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/              |<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:33:31 +0100<BR>
From: Ewan Quibell <E.D.Quibell@bton.ac.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Defiantly.<BR>
<BR>
GURPS Lite is what persuaded me to buy GURPS Basic, even though I'll<BR>
probably never play GURPS.<BR>
<BR>
I suspect GT Lite might encourage more people to discover the wonders of Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
Just as an aside, how dose GT stack up to other GURPS stuff in volume of<BR>
sales ? or are you not a liberty to say ?<BR>
<BR>
Ewan<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Gentlebeings,<BR>
> <BR>
> How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<BR>
snip<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
> players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
> <BR>
> Loren Wiseman<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
   Ewan Quibell                       Their's not to make reply,<BR>
   Senior Communications Engineer     Their's not to reason why,<BR>
   Computer Centre                    Their's but to do and die:<BR>
   University of Brighton             Into the valley of Death<BR>
                                      Rode the six hundred.<BR>
   E.D.Quibell@brighton.ac.uk              Alfred, Lord Tennyson<BR>
<BR>
   #include<stddisclaimer.h><BR>
<BR>
   My spelling is entirerly due to dyslexia, typos, and poetic license<BR>
<BR>
   University of Brighton - Sunday Times' University of the Year<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:14:55 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Excellent Idea.<BR>
<BR>
Would certainly help both 'newbies' and 'oldies' to make the transition (if<BR>
they desire to of course).<BR>
<BR>
Maybe a variant of GURPS Lite with a bit of basic OTU Imperium background<BR>
attached might help GM's and new potential GURPS players to get into the<BR>
'swing' of things.<BR>
<BR>
Best Wishes<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 04:36:53 EDT<BR>
From: RvKsword@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/27/00 12:35:27 AM Central Daylight Time, <BR>
jlindsay@home.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> > Point thy browser to yon www.securityleak.net !<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Thank you Colin.  I wanna have your baby :)<BR>
>  <BR>
>  In all my years (not that I'm old like Leonard or anything), but I've never<BR>
>  heard of Security Leak magazine until today.  I was downloading and saving<BR>
>  the individual images from the Zhodani Core Exploration issue faster than I<BR>
>  can read it (which I'll probably do tomorrow).<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
that all goes ditto for me! (well except for the baby part, nothing personal <BR>
but im just not that kinda guy...well alright just that once but I really <BR>
needed the money okay???)  but thanks just the same :)<BR>
<BR>
and after seeing all those links...well thank god for webwhacker!!  (or <BR>
whatever the hell im usin nowadays, they all look the same to me)<BR>
<BR>
RvK<BR>
v^v^v  "NO NO NO DON'T PUSH THE RED BUTTON OH DEAR GOD NOOOOO!!!!!!!"<BR>
"But....the coolest stuff always happens when you push the red button!!"  <BR>
v^v^v<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 01:39:42<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
At 11:24 PM 4/26/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Penguin. Penguin! PENGUIN! Who needs this Hasta-whatsis?<BR>
<BR>
There are worse things....<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
<BR>
TML Great Old One<BR>
Plague of the Traveller Riders of the Apocalypse<BR>
Chant "Gridlore" thrice to summon.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 06:50:41 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
I created an organization years ago for the 3i simply called the Imperial<BR>
Legion. They were primarily troops gathered from worlds willing to export<BR>
any criminals sentenced to life or death sentences.  They were issued<BR>
inexpensive armor and weapons, and used to assault fortifications that would<BR>
make marines nervous. They were not expected to live. They WERE expected to<BR>
soften up the resistance for the next wave of the imperial military units.<BR>
<BR>
A fun diversion upon occasion, and one that allowed players to take a<BR>
character into a mission knowing he probably wasn't going to make it out<BR>
alive. I had special equipment designed for them, (cheap and nasty) and the<BR>
few missions I ran were very rough.<BR>
<BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
I had this idea that the Sylean Federation had a Roman Axillaries thing<BR>
happening - where, from memory (so I am most likely wrong) - the empire<BR>
offered citizenship to troops from certain annexed provinces in return for<BR>
service (20 years?). In Sylea - I thought that 3 terms (minimum & honourable<BR>
discharge at service's end) in the marines would give someone Sylean Fed<BR>
citizen. In terms of training -  the first two years were a combination of<BR>
basic, advanced and high tech acclimatisation training.<BR>
<BR>
Any comments?<BR>
<BR>
PS What's the deal with people from US protectorates like Puerto Rico<BR>
(spelling) joining the military. Can they? Do they get citizenship as a<BR>
result? Can other nation's join up before citizenship come's through?<BR>
<BR>
M (As in Michael, not as in Bond's controller)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 21:16:36 +1200<BR>
From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" <a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz><BR>
Subject: GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
<BR>
Title say's it all<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:46:12 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Guarding the Mail<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>BTW, this means that Traveller *should* have the occasional incident<BR>
>>similar to incident's in C.J. Cherryh's books. You are boosting at max<BR>
>>and dodging around to avoid an enemy, and your drive gets taken out.<BR>
>>You are moving on a trajectory that will take you out of the system. It<BR>
>>could take a while for someone to rendezvous with you. Maybe longer<BR>
>>than your life support is good for.<BR>
>><BR>
>>And don't forget that it doesn't do any good to jump out to where<BR>
>>you'll be in a week. Any rescue ship has to not only be in the same<BR>
>>place as you, but also has to be moving at the right speed in the right<BR>
>>direction.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> Well as you stopped accelerating when you drive bought it, the rescue ship<BR>
> jumps to where you will be in ten days time, and even with a longer than<BR>
> average jump duration it will still have a couple of days of constant<BR>
> acceleration to match vectors for an intercept...<BR>
<BR>
Of course, this requires a high accel ship in-system at the time. <BR>
<BR>
And then there's the problem if the damaged ship's life support is only<BR>
good for 9 days and it'll take 10 to reach them. That's when you find<BR>
out if the players are good at role playing... as they each do the math<BR>
and realize that the life support that won't support *all* of them for<BR>
10 days will support *some* of them that long... and start eying the<BR>
other characters.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:54:31 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>For those of you looking puzzled, in Roman times you "testified" by<BR>
> placing one hand on your crotch. Think of it as pledging that "If this<BR>
> isn't true, castrate me..."<<BR>
><BR>
> :)<BR>
> Would have some very interesting implications these days if adopted as the<BR>
> penalty for lying. It goes back further than that however. Check Genesis.<BR>
<BR>
But the *words* (testicles & testify) only go back to the Romans.<BR>
<BR>
>>What's most *likely* to happen long before then is some sort of "lie<BR>
> detector" that *works*. Alas, this screws up too many published<BR>
> scenarios. <<BR>
><BR>
> DGP made a court bailiff robot that could detect lies with its metabolic<BR>
> scanner. They decided it wasn't trusted enough and its use was usually<BR>
> rejected.<BR>
<BR>
I can see the use be *strictly* controlled. You can't force a witness<BR>
to use it. And when they do, questions would have to be severely<BR>
limited. <BR>
<BR>
Of course, that means juries tend to draw conclusions when the accused<BR>
declines to testify under veridication. :-)<BR>
<BR>
This stll leaves the problem with criminals using illegally obtained<BR>
veridicators to screen out informers and enforce discipline. And intel<BR>
agencies will be able to get them and use them without all these silly<BR>
restrictions. <BR>
<BR>
On the other hand, maybe that's *why* SolSec and IMJI are so feared. <BR>
<BR>
>>"Your Honor, the witness is being unresponsive..."<<BR>
><BR>
> "Excuse me your Honor.<BR>
> <to the lawyer><BR>
> Nothing."<BR>
<BR>
Huh?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:05:43 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Terraforming<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
>> <BR>
>> >1 kgf = ~ 1 Newton.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Isn't 1kgf ~= 10 Newtons ?<BR>
><BR>
>         I'm not sure what kgf is, but 1 N = 1 kg*m*s^-2. (1 kilogram meter per<BR>
> second squared). Thus, the gravitational field constant is 9.8 N/kg<BR>
> (newtons per kilogram), which translates to kg*m*s^-2*kg^-1 = m*s^-2<BR>
> (meters per second squared, the unit of acceleration). I'm guessing this<BR>
> was about units of force. Thus, on earth, a 1kg mass experiences a force<BR>
> of 9.81N.<BR>
<BR>
I'm going by the conversion factors listed in the CRC Handbook of<BR>
Chemistry and Physics. But I may have missed an exponent... (checking)<BR>
<BR>
Oops! I did. A kgf (kilogram-force) *is* 9.81.... Newtons. <BR>
<BR>
So my figures for the required mass, etc are too big by one order of<BR>
magnitude. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:14:10 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Gearhead question about det lasers<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I seem to remember seeing on this list  recently  the  idea  that<BR>
> missiles in Traveller were actually detonation lasers (as  they'd<BR>
> do better damage than direct impact).  Simple question:  Would  a<BR>
> detonation laser work in a gas giant  atmosphere?  (I'm  thinking<BR>
> about what happens when SDBs ambush someone performing gas  giant<BR>
> refuelling.)<BR>
<BR>
Yes, but the range will be *severely* reduced. Ditto for most sensors,<BR>
and beam weapons.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:19:11 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Citizens of the Empire<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Of course, you can be a Citizen and have less<BR>
> political power than a Subject... as any Paranoia<BR>
> player would know.<BR>
><BR>
> People could call themselves "Citizens" but still be<BR>
> more like than "Subjects", and vice versa.<BR>
<BR>
The Computer doesn't like your implications, Citizen. Please report to<BR>
Security for possible re-education.<BR>
<BR>
Paranoia is *obviously* set on a colony where a very *odd* strain of<BR>
Virus took over. :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:25:19 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>><<  What would be an equivalent unit to the Foriegn<BR>
>  Legion in the 3I? >><BR>
<BR>
> I created an organization years ago for the 3i simply called the Imperial<BR>
> Legion. They were primarily troops gathered from worlds willing to export<BR>
> any criminals sentenced to life or death sentences.  They were issued<BR>
> inexpensive armor and weapons, and used to assault fortifications that would<BR>
> make marines nervous. They were not expected to live. They WERE expected to<BR>
> soften up the resistance for the next wave of the imperial military units.<BR>
<BR>
You need a reason for them to be *willing* to assualt the positions<BR>
rather than just be executed. I'd go for extending the recruiting down<BR>
to anyone serving long sentences for violent crimes. <BR>
<BR>
And you might want to borrow an idea from the old Janissaries. ST:DS9<BR>
stole it already, but it *is* a usable idea...<BR>
<BR>
Addict the troops to a drug. Perform well, and they get their doses.<BR>
Desert, and die from withdrawal. <BR>
<BR>
Add in a compromise between the level of discipline required in<BR>
barracks, and that required on "active" duty, and the cons would be<BR>
willing sign up. <BR>
<BR>
I figure that when not in action, they'd be based on marginal worlds,<BR>
and the only discipline would be some drilling and exercise to maintain<BR>
conditioning. So the rest of the time they can indulge themselves in<BR>
anything they can afford (pay should be "ok", after all they won't be<BR>
collecting pensions!).<BR>
<BR>
Sort of a biker gang with some training and discipline. Moralistic<BR>
types will have a *fit* at the stuff that goes on in "quarters". Girls,<BR>
boys, gambling (no drugs except their regular issue, which gives them a<BR>
bad reaction to alcohol and "street drugs"). <BR>
<BR>
Typical response to anyone raising objections to the stuff these<BR>
"troops" are allowed to get away with between missions:<BR>
<BR>
"Look, we're sending them out to *die*. We know it, they know it.<BR>
Letting them spending their pay on hookers and gambling is the least we<BR>
can do.  Besides, it all winds up back in our funding anyway...."<BR>
<BR>
> A fun diversion upon occasion, and one that allowed players to take a<BR>
> character into a mission knowing he probably wasn't going to make it out<BR>
> alive. I had special equipment designed for them, (cheap and nasty) and the<BR>
> few missions I ran were very rough. <BR>
<BR>
Picture the PCs trying to infiltrate a "base" for such troops. And<BR>
trying to *exfiltrate* later... <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:40:59 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> The Legion, historically has been populated by defeated soldiers from the<BR>
> last war, criminals, adventurers and those just wanting to disappear.  Not<BR>
> to mention soldiers of conscience.  After WWII, the legion was often<BR>
> described as being only as strong as its weakest German legionnaire.<BR>
> Notable legionaries include poet Alan Seeger and Cole Porter to name a<BR>
> couple.  When a legionnaire joins, he is granted a nom de guerre.  Family or<BR>
> others looking for him will be turned away.  His legion identity begins when<BR>
> he joins, and ends when he dies. The legion is a refuge for the 'lost' who<BR>
> find a sense of belonging.  This is what makes the legionnaire such an<BR>
> excellent fighter. Soldiers may claim to fight for an ideal, or a cause, but<BR>
> studies show that morale depends on the forming of small, close knit groups,<BR>
> and soldiers take part in the wretched business of combat for their buddies.<BR>
> The legion merely removes the veneer.  Troopers swear an oath, not to<BR>
> France, but to the legion, and fight for their fellow legionnaires.<BR>
<BR>
And then there are the things like the infamous "orderly room" sign:<BR>
<BR>
"You are in the Legion to die. The Legion will send you where you can die."<BR>
<BR>
Or the "slogan" from the Saharan campaigns: "March or Die!"<BR>
<BR>
> A legion in the Imperium?  perhaps not a foreign one, but certainly some<BR>
> sort of all volunteer force with lots of history and romance, populated by<BR>
> tough hombres and intellectuals banded together as brothers, and useful to<BR>
> the Imperium or local Duke for there lack of connection to anyone outside<BR>
> the legion.  An it may be used with little public outcry, for as one<BR>
> legionnaire noted 'who will miss us?'  Just the thing for dirty little wars.<BR>
<BR>
Check out Pournelle's Co-Dominium Marines, and Falkenberg's Legion for<BR>
ideas about how such groups operate.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2359<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2360</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 27 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2360<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations (was Re Camerone) (Long)<BR>
Re: Re : Re : Chemistry Question (methane/ammonia, ammonia/water, etc.)<BR>
What happens to the little merchant?<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2359<BR>
Re: New & Old<BR>
TL7-8 Orbital Spacecraft<BR>
Re: What happens to the little merchant?<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... eh, Imperium<BR>
RE: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
Re: Camerone Day/Viva La Legion<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
Re: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:55:04 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations (was Re Camerone) (Long)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> *Swiss Guards of the Vatican (now purely ceremonial, but in their day the<BR>
> MM-F (please don't ask me to explain this one, work it out....) on the<BR>
> European continent<BR>
<BR>
Actually, they are both ceremonial *and* practical. They do guard<BR>
mounts in the fancy outfits, just like the Coldstream Guard in their<BR>
"traditional" uniforms guarding Buckingham Palace. <BR>
<BR>
But both units have quite modern weapons ready to hand, as well as<BR>
folks in more practical uniforms in reserve.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:50:20 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re : Re : Chemistry Question (methane/ammonia, ammonia/water, etc.)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote :-<BR>
>> > I assume we're operating well below the critical points of ammonia [405K<BR>
>> > and ~11MPa] and water [647K and ~21MPa] in most situations.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Check out Clement's "Close to Critical" for a planet with a surface<BR>
>> near the critical point of water...<BR>
><BR>
> A surface temperature approaching 647K, with a surface atmospheric<BR>
> pressure of 210 atmospheres? Makes Venus look positively temperate.<BR>
> The 'planetology' of the world would be very interesting.<BR>
<BR>
It is. Silicate rocks are crumbly, spongy stuff because the silica<BR>
dissolves out!<BR>
<BR>
>> > In the regime of extreme pressures and temperatures the following<BR>
>> > article has a useful phase diagram :-<BR>
> <journal reference snipped> <BR>
>> I somehow doubt that the players, or ever remote probes are going to<BR>
>> fare well under *those* conditions... :-)<BR>
> At the lower end of the isentrope, conditions aren't terribly dissimilar<BR>
> to the mantle of an Earthlike planet (temperatures of a couple of<BR>
> thousand K, pressures of tens to hundreds of gigapascals) ; so if<BR>
> mantle swimming 'subterrenes' can exist, then SDBs in the deep layers<BR>
> of a gas giant can too.<BR>
<BR>
From your reaction, you haven't read "Close To Critical". Track it down<BR>
and read it. It's interesting. Also check out "Iceworld" it deals with<BR>
a *very* alien planet... Or is it very *familiar*? :-)<BR>
<BR>
Just about anything by Clement will be interesting.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 07:39:17 -0700<BR>
From: "Joe Lachance" <Lachance@nc.rr.com><BR>
Subject: What happens to the little merchant?<BR>
<BR>
First of all I'd like to send out a greeting to the fine sophonts of the<BR>
TML.  About 4 years ago I was last on this list (as what could best be<BR>
described as a "power lurker" and it is good to be back).  Anyway, my<BR>
question is this?<BR>
<BR>
How are small merchant ships,ie free traders and the like, able to survive<BR>
in an economic environment that involves large shipping/transport companies<BR>
such as Tukera Lines and a great many others?<BR>
<BR>
Somehow I picture the free trader merchant class as serving esoteric niches<BR>
in the economy.  Due to limited hull size they are unable to compete with<BR>
the "big boys" when it comes to volume.  What that means is that small<BR>
volum-high priced-and perishable goods seem most likely to be transported by<BR>
free traders (at least if they want to be able to compete with high volume<BR>
megacorp shipping.  Perhaps an analogy from the year 2000 on Terra would be<BR>
that of a gourmet food/wine distributor.  While the profits earned by<BR>
shipping lesser known, but higher quality (and as a result MUCH higher<BR>
priced) goods are a drop in the bucket compared to the volume the great big<BR>
conglomerates ship, the margins make it all worthwhile.<BR>
<BR>
I always found it a bid odd for a 40MCr spaceship to be shipping ore, but<BR>
then again what else are you going to ship from that D400324-A NiVaAs world?<BR>
At least the supply catalog in T4 gives a bit different trade model (though<BR>
it can be a wee bit too lucrative if one specializes in pharmaceuticals).<BR>
<BR>
What say you?<BR>
Joe Lachance<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:02:23 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2359<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-27 06:08:33 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< Just as an aside, how dose GT stack up to other GURPS stuff in volume of<BR>
 sales ? or are you not a liberty to say ?<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
I don't have the exact numbers, but GT is one of SJ Games better-sellers. <BR>
Initial orders are large, and sell-thru is good. Witness we had to do a <BR>
second printing of GT within a year of original publication.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:54:25 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Re: New & Old<BR>
<BR>
>The other BITS products are pretty generic in use; aimed at er,<BR>
>Traveller. Stats tend to be T4 or GT. The 101s are all T4 not GT as<BR>
>Gt wasn't released then. 101 Lifeforms (and ACQ) actually have rules<BR>
>for using animals in combat etc...<BR>
<BR>
Long may BITS sit across the divide! (that is GT:Trav (CT, MT. TNE, T4,<BR>
....)<BR>
<BR>
Having perused the TML and the WWW for a while now I can see that Traveller<BR>
is alive and well.  GURPS (SJG) saw that too, and having got the patient<BR>
back on his feet and back in the game has an interest in keeping it alive<BR>
and well (at least someone cares!!!), if in a slightly different (or is it<BR>
traditional) milieu (anybody else remember Bobby coming out of the shower in<BR>
Dallas!).<BR>
<BR>
Seriously, BITS has actually made T4 both workable and (almost) respectable.<BR>
By producing such high quality products they are at the moment (IMHO at<BR>
least) the current home of "Classic Traveller" (as opposed to GT).  I<BR>
haven't yet sighted a poor review of their products, have bought most<BR>
myself, and they have faithfully kept to Marc Millers original<BR>
"philosophical view" that Traveller should be good, 'wholesome', (sci-fi<BR>
based) fun (Marc, if you're listening, you'd do worse than to look at this<BR>
BITS bunch seriously as publishers of T5).<BR>
<BR>
I haven't yet had the chance to play a GT game (despite buying quite a few<BR>
of the books), but "Classic Traveller" in all its forms (CT, MT, TNE & T4),<BR>
has been great fun.  I do hope that BITS continues to stay "Type Neutral" in<BR>
what has clearly the potential to become a commercial conflict of interest<BR>
(Marc, perhaps you ought to forget my last .....).<BR>
<BR>
Please excuse my cynicism, after all SJG has not only kept Traveller alive,<BR>
but given it a whole new lease of life, and for that alone they deserve a<BR>
huge amount of praise.<BR>
<BR>
"Hit decontamination, Vorn.  Its time I got off this soap box and got some<BR>
space time!!!"<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
(aka Vorn Dagor (ex CT:Marine & part time Merchant)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:17:55 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: TL7-8 Orbital Spacecraft<BR>
<BR>
Need some space ships for a TL7-8 balkanized<BR>
world?<BR>
<BR>
http://www.deepcold.com/<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 08:27:02 -0700<BR>
From: Rob Eaglestone <downport@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: What happens to the little merchant?<BR>
<BR>
Joe Lachance wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> How are small merchant ships,ie free traders and the like, <BR>
> able to survive in an economic environment that involves large <BR>
> shipping/transport companies such as Tukera Lines and a great<BR>
> many others?<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
Hello Joe,<BR>
<BR>
IMTU (In My Traveller Universe), the X-Boat routes are<BR>
dominated by Trade Guilds, made up of Very Large Corporations<BR>
and Megacorporations.  From there, feeder lines made up of<BR>
subsector-wide or multiple subsector corporations transport<BR>
goods directly to and from the X-Boat network.  Finally, we<BR>
get small companies, which provide world to world trade, and<BR>
the Tramp Free Trader, who fights for the table scraps and<BR>
wanders between useless worlds.<BR>
<BR>
That's my framework; it's not the law.  A Free Trader can<BR>
make a great find and ship it to Rhylanor, where there are<BR>
dozens of greedy Brokers who may pay good money for unique<BR>
finds, regardless of the bearer.  Or, a Free Trader can<BR>
prove itself to a local cluster of worlds and earn a niche<BR>
trading route -- for example, a mail contract.<BR>
<BR>
But the norm for the Free Trader is to go broke and end up<BR>
destitude on some miserable rock.  Where do you think <BR>
Travellers come from?  Here's what I think:<BR>
<BR>
1. Travellers come from the military.  They've seen more<BR>
   than one world and want to experience more.<BR>
<BR>
2. Travellers used to have their own ship.  They're <BR>
   infected with wanderlust.<BR>
<BR>
3. Travellers used to be ship crew.  ...and are looking<BR>
   for working passage off this miserable rock.<BR>
<BR>
I haven't refereed Traveller in quite this way, but I'm<BR>
thinking I should.<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:23:58 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... eh, Imperium<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin writes:<BR>
<BR>
>There are, however, two very disturbing issues in Imperial history that are<BR>
>worth pointing out:  the psionics suppressions and the Droyne question.<BR>
<BR>
I can think of others, the destruction of Ileish's tropical belt, for<BR>
instance.<BR>
<BR>
>It seems that the result of the psionics suppressions (about 400, I think?)<BR>
<BR>
800 to 826.<BR>
<BR>
>is that, 800 or so years later, Imperial citizens of every species see<BR>
>psionics as dangerous and repulsive and would be willing to lynch<BR>
>telepaths, at least, if not all other psionicists.<BR>
<BR>
That was discussed during the GT Aliens 3 playtest and I think we reached<BR>
the conclusion that some people, notably among the less well educated though<BR>
they could be found in all walks of life, were violently anti-psionic, but<BR>
not all.<BR>
<BR>
>At the same time, most of the Droyne (a psionic race) live on interdicted<BR>
>planets -- not a long step from living in ghettos.   <BR>
<BR>
This is not the case. The two most well-known (by players, that is, not<BR>
in-game) Droyne planets, Andor and Candory are interdicted, but off-hand I<BR>
can't think of any other (though there propably are a few more). Most<BR>
planets with Droyne living on them are not even Amber Zoned. Not even<BR>
planets under Droyne governments. (The HTA3 playtest theory is that not<BR>
very many people realize that all Droyne are psionic; mostly it is assumed<BR>
that Droyne are like most other species: some are psionic, but most aren't).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 10:33:58 -0700<BR>
From: "Antony Farrell" <Skaran@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: RE: One turret per 100 dtons?<BR>
<BR>
> Patrik Holmstrm writes:<BR>
> >If you use this rule big ships will be even more superior to<BR>
> smaller ships,<BR>
> <snipped><BR>
> >As an exercise in gearheading I bring you _my_ Type S variant.<BR>
> <snipped><BR>
> >100 dt Wedge<BR>
> >Vol 1400 m3<BR>
> >Area 561 m2<BR>
> >In this hull we could install 33 3dt laser turrets before running out of<BR>
> >space.<BR>
> <snipped><BR>
> >By comparison Tigress (500kdt dreadnought - Area 176696m2) could<BR>
> be fitted<BR>
> >with only 17670 laser turrets (remaining volume 6'257'860 m3)<BR>
> which is 3.53<BR>
> >turrets/100 dt. This is still more than the 5000 turrets allowed<BR>
> by the 100<BR>
> >dt rule though.<BR>
><BR>
> 	Yes, 3.53 per 100 tons is greater than 1 per 100 tons, but<BR>
> it is much<BR>
> 	less than the 33 per 100 tons that you had for the Type S variant.<BR>
><BR>
> Peez<BR>
<BR>
>Lets see 42m3 (TNE/FFS1 volume of 1 turret) x 33 = 1386m3 Doesn't seem to<BR>
be a lot of room in the scout for anything else like power for the weapons,<BR>
sensors, gunners etc.<BR>
The real limit on weaponry on ships should surely be the vessels mission<BR>
requirements and a need to fit everything in. However this has given me an<BR>
idea for a multi-laser platform (such a change from the ubiquitous missile<BR>
platforms dont you think.)<BR>
<BR>
Antony<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:23:46 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Camerone Day/Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Terry Carlino" <BR>
> What about the Aslan regiment of the Imperial guard? Aren't they an<BR>
> Imperial equivalent of the FFL or at least the Swiss Guard?<BR>
<BR>
My impression was that they would be recruited from Aslan living in the<BR>
Imperium.  I don't think that this has ever been stated though.<BR>
<BR>
I suspect that Brzk (and Soegz before him) would have lots of Vargr in his<BR>
Huscarles, just for the sake of his charisma.  Again, I would tend to<BR>
assume them as being Imperial citizens/subjects, although some of them may<BR>
be from over the border.  In Soegz' case, it seems possible that he might<BR>
have picked up a bunch of followers during his (and Arbellatra's!) March to<BR>
the Core.<BR>
<BR>
I wouldn't be surprised if Imperial Vargr units didn't have a certain<BR>
proportion of "wild" Vargr present.  There is also the possibility that<BR>
former Vargr client state forces might wind up in Imperial service.<BR>
<BR>
> From: Michael Hughes<BR>
> I had this idea that the Sylean Federation had a Roman Axillaries thing<BR>
> happening - where, from memory (so I am most likely wrong) - the empire<BR>
> offered citizenship to troops from certain annexed provinces in return<BR>
> for service (20 years?). In Sylea - I thought that 3 terms (minimum &<BR>
> honourable discharge at service's end) in the marines would give someone<BR>
> Sylean Fed citizen. In terms of training -  the first two years were a<BR>
> combination of basic, advanced and high tech acclimatisation training.<BR>
> <BR>
> Any comments?<BR>
<BR>
This sounds likely.  It probably doesn't apply as much once the Imperial<BR>
borders are stabilised, but it would have made a great deal of sense during<BR>
the Federation period, or even when the Imperium was "the Sylean Federation<BR>
and the Seven Dwarfs".  In other words, sure.  YMMV as to whether it<BR>
applies in IY1100.<BR>
<BR>
Now I think about it, yes, I can actually see service in the Imperial<BR>
military as being a way of gaining a legal status within the Imperium. <BR>
This would only make sense for beings from non-Imperial worlds, of course. <BR>
I suspect the Imperial "borders" leak like a sieve, and that nearly anyone<BR>
who wants to get in can, but getting the necessary identity documents and<BR>
so on required to function on most worlds could be a little difficult.  So<BR>
establishing a "legal identity" recognised by the Imperium, and its member<BR>
worlds could actually be useful.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:23:52 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <BR>
> Boy are there fans of the FFL around here.<BR>
> :)<BR>
<BR>
Count me out, for starters.<BR>
<BR>
> >To get back to Traveller, the scope for unusual military units given the<BR>
> number of different species, races and cultures would be even more varied<BR>
> than on Terra<<BR>
> <snip><BR>
> <BR>
> I agree. I am just saying that I don't see the particular dynamics for a<BR>
> FFL being in place. But Gurkha type units for example would be more than<BR>
> likely.<BR>
<BR>
I think you may be being a little too literal minded.  Really all we need<BR>
to insist on are that there are regular units in the Imperial and/or<BR>
planetary military forces drawn from populations outside the Imperium. <BR>
This is no big deal.<BR>
<BR>
> >Think "Swiss Guard".<BR>
> <BR>
> I can't. The reason the Swiss Guard only gets to guard the Pope is the<BR>
> rest of Europe was so damn afraid of them. These are the people who have<BR>
> the lion sleeping by the pool because of their self control. A bunch of<BR>
> gaol scrapings and remittance men? I don't think so.<BR>
<BR>
Well, the Scots and Irish were historically other big mercenary exporting<BR>
nations...    <BR>
<BR>
The fact is that the Swiss Guard are just a relic of a period when just<BR>
about every nation in Europe was using foreign mercenaries.  Granted, the<BR>
Swiss had a bit of a reputation, but it had pretty much faded by the 17th<BR>
century.<BR>
<BR>
> >As far as other groups in Traveller canon using "foreign" troops:  I<BR>
> >can't see any reason why they shouldn't.  <BR>
> ><BR>
> Hivers would build more robots.<BR>
<BR>
Nonsense.  Robots can't do everything.  That's why the Hivers use the<BR>
Ithklur.  I suspect they would use other races too, when it is necessary.<BR>
<BR>
> K'kree wouldn't let others use weapons. (That may be canon.)<BR>
<BR>
It's not.  GT:AR2 is quite explicit on there being subject race troops, and<BR>
on foreign mercenaries being used.  Whether or not any of these would count<BR>
as a suitable analogy is another question.  Perhaps not.  I haven't checked<BR>
the CT Alien Module, but I don't recall it contradicting AR2.<BR>
<BR>
> Fteirle wouldn't turn away from the criminal backgrounds of people like<BR>
> in the FFL.<BR>
<BR>
But the FFL aren't all criminals.  For example, during World War II there<BR>
were lots of Spanish Republicans, and anti-Nazi Germans.<BR>
<BR>
In any case, there are stacks of human worlds in Fteirle space to recruit<BR>
from, and not all their troops are sepoys.  In addition, recruits from the<BR>
Imperium, the Solomani Confederation (not all Solomani are pinheads), and<BR>
minor states are all quite possible.  <BR>
<BR>
For that matter, it's not unknown in canon for Aslan to serve as<BR>
mercenaries themselves, although there wouldn't be much point in pushing<BR>
the analogy too far here.<BR>
<BR>
> Vargr wouldn't notice the difference between their own units enough for<BR>
> it to be worthy of comment.<BR>
<BR>
Except that leading human troops is less charismatic than leading other<BR>
Vargr!  (Of course, Vargr still use human troops, they just don't brag<BR>
about it.)<BR>
<BR>
> Zhodani wouldn't period.<BR>
<BR>
True.  There are Ine Givar exiles "out there" in MTU though.  They mainly<BR>
hang out in the Federation of Arden, or independent worlds.  Come to think<BR>
of it, Arden is a _very_ likely candidate to have a Legion.<BR>
<BR>
> Droyne would though, I'll give you that. Once they go to war they would<BR>
> use all assets available, including non-Droyne they could get to die for<BR>
them.<BR>
<BR>
They don't go to war very often, though.  I doubt that they would have<BR>
regular mercenary units like the Legion.  They might use mercenaries hired<BR>
on an as-needed basis though.<BR>
<BR>
> Vilani would only when in decline. otherwise, their caste structure<BR>
> wouldn't support such people being recognized at all.<BR>
<BR>
Maybe.  The documented case of a governor using Vargr allies was an "in<BR>
decline" case, and in any case, there is no evidence to suggest that they<BR>
were part of his regular forces.  Were there subject troops?  Perhaps, but<BR>
there are more likely to be sepoy-types.<BR>
<BR>
> Solomani would. Especially if it involved non party members.<BR>
<BR>
As long as they were human!<BR>
<BR>
In general, I think you are being a bit dogmatic in your perception of what<BR>
the Legion is.  Granted, I think other people on the list may have a<BR>
somewhat romanticised version of it, too, but if we want to use it as an<BR>
analogy for interesting military units in the TU, then we can go ahead<BR>
without much problem.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:58:47 -0500<BR>
From: Jason Kemp <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: Re: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
<BR>
> With only a 2 in 18 chance of rolling for more<BR>
> Psionic skill, 3 in 24 if Edu8+, not a whole lot<BR>
> of likelihood that these guys are too intimidating,<BR>
> or even competent.<BR>
<BR>
Competent, by what definition? What skill level is considered competent?<BR>
<BR>
On the average, most won't be. Remember that the role models we've seen that<BR>
inspired this prior career/concept were the elite of their kind, and<BR>
specifically received psionic training, and devoted time to achieve their<BR>
skill levels.<BR>
<BR>
The Psionics skill is present to reflect the development of one's Psionic<BR>
potential over time. Even in regular game play, after psionic training PCs<BR>
start with a skill level-1 in their respective psi skills, IIRC, and must<BR>
develop them later in game, through the passage of time and lots of<BR>
practice.<BR>
<BR>
Thus, the Zar-Tis shouldn't be too much out of line with a PC who has<BR>
learned his psionics during game play. Their biggest advantage is that they<BR>
never suffer the -1 psi per term penalty for undeveloped potential.<BR>
<BR>
> With T4, 4 in 36 is still pretty weak for psionic<BR>
> skills.<BR>
<BR>
But in T4, you can choose your skills from the tables if you want. At least,<BR>
I thought you could, as one of the methods of character generation.<BR>
<BR>
An alternate method of developing psionic potential could be implemented<BR>
with members of this and similar prior careers that involve psionics. For<BR>
example, the PC could add 1d6-2 (min 1) or even 1d6 (max 4) to each psionic<BR>
talent they possess at the end of every term served, to represent the<BR>
natural advancement in psionic skill, until they achieve their Psi rating.<BR>
(Or you could even go with a flat rate of +1 per year, if you wanted to.)<BR>
Receiving the Psionics skill allows them to add one more level to that<BR>
advancement, _or_ (and this is, of course, what a lot of PCs will consider)<BR>
adding a whole new Psionic Talent at skill level-1.<BR>
<BR>
> Altogether, as constructed, its fairly likely that<BR>
> most members of the Order will not have<BR>
> Psionics at all, and not much Sabre either.<BR>
<BR>
True, but not all of those generated are supposed to be Luke Skywalker or<BR>
Qui-Gon either. Saber-1 or Saber-2 works for the general membership of the<BR>
Order, at least conceptually. Also, under the material benefits section, the<BR>
PC has a 1 in 3 chance per benefit role of acquiring a Saber. Every Saber<BR>
roll after that adds another skill level. Consider a 7 term Zar-Tis. He<BR>
will, on the average, under MT/CT generation, possess a Saber and about a<BR>
Saber-3 skill, which is within reason, I believe.<BR>
<BR>
But that was my rational behind the distribution of skills. Do you have any<BR>
suggestions on how to fix it? Otherwise, I'll stumble blindly about and give<BR>
it another go. :)<BR>
<BR>
[Whoa, just noticed something else. I didn't include a +1 Psi, either in the<BR>
tables or as part of mustering out, either way. Hmmmm, perhaps the Psionics<BR>
cascade skill could also include that +1 Psi as one of its options.<BR>
Hmmm....]<BR>
<BR>
> Nice light saber . .  er plasma stick.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks! :)<BR>
<BR>
I appreciate the feedback, bloo. Keep it coming. (That is correct, right?<BR>
bloo, without a capitol letter?)<BR>
<BR>
Hasta,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:15:07 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Doug Berry said:<BR>
<BR>
>>So yeah, maybe the Hiver don't fix bayonets and jab away or wrestle with<BR>
the<BR>
>>K'Kree in the trenches (which would be a humorous sight, I imagine), but<BR>
>>they do fight in some sense of the word.<BR>
><BR>
>Every reference stats that Hivers don't like to fight, but will.  We have<BR>
>examples of Hiver weaponry after all.<BR>
<BR>
Just because that they *will* fight doesn't mean that they're particularly<BR>
good at it. Every reference I have at arm's length also implies that the<BR>
concept of war was alien to them until they started to travel between the<BR>
stars. Just because they will fight doesn't mean that they do.<BR>
<BR>
>They're like Pat Buchanan, whip a war and then send somebody else to fight<BR>
>it. :)<BR>
<BR>
I know you're joking, but I'm not sure that this is the case. They don't<BR>
seem particularly interested in waging war.<BR>
<BR>
>>Is it really a preference? After all, the Hivers aren't really built for<BR>
>>hand-to-hand combat. I'm not saying this merely to point out that hivers<BR>
>>don't have "hands" (appendage-to-appendage combat), but that they just<BR>
don't<BR>
>>appear to be built for the same sort of combat we're built for.<BR>
><BR>
>I don't know, a low to the ground, very stable creature that can strike in<BR>
>any direction, and can see in a 360 circle?  I think that Hivers may be<BR>
>better at "hand  to hand" that we might think.<BR>
<BR>
The stability comes at the high price of the use of its arms. They have five<BR>
limbs which they may use as arms or legs, but it appears to me that at least<BR>
three would have to be planted at any time in order to stand. This is due to<BR>
the width of their central, inflexible, bulk. It looks like four would be<BR>
required in order to move in an effective fashion. Their "rear" appendage<BR>
would be the best candidate for weapon use.<BR>
<BR>
>>They're aliens.<BR>
>><BR>
>>They look differently, and more importantly think differently. It seems<BR>
>>absurd to map human concepts or emotional states, such as cowardice, onto<BR>
>>the Hivers. I think even the notion that the Hivers "prefer" not to engage<BR>
>>in close combat is a little bizarre. It seems to me to be like saying that<BR>
>>humans prefer not to fly without the aid of machinery. Consider the<BR>
>>following:<BR>
>><BR>
>>- Hivers appear as if they would be relatively ponderous and slow moving.<BR>
><BR>
>So does an alligator.  Ever see one run?<BR>
<BR>
Yes, but I've never seen a Hiver run. If James is right, and I'm assuming he<BR>
is, it's not possible.<BR>
<BR>
>>Depending on how slow they are, this makes running across a field avoiding<BR>
>>machinegun fire a bit more difficult. This would also make getting away<BR>
from<BR>
>>an opponent in hand to hand combat very difficult.<BR>
><BR>
><ex-solidier>one does not run to avoid machinegun fire, one hugs dirt and<BR>
>invents new religions to avoid machinegun fire.</ex-soldier><BR>
<BR>
Interesting. I met a D-Day vet on the train to work one day a few years<BR>
back. He seemed to think that his fast legs saved his life. My father, a<BR>
Vietnam vet, has similar stories.<BR>
<BR>
>I'm not saying that they'd be like human soldiers, but there early wars<BR>
>would have been against fellow Hivers (if they had any), and the equipment,<BR>
>tactics, ex cetera, would develop from their limitations and advantages.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not convinced that they actually had early wars. As I said in my<BR>
response to James, canon makes the claim that Hivers came late to the very<BR>
concept of war, and I feel that there is reason to believe the Hivers didn't<BR>
develop war until after they got into space (they formed the Federation Navy<BR>
*after* they met other races). It is also mentioned that population pressure<BR>
was never an issue for the Hivers, since the population of their settlements<BR>
stabilizes at a certain point. Some have argued, in a convincing fashion,<BR>
that population pressures are what lead to wars here on earth. This is a<BR>
position that I don't necessarily agree with, but a potential culture<BR>
builder might.<BR>
<BR>
>>- Hivers are ungainly. It would appear that it would be somewhat awkward<BR>
in<BR>
>>turning. The placement of their manipulative appendages is such that it<BR>
>>could be very difficult for the poor critters the wheel around, to change<BR>
>>facing and direction. This is absolutely essential in both hand-to-hand<BR>
and<BR>
>>ranged combat.<BR>
><BR>
>As noted above, they have eyes on stalks for 360 vision, and have five<BR>
>hands available for use.  I've never seen any statements that they are slow<BR>
>or ungainly, in fact I don't recall them having a DEX penalty in character<BR>
>generation.<BR>
<BR>
They are always pictured as being ungainly. I say that they would be slow in<BR>
changing facing and direction because their limbs double as arms and legs,<BR>
and their use as one would seem to preclude their use as the other.<BR>
<BR>
>Where you see bulk, I see something akin to a Komodo Dragon.  These puppies<BR>
>are sloth-slow, until they *need* to move quickly, and then they can move<BR>
>like lightning.<BR>
<BR>
It doesn't seem that Hivers share that tendency, at least according to TNE.<BR>
The truth is that Hivers don't look like Komodo dragons to me. Lizards are<BR>
flexible, sleek, and their bodies are arranged in such a fashion that allows<BR>
them to move quickly. The Hiver hub is non-flexible, the legs double as<BR>
arms, and a certain number appear necessary for the Hiver to stay up or<BR>
move, if the illustrations are accurate.<BR>
<BR>
I have studied human and animal motion for a class in animation. I don't<BR>
present myself as an expert on the subject, but speedy beasts tend to have a<BR>
specific look and feel which the Hivers just don't have. Keep in mind that<BR>
the vast majority of Hiver young set out into the wild *don't* make it.<BR>
Granted, their young, small, and untrained, but it appears to me that<BR>
evolution hasn't been particularly kind to them with respect to physical<BR>
characteristics which would allow them to avoid being eaten by predators.<BR>
This would seem to me that they're not naturally good fighters, nor are they<BR>
naturally good at getting away from predators.<BR>
<BR>
To put it another way, I'm having a hard time imagining how a hiver could<BR>
*naturally* hurt anything, especially another hiver. They don't have biting<BR>
teeth, they don't have claws, they don't have any bones to provide solidity<BR>
in their punches and kicks. They might be able to slap things, but this<BR>
wouldn't seem to be particularly effective against other hivers (as most of<BR>
their important bits are protected by a fused carapace). I don't know. I<BR>
can't really see these guys as effective fighters.<BR>
<BR>
>>- Hivers are relatively big targets. They are effectively the same size<BR>
from<BR>
>>all sides. Due to their bulk, finding appropriate cover could be<BR>
difficult.<BR>
>>Humans can drop to the ground to reduce their profile in the face of<BR>
missile<BR>
>>weapons. Hivers cannot.<BR>
><BR>
>Hivers are already low to the ground, being only about a meter tall to<BR>
>begin with.  Also, Hivers don't have to expose their brains to observe the<BR>
>battlefield.  They just raise an eye or two.<BR>
<BR>
Fair enough. I misremembered their size. I thought that they were 1.5 meters<BR>
tall from the ground to the top of their central hub. Even so, they're still<BR>
pretty big. They could raise an eye or two, I suppose, but I'm not sure how<BR>
their eyes work.<BR>
<BR>
>>- Hivers are mute. They cannot bark orders to each other. Humans can hear<BR>
>>somebody saying something as they look at or do something else. A human<BR>
can<BR>
>>yell "Cover Me!" to his fellow soldiers, and even if they are otherwise<BR>
>>occupied, they can hear and respond. In order for a hiver to bark to his<BR>
>>comrades "cover me" it would have to use sign language, which would mean<BR>
>>that other hivers would have to look at it, which would mean that they<BR>
>>couldn't be doing anything else.<BR>
><BR>
>Soldiers use hand signals.  I've done entire missions under complete<BR>
>silence orders.  What you see as "mute" is just normal for Hivers.  Off the<BR>
>top of my head, I'd imagine that Hiver infantry and armor relay heavily on<BR>
>set battle tactics.  Then again, you have those six mobile eyes.  Spare a<BR>
>couple to watch your squaddies, the rest to the front, except for the one<BR>
>guarding the rear.<BR>
<BR>
I'm currently grappling with the setup of the eyes. 360 degree vision would<BR>
seem to preclude the ability to independently focus individual eyes, but<BR>
maybe not.<BR>
<BR>
>>Now, assuming that the Hivers *prefer* not to fight in close combat, can<BR>
it<BR>
>>really be called cowardice? Cowardice is, after all, the lack of courage<BR>
in<BR>
>>the face of danger. Assuming that Hivers have a notion such as courage in<BR>
>>the first place, which would be necessary for them to be considered<BR>
cowards,<BR>
>>is such a preference unreasonable? They're not built for combat as we know<BR>
>>combat. For a hiver to engage in combat the way we understand it would not<BR>
>>necessarily be courage, but a certain form of stupidity, or some sort of<BR>
>>desire for self-destruction.<BR>
><BR>
>Your letting your human perceptions overtake you.  Hivers have bladed<BR>
>weapons, so they do fight.<BR>
<BR>
No, I don't think I'm letting my human perceptions overtake me on this.<BR>
Indeed, I'm trying to think of them as truly alien, they way that they were<BR>
first presented. I'm not convinced that they do fight, except perhaps when<BR>
they can be detached from combat in some way, or out of necessity (that is,<BR>
self defense).<BR>
<BR>
They take great pains to ensure that all of the Hive Federation's member<BR>
worlds are non-aggressive. When they met an extremely aggressive race, they<BR>
immediately quarantined it. As a general rule they don't use violent force<BR>
in order to back up policy. They discovered the concept of war late in the<BR>
game. Their parental instincts are easily aroused, even when it comes to<BR>
other races. Their culture is blessed with a unity which is unprecendented<BR>
among the known races. They enforce this unity by travelling around, having<BR>
parties and meeting lots of new hivers, not by force of arms (or appendages,<BR>
as it were).<BR>
<BR>
They don't appear to me to have much interest in fighting. Indeed, I can't<BR>
think of any source that indicates that the Hivers ever fought anybody that<BR>
they didn't feel strongly threatened by.<BR>
<BR>
>They just prefer to do it from a nice clean starship and leave the mucking<BR>
>about in the mud and blood to the Ithklur.  Having been a PBI, I can't say<BR>
>I blame them.<BR>
<BR>
I honestly think that this is a mischaracterization of the Hivers.<BR>
<BR>
>>Of course, if they don't have an emotional state such as courage, it's<BR>
>>obviously a moot point because they are incapable of being cowards (they<BR>
>>would always be equally courageous, or equally cowardly).<BR>
><BR>
>They're sentient creatures! Of course they have courage and cowardice.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not sure that I see how one naturally follows from the other.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2360<BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 27 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2361<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
Re: expert witnesses<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2359<BR>
RE: Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
Airborne<BR>
Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
Re: What happens to the little merchant?<BR>
Re: Airborne<BR>
Keyboard warning!<BR>
Makes you go hmmm...<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
Re: Airborne<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:15:11 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Samuel D. Weiss said:<BR>
<BR>
>>Cowardice is, after all, the lack of courage in the face of danger. <<BR>
><BR>
>Cowardice is doing what is Wrong because it easier. Courage is doing what<BR>
is<BR>
>Right despite your fear. (Please note the use of capitals in the<BR>
preceding.)<BR>
<BR>
I note the use of capitals, but I have no idea what it is you're talking<BR>
about.<BR>
<BR>
>Simply lacking courage is not being cowardly.<BR>
<BR>
You're right, the absence of courage in the face of danger is, however.<BR>
<BR>
>As well, recall that a rational army would run away. (Even if I am<BR>
forgetting<BR>
>who said that. Anybody?) Indeed, I think if you ask any warrior if he LIKES<BR>
to<BR>
>go into a firefight he will give you a look as though you were less than<BR>
sane.<BR>
>(Or assume you are trying to be insulting. I assume no responsibility for<BR>
any<BR>
>field testing of this in such cases.)<BR>
<BR>
Um... Who said anything about anybody *liking* to go into firefight? It<BR>
certainly wasn't me.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:26:27 EDT<BR>
From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/26/00 3:24:02 PM !!!First Boot!!!, lkw@io.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< How many of you would like to see a GT Lite? >><BR>
<BR>
OH F**K YEAH!!!!! This is a GREAT idea to bring in fresh blood to <BR>
Traveller...Print it in the thousands and send them to EVERY FLGS and <BR>
convention on the planet...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:34:45 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
<BR>
Jason Kemp wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
><BR>
> > With only a 2 in 18 chance of rolling for more<BR>
> > Psionic skill, 3 in 24 if Edu8+, not a whole lot<BR>
> > of likelihood that these guys are too intimidating,<BR>
> > or even competent.<BR>
><BR>
> Competent, by what definition? What skill level is considered competent?<BR>
<BR>
You tell me.  CT skills are more significant than T4.<BR>
<BR>
> The Psionics skill is present to reflect the development of one's Psionic<BR>
> potential over time. Even in regular game play, after psionic training PCs<BR>
> start with a skill level-1 in their respective psi skills, IIRC, and must<BR>
> develop them later in game, through the passage of time and lots of<BR>
> practice.<BR>
<BR>
Unless they go for the Psionicist Career (T4)<BR>
Or Zhodani Nobles and Intendents (CT)<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> Thus, the Zar-Tis shouldn't be too much out of line with a PC who has<BR>
> learned his psionics during game play. Their biggest advantage is that they<BR>
> never suffer the -1 psi per term penalty for undeveloped potential.<BR>
><BR>
> > With T4, 4 in 36 is still pretty weak for psionic<BR>
> > skills.<BR>
><BR>
> But in T4, you can choose your skills from the tables if you want. At least,<BR>
> I thought you could, as one of the methods of character generation.<BR>
<BR>
If you can choose it there, you can choose it anywhere.<BR>
<BR>
> > Altogether, as constructed, its fairly likely that<BR>
> > most members of the Order will not have<BR>
> > Psionics at all, and not much Sabre either.<BR>
><BR>
> True, but not all of those generated are supposed to be Luke Skywalker or<BR>
> Qui-Gon either. Saber-1 or Saber-2 works for the general membership of the<BR>
> Order, at least conceptually. Also, under the material benefits section, the<BR>
> PC has a 1 in 3 chance per benefit role of acquiring a Saber. Every Saber<BR>
> roll after that adds another skill level. Consider a 7 term Zar-Tis. He<BR>
> will, on the average, under MT/CT generation, possess a Saber and about a<BR>
> Saber-3 skill, which is within reason, I believe.<BR>
<BR>
(and be too old for it to do him any good)  ;-)<BR>
<BR>
> But that was my rational behind the distribution of skills. Do you have any<BR>
> suggestions on how to fix it? Otherwise, I'll stumble blindly about and give<BR>
> it another go. :)<BR>
<BR>
I recommend taking a look at the T4 Psionicist (T4 p.128) and<BR>
CT Zhodani chargen systems (AM4), and tweak those to add<BR>
the other skills you want.<BR>
<BR>
In T4:<BR>
5/36 chance of rolling another Psi Level skill each year;<BR>
2/36 chance of increasing Psi attribute each year.<BR>
So at a minimum, a psionicist will Level-2 in one discipline<BR>
(Level-1 in the rest), with good chances of getting more<BR>
Levels.  If you pick em, character could walk out of one<BR>
term with Discipline-6 (one from exam, one automatic from<BR>
enlistment, one per year; if promoted, one more for Disc.-7)<BR>
<BR>
Also don't forget to deal with T4 skill inflation (T4 average<BR>
1.25 skills/year - including 4 before any career even starts)<BR>
Since skills are easier to get, their meaning is less significant<BR>
than in CT.<BR>
<BR>
> I appreciate the feedback, bloo. Keep it coming. (That is correct, right?<BR>
> bloo, without a capitol letter?)<BR>
<BR>
It doesn't matter.  My fingers get lazy.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:04:24 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
>I had this idea that the Sylean Federation had a Roman Axillaries thing<BR>
happening - where, from memory (so I am most likely wrong) - the empire<BR>
offered citizenship to troops from certain annexed provinces in return for<BR>
service (20 years?).<<BR>
<BR>
In Sylea, sure. It would be a great way of bringing people into the<BR>
Federation/new Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
>PS What's the deal with people from US protectorates like Puerto Rico<BR>
(spelling) joining the military. Can they? Do they get citizenship as a<BR>
result? Can other nation's join up before citizenship come's through?<<BR>
<BR>
Puerto Ricans are U.S. citizens. Have been for quite some time. They don't<BR>
need to do anything other than be born in PR to qualify. They have served in<BR>
the military fully since the Island was transferred from Spain at the end of<BR>
the Spanish-American War, which was before they were given citizenship.<BR>
Most nations allow non-citizens to serve in the military. Citizenship is not<BR>
always part of the severance package however, and often will be specifically<BR>
excluded depending on the nation in question.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:05:22 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: expert witnesses<BR>
<BR>
>But the *words* (testicles & testify) only go back to the Romans.<<BR>
<BR>
I meant  the concept, not the specific words.<BR>
<BR>
>Of course, that means juries tend to draw conclusions when the accused<BR>
declines to testify under veridication. :-)<<BR>
<BR>
Which would likely be illegal if American standards of jurisprudence hold<BR>
sway.<BR>
<BR>
>>>"Your Honor, the witness is being unresponsive..."<<BR>
><BR>
> "Excuse me your Honor.<BR>
> <to the lawyer><BR>
> Nothing."<BR>
<BR>
Huh?<<BR>
<BR>
If the lawyer doesn't want the full explanation, the witness gives the<BR>
short, fully accurate, slightly confusing to the observer one.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:05:32 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>I note the use of capitals, but I have no idea what it is you're talking<BR>
about.<<BR>
<BR>
I mean Right and Wrong as abstract philosophical and moral concepts, not<BR>
right and wrong as in "you should have dodged left instead of right". When<BR>
capitals are used for such words they typically indicate abstract concepts<BR>
rather than physical ones.<BR>
<BR>
>You're right, the absence of courage in the face of danger is, however.<<BR>
<BR>
Define what constitutes Courage here? If you mean choosing to fight when<BR>
confronted by force, I say you are wrong. Sometimes it takes significantly<BR>
more Courage not to fight. Likewise, calling someone a coward because they<BR>
choose life for themselves over some abstract concept of life for someone<BR>
else is also unfair. Choose to die for others yourself but do not be so bold<BR>
as to require it of others to meet some undefinable standard of behavior. As<BR>
well, someone overcome with fear because of a mental condition would<BR>
unfairly be tarred by this standard. Are K'kree total cowards because they<BR>
won't be alone or go into small places or leave meat eaters in peace? Extend<BR>
this enough, and every race in the TU is cowardly. They all fear to do<BR>
something for some reason or other.<BR>
<BR>
>Um... Who said anything about anybody *liking* to go into firefight? It<BR>
certainly wasn't me.<<BR>
<BR>
I don't say you. I say that presuming that Hivers are cowards because they<BR>
dislike personal combat does so. Just because they don't like some form of<BR>
combat has nothing to do with the strength of their moral convictions.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:05:13 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
>I think you may be being a little too literal minded.  Really all we need<BR>
to insist on are that there are regular units in the Imperial and/or<BR>
planetary military forces drawn from populations outside the Imperium.<BR>
This is no big deal.<<BR>
<BR>
Not really. I think there are significant differences between groups like<BR>
the FFL and the Gurkha regiments. Using the name for one when you mean<BR>
something like the other simply causes confusion.<BR>
<BR>
>The fact is that the Swiss Guard are just a relic of a period when just<BR>
about every nation in Europe was using foreign mercenaries.  Granted, the<BR>
Swiss had a bit of a reputation, but it had pretty much faded by the 17th<BR>
century.<<BR>
<BR>
Excuse me? Faded? So that is why they were prohibited by international<BR>
treaty from serving as anything but the Pope's guard? Hardly seems like a<BR>
"faded" rep to me. Now if you mean their domination of the battle field had<BR>
faded, I agree. But their reputation was more than intact into the 19th<BR>
century.<BR>
<BR>
>Nonsense.  Robots can't do everything.  That's why the Hivers use the<BR>
Ithklur.  I suspect they would use other races too, when it is necessary.<<BR>
<BR>
Hivers had the best modern robots in CT and MT. If that has changed, so be<BR>
it. But starting with Book 8 Hivers had entire armies composed entirely of<BR>
robots. Given a choice between making more or letting an immature species<BR>
have more dangerous toys, I strongly suspect they would build more robots.<BR>
<BR>
>It's not.  GT:AR2 is quite explicit on there being subject race troops, and<BR>
on foreign mercenaries being used.  Whether or not any of these would count<BR>
as a suitable analogy is another question.  Perhaps not.  I haven't checked<BR>
the CT Alien Module, but I don't recall it contradicting AR2.<<BR>
<BR>
It is strongly implied that they don't in other places. AM2 says nothing<BR>
about subject races in the military and says there are no K'kree<BR>
mercenaries. B8 says they K'kree have a general distrust of non-K'kree with<BR>
weapons and JTAS21 has a Contact: article on a K'kree minor race that has a<BR>
police force but no military, said race being the one with the highest<BR>
standing among K'kree subject races.<BR>
<BR>
>But the FFL aren't all criminals.  For example, during World War II there<BR>
were lots of Spanish Republicans, and anti-Nazi Germans.<<BR>
<BR>
That's fine. What about the ones who are?<BR>
<BR>
>n any case, there are stacks of human worlds in Fteirle space to recruit<BR>
from, and not all their troops are sepoys.  In addition, recruits from the<BR>
Imperium, the Solomani Confederation (not all Solomani are pinheads), and<BR>
minor states are all quite possible.  <<BR>
<BR>
Humans would be culturally Fteirle to begin with if within the Hierate.<BR>
Outside recruits would have to perform to Fteirle cultural standards as<BR>
mentioned or the hiring Clan would lose honor. Why take that chance?<BR>
<BR>
>For that matter, it's not unknown in canon for Aslan to serve as<BR>
mercenaries themselves, although there wouldn't be much point in pushing<BR>
the analogy too far here.<<BR>
<BR>
Mercenaries for land. How many humans would work for such?<BR>
<BR>
>Except that leading human troops is less charismatic than leading other<BR>
Vargr!  (Of course, Vargr still use human troops, they just don't brag<BR>
about it.)<<BR>
<BR>
Exactly.<BR>
Indeed, I'd say certain Vargr might prefer human troops knowing they won't<BR>
run off when they feel their Charisma is threatened.<BR>
<BR>
>True.  There are Ine Givar exiles "out there" in MTU though.  They mainly<BR>
hang out in the Federation of Arden, or independent worlds.  Come to think<BR>
of it, Arden is a _very_ likely candidate to have a Legion.<<BR>
<BR>
Arden, yes. The Imperium no. Bear in mind, I keep saying it would not be an<BR>
Imperial artifact.<BR>
<BR>
>Maybe.  The documented case of a governor using Vargr allies was an "in<BR>
decline" case, and in any case, there is no evidence to suggest that they<BR>
were part of his regular forces.  Were there subject troops?  Perhaps, but<BR>
there are more likely to be sepoy-types.<<BR>
<BR>
Hard to say. I can't see "true" Vilani recognizing such though. Too untidy<BR>
and not the way things are done.<BR>
<BR>
>In general, I think you are being a bit dogmatic in your perception of what<BR>
the Legion is.  Granted, I think other people on the list may have a<BR>
somewhat romanticised version of it, too, but if we want to use it as an<BR>
analogy for interesting military units in the TU, then we can go ahead<BR>
without much problem.<<BR>
<BR>
*shrug*<BR>
Possibly. I see the FFL having a specific history and organization that<BR>
wouldn't fit into 1100 era Imperial operations. As mentioned, Sylean and<BR>
Pacification campaign era, sure. But not after the end of the Civil Wars.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:11:37 -0400<BR>
From: Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Every reference stats that Hivers don't like to fight, but will.  <BR>
<BR>
The same applies to the K'kree. There are K'kree tank drivers. Most<BR>
K'kree would probably die, quite literally, of shock if forced into<BR>
such a confined space. Perhaps somewhere out there is the Hiver <BR>
equivalent of Jacky Chan.<BR>
<BR>
> They're sentient creatures! Of course they have courage and cowardice.<BR>
<BR>
I dunno Doug. Sounds pretty rubber-suit-ish to me. I doubt if you can <BR>
get two humans to agree on what courage is, much less say Hivers have<BR>
whatever it is we call it.<BR>
- --<BR>
Ethan Henry                                         egh@klg.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:24:42 +0100<BR>
From: Ewan Quibell <E.D.Quibell@bton.ac.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2359<BR>
<BR>
GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> In a message dated 00-04-27 06:08:33 EDT, you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> << Just as an aside, how dose GT stack up to other GURPS stuff in volume of<BR>
>  sales ? or are you not a liberty to say ?<BR>
>   >><BR>
> <BR>
> I don't have the exact numbers, but GT is one of SJ Games better-sellers.<BR>
> Initial orders are large, and sell-thru is good. Witness we had to do a<BR>
> second printing of GT within a year of original publication.<BR>
> <BR>
> LKW<BR>
<BR>
Good news for Traveller then. What was the GT's initial print run ?<BR>
(again if you don't mind me asking and it won't take too long to find<BR>
out the figures).<BR>
<BR>
Ewan<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
   Ewan Quibell                       Their's not to make reply,<BR>
   Senior Communications Engineer     Their's not to reason why,<BR>
   Computer Centre                    Their's but to do and die:<BR>
   University of Brighton             Into the valley of Death<BR>
                                      Rode the six hundred.<BR>
   E.D.Quibell@brighton.ac.uk              Alfred, Lord Tennyson<BR>
<BR>
   #include<stddisclaimer.h><BR>
<BR>
   My spelling is entirerly due to dyslexia, typos, and poetic license<BR>
<BR>
   University of Brighton - Sunday Times' University of the Year<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:19:02 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
<BR>
The e-mails which I have received make it clear that I should have described<BR>
what Aide de Camp is in more detail.<BR>
<BR>
Aide de Camp is software which lets you create electronic copies of<BR>
boardgames or cardgames and then play them, either on your computer or by<BR>
e-mail. You create what amounts to an electronic copy of the pieces and<BR>
board, so you need the rules to play the game. More information is available<BR>
at http://www.hpssims.com/adc2.htm.<BR>
<BR>
Since Fifth Frontier War is the Greatest Game Ever Written, I thought that<BR>
the universe (which is apparently flat, judging from the headline in today's<BR>
paper) would benefit greatly from the creation of an electronic version, but<BR>
more importantly, I wanted a chance to play it again.<BR>
<BR>
Anyway, it turns out that creating an electronic copy of the board and<BR>
pieces is fairly involved and time-consuming, so to make sure that I work<BR>
out all of the bugs before working on the Greatest Game Ever Written, I<BR>
decided to start with a simpler game, like Mayday.<BR>
<BR>
So far, I have found that making the game pieces takes quite a bit of time.<BR>
Fortunately, the board for Mayday is fairly simple.  Another plus is that I<BR>
will now have a way to kill time on those annoying flights from San<BR>
Francisco to Singapore.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:16:39 -0700<BR>
From: scharlto@ifsna.com<BR>
Subject: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
> Adverse does not mean unable.  Humans are have an adverse<BR>
reaction to great<BR>
> heights.  But the 82nd Airborne Division has over 10,000<BR>
people who make<BR>
> their living jumping out of airplanes.<BR>
- - --<BR>
<BR>
Well, yeah, but thats Airborne.  They're "differently abled", if<BR>
you know what I mean.<BR>
<BR>
Steven Charlton<BR>
Fully in control of mental abilities<BR>
Not even remotely Airborne<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:24:24 -0700<BR>
From: scharlto@ifsna.com<BR>
Subject: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
Hey Loren or Jesse or whoever<BR>
<BR>
Anyone ever suggested putting the full color versions of the<BR>
stuff Jesse has done for the GT books up on the Pyramid site (or<BR>
better yet the JTAS site).  Jesse's stuff deserves to be seen in<BR>
color, I think.<BR>
<BR>
And in general, I like the idea of GT Lite, particularly with a<BR>
Jesse cover.  And I like the GT: Cutter book idea too, but then<BR>
I was excited by it when it was a GDW project too.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Steven Charlton<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:46:26<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
At 12:25 AM 4/27/2000 PST, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> I created an organization years ago for the 3i simply called the Imperial<BR>
>> Legion. They were primarily troops gathered from worlds willing to export<BR>
>> any criminals sentenced to life or death sentences.  They were issued<BR>
>> inexpensive armor and weapons, and used to assault fortifications that <BR>
>> would make marines nervous. They were not expected to live. They WERE <BR>
>> expected to soften up the resistance for the next wave of the imperial <BR>
>> military units.<BR>
><BR>
>You need a reason for them to be *willing* to assualt the positions<BR>
>rather than just be executed. I'd go for extending the recruiting down<BR>
>to anyone serving long sentences for violent crimes. <BR>
<BR>
Really, I'd expect that many of the IL "assaults" would end with white<BR>
flags and the Legionaires inside the fortification spilling their guts,<BR>
telling everything they know about the regular assault.<BR>
<BR>
>Addict the troops to a drug. Perform well, and they get their doses.<BR>
>Desert, and die from withdrawal. <BR>
<BR>
Kill the officers, hijack the supply ship.<BR>
<BR>
>Sort of a biker gang with some training and discipline. Moralistic<BR>
>types will have a *fit* at the stuff that goes on in "quarters". Girls,<BR>
>boys, gambling (no drugs except their regular issue, which gives them a<BR>
>bad reaction to alcohol and "street drugs"). <BR>
<BR>
There have been armies like through history, and they only win by<BR>
overwhelming their foes with numbers.<BR>
<BR>
>Typical response to anyone raising objections to the stuff these<BR>
>"troops" are allowed to get away with between missions:<BR>
><BR>
>"Look, we're sending them out to *die*. We know it, they know it.<BR>
>Letting them spending their pay on hookers and gambling is the least we<BR>
>can do.  Besides, it all winds up back in our funding anyway...."<BR>
<BR>
<trooper>"Yeah, you want me to go fight now? [deleted] you, you [deleted]<BR>
[deleted] of a [deleted].  I ain't going anywhere.  Y'all can shoot me<BR>
where I sit."</trooper><BR>
<BR>
To make good suicide squads, you need fanatics, either religious or<BR>
political.  In general giving less-than-dedicated people heavy weapons is a<BR>
bad idea.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:59:44<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
At 06:50 AM 4/28/2000 +1000, you wrote:<BR>
>I created an organization years ago for the 3i simply called the Imperial<BR>
>Legion. They were primarily troops gathered from worlds willing to export<BR>
>any criminals sentenced to life or death sentences.  They were issued<BR>
>inexpensive armor and weapons, and used to assault fortifications that would<BR>
>make marines nervous. They were not expected to live. They WERE expected to<BR>
>soften up the resistance for the next wave of the imperial military units.<BR>
<BR>
"Get in the boat."<BR>
<BR>
"Screw you."<BR>
<BR>
"Listen Jones, get in the bloody boat!"<BR>
<BR>
"No way in Hades, I'm staying in this nice bunk.  Ain't no way Mama Jones'<BR>
little boy is going to go die for the glory of the damn Imperium."<BR>
<BR>
This might also violate the laws against slavery.<BR>
<BR>
>PS What's the deal with people from US protectorates like Puerto Rico<BR>
>(spelling) joining the military. Can they? Do they get citizenship as a<BR>
>result? Can other nation's join up before citizenship come's through?<BR>
<BR>
Puerto Ricans are US citizens, as are the residents of other US<BR>
possessions.  Foreigners do join the military (I went through OSUT with a<BR>
German), but they have to have permanent residence status when they enlist.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"But that's not the point!" raged Ford. "The point is that I am now a<BR>
perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of<BR>
limbs!"  - The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 10:02:34<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: What happens to the little merchant?<BR>
<BR>
At 07:39 AM 4/27/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Somehow I picture the free trader merchant class as serving esoteric niches<BR>
>in the economy.<BR>
<BR>
You got it.  The little guys work around the fringes, picking up the odd<BR>
lots and strange cargoes that the big guys miss.  They also hit the low pop<BR>
worlds that aren't worth the attention of the larger corps.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 10:04:52<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
At 09:16 AM 4/27/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Well, yeah, but thats Airborne.  They're "differently abled", if<BR>
>you know what I mean.<BR>
<BR>
The C-130 is over a battlefield filled with AAA and SAMs.  The paratrooper<BR>
is standing in the door with a chute, his weapon, and another sixty pounds<BR>
of supplies, ready to jump.  The pilot is strapped into his chair.  Most<BR>
planes get shot down leaving the target area.<BR>
<BR>
You make the call on who is smarter in this situation  :)<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 10:14:46<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Keyboard warning!<BR>
<BR>
Before opening this link:<BR>
<BR>
Swallow any and all liquids or foodstuffs.<BR>
<BR>
Warn co-workers that explosive laughter may soon come from your workspace.<BR>
<BR>
Ready?<BR>
<BR>
http://www.linuxrangers.com/<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"But that's not the point!" raged Ford. "The point is that I am now a<BR>
perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of<BR>
limbs!"  - The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 10:22:15<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Makes you go hmmm...<BR>
<BR>
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2000/04/27/MN106337.DTL&nl=fix<BR>
<BR>
The universe is evidently flat, just like Marc and Loren told us in 1977..<BR>
just who are these guys?<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry      gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
   http://gridlore.home.mondspring.com<BR>
<BR>
"A mrgs einu sinni hluti minn systir..."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:13:53 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>Every reference stats that Hivers don't like to fight, but will.  We have<BR>
>examples of Hiver weaponry after all.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Oh, another point I noticed today. According to Book 8, the Hivers have very<BR>
sophisticated Warbots, and use them heavily in ground combat.<BR>
<BR>
That kinda fits my view of the Hivers.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:35:43 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
<BR>
>In all my years (not that I'm old like Leonard or anything), but I've never<BR>
>heard of Security Leak magazine until today.  I was downloading and saving<BR>
>the individual images from the Zhodani Core Exploration issue faster than I<BR>
>can read it (which I'll probably do tomorrow).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Me either, but then I'm the list baby, aren't I?<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:57:10 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
>Well, yeah, but thats Airborne.  They're "differently abled", if<BR>
>you know what I mean.<BR>
><BR>
>Steven Charlton<BR>
>Fully in control of mental abilities<BR>
>Not even remotely Airborne<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
How does that song go?<BR>
"Airborne rangers jump from planes,<BR>
They ain't got......err....I forget how it ends.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
<running off><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:58:14 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
>Just as an aside, how dose GT stack up to other GURPS stuff in volume of<BR>
>sales ? or are you not a liberty to say ?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I don't know, having no connections with SJG except for sending them half of<BR>
my income, but from the writers section of their website it seems to be one<BR>
of the two big GURPS projects at the moment (the other being GURPS:In<BR>
Nomine).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Oh, and by the way - my Friendly Local Game Store owner, Phil, managed to<BR>
track me down a copy of FFS2 which I picked up today, so thankyou to you all<BR>
who offered suggestions and help trying to find copies.<BR>
<BR>
I also picked up the Big Floppy Book of CT reprints. I got a strange sense<BR>
of nostalgia from reading through it, despite the fact I've only been<BR>
playing Trav for three years (and wasn't actually conceived when CT was<BR>
first published...). Must be from hanging around here with you guys, I<BR>
guess...<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2361<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2362</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 27 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2362<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens <BR>
Re: Airborne<BR>
Re: GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
RE: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
RE: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
RE: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations (was Re Camerone) (Long)<BR>
Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Re: New & Old<BR>
Hivers<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re US Citizens in US Military<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 10:03:18 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens <BR>
<BR>
shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) wrote<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
> > "Brottah Forsythe hahv yew counsidderred thaat the juump draiv<BR>
> > ais up tuh saix parsex and a misjuump ais up tew thoirtysaix <BR>
> > parsex (6^6) witch clairly shews te eevil, aatheiistic, plotts<BR>
> > of them DROYNe haythans.<BR>
<BR>
> Excuse me... 6^6 is 46656 parsecs... or about halfway across the galaxy.<BR>
<BR>
Yes it is. I deliberately wrote it wrong to show that the<BR>
character in question was mathematically illiterate. He should<BR>
have written 6 x 6. I did not want to spoil the style by<BR>
footnoting the Most Reverend Eminence Doctor Emile St. John<BR>
Prozlowskis errors. (Given that his whole statement was factually<BR>
wrong I'd have needed a _lot_ of footnotes).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:02:18 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
>The C-130 is over a battlefield filled with AAA and SAMs.  The paratrooper<BR>
>is standing in the door with a chute, his weapon, and another sixty pounds<BR>
>of supplies, ready to jump.  The pilot is strapped into his chair.  Most<BR>
>planes get shot down leaving the target area.<BR>
><BR>
>You make the call on who is smarter in this situation  :)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Me. I'm two thousand miles away designing a submarine.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:05:42 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
<BR>
>Title say's it all<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Woo-heee-ha! Have I been waiting for that....<BR>
Download complete.<BR>
<BR>
I'll get back to y'all in a couple of hours, after I've read through it.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:11:30<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
At 06:58 PM 4/27/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>>Just as an aside, how dose GT stack up to other GURPS stuff in volume of<BR>
>>sales ? or are you not a liberty to say ?<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
>Oh, and by the way - my Friendly Local Game Store owner, Phil, managed to<BR>
>track me down a copy of FFS2 which I picked up today, so thankyou to you all<BR>
>who offered suggestions and help trying to find copies.<BR>
<BR>
I ask at my FLGS, and they tell me that GT stuff flies off the shelves.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:18:53 +0100<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> I also picked up the Big Floppy Book of CT reprints. I got a <BR>
> strange sense of nostalgia from reading through it, despite the<BR>
> fact I've only been playing Trav for three years (and wasn't<BR>
> actually conceived when CT was first published...).<BR>
<BR>
S**t, now I feel old!  :-(<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 13:32:55 -0500<BR>
From: Jason Kemp <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: Re: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
<BR>
> > Competent, by what definition? What skill level is <BR>
> considered competent?<BR>
> <BR>
> You tell me.  CT skills are more significant than T4.<BR>
<BR>
Good point. I often forget that in considering these things.<BR>
<BR>
> Unless they go for the Psionicist Career (T4)<BR>
> Or Zhodani Nobles and Intendents (CT)<BR>
<BR>
True, but in the case of the Psionicist career (T4), they handle Psionics<BR>
the same way I tried to approach them with the Zar-Tis. That was the<BR>
inspiration for the Psionics cascade group, actually.<BR>
<BR>
Zhodani Nobles and Intendents (CT) start with their skills fully developed<BR>
by the time they start their careers due to the Zhodani culture, IIRC, and<BR>
so it's not the same as the situation we're looking at here. I could be<BR>
wrong, however, and would welcome specific quotes from the source material<BR>
if such is available. (I no longer have CT's AMs, so I am of no help here.)<BR>
<BR>
> If you can choose it there, you can choose it anywhere.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, but T4 was the first time I'd actually seen the rule in print. :)<BR>
<BR>
> > PC has a 1 in 3 chance per benefit role of acquiring a <BR>
> Saber. Every Saber<BR>
> > roll after that adds another skill level. Consider a 7 term <BR>
> Zar-Tis. He<BR>
> > will, on the average, under MT/CT generation, possess a <BR>
> Saber and about a<BR>
> > Saber-3 skill, which is within reason, I believe.<BR>
> <BR>
> (and be too old for it to do him any good)  ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Good point, but he's a natural for the Ol' Ben role, eh?<BR>
<BR>
Okay, so I need to up the frequency of Psionics and Saber skill. Got it.<BR>
<BR>
> I recommend taking a look at the T4 Psionicist (T4 p.128) and<BR>
> CT Zhodani chargen systems (AM4), and tweak those to add<BR>
> the other skills you want.<BR>
<BR>
Don't have AM4, unfortunately. Do you know if they're going to be among the<BR>
reprints converted to BFB format?<BR>
<BR>
> In T4:<BR>
> 5/36 chance of rolling another Psi Level skill each year;<BR>
> 2/36 chance of increasing Psi attribute each year.<BR>
> So at a minimum, a psionicist will Level-2 in one discipline<BR>
> (Level-1 in the rest), with good chances of getting more<BR>
> Levels.  If you pick em, character could walk out of one<BR>
> term with Discipline-6 (one from exam, one automatic from<BR>
> enlistment, one per year; if promoted, one more for Disc.-7)<BR>
<BR>
Very nice analysis. (Of course, the same process and skill selection works<BR>
with my presented T4 gen method as well, except for the one from enlistment.<BR>
There, you trade Saber-1 for one level of Psionics for the first term, but<BR>
that's why you're a Zar-Tis Knight and not a Psionicist.) I can work with<BR>
that. I'll have to get my books out when I get home later this evening, and<BR>
give the Psionicist a once over for conversion purposes.<BR>
<BR>
> Also don't forget to deal with T4 skill inflation (T4 average<BR>
> 1.25 skills/year - including 4 before any career even starts)<BR>
> Since skills are easier to get, their meaning is less significant<BR>
> than in CT.<BR>
<BR>
Again, I tend to forget about this. Obviously, I'm not playing nearly as<BR>
much as I should be. :)<BR>
<BR>
Also, Psionics works a bit differently in T4 than it does in MT. So the<BR>
levels have a slightly different meaning there, too.<BR>
<BR>
Perhaps I should consider creating a Psionicist prior career for CT and MT<BR>
at some point, through converting the T4 prior career. Hmmmm.... (Unless<BR>
someone else already has a handle on that. Anyone?)<BR>
<BR>
Thanks, bloo,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 13:27:18 -0500<BR>
From: "Smart, David J (David)" <dasmart@lucent.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
scharlto@ifsna.com posted:<BR>
> <BR>
> Hey Loren or Jesse or whoever<BR>
> <BR>
> Anyone ever suggested putting the full color versions of the<BR>
> stuff Jesse has done for the GT books up on the Pyramid site (or<BR>
> better yet the JTAS site).  Jesse's stuff deserves to be seen in<BR>
> color, I think.<BR>
> <BR>
> And in general, I like the idea of GT Lite, particularly with a<BR>
> Jesse cover.  And I like the GT: Cutter book idea too, but then<BR>
> I was excited by it when it was a GDW project too.<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> Steven Charlton<BR>
<BR>
OR............<BR>
<BR>
Loren,<BR>
<BR>
How about SJG putting together a "Best of Traveller Art" book with<BR>
as many color plates from Jesse and other excellent Traveller artists<BR>
as economically feasible and selling it throughout the world?<BR>
<BR>
That way as many people as possible have access to it and SJG, Jesse,<BR>
et all make a mint (hopefully) and you hit another home run for SJG?<BR>
<BR>
Anybody other than me want, say, 15-30 pages of 8.5x11 color plates of<BR>
awesome artwork you can show other players? Especially if each plate<BR>
had a text explanation in the back of the book which describes the plate's<BR>
subject and can be used in-game?<BR>
<BR>
How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published <BR>
centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
Collect them all!<BR>
<BR>
David Smart<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:37:45 +0100<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
David Smart wrote:<BR>
> How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published <BR>
> centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
> Collect them all!<BR>
<BR>
Now that I'd buy.<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:55:05 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/27/00 9:11 AM, egh@klg.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Perhaps somewhere out there is the Hiver<BR>
> equivalent of Jacky Chan.<BR>
<BR>
Now this could make an amusing sight! ;)<BR>
<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
BZAT: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/index.html<BR>
Lanth6: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Lanth6/Main.html<BR>
E-mail: xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:59:08 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations (was Re Camerone) (Long)<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> > *Swiss Guards of the Vatican (now purely ceremonial, but in their day the<BR>
> > MM-F (please don't ask me to explain this one, work it out....) on the<BR>
> > European continent<BR>
> <BR>
> Actually, they are both ceremonial *and* practical. They do guard<BR>
> mounts in the fancy outfits, just like the Coldstream Guard in their<BR>
> "traditional" uniforms guarding Buckingham Palace.<BR>
> <BR>
> But both units have quite modern weapons ready to hand, as well as<BR>
> folks in more practical uniforms in reserve.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, also, those guys in dark suits with earplugs in their ears<BR>
surrounding the Pope when he travels are also Swiss Guards.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:00:35 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/27/00 9:24 AM, scharlto@ifsna.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Anyone ever suggested putting the full color versions of the<BR>
> stuff Jesse has done for the GT books up on the Pyramid site (or<BR>
> better yet the JTAS site).  Jesse's stuff deserves to be seen in<BR>
> color, I think.<BR>
<BR>
Jesse's art /can/ be seen in color at his site:<BR>
http://vision-forge-graphics.com/jesse/traveller/trav_welcome.htm<BR>
<BR>
However, are there any plans to put together a book of Traveller art? Maybe<BR>
a series? Featuring Jesse of course, with maybe a few other artists, both<BR>
finished works and concept drawings.<BR>
<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
BZAT: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/index.html<BR>
Lanth6: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Lanth6/Main.html<BR>
E-mail: xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:10:52 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: New & Old<BR>
<BR>
At 11:14 -0400 27/4/00, "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com> wrote:<BR>
>Long may BITS sit across the divide! (that is GT:Trav (CT, MT. TNE, T4,<BR>
>....)<BR>
<BR>
Let's just say getting into a specific niche other than 'Traveller' <BR>
isn't too attractive ;-)<BR>
<BR>
>Seriously, BITS has actually made T4 both workable and (almost) respectable.<BR>
>By producing such high quality products they are at the moment (IMHO at<BR>
>least) the current home of "Classic Traveller" (as opposed to GT).  I<BR>
>haven't yet sighted a poor review of their products, have bought most<BR>
>myself, and they have faithfully kept to Marc Millers original<BR>
>"philosophical view" that Traveller should be good, 'wholesome', (sci-fi<BR>
>based) fun (Marc, if you're listening, you'd do worse than to look at this<BR>
>BITS bunch seriously as publishers of T5).<BR>
<BR>
<blush> On a serious note, I would look to the likes of SJ Games as a <BR>
publisher - we are not really a profit making organisation (we make a <BR>
small amount), and barring a lottery win I don't see either Andy or <BR>
myself giving up our real life (200 mile divergent) engineering <BR>
project management jobs for BITS. Bills to pay etc.<BR>
<BR>
This isn't a winge - just we acknowledge that BITS is a hobby to us - <BR>
after discussion with Andy Slack (CT, 2300, GT, BITS) who used to <BR>
work for Games Workshop (not GDW) it is apparent that it isn't really <BR>
financial viable to do this as a career (unless maybe we moved to the <BR>
US) unless we live in bedsits. But, I like my real job, and I just <BR>
feel privileged to be able to write stuff for the game that really <BR>
fired me up about RPGs. Naturally, I'd hope that there is scope for <BR>
CORE (http://www.core.org.uk/) to contribute to T5 in the future.<BR>
<BR>
Cheers<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:12:00 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Hivers<BR>
<BR>
>>They're sentient creatures! Of course they have courage and cowardice.<BR>
><BR>
>I'm not sure that I see how one naturally follows from the other.<BR>
<BR>
Courage: The ability to get done those things which need to be done, but<BR>
your natural (Physical/Psychological) make-up tries to prevent.<BR>
<BR>
Cowardice: running and hiding simply because it's easier than facing the<BR>
situation.<BR>
<BR>
They might not exist as EMOTIONAL states, but will exist somehow by<BR>
non-emotional cases.<BR>
<BR>
Besides, according to CT, all hivers should have the curiosity disad; some<BR>
would make combat the focus of their curiosity. a very small fraction, mind<BR>
you, but some.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 20:17:02 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
Glenn (and Nick thusly >) wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >I know canon says that magnetic fields (like psi-shield<BR>
> >helmets or power stations) can interrupt psionic activity,<BR>
> >but does it actually nail it down any further than that?<BR>
> >Presumeably if they bother building psi-shield helmets a<BR>
> >simple Faraday cage won't work?<BR>
>Maybe a psi shield is a simple Faraday cage with good<BR>
>marketing, good timing (during pre-war psi hysteria), and a<BR>
>premium price for the extra gullible.  It seems to me that<BR>
>the first (and maybe only) canon reference to psi shields<BR>
>is an advertisement or a press release by the manufacturer.<BR>
<BR>
Let's take this another way - maybe psi-shields are just a <BR>
psychological way of making the non-Psi talented *believe* they have, <BR>
and thus create their own natural shield. Sort of a psychosomatic <BR>
effect, all in the mind...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 20:07:55 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
At 14:01 -0400 27/4/00, Sethkimmel@aol.com wrote:<BR>
><< How many of you would like to see a GT Lite? >><BR>
><BR>
>OH F**K YEAH!!!!! This is a GREAT idea to bring in fresh blood to<BR>
>Traveller...Print it in the thousands and send them to EVERY FLGS and<BR>
>convention on the planet...<BR>
<BR>
Faded Suns 1st Edition had a similar background pack; I got a copy <BR>
from the Noble Armada set.<BR>
<BR>
And no, I don't just play Traveller ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:18:52 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re US Citizens in US Military<BR>
<BR>
>>PS What's the deal with people from US protectorates like Puerto Rico<BR>
>(spelling) joining the military. Can they? Do they get citizenship as a<BR>
>result? Can other nation's join up before citizenship come's through?<<BR>
><BR>
find a roster of those US Soldiers awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor<BR>
(IE, before it became the Medal of Honor). Look up one Ted Bradley, USMC.<BR>
Born in Islington England. Had to become a US citizen to make E6, as I<BR>
recall.<BR>
<BR>
It's always been easy to join the US military. Making rank, however, is<BR>
another story.<BR>
<BR>
When I did army basic, we had one Puerto Rican, one korean, one samoan, and<BR>
one brit in my company. No distinction made at all in how they were<BR>
treated. Well, Nuygen recycled 4 times for injuries, but...<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:47:01 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:59:14 -0400, Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> James W. Lindsay said:<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> >> - Hivers are ungainly. It would appear that it would be somewhat awkward<BR>
> in<BR>
> >> turning. The placement of their manipulative appendages is such that it<BR>
> >> could be very difficult for the poor critters the wheel around, to change<BR>
> >> facing and direction. This is absolutely essential in both hand-to-hand<BR>
> and<BR>
> >> ranged combat.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >I'm not too sure about that either.  IIRC, Hiver limbs are more dexterous,<BR>
> >but not as strong as a human.  And I'd think that having six limbs with<BR>
> >more or less the same "function" would be a benefit, since you wouldn't<BR>
> >necessarily have to turn to attack an opponent on your flank or at your<BR>
> >rear.  Horses (and centaurs) don't.<BR>
> <BR>
> The limbs may be dextrous, but unless I see a Hiver in action, I won't be<BR>
> convinced that they would not be awkward in combat. Just because the six<BR>
> limbs can be used as arms or legs doesn't mean that this would be<BR>
> comfortable or desirable. It appears that, for all intents and purposes,<BR>
> they walk on four limbs (at least this is how they are always illustrated).<BR>
> I'm trying to imagine *how* they would wield weapons, and it seems<BR>
> difficult.<BR>
<BR>
From a Hiver viewpoint, us humanoids might appear "awkward" in HTH combat.<BR>
"Look at those strange creatures-- balanced on those two spindly legs.<BR>
Their limb movements seem so restricted and they have to turn their<BR>
top-heavy bodies around in order to face a threat from behind!"<BR>
<BR>
> The best I can come up with is that they would use their "rear" hand (the<BR>
> one opposite the head) to grip a weapon, but their lower strength and<BR>
> bizarre form might make using such a weapon effectively somewhat difficult.<BR>
<BR>
I always thought that they would use such weaponry in their "front" hand,<BR>
since *it* is the one with the eyes.  Eyes sighting parallel with the<BR>
weapon's barrel would be a lot more accurate than the Hiver equivalent of<BR>
"shooting from the hip".<BR>
<BR>
> >We had a similar discussion when it came to applying Hivers (and Centaurs)<BR>
> >to ACQ.  Exactly how does a Hiver climb a ladder between starship decks?<BR>
> >Can a Hiver even pass through an iris valve or hatch designed for humanoid<BR>
> >use?  Etc.<BR>
> <BR>
> It makes sense that such things would come up.<BR>
<BR>
It was actually me who asked Doug these very questions.  He seemed to think<BR>
that Hivers weren't as sloth-like as I originally thought.<BR>
<BR>
BTW: The "aliens" section of ACQ is probably its weakest area.  I admit it.<BR>
Lots of important stuff was left out due to a lack of playtested aliens and<BR>
a lack of space in the final version.  To be fair, *alien* aliens such as<BR>
the Hivers and K'kree really require their own dedicated combat system.  I<BR>
hope that Doug and I will be forgiven :)<BR>
<BR>
> >> - Hivers are relatively big targets. They are effectively the same size<BR>
> from<BR>
> >> all sides. Due to their bulk, finding appropriate cover could be<BR>
> difficult.<BR>
> >> Humans can drop to the ground to reduce their profile in the face of<BR>
> missile<BR>
> >> weapons. Hivers cannot.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >They do have a lower center of gravity, however.<BR>
> <BR>
> Fair enough. So they have something going for them. :)<BR>
> <BR>
> On the other hand, their central bulk is "solid". I'm not sure how well it<BR>
> would stand up to impact.<BR>
<BR>
But it is heavily armoured-- more so than our own skulls I might think.<BR>
<BR>
> >I'm sure that over millions of years of evolution, Hivers have gotten just<BR>
> >as good as the rest of us at protecting themselves when it comes to combat.<BR>
> >Granted, that ability may be more slanted towards detecting such a conflict<BR>
> >before it actually happens.  I'll have to reread the Hiver AM...<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm not sure about this. Everything I've read about seems to indicate that<BR>
> they don't involve themselves in ground combat at all, and there is good<BR>
> reason to believe that the entire concept of war was alien to them for a<BR>
> huge chunk of their history. Further, the internal policy of the Hive<BR>
> Federation is based around the (scientific) manipulation of the member<BR>
> races, as well as their neighbors. Hivers defend themselves by making sure<BR>
> that no one around them has an interest in beating the snot out of them.<BR>
<BR>
Possibly.  It is also equally possible that Hivers were at one point in<BR>
their history better at ground combat than they are now, just as the<BR>
"average" homo sapien was better at hunting 10,000 years ago than we are<BR>
now (although our ATM skills are probably a little bit better than theirs).<BR>
Technology and intellect have replaced cunning and instinct.<BR>
<BR>
Hivers *had* to be combat effective at one point.  It only makes sense.<BR>
They can't manipulate *every* potential foe.  Manipulation takes years.  A<BR>
whack upside the head takes a fraction of a second.  Our disagreement on<BR>
this point probably revolves around the *degree* of this effectiveness in<BR>
combat.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
The Definition of an Upgrade: Take old bugs out, put new ones in.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:47:02 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:15:07 -0400, Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> The stability comes at the high price of the use of its arms. They have five<BR>
> limbs which they may use as arms or legs, but it appears to me that at least<BR>
> three would have to be planted at any time in order to stand. This is due to<BR>
> the width of their central, inflexible, bulk. It looks like four would be<BR>
> required in order to move in an effective fashion. Their "rear" appendage<BR>
> would be the best candidate for weapon use.<BR>
<BR>
Then again, they can also do hand-stands using only one "limb"-- if you<BR>
assume that the picture in the CT Alien Module is canon :)<BR>
<BR>
> They are always pictured as being ungainly.<BR>
<BR>
And rhinos typically appear ungainly too.  Large heavy bodies, short "wheel<BR>
base", etc.  The octopus too seems utterly incapable of moving at any great<BR>
speed.  Luckily we have actual fluid footage of rhinos and octopi in action<BR>
to prove otherwise.  The same is not true of an actual Hiver :(  What we<BR>
need is the educated opinion of an actual zoologist...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
The Definition of an Upgrade: Take old bugs out, put new ones in.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:47:04 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 01:15:08 PST, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> > Would'nt psi-shield helmets cause medical problems from long<BR>
> > term exposure to the helmets electrical field? I'm guessing it would<BR>
> > be a problem for certain types of lower tech shield helmets IMTU.<BR>
> <BR>
> Why? Contrary to popular belief there's *no* conclusive evidence that<BR>
> low level EM fields have any effects worth mentioning on humans. That's<BR>
> *not* to say that it isn't *possible* that such effects exist, just<BR>
> that with a lot of people looking fairly hard, the evidence isn't atr<BR>
> all consistent.<BR>
<BR>
Perhaps it has something to do with the fact that us humans still live<BR>
within 100 diameters of Sol.  Once a few of us head on out to Titan, our<BR>
heads may all explode...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
The Definition of an Upgrade: Take old bugs out, put new ones in.<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 15:56:20 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Samuel D. Weiss said:<BR>
<BR>
<SNIP><BR>
<BR>
>I don't say you. I say that presuming that Hivers are cowards because they<BR>
>dislike personal combat does so. Just because they don't like some form of<BR>
>combat has nothing to do with the strength of their moral convictions.<BR>
<BR>
Which was exactly my point, which is why I'm wondering why you responded in<BR>
a fashion which seemed to be disagreement.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:04:39 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: CT and T4 Generation for Order of Zar-Tis<BR>
<BR>
Jason Kemp wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Perhaps I should consider creating a Psionicist prior career for CT and MT<BR>
> at some point, through converting the T4 prior career. Hmmmm.... (Unless<BR>
> someone else already has a handle on that. Anyone?)<BR>
<BR>
I don't have a handle on it and I haven't taken a monkey<BR>
wrench to it but I'm tempted.  I'll try to work on the same<BR>
ideas soon.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:17:59 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:18:46 -0400 (EDT), Loren Wiseman<BR>
<lkw@io.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
<BR>
>This would be a 16-page freebie booklet (similar to GURPS Lite) but instead<BR>
>of rules, it would be a "briefing booklet" on the background. We would have<BR>
>it as a PDF on the website, and a printed version would be free for the<BR>
>asking at stores, conventions, and through the mail. This would explain the<BR>
>history of the Third Imperium and its neighbors, give thumbnail sketches of<BR>
>the assorted milieu, and explain "what go what" (old GDW in-joke).<BR>
<BR>
>It strikes me that this sort of thing would be very useful in getting new<BR>
>players up to speed on the universe -- what do you think?<BR>
<BR>
Damn it, now you've got me typing with one hand while I wipe up<BR>
the drool with the other....<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 15:39:44 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/27/00 9:11 AM, egh@klg.com issued forth:<BR>
> <BR>
> > Perhaps somewhere out there is the Hiver<BR>
> > equivalent of Jacky Chan.<BR>
> <BR>
> Now this could make an amusing sight! ;)<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm.  "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater."<BR>
<BR>
Do they gesture out-of-synch? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2362<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2363</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 27 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2363<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Re: Keyboard warning!<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Re: GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
"Hiver Kung-Fu Theater" (was Re: Newbie question on Traveller ali ens)<BR>
Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Re: "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater" (was Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Psi-gear<BR>
surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: Airborne<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2354<BR>
Re: GT Lite<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
Re: GT Lite<BR>
Re: Traveller Art<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:39:59 -0400<BR>
From: "Eric & Diane Freitas" <ericfrei@gte.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
This is a great idea!  I might even buy such a book.<BR>
<BR>
Eric<BR>
>OR............<BR>
><BR>
>Loren,<BR>
><BR>
>How about SJG putting together a "Best of Traveller Art" book with<BR>
>as many color plates from Jesse and other excellent Traveller artists<BR>
>as economically feasible and selling it throughout the world?<BR>
><BR>
>That way as many people as possible have access to it and SJG, Jesse,<BR>
>et all make a mint (hopefully) and you hit another home run for SJG?<BR>
><BR>
>Anybody other than me want, say, 15-30 pages of 8.5x11 color plates of<BR>
>awesome artwork you can show other players? Especially if each plate<BR>
>had a text explanation in the back of the book which describes the plate's<BR>
>subject and can be used in-game?<BR>
><BR>
>How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published <BR>
>centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
>Collect them all!<BR>
><BR>
>David Smart<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:43:33 -0400<BR>
From: "Eric & Diane Freitas" <ericfrei@gte.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Keyboard warning!<BR>
<BR>
Now that picture, I'll save!<BR>
<BR>
When does the game hit the shelves? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 15:48:43 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
"James W. Lindsay" wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> <BR>
> And rhinos typically appear ungainly too.  Large heavy bodies, short "wheel<BR>
> base", etc.  The octopus too seems utterly incapable of moving at any great<BR>
> speed.  Luckily we have actual fluid footage of rhinos and octopi in action<BR>
> to prove otherwise.  The same is not true of an actual Hiver :(  What we<BR>
> need is the educated opinion of an actual zoologist...<BR>
<BR>
No, what we _need_ is to go out there and find out for ourselves!<BR>
<BR>
**grumble, grumble...fricking NASA...grumble...Proxmire....**<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:19:21 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
Eric & Diane Freitas wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> This is a great idea!  I might even buy such a book.<BR>
<BR>
[snip Traveller Art books]<BR>
<BR>
Me too!<BR>
<BR>
> >How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published<BR>
> >centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
> >Collect them all!<BR>
<BR>
Yes!  I want it!  Though I do appreciate the scenes + ships,<BR>
to ships alone.  And maybe some ship interiors?<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:15:33 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
<BR>
Andrew Moffatt-Vallance wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Title say's it all<BR>
<BR>
Note that, according to David Pulver (posting to the SJG GT discussion<BR>
board), the playtest board should open on Monday.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:25:49 -0500<BR>
From: Jason Kemp <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater" (was Re: Newbie question on Traveller ali ens)<BR>
<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
<BR>
> > Via electronic medium on 4/27/00 9:11 AM, egh@klg.com issued forth:<BR>
> > <BR>
> > > Perhaps somewhere out there is the Hiver<BR>
> > > equivalent of Jacky Chan.<BR>
> > <BR>
> > Now this could make an amusing sight! ;)<BR>
> <BR>
> Hmmm.  "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater."<BR>
> <BR>
> Do they gesture out-of-synch? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
ROFLMAOASTCOTOSOTP!<BR>
<BR>
Bwahahahahahhaahhaahhahahahaha!<BR>
<BR>
That one actually got me laughing out loud so hard, tears were rolling down<BR>
my face! I can just picture it, a big starfish with mops flopping as it<BR>
spins, twists, and pulls it's own version of Drunken Style Boxing! And all<BR>
the while, bad Galanglic voice-overs about two seconds behind the floppy<BR>
tentacle bits. :)<BR>
<BR>
For what it's worth, I've never been splorted by the TML, but this is the<BR>
closest I've ever come. Chalk yourself up for a kill, my friend.<BR>
<BR>
*snicker, snicker, wiping the eyes*<BR>
<BR>
Hiver Chan flaps his tentacles, then launches into a spinning barrage of<BR>
attacks.<BR>
<BR>
Voiceover: "I give her a Yaaa!"<BR>
<BR>
More flapping tentacles, different but equally quivery, followed by aikido<BR>
redirection techniques, Hiver-style.<BR>
<BR>
Voiceover: "And a Hiiiiyaaa!"<BR>
<BR>
Finally, Hiver Chan mounts his intended victim, and pummels them with three<BR>
or four arms at once, amidst more furious flapping.<BR>
<BR>
Voiceover: "And then I keek her, Sir!"<BR>
<BR>
Enjoy,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 15:43:18 -0700<BR>
From: Keith Johnson <keithalanjohnson@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
At 02:01 PM 4/27/00 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Hey Loren or Jesse or whoever<BR>
<BR>
I think I qualify under the whoever section. . .<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Anyone ever suggested putting the full color versions of the<BR>
>stuff Jesse has done for the GT books up on the Pyramid site (or<BR>
>better yet the JTAS site).  Jesse's stuff deserves to be seen in<BR>
>color, I think.<BR>
<BR>
That's a good idea.  If Jesse doesn't mind, I wouldn't have a problem <BR>
posting the color versions of some of the pictures that were used in each book.<BR>
<BR>
I would probably place them in the Art Gallery pages that are linked to <BR>
each book, though.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>And in general, I like the idea of GT Lite, particularly with a<BR>
>Jesse cover.<BR>
<BR>
I know that GT:L isn't even off the drawing board, but I imagine that it <BR>
won't have a full color cover.  Unfortunately, they do cost money to <BR>
print.  I'm willing to bet that if we are giving it away for free the book <BR>
would be in a similar format as GURPS Lite.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, if The Powers That Be decide that full color is within budget, <BR>
then I'll be right next to you begging that Jesse does the cover. ;)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>And I like the GT: Cutter book idea too, but then<BR>
>I was excited by it when it was a GDW project too.<BR>
<BR>
I'm a big fan of games that are centered around one system, so I am really <BR>
looking forward to this book.  Heck, I am even planning on submitting some <BR>
module designs to Loren in the hopes it gets published.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
_________________________________________________________<BR>
Rev. Keith Johnson      /\     keith@sjgames.com<BR>
Assistant Webmaster    /()\    keithalanjohnson@home.com<BR>
Steve Jackson Games   /____\   reverendkeith@hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
  IMTU tm++@ t4+@ tg++$ ru- ge-@ st+ pi+ he+ dr+ hi-@ zh+<BR>
_________________________________________________________ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:56:43 -0400<BR>
From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
Subject: Re: "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater" (was Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
<BR>
This is starting to remind me of that RealMedia short film, "KungFu<BR>
Kitchen".<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
 J-Man<BR>
 ICQ# 2843475<BR>
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
 Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
 Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Jason Kemp" <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2000 5:25 PM<BR>
Subject: "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater" (was Re: Newbie question on Traveller<BR>
aliens)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> Finally, Hiver Chan mounts his intended victim, and pummels them with<BR>
three<BR>
> or four arms at once, amidst more furious flapping.<BR>
><BR>
> Voiceover: "And then I keek her, Sir!"<BR>
><BR>
> Enjoy,<BR>
> Jason<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:50:29 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>Which was exactly my point, which is why I'm wondering why you responded in<BR>
a fashion which seemed to be disagreement.<<BR>
<BR>
That's why I didn't quote anyone directly with my first post. I wanted to<BR>
make a base statement without directly agreeing or disagreeing with anyone<BR>
in particular.<BR>
By now of course...<BR>
<BR>
>Courage: The ability to get done those things which need to be done, but<BR>
your natural (Physical/Psychological) make-up tries to prevent.<BR>
<BR>
Cowardice: running and hiding simply because it's easier than facing the<BR>
situation.<<BR>
<BR>
As long as you recognize that sometimes running and hiding doesn't always<BR>
mean running and hiding. You can hide from a  problem by fighting. The<BR>
classic Bully mindset would be an example of this..<BR>
People have referred to the Pierson's Puppeteers before. How many made note<BR>
of the fact that the "Hindmost" among a pack of fleeing herd animals is<BR>
actually the bravest one, remaining behind to delay the attacking predators?<BR>
Somewhere along the way, PP culture transferred that to being behind the<BR>
great mass of others when a fight starts, but the foot through the chest<BR>
incident clearly shows it was otherwise. Yes, the PP wanted to convince<BR>
themselves that such behavior was insane. Many cultures have done likewise<BR>
with other acts through the years. It doesn't change the reality.<BR>
So again, are Hivers cowards?<BR>
To the Fteirle who live to fight, definitely.<BR>
To the k'kree who want a stand up fight and not to have their people changed<BR>
as they change others, yes again.<BR>
To the Vargr who force others to follow them openly rather than convincing<BR>
them on the sly, most likely.<BR>
To the Zhodani who prefer Psionic cures for any criminal activity or social<BR>
difficulty, I seriously doubt it.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:49:27 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Chris Seamans <semo@pil.net><BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
>I have studied human and animal motion for a class in animation. I don't<BR>
>present myself as an expert on the subject, but speedy beasts tend to have<BR>
a<BR>
>specific look and feel which the Hivers just don't have. Keep in mind that<BR>
>the vast majority of Hiver young set out into the wild *don't* make it.<BR>
>Granted, their young, small, and untrained, but it appears to me that<BR>
>evolution hasn't been particularly kind to them with respect to physical<BR>
>characteristics which would allow them to avoid being eaten by predators.<BR>
>This would seem to me that they're not naturally good fighters, nor are<BR>
they<BR>
>naturally good at getting away from predators.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Sure, 99% of all the Hivelets are killed during their first year, but that<BR>
means that the ones that survive are the most capable (or the luckiest...)<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:59:26 EDT<BR>
From: Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-gear<BR>
<BR>
Luther Martin writes:<BR>
<BR>
 >> One thing I found interesting about the psi-shields was that it<BR>
 >> suggested<BR>
 >> that psionics were an electromagnetic force, and could be sensed and<BR>
 >> analyzed...<BR>
 ><BR>
 ><BR>
 >And faked. Or this could allow communication between a person and a<BR>
 >machine.<BR>
 >Or a machine could be used to zap people with those undesirable psionic<BR>
 >powers. Or...<BR>
<BR>
For starters note that:<BR>
<BR>
Psi shields available at TL-12   = Telepathy-0 Shield.<BR>
<BR>
Neural Activity Sensors available at TL-13 = Telepathy-1 Life Sense.<BR>
<BR>
Cute, eh?  Therefore: MechPsi level = TL - 12.  I guess that at TL-14 you <BR>
get machine generated telempathy.  At TL-16 you get the electronic mind<BR>
probe.  <go to the Halls of Karma>  :P<BR>
<BR>
Is this the real reason why AM 4 has psi-shielding standard in Zhodani <BR>
combat armor?  Does the 3I have battlefield applications of these dev-<BR>
ices?  How about a bulky, expensive, relatively short ranged secret <BR>
telempathic "buzzer": "Sarge, I don't feel so good..." <Thud!>.<BR>
<BR>
Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:04:01 EDT<BR>
From: Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
Subject: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
<BR>
 >Hell, no SF game (and damn few stories) deals with the problem of<BR>
 >disposing of waste heat! Most ships would fry in short order because of<BR>
 >waste heat buildup.<BR>
<BR>
I was thinking of surface area requirements in FFS2 and the heat dissipation<BR>
problems and a strange thought came to me.  What if we take a cue from bio-<BR>
logy to help increase surface area?  Organisms have taken many routes to <BR>
increase the area/volume ratio, some of which could be done to spacecraft in <BR>
Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
What if we cover the skin of a Trav craft with a type of "hair": metal wires <BR>
(not too closely packed) sticking out of the craft's skin?  They would in-<BR>
crease surface area (IIRC this is why people have axillary & pubic hair; the <BR>
hairs increase the surface area of the regions producing the smelliest sweat,<BR>
increasing the area on which the sweat can gather and evaporate from, there-<BR>
fore strengthening the individuals characteristic odor -- yuck).  There would<BR>
be some problems with these wire "hairs" absorbing heat radiated by adjacent<BR>
hairs, but there must be some useful gain in effective area.<BR>
<BR>
A variant of the above would use tiny denticles -- like shark scales, or <BR>
larger scales, maybe like spear points, sticking vertically up from the <BR>
craft's skin.  Perhaps fewer, largish spines would also help.  What about <BR>
feathered structures, like the antennae of moths, or spiny "trees" whose <BR>
whose branches themselves are treelike (all made of metal or whatever)?<BR>
<BR>
Another possible solution would be to cover the surface of the craft with <BR>
small cylindrical pipes or tubes, running the length of the craft (assuming <BR>
a cylinder or needle, they would girdle a spheroid or other short hull).  <BR>
They would block the surface of the hull but their own useful area would be<BR>
greater than the area covered (I think).  Maybe the hull could be covered in <BR>
hexagonal rings of pipes (with smaller rings inside the individual hexes).<BR>
<BR>
A simpler variation of the above would be to give the craft a corrugated skin,<BR>
like those Junkers aircraft from the 1930's.<BR>
<BR>
All turrets and other projections could be covered in the above coatings, <BR>
where practical.  I suppose big radiating panels (like solar panels) would <BR>
work, <BR>
too, but they lack style & are vulnerable to battle damage; one hit could <BR>
cripple<BR>
a ships power plant.  My radiators would have to be "scrubbed" off a target <BR>
ship.<BR>
<BR>
Does anyone have the math/physics skills to check if I'm right in this?  I <BR>
think craft like these might add flavor to any TU.  Imagine ships like fuzzy <BR>
caterpillars, or spiked sea urchins, or ships covered with vein-like stri-<BR>
ations, or covered in speartips like the Korean Tortoise ships?  The mind<BR>
boggles (or merely gets a bit nauseous).  <BR>
<BR>
Who sez Trav is old fashioned? <BR>
<BR>
Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:18:12 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
Ludowick@aol.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> I was thinking of surface area requirements in FFS2 and the heat<BR>
> dissipation problems and a strange thought came to me.  What if we take a<BR>
> cue from bio- logy to help increase surface area?  Organisms have taken many<BR>
> routes to  increase the area/volume ratio, some of which could be done to<BR>
> spacecraft in  Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
Most of those methods, unfortunately, do not work for radiant heat, only for<BR>
conduction.  A 'furry' surface may have 10x the surface area of the same <BR>
number of square meters of flat metal, but it won't radiate any more energy<BR>
(unless its albedo is changed, which might either increase or decrease<BR>
effectiveness).  The reason for this is that on a 'fuzzy' surface, a lot of<BR>
the heat that is radiated is promptly re-absorbed by another part of the<BR>
surface.<BR>
<BR>
> Does anyone have the math/physics skills to check if I'm right in this?  I <BR>
> think craft like these might add flavor to any TU.  Imagine ships like<BR>
> fuzzy  caterpillars, or spiked sea urchins, or ships covered with<BR>
> vein-like stri- ations, or covered in speartips like the Korean Tortoise<BR>
> ships?  The mind boggles (or merely gets a bit nauseous).  <BR>
<BR>
Its nifty, but doesn't work.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:21:48 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
Ludowick@aol.com wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
> What if we cover the skin of a Trav craft with a type of "hair": metal wires<BR>
> (not too closely packed) sticking out of the craft's skin?  They would in-<BR>
> crease surface area (IIRC this is why people have axillary & pubic hair; <BR>
<BR>
Unfortunately you're forgetting about one major fact: all of the<BR>
applications you're talking about are dealing with conductive heat<BR>
transfer to some medium, air in this case. <BR>
<BR>
This doesn't work in a vaccuum; the 'hairs' can only shed head by<BR>
radiating it, and if they can 'see' each other they radiate it onto each<BR>
other. This doesn't actally remove heat from the system.<BR>
<BR>
The heat transfer problem can be easily visualized: take a thermos. Why<BR>
does it work so well? two reasons. First: the walls are separated by a<BR>
vaccuum. This eliminates conductive cooling, there's no conductor.<BR>
Second, the glass bottle is silvered, which reflects radiated heat back<BR>
into the liquid contained in the thermos.<BR>
<BR>
So your coffee stays hot.<BR>
<BR>
Now put a heat source in there. Remember heat only gets out slowly, you<BR>
can see that you'll heat up very quickly.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:35:18 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
<BR>
>Title say's it all<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In the last five hours I have eaten dinner, watched twenty minutes of<BR>
Notting Hill, and read the entire playtest manuscript of Ground Forces.<BR>
<BR>
Well done, Doug - it's looking excellent.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:09:50 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 11:24 PM 4/26/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>Penguin. Penguin! PENGUIN! Who needs this Hasta-whatsis?<BR>
><BR>
> There are worse things....<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, "Brother Jed" comes to mind...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:39:50 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
>Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
>> I also picked up the Big Floppy Book of CT reprints. I got a<BR>
>> strange sense of nostalgia from reading through it, despite the<BR>
>> fact I've only been playing Trav for three years (and wasn't<BR>
>> actually conceived when CT was first published...).<BR>
><BR>
>S**t, now I feel old!  :-(<BR>
>Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I think this is a conversation we already had...<g><BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:56:20 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
>What if we cover the skin of a Trav craft with a type of "hair": metal<BR>
wires<BR>
>(not too closely packed) sticking out of the craft's skin?  They would in-<BR>
>crease surface area (IIRC this is why people have axillary & pubic hair;<BR>
the<BR>
>hairs increase the surface area of the regions producing the smelliest<BR>
sweat,<BR>
<BR>
Mainly because the fundamental mechanisms an animal and a spaceship use for<BR>
heat dissipation are different.<BR>
<BR>
Animals operate in an atmosphere, so they can lose heat by conduction to the<BR>
air, and then convection away. Increasing the surface area means more<BR>
contact with with air, so the heat is conducted away faster. Incidentally,<BR>
raising the hairs (when you;re cold) actually lowers the rate of heat loss,<BR>
by slowing down the passage of air over the skin, and so impeding the<BR>
convection process.<BR>
<BR>
Spacecraft operate in a vacuum, so conduction is not an option. Any heat<BR>
they want to lose has to be done by the process of radiation. A point will<BR>
radiate heat in all directions, so while one of your hairs would radiate<BR>
heat sideways, it would also be absorbing the heat radiated sideways by<BR>
those around it. Sure, around the edges you'd radiate a little more away,<BR>
but it's probably not worth the effort.<BR>
<BR>
Incidentally, (and this occured to me yesterday while browsing FFS2's<BR>
Superblack Coatings section) won't painting your hull black, as every<BR>
warship does, increase the rate of heat radiation from your surface?<BR>
Painting it silver would seem to be the better option. Sure, a mirrored hull<BR>
would make you reflect back active sensor traces something terrible, but in<BR>
FFS2 actives don't seem to be a lot of good at space combat ranges. Anyone<BR>
agree?<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:54:47 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
Dougals Berry wrote:<BR>
>The C-130 is over a battlefield filled with AAA and SAMs.  The paratrooper<BR>
>is standing in the door with a chute, his weapon, and another sixty pounds<BR>
>of supplies, ready to jump.  The pilot is strapped into his chair.  Most<BR>
>planes get shot down leaving the target area.<BR>
><BR>
>You make the call on who is smarter in this situation  :)<BR>
<BR>
The C-130 pilot is expected to come home to his nice, safe airbase.<BR>
The paratrooper is expected to spend the next few hours or days in<BR>
close contact with numerically superior (but hopefully disorganized<BR>
and lower-quality) enemy forces.<BR>
<BR>
Are there really any serious military planners today who would plan<BR>
a drop into a contested drop zone?<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 20:04:06 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2354<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-26 14:06:07 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<<  I agree in general, but with the re-release of the CT books, and<BR>
 (hopefully) the release of a T5, why would this be a "GT Lite"? It sounds<BR>
 more like a briefing on the setting, not the rules.<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
"GT Lite" is the working title here at SJ Games. The plan is that it will <BR>
cover background, which (before 1116) is identical between all forms of <BR>
traveller. After 1116 we'll just have to cover more than one timeline.<BR>
<BR>
That said, it's going to have SJ Game's address on it, and it will give our <BR>
URL -- we're footing the bill for printing it, after all -- as well as <BR>
BITS/FarFuture's contact info.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 20:04:05 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: GT Lite<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-26 12:23:13 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< 2 suggestions:<BR>
  - Get Jesse to do a nice pic for the cover, and<BR>
  - Include a map of 'Known Space' (the one is GT is<BR>
 fine, if you nix the "Touch Screen" crap).<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
It is going to be a freedie, so the budget is limited. <BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:58:50 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
>Sure, 99% of all the Hivelets are killed during their first year, but that<BR>
>means that the ones that survive are the most capable (or the luckiest...)<BR>
<BR>
Remember that Hiver newborns are itty-bitty larva.  <BR>
<BR>
Still, I wonder what it does to a race's psychology to have every<BR>
individual's first awareness include being a hunted food animal/pest.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:06:09 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >> I also picked up the Big Floppy Book of CT reprints. I got a<BR>
> >> strange sense of nostalgia from reading through it, despite the<BR>
> >> fact I've only been playing Trav for three years (and wasn't<BR>
> >> actually conceived when CT was first published...).<BR>
> ><BR>
> >S**t, now I feel old!  :-(<BR>
> >Regards PLST<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> I think this is a conversation we already had...<g><BR>
><BR>
> NB<BR>
<BR>
Consider this. All of the people who originally played CT are now suffering<BR>
from a wide range of symptoms including weight gain, increased blood<BR>
pressure, memory loss, etc. Could CT be hazardous to your health? Should it<BR>
be strictly regulated by the government? What will happen now that the CT<BR>
reprints are available?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 20:07:25 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: GT Lite<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/27/00 8:06:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time, GDWGAMES@aol.com <BR>
writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< It is going to be a freedie, so the budget is limited. <BR>
  >><BR>
Maybe just a small Jesse pic :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:12:24 -0700<BR>
From: Clay <arioch@theriver.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller Art<BR>
<BR>
> How about SJG putting together a "Best of Traveller Art" book with<BR>
> as many color plates from Jesse and other excellent Traveller artists<BR>
> as economically feasible and selling it throughout the world?<BR>
<BR>
> Anybody other than me want, say, 15-30 pages of 8.5x11 color plates of<BR>
> awesome artwork you can show other players? Especially if each plate<BR>
> had a text explanation in the back of the book which describes the plate's<BR>
> subject and can be used in-game?<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
I would pay for a book like that.  I would prefer more than 30 pages<BR>
though.  Putting text on the back side is a great idea.<BR>
<BR>
Is there any chance that some of the DGP artists' work would end up in a<BR>
GT book? (Blair Reynolds, Rob Caswell, & Michael Vilardi)<BR>
I've seen a couple of Rob Caswell's works here & there in GT and would<BR>
like to see more of it (along with the others).  Does anyone know if<BR>
they are still making art for Traveller or Sci-Fi at all?<BR>
<BR>
Also, a while back someone was compiling a list of Traveller players and<BR>
games.  What ever became of that list?<BR>
<BR>
Clay<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2363<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2364</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Thursday, April 27 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2364<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
CT Health Hazard<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2354<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations (was Re Camerone) (Long)<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
[OT] Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
Re: Airborne<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re Zar-Tis<BR>
[none]<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 02:37:45 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
Someone wrote:<BR>
> How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published<BR>
> centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
<BR>
Well, since Mr Miller has his rules for Traveller art, the centerfolds would<BR>
have to be ships.<BR>
<BR>
I am sure that TMLers of all ages would still drool over the pictures, though.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
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| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
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| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:40:53 -0500<BR>
From: Dan Roseberry <rosebee@troi.csw.net><BR>
Subject: CT Health Hazard<BR>
<BR>
At 27 Apr 2000 17:06:09 Luther Martin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Could CT be hazardous to your health? Should it<BR>
>be strictly regulated by the government? What will happen<BR>
>now that the CT reprints are available?<BR>
<BR>
I deserved that. Pass the Dilantin pills please :-]<BR>
<BR>
Dan Roseberry (plop101) Hot Springs, Arkansas<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:43:43 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/27/00 12:47 PM, jlindsay@home.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> What we<BR>
> need is the educated opinion of an actual zoologist...<BR>
<BR>
No, what we /really need is a Hiver specimen of our own to poke and prod! ;)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 20:41:21 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2354<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: <GDWGAMES@aol.com><BR>
> That said, it's going to have SJ Game's address on it, and it will give<BR>
our<BR>
> URL -- we're footing the bill for printing it, after all -- as well as<BR>
> BITS/FarFuture's contact info.<BR>
<BR>
Ooh, ooh!  Um.... nevermind.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: Our intrepid adventurers have a sure-fire business idea, guaranteed<BR>
to bring customers flocking in from every quarter.  An astute patron then<BR>
points out that their gimmick of selling their product at a loss is sure to<BR>
cut into their profits ;-)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:51:42 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/27/00 4:04 PM, Ludowick@aol.com issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> I was thinking of surface area requirements in FFS2 and the heat dissipation<BR>
> problems and a strange thought came to me.<BR>
<BR>
 Strange perhaps, but I like it!<BR>
<BR>
Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
"Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
BZAT: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/index.html<BR>
Lanth6: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Lanth6/Main.html<BR>
E-mail: xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:10:23 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Whatever happened to... Coreward Expedition<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> In all my years (not that I'm old like Leonard or anything), but I've <BR>
<BR>
AHEM.<BR>
<BR>
"Ditzie? I've got a special project I'd like to hire you and your crew<BR>
for..."<BR>
<BR>
"An assassination? No nothing as painless as that...."<BR>
<BR>
<eg><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:16:47 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published <BR>
> centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
> Collect them all!<BR>
<BR>
Heck, do one with pictures of beautiful females and males too. Say<BR>
"Pinup" level art (ie Sports Ilustrated Swimsuit Issue, not Playboy<BR>
Centerfold). But consider. We've got 12 months to cover, and 6 major<BR>
races with two sexes each (well, maybe not for the Hivers, but that's<BR>
ok, "equal time" and all that). <BR>
<BR>
So, that gives us:<BR>
<BR>
A male human "hunk"<BR>
A female human "dish"<BR>
A male Aslan<BR>
A female Aslan<BR>
A male Vargr<BR>
A female Vargr<BR>
A male K'Kree<BR>
A female K'kree<BR>
A male Droyne (what caste?)<BR>
A female Droyne (ditto)<BR>
A "male" Hiver<BR>
A "female" Hiver<BR>
<BR>
(and if as I suspect, Hivers don't really have male/female that just<BR>
becomes a sort of in joke).<BR>
<BR>
Take the above, do appropriate drawings, and assign to months in<BR>
whatever order seems right. <BR>
<BR>
The poses, "backgrounds" and even "types" can help get across ideas<BR>
about the races. for example, as one might expect, the male Aslan would<BR>
be muclar, in a "warlike" pose, implying that he's a *good* fighter, a<BR>
real "alpha male" type. But the *female* should be what a male *Aslan*<BR>
would be interested in. So her "smarts" and fininacal skills need to be<BR>
emphasized. So she might be in the Aslan equivalent of a CEO's office.<BR>
 <BR>
I leave the other species to your imagination.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:38:16 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 06:50 AM 4/28/2000 +1000, you wrote:<BR>
>>I created an organization years ago for the 3i simply called the Imperial<BR>
>>Legion. They were primarily troops gathered from worlds willing to export<BR>
>>any criminals sentenced to life or death sentences.  They were issued<BR>
>>inexpensive armor and weapons, and used to assault fortifications that would<BR>
>>make marines nervous. They were not expected to live. They WERE expected to<BR>
>>soften up the resistance for the next wave of the imperial military units.<BR>
><BR>
> "Get in the boat."<BR>
><BR>
> "Screw you."<BR>
><BR>
> "Listen Jones, get in the bloody boat!"<BR>
><BR>
> "No way in Hades, I'm staying in this nice bunk.  Ain't no way Mama Jones'<BR>
> little boy is going to go die for the glory of the damn Imperium."<BR>
><BR>
> This might also violate the laws against slavery.<BR>
<BR>
Only if prison sentences do. Check out the wording in the relevant<BR>
amendment to the US Consitution. They *had* to include a clause "except<BR>
as punishment for a crime" or else they'd have been banning jailing<BR>
someone. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:46:56 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Glenn (and Nick thusly >) wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> >I know canon says that magnetic fields (like psi-shield<BR>
>> >helmets or power stations) can interrupt psionic activity,<BR>
>> >but does it actually nail it down any further than that?<BR>
>> >Presumeably if they bother building psi-shield helmets a<BR>
>> >simple Faraday cage won't work?<BR>
>>Maybe a psi shield is a simple Faraday cage with good<BR>
>>marketing, good timing (during pre-war psi hysteria), and a<BR>
>>premium price for the extra gullible.  It seems to me that<BR>
>>the first (and maybe only) canon reference to psi shields<BR>
>>is an advertisement or a press release by the manufacturer.<BR>
<BR>
Just a note. A Faraday cage has to *completely* surround the item it is<BR>
shielding. No holes larger than a fraction of a wavelngth are<BR>
permissible. <BR>
<BR>
So unless you are marketing a *suit*, you'd have to extend the shield<BR>
*all* the way around the head. Which means cutting off the head from<BR>
the neck. It also means no way for air to get in.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:34:04 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>
><BR>
>  >Hell, no SF game (and damn few stories) deals with the problem of<BR>
>  >disposing of waste heat! Most ships would fry in short order because of<BR>
>  >waste heat buildup.<BR>
><BR>
> I was thinking of surface area requirements in FFS2 and the heat dissipation<BR>
> problems and a strange thought came to me.  What if we take a cue from bio-<BR>
> logy to help increase surface area?  Organisms have taken many routes to <BR>
> increase the area/volume ratio, some of which could be done to spacecraft in <BR>
> Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
Slight problem. Biological organisms get rid of heat via conduction and<BR>
convection. Thus, highly convoluted surfaces increase surface area in a<BR>
useful way.<BR>
<BR>
But in a vacuum, you can *only* get rid of heat via radiation. Which<BR>
means that the most efficient radiator is a *flat plate*!<BR>
<BR>
Why? Because any inward curve (concavity) results in part of the<BR>
surface of the radiator being "visible" from other parts of the<BR>
radiator. In effect, they "cut off" part of the "sky", reducing the<BR>
spread of angles thru which the energy can be radiated. So part of the<BR>
energy that leaves the radiator gets intercepted by the (visible)<BR>
parts, which reduces the amount that leaves *permanently*.<BR>
<BR>
Convex radiators have an even better (greater than 180) radiation<BR>
angle, but the greater the curvature, the smaller the enclosed volume. <BR>
<BR>
So the absolute *best* you can do is a pair of "wings" one on each side<BR>
of the ship. *Big* civilian ships will likely have such fold out<BR>
arrays. Or else be designed as a "flat disk" (which is a nice design<BR>
for a passenger liner, because you can put the radiators on one side<BR>
and lots and lots of staterooms with *windows* on the other side, thus<BR>
maximizing the number of "deluxe" accomodations).<BR>
<BR>
> What if we cover the skin of a Trav craft with a type of "hair": metal wires <BR>
> (not too closely packed) sticking out of the craft's skin?  They would in-<BR>
> crease surface area (IIRC this is why people have axillary & pubic hair; the <BR>
> hairs increase the surface area of the regions producing the smelliest sweat,<BR>
> increasing the area on which the sweat can gather and evaporate from, there-<BR>
> fore strengthening the individuals characteristic odor -- yuck).  There would<BR>
> be some problems with these wire "hairs" absorbing heat radiated by adjacent<BR>
> hairs, but there must be some useful gain in effective area.<BR>
<BR>
Nope. A flat plate with the same surface are will radiate more heat<BR>
*and* be easier to fabricate. Hairs work in *air* because they maximize<BR>
the area the air can contact. Without air, what matters is "subtended<BR>
angle" of the distant sky.<BR>
<BR>
Draw *straight* lines radiating out from a point on the *surface* of a<BR>
radiator. Any line that intersects any part of the ship has to be<BR>
erased. The remaining lines are the effective angle for that point on<BR>
the radiator. <BR>
<BR>
Repeat for every point on the surface of the radiator. You'll quickly<BR>
find that you get the *same* overall angle of radiation by flattening<BR>
any parts of the radiation that bulge away from the ship. <BR>
<BR>
And you'll *increase* the effective angle by flattening any parts that<BR>
curve *towards* the ship.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:46:17 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <BR>
> >In general, I think you are being a bit dogmatic in your perception of<BR>
> what the Legion is.  Granted, I think other people on the list may have a<BR>
> somewhat romanticised version of it, too, but if we want to use it as an<BR>
> analogy for interesting military units in the TU, then we can go ahead<BR>
> without much problem.<<BR>
> <BR>
> *shrug*<BR>
> Possibly. I see the FFL having a specific history and organization that<BR>
> wouldn't fit into 1100 era Imperial operations. As mentioned, Sylean and<BR>
> Pacification campaign era, sure. But not after the end of the Civil Wars.<BR>
<BR>
So the units were established before the Civil Wars, and are still around. <BR>
Or else they were established by some commander sitting on some horrible<BR>
frontier, like the Trojan Reach, and haven't been disbanded.  The Imperium<BR>
doesn't operate neatly or efficiently - there is plenty of slack for all<BR>
kinds of things.  Just make up a story - or don't bother if you don't want<BR>
to.<BR>
<BR>
I have some minor differences of opinion on some other stuff you wrote, but<BR>
who cares?<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 01:56:45 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations (was Re Camerone) (Long)<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, 27 Apr 2000 11:59:08 -0700, Bruce Johnson<BR>
<johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
>> <BR>
>> In mail you write:<BR>
>> <BR>
>> > *Swiss Guards of the Vatican (now purely ceremonial, but in their day the<BR>
>> > MM-F (please don't ask me to explain this one, work it out....) on the<BR>
>> > European continent<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Actually, they are both ceremonial *and* practical. They do guard<BR>
>> mounts in the fancy outfits, just like the Coldstream Guard in their<BR>
>> "traditional" uniforms guarding Buckingham Palace.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> But both units have quite modern weapons ready to hand, as well as<BR>
>> folks in more practical uniforms in reserve.<BR>
><BR>
>Yes, also, those guys in dark suits with earplugs in their ears<BR>
>surrounding the Pope when he travels are also Swiss Guards.<BR>
<BR>
I remember a color plate in a book titled "Mercenary Uniforms"(?). It<BR>
showed a Swiss Pikeman in Ceremonial uniform pulling a Beretta M-12<BR>
SMG from something that looked like an umbrella stand. Quite the<BR>
anachronism.<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"'Need' now means wanting someone else's money. 'Greed' means wanting to keep<BR>
 your own. 'Compassion' is when a politician arranges the transfer."<BR>
                                     -Joseph Sobran<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:12:47 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> I was thinking of surface area requirements in FFS2 and the heat dissipation<BR>
> problems and a strange thought came to me.  What if we take a cue from bio-<BR>
> logy to help increase surface area?  Organisms have taken many routes to<BR>
> increase the area/volume ratio, some of which could be done to spacecraft in<BR>
> Traveller.<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
The problem is that waste heat can only be eliminated via radiation, rather<BR>
than conduction or convection.<BR>
<BR>
In a very early traveller game I ran (late 70's, before any detailed rules)<BR>
ships used thermal buffers to absorb the heat generated.  These buffers were<BR>
merely that fuel cells frozen into solid water.  A ship's combat manuvering<BR>
was limited by its ability to store waste heat before the crew baked.  A<BR>
captain has two options:  Vent steam, and quickly eliminate stored heat, but<BR>
reduce fuel, or deploy deploy his radiator--huge sail like radiating<BR>
surfaces trailed behind the ship while cruising.<BR>
<BR>
This led to some interesting manuvers, like dragging your 'sails' through<BR>
the upper atmosphere to increase the cooling effect, but making a ship<BR>
vulnerable in a gravity well.  You could also get caught with your 'sails'<BR>
deployed.  If an enemy destroys them, you have no effecient way to shed<BR>
heat, which means you must figh a quick battle, run while you ship turns<BR>
into a roaster, or surrender with a relatively intact ship.<BR>
<BR>
I don't remember the exact formula for calculating 'sail' size vs.<BR>
powerplant, but the sails were kilometers long.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Everything I need to know, I learned from<BR>
killing smart people and eating their brains."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:23:38 -0400<BR>
From: "Eric & Diane Freitas" <ericfrei@gte.net><BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
Hey, just ask if you can use a version of Larry Niven's Firestop (tm)<BR>
device.<BR>
<BR>
Personally I'd go with stowable arrays.  It works.<BR>
<BR>
Eric<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 02:41:01 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: [OT] Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:59:44, "Douglas E. Berry"<BR>
<gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>Puerto Ricans are US citizens, as are the residents of other US<BR>
>possessions.  Foreigners do join the military (I went through OSUT with a<BR>
>German), but they have to have permanent residence status when they enlist.<BR>
<BR>
Right. IIRC immigrants normally need to be residents for six years<BR>
before becoming US citizens. They can shave two years off this time by<BR>
enlisting for four years in the armed forces.<BR>
<BR>
Filipinos are specifically allowed by treaty to enlist. They don't<BR>
have to become citizens. I'm not sure if they have to be residents.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"'Need' now means wanting someone else's money. 'Greed' means wanting to keep<BR>
 your own. 'Compassion' is when a politician arranges the transfer."<BR>
                                     -Joseph Sobran<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 16:37:32 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >The C-130 is over a battlefield filled with AAA and SAMs.  The paratrooper<BR>
> >is standing in the door with a chute, his weapon, and another sixty pounds<BR>
> >of supplies, ready to jump.  The pilot is strapped into his chair.  Most<BR>
> >planes get shot down leaving the target area.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >You make the call on who is smarter in this situation  :)<BR>
> <BR>
> Me. I'm two thousand miles away designing a submarine.<BR>
> <BR>
> Nick<BR>
<BR>
Me. Sitting in Hawaii getting paid by Uncle Sam to learn how to teach<BR>
people to shoot other people. Presumably so that I can continue sitting<BR>
in Hawaii doing what I was recruited for: rake leaves.<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 02:44:54 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:12:47 -0700, Tod Glenn<BR>
<webmaster@travellercentral.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
>merely that fuel cells frozen into solid water.  A ship's combat manuvering<BR>
>was limited by its ability to store waste heat before the crew baked.  A<BR>
>captain has two options:  Vent steam, and quickly eliminate stored heat, but<BR>
>reduce fuel, or deploy deploy his radiator--huge sail like radiating<BR>
>surfaces trailed behind the ship while cruising.<BR>
><BR>
>This led to some interesting manuvers, like dragging your 'sails' through<BR>
>the upper atmosphere to increase the cooling effect, but making a ship<BR>
>vulnerable in a gravity well.  You could also get caught with your 'sails'<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
Wouldn't the sails gain heat from friction caused by contacting the<BR>
atmosphere at orbital speeds?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"'Need' now means wanting someone else's money. 'Greed' means wanting to keep<BR>
 your own. 'Compassion' is when a politician arranges the transfer."<BR>
                                     -Joseph Sobran<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:48:45 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Zar-Tis<BR>
<BR>
>Zhodani Nobles and Intendents (CT) start with their skills fully developed<BR>
>by the time they start their careers due to the Zhodani culture, IIRC, and<BR>
>so it's not the same as the situation we're looking at here. I could be<BR>
>wrong, however, and would welcome specific quotes from the source material<BR>
>if such is available. (I no longer have CT's AMs, so I am of no help here.)<BR>
<BR>
Actually, that is an artifact of the CT Psionics rules, more than anything<BR>
else; in CT, you can  up your level in a psi-skill monthly, so by the time<BR>
a Zhodani character starts play, he's likely to have maxed out his<BR>
psi-skills. In theory, any CT character who has gained a psi-skill in any<BR>
but the last term should have his psi-skills maxed to match his PSR. Same<BR>
happens for droyne as for Zhodani. Likewise, MT allows raising Psi-Skills<BR>
monthly, to the limit of PSR.<BR>
<BR>
In T4 (and in TNE), each psionic skill is JUST ANOTHER SKILL. So they are<BR>
raised as per any other skill. ANd thus, the lower levels being more<BR>
limiting, but also the need for levels of skill to be specifically gained<BR>
is present.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>> If you can choose it there, you can choose it anywhere.<BR>
><BR>
>Yeah, but T4 was the first time I'd actually seen the rule in print. :)<BR>
<BR>
No, CT and MT specify you roll. T4 specifies pick or roll. Rules-canon<BR>
differences. (And, just for completeness: TNE is pick only. GT is totally<BR>
open choice, provided you can con your GM into accepting it and have the<BR>
points for it.)<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:58:19 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: [none]<BR>
<BR>
>Ludowick@aol.com writes:<BR>
><BR>
>> I was thinking of surface area requirements in FFS2 and the heat<BR>
>> dissipation problems and a strange thought came to me.  What if we take a<BR>
>> cue from bio- logy to help increase surface area?  Organisms have taken many<BR>
>> routes to  increase the area/volume ratio, some of which could be done to<BR>
>> spacecraft in  Traveller.<BR>
><BR>
>Most of those methods, unfortunately, do not work for radiant heat, only for<BR>
>conduction.  A 'furry' surface may have 10x the surface area of the same<BR>
>number of square meters of flat metal, but it won't radiate any more energy<BR>
>(unless its albedo is changed, which might either increase or decrease<BR>
>effectiveness).  The reason for this is that on a 'fuzzy' surface, a lot of<BR>
>the heat that is radiated is promptly re-absorbed by another part of the<BR>
>surface.<BR>
<BR>
OTGH, there is a way that does work, but it only increases surface area by<BR>
10-20%: concave corrugation:<BR>
<BR>
vaccum<BR>
\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/<BR>
Radiator  assy.<BR>
<BR>
since the radiant heat will only be partially back towards the radiator, so<BR>
long as the grooves are shallow enough, the net effect will be increased<BR>
effective surface area; albeit at highly increased cost in most cases.<BR>
<BR>
Also, if run at the correct depth and angles, the lammelar air-flow<BR>
turbulence will increase strealined-efficiency when in atmosphere.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:11:16 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
James Lindsay said:<BR>
<BR>
>> The stability comes at the high price of the use of its arms. They have<BR>
five<BR>
>> limbs which they may use as arms or legs, but it appears to me that at<BR>
least<BR>
>> three would have to be planted at any time in order to stand. This is due<BR>
to<BR>
>> the width of their central, inflexible, bulk. It looks like four would be<BR>
>> required in order to move in an effective fashion. Their "rear" appendage<BR>
>> would be the best candidate for weapon use.<BR>
><BR>
>Then again, they can also do hand-stands using only one "limb"-- if you<BR>
>assume that the picture in the CT Alien Module is canon :)<BR>
<BR>
Hehe. Aliens of the Rim confirmed my suspicions: they need three legs to<BR>
support themselves, and at least four to move.<BR>
<BR>
>> They are always pictured as being ungainly.<BR>
><BR>
>And rhinos typically appear ungainly too.  Large heavy bodies, short "wheel<BR>
>base", etc.<BR>
<BR>
Rhinos are fast in a charge, but that's not what I meant by ungainly. In my<BR>
initial post on the subject I gave more detail as to what I meant. I was<BR>
saying that it would be more difficult for them to "wheel around" to "face"<BR>
other foes. Rhinos are actually slow to wheel around, from what I<BR>
understand.<BR>
<BR>
Others have said that they wouldn't have to wheel around in combat. I<BR>
disagree. Their tentacles are relatively short. Although a Hiver might<BR>
effectively be able to use a pistol in any direction (which would certainly<BR>
be an advantage), or throw something, melee weapons would afford them less<BR>
flexibility. The long reach of their limbs is an advantage, but only if that<BR>
limb's facing is pointed in your direction. If a fighter could manage to get<BR>
on the other side of a Hiver, the Hiver would not be able to strike him<BR>
unless he switched hands.<BR>
<BR>
Due to the unique hand shape of the hiver, this would be difficult. The<BR>
six-fingered Hiver hand fits over ball shaped objects. In order to pass<BR>
something like a Hiver knife from one appendage to another, the direction<BR>
the weapon is facing would have to be changed, for obvious reasons. So, a<BR>
hiver would have to either wheel around, or pass the weapon from one<BR>
appendage to another.<BR>
<BR>
If I'm right, and they're slow to wheel around, a hiver could easily be<BR>
attacked from the other side, as the poor beast would be slow to respond. If<BR>
I'm wrong, this might not be too much of a disadvantage.<BR>
<BR>
The shape of their hand would limit the sorts of weapons they could use, as<BR>
well. Small knives and short bladed weapons would likely be beast. Heavier<BR>
weapons would appear difficult to use, not merely because Hivers are weaker,<BR>
but because Hiver hands seem designed to hold things horizontally, not<BR>
vertically like human hands. This would seem to limit the sorts to smaller<BR>
piercing and slashing weapons.<BR>
<BR>
Here's a crude illustration of what I mean (I hope that the font you're<BR>
using gets this right):<BR>
<BR>
Hiver:<BR>
<BR>
====#---<BR>
<BR>
= is the tentacle, # is the hand and - is the weapon. This is illustrated<BR>
effectively in MT's Imperial Encyclopedia.<BR>
<BR>
Human:<BR>
<BR>
    |<BR>
====#<BR>
<BR>
= is the arm, # is the hand and | is the weapon.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>The octopus too seems utterly incapable of moving at any great<BR>
>speed.<BR>
<BR>
I disagree. The octopus looks like it evolved to be quick in the water. It's<BR>
never been surprising to me that it is. Incidentally, Hivers look like they<BR>
might be a pretty good swimmers.<BR>
<BR>
>Luckily we have actual fluid footage of rhinos and octopi in action<BR>
>to prove otherwise.  The same is not true of an actual Hiver :(  What we<BR>
>need is the educated opinion of an actual zoologist...<BR>
<BR>
I think it would be better if we actually had a Hiver to beat up on.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 20:09:38 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
That'd be about the only reason I could see for jumping out of a perfectly<BR>
good airplane :)<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Douglas E.<BR>
> Berry<BR>
> Sent: Thursday, April 27, 2000 3:05 AM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Airborne<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> At 09:16 AM 4/27/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> >Well, yeah, but thats Airborne.  They're "differently abled", if<BR>
> >you know what I mean.<BR>
><BR>
> The C-130 is over a battlefield filled with AAA and SAMs.  The paratrooper<BR>
> is standing in the door with a chute, his weapon, and another sixty pounds<BR>
> of supplies, ready to jump.  The pilot is strapped into his chair.  Most<BR>
> planes get shot down leaving the target area.<BR>
><BR>
> You make the call on who is smarter in this situation  :)<BR>
> --<BR>
><BR>
> Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
> http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2364<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 28 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2365<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
Ground Forces<BR>
Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris NavigationalHazards)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Armor vs X-ray Lasers<BR>
Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris NavigationalHazards)<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Small Merchants<BR>
GDW Memo...<BR>
RE: GDW Memo...<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations (was Re Camerone) (Long)<BR>
Re: Camerone Day/Viva La Legion<BR>
Re: Armor vs X-ray Lasers<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:22:08 -0700<BR>
From: Rob Eaglestone <downport@home.com><BR>
Subject: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
<BR>
For your reading pleasure, here is the first<BR>
section of the first chapter of the first<BR>
Dumarest book.  I found it this Tuesday and<BR>
greatly relished reading it.  Visit your local<BR>
used bookstores and look for the Dumarest books<BR>
by E.C. Tubb if you like a well-written Sci-Fi<BR>
adventure that is Traveller compatible.<BR>
<BR>
If anyone has this fine book, perhaps he or<BR>
she would condescend to volunteer to type in<BR>
the second [or third] section of Chapter 1.<BR>
<BR>
Just for your general information:<BR>
<BR>
Book One has fifteen chapters, 175 pages.  Below<BR>
are not quite the first three pages.  There are<BR>
on the average perhaps three sections (divisions)<BR>
per chapter, and slightly more than 10 pages per <BR>
chapter.<BR>
<BR>
- -------------------------<BR>
The Winds of Gath<BR>
Dumarest of Terra #1<BR>
Chapter 1<BR>
[Section 1]<BR>
<BR>
He woke counting seconds, rising throught interminable<BR>
strata of ebony chill to warmth, light and a growing <BR>
awareness. At thirty-two the eddy currents had warmed<BR>
him back to normal. At fifty-eight his heart began<BR>
beating under its own power. At seventy-three the pul-<BR>
mostor ceased heling his lungs. At two hundred and<BR>
fifteen the lid swung open with a pneumatic hiss.<BR>
<BR>
He lay enjoying the euphoria of resurrection.<BR>
<BR>
It was always the same, this feeling of well-being.<BR>
Each time he woke there was the surge of gladness that<BR>
once again he had beaten the odds. His body tingled<BR>
with life after the long sleep during which it had been <BR>
given the opportunity to mend minor ills. The waking<BR>
drugs stimulated his imagination. It was pleasant to lie,<BR>
eyes closed, lost in the pleasure of the moment.<BR>
<BR>
"You okay?"<BR>
<BR>
The voice was sharp, anxious, breaking into his<BR>
mood. Dumarest sighed and opened his eyes. The light<BR>
was too bright. He lifted a hand to shield his face,<BR>
lowered it as something blocked the glare. Benson<BR>
stood looking down at him from the foot of the open<BR>
box. He looked the same as Dumarest remembered, a<BR>
small man with a puckered face, an elaborate fringe of<BR>
beard and a slick of black hair, but how much did a man<BR>
have to age before it showed?<BR>
<BR>
"You made it," said the handler. He sounded<BR>
pleased. "I didn't expect trouble but for a minute back<BR>
there you had me worried." He leaned forward, his<BR>
head blocking more of the light. "You sure that you're<BR>
okay?"<BR>
<BR>
Dumarest nodded, reluctantly recognizing the need <BR>
to move. Reaching out, he clamped his hands on the<BR>
edges of the box and slowly pulled himself upright. His<BR>
body was as expected, nude, bleached white, the skin <BR>
tight over prominent bone. Cautiously he flexed his<BR>
muscles, inflated the barrel of his chest. He had lost fat<BR>
but little else. He was still numb for which he was <BR>
thankful.<BR>
<BR>
"I haven't lost a one yet," boasted the handler.<BR>
"That's why you had me worried. I've got a clean score<BR>
and I want it to stay that way."<BR>
<BR>
It wouldn't, of course. Benson was still fresh at the<BR>
game. Give him time and he would become less con-<BR>
scientous, more time and he would grow careless,<BR>
finally he wouldn't give a damn. That's when some of<BR>
his kind thought it cute to cut the dope and watch some<BR>
poor devil scream his lungs raw with the agony of<BR>
restored circulation.<BR>
<BR>
"I'm forgetting," he said. He passed over a cup of <BR>
brackish water. Dumarest drank it, handed back the <BR>
cup.<BR>
<BR>
"Thanks." His voice was thin, a little rusty. He<BR>
swallowed and tried again. This time he sounded more<BR>
like his normal self. "How about some basic?"<BR>
<BR>
"Coming right up."<BR>
<BR>
Dumarest sat hunched in the box as Benson crossed<BR>
to the dispenser. He wrapped his arms about his chest,<BR>
conscious of the cold, the bleakness of the compartment.<BR>
The place resembled a morgue. A chill,<BR>
blue-lighted cavern, the air tainted with a chemical<BR>
smell. A low place, shapeless with jutting struts and<BR>
curved beams, harsh with the unrelieved monotony of<BR>
unpainted metal.<BR>
<BR>
There was no need for heat in this part of the ship and<BR>
no intention of providing comfort. Just the bare metal,<BR>
the ultraviolet lamps washing the naked, coffin-like<BR>
boxes with their streilizing glow. Here was where the <BR>
livestock rode, doped, frozen, ninety per cent dead.<BR>
Here was the steerage for travelers willing to gamble<BR>
against the fifteen per cent mortality rate.<BR>
<BR>
Such travel was cheap - its sole virtue.<BR>
<BR>
But something was wrong.<BR>
<BR>
Dumarest sensed it with the caution born of long <BR>
years of experience. It wasn't the waking. He had<BR>
gained awareness long before the end of the five-minute<BR>
waking cycle. It wasn't Benson. It was something <BR>
else -- something which should not be.<BR>
<BR>
He found it after he had moistened the tips of his<BR>
fingers and rested them lightly against the bare metal of<BR>
the structure. They tingled with the faint but unmistak-<BR>
able effect of the Erhaft field. The ship was still in<BR>
space.<BR>
<BR>
And travelers were never revived until after landing.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:32:56 -0400<BR>
From: Mark Urbin <urbin@bigfoot.com><BR>
Subject: Ground Forces<BR>
<BR>
I've been up too late reading the playtest files for ground forces.<BR>
<BR>
I like it so far.  I'll get critical on the second pass.<BR>
<BR>
One nit...Jens as a Marine Recruit Instructor?  Berry, you have a sick <BR>
sense of humor. :-)<BR>
<BR>
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
urbin@bigfoot.com -- These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>
Joan of Arc: the patron saint of welders http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:40:08 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris NavigationalHazards)<BR>
<BR>
SD Mooney wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> At 12:18 -0400 26/4/00, "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote:<BR>
> >I see a trend... my first game was played on the SPI StarForce map.  I<BR>
> >played a Merchant named Beywolf Schaffer.  Craig ran the game, and I eneded<BR>
> >up being mind controlled by a Grog.<BR>
> <BR>
> I've been mind controlled by Grog too... ;-)<BR>
<BR>
"Mister President!"<BR>
<BR>
"Mister Vice!"<BR>
<BR>
"I regret to report that, contrary to the rules of the mess, Mister<BR>
Mooney has quoted a game other than Traveller in his signature file. <BR>
Sir!"<BR>
<BR>
"Mister Mooney, you will report to the grog bucket."<BR>
<BR>
<homer><BR>
Mmmmm, grog....<BR>
</homer><BR>
<BR>
BTW, who exactly _is_ the Mess President for the TML?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:01:51 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Especially the out-takes at the end of the movie<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Via electronic medium on 4/27/00 9:11 AM, egh@klg.com issued forth:<BR>
><BR>
> > Perhaps somewhere out there is the Hiver<BR>
> > equivalent of Jacky Chan.<BR>
><BR>
> Now this could make an amusing sight! ;)<BR>
><BR>
> Akella 0609 C654474-6 S kk+ hi++ as+ va+ dr+ da+ so@ zh- vi++  A523<BR>
> IMTU tc++ ?t4 ru@ 3i+(-) c+ jt au@ st- ls+ pi+ ta@ he+<BR>
> "Reality is an open ended event with no beginning and no end."<BR>
> BZAT: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/index.html<BR>
> Lanth6: http://www.sierratel.com/aum/BZAT/Lanth6/Main.html<BR>
> E-mail: xrp@sierratel.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:06:15 -0600<BR>
From: Dale Gyles <gyles@mtn-webtech.com><BR>
Subject: Armor vs X-ray Lasers<BR>
<BR>
I have some questions about armor protectection from X-ray detonation<BR>
lasers for the gearheads on the list.<BR>
<BR>
I was looking at HG today, and started wondering about the actual mass<BR>
needed to protect a ship from the dreaded detonation laser warhead.  Then I<BR>
wondered if a foamsteel could be used, perhaps foamed with a gas that<BR>
absorbed neutrons well and layered with ceramics for laser protection.<BR>
<BR>
Basically, I am looking for a way to make the volume tonnage and mass<BR>
tonnage of the armor somewhat closer together.  I am thinking that an<BR>
ablative, radiation scattering armor would work better for the type of<BR>
threats that a starship would face in combat, rather than the traditional<BR>
view of a dense plate of metal. <BR>
<BR>
Comments and/or info would be greatly appreciated.<BR>
<BR>
1.  Basic question; what would a square meter of armor with a 1/2 value<BR>
absorption mass?  IIRC, a density of 20 to 25 grams per centimeter squared<BR>
is needed to absorb half the X-rays from a nuclear detonation, which leads<BR>
to a mass of 200 to 250 kilograms per square meter.<BR>
<BR>
2.  Related questions; what would be the best real world material to use?<BR>
Would the density and material type  parameters be greatly affected by<BR>
variations in the X-ray frequency?  Would foamed armor filled with gas<BR>
affect the scattering/absorption of X-rays by increasing the path length,<BR>
assuming the same density per cm squared was used?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Dale Gyles<BR>
Black Eagle, MT<BR>
gyles@mtn-webtech.com<BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:28:43 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris NavigationalHazards)<BR>
<BR>
Black ICE wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> "Mister President!"<BR>
><BR>
> "Mister Vice!"<BR>
><BR>
> "I regret to report that, contrary to the rules of the mess, Mister<BR>
> Mooney has quoted a game other than Traveller in his signature file.<BR>
> Sir!"<BR>
><BR>
> "Mister Mooney, you will report to the grog bucket."<BR>
><BR>
> <homer><BR>
> Mmmmm, grog....<BR>
> </homer><BR>
><BR>
> BTW, who exactly _is_ the Mess President for the TML?<BR>
<BR>
It depends..who got us into this mes in the first place? hmmmm?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:47:45 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
James Lindsay wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>From a Hiver viewpoint, us humanoids might appear "awkward" in HTH combat.<BR>
>"Look at those strange creatures-- balanced on those two spindly legs.<BR>
>Their limb movements seem so restricted and they have to turn their<BR>
>top-heavy bodies around in order to face a threat from behind!"<BR>
<BR>
I'm trying to talk absolutes here, James. My contention is that Hivers<BR>
aren't built for the same kind of combat that we are[1]. On the other hand,<BR>
we have certain distinct advantages over Hivers in combat:<BR>
<BR>
Balanced on two spindly legs: fewer legs to move when turning. The ability<BR>
to place one foot on the ground and use it to pivot, with some degree of<BR>
stability, is extremely useful in combat. Our top heavy bodies are top heavy<BR>
because they're built vertically, not horizontally. The musculature and<BR>
weight of the top of the body can be used to great effect when punching or<BR>
swinging a weapon, all while our feet remain firmly planted. The basic<BR>
vertical nature of our hands allows us to use both balanced and unbalanced<BR>
weapons, of varying lengths. We do have to turn around when facing opponents<BR>
to our rear, but we can do that quickly and easily because we are tall, not<BR>
"wide" or "long". We may only have one facing, but it's easy to change that<BR>
facing, and we don't have necessarily give up a striking limb to do so. In<BR>
fact, it is possible to use that need to turn to our advantage if the right<BR>
manuever or weapon is used.<BR>
<BR>
Hivers might very well have an advantage with respect to *extremely* close<BR>
in grappling. In order to gain this advantage, however, they would have to<BR>
give up a good deal of their mobility.<BR>
<BR>
[1] Incidentally, we humans are not well equipped for the subtle nature of<BR>
Hiver fighting, which is one of the reasons that humans are scared sh*tless<BR>
of the Hivers and tend to get pretty paranoid around them.<BR>
<BR>
>> The best I can come up with is that they would use their "rear" hand (the<BR>
>> one opposite the head) to grip a weapon, but their lower strength and<BR>
>> bizarre form might make using such a weapon effectively somewhat<BR>
difficult.<BR>
><BR>
>I always thought that they would use such weaponry in their "front" hand,<BR>
>since *it* is the one with the eyes.  Eyes sighting parallel with the<BR>
>weapon's barrel would be a lot more accurate than the Hiver equivalent of<BR>
>"shooting from the hip".<BR>
<BR>
For small pistol-type weapons, I can imagine this would be useful. Longer<BR>
firearms would be awkward, unless balanced in some way. This could be<BR>
difficult, as any balance I can think of would, out of necessity, screw with<BR>
the eyes.<BR>
<BR>
Piercing melee weapons could also be used in the "head" hand, although any<BR>
blow to the weapon itself would likely endanger the eyes. I don't think that<BR>
slashing or bludgeoning melee weapons would be very effective in the "head"<BR>
hand (I know, it's not really a "head"), because that's where the eyes<BR>
happen to be. The eyes would have to move around a lot, and quickly, which<BR>
might serve to "blind" the Hiver.<BR>
<BR>
>It was actually me who asked Doug these very questions.  He seemed to think<BR>
>that Hivers weren't as sloth-like as I originally thought.<BR>
<BR>
Personally, I think you were right "originally". :)<BR>
<BR>
>BTW: The "aliens" section of ACQ is probably its weakest area.  I admit it.<BR>
>Lots of important stuff was left out due to a lack of playtested aliens and<BR>
>a lack of space in the final version.  To be fair, *alien* aliens such as<BR>
>the Hivers and K'kree really require their own dedicated combat system.  I<BR>
>hope that Doug and I will be forgiven :)<BR>
<BR>
If I pick it up, I'll be sure to be forgiving.<BR>
<BR>
>> On the other hand, their central bulk is "solid". I'm not sure how well<BR>
it<BR>
>> would stand up to impact.<BR>
><BR>
>But it is heavily armoured-- more so than our own skulls I might think.<BR>
<BR>
It is armored, the hiver brain is protected by two carapaces, between which<BR>
is a padding of internal organs. In addition, the brain is held in place by<BR>
shock absorbing ligaments so that it doesn't bounce around. If you ever do<BR>
an alien expansion for ACQ, I'd like to humbly suggest that this would mean<BR>
that Hivers would not be stunned or knocked out as easily as humans.<BR>
<BR>
However, their central bulk is *solid*. Impacts would be, to some extent<BR>
worse. When I was younger, I got hit by a car. Besides a slight pain in my<BR>
knee, and some scrapes, I was fine. A few years later, a car going about the<BR>
same speed crashed into a brick wall around the corner. It opened up a very<BR>
big hole. What I was getting at was that the solidity of the hub is a<BR>
disadvantage in this sense, that the solidity is a disadvantage with respect<BR>
to impact.<BR>
<BR>
Further, until you pointed out the top heavy nature of the human body in<BR>
another post, I hadn't realized that the central bulk has no internal<BR>
musculature, and the limbs aren't connected solidly to the trunk. In short,<BR>
each arm is completely independent, which means that it would be difficult<BR>
to use the bulk as an advantage in combat, as we use our torsos (and dogs<BR>
use their neck and shoulders).<BR>
<BR>
>> I'm not sure about this. Everything I've read about seems to indicate<BR>
that<BR>
>> they don't involve themselves in ground combat at all, and there is good<BR>
>> reason to believe that the entire concept of war was alien to them for a<BR>
>> huge chunk of their history. Further, the internal policy of the Hive<BR>
>> Federation is based around the (scientific) manipulation of the member<BR>
>> races, as well as their neighbors. Hivers defend themselves by making<BR>
sure<BR>
>> that no one around them has an interest in beating the snot out of them.<BR>
><BR>
>Possibly.  It is also equally possible that Hivers were at one point in<BR>
>their history better at ground combat than they are now, just as the<BR>
>"average" homo sapien was better at hunting 10,000 years ago than we are<BR>
>now (although our ATM skills are probably a little bit better than theirs).<BR>
>Technology and intellect have replaced cunning and instinct.<BR>
<BR>
There is no indication that the Hivers ever *had* the concept of war until<BR>
they got out into space and (presumably) came across the Ithklur. It might<BR>
have been earlier. That's not to say that Hivers didn't kill each other. An<BR>
Ithklur commenting on Hiver society implies that this is done in a<BR>
nonviolent fashion which would be detectable only by more than a cursory<BR>
autopsy (I take this to mean poison, myself). Of course, the Blissful<BR>
Warrior may be lying.<BR>
<BR>
At any rate, all canon sources I have at arm's length point out that Hiver<BR>
society is much more "harmonious" and "unified" then ours. I use each of<BR>
those terms in quotes because Hiver society is a complex web of individual<BR>
manipulations all going on at once. The Hivers did not form a central<BR>
government until after they got into space. Indeed, the Hivers themselves<BR>
don't have any far reaching government, merely custom. The Hive Federation<BR>
government exists for the benefit of other races which don't function as the<BR>
Hivers do.<BR>
<BR>
The Hivers are devoid of "love" in any sense of the word that we understand<BR>
it. Even their parental instinct is a generalized one. There is the strong<BR>
implication that they don't get angry. They don't appear to know fear in the<BR>
way that we do, *but* this seems to be left purposely ambiguous by the text.<BR>
Their primary instinct in a combat situation is to bolt, and even Hivers who<BR>
think that they can deal with combat run despite themselves. Still, the text<BR>
is ambiguous on this point.<BR>
<BR>
The only war that they ever got involved in canonically was against the<BR>
K'Kree. They didn't even establish a partnership with other races until they<BR>
realized that they were threatened by the Centaurs. They seem to have no<BR>
interest in *physical* conquest, though their manipulative / parental nature<BR>
lends itself to more subtle forms of domination. Presumably, they fight<BR>
against Virus-controlled ships when they show up as well.<BR>
<BR>
Not a single canonical reference I have nearby indicates that the Hivers<BR>
even *might* have been better at combat at one point.<BR>
<BR>
>Hivers *had* to be combat effective at one point.  It only makes sense.<BR>
<BR>
I honestly don't see why it makes sense, personally. Canonically, it's<BR>
stated that they hunted at one point in their past, but given everything<BR>
else that is mentioned about their society, I'd bet dollars to donuts that<BR>
they tended to *trap* their prey, not spear it or club it or go in close.<BR>
<BR>
>They can't manipulate *every* potential foe.<BR>
<BR>
It's worked so far for them.<BR>
<BR>
>Manipulation takes years.  A whack upside the head takes a fraction of a<BR>
second.<BR>
<BR>
That's just it, though. The Hivers have always *had* years. None of the<BR>
races which they initially discovered had acquired starflight. By the time<BR>
that they ran into the K'Kree, (the only foes they've gone up against) they<BR>
had already manipulated the Ithklur to the point that they could serve as<BR>
ground troops. The only sort of combat which they have *ever* engaged in (at<BR>
least on any wide scale) is space combat. The Ithklur blissful warrior<BR>
points out that they tend to run from that sort of combat as well (he seems<BR>
as bitter as an Ithklur can be about this, since Ithklur tend to get left<BR>
planetside with no space support when that happens).<BR>
<BR>
>Our disagreement on this point probably revolves around the *degree* of<BR>
this<BR>
>effectiveness in combat.<BR>
<BR>
It seems that we disagree on a number of points. :)<BR>
<BR>
To sum up my current position:<BR>
<BR>
Hivers are physiologically not designed for the same sort of ground combat<BR>
that we know. In my opinion, this physical weakness is the reason that they<BR>
are psychologically adverse to combat to the point that they will<BR>
characteristically bolt. Canonically, the second part of my position is<BR>
supported, and the first part comes from only semi-informed speculation<BR>
based on canon.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 01:03:19 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>Remember that Hiver newborns are itty-bitty larva.<BR>
><BR>
>Still, I wonder what it does to a race's psychology to have every<BR>
>individual's first awareness include being a hunted food animal/pest.<BR>
<BR>
I would bet the Hivers who try to avoid being eaten, by getting away as fast<BR>
as possible, would be the ones most likely to survive. Interestingly enough,<BR>
when faced with the possibility of close combat, they characteristically run<BR>
away and fight only as an absolute last resort. According to Aliens of the<BR>
Rim, Hivers are highly individualistic and extremely selfish[1]. I suspect<BR>
that both of these general traits are reasonable for members of a race in<BR>
which every individual's first awareness includes being a hunted food<BR>
animal/pest.<BR>
<BR>
[1] Paradoxically, they are said to also be extremely cooperative. The<BR>
running Ithklur commentary chalks this up to the constant manipulations<BR>
which are always going on. While I agree with him, it should be noted that<BR>
the Hiver parental instinct is strongest toward "yearlings" who have made it<BR>
back from the wilderness. The way I understand it is that while they may<BR>
struggle with other individualistic Hivers through manipulation, they would<BR>
see the safety of the yearlings in the nest to be of paramount, and hence<BR>
would cooperate to this end. This generalized parental instinct is probably<BR>
why they never developed a concept of "war" on their homeworld. Their<BR>
parental instinct covers *all* yearlings, not just their own. Indeed, this<BR>
parental instinct has even been aroused by the developing cultures of other<BR>
races.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 01:01:51 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Small Merchants<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/27/00 9:19:18 AM Mountain Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> How are small merchant ships,ie free traders and the like, able to survive<BR>
>  in an economic environment that involves large shipping/transport companies<BR>
>  such as Tukera Lines and a great many others?<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
    GT: Far Trader explains this nicely.  The major carriers like things <BR>
regular and predictable: they'd book the large ships to capacity a decade in <BR>
advance if they could.  Those who ship cargo, on the other hand, would prefer <BR>
their stuff sent or delivered when it is needed: not a day later nor an hour <BR>
earlier, and don't know years in advance when that will be. So, the free <BR>
trader caters to out-of-the way destinations, last-minute contracts, <BR>
temporary periods when the big freighters and liners are overbooked, odd <BR>
lots, special handling, and customized pickup and delivery services. They are <BR>
also usually the ones that *develop* new routes and markets for the larger <BR>
carriers.<BR>
<BR>
    IMTU, the big lines contract with smaller companies to do this kind of <BR>
specialty work.  As long as they know and keep their place, competent and <BR>
reliable small traders can pick up enough contracts and referrals from the <BR>
large carriers to make a comfortable living. Earning a  bad reputation <BR>
(upstart or incompetent) with the big lines is a well-travelled road to <BR>
starvation.<BR>
<BR>
    Just before GT: Far Trader came out, I had just done a variant on trade <BR>
rules. They had some problems, but one thing they did reasonably well was <BR>
help determine what proportions of  what kind of cargo would come from what <BR>
worlds, and adjust speculative prices according to the kind of goods being <BR>
dealt with. Should I dig these out and see if they can be revised?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:28:16 -0700<BR>
From: "J. Paul Sanders" <timmon@primenet.com><BR>
Subject: GDW Memo...<BR>
<BR>
Was going through some of my material and came across this old GDW memo (Marc<BR>
included it with some items I ordered from him a few years ago). It was<BR>
apparently written in preparation for the production of the Atlas of the<BR>
Imperium. Thought I'd share it with the list as some might find it<BR>
interesting.<BR>
<BR>
Enjoy!<BR>
Paul<BR>
<BR>
***<BR>
BACKGROUND: Not for publication without prior arrangement.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Game Designers' Workshop<BR>
<BR>
P.O. Box 1646 <BR>
Bloomington, Illinois 61701<BR>
(309) 452-3632<BR>
<BR>
Subject: Sectors Assigned to Individuals and Companies.<BR>
<BR>
Trojan Reach - granted to Bob McWilliams of Games Workshop. Portions mapped by<BR>
him in Leviathan. Remaining 14 subsectors will be mapped by Marc W. Miller in<BR>
Atlas of the Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Riftspan Reaches - granted to Andy Slack of Games Workshop. Proposed<BR>
mapping by<BR>
him proved unsatisfactory. Will be mapped by Marc W. Miller in Atlas of the<BR>
Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Corridor - used as a personal preserve by Marc W. Miller.<BR>
<BR>
Reavers Deep - granted to Bill and Andrew Keith of Marischal Adventures. Their<BR>
mapping will appear in Atlas of the Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Old Expanses - granted to Jim Cunningham of High Passage Magazine. His mapping<BR>
will appear in Atlas of the Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Solomani Rim - mapped by Jim Harshman.<BR>
<BR>
Spinward Marches - mapped by Marc W. Miller.<BR>
<BR>
Far Frontiers - granted to FASA and mapped by Dale L. Kemper. When FASA<BR>
discontinued production of Traveller materials, they set Dale loose with his<BR>
manuscript, which he offered to Ares magazine. They published it in Special<BR>
Edition 2.<BR>
<BR>
Theta Borealis - mapped using a computer program at GDW and supplied to Group<BR>
One. Frankly, I disremember if they ever published the sector map and data,<BR>
although they worked from the data.<BR>
<BR>
Vanguard Reaches - granted to Chuck Kallenbach of Paranoia Press. See Beyond.<BR>
<BR>
Beyond - granted to Don Rapp of Paranoia Press. These two early sectors<BR>
(Vanguard Reaches and Beyond) contain materials which are now thought<BR>
unacceptable, and as a result we consider them to be like Prester John's<BR>
Kingdom - wild stories of far away places rather than accurate readings of<BR>
astrography. Both are out of print, with the rights sold to FASA: FASA has<BR>
been<BR>
informed that they cannot be reprinted in their present form and will require<BR>
approval prior to a new edition.<BR>
<BR>
Let Sector - granted to Judges Guild.<BR>
<BR>
Glimmerdrift - granted to Judges Guild.<BR>
<BR>
Marantha Alkahest - granted Judges Guild.<BR>
<BR>
Crucis Margin - granted to Judges Guild.<BR>
<BR>
 all four Judges Guild sectors were granted at their urging with promises of<BR>
many adventures set within their boundaries. At one point, GDW specifically<BR>
urged more adventures before new sectors were published, but JG said they<BR>
needed the entire four sectors in print first. Once they were in print,<BR>
adventures just never appeared. The Judges Guild license has lapsed, and no<BR>
new<BR>
products from them are expected. These sectors are now considered<BR>
unacceptable;<BR>
entirely new star maps are being generated for inclusion in the Atlas of the<BR>
Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
***<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 01:45:07 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: GDW Memo...<BR>
<BR>
J. Paul Sanders wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Corridor - used as a personal preserve by Marc W. Miller.<BR>
<BR>
I guess that makes Corridor a (roleplaying) game preserve... :)<BR>
<BR>
[Yeah, it's a horrible pun, so shoot me!]<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:11:53 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations (was Re Camerone) (Long)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>> *Swiss Guards of the Vatican (now purely ceremonial, but in their day the<BR>
>> MM-F (please don't ask me to explain this one, work it out....) on the<BR>
>> European continent<BR>
<BR>
>Actually, they are both ceremonial *and* practical. They do guard<BR>
>mounts in the fancy outfits, just like the Coldstream Guard in their<BR>
>"traditional" uniforms guarding Buckingham Palace.<BR>
<BR>
>But both units have quite modern weapons ready to hand, as well as<BR>
>folks in more practical uniforms in reserve.<BR>
<BR>
I stand corrected (Picture: Self bashing own head saying "I knew that, I<BR>
knew that.  Doc, how prevalent is BSE ......).<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:21:15 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Camerone Day/Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
> I had this idea that the Sylean Federation had a Roman Axillaries thing<BR>
> happening - where, from memory (so I am most likely wrong) - the empire<BR>
> offered citizenship to troops from certain annexed provinces in return<BR>
> for service (20 years?). In Sylea - I thought that 3 terms (minimum &<BR>
> honourable discharge at service's end) in the marines would give someone<BR>
> Sylean Fed citizen. In terms of training -  the first two years were a<BR>
> combination of basic, advanced and high tech acclimatisation training.<BR>
><BR>
> Any comments?<BR>
<BR>
Strangely enough I think that this is exactly the incentive that the FFL<BR>
uses in its recruiting.  I understand that after a specific length of<BR>
service (or is it on reaching a particular rank?  Anyone know?)  they are<BR>
offered French citizenship.  In effect their lives 'before the legion'<BR>
ceases to exist from a French Government perspective once they take<BR>
citizenship.   I may be wrong, but I'm fairly sure that that is the deal.<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 01:27:46 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Armor vs X-ray Lasers<BR>
<BR>
Dale Gyles wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> I have some questions about armor protectection from X-ray detonation<BR>
> lasers for the gearheads on the list.<BR>
> <BR>
> I was looking at HG today, and started wondering about the actual mass<BR>
> needed to protect a ship from the dreaded detonation laser warhead.  Then I<BR>
> wondered if a foamsteel could be used, perhaps foamed with a gas that<BR>
> absorbed neutrons well and layered with ceramics for laser protection.<BR>
> <BR>
> Basically, I am looking for a way to make the volume tonnage and mass<BR>
> tonnage of the armor somewhat closer together.  I am thinking that an<BR>
> ablative, radiation scattering armor would work better for the type of<BR>
> threats that a starship would face in combat, rather than the traditional<BR>
> view of a dense plate of metal.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, given that jump performance of a starship in Traveller is<BR>
based on the volume of the ship, designers _want_ dense armor for<BR>
ships.  After all, every cubic meter of armor is one less cubic meter of<BR>
other stuff (power plant, weapons, accommodations, cargo, etc.).<BR>
<BR>
Besides, if you're using HG2 (or FF&S2; I'm not familiar with MT or TNE<BR>
design sequences), then det-laser missiles and X-ray lasers are not the<BR>
main threats to warships of destroyer (3000+ dtons) size and larger. <BR>
Meson guns (which ignore armor) and NPAWs (which, while affected by<BR>
armor, have much higher battery ratings than either missiles or lasers)<BR>
are the main threat to major combatants.  You protect against meson guns<BR>
with meson shielding; you protect against NPAWs with as much mass<BR>
between the NPAW and you as possible.  To achieve the same protection as<BR>
1 cm of TL12 Superdense [density 15], you would need to use 2.8 cm of<BR>
Light Ceramic Composite [density 6] (using FF&S2 figures).  Note that<BR>
1*15 < 2.8*6, making Superdense more efficient in terms of<BR>
mass/protection, as well as in terms of volume/protection.  The least<BR>
dense material listed in FF&S2 is TL7 Fiberglass [density .4].  You<BR>
would need 55.56 cm of TL7 Fiberglass to equal the protection of 1 cm of<BR>
Superdense.  This would mass more (55.56*0.4=22.22) than either<BR>
Superdense (1*15=15) or Light Ceramic Composite (2.8*6=16.8), for the<BR>
same level of protection.  Again, I point out that the more volume your<BR>
armor requires, the less room you have for other items.<BR>
<BR>
Concerning ablative armor:  Picture how long it would take to replace<BR>
damaged ablative armor on a _Tigress_.  Regular armor would require<BR>
relatively little repair, while ablative armor, by its very nature,<BR>
would tend to require more extensive replacement (after all, ablative<BR>
armor works by vaporizing, thus dissipating the incoming energy).<BR>
<BR>
Bottom line:  If you're worried about det-laser missiles, add a few<BR>
laser turret batteries, sandcasters, and/or dampers to your designs. <BR>
Armor is for the big stuff (NPAWs), the denser the better.<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2365<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 28 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2366<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
GT: Alien Module 3 (also: Attn: LKW)<BR>
Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater" (was Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
RE: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
OT? Cherryh Maps<BR>
Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris NavigationalHazards)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re Centerfolds<BR>
Re increased radiation surface<BR>
Lost Keith Supplements<BR>
Non Citizen's in the US forces and those fluffy FFL types<BR>
GT GF Playtest<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Armor vs X-ray Lasers<BR>
Re: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Radiators, airflow<BR>
RE: CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:49:06 -0700<BR>
From: Kristian Miller <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
<BR>
Luther Martin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Fortunately, the board for Mayday is fairly simple.  Another plus is that I<BR>
> will now have a way to kill time on those annoying flights from San<BR>
> Francisco to Singapore.<BR>
<BR>
Yea, company trips to Singapore are rough.  <BR>
<BR>
Count me in for some ADC testing of FFW.<BR>
<BR>
Kristian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:56:25 +0200<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
Subject: GT: Alien Module 3 (also: Attn: LKW)<BR>
<BR>
Anybody seen this one yet? Is it out?<BR>
<BR>
What Ive seen so far in the announcements sounds absolutely great! I love<BR>
the idea with the Coyns...<BR>
<BR>
Loren, when we get the book, may we copy those coyns so we dont have to <BR>
punch them out if we want to use em?<BR>
- ---<BR>
Volker A. Greimann<BR>
greimann@geocities.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:00:06 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
>> I also picked up the Big Floppy Book of CT reprints. I got a<BR>
>> strange sense of nostalgia from reading through it, despite the<BR>
>> fact I've only been playing Trav for three years (and wasn't<BR>
>> actually conceived when CT was first published...).<BR>
<BR>
>S**t, now I feel old!  :-(<BR>
<BR>
Ditto.  (I still have the original LBB's I bought in 1979!  I might just<BR>
invest in a BFB in order to give the fraying pages a chance.)<BR>
<BR>
Dom  wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>This isn't a winge - just we acknowledge that BITS is a hobby to us -<BR>
>after discussion with Andy Slack (CT, 2300, GT, BITS) who used to<BR>
>work for Games Workshop (not GDW) it is apparent that it isn't really<BR>
>financial viable to do this as a career (unless maybe we moved to the<BR>
>US) unless we live in bedsits. But, I like my real job, and I just<BR>
>feel privileged to be able to write stuff for the game that really<BR>
>fired me up about RPGs. Naturally, I'd hope that there is scope for<BR>
>CORE (http://www.core.org.uk/) to contribute to T5 in the future.<BR>
<BR>
Strangely enough Andy Slack is the guy who introduced me to Traveller back<BR>
in 1979 whilst we both attended  Reading University.  He graduated soon<BR>
after I arrived and I then had a disagreement with the "Failure's<BR>
Committee".  I eventually took the Queens shilling and have been<BR>
"Travelling" at government expense ever since.  Small World!!<BR>
<BR>
Point taken re financial viability, but that only increases my admiration<BR>
for what you guys at BITS have actually achieved.  (I'll get up off my knees<BR>
now and retreat backwards towards the door ....) :-)<BR>
<BR>
Best Wishes<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:11:55 +1000<BR>
From: "John Mee" <jbmee@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Re: "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater" (was Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
<BR>
Picture:  Self on floor lying face down.  Feet and hands thumping ground<BR>
rapidly.  Voice over, shouting "Stop it! Stop it! Please I can't go on .....<BR>
<BR>
John<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:42:20 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Rob Eaglestone<BR>
><BR>
> If anyone has this fine book,<BR>
<BR>
I have both that and the first eleven books in the series.<BR>
<BR>
> perhaps he or<BR>
> she would condescend to volunteer to type in<BR>
> the second [or third] section of Chapter 1.<BR>
<BR>
Why ?<BR>
That's what _scanners_ are for !<BR>
<grin><BR>
<BR>
Seriously though, these are great books for Traveller, thought they do fall<BR>
into a formula.<BR>
<BR>
The one I like best is number 7(?) "The Jester at Skar", largely because of<BR>
the fungoid life forms  (talk about a "corrosive" atmosphere, and the<BR>
character of the Jester himself.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:22:57 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: OT? Cherryh Maps<BR>
<BR>
This is cross posted from the Cherryh list and may be of interest to <BR>
some of you.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
At 7:19 +0100 28/4/00, Cherryhlist wrote:<BR>
>;Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:01:28 -0400<BR>
>;From: Ben Lin <benlin@nova.org><BR>
><BR>
>After a year and a half of laziness, I have finally put an on-line<BR>
>version of<BR>
>the ChView map with CJC's place names at:<BR>
><BR>
>http://www.solstation.com/cjc-25ly.htm<BR>
><BR>
>The map only encompasses stars within 25 light-years of Earth/Sol.  In<BR>
>addition, although it only has some minimal features from the full<BR>
>ChView<BR>
>version, you can still rotate and re-center it like with a ChView map.<BR>
><BR>
>However, in a new feature only possible with the web, you can<BR>
>double-click on<BR>
>a CJC star/place name and go to a web page with a bit of additional<BR>
>information (such as a chronology of events mostly before the Treaty of<BR>
>Pell was negotiated in 2353 CE that was copied from the ChView<BR>
>"colonize" file -- which was created with God's permission).  (Each<BR>
>place page may also have links to a map with the real star names and<BR>
>astronomical information on the closest stars -- yes, a project that<BR>
>will never be trully finished.)  A web page with links to available web<BR>
>pages on CJC places is available at:<BR>
><BR>
>http://www.solstation.com/cjcstars.htm<BR>
><BR>
>If you would like to suggest corrections or the inclusion of additional<BR>
>information, please let me know.<BR>
><BR>
>Cheers,<BR>
><BR>
>Ben<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:17:23 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris NavigationalHazards)<BR>
<BR>
At 2:27 -0400 28/4/00, Black ICE <wombat@premier.net> wrote:<BR>
> > I've been mind controlled by Grog too... ;-)<BR>
>"Mister President!"<BR>
>"Mister Vice!"<BR>
>"I regret to report that, contrary to the rules of the mess, Mister<BR>
>Mooney has quoted a game other than Traveller in his signature file.<BR>
>Sir!"<BR>
>"Mister Mooney, you will report to the grog bucket."<BR>
><homer><BR>
>Mmmmm, grog....<BR>
></homer><BR>
<BR>
;-) So I play RuneQuest (hi Derrick), 7th Sea, LoT5R, Cyberpunk 2020, <BR>
Faded Suns, and CoC... Your problem is....? <grin><BR>
<BR>
>BTW, who exactly _is_ the Mess President for the TML?<BR>
<BR>
Probably Eris, it's make the rules more fun if they got changed regularly...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com--------<BR>
"Even in the most depressing dystopia, there's still the notion<BR>
that the future is something we build. It doesn't just happen.<BR>
You can't predict the future, but you can invent it. Build it." -<BR>
'Fallen Angels' Niven/Pournelle/Flynn ---All Rob Prior's<BR>
MacOS software @ http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:07:00 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
At 16:39 -0400 27/4/00, "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote:<BR>
>BTW: The "aliens" section of ACQ is probably its weakest area.  I admit it.<BR>
>Lots of important stuff was left out due to a lack of playtested aliens and<BR>
>a lack of space in the final version.  To be fair, *alien* aliens such as<BR>
>the Hivers and K'kree really require their own dedicated combat system.  I<BR>
>hope that Doug and I will be forgiven :)<BR>
<BR>
Well, we'll happily put any system extensions/notes on the BITS <BR>
website, probably an FAQ too.<BR>
<BR>
We'll also happily take scenario suggestions if you want to share <BR>
them with us; these are open to everyone, not just Doug and James ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:53:56 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Centerfolds<BR>
<BR>
While hivers only have one gender, ISTR that droyne have 3... Alpha Male,<BR>
Beta Male (Catalyst? Binom?), and female.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:01:10 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re increased radiation surface<BR>
<BR>
One further comment on textured surfaces:<BR>
<BR>
the method of small grooves works best on an overall convex surface; very<BR>
few traveller ships will have anything but curved radiator surfaces; nice<BR>
flat plates are not common in traveller ships.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:45:00 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: Lost Keith Supplements<BR>
<BR>
Received mine today, and I have to agree with previous comments.<BR>
<BR>
These were _definitely_ worth the wait !<BR>
<BR>
Even the packaging was innovative, like a lost file recovered from the<BR>
depths of an Imperial ministry somewhere.<BR>
<BR>
The Letter of Marque and the Bar Chit's are great props.<BR>
<BR>
And all that Keith artwork !<BR>
<BR>
Thanks for all the time & effort that went into them Paul.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:36:41 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: Non Citizen's in the US forces and those fluffy FFL types<BR>
<BR>
Thanks for the info guys. Okay, another question. Just how much can a non<BR>
citizen US mil person access? In terms of accessing intel - is citizenship a<BR>
requirement in a clearance process? It is in Oz...<BR>
<BR>
Also, FFL soldier's do get french citizenship (but I'm not sure when). And<BR>
as for 'your life begins anew' that's also true - but you have to tell them<BR>
anything that went on in the old - in great detail. In terms of accepting<BR>
crims, I believe that it's a no to druggies, sex offenders and murderers -<BR>
but GBH and Armed Robbery is A-OK.<BR>
<BR>
I think the Spanish FL has the same deal (and their nasty - they only banned<BR>
physical abuse by instructor's 15 years ago - from memory).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Ob Trav; Would impies accept crims into their ranks? I like the idea of what<BR>
some judges did in years past; '3 years in the military or 30 in the pen -<BR>
choose'. Um - military, yes please.<BR>
<BR>
M ('007 - do you know what this is', 'a faberge egg sir...')<BR>
<BR>
I'd make a good M (In RL I believe it's 'C').<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:56:45 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: GT GF Playtest<BR>
<BR>
GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
<BR>
>Title say's it all<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Woo-heee-ha! Have I been waiting for that....<BR>
Download complete.<BR>
<BR>
I'll get back to y'all in a couple of hours, after I've read through it.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
Pssst, send me a copy - but don't tell Doug B or LKW or SJ. Frankly, I enjoy<BR>
living without a Penguin, ahem, inserted somewhere unpleasant.<BR>
<BR>
Frankly, I can see Doug as one of the RPG designers least likely to by<BR>
Copyright violated. Perhaps a pic of him with a bandolier of 4cm P-shaped<BR>
RAM grenades for the designer pic might help enforce this 'don't mess with<BR>
my royalties' image.<BR>
<BR>
Michael<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:55:01 +0100<BR>
From: "Greg Aldridge" <Greg.Aldridge@marconicomms.com><BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
> >Hell, no SF game (and damn few stories) deals with the problem of<BR>
> >disposing of waste heat! Most ships would fry in short order because of<BR>
> >waste heat buildup.<BR>
><BR>
> I was thinking of surface area requirements in FFS2 and the heat dissipation<BR>
> problems and a strange thought came to me.  What if we take a cue from bio-<BR>
> logy to help increase surface area?  Organisms have taken many routes to<BR>
> increase the area/volume ratio, some of which could be done to spacecraft in<BR>
> Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
Doesn't T4 have radiators with 'fractal' surfaces.  I'm sure I've read it in<BR>
either the main book or FF&S2.<BR>
<BR>
Greg.<BR>
<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
     Greg Aldridge      | "Since light travels faster than sound, isn't<BR>
   Software Engineer,   | that why some people appear bright until you<BR>
    Marconi Software    |              hear them speak?"<BR>
       Solutions        |<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
                 Email: Greg.Aldridge@marconicomms.com<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
IMTU tc tm tn t4+ tg ru+ ge(+) 3i+ c+ jt au- ls+ pi ta-- he as vi sy+ so<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:24:09 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Hey, just ask if you can use a version of Larry Niven's Firestop (tm)<BR>
> device.<BR>
<BR>
The "Fryrestop device" was essentially the same as Jown W. Campbell's<BR>
"Nevian ray of anti-catalysis" (from the Arcot,. Morey and Wade series<BR>
of stories). Both function in exactly the same way. They *stop*<BR>
chemical reactions in their effect area. <BR>
<BR>
That has nothing to do with *cooling*. But they make great death rays.<BR>
:-) <BR>
<BR>
> Personally I'd go with stowable arrays.  It works.<BR>
<BR>
I like it because it gives a *reason* that ships can be taken intact.<BR>
Do enough surface damage, and they no longer have enough radiator area<BR>
to run the drive without frying themselves. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:31:27 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> >> I also picked up the Big Floppy Book of CT reprints. I got a<BR>
>> >> strange sense of nostalgia from reading through it, despite the<BR>
>> >> fact I've only been playing Trav for three years (and wasn't<BR>
>> >> actually conceived when CT was first published...).<BR>
>> ><BR>
>> >S**t, now I feel old!  :-(<BR>
>> >Regards PLST<BR>
>><BR>
>><BR>
>> I think this is a conversation we already had...<g><BR>
>><BR>
>> NB<BR>
><BR>
> Consider this. All of the people who originally played CT are now suffering<BR>
> from a wide range of symptoms including weight gain, increased blood<BR>
> pressure, memory loss, etc.<BR>
<BR>
Weight, yeah. Blood pressuure increaese? Nope. Memory loss? Hah! I do<BR>
most of my replies based on rules background without even needing to<BR>
pick up the books!<BR>
<BR>
> Could CT be hazardous to your health? Should it be strictly regulated<BR>
> by the government? What will happen now that the CT reprints are<BR>
> available?<BR>
<BR>
Lots of senior citizens will have *improved* mental acuity due to the<BR>
(quite real!) "use it or lose it" effect.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:34:05 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Others have said that they wouldn't have to wheel around in combat. I<BR>
> disagree. Their tentacles are relatively short. Although a Hiver might<BR>
> effectively be able to use a pistol in any direction (which would certainly<BR>
> be an advantage), or throw something, melee weapons would afford them less<BR>
> flexibility. The long reach of their limbs is an advantage, but only if that<BR>
> limb's facing is pointed in your direction. If a fighter could manage to get<BR>
> on the other side of a Hiver, the Hiver would not be able to strike him<BR>
> unless he switched hands.<BR>
<BR>
Which is why a Hiver's idea of a "personal weapon" is a projectile or<BR>
energy weapon strapped to his "back", with a hand control for *powered*<BR>
rotation and firing (ie a miniature turret!).<BR>
<BR>
Or maybe (for use against taller opponents) a sort of upside down "weed<BR>
whacker... :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:01:12 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Armor vs X-ray Lasers<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I have some questions about armor protectection from X-ray detonation<BR>
> lasers for the gearheads on the list.<BR>
><BR>
> I was looking at HG today, and started wondering about the actual mass<BR>
> needed to protect a ship from the dreaded detonation laser warhead.  Then I<BR>
> wondered if a foamsteel could be used, perhaps foamed with a gas that<BR>
> absorbed neutrons well and layered with ceramics for laser protection.<BR>
><BR>
> Basically, I am looking for a way to make the volume tonnage and mass<BR>
> tonnage of the armor somewhat closer together.  I am thinking that an<BR>
> ablative, radiation scattering armor would work better for the type of<BR>
> threats that a starship would face in combat, rather than the traditional<BR>
> view of a dense plate of metal. <BR>
><BR>
> Comments and/or info would be greatly appreciated.<BR>
><BR>
> 1.  Basic question; what would a square meter of armor with a 1/2 value<BR>
> absorption mass?  IIRC, a density of 20 to 25 grams per centimeter squared<BR>
> is needed to absorb half the X-rays from a nuclear detonation, which leads<BR>
> to a mass of 200 to 250 kilograms per square meter.<BR>
<BR>
You are overlooking a *critical* detail. When absorbing energy from a<BR>
laser hit of *any* sort, you have to consider the *rate* at which the<BR>
energy is deposited (joules/sec). As well as the "density"<BR>
(joules/m^2). <BR>
<BR>
You'll quickly discover that the armor doing the absorbing is<BR>
*explosively* converted to plasma. These hits are *explosions* on/in<BR>
the armor. As such, many materials are ruled out because they'll<BR>
fracture badly from the shock waves.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:13:57 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> For your reading pleasure, here is the first<BR>
> section of the first chapter of the first<BR>
> Dumarest book.  I found it this Tuesday and<BR>
> greatly relished reading it.  Visit your local<BR>
> used bookstores and look for the Dumarest books<BR>
> by E.C. Tubb if you like a well-written Sci-Fi<BR>
> adventure that is Traveller compatible.<BR>
<BR>
Given that his stuff was one of the *inspirations* for Traveller... :-)<BR>
<BR>
> If anyone has this fine book, perhaps he or<BR>
> she would condescend to volunteer to type in<BR>
> the second [or third] section of Chapter 1.<BR>
<BR>
Please *don't*. We don't want anyone being sued for copyright<BR>
infringement. Those books won't be out of copyright until 50 (or is it<BR>
70?) years after the author *dies*. <BR>
<BR>
I also think they may be back in print.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:28:23 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Incidentally, (and this occured to me yesterday while browsing FFS2's<BR>
> Superblack Coatings section) won't painting your hull black, as every<BR>
> warship does, increase the rate of heat radiation from your surface?<BR>
<BR>
Yes. It also increases the rate at which you *absorb* heat from the<BR>
star. <BR>
<BR>
> Painting it silver would seem to be the better option. Sure, a mirrored hull<BR>
> would make you reflect back active sensor traces something terrible, but in<BR>
> FFS2 actives don't seem to be a lot of good at space combat ranges. Anyone<BR>
> agree?<BR>
<BR>
It's "hard" to get a coating that is "silver" at IR wavelengths. :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:30:05 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> On Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:12:47 -0700, Tod Glenn<BR>
> <webmaster@travellercentral.com> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> <snip><BR>
>>merely that fuel cells frozen into solid water.  A ship's combat manuvering<BR>
>>was limited by its ability to store waste heat before the crew baked.  A<BR>
>>captain has two options:  Vent steam, and quickly eliminate stored heat, but<BR>
>>reduce fuel, or deploy deploy his radiator--huge sail like radiating<BR>
>>surfaces trailed behind the ship while cruising.<BR>
>><BR>
>>This led to some interesting manuvers, like dragging your 'sails' through<BR>
>>the upper atmosphere to increase the cooling effect, but making a ship<BR>
>>vulnerable in a gravity well.  You could also get caught with your 'sails'<BR>
> <snip><BR>
><BR>
> Wouldn't the sails gain heat from friction caused by contacting the<BR>
> atmosphere at orbital speeds?<BR>
<BR>
Only if there's a *lot* of friction. Most "re-entry" heating is due to<BR>
*compression* heating of the air piling up in front of the ship.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 22:38:06 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Radiators, airflow<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>Ludowick@aol.com writes:<BR>
>><BR>
>>> I was thinking of surface area requirements in FFS2 and the heat<BR>
>>> dissipation problems and a strange thought came to me.  What if we take a<BR>
>>> cue from bio- logy to help increase surface area?  Organisms have taken <BR>
> many<BR>
>>> routes to  increase the area/volume ratio, some of which could be done to<BR>
>>> spacecraft in  Traveller.<BR>
>><BR>
>>Most of those methods, unfortunately, do not work for radiant heat, only for<BR>
>>conduction.  A 'furry' surface may have 10x the surface area of the same<BR>
>>number of square meters of flat metal, but it won't radiate any more energy<BR>
>>(unless its albedo is changed, which might either increase or decrease<BR>
>>effectiveness).  The reason for this is that on a 'fuzzy' surface, a lot of<BR>
>>the heat that is radiated is promptly re-absorbed by another part of the<BR>
>>surface.<BR>
><BR>
> OTGH, there is a way that does work, but it only increases surface area by<BR>
> 10-20%: concave corrugation:<BR>
><BR>
> vaccum<BR>
> \__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/\__/<BR>
> Radiator  assy.<BR>
><BR>
> since the radiant heat will only be partially back towards the radiator, so<BR>
> long as the grooves are shallow enough, the net effect will be increased<BR>
> effective surface area; albeit at highly increased cost in most cases.<BR>
<BR>
You'll discover that you *don't* radiate any more heat than a flat<BR>
plate that covers the same area will. Because a good chunk of the<BR>
radiation from the sides of the grooves is towards the back towards the<BR>
"floor" or other side of the groove.<BR>
<BR>
Consider yourself to be an oberserver at some distance *from* the<BR>
plate. And calculate the radiant flux *from* the plate. Surprise, the<BR>
flat plate produces the *same* flux as the corrugated one. <BR>
<BR>
What counts is *how much of the sky* the radiator can see. A flat plate<BR>
can see 180 degrees. <BR>
<BR>
A simpler corrugation:  \/\/ sees the angle at which the sides meet.<BR>
Your more complex one sees an angle defined by drawiing a line from the<BR>
center of the bottom to the edges of the corrugation. That angle gets<BR>
wider as the sides get shorter (and thus the flat central portion gets<BR>
wider). And when the sides reach the limit of zero height, it becomes<BR>
180. At which point you are back to a flat plate again!<BR>
<BR>
> Also, if run at the correct depth and angles, the lammelar air-flow<BR>
> turbulence will increase strealined-efficiency when in atmosphere.<BR>
<BR>
So would "blowing" the surface (look up the Coanda effect). And there<BR>
are reports that the right sort of small, electrically charged spikes<BR>
will tailor airflow as well. <BR>
<BR>
On the other hand, we are dealing with *supersonic* airflows here.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:05:12 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Leonard Erickson<BR>
> <BR>
> Weight, yeah. Blood pressuure increaese? Nope. Memory loss? Hah! I do<BR>
> most of my replies based on rules background without even needing to<BR>
> pick up the books!<BR>
<BR>
We can tell !<BR>
<grin> <BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 21:48:46 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
All this brings to mind a bit of technical data from Niven/Pournelle's "The Moat<BR>
around Murchisons's Eye"... Empire warships and one of the civilian ships (a<BR>
racing yacht) have hull coatings of superconductor material with a wire<BR>
(superconducting) running into a tank of water/ice for cooling. Of course the<BR>
ships (at least the warships) have black globe style generators (some<BR>
differences). The point is...would a superconduccting coat a) stop visible<BR>
wavelength lasers? and b) radiate heat more efficiently?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> > On Thu, 27 Apr 2000 19:12:47 -0700, Tod Glenn<BR>
> > <webmaster@travellercentral.com> wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > <snip><BR>
> >>merely that fuel cells frozen into solid water.  A ship's combat manuvering<BR>
> >>was limited by its ability to store waste heat before the crew baked.  A<BR>
> >>captain has two options:  Vent steam, and quickly eliminate stored heat, but<BR>
> >>reduce fuel, or deploy deploy his radiator--huge sail like radiating<BR>
> >>surfaces trailed behind the ship while cruising.<BR>
> >><BR>
> >>This led to some interesting manuvers, like dragging your 'sails' through<BR>
> >>the upper atmosphere to increase the cooling effect, but making a ship<BR>
> >>vulnerable in a gravity well.  You could also get caught with your 'sails'<BR>
> > <snip><BR>
> ><BR>
> > Wouldn't the sails gain heat from friction caused by contacting the<BR>
> > atmosphere at orbital speeds?<BR>
><BR>
> Only if there's a *lot* of friction. Most "re-entry" heating is due to<BR>
> *compression* heating of the air piling up in front of the ship.<BR>
><BR>
> --<BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
>  shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
> leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2366<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 28 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2367<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
(FFL in Traveller?) Imperial Legion<BR>
Re: First Traveller Game <BR>
Re: TML Mess<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
RE: GDW Memo...<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
Re:Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2366<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2361<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2361<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2362<BR>
Re: Airborne<BR>
Re: Print run<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2363<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations<BR>
Re: GDW Memo...<BR>
RE: GDW Memo...<BR>
LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
RE: CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
Space Weather<BR>
Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
Re: First Traveller Game <BR>
Re: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri Apr 28 08:17:26 2000<BR>
From: TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
Subject: (FFL in Traveller?) Imperial Legion<BR>
<BR>
Actually, each convict earned a number of points per drop, and they were applied toward his possible release. Most never made it, but a few lucky ones managed to rake in enough points to achieve freedom.<BR>
In a nutshell example.<BR>
Life sentence = 20 points<BR>
Death sentence = 30 points<BR>
<BR>
Each mission would be equal to a number of points, depending on the drop. I used a modified version of the advanced character generation system of MT. Each time a "promotion or decoration" was achieved, bonus points were applied. Paltrooney (sp?) could get you executed early. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I do remember the best way to make progress was to go for the SEH decoration by taking the negative on the survival roll and hoping for the best. (In case anyone was wondering, a PH meant nothing, other than the guy might have been lucky enough to get to go on another drop, or get assigned to a support team for a while.)<BR>
<BR>
Cruel? Sure. Then again, it was the only chance any of these "lowlife scumbags of the galaxy" had a chance to redeem their lives and gain freedom again. A few made it, and then ended up with mercenary jobs or became bounty hunters. One became a priest. (That was a fun NPC.)<BR>
<BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 05:50:44 -0700<BR>
From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
Subject: Re: First Traveller Game <BR>
<BR>
...<BR>
>It depends..who got us into this mes in the first place? hmmmm?<BR>
<BR>
  "Gilligan!"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:08:12 -0500 (CDT)<BR>
From: Christopher Thrash <thrash@io.com><BR>
Subject: Re: TML Mess<BR>
<BR>
> Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:17:23 +0100<BR>
> From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
> Subject: Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris NavigationalHazards)<BR>
> <BR>
> >BTW, who exactly _is_ the Mess President for the TML?<BR>
> <BR>
> Probably Eris, it's make the rules more fun if they got changed regularly...<BR>
<BR>
Eris gets my vote for Mr. Vice: he can apply his ample imagination to<BR>
punishing offenses to civil behaviour. Since, however, the first Rule of<BR>
the Mess is "The President of the Mess is above reproach," about the only<BR>
candidate I can imagine is Mr. Miller himself -- perhaps Honorary<BR>
President, with an appointed stand-in? That would make the list moderator<BR>
Mr. President Pro Tem.<BR>
<BR>
In all seriousness, I'd much rather see Points of Order than flamefests.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:20:36 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net><BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
Howdy!<BR>
<BR>
The subject line caused an involuntary thought to pop to mind...<BR>
<BR>
Consider the Dread Penguin Roberts...<BR>
<BR>
yours,<BR>
Michael<BR>
- -- <BR>
Michael and MJ Houghton   | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>
herveus@radix.net         | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>
Bowie, MD, USA            | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>
                          | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:27:24 +0100<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: GDW Memo...<BR>
<BR>
J. Paul Sanders wrote:<BR>
> Was going through some of my material and came across this old<BR>
> GDW memo<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
Is this legit?  I ask because ...<BR>
<BR>
> all four Judges Guild sectors were granted at their urging with<BR>
> promises of many adventures set within their boundaries. At one<BR>
> point, GDW specifically urged more adventures before new<BR>
> sectors were published, but JG said they needed the entire four<BR>
> sectors in print first. Once they were in print, adventures<BR>
> just never appeared. The Judges Guild license has lapsed, and<BR>
> no new products from them are expected.<BR>
<BR>
I have a bunch of JG  Traveller  adventures  set  in  these  four<BR>
sectors (the Border Prowler trilogy, Pirates of the Turku Wastes,<BR>
Doom of the Sining Star, etc).  I quite like them,  too,  despite<BR>
standard JG production quality.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Also, fyi ...<BR>
> Theta Borealis - mapped using a computer program at GDW and <BR>
> supplied to Group One. Frankly, I disremember if they ever<BR>
> published the sector map and data, although they worked from<BR>
> the data.<BR>
<BR>
They *did* publish the sector map and  data  (as  "Theta  Boralis<BR>
Sector") ... low 'fanzine' production  standards.  B&W  plus  red<BR>
map, typed list of UPP stats, a couple  of  pages  of  background<BR>
info.  Very thin product of interest only to completeists.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:30:37 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
Greetings...<BR>
<BR>
Lordy, lordy...anyone else with Princess Bride References?<BR>
<BR>
How 'bout "Solomani never bluff when death is involved..." (sorry if the<BR>
quote is slightly off)<BR>
<BR>
Rob Houghton (no relation)<BR>
<BR>
Michael Houghton wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Howdy!<BR>
><BR>
> The subject line caused an involuntary thought to pop to mind...<BR>
><BR>
> Consider the Dread Penguin Roberts...<BR>
><BR>
> yours,<BR>
> Michael<BR>
> --<BR>
> Michael and MJ Houghton   | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>
> herveus@radix.net         | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>
> Bowie, MD, USA            | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>
>                           | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:46:06 -0500 (CDT)<BR>
From: Steven Bonneville <bonnevil@ima.umn.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
<BR>
> Hiver Chan flaps his tentacles, then launches into a spinning barrage of<BR>
> attacks.<BR>
><BR>
> Voiceover: "I give her a Yaaa!"<BR>
><BR>
> More flapping tentacles, different but equally quivery, followed by aikido<BR>
> redirection techniques, Hiver-style.<BR>
><BR>
> Voiceover: "And a Hiiiiyaaa!"<BR>
><BR>
> Finally, Hiver Chan mounts his intended victim, and pummels them with three<BR>
> or four arms at once, amidst more furious flapping.<BR>
><BR>
> Voiceover: "And then I keek her, Sir!"<BR>
<BR>
Does this remind anyone else of the hiver doing a limbstand / cartwheel<BR>
in the back of the *old* Hiver book?  :)  You could tell it wasn't a <BR>
headstand (well, "sensory-organ-modified-limb stand") because you could<BR>
see the eyestalks on the limb just clockwise of the one it was balancing<BR>
on.  :) :)<BR>
<BR>
  -- Steve Bonneville<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 07:02:15 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re:Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
>All this brings to mind a bit of technical data from Niven/Pournelle's "The<BR>
Moat<BR>
>around Murchisons's Eye"... Empire warships and one of the civilian ships (a<BR>
>racing yacht) have hull coatings of superconductor material with a wire<BR>
>(superconducting) running into a tank of water/ice for cooling. Of course the<BR>
>ships (at least the warships) have black globe style generators (some<BR>
>differences). The point is...would a superconduccting coat a) stop visible<BR>
>wavelength lasers? and b) radiate heat more efficiently?<BR>
Niven likes this a lot, but it turns out that superconductors don't<BR>
superconduct<BR>
heat in any special way. This would particularly be a problem with Traveller<BR>
lasers,<BR>
which are pulsed and hence deliver their energy almost instantaneously.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 00:03:09 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
<BR>
With reference to the "Hiver Handstand" perhaps the hiver posing for the pic was<BR>
the hiver Nadia Comanechi...I can't stand on one hand but I know people who<BR>
can...maybe the Hiver is a trained gymnist.<BR>
<BR>
As for the weapons...the turret mount on the caraprace seems logical...I remember<BR>
a picture from a SFRPG called (i think) "Battlelords of the 30th Century" a<BR>
quadrepedal "Big Cat" race with a targeting monocle and tracking mount on it's<BR>
back (like an Apache IHADDS helmet.<BR>
<BR>
Rob Houghton<BR>
<BR>
Steven Bonneville wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> > Hiver Chan flaps his tentacles, then launches into a spinning barrage of<BR>
> > attacks.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Voiceover: "I give her a Yaaa!"<BR>
> ><BR>
> > More flapping tentacles, different but equally quivery, followed by aikido<BR>
> > redirection techniques, Hiver-style.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Voiceover: "And a Hiiiiyaaa!"<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Finally, Hiver Chan mounts his intended victim, and pummels them with three<BR>
> > or four arms at once, amidst more furious flapping.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Voiceover: "And then I keek her, Sir!"<BR>
><BR>
> Does this remind anyone else of the hiver doing a limbstand / cartwheel<BR>
> in the back of the *old* Hiver book?  :)  You could tell it wasn't a<BR>
> headstand (well, "sensory-organ-modified-limb stand") because you could<BR>
> see the eyestalks on the limb just clockwise of the one it was balancing<BR>
> on.  :) :)<BR>
><BR>
>   -- Steve Bonneville<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 07:08:30 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
> Incidentally, (and this occured to me yesterday while browsing FFS2's<BR>
> Superblack Coatings section) won't painting your hull black, as every<BR>
> warship does, increase the rate of heat radiation from your surface?<BR>
<BR>
Yes. Warships with IR masking include active hull cooling (refrigeration pipes<BR>
running under the hull, with the waste heat dumped into the radiators.)<BR>
<BR>
> Painting it silver would seem to be the better option. Sure, a mirrored hull<BR>
> would make you reflect back active sensor traces something terrible, but in<BR>
> FFS2 actives don't seem to be a lot of good at space combat ranges. Anyone<BR>
> agree?<BR>
<BR>
Active sensors aren't so much the problem as visible-light. If you want to<BR>
experiment<BR>
with this, a silver coating would reduce IR signature *when the ship is<BR>
powered down*<BR>
by -1 (when the ship is powered up, IR is dominated completely by the power<BR>
plant)<BR>
but increase visible singature by +1.<BR>
<BR>
Shadow writes<BR>
>It's "hard" to get a coating that is "silver" at IR wavelengths. :-)<BR>
Not that hard - after all, there are IR telescopes. Polished aluminum is fine<BR>
as long<BR>
as you don't anodize it. Silver is better, gold is best.<BR>
Or the shiny coating on mylar "space blankets" and<BR>
"super insulation" - the point of that is that it is indeed shiny in the IR,<BR>
to reduce<BR>
radiation heat transfer.<BR>
<BR>
What you want for heat reduction is a coating that is silver in the visible<BR>
and black in<BR>
the IR (so it radiates well); that's easy to make too. Black in the visible<BR>
and silver in<BR>
the IR is possible but doesn't help, because most of the ambient heat comes in<BR>
in<BR>
the visible (from sunlight), and silvering in the IR just causes the<BR>
spacecraft to heat up<BR>
more until it radiates the same total power as is coming in.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:04:36 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2366<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-28 07:51:32 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:56:25 +0200<BR>
 From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
 Subject: GT: Alien Module 3 (also: Attn: LKW)<BR>
 <BR>
 Anybody seen this one yet? Is it out?>><BR>
<BR>
It is due back from the printer about the middle of May.<BR>
 <BR>
<< What Ive seen so far in the announcements sounds absolutely great! I love<BR>
 the idea with the Coyns...<BR>
 <BR>
 Loren, when we get the book, may we copy those coyns so we dont have to <BR>
 punch them out if we want to use em?  >><BR>
<BR>
We will have a limited number of extra sets for sale through Warehouse 23 -- <BR>
so much beter looking than photocopies.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:11:26 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2361<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-27 14:04:31 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:24:24 -0700<BR>
 From: scharlto@ifsna.com<BR>
 Subject: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
 <BR>
 Hey Loren or Jesse or whoever<BR>
 <BR>
 Anyone ever suggested putting the full color versions of the<BR>
 stuff Jesse has done for the GT books up on the Pyramid site (or<BR>
 better yet the JTAS site).  Jesse's stuff deserves to be seen in<BR>
 color, I think.>><BR>
<BR>
You are not the first person that this has occured to. Frankly, I doubt you <BR>
are the 1187th person this has occured to.<BR>
 <BR>
<< And in general, I like the idea of GT Lite, particularly with a<BR>
 Jesse cover.  And I like the GT: Cutter book idea too, but then<BR>
 I was excited by it when it was a GDW project too.  >><BR>
<BR>
Guess who proposed it back then . . .<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:11:25 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2361<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-27 14:04:31 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< <BR>
 Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 09:19:02 -0700<BR>
 From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
 Subject: RE: Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
 <BR>
 The e-mails which I have received make it clear that I should have described<BR>
 what Aide de Camp is in more detail. >><BR>
<BR>
Does Marc know you are doing this? <BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:11:28 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2362<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-27 16:42:32 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< Loren,<BR>
 <BR>
 How about SJG putting together a "Best of Traveller Art" book with<BR>
 as many color plates from Jesse and other excellent Traveller artists<BR>
 as economically feasible and selling it throughout the world?<BR>
 <BR>
 That way as many people as possible have access to it and SJG, Jesse,<BR>
 et all make a mint (hopefully) and you hit another home run for SJG?<BR>
 <BR>
 Anybody other than me want, say, 15-30 pages of 8.5x11 color plates of<BR>
 awesome artwork you can show other players? Especially if each plate<BR>
 had a text explanation in the back of the book which describes the plate's<BR>
 subject and can be used in-game?>><BR>
<BR>
Depends. How much would you be willing to pay for a book like that. 4cp costs <BR>
big time . . .  <BR>
<BR>
<< How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published <BR>
 centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
 Collect them all!<BR>
 <BR>
 David Smart >><BR>
<BR>
What _are_ you doing with those ship pictures?  :  )<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:11:27 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
I always rather liked Clint Eastwood's (grizzled Marine Force Recon sgt) <BR>
comment standing on the ramp of the CH-47: <BR>
<BR>
"Of course I'm nervous -- jumping out of an aircraft is not a rational act."<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:11:24 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Print run<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-27 14:04:31 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< Good news for Traveller then. What was the GT's initial print run ?<BR>
 (again if you don't mind me asking and it won't take too long to find<BR>
 out the figures). >><BR>
<BR>
I don't remember -- it was larger than the normal SJ Games print run, and we <BR>
did 1,000 hardbacks on top of that (which are gone from the warehouse). <BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:11:31 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2363<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-27 20:14:08 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< Is there any chance that some of the DGP artists' work would end up in a<BR>
 GT book? (Blair Reynolds, Rob Caswell, & Michael Vilardi)<BR>
 I've seen a couple of Rob Caswell's works here & there in GT and would<BR>
 like to see more of it (along with the others).  Does anyone know if<BR>
 they are still making art for Traveller or Sci-Fi at all? >><BR>
<BR>
Rob is working for several times what he can make from SJ Games. We bought <BR>
second rights to a bunch of his Traveller stuff (he gave us a deal because he <BR>
likes Traveller). <BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:17:14 -0400<BR>
From: Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations<BR>
<BR>
j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete) wrote:<BR>
> I remember a color plate in a book titled "Mercenary Uniforms"(?). It<BR>
> showed a Swiss Pikeman in Ceremonial uniform pulling a Beretta M-12<BR>
                 ^^^^^^^- I initially read this as "Pokemon".<BR>
                          Imagine my utter confusion.<BR>
- --<BR>
Ethan Henry                                         egh@klg.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 00:29:50 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military Variations<BR>
<BR>
"Glocknineachu: I chose you" ---Blam Blam Blam---  the CCG card design is<BR>
left as an exercise for the reader.<BR>
<BR>
Robert Houghton<BR>
<BR>
Ethan Henry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete) wrote:<BR>
> > I remember a color plate in a book titled "Mercenary Uniforms"(?). It<BR>
> > showed a Swiss Pikeman in Ceremonial uniform pulling a Beretta M-12<BR>
>                  ^^^^^^^- I initially read this as "Pokemon".<BR>
>                           Imagine my utter confusion.<BR>
> --<BR>
> Ethan Henry                                         egh@klg.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:08:04 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GDW Memo...<BR>
<BR>
"J. Paul Sanders" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
[snip from memo]<BR>
<BR>
> These sectors are now considered unacceptable;<BR>
> entirely new star maps are being generated for inclusion in the Atlas of the<BR>
> Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Drat!  My Ley Sector and Glimmerdrift JG stuff has been<BR>
officially ex-communicated!!<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:22:04 -0700<BR>
From: "J. Paul Sanders" <timmon@primenet.com><BR>
Subject: RE: GDW Memo...<BR>
<BR>
At 02:27 PM 4/28/00 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>J. Paul Sanders wrote:<BR>
>> Was going through some of my material and came across this old<BR>
>> GDW memo<BR>
><snip><BR>
><BR>
>Is this legit? I ask because ...<BR>
><BR>
>> all four Judges Guild sectors were granted at their urging with<BR>
>> promises of many adventures set within their boundaries. At one<BR>
>> point, GDW specifically urged more adventures before new<BR>
>> sectors were published, but JG said they needed the entire four<BR>
>> sectors in print first. Once they were in print, adventures<BR>
>> just never appeared. The Judges Guild license has lapsed, and<BR>
>> no new products from them are expected.<BR>
<BR>
- -snip-<BR>
<BR>
>I have a bunch of JG Traveller adventures set in these four<BR>
>sectors (the Border Prowler trilogy, Pirates of the Turku Wastes,<BR>
>Doom of the Sining Star, etc). I quite like them, too, despite<BR>
>standard JG production quality.<BR>
><BR>
>Also, fyi ...<BR>
>> Theta Borealis - mapped using a computer program at GDW and <BR>
>> supplied to Group One. Frankly, I disremember if they ever<BR>
>> published the sector map and data, although they worked from<BR>
>> the data.<BR>
><BR>
>They *did* publish the sector map and data (as "Theta Boralis<BR>
>Sector") ... low 'fanzine' production standards. B&W plus red<BR>
>map, typed list of UPP stats, a couple of pages of background<BR>
>info. Very thin product of interest only to completeists.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, the memo certainly looks legit. It is written on GDW stationary, and I<BR>
did<BR>
get it from Marc himself. Perhaps it was written prior to the items you list<BR>
above being published? I'm unsure...wish the memo had a date on it, but it<BR>
doesn't. In any event, I keyed it in because I thought it was interesting to<BR>
see how the various Traveller sectors were apportioned in the early days of<BR>
the<BR>
game.<BR>
<BR>
Paul<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:22:50 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
<BR>
LKW wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>  The e-mails which I have received make it clear that I should<BR>
> have described<BR>
>  what Aide de Camp is in more detail. >><BR>
><BR>
> Does Marc know you are doing this?<BR>
<BR>
Is the issue copyright infringements? According to HPS Simulations (the<BR>
creators of ADC2), creating an ADC2 copy of a game for personal use is not<BR>
an infringement, nor is playing the game using ADC2, as long as at least one<BR>
player owns a copy of the game.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:28:10 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Weight, yeah. Blood pressuure increaese? Nope. Memory loss? Hah! I do<BR>
> most of my replies based on rules background without even needing to<BR>
> pick up the books!<BR>
<BR>
If you experienced no memory loss, you would have *accurate* replies based<BR>
on rules background. (Smiley face icon omitted, but intended.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:49:03 -0500<BR>
From: "Smart, David J (David)" <dasmart@lucent.com><BR>
Subject: Space Weather<BR>
<BR>
There's been a breakthrough in the tracking of solar weather.<BR>
The way its done was so cool I just had to post excerpts.<BR>
The full story can be found at:<BR>
<BR>
http://helix.nature.com/nsu/000504/000504-2.html<BR>
<BR>
- --- quote ---<BR>
<BR>
space : And now, the solar weather<BR>
<BR>
JEREMY THOMSON <BR>
<BR>
Solar flares - billion-ton bubbles of boiling<BR>
plasma - pose a serious threat to the Earth.<BR>
Belching out unpredictably from the Sun, they can<BR>
cause power failures and even fry satellites. Now,<BR>
researchers have made an important step towards<BR>
forecasting solar flares, as they report in<BR>
Geophysical Research Letters1. Using interplanetary<BR>
space as an ethereal reflector, the team can spot<BR>
solar activity on the far side of the Sun...<BR>
<BR>
Stormy parts of the Sun emit more of a particular<BR>
frequency of ultraviolet light, known as the<BR>
'Lyman-a band' (Lya). This light is invisible from<BR>
the Earth, as it is filtered out by ozone in the <BR>
atmosphere. But it can be measured accurately from<BR>
space by the Solar and Heliospheric Observatory<BR>
(SOHO) satellite that NASA and the European Space<BR>
Agency run jointly...<BR>
<BR>
Because hydrogen, the element that emits the Lya<BR>
band in the Sun, is also present in small amounts<BR>
in interplanetary space, areas of high solar<BR>
activity 'light up' free-floating hydrogen, like<BR>
a lighthouse shining through fog. The team monitored<BR>
this faint glow across the sky. <BR>
<BR>
After subtracting differences caused by the Sun's <BR>
27-day spin and variations in the amount of <BR>
interplanetary hydrogen, the researchers were left <BR>
with a graph of solar activity accurate to within 10%.<BR>
"New bright areas can be identified, and located rather<BR>
precisely on the surface of the Sun, even on the<BR>
far side," say Bertaux's group...<BR>
<BR>
- --- endquote ---<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav:  More details for those running scientific<BR>
research campaigns.<BR>
<BR>
David Smart<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 09:17:42 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
Robert Houghton writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> All this brings to mind a bit of technical data from Niven/Pournelle's "The<BR>
> Moat around Murchisons's Eye"... Empire warships and one of the civilian<BR>
> ships (a racing yacht) have hull coatings of superconductor material with a<BR>
> wire (superconducting) running into a tank of water/ice for cooling. Of<BR>
> course the ships (at least the warships) have black globe style generators<BR>
> (some differences). The point is...would a superconduccting coat a) stop<BR>
> visible wavelength lasers? and b) radiate heat more efficiently?<BR>
<BR>
Not unless its superconducting of _thermal_ energy, which electrical <BR>
superconductors are not.  If you're specifically concerned with conducting<BR>
heat away, I can't think of a better material than graphite with aligned<BR>
crystals -- its one of the best thermal conductors known along its planes, <BR>
a very poor conductor through its planes, doesn't evaporate until well<BR>
over 3,000 kelvins, and has just about the highest heat of vaporization per<BR>
unit mass of any material known.  Only problem is that its not white (against<BR>
visible light lasers, various refractory crystals would be better).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:04:40 -0400<BR>
From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
Subject: Re: First Traveller Game <BR>
<BR>
ROFLOL!<BR>
<BR>
Anyone ever try to convert Gilligan to CT then use him as an NPC on<BR>
unsuspecting Players?<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
 J-Man<BR>
 ICQ# 2843475<BR>
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
 Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
 Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Steven Hudson" <shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 8:50 AM<BR>
Subject: Re: First Traveller Game<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> ...<BR>
> >It depends..who got us into this mes in the first place? hmmmm?<BR>
><BR>
>   "Gilligan!"<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:47:48 -0500<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
<BR>
Luther Martin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> LKW wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> >  The e-mails which I have received make it clear that I should<BR>
> > have described<BR>
> >  what Aide de Camp is in more detail. >><BR>
> ><BR>
> > Does Marc know you are doing this?<BR>
><BR>
> Is the issue copyright infringements? According to HPS Simulations (the<BR>
> creators of ADC2), creating an ADC2 copy of a game for personal use is not<BR>
> an infringement, nor is playing the game using ADC2, as long as at least one<BR>
> player owns a copy of the game.<BR>
<BR>
    Let me tack on a bit more information here...ADC lets you recreate maps and<BR>
counters, but it doesn't include the game's =rules=.  It's basically a program<BR>
that allows for two main things:<BR>
<BR>
1) PBEM games,<BR>
2) Solo games without having to take up the dining table.<BR>
<BR>
    You =can't= play a game via ADC unless you know the rules, and there are<BR>
very few wargames I've seen where you can know the rules without having a<BR>
reference copy handy.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Stormhound<BR>
DNRC Ombudsman for Induhvidual Affairs, Holder of Past Knowledge<BR>
Come visit my web page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd<BR>
Or my new Amateur Radio web page at http://www.qsl.net/kc0ekv<BR>
Or my JN6 course design page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd/golfpage.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2367<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 28 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2368<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Bloody lucky for my keyboard...<BR>
Re: Psi-shields<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
Re: [OT] Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
Re: Ground Forces<BR>
Re: GT GF Playtest<BR>
Re: GT Lite<BR>
Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Re: Keyboard warning!<BR>
Re: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
Traveller Centerfolds (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2362)<BR>
Hiver Personal Defense Arsenal<BR>
RE: Traveller Centerfolds (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2362)<BR>
Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
Re: Non Citizen's in the US forces and those fluffy FFL types<BR>
Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
RE: GT GF Playtest<BR>
[Announce] http://traveller.copyleft.de/<BR>
Re: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
Re: GT: Alien Module 3 (also: Attn: LKW)<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Non Citizen's in the US forces and those fluffy FFL types<BR>
Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater (getting OT)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:02:04 -0400<BR>
From: Mark Urbin <urbin@bigfoot.com><BR>
Subject: Bloody lucky for my keyboard...<BR>
<BR>
that my coffee cup was empty...<BR>
<BR>
>  Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net><BR>
>Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
>Howdy!<BR>
>The subject line caused an involuntary thought to pop to mind...<BR>
><BR>
>Consider the Dread Penguin Roberts...<BR>
<BR>
One of a long line of Dread Penguin Roberts...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
urbin@bigfoot.com - Opinions should be yours too!<BR>
Monday special, two valiums with a coffee chaser.<BR>
http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:13:04 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Psi-shields<BR>
<BR>
Leonard writes:<BR>
>Just a note. A Faraday cage has to *completely* surround the item it is<BR>
>shielding. No holes larger than a fraction of a wavelngth are<BR>
>permissible.<BR>
><BR>
>So unless you are marketing a *suit*, you'd have to extend the shield<BR>
>*all* the way around the head. Which means cutting off the head from<BR>
>the neck. It also means no way for air to get in.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
True in theory, but it's not always practically necessary.<BR>
<BR>
For example. I have a pacemaker. Operating welding equipment (especially<BR>
plasma cutters) plays merry hell with this, and people keep demanding that I<BR>
learn to weld. So I have a waistcoat made of aircraft EM shielding mesh<BR>
jacketed in fabric. It has holes for my arms, waist and head, but it screens<BR>
the EM field well enough to allow me to weld. (Although I look like some<BR>
kind of UN-peacekeeping-type when I do...)<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:36:45 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>Which is why a Hiver's idea of a "personal weapon" is a projectile or<BR>
>energy weapon strapped to his "back", with a hand control for *powered*<BR>
>rotation and firing (ie a miniature turret!).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I believe the Hivers would take the weapon a stage further, adding<BR>
Contragrav and a robot brain to allow it to float along next to the Hiver<BR>
and give him covering fire while he runs for cover.<BR>
<BR>
To quote Book 8 (see, I can do this too, now I have the BFB...)<BR>
"Hiver Warbots: Hivers do not like close combat, and their excellent warbots<BR>
have relieved them from this unpleasant duty. Some Hiver armies have<BR>
consisted entirely of warbots, with no living members. Hiver warbots are of<BR>
such qiuality that their import into the Imperium is illegal." - page 13<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I think that kinda sums up the whole 'Hivers in ground combat'<BR>
situation.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:47:32 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
The Sensors Guru writes:<BR>
>What you want for heat reduction is a coating that is silver in the visible<BR>
>and black in<BR>
>the IR (so it radiates well); that's easy to make too.<BR>
<BR>
In the light of my learned collegue's comments, I modify my question to:<BR>
<BR>
"Wouldn't coating it with a material which is silver in the visible spectrum<BR>
and<BR>
black in the IR spectrum be a better option?"<BR>
<BR>
We'll still end up with warships which look silver.....very early-SF. Nice!<BR>
<BR>
NB<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:14:17 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
<BR>
>As for the weapons...the turret mount on the caraprace seems logical...I<BR>
remember<BR>
>a picture from a SFRPG called (i think) "Battlelords of the 30th Century" a<BR>
>quadrepedal "Big Cat" race with a targeting monocle and tracking mount on<BR>
it's<BR>
>back (like an Apache IHADDS helmet.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Ah, the Cizerack combat armour, mounting a look-and-shoot RKM-5000 impact<BR>
laser on a powered back-mount and a cluster of arm-mounted rockets. It *is*<BR>
very cool.<BR>
<BR>
(And it's Battlelords of the 23rd Century - the picture I'm looking at is in<BR>
'Lock-N-Load, the Battlelord's War Manual'. A game which swings from very<BR>
gritty to slightly silly*, with cover art by somebody called Rob Prior.)<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
+++<BR>
*with guns called the 'Yo Momma', 'Shake-N-Bake', 'Wax-em Gun', 'RKM<BR>
Showtime' and the ever popular 'Extra Crispy' Thunderbolt Generator....<BR>
+++<BR>
There's a picture of a suit of Ultra-Armour with a bumper sticker saying<BR>
"Honk if you love excessive firepower". I can't help but wonder if he bought<BR>
that from Famille Spofulam....<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 10:41:45<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: [OT] Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
At 02:41 AM 4/28/2000 GMT, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Right. IIRC immigrants normally need to be residents for six years<BR>
>before becoming US citizens. They can shave two years off this time by<BR>
>enlisting for four years in the armed forces.<BR>
<BR>
I had a Drill Sergeant from the PRC who went that route.  He got off the<BR>
boat knowing two words in English.  "Push" and "up".  How nice that he<BR>
found a career were he could use them!<BR>
<BR>
Drill Sergeant Chin was actually one of ther best drills we had, able to<BR>
train us with both discipline and a sense of humor.  He did have a *thick*<BR>
accent, and use to drop me because "I cahn't say you name, Belly, so you<BR>
dlop!  Do diamond push-ups!"<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:12:37<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Ground Forces<BR>
<BR>
At 11:32 PM 4/27/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I like it so far.  I'll get critical on the second pass.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks, I'll practise cringing in horror for your second set of comments.<BR>
<BR>
>One nit...Jens as a Marine Recruit Instructor?  Berry, you have a sick <BR>
>sense of humor. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Of all the names people volunteered, I just knew that Jens was going to be<BR>
a S-I.  just imagining him saying it before a mob of terrified recruits...<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:13:22<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GT GF Playtest<BR>
<BR>
At 06:56 AM 4/29/2000 +1000, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Pssst, send me a copy - but don't tell Doug B or LKW or SJ. Frankly, I enjoy<BR>
>living without a Penguin, ahem, inserted somewhere unpleasant.<BR>
<BR>
don't woory, I'll never tell Doug.  :)<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:22:10<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GT Lite<BR>
<BR>
At 08:04 PM 4/27/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>It is going to be a freedie, so the budget is limited. <BR>
<BR>
Perhaps Jesse could donate a piece.  I'm thinking of the ship he did a<BR>
while back that was, IIRC, a sort of gift to the TML.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:25:02<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
At 02:37 AM 4/28/2000 +0200, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published<BR>
>> centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
><BR>
>Well, since Mr Miller has his rules for Traveller art, the centerfolds would<BR>
>have to be ships.<BR>
><BR>
>I am sure that TMLers of all ages would still drool over the pictures,<BR>
though.<BR>
<BR>
Wow!  Look the size of those turrets!<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry      gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
   http://gridlore.home.mondspring.com<BR>
<BR>
"A mrgs einu sinni hluti minn systir..."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:26:38<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Keyboard warning!<BR>
<BR>
At 04:43 PM 4/27/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>Now that picture, I'll save!<BR>
><BR>
>When does the game hit the shelves? ;-)<BR>
<BR>
It's called ACQ2: The Penguins' Revenge.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:52:01 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
<BR>
At 7:49 -0400 28/4/00, shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) wrote:<BR>
>Please *don't*. We don't want anyone being sued for copyright<BR>
>infringement. Those books won't be out of copyright until 50 (or is it<BR>
>70?) years after the author *dies*.<BR>
><BR>
>I also think they may be back in print.<BR>
<BR>
Please tell me more - enquiring minds want to know so they can spend money...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:27:02 -0500<BR>
From: "Smart, David J (David)" <dasmart@lucent.com><BR>
Subject: Traveller Centerfolds (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2362)<BR>
<BR>
GDWGAMES@aol.com posted:<BR>
><BR>
>In a message dated 00-04-27 16:42:32 EDT, you write:<BR>
><BR>
><< Loren,<BR>
> <BR>
> How about SJG putting together a "Best of Traveller Art" book with<BR>
> as many color plates from Jesse and other excellent Traveller artists<BR>
> as economically feasible and selling it throughout the world?<BR>
> <BR>
> That way as many people as possible have access to it and SJG, Jesse,<BR>
> et all make a mint (hopefully) and you hit another home run for SJG?<BR>
> <BR>
> Anybody other than me want, say, 15-30 pages of 8.5x11 color plates of<BR>
> awesome artwork you can show other players? Especially if each plate<BR>
> had a text explanation in the back of the book which describes the plate's<BR>
> subject and can be used in-game?>><BR>
><BR>
>Depends. How much would you be willing to pay for a book like that. 4cp<BR>
costs <BR>
>big time . . .  <BR>
<BR>
I'm thinking about $25-$40. Per book, depending on the # of plates.<BR>
<BR>
><< How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published <BR>
> centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
> Collect them all!<BR>
> <BR>
> David Smart >><BR>
><BR>
>What _are_ you doing with those ship pictures?  :  )<BR>
><BR>
>LKW<BR>
<BR>
Hey, just be thankful Jesse hasn't submitted pics of a Hiver in a thong.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, a Hiver thong is really just two pairs of gloves.<BR>
<BR>
David Smart<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri Apr 28 14:33:51 2000<BR>
From: TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Hiver Personal Defense Arsenal<BR>
<BR>
Try a TDX charge on a short pedestal in a backpack...<BR>
<grin><BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
travelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Or maybe (for use against taller opponents) a sort of upside down "weed<BR>
whacker... :-)<BR>
<BR>
- - -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:48:38 -0500<BR>
From: "Derek Dees" <djdees@mm.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Traveller Centerfolds (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2362)<BR>
<BR>
How about something like the old Peterson's Guide to the Dreamlands.<BR>
Chaosium put out a couple-three different "guide" books that included a nice<BR>
(this is Cthulhu, so the nice is relative) picture of the beastie on one<BR>
page and info about the critter on the facing page? IIRC those were in the<BR>
$15-20 for a reasonable number of pages.<BR>
<BR>
Derek<BR>
djdees@mm.com<BR>
http://www.mm.com/user/djdees<BR>
<BR>
Sarchasm: The gulf between the author of sarcastic wit and the person who<BR>
doesn't get it.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> >Depends. How much would you be willing to pay for a book like that. 4cp<BR>
> costs big time . . .<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri Apr 28 14:46:39 2000<BR>
From: TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
Princess Bride Quotes?<BR>
(heh heh)<BR>
<BR>
"The Sword Worlds?"<BR>
<BR>
"No one going in there ever survives."<BR>
<BR>
"You're only saying that because no one ever has..."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
and:<BR>
<BR>
Duke Norris during the FFW upper naval command purges:<BR>
"Do I have to remind you that your JOB is on the line here?!"<BR>
<BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
travelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 13:58:10 -0500<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
    Then there's the one most universally applicable to adventuring groups<BR>
pondering their chances of success:<BR>
<BR>
    "It'd take a miracle."<BR>
<BR>
    Or for fans of MT...<BR>
<BR>
    "My name is Crown Prince Lucan.  You killed my father.  Prepare to die."<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Stormhound<BR>
DNRC Ombudsman for Induhvidual Affairs, Holder of Past Knowledge<BR>
Come visit my web page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd<BR>
Or my new Amateur Radio web page at http://www.qsl.net/kc0ekv<BR>
Or my JN6 course design page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd/golfpage.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:36:44<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Non Citizen's in the US forces and those fluffy FFL types<BR>
<BR>
At 06:36 AM 4/29/2000 +1000, you wrote:<BR>
>Thanks for the info guys. Okay, another question. Just how much can a non<BR>
>citizen US mil person access? In terms of accessing intel - is citizenship a<BR>
>requirement in a clearance process? It is in Oz...<BR>
<BR>
Clearences are granted based on an investigation into the subject.  Since<BR>
many programs are classified to a level that precludes showing the files to<BR>
a non-citizen, Being a foreign national would be something of a problem.<BR>
But most of these levels of security are the stomping grounds of<BR>
field-grade officers and above.  Very few aliens at that level, if any.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:44:07<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
At 04:38 PM 4/27/2000 PST, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> This might also violate the laws against slavery.<BR>
><BR>
>Only if prison sentences do. Check out the wording in the relevant<BR>
>amendment to the US Consitution. They *had* to include a clause "except<BR>
>as punishment for a crime" or else they'd have been banning jailing<BR>
>someone. <BR>
<BR>
Except rather than just confining someone for punishmentm, you are forcing<BR>
them to work in a very hazardous job, a job from which they cannot seek any<BR>
relief.<BR>
<BR>
If these were volunteers, I can see this.  But just hauling prisoners out<BR>
of jail cells? No.  You'd get an armed mob, and I don't want to think about<BR>
what happens in their barracks!<BR>
<BR>
Remember, there were many people who thought that the peace-time draft<BR>
violated the 13th and 14th Amendments.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"When you're raised by the Jesuits, you<BR>
end up obedient or impertinent."<BR>
   - Asst DA Jack McCoy, _Law And Order_<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:17:19<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
At 01:58 PM 4/28/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>    Or for fans of MT...<BR>
><BR>
>    "My name is Crown Prince Lucan.  You killed my father.  Prepare to die."<BR>
<BR>
Canon patrol!  He wasn't Crown Prince, and Strephon was his uncle.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
<BR>
Duugirashir Irebamenagiin  gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
  http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>
Inquisitor Maximus, Reformed Canon Church of Sylea<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:19:30 -0700<BR>
From: "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
<BR>
Given the high quality of Hiver Voders, I suspect that the voder will have<BR>
to be dumbed down considerably to capture the effect of Kung-Fu theater.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, the Hiver's gyrations through it's "Kata" might well be<BR>
interpreted by another hiver as simply one who is talking very quickly...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Steven Bonneville" <bonnevil@ima.umn.edu><BR>
To: <traveller@mpgn.com><BR>
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 6:46 AM<BR>
Subject: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> > Hiver Chan flaps his tentacles, then launches into a spinning barrage of<BR>
> > attacks.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Voiceover: "I give her a Yaaa!"<BR>
> ><BR>
> > More flapping tentacles, different but equally quivery, followed by<BR>
aikido<BR>
> > redirection techniques, Hiver-style.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Voiceover: "And a Hiiiiyaaa!"<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Finally, Hiver Chan mounts his intended victim, and pummels them with<BR>
three<BR>
> > or four arms at once, amidst more furious flapping.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Voiceover: "And then I keek her, Sir!"<BR>
><BR>
> Does this remind anyone else of the hiver doing a limbstand / cartwheel<BR>
> in the back of the *old* Hiver book?  :)  You could tell it wasn't a<BR>
> headstand (well, "sensory-organ-modified-limb stand") because you could<BR>
> see the eyestalks on the limb just clockwise of the one it was balancing<BR>
> on.  :) :)<BR>
><BR>
>   -- Steve Bonneville<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:42:42 -0500<BR>
From: Jason Kemp <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: RE: GT GF Playtest<BR>
<BR>
> GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
<BR>
My first read-through, it looks very cool. I remember volunteering my name<BR>
for use in the text, and in the course of reading the playtest files, I<BR>
found it. Thanks, Doug. Even generated a character based on the name, and<BR>
it's just the type of character I'd probably play. It's almost scary. Doug<BR>
got my physical description (at that age, anyway,) dead on, too, except I<BR>
have blue eyes instead of green. I must say, I am impressed. You Zhodani or<BR>
something? :)<BR>
<BR>
More comments will follow once we can start posting to the discussion group.<BR>
Thank you, Doug, for the honor.<BR>
<BR>
Regards,<BR>
Jason Kemp<BR>
aka Armsman Second Class Jason haut-Kemp, Baron Casttie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 21:43:48 +0200<BR>
From: Michael Koehne <kraehe@copyleft.de><BR>
Subject: [Announce] http://traveller.copyleft.de/<BR>
<BR>
Hy Folks & Gurus, <BR>
<BR>
  The so called 3nd & 3rd survey is back online.<BR>
<BR>
  The above URL offer precise information done by the Imperial Covered Scout<BR>
  Survey Group (Mega Traveller) and the Gushemege Merchantile Guild Survey<BR>
  Group (Traveller New Era), based on the DGP archive, the GAL archive and<BR>
  the HIWG.<BR>
<BR>
  This is a !RELAUNCH! of an old site, prior known under traveller.is-bremen.de<BR>
  or even *.kn-bremen.de. !PLEASE! grep through your older link lists for<BR>
  those sites and !REPLACE! old anchors. Please also grep through published<BR>
  material and replace *@bakunin.north.de to kraehe@copyleft.de.<BR>
<BR>
  Ok - back to the future ;-)<BR>
<BR>
  I've told Joachim Koldehofe how to use Linux and GIMP, and he provided<BR>
  some dozen 64x64 ship icons, that are realy kiss. I plan to use them<BR>
  and the already available hexagon map to implement BR/BL like games.<BR>
<BR>
  If you have some nice ship - convert stats to TNE or T4 and provide<BR>
  a 64x64 (draw a circle inside, and do not use the full circle) icon,<BR>
  and you may find it on traveller.copyleft.de real soon now.<BR>
<BR>
  I plan to publish to sets of senarios :<BR>
<BR>
  - the known TNE secenarios (BT&BL)<BR>
  - the Gushemege Pacification Campain (600 Imperial)<BR>
  - the "Last Days of Strephon" Campain (MT 1120 Imperial)<BR>
  - the Gushemege Merchantile Guild Expansion (TNE 1120-1230)<BR>
<BR>
  I hope that object oriented design will help to implement diffent<BR>
  rule sets, so dont flame me just because of my alignment to virus,<BR>
  I also plan to provide ways to implement T4 and High Guard rules ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Bye Michael<BR>
- -- <BR>
  mailto:kraehe@copyleft.de             UNA:+.? 'CED+2+:::Linux:2.2:14'UNZ+1'<BR>
  http://www.xml-edifact.org/           CETERUM CENSEO MSDOS ESSE DELENDAM<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 12:46:00 -0700<BR>
From: Clay <arioch@theriver.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
>Okay, another question. Just how much can a non<BR>
>citizen US mil person access? In terms of accessing intel - <BR>
>is citizenship a requirement in a clearance process? <BR>
<BR>
Generally speaking, yes it is a requirement.  There are some<BR>
non-U.S.-citzen soldiers in MI units, though.  They do not have<BR>
clearances nor do they have access to secured areas, they work in admin.<BR>
slots for the most part.<BR>
<BR>
IIRC, you also need citizenship for promotion to certain ranks (E-6 and<BR>
above?).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:50:24 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
For ACQ:<BR>
<BR>
    Marine: "Why won't my arms move?"<BR>
    Medic: "You've been mostly dead all day."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
For players that missed half of a six hour session:<BR>
<BR>
    Absent player: "Who are you?  Are we enemies?  Why am I on this wall?<BR>
Where's Buttercup?"<BR>
    Beleagered Player: "Let me 'splain... no, is too much.  Let me sum up."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:51:47 -0700<BR>
From: Keith Johnson <keithalanjohnson@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GT: Alien Module 3 (also: Attn: LKW)<BR>
<BR>
At 07:49 AM 4/28/00 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>Subject: GT: Alien Module 3 (also: Attn: LKW)<BR>
><BR>
>Anybody seen this one yet? Is it out?<BR>
<BR>
AR3 hasn't come back from the printer yet.  It should be released in mid-May.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
_________________________________________________________<BR>
Rev. Keith Johnson      /\     keith@sjgames.com<BR>
Assistant Webmaster    /()\    keithalanjohnson@home.com<BR>
Steve Jackson Games   /____\   reverendkeith@hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
  IMTU tm++@ t4+@ tg++$ ru- ge-@ st+ pi+ he+ dr+ hi-@ zh+<BR>
_________________________________________________________ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:13:58 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Leonard wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Which is why a Hiver's idea of a "personal weapon" is a projectile or<BR>
>energy weapon strapped to his "back", with a hand control for *powered*<BR>
>rotation and firing (ie a miniature turret!).<BR>
<BR>
Just after this discussion, I started talking to a friend of mine about<BR>
Hiver powered armor[1]. We established that this setup would make the most<BR>
sense.<BR>
<BR>
Hand control? How about a gun cam attached to one eyestalk which points the<BR>
turret wherever the eye is looking? Sounds more properly "Hiver" to me.<BR>
Still, I'd have no qualms with this, if it wasn't for the fact that Hivers,<BR>
as a general rule, don't inolve themselves in ground combat.<BR>
<BR>
[1] I was thinking about Hiver powered armor for a mercenary troop made up<BR>
of nihilist Hivers who had managed to overcome their aversion to ground<BR>
combat.<BR>
<BR>
>Or maybe (for use against taller opponents) a sort of upside down "weed<BR>
>whacker... :-)<BR>
<BR>
Ha!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 11:13:23 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Non Citizen's in the US forces and those fluffy FFL types<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> At 06:36 AM 4/29/2000 +1000, you wrote:<BR>
> >Thanks for the info guys. Okay, another question. Just how much can a non<BR>
> >citizen US mil person access? In terms of accessing intel - is citizenship a<BR>
> >requirement in a clearance process? It is in Oz...<BR>
> <BR>
> Clearences are granted based on an investigation into the subject.  Since<BR>
> many programs are classified to a level that precludes showing the files to<BR>
> a non-citizen, Being a foreign national would be something of a problem.<BR>
> But most of these levels of security are the stomping grounds of<BR>
> field-grade officers and above.  Very few aliens at that level, if any.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, it's really funny when you have a higher clearance than your<BR>
First Sergeant. <BR>
"No First Sergeant, I wasn't late." <BR>
"Then where were you?!?" <BR>
"I'm afraid you're not cleared to know that." <BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:16:20 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater (getting OT)<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
>(And it's Battlelords of the 23rd Century - the picture I'm looking at is in<BR>
>'Lock-N-Load, the Battlelord's War Manual'. A game which swings from very<BR>
>gritty to slightly silly*, with cover art by somebody called Rob Prior.)<BR>
<BR>
I met Lawrence Sims, the author,  at a game convention in Binghamton, <BR>
NY some years back.  He sold me a numbered & signed second edition of <BR>
his game, and was very proud to state that it had the longest weapons list<BR>
of any game in print. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2368<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 28 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2369<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
Adieu<BR>
re:  Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
Re: The Third Reich... eh, Imperium<BR>
Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
Re: Re Centerfolds<BR>
Re: Re increased radiation surface<BR>
Various Stuff<BR>
The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: I've Seen the Economic Light<BR>
Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
re:  CT Health Hazard <BR>
Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military <BR>
re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
"Excessive Firepower" Sticker (was: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater)<BR>
RE: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
RE: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:46:53 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
At 13:48 -0400 28/4/00, Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net> wrote:<BR>
>The subject line caused an involuntary thought to pop to mind...<BR>
><BR>
>Consider the Dread Penguin Roberts...<BR>
<BR>
Hello, my name is Inigo Montoya....<BR>
<BR>
Dom ;-)<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 22:39:17 +0100<BR>
From: "Nick Bradbeer" <nickb@ndirect.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Adieu<BR>
<BR>
Gentlesophonts,<BR>
Once again university calls, and I take my leave of you for another couple<BR>
of months.<BR>
<BR>
Keep the flame, keep the penguins, and keep up the daft humour. See some of<BR>
you at GenCon.<BR>
<BR>
Nick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:44:04 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Aide de Camp Testing<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
<BR>
>Now that I have a crude version of Mayday, I am in search <BR>
>of playtesting volunteers.<BR>
<BR>
not this month, sorry<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
http://im.yahoo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:49:52 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Third Reich... eh, Imperium<BR>
<BR>
>From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
<BR>
>This is not the case. The two most well-known (by players,<BR>
<BR>
>that is, not in-game) Droyne planets, Andor and Candory <BR>
>are interdicted, but off-hand I can't think of any other <BR>
>(though there propably are a few more). Most planets with <BR>
>Droyne living on them are not even Amber Zoned. Not even<BR>
>planets under Droyne governments. (The HTA3 playtest<BR>
>theory is that not very many people realize that all <BR>
>Droyne are psionic; mostly it is assumed that Droyne are <BR>
>like most other species: some are psionic, but most <BR>
>aren't).<BR>
<BR>
So the situation with respect to the Droyne is a lot better<BR>
than I thought; good.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:50:07 -0500 (CDT)<BR>
From: Steven Bonneville <bonnevil@ima.umn.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
> >    "My name is Crown Prince Lucan.  You killed my father.  Prepare to die."<BR>
> <BR>
> Canon patrol!  He wasn't Crown Prince, and Strephon was his uncle.<BR>
<BR>
Sure, but what *did* happen to his real dad, Duke Dresden?  He and Princess<BR>
Lydia died suspiciously young....  <BR>
<BR>
(One more thing for Lucan to be peeved with Varian about; when Dresden died,<BR>
the duchy went to Varian.  *Everything* was going to Varian; the duchy, the<BR>
Throne, the girl....)  :)<BR>
<BR>
  -- Steve Bonneville<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:04:47 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re Centerfolds<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> While hivers only have one gender, ISTR that droyne have 3... Alpha Male,<BR>
> Beta Male (Catalyst? Binom?), and female.<BR>
<BR>
Ok, that's still 4 pages between the 2 species, so it all works out.<BR>
<BR>
(Obviously another of Grandfather's plots! :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:06:19 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re increased radiation surface<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> One further comment on textured surfaces:<BR>
><BR>
> the method of small grooves works best on an overall convex surface; very<BR>
> few traveller ships will have anything but curved radiator surfaces; nice<BR>
> flat plates are not common in traveller ships.<BR>
<BR>
flat "facets" might work better. But grooves still have limited<BR>
radiation angle problem. Their effective area is that of the "opening".<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 08:25:18 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Various Stuff<BR>
<BR>
Well, in the words of an ex-Sheriff, "well, I'm back".<BR>
<BR>
And, boy, was there a shitload of digests to catch up on.<BR>
<BR>
OK, first things first. The Famile Spofulam Light Sabre.<BR>
<BR>
I have been doing some thinking on this one, and I think the way to go is to<BR>
take the existing Barbie-scale Particle Carbine, modify it for rapid fire,<BR>
and then multiplex 16 of the little buggers into a handle. This should give<BR>
us about 5 shots per second, which will provide a decent approximation of a<BR>
continuous beam (His Jadeness will not be testing it). We probably arent<BR>
bending the rules too far by allowing them to all one one accumulator bank.<BR>
<BR>
Unfortunatly, it probably wont set the atmosphere on fire. Sorry, Loren.<BR>
<BR>
I think we can build something that is 90% legal, though.<BR>
<BR>
BTW, speaking of setting the atmosphere on fire, can somebody please re-post<BR>
the Famile Spofulam Sound System ?<BR>
<BR>
OK, second things. Cardinal Richelieu. Cool guy, huh ? The other one is<BR>
Admiral Coligny, who was somewhat earlier. Anyone remember seeing Queen<BR>
Margot ? The St Bartholemew's Day Massacre was basically aimed at him. He<BR>
was the highest ranking French Protetstant, and there is this wonderful<BR>
quote about him to the King of Spain, who has been complaining about this<BR>
heretic supporting pirates and generally opposing all good plans, "He is a<BR>
very bad man, and the King places no trust in him, but it is better to have<BR>
him at Court than making mischief outside it".<BR>
<BR>
OK, third thing. I need some Latin translated - I need the imperitive form<BR>
of "There must be no controlling legal authority". It's for an SCA project<BR>
of mine - making Lochac a center of excellence for maritime insurance and<BR>
associated issues (hey, I had to put all the Great Piracy Debate stuff to<BR>
some use ...).<BR>
<BR>
Fourth thing - Piracy and Mail Contracts. Speaking on behalf of the<BR>
anti-Piracy faction, we never denied Piracy in all those unsafe outsystems,<BR>
just that you could make a living at it in the long term. In any case, it's<BR>
a bureaucratic requirement - it's been in the regs since the Sylean Mail<BR>
Union, and it's just one of those things.<BR>
<BR>
Fifth thing - Braudel and the Third Imperium. Interesting thinking.<BR>
<BR>
OK, thats about it ...<BR>
<BR>
Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:43:37 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
In reference to the derision toward the H&I comment about aliens<BR>
being humans in rubber suits, I'm not sure that it's an incorrect<BR>
statement - or that it _can_ be an incorrect statement.<BR>
<BR>
The "problem" comes down to the fact that all of these aliens are<BR>
being invented and described by humans - humans who _can't_<BR>
_possibly_ have any experience outside the human viewpoint.  All<BR>
of the explanations - even those putatively by the aliens<BR>
themselves - are going to be from the human viewpoint, and imbued<BR>
with the human worldview.<BR>
<BR>
Orson Scott Card, in _Speaker_For_The_Dead_, outlined the concept<BR>
well in his hierarchy of foreignness.  In that hierarchy, there<BR>
are three kinds of strangers with whom we may have conversation<BR>
(implied meaning: _meaningful_ conversation, with common and<BR>
agreed concepts), and one with whom we may not [1]; of the three,<BR>
the third, _raman_, is characterized in SFTD as "human, but of<BR>
another species".  This is, in short, the "alien as human in a<BR>
rubber suit".  It is _because_ they are "human" that we can<BR>
interact to mutual understanding; were they not "human",<BR>
meaningful interaction to mutual understanding would perforce be<BR>
precluded - as, for example, with animals (in fact, that is the<BR>
distinction between ramen and varelse as given in SFTD).  To<BR>
recognize (for example) the Vargr or the Aslan as sophont is to<BR>
classify them as _raman_ - that is, to identify them as "human";<BR>
it says immediately that we have identified some sort of common<BR>
basis on which to interact with them.  We cannot know if varelse<BR>
are sophont or not; we have not and cannot establish meaningful<BR>
interaction to find out.<BR>
<BR>
This is not to say that we can fully understand ramen - or even<BR>
frmlings or utlnnings.  That we can recognize them as "foreign"<BR>
to ourselves indicates that we recognize cultural assumptions in<BR>
them that we do not share - or cultural concepts in ourselves<BR>
that we perceive that they do not share. We may "understand"<BR>
those concepts in the sense that we can say, "oh, yes, s/he does<BR>
that because 'face' is very important to them", but do we truly<BR>
understand what 'face' _is_ - what _all_ the social ramifications<BR>
are?  All of our attempts to explain them will fall short of the<BR>
mark, not by intent, but simply because the words we hear are<BR>
imbued with _our_ cultural baggage, not that of the speaker (and<BR>
translation may compound the problem, as the _translator's_<BR>
cultural baggage may also be involved).  For example: Most of us<BR>
here on the TML are from Western European cultures - and probably<BR>
Americans, at that.  We can discuss seppuku and the reasons<BR>
someone might commit it intellectually, but it's a good bet that<BR>
in similar situations, none of us would consider it as a viable<BR>
course of action - we simply do not have the cultural outlook<BR>
that includes such an act as a viable response to a situation -<BR>
and in situations where a person from our culture _does_ include<BR>
self-obliteration as a "viable" response, that person is often<BR>
immediately judged to be in serious need of psychological help.<BR>
<BR>
Similar cultural gulfs necessarily exist with respect to Vargr<BR>
concepts of what we have labelled "charisma", to Aslan concepts<BR>
of what we have labelled "honor", and so on. They do not preclude<BR>
interaction to mutuality of concept (thus ensuring that they are<BR>
ramen, rather than varelse), but at the same time, the fact that<BR>
we can recognize them - or that we can recognize a culture at all<BR>
- - says that they _are_, in some respect, "human".  If we can<BR>
identify them as _ramen_, we are saying, in essence, "these are<BR>
humans in funny suits"<BR>
<BR>
We will not be able to understand _truly_ alien concepts - we<BR>
won't even be able to discuss them: to discuss them, we must have<BR>
a way to identify and describe them, and if they are truly alien,<BR>
we won't have words useful for describing them - and if we make<BR>
up the words to describe them, all we have done is label them -<BR>
we still can't discuss it meaningfully. To do so, we would have<BR>
to define the label in some way, which means we would have to<BR>
understand the concept well enough to be able to describe it<BR>
using words that have our own cultural baggage attached - and if<BR>
we could discuss it in such meaningful terms, it wouldn't be<BR>
truly alien.  In short, because we are human, our aliens _must_<BR>
be "humans in rubber suits".<BR>
<BR>
(Of course, there is the question of the well-constructed rubber<BR>
suit vs. the poorly constructed rubber suit - i.e., the<BR>
believable "alien", vs. the cardboard cutout set up for the hero<BR>
to knock down, or the exaggerated one-dimensional psychology set<BR>
up merely to establish a contrast to what is Right and True.<BR>
_Those_ bug me.)<BR>
<BR>
[1] The hierarchy is as follows:<BR>
    utlnning - the stranger who is human of our species, but of<BR>
                another city or country (plural utlnnings)<BR>
                Example: Chinese, to most Americans - or<BR>
                         Californians, to New Yorkers<BR>
    frmling  - the stranger who is human of our species, but of<BR>
                another world (plural frmlings)<BR>
                Example: Zhodani or Vilani, to Solomani or Daryen<BR>
    raman     - the stranger who is human, but of another species<BR>
                (plural ramen)<BR>
                Example: Vargr or Aslan, to Humaniti or K'kree<BR>
    varelse   - the animal, with whom we can identify no<BR>
                mutuality of concept (but with whom we can<BR>
                coexist) (plural varelse)<BR>
                Example: plenty of them - look in any zoo...<BR>
    <BR>
    There is suggestions of a fifth class, djur - the beast, with<BR>
    whom no coexistence is possible, but it is not made clear if<BR>
    this is formally considered part of the hierarchy.  An<BR>
    example of this _might_ be Gnaak, to K'kree - but Gnaak are<BR>
    presumed to have been sophont, implying that we would<BR>
    consider them ramen.<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:43:45 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: I've Seen the Economic Light<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 26 Apr 2000 23:48:54 -0400 (EDT), Rob Eaglestone<BR>
<downport@home.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>The X-Boat Network<BR>
>==================<BR>
<BR>
The only problem I have with this is that canonically, XBoats<BR>
don't carry goods, they carry information - think "Pony Express",<BR>
or "Express Mail" or even "Western Union".  It's entirely likely<BR>
that goods-carrying ships - even hi-capacity ones - are limited<BR>
to J2 or J3 for economic reasons (high-jump drives are damned<BR>
expensive, and require damn! for fuel space), which means that,<BR>
at best, they'll follow routes that are roughly parallel to large<BR>
portions of the Xboat routes - but they're more likely to follow<BR>
the mains. In fact, I would expect that high-quality (A and B)<BR>
starports would themselves form "pseudo-mains" within the mains<BR>
and/or along the XBoat routes, and it is the patterns of these<BR>
pseudo-mains that the flow of goods would follow.<BR>
<BR>
>Okay, so what?<BR>
<BR>
So, when you've got this idea bashed out a little better, and<BR>
well-written, I've got space in Freelance Traveller for it.<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:40:46 -0500<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
Steven Bonneville wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> > >    "My name is Crown Prince Lucan.  You killed my father.  Prepare to die."<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Canon patrol!  He wasn't Crown Prince, and Strephon was his uncle.<BR>
><BR>
> Sure, but what *did* happen to his real dad, Duke Dresden?  He and Princess<BR>
> Lydia died suspiciously young....<BR>
><BR>
> (One more thing for Lucan to be peeved with Varian about; when Dresden died,<BR>
> the duchy went to Varian.  *Everything* was going to Varian; the duchy, the<BR>
> Throne, the girl....)  :)<BR>
<BR>
    Don't worry...I'm sure Doug will be able to come up with a perfectly good<BR>
explanation when asked by the Emperor why he publicly contradicted certain<BR>
statements of the Crown. (eg)<BR>
<BR>
    (And in the meantime, we'll keep the Adelie Guard warmed up for a possible<BR>
execution.)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Stormhound<BR>
DNRC Ombudsman for Induhvidual Affairs, Holder of Past Knowledge<BR>
Come visit my web page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd<BR>
Or my new Amateur Radio web page at http://www.qsl.net/kc0ekv<BR>
Or my JN6 course design page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd/golfpage.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:46:58 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  CT Health Hazard <BR>
<BR>
>From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
>Subject: CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
<BR>
>Consider this. All of the people who originally played CT <BR>
>are now suffering from a wide range of symptoms including <BR>
>weight gain, increased blood pressure, memory loss, etc. <BR>
>Could CT be hazardous to your health? Should it be <BR>
>strictly regulated by the government? What will happen now<BR>
>that the CT reprints are available?<BR>
<BR>
You're quite right about CT Syndrome.  We're still in the<BR>
conscious-raising phase, but I predict government<BR>
intervention and probably class action litigation.  Just<BR>
like the tobacco companies, GDW certainly knew that its<BR>
products were addictive and dangerous.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
http://im.yahoo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:51:08 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Douglas E. Berry <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 28 April 2000 20:18<BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>At 01:58 PM 4/28/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>    Or for fans of MT...<BR>
>><BR>
>>    "My name is Crown Prince Lucan.  You killed my father.  Prepare to<BR>
die."<BR>
><BR>
>Canon patrol!  He wasn't Crown Prince, and Strephon was his uncle.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Now in GT...<BR>
<BR>
To Strephon:<BR>
"I am Archduchess Isis of Ielish. You killed my father. Prepare to die!"<BR>
<BR>
And who's to say it *isn't* canon... <g><BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:13:03 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> All this brings to mind a bit of technical data from Niven/Pournelle's "The <BR>
> Moat<BR>
> around Murchisons's Eye"... Empire warships and one of the civilian ships (a<BR>
> racing yacht) have hull coatings of superconductor material with a wire<BR>
> (superconducting) running into a tank of water/ice for cooling. Of course the<BR>
> ships (at least the warships) have black globe style generators (some<BR>
> differences). The point is...would a superconduccting coat a) stop visible<BR>
> wavelength lasers? and b) radiate heat more efficiently?<BR>
<BR>
Well, for starters, this is an *old* technical error that Niven keeps<BR>
re-using. He's somehow gotten the idea that superconductors of<BR>
*electricity* also have infinite *thermal* conductivity. In reality the<BR>
situation is almost the exact opposite. <BR>
<BR>
And look up what it takes to raise a block of ice from subzero temps to<BR>
high temp steam. It'll seem like a lot. Then work out how long it takes<BR>
for typical "energy losses" (never mind *combat*!) to do that to any<BR>
reasonable amount of ice. <BR>
<BR>
It's at best a *very* short term solution.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:05:33 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military <BR>
<BR>
>From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
><BR>
>I remember a color plate in a book titled "Mercenary<BR>
>Uniforms"(?). It showed a Swiss Pikeman in Ceremonial <BR>
> uniform pulling a Beretta M-12 SMG from something that <BR>
>looked like an umbrella stand. Quite the anachronism.<BR>
<BR>
Uniforms of the Soldiers of Fortune; I have that book.  It<BR>
includes the Varangian Guard, as I recall, and goes up to<BR>
the mid-1980s advisors to the Contras in Nicaragua.  I once<BR>
went to a Halloween party as Mad Mike Hoare.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
http://im.yahoo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:04:19 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
Jeff Zeitlen wrote:<BR>
>We will not be able to understand _truly_ alien concepts - we<BR>
>won't even be able to discuss them: to discuss them, we must have<BR>
>a way to identify and describe them, and if they are truly alien,<BR>
>we won't have words useful for describing them - and if we make<BR>
>up the words to describe them, all we have done is label them -<BR>
>we still can't discuss it meaningfully. To do so, we would have<BR>
>to define the label in some way, which means we would have to<BR>
>understand the concept well enough to be able to describe it<BR>
>using words that have our own cultural baggage attached - and if<BR>
>we could discuss it in such meaningful terms, it wouldn't be<BR>
>truly alien.  In short, because we are human, our aliens _must_<BR>
>be "humans in rubber suits".<BR>
<BR>
Sounds to me like you're setting up definitions that lead to you talking<BR>
in circles.<BR>
<BR>
You're saying that we can't understand aliens at all, with the escape<BR>
clause that any alien we do understand is actually not alien - otherwise<BR>
we couldn't understand them.  Any time we make a breakthrough in<BR>
understanding and connect with an alien race, we haven't actually<BR>
connected with an alien, we just discovered that these apparent<BR>
aliens were actually "humans in rubber suits" - since we are, by your<BR>
definition, incapable of understanding anything alien.  Understand my <BR>
skepticism about your theory?<BR>
<BR>
FWIW, aliens IMTU are "humans in rubber suits", as far as the average<BR>
human is concerned.  The aliens understand this and deal with it, for<BR>
the most part - some even find ways to take advantage of it.<BR>
There are areas where values map very closely between species,<BR>
such as humans and Vargr in charisma situations - which is easy to<BR>
see, as humans and canines made such connections in Earth history.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 18:11:25 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: "Excessive Firepower" Sticker (was: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater)<BR>
<BR>
Nick Bradbeer wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> +++<BR>
> There's a picture of a suit of Ultra-Armour with a bumper sticker saying<BR>
> "Honk if you love excessive firepower". I can't help but wonder if he bought<BR>
> that from Famille Spofulam....<BR>
<BR>
Of _course_ not!  In the corporate philosophy of Famille Spofulam,<BR>
"excessive firepower" is an oxymoron.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:30:06 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
What the theory does is redifine what "human" means to allow other species<BR>
to be included in the definition, not redifine "alien."<BR>
<BR>
The reason for presenting the theory in the novel is to help the characters<BR>
make the correct moral decisions.<BR>
<BR>
Ender killed the Buggers and was thought of as a hero when it was thought<BR>
they were varelse.  No one missed something that they couldn't relate to.<BR>
When the Speaker of the Dead (also Ender) re-defined the Buggers as raman,<BR>
Ender was seen as a war criminal - the only human guilty of xenocide -<BR>
because peaceful relations had been a possibilty.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Walt Smith [mailto:smithw@hartwick.edu]<BR>
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 5:04 PM<BR>
To: 'TML'<BR>
Subject: re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jeff Zeitlen wrote:<BR>
>We will not be able to understand _truly_ alien concepts - we<BR>
>won't even be able to discuss them: to discuss them, we must have<BR>
>a way to identify and describe them, and if they are truly alien,<BR>
>we won't have words useful for describing them - and if we make<BR>
>up the words to describe them, all we have done is label them -<BR>
>we still can't discuss it meaningfully. To do so, we would have<BR>
>to define the label in some way, which means we would have to<BR>
>understand the concept well enough to be able to describe it<BR>
>using words that have our own cultural baggage attached - and if<BR>
>we could discuss it in such meaningful terms, it wouldn't be<BR>
>truly alien.  In short, because we are human, our aliens _must_<BR>
>be "humans in rubber suits".<BR>
<BR>
Sounds to me like you're setting up definitions that lead to you talking<BR>
in circles.<BR>
<BR>
You're saying that we can't understand aliens at all, with the escape<BR>
clause that any alien we do understand is actually not alien - otherwise<BR>
we couldn't understand them.  Any time we make a breakthrough in<BR>
understanding and connect with an alien race, we haven't actually<BR>
connected with an alien, we just discovered that these apparent<BR>
aliens were actually "humans in rubber suits" - since we are, by your<BR>
definition, incapable of understanding anything alien.  Understand my <BR>
skepticism about your theory?<BR>
<BR>
FWIW, aliens IMTU are "humans in rubber suits", as far as the average<BR>
human is concerned.  The aliens understand this and deal with it, for<BR>
the most part - some even find ways to take advantage of it.<BR>
There are areas where values map very closely between species,<BR>
such as humans and Vargr in charisma situations - which is easy to<BR>
see, as humans and canines made such connections in Earth history.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:31:22 -0600<BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
Who's to say Niven's futuristic room-temperature superconductors AREN'T also<BR>
superconductors of heat?  We certainly have no idea how to make them or what<BR>
physical properties they might have beyond super-conductance.<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com [mailto:shadow@krypton.rain.com]<BR>
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 5:13 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> All this brings to mind a bit of technical data from Niven/Pournelle's<BR>
"The <BR>
> Moat<BR>
> around Murchisons's Eye"... Empire warships and one of the civilian ships<BR>
(a<BR>
> racing yacht) have hull coatings of superconductor material with a wire<BR>
> (superconducting) running into a tank of water/ice for cooling. Of course<BR>
the<BR>
> ships (at least the warships) have black globe style generators (some<BR>
> differences). The point is...would a superconduccting coat a) stop visible<BR>
> wavelength lasers? and b) radiate heat more efficiently?<BR>
<BR>
Well, for starters, this is an *old* technical error that Niven keeps<BR>
re-using. He's somehow gotten the idea that superconductors of<BR>
*electricity* also have infinite *thermal* conductivity. In reality the<BR>
situation is almost the exact opposite. <BR>
<BR>
And look up what it takes to raise a block of ice from subzero temps to<BR>
high temp steam. It'll seem like a lot. Then work out how long it takes<BR>
for typical "energy losses" (never mind *combat*!) to do that to any<BR>
reasonable amount of ice. <BR>
<BR>
It's at best a *very* short term solution.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:33:30 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
>From: Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net><BR>
><BR>
>The subject line caused an involuntary thought to pop to<BR>
>mind...<BR>
>Consider the Dread Penguin Roberts...<BR>
<BR>
No, mon, Dread Penguin was a reggae rasta! But not from<BR>
Ethiopia, from Antarctica!<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
http://im.yahoo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:34:28 -0400<BR>
From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
Subject: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
The answer below is somewhat true but not entirely. I spent 20 years in the<BR>
Intelligence world in the U.S. Army. The first 8 years were with the U.S.<BR>
Army Security Agency (think tactical NSA) and then we were rolled into the<BR>
regular Army in Military Intelligence (MI). Tactical units were comprised of<BR>
elements of the old MI Corps and the USASA and called "Combat Electronic<BR>
Warfare & Intelligence" (CEWI BN's at Division & BDE's at Corps). The<BR>
strategic sites were just called MI. Now to get to the clearance issue.....<BR>
<BR>
Lots of Interrogators (just as an example) were of foreign extraction<BR>
(native speakers) and classed into two categories:<BR>
1) Native Born, U.S. citizen (Spoke the language at home with family<BR>
members.)<BR>
2) Foreign Born, U.S. citizen (English as a second language)<BR>
<BR>
Category 1 were eligible for clearances of the highest order (Special<BR>
Background Investigation required, [SBI]) and were given access on a need to<BR>
know basis. (Top Secret, blah, blah, blah)<BR>
<BR>
Category 2 could only be cleared for *UP TO* "Top Secret" with no further<BR>
access available, period. There were a few exceptions to this "foreign born"<BR>
rule (anybody remember Henry Kissinger?) but it was and is *EXTREMELY* rare.<BR>
<BR>
(Another one was the last Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General<BR>
???????????????, can't remember his name but he was born in Poland.)<BR>
<BR>
The highest *CLEARANCE* that anyone can have is "Top Secret". It is the<BR>
caveats attached to this classification that got you access to other things.<BR>
For example; I had a "Top Secret Crypto" (stands for Top Secret,<BR>
Cryptographic access) clearance when assigned to the USASA. When we rolled<BR>
into the MI the classification was changed to read "Top Secret SI" (stands<BR>
for Top Secret, Special Intelligence access) and covered me for all of the<BR>
standard requirements in the MI field. It didn't get me into the "Nuclear"<BR>
world, although my clearance was high enough, I didn't have a need to know.<BR>
If I had needed to work with the nuclear forces I would have gotten a 1 time<BR>
"read on" for that assignment. I did have requirements to do some "special"<BR>
work that required me to get access to a number of the "Very Restricted<BR>
Knowledge" (VRK series) "read-ons" and as soon as the projects were over I<BR>
was "read-off" or "debriefed from that level of access. I held my clearances<BR>
for 25 years and felt naked when I was finally debriefed from all access'.<BR>
<BR>
I would be happy to go into further detail off-line but there is a limit to<BR>
what I can say about how the system is set-up (even now, 5 years after my<BR>
final debriefing) so please don't be too specific.<BR>
<BR>
Sorry for the band width.....<BR>
<BR>
Thom Harris<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Clay" <arioch@theriver.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 3:46 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> >Okay, another question. Just how much can a non<BR>
> >citizen US mil person access? In terms of accessing intel -<BR>
> >is citizenship a requirement in a clearance process?<BR>
><BR>
> Generally speaking, yes it is a requirement.  There are some<BR>
> non-U.S.-citzen soldiers in MI units, though.  They do not have<BR>
> clearances nor do they have access to secured areas, they work in admin.<BR>
> slots for the most part.<BR>
><BR>
> IIRC, you also need citizenship for promotion to certain ranks (E-6 and<BR>
> above?).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2369<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2370</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Friday, April 28 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2370<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2369<BR>
Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
RE: CT Health Hazard <BR>
Princess Bride quotes<BR>
re:  Various Stuff<BR>
RE: Re increased radiation surface<BR>
Re: LKW on ADC<BR>
Re: Re:Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
Re: Princess Bride quotes<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military <BR>
Re: Airborne<BR>
Re: Ground Forces<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Design Question...<BR>
Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater  <BR>
Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater  <BR>
Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
RE: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
Re: Princess Bride quotes<BR>
Morality of "Heros"<BR>
re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
RE: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:44:10 -0700<BR>
From: "Brian Jenkins" <Brian.Jenkins@grpwise1.westek.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2369<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
<BR>
>Now that I have a crude version of Mayday, I am in search <BR>
>of playtesting volunteers.<BR>
<BR>
I might be able to help with that.  Give me the details on what you need done.<BR>
<BR>
Brian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:45:40 -0400<BR>
From: Brian Quirt <baqrt@mta.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Who's to say Niven's futuristic room-temperature superconductors AREN'T also<BR>
> superconductors of heat?  We certainly have no idea how to make them or what<BR>
> physical properties they might have beyond super-conductance.<BR>
<BR>
	Simply, it can't happen. Heat is (essentially) the vibrational<BR>
(kinetic) energy of the molecules making up the substance. A<BR>
superconductor of heat (same temperature at all points) would be very<BR>
difficult, because heat is transferred via these same vibrations<BR>
(conduction). In order to be a superconductor of heat, the molecules<BR>
involved would have to move faster than light. This does NOT sound<BR>
likely at all (even in Niven's universe - there FTL is NOT something<BR>
that happens on the molecular scale whenever you feel like it (of<BR>
course, the same can be said of Traveller canon) ).<BR>
<BR>
Hope that provides a brief summary. Note that this is NOT intended as<BR>
absolutely correct - I don't have the equations with me right now, and I<BR>
don't want to turn this into a math-fest either. If you want more<BR>
information, you could probably post a query on rec.arts.sf.science (I<BR>
believe that's the group).<BR>
<BR>
- -Brian Quirt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:41:13 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: CT Health Hazard <BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> You're quite right about CT Syndrome.  We're still in the<BR>
> conscious-raising phase, but I predict government<BR>
> intervention and probably class action litigation.  Just<BR>
> like the tobacco companies, GDW certainly knew that its<BR>
> products were addictive and dangerous.<BR>
<BR>
Some additional thought makes me think that Steve Jackson Games may have the<BR>
same liability issue to contend with. The latest generation of gamers who<BR>
have been raised on GURPS are suffering a different set of symptoms,<BR>
including shortened attention spans, low incomes, and the incomprehensible<BR>
desire to get body parts pierced. There must be others, too, but I seem to<BR>
have forgotten what they are...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 00:07:35 +0100<BR>
From: "MJ Dougherty" <martinjd@globalnet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Princess Bride quotes<BR>
<BR>
Hiver: waggle-wiggle-wigwag-wiggle<BR>
<BR>
Trans: I'm not left-handed either! (I don't think....)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
So many great quotes from one movie!<BR>
<BR>
From the bridge of a Far Trader:<BR>
<BR>
"Is he using the same Jumpspace we are using?"<BR>
"Move the thing! That other thing!"<BR>
"It's probably just some local belters out for a pleasure cruise...."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
... to the Imperial Court:<BR>
<BR>
"I've got my brother's murder to plan, a guard to frame for it... I'm<BR>
swamped!"<BR>
<BR>
Great movie.... Great book, too.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:56:31 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Various Stuff<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
<BR>
>OK, third thing. I need some Latin translated - I need the<BR>
<BR>
>imperitive form of "There must be no controlling legal <BR>
>authority". It's for an SCA project of mine - making<BR>
>Lochac a center of excellence for maritime insurance and <BR>
>associated issues (hey, I had to put all the Great Piracy<BR>
>Debate stuff to some use ...)<BR>
<BR>
I don't even know how to put that into imperative mood in<BR>
English, and I studied Latin.  An imperative mood is a<BR>
command:  Go away.  Be strong.  Pass the butter.  It is<BR>
directed at some specific second person, a "you":  You, who<BR>
are hearing me, pass the butter.  You, the person reading<BR>
this sign, go away.  <BR>
<BR>
The sentence presented states a required condition, but<BR>
does not identify who is to put that condition into effect.<BR>
 Maybe one could say: Have no controlling legal authority,<BR>
but that doesn't make sense.  Be without controlling legal<BR>
authority.  Lack controlling legal authority.  I don't<BR>
know.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
http://im.yahoo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 12:27:03 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Re increased radiation surface<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Leonard Erickson<BR>
><BR>
> flat "facets" might work better. But grooves still have limited<BR>
> radiation angle problem. Their effective area is that of the "opening".<BR>
<BR>
So, for radiation efficiency purposes we should have spacehips that look the<BR>
F117 "Wobbly Goblin" ?<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:39:30 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: LKW on ADC<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-28 13:51:33 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:22:50 -0700<BR>
 From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
 Subject: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
 <BR>
 LKW wrote:<BR>
 <BR>
 >  The e-mails which I have received make it clear that I should<BR>
 > have described<BR>
 >  what Aide de Camp is in more detail. >><BR>
 ><BR>
 > Does Marc know you are doing this?<BR>
 <BR>
 Is the issue copyright infringements? According to HPS Simulations (the<BR>
 creators of ADC2), creating an ADC2 copy of a game for personal use is not<BR>
 an infringement, nor is playing the game using ADC2, as long as at least one<BR>
 player owns a copy of the game.  >><BR>
<BR>
I still suggest you clear it with Marc, though. <BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:44:13 -0400<BR>
From: "Eric & Diane Freitas" <ericfrei@gte.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Re:Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
Sure, but Niven & Pournelle speculated on a thermal superconductor, not<BR>
electrical.<BR>
<BR>
The novel was after all science fiction. :)<BR>
<BR>
Eric<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Bruce Macintosh <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
<BR>
>Niven likes this a lot, but it turns out that superconductors don't<BR>
>superconduct<BR>
>heat in any special way. This would particularly be a problem with<BR>
Traveller<BR>
>lasers,<BR>
>which are pulsed and hence deliver their energy almost instantaneously.<BR>
><BR>
>Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 01:04:41 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride quotes<BR>
<BR>
On Sat, 29 Apr 2000 00:07:35 +0100, "MJ Dougherty"<BR>
<martinjd@globalnet.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>"I've got my brother's murder to plan, a guard to frame for it... I'm<BR>
>swamped!"<BR>
<BR>
"If you don't have your health, you haven't got anything."<BR>
<BR>
"TO THE PAIN!"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"Don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but rum, sodomy, and the<BR>
 lash."                              - Winston Churchill<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 01:10:11 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military <BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:05:33 -0700 (PDT), Glenn Goffin<BR>
<gmgoffin@yahoo.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>>From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
>><BR>
>>I remember a color plate in a book titled "Mercenary<BR>
>>Uniforms"(?). It showed a Swiss Pikeman in Ceremonial <BR>
>> uniform pulling a Beretta M-12 SMG from something that <BR>
>>looked like an umbrella stand. Quite the anachronism.<BR>
><BR>
>Uniforms of the Soldiers of Fortune; I have that book.  It<BR>
>includes the Varangian Guard, as I recall, and goes up to<BR>
>the mid-1980s advisors to the Contras in Nicaragua.  I once<BR>
>went to a Halloween party as Mad Mike Hoare.<BR>
<BR>
Ah yes, that's the book. Was I right about the picture? It's been<BR>
something like ten years since I saw it at the library.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"Don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but rum, sodomy, and the<BR>
 lash."                              - Winston Churchill<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 01:14:46 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, 27 Apr 2000 20:09:38 -0700, Jesse DeGraff<BR>
<jdegraff@pacbell.net> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>That'd be about the only reason I could see for jumping out of a perfectly<BR>
>good airplane :)<BR>
>Jesse<BR>
<BR>
I can think of several reasons to jump out of an airplane. You see,<BR>
I've known many aircraft maintenance personnel. In fact I used to be<BR>
one. ;-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"Don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but rum, sodomy, and the<BR>
 lash."                              - Winston Churchill<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:16:39 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Ground Forces<BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
> Of all the names people volunteered, I just knew that Jens was going to be<BR>
> a S-I.  just imagining him saying it before a mob of terrified recruits...<BR>
<BR>
LOL<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 01:17:19 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:30:37 +1000, Robert Houghton<BR>
<rhoughto@one.net.au> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Greetings...<BR>
><BR>
>Lordy, lordy...anyone else with Princess Bride References?<BR>
><BR>
>How 'bout "Solomani never bluff when death is involved..." (sorry if the<BR>
>quote is slightly off)<BR>
<BR>
"Never go in against a Solomani when death is on the line! Ha ha ha!<BR>
Ha ha ha! Ha ha ha! Ha ha ha!" [thump]<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"Don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but rum, sodomy, and the<BR>
 lash."                              - Winston Churchill<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:19:51 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater<BR>
<BR>
Matthew W. Helton wrote:<BR>
> Given the high quality of Hiver Voders, I suspect that the voder will have<BR>
> to be dumbed down considerably to capture the effect of Kung-Fu theater.<BR>
> <BR>
> Of course, the Hiver's gyrations through it's "Kata" might well be<BR>
> interpreted by another hiver as simply one who is talking very quickly...<BR>
<BR>
Heeeeeeeeeey Macarena !<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 01:19:44 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:30:37 +1000, Robert Houghton<BR>
<rhoughto@one.net.au> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Greetings...<BR>
><BR>
>Lordy, lordy...anyone else with Princess Bride References?<BR>
><BR>
>How 'bout "Solomani never bluff when death is involved..." (sorry if the<BR>
>quote is slightly off)<BR>
<BR>
"Never go in against a Solomani when death is on the line! Ha ha ha!<BR>
Ha ha ha! Ha ha ha! Ha ha ha!" [thump]<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"Don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but rum, sodomy, and the<BR>
 lash."                              - Winston Churchill<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:25:53 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>
> [1] The hierarchy is as follows:<BR>
>     utlnning - the stranger who is human of our species, but of<BR>
>                 another city or country (plural utlnnings)<BR>
>                 Example: Chinese, to most Americans - or<BR>
>                          Californians, to New Yorkers<BR>
>     frmling  - the stranger who is human of our species, but of<BR>
>                 another world (plural frmlings)<BR>
>                 Example: Zhodani or Vilani, to Solomani or Daryen<BR>
>     raman     - the stranger who is human, but of another species<BR>
>                 (plural ramen)<BR>
>                 Example: Vargr or Aslan, to Humaniti or K'kree<BR>
>     varelse   - the animal, with whom we can identify no<BR>
>                 mutuality of concept (but with whom we can<BR>
>                 coexist) (plural varelse)<BR>
>                 Example: plenty of them - look in any zoo...<BR>
>     <BR>
>     There is suggestions of a fifth class, djur - the beast, with<BR>
>     whom no coexistence is possible, but it is not made clear if<BR>
>     this is formally considered part of the hierarchy.  An<BR>
>     example of this _might_ be Gnaak, to K'kree - but Gnaak are<BR>
>     presumed to have been sophont, implying that we would<BR>
>     consider them ramen.<BR>
<BR>
What strikes me as funny is that these terms (except Raman) are in Swedish.<BR>
<BR>
Utlnning (pl. utlnningar) = Foreigner<BR>
<BR>
Frmling (pl. frmlingar) = Stranger<BR>
<BR>
Varelse (pl. varelser) = Being<BR>
<BR>
Djur (pl. djur) = Animal<BR>
<BR>
Where did that additional term (Raman) come from ? What language ?<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:31:03 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Design Question...<BR>
<BR>
First of all, I want to thank all of you for updating me on The<BR>
Traveller Situation. Next, I would appreciate your comments on the<BR>
following designs:<BR>
<BR>
I wanted to build a set of lower-end paramilitary weapons for use at<BR>
about TL10 (T4). My reasoning is that it would be easy to manufacture,<BR>
and would therefore be more widely available. I chose caseless rounds<BR>
because they were lighter and cheaper. Most importantly, I wanted to<BR>
make use of the barrel length modifier to increase performance as much<BR>
as was reasonable.<BR>
<BR>
TL10 10x27mm Caseless<BR>
Energy 1000J  834mm3 of propellant <BR>
Minimum CC length 6.638mm   CC Length 27mm  <BR>
Length of round 37mm  Mass 15.9g  0.636cr/round<BR>
<BR>
I got thrown off by the minimum CC length. The design sequence says to<BR>
use Necked configuration modifiers for caseless rounds, but that didn't<BR>
make sense in this case. So I used the straight configuration modifiers<BR>
as a guide instead.<BR>
<BR>
TL10 10mm Caseless SMG<BR>
Bullpup Stock  5cm  .1kg 10cr<BR>
Shock Absorber  .2kg 300cr<BR>
25cm Lt Barrel  .5kg 100cr   Muzzle Energy 1750J<BR>
Long Muzzle Brake 8cm .4kg 200cr  Laser Sight .5kg 300cr<BR>
Light Autoburst Receiver 18.7cm 2.24kg 672cr<BR>
50rnd box magazine .286kg 2.86cr (1.081kg loaded)<BR>
Weapon Length 56.7cm Mass 3.94kg/5.021kg loaded 1582cr<BR>
Short Range 104m (Medium) Damage(T4) 4/5 explosive (3.98/4.53)<BR>
SS Recoil 1.09 5rnd Burst Recoil 2.725<BR>
<BR>
It has excellent range for a weapon little more than 1.5 feet long, good<BR>
ammo capacity, good hitting power, good recoil. I see it being used for<BR>
CQB and scout missions, where heavier rifles would be inappropriate.<BR>
<BR>
TL10 10mm Caseless Pistol<BR>
Hollow Pistol Grip .1kg 25cr<BR>
10cm Lt Barrel w/ Recoil Compensator .2kg 340cr<BR>
Lt SA Receiver 18.7cm 1.774kg 532cr<BR>
14rnd grip magazine .095kg .95cr (.318 loaded)<BR>
Weapon Length 28.7cm Mass 2.077kg/2.395 loaded 897cr<BR>
Short Range 12.65m (Very Short) Damage(T4) 3/4 explosive (3.011/3.7)<BR>
SS Recoil 2.265<BR>
<BR>
This one seemed a bit off. The receiver looks way too long; can't<BR>
remember any pistol where the receiver extended 7" past the rear of the<BR>
barrel. Of course, on most pistols the receiver is sort of wrapped<BR>
around the barrel... anyone have an idea on how to incorporate that into<BR>
the design sequence? Perhaps for grip magazine fed weapons only?<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:39:57 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
Someone wrote<BR>
<BR>
>  "My name is Crown Prince Lucan.  You killed my father.  Prepare to die."<BR>
<BR>
This is not the Lucan who became Emperor, this is his _son_ <BR>
who was born in 1125 or so and is thus undocumented in Traveller <BR>
canon. The quote is circa 1150 or so Crown Prince Lucan (who <BR>
having a better grasp of Imperial law than his father does <BR>
not style himself Lucan the Second) is challenging the Virus <BR>
that killed his father. C.P. Lucan and his anti Virus 'rebel <BR>
alliance' on Capital/Core are about to throw the switch on <BR>
their anti Viral weapon, thus creating the Black Curtain. <BR>
[g, d,r]<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:49:33 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater  <BR>
<BR>
My suggestion would be that the Hiver doing a handstand <BR>
was in a low gravity area. Later descriptions of Hiver say <BR>
that Hiver can't do one legged stands because they can't <BR>
in normal gravity. If the Hiver in the illustration was in <BR>
a low grav field at the time then it can be done.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:10:16<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater  <BR>
<BR>
At 05:49 PM 4/28/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
>My suggestion would be that the Hiver doing a handstand <BR>
>was in a low gravity area. Later descriptions of Hiver say <BR>
>that Hiver can't do one legged stands because they can't <BR>
>in normal gravity. If the Hiver in the illustration was in <BR>
>a low grav field at the time then it can be done.<BR>
<BR>
Where does it state that Hivers can't do one hand stands in normal graivty?<BR>
<BR>
Anyway, whit is their homeworld's gravity?  A high-g world would explain much.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:12:47<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
At 05:40 PM 4/28/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>    Don't worry...I'm sure Doug will be able to come up with a perfectly<BR>
>good explanation when asked by the Emperor why he publicly contradicted <BR>
>certain statements of the Crown. (eg)<BR>
<BR>
Doug lives in San Francisco, on Terra, well behind the the advancing forces<BR>
of our Glorious Solomani Fleet!<BR>
<BR>
Anyway, I have enough dirt on the Army and Marines to make it to expensive<BR>
to take me.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 22:50:24 -0400<BR>
From: "VonRammen" <von_rammen@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
wrote in re Larry Niven's superconductive ship's hulls in "The Gripping<BR>
Hand":<BR>
<BR>
>Well, for starters, this is an *old* technical error that Niven keeps<BR>
>re-using. He's somehow gotten the idea that superconductors of<BR>
>*electricity* also have infinite *thermal* conductivity. In reality the<BR>
>situation is almost the exact opposite.<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net> Replied:<BR>
<BR>
>Who's to say Niven's futuristic room-temperature superconductors AREN'T<BR>
also<BR>
>superconductors of heat?  We certainly have no idea how to make them or<BR>
what<BR>
>physical properties they might have beyond super-conductance.<BR>
<BR>
I think this confusion is coming from the fact that in "The Gripping Hand"<BR>
the coatings are simply referred to as "superconductors." They actually<BR>
*are* superconductors of heat. The technology was copied from a Motie<BR>
artifact found in the Beehive Asteroid in "The Mote in God's Eye." (Chapter<BR>
18)<BR>
<BR>
Note that the Moties used the technology when they tried to run the blockade<BR>
the Empire put up, IIRC, but it didn't help as they were "jumping" into the<BR>
photosphere of a red giant star.<BR>
<BR>
Fred Ramen<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 21:46:11 -0700<BR>
From: Rob Eaglestone <downport@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride quotes<BR>
<BR>
"He's still gaining on us.  I wonder if he's using the<BR>
same wind?"<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
<BR>
"Your hand... it has six fingers.  I know a fellow who's<BR>
looking for you..."<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
<BR>
"You mock my pain!"<BR>
<BR>
"Life IS pain.  Anyone who tells you differently is<BR>
selling something."<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
<BR>
"Hear that, your highness?  Those are the sounds of<BR>
the Shrieking Eels!"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:12:17 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
Speaking of the Princess Bride, Wesley is the current Dread Pirate Roberts.<BR>
He, like his predecessors, maintains his secret identity by the simple<BR>
expedient of murdering everyone he encounters. At the end, he seems to pass<BR>
the mantle along to Inigo Montoya. At no point does any of this seem  to<BR>
have any downside or fallout. Princess Buttercup is outraged that the Dread<BR>
pirate may have murdered her dear Wesley, but is only overjoyed that her<BR>
dear Wesley is alive, utterly unconcerned about whoever he has gone about<BR>
murdering merrily.<BR>
What does this have to with Traveller?<BR>
While going through 76 Patrons in preparation for another game, I took some<BR>
time to consider the range of missions. More than half involve criminal<BR>
activity of some sort. While a few are simple B&E or Trespass, they range<BR>
quickly up through Industrial Espionage, interfering in local government,<BR>
Revolution and finally Kidnapping, Contract Assassination and Terrorism.<BR>
Quite a few Amber Zones from the CT days of JTAS are on the same level. Even<BR>
the fallout from some of the Adventures is mentioned as being the result of<BR>
terrorists in the GT History updates.<BR>
Am I just being overly sensitive or was there a very distinct lean towards<BR>
players making their fortunes through outright illegal activity in the CT<BR>
days? Is that why A8 - Prison Planet was needed?<BR>
They definitely mellowed as MT came around, especially with Charles Gannon<BR>
and the Bad Karma rule for Star Mercs in Hard Times.<BR>
I skipped TNE, but T4 seemed to have a slight subcurrent of the illegal<BR>
becoming ascendant.<BR>
Where does GT sit?<BR>
And where are individual GMs? Do you run Saviors of the Imperium or It's<BR>
Money, Hand it to Me?<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:26:44 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:38:01 -0400 (EDT), Walt Smith<BR>
<smithw@hartwick.edu> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Sounds to me like you're setting up definitions that lead to you talking<BR>
>in circles.<BR>
<BR>
It _does_ sort of work out that way - but chalk that up to my not<BR>
being a psychologist, and not knowing (and therefore not being<BR>
able to explain) exactly what the correct terminology would be.<BR>
In a sense, psychologists are "utlnnings" to me, a computer<BR>
techie.  I don't have the background in their "professional<BR>
culture" to be able to communicate their concepts accurately.<BR>
<BR>
Can you propose an alternate theory?  One that eliminates the<BR>
"rubber suit" problem?<BR>
<BR>
>FWIW, aliens IMTU are "humans in rubber suits", as far as the average<BR>
>human is concerned.  The aliens understand this and deal with it, for<BR>
>the most part - some even find ways to take advantage of it.<BR>
>There are areas where values map very closely between species,<BR>
>such as humans and Vargr in charisma situations - which is easy to<BR>
>see, as humans and canines made such connections in Earth history.<BR>
<BR>
Certainly - but all you've said here is that Vargr are _ramen_.<BR>
If you haven't already, I recommend that you read the Ender<BR>
Wiggen series by OSC - especially Speaker.  I think he makes it<BR>
clearer than I do - which, honestly, isn't saying much.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:26:47 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: RE: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:38:01 -0400 (EDT), Jason Postma<BR>
<JasonP@i-link.net> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>What the theory does is redifine what "human" means to allow other species<BR>
>to be included in the definition, not redifine "alien."<BR>
<BR>
I'm not sure I would have expressed it that way, but it's not<BR>
inaccurate.<BR>
<BR>
>The reason for presenting the theory in the novel is to help the characters<BR>
>make the correct moral decisions.<BR>
<BR>
>Ender killed the Buggers and was thought of as a hero when it was thought<BR>
>they were varelse.  No one missed something that they couldn't relate to.<BR>
>When the Speaker of the Dead (also Ender) re-defined the Buggers as raman,<BR>
>Ender was seen as a war criminal - the only human guilty of xenocide -<BR>
>because peaceful relations had been a possibilty.<BR>
<BR>
This I'm not clear on - was the change in perception of Ender<BR>
Wiggen to Ender the Xenocide a _result_ of the publication of<BR>
_The_Hive_Queen_and_The_Hegemon_ - that is, by Ender's Speaking<BR>
for both the Hive Queen and his (Ender's) brother, or did<BR>
perceptions change first - to the best of my recollection, Card<BR>
wasn't quite clear on that. (N.B. Certainly, Ender's perception<BR>
of _himself_ predates the publication, otherwise he would never<BR>
have started Speaking, much less Speaking for the Hive Queen. The<BR>
question is applied to the human society at large.)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2370<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2371</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 29 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2371<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re complex geometry radiators<BR>
Re Utanling/Framling/Raman/Varelse & Traveller<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2370<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
Gearhead Question: Feasibility of LHyd as Fuel for IC Engines<BR>
Frequency of UWP Updates?<BR>
Plasma guns...<BR>
Re: "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater"<BR>
SolSec and Canon<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Various Stuff<BR>
Re: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Re: Bloody lucky for my keyboard...<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:23:02 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re complex geometry radiators<BR>
<BR>
>> One further comment on textured surfaces:<BR>
>><BR>
>> the method of small grooves works best on an overall convex surface; very<BR>
>> few traveller ships will have anything but curved radiator surfaces; nice<BR>
>> flat plates are not common in traveller ships.<BR>
><BR>
>flat "facets" might work better. But grooves still have limited<BR>
>radiation angle problem. Their effective area is that of the "opening".<BR>
<BR>
Except on curved surfaces. the ideal height for the raises is a function of<BR>
curvature and width of groove. Unfortunately, ASCII text art cannot do this<BR>
well.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:29:36 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Utanling/Framling/Raman/Varelse & Traveller<BR>
<BR>
> In short, because we are human, our aliens _must_<BR>
>be "humans in rubber suits".<BR>
<BR>
But, in good roleplaying, we should strive to have them be more than man in<BR>
suit. Not that we will attain this. THe author, would he have been aware fo<BR>
this, probably would have written them as framling, when really, they need<BR>
to be played as close to varelse as the group is capable of. H&I Nearly<BR>
tries to prevent this.<BR>
><BR>
>(Of course, there is the question of the well-constructed rubber<BR>
>suit vs. the poorly constructed rubber suit - i.e., the<BR>
>believable "alien", vs. the cardboard cutout set up for the hero<BR>
>to knock down, or the exaggerated one-dimensional psychology set<BR>
>up merely to establish a contrast to what is Right and True.<BR>
>_Those_ bug me.)<BR>
><BR>
H&I takes a nice suit, and puts an amature paint-job on it...<BR>
<BR>
>[1] The hierarchy is as follows:<BR>
><BR>
[snip]<BR>
>    There is suggestions of a fifth class, djur - the beast, with<BR>
>    whom no coexistence is possible, but it is not made clear if<BR>
>    this is formally considered part of the hierarchy.  An<BR>
>    example of this _might_ be Gnaak, to K'kree - but Gnaak are<BR>
>    presumed to have been sophont, implying that we would<BR>
>    consider them ramen.<BR>
I consider djur to be the fifth stage, but there should be one in between:<BR>
one where no interaction is capable, but coexistance is possible.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:43:46 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2370<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:17:08 -0400 (EDT), Jens Rydholm<BR>
<jenry023@student.liu.se> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>What strikes me as funny is that these terms (except Raman) are in Swedish.<BR>
<BR>
>Utlnning (pl. utlnningar) = Foreigner<BR>
<BR>
>Frmling (pl. frmlingar) = Stranger<BR>
<BR>
>Varelse (pl. varelser) = Being<BR>
<BR>
>Djur (pl. djur) = Animal<BR>
<BR>
>Where did that additional term (Raman) come from ? What language ?<BR>
<BR>
According to Card, within the story context, they all _do_ come<BR>
from Swedish.  Is there a similar term in Swedish - or any<BR>
Nordic/Germanic language - to _raman_ that might be applied as<BR>
given?  Or from which _raman_ could be derived?  (Remember, the<BR>
application hasn't actually come up yet, so usage might only be<BR>
theoretical - and I don't know how much linguistics Card knows.)<BR>
<BR>
Rechecking, I cheated a little bit; the Stark terms don't<BR>
actually have the umlauts.<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:34:43 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
On Sat, 29 Apr 2000 01:17:19 GMT, Pete wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:30:37 +1000, Robert Houghton<BR>
> <rhoughto@one.net.au> wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >Greetings...<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Lordy, lordy...anyone else with Princess Bride References?<BR>
> ><BR>
> >How 'bout "Solomani never bluff when death is involved..." (sorry if the<BR>
> >quote is slightly off)<BR>
> <BR>
> "Never go in against a Solomani when death is on the line! Ha ha ha!<BR>
> Ha ha ha! Ha ha ha! Ha ha ha!" [thump]<BR>
<BR>
Beware the Rodents of Unusual Size!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Can you repeat the part after "Listen very carefully"?<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:34:51 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:07:00 +0100, SD Mooney wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 16:39 -0400 27/4/00, "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com> wrote:<BR>
> >BTW: The "aliens" section of ACQ is probably its weakest area.  I admit it.<BR>
> >Lots of important stuff was left out due to a lack of playtested aliens and<BR>
> >a lack of space in the final version.  To be fair, *alien* aliens such as<BR>
> >the Hivers and K'kree really require their own dedicated combat system.  I<BR>
> >hope that Doug and I will be forgiven :)<BR>
> <BR>
> Well, we'll happily put any system extensions/notes on the BITS <BR>
> website, probably an FAQ too.<BR>
<BR>
I'm up for creating a short Alien Combat supplement for ACQ.  How 'bout<BR>
you, Doug?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Can you repeat the part after "Listen very carefully"?<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:34:52 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:47:45 -0400, Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> James Lindsay wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >From a Hiver viewpoint, us humanoids might appear "awkward" in HTH combat.<BR>
> >"Look at those strange creatures-- balanced on those two spindly legs.<BR>
> >Their limb movements seem so restricted and they have to turn their<BR>
> >top-heavy bodies around in order to face a threat from behind!"<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm trying to talk absolutes here, James. My contention is that Hivers<BR>
> aren't built for the same kind of combat that we are[1]. On the other hand,<BR>
> we have certain distinct advantages over Hivers in combat:<BR>
<BR>
All I was saying was that what we perceive as "awkward" might be perfectly<BR>
natural for a Hiver.  After all, it is his/her/its body we're talking about<BR>
and who else would know what is awkward for a Hiver?  We can't bend our<BR>
elbows backwards but that little "drawback" doesn't even enter into our<BR>
minds as an awkward limitation to our bipedal construction.  We simply work<BR>
around the limitations of our bodies.  The same would be true for Hivers.<BR>
<BR>
> For small pistol-type weapons, I can imagine this would be useful. Longer<BR>
> firearms would be awkward, unless balanced in some way. This could be<BR>
> difficult, as any balance I can think of would, out of necessity, screw with<BR>
> the eyes.<BR>
<BR>
According to the artwork in AM:7, pistols are ball-shaped weapons easily<BR>
grasped in one "hand".  Hiver rifles are longer, with the same ball-shaped<BR>
"grip" located near the center of the weapon's mass center.  The "stock" of<BR>
the weapon appears to be braced by the "arm" of the "hand" holding the<BR>
weapon by wrapping around it to some degree.  In all cases, the artwork in<BR>
AM:7 show the weapons being wielded in the same "hand" that contains the<BR>
eyes of the Hiver.<BR>
<BR>
> Piercing melee weapons could also be used in the "head" hand, although any<BR>
> blow to the weapon itself would likely endanger the eyes. I don't think that<BR>
> slashing or bludgeoning melee weapons would be very effective in the "head"<BR>
> hand (I know, it's not really a "head"), because that's where the eyes<BR>
> happen to be. The eyes would have to move around a lot, and quickly, which<BR>
> might serve to "blind" the Hiver.<BR>
<BR>
The only melee weapon to appear in AM:7 is a Hiver "Finger Dagger".  Alas,<BR>
there is no artwork that shows one being used by a Hiver.  The write-up<BR>
specifically states that Hivers prefer pistols to knives, and rifles to<BR>
pistols.  The weapons exist, so the Hiver culture must use them at some<BR>
point.  "Although Hivers dislike violence, they realize it is sometimes<BR>
necessary."<BR>
<BR>
> It is armored, the hiver brain is protected by two carapaces, between which<BR>
> is a padding of internal organs. In addition, the brain is held in place by<BR>
> shock absorbing ligaments so that it doesn't bounce around. If you ever do<BR>
> an alien expansion for ACQ, I'd like to humbly suggest that this would mean<BR>
> that Hivers would not be stunned or knocked out as easily as humans.<BR>
<BR>
I like it.<BR>
<BR>
> However, their central bulk is *solid*. Impacts would be, to some extent<BR>
> worse. When I was younger, I got hit by a car. Besides a slight pain in my<BR>
> knee, and some scrapes, I was fine. A few years later, a car going about the<BR>
> same speed crashed into a brick wall around the corner. It opened up a very<BR>
> big hole. What I was getting at was that the solidity of the hub is a<BR>
> disadvantage in this sense, that the solidity is a disadvantage with respect<BR>
> to impact.<BR>
<BR>
With all due respect, a Hiver is *not* a brick wall.  They don't mass that<BR>
much more than an average humanoid-- tipping the scales at 150 kg.  Bone is<BR>
tough, not brittle.  Bone material can bend, bricks cannot.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Can you repeat the part after "Listen very carefully"?<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:34:53 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:11:16 -0400, Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> James Lindsay said:<BR>
> <BR>
> >And rhinos typically appear ungainly too.  Large heavy bodies, short "wheel<BR>
> >base", etc.<BR>
> <BR>
> Rhinos are fast in a charge, but that's not what I meant by ungainly. In my<BR>
> initial post on the subject I gave more detail as to what I meant. I was<BR>
> saying that it would be more difficult for them to "wheel around" to "face"<BR>
> other foes. Rhinos are actually slow to wheel around, from what I<BR>
> understand.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, they can turn on a dime.  Their rate of turn is second to none.<BR>
<BR>
> >The octopus too seems utterly incapable of moving at any great<BR>
> >speed.<BR>
> <BR>
> I disagree. The octopus looks like it evolved to be quick in the water. It's<BR>
> never been surprising to me that it is.<BR>
<BR>
Are you sure you are not basing this opinion on knowledge you gained<BR>
*after* you saw footage of an octopus jetting away at high speed?  I would<BR>
think that most people-- after seeing an octopus in an aquarium, etc. for<BR>
the first time-- wouldn't come to this conclusion.  I didn't, but I was<BR>
only six.<BR>
<BR>
> >Luckily we have actual fluid footage of rhinos and octopi in action<BR>
> >to prove otherwise.  The same is not true of an actual Hiver :(  What we<BR>
> >need is the educated opinion of an actual zoologist...<BR>
> <BR>
> I think it would be better if we actually had a Hiver to beat up on.<BR>
<BR>
Or get beaten up by :)  I still can't get the image of Hiver Chan out of my<BR>
head...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Can you repeat the part after "Listen very carefully"?<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:34:49 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 15:50:24 -0400, Sword-Worlder wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> For ACQ:<BR>
> <BR>
>     Marine: "Why won't my arms move?"<BR>
>     Medic: "You've been mostly dead all day."<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> For players that missed half of a six hour session:<BR>
> <BR>
>     Absent player: "Who are you?  Are we enemies?  Why am I on this wall?<BR>
> Where's Buttercup?"<BR>
>     Beleagered Player: "Let me 'splain... no, is too much.  Let me sum up."<BR>
<BR>
Taken from the introduction of the new T5:<BR>
<BR>
"Return to the time when Vargr were Vargr and swamps were swamps.  Fire<BR>
Swamps, that is."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Can you repeat the part after "Listen very carefully"?<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 22:59:08 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Gearhead Question: Feasibility of LHyd as Fuel for IC Engines<BR>
<BR>
While working out a few details on my TML Landgrab project (Leander), I<BR>
realized that a world of 800 sophonts could not easily provide distilled<BR>
hydrocarbon fuel for TL5 IC engines.  OTOH, an imported LHyd refinery<BR>
(at say, TL12) could easily be operated with minimal manpower, although<BR>
anything other than operator maintnance would require off-world tech<BR>
support.<BR>
<BR>
Would LHyd work as a fuel for IC engines (or other TL5 engines)?  What<BR>
problems would this present?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:01:37 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Frequency of UWP Updates?<BR>
<BR>
How often does the IISS update UWPs of member worlds?  Any ideas?<BR>
<BR>
If the answer is "once every century" or so, then I'm thinking of making<BR>
significant changes to Leander's Pop and TL (that would be reflected in<BR>
the _next_ update) for my TML Landgrab project.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 17:59:01 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Plasma guns...<BR>
<BR>
Ok, I guess I just got on a design kick or something. A few plasma guns<BR>
to ponder:<BR>
<BR>
TL12 .25MJ Plasma Carbine<BR>
Firing Unit 1kg 1200cr.<BR>
Support Hardware 1kg 1200cr.<BR>
Bullpup Stock .1kg 10cr.<BR>
SA Stock .2kg 75cr.<BR>
Action (Rof 12) .025kg .15cr.<BR>
Mass/rnd .6kg 5rnd box magazine 1.5kg/4.5kg loaded.<BR>
Weapon Mass/Loaded 2.3025kg/6.8025kg 2485cr.<BR>
Single Shot Recoil  9.37(!)<BR>
Damage (T4) 20 Short Range 50m (Medium)<BR>
W/ TL12 Gyro Compensator 7.3025kg/11.81025kg, 5410cr.<BR>
SS Recoil 4.32<BR>
<BR>
TL12 .04MJ RF Plasma Carbine<BR>
Firing Unit .16kg 192cr.<BR>
Support Unit .16kg 192cr.<BR>
Bullpup Stock .1kg 10cr<BR>
SA Stock .2kg 75cr.<BR>
Action (Rof 180) .0048kg .0288cr.<BR>
EPG Cartridge .096kg 30rnd box magazine 1.088kg/3.968kg loaded.<BR>
Weapon Mass/Loaded .6248kg/4.5928kg 469.0288cr.<BR>
Short Range 20m (Short) Damage 8 <BR>
SS Recoil 5.55 3rnd Burst Recoil 8.33<BR>
<BR>
Both weapons could conceivable be used be troops in regular flex armor,<BR>
or unaugmented battle dress. Either will penetrate light battle dress<BR>
(though the lighter of the two won't penetrate augmeted TL12+), and the<BR>
first has a hell of a lot better stats than the PCMP-12 published in<BR>
Emperor's Arsenal. The second is light enough that some of the less sane<BR>
among my players might consider it for room clearing. ("Supressive fire<BR>
on that doorway." "With a PLASMA GUN?!?!?")<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:07:54 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater"<BR>
<BR>
Jason Kemp wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
> <BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> ><BR>
> > Hmmm.  "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater."<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Do they gesture out-of-synch? ;-)<BR>
> <BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> <BR>
> Hiver Chan flaps his tentacles, then launches into a spinning barrage of<BR>
> attacks.<BR>
> <BR>
> Voiceover: "I give her a Yaaa!"<BR>
> <BR>
> More flapping tentacles, different but equally quivery, followed by aikido<BR>
> redirection techniques, Hiver-style.<BR>
> <BR>
> Voiceover: "And a Hiiiiyaaa!"<BR>
> <BR>
> Finally, Hiver Chan mounts his intended victim, and pummels them with three<BR>
> or four arms at once, amidst more furious flapping.<BR>
> <BR>
> Voiceover: "And then I keek her, Sir!"<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I was thinking that the last quote should be along the lines<BR>
of:<BR>
<BR>
"Your kung-fu is very good.  But it will not stop my<BR>
throat-warbler-mangrove kata!"<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 22:04:21 -0700<BR>
From: SolSec <section9@solsec.org><BR>
Subject: SolSec and Canon<BR>
<BR>
Greeting all.<BR>
<BR>
I am looking for Traveller SolSec references for the SolSec Website.  Any<BR>
published sources besides the Solomani supplement?<BR>
<BR>
Thanks<BR>
- -- <BR>
"Keeping the Confederation Safe for Humaniti"<BR>
- --<BR>
section9@solsec.org<BR>
http://www.solsec.org<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 01:33:33 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
James Lindsay wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> Rhinos are fast in a charge, but that's not what I meant by ungainly. In<BR>
my<BR>
>> initial post on the subject I gave more detail as to what I meant. I was<BR>
>> saying that it would be more difficult for them to "wheel around" to<BR>
"face"<BR>
>> other foes. Rhinos are actually slow to wheel around, from what I<BR>
>> understand.<BR>
><BR>
>Actually, they can turn on a dime.  Their rate of turn is second to none.<BR>
<BR>
Really? I had understood the exact opposite, and the ones I've seen at the<BR>
zoo have never seemed to spin around too fast. I distinctly remember<BR>
references to their inability to turn (but perhaps that's when they're in a<BR>
charge).<BR>
<BR>
>> I disagree. The octopus looks like it evolved to be quick in the water.<BR>
It's<BR>
>> never been surprising to me that it is.<BR>
><BR>
>Are you sure you are not basing this opinion on knowledge you gained<BR>
>*after* you saw footage of an octopus jetting away at high speed?<BR>
<BR>
Positive. If I had intended otherwise, I would have said something like, "I<BR>
was surprised when I first saw an octopus jet away at high-speed on TV." :)<BR>
<BR>
>I would think that most people-- after seeing an octopus in an aquarium,<BR>
etc. for<BR>
>the first time-- wouldn't come to this conclusion.  I didn't, but I was<BR>
>only six.<BR>
<BR>
It's not usually a good idea to assume things like this, unless you're sure<BR>
that this is the case. The first octopus picture I ever saw was the one of<BR>
the variety with the pointy head. Terribly unscientific, I know. :) Still,<BR>
it was a long time ago.<BR>
<BR>
>> I think it would be better if we actually had a Hiver to beat up on.<BR>
><BR>
>Or get beaten up by :)  I still can't get the image of Hiver Chan out of my<BR>
>head...<BR>
<BR>
I'd step into the ring with one! :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 01:53:05 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
James Lindsay wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>All I was saying was that what we perceive as "awkward" might be perfectly<BR>
>natural for a Hiver.  After all, it is his/her/its body we're talking about<BR>
>and who else would know what is awkward for a Hiver?<BR>
<BR>
Since we don't have any Hivers at arm's length, and they probably don't<BR>
exist, we can't really ask one how awkward they may be.<BR>
<BR>
> We can't bend our elbows backwards but that little "drawback" doesn't even<BR>
>enter into our minds as an awkward limitation to our bipedal construction.<BR>
>We simply work around the limitations of our bodies.<BR>
<BR>
That's because the fact that we can't bend our elbows backwards isn't always<BR>
a drawback. For example, this feature allows the arm to be snapped straight<BR>
for a punch, or to provide extra force for a downward swing.<BR>
<BR>
>The same would be true for Hivers.<BR>
<BR>
I have no reason to believe so.<BR>
<BR>
>> For small pistol-type weapons, I can imagine this would be useful. Longer<BR>
>> firearms would be awkward, unless balanced in some way. This could be<BR>
>> difficult, as any balance I can think of would, out of necessity, screw<BR>
with<BR>
>> the eyes.<BR>
><BR>
>According to the artwork in AM:7, pistols are ball-shaped weapons easily<BR>
>grasped in one "hand".  Hiver rifles are longer, with the same ball-shaped<BR>
>"grip" located near the center of the weapon's mass center.  The "stock" of<BR>
>the weapon appears to be braced by the "arm" of the "hand" holding the<BR>
>weapon by wrapping around it to some degree.  In all cases, the artwork in<BR>
>AM:7 show the weapons being wielded in the same "hand" that contains the<BR>
>eyes of the Hiver.<BR>
<BR>
In that case, Hiver rifles do interfere with the eyes, since the eyes are<BR>
placed between the fingers. Anything placed between two fingers would<BR>
naturally preclude the use of that eye. Then we're back to square one with<BR>
Hiver rifles: the Hiver has to turn to face the target.<BR>
<BR>
I'm familiar with the configuration of the pistols.<BR>
<BR>
>The only melee weapon to appear in AM:7 is a Hiver "Finger Dagger".  Alas,<BR>
>there is no artwork that shows one being used by a Hiver.  The write-up<BR>
>specifically states that Hivers prefer pistols to knives, and rifles to<BR>
>pistols.  The weapons exist, so the Hiver culture must use them at some<BR>
>point.  "Although Hivers dislike violence, they realize it is sometimes<BR>
>necessary."<BR>
<BR>
"In their own minds, many Hivers feel that they can handle fighting - they<BR>
learn to use guns; they study strategy and tactics; they even train for<BR>
close combat.<BR>
<BR>
"[Like your aunties train for tea parties]<BR>
<BR>
"But in the final analysis, they always seem to break, unable to respond<BR>
with the violence that would carry them to a victory at close combat unless<BR>
they are in a true survival situation. It is fortunate for the Hivers that<BR>
modern warfare is carried out at long ranges."<BR>
<BR>
"Aliens of the Rim: Hivers and Ithklur". Bracketed text is added by the<BR>
Ithklur Blissful Warrior. I would tend to believe that the Hiver weapons are<BR>
used for such purposes, and for last ditch defense when escape is no longer<BR>
possible.<BR>
<BR>
I also point to earlier materials (several, "Library Data: (A-M)" and MT's<BR>
"Imperial Encyclopedia" which point out that the Hivers "came late to the<BR>
concept of war".<BR>
<BR>
>With all due respect, a Hiver is *not* a brick wall.  They don't mass that<BR>
>much more than an average humanoid-- tipping the scales at 150 kg.  Bone is<BR>
>tough, not brittle.  Bone material can bend, bricks cannot.<BR>
<BR>
Bone material can bend, but even it has a breaking point. Humans can<BR>
withstand relatively impressive impacts because they are *flexible*, which<BR>
is what I was trying to illustrate by the use of the brick wall. The fused<BR>
carapace of the Hiver's central bulk is solid, hence not as flexible. We're<BR>
talking about an eggshell here, a really thick eggshell, but and eggshell<BR>
nonetheless.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 02:07:23 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Various Stuff<BR>
<BR>
Katharine Whitchurch wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> OK, first things first. The Famile Spofulam Light Sabre.<BR>
><BR>
> I have been doing some thinking on this one, and I think the way to go is to<BR>
> take the existing Barbie-scale Particle Carbine, modify it for rapid fire,<BR>
> and then multiplex 16 of the little buggers into a handle. This should give<BR>
> us about 5 shots per second, which will provide a decent approximation of a<BR>
> continuous beam (His Jadeness will not be testing it). We probably arent<BR>
> bending the rules too far by allowing them to all one one accumulator bank.<BR>
<BR>
The only way it will appear to be a continuous beam is if<BR>
the brightness stuns the retinae's (whatever the proper<BR>
language is for that - "flaring"?).  5 impressions per second<BR>
is really, really slow for human eyes.  30 is pretty smooth.<BR>
60 is good and it will appear solid.  100+ and you will<BR>
have difficulty detecting anything but seemless continuity.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 21:16:28 -0400<BR>
From: "Chauncey Smith" <csmith@ICDC.com><BR>
Subject: Re: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: Friday, April 28, 2000 1:52 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Luther Martin wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> LKW wrote:<BR>
>><BR>
>> >  The e-mails which I have received make it clear that I should<BR>
>> > have described<BR>
>> >  what Aide de Camp is in more detail. >><BR>
>> ><BR>
>> > Does Marc know you are doing this?<BR>
>><BR>
>> Is the issue copyright infringements? According to HPS Simulations (the<BR>
>> creators of ADC2), creating an ADC2 copy of a game for personal use is<BR>
not<BR>
>> an infringement, nor is playing the game using ADC2, as long as at least<BR>
one<BR>
>> player owns a copy of the game.<BR>
><BR>
>    Let me tack on a bit more information here...ADC lets you recreate maps<BR>
and<BR>
>counters, but it doesn't include the game's =rules=.  It's basically a<BR>
program<BR>
>that allows for two main things:<BR>
><BR>
>1) PBEM games,<BR>
>2) Solo games without having to take up the dining table.<BR>
><BR>
>    You =can't= play a game via ADC unless you know the rules, and there<BR>
are<BR>
>very few wargames I've seen where you can know the rules without having a<BR>
>reference copy handy.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
I have a stupid question here.<BR>
what happens when some one packages an ADC game with the rules in a zip<BR>
file?<BR>
does that become copy right infringe ment? and where do we get a copy of<BR>
this program I'm beginning to get idea about play by e-mail clan wars<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:37:38 -0700<BR>
From: Evyn MacDude <wmacdude@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 02:37 AM 4/28/2000 +0200, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> >> How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published<BR>
> >> centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Well, since Mr Miller has his rules for Traveller art, the centerfolds would<BR>
> >have to be ships.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >I am sure that TMLers of all ages would still drool over the pictures,<BR>
> though.<BR>
><BR>
> Wow!  Look the size of those turrets!<BR>
<BR>
Damn..... Look at the size of those thrusters.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Evyn...<BR>
<BR>
C-Space home http://home.att.net/~wmacdude/<BR>
<BR>
Get six jolly cowboys to carry my coffin<BR>
Get six pretty maidens to bear up my pall<BR>
Bunches of roses all over my coffin<BR>
Roses to deaden the clods as they fall<BR>
 Laredo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 17:13:17 +1000<BR>
From: "The Roc" <roc@kewl.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Bloody lucky for my keyboard...<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Mark Urbin <urbin@bigfoot.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2000 4:02 AM<BR>
Subject: Bloody lucky for my keyboard...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> that my coffee cup was empty...<BR>
><BR>
> >  Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net><BR>
> >Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
> >Howdy!<BR>
> >The subject line caused an involuntary thought to pop to mind...<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Consider the Dread Penguin Roberts...<BR>
><BR>
> One of a long line of Dread Penguin Roberts...<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Arrrrrrgh!  Please don't do this to that movie!  D'oh!  I can already see<BR>
the prince tracking a penguin across a cloudy sky!  No!  No!  Iocane poison<BR>
is only available from... penguins!!!!  You Bastards!!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2371<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2372</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 29 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2372<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
Re: First Traveller Game<BR>
Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Re increased radiation surface<BR>
Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re : Gearhead Question: Feasibility of LHyd as Fuel for IC Engines<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
re: Princess Bride quotes<BR>
re: SolSec and Canon<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: Various Stuff<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Various Stuff<BR>
TML Landgrab - Techie questions<BR>
Re: LKW on ADC<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:20:31 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: CT Health Hazard (was Re: Opinions Sought)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> Weight, yeah. Blood pressuure increaese? Nope. Memory loss? Hah! I do<BR>
>> most of my replies based on rules background without even needing to<BR>
>> pick up the books!<BR>
><BR>
> If you experienced no memory loss, you would have *accurate* replies based<BR>
> on rules background. (Smiley face icon omitted, but intended.)<BR>
<BR>
So what's your point? :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:35:33 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: First Traveller Game<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> ROFLOL!<BR>
><BR>
> Anyone ever try to convert Gilligan to CT then use him as an NPC on<BR>
> unsuspecting Players?<BR>
<BR>
Just convert the whole bunch and strand them on some habitable planet<BR>
someplace. One that get's lots of "drop in" vistors, but none that<BR>
stay. And for some reason they either never report the castaways, or<BR>
aren't believed when they do.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:32:22 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 04:38 PM 4/27/2000 PST, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>> This might also violate the laws against slavery.<BR>
>><BR>
>>Only if prison sentences do. Check out the wording in the relevant<BR>
>>amendment to the US Consitution. They *had* to include a clause "except<BR>
>>as punishment for a crime" or else they'd have been banning jailing<BR>
>>someone. <BR>
><BR>
> Except rather than just confining someone for punishmentm, you are forcing<BR>
> them to work in a very hazardous job, a job from which they cannot seek any<BR>
> relief.<BR>
<BR>
Chain gangs....<BR>
<BR>
> Remember, there were many people who thought that the peace-time draft<BR>
> violated the 13th and 14th Amendments.<BR>
<BR>
Well of course, the draftees hadn't been convicted of anything!<BR>
(only a half smiley there).<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:39:53 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> To quote Book 8 (see, I can do this too, now I have the BFB...)<BR>
> "Hiver Warbots: Hivers do not like close combat, and their excellent warbots<BR>
> have relieved them from this unpleasant duty. Some Hiver armies have<BR>
> consisted entirely of warbots, with no living members. Hiver warbots are of<BR>
> such qiuality that their import into the Imperium is illegal." - page 13<BR>
<BR>
"Ok, let's take a look at this Hiver "repair-bot" you want to import...<BR>
Hey! That's a laser!"<BR>
"Yessir! For welding and cutting work..."<BR>
"Well... ok. What's *this*?"<BR>
"Rivet gun..."<BR>
"A bit overpowered isn't it?"<BR>
"Superdense is hard to work."<BR>
"And what's this?"<BR>
"Plasma sprayer for applying refractory coatings..."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In other words, he's got a laser, gauss rifle, and plasma gun mounted<BR>
on this thing... :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 04:04:22 -0400<BR>
From: "Chauncey Smith" <csmith@ICDC.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
well Sam this is my take on things from things I've read and heard and it<BR>
may not really be true. CT came out and the first 3 lbb sat around with out<BR>
much support for about a year. then we get the supplements that we now call<BR>
classic traveller canon. My belief is that once this thing was created no<BR>
one really had a clue what to do with it.<BR>
and the imperium was born out of need for a place to tell stories. I believe<BR>
the leaning toward the criminal activity was because it's very easy to write<BR>
those from a gamemaster / story point of view. also remember at this time<BR>
alot of crawling around in dark tunnels was going on so there was no idea<BR>
how to write an RPG that didn't have that goal structure built in.<BR>
so get the money or video tapes was an easy thing to write.<BR>
by the time of MT. from something I've heard GDW was fed up with the simple<BR>
adventures and a way to write more complex stories was around. that being<BR>
the nugget format and matrix games.<BR>
so we see a lean away from published b&e's<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Samuel D. Weiss <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: Friday, April 28, 2000 11:18 PM<BR>
Subject: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Speaking of the Princess Bride, Wesley is the current Dread Pirate Roberts.<BR>
>He, like his predecessors, maintains his secret identity by the simple<BR>
>expedient of murdering everyone he encounters. At the end, he seems to pass<BR>
>the mantle along to Inigo Montoya. At no point does any of this seem  to<BR>
>have any downside or fallout. Princess Buttercup is outraged that the Dread<BR>
>pirate may have murdered her dear Wesley, but is only overjoyed that her<BR>
>dear Wesley is alive, utterly unconcerned about whoever he has gone about<BR>
>murdering merrily.<BR>
>What does this have to with Traveller?<BR>
>While going through 76 Patrons in preparation for another game, I took some<BR>
>time to consider the range of missions. More than half involve criminal<BR>
>activity of some sort. While a few are simple B&E or Trespass, they range<BR>
>quickly up through Industrial Espionage, interfering in local government,<BR>
>Revolution and finally Kidnapping, Contract Assassination and Terrorism.<BR>
>Quite a few Amber Zones from the CT days of JTAS are on the same level.<BR>
Even<BR>
>the fallout from some of the Adventures is mentioned as being the result of<BR>
>terrorists in the GT History updates.<BR>
>Am I just being overly sensitive or was there a very distinct lean towards<BR>
>players making their fortunes through outright illegal activity in the CT<BR>
>days? Is that why A8 - Prison Planet was needed?<BR>
>They definitely mellowed as MT came around, especially with Charles Gannon<BR>
>and the Bad Karma rule for Star Mercs in Hard Times.<BR>
>I skipped TNE, but T4 seemed to have a slight subcurrent of the illegal<BR>
>becoming ascendant.<BR>
>Where does GT sit?<BR>
>And where are individual GMs? Do you run Saviors of the Imperium or It's<BR>
>Money, Hand it to Me?<BR>
><BR>
>Sam<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 19:31:08 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Re increased radiation surface<BR>
<BR>
Query...<BR>
    How much heat would be lost via drive plasma?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 19:35:29 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Dread Penguin<BR>
<BR>
thanks<BR>
<BR>
rob<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Pete wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:30:37 +1000, Robert Houghton<BR>
> <rhoughto@one.net.au> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> >Greetings...<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Lordy, lordy...anyone else with Princess Bride References?<BR>
> ><BR>
> >How 'bout "Solomani never bluff when death is involved..." (sorry if the<BR>
> >quote is slightly off)<BR>
><BR>
> "Never go in against a Solomani when death is on the line! Ha ha ha!<BR>
> Ha ha ha! Ha ha ha! Ha ha ha!" [thump]<BR>
><BR>
> - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
> "Don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but rum, sodomy, and the<BR>
>  lash."                              - Winston Churchill<BR>
> Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
> NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 02:49:20 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Who's to say Niven's futuristic room-temperature superconductors AREN'T also<BR>
> superconductors of heat?  We certainly have no idea how to make them or what<BR>
> physical properties they might have beyond super-conductance.<BR>
<BR>
Alas, as I recall from the comments of professional scientists, the<BR>
properties required for the two types of "superconductivity" aren't<BR>
compatible.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 02:56:42 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>> I disagree. The octopus looks like it evolved to be quick in the<BR>
>>> water. It's never been surprising to me that it is.<BR>
>><BR>
>> Are you sure you are not basing this opinion on knowledge you gained<BR>
>> *after* you saw footage of an octopus jetting away at high speed?<BR>
><BR>
> Positive. If I had intended otherwise, I would have said something<BR>
> like, "I was surprised when I first saw an octopus jet away at<BR>
> high-speed on TV." :)<BR>
><BR>
>> I would think that most people-- after seeing an octopus in an<BR>
>> aquarium, etc. for the first time-- wouldn't come to this<BR>
>> conclusion. I didn't, but I was only six.<BR>
><BR>
> It's not usually a good idea to assume things like this, unless<BR>
> you're sure that this is the case. The first octopus picture I ever<BR>
> saw was the one of the variety with the pointy head. Terribly<BR>
> unscientific, I know. :) Still, it was a long time ago.<BR>
<BR>
If it's got a "pointy head", it's a *squid*, not an octopus.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:10:59 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
At 19:38 -0400 28/4/00, "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net> wrote:<BR>
>I would be happy to go into further detail off-line but there is a limit to<BR>
>what I can say about how the system is set-up (even now, 5 years after my<BR>
>final debriefing) so please don't be too specific.<BR>
><BR>
>Sorry for the band width.....<BR>
<BR>
Delta Green (the RPG supplement for CoC) is set in modern day and has <BR>
a lot on this - seems to concur with what you describe so it may be <BR>
worth the first respondent checking it out.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 07:49:11 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
> Am I just being overly sensitive or was there a very distinct lean towards<BR>
> players making their fortunes through outright illegal activity in the CT<BR>
> days? Is that why A8 - Prison Planet was needed?<BR>
<BR>
<mouthpiece value="high"><BR>
Illegal?  There is no controlling, legal authority!  Besides, no intent to<BR>
break the laws of any jurisdiction can be shown.  And don't get on your high<BR>
moral horse with me.  There is no valid argument possible with the infinite<BR>
cultural differences in the universe.  It's not our fault, anyway, because<BR>
our highest authorities recognize murder as a valid way to establish<BR>
governing power in the first place!  Just you remember that it is only<BR>
against the law if you get convicted of a crime.  Wealth and power greatly<BR>
reduce the likelihood of wrongdoing, obviously, since so few in that class<BR>
are ever convicted of a crime, no matter how they obtained their money or<BR>
power.<BR>
</mouthpiece><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
One of the earliest scenarios I ran as a Ref had the characters, as members<BR>
of the Special Corps, chasing a rather slippery criminal across known space.<BR>
They were so entertained by the antics and escapes of the criminal that they<BR>
were actually sad when they finally cornered him :-)<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 07:59:53 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Chauncey Smith" <csmith@ICDC.com><BR>
> well Sam this is my take on things from things I've read and heard and it<BR>
> may not really be true. CT came out and the first 3 lbb sat around with<BR>
out<BR>
> much support for about a year. then we get the supplements that we now<BR>
call<BR>
> classic traveller canon. My belief is that once this thing was created no<BR>
> one really had a clue what to do with it.<BR>
<BR>
Gol durn whippersnappers of the video game age!  Didn't know what to do with<BR>
it!?  <growl, spit, sound of popping veins>  We played weekly from 1978 thru<BR>
1981 without ever using the so-called official canon background.  Canon was<BR>
silly and terribly thin and, yes, UNIMAGINATIVE as far as I was concerned.<BR>
Excuse me while I go take my blood pressure medicine.<BR>
<BR>
- -Crusty<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 22:02:46 +1000<BR>
From: "Robert O'Connor" <robocon@ozemail.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re : Gearhead Question: Feasibility of LHyd as Fuel for IC Engines<BR>
<BR>
John Groth (Black Ice) wrote :-<BR>
> While working out a few details on my TML Landgrab project (Leander), I<BR>
> realized that a world of 800 sophonts could not easily provide<BR>
> distilled hydrocarbon fuel for TL5 IC engines.<BR>
If the planet has deposits of oil/coal/gas, they could if they ran an<BR>
appropriate rig/well, refinery and pharmaceutical plant.<BR>
The main export could be complex organic chemicals and drugs (natch) ;<BR>
everything else (food especially, unless they live on stuff grown in<BR>
oil sludge?) is imported.<BR>
<BR>
> Would LHyd work as a fuel for IC engines (or other TL5 engines)?  What<BR>
> problems would this present?<BR>
<BR>
At TTL 5, options include :-<BR>
- - using fuel cells instead of IC (most expensive, as platinum coated<BR>
catalytic membranes required, but most energy efficient) ;<BR>
- - using external combustion.<BR>
<BR>
The big problem is the low energy density of hydrogen<BR>
compared with other fuels :-<BR>
Type     MJ/kg MJ/L   density   Fuel Rate (L/MW-h, 10/20/50/100% eff)<BR>
Diesel    40    36     0.9       1000 / 500 / 200 / 100<BR>
Gasoline  43    35     0.8       1029 / 515 / 206 / 103<BR>
EtOH      27    21.3   0.8       1690 / 845 / 338 / 169<BR>
MeOH      19.7  15.6   0.8       2308 / 1154 / 462 / 231<BR>
Hydrogen* 1.6   0.14   0.0875    257143 / 128571 / 51429 / 25714<BR>
LH2       12    0.84   0.07      42857 / 21429 / 8571 / 4286<BR>
TiFeH     2     2      1.0       18000 / 9000 / 3600 / 1800<BR>
MgH       5     5      1.0       7200 / 3600 / 1440 / 720<BR>
<BR>
*hydrogen gas at one atmosphere and zero degrees C<BR>
LPG = liquid petroleum gas, EtOH = ethanol, MeOH = methanol, TiFeH =<BR>
titanium-iron hydride, MgH = magnesium hydride<BR>
<BR>
Gelling hydrogen with methane (25/75 methane/H2 by weight) increases<BR>
energy density by about 40% at double the density (mass/volume).<BR>
'Slush hydrogen' is similarly advantageous.<BR>
(The weight saving is in tankage, which no vehicle design system really<BR>
allows for, because it's difficult to model).<BR>
<BR>
As you can see metal hydrides are better storage solutions than LH2<BR>
(refrigeration gear and heavy tanks not required), but the energy<BR>
density is low.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor<BR>
Medico, Gamer<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:15:45 +0100<BR>
From: Martin Hardgrave <martin@deira.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
In message <B52E41AE.106A7%webmaster@travellercentral.com>, Tod Glenn<BR>
<webmaster@travellercentral.com> writes<BR>
>In a very early traveller game I ran (late 70's, before any detailed rules)<BR>
>ships used thermal buffers to absorb the heat generated.  These buffers were<BR>
>merely that fuel cells frozen into solid water.  A ship's combat manuvering<BR>
>was limited by its ability to store waste heat before the crew baked.  A<BR>
>captain has two options:  Vent steam, and quickly eliminate stored heat, but<BR>
>reduce fuel, or deploy deploy his radiator--huge sail like radiating<BR>
>surfaces trailed behind the ship while cruising.<BR>
<BR>
A BOTE calculation would suggest that fuel stored as water (ice) at -250<BR>
C used as a heat sink would absorb about 500 MJ per tonne to make water<BR>
at 0 C, and ice at 0 C would absorb 330 MJ per tonne to make water at 0<BR>
C.  How big are those fuel tanks?<BR>
- -- <BR>
Martin Hardgrave<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 08:48:40 -0500<BR>
From: "D. Smart" <dsmart@imagin.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
Samuel D. Weiss posted:<BR>
> <BR>
> Am I just being overly sensitive or was there a very distinct lean towards<BR>
> players making their fortunes through outright illegal activity in the CT<BR>
> days? Is that why A8 - Prison Planet was needed?<BR>
> They definitely mellowed as MT came around, especially with Charles Gannon<BR>
> and the Bad Karma rule for Star Mercs in Hard Times.<BR>
> I skipped TNE, but T4 seemed to have a slight subcurrent of the illegal<BR>
> becoming ascendant.<BR>
> Where does GT sit?<BR>
> And where are individual GMs? Do you run Saviors of the Imperium or It's<BR>
> Money, Hand it to Me?<BR>
> <BR>
> Sam<BR>
<BR>
Oh, excellent questions, Sam! Seriously.<BR>
<BR>
You're not overly sensitive. I noticed the same thing as I<BR>
played the<BR>
various adventures when each was published.<BR>
<BR>
As a GM, I try to run a fairly realistic campaign and,<BR>
therefore, give my<BR>
players full rein to do anything they want to. The breaking<BR>
of local laws<BR>
at will derives from the sci fi/heroic tales most of us have<BR>
read:  Dumarest,<BR>
Lensmen, Retief, etc. One could even throw Conan into the<BR>
mix (he *is* heroic).<BR>
<BR>
However...<BR>
<BR>
A fairly realistic campaign also includes _consequences_<BR>
associated with the<BR>
PCs' actions. One group once decided to drive a groundcar<BR>
through a shopping<BR>
mall to kill the bad guy they were after. Lots of fun for<BR>
about 2 hours real<BR>
time running the combat, smashing through stores, etc. but<BR>
in the end they<BR>
died. Shot by members of the local-equivalent of a SWAT<BR>
team. And I made sure<BR>
the SWAT team was run realistically.<BR>
<BR>
Did they have fun? Sure!  Did they suffer the consequences<BR>
of their actions?<BR>
You bet.<BR>
<BR>
David<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 11:40:47 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Princess Bride quotes<BR>
<BR>
At 23:17 -0400 28/4/00, "MJ Dougherty" <martinjd@globalnet.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
>... to the Imperial Court:<BR>
>"I've got my brother's murder to plan, a guard to frame for it... I'm<BR>
>swamped!"<BR>
>Great movie.... Great book, too.<BR>
<BR>
I agree - the book is better than the film though - the ending is a <BR>
little different too.<BR>
<BR>
Music isn't too bad either...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 11:49:24 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: SolSec and Canon<BR>
<BR>
At 3:02 -0400 29/4/00, SolSec <section9@solsec.org> wrote:<BR>
>I am looking for Traveller SolSec references for the SolSec Website.  Any<BR>
>published sources besides the Solomani supplement?<BR>
<BR>
Signal GK (Adventure 12 or 13)<BR>
Solomani and Aslan<BR>
The Alien module for CT<BR>
<BR>
MTJ and Traveller's Digest.<BR>
Passing references to the expansion of the Confederation in various MT books.<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:00:31 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:26:47 -0400, Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
<jzeitlin@cyburban.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 19:38:01 -0400 (EDT), Jason Postma<BR>
><JasonP@i-link.net> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>What the theory does is redifine what "human" means to allow other species<BR>
>>to be included in the definition, not redifine "alien."<BR>
><BR>
>I'm not sure I would have expressed it that way, but it's not<BR>
>inaccurate.<BR>
><BR>
>>The reason for presenting the theory in the novel is to help the characters<BR>
>>make the correct moral decisions.<BR>
><BR>
>>Ender killed the Buggers and was thought of as a hero when it was thought<BR>
>>they were varelse.  No one missed something that they couldn't relate to.<BR>
>>When the Speaker of the Dead (also Ender) re-defined the Buggers as raman,<BR>
>>Ender was seen as a war criminal - the only human guilty of xenocide -<BR>
>>because peaceful relations had been a possibilty.<BR>
><BR>
>This I'm not clear on - was the change in perception of Ender<BR>
>Wiggen to Ender the Xenocide a _result_ of the publication of<BR>
>_The_Hive_Queen_and_The_Hegemon_ - that is, by Ender's Speaking<BR>
>for both the Hive Queen and his (Ender's) brother, or did<BR>
>perceptions change first - to the best of my recollection, Card<BR>
>wasn't quite clear on that. (N.B. Certainly, Ender's perception<BR>
>of _himself_ predates the publication, otherwise he would never<BR>
>have started Speaking, much less Speaking for the Hive Queen. The<BR>
>question is applied to the human society at large.)<BR>
<BR>
Perceptions changed *after* Ender published the book. Nobody (except<BR>
his sister) knew the whole story until he told it.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"An organization is like a tree full of monkeys,  all on different levels. The <BR>
monkeys on the top look down and all they see are smiling faces, the monkeys <BR>
on the bottom look up and see nothing but assholes."<BR>
                                     - Unknown (If you know, tell me.)<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 09:15:56 -0500<BR>
From: "Pat Connaughton" <pconn@i1.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Various Stuff<BR>
<BR>
Hello the 'List.<BR>
Last evening we were having a discussion in<BR>
re: tactical weapons for Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
We came up with a very simple concept and<BR>
I was hpoing that one of the wise person(s) on this<BR>
list would be able to guide me in working out<BR>
the specifics of this.<BR>
<BR>
I've not been a very "gearheaded" soul up to now,<BR>
however it does seem to have some attraction.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks<BR>
Pat Connaughton <BR>
ICQ # 2535086<BR>
pconn@i1.net<BR>
"He who knows not how to dissemble knows not<BR>
how to reign"<BR>
Tiberius, Emperator and Princips of Rome<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:17:24 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000 23:12:17 -0400, "Samuel D. Weiss"<BR>
<samwise1@email.msn.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>What does this have to with Traveller?<BR>
>While going through 76 Patrons in preparation for another game, I took some<BR>
>time to consider the range of missions. More than half involve criminal<BR>
>activity of some sort. While a few are simple B&E or Trespass, they range<BR>
>quickly up through Industrial Espionage, interfering in local government,<BR>
>Revolution and finally Kidnapping, Contract Assassination and Terrorism.<BR>
>Quite a few Amber Zones from the CT days of JTAS are on the same level. Even<BR>
>the fallout from some of the Adventures is mentioned as being the result of<BR>
>terrorists in the GT History updates.<BR>
>Am I just being overly sensitive or was there a very distinct lean towards<BR>
>players making their fortunes through outright illegal activity in the CT<BR>
>days? Is that why A8 - Prison Planet was needed?<BR>
<snip><BR>
>Where does GT sit?<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
The sidebar an page 12 of GT pretty much says the same thing you said.<BR>
My take on this is because most players don't do that sort of thing in<BR>
real life. How fun is it to roleplay yourself in your everyday life?<BR>
When I play RPGs I want do something different.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"An organization is like a tree full of monkeys,  all on different levels. The <BR>
monkeys on the top look down and all they see are smiling faces, the monkeys <BR>
on the bottom look up and see nothing but assholes."<BR>
                                     - Unknown (If you know, tell me.)<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:19:06 GMT<BR>
From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
Subject: Re: Various Stuff<BR>
<BR>
On Sat, 29 Apr 2000 09:15:56 -0500, "Pat Connaughton" <pconn@i1.net><BR>
wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Hello the 'List.<BR>
>Last evening we were having a discussion in<BR>
>re: tactical weapons for Traveller.<BR>
><BR>
>We came up with a very simple concept and<BR>
>I was hpoing that one of the wise person(s) on this<BR>
>list would be able to guide me in working out<BR>
>the specifics of this.<BR>
><BR>
>I've not been a very "gearheaded" soul up to now,<BR>
>however it does seem to have some attraction.<BR>
<BR>
Ok. What's the concept?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"An organization is like a tree full of monkeys,  all on different levels. The <BR>
monkeys on the top look down and all they see are smiling faces, the monkeys <BR>
on the bottom look up and see nothing but assholes."<BR>
                                     - Unknown (If you know, tell me.)<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 02:21:52 +1200<BR>
From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" <a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz><BR>
Subject: TML Landgrab - Techie questions<BR>
<BR>
Sitting here working on my writeup of Ficant and reading John's question, I <BR>
was struck by a similar problem. I've set Ficant at an early evolutionary <BR>
stage (roughly equivalent to the Carboniferous period). Now this probably <BR>
means no deposits of hydrocarbons? So I was assuming that they use <BR>
alcohol distilled from local plants instead. Will this work, and is alcohol (I'm <BR>
thinking methanol/ethanol) an inferior fuel to normal petrol/diesel? (I've <BR>
assumed it is).<BR>
<BR>
Also on Ficant, does anybody know where the name comes from? I've <BR>
assumed initial colonisation by the Sword Worlds. Does the name fit?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 11:23:18 EDT<BR>
From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: LKW on ADC<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/28/00 8:19:01 PM Pacific Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
>  Subject: Re: LKW on ADC<BR>
>  <BR>
>  In a message dated 00-04-28 13:51:33 EDT, you write:<BR>
>  <BR>
>  << Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:22:50 -0700<BR>
>   From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
>   Subject: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
>   <BR>
>   LKW wrote:<BR>
>   <BR>
>   >  The e-mails which I have received make it clear that I should<BR>
>   > have described<BR>
>   >  what Aide de Camp is in more detail. >><BR>
>   ><BR>
>   > Does Marc know you are doing this?<BR>
>   <BR>
>   Is the issue copyright infringements? According to HPS Simulations (the<BR>
>   creators of ADC2), creating an ADC2 copy of a game for personal use is not<BR>
>   an infringement, nor is playing the game using ADC2, as long as at least <BR>
one<BR>
>   player owns a copy of the game.  >><BR>
>  <BR>
>  I still suggest you clear it with Marc, though. <BR>
>  <BR>
>  LKW<BR>
  <BR>
From what I know it should be okay as I know Marc would be interested in the <BR>
files as part of the Traveller CD project (the only problem would be if he <BR>
distributes the files to others, so yeah a check in that regards might be <BR>
involved).<BR>
<BR>
Bryan<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2372<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2373</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 29 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2373<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
Re: LKW on ADC<BR>
Re: Anti-laser coatings<BR>
Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
TML Landgrab Question<BR>
Re: Keith Supplements - Last Call!<BR>
Re: Design Question...<BR>
Re: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
The Art of War - Hiver Style (was Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater)<BR>
Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Re: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
Re: Various Stuff<BR>
Hoody-hoo!<BR>
Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
RE: Traveller Centerfolds (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2362)<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
Virtual Reality<BR>
RE: Airborne<BR>
Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 07:28:37<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
At 08:34 PM 4/28/2000 -0700, James W. Lindsay wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I'm up for creating a short Alien Combat supplement for ACQ.  How 'bout<BR>
>you, Doug?<BR>
<BR>
At the moment, and for the forseeable future, I'm way too busy with Ground<BR>
Forces.<BR>
<BR>
But I'd love to do an ACQ Companion, with alien rules, optionals, more<BR>
weapons and extended rules for PenguinBlitz.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 07:31:31<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
At 11:37 PM 4/28/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> Wow!  Look the size of those turrets!<BR>
><BR>
>Damn..... Look at the size of those thrusters.<BR>
<BR>
Suffering from thruster envy, Evyn?  :)<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 07:41:13<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
At 04:32 PM 4/28/2000 PST, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> Except rather than just confining someone for punishmentm, you are forcing<BR>
>> them to work in a very hazardous job, a job from which they cannot seek <BR>
>> any relief.<BR>
><BR>
>Chain gangs....<BR>
<BR>
Which normally do things like road maintenance or field clearing.  I pass<BR>
inmates from the SF jail cleaning gutters everyday.  That doesn't come<BR>
close to being forced to attack heavily defended points with inadequate<BR>
weaponry.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not completely against the idea, if you use it as a voluntary thing.<BR>
<BR>
"Smitty, you are going to be brain wiped next Senday, and parted out.  You<BR>
can do that, or you can listen to the offer Colonel Sherman is about to<BR>
make..."<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
There was once a time when the church controlled the government.<BR>
The laws of the church were the laws of the land. Belief in God <BR>
was strong, teachings of the church were rarely questioned.<BR>
This time was called The Dark Ages.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 08:43:17<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: LKW on ADC<BR>
<BR>
At 11:23 AM 4/29/2000 EDT, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>From what I know it should be okay as I know Marc would be interested in the <BR>
>files as part of the Traveller CD project (the only problem would be if he <BR>
>distributes the files to others, so yeah a check in that regards might be <BR>
>involved).<BR>
<BR>
I think the implication is that Marc had better be asked *now*, before any<BR>
work is done.  I imagine after the IG debacle he is very serious about<BR>
protecting his rights.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 08:48:16 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Anti-laser coatings<BR>
<BR>
>Sure, but Niven & Pournelle speculated on a thermal superconductor, not<BR>
>electrical.<BR>
>The novel was after all science fiction. :)<BR>
<BR>
The first time Niven used the idea (in "The Ringworld Engineers", I believe)<BR>
he certainly had an electrical superconductor in mind - it was electrically<BR>
superconducting<BR>
wire/fabric intended as trade goods.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 08:49:19 -0700 (MST)<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU><BR>
Subject: Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000, Thom Harris wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Lots of Interrogators (just as an example) were of foreign extraction<BR>
> (native speakers) and classed into two categories:<BR>
> 1) Native Born, U.S. citizen (Spoke the language at home with family<BR>
> members.)<BR>
> 2) Foreign Born, U.S. citizen (English as a second language)<BR>
> <BR>
> Category 1 were eligible for clearances of the highest order (Special<BR>
> Background Investigation required, [SBI]) and were given access on a need to<BR>
> know basis. (Top Secret, blah, blah, blah)<BR>
> <BR>
> Category 2 could only be cleared for *UP TO* "Top Secret" with no further<BR>
> access available, period. There were a few exceptions to this "foreign born"<BR>
> rule (anybody remember Henry Kissinger?) but it was and is *EXTREMELY* rare.<BR>
> <BR>
> (Another one was the last Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General<BR>
> ???????????????, can't remember his name but he was born in Poland.)<BR>
<BR>
And there's Madeline Albright, current SoS. She was born in the Balkans,<BR>
IIRC.<BR>
<BR>
What happens when you get agencies like NATO thrown into the mix? Or<BR>
tactical alliances like the Coalition during Desert Storm?<BR>
<BR>
Obviously, there is a need for rapid, deep access to Intel from a variety<BR>
of sources, do they 'firewall' off the different agencies or what?<BR>
<BR>
(If, of course, you don't have to shoot me after telling me ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Of course, this doesn't happen in the 3I, since the 3I doesn't _have_<BR>
allies...<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 11:46:05 -0400<BR>
From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
Subject: TML Landgrab Question<BR>
<BR>
Greetings All TML'ers!<BR>
<BR>
    The Land Grab got me fired up about stuff I was writing on Glisten in<BR>
the Spinward Marches. I have been creating characters, companies,<BR>
organizations, bases, shipyards, maps (lots of maps & floor plans),<BR>
bordello's, government bldg's, gyms, bars, etc., etc..... What I am looking<BR>
for is simply a list of all books, magazines, ezines, web sites or any other<BR>
published articles/info (canon or not) that mention Glisten. I have a bunch<BR>
of the magazines and books but if I knew specifically which ones had Glisten<BR>
data it would save me an immeasurable amount of time and you would receive<BR>
my undying gratitude (as if that means anything to anyone, ha ha ha).<BR>
<BR>
Thanks in advance....<BR>
<BR>
Thom<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 10:54:49 -0500<BR>
From: Terry Mixon <tmixon@ghg.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Keith Supplements - Last Call!<BR>
<BR>
"J. Paul Sanders" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> 5...4... 3...  - yes folks - 3 sets left. If you want to reserve one, do it<BR>
> while you can! Details at:<BR>
> <http://www.primenet.com/~timmon/supplements.html>www.primenet.com/~timmon/s<BR>
> upplements.html<BR>
<BR>
Are they all gone?<BR>
<BR>
Terry<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 09:25:43 -0700 (MST)<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU><BR>
Subject: Re: Design Question...<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 28 Apr 2000, Veskrashen wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> First of all, I want to thank all of you for updating me on The<BR>
> Traveller Situation. Next, I would appreciate your comments on the<BR>
> following designs:<BR>
> <BR>
> I wanted to build a set of lower-end paramilitary weapons for use at<BR>
> about TL10 (T4). My reasoning is that it would be easy to manufacture,<BR>
> and would therefore be more widely available. I chose caseless rounds<BR>
> because they were lighter and cheaper. Most importantly, I wanted to<BR>
> make use of the barrel length modifier to increase performance as much<BR>
> as was reasonable.<BR>
<BR>
snip <BR>
<BR>
> This one seemed a bit off. The receiver looks way too long; can't<BR>
> remember any pistol where the receiver extended 7" past the rear of the<BR>
> barrel. Of course, on most pistols the receiver is sort of wrapped<BR>
> around the barrel... anyone have an idea on how to incorporate that into<BR>
> the design sequence? Perhaps for grip magazine fed weapons only?<BR>
 <BR>
Hmmm...you didn't say which design system you are using, but given the T4<BR>
reference I'll guess it's FFS2. Still, this problem applies no matter<BR>
which of the many design systems are used (I can't speak for GURPS since I<BR>
don't have that supplement yet). None of them model pistols all that well,<BR>
poarticularly semiauto pistols. The recievers seem to come out too long<BR>
and too heavy. <BR>
<BR>
The reason in FFS2, of course is that bit about the length<BR>
of a reciever being 150 mm + length of the cartrige. FFS made a<BR>
distinction between Box magzines and Grip magazines that FFS2 does not,<BR>
indeed the example in FFS2 describes a conventional pistol grip magazine<BR>
as a box magazine, subject to the 150mm rule. FFS was unclear on the<BR>
subject, which is why (iirc) it was clarified in FFS2.<BR>
<BR>
Under FFS2 rules it's impossible to accurately model most small<BR>
semi-autos. (the entire length of a Browning .25 Pocket model is less than<BR>
150 mm, yet by FFS rules it would have to considerably longer, as the<BR>
reciever alone is larger than that size)<BR>
<BR>
I think a reasonable modification is to halve the necessary length of a<BR>
 pistol grip magazine to 75 mm + cartridge length, (or double or triple<BR>
the cartidge length, which is more reasonable imo), on the theory that in<BR>
box magazine fed rifles and submachineguns the entire receiver movement is<BR>
contained within the length of the weapon frame, whereas in a pistol,<BR>
the reciever freely moves past the end of the frame.<BR>
<BR>
Trying to devise rules to model the co-location of reciever and barrel is<BR>
beyond the scope of these books, then we might just as well publish<BR>
gunsmithing books.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 12:31:51 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
<BR>
Chauncey Smith wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I have a stupid question here.<BR>
> what happens when some one packages an ADC game with the rules in a zip<BR>
> file?<BR>
> does that become copy right infringe ment?<BR>
<BR>
Yup.<BR>
<BR>
> and where do we get a copy of<BR>
> this program I'm beginning to get idea about play by e-mail clan wars<BR>
<BR>
Got US$60?  You'll need it:<BR>
http://www.hpssims.com/adc2.htm<BR>
<BR>
You might also take a look at V_Map.<BR>
http://zircher.iwarp.com/v_map.html<BR>
<BR>
Or the Strategic Map Simulator<BR>
http://www.flyingzebra.com/sms/index.htm<BR>
<BR>
I haven't time to try all of these out, but I have tried the<BR>
ADC demo.  While it has a 'professional' appearance,<BR>
I found it over-engineered and the interface weak.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 13:32:51 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: The Art of War - Hiver Style (was Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater)<BR>
<BR>
At 11:03 AM 4/28/00, you wrote:<BR>
>With reference to the "Hiver Handstand" perhaps the hiver posing for the <BR>
>pic was<BR>
>the hiver Nadia Comanechi...I can't stand on one hand but I know people who<BR>
>can...maybe the Hiver is a trained gymnist.<BR>
><BR>
>As for the weapons...the turret mount on the caraprace seems logical...I <BR>
>remember<BR>
>a picture from a SFRPG called (i think) "Battlelords of the 30th Century" a<BR>
>quadrepedal "Big Cat" race with a targeting monocle and tracking mount on it's<BR>
>back (like an Apache IHADDS helmet.<BR>
><BR>
>Rob Houghton<BR>
<BR>
         However, given the Hiver love of robots for warfare, perhaps the <BR>
turret is a target designator...  his platoon of robots "pig-pens" whatever <BR>
he designates....  Talk about suppression fire...<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 12:38:49 -0400<BR>
From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Bruce Johnson" <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2000 11:49 AM<BR>
Subject: Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> On Fri, 28 Apr 2000, Thom Harris wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> > Category 1 were eligible for clearances of the highest order (Special<BR>
> > Background Investigation required, [SBI]) and were given access on a<BR>
need to<BR>
> > know basis. (Top Secret, blah, blah, blah)<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Category 2 could only be cleared for *UP TO* "Top Secret" with no<BR>
further<BR>
> > access available, period. There were a few exceptions to this "foreign<BR>
born"<BR>
> > rule (anybody remember Henry Kissinger?) but it was and is *EXTREMELY*<BR>
rare.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > (Another one was the last Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General<BR>
> > ???????????????, can't remember his name but he was born in Poland.)<BR>
><BR>
> And there's Madeline Albright, current SoS. She was born in the Balkans,<BR>
> IIRC.<BR>
><BR>
> What happens when you get agencies like NATO thrown into the mix? Or<BR>
> tactical alliances like the Coalition during Desert Storm?<BR>
><BR>
> Obviously, there is a need for rapid, deep access to Intel from a variety<BR>
> of sources, do they 'firewall' off the different agencies or what?<BR>
><BR>
> Bruce Johnson<BR>
<BR>
What is *normally* done is all references of how the Intel was<BR>
gathered/processed is stripped away (sources, capabilities and methods are<BR>
what is being protected in the Intelligence world) and basically it becomes<BR>
"non-attribution" material at the straight Secret level. Another thing that<BR>
is done sometimes is, Intel is attributed to a known "collateral" source and<BR>
that protects the true sources, etc. When it is impossible to pass the Intel<BR>
without the enemy being able to figure out how it was done, then a decision<BR>
would be made by the Director, NSA (and/or a panel of senior Intel advisors)<BR>
as to whether or not the Intel asset could be compromised and the Info<BR>
passed anyway. This was not usually the case, as this type of situation was<BR>
decided in "real-time" and decisions had to be made in seconds, not hours.<BR>
<BR>
In Viet Nam the Intel produced by our organization was handled as if it were<BR>
"Behind The Green Door" and a lot of Intel that could help the lowly<BR>
Infantry squad/platoon/company/battalion (real time) was denied to them<BR>
because of security implications. The Intel had to go to the Division/Corps<BR>
G-2 to be implemented without a reason being given as to why. As you can<BR>
imagine this left a sour taste in the mouths of the grunts that were being<BR>
told to respond to some nebulous order when it was their lives that were at<BR>
stake. I can't give any details as examples here and like the poor grunts<BR>
you just have to "Trust Me" when I tell you this is the way it is. (Did you<BR>
like this last statement? That in itself is an example of how business was<BR>
done.)<BR>
<BR>
A case where the asset was given up would be the U2 photos of Cuba and the<BR>
Russian missile launch facilities. President Kennedy felt that it was more<BR>
important that the American people (and the rest of the world, to gain their<BR>
confidence in the US's stand) be shown the evidence than protect the<BR>
capability of the U2 spy plane. He gave up the asset and the Russians found<BR>
out how finite our photography was as well as how good our analysts were at<BR>
determining the equipment and layout of the sites from them.<BR>
<BR>
Another case would be President Carter showing the pictures from one of our<BR>
imaging satellites during the hostage crisis in 1980. He confirmed that we<BR>
were using spy satellites, the cover name of the project and even showed<BR>
some detailed photos recovered from the satellite on the evening news during<BR>
one of his press conferences.<BR>
<BR>
Hope this helps<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 13:46:11 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
At 02:36 PM 4/28/00, you wrote:<BR>
         [snip]<BR>
>To quote Book 8 (see, I can do this too, now I have the BFB...)<BR>
>"Hiver Warbots: Hivers do not like close combat, and their excellent warbots<BR>
>have relieved them from this unpleasant duty. Some Hiver armies have<BR>
>consisted entirely of warbots, with no living members. Hiver warbots are of<BR>
>such qiuality that their import into the Imperium is illegal." - page 13<BR>
><BR>
>Actually, I think that kinda sums up the whole 'Hivers in ground combat'<BR>
>situation.<BR>
><BR>
>Nick<BR>
<BR>
         "We don't fight with Hivers, because they're just replacing <BR>
equipment, even if we nuke 'em...  we're replacing *people*....<BR>
         "'Sides, what can you do against a platoon of infantryman sized <BR>
*tanks*..."<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 12:53:51 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson said:<BR>
<BR>
>If it's got a "pointy head", it's a *squid*, not an octopus.<BR>
<BR>
Sorry Leonard. That's simply not the case. There are indeed octopi with<BR>
pointy heads. A quick 30 second search on the web, for example, turned up<BR>
the Octopus macropus, as well as the "blue-ringed octopus" (Hapalochlaena<BR>
lunulata).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 12:05:20 -0500<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
<BR>
Chauncey Smith wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I have a stupid question here.<BR>
> what happens when some one packages an ADC game with the rules in a zip<BR>
> file?<BR>
> does that become copy right infringe ment? and where do we get a copy of<BR>
> this program I'm beginning to get idea about play by e-mail clan wars<BR>
<BR>
    Yes...on the part of the person who copied the rules.  But it's not<BR>
reasonable to ban something with a legitimate use just because someone might do<BR>
something illegal with it.<BR>
<BR>
    I'm not against getting Marc's permission, just pointing out information<BR>
that would be important to relay in any such request.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Stormhound<BR>
DNRC Ombudsman for Induhvidual Affairs, Holder of Past Knowledge<BR>
Come visit my web page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd<BR>
Or my new Amateur Radio web page at http://www.qsl.net/kc0ekv<BR>
Or my JN6 course design page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd/golfpage.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 11:56:56 -0500<BR>
From: Bolie Williams IV <bolie@io.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Various Stuff<BR>
<BR>
At 2:07 AM -0400 4/29/00, Steve Daniels wrote:<BR>
>Katharine Whitchurch wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>  OK, first things first. The Famile Spofulam Light Sabre.<BR>
>><BR>
>>  I have been doing some thinking on this one, and I think the way to go is to<BR>
>>  take the existing Barbie-scale Particle Carbine, modify it for rapid fire,<BR>
>>  and then multiplex 16 of the little buggers into a handle. This should give<BR>
>>  us about 5 shots per second, which will provide a decent approximation of a<BR>
>>  continuous beam (His Jadeness will not be testing it). We probably arent<BR>
>>  bending the rules too far by allowing them to all one one accumulator bank.<BR>
><BR>
>The only way it will appear to be a continuous beam is if<BR>
>the brightness stuns the retinae's (whatever the proper<BR>
>language is for that - "flaring"?).  5 impressions per second<BR>
>is really, really slow for human eyes.  30 is pretty smooth.<BR>
>60 is good and it will appear solid.  100+ and you will<BR>
>have difficulty detecting anything but seemless continuity.<BR>
<BR>
If you're firing five shots/second, the air will probably ionize<BR>
and glow in the path of the beam.  If you hold the beam fairly<BR>
steady or move it slowly, you probably will get a glowing beam<BR>
which will fade out after you stop.<BR>
<BR>
Bolie IV<BR>
- -- <BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Bolie Williams IV<BR>
bolie@io.com<BR>
http://www.io.com/~bolie/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 19:12:10 +0200<BR>
From: "Jonas Karlsson" <Jonas.Karlsson@baldakinen.umea.se><BR>
Subject: Hoody-hoo!<BR>
<BR>
That is, I just got my Lost Supplements, only slightly mangled by the post.<BR>
<BR>
So, why did we just last weekend pretty much kill off the idea of starting<BR>
another Traveller campaign? :(<BR>
<BR>
(I'm happy to gm anything, one player wants poor and peaceful traders, one<BR>
wants low-level special ops and one wants to tinker with the starship<BR>
building system (at GTL 13+ ;-) Not too compatible, those. Ah well...)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:10:34 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Princess Bride Quotes<BR>
<BR>
At 03:58 PM 4/28/00, you wrote:<BR>
>     Then there's the one most universally applicable to adventuring groups<BR>
>pondering their chances of success:<BR>
><BR>
>     "It'd take a miracle."<BR>
><BR>
>     Or for fans of MT...<BR>
><BR>
>     "My name is Crown Prince Lucan.  You killed my father.  Prepare to die."<BR>
>--<BR>
>Stormhound<BR>
<BR>
         "G'bye, boys!  Have fun stormin' the station!"<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 10:47:58 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Traveller Centerfolds (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2362)<BR>
<BR>
That isn't too far from the truth.  Originally I was going to have a stab at<BR>
modeling both Hivers & Droyne for AR3, but Mr. Murphy intervened and it<BR>
didn't come to fruition.<BR>
<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Smart, David<BR>
> J (David)<BR>
> Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 11:27 AM<BR>
> To: 'traveller@mpgn.com'<BR>
> Subject: Traveller Centerfolds (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2362)<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> GDWGAMES@aol.com posted:<BR>
> ><BR>
> >In a message dated 00-04-27 16:42:32 EDT, you write:<BR>
> ><BR>
> ><< Loren,<BR>
> ><BR>
> > How about SJG putting together a "Best of Traveller Art" book with<BR>
> > as many color plates from Jesse and other excellent Traveller artists<BR>
> > as economically feasible and selling it throughout the world?<BR>
> ><BR>
> > That way as many people as possible have access to it and SJG, Jesse,<BR>
> > et all make a mint (hopefully) and you hit another home run for SJG?<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Anybody other than me want, say, 15-30 pages of 8.5x11 color plates of<BR>
> > awesome artwork you can show other players? Especially if each plate<BR>
> > had a text explanation in the back of the book which describes<BR>
> the plate's<BR>
> > subject and can be used in-game?>><BR>
> ><BR>
> >Depends. How much would you be willing to pay for a book like that. 4cp<BR>
> costs<BR>
> >big time . . .<BR>
><BR>
> I'm thinking about $25-$40. Per book, depending on the # of plates.<BR>
><BR>
> ><< How about Traveller-based calendars with never-before-published<BR>
> > centerfolds? (I'm thinking ships but you're the Line Editor, Loren)<BR>
> > Collect them all!<BR>
> ><BR>
> > David Smart >><BR>
> ><BR>
> >What _are_ you doing with those ship pictures?  :  )<BR>
> ><BR>
> >LKW<BR>
><BR>
> Hey, just be thankful Jesse hasn't submitted pics of a Hiver in a thong.<BR>
><BR>
> Of course, a Hiver thong is really just two pairs of gloves.<BR>
><BR>
> David Smart<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 10:50:22 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 4/29/00 9:53 AM, semo@pil.net issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson said:<BR>
> <BR>
>> If it's got a "pointy head", it's a *squid*, not an octopus.<BR>
> <BR>
> Sorry Leonard. That's simply not the case. There are indeed octopi with<BR>
> pointy heads. A quick 30 second search on the web, for example, turned up<BR>
> the Octopus macropus, as well as the "blue-ringed octopus" (Hapalochlaena<BR>
> lunulata).<BR>
<BR>
I knew about the blue-ringed octopus, but that macropus is new to me. For<BR>
those interested in checking out octopi, squids and such, I found a page<BR>
with quite a few pictures and data. Both species Chris mentioned are here:<BR>
http://is.dal.ca/~ceph/TCP/taxa.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 13:58:22 -0400<BR>
From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
Subject: Virtual Reality<BR>
<BR>
Hi all,<BR>
<BR>
Anyone have any ideas on how to do VR on those long lonely days/nights while<BR>
in Jump Space, or anytime for that matter. I have a few of my own that I<BR>
will share... You could buy modules at Star Ports for training in ANY<BR>
subject, game playing, hobbies, and yes even sex and sell them with the VR<BR>
suits at lower tech level planets. I would believe that there would be a<BR>
lucrative black market for certain chips and they would be easy to hide on a<BR>
Star Ship and smuggled into a Star Town. Of course VR suits from particular<BR>
manufacturers would be hot items and they could be "copied" and sold (much<BR>
like Rolex's and so forth) by unscrupulous traders/investors.<BR>
<BR>
I would certainly be looking for something to kill my time while in Jump<BR>
Space. If the quality were good enough and I think it would be GREAT by the<BR>
time it got to T:TL 13+, you could see cults forming around certain<BR>
programs.<BR>
<BR>
Anybody interested in doing an equipment sheet for VR? I think that we would<BR>
be seeing it a lot around T:TL 10 and going all the way to T:TL 15+. It is<BR>
being experimented with now. You can even have some in your home if you buy<BR>
the Microsoft "Force Feedback" Joystick (which I have) and a few other<BR>
devices that are on the market.<BR>
<BR>
Any and all ideas will be read with joy.<BR>
<BR>
Thom<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 11:08:28 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Airborne<BR>
<BR>
Oh great, THAT'S something to think about the next time I fly.  Thanks Jeff!<BR>
:P<BR>
<BR>
Jesse<BR>
:)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Pete<BR>
> Sent: Friday, April 28, 2000 6:15 PM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Airborne<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> On Thu, 27 Apr 2000 20:09:38 -0700, Jesse DeGraff<BR>
> <jdegraff@pacbell.net> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> >That'd be about the only reason I could see for jumping out of a<BR>
> perfectly<BR>
> >good airplane :)<BR>
> >Jesse<BR>
><BR>
> I can think of several reasons to jump out of an airplane. You see,<BR>
> I've known many aircraft maintenance personnel. In fact I used to be<BR>
> one. ;-)<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
> "Don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but rum,<BR>
> sodomy, and the<BR>
>  lash."                              - Winston Churchill<BR>
> Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
> NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 19:28:39 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU><BR>
>Of course, this doesn't happen in the 3I, since the 3I doesn't _have_<BR>
>allies...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Darrians?<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2373<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2374</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	4/29/00 5:46:37 PM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
Sender:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
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</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
Traveller-digest      Saturday, April 29 2000      Volume 1999 : Number 2374<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Hoody-hoo!<BR>
Re: TML Landgrab - Techie questions<BR>
Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
Hiver Warbots (was Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
Re: Design Question...<BR>
OT: Cheap copies of Rick Swan's RPG guide<BR>
Re: Veskrashen Design SMG and Pistol<BR>
Re: Plasma Guns<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
RE: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
Re: LWK on ADC<BR>
Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater  <BR>
Re Utanling/Framling/Raman/Varelse & Traveller<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:47:42 -0400<BR>
From: "Eric & Diane Freitas" <ericfrei@gte.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Hoody-hoo!<BR>
<BR>
It's tough getting a gaming group together.  Tomorrow I am going to run<BR>
yes actually *run* Traveller.  Only two of the players will be showing up<BR>
though.<BR>
This is twice in a row.  Two of my players have finals this week.<BR>
<BR>
Last time we were together we took the time to convert their characters from<BR>
Gurps Traveller rules over to Mega Traveller rules.  We just like them<BR>
better.<BR>
Besides I don't like English/Imperial units. :)<BR>
<BR>
We like the character generation sequences better, except for the survival<BR>
roll<BR>
of course <grin>.<BR>
<BR>
Eric<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Jonas Karlsson <Jonas.Karlsson@baldakinen.umea.se><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: Saturday, April 29, 2000 1:16 PM<BR>
Subject: Hoody-hoo!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>That is, I just got my Lost Supplements, only slightly mangled by the post.<BR>
><BR>
>So, why did we just last weekend pretty much kill off the idea of starting<BR>
>another Traveller campaign? :(<BR>
><BR>
>(I'm happy to gm anything, one player wants poor and peaceful traders, one<BR>
>wants low-level special ops and one wants to tinker with the starship<BR>
>building system (at GTL 13+ ;-) Not too compatible, those. Ah well...)<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 14:29:14 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: TML Landgrab - Techie questions<BR>
<BR>
Andrew Moffatt-Vallance wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Sitting here working on my writeup of Ficant and reading John's question, I<BR>
> was struck by a similar problem. I've set Ficant at an early evolutionary<BR>
> stage (roughly equivalent to the Carboniferous period). Now this probably<BR>
> means no deposits of hydrocarbons? So I was assuming that they use<BR>
> alcohol distilled from local plants instead. Will this work, and is alcohol (I'm<BR>
> thinking methanol/ethanol) an inferior fuel to normal petrol/diesel? (I've<BR>
> assumed it is).<BR>
<BR>
Using the figures from Twilight: 2000 ver. 2.2 (page 273), ethanol's<BR>
Consumption Multiplier is 3 (you burn 3 liters of ethanol to equal 1<BR>
liter of distilled hydorcarbon).  Methanol has a CM of 3.5 (the T:2K<BR>
advantage of methanol is that it doesn't require edible feedstock).<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 15:33:25 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
> Last time we were together we took the time to convert their characters from<BR>
> Gurps Traveller rules over to Mega Traveller rules.  We just like them<BR>
> better.<BR>
> Besides I don't like English/Imperial units. :)<BR>
><BR>
> We like the character generation sequences better, except for the survival<BR>
> roll<BR>
> of course <grin>.<BR>
<BR>
That reminds me, I thought of a simple fix for CT/MT that almost ensures that<BR>
characters pass their survival rolls (without replacing them with "injury" rolls<BR>
as in T4). It works like this:<BR>
<BR>
Every player gets a pool of 10 points at the beginning of character generation.<BR>
These points can be used to improve *any roll* after characteristics are<BR>
determined.<BR>
They can be used for enlistment, survival, commission, promotion or aging rolls,<BR>
as well as for mustering out benefits, and the player doesn't have to spend<BR>
these<BR>
points until after he throws the dice.<BR>
<BR>
I like it because it's simple and it gives players a strong incentive to pick<BR>
safe<BR>
careers, while ensuring that few characters die before play begins.<BR>
What do you think of it?<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 15:39:37 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
The only problem I see is that it may wind up helping characters with poor<BR>
stats make it through a service that they should net have chosen.  Of<BR>
course, it is also possible that I have jumped to this negative opinion<BR>
because I really like the CT chargen system as is :-)<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
> Every player gets a pool of 10 points at the beginning of character<BR>
generation.<BR>
> These points can be used to improve *any roll* after characteristics are<BR>
> determined.<BR>
> They can be used for enlistment, survival, commission, promotion or aging<BR>
rolls,<BR>
> as well as for mustering out benefits, and the player doesn't have to<BR>
spend<BR>
> these points until after he throws the dice.<BR>
><BR>
> I like it because it's simple and it gives players a strong incentive to<BR>
pick<BR>
> safe careers, while ensuring that few characters die before play begins.<BR>
> What do you think of it?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 12:49:05 -0700<BR>
From: "James W. Lindsay" <jlindsay@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
On Sat, 29 Apr 2000 15:39:37 -0400, Sword-Worlder wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> The only problem I see is that it may wind up helping characters with poor<BR>
> stats make it through a service that they should net have chosen.  Of<BR>
> course, it is also possible that I have jumped to this negative opinion<BR>
> because I really like the CT chargen system as is :-)<BR>
<BR>
I've usually use the "Three Wishes" house rule, and allowed players to have<BR>
three rerolls to spend during character creation.  If you don't like a<BR>
particular die result, roll again and take the "better" of the two<BR>
("better" being a subjective term sometimes).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
James W. Lindsay             Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada<BR>
Website: http://members.home.net/jlindsay          ICQ: #7521644<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Imagination is more important than knowledge - Einstein<BR>
- ----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 15:48:59 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry wrote:<BR>
>I'm not completely against the idea, if you use it as a voluntary thing.<BR>
><BR>
>"Smitty, you are going to be brain wiped next Senday, and parted out.<BR>
>You can do that, or you can listen to the offer Colonel Sherman is about<BR>
>to make..."<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, I enjoyed _The Dirty Dozen_ too...fun flick, one of the few movies<BR>
I've actually purchased.  _Kelly's Heroes_ is another one I bought - it was <BR>
better RPG fodder, and it was easier to pick out the player  characters. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 16:03:24 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: Hiver Warbots (was Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens)<BR>
<BR>
Michel Vaillancourt wrote:<BR>
>"'Sides, what can you do against a platoon of infantryman sized <BR>
>*tanks*..."<BR>
<BR>
Same thing you do against any other high-tech tank company, with the<BR>
added possible advantage of very predictable "crews" in the tanks.<BR>
Strafe 'em with air support, nail 'em with AT arty, go best-on-best with<BR>
your own tanks, have your PBI's play panzerjaeger.  Just because the<BR>
Hivers call 'em a platoon of infantry doesn't mean you don't still have<BR>
a hundred armored vehicles coming down the pike, with the same <BR>
problems and solutions usually involved.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, the Hivers aren't dying at the front lines.  They're also not very <BR>
good at this kind of thing.  Chances are, if shooting is going on, the<BR>
Hivers' manipulations aren't working all that well, and they're probably <BR>
one bad day away from backing off anyway (to "live to manipulate<BR>
another day").<BR>
<BR>
Of course, that may be exactly what they want you to think...<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 10:07:46 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Design Question...<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson wrote:<BR>
> Hmmm...you didn't say which design system you are using, but given the T4<BR>
> reference I'll guess it's FFS2.<BR>
<BR>
Well, my playtest PDF of it, yes. Can't seem to find a copy around here.<BR>
Hawaii sucks for finding games which aren't quite mainstream.<BR>
 <BR>
> The reason in FFS2, of course is that bit about the length<BR>
> of a reciever being 150 mm + length of the cartrige. FFS made a<BR>
> distinction between Box magzines and Grip magazines that FFS2 does not,<BR>
> indeed the example in FFS2 describes a conventional pistol grip magazine<BR>
> as a box magazine, subject to the 150mm rule. FFS was unclear on the<BR>
> subject, which is why (iirc) it was clarified in FFS2.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, but the receiver was 12.7cm before extending it to conform to the<BR>
150mm rule.<BR>
 <BR>
> I think a reasonable modification is to halve the necessary length of a<BR>
>  pistol grip magazine to 75 mm + cartridge length, (or double or triple<BR>
> the cartidge length, which is more reasonable imo), on the theory that in<BR>
> box magazine fed rifles and submachineguns the entire receiver movement is<BR>
> contained within the length of the weapon frame, whereas in a pistol,<BR>
> the reciever freely moves past the end of the frame.<BR>
> <BR>
> Trying to devise rules to model the co-location of reciever and barrel is<BR>
> beyond the scope of these books, then we might just as well publish<BR>
> gunsmithing books.<BR>
<BR>
True enough, and that's pretty much what I figured. One other fix might<BR>
be to require that 2-3 times the cartidge length extend past the rear of<BR>
the barrel (adding to the weapon's length) while the rest of it can be<BR>
assumed to be wrapped around the barrel. This would be a bit closer to<BR>
the actual configuration of pistols, where the firing mechanism is<BR>
behind the barrel but the recoil spring and such is below the barrel.<BR>
The receiver length would have to equal the length of the barrel plus<BR>
2-3 times the cartridge length. I'm not entirely sure how to work that,<BR>
since it would increase the receiver weight considerably in some cases.<BR>
This sort of configuration would only apply to pistols, with grip<BR>
magazines, and they probably couldn't be made full auto. Comments?<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 16:21:22 -0400<BR>
From: Walt Smith <smithw@hartwick.edu><BR>
Subject: OT: Cheap copies of Rick Swan's RPG guide<BR>
<BR>
My local dollar store has about eight copies in stock of _The Complete<BR>
Guide to Role-Playing Games_ by Rick Swan, at a dollar each.<BR>
261 pages, paperback, very nice Phil Foglio artwork on the cover.<BR>
It's got one page blurbs of just about every RPG published before 1990,<BR>
and the appendices include company addresses, the author's favorites<BR>
in top-ten format, and games divided up by subject matter.  The opening<BR>
chapter is a pretty straightforward intro to RPG's in general, reasonably<BR>
well-written but I think anyone interested in this book will get few new <BR>
insights from the first chapter.<BR>
<BR>
If anyone would like me to pick them up a copy, let me know and<BR>
I'll get it for you for $1.00+shipping.  I mainly got it for the color Foglio<BR>
cover - it depicts a wryly grinning GM towering over a multigenre horde<BR>
of evil baddies - but it looks to have some good detail info.  I've heard<BR>
on Usenet that the ratings Swan gave the games are biased, but even<BR>
if true that would be both expected and not that big a deal.<BR>
<BR>
First come first serve, email to smithw@hartwick.edu if interested,<BR>
I'll take a check, money order or Paypal for the cost and shipping.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 18:38:01 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Veskrashen Design SMG and Pistol<BR>
<BR>
> From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
> Subject: Design Question...<BR>
<BR>
They are nice paramilitary weapons. I dont think they have the 'crunch<BR>
power' you need to deal with a battlefield where everybody and their dog is<BR>
in Combat Environment Suits, but for paramilitary police/civilian weapons<BR>
they look fine.<BR>
<BR>
Just as a question of interest, what happens if you build them at TL8, or if<BR>
you use ETC ammo ?<BR>
<BR>
Ditzie asks if we can we get a 10mm HEAP warhead ...<BR>
<BR>
Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 07:13:38 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Plasma Guns<BR>
<BR>
> From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
> Subject: Plasma guns...<BR>
><BR>
> Ok, I guess I just got on a design kick or something. A few plasma guns<BR>
> to ponder:<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Right, thats it.<BR>
<BR>
Veskrashen, you're hired as part of Famile Spofulam.<BR>
<BR>
The idea of a Plasma Submachinegun is something that has Ditzie drooling.<BR>
<BR>
Jesse, when you have a few spare minutes, can you do a pic of everybody's<BR>
favorite tyke in rapid-fire mode ?<BR>
<BR>
Great weapons. Great, great weapons. Can these get posted on the web<BR>
somewhere ?<BR>
<BR>
> Both weapons could conceivable be used be troops in regular flex armor,<BR>
> or unaugmented battle dress. Either will penetrate light battle dress<BR>
> (though the lighter of the two won't penetrate augmeted TL12+), and the<BR>
> first has a hell of a lot better stats than the PCMP-12 published in<BR>
> Emperor's Arsenal. The second is light enough that some of the less sane<BR>
> among my players might consider it for room clearing. ("Supressive fire<BR>
> on that doorway." "With a PLASMA GUN?!?!?")<BR>
<BR>
"No, with the man-portable particle accelerator"<BR>
<BR>
Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 18:03:29 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
>>For that matter, it's not unknown in canon for Aslan to serve as<BR>
>>mercenaries themselves, although there wouldn't be much point in pushing<BR>
>>the analogy too far here.<<BR>
<BR>
>Mercenaries for land. How many humans would work for such?<BR>
<BR>
Land grants were a typical retirement benefit in the early professional<BR>
Roman Army. It could also be maintained that the troops who accompanied<BR>
people like William the Conqueror were Norman mercenaries who took their pay<BR>
in English land after Hastings.  Is the VA home loan guarantee a kind of<BR>
payment of land for military service.<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 18:20:26 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
Cool<BR>
I was just sort of wondering. I don't have problems with the lean, I just<BR>
wanted to know if I was simply imagining things. I have used criminal acts<BR>
as a focus in games I've run before as well. One of the first games I ran I<BR>
had the players running guns. The pickup tried a double cross and they had<BR>
to run without the money picking up some battle damage along the way. At the<BR>
first starport they stopped in, the Portmaster asked them where all the<BR>
damage came from. The Shipmaster responded, "During our gun running in the<BR>
restricted area." The Bodyguard  character chimed in with "Hey, he just paid<BR>
me to keep him alive. I don't know anything." He got to skip the 20 years on<BR>
the penal planet.<BR>
I still like playing the hero type myself.There are so many badguys I'd like<BR>
to upside, that would is fun enough for me in a game.<BR>
As for the dungeon crawling connection, I see how Traveller would need<BR>
something different as a theme mechanism. Still, several early adventures<BR>
are little more than dungeons in space structurally.<BR>
And I suppose I am bit lean in the sci-fi reading area. Mainly pulp stuff<BR>
from ERB plus the Stainless Steel Rat and other Harry Harrison.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 18:18:30 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Newbie question on Traveller aliens<BR>
<BR>
>That's because the fact that we can't bend our elbows backwards isn't<BR>
always<BR>
a drawback. For example, this feature allows the arm to be snapped straight<BR>
for a punch, or to provide extra force for a downward swing.<<BR>
<BR>
Snapping your elbow straight while punching is a good way to severely injure<BR>
yourself. Not only is the immediate pain quite excruciating and momentarily<BR>
incapacitating, but the long term damage to the tendons caused by repeated<BR>
hyperextension will reduce the overall strength and flexibility of the<BR>
joint.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 15:28:44 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
<BR>
The word from Marc Miller:<BR>
<BR>
>I understand the concept completely. In fact, I would love to see these<BR>
myself.<BR>
<BR>
>Marc<BR>
<BR>
In the following context:<BR>
<BR>
1. The electronic copies are for personal use, not commercial.<BR>
2. The players own a copy of the game.<BR>
<BR>
And I have now finished the Mayday conversion for Aide de Camp II. I think<BR>
that both I and the rest of the world are lucky that I didn't become a<BR>
graphic designer. In any event, anyone who meets the above two conditions<BR>
and would like to try playing Mayday with this gameset should e-mail me off<BR>
list. You also need a copy of ADC2, of course.<BR>
<BR>
Overall, my impression of ADC2 is that it's well worth the money,<BR>
particularly since I am lucky to find the time for face-to-face gaming once<BR>
per month. Actually, as the Bay Area Traveller Gamers can attest to, work<BR>
and other crises make it more like every other month. Don't think of it as<BR>
$60; think of as being better for you than 120 candy bars.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 18:35:10 -0500<BR>
From: tim@premier.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
> > We like the character generation sequences better, except for the survival<BR>
> > roll<BR>
> > of course <grin>.<BR>
<BR>
This is the main reasons why I cant get FTF CT or any other <BR>
traveller game going : (<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> That reminds me, I thought of a simple fix for CT/MT that almost ensures that<BR>
> characters pass their survival rolls (without replacing them with "injury" rolls<BR>
> as in T4). It works like this:<BR>
> <BR>
> Every player gets a pool of 10 points at the beginning of character generation.<BR>
> These points can be used to improve *any roll* after characteristics are<BR>
> determined.<BR>
> They can be used for enlistment, survival, commission, promotion or aging rolls,<BR>
> as well as for mustering out benefits, and the player doesn't have to spend<BR>
> these<BR>
> points until after he throws the dice.<BR>
> <BR>
> I like it because it's simple and it gives players a strong incentive to pick<BR>
> safe<BR>
> careers, while ensuring that few characters die before play begins.<BR>
> What do you think of it?<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
I like it but 10 points is really to much and three can be to little.  <BR>
So I have an idea. <BR>
<BR>
Officers get half their commision modifer characteristics rounded <BR>
down for points thats a range of 3-6 pts.  This represents the <BR>
character's ability to pull strings.<BR>
<BR>
For enlisted characters use their Surivival characterestic for a range <BR>
of 2-6 points.  This is just their bline luck and skill.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Examples<BR>
Naval Officer Sir Joe<BR>
<BR>
UPP 67689B<BR>
<BR>
The commission characteristics modifer for a naval officer is<BR>
Social Standing so Sir Joe with 11 points would get five points.<BR>
<BR>
Army Private Joe<BR>
<BR>
UPP 676869<BR>
<BR>
In this case the Private Joe an army solider Surivial characterestic <BR>
is education in this case Joe would get only 3 points.<BR>
Tim Reynolds<BR>
tim@premier.net <BR>
225-334-5063<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable <BR>
sexual disease.  It made you unsuitable for <BR>
a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.<BR>
<BR>
Terry Pratchett <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 19:49:04 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
>Land grants were a typical retirement benefit in the early professional<BR>
Roman Army. It could also be maintained that the troops who accompanied<BR>
people like William the Conqueror were Norman mercenaries who took their pay<BR>
in English land after Hastings.  Is the VA home loan guarantee a kind of<BR>
payment of land for military service.<<BR>
<BR>
All well and good - in context.<BR>
How many people will look forward to a life of TL 1-3 (CT) tiling the soil?<BR>
Especially under a Fteirle overlord?<BR>
Likewise with the new English nobility, how many will want to be a Fteirle<BR>
noble as opposed to an Imperial rich man?<BR>
And lastly a home in the Hierate? Nice, but all those challenges...<BR>
Culturally, it just isn't likely.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 20:02:43 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
Hello, Colin,<BR>
<BR>
> The only problem I see is that it may wind up helping characters with poor<BR>
> stats make it through a service that they should net have chosen. <BR>
<BR>
Well they still have an incentive to choose a career that's right for them,<BR>
otherwise they'd use up their points quickly using them for nothing<BR>
*but* survival rolls.<BR>
<BR>
> Of course, it is also possible that I have jumped to this negative opinion<BR>
> because I really like the CT chargen system as is :-)<BR>
<BR>
I understand. I get pretty misty-eyed singing the LBB anthem, too. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 15:22:42 -0400<BR>
From: Thom Jones-Low <tjoneslo@together.net><BR>
Subject: Re: LWK on ADC<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 20:39:30 EDT<BR>
> From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: LKW on ADC<BR>
> <BR>
> In a message dated 00-04-28 13:51:33 EDT, you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> << Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:22:50 -0700<BR>
>  From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
>  Subject: LKW on Aide de Camp<BR>
> <BR>
>  LKW wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
>  >  The e-mails which I have received make it clear that I should<BR>
>  > have described<BR>
>  >  what Aide de Camp is in more detail. >><BR>
>  ><BR>
>  > Does Marc know you are doing this?<BR>
> <BR>
>  Is the issue copyright infringements? According to HPS Simulations (the<BR>
>  creators of ADC2), creating an ADC2 copy of a game for personal use is not<BR>
>  an infringement, nor is playing the game using ADC2, as long as at least one<BR>
>  player owns a copy of the game.  >><BR>
> <BR>
> I still suggest you clear it with Marc, though.<BR>
> <BR>
> LKW<BR>
> <BR>
	I second the notion. Even if you are not technically violating<BR>
copyright law, copyright, traveller and network etiquette all suggest<BR>
you let Marc know. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
    Thomas Jones-Low<BR>
    tjoneslo@together.net<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 20:16:03 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
Hi, Tim,<BR>
<BR>
> I like it but 10 points is really to much and three can be to little.<BR>
> So I have an idea.<BR>
><BR>
> Officers get half their commision modifer characteristics rounded<BR>
> down for points thats a range of 3-6 pts.  This represents the<BR>
> character's ability to pull strings.<BR>
<BR>
I prefer using fixed points from a pool (or using James's "three wishes"<BR>
rule, which would also work fine) for three reasons:<BR>
<BR>
First of all characters<BR>
who used points on the survival roll would be giving up something<BR>
else (like a promotion or a mustering out benefit), so that characters<BR>
who take dangerous careers will have to make sacrifices elsewhere.<BR>
<BR>
Second, I prefer to give every character the same bonus, helping to<BR>
make all characters a little more equal. If the bonus was based on<BR>
a characteristic, it would reinforce existing inequalities.<BR>
<BR>
Third, since the points can be used for *anything*, not just survival<BR>
rolls, my system (or James's) can be used to give players more<BR>
control during character gen.<BR>
<BR>
Still, I will admit your system would be a bit more realistic, so this may<BR>
partly<BR>
be a matter of taste...<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 16:26:42 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Hiver Kung-Fu Theater  <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> At 05:49 PM 4/28/2000 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
> >My suggestion would be that the Hiver doing a handstand <BR>
> >was in a low gravity area. Later descriptions of Hiver say <BR>
> >that Hiver can't do one legged stands because they can't <BR>
> >in normal gravity. If the Hiver in the illustration was in <BR>
> >a low grav field at the time then it can be done.<BR>
> <BR>
> Where does it state that Hivers can't do one hand stands in normal graivty?<BR>
<BR>
I'm not saying that they don't have the balance to do it,<BR>
I'm saying their arms aren't typically strong enough for them <BR>
to be able to support their body weight on one arm.<BR>
<BR>
Aliens of the Rim (TNE) establishes this, at least in my mind.<BR>
(I know some people have problems with AotR so this may not<BR>
be a valid source for everyone).<BR>
<BR>
"In general, Hiver Arms an legs are weaker than human limbs."<BR>
p 9. (although no rules are given to reflect this supposed<BR>
weakness)<BR>
<BR>
Hiver Character Gen. Worksheet: Weight = 4 x (STR - AGL) + 90 kg.<BR>
[An average of 10 kg more than a male human of the same STR<BR>
& AGL or 25 kg more than a female human.]<BR>
Load (STR + CON) x 3 kg [The Same as for Humans]<BR>
(AotR p 93)<BR>
<BR>
Load is defined (TNE Rulebook p 35) as equal to load above<BR>
and states that up to twice normal load, or (Str + Con)  x 6 kg,<BR>
is the characters burdened load. "A character may _lift_<BR>
(emphasis added) loads up to 4 times the normal load <BR>
[or (STR + CON) x 12 kg] and carry them short distances<BR>
(50 to 100 meters at a time; Initiative is reduced to 1<BR>
while this load is carried.)<BR>
<BR>
This means that a typical Hiver (at age 18) with STR 6 Con 6<BR>
has a basic load of 36 kg, a burdened load of 72 kg, and a<BR>
maximum load of 144 kg.<BR>
<BR>
Given that this typical Hivers weight (of 90 kg) is within his<BR>
maximum load of 144 kg you might argue that a Hiver ought to<BR>
be able to use one arm to lift its own body mass. However my<BR>
interpretation of maximum lift is that it requires the use<BR>
of the combined strength of all free manipulative members and<BR>
bodily strength. So for human charecters it would be the<BR>
'just barely pick up and move using both arms and getting<BR>
your back into it strength.' I think the same logic applies to<BR>
Hiver, possibly even more so given the canonical weakness of<BR>
their arms. When you do a handstand you are supporting all of <BR>
your weight on that one arm. Given the weight of the Hiver body <BR>
very few Hiver will be strong enough to lift that much weight and <BR>
support it with one hand.<BR>
<BR>
This does of course depend on your interpretation of the Load<BR>
rule. Using the Load rules to establish lifting capacity may<BR>
be an invalid interpretation as it is the maximum that can be<BR>
lifted and still move, not necessarily the maximum that can be<BR>
lifted at all. YMMV.<BR>
<BR>
To me suggesting that the illustration was of a Hiver in a low<BR>
gravity area seemed logical. Given Hiver curiosity it did not<BR>
seem unlikely to me that a Hiver in a low gravity area would<BR>
try it out by doing physical stunts that their limbs were too<BR>
weak to accomplish in standard gravity. YMMV.<BR>
<BR>
> Anyway, whit is their homeworld's gravity?  A high-g world would explain much.<BR>
<BR>
Guran is size 5 (7900 km in diameter) with a standard atmosphere.<BR>
(CT AM7 p 15) Given its smaller size and equivalent atmospheric <BR>
density it seems likely that its gravity is somewhat less than <BR>
Earths. The Hiver Capitol of Glea is size 6, and AM 7 states<BR>
(p. 15) that Hivers are attracted to worlds between sizes 4<BR>
and 6 with atmospheres between 5 and 9.<BR>
<BR>
Has Guran been detailed by anyone yet?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 20:54:29 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re Utanling/Framling/Raman/Varelse & Traveller<BR>
<BR>
On Sat, 29 Apr 2000 03:02:31 -0400 (EDT), "William F. Hostman"<BR>
<aramis@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> In short, because we are human, our aliens _must_<BR>
>>be "humans in rubber suits".<BR>
<BR>
>But, in good roleplaying, we should strive to have them be more than man in<BR>
>suit. Not that we will attain this. THe author, would he have been aware fo<BR>
>this, probably would have written them as framling, when really, they need<BR>
>to be played as close to varelse as the group is capable of. H&I Nearly<BR>
>tries to prevent this.<BR>
<BR>
No, you're missing _raman_ in your concept here - a properly<BR>
played Zhodani would undoubtedly be _framling_, assuming a<BR>
first-person of Imperial, Vilani, or Solomani extraction.  A<BR>
properly played Vargr or Aslan would be _raman_ - we can interact<BR>
to mutuality of concept (most often equated, incorrectly, with<BR>
commercial benefit, but could include cultural exchange), but we<BR>
recognize them as foreign, not even of our species.  _Varelse_<BR>
are those that we can coexist with (i.e., share a habitat with),<BR>
but cannot interact with to mutuality of concept.  The best<BR>
example I can find in Traveller canon would still be _raman_, but<BR>
the Jgd-Il-Jagd are probably as close to _varelse_ as you will<BR>
get in canonical Traveller, if you focus your attention on those<BR>
aliens known to be sophont.<BR>
<BR>
>>    There is suggestions of a fifth class, djur - the beast, with<BR>
>>    whom no coexistence is possible, but it is not made clear if<BR>
>>    this is formally considered part of the hierarchy.  An<BR>
>>    example of this _might_ be Gnaak, to K'kree - but Gnaak are<BR>
>>    presumed to have been sophont, implying that we would<BR>
>>    consider them ramen.<BR>
<BR>
>I consider djur to be the fifth stage, but there should be one in between:<BR>
>one where no interaction is capable, but coexistance is possible.<BR>
<BR>
That's essentially the definition of varelse.  Remember, the<BR>
question isn't merely interaction, but interaction to mutuality<BR>
of concept.  After all, the implacable hostility of the (probably<BR>
djur) relationship between Gnaak and K'kree certainly resulted in<BR>
interaction (as in war and genocide).  Also, one can interact<BR>
with a corrosive atmosphere, but such an interaction would hardly<BR>
be thought to have any place in the hierarchy of foreignness.<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2374<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Sunday, April 30 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2375<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: GDW Memo...<BR>
Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US<BR>
[www] 30 Apr 00 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Looking for info...<BR>
Another Question....<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
VR<BR>
Kelly's Hero's in Trav<BR>
RL Merc Ticket!<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 16:36:33 +0100<BR>
From: Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: GDW Memo...<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Steve Daniels [mailto:stevedaniels@portcaddo.com]<BR>
> <BR>
> "J. Paul Sanders" wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> [snip from memo]<BR>
> <BR>
> > These sectors are now considered unacceptable;<BR>
> > entirely new star maps are being generated for inclusion in <BR>
> the Atlas of the<BR>
> > Imperium.<BR>
> <BR>
> Drat!  My Ley Sector and Glimmerdrift JG stuff has been<BR>
> officially ex-communicated!!<BR>
> <BR>
> bloo<BR>
<BR>
I think you'll find they were 'ex-communicated' over 16 years ago. IIRC<BR>
the publication date of Atlas of the Imperium was 1984, and the memo<BR>
obviously pre-dates that.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:31:09 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Matthew Bond" <BR>
> From: Bruce Johnson <BR>
> >Of course, this doesn't happen in the 3I, since the 3I doesn't _have_<BR>
> >allies...<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> Darrians?<BR>
<BR>
Matt beat me to it.<BR>
<BR>
There are many others too.  I can't name them all, but we can list every<BR>
Imperial client state, to begin with.  We can, no doubt, add a bunch of<BR>
independent worlds (Collace?).  Then there are significant interstellar<BR>
states.  These include:  the Senlis Foederate (Trojan Reach), the<BR>
Thoengling Empire (Gvurrdon), and a swag of others out in Foreven and Far<BR>
Frontiers.  And this is only the start of the list.  Furthermore, there is<BR>
no obviously good reason why shorter term alliances aren't possible to<BR>
achieve common goals.<BR>
<BR>
The Imperium actively engages in diplomacy, alliance-building, and military<BR>
and non-military cooperation with other states all over the place.  Yes, it<BR>
has allies.  <BR>
<BR>
For campaign purposes, it is often possible to use such allies as a<BR>
smaller, more manageable surrogate for the Imperium.  An example of this<BR>
would be a campaign set in Pax Rulin subsector in Trojan Reach, fighting<BR>
off the Aslan.  You could have the characters working for the Imperium, or<BR>
you could have them working for the Senlis Foederate.  The goals are the<BR>
same, the gear can be the same, but the characters have more freedom of<BR>
action in the latter case.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 22:08:34 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: [www] 30 Apr 00 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR>
<BR>
Freelance Traveller, the Electronic Fan-Supported Traveller<BR>
Resource has posted its most recent update to<BR>
http://come.to/FreelanceTraveller and<BR>
http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/Default.htm.  <BR>
<BR>
This update features:<BR>
<BR>
 - A copy of Traveller Navigator, an early Windows program for<BR>
   Traveller, has been found. You can get it from the Computer<BR>
   Connection, in the Information Center. <BR>
<BR>
 - Colin Michl reviews the first volume of the Classic Traveller<BR>
   reprints. Read it in Critic's Corner. <BR>
<BR>
 - Some corrections were made to Ken Pick's Subsiduzed Merchants<BR>
   and Supermerchants in the Shipyard, and a link from the main<BR>
   Shipyard page to the Supermerchants was added after being<BR>
   inadvertently omitted in the last update. <BR>
<BR>
 - 'Twas the week after Easter, and all through the site, I took<BR>
    the page backgrounds, and set them to white. A couple of<BR>
    visitors indicated that the text was a little tough to read<BR>
    on the default grey background, which gave me a "Huh?" for a<BR>
    while. Until I remembered that not everyone uses IE, and not<BR>
    everyone has the default background color set to white.<BR>
    Fixed; everything should be readable now, if you've got a<BR>
    color display. We know about a problem with monochrome<BR>
    displays; research is ongoing. <BR>
<BR>
 - A new task system for T4 from Matt Stevens, a new author, can<BR>
   be found in Doing It My Way. <BR>
<BR>
 - In the Information Center, some broken links to Windows<BR>
   programs in the Computer Connection have been fixed.. <BR>
<BR>
 - Matt Stevens was kind enough to provide us with a brief<BR>
   biographical paragraph. We've put it with the others, in<BR>
   Author Profiles. <BR>
<BR>
Your questions, comments, and ideas are always welcome at<BR>
Freelance Traveller.  Please write to<BR>
freelancetraveller@yahoo.com with any and all of them, as we are<BR>
in the process of reconfiguring the forms, and they may be<BR>
temporarily disabled.  Freelance Traveller depends on the good<BR>
will of Traveller fans both to visit our site and justify our<BR>
existence, and to write for us, making our existence possible.<BR>
<BR>
Freelance Traveller is mirrored at http://w3.execnet.com/jeffz.<BR>
<BR>
Freelance Traveller wishes to extend its thanks and appreciation<BR>
to The Traveller Downport (http://www.downport.com) and to<BR>
Executive Network Information Systems (http://www.execnet.com)<BR>
for hosting services. Without organizations willing to cooperate<BR>
with Freelance Traveller's ever-growing needs, we would be unable<BR>
to bring you the articles and other resources that have made<BR>
Freelance Traveller one of the premier Traveller sites on the <BR>
'net.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture <BR>
Enterprises, 1977-2000.  Use of the trademark in <BR>
this notice and in the referenced materials is not <BR>
intended to infringe or devalue the trademark.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin, Editor<BR>
Freelance Traveller - The Electronic Fan-Supported Traveller Resource<BR>
http://come.to/FreelanceTraveller<BR>
http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/Default.htm<BR>
freelancetraveller@yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 21:10:39 -0700<BR>
From: Rob Eaglestone <downport@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
"Samuel D. Weiss" wrote:<BR>
> And where are individual GMs? Do you run Saviors of the Imperium or It's<BR>
> Money, Hand it to Me?<BR>
<BR>
Our group is in it for "fun".  That means entertainment.<BR>
THAT means whatever members of our group like to watch on<BR>
the movie screen is what they like in Traveller.  Steven<BR>
Segall, Sean Connery, Star Wars, the X Files.<BR>
<BR>
The Imperium seems to be a place where local government<BR>
rule overlaps Imperial rule, and both of which overlap<BR>
megacorporation rule.  And who knows who else has authority<BR>
out there.  Can't hardly run cargo without breaking<BR>
someone's laws...<BR>
<BR>
Doesn't have to be that way.  Military espionage works just<BR>
as well, if you know how to do it.<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 15:31:53 -0700<BR>
From: "Legate Legion" <legate@futureone.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
From: Sword-Worlder <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
<BR>
><mouthpiece value="high"><BR>
>Illegal?  There is no controlling, legal authority!  Besides, no intent to<BR>
>break the laws of any jurisdiction can be shown.  And don't get on your<BR>
high<BR>
>moral horse with me.  There is no valid argument possible with the infinite<BR>
>cultural differences in the universe.  It's not our fault, anyway, because<BR>
>our highest authorities recognize murder as a valid way to establish<BR>
>governing power in the first place!  Just you remember that it is only<BR>
>against the law if you get convicted of a crime.  Wealth and power greatly<BR>
>reduce the likelihood of wrongdoing, obviously, since so few in that class<BR>
>are ever convicted of a crime, no matter how they obtained their money or<BR>
>power.<BR>
></mouthpiece><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
    Just one point here.  All governments are built upon the bodies of the<BR>
dead.  I know it.  You know it.  Everyone knows it.  When the first Homo Sap<BR>
wanted to rule he killed the other Homo Sap who wanted to rule & took over.<BR>
End of story.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 15:36:34 -0700<BR>
From: "Legate Legion" <legate@futureone.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
From: Sword-Worlder <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
<BR>
>Gol durn whippersnappers of the video game age!  Didn't know what to do<BR>
with<BR>
>it!?  <growl, spit, sound of popping veins>  We played weekly from 1978<BR>
thru<BR>
>1981 without ever using the so-called official canon background.  Canon was<BR>
>silly and terribly thin and, yes, UNIMAGINATIVE as far as I was concerned.<BR>
>Excuse me while I go take my blood pressure medicine.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Swordy,<BR>
<BR>
    Calm down.  He most likely wasn't even born when Star Wars came out, for<BR>
the first time.  (To all of you young whippersnappers, that would be Star<BR>
Wars:  A New Hope, before it was restored, digitalized, an had a name<BR>
change.)<BR>
    He also most likely does not know that the game did not even come with a<BR>
background, just rules.  The GM had to create & provide the background, not<BR>
MM or LKW, but the GM.<BR>
    So, please lay off the child & let him be.<BR>
    Btw, do you want a nice glass of wine with your medicine?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 23:08:53 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/28/00 9:19:53 PM Mountain Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
>  What strikes me as funny is that these terms (except Raman) are in Swedish.<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Utlnning (pl. utlnningar) = Foreigner<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Frmling (pl. frmlingar) = Stranger<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Varelse (pl. varelser) = Being<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Djur (pl. djur) = Animal<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Where did that additional term (Raman) come from ? What language ?<BR>
<BR>
According to the preface to Speaker for the Dead, the "Nordic" these terms <BR>
come from is descended from Swedish, so if 'raman' isn't Swedish, I don't <BR>
know where it comes from. <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:17:13 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	1)  Does anyone have a program that does Animal creation per pp94-95 of <BR>
TTB?  Either JAVA on the Web or something that will run on a WinTel box?<BR>
<BR>
	2)  What is the physical dimensions of a 16 troy oz gold bar?<BR>
<BR>
	3)  Does anyone have a STRIKER design spreadsheet or program?<BR>
<BR>
	Thanks!<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:27:31 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Another Question....<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	Anyone know the "food density" currently achievable with modern <BR>
hydroponics systems?  I am trying to roughly model out how much square area <BR>
is required to sustainably feed 100 people for a year.  Thanks!<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 13:38:37 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion in Traveller?<BR>
<BR>
"Samuel D. Weiss" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >Land grants were a typical retirement benefit in the early professional<BR>
> Roman Army. It could also be maintained that the troops who accompanied<BR>
> people like William the Conqueror were Norman mercenaries who took their pay<BR>
> in English land after Hastings.  Is the VA home loan guarantee a kind of<BR>
> payment of land for military service.<<BR>
><BR>
> All well and good - in context.<BR>
> How many people will look forward to a life of TL 1-3 (CT) tiling the soil?<BR>
> Especially under a Fteirle overlord?<BR>
> Likewise with the new English nobility, how many will want to be a Fteirle<BR>
> noble as opposed to an Imperial rich man?<BR>
> And lastly a home in the Hierate? Nice, but all those challenges...<BR>
> Culturally, it just isn't likely.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
On the flipside...if your mustering-out included a place for you and your<BR>
extended family on a well supported colony mission...none of this TL 1-3 stuff<BR>
but perhaps (Campaign tech - 1 or 2).  A contingent of experienced military<BR>
types is always welcome to deal with anything nasty that pops up on a new colony<BR>
world. Land grants were usually given somwhere near the border of the<BR>
empire...or in somewhat rebellious provinces...good for expanding the<BR>
"civilized" ZOI.<BR>
<BR>
Rob Houghton<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:13:51 EDT<BR>
From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
<BR>
Quick linguistic question, if anyone out there knows Mandarin.<BR>
<BR>
As a piece of flavor text for Rim of Fire, I need a Chinese word that<BR>
can translate as something like "in accordance with Heaven" or "in<BR>
harmony with the universe."  The nearest I can come up with is<BR>
either "tianzhao" or "zhouzhao," but I have a tin ear for Mandarin and<BR>
I have no idea if either of those would sound plausible.<BR>
<BR>
Anyone have any insight?<BR>
<BR>
- ----------<BR>
Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>
writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>
"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>
set of people who will take offense at it."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 05:14:24 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
To: traveller@mpgn.com <traveller@mpgn.com><BR>
Date: 30 April 2000 04:21<BR>
Subject: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> 1)  Does anyone have a program that does Animal creation per pp94-95 of<BR>
>TTB?  Either JAVA on the Web or something that will run on a WinTel box?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Uh-oh! Michel, you're getting me worried...<BR>
<BR>
> 2)  What is the physical dimensions of a 16 troy oz gold bar?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm... yet strangely intrigued...<BR>
<BR>
> 3)  Does anyone have a STRIKER design spreadsheet or program?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Now I wonder what you need *that* for... souped-up gun-bunnymobile,<BR>
perhaps...<g><BR>
<BR>
> Thanks!<BR>
><BR>
> -- Michel R. Vaillancourt<BR>
>    (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
(Player in Michel's CT PBeM The Near Earth Campaign 2)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 02:09:20 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: VR<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
> Subject: Virtual Reality<BR>
><BR>
> Hi all,<BR>
><BR>
> Anyone have any ideas on how to do VR on those long lonely days/nights<BR>
while<BR>
> in Jump Space, or anytime for that matter. I have a few of my own that I<BR>
> will share... You could buy modules at Star Ports for training in ANY<BR>
> subject, game playing, hobbies, and yes even sex and sell them with the VR<BR>
> suits at lower tech level planets. I would believe that there would be a<BR>
> lucrative black market for certain chips and they would be easy to hide on<BR>
a<BR>
> Star Ship and smuggled into a Star Town. Of course VR suits from<BR>
particular<BR>
> manufacturers would be hot items and they could be "copied" and sold (much<BR>
> like Rolex's and so forth) by unscrupulous traders/investors.<BR>
><BR>
> I would certainly be looking for something to kill my time while in Jump<BR>
> Space. If the quality were good enough and I think it would be GREAT by<BR>
the<BR>
> time it got to T:TL 13+, you could see cults forming around certain<BR>
> programs.<BR>
><BR>
> Anybody interested in doing an equipment sheet for VR? I think that we<BR>
would<BR>
> be seeing it a lot around T:TL 10 and going all the way to T:TL 15+. It is<BR>
> being experimented with now. You can even have some in your home if you<BR>
buy<BR>
> the Microsoft "Force Feedback" Joystick (which I have) and a few other<BR>
> devices that are on the market.<BR>
><BR>
> Any and all ideas will be read with joy.<BR>
><BR>
> Thom<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
A couple of years ago I asked a similar thing on ze TML. One option seemed<BR>
to be the Red Dwarf model (looks like a RL VR set up only with, ahem,<BR>
groinal attachments).<BR>
<BR>
My idea was this. Double dimensions, cost and power requirement of a low<BR>
berth. The VR booth uses gravatics to simulate 'movement' or resistance of<BR>
'solid' objects in the booth and the quality of the experience is 90% that<BR>
of RL - as in so good it seems real, but there is enough difference between<BR>
it an RL that one can tell it is just a simulation (in fact, for legal<BR>
purposes there is a 'This is a VR simulation' text display at all times<BR>
whilst boothed). What does this mean for training purposes? Well Ringworld<BR>
system had rules on this (if you have it, use those mod for Trav), but<BR>
depending on the system used, treat VR training as 'the real thing' save<BR>
that there is a penalty when 'rolling' for experience, quite high for say<BR>
Tech 9-B, but only slight for E-F.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, VR booths can be linked (which would be cool) for multi user<BR>
experiences. Indeed a clever tech could remove the 'disclaimer', clean up<BR>
the simulation and a PC would never know (if they had limited computer<BR>
experience or are a low techie) they were boothed.<BR>
<BR>
VR low berth's would be a boon to long term spacers (ala holo deck in star<BR>
trek).<BR>
<BR>
Michael<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 02:14:42 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: Kelly's Hero's in Trav<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry wrote:<BR>
>I'm not completely against the idea, if you use it as a voluntary thing.<BR>
><BR>
>"Smitty, you are going to be brain wiped next Senday, and parted out.<BR>
>You can do that, or you can listen to the offer Colonel Sherman is about<BR>
>to make..."<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, I enjoyed _The Dirty Dozen_ too...fun flick, one of the few movies<BR>
I've actually purchased.  _Kelly's Heroes_ is another one I bought - it was<BR>
better RPG fodder, and it was easier to pick out the player  characters. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
Freaky, I ran a Traveller 'Kelly's Hero's' adventure!!!!!! Plot was the PC's<BR>
were a high tech merc scouting group on a mid tech (okay tech 8 - sound<BR>
familiar?) world - as in have grav craft, and discovered that there was this<BR>
bank behind enemy lines serving as a stop over for a gold shipment. So<BR>
flying NOE with 2 G Carriers they went to get it.<BR>
<BR>
Most of them died - good rolls by the opposition, bad by the Travs (and bad<BR>
actions too). From memory one Trav fired a rocket launcher whilst standing<BR>
on the lip of the bank's roof . . .  and promptly fell off with a bad dex<BR>
check.<BR>
<BR>
Hee hee - that was fun (character's were one offs so no one minded too much)<BR>
<BR>
Michael<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 02:22:11 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: RL Merc Ticket!<BR>
<BR>
Papua New Guinea<BR>
<BR>
The head of a plantation owner's Co-op in PNG has called for members to fund<BR>
a 300 man, 7 helicopter, strike force to take out rascol's (PNG gangs with a<BR>
loose tribal affiliation I believe), highway bandits and put down tribal<BR>
fighting. This is response to tribal fighting using semi automatic weapons<BR>
and heavily armed gangs raiding plationtations and indulging in highway<BR>
robbery.<BR>
<BR>
PNG has gone a tad anarchic in the past few years - the PNGDF is underfunded<BR>
and still has a number of officers who lead a semi-coup a couple of years<BR>
ago over the Sandline Mercenary affair, corruption in the government is rife<BR>
and the police services stretched beyond belief (as well as largely<BR>
incompetant - in some areas).<BR>
<BR>
It's got a Trav adventure all over it (replace heli's with grav craft). Make<BR>
it a cadre ticket of PC mercs training the strikeforce and grav pilots. Then<BR>
watch the fun begin.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, it is all very sad.<BR>
<BR>
M<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 01:25:48 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
At 01:14 AM 4/30/00, you wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > 1)  Does anyone have a program that does Animal creation per pp94-95 of<BR>
> >TTB?  Either JAVA on the Web or something that will run on a WinTel box?<BR>
><BR>
>Uh-oh! Michel, you're getting me worried...<BR>
<BR>
         Other game...  I want to do stats for two critters on Bahquyvi...<BR>
<BR>
> > 2)  What is the physical dimensions of a 16 troy oz gold bar?<BR>
><BR>
>Hmmm... yet strangely intrigued...<BR>
<BR>
         Other game...  I need to know what a dTon of bullion is <BR>
worth...  if its BCr or not.<BR>
<BR>
> > 3)  Does anyone have a STRIKER design spreadsheet or program?<BR>
><BR>
>Now I wonder what you need *that* for... souped-up gun-bunnymobile,<BR>
>perhaps...<g><BR>
<BR>
         I'd like to do some STRIKER TNEC stuff for the website/ <BR>
TML...  the 6x4 PersPorter, the CMC War Ranger (the ATVfH), and the CMC <BR>
StingRay GEV...  Pretty ubiquitous on the Frontier.<BR>
<BR>
> > Thanks!<BR>
> ><BR>
> > -- Michel R. Vaillancourt<BR>
> >    (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
><BR>
>Matt<BR>
>(Player in Michel's CT PBeM The Near Earth Campaign 2)<BR>
<BR>
         ...and he came *willingly*!<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:50:06 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
> 1)  Does anyone have a program that does Animal creation per pp94-95 of <BR>
> TTB?  Either JAVA on the Web or something that will run on a WinTel box?<BR>
<BR>
Well it isn't Java, but I wrote a BASIC program a LONG time ago to do such<BR>
a thing. (I also had character generators, world generators, etc. etc. What can<BR>
I say, I was an obsessive teenager.) It uses line numbers (it's THAT old), but <BR>
you could incorporate it into a Visual Basic program if you wished.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:50:06 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
> 1)  Does anyone have a program that does Animal creation per pp94-95 of <BR>
> TTB?  Either JAVA on the Web or something that will run on a WinTel box?<BR>
<BR>
Well it isn't Java, but I wrote a BASIC program a LONG time ago to do such<BR>
a thing. (I also had character generators, world generators, etc. etc. What can<BR>
I say, I was an obsessive teenager.) It uses line numbers (it's THAT old), but <BR>
you could incorporate it into a Visual Basic program if you wished.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 23:55:42 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
On 04/29/00 at 08:16 PM,  "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu> said:<BR>
<BR>
>> I like it but 10 points is really to much and three can be to little.<BR>
>> So I have an idea.<BR>
>><BR>
>> Officers get half their commision modifer characteristics rounded<BR>
>> down for points thats a range of 3-6 pts.  This represents the<BR>
>> character's ability to pull strings.<BR>
<BR>
>I prefer using fixed points from a pool (or using James's "three wishes"<BR>
<BR>
Everything old is new again. <g><BR>
<BR>
Brownie Points (MTPH, p 46):  Brownie points (BP) are special DM's<BR>
received for significant successful efforts on the part of a<BR>
character.  A brownie point may be used at any time as an extra DM<BR>
on any die roll *after it has been rolled*.  Once a brownie point is<BR>
expended in this way, it is used up for good.  Any number of brownie<BR>
points may be used on a given roll, as long as the character has them<BR>
available.  Brownie points may be accumulated for as long as desired<BR>
and used whenever desired.<BR>
<BR>
You get 1 BP for each:<BR>
    Term completed<BR>
    Graduation from college or academy<BR>
    Graduation from med. school or flight academy<BR>
    Honor received<BR>
    Special assignment earned<BR>
    Decoration earned <BR>
        2 for MCG<BR>
        3 for SEH<BR>
<BR>
I'd also start the PC off with BP's equal to their initially rolled<BR>
SOC...on the principle that the rich keep getting richer. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:05:28 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
Michel Vaillancourt wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> <BR>
>         2)  What is the physical dimensions of a 16 troy oz gold bar?<BR>
<BR>
I haven't worked that out yet.  However, according to:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.webelements.com/webelements/elements/text/phys/Au.html<BR>
<BR>
elemental gold masses 19,300 kg/m^3.  Thus, one dton (using T4<BR>
14m^3/dton) masses 270,200 kg.  At 31.1 grams/troy ounce, that gives us<BR>
approximately 32.154 troy ounces/kilogram, or 8,688,011 troy ounces per<BR>
dton (give or take a few due to rounding).  Value in credits is left as<BR>
an exercise for the student.  However, at Cr 115.11 per troy ounce or<BR>
higher, the value of 1 dton of gold will equal or exceed BCr 1.<BR>
<BR>
Hope that helps!<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 06:15:47 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 30 April 2000 06:08<BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Michel Vaillancourt wrote:<BR>
><BR>
><<snip>><BR>
>><BR>
>>         2)  What is the physical dimensions of a 16 troy oz gold bar?<BR>
><BR>
>I haven't worked that out yet.  However, according to:<BR>
><BR>
>http://www.webelements.com/webelements/elements/text/phys/Au.html<BR>
><BR>
>elemental gold masses 19,300 kg/m^3.  Thus, one dton (using T4<BR>
>14m^3/dton) masses 270,200 kg.  At 31.1 grams/troy ounce, that gives us<BR>
>approximately 32.154 troy ounces/kilogram, or 8,688,011 troy ounces per<BR>
>dton (give or take a few due to rounding).  Value in credits is left as<BR>
>an exercise for the student.  However, at Cr 115.11 per troy ounce or<BR>
>higher, the value of 1 dton of gold will equal or exceed BCr 1.<BR>
><BR>
>Hope that helps!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Bear in mind that the above describes a solid block of gold of 14m^3...<BR>
Allowing for gaps between stacked bars, packing cases etc, will reduce the<BR>
amount of gold in a dton by, say, upto 1/3. So if gold is >~Cr173 per troy<BR>
oz a dton would be BCr1+<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:28:50 -0500<BR>
From: tim@premier.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
> On 04/29/00 at 08:16 PM,  "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu> said:<BR>
> <BR>
> >> I like it but 10 points is really to much and three can be to little.<BR>
> >> So I have an idea.<BR>
> >><BR>
> >> Officers get half their commision modifer characteristics rounded<BR>
> >> down for points thats a range of 3-6 pts.  This represents the<BR>
> >> character's ability to pull strings.<BR>
> <BR>
> >I prefer using fixed points from a pool (or using James's "three wishes"<BR>
> <BR>
> Everything old is new again. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris you know me, I usually come up with a soluation sometime <BR>
after somebody already has : )  I take solace(sp) in that its got to <BR>
be good if somebody else is already thinking this way. <BR>
> <BR>
> Brownie Points (MTPH, p 46):  Brownie points (BP) are special DM's<BR>
> received for significant successful efforts on the part of a<BR>
> character.  A brownie point may be used at any time as an extra DM<BR>
> on any die roll *after it has been rolled*.  Once a brownie point is<BR>
> expended in this way, it is used up for good.  Any number of brownie<BR>
> points may be used on a given roll, as long as the character has them<BR>
> available.  Brownie points may be accumulated for as long as desired<BR>
> and used whenever desired.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Tim Reynolds<BR>
tim@premier.net <BR>
225-334-5063<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable <BR>
sexual disease.  It made you unsuitable for <BR>
a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.<BR>
<BR>
Terry Pratchett <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2375<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2376</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Sunday, April 30 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2376<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2375<BR>
Gold Bars<BR>
RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Aliens in Rubber Suits<BR>
Nordic words<BR>
Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
Hoody-doo<BR>
Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris NavigationalHazards)<BR>
One for the gearheads...<BR>
Not _Just_ Camerone Day!<BR>
Heaven & Earth Update<BR>
"safing" CGen<BR>
Re Card's Ratings of alienness<BR>
Re: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
Re: Nordic words<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2375 -- Another Question<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Plasma Guns<BR>
Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 06:26:43 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Matt Stevens <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com>;<BR>
traveller@mpgn.com <traveller@mpgn.com><BR>
Date: 30 April 2000 05:51<BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
> It uses line numbers (it's THAT old)<BR>
<BR>
Hey! Young wippersnapper! I'm currently employed to support a stockcontrol<BR>
package written in a line-numbered dos basic (HAI*Basic, to be precise). I'm<BR>
writing line-numbered code on a daily basis<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>you could incorporate it into a Visual Basic program if you wished.<BR>
><BR>
>Matt<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Ohh, I wish! I really, really wish! You don't know how much I long for<BR>
variable names other than A, A$, A1, A1$, A[2], A$[2], A1[2], A1$[2], where<BR>
A is any letter, 1 is any single digit number 0-9, and 2 is any number<BR>
1-256... Talk about descriptive code <shudder><BR>
<BR>
t'other Matt<BR>
(harumph! damn upstarts taking my name... <g>)<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 22:27:02<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
<BR>
At 03:48 PM 4/29/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Yeah, I enjoyed _The Dirty Dozen_ too...fun flick, one of the few movies<BR>
>I've actually purchased.  _Kelly's Heroes_ is another one I bought - it was <BR>
>better RPG fodder, and it was easier to pick out the player  characters. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Then you'll love the intro for GF Chapter 8...  :)<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:40:32 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> <BR>
> Hey! Young wippersnapper! I'm currently employed to support a stockcontrol<BR>
> package written in a line-numbered dos basic (HAI*Basic, to be precise). I'm<BR>
> writing line-numbered code on a daily basis<BR>
> <BR>
> >you could incorporate it into a Visual Basic program if you wished.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Matt<BR>
> <BR>
> Ohh, I wish! I really, really wish! You don't know how much I long for<BR>
> variable names other than A, A$, A1, A1$, A[2], A$[2], A1[2], A1$[2], where<BR>
> A is any letter, 1 is any single digit number 0-9, and 2 is any number<BR>
> 1-256... Talk about descriptive code <shudder><BR>
<BR>
You Know You're a Gearhead When...<BR>
<BR>
...you hear the term "G-string", and you immediately think of an<BR>
alphanumeric variable.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, I learned BASIC on a TRS-80 (later on a TI-99/4A).  And FORTRAN<BR>
with punch cards.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 08:51:05 +0300<BR>
From: "Ken J. Kazinski" <kjkazinski@ksaits.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2375<BR>
<BR>
Michel,<BR>
<BR>
You might try info from the biodrome project (in texas I think).  There was a lot<BR>
of research done in this area.  Unfortunately, I don't have any links for you.<BR>
<BR>
Kaz<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:27:31 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Another Question....<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
        Anyone know the "food density" currently achievable with modern<BR>
hydroponics systems?  I am trying to roughly model out how much square area<BR>
is required to sustainably feed 100 people for a year.  Thanks!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
        -- Michel R. Vaillancourt<BR>
           (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 08:57:45 +0300<BR>
From: "Ken J. Kazinski" <kjkazinski@ksaits.com><BR>
Subject: Gold Bars<BR>
<BR>
<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"><BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
Packing material is normally considered to be 10% of the weight.<BR>
<BR>
Kaz<BR>
<BR>
&nbsp;<BR>
Bear in mind that the above describes a solid block of gold of 14m^3...<BR>
Allowing for gaps between stacked bars, packing cases etc, will reducethe<BR>
amount of gold in a dton by, say, upto 1/3. So if gold is >~Cr173 pertroy<BR>
oz a dton would be BCr1+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 22:58:08 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
The youngster Black ICE wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> You Know You're a Gearhead When...<BR>
><BR>
> ...you hear the term "G-string", and you immediately think of an<BR>
> alphanumeric variable.<BR>
><BR>
> Yes, I learned BASIC on a TRS-80 (later on a TI-99/4A).  And FORTRAN<BR>
> with punch cards.<BR>
<BR>
Kids today. When I first wrote BASIC, it was on a teletype which had a<BR>
maximum speed of 110 bps. We would save our programs on paper 5-hole<BR>
teletype tape. You would type in your code, debug it, and then to save it<BR>
you did a three step process. You would first type "LIST" but not hit<BR>
return. You would then turn on the tape puncher, then finally hit <cr> to<BR>
start the tape punching process. You then took the paper tape, tore it off,<BR>
rolled it up, and put in your pocket for later use.<BR>
<BR>
When I finally got to use punched cards, I thought they were really cool.<BR>
Before then, we would write our FORTRAN programs on those old FORTRAN coding<BR>
forms and submit the forms to data entry people who made the card decks for<BR>
us.<BR>
<BR>
And I had to do assembly language in college on punched cards. That was a<BR>
real pain. If I thought card punchers were cool, you have no idea how cool I<BR>
thought CRT terminals were when I first got to use one.<BR>
<BR>
Geez, I've been programming for 28 years. I'll bet that's longer than some<BR>
list readers have been alive. At least I started young. On the other hand, I<BR>
feel confident that I can claim at least computer-4 as one of my skills.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 02:07:57 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Aliens in Rubber Suits<BR>
<BR>
Wlliam F. Hostman wrote (including quotes) <BR>
<BR>
> [1] The hierarchy is as follows:<BR>
>  ><BR>
>  [snip]<BR>
>  >    There is suggestions of a fifth class, djur - the beast, with<BR>
>  >    whom no coexistence is possible, but it is not made clear if<BR>
>  >    this is formally considered part of the hierarchy.  An<BR>
>  >    example of this _might_ be Gnaak, to K'kree - but Gnaak are<BR>
>  >    presumed to have been sophont, implying that we would<BR>
>  >    consider them ramen.<BR>
<BR>
"The difference between raman and varelse is not in the creature judged, but <BR>
in the creature judging"  Traveller is considerably more tolerant of aliens <BR>
than Card's universe is, and most alien sophont races are treated as raman. <BR>
Interestlingly, even the K'kree appear to be recognized as such, though this <BR>
recognition does not appear to be mutual.<BR>
<BR>
>  I consider djur to be the fifth stage, but there should be one in between:<BR>
>  one where no interaction is capable, but coexistance is possible.<BR>
<BR>
No, that's included with varelse.  "The fourth is the true alien, the <BR>
varelse, which includes all the animals, for with them no conversation is <BR>
possible. They live, but we cannot guess what purposes or causes make them <BR>
act. They might be intelligent, they might be self aware, but we cannot know <BR>
it". <BR>
If coexistence is not thought to be possible, they are likely to be perceived <BR>
as djur, "the dire beast, that comes in the night with slavering jaws"<BR>
Probably Virus at the time of the New Era is the closest Traveller comes to <BR>
presenting a race as varelse,  presuming that surviving strains are less <BR>
actively homicidal and djur-like in behavior than they were when first <BR>
realeased. <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 02:08:04 EDT<BR>
From: TOCoons@cs.com<BR>
Subject: Nordic words<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/29/00 1:07:20 AM Mountain Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> According to Card, within the story context, they all _do_ come<BR>
>  from Swedish.  Is there a similar term in Swedish - or any<BR>
>  Nordic/Germanic language - to _raman_ that might be applied as<BR>
>  given?  Or from which _raman_ could be derived?  (Remember, the<BR>
>  application hasn't actually come up yet, so usage might only be<BR>
>  theoretical - and I don't know how much linguistics Card knows.)<BR>
<BR>
Card does speak Portuguese, but my guess would be that his knowledge of <BR>
Swedish comes through a friend or family member. <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 01:20:59 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
On 04/30/00 at 12:28 AM,  tim@premier.net said:<BR>
<BR>
>> Everything old is new again. <g><BR>
<BR>
>Eris you know me, I usually come up with a soluation sometime  after<BR>
>somebody already has : )  I take solace(sp) in that its got to  be good<BR>
>if somebody else is already thinking this way. <BR>
>> <BR>
>> Brownie Points (MTPH, p 46):  Brownie points (BP) are special DM's<BR>
>> received for significant successful efforts on the part of a<BR>
>> character.  A brownie point may be used at any time as an extra DM<BR>
>> on any die roll *after it has been rolled*.  Once a brownie point is<BR>
>> expended in this way, it is used up for good.  Any number of brownie<BR>
>> points may be used on a given roll, as long as the character has them<BR>
>> available.  Brownie points may be accumulated for as long as desired<BR>
>> and used whenever desired.<BR>
<BR>
Hee, yeah, I know. Me, I just *love* to tinker. <g><BR>
<BR>
I'm way behind my email reading, but as soon as I saw this thread<BR>
Brownie Points popped into my head.  They were something in MT that<BR>
made me slap my head and say, "Why didn't I think of that!"  <g><BR>
They handle the survival roll *and* help the player focus character<BR>
development while still maintaining the basic random nature.<BR>
<BR>
Remember for years I didn't have anyone to play Traveller with, so<BR>
from time to time I would solo-play designing characters and<BR>
imagining their careers.  The BP's gave you some control, but not<BR>
complete license to do anything you wanted..."Do I spend my last 2<BR>
BP's to get that Gun Cbt this term or not?  Hum, better not, he just<BR>
didn't get that training this term, maybe next time"...things like<BR>
that.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, when I get to play with *others* I'd just as soon pick a<BR>
few skills and get started. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 01:51:43 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
<BR>
On 04/27/00 at 05:34 PM,  shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) said:<BR>
<BR>
>So the absolute *best* you can do is a pair of "wings" one on each side<BR>
>of the ship. *Big* civilian ships will likely have such fold out arrays.<BR>
>Or else be designed as a "flat disk" (which is a nice design for a<BR>
>passenger liner, because you can put the radiators on one side and lots<BR>
>and lots of staterooms with *windows* on the other side, thus maximizing<BR>
>the number of "deluxe" accomodations).<BR>
<BR>
Extend booms to the side and unfurl long "streamers" parallel to the<BR>
ship's main axis. The flat surfaces of both sides of the streamers<BR>
can radiate perpendicular to the ship.  This isn't for stealth, just<BR>
maximizing radiation surface area.<BR>
<BR>
OTOH, if you want to go Space Opera, then build your furry ships and<BR>
have them conduct waste heat into the "ether." <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 08:58:39 +0200<BR>
From: "Julius Waller" <julius@xs4all.nl><BR>
Subject: Hoody-doo<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 19:12:10 +0200<BR>
> From: "Jonas Karlsson" <Jonas.Karlsson@baldakinen.umea.se><BR>
> Subject: Hoody-hoo!<BR>
><BR>
> That is, I just got my Lost Supplements, only slightly mangled by the<BR>
post.<BR>
><BR>
> So, why did we just last weekend pretty much kill off the idea of starting<BR>
> another Traveller campaign? :(<BR>
><BR>
> (I'm happy to gm anything, one player wants poor and peaceful traders, one<BR>
> wants low-level special ops and one wants to tinker with the starship<BR>
> building system (at GTL 13+ ;-) Not too compatible, those. Ah well...)<BR>
<BR>
Now let me see...Kilo credit squadron - the adventure ;-)<BR>
<BR>
 Take a border world between the Imperium and the Consulate, say TL 10. Poor<BR>
but strategically located and declared a Neutral world (my own CT campaign<BR>
plays before the 5th frontier war so I would have chosen a world in the<BR>
Jewell system - of expedition to Zhodane fame.) The Imperium and the<BR>
Consulate both declare this world Red Zone (restricted anyway) and suspect<BR>
the other of covert activities to bring the world back into their respective<BR>
empires.<BR>
<BR>
Perhaps the other balkanised worlds in the sector want to extend their reach<BR>
and incorporate this world into their little neutral alliance, perhaps<BR>
pirates are a problem or perhaps they just wish to have some defence force,<BR>
but the world is in need of starships to defend itself. The powerful<BR>
Imperium/Consulate are happy to oblige with Navy assistance in exchange for<BR>
a treaty that would be perceived as hostile by the other side. So they<BR>
cannot rely on direct assistance. Neither the Imperium or the Consulate will<BR>
sell them to them or give them the necessary spare parts hoping to force<BR>
them to accept direct help.. Given the opposition TL 13+ starships are<BR>
necessary and the industris need to be built up locally.<BR>
<BR>
Now incorporate your players into this: the starship dude starts designing<BR>
and listing materials needed as well as technology. This can be obtained by<BR>
peaceful - if covert trading - in the Imperium, the Consulate or further<BR>
afield. Obviously the world cannot afford massively expensive starships so<BR>
clever designing and trading will be essential. Given the TL difference<BR>
there is a lot to be done and this will take some time. Furthermore<BR>
somethings are too hard to get by trading so a little low level<BR>
infiltration, industrial espionage and/or kidnapping of suitable personnel<BR>
is involved. The other worlds in the sub-sector, the Imperium's secret<BR>
service or the Consulates also dont like this and might attempt to thwart<BR>
the building of the TL 13 plant or steal the plans requiring a recovery<BR>
plan.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
More low level Special ops are neede to prevent full strikes being launched<BR>
by the priates/balkanised worlds against your world or even some<BR>
machinations by the Consulate or the Imperium. The experimental ship/ships<BR>
are faced with an attack whilst in testing requiring further work by your<BR>
starship dude thereafter.<BR>
<BR>
The team must work together because resources are small. Your starship guy<BR>
can identify correct technologies but doesnt know how to trade for them. The<BR>
SOF guy is the security officer given the difficult task of protecting the<BR>
other two and blasting them safely in to installations where stuff can be<BR>
stolen. Anyway sorry about the ramble ;-)<BR>
<BR>
This may still not be what your players expect/fit in your traveller world<BR>
but maybe its a shot?<BR>
Julius<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 02:04:41 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris NavigationalHazards)<BR>
<BR>
On 04/28/00 at 08:17 AM,  SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com> said:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>>BTW, who exactly _is_ the Mess President for the TML?<BR>
<BR>
>Probably Eris, it's make the rules more fun if they got changed<BR>
>regularly...<BR>
<BR>
Ho!  Ho!  I'm imagining "Eris' Rules of Order"...or would that be<BR>
Disorder?  <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 17:29:40 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: One for the gearheads...<BR>
<BR>
Here's one for the gearheads among us...<BR>
<BR>
    IMTC (TNE rules...a 'lost colony' type campaign...soon to webposted!<BR>
) the homeworld has just broken TL-10 but with some differences...HePlaR<BR>
(or Plasma Focus Drives) have recently been developed but power is a<BR>
problem. The smallest fusion plant is 10dT and no fissionable materials<BR>
readily available. And no CG. What would people do about landing ships<BR>
for long duration exploration missions?<BR>
<BR>
Rob Houghton<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 03:19:20 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Not _Just_ Camerone Day!<BR>
<BR>
As Illuminated TMLers no doubt know, today (30 April) is Walpurgisnacht.<BR>
<BR>
"This is the dawning of the Age of Bavaria...."<BR>
<BR>
This message brought to you by the Fnord Motor Company:<BR>
"Conspiracy is Job 1!" ;-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:12:54 +0100<BR>
From: "Stuart Ferris" <stuart.ferris@virgin.net><BR>
Subject: Heaven & Earth Update<BR>
<BR>
The Final Beta of Heaven & Earth has been released to Members of the WBD<BR>
Mailing List for testing.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.downport.com/wbd/HEAVEN_&_EARTH.htm<BR>
<BR>
The release date for the software has been pencilled in as 13th May 2000.<BR>
<BR>
Stuart Ferris<BR>
stuart.ferris@virgin.net<BR>
http://freespace.virgin.net/stuart.ferris/index.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:43:33 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: "safing" CGen<BR>
<BR>
>Every player gets a pool of 10 points at the beginning of character<BR>
>generation.<BR>
>These points can be used to improve *any roll* after characteristics are<BR>
>determined.<BR>
>They can be used for enlistment, survival, commission, promotion or aging<BR>
>rolls,<BR>
>as well as for mustering out benefits, and the player doesn't have to spend<BR>
>these<BR>
>points until after he throws the dice.<BR>
><BR>
>I like it because it's simple and it gives players a strong incentive to pick<BR>
>safe<BR>
>careers, while ensuring that few characters die before play begins.<BR>
>What do you think of it?<BR>
><BR>
easily as workable as CT/MT's Brownie points for enhanced CGen.<BR>
<BR>
Basic CGen, I use 2dice worth of rerolls, during the whole of CG, and yes,<BR>
you may reroll 1 of the two on a 2d throw, and as an added benefit, the new<BR>
roll will never be worse (keep rolling until equal or greater...).<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 01:08:33 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Card's Ratings of alienness<BR>
<BR>
[sniping whole of context]<BR>
<BR>
Jeff:<BR>
 the in between stage between the djur and varelse to me would contain<BR>
soemthing like McCafree's Thoks (Dinosaur Planet Survivors, Death of Sleep,<BR>
etc series): Beings whom, could we interact with them on a useful basis, we<BR>
could come to some commonality of purpose, but due to alien physiognomy,<BR>
are beyond the ability to communicate and interact with. With the exception<BR>
of djur, all of his can be communicated with (even if no commonality of<BR>
purpose can be reached). The thoks, while they are able to be coexisted<BR>
with, cannot normally be communicated with.<BR>
<BR>
For those not following the above, thoks are basically 2-3 m tall pyramidal<BR>
stone philosophers, who, as they age, pecieve time in longer and longer<BR>
base units; a thok even a few centuries old cannot speak in such a manner<BR>
that a human COULD understand them; each word would take several minutes.<BR>
Aside from that, they are fairly close to ramen. Young thoks do participate<BR>
in intercultural activities, until they begin to slow down too far to be<BR>
able to do so.<BR>
<BR>
As for varelse vs ramen: ramen are those that we can interact with and have<BR>
no need to eradicate for our own presevation; the whole orthogoraphy has<BR>
numerous gaps... any orthography will.<BR>
<BR>
Personally, I see more of a two axis approach:<BR>
Axis one: can not interact - Can not communicate but can interact - can<BR>
communicate effectively<BR>
Axis two: xenocidal - hostile - neutral - friendly - xenophillial (in a<BR>
non-sexual way) - sexually xenophillial (which is nearly to xenocidal by<BR>
some people's mindsets.<BR>
<BR>
But Card's orthography made my original point: when presenting traveller<BR>
aliens, one should strive to make them seem closer to varelse than ramen;<BR>
yeah, most groups will wind up with ramen. And of course, Zhodani and<BR>
vilani would be utanlings: they look like us, but don't think like us.<BR>
Traveller was my first experience with aliens which were presented by the<BR>
game system supplements as more than "Men in suits"; presented with alien<BR>
mindsets, and alien cultures. True, no traveller aliens in CT really got<BR>
any wierder than some of the utanlings on earth, but they DON'T think like<BR>
us; ramen, almost by cards own words, are thinking like us.<BR>
<BR>
Say, Jeff, do you consider the pequenios to be ramen or varelse?<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:37:27 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
<BR>
JFZeigler@aol.com wrote:<BR>
> Quick linguistic question, if anyone out there knows Mandarin.<BR>
> <BR>
> As a piece of flavor text for Rim of Fire, I need a Chinese word that<BR>
> can translate as something like "in accordance with Heaven" or "in<BR>
> harmony with the universe."  The nearest I can come up with is<BR>
> either "tianzhao" or "zhouzhao," but I have a tin ear for Mandarin and<BR>
> I have no idea if either of those would sound plausible.<BR>
> <BR>
> Anyone have any insight?<BR>
<BR>
In this context, the word "Tian" should mean "heaven," but I could be mistaken.<BR>
<BR>
I don't really know the language, but I've read RPG supplements :-)<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
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| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:43:48 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Nordic words<BR>
<BR>
TOCoons@cs.com wrote:<BR>
> Card does speak Portuguese, but my guess would be that his knowledge of <BR>
> Swedish comes through a friend or family member.<BR>
<BR>
Or through a dictionary, since he got the basic forms of the words right, but<BR>
used English plural forms.<BR>
<BR>
I still haven't figured out what "raman" is supposed to mean, though. The<BR>
closest guess I have is that it could refer to the aliens in "Rama" (A. C.<BR>
Clarke), but that seems wrong.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
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+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 07:54:41 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2375 -- Another Question<BR>
<BR>
At 02:51 AM 4/30/00, you wrote:<BR>
>Michel,<BR>
><BR>
>You might try info from the biodrome project (in texas I think).  There <BR>
>was a lot<BR>
>of research done in this area.  Unfortunately, I don't have any links for you.<BR>
><BR>
>Kaz<BR>
<BR>
         Hi, Kaz!<BR>
         I chase that down.  Thanks!<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 08:06:24 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
At 02:05 AM 4/30/00, you wrote:<BR>
>elemental gold masses 19,300 kg/m^3.  Thus, one dton (using T4<BR>
>14m^3/dton) masses 270,200 kg.  At 31.1 grams/troy ounce, that gives us<BR>
>approximately 32.154 troy ounces/kilogram, or 8,688,011 troy ounces per<BR>
>dton (give or take a few due to rounding).  Value in credits is left as<BR>
>an exercise for the student.  However, at Cr 115.11 per troy ounce or<BR>
>higher, the value of 1 dton of gold will equal or exceed BCr 1.<BR>
><BR>
>Hope that helps!<BR>
<BR>
         Excellent!  Thanks very much;  that is *exactly* what I am looking <BR>
for.   Now I just have to reality-check the stockpile I am considering <BR>
against some RealWorld(tm) numbers...  Gotta hunt down the number of TOz in <BR>
the US Gold Reserve to figure out if the number I am suggesting a <BR>
seven-year old mining colony could have pulled up is sane or not.<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 08:27:57 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
>         Excellent!  Thanks very much;  that is *exactly* what I am <BR>
> looking for.   Now I just have to reality-check the stockpile I am <BR>
> considering against some RealWorld(tm) numbers...  Gotta hunt down the <BR>
> number of TOz in the US Gold Reserve to figure out if the number I am <BR>
> suggesting a seven-year old mining colony could have pulled up is sane or not.<BR>
><BR>
>         -- Michel R. Vaillancourt<BR>
>            (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
         Hmmm....  http://www.gold.org/Gra/T_faqs.htm has some interesting <BR>
things to say about the topic....<BR>
<BR>
         Some snippets, for the Colonial Economists here....<BR>
<BR>
         "...the National Bank of Belgium sold 299 tonnes of gold in late <BR>
1997/early 1998..."  (~1.1dtons)<BR>
<BR>
         "...The world's central banks and monetary institutions still hold <BR>
34,000 tonnes, or 25% of all above-ground stocks..."  (~125.8dton)<BR>
<BR>
         "...Switzerland, for example, has announced plans to sell around <BR>
half of its very high stocks of gold...  total "excess" confirmed at <BR>
approximately 1400 tonnes..." (~5.2dtons)<BR>
<BR>
         At a guess-price of Cr220/Toz, that rings in for 1.72BCr/dton <BR>
(packaged for shipping)...  Hmm...  Nope, my numbers weren't even *close* <BR>
to sane.  One can rough out that in ~5000 years of panicking about the <BR>
stuff, we've hauled ~500dton to the surface;  or ~.1dton per year.  So my <BR>
seven-year-old colony should have a stockpile of somewhere in the .7dton to <BR>
1.5dton range, to allow for a) improvements in technology and b) having <BR>
other things to worry about.<BR>
<BR>
         Thanks to everyone on the list for all your help!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:30:49 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Plasma Guns<BR>
<BR>
At 20:44 -0400 29/4/00, "Katharine Whitchurch" <BR>
<katts@globalfreeway.com.au> wrote:<BR>
>Great weapons. Great, great weapons. Can these get posted on the web<BR>
>somewhere ?<BR>
<BR>
If you send me a selection and some blurb, I'm happy to consider a <BR>
2000 edition of the FS catalogue at BITS.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:35:25 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US<BR>
<BR>
At 1:23 -0400 30/4/00, "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au> wrote:<BR>
>There are many others too.  I can't name them all, but we can list every<BR>
>Imperial client state, to begin with.  We can, no doubt, add a bunch of<BR>
>independent worlds (Collace?).  Then there are significant interstellar<BR>
>states.  These include:  the Senlis Foederate (Trojan Reach), the<BR>
>Thoengling Empire (Gvurrdon), and a swag of others out in Foreven and Far<BR>
>Frontiers.  And this is only the start of the list.  Furthermore, there is<BR>
>no obviously good reason why shorter term alliances aren't possible to<BR>
>achieve common goals.<BR>
<BR>
And in Milieu 0 there will be a lot more client states/allies as the <BR>
Imperium expands/annexes it's neighbours.<BR>
<BR>
>The Imperium actively engages in diplomacy, alliance-building, and military<BR>
>and non-military cooperation with other states all over the place.  Yes, it<BR>
>has allies.<BR>
<BR>
Next you'll say the Imperium actively indulges in empire-building ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2376<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Sunday, April 30 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2377<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: Gearhead Question: Feasibility of LHyd as Fuel for IC Engines<BR>
Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
Re: RL Merc Ticket!<BR>
Re: RL Merc Ticket!<BR>
Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
Re: Nordic words<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2375 -- Another Question<BR>
Re: VR<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2376<BR>
Re: Gearhead Question: Feasibility of LHyd as Fuel (Longish)<BR>
More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:37:17 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
At 1:23 -0400 30/4/00, "Legate Legion" <legate@futureone.com> wrote:<BR>
>    Calm down.  He most likely wasn't even born when Star Wars came out, for<BR>
>the first time.  (To all of you young whippersnappers, that would be Star<BR>
>Wars:  A New Hope, before it was restored, digitalized, an had a name<BR>
>change.)<BR>
<BR>
Episode IV was always called 'A New Hope' in the yellow scrolling titles.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 05:08:43 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> In reference to the derision toward the H&I comment about aliens<BR>
> being humans in rubber suits, I'm not sure that it's an incorrect<BR>
> statement - or that it _can_ be an incorrect statement.<BR>
><BR>
> The "problem" comes down to the fact that all of these aliens are<BR>
> being invented and described by humans - humans who _can't_<BR>
> _possibly_ have any experience outside the human viewpoint.  All<BR>
> of the explanations - even those putatively by the aliens<BR>
> themselves - are going to be from the human viewpoint, and imbued<BR>
> with the human worldview.<BR>
<BR>
Just keep in mind that there *isn't* any "human viewpoint" or "human<BR>
worldview". But there *are* a whole bunch of *cultural* ones. And some<BR>
*human* cultures are alien beyond what most authors would *dare* try to<BR>
pass off as an alien culture.<BR>
<BR>
> Orson Scott Card, in _Speaker_For_The_Dead_, outlined the concept<BR>
> well in his hierarchy of foreignness.  In that hierarchy, there<BR>
> are three kinds of strangers with whom we may have conversation<BR>
> (implied meaning: _meaningful_ conversation, with common and<BR>
> agreed concepts), and one with whom we may not [1]; of the three,<BR>
> the third, _raman_, is characterized in SFTD as "human, but of<BR>
> another species".  This is, in short, the "alien as human in a<BR>
> rubber suit".  It is _because_ they are "human" that we can<BR>
> interact to mutual understanding; were they not "human",<BR>
> meaningful interaction to mutual understanding would perforce be<BR>
> precluded - as, for example, with animals (in fact, that is the<BR>
> distinction between ramen and varelse as given in SFTD).  To<BR>
> recognize (for example) the Vargr or the Aslan as sophont is to<BR>
> classify them as _raman_ - that is, to identify them as "human";<BR>
> it says immediately that we have identified some sort of common<BR>
> basis on which to interact with them.  We cannot know if varelse<BR>
> are sophont or not; we have not and cannot establish meaningful<BR>
> interaction to find out.<BR>
<BR>
I haven't read those books, so I can't comment on his definitions. But<BR>
again, if you check with anthropologists, you'll find that there are<BR>
human cultures that westerners have *very* little common ground with. <BR>
<BR>
> This is not to say that we can fully understand ramen - or even<BR>
> fr=E4mlings or utl=E4nnings.  That we can recognize them as "foreign"<BR>
> to ourselves indicates that we recognize cultural assumptions in<BR>
> them that we do not share - or cultural concepts in ourselves<BR>
> that we perceive that they do not share. We may "understand"<BR>
> those concepts in the sense that we can say, "oh, yes, s/he does<BR>
> that because 'face' is very important to them", but do we truly<BR>
> understand what 'face' _is_ - what _all_ the social ramifications<BR>
> are?  All of our attempts to explain them will fall short of the<BR>
> mark, not by intent, but simply because the words we hear are<BR>
> imbued with _our_ cultural baggage, not that of the speaker (and<BR>
> translation may compound the problem, as the _translator's_<BR>
> cultural baggage may also be involved).<BR>
<BR>
True enough.<BR>
<BR>
> For example: Most of us<BR>
> here on the TML are from Western European cultures - and probably<BR>
> Americans, at that.  We can discuss seppuku and the reasons<BR>
> someone might commit it intellectually, but it's a good bet that<BR>
> in similar situations, none of us would consider it as a viable<BR>
> course of action - we simply do not have the cultural outlook<BR>
> that includes such an act as a viable response to a situation -<BR>
> and in situations where a person from our culture _does_ include<BR>
> self-obliteration as a "viable" response, that person is often<BR>
> immediately judged to be in serious need of psychological help.<BR>
<BR>
Not alway. And I have to note that some of us *can* understand such<BR>
things at an *emotional* level, while at the same time not letting that<BR>
affect our actions. <BR>
<BR>
I'm phrasing this poorly, because English doesn't have the words for<BR>
it. Brest I can describe it is that given enough behavioral data, I can<BR>
"extract" the rules behind them well enough to anticipate reactions and<BR>
even the "reasons" behind them. I just can't always render the results<BR>
into English. :-)<BR>
<BR>
All cultures have such "rules" built upon "fundamental assumptions". If<BR>
they didn't they wouldn't *be* a culture/society.<BR>
<BR>
It's *possible* for aliens to have rules thatr "don't make sense" to<BR>
us, because of the assumptions behind them. But just as it's possible<BR>
to learn to "think" in non-Euclidean geometries, or in "higher<BR>
dimensions", We should be able to internalize the alien rules well<BR>
enough to more or less anticipate their actions/reactions. <BR>
<BR>
Doing so *will* require great mental flexibility, and may even be<BR>
somewhat of a risk to "sanity (of course, much of "sanity" is<BR>
culturally defined). <BR>
<BR>
> Similar cultural gulfs necessarily exist with respect to Vargr<BR>
> concepts of what we have labelled "charisma", to Aslan concepts<BR>
> of what we have labelled "honor", and so on. They do not preclude<BR>
> interaction to mutuality of concept (thus ensuring that they are<BR>
> ramen, rather than varelse), but at the same time, the fact that<BR>
> we can recognize them - or that we can recognize a culture at all<BR>
> - says that they _are_, in some respect, "human".  If we can<BR>
> identify them as _ramen_, we are saying, in essence, "these are<BR>
> humans in funny suits"<BR>
<BR>
Sorry, but I disagree. You see, "humans in funny suits" has a long<BR>
history as a phrase meaning the exact *opposite* of your usage.<BR>
Essentially it means "They may *look* alien, but they are acting<BR>
exactly as you'd expect humans to act". And in most cases, *Western*,<BR>
20th century humans. <BR>
<BR>
> We will not be able to understand _truly_ alien concepts - we<BR>
> won't even be able to discuss them: to discuss them, we must have<BR>
> a way to identify and describe them, and if they are truly alien,<BR>
> we won't have words useful for describing them - and if we make<BR>
> up the words to describe them, all we have done is label them -<BR>
> we still can't discuss it meaningfully. To do so, we would have<BR>
> to define the label in some way, which means we would have to<BR>
> understand the concept well enough to be able to describe it<BR>
> using words that have our own cultural baggage attached - and if<BR>
> we could discuss it in such meaningful terms, it wouldn't be<BR>
> truly alien.  In short, because we are human, our aliens _must_<BR>
> be "humans in rubber suits".<BR>
<BR>
Sorry, but you are suffering from a common misconception. First of all,<BR>
it's possible to have/understand a concept *without* being able to put<BR>
it into words.  <BR>
<BR>
Second, we *can* define the concept. All we need is a referent to point<BR>
at. That can be done in situations where we may not be able to write<BR>
the sort of definition you find in a dictionary. <BR>
<BR>
So it's possible to assign labels, *meaningful* labels to *anything, as<BR>
long as you have an object or action to assign them to. Or you can<BR>
borrow the "native" term. "Savoir faire" is a good example. You can<BR>
understand the concept *long* before you can write a "definition" that<BR>
will convey your understanding to another person.<BR>
<BR>
But as long as you can point to a person's behavior in several<BR>
situations and state when he does and does not exhibit savior faire,<BR>
you *have* accurately labeled it. <BR>
<BR>
In short the inability of a given language to *express* a concept has<BR>
no bearing on the ability of a speaker of that language to *grasp* the<BR>
concept. <BR>
<BR>
Say your language had no word for green or blue, but used one word<BR>
"mlap" to refer to both. You will *never* be able to define "green" or<BR>
"blue" *usefully* in that language without (in essence) *inventing* new<BR>
words, or providing a color chart with various samples labeled "green"<BR>
and "blue", and (of course) where green stops and blue starts is<BR>
actually rather arbitrary. <BR>
<BR>
Now imagine trying this with someone who is totally colorblind. Believe<BR>
it or not, he may actually learn to tell green from blue fairly well.<BR>
But he'll consider it a pretty silly distinction. (yes, really,<BR>
apparently a lot pof colorblind folks can see a difference in visual<BR>
aspect that more or less corresponds with "color" but to *them* it's<BR>
*far* less important than shade and intensity. That is, if they *study*<BR>
the object they can assign a color to it, but if they just *look* at<BR>
it, that "sensation" is buried beneath the "sensation" of how<BR>
bright/dark it is, and other aspects, some of which *we* may not pay a<BR>
lot of attention to).<BR>
<BR>
Ditto for "tone deaf". It's not that they can't *hear* the notes. It's<BR>
just that they don't see why we get so excited about these various<BR>
combinations of sounds. <BR>
<BR>
So we've got *humans* with whom there's a gap as great as that with any<BR>
alien. Yet even so, they get the idea that these things *are* important<BR>
to us, even if they don't understand why. <BR>
<BR>
Now consider a species that can (like many insects) "see" the<BR>
polarization of light. This will likely be at least as important to<BR>
*them* as tone or color is to us. So while we can grasp the concept,<BR>
the "meaning" will be harder. <BR>
<BR>
So a concept doesn't *have* to be alien to be a barrier. <BR>
<BR>
I daresay that differences in the way sensory apparatus works will be<BR>
*far* more of a problem that "alien concepts". <BR>
<BR>
Here's a thought for you. What was Helen Keller? I'd argue that *at<BR>
best* she was "raman". <BR>
<BR>
Communication, "understanding", and "empathy" are three *different*<BR>
things even when dealing with humans. We can communication with Helen<BR>
Keller or with a pure sociopath. We can sort of "understand" both their<BR>
worlds. But "empathize" with them? No.<BR>
<BR>
Yet as I noted initially, we may come to understand *how* the reactions<BR>
driven by the stuff we can't "empathize" drive them, just like a tone<BR>
deaf man can learn to anticipate the effects of music on "normal"<BR>
people. But we'll never know *why* they react that way.<BR>
<BR>
Still, I think this means that any sort of alien that can live on<BR>
planets we would have any interest in ought to be similar enough that<BR>
we can co-exist, even if we and they spend a lot of time going "*Why*<BR>
do they xxxx?"<BR>
<BR>
C.J. Cherryh presents some rather alien, aliens in some of her books,<BR>
yet does so in such a manner that with some work, readers can<BR>
understand *how* they think, even if the *why* remains a mystery. <BR>
<BR>
The Faded Sun trilogy<BR>
The Chanur books<BR>
40,000 in Gehenna<BR>
<BR>
And a few of the other Union/Alliance stories. I can never remember<BR>
which side is which, but the ones with the Azi are often *more* alien<BR>
to *us* than a good many of her other aliens.<BR>
<BR>
Some of Gordon Dickson's earlier work had some moderately alien aliens<BR>
(based on his studies of anthropology and ethology). But while Dickson<BR>
was good at coming up with bases for such cultures, we wasn't as good<BR>
at *showing* you what the differences *meant*. He usually had to have a<BR>
character *explain* the alien motivations. Cherryh sometimes tosses out<BR>
tidbit, but mostly she *shows* you actions that lead you to figure out<BR>
the motivations yourself. <BR>
<BR>
BTW, be careful if you read the Chanur books (especially the Trilogy)<BR>
both intently and fast. I and several other people I know got a bt<BR>
*too* well acquainted with the way her "Kif" think... Sort of like<BR>
reading about a serial killer at realizing that you understand his <BR>
motives... brrr.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:18:05 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Gearhead Question: Feasibility of LHyd as Fuel for IC Engines<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> While working out a few details on my TML Landgrab project (Leander), I<BR>
> realized that a world of 800 sophonts could not easily provide distilled<BR>
> hydrocarbon fuel for TL5 IC engines.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, if you aren't worried about maximizing the efficiency,<BR>
distilling fuel for TL-5 engines is *easy*. About as hard as distilling<BR>
Whiskey. With 800 people you don't need a lot. Heck, if there's a local<BR>
petroleum seep, you can probably skip drilling a well!<BR>
<BR>
> OTOH, an imported LHyd refinery<BR>
> (at say, TL12) could easily be operated with minimal manpower, although<BR>
> anything other than operator maintnance would require off-world tech<BR>
> support.<BR>
<BR>
> Would LHyd work as a fuel for IC engines (or other TL5 engines)?  What<BR>
> problems would this present?<BR>
<BR>
It'd require some adjustments. And the *big* problem is that using LH2<BR>
means your fuel tank winds up something like 10 times as big as<BR>
with gasoline or diesel. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 06:10:44 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> The highest *CLEARANCE* that anyone can have is "Top Secret". It is the<BR>
> caveats attached to this classification that got you access to other things.<BR>
> For example; I had a "Top Secret Crypto" (stands for Top Secret,<BR>
> Cryptographic access) clearance when assigned to the USASA. When we rolled<BR>
> into the MI the classification was changed to read "Top Secret SI" (stands<BR>
> for Top Secret, Special Intelligence access) and covered me for all of the<BR>
> standard requirements in the MI field. It didn't get me into the "Nuclear"<BR>
> world, although my clearance was high enough, I didn't have a need to know.<BR>
> If I had needed to work with the nuclear forces I would have gotten a 1 time<BR>
> "read on" for that assignment. I did have requirements to do some "special"<BR>
> work that required me to get access to a number of the "Very Restricted<BR>
> Knowledge" (VRK series) "read-ons" and as soon as the projects were over I<BR>
> was "read-off" or "debriefed from that level of access. I held my clearances<BR>
> for 25 years and felt naked when I was finally debriefed from all access'.<BR>
<BR>
I'm reminded of the most *frustrated* I've ever been. A friend had a<BR>
relative visit on leave. She worked in SIGINT, and I'm pretty sure that<BR>
she was in cryptanalysis. I've been into that since shortly after I<BR>
learned to read. <BR>
<BR>
Alas, I knew all too well, that even *trying* to talk shop was a bad<BR>
idea. So our conversation on the subject was essentially, my saying<BR>
"I'm into cryptography, pity we can't talk about it" and her replying<BR>
"Yep."<BR>
<BR>
> I would be happy to go into further detail off-line but there is a limit to<BR>
> what I can say about how the system is set-up (even now, 5 years after my<BR>
> final debriefing) so please don't be too specific.<BR>
<BR>
You probably can neither confirm nor deny that there are clearance<BR>
levels that only holders of said clearances are allowed to know<BR>
exist... <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 09:57:26 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: RL Merc Ticket!<BR>
<BR>
Karen and Michael Hughes wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> It's got a Trav adventure all over it (replace heli's with grav craft). Make<BR>
> it a cadre ticket of PC mercs training the strikeforce and grav pilots. Then<BR>
> watch the fun begin.<BR>
<BR>
And then have them travel by boat through the South China<BR>
Sea to protect precious cargo from real live Pirates!<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:46:33 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: RL Merc Ticket!<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <BR>
> This is response to tribal fighting using semi automatic weapons<BR>
<BR>
It wasn't so long ago when it was bows and arrows.  There has been a bit of<BR>
an arms race in the last couple of decades. <BR>
<BR>
> PNG has gone a tad anarchic in the past few years <BR>
<BR>
That's putting it mildly.  <BR>
<BR>
Of course, even without all the bad stuff - corruption, poverty, etc, PNG<BR>
is fundamentally ungovernable.  <BR>
<BR>
> It's got a Trav adventure all over it (replace heli's with grav craft).<BR>
Make<BR>
> it a cadre ticket of PC mercs training the strikeforce and grav pilots.<BR>
Then<BR>
> watch the fun begin.<BR>
<BR>
You didn't tell everyone what the terrain is like! :)<BR>
<BR>
OK, everyone, listen up.  You remember a thread a couple of weeks ago about<BR>
swamps on hilltops?  Well, these are serious mountains.  Think "vertical<BR>
swamp".  Anywhere that's not swamp is jungle.  Add lots of cloud cover<BR>
(halfway up the mountains!), and at least some rain virtually every day of<BR>
the year.<BR>
<BR>
Oh, and the communities are _very_ close knit.  That bandit you just shot<BR>
was related to at least some senior members of the government.  _And_ some<BR>
of the local staff at your base.  And workers on the plantations you are<BR>
supposed to be protecting.  And some of the local cops, and some of the<BR>
local army, and local journalists, student radicals, lawyers, trade<BR>
unionists, priests, publicans, prostitutes...<BR>
<BR>
> Of course, it is all very sad.<BR>
Damn straight.<BR>
<BR>
One day I'm going back up to PNG.  It may only be for a couple of days, but<BR>
I'm going back.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:25:46 -0400<BR>
From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Leonard Erickson" <shadow@krypton.rain.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2000 10:10 AM<BR>
Subject: Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US forces<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> I'm reminded of the most *frustrated* I've ever been. A friend had a<BR>
> relative visit on leave. She worked in SIGINT, and I'm pretty sure that<BR>
> she was in cryptanalysis. I've been into that since shortly after I<BR>
> learned to read.<BR>
><BR>
> Alas, I knew all too well, that even *trying* to talk shop was a bad<BR>
> idea. So our conversation on the subject was essentially, my saying<BR>
> "I'm into cryptography, pity we can't talk about it" and her replying<BR>
> "Yep."<BR>
><BR>
Unfortunately Signals Intelligence or "SIGINT" covers a wide variety of<BR>
categories in the Intel world. She might have been a linguist or an analyst<BR>
or possibly one of the morse code fields or as you suspected, crytography.<BR>
If you know her "MOS" code you could then figure out what she did. Most<BR>
SIGINT'ers are 98GnL xx (where "98G" is the MOS code, "n" is the level they<BR>
are at, [1, 2, 3, or 4], "L" stands for Language and the "xx" would be the<BR>
two letter language identifier ["RU" would be Russian]) linguists and 98C<BR>
analysts. The linguists listen to the radio traffic and translate it. The<BR>
98C's pore over the transcripts digging out the tidbits. Cryptoanalysis now<BR>
falls under the 98C and s/he will have whats called an Additional Skill<BR>
Identifier or "ASI". Your friend might have an MOS code of 98C3L RU C4. She<BR>
would be a Staff Sergeant (E-6) (the "3" following 98C says she is skill<BR>
level 3 or "E-6"), "Traffic Analyst" that has graduated from the Language<BR>
Institute (in Monterey, CA) with Russian as a language and is a trained<BR>
cryptographer (I used "C4" as the ASI code but that is arbitrary, as I can't<BR>
remember what the real code is anymore). This is the short version of Army<BR>
MOS decyphering. The Army does have a web page that breaks all of this out.<BR>
I will look it up and post the URL if anyone is interested. I spent my<BR>
enlisted time as a 98J40 J1 K3 C4 and then I went the Warrant Officer route<BR>
and my MOS code changed to 983A. This later was changed to 352J about a year<BR>
before I retired. It was the same MOS but the Army restructured the coding<BR>
system and mine was recoded.<BR>
><BR>
> > I would be happy to go into further detail off-line but there is a limit<BR>
to<BR>
> > what I can say about how the system is set-up (even now, 5 years after<BR>
my<BR>
> > final debriefing) so please don't be too specific.<BR>
><BR>
> You probably can neither confirm nor deny that there are clearance<BR>
> levels that only holders of said clearances are allowed to know<BR>
> exist...<BR>
><BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
><BR>
What you are asking I can't directly respond to. Let me say this, whenever<BR>
you are "read-on" for a project you will be debriefed (we jokingly called it<BR>
degaussing) at the end of the project or when you leave it. Because I've<BR>
been debriefed I can't remember what I was read-on for.<BR>
<BR>
Thom<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 00:39:06 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Nordic words<BR>
<BR>
The only version of Ramen that springs to my mind is Japenese...But I dont think the<BR>
reference is to a bowl of noodles...<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> TOCoons@cs.com wrote:<BR>
> > Card does speak Portuguese, but my guess would be that his knowledge of<BR>
> > Swedish comes through a friend or family member.<BR>
><BR>
> Or through a dictionary, since he got the basic forms of the words right, but<BR>
> used English plural forms.<BR>
><BR>
> I still haven't figured out what "raman" is supposed to mean, though. The<BR>
> closest guess I have is that it could refer to the aliens in "Rama" (A. C.<BR>
> Clarke), but that seems wrong.<BR>
><BR>
> +--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
> |                                      |                                       |<BR>
> | Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
> | Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
> | Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
> | ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
> |                                      |                                       |<BR>
> +--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 08:10:50 -0700 (MST)<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2375 -- Another Question<BR>
<BR>
That would be Biosphere II, and it's in Arizona, not Texas...though it was<BR>
an eccentric Texan billionaire who first founded it, (and was the model<BR>
for the eccentric Texan billionaire in Contact, btw...)<BR>
<BR>
Now managed by Columbia University, their web site is at: http://www.bio2.edu/<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 30 Apr 2000, Michel Vaillancourt wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 02:51 AM 4/30/00, you wrote:<BR>
> >Michel,<BR>
> ><BR>
> >You might try info from the biodrome project (in texas I think).  There <BR>
> >was a lot<BR>
> >of research done in this area.  Unfortunately, I don't have any links for you.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Kaz<BR>
> <BR>
>          Hi, Kaz!<BR>
>          I chase that down.  Thanks!<BR>
> <BR>
> 	<BR>
> 	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
> 	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 08:14:36 -0700 (MST)<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU><BR>
Subject: Re: VR<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 1 May 2000, Karen and Michael Hughes wrote:<BR>
 <BR>
> Of course, VR booths can be linked (which would be cool) for multi user<BR>
> experiences. Indeed a clever tech could remove the 'disclaimer', clean up<BR>
> the simulation and a PC would never know (if they had limited computer<BR>
> experience or are a low techie) they were boothed.<BR>
<BR>
"I'm DWAYNE DIBLEY???????!!!!!!????"<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:17:22 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
> <snip><BR>
> > It uses line numbers (it's THAT old)<BR>
><BR>
> Hey! Young wippersnapper! I'm currently employed to support a stockcontrol<BR>
> package written in a line-numbered dos basic (HAI*Basic, to be precise). I'm<BR>
> writing line-numbered code on a daily basis<BR>
<BR>
Ah, that's kid stuff! I wrote my FIRST Traveller program on an ENIAC 4000 in the<BR>
late<BR>
1940s. It took weeks to generate a SINGLE Traveller character, and that was back<BR>
when it had only 1 stat and chargen was nothing but a single Survival roll.<BR>
THOSE were the days!<BR>
<BR>
The Doppleganger Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:20:47 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
> >I prefer using fixed points from a pool (or using James's "three wishes"<BR>
> <BR>
> Everything old is new again. <g><BR>
> <BR>
> Brownie Points (MTPH, p 46):  Brownie points (BP) are special DM's<BR>
> received for significant successful efforts on the part of a<BR>
> character.  <BR>
<BR>
Damn. I *knew* I should've picked up the MTPH for $5 when I had the chance.<BR>
(I had given it a quick look, said "nothing here that isn't in the LBBs" and<BR>
returned it to the shelf...)<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 09:47:16 -0700<BR>
From: william wheeler <wuffa@inetarena.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2376<BR>
<BR>
Traveller-digest wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Traveller-digest       Sunday, April 30 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2376<BR>
><BR>
> (R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
> All rights reserved.<BR>
><BR>
> The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
><BR>
> Re: Looking for info...<BR>
> Re: Viva La Legion<BR>
> You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
> Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2375<BR>
> Gold Bars<BR>
> RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
> Re: Aliens in Rubber Suits<BR>
> Nordic words<BR>
> Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
> Re: surface area & heat radiation<BR>
> Hoody-doo<BR>
> Re: First Traveller Game (was Re: Battle Debris NavigationalHazards)<BR>
> One for the gearheads...<BR>
> Not _Just_ Camerone Day!<BR>
> Heaven & Earth Update<BR>
> "safing" CGen<BR>
> Re Card's Ratings of alienness<BR>
> Re: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
> Re: Nordic words<BR>
> Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2375 -- Another Question<BR>
> Re: Looking for info...<BR>
> Re: Looking for info...<BR>
> Re: Plasma Guns<BR>
> Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US<BR>
><BR>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
><BR>
> Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 06:26:43 +0100<BR>
> From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
> Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
><BR>
> - -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Matt Stevens <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com>;<BR>
> traveller@mpgn.com <traveller@mpgn.com><BR>
> Date: 30 April 2000 05:51<BR>
> Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
><BR>
> <snip><BR>
> > It uses line numbers (it's THAT old)<BR>
><BR>
> Hey! Young wippersnapper! I'm currently employed to support a stockcontrol<BR>
> package written in a line-numbered dos basic (HAI*Basic, to be precise). I'm<BR>
> writing line-numbered code on a daily basis<BR>
><BR>
> >you could incorporate it into a Visual Basic program if you wished.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Matt<BR>
><BR>
> Ohh, I wish! I really, really wish! You don't know how much I long for<BR>
> variable names other than A, A$, A1, A1$, A[2], A$[2], A1[2], A1$[2], where<BR>
> A is any letter, 1 is any single digit number 0-9, and 2 is any number<BR>
> 1-256... Talk about descriptive code <shudder><BR>
><BR>
> t'other Matt<BR>
> (harumph! damn upstarts taking my name... <g>)<BR>
> ><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
My Godson is running at work a HP2000 G<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 12:09:41 -0700<BR>
From: "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Gearhead Question: Feasibility of LHyd as Fuel (Longish)<BR>
<BR>
LHyd would be a good fuel for an IC engine, however, it would not be as<BR>
simple a conversion as say, Gasoline to Propane. The baisc problem with<BR>
Hyodrogen engines is Hydrogen has very low "Octane" (referring to its<BR>
burning properties under pressure, LHyd is, of course, an elemental gas in<BR>
liquid form, and does not contain the compound Octane). They require a<BR>
direct injected type engine arrangement (Commonly used in diesels<BR>
presently). Ford, Mercedes, and Rover have all demonstrated LHyd vehicles<BR>
using reciprocating engines, but the reason they have not seen commercial<BR>
use is because they are very sensitive to atmospheric changes (as it relates<BR>
to air density and compression ratios). I think I read somewhere that the<BR>
"Octane" test of Hydrogen is less than 70 using the R+M/2 method. An engine<BR>
designed specifically for LHyd would probably be a fairly high RPM and very<BR>
low compression gas turbine: It would still put out a good deal of power<BR>
because 1 kilo of hydrogen packs about twice the heat energy as a kilo of<BR>
gasoline.<BR>
<BR>
 ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Leonard Erickson" <shadow@krypton.rain.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2000 7:18 AM<BR>
Subject: Re: Gearhead Question: Feasibility of LHyd as Fuel for IC Engines<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> > While working out a few details on my TML Landgrab project (Leander), I<BR>
> > realized that a world of 800 sophonts could not easily provide distilled<BR>
> > hydrocarbon fuel for TL5 IC engines.<BR>
><BR>
> Actually, if you aren't worried about maximizing the efficiency,<BR>
> distilling fuel for TL-5 engines is *easy*. About as hard as distilling<BR>
> Whiskey. With 800 people you don't need a lot. Heck, if there's a local<BR>
> petroleum seep, you can probably skip drilling a well!<BR>
><BR>
> > OTOH, an imported LHyd refinery<BR>
> > (at say, TL12) could easily be operated with minimal manpower, although<BR>
> > anything other than operator maintnance would require off-world tech<BR>
> > support.<BR>
><BR>
> > Would LHyd work as a fuel for IC engines (or other TL5 engines)?  What<BR>
> > problems would this present?<BR>
><BR>
> It'd require some adjustments. And the *big* problem is that using LH2<BR>
> means your fuel tank winds up something like 10 times as big as<BR>
> with gasoline or diesel.<BR>
><BR>
> --<BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
>  shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
> leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 13:14:02 -0400<BR>
From: Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com><BR>
Subject: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
So, I'm reading "The Strategy and Tactics of Pricing" by<BR>
Nagle and Holden, a great book if you ever find yourself<BR>
in the position of having to price something.<BR>
<BR>
One bit caught my eye and I thought seemed germane to those<BR>
running trader campaigns:<BR>
<BR>
 "For industries with high fixed costs, segmented pricing is often<BR>
  essential. The U.S. rail system, for example, could never have been<BR>
  built and could not currently be maintained were it not for a <BR>
  strategy of extensively segmented prices. Railroad tariffs are based<BR>
  on the value of goods hauled. Coal and unprocessed grains, for<BR>
  example, are carried at a much lower cost per carload than are<BR>
  manufactured goods. If railroads had to charge all shippers the<BR>
  same tariff charged for unprocessed grain, they would lack sufficient<BR>
  income per shipment to cover their fixed costs. Were they required<BR>
  to charge all shippers the tariff for manufactured goods, they<BR>
  would lose many shippers and so would again lack sufficient<BR>
  revenue. Without segmented pricing, many rail lines could never cover<BR>
  their costs, whereas others would be forced either to raise tariffs<BR>
  above the highest currently charged or suffer the same fate. The <BR>
  railroads survive to serve all their customers at reasonable rates<BR>
  only because the customers can be effectively segmented for pricing."<BR>
            - Nagle and Holden, p. 230-231<BR>
<BR>
Now, someone will probably just reply and say "go buy GT:FT", but<BR>
I guess the obvious conclusion that I draw is that the stock <BR>
per-dT price for cargo is just a game simplification and people<BR>
that try to assess real-world profitability are not going to be able<BR>
to do it with that figure. In a "real" TU, free traders, et al make<BR>
their living by shipping really, really high value cargo and <BR>
charging correspondingly high rates. Most free traders probably <BR>
handle cargo by hand (on grav palettes) enabling them to take care<BR>
of things that a bulk freighter just can't deal with - things<BR>
like art, specialized equipment, rare livestock, etc. Of course,<BR>
these are the same kinds of cargos that tend to get people in trouble...<BR>
<BR>
Anyway, it is a really good book, if you're into that kind of thing. :)<BR>
<BR>
Ethan<BR>
- --<BR>
Ethan Henry                                         egh@klg.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2377<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2378</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Sunday, April 30 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2378<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Nordic words<BR>
RE: GT GF Playtest<BR>
Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
anyone out there?<BR>
Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
Re: anyone out there?<BR>
Re: One for the gearheads<BR>
Re: Another Question....<BR>
Re: anyone out there?<BR>
Re: Re increased radiation surface<BR>
TML Landgrab - Ylaven/Lanth Web Site<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2377<BR>
OT: Episode IV<BR>
Re: Episode IV<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
RE: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
Re: Another Question....<BR>
RE: Plasma Guns<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
Re Card's Ratings of alienness<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 19:33:24 +0200 (MET DST)<BR>
From: Tommy Grav <tommy.grav@astro.uio.no><BR>
Subject: Re: Nordic words<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 30 Apr 2000, Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I still haven't figured out what "raman" is supposed to mean, though. The<BR>
>closest guess I have is that it could refer to the aliens in "Rama" (A. C.<BR>
>Clarke), but that seems wrong.<BR>
<BR>
Could it be that he is meaning "mann fra ra" - in english "man from ra" or<BR>
"man of the ra". Ra is (at least in norwegian) a geological structure. It <BR>
is the stones and earth pushed forward by the advancing ice during an iceage.<BR>
When the ice later receedes the ra formes a large natural hill-line.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
<BR>
Tommy Grav<BR>
- -------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
tommy.grav@astro.uio.no     http://www.uio.no/~tommygr/  <BR>
Institute of Astrophysics, UiO, No  <BR>
IMTU tn++t4+tg+ ru+ge++ !3i jt+au+st+ls hi++dr-so++zh-sy-sw++ <BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:14:55<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: GT GF Playtest<BR>
<BR>
At 02:42 PM 4/28/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
>> GT Ground Forces playtest files now available<BR>
><BR>
>My first read-through, it looks very cool. I remember volunteering my name<BR>
>for use in the text, and in the course of reading the playtest files, I<BR>
>found it. Thanks, Doug. Even generated a character based on the name, and<BR>
>it's just the type of character I'd probably play. It's almost scary. Doug<BR>
>got my physical description (at that age, anyway,) dead on, too, except I<BR>
>have blue eyes instead of green. I must say, I am impressed. You Zhodani or<BR>
>something? :)<BR>
<BR>
I'm sorry, but as the author, I'm never wrong.  Please have your eyes<BR>
replaced asap.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks for the kind words.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 10:51:27 -0700<BR>
From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
>From: Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com><BR>
>Subject: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
...<BR>
> "For industries with high fixed costs, segmented pricing is often<BR>
>  essential. The U.S. rail system, for example, could never have been<BR>
>  built and could not currently be maintained were it not for a <BR>
>  strategy of extensively segmented prices. Railroad tariffs are based<BR>
...<BR>
>  railroads survive to serve all their customers at reasonable rates<BR>
>  only because the customers can be effectively segmented for pricing."<BR>
>            - Nagle and Holden, p. 230-231<BR>
<BR>
  A limitation here is that railroads (and systems where terminals for<BR>
ships/craft of whatever sort are required) require a very large fixed<BR>
investment before any cargo is shipped, but once at that point the <BR>
amount of cargo that can be hauled over that infrastructure is then<BR>
relatively of little impact on your capital costs (:simplification).<BR>
<BR>
  For Trav starships the substantial capital costs are almost directly<BR>
related to capacity - even terminal facilities (given AG for landing)<BR>
are mostly for local admin/trans-shipping convenience and not the use<BR>
of the incoming cargo haulers themselves.<BR>
<BR>
        Steven Hudson<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:16:51 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: allensh <allensh@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: anyone out there?<BR>
<BR>
Just resubbed and testing to see if the list is still<BR>
around..I tried to get the digest format and it never<BR>
sent me any messages.<BR>
<BR>
Allen<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
http://im.yahoo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 13:14:58 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Survival Roll (was re:Hoody-hoo!)<BR>
<BR>
On 04/30/00 at 11:20 AM,  "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu> said:<BR>
<BR>
>> >I prefer using fixed points from a pool (or using James's "three wishes"<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Everything old is new again. <g><BR>
>> <BR>
>> Brownie Points (MTPH, p 46):  Brownie points (BP) are special DM's<BR>
>> received for significant successful efforts on the part of a<BR>
>> character.  <BR>
<BR>
>Damn. I *knew* I should've picked up the MTPH for $5 when I had the<BR>
>chance. (I had given it a quick look, said "nothing here that isn't in<BR>
>the LBBs" and returned it to the shelf...)<BR>
<BR>
Well, I've got the MT that is chock-a-block full of errata, and frankly I prefer CT for some things, but there *is* a lot of good stuff in the MT material.  BTW, if Erwin Fritz *ever* gets permission to send out more copies of his errataed-MT in Word I want to be on the top of the list. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:27:23 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: allensh <allensh@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: anyone out there?<BR>
<BR>
- --- allensh <allensh@yahoo.com> wrote:<BR>
> Just resubbed and testing to see if the list is<BR>
> still<BR>
> around..I tried to get the digest format and it<BR>
> never<BR>
> sent me any messages.<BR>
<BR>
never mind :) anyway, glad to be back among the<BR>
Traveller community..I have some GT ship stats and<BR>
other stuff I'll be posting over the next few weeks. <BR>
Allen<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Talk to your friends online and get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
http://im.yahoo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 11:45:48 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: One for the gearheads<BR>
<BR>
>    IMTC (TNE rules...a 'lost colony' type campaign...soon to webposted!<BR>
>) the homeworld has just broken TL-10 but with some differences...HePlaR<BR>
>(or Plasma Focus Drives) have recently been developed but power is a<BR>
>problem. The smallest fusion plant is 10dT and no fissionable materials<BR>
>readily available. And no CG. What would people do about landing ships<BR>
>for long duration exploration missions?<BR>
<BR>
I have several designs for TL8-9 orbit-to-surface vehicles for no CG<BR>
worlds. (In my mental picture, Earth didn't develop CG even when they<BR>
developed the jump drive - they had to copy it from the Vilani, so the<BR>
21st century was dominated by such vehicles.) Some are TNE HTHL<BR>
spaceplanes with AZHRAE;<BR>
some are FFS2 vertical-lift landers with mixed chemical and NTR propulsion.<BR>
Both types include<BR>
variants that run on hydrogen/oxygen and hence are field-refuellable.<BR>
(I was designing them in part for carriage by first-gen Terran jump ships.)<BR>
I can post them to the list if there's general interest or email privately.<BR>
<BR>
(Actually, I might have trouble finding the spaceplanes, so if anyone<BR>
kept those I'd be interested in getting a copy.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 14:09:42 -0700<BR>
From: Rob Eaglestone <downport@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Another Question....<BR>
<BR>
Michel Vaillancourt wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
>         Anyone know the "food density" currently achievable with modern<BR>
> hydroponics systems?  I am trying to roughly model out how much square area<BR>
> is required to sustainably feed 100 people for a year.  Thanks!<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
>         -- Michel R. Vaillancourt<BR>
>            (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
Hi Michel,<BR>
<BR>
Do what I do: fake it.<BR>
<BR>
Assume the average human consumes about 8 liters of food per day,<BR>
including liquids.  That's 50-60 liters per week, 2600 - 3000 <BR>
liters per year: 26-30 cubic meters per year.  Lay that out 1<BR>
meter tall and you have 6m x 5m x 1m.  That's dense-packed, all-edible<BR>
volume there, of course.  I don't know how dense hydroponics are,<BR>
but there's your limits food-storage wise.<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 15:17:07 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: anyone out there?<BR>
<BR>
Welcome back, Allen!  No major flame wars at the moment, but the penguins<BR>
are knee deep!  Wade in, grab a world ( http://www.downport.com/landgrab )<BR>
and rejoin the fun.<BR>
<BR>
- -Colin<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "allensh" <allensh@yahoo.com><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Just resubbed and testing to see if the list is still<BR>
> around..I tried to get the digest format and it never<BR>
> sent me any messages.<BR>
><BR>
> Allen<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 07:46:53 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re increased radiation surface<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Query...<BR>
>     How much heat would be lost via drive plasma?<BR>
<BR>
None, except *possibly* heat from the drive itself. <BR>
<BR>
Remember, a radiator has to be *cooler* than what you want to cool. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:39:38 +0100<BR>
From: Paul Campbell <paul@kemitix.uklinux.net><BR>
Subject: TML Landgrab - Ylaven/Lanth Web Site<BR>
<BR>
Okay,<BR>
<BR>
I've finally put together some of my information for Ylaven.<BR>
<BR>
You can have a look at what I've done so far at<BR>
http://www.kemitix.uklinux.net/tmllandgrab/ylaven/<BR>
<BR>
Any comments, on- or off-list are welcome.  Just don't go hitting the W3C HTML<BR>
4.0 button to validate the pages, they still need cleaned up a bit there.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Paul Campbell <paul@kemitix.uklinux.net><BR>
8:39pm up 15 days, 3:43, 1 user, load average: 0.20, 0.11, 0.02<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 13:27:24 -0700<BR>
From: Russell Bornschlegel <kaleja@estarcion.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2377<BR>
<BR>
Dom wrote:<BR>
> At 1:23 -0400 30/4/00, "Legate Legion" <legate@futureone.com> wrote:<BR>
> >    Calm down.  He most likely wasn't even born when Star Wars came out, for<BR>
> >the first time.  (To all of you young whippersnappers, that would be Star<BR>
> >Wars:  A New Hope, before it was restored, digitalized, an had a name<BR>
> >change.)<BR>
> <BR>
> Episode IV was always called 'A New Hope' in the yellow scrolling titles.<BR>
<BR>
I believe this is not true of the original theatrical release. I <BR>
think "Episode IV: A New Hope" was added to the crawl when it was <BR>
re-released in support of Empire Strikes Back (ca. 1980). It was <BR>
always the case, however, that Lucas envisioned it as "Episode IV".<BR>
<BR>
- -Russell B<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 14:43:53 -0600<BR>
From: Erwin Fritz <efritz@GLJA.com><BR>
Subject: OT: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
Russell Bornschlegel wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Dom wrote:<BR>
> > At 1:23 -0400 30/4/00, "Legate Legion" <legate@futureone.com> wrote:<BR>
> > >    Calm down.  He most likely wasn't even born when Star Wars came out, for<BR>
> > >the first time.  (To all of you young whippersnappers, that would be Star<BR>
> > >Wars:  A New Hope, before it was restored, digitalized, an had a name<BR>
> > >change.)<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Episode IV was always called 'A New Hope' in the yellow scrolling titles.<BR>
> <BR>
> I believe this is not true of the original theatrical release. I<BR>
> think "Episode IV: A New Hope" was added to the crawl when it was<BR>
> re-released in support of Empire Strikes Back (ca. 1980). It was<BR>
> always the case, however, that Lucas envisioned it as "Episode IV".<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
At last! Someone else who remembers this. Having seen Star Wars several<BR>
times before the 1980 rerelease, I remember distinctly being surprised<BR>
at the "Episode IV" header when the 1980 version came out. I too knew<BR>
that it was part 4 of a 9-part series, but the 1980 version was the<BR>
first time I saw this made "official".<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Erwin Fritz<BR>
Star Wars fan<BR>
Episode I  - 5 theatrical viewings<BR>
Episode IV - 13 theatrical viewings<BR>
Episode V  - 13 theatrical viewings<BR>
Episode VI - 6 theatrical viewings<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 16:51:59 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
I saw Star Wars when it first opened. No New Hope nonsense back then. I also<BR>
remember debating with friends whether something like Episode 4 would be<BR>
added when it was re-released after  Empire and Jedi.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 17:33:46 EDT<BR>
From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 4/30/00 10:15:53 AM Pacific Daylight Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
>  Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
>  <BR>
>  > <snip><BR>
>  > > It uses line numbers (it's THAT old)<BR>
>  ><BR>
>  > Hey! Young wippersnapper! I'm currently employed to support a <BR>
stockcontrol<BR>
>  > package written in a line-numbered dos basic (HAI*Basic, to be precise). <BR>
I'<BR>
> m<BR>
>  > writing line-numbered code on a daily basis<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Ah, that's kid stuff! I wrote my FIRST Traveller program on an ENIAC 4000 <BR>
in <BR>
> the<BR>
>  late<BR>
>  1940s. It took weeks to generate a SINGLE Traveller character, and that <BR>
was <BR>
> back<BR>
>  when it had only 1 stat and chargen was nothing but a single Survival roll.<BR>
>  THOSE were the days!<BR>
>  <BR>
>  The Doppleganger Matt<BR>
<BR>
I wrote pnzip/unzip when I was in High School with no computer education, so <BR>
there. Now if I had only known what I had created at the time would have been <BR>
worth money I'd be rich (well, at least independent) and retired already.<BR>
<BR>
Bryan<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:43:48 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
<BR>
Well, I have *most* of the series - yes, I admit to being one of those<BR>
SF buffs that buy whole collections by particular authors - but if I<BR>
wrote any more of it down, I'd risk cramp in an essential wrist as<BR>
well as being sued for infringement of copyright. But the books are<BR>
very good (except possibly for the four I'm missing...)<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Leonard<BR>
> Erickson<BR>
> Sent: 28 April 2000 09:14<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> > For your reading pleasure, here is the first<BR>
> > section of the first chapter of the first<BR>
> > Dumarest book.  I found it this Tuesday and<BR>
> > greatly relished reading it.  Visit your local<BR>
> > used bookstores and look for the Dumarest books<BR>
> > by E.C. Tubb if you like a well-written Sci-Fi<BR>
> > adventure that is Traveller compatible.<BR>
><BR>
> Given that his stuff was one of the *inspirations* for<BR>
> Traveller... :-)<BR>
><BR>
> > If anyone has this fine book, perhaps he or<BR>
> > she would condescend to volunteer to type in<BR>
> > the second [or third] section of Chapter 1.<BR>
><BR>
> Please *don't*. We don't want anyone being sued for copyright<BR>
> infringement. Those books won't be out of copyright until<BR>
> 50 (or is it<BR>
> 70?) years after the author *dies*.<BR>
><BR>
> I also think they may be back in print.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:51:40 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Another Question....<BR>
<BR>
At 06:09 PM 4/30/00, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Hi Michel,<BR>
<BR>
         Hi, Rob!<BR>
<BR>
>Do what I do: fake it.<BR>
<BR>
         Words from the Master!  <g><BR>
<BR>
>Assume the average human consumes about 8 liters of food per day,<BR>
>including liquids.  That's 50-60 liters per week, 2600 - 3000<BR>
>liters per year: 26-30 cubic meters per year.  Lay that out 1<BR>
>meter tall and you have 6m x 5m x 1m.  That's dense-packed, all-edible<BR>
>volume there, of course.  I don't know how dense hydroponics are,<BR>
>but there's your limits food-storage wise.<BR>
><BR>
>Rob<BR>
<BR>
         Cool.  Its not much of a hand-wave to say that 70% of a given <BR>
plant or animal is throw-away in terms of space required, so if I triple <BR>
that to 90m^3 per year I should have a good working basis.  Thanks very <BR>
much for the suggestion.<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 14:59:02 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Plasma Guns<BR>
<BR>
I'll see what I can do when I've got a few spare....<BR>
<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Katharine<BR>
> Whitchurch<BR>
> Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2000 2:14 PM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Plasma Guns<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> > From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
> > Subject: Plasma guns...<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Ok, I guess I just got on a design kick or something. A few plasma guns<BR>
> > to ponder:<BR>
> ><BR>
><BR>
> Right, thats it.<BR>
><BR>
> Veskrashen, you're hired as part of Famile Spofulam.<BR>
><BR>
> The idea of a Plasma Submachinegun is something that has Ditzie drooling.<BR>
><BR>
> Jesse, when you have a few spare minutes, can you do a pic of everybody's<BR>
> favorite tyke in rapid-fire mode ?<BR>
><BR>
> Great weapons. Great, great weapons. Can these get posted on the web<BR>
> somewhere ?<BR>
><BR>
> > Both weapons could conceivable be used be troops in regular flex armor,<BR>
> > or unaugmented battle dress. Either will penetrate light battle dress<BR>
> > (though the lighter of the two won't penetrate augmeted TL12+), and the<BR>
> > first has a hell of a lot better stats than the PCMP-12 published in<BR>
> > Emperor's Arsenal. The second is light enough that some of the less sane<BR>
> > among my players might consider it for room clearing. ("Supressive fire<BR>
> > on that doorway." "With a PLASMA GUN?!?!?")<BR>
><BR>
> "No, with the man-portable particle accelerator"<BR>
><BR>
> Ian Whitchurch<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:59:39 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> Just keep in mind that there *isn't* any "human viewpoint" or "human<BR>
> worldview". But there *are* a whole bunch of *cultural* ones. And some<BR>
> *human* cultures are alien beyond what most authors would *dare* try to<BR>
> pass off as an alien culture.<BR>
<BR>
How would you like to compete for the honor of being sacrificed to the gods? I<BR>
am pretty sure that most of the folks around here would not do their best in<BR>
such a contest...<BR>
<BR>
> I'm phrasing this poorly, because English doesn't have the words for<BR>
> it. Brest I can describe it is that given enough behavioral data, I can<BR>
> "extract" the rules behind them well enough to anticipate reactions and<BR>
> even the "reasons" behind them. I just can't always render the results<BR>
> into English. :-)<BR>
> <BR>
> All cultures have such "rules" built upon "fundamental assumptions". If<BR>
> they didn't they wouldn't *be* a culture/society.<BR>
<BR>
Most of the Nordic languages have one such example: the word/concept "lagom"<BR>
<BR>
"Lagom" is not possible to translate into English (or German, French, Spanish,<BR>
Italian, probably most other languages as well). The translation most often<BR>
found is "just the right amount," but it is not correct.<BR>
<BR>
"Lagom" is more like "not worth to improve/change/add/decrease, either because<BR>
it's not worth the effort, or because it works all right anyway." The most<BR>
obvious examples are temprature and amount of food, but you can also have<BR>
"lagom" money, "lagom" spare time, etc.<BR>
<BR>
Another example: In order for a bowl of food to feed all persons around the<BR>
table, everyone needs to take a "lagom" large amount of food from the bowl.<BR>
This kind of sharing is probably the origin of the word itself ("lag om" =<BR>
"around team/group").<BR>
<BR>
> It's *possible* for aliens to have rules thatr "don't make sense" to<BR>
> us, because of the assumptions behind them. But just as it's possible<BR>
> to learn to "think" in non-Euclidean geometries, or in "higher<BR>
> dimensions", We should be able to internalize the alien rules well<BR>
> enough to more or less anticipate their actions/reactions. <BR>
> <BR>
> Doing so *will* require great mental flexibility, and may even be<BR>
> somewhat of a risk to "sanity (of course, much of "sanity" is<BR>
> culturally defined). <BR>
<BR>
I guess that means my sanity will be harmed beyond repair by now... just<BR>
returning from yet another 12-hour period of studying calculus in a variable<BR>
number of dimensions as well as non-Euclidean geometries...<BR>
<BR>
I aM a PeNgUiN...<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 14:17:02 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com> wrote<BR>
 <BR>
> I'm reading "The Strategy and Tactics of Pricing" by<BR>
> Nagle and Holden, One bit caught my eye<BR>
<BR>
>  "For industries with high fixed costs, segmented pricing is often<BR>
>   essential. The U.S. rail system, for example, could never have been<BR>
>   built and could not currently be maintained were it not for a <BR>
>   strategy of extensively segmented prices. Railroad tariffs are based<BR>
>   on the value of goods hauled. Coal and unprocessed grains, for<BR>
>   example, are carried at a much lower cost per carload than are<BR>
>   manufactured goods. If railroads had to charge all shippers the<BR>
>   same tariff charged for unprocessed grain, they would lack sufficient<BR>
>   income per shipment to cover their fixed costs. <BR>
<BR>
This may not be an appropriate comparison as the canonical <BR>
Traveller universe does not have tariffs based on the value<BR>
of the goods. Therefore freight rates do not need to vary<BR>
based on the value of the goods. (Although more expensive<BR>
goods will be more expensive to ensure against loss so logically<BR>
if the shipper assumes this risk of loss then he would have<BR>
to raise his rates to cover this loss. Requiring the owner<BR>
of the freight to assume the risk of loss avoids this problem.)<BR>
<BR>
> Now, someone will probably just reply and say "go buy GT:FT", but<BR>
> I guess the obvious conclusion that I draw is that the stock <BR>
> per-dT price for cargo is just a game simplification and people<BR>
> that try to assess real-world profitability are not going to be able<BR>
> to do it with that figure. <BR>
<BR>
Of course its a simplification but, unlike a railroad, you don't<BR>
have to build tracks in jump space. It would probably be better<BR>
to compare space ship rates to water shipping rates because<BR>
(just like in space) ships don't have to have a path built for<BR>
them (except for canals, and harbors).<BR>
<BR>
> In a "real" TU, free traders, et al make<BR>
> their living by shipping really, really high value cargo and <BR>
> charging correspondingly high rates. Most free traders probably <BR>
> handle cargo by hand (on grav palettes) enabling them to take care<BR>
> of things that a bulk freighter just can't deal with - things<BR>
> like art, specialized equipment, rare livestock, etc. Of course,<BR>
> these are the same kinds of cargos that tend to get people in trouble...<BR>
<BR>
Why do you assume that the Free traders are shipping this cargo<BR>
as freight rather than simply buying it. You can make more money <BR>
(or loose more money if unlucky) with a higher value cargo because<BR>
an extra 10% on the Value table is ten times as much if the<BR>
goods are worth 10 times as much. While your rate of return on your<BR>
investment in the cargo is no better you get a much better return<BR>
on your fixed costs of ship operation.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:32:14 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re Card's Ratings of alienness<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 30 Apr 2000 08:53:32 -0400 (EDT), "William F. Hostman"<BR>
<aramis@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Subject: Re Card's Ratings of alienness<BR>
<BR>
... and I think here is the viewpoint problem - I perceive Card<BR>
as discussing less the question of "alienness" than of<BR>
"not-like-us-ness".  More to the point, I think that the entire<BR>
series is less focussed on the question of perception of the<BR>
alien than it is on our own "social maturity" (for lack of a<BR>
better phrase) - whether we perceive a non-human species as<BR>
_ramen_ or _varelse_ seems to be mostly a question of "how<BR>
broad-minded are _we_, who are doing the classification?".<BR>
<BR>
> the in between stage between the djur and varelse to me would contain<BR>
>soemthing like McCafree's Thoks (Dinosaur Planet Survivors, Death of Sleep,<BR>
>etc series): Beings whom, could we interact with them on a useful basis, we<BR>
>could come to some commonality of purpose, but due to alien physiognomy,<BR>
>are beyond the ability to communicate and interact with. With the exception<BR>
>of djur, all of his can be communicated with (even if no commonality of<BR>
>purpose can be reached). The thoks, while they are able to be coexisted<BR>
>with, cannot normally be communicated with.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, one could take the position that these might be hard to<BR>
classify, though I would think that there would be a<BR>
technological solution to the problem of communication.  Consider<BR>
the Cheela, from Robert L. Forward's _Dragon's_Egg_ (and sequel<BR>
_StarQuake_); they live much faster than us; the solution to the<BR>
establishment of communication, and therefore the proof of<BR>
_raman_ status (though Forward doesn't use this viewpoint) was<BR>
technological.  I would place the Thok squarely in _raman_, based<BR>
on your description (I haven't read the series in question).<BR>
McCaffery's Pernese dragons are potentially a little more<BR>
difficult to classify; there is communication and commonality of<BR>
some concepts, simplistically, but it's not clear whether the<BR>
level of intelligence displayed by the dragons would remain if a<BR>
particular dragon never established a telepathic rapport with a<BR>
rider - dragons, like the fire lizards they were developed from,<BR>
may be _varelse_ - but I am less certain of this classification<BR>
than I have been of any other aliens discussed in this context to<BR>
date.<BR>
<BR>
>As for varelse vs ramen: ramen are those that we can interact with and have<BR>
>no need to eradicate for our own presevation; the whole orthogoraphy has<BR>
>numerous gaps... any orthography will.<BR>
<BR>
Yes - but no: The issue of need to eradicate is the distinction<BR>
between _djur_ and _not-djur_; _djur_ need to be eliminated for<BR>
our own preservation, _varelse_ and the others do not.  The<BR>
_raman_/_varelse_ distinction is interaction to commonality of<BR>
concept.  Dogs and cats are _varelse_; Vargr and Aslan are<BR>
_ramen_. (Traveller uplifted dolphins are _ramen_; current<BR>
Terrestrial dolphins are currently considered _varelse_, but<BR>
there is a large and vocal minority who assert - with less than<BR>
totally convincing evidence - that they are _ramen_.)<BR>
<BR>
>Personally, I see more of a two axis approach:<BR>
>Axis one: can not interact - Can not communicate but can interact - can<BR>
>communicate effectively<BR>
>Axis two: xenocidal - hostile - neutral - friendly - xenophillial (in a<BR>
>non-sexual way) - sexually xenophillial (which is nearly to xenocidal by<BR>
>some people's mindsets.<BR>
<BR>
Yes - but Card's system doesn't need to take the second axis into<BR>
account - it's strictly first-axis.  Consider: The Zhodani are<BR>
undoubtedly _framling_ - but the relationship between them and<BR>
the Vilani is hostile.  Compare Vilani-Daryen: still _framling_,<BR>
but definitely not hostile.  In either case, the Vilani can<BR>
interact to mutuality of concept - but will disagree on the value<BR>
of the concept and the reaction to it with the Zhodani, and agree<BR>
with the Daryen. (Simplistic, but gets the idea across.<BR>
Actually, there will be many different concepts, with differing<BR>
reactions and values to each.  Such is the texture of<BR>
intersophont and intercultural relationships.)<BR>
<BR>
>But Card's orthography made my original point: when presenting traveller<BR>
>aliens, one should strive to make them seem closer to varelse than ramen;<BR>
>yeah, most groups will wind up with ramen. And of course, Zhodani and<BR>
>vilani would be utanlings: they look like us, but don't think like us.<BR>
>Traveller was my first experience with aliens which were presented by the<BR>
>game system supplements as more than "Men in suits"; presented with alien<BR>
>mindsets, and alien cultures. True, no traveller aliens in CT really got<BR>
>any wierder than some of the utanlings on earth, but they DON'T think like<BR>
>us; ramen, almost by cards own words, are thinking like us.<BR>
<BR>
Here we disagree: If Vargr/K'kree/Aslan/Jgd-Il-Jagd/whatever are<BR>
_varelse_, then there's no purpose to them; we don't, after all,<BR>
make any particular issue about the existence of, say, dogs in<BR>
the Traveller universe, and they rarely, if ever, are part of an<BR>
adventure.  The intelligent non-human in Traveller - or in Star<BR>
Trek, or whatever SF we are currently discussing - _must_ be<BR>
_raman_, or your plot opportunities are limited, to either<BR>
human-as-master-alien-as-pet, or the struggle to get the alien<BR>
_recognized_ as _raman_.<BR>
<BR>
All Traveller aliens are, and should be presented as, _ramen_;<BR>
the question is, are they _raman_ closer to being _framling_, or<BR>
_raman_ closer to being _varelse_?  From where I sit, Vargr are<BR>
closer to _framling_; Hiver are closer to _varelse_ - but both<BR>
are undoubtedly _raman_, and have been since their initial<BR>
presentation in Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
The question is not whether they think like us; that is why I<BR>
have been using the phrase "mutuality of concept" - in order to<BR>
communicate at all, and to have any chance of understanding the<BR>
motivations et cetera of an alien, there _must_ be concepts that<BR>
we have in common, and identify as such.  If there are no<BR>
identifiably common concepts, communication is impossible (though<BR>
coexistence may not be), and there is no essential difference<BR>
between the alien and the animal, hence they are _varelse_.  In<BR>
order to have a story, you must have the differences in thinking<BR>
that are emphasized in the background material for Traveller<BR>
aliens, but the aliens must be _ramen_ - they must have concepts<BR>
in common with us, to form a basis for interaction - not<BR>
agreement, interaction.<BR>
<BR>
>Say, Jeff, do you consider the pequenios to be ramen or varelse?<BR>
<BR>
Clearly and undoubtedly _ramen_. The fact that we were able to<BR>
have two-way communication with them indicates that.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2378<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2379</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Sunday, April 30 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2379<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Hiver HTH combat<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2377<BR>
Re: Re Card's Ratings of alienness<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Nordic words<BR>
Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: PNG<BR>
Re: TML Landgrab - Techie questions<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Another Question....<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Veskrashen Design SMG and Pistol<BR>
Re: Virtual Reality<BR>
Re: Plasma Guns<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: One for the gearheads...<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:28:53 EDT<BR>
From: Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Hiver HTH combat<BR>
<BR>
Since Hiver mouthparts are on their undersides, they haven't been <BR>
depicted in Traveller artwork.  What if they are very strong, (the <BR>
jaws, that is) and Hivers like to grapple in HTH (when they must) <BR>
and bite away with powerful, multi-toothed jaws (like the business <BR>
end of a leech)?<BR>
<BR>
Hivers evolved from scavengers, and I assume that most large critters<BR>
on their homeworld are built like Hivers -- six limbs emanating from <BR>
a central hub with a tough carapace.  How did non-sentient proto-Hivers<BR>
eat the corpses of their fellow animals?  They might be able to twist a<BR>
limb off to eat it (though their limbs are described as tough & leathery),<BR>
but how did they get at all the goodies inside the carapace?  How about <BR>
a protrusible organ inside the mouth cavity, equipped either with a rad-<BR>
ula (like a snail's) for rasping bits of meat from inside the prey, or <BR>
glands which secrete digestive enzymes that liquify the prey's innards,<BR>
which can then be sucked up by this "trunk"?  Hiver feeding on large car-<BR>
cases then begins with wrenching/biting the limbs off, followed by probing<BR>
with the, well, proboscis; the points of entry might be the stumps where <BR>
the limbs have been removed, the oro-genital-excretory pore, or the nos-<BR>
tril.   <BR>
<BR>
Hiver HTH combat might then consist of grappling an opponent with the six<BR>
limbs, and letting their mouth/proboscis do the damage.  Each limb has to<BR>
support 25 kg. for extended periods (1/6th * 150 kg.), so they're probably <BR>
fairly strong (though they're used to lower gravities than Earth's).  I <BR>
don't think I'd like to fight one hand to hand.  Might be different if I <BR>
had a spear or staff to jab/smack 'em with, but I wouldn't want to close <BR>
with one.  <BR>
<BR>
For combat communications, note that Hiver can whistle through their<BR>
nostril (from AM 7).  Striker 1 states that Hivers do have some Hiver <BR>
"manned" ground units, but they are only artillery, armour, or support;<BR>
no Hiver infantry units.  <BR>
<BR>
What was that Hammer film with the creatures that ate people's bone <BR>
marrow?  They looked like hivers, but had only one tentacle, were smaller, <BR>
and were dark coloured.  The late Peter Cushing was in it.<BR>
<BR>
Ludowick@aol.com                   <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:51:43 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2377<BR>
<BR>
Russell Bornschlegel wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> It was always the case, however, that Lucas envisioned it as "Episode IV".<BR>
<BR>
In some fan books, released prior to ESP, the first movie<BR>
was described at the fourth attempt by Lucas to make the<BR>
story and setting work.  Various elements from the previous<BR>
three drafts mutated into the characters in ANH.  Among them:<BR>
<BR>
 - Replacing the male protagonist Luke with a femail one named Leia<BR>
(later becomes sister to Luke instead of total replacement)<BR>
 - Leia's mentor was an old warrior named Han Solo (old character<BR>
becomes OB1, name becomes smuggler/scoundrel)<BR>
[There is a concept sketch of these two]<BR>
<BR>
 - Wookies were hairless and evil.  Ride giant bat-like creatures.<BR>
Luke battles the whole planet of them.<BR>
<BR>
I can't remember the other one.  IIRC, Lucas said what finally<BR>
made the background and characters come together was<BR>
the Empire vs. Rebel Alliance and Darth Vader, none of which<BR>
appeared in the earlier treatments.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:54:15 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Re Card's Ratings of alienness<BR>
<BR>
[snip]<BR>
<BR>
What in hell are you all talking about?<BR>
Ramen?  Djur?<BR>
<BR>
Ah never mind.  If it involves Card and McAffree,<BR>
I'm out.  Reading them gives me a headache.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 15:51:14 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 1:23 -0400 30/4/00, "Legate Legion" <legate@futureone.com> wrote:<BR>
>>    Calm down.  He most likely wasn't even born when Star Wars came out, for<BR>
>>the first time.  (To all of you young whippersnappers, that would be Star<BR>
>>Wars:  A New Hope, before it was restored, digitalized, an had a name<BR>
>>change.)<BR>
><BR>
> Episode IV was always called 'A New Hope' in the yellow scrolling titles.<BR>
<BR>
No it wasn't.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 17:14:40 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Nordic words<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 30 Apr 2000, Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I still haven't figured out what "raman" is supposed to mean, though. The<BR>
>closest guess I have is that it could refer to the aliens in "Rama" (A. C.<BR>
>Clarke), but that seems wrong.<BR>
<BR>
It's actually a slight mistranslation. It indcates that the aliens in question<BR>
make surprisingly tasty noodles when immersed in boiling water.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 19:16:05 -0500<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Why do you assume that the Free traders are shipping this cargo<BR>
> as freight rather than simply buying it. You can make more money<BR>
> (or loose more money if unlucky) with a higher value cargo because<BR>
> an extra 10% on the Value table is ten times as much if the<BR>
> goods are worth 10 times as much. While your rate of return on your<BR>
> investment in the cargo is no better you get a much better return<BR>
> on your fixed costs of ship operation.<BR>
<BR>
    But logically, the owner of the goods would know this as well.  Unless<BR>
you're dealing with someone totally untutored in the ways of space trade, they<BR>
would know that they could make a better profit themselves even if they had to<BR>
arrange for a broker's fees on the far end.  There might be an exception if<BR>
the goods have to travel a long way to market, but then the Free Traders might<BR>
not want to buy it either.<BR>
    Or perhaps the owner needs the cash now, but that's a special case.<BR>
    I'd definitely be wary of someone too eager to sell me the goods and let<BR>
me take my own chances on a profit.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Stormhound<BR>
DNRC Ombudsman for Induhvidual Affairs, Holder of Past Knowledge<BR>
Come visit my web page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd<BR>
Or my new Amateur Radio web page at http://www.qsl.net/kc0ekv<BR>
Or my JN6 course design page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd/golfpage.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:26:53 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
Leonard wrote:<BR>
<BR>
[Dom wrote:]<BR>
>> Episode IV was always called 'A New Hope' in the yellow scrolling titles.<BR>
><BR>
>No it wasn't.<BR>
<BR>
Okay. You've piqued my curiosity now. What makes you say that?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:44:45 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
> >> Episode IV was always called 'A New Hope' in the yellow scrolling<BR>
titles.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >No it wasn't.<BR>
><BR>
> Okay. You've piqued my curiosity now. What makes you say that?<BR>
<BR>
I'm no authority, but I do remember that when ESB came out there was quite a<BR>
hubbub over the fact that it was "Episode V".  Though I only saw Star Wars<BR>
about five times in original release, I do not recall seeing "A New Hope" on<BR>
it.  I do recall that the original poster was replaced by a tamer version<BR>
pretty quickly, but I don't recall exactly why.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Disclaimer: though I enjoyed Star Wars (and still do) I have never used any<BR>
of the characters or situations in a Traveller game.  I do admit to using<BR>
those cute little robot thingies that zip up and down the passages under<BR>
your feet, though ;-)<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 22:04:36 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: PNG<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-30 13:15:53 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< One day I'm going back up to PNG.  It may only be for a couple of days, but<BR>
 I'm going back >><BR>
<BR>
I had an uncle that visited for a couple of years in the early 40s. He's in <BR>
no hurry to return, even if we can guarantee no one will shoot at him this <BR>
time.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:27:50 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: TML Landgrab - Techie questions<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Sitting here working on my writeup of Ficant and reading John's question, I <BR>
> was struck by a similar problem. I've set Ficant at an early evolutionary <BR>
> stage (roughly equivalent to the Carboniferous period). Now this probably <BR>
> means no deposits of hydrocarbons?<BR>
<BR>
Not necessarily. There's a theory (not proven and rather controversial)<BR>
to the effect that at least *some* gas & oil deposits are the result of<BR>
carbonaceous meteorite impacts.<BR>
<BR>
> So I was assuming that they use alcohol distilled from local plants<BR>
> instead. Will this work, and is alcohol (I'm thinking<BR>
> methanol/ethanol) an inferior fuel to normal petrol/diesel? (I've<BR>
> assumed it is).<BR>
<BR>
There *is* a tendency to absorb water from the air, which requires<BR>
additive and special gas caps. And I'm not sure a diesel can run on<BR>
alcohol (I'm not sure how well it "pressure detonates"). But gasoline<BR>
engines are *easily* converted.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:40:50 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
>> <BR>
> <<snip>><BR>
>> <BR>
>> Hey! Young wippersnapper! I'm currently employed to support a stockcontrol<BR>
>> package written in a line-numbered dos basic (HAI*Basic, to be precise). <BR>
>> I'm writing line-numbered code on a daily basis<BR>
<BR>
Why not switch to a more modern BASIC? Even FirstBasic (a sort of<BR>
stripped down PowerBasic) would be better.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, converting datafiles could be a problem, but you only have to do<BR>
it *once*. <BR>
<BR>
>> Ohh, I wish! I really, really wish! You don't know how much I long for<BR>
>> variable names other than A, A$, A1, A1$, A[2], A$[2], A1[2], A1$[2], where<BR>
>> A is any letter, 1 is any single digit number 0-9, and 2 is any number<BR>
>> 1-256... Talk about descriptive code <shudder><BR>
<BR>
> Yes, I learned BASIC on a TRS-80 (later on a TI-99/4A).  And FORTRAN<BR>
> with punch cards.<BR>
<BR>
FORTRAN on punchcards, then BASIC using an ASR-33 on an HP-3000<BR>
timesharing system. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:44:38 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> The youngster Black ICE wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> You Know You're a Gearhead When...<BR>
>><BR>
>> ...you hear the term "G-string", and you immediately think of an<BR>
>> alphanumeric variable.<BR>
>><BR>
>> Yes, I learned BASIC on a TRS-80 (later on a TI-99/4A).  And FORTRAN<BR>
>> with punch cards.<BR>
><BR>
> Kids today. When I first wrote BASIC, it was on a teletype which had a<BR>
> maximum speed of 110 bps. We would save our programs on paper 5-hole<BR>
> teletype tape.<BR>
<BR>
Bet you a cookie it was *8*-hole, with the 8-th hole being parity.<BR>
5-hole (Baudot) code doesn't have all the characters required by even<BR>
the most *primitive* BASIC.<BR>
<BR>
And if you could print lowercase, it *definitely* wasn't 5-hole.<BR>
<BR>
> You would type in your code, debug it, and then to save it<BR>
> you did a three step process. You would first type "LIST" but not hit<BR>
> return. You would then turn on the tape puncher, then finally hit <cr> to<BR>
> start the tape punching process. You then took the paper tape, tore it off,<BR>
> rolled it up, and put in your pocket for later use.<BR>
<BR>
We were issued 35 mm film cans to store our tapes in.<BR>
<BR>
> And I had to do assembly language in college on punched cards. That was a<BR>
> real pain. If I thought card punchers were cool, you have no idea how cool I<BR>
> thought CRT terminals were when I first got to use one.<BR>
<BR>
I guess you never learned to program the "drum card" so that the<BR>
keypunch would automatically move to the next field, and do stuff like<BR>
automatically add (or increment) card numbers.<BR>
<BR>
> Geez, I've been programming for 28 years. I'll bet that's longer than some<BR>
> list readers have been alive. At least I started young. On the other hand, I<BR>
> feel confident that I can claim at least computer-4 as one of my skills.<BR>
<BR>
Funny, I started in 1972 myself.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:51:11 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Another Question....<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>         Anyone know the "food density" currently achievable with modern <BR>
> hydroponics systems?  I am trying to roughly model out how much square area <BR>
> is required to sustainably feed 100 people for a year.  Thanks!<BR>
<BR>
Check out "aeroponics". Instead of using tanks of liquid, they have the<BR>
plants in a high humidity area, with the roots growing in a spongy<BR>
material or webbing (of fine tubes) which supply the nutrient liquid.<BR>
Besides saving mass, you also save a lot of *space*, because the plants<BR>
can be placed on a *vertical* mesh. So you get the equivalent of a<BR>
several rows in the space formerly taken by one row. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 18:55:42 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>         2)  What is the physical dimensions of a 16 troy oz gold bar?<BR>
<BR>
1 troy ounce = 3.110348e-2 kg, so 16 = .497656 kg. Very close to 500<BR>
grams (and thus a more likely size :-)<BR>
<BR>
Gold has a density of 19.3. So the bar will have a volume of 25.78527 cc.<BR>
<BR>
So one configuration would be 5x5x1.03 cm. <BR>
<BR>
Gold is *heavy*. A normal sized brick, made of gold weighs around 80<BR>
pounds. So if the guy trying to sell it to you is holding it in one<BR>
hand, he'd better look like Arnold Scwharzenegger!<BR>
<BR>
For reference:<BR>
<BR>
Gold	19.3<BR>
mercury	13.6<BR>
lead	11.3<BR>
iron	 7.8<BR>
<BR>
So a hunk of gold weighs about 2.5 times what a hunk of steel the same<BR>
size does.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 21:09:22 -0500<BR>
From: Pete <j_pete@bellsouth.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:44:45 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>Disclaimer: though I enjoyed Star Wars (and still do) I have never used any<BR>
>of the characters or situations in a Traveller game.  I do admit to using<BR>
>those cute little robot thingies that zip up and down the passages under<BR>
>your feet, though ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Ah yes. Those would be Rebaxan Colmuni MSE-6 General Purpose Droids.<BR>
<BR>
How sad am I? <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 16:04:57 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Veskrashen Design SMG and Pistol<BR>
<BR>
Katharine Whitchurch wrote:<BR>
> Just as a question of interest, what happens if you build them at TL8, or if<BR>
> you use ETC ammo ?<BR>
> Ditzie asks if we can we get a 10mm HEAP warhead ...<BR>
> Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
Honestly, I intended it as a replacement/upgunned version of an MP-5<BR>
type weapone, for use by vehicle crews, SWAT teams and such. With<BR>
explosive ammo, the DV is equivalent to a TL12 standard ACR, so I don't<BR>
see all that much of a disadvantage. As requested, here is the TL8<BR>
version and 2 TL10 ETC versions.<BR>
<BR>
TL8 10mm Caseless Cartridge<BR>
Length 39mm Mass 17g .68cr 1000J<BR>
<BR>
TL8 10mm Caseless SMG<BR>
25cm Light Barrel w/ Long Muzzle Brake<BR>
0.9kg 33cm 300cr RclMod .6 EMuzzle 1750J<BR>
Multi-Selective Receiver<BR>
2.01kg 18.9cm 603cr <BR>
Bullpup Shock Absorbing Stock<BR>
0.3kg 5cm 85cr RclMod .85<BR>
50rnd Box Magazine<BR>
0.306kg/1.156kg loaded<BR>
Final Evaluation<BR>
57cm 3.31kg/4.466kg loaded 988cr<BR>
SR 104m (Medium) DV 4 SSRcl 1.165 Brst5Rcl 2.913<BR>
<BR>
This one turned out a bit cheaper and lighter, with slightly more<BR>
recoil. Explosive ammo isn't available at TL8 for this caliber, so it<BR>
doesn't hit quite as hard as the TL10 version. I didn't mount a laser<BR>
sight on this one because I hate the figures for the TL8 version. Using<BR>
an imported TL10 laser sight would reduce the recoil slightly, and using<BR>
TL10 explosive ammo (yes, even 10mm HEAP if you would like) would get<BR>
the damage value back up. This actually turned out to be a more efficent<BR>
design overall; the receiver is lighter because I didn't have to extend<BR>
it as much to use the box magazine.<BR>
<BR>
TL10 10x23mm ETC Cartridge<BR>
23.27mm 8.34g .33cr 1000J<BR>
<BR>
TL10 10mm ETC SMG<BR>
25cm Light Barrel w/ Long Muzzle Brake<BR>
.9kg 33cm 300cr RclMod .6 EMuzzle 1750J<BR>
Multi-Selective ETC Receiver<BR>
17.33cm 1.336kg 400.8cr<BR>
Bullpup SA Stock<BR>
.3kg 5 cm 85cr RclMod .85<BR>
Laser sight .5kg 300cr<BR>
50rnd Box Magazine<BR>
1.1kg/1.517kg loaded<BR>
Final Evaluation<BR>
55.33cm 3.036kg/4.533kg loaded 1085.8cr<BR>
SR 104m (Medium) DV 4/5expl SSRcl 0.73 Brst5Rcl 1.82<BR>
<BR>
A little lighter, a little cheaper for the base weapon. Damage and<BR>
ranges are identical, and using explosive ammo ups the damage to compete<BR>
with ACRs. The calculated ideal barrel length was 5cm; a 7.1mm ETC<BR>
cartridge would get closer to 10cm ideal barrel length, and might be a<BR>
more efficent design. I'll have to run the numbers later. With an ideal<BR>
barrel length of 10cm, using a 25cm barrel yields a muzzle velocity of<BR>
175% of the cartridge's base, with predictable increases in damage and<BR>
range. Here's a 10mm ETC design that uses 2000J cartridges to achieve<BR>
that perfect 10cm IBL.<BR>
<BR>
TL10 10x36.5mm ETC Cartridge<BR>
36.52mm 16.68g .66cr 2000J<BR>
<BR>
TL10 10mm ETC Assault Carbine<BR>
25cm Light Barrel w/ Long Muzzle Brake<BR>
0.9kg 33cm 300cr RclMod .6 EMuzzle 3500J<BR>
Multi-Selective ETC Receiver<BR>
23.66cm 2.175kg 652.5cr<BR>
Bullpup SA Stock and Laser Sight<BR>
.8kg 5cm 385cr RclMod .85<BR>
50rnd Box Magazine<BR>
1.25kg/2.08kg loaded<BR>
Final Evaluation<BR>
61.66cm 3.875kg/5.955kg loaded 1337cr<BR>
SR 147m (Medium) DV 6(5.63/6.03expl) SSRcl .76 Brst5Rcl 1.91<BR>
<BR>
This is a bit heavier and slightly longer, and ammo costs are higher.<BR>
However, the range could be bumped to long with the addition of basic<BR>
optic sights, and the damage is better than the Imperial standard ACR.<BR>
It's even capable of putting damage past Flex armor, which the standard<BR>
ACR can't do. It's small enough to still be issued to vehicle crews, and<BR>
adding a small single shot breech action grenade launcher would allow it<BR>
to be used by light infantry as a standard battle rifle. All in all, I'm<BR>
fairly pleased.<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:05:13 -0700<BR>
From: Kristian Miller <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Virtual Reality<BR>
<BR>
Thom Harris wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> Anybody interested in doing an equipment sheet for VR? I think that we would<BR>
> be seeing it a lot around T:TL 10 and going all the way to T:TL 15+. It is<BR>
> being experimented with now. You can even have some in your home if you buy<BR>
<BR>
I would say, or IMTU, that equipment is already built in to the ship's<BR>
computer.  The higher tech equipment already has force feedback in the<BR>
controls.<BR>
<BR>
Kristian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 16:48:15 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Plasma Guns<BR>
<BR>
Katharine Whitchurch wrote:<BR>
> Right, thats it.<BR>
> Veskrashen, you're hired as part of Famile Spofulam.<BR>
> The idea of a Plasma Submachinegun is something that has Ditzie drooling.<BR>
> Great weapons. Great, great weapons. Can these get posted on the web<BR>
> somewhere ?<BR>
<BR>
We here at Risen Light Industries are more than willing to consider a<BR>
merger. Feel free to contact our CEO to work out the details.<BR>
<BR>
In honor of the recent overtures from Famile Spofulam, we here at Risen<BR>
Light Industries are proud to announce the first practical solution to<BR>
one of the largest problems facing legitimate mercenary and defense<BR>
forces today: Battle Dress.<BR>
<BR>
The problem is quite simple, of course. Imperial Battle Dress is proof<BR>
against most personal weapons currently available. Even squad machine<BR>
guns have a difficult time with these monstrosities, and no light<BR>
infantry platoon can carry enough heavy weapons to handle even a squad<BR>
of Battle Dress infantry. These heavily armored infantrymen can carry<BR>
weapons far heavier than your own. And the newest "augmented" Battle<BR>
Dress is even worse, with heavier armor, integral point defense, and the<BR>
ability to carry even heavier ordanance. Battle Dress has seemed to<BR>
sound the death knell for light infantry and unpowered mercenary units. <BR>
<BR>
But we have Risen to the challenge.<BR>
<BR>
Introducing the Risen Light Industries .0625MJ Rapid Fire Plasma<BR>
Carbine. This weapon is intended to level the field against powered<BR>
infantry in urban or other close terrain. It gives the unpowered light<BR>
infantryman a formidable weapon capable of engaging numerous targets<BR>
with overwhelming efficency. Used as a replacement for the light<BR>
machinegun generally carried in a four-man Imperial Marine fireteam, it<BR>
is powerful enough to instantly incenerate an unprotected sophont, kill<BR>
infantry in standard Flex armor, and seriously injure powered<BR>
infantrymen in Battle Dress, augmented or not. With rapid fire<BR>
capability, it can engage a number of targets with great rapidity, and<BR>
the sheer volume of firepower in this small package is sure to create<BR>
intense shock value. Being relatively lightweight and extremely compact,<BR>
it returns the typical advantages of light infantry mobility to the<BR>
force commander, allowing you to turn the battlefield into a three<BR>
dimensional nightmare. You can redeploy into sewers, storm drains, and<BR>
basements where Battle Dress simply can't fit, or move quickly through<BR>
lighter structures where their armor's bulk and weight make it<BR>
impractical to follow. It is also capable of engaging light armored<BR>
vehicles or as a breaching weapon against light structures. Best yet, it<BR>
has no active power source, allowing you to maintain the traditional low<BR>
sensor profile of unpowered infantry, giving you a tremendous edge over<BR>
your blindingly obvious powered opponents.<BR>
<BR>
Risen Light Industries. Parity Without The Price.<BR>
<BR>
TL12 .0625MJ RF Plasma Carbine<BR>
Firing Unit and Support Hardware<BR>
0.5kg 600cr<BR>
Gyro Compensator<BR>
0.3125kg 187.5cr RclMod 0.8<BR>
SA Bullpup Stock with Laser Sight<BR>
0.8kg 385cr. RclMod 0.85<BR>
ROF 180 Receiver (3rnd Burst)<BR>
0.011kg 0.066cr.<BR>
30rnd Magazine<BR>
1.7kg/6.2kg loaded<BR>
Final Evaluation<BR>
1.624kg/7.824kg loaded 1072.57cr.<BR>
SR 25m (Short) DV 10 SSRcl 3.25  3BurstRcl 4.875<BR>
<BR>
THIS is what I was striving for in my original designs. It is relatively<BR>
lightweight, outstanding ammo capacity, excellent damage, cheap. The<BR>
recoil is easily controllable for the average person, and it is capable<BR>
of engaging 3 targets per turn in automatic fire. It does 10D damage to<BR>
unprotected infantry, 5D+5 to troops in Flex, 3D to troops in battle<BR>
dress, and 2D to augmented battle dress. In burst or autofire mode, it<BR>
does 20D to unprotected personnel, 10D+5 to Flex, 6D to battle dress,<BR>
and 4D to augmented. Given the expense of augmented battle dress<BR>
(200KCr), this is a hell of a threat to Imperial Heavy Infantry,<BR>
especially in an urban environment where a light infantryman can use the<BR>
terrain to the max. <BR>
<BR>
Next in the pipeline are a single shot 1MJ plasma gun for anti-armor<BR>
work, a 0.25MJ Underbarrel Plasma Gun for to replace UBGLs for direct<BR>
fire purposes, and a 1MJ Meson Fire Support System.<BR>
<BR>
And yes, as long as you attribute this nightmare to me (and give me the<BR>
link so I can look too!), I don't mind this being added to any webpage.<BR>
And I would be honored for it to be included in the FS2K catalouge.<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 19:36:24 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>          At a guess-price of Cr220/Toz, that rings in for 1.72BCr/dton <BR>
> (packaged for shipping)...  Hmm...  Nope, my numbers weren't even *close* <BR>
> to sane.  One can rough out that in ~5000 years of panicking about the <BR>
> stuff, we've hauled ~500dton to the surface;  or ~.1dton per year.  So my <BR>
> seven-year-old colony should have a stockpile of somewhere in the .7dton to <BR>
> 1.5dton range, to allow for a) improvements in technology and b) having <BR>
> other things to worry about.<BR>
<BR>
Do keep in mind that if it's a remotely terrestrial planet, the<BR>
initially found deposits are apt to be hideously rich by our standards.<BR>
<BR>
I'd expect placer deposits would be dredged up first, while crews<BR>
headed upstream looking for the deposits that the placer gold came<BR>
from. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:05:53 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: One for the gearheads...<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Here's one for the gearheads among us...<BR>
><BR>
>     IMTC (TNE rules...a 'lost colony' type campaign...soon to webposted!<BR>
> ) the homeworld has just broken TL-10 but with some differences...HePlaR<BR>
> (or Plasma Focus Drives) have recently been developed but power is a<BR>
> problem. The smallest fusion plant is 10dT and no fissionable materials<BR>
> readily available. And no CG. What would people do about landing ships<BR>
> for long duration exploration missions?<BR>
<BR>
Use the fusion reactor to heat some convenient substance to very high<BR>
temps. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 00:19:42 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
At 12:36 AM 5/1/00, you wrote:<BR>
>In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> >          At a guess-price of Cr220/Toz, that rings in for 1.72BCr/dton<BR>
> > (packaged for shipping)...  Hmm...  Nope, my numbers weren't even *close*<BR>
> > to sane.  One can rough out that in ~5000 years of panicking about the<BR>
> > stuff, we've hauled ~500dton to the surface;  or ~.1dton per year.  So my<BR>
> > seven-year-old colony should have a stockpile of somewhere in the <BR>
> .7dton to<BR>
> > 1.5dton range, to allow for a) improvements in technology and b) having<BR>
> > other things to worry about.<BR>
><BR>
>Do keep in mind that if it's a remotely terrestrial planet, the<BR>
>initially found deposits are apt to be hideously rich by our standards.<BR>
><BR>
>I'd expect placer deposits would be dredged up first, while crews<BR>
>headed upstream looking for the deposits that the placer gold came<BR>
>from.<BR>
         Hi, Leonard!<BR>
         Of course!  There hasn't been 5000 years of panning and mining <BR>
taking place.  Which basically brings the whole thing back to a WAG.<BR>
         However, its a 10k person colony, so I would expect the big issues <BR>
have been building and securing the Colony Main itself.  Not everyone will <BR>
be panning for gold <g>.<BR>
         It certainly plays havoc with the idea of colonies being hideously <BR>
expensive affairs...   Unless gold or similar commodities are horribly <BR>
devaluated, a colony ought to be able to pay for itself in short order once <BR>
a vien of something interesting is uncovered.<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2379<BR>
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Traveller-digest        Monday, May 1 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2380<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Hivers<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: One for the gearheads...<BR>
Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
The Alien(ness) Debate<BR>
RE: Episode IV<BR>
RE: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US<BR>
Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
Request assistance.<BR>
Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2379<BR>
Re:  More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:30:29 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Hivers<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-04-30 23:23:15 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< Since Hiver mouthparts are on their undersides, they haven't been <BR>
 depicted in Traveller artwork.  What if they are very strong, (the <BR>
 jaws, that is) and Hivers like to grapple in HTH (when they must) <BR>
 and bite away with powerful, multi-toothed jaws (like the business <BR>
 end of a leech)? >><BR>
<BR>
No jaws. No radula/beak/proboscis. <BR>
<BR>
Sorry.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:15:57 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> [Dom wrote:]<BR>
>>> Episode IV was always called 'A New Hope' in the yellow scrolling titles.<BR>
>><BR>
>>No it wasn't.<BR>
><BR>
> Okay. You've piqued my curiosity now. What makes you say that?<BR>
<BR>
Around 3 dozen viewings of the original release...<BR>
<BR>
And that's not as excessive as it sounds. The only reason the Westgate<BR>
theater quit showing it was that the sequel had come out (they were<BR>
able to do this because of a loophole in their contract :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 20:24:35 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
>> Just keep in mind that there *isn't* any "human viewpoint" or "human<BR>
>> worldview". But there *are* a whole bunch of *cultural* ones. And some<BR>
>> *human* cultures are alien beyond what most authors would *dare* try to<BR>
>> pass off as an alien culture.<BR>
><BR>
> How would you like to compete for the honor of being sacrificed to<BR>
> the gods?  I am pretty sure that most of the folks around here would<BR>
> not do their best in such a contest...<BR>
<BR>
Yet the Aztec/Maya *did* do so. It took a *long* time before<BR>
archeologists gave in to the overwhelming weight of evidence and<BR>
officially stated that it was the *winning* team that was sacraficed.<BR>
<BR>
>> I'm phrasing this poorly, because English doesn't have the words for<BR>
>> it. Brest I can describe it is that given enough behavioral data, I can<BR>
>> "extract" the rules behind them well enough to anticipate reactions and<BR>
>> even the "reasons" behind them. I just can't always render the results<BR>
>> into English. :-)<BR>
>> <BR>
>> All cultures have such "rules" built upon "fundamental assumptions". If<BR>
>> they didn't they wouldn't *be* a culture/society.<BR>
><BR>
> Most of the Nordic languages have one such example: the word/concept<BR>
> "lagom"<BR>
><BR>
> "Lagom" is not possible to translate into English (or German, French,<BR>
> Spanish, Italian, probably most other languages as well). The<BR>
> translation most often found is "just the right amount," but it is<BR>
> not correct.<BR>
<BR>
> "Lagom" is more like "not worth to improve/change/add/decrease,<BR>
> either because it's not worth the effort, or because it works all<BR>
> right anyway." The most obvious examples are temprature and amount of<BR>
> food, but you can also have "lagom" money, "lagom" spare time, etc.<BR>
<BR>
There's an English phrase with a similar meaning. alas, too many people<BR>
don't "get" it.<BR>
<BR>
"Better is the enemy of 'good enough'."<BR>
<BR>
>> It's *possible* for aliens to have rules thatr "don't make sense" to<BR>
>> us, because of the assumptions behind them. But just as it's possible<BR>
>> to learn to "think" in non-Euclidean geometries, or in "higher<BR>
>> dimensions", We should be able to internalize the alien rules well<BR>
>> enough to more or less anticipate their actions/reactions. <BR>
>> <BR>
>> Doing so *will* require great mental flexibility, and may even be<BR>
>> somewhat of a risk to "sanity (of course, much of "sanity" is<BR>
>> culturally defined). <BR>
><BR>
> I guess that means my sanity will be harmed beyond repair by now...<BR>
> just returning from yet another 12-hour period of studying calculus<BR>
> in a variable number of dimensions as well as non-Euclidean<BR>
> geometries...<BR>
<BR>
No san loss unless you forget which set of rules apply in the "real<BR>
world". <BR>
<BR>
You want *real* san loss, try topology. Multiply connected manifolds<BR>
are *weird*. There's stuff that make Moebius strips and Klein bottles<BR>
seem *normal*. Crosstops, for example.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 14:14:20 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
OTOH look at modern gold extraction methods...most of the gold dig out in the<BR>
last 5000 odd years was done pick and shovel and pan...rarity value...difficulty<BR>
value...etc. Modern (TL 7-8) methods are a lot more efficient...so even a small<BR>
TL 9 plant should be able to jack out 140 m^3 in a year or two...depending on the<BR>
deposit.<BR>
<BR>
Has anyone considered what dropping 1DTon of gold on a local market will do tho<BR>
the price? to the local economy?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
Michel Vaillancourt wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 12:36 AM 5/1/00, you wrote:<BR>
> >In mail you write:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > >          At a guess-price of Cr220/Toz, that rings in for 1.72BCr/dton<BR>
> > > (packaged for shipping)...  Hmm...  Nope, my numbers weren't even *close*<BR>
> > > to sane.  One can rough out that in ~5000 years of panicking about the<BR>
> > > stuff, we've hauled ~500dton to the surface;  or ~.1dton per year.  So my<BR>
> > > seven-year-old colony should have a stockpile of somewhere in the<BR>
> > .7dton to<BR>
> > > 1.5dton range, to allow for a) improvements in technology and b) having<BR>
> > > other things to worry about.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Do keep in mind that if it's a remotely terrestrial planet, the<BR>
> >initially found deposits are apt to be hideously rich by our standards.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >I'd expect placer deposits would be dredged up first, while crews<BR>
> >headed upstream looking for the deposits that the placer gold came<BR>
> >from.<BR>
>          Hi, Leonard!<BR>
>          Of course!  There hasn't been 5000 years of panning and mining<BR>
> taking place.  Which basically brings the whole thing back to a WAG.<BR>
>          However, its a 10k person colony, so I would expect the big issues<BR>
> have been building and securing the Colony Main itself.  Not everyone will<BR>
> be panning for gold <g>.<BR>
>          It certainly plays havoc with the idea of colonies being hideously<BR>
> expensive affairs...   Unless gold or similar commodities are horribly<BR>
> devaluated, a colony ought to be able to pay for itself in short order once<BR>
> a vien of something interesting is uncovered.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>         -- Michel R. Vaillancourt<BR>
>            (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:19:58 -0500<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
> ><BR>
> > Most of the Nordic languages have one such example: the word/concept<BR>
> > "lagom"<BR>
> ><BR>
> > "Lagom" is not possible to translate into English (or German, French,<BR>
> > Spanish, Italian, probably most other languages as well). The<BR>
> > translation most often found is "just the right amount," but it is<BR>
> > not correct.<BR>
> <BR>
> > "Lagom" is more like "not worth to improve/change/add/decrease,<BR>
> > either because it's not worth the effort, or because it works all<BR>
> > right anyway." The most obvious examples are temprature and amount of<BR>
> > food, but you can also have "lagom" money, "lagom" spare time, etc.<BR>
> <BR>
> There's an English phrase with a similar meaning. alas, too many people<BR>
> don't "get" it.<BR>
> <BR>
> "Better is the enemy of 'good enough'."<BR>
<BR>
Or, as my tutoring client was dismayed to hear me say this weekend,<BR>
"Close enough for government work." ;-)<BR>
<BR>
<<snip>><BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>
<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 00:45:58 EDT<BR>
From: RvKsword@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: One for the gearheads...<BR>
<BR>
> > Here's one for the gearheads among us...<BR>
>  ><BR>
>  >     IMTC (TNE rules...a 'lost colony' type campaign...soon to webposted!<BR>
>  > ) the homeworld has just broken TL-10 but with some differences...HePlaR<BR>
>  > (or Plasma Focus Drives) have recently been developed but power is a<BR>
>  > problem. The smallest fusion plant is 10dT and no fissionable materials<BR>
>  > readily available. And no CG. What would people do about landing ships<BR>
>  > for long duration exploration missions?<BR>
>  <BR>
<BR>
In a similar situation in our VentureQuest campaing of ages long past, my <BR>
players used a kind of "space wing" - used hydrox-fueled scramjet boosters <BR>
to reach escape velocity to hit orbit and then tugs used to bring it back to <BR>
the mothership.  In atmosphere, the boosters were scaled back into regular <BR>
thrusters, albeit very high power ones (think of a big ass B52 bomber - i <BR>
think that was the wing shaped one) <BR>
It used capacitor-type power storage rather than a true power plant, since <BR>
they didnt have fusion plants at all, it would glide to the surface of a <BR>
planet, dispatch the team to do their business, then only need enough power <BR>
and fuel to reach orbit again<BR>
<BR>
RvK<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 05:38:07 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 01 May 2000 01:19<BR>
Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> Why do you assume that the Free traders are shipping this cargo<BR>
>> as freight rather than simply buying it. You can make more money<BR>
>> (or loose more money if unlucky) with a higher value cargo because<BR>
>> an extra 10% on the Value table is ten times as much if the<BR>
>> goods are worth 10 times as much. While your rate of return on your<BR>
>> investment in the cargo is no better you get a much better return<BR>
>> on your fixed costs of ship operation.<BR>
><BR>
>    But logically, the owner of the goods would know this as well.  Unless<BR>
>you're dealing with someone totally untutored in the ways of space trade,<BR>
they<BR>
>would know that they could make a better profit themselves even if they had<BR>
to<BR>
>arrange for a broker's fees on the far end.  There might be an exception if<BR>
>the goods have to travel a long way to market, but then the Free Traders<BR>
might<BR>
>not want to buy it either.<BR>
>    Or perhaps the owner needs the cash now, but that's a special case.<BR>
>    I'd definitely be wary of someone too eager to sell me the goods and<BR>
let<BR>
>me take my own chances on a profit.<BR>
><BR>
>--<BR>
>Stormhound<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Riiiight... So all carmakers own steelmills and Iron ore mines, and coal<BR>
mines and chemical plants, and refineries.<BR>
<BR>
And all software shops are owned by Microsoft.<BR>
<BR>
And there are no wholesalers or distributors.<BR>
<BR>
In the real world, people/firms focus on key aspects of their business.<BR>
Manufacturer purchase raw materials from extractors, and sell components to<BR>
assemblers who sell assembled goods to wholesalers who sell them to<BR>
retailers who sell them to the public etc (depending on the product there<BR>
may be greater or fewer stages). At each stage there is profit to be made,<BR>
but there are also costs involved. Because there are different economies of<BR>
scale at each level it is very rare for large manufacturers or extractors to<BR>
sell direct to the public. They are dealing in vast quantities of material<BR>
and money. The consumer isn't. Intermediaries exist to transfer a large<BR>
quantity from a small number of suppliers to a small quantity for a large<BR>
number of customers. In very large economies it is necessary for there to be<BR>
more than one layer of intermediaries.<BR>
<BR>
As long as the income at each stage exceeds costs, and thus a profit is<BR>
made, then everyone is happy (except, perhaps, the consumer <g>).  I can get<BR>
chips from Intel at the same price as Dell buy them, if I buy in the same<BR>
sort of quantities, and can sell them on for the same price as Dell does if<BR>
I can find the customers. Intel doesn't care that I am not a faceless<BR>
corporation, only that I can pay for the goods. Of course I then end up with<BR>
thousands of chips that I need to store, transport, and resell. That's my<BR>
business, and I'm entitled to make a profit. I very much doubt if a private<BR>
individual could order a single chip from Intel for less than they could get<BR>
it for at a local computer store.<BR>
<BR>
Similarly, If I am buying several dton of goods on the speculative trade<BR>
markets in traveller, the seller doesn't care that I'm going to (hopefully)<BR>
make a profit when I sell them. He's made his profit, and it isn't worth his<BR>
while arranging for transportation and sale at my destination to sell the<BR>
good there himself. The manufacturers who *are* doing this are the ones<BR>
shipping goods at Cr1000 per dton in your hold.<BR>
<BR>
Think of the speculative trade as being the niche items that are generally<BR>
sold into the local economy, but you realise that you could sell the same<BR>
stuff elsewhere at a profit. The quantities not consumed directly by the<BR>
local economy are not sufficient for regular export. If the goods are<BR>
available in sufficient quantities for larger exporters to get a regular<BR>
shipment, or if there is no local demand, they will all ready have made<BR>
arrangements, and it will be shipped as regular cargo.<BR>
<BR>
YMMV,<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 14:52:11 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: The Alien(ness) Debate<BR>
<BR>
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 I wish to quote here...so this may take some time.<BR>
<BR>
    'Why this sword?' Old Sam had asked as they left the museum.<BR>
    'If you humans have a  strength it lies in your diversity,' the<BR>
Doctor had said.'Your culture is prolific and multifaceted.When it comes<BR>
to an interaction with an alien culture there is always a facet of your<BR>
own culture that puts you closer to the alien. Perhaps closer than you<BR>
would like.'<BR>
    'Lucky us' said Old Sam.<BR>
    'The problem,' said the Doctor, 'is that you are astonishingly bad<BR>
at utilising this diversity. Faced with an agrarian culture with a<BR>
non-linear temporal perception, do you send in crack squad of Zen<BR>
Buddhists? No, the aggressive imperialists go in instead. The result in<BR>
mutual incomrehension and a lot of unnecessary aggravation.'<BR>
    'Are you telling me the Greenies are samurai?'<BR>
    'Actually, the bushido code is quite a bit different from Xss kskz,<BR>
the 'path of correct behaviour in most situations' , but close enough<BR>
for our purposes. Symbols are very important, thats why you have to use<BR>
this particular sword.'<BR>
    'How will they know?'<BR>
    They'll know'<BR>
    Inside the museum, burglar alarms were just starting to go off.<BR>
    Old Sam held the sword horizontally in front of himat sholder<BR>
height. He switched on the suits external speakers, digital gain should<BR>
make him audible in the thin air.<BR>
    'I am Samual Robert Garvey Moore of the Second Battalion Third<BR>
Brigade of the United Nation Armed Forces, I have killed more people<BR>
than I can count.'<BR>
    Old Sam broke the ancient sword across his knee.<BR>
    'I come in peace,' he said<BR>
<BR>
from Transit<BR>
author Ben Aaronovitch<BR>
<BR>
    comment? response?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
 I wish to quote here...so this may take some time.<BR>
<BR>
    'Why this sword?' Old Sam had asked as they left<BR>
the museum.<BR>
<BR>
    'If you humans have a  strength it lies in your diversity,' the Doctor had said.'Your culture is prolific and multifaceted.When it comes to an interaction with an alien culture there is always a facetof your own culture that puts you closer to the alien. Perhaps closer thanyou would like.'<BR>
    'Lucky us' said Old Sam.<BR>
    'The problem,' said the Doctor, 'is that you areastonishingly bad at utilising this diversity. Faced with an agrarian culture with a non-linear temporal perception, do you send in crack squad of Zen Buddhists? No, the aggressive imperialists go in instead. The result inmutual incomrehension and a lot of unnecessary aggravation.'<BR>
    'Are you telling me the Greenies are <I>samurai</I>?'<BR>
    'Actually, the <I>bushido</I> code is quite a bitdifferent from <I>Xss kskz,</I> the 'path of correct behaviour in mostsituations' , but close enough for our purposes. Symbols are very important,thats why you have to use this particular sword.'<BR>
    'How will they know?'<BR>
    They'll know'<BR>
    Inside the museum, burglar alarms were just startingto go off.<BR>
    Old Sam held the sword horizontally in front of himat sholder height. He switched on the suits external speakers, digitalgain should make him audible in the thin air.<BR>
    'I am Samual Robert Garvey Moore of the Second Battalion Third Brigade of the United Nation Armed Forces, I have killed more peoplethan I can count.'<BR>
    Old Sam broke the ancient sword across his knee.<BR>
    'I come in peace,' he said<BR>
from Transit<BR>
author Ben Aaronovitch<BR>
    comment? response?<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 17:36:54 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Erwin Fritz<BR>
<BR>
> At last! Someone else who remembers this. Having seen Star Wars several<BR>
> times before the 1980 rerelease,<BR>
<BR>
It was re-released in 1980 ?<BR>
<BR>
I remember distinctly being surprised<BR>
> at the "Episode IV" header when the 1980 version came out. I too knew<BR>
> that it was part 4 of a 9-part series, but the 1980 version was the<BR>
> first time I saw this made "official".<BR>
<BR>
It was official before it was released.<BR>
<BR>
I still have a pre-release magazine article where Lucas discussed this whole<BR>
concept.<BR>
It was based on his experiencesd at Saturday matinee movie clubs, something<BR>
even I used to do back in England in the sixties.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 17:45:59 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Mark Preston<BR>
> Well, I have *most* of the series - yes, I admit to being one of those<BR>
> SF buffs that buy whole collections by particular authors - but if I<BR>
> wrote any more of it down, I'd risk cramp in an essential wrist as<BR>
> well as being sued for infringement of copyright. But the books are<BR>
> very good (except possibly for the four I'm missing...)<BR>
<BR>
What are ya missing Mark ?<BR>
I'll keep an eye out for ya.<BR>
<BR>
Frankly, I find them the SF equivalent of the "Nick Carter"  or "Punisher",.<BR>
er sorry "Executioner" novels.<BR>
<BR>
Plot of all of them is basically :<BR>
"Amazingly good guy gets laid in every planet/country/town he visits while<BR>
slightly furthering meta-plot and surviving danger d'jpour"<BR>
<BR>
That being said, they are still fun and great sources for Traveller<BR>
inspiration.<BR>
<BR>
Heck, my first Trav game included the baddies from Dumarest, except I<BR>
decided that there was no way such a secret could have been kept away from<BR>
the Impies, so I decided the CyClan(?) were the intelligence arm of the<BR>
Zhodani on the Fringes.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 02:19:40 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Clearances in US Military; was: Non Citizen's in the US<BR>
<BR>
>.  An example of this would be a campaign set in Pax Rulin subsector in<BR>
Trojan Reach, fighting off the Aslan.  <<BR>
<BR>
I am hoping to build my current campaign on something similar to this.<BR>
After allowing the players to gain some money and connections in the<BR>
Coreward reaches of the Marches, allow them to organize a mercenary force<BR>
with the eventual goal of empire building in parts of Trojan Reach and<BR>
possibly Five Sisters and District 268. Of course, when the Fteirle come<BR>
wandering along...<BR>
I am starting it in 1100 and I hope it lasts long enough for it all to<BR>
develop.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 01:26:52 -0500<BR>
From: Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >    But logically, the owner of the goods would know this as well.  Unless<BR>
> >you're dealing with someone totally untutored in the ways of space trade,<BR>
> they<BR>
> >would know that they could make a better profit themselves even if they had<BR>
> to<BR>
> >arrange for a broker's fees on the far end.<BR>
><BR>
> Riiiight... So all carmakers own steelmills and Iron ore mines, and coal<BR>
> mines and chemical plants, and refineries.<BR>
> And all software shops are owned by Microsoft.<BR>
> And there are no wholesalers or distributors.<BR>
<BR>
    Non sequitur with sarcasm.  Does the steelmaker sell their goods to the<BR>
railroad, who resells it to the automaker?  Does Microsoft sell to UPS, who<BR>
resells to the software shop?  At least make your rebuttal fit the statement.<BR>
(BTW, did you know that some software makers and other manufacturers actually<BR>
sell their stuff over the Internet?  Perhaps you should have a word with them<BR>
about that.  Oh, and about this newfangled thing called a "conglomerate"...okay,<BR>
that's enough return sarcasm.)<BR>
<BR>
    <lots of stuff from Econ 101 snipped><BR>
<BR>
    In the real world, the railroads, airlines, trucklines, etc. aren't the<BR>
wholesalers.  This means neither that said wholesalers do not exist, nor that I<BR>
believe them not to exist.  Wholesalers (and distributors) exist because they<BR>
fulfill a specific market function, that of gathering goods from MANY<BR>
manufacturers, and making it more easily available to retailers.  This is not,<BR>
BTW, the niche that most Free Traders are going to fill.<BR>
<BR>
> Similarly, If I am buying several dton of goods on the speculative trade<BR>
> markets in traveller, the seller doesn't care that I'm going to (hopefully)<BR>
> make a profit when I sell them. He's made his profit, and it isn't worth his<BR>
> while arranging for transportation and sale at my destination to sell the<BR>
> good there himself. The manufacturers who *are* doing this are the ones<BR>
> shipping goods at Cr1000 per dton in your hold.<BR>
<BR>
    In other words, these sellers know whether the potential profit is worth the<BR>
time and effort required, or whether it would be better to sell the goods to a<BR>
speculator.  This sounds suspiciously like my argument, just followed to its<BR>
logical conclusion.  Peter specifically mentioned higher-value goods, which have<BR>
higher potential profit margins.  If you knew that you could make a $200,000<BR>
profit by selling the goods directly to me, and a $1M profit by arranging<BR>
shipping and sales yourself, which would you do?  If you didn't know about the<BR>
$1M, then yes, you'd sell 'em and let me worry about it.<BR>
<BR>
> Think of the speculative trade as being the niche items that are generally<BR>
> sold into the local economy...<BR>
<BR>
    I don't believe I'm arguing that speculative trade doesn't or shouldn't<BR>
exist.  I'm merely following the simple principle that where there is money to<BR>
be made, other people than those making it will figure it out and try to see if<BR>
they can't possibly make it themselves.  And from what I'm reading, you're<BR>
making the same argument while you think you're correcting me.<BR>
    Speculative trade will exist where (a) the seller *cannot* make a<BR>
significant enough profit to justify personally arranging for shipping goods and<BR>
selling them elsewhere, or (b) the seller does not yet *know* that such a profit<BR>
can be made.  Free Traders can make some money in this niche, but it's a<BR>
constantly shifting niche (not least because there's also a class of person who<BR>
makes money in keeping track of what sells and trying to wangle advertising<BR>
contracts from the manufacturers of same, and don't try to tell me I don't<BR>
believe in them either).  In fact, one function of the Free Trader will<BR>
essentially be to open new markets that nobody else has discovered (not an easy<BR>
thing!).  You might make a tidy profit selling Reginan stun-bolts to an Efatian<BR>
grav-vehicle maker the first time; after that said Efatians will be aware that<BR>
the Reginian factory exists and will make arrangements through "normal" channels<BR>
for further shipments (assuming they like the product).  But if someone else<BR>
picked up a load of those stun-bolts a month ago and delivered them to that same<BR>
Efatian, you might be SOL (or just barely profit).<BR>
    Case in point, the aforementioned software makers.  Prior to e-commerce,<BR>
there was mail-order.  Prior to that, you pretty much just had the distributors,<BR>
though that's still an overgeneralization.  But each step toward a more direct<BR>
interaction with the consumer took a chunk of the middleman's business.  (Ask<BR>
RPG distributors how hard they're getting squeezed these days, too.)<BR>
    If you'd like, I can quote the sidebar from GT:FT p.11 and the speculative<BR>
trade section beginning on p.36 to tell you what else I already know (and that<BR>
you appear to as well), but I think *you're* bright enough not to take things<BR>
that far whether or not you'll admit that *I* am.  The short version is "if it<BR>
was a sure thing, they wouldn't be calling it speculation."<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Stormhound<BR>
DNRC Ombudsman for Induhvidual Affairs, Holder of Past Knowledge<BR>
Come visit my web page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd<BR>
Or my new Amateur Radio web page at http://www.qsl.net/kc0ekv<BR>
Or my JN6 course design page at http://www.fidnet.com/~stormhnd/golfpage.htm<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 00:13:32 -0700<BR>
From: Evyn MacDude <wmacdude@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's Art (was RE: GT Lite)<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 11:37 PM 4/28/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> >"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> >> Wow!  Look the size of those turrets!<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Damn..... Look at the size of those thrusters.<BR>
><BR>
> Suffering from thruster envy, Evyn?  :)<BR>
<BR>
Only in your best nightmares Baby..........<BR>
<BR>
Damn a whole new topic...<BR>
<BR>
Cat Calls of the Imperium<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Evyn...<BR>
<BR>
C-Space home http://home.att.net/~wmacdude/<BR>
<BR>
Get six jolly cowboys to carry my coffin<BR>
Get six pretty maidens to bear up my pall<BR>
Bunches of roses all over my coffin<BR>
Roses to deaden the clods as they fall<BR>
 Laredo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 01:00:22 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Request assistance.<BR>
<BR>
If any one knows of any canon information on the planet Jenghe/Regina <BR>
(or just any info period), could you PLEASE drop me a line (on or off <BR>
list)?  I have been trying to find information other than the UWP to <BR>
no avail, and I've looked in CT, MT, and Gurps as well.  The only <BR>
thing I haven't been able to get my hands on (other than Journal <BR>
articles and the like) is the Grand Survey, but I'm not sure even <BR>
that has anything on Jenghe.<BR>
<BR>
Help or even hunches would be appreciated, since I would like to get <BR>
the canon info up on the landgrab site first.<BR>
<BR>
Thank you.<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon May 01 07:29:08 2000<BR>
From: TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
And where are individual GMs? Do you run Saviors of the Imperium or It's<BR>
Money, Hand it to Me?<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
Sam,<BR>
Most of my games are run with independent adventurers who are often required to break (minor?) laws to fight for good. This does not promote lawbreaking as a career, but instead allows the PCs a chance to work toward justice. Profit is nice, but not always there. The law is not always right, and those who break it are not always blackhearts.<BR>
<BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 03:34:41 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2379<BR>
<BR>
> Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
> Subject: Hiver HTH combat<BR>
> <BR>
> Since Hiver mouthparts are on their undersides, they haven't been <BR>
> depicted in Traveller artwork.  What if they are very strong, (the <BR>
> jaws, that is) and Hivers like to grapple in HTH (when they must) <BR>
> and bite away with powerful, multi-toothed jaws (like the business <BR>
> end of a leech)?<BR>
<BR>
Hiver do not have a mouth, they have a cloaca which is used<BR>
for eating, excretion, and reproduction.<BR>
<BR>
TNE Canon establishes that HTH damage for Hivers is always<BR>
one die, unlike for humans for whom HTH damage varies with<BR>
skill and strength. Since they only do 1 die of damage it<BR>
seems unlikely that they have powerful multi toothed jaws.<BR>
<BR>
In canon Hiver are descended from omnivorous scavengers. Some<BR>
carnivorous scavengers have very powerful jaws and teeth (so <BR>
that they can break bones and eat marrow) so I suppose you<BR>
could give hyena like jaws to an omnivore as well but it seems<BR>
unlikely to me. YMMV.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 03:46:50 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re:  More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
Stormhound <stormhnd@fidnet.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Peter Newman wrote:<BR>
> > Why do you assume that the Free traders are shipping this cargo<BR>
> > as freight rather than simply buying it. You can make more money<BR>
> > (or loose more money if unlucky) with a higher value cargo<BR>
<BR>
> But logically, the owner of the goods would know this as well.  Unless<BR>
> you're dealing with someone totally untutored in the ways of space trade, they<BR>
> would know that they could make a better profit themselves even if they had to<BR>
> arrange for a broker's fees on the far end. <BR>
<BR>
Not every manufacturer is also a wholesaler. If you own a widget<BR>
factory, or a clothing factory, or a farm you may simply sell<BR>
your goods to a wholesaler, who then sells it to a retailer, who<BR>
then sells it to a consumer. A lot of trade occurs this way now, <BR>
why would this change in the future?<BR>
<BR>
> There might be an exception if <BR>
> the goods have to travel a long way to market, but then the Free Traders might<BR>
> not want to buy it either.<BR>
> Or perhaps the owner needs the cash now, but that's a special case.<BR>
<BR>
No it's not. Managing cash flow is crucial to the success of<BR>
any business. Many manufacturers can not afford to engage in<BR>
speculative trade, they need to be sure of getting payment<BR>
of a certain amount now. When a ship owner sells goods they<BR>
get paid right away. When a business owner has their goods sold<BR>
on another planet they have to wait for the money to be jumped<BR>
back. In the meantime they've got suppliers to pay, rent to pay,<BR>
employee's to pay. Letting these payments wait while they wait<BR>
for a speculative return on another planet is not an ideal<BR>
business plan.<BR>
<BR>
> I'd definitely be wary of someone too eager to sell me the goods and let<BR>
> me take my own chances on a profit.<BR>
<BR>
Don't buy the goods unless you are willing to assume this risk<BR>
but don't assume that the current owner is trying to cheat you.<BR>
Every single business transaction requires both a buyer and a<BR>
seller. The goods are worth less, and the cash is worth more,<BR>
to the seller not because he's trying to cheat you (usually)<BR>
but because he can make the stuff cheaper than you can buy it.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2380<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2381</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest        Monday, May 1 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2381<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: TML Landgrab - Techie questions<BR>
Re: Episode IV<BR>
RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Episode IV<BR>
OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
Computer use in jumpspace<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: Gold Bars<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
RE: Episode IV<BR>
Request<BR>
Re: "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater"<BR>
The trinity homepage<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 13:11:34 +0100<BR>
From: Ewan Quibell <E.D.Quibell@bton.ac.uk><BR>
Subject: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
G'day y'all<BR>
<BR>
Dose anyone know if there is a use for salt in any industrial processes<BR>
? I'm doing a write up for a system which has a load of spear salt and<BR>
I'd like to have them put it to good use.<BR>
<BR>
Many Thanks<BR>
<BR>
Ewan<BR>
- --<BR>
<BR>
   Ewan Quibell                       Their's not to make reply,<BR>
   Senior Communications Engineer     Their's not to reason why,<BR>
   Computer Centre                    Their's but to do and die:<BR>
   University of Brighton             Into the valley of Death<BR>
                                      Rode the six hundred.<BR>
   E.D.Quibell@brighton.ac.uk              Alfred, Lord Tennyson<BR>
<BR>
   #include<stddisclaimer.h><BR>
<BR>
   My spelling is entirerly due to dyslexia, typos, and poetic license<BR>
<BR>
   University of Brighton - Sunday Times' University of the Year<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 06:26:28 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: TML Landgrab - Techie questions<BR>
<BR>
on 4/30/00 7:27 PM, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> So I was assuming that they use alcohol distilled from local plants<BR>
>> instead. Will this work, and is alcohol (I'm thinking<BR>
>> methanol/ethanol) an inferior fuel to normal petrol/diesel? (I've<BR>
>> assumed it is).<BR>
> <BR>
> There *is* a tendency to absorb water from the air, which requires<BR>
> additive and special gas caps. And I'm not sure a diesel can run on<BR>
> alcohol (I'm not sure how well it "pressure detonates"). But gasoline<BR>
> engines are *easily* converted.<BR>
<BR>
Replacement diesel can be made from alcohol and vegetable oil.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Everything I need to know, I learned from<BR>
killing smart people and eating their brains."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 07:45:26 -0600<BR>
From: Erwin Fritz <efritz@glja.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
"Frank G. Pitt" wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> > On Behalf Of Erwin Fritz<BR>
> <BR>
> > At last! Someone else who remembers this. Having seen Star Wars several<BR>
> > times before the 1980 rerelease,<BR>
> <BR>
> It was re-released in 1980 ?<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
Perhaps that wasn't a good word. It first came out in 1977. Then, right<BR>
before Empire came out, it reappeared in theatres. For a while there, some<BR>
theatres in my city (Calgary) were doing back-to-back showings of Episodes<BR>
IV and V.<BR>
<BR>
> I still have a pre-release magazine article where Lucas discussed this whole<BR>
> concept.<BR>
> It was based on his experiencesd at Saturday matinee movie clubs, something<BR>
> even I used to do back in England in the sixties.<BR>
<BR>
I have a set of bubble-gum cards I collected, on the backs of which are<BR>
blurbs about the first film. In that there's an interview with Lucas in<BR>
which he mentions the nine-part series.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Erwin Fritz<BR>
Gilbert Laustsen Jung Associates Ltd.<BR>
http://www.glja.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:54:34 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
And, my God, but weren't those 80 column card punch machines a<BR>
finger-twisting, wrist-wrenching utter pain to use. Better than<BR>
creasing up the end of your paper tape though.<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Luther<BR>
> Martin<BR>
> Sent: 30 April 2000 06:58<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re:<BR>
> Looking for<BR>
> info)<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> The youngster Black ICE wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> > You Know You're a Gearhead When...<BR>
> ><BR>
> > ...you hear the term "G-string", and you immediately think of an<BR>
> > alphanumeric variable.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Yes, I learned BASIC on a TRS-80 (later on a TI-99/4A).<BR>
> And FORTRAN<BR>
> > with punch cards.<BR>
><BR>
> Kids today. When I first wrote BASIC, it was on a teletype<BR>
> which had a<BR>
> maximum speed of 110 bps. We would save our programs on paper 5-hole<BR>
> teletype tape. You would type in your code, debug it, and<BR>
> then to save it<BR>
> you did a three step process. You would first type "LIST"<BR>
> but not hit<BR>
> return. You would then turn on the tape puncher, then<BR>
> finally hit <cr> to<BR>
> start the tape punching process. You then took the paper<BR>
> tape, tore it off,<BR>
> rolled it up, and put in your pocket for later use.<BR>
><BR>
> When I finally got to use punched cards, I thought they<BR>
> were really cool.<BR>
> Before then, we would write our FORTRAN programs on those<BR>
> old FORTRAN coding<BR>
> forms and submit the forms to data entry people who made<BR>
> the card decks for<BR>
> us.<BR>
><BR>
> And I had to do assembly language in college on punched<BR>
> cards. That was a<BR>
> real pain. If I thought card punchers were cool, you have<BR>
> no idea how cool I<BR>
> thought CRT terminals were when I first got to use one.<BR>
><BR>
> Geez, I've been programming for 28 years. I'll bet that's<BR>
> longer than some<BR>
> list readers have been alive. At least I started young. On<BR>
> the other hand, I<BR>
> feel confident that I can claim at least computer-4 as one<BR>
> of my skills.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 04:07:39 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
>> <BR>
>> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> <<snip>><BR>
>>><BR>
>>> Most of the Nordic languages have one such example: the word/concept<BR>
>>> "lagom"<BR>
>>><BR>
>>> "Lagom" is not possible to translate into English (or German, French,<BR>
>>> Spanish, Italian, probably most other languages as well). The<BR>
>>> translation most often found is "just the right amount," but it is<BR>
>>> not correct.<BR>
>> <BR>
>>> "Lagom" is more like "not worth to improve/change/add/decrease,<BR>
>>> either because it's not worth the effort, or because it works all<BR>
>>> right anyway." The most obvious examples are temprature and amount of<BR>
>>> food, but you can also have "lagom" money, "lagom" spare time, etc.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> There's an English phrase with a similar meaning. alas, too many people<BR>
>> don't "get" it.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> "Better is the enemy of 'good enough'."<BR>
><BR>
> Or, as my tutoring client was dismayed to hear me say this weekend,<BR>
> "Close enough for government work." ;-)<BR>
<BR>
No, "close enough for government work" essentially means "we could do<BR>
better, but we aren't *required* to."<BR>
<BR>
"Better is the enemy of good enough" is more along the lines of, "yes,<BR>
we could make it 'better'. But it'd take a lot of time and money, and<BR>
wouldn't really be worth it".<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 04:17:27 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> OTOH look at modern gold extraction methods... most of the gold dig<BR>
> out in the last 5000 odd years was done pick and shovel and pan...<BR>
> rarity value... difficulty value... etc. Modern (TL 7-8) methods are<BR>
> a lot more efficient... so even a small TL 9 plant should be able to<BR>
> jack out 140 m^3 in a year or two... depending on the deposit.<BR>
><BR>
> Has anyone considered what dropping 1DTon of gold on a local market<BR>
> will do tho the price? to the local economy?<BR>
<BR>
Since gold isn't a "monetary metal" in the Imperium, the price won't<BR>
drop *that* far. Gold has a lot of industrial uses. Gold plating acts<BR>
as a lubricant on metal parts in vacuum. Thin gold film over viewports<BR>
and helmets helps screen out harmful radiation. <BR>
<BR>
So the price might drop some, but it wouldn't screw up the economy. But<BR>
*iridium*, on the other hand.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 04:10:09 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 12:36 AM 5/1/00, you wrote:<BR>
>>In mail you write:<BR>
>><BR>
>> Do keep in mind that if it's a remotely terrestrial planet, the<BR>
>> initially found deposits are apt to be hideously rich by our<BR>
>> standards.<BR>
>><BR>
>> I'd expect placer deposits would be dredged up first, while crews<BR>
>> headed upstream looking for the deposits that the placer gold came<BR>
>> from.<BR>
>          Hi, Leonard!<BR>
>          Of course!  There hasn't been 5000 years of panning and<BR>
> mining taking place.  Which basically brings the whole thing back to<BR>
> a WAG.<BR>
<BR>
Actually more like 10-30 k years. Folks have been picking up those<BR>
"shiny rocks" for a *long* time...<BR>
<BR>
>          However, its a 10k person colony, so I would expect the big<BR>
> issues have been building and securing the Colony Main itself.  Not<BR>
> everyone will be panning for gold <g>.<BR>
<BR>
Check out what crudge hydraulic dregdes did to some rivers in<BR>
California. Nothing as crude as "panning" here.<BR>
<BR>
>          It certainly plays havoc with the idea of colonies being<BR>
> hideously expensive affairs...   Unless gold or similar commodities<BR>
> are horribly devaluated, a colony ought to be able to pay for itself<BR>
> in short order once a vien of something interesting is uncovered.<BR>
<BR>
There's a *lot* of stuff that colonies ought to be producing in<BR>
quantities not worth the time of the megacorps, but *very* profitable<BR>
for the small free trader.<BR>
<BR>
Once the colony starts producing enough (say) flamewood, the megacorps<BR>
can move in and "buy out" the contract (and "goodwill") the free<BR>
trader(s) have.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:07:25 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 5/1/00 9:46:57 AM Eastern Daylight Time, efritz@glja.com <BR>
writes:<BR>
<BR>
<<  In that there's an interview with Lucas in<BR>
 which he mentions the nine-part series.<BR>
  >><BR>
Lucas has said he won't do 7-9....<BR>
<BR>
Mike<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:07:20 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
Does anyone know if someone has picked up the RPG rights to this show? Just <BR>
wondering...<BR>
<BR>
Mike<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:16:08 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
> And, my God, but weren't those 80 column card punch machines a<BR>
> finger-twisting, wrist-wrenching utter pain to use. Better than<BR>
> creasing up the end of your paper tape though.<BR>
<BR>
The embedded numeric keypad was a bear to learn, but worked well once you<BR>
got the hang of it.  I'm just glad to have had machines that allowed<BR>
corrections before punching the cards.  I was forever double clicking the<BR>
spacebar.  Another thing I remember; since I was a junior enlisted guy in my<BR>
shop, I got the priviledge of emptying the confetti drawers and vacuuming<BR>
the innards.  I should write a supplement: 101 Uses for Punched Card<BR>
Confetti.  My personal favorite was tossing a handful onto some poor slob as<BR>
he stepped out of the shower or down the back of a sweaty person.  They<BR>
stick like glue and jab you with their little, pointy corners :-><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: What do his shipmates do to the practical joker who puts itching<BR>
powder in the low berths?<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 10:22:56 -0400<BR>
From: Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
Ok, before I get going here, let me make one thing clear. The<BR>
quote is question is from a book on _pricing_. Not from a book <BR>
on economics, not a book on running the most profitable business <BR>
possible (although that is a significant sub-theme), but a book<BR>
on how to price goods and services.<BR>
<BR>
> From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
><BR>
>   A limitation here is that railroads (and systems where terminals for<BR>
> ships/craft of whatever sort are required) require a very large fixed<BR>
> investment before any cargo is shipped, but once at that point the<BR>
> amount of cargo that can be hauled over that infrastructure is then<BR>
> relatively of little impact on your capital costs (:simplification).<BR>
<BR>
Somewhat counter-intuitively, capital costs don't usually come into<BR>
question when it comes to pricing decisions. I won't quote any further,<BR>
but Nagle and Holden divide costs into "incremental" and "non-incremental"<BR>
where only incremental costs drive pricing and most capital costs are<BR>
non-incremental, thus irrelevant to pricing (usually).<BR>
<BR>
Anyway, the point I was trying to make was not about breakeven points,<BR>
but that real cargo shippers segment their pricing, something that's <BR>
not done in OTU canon.<BR>
<BR>
>   For Trav starships the substantial capital costs are almost directly<BR>
> related to capacity - even terminal facilities (given AG for landing)<BR>
> are mostly for local admin/trans-shipping convenience and not the use<BR>
> of the incoming cargo haulers themselves.<BR>
<BR>
Which is interesting - with fixed capacity service industries, like <BR>
hotels, passenger airplanes and cargo services in general, since<BR>
capacity is fixed, the seller wants to fill capacity 100% because<BR>
unused capacity is unpaid-for capacity. This is why airlines sell seats<BR>
at different prices - depending on how far away the flight is, the airlines<BR>
can get away with different pricing and they try to maximize their<BR>
loading to maximize profit, even if every seat doesn't go for the<BR>
maximum price.<BR>
<BR>
> From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
><BR>
> This may not be an appropriate comparison as the canonical<BR>
> Traveller universe does not have tariffs based on the value<BR>
> of the goods. <BR>
<BR>
Right and I was trying to say that we really have to see this as a<BR>
simplifying game mechanic as it's really almost impossible to assume<BR>
that it works any other way. I have an easier time believing in the<BR>
existence of anti-gravity and jump drives rather than fixed cargo<BR>
costs in a very free market Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
> Therefore freight rates do not need to vary<BR>
> based on the value of the goods. (Although more expensive<BR>
> goods will be more expensive to ensure against loss so logically<BR>
> if the shipper assumes this risk of loss then he would have<BR>
> to raise his rates to cover this loss. Requiring the owner<BR>
> of the freight to assume the risk of loss avoids this problem.)<BR>
<BR>
No, freight costs _do_ need to vary, otherwise everyone goes out of <BR>
business. That was kind of my point.<BR>
<BR>
> Of course its a simplification but, unlike a railroad, you don't<BR>
> have to build tracks in jump space. It would probably be better<BR>
> to compare space ship rates to water shipping rates because<BR>
> (just like in space) ships don't have to have a path built for<BR>
> them (except for canals, and harbors).<BR>
<BR>
The cost of tracks is irrelevant to pricing, believe it or not.<BR>
It's very relevant to a lot of other factors, but it's a "non-incremental<BR>
cost" which is fixed regardless of the amount of cargo shipped and sunk,<BR>
so it's not considered unless you're looking at something like possible<BR>
pricing for a new rail line that's not yet built.<BR>
<BR>
> Why do you assume that the Free traders are shipping this cargo<BR>
> as freight rather than simply buying it. <BR>
<BR>
Because that's what I'm assuming. It is an assumption after all...<BR>
maybe not _all_ free traders are "pure shipping plays" but somewhere<BR>
out there, there are companies that just ship stuff. And they're going<BR>
to have to segment pricing. Therefore _anyone_ who gets into <BR>
shipping is going to have to segment their pricing as well, unless they<BR>
have some very funky pricing model.<BR>
<BR>
> You can make more money<BR>
> (or loose more money if unlucky) with a higher value cargo because<BR>
> an extra 10% on the Value table is ten times as much if the<BR>
> goods are worth 10 times as much. While your rate of return on your<BR>
> investment in the cargo is no better you get a much better return<BR>
> on your fixed costs of ship operation.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not trying to address the issue of speculative trade versus plain<BR>
shipping as a viable business model. Speculative trade has higher<BR>
risks (and correspondingly higher potential rewards) and much higher<BR>
capital costs than playing Imperial Express (ImpEx). Considering that<BR>
most characters are up in hock to their eyeballs just for the damn ship <BR>
in the first place, making another capital outlay to buy a very risky<BR>
speculative cargo is a pretty ballsy move. No wonder most characters<BR>
have so little aversion to gun play - it may be their quickest and least<BR>
painful way out of debt. <BR>
<BR>
Anyway, to sum up, my point was about segmentation of pricing, which<BR>
is pretty essential in the real world and that it's really hard to<BR>
come up with a viable handwave to justify the lack of it in the OTU.<BR>
(although, yes, I know people have tried).<BR>
- --<BR>
Ethan Henry                                         egh@klg.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:38:11 -0700<BR>
From: "Joe Lachance" <Lachance@nc.rr.com><BR>
Subject: Computer use in jumpspace<BR>
<BR>
    In the campaign I'm running the player characters have a need to harness<BR>
shipboard computing power to chug through a rather large dataset.  As best I<BR>
can tell traditional craft have three computer systems: primary, backup, and<BR>
a dedicated jump computer (note: I do not have a copy of DGP's starship<BR>
operation's manual).  If one of the onboard computers is used primariliy for<BR>
jump calculations, does it cease to be needed when the ship enters jumpspace<BR>
(freeing it up for other tasks)?<BR>
    This opens up the question of how jump engines interact with the<BR>
manifold of jumpspace in in Traveller.  My gut feeling is that once a ship's<BR>
jump grid is energized and it enters jump-space the 'trajectory' of the next<BR>
week is one that is not actively changed (by computer use or astrogation).<BR>
<BR>
IMTU traditional jump engines behave as above, while psionic drives<BR>
(somewhat similar to those outlined in FFS1) differ: with the astrogator<BR>
continually weaving the ship through jumpspace (think of the Pilot's in<BR>
David Zindell's Neverness series of novels).<BR>
<BR>
Joe<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 00:56:51 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
I'd be happy just see the d#% thing...they are running teasers out the wazoo<BR>
down here...driving me not-so-slowly nuts!<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
Qstor@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Does anyone know if someone has picked up the RPG rights to this show? Just<BR>
> wondering...<BR>
><BR>
> Mike<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 11:00:43 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 5/1/00 10:58:41 AM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>
rhoughto@one.net.au writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< I'd be happy just see the d#% thing...they are running teasers out the <BR>
wazoo<BR>
 down here...driving me not-so-slowly nuts!<BR>
  >><BR>
That's funny that some of the Australian tv stations don't have it <BR>
on...because of their role in production...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:09:27 -0500<BR>
From: ehenry@newberlin.org (Eric Henry)<BR>
Subject: Re: Gold Bars<BR>
<BR>
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
Apologies for the public post but i didn't have a private address.<BR>
<BR>
Did you go to high school in wisconsin?<BR>
  ----- Original Message -----=20<BR>
  From: Ken J. Kazinski=20<BR>
  To: Traveller List=20<BR>
  Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2000 12:57 AM<BR>
  Subject: Gold Bars<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
  Packing material is normally considered to be 10% of the weight.=20<BR>
  Kaz=20<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
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<STYLE></STYLE><BR>
</HEAD><BR>
<BR>
<DIV>Apologies for the public post but i didn't have a =<BR>
private=20<BR>
address.</DIV><BR>
<DIV> </DIV><BR>
<DIV>Did you go to high school in wisconsin?</DIV><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20<BR>
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =<BR>
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px"><BR>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV><BR>
  <DIV=20<BR>
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =<BR>
black"><B>From:</B>=20<BR>
  <A HREF="3D">Ken J.=20
  Kazinski</A> </DIV><BR>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20<BR>
  href=3D"mailto:traveller@lists.imagiconline.com"=20<BR>
  title=3Dtraveller@lists.imagiconline.com>Traveller List </DIV><BR>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, April 30, 2000 =<BR>
12:57=20<BR>
  AM</DIV><BR>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Gold Bars</DIV><BR>
  <DIV><BR>
</DIV>Packing material is normally considered to be 10% of =the=20  weight.=20  <BR>
Kaz </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
- ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01BFB355.55169A80--<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 01:17:44 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
Dumping a large enough amount of anything on the market affects the value,<BR>
albeit at a local level. If someone parked a small metallic asteroid in<BR>
orbit tomorrow, found a way of getting it down to the surface without deep<BR>
impacting it what would the effect be (apart from worried looks from all<BR>
the world powers) on local metal prices? Gold may not be a monetary metal<BR>
but the demand can't be that high that 140 m^3 dropped on the local market<BR>
would dissappear without a trace...If it did...it wouldn't be worth<BR>
shipping costs. If it doesn't have rarity/money value...what's the point of<BR>
shipping it.<BR>
<BR>
Case in point... one of H. Beam Pipers "When in the Course-" from the<BR>
Federation collection ( I have it but my books are in the milk crates<BR>
holding up my bed). The protaginists are trying to decide what to ship<BR>
where to make a profit...can't remember just wht they do but the story is a<BR>
great example for running a TNE upift adventure/campaign ( I think I saw<BR>
it, with the numbers filed off somewhere in PoT.)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
rob<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> > OTOH look at modern gold extraction methods... most of the gold dig<BR>
> > out in the last 5000 odd years was done pick and shovel and pan...<BR>
> > rarity value... difficulty value... etc. Modern (TL 7-8) methods are<BR>
> > a lot more efficient... so even a small TL 9 plant should be able to<BR>
> > jack out 140 m^3 in a year or two... depending on the deposit.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Has anyone considered what dropping 1DTon of gold on a local market<BR>
> > will do tho the price? to the local economy?<BR>
><BR>
> Since gold isn't a "monetary metal" in the Imperium, the price won't<BR>
> drop *that* far. Gold has a lot of industrial uses. Gold plating acts<BR>
> as a lubricant on metal parts in vacuum. Thin gold film over viewports<BR>
> and helmets helps screen out harmful radiation.<BR>
><BR>
> So the price might drop some, but it wouldn't screw up the economy. But<BR>
> *iridium*, on the other hand.<BR>
><BR>
> --<BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
>  shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
> leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:32:41 -0500 <BR>
From: Bill Dunn <bdunn@epicsystems.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
I remember 2 distinct theatrical runs in and around 1977-78, probably<BR>
because no theater contracted for long enough to satisfy demand the first<BR>
time. Then it was re-released a few years later and that's when I remember<BR>
the Episode IV being added to the crawl.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, this all from distant memory but, hell, I still remember the<BR>
preview trailer for it that I saw at a drive-in movie presentation of Freaky<BR>
Friday and Gus the Mule. How sad is that?<BR>
<BR>
Seriously, when I listen to Lucas these days, I have an overwhelming sense<BR>
of the man contantly engaging in revisionism about the whole Star Wars<BR>
project. Sure, he may have always wanted to do a set of trilogies, blah blah<BR>
blah. But none of it could have been officially laid out when Star Wars was<BR>
released. The movie could have tanked. If it had, that would have been the<BR>
end of the story and Lucas would have gone on to do other things. But<BR>
instead it became a cultural phenomenon, hence the re-releases, the go-ahead<BR>
on the rest of the trilogy, essentially being given a blank check, etc.<BR>
<BR>
- ------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:31:23 -0600<BR>
From: Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com><BR>
Subject: Request<BR>
<BR>
Would some kind soul please send me the current address for subscribing to<BR>
the TML? I want to verify the one we are giving in our books is correct.<BR>
Thanks.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Loren Wiseman<BR>
     Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>
     Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society  http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>
     SJ Games<BR>
     lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>
     (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>
     (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:39:21 -0500 <BR>
From: Jason Kemp <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: Re: "Hiver Kung-Fu Theater"<BR>
<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
<BR>
> Jason Kemp wrote:<BR>
> > Voiceover: "And then I keek her, Sir!"<BR>
> <BR>
> Actually, I was thinking that the last quote should be along the lines<BR>
> of:<BR>
> <BR>
> "Your kung-fu is very good.  But it will not stop my<BR>
> throat-warbler-mangrove kata!"<BR>
<BR>
The entire quote's from the animated movie "Anastasia," spoken by the bat<BR>
Bartok to his master, Rasputin. :)<BR>
<BR>
Straying from that source, though, how about:<BR>
<BR>
"Your defense suck." (Kickboxer)<BR>
<BR>
Grin,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 01:34:39 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: The trinity homepage<BR>
<BR>
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To the list:<BR>
    The trinity homepage is up an limping have a look if you like:<BR>
<BR>
http://web.one.net.au/~rhoughto/trinity.html<BR>
<BR>
Rob Houghton<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
<BR>
To the list:<BR>
<BR>
    The trinity homepage is up an limping have a lookif you like:<BR>
<A HREF="http://web.one.net.au/~rhoughto/trinity.html">http://web.one.net.au/~rhoughto/trinity.html</A><BR>
Rob Houghton<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2381<BR>
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Traveller-digest        Monday, May 1 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2382<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Nordic words<BR>
Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
Technology Marches On:  Nano-BioTech Breakthrough<BR>
Punch Cards<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
RE: Hoody-hoo!<BR>
The Road To Space Is..Asphalt?<BR>
Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
OT: Episode IV<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Episode IV<BR>
Piloting Skill<BR>
RE: Episode IV<BR>
Cat Calls (was: Re: Jesse's Art)<BR>
RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re Landgrab<BR>
Re SW Ep IV<BR>
[none]<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:42:30 -0500 <BR>
From: Bill Dunn <bdunn@epicsystems.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
If any of you feel that a lot of early 'canon' Traveller adventures are just<BR>
dungeon crawls with spaceship trappings, you're pretty much right. But we<BR>
should all cut the early authors some slack. RPGs were still pretty new and<BR>
the concepts of story-telling, interaction, and the 'higher' aspects of<BR>
role-playing were still being developed. It's interesting to see younger<BR>
players turn up their noses at the old adventures and games in favor of<BR>
their story-telling games like Vampire, Amber, and so on. But where would<BR>
those gamers be if those old adventures and games hadn't pioneered the<BR>
way... <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 13:13:28 +0100<BR>
From: Martin Hardgrave <martin@deira.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Nordic words<BR>
<BR>
>On Sun, 30 Apr 2000, Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>I still haven't figured out what "raman" is supposed to mean, though. The<BR>
>>closest guess I have is that it could refer to the aliens in "Rama" (A. C.<BR>
>>Clarke), but that seems wrong.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
Could it be from "raamand" (my bolle-aa key is missing - an a with a<BR>
circle over it) meaning something like "raw-man"?<BR>
- -- <BR>
Martin Hardgrave<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 09:07:25 -0700<BR>
From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
>From: Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com><BR>
>Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
...<BR>
>>   A limitation here is that railroads (and systems where terminals for<BR>
>> ships/craft of whatever sort are required) require a very large fixed<BR>
>> investment before any cargo is shipped, but once at that point the<BR>
>> amount of cargo that can be hauled over that infrastructure is then<BR>
>> relatively of little impact on your capital costs (:simplification).<BR>
><BR>
>Somewhat counter-intuitively, capital costs don't usually come into<BR>
>question when it comes to pricing decisions. I won't quote any further,<BR>
>but Nagle and Holden divide costs into "incremental" and "non-incremental"<BR>
>where only incremental costs drive pricing and most capital costs are<BR>
>non-incremental, thus irrelevant to pricing (usually).<BR>
<BR>
  I'd be inclined to suspect that the text is largely referring to retail<BR>
and/or distributor pricing then; capital costs most certainly do come into<BR>
consideration with the provision of goods from capital-intensive facilities<BR>
(be they car manufacturers, mini-mills, or coal mines); also see below.<BR>
<BR>
>Anyway, the point I was trying to make was not about breakeven points,<BR>
>but that real cargo shippers segment their pricing, something that's <BR>
>not done in OTU canon.<BR>
<BR>
  FWIW, ISTR someone from the trucking industry being on the list - I wonder<BR>
if they have a comment, as that is a close model (?) to Trav shipping, except<BR>
that cost of market entry is much higher in the OTU (meaning somewhat less<BR>
tendency for over-capacity that might lead to below-cost pricing).<BR>
<BR>
>>   For Trav starships the substantial capital costs are almost directly<BR>
>> related to capacity - even terminal facilities (given AG for landing)<BR>
...<BR>
>Which is interesting - with fixed capacity service industries, like <BR>
>hotels, passenger airplanes and cargo services in general, since<BR>
>capacity is fixed, the seller wants to fill capacity 100% because<BR>
>unused capacity is unpaid-for capacity. This is why airlines sell seats<BR>
>at different prices - depending on how far away the flight is, the airlines<BR>
>can get away with different pricing and they try to maximize their<BR>
>loading to maximize profit, even if every seat doesn't go for the<BR>
>maximum price.<BR>
<BR>
  Yes, pricing will be flexible to maximize utilization (see GT:FT for a<BR>
full treatment of handling this in T*), but additional capacity will not<BR>
be created to carry stuff at below marginal cost. This (if correct...) is<BR>
because Trav FTL shipping marginal cost is pretty much the same as total<BR>
cost, whereas with a railroad (or even a RO-RO boat & terminal system) the<BR>
cost is closer (_much_ closer with trains) to the simple marginal cost.<BR>
<BR>
  FWIW, even with one of my players being an accountant (the rest, thankfully,<BR>
are economic illiterates) I wouldn't bother doing things to this level of<BR>
detail, although it can be fun to fiddle with. IAC, I run a fantasy RPG<BR>
these days, which gives me a long head-start on even the accountant :)<BR>
<BR>
        Steven Hudson<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 11:14:18 -0500 <BR>
From: "Smart, David J (David)" <dasmart@lucent.com><BR>
Subject: Technology Marches On:  Nano-BioTech Breakthrough<BR>
<BR>
UniSci has posted an incredible story, excerpts below.<BR>
The full story is at:<BR>
<BR>
http://unisci.com/stories/20002/0501003.htm<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- quote --<BR>
<BR>
Tiny Tool To Manipulate Gene Parts Developed<BR>
<BR>
A decade-old international effort to map the human genetic<BR>
code is expected to wrap up this summer, giving scientists<BR>
all the information they need to identify the genes behind<BR>
diseases ranging from diabetes to heart disease.<BR>
<BR>
Before researchers can turn the wealth of data provided by<BR>
the Human Genome Project into new medical treatments, they'll<BR>
need tiny tools to rearrange genes or gene parts and monitor<BR>
the impacts. <BR>
<BR>
Now, University of Florida researchers are reporting success<BR>
in developing a molecule that may serve as one such tool. <BR>
Researchers have also created other tools that may identify <BR>
disease or toxins in single cells before they invade the<BR>
body...<BR>
<BR>
- -- endquote --<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav:  Another bit of info on the tools hi-tech doctors in<BR>
Traveller use.<BR>
<BR>
David Smart<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 17:41:23 +0100<BR>
From: "MJ Dougherty" <martinjd@globalnet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Punch Cards<BR>
<BR>
I remember having an important job to do at the Sunderland Council Housing<BR>
Department Offices. When there were too many punch cards in the big reader<BR>
they piled up on one another in the out trough and made a ramp. The next<BR>
ones to come out spilled out of the trough and escaped under machinery and<BR>
stuff.<BR>
<BR>
I had some Real Important jobs:<BR>
<BR>
1. Grab the cards and clear the trough, trying to maintain the order of the<BR>
cards or at least some semblance of it.<BR>
<BR>
2. Catch the cards when 1. Failed.<BR>
<BR>
3. Find the Cards when 2. Failed.<BR>
<BR>
4. Sort the cards out from where they landed on the floor, under stuff, in<BR>
the trough, on top of the machine....<BR>
<BR>
5. Group them (the right way up!) and put an elastic band around each group.<BR>
<BR>
6. Chuck the group back in the box.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
This was my early experience of mainframe computing. They went to the moon<BR>
with machines this good. Yeek.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 12:22:05 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
>If any of you feel that a lot of early 'canon' Traveller adventures are<BR>
just<BR>
dungeon crawls with spaceship trappings, you're pretty much right. But we<BR>
should all cut the early authors some slack. RPGs were still pretty new and<BR>
the concepts of story-telling, interaction, and the 'higher' aspects of<BR>
role-playing were still being developed. It's interesting to see younger<BR>
players turn up their noses at the old adventures and games in favor of<BR>
their story-telling games like Vampire, Amber, and so on. But where would<BR>
those gamers be if those old adventures and games hadn't pioneered the<BR>
way...<<BR>
<BR>
I wonder if I saved it...<BR>
We got off on quite similar themes on the Gygax list a month or so ago. I<BR>
stated my position quite directly.<BR>
D&D was a conversion of miniature wargames. To expect this not to have an<BR>
influence on the structure of playing the game, namely that the ultimate<BR>
resolution of an encounter would be through combat, is rather absurd. No one<BR>
pulls out their miniatures, sets up the table, goes over the rules....and<BR>
then just negotiates a peaceful resolution to the battle. Why on earth would<BR>
you expect the same in D&D? Or in this case, Traveller. Further, why should<BR>
the game system be relied on to manage such? When playing a wargame, board<BR>
or miniatures, the system contains a structure for equipping and refitting<BR>
units, likewise RPGs. But does either need a system to regulate sitting<BR>
around after and going over after action reports? Or deciding what next<BR>
week's battle will be? Of course not! And why should it? The system should<BR>
not be the repository of role-playing concepts but rather the participants<BR>
must be. As such, any adventure would concentrate on the combat resolution<BR>
aspects. Done well, it will contain sufficient background that any<BR>
reasonably adept person can expand almost endlessly upon the basic<BR>
situation.<BR>
Now, some of the early adventures failed in this. on an individual basis.<BR>
Shadows for example has very little expandable structure. Taken as a lead in<BR>
for Twilight's Peak however, and it becomes much more complete.<BR>
When I suggest that early adventures were "dungeon like" I am not putting<BR>
them down. Rather, I am admiring their ability to convert from underground<BR>
to outer space.<BR>
Likewise any question about morality is an attempt to understand the themes<BR>
used in development, not a default condemnation. This then leads into a<BR>
discussion of the literary style used in play. Is it Space Opera? Starships<BR>
and Psionics (Swords and Sorcery)? Something else? D&D had aspects of both<BR>
S&S and Epic High Fantasy with the alignment system reflecting the Epic High<BR>
Fantasy aspects. Few if any S&S heroes are of Good alignment by any stretch<BR>
of the imagination. If this is the theme of Traveller, then obviously a bias<BR>
in favor of criminal adventures is almost required. How many Conan<BR>
adventures would be left if we ignored all the ones where he engaged in<BR>
questionable activity?<BR>
So give me that old time role-playing. It is good enough for me.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 11:31:25 -0500 <BR>
From: "Moody, Danny M." <DMoody@bridge.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Hoody-hoo!<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Eric & Diane Freitas [mailto:ericfrei@gte.net]<BR>
><BR>
> It's tough getting a gaming group together.  Tomorrow I am <BR>
> going to run<BR>
> yes actually *run* Traveller.  Only two of the players will <BR>
> be showing up<BR>
> though.<BR>
> This is twice in a row.  Two of my players have finals this week.<BR>
<BR>
Oh, I know what you mean.  I have been lucky to have a gaming group get together fairly regularly (once a week mainly at our F-not-so-LGS) for the last couple of months (Hi, Jay! How's the paranoia level?).<BR>
<BR>
It's a treat!<BR>
<BR>
The campaign concept? <BR>
Captain Steve (and company) - Agent of the Office of Calendar Compliance!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
 -- vargr1                                              UPP-8D9B85 --<BR>
The three principle virtues of a good programmer   | dmoody@bridge-dot-com<BR>
 are Laziness, Impatience, and Hubris.             | vargr1@jcn1-dot-com<BR>
             ** Omnia dicta fortiora, si dicta latina. **           <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 11:31:14 -0500 <BR>
From: "Smart, David J (David)" <dasmart@lucent.com><BR>
Subject: The Road To Space Is..Asphalt?<BR>
<BR>
Found another "unique" story at:<BR>
http://exn.ca/space/index.cfm?Type=Astronomy&ID=20000428-55<BR>
<BR>
- -- quote --<BR>
On board the spacecraft Stardust, which launched<BR>
February 7th, 1999, is an in-situ interstellar-dust<BR>
analyzer, essentially a mass spectrometer, which has<BR>
yielded some puzzling results for scientists. The<BR>
dust particles seem to be more like large organic<BR>
molecules, rather than mainly mineral-based...<BR>
<BR>
..."They rather resemble tar-like substances," said Dr.<BR>
Franz R. Krueger and Dr. Jochen Kissel of the Max<BR>
Planck Institute near Munich, Germany, in the latest<BR>
issue of a German astronomy magazine...<BR>
- -- endquote --<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav:  I wonder if annual maintenance covers removing<BR>
tar from a starship's undercarriage. Anybody got any<BR>
TL 15 Armor-All?  :P<BR>
<BR>
David Smart<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 12:51:07 EDT<BR>
From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
<BR>
I propose we add another member to the Spofulam clan, since Jesse has already <BR>
drawn her. Rename the "older Ditzie" picture and viola!  Pennie Spofulam. A <BR>
teenaged cousin who figured out the young genius scheme when it was her turn, <BR>
and managed to supress the characteristics that worry Uncle Hengie so much. <BR>
He is only now learning of his mistake in allowing her to reach 15...<BR>
<BR>
 Why the similar clothing styles? Either Pennie invented the look and Ditzie <BR>
is imitating by way of hero worship, or both get their look from the Spofulam <BR>
Family Creche (Morticia Adams, Headmistress).<BR>
<BR>
 Oh yes. Pennie is the short form of the names of a pair of ancient Terran <BR>
saints of mostly controlled mayhem. Her full name is Penanteller Spofulam...<BR>
<BR>
GC<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 13:02:48 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
> If any of you feel that a lot of early 'canon' Traveller adventures are just<BR>
> dungeon crawls with spaceship trappings, you're pretty much right. But we<BR>
> should all cut the early authors some slack. RPGs were still pretty new and<BR>
> the concepts of story-telling, interaction, and the 'higher' aspects of<BR>
> role-playing were still being developed. <BR>
<BR>
Note that some GMs and players decry this "story-telling" trend, believing<BR>
it has undermined player freedom and the sense of game-world immersion.<BR>
Paul Mason has been saying this in Imazine for years (you can read his<BR>
stuff at http://www.tcp-ip.or.jp/~panurge/imaz.htm).<BR>
<BR>
If you take this position, then the early Traveller adventures can be seen in<BR>
a much more generous light. They were *intelligent* dungeon adventures<BR>
in a sense: they described realistic settings and the opportunities<BR>
for adventure within them, but didn't lay down a rigid "plot" (as most<BR>
published scenarios do these days). It may have been "old fashioned"<BR>
but I think there's a lot to be said for it.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 12:06:41 -0500<BR>
From: ehenry@newberlin.org (Eric Henry)<BR>
Subject: Re: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
<BR>
A response from the 2300ad list<BR>
<BR>
++++++<BR>
<BR>
Well, I'm not a native speaker, but I'm fairly literate in modern &<BR>
classical.<BR>
<BR>
I checked the classical dictionaries and phrasebooks I have handy to see<BR>
if there's an existing phrase like this that uses "tian" for "Heaven" and<BR>
came up with nothing really close.  Tianhe exists, but really means<BR>
something more like "divine harmony", rather than the willing act of<BR>
"harmonizing" oneself with "Heaven".  In literati culture, discussions of<BR>
"tian" are distinctly in terms of it being something more like "the system<BR>
of nature" -- which doesn't issue commands to be complied with -- and even<BR>
in popular religion, "tian" tends to just punish the bad guys and reward<BR>
the good guys in a fairly obvious, common-sense setup that one doesn't<BR>
really "harmonize" or "obey".  I'm not sure what the original questioner's<BR>
intent was, but I can't help but think that it seems he's trying to<BR>
translate a distincly Judeo-Christian sentiment.  Perhaps looking at<BR>
Chinese Christian literature and usage would be more fruitful?<BR>
<BR>
In the meantime, I'd suggest "hetian", which is more correct if you want<BR>
it to mean "harmonizes/is at peace with heaven" (not "tianhe", which<BR>
would be either "the weather is calm" or "heavenly harmony" :) ).<BR>
"Xuntian" would also work, though I think it might sound like<BR>
translationese.<BR>
<BR>
Kenji<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: <JFZeigler@aol.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2000 11:13 PM<BR>
Subject: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Quick linguistic question, if anyone out there knows Mandarin.<BR>
><BR>
> As a piece of flavor text for Rim of Fire, I need a Chinese word that<BR>
> can translate as something like "in accordance with Heaven" or "in<BR>
> harmony with the universe."  The nearest I can come up with is<BR>
> either "tianzhao" or "zhouzhao," but I have a tin ear for Mandarin and<BR>
> I have no idea if either of those would sound plausible.<BR>
><BR>
> Anyone have any insight?<BR>
><BR>
> ----------<BR>
> Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>
> writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>
> "For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>
> set of people who will take offense at it."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 13:49:55 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: OT: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
At 18:21 -0400 30/4/00, Erwin Fritz <efritz@GLJA.com> wrote:<BR>
> > > Episode IV was always called 'A New Hope' in the yellow scrolling titles.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > I believe this is not true of the original theatrical release. I<BR>
> > think "Episode IV: A New Hope" was added to the crawl when it was<BR>
> > re-released in support of Empire Strikes Back (ca. 1980). It was<BR>
> > always the case, however, that Lucas envisioned it as "Episode IV".<BR>
> ><BR>
><BR>
>At last! Someone else who remembers this. Having seen Star Wars several<BR>
>times before the 1980 rerelease, I remember distinctly being surprised<BR>
>at the "Episode IV" header when the 1980 version came out. I too knew<BR>
>that it was part 4 of a 9-part series, but the 1980 version was the<BR>
>first time I saw this made "official".<BR>
<BR>
My memory (and I was 7 at the time so it mightn't be the best) is <BR>
that the second time my dad took me to see the film (about three or <BR>
four months after the first) there was more in it. I can't remember <BR>
what, but I can remember my dad saying it had extra bits.<BR>
<BR>
Hmm. Maybe I'm just loosing it..<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 10:21:31 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Kids today. When I first wrote BASIC, it was on a teletype which had a<BR>
> > maximum speed of 110 bps. We would save our programs on paper 5-hole<BR>
> > teletype tape.<BR>
><BR>
> Bet you a cookie it was *8*-hole, with the 8-th hole being parity.<BR>
> 5-hole (Baudot) code doesn't have all the characters required by even<BR>
> the most *primitive* BASIC.<BR>
><BR>
> And if you could print lowercase, it *definitely* wasn't 5-hole.<BR>
<BR>
I'm fairly sure that it was 5-hole, plus a smaller hole for feeding the<BR>
tape. Three holes on one side and two on the other. We only had capital<BR>
letters. Remember that Baudot has characters to<BR>
let you escape out of the basic character set to additional ones, so that<BR>
you really have more than 32 characters.<BR>
<BR>
I want my cookie.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 10:25:25 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
I remember it from the first showing...It defintiely said 'Episode IV A<BR>
New Hope'. Of course we were looking for it, since some of the details<BR>
about that had slipped out by then. <BR>
<BR>
(My friends and I were _way_ into film at the time.)<BR>
<BR>
Samuel D. Weiss wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> I saw Star Wars when it first opened. No New Hope nonsense back then. I also<BR>
> remember debating with friends whether something like Episode 4 would be<BR>
> added when it was re-released after  Empire and Jedi.<BR>
> <BR>
> Sam<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 12:41:41 -0500<BR>
From: Alex Ingram <ingram@airmail.net><BR>
Subject: Piloting Skill<BR>
<BR>
I can understand that 'Ship's Boat' refers to the piloting of small vacuum or<BR>
zero-gravity craft such as lifeboats, launches, orbital shuttles, workcraft and<BR>
fighters. My problem is with 'Pilot'. According to CT 'Pilot' includes not only<BR>
zero-g maneuvering and orbital transition/reentry or spaceships of >100 tons, but<BR>
also their atmospheric flight including takeoffs and landings. I assume it can<BR>
include either Gravitic Drives and/or VTOL techniques as well. As I interpret it<BR>
'Pilot' is not actually used to jump a ship - that's where navigation, engineering<BR>
and computer skills come in. So whether a ship is jump-capable or not should have<BR>
nothing to do with piloting skill, or should it? Should streamlining be the<BR>
determining factor here? And does ship size enter into this and if so at what<BR>
cutoff point - doesn't a 50-ton shuttlecraft operate using the same laws of<BR>
physics as a 100,000 ton starship within a vacuum? Would not the term 'Helm' or<BR>
'Helmsmanship' be more appropriate for space flight - especially for a large<BR>
non-streamlined ship? Or would it not be more realistic to follow the present day<BR>
example of NASA astronauts and have piloting a combination of two separate related<BR>
skills: Aircraft Piloting (for atmospheric flight) and Spacecraft Piloting (for<BR>
vacuum flight)? Comments please!<BR>
<BR>
Alex Ingram<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 08:30:51<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
At 05:36 PM 5/1/2000 +1200, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>It was re-released in 1980 ?<BR>
<BR>
For a few months before the release of ESB.  I clearly recall seeing it,<BR>
with the "Episode IV: A New Hope" at the top of the scroll.<BR>
<BR>
I also seem to recall that they showed the ESB trailer *after* the movie.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 08:38:01<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Cat Calls (was: Re: Jesse's Art)<BR>
<BR>
At 12:13 AM 5/1/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Cat Calls of the Imperium<BR>
<BR>
"Yo Mama so ugly, she makes Hivers gag."<BR>
<BR>
"Yo Daddy so dumb, he couldn't catch fish on Roup."<BR>
<BR>
"Yo sister so fat, the high port pays her to stay 100 diameters away."<BR>
<BR>
"This officer has the organizational skills of a blind, deaf, schizophrenic<BR>
Vargr."<BR>
<BR>
"Man, if nature abhors a vacuum, she must really have it in for your brain."<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
Egotist: a person more interested in himself than in me.<BR>
- -- Ambrose Bierce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 08:41:32<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
At 08:26 PM 4/30/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>Leonard wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>>No it wasn't.<BR>
><BR>
>Okay. You've piqued my curiosity now. What makes you say that?<BR>
<BR>
The fact that many of us saw the movie in its original release.  Several<BR>
times.  In theaters, I have seen the Rocky Horror Picture Show over 700<BR>
times.  Star Wars a bit over 100.  Trust me.  The original release did not<BR>
have the "New Hope" bit at the top of the scroll.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"Non possum existimare plus quemquem facini"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 08:47:06<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
At 11:54 PM 4/30/2000 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>And, my God, but weren't those 80 column card punch machines a<BR>
>finger-twisting, wrist-wrenching utter pain to use. Better than<BR>
>creasing up the end of your paper tape though.<BR>
<BR>
Feh.  Yer all kids compared to the original..<BR>
<BR>
Charles Babbage's *printer* is now running<BR>
<BR>
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/tech/newsid_710000/710950.stm<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry      )+(      gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
    http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
"Well, thanks to the Internet, I'm now bored with sex."<BR>
	                    - Fry, Futurama<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 11:40:29 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
Douglas Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >And, my God, but weren't those 80 column card punch machines a<BR>
> >finger-twisting, wrist-wrenching utter pain to use. Better than<BR>
> >creasing up the end of your paper tape though.<BR>
> <BR>
> Feh.  Yer all kids compared to the original..<BR>
> <BR>
> Charles Babbage's *printer* is now running<BR>
> <BR>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/tech/newsid_710000/710950.stm<BR>
<BR>
Yes, but is it PC-compatible? <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 11:37:44 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re Landgrab<BR>
<BR>
The beginnings of the Wypoc material (In short, the "Tourist brochure") are<BR>
beginning to take shape on my W-site. Rules materials to follow, in CT/MT<BR>
formats.<BR>
<BR>
find it at<BR>
site:	http://home.gci.net/~aramis/<BR>
subj:	http://home.gci/net/~aramis/trav.html<BR>
page:	http://home.gci.net/~aramis/mt/wypoc.html<BR>
<BR>
commentary welcomed (but it won't of need change my mind).<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 11:43:03 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
<BR>
>> Episode IV was always called 'A New Hope' in the yellow scrolling titles.<BR>
><BR>
>I believe this is not true of the original theatrical release. I<BR>
>think "Episode IV: A New Hope" was added to the crawl when it was<BR>
>re-released in support of Empire Strikes Back (ca. 1980). It was<BR>
>always the case, however, that Lucas envisioned it as "Episode IV".<BR>
><BR>
The original release had No episode title between "Star Wars" and the text.<BR>
<BR>
The "A new hope" was added during the initial release period, once lucas<BR>
knew he'd made a winner. One of a very few movies to have a recall for<BR>
editing.<BR>
<BR>
I don't recall if the "Ep IV" bit was added then or in 1980.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 12:00:28 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: [none]<BR>
<BR>
>[snip]<BR>
><BR>
>What in hell are you all talking about?<BR>
>Ramen?  Djur?<BR>
><BR>
>Ah never mind.  If it involves Card and McAffree,<BR>
>I'm out.  Reading them gives me a headache.<BR>
><BR>
>bloo<BR>
<BR>
THen, steve, take two hydrocodone, and read on!<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I found the ender-cycle, once one gets away from the first two,<BR>
is wonderful. And, aside from pern, McCaffree's novels present wonderful<BR>
characters and a consistant (if technologically unexplained) set of sci-fi<BR>
settings.<BR>
<BR>
Card, in his novels uses an orthography of "humanness" or "Alienness";<BR>
which is subject to interpretation. His characters use it often. I consider<BR>
it to be a measure of alienness, Jeff Z. considers it to be a measure of<BR>
humanness, commonality of communication. I don't consider it to measure<BR>
commonality of throught process, but behavior and form.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 12:58:53 -0700<BR>
From: "Legate Legion" <legate@futureone.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
From: Douglas E. Berry <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
<BR>
>The fact that many of us saw the movie in its original release.  Several<BR>
>times.  In theaters, I have seen the Rocky Horror Picture Show over 700<BR>
>times.  Star Wars a bit over 100.  Trust me.  The original release did not<BR>
>have the "New Hope" bit at the top of the scroll.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
    You know this reminds of the time I first saw the Rocky Horror Picture<BR>
Show.<BR>
    It was 1986, I was 16, & I had had just started a new Traveller Game<BR>
with a few friends from High School (yes, I was 7 when Star Wars came out, I<BR>
was 8 when I started to play D&D & Traveller).  Anyway, it was on a double<BR>
feature with RHPS.  So we went to see just Star Wars, but we stayed to geek<BR>
on the RHPS people.  But, funny thing was that we kinda enjoyed RHPS.  The<BR>
next week we did the same thing, go to see SW & RHPS, but we went in<BR>
costume, not in RHPS costume, but in SW costume.  Anyway, every week we<BR>
would go & see SW & RHPS.  This lasted all summer.  So I would have to say<BR>
this, I have seen SW about 250 times (100 times at the theaters, 100 times<BR>
on video, & 50 times when it came back out a few years ago.)  I have seen<BR>
ESB about 200 times, & RoftJ about 225 times, TPM I have seen about 100<BR>
times, as for RHPS, well I have seen it about 200 times as well.  Of the<BR>
videos I own, I have had to rebuy SW, ESB, RoftJ, & RHPS a couple of times.<BR>
    OBTrav, in the 3I, is there "cults" of people who, like the fans of<BR>
RHPS, SW, or ST who will go & see the new instalment or even the old ones in<BR>
costume, & is the RHPS even around?<BR>
<BR>
Janet: What have you done to Brad!<BR>
Doctor Frank-N-Furter : Nothing. Why, do you think I should?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2382<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2383</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	5/1/00 4:48:43 PM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
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Traveller-digest        Monday, May 1 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2383<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Nordic words<BR>
Re: The Road To Space Is..Asphalt?<BR>
Re: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
Re:Any Mandarin Experts<BR>
Prilissa map info<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re SW Ep IV<BR>
RE: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Powerkill (was Re: Morality of "Heros")<BR>
no keyboard kill here...<BR>
Re: Keith Supplements - Last Call!<BR>
Re: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
Re : OT Charles Babbage's printer<BR>
[BITS] Convention Update Dudley Bug Ball<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Computer use in jumpspace<BR>
Re: OT Charles Babbage's printer<BR>
Re: Piloting Skill<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Nordic words<BR>
Re: Re: Card's Ratings of alienness<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 22:11:43 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Nordic words<BR>
<BR>
Martin Hardgrave wrote:<BR>
> Could it be from "raamand" (my bolle-aa key is missing - an a with a<BR>
> circle over it) meaning something like "raw-man"?<BR>
<BR>
The translation of "rman" into English would be more like "rough man," which<BR>
could be correct. It might be similiar to "savage" or "barbarian," ie a person<BR>
with a very different culture.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 22:16:26 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: The Road To Space Is..Asphalt?<BR>
<BR>
Smart, David J (David) wrote:<BR>
> Found another "unique" story at:<BR>
> http://exn.ca/space/index.cfm?Type=Astronomy&ID=20000428-55<BR>
> <BR>
> -- quote --<BR>
> On board the spacecraft Stardust, which launched<BR>
> February 7th, 1999, is an in-situ interstellar-dust<BR>
> analyzer, essentially a mass spectrometer, which has<BR>
> yielded some puzzling results for scientists. The<BR>
> dust particles seem to be more like large organic<BR>
> molecules, rather than mainly mineral-based...<BR>
> <BR>
> ..."They rather resemble tar-like substances," said Dr.<BR>
> FFranz R. Krueger and Dr. Jochen Kissel of the Max<BR>
> Planck Institute near Munich, Germany, in the latest<BR>
> issue of a German astronomy magazine...<BR>
> -- endquote --<BR>
<BR>
They have discovered the roadwork areas for the interstellar bypass, and it's<BR>
not at all far away! Soon, the Vogons will be here...<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 16:20:42 EDT<BR>
From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
<BR>
(Feel free to forward to Kenji if you wish -- I gather he's not on this list.)<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 5/1/00 1:07:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>
ehenry@newberlin.org writes:<BR>
<BR>
> I checked the classical dictionaries and phrasebooks I have handy to see<BR>
>  if there's an existing phrase like this that uses "tian" for "Heaven" and<BR>
>  came up with nothing really close.  Tianhe exists, but really means<BR>
>  something more like "divine harmony", rather than the willing act of<BR>
>  "harmonizing" oneself with "Heaven".  In literati culture, discussions of<BR>
>  "tian" are distinctly in terms of it being something more like "the system<BR>
>  of nature" -- which doesn't issue commands to be complied with -- and even<BR>
>  in popular religion, "tian" tends to just punish the bad guys and reward<BR>
>  the good guys in a fairly obvious, common-sense setup that one doesn't<BR>
>  really "harmonize" or "obey".  I'm not sure what the original questioner's<BR>
>  intent was, but I can't help but think that it seems he's trying to<BR>
>  translate a distincly Judeo-Christian sentiment.  Perhaps looking at<BR>
>  Chinese Christian literature and usage would be more fruitful?<BR>
<BR>
The idea is to postulate a future philosophical school which holds<BR>
that a Supreme Being (vaguely defined) has written the key to<BR>
right conduct into the laws of nature, and that understanding those<BR>
laws will lead to moral behavior and a healthy society.  So "tian"<BR>
in the sense of "the system of nature" fits nicely, actually.  The only<BR>
departure from classical Chinese thought as I understand it is the<BR>
notion that "nature" might encode (not issue) moral commandments.<BR>
Where that notion came from I don't think I want to specify, although<BR>
I suppose it could come from Christian ideas like process theology.<BR>
(I do want to have *some* departure from classical thought, otherwise<BR>
I'll end up with Confucians In Space.)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>  In the meantime, I'd suggest "hetian", which is more correct if you want<BR>
>  it to mean "harmonizes/is at peace with heaven" (not "tianhe", which<BR>
>  would be either "the weather is calm" or "heavenly harmony" :) ).<BR>
>  "Xuntian" would also work, though I think it might sound like<BR>
>  translationese.<BR>
<BR>
As a name for the movement, "tianhe" sounds like it would work<BR>
("He's a member of that Divine Harmony group.")  Another idea I had,<BR>
based on another fellow's suggestion, was "tianzhenli."  I haven't been<BR>
able to find that in the literature, so it may sound too much like a<BR>
coinage produced by a foreigner :-).<BR>
<BR>
- ----------<BR>
Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>
writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>
"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>
set of people who will take offense at it."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 16:52:06 -0400<BR>
From: "James Fleming" <blackjack@pil.net><BR>
Subject: Re:Any Mandarin Experts<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
According to the dictionary program I have, the word "tian tang" =<BR>
translates into "heaven" or "paradise"  Hope this helps.<BR>
<BR>
Jim Fleming<BR>
AKA Blackjack Fleming Hero For Hire<BR>
blackjack@pil.net<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
<DIV>According to the dictionary program I have, the word "tian tang" =<BR>
translates=20<BR>
into "heaven" or "paradise"  Hope this helps.</DIV><BR>
<DIV> </DIV><BR>
<DIV>Jim Fleming<BR>
AKA Blackjack Fleming Hero For Hire<BR>
<A=20href=3D"mailto:blackjack@pil.net">blackjack@pil.net</DIV></HTM=L>- ------=_NextPart_000_004B_01BFB38D.956BE4E0--------------------------------Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 19:42:16 +0100From: John Wood <John@elvw.demon.co.uk>Subject: Prilissa map info  Referring to            http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/Prilissa.html  John Toth wrote, >What a GREAT map and Planetary info You have created !!!!!!!  Cheers - I just wish I had time to type up the rest of it (and complete the maps, but that's less important). As Doug suggested I'm concentrating on kid-developing rather than worldbuilding ATM!  >If you do not mind, Could you please Share how you did the Wonderful  >Map ? I have just started to gather information to Flesh out a small  >system.  Any information  you could spare would be Most Helpful (like  >Programs, Format, Etc).    All the software used was for Windows (yes, I'm a Microserf).  The world map was generated using Wilbur, a free fractal terrain generator:          http://www.ridgenet.net/~jslayton/software.html   The system map was created (in a bit of a hurry) using Campaign Cartographer 2:          http://www.profantasy.com/  It was then cleaned up in PaintShop Pro:          http://www.jasc.com  The text for the page was entered using the Programmer's File Editor:          http://www.lancs.ac.uk/people/cpaap/pfe  >I also visited the LandGrab Button on your Site and I think I should  >gravitate closer to that group.  The more the merrier! There's a lot more worlds in the Marches waiting to be grabbed.  >PS Good Luck with the Baby.  Thanks. May's a delight, and I'd love to continue being a full-time parent; unfortunately one of us has to work... Still, it's all been going really well since they came out of hospital (if you discount the fact that I'm getting to my email once or twice a week).  Must dash,  John   John G. Wood  |  john@elvw.demon.co.uk  |  Oxford, United Kingdom IMTU tc+ tm+ tn t4(+) ru--(+) ge 3i+ jt au- st ls+ hi++ so- zh+ pi+ jd++ Traveller IS Forms, Gal2CC, etc: http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/  ------------------------------Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 21:44:48 +0100From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"At 16:09 -0400 1/5/00, "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com> wrote:> >If any of you feel that a lot of early 'canon' Traveller adventures are >just >dungeon crawls with spaceship trappings, you're pretty much right. But we >should all cut the early authors some slack. RPGs were still pretty new and >the concepts of story-telling, interaction, and the 'higher' aspects of >role-playing were still being developed. It's interesting to see younger >players turn up their noses at the old adventures and games in favor of >their story-telling games like Vampire, Amber, and so on. But where would >those gamers be if those old adventures and games hadn't pioneered the>way...<If you're interested in the morality of early games then John Tynes makes quite an eloquent point with game 'Powerkill' which is included with HogsHead's Puppetland. (About four quid). It adds a 'metagame' over your normal RPG where you psychoanalyse the characters and their actions. As most RPGs have actions which are inherently anti-social and criminal, it can be quite interesting. But my copy of this is in storage so I can't say much more.>Now, some of the early adventures failed in this. on an individual basis. >Shadows for example has very little expandable structure. Taken as a lead in >for Twilight's Peak however, and it becomes much more complete. >When I suggest that early adventures were "dungeon like" I am not putting >them down. Rather, I am admiring their ability to convert from underground >to outer space.  But for example, Twilight's Peak, has a whole wandering campaign over  it. Admittedly, the end section is almost a Dungeon Crawl - it made  Traveller distinct from D&D in my eyes.  Dom  - ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------ "We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/   ------------------------------Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 21:50:22 +0100From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>Subject: Re SW Ep IVAt 16:09 -0400 1/5/00,  "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net> wrote:>The original release had No episode title between "Star Wars" and the text.>>The "A new hope" was added during the initial release period, once lucas >knew he'd made a winner. One of a very few movies to have a recall for >editing. > >I don't recall if the "Ep IV" bit was added then or in 1980.  If it was added then it would explain why I recall it being there -  because the UK releases are delayed because we get the US prints sent  over as the films are finishing in the US... Saves money.  BTW if you're looking for a film which does court politics quite well  (maybe applicable to Civil War Era Traveller) then have a look at  'Elizabeth', a recent release (last year) about the consolidation of  power by Queen Elizabeth 1st in the 1500's. I suspect chunks of it  could be stolen for a court campaign.  Dom  - ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------ "We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/   ------------------------------  Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 14:58:41 -0600  From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net>Subject: RE: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)  A pity.  Of course, this is the same universe that features psionic mass detectors, indestructable starship hulls constructed from a single artificial molecule, artificial gravity, reactionless thrusters, time-retardation fields, teleportation, hyperdrive, impact armor, forcefields, perfect anagathics, total conversion power sources (in certain tnuctipun relics), the equipment to move quantum black holes, and artificial structures as large as the Earth's orbit.  So if we start taking out the implausible or impossible technology we won't have much story left to enjoy.  And in the stories it all _reads_ as if it were plausible.  - -----Original Message----- From: shadow@krypton.rain.com [mailto:shadow@krypton.rain.com] Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2000 4:49 AM To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com Subject: Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)   In mail you write:  > Who's to say Niven's futuristic room-temperature superconductors AREN'T also > superconductors of heat?  We certainly have no idea how to make them or what > physical properties they might have beyond super-conductance.  Alas, as I recall from the comments of professional scientists, the properties required for the two types of "superconductivity" aren't compatible.- -- Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow) shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferredleonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort------------------------------Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 13:58:42From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com>Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"  At 12:58 PM 5/1/2000 -0700, you wrote:  >Janet: What have you done to Brad!  Crowd: "Nothing! Your room was first!" - - or - "Nothing! Business before pleasure!" - - or - "Nothing! This was the easier lock to pick!"  >Doctor Frank-N-Furter : Nothing. Why, do you think I should?  - --   Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html  "Non possum existimare plus quemquem facini"  ------------------------------  Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 17:16:18 -0400From: "Walt Smith" <smithw@hartwick.edu> Subject: Powerkill (was Re: Morality of "Heros")  SD Mooney wrote: >If you're interested in the morality of early games  >then John Tynes makes quite an eloquent point with  >game 'Powerkill' which is included with HogsHead's  >Puppetland. (About four quid). It adds a 'metagame'  >over your normal RPG where you psychoanalyse the  >characters and their actions. As most RPGs have  >actions which are inherently anti-social and criminal,  >it can be quite interesting.   I read the web version and while I'd agree with "interesting", notice that his "reclassify everything the characters do as criminal acts" could be used for more than describing a Vampire clanfight as a mass murder in a bar, or describing an AD&D dungeon  crawl as a murder-robbery spree through a low-income housing complex.  You coud just as easily "Powerkill" the tale of a knight defeating a rampaging dragon  (local psycho tortures farmer's cow with sharp stick), or "Powerkill" a desperate escape from evil stormtroopers (escaped mental patients still at large after murdering two police officers).  Take anything the players do, alter the settings, participants and actions until you've managed to retell an entertaining evening of usual gameplay as the worst kind of real-crime sleazeballs and psychos exploitation video.  Is "Powerkill" some kind  of moral relatavism propaganda piece?  Walt Smith  ------------------------------  Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 17:18:36 -0400From: Mark Urbin <urbin@bigfoot.com>Subject: no keyboard kill here...  GypsyComet puts out into the ether: >  Oh yes. Pennie is the short form of the names of a pair of ancient Terran >saints of mostly controlled mayhem. Her full name is Penanteller Spofulam...  No spraying of coffee on the keyboard with this...because it sent a serious  chill right down to the bone...   - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- urbin@bigfoot.com - Opinions should be yours too! "Tension, apprehension and dissension have begun." -- Alfred Bester http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/ - -----------------------------------------------------------------------------  ------------------------------Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 14:41:25 -0700From: "J. Paul Sanders" <timmon@primenet.com>Subject: Re: Keith Supplements - Last Call!At 10:54 AM 4/29/00 -0500, you wrote:>"J. Paul Sanders" wrote: > >> 5...4... 3... - yes folks - 3 sets left. If you want to reserve one, do it>> while you can! Details at:>><<http://www.primenet.com/~timmon/supplements.html>http://www.primenet.com/~timmon/supplements.html><http://www.primenet.com/~timmon/s>www.primenet.com/~timmon/s >> upplements.html > >Are they all gone? > >Terry  I have a couple of sets left. Let me know if you're still interested in one.  Cordially, Paul Sanders  ------------------------------Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 07:52:54 +1000From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au>Subject: Re: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan> From: GypsyComet@aol.com> Subject: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan > > I propose we add another member to the Spofulam clan, since Jesse has already > drawn her. Rename the "older Ditzie" picture and viola!  Pennie Spofulam  FWIW I think that pic is of an already-existing member of the clan - Winifreda Spofulam.  She does a lot of weapons testing and such, but isnt really in the design end of things.  Ian  ------------------------------  Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 07:55:58 +1000 From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au>Subject: Re : OT Charles Babbage's printer> From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com>> > Charles Babbage's *printer* is now running> >  > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/tech/newsid_710000/710950.stm >  > Yes, but is it PC-compatible?  >   Alexi Suvurov's driver for it should be in the next dev kernel.  Ian Whitchurch------------------------------Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 23:03:02 +0100From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>Subject: [BITS] Convention Update Dudley Bug BallBITS - British Isles Traveller Support http://www.bits.org.uk/  The Dudley Bug Ball V (sponsored by Brittannia Game Designs Ltd).  Now in its fifth year the annual Duggley Bug Ball will soon be coming  on the 6th of May 2000 at Rowley Regis College, at 9.30AM until  8.30PM. BITS will be there.  NEWSFLASH: a word from Steve Turner  For anyone driving upto DBB from the south on the M5, I've just  learnt that the northbound exit slipway of J2 of the M5 will be shut.  The Highways Agency have sent me a PDF giving diversions for any  northbound traffic using the M5. If you follow the diversion to  Birchfield Island on the Map and then take the A4034 signposted  Halesowen you will be back on route.,  The PDF is at http://members.aol.com/dudleybug/ as is further  information about the Convention.  Hope this helps,  Dom - -------------Dom Mooney---webmaster@bits.org.uk----------------                   BITS - British Isles Traveller Support.   http://www.bits.org.uk/              mailto:bits@bits.org.uk Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises. GURPS is a registered trademark of Steve Jackson Games, Inc. BITS and CORE are trademarks of BITS UK Limited. All rights reserved.  ------------------------------Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 14:09:38 -0400From: "Chauncey Smith" <csmith@ICDC.com>Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"- -----Original Message-----From: Matt Stevens <mfs10@columbia.edu>To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com>Date: Monday, May 01, 2000 1:03 PM Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"   > >Note that some GMs and players decry this "story-telling" trend, believing >it has undermined player freedom and the sense of game-world immersion. >Paul Mason has been saying this in Imazine for years (you can read his >stuff at http://www.tcp-ip.or.jp/~panurge/imaz.htm). > >If you take this position, then the early Traveller adventures can be seen in >a much more generous light. They were *intelligent* dungeon adventures >in a sense: they described realistic settings and the opportunities >for adventure within them, but didn't lay down a rigid "plot" (as most >published scenarios do these days). It may have been "old fashioned" >but I think there's a lot to be said for it. > >Matt  Of Course you can say alot for it. (I'm going back on my gaming technology stick again). From it came the idea for using Flowcharts to game with. And the Idea of free form gaming. Look at any amber zone and you see a free form game. just the beginning and the player take over. It's truly story telling. even if you look at patrons you can simply roll some dice and start a small Free form adventure.  This came simply because there where no walls to hold in the players. No real goals except those given by the ref to meet. This environment let's players find the "Voice " of the charter they are playing. I recently tried to use one of the patron adventures for my Traveller game and the players all got into the illegality of it. One of them turned to me and said " what happens if we get caught? I'll ruin my family name" it was a great moment he was thinking about being a noble and doing this illegal act. I suggested they find another way. They did and it was a great game.  ------------------------------Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 14:25:21 -0400From: "Chauncey Smith" <csmith@ICDC.com>Subject: Re: Computer use in jumpspace  According to the SOM One of the three computers is used for navigation and control of the ship the other 2 or back ups. If the first one is damaged then one of the others take over.- -----Original Message-----From: Joe Lachance <Lachance@nc.rr.com>To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com>Date: Monday, May 01, 2000 10:46 AM Subject: Computer use in jumpspace   >    In the campaign I'm running the player characters have a need to harness >shipboard computing power to chug through a rather large dataset.  As best I >can tell traditional craft have three computer systems: primary, backup, and >a dedicated jump computer (note: I do not have a copy of DGP's starship >operation's manual).  If one of the onboard computers is used primariliy for >jump calculations, does it cease to be needed when the ship enters jumpspace >(freeing it up for other tasks)? >    This opens up the question of how jump engines interact with the >manifold of jumpspace in in Traveller.  My gut feeling is that once a ship's >jump grid is energized and it enters jump-space the 'trajectory' of the next >week is one that is not actively changed (by computer use or astrogation). > >IMTU traditional jump engines behave as above, while psionic drives >(somewhat similar to those outlined in FFS1) differ: with the astrogator >continually weaving the ship through jumpspace (think of the Pilot's in >David Zindell's Neverness series of novels). > >Joe > >  ------------------------------Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 15:18:51 -0700From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com>Subject: Re: OT Charles Babbage's printer> Charles Babbage's *printer* is now running > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/tech/newsid_710000/710950.stm  Maybe not. I noticed when I read the article that they had to correct several "deliberate errors" in the design. I wish I had thought of that. "That's not a bug. It's a deliberate error designed to frustrate industrial espionage. And our schedule slippage is really a clever ploy to frustrate people who were planning on intercepting our first shipment. I deserve a bonus."------------------------------Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 18:22:56 -0400From: "Thom Harris" <thomharr@mediaone.net>Subject: Re: Piloting SkillPlease remember that in CT and I believe MT "Pilot" could handle all ship's boat a -1 to their piloting skill. Seems to me that they are ALMOST interchangeable.Thom- ----- Original Message -----From: "Alex Ingram" <ingram@airmail.net>To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com>Sent: Monday, May 01, 2000 1:41 PMSubject: Piloting Skill   > I can understand that 'Ship's Boat' refers to the piloting of small vacuum or > zero-gravity craft such as lifeboats, launches, orbital shuttles, workcraft and > fighters. My problem is with 'Pilot'. According to CT 'Pilot' includes not only > zero-g maneuvering and orbital transition/reentry or spaceships of >100 tons, but > also their atmospheric flight including takeoffs and landings.<Snipped>> Or would it not be more realistic to follow the present day > example of NASA astronauts and have piloting a combination of two separate related > skills: Aircraft Piloting (for atmospheric flight) and Spacecraft Piloting (for > vacuum flight)? Comments please! > > Alex Ingram >  ------------------------------  Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 18:46:27 -0400From: "Josh W. Spencer" <macmanjws@earthlink.net>Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)  Luther Martin refers to Charles Babbage's printer!: >  > Yes, but is it PC-compatible?  ObTrav: Has anyone come up with a world in the OTU where Babbage's designs were actually put into full use at (and I'm guessing here) a TL 4 or 5 setting, not to mention the entire society changes as a result of the discovery?  Refer to the novel "The Difference Engine" by Gibson & Sterling. Imagine 19th-century Commies! :) :)  - --  Josh W. Spencer (macmanjws@earthlink.net) VILANI ALIAS: Iashir Rekiinikimas Uiagam Ypsilanti, Michigan, North America, Terra Sol Subsector, Solomani Rim Sector  ------------------------------  Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 19:45:23 EDT From: TOCoons@cs.com Subject: Re: Nordic words  In a message dated 4/30/00 6:57:41 AM Mountain Daylight Time,  owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:  Jens Rydholm wrote:  >  TOCoons@cs.com wrote: >  > Card does speak Portuguese, but my guess would be that his knowledge of  >  > Swedish comes through a friend or family member. >   >  Or through a dictionary, since he got the basic forms of the words right,  > but used English plural forms. >   Since the words were borrowed from Nordic (descended from Swedish) by Ender's  sister Val, writing as the historian Demosthenes in her highly influential  history, and one of Val's students comments on the fact that she simply dropped the umlaut  from a Nordic word, I think Card's anglicization was intentional.  ------------------------------  Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 19:45:30 EDT From: TOCoons@cs.com Subject: Re: Re: Card's Ratings of alienness  Steve Daniels wrote:  >  [snip] >   >  What in hell are you all talking about? >  Ramen?  Djur? >   >  Ah never mind.  If it involves Card and McAffree, >  I'm out.  Reading them gives me a headache. >   >  bloo >   >  ------------------------------  They come from Orson Scott Card's "Speaker for the Dead", where one of his  characters  sets forth a Theory of human relationships with aliens. Think: Framlings: "Us",  Utlannings: "People like Us",.  Raman:       "Aliens like Us",  Varelse     "Real Aliens",  Djur        "Bug-eyed monsters", and you about have it. Now invent a race that are "Real Aliens", whom the Powers think are  "Bug-Eyed-Monsters" but the hero and company know or discover to be "Aliens  like Us" and you have the gist of it.  I don't particularly enjoy his style of writing,  I don't like what he does  with his characters (especially those I liked in earlier books), and his  portrayal of humanity is depressingly realistic (Covering the range from  corrupt stupidity  to ordinary and mundane to occasional wisdom, compassion,  and heroism ) On the other hand, his aliens are alien, his heroes are heroic,  and his villians villanious, and he can tell a good story. No one in SF  treats moral and ethical issues more thoroughly, though you do run the risk  of  getting SF with your philosophy in some parts of his work.  I used to like McAffrey, but nowadays her stuff gives me a bellyache.   ------------------------------  End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2383 ***********************************  To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:  unsubscribe traveller-digest  in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.imagiconline.com". If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe "local-traveller":  subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net  A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest" in the commands above with "traveller".  Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com </FONT><FONT  COLOR="#0f0f0f" BACK="#fffffe" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2384</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest        Tuesday, May 2 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2384<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
RE: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: orbit to surface<BR>
Re: orbit to surface<BR>
Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Episode IV<BR>
Re: Episode IV<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Computer use in jumpspace<BR>
Re: Episode IV<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
Re: The Road To Space Is..Asphalt?<BR>
Re: The Road To Space Is..Asphalt?<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
OT: Re: Episode IV<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 19:26:51 -0500<BR>
From: "Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
<BR>
She also did a stint with a Retro Terran rock band called the Hong <BR>
Kong Cavaliers under the name of Pretty Penny<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 18:04:40 -0700<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
<BR>
Boy is it a good thing I'd set the beer down 'cause of the subject line!<BR>
<BR>
ROFLMAO!!!!!!  Penanteller Spofulam!!!  Stop it, yer' killin' me!!!!<BR>
LOL!!!!<BR>
<BR>
Jesse<BR>
(with hurting ribs from laughing so much :)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of<BR>
> GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>
> Sent: Monday, May 01, 2000 9:51 AM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> I propose we add another member to the Spofulam clan, since Jesse<BR>
> has already<BR>
> drawn her. Rename the "older Ditzie" picture and viola!  Pennie<BR>
> Spofulam. A<BR>
> teenaged cousin who figured out the young genius scheme when it<BR>
> was her turn,<BR>
> and managed to supress the characteristics that worry Uncle<BR>
> Hengie so much.<BR>
> He is only now learning of his mistake in allowing her to reach 15...<BR>
><BR>
>  Why the similar clothing styles? Either Pennie invented the look<BR>
> and Ditzie<BR>
> is imitating by way of hero worship, or both get their look from<BR>
> the Spofulam<BR>
> Family Creche (Morticia Adams, Headmistress).<BR>
><BR>
>  Oh yes. Pennie is the short form of the names of a pair of<BR>
> ancient Terran<BR>
> saints of mostly controlled mayhem. Her full name is Penanteller<BR>
> Spofulam...<BR>
><BR>
> GC<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 21:23:32 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
>But for example, Twilight's Peak, has a whole wandering campaign over<BR>
it. Admittedly, the end section is almost a Dungeon Crawl - it made<BR>
Traveller distinct from D&D in my eyes.<<BR>
<BR>
Check early modules like Village of Hommlett or the Secret of Bone Hill.<BR>
Both had significant support material. Traveller is of bigger scope in<BR>
general and so should be expected to produce significantly larger scale<BR>
support material. On that basis, Twilight's Peak covers a small barony in<BR>
D&D. Rather equitable I'd say.<BR>
We could try going off on the sci-fi vs fantasy stuff here, but I think the<BR>
old Phil and Dixie dealt with it rather well. It is names and a bit of scale<BR>
and little else different when it comes down to it. It is hardly surprising<BR>
adventures would not be all that different.<BR>
And I like dungeon crawls, in space or underground.<BR>
<BR>
>Look at any amber zone and you see a free form game. just the beginning and<BR>
the player take over. <<BR>
<BR>
Bu again, most early Amber Zones still had combat as the ultimate<BR>
resolution. Plotting the strike and sometimes gaining the assignment was<BR>
where the role-playing aspects came into play, but limited as they should be<BR>
to allow full freedom for players and referee.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 19:11:04 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: orbit to surface<BR>
<BR>
I hate to say this, but I can't find the damn things. Is the TML archived<BR>
anywhere?<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 22:15:05 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: orbit to surface<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 5/1/00 10:12:42 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>
bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< I hate to say this, but I can't find the damn things. Is the TML archived<BR>
 anywhere?<BR>
 <BR>
 Bruce<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
Yes at ftp.mpgn.com/gaming....<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 12:25:38 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
<BR>
Sword-Worlder wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> ----- Original Message -----<BR>
> From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
> > And, my God, but weren't those 80 column card punch machines a<BR>
> > finger-twisting, wrist-wrenching utter pain to use. Better than<BR>
> > creasing up the end of your paper tape though.<BR>
><BR>
> The embedded numeric keypad was a bear to learn, but worked well once you<BR>
> got the hang of it.  I'm just glad to have had machines that allowed<BR>
> corrections before punching the cards.  I was forever double clicking the<BR>
> spacebar.  Another thing I remember; since I was a junior enlisted guy in my<BR>
> shop, I got the priviledge of emptying the confetti drawers and vacuuming<BR>
> the innards.  I should write a supplement: 101 Uses for Punched Card<BR>
> Confetti.  My personal favorite was tossing a handful onto some poor slob as<BR>
> he stepped out of the shower or down the back of a sweaty person.  They<BR>
> stick like glue and jab you with their little, pointy corners :-><BR>
><BR>
> ObTrav: What do his shipmates do to the practical joker who puts itching<BR>
> powder in the low berths?<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Immediate Spacing."They put  itching powder in my low berth" is  also an<BR>
accepted murder defence in Admiralty Court.<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 18:40:51 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>><BR>
>>> Kids today. When I first wrote BASIC, it was on a teletype which had a<BR>
>>> maximum speed of 110 bps. We would save our programs on paper 5-hole<BR>
>>> teletype tape.<BR>
>><BR>
>> Bet you a cookie it was *8*-hole, with the 8-th hole being parity.<BR>
>> 5-hole (Baudot) code doesn't have all the characters required by even<BR>
>> the most *primitive* BASIC.<BR>
>><BR>
>> And if you could print lowercase, it *definitely* wasn't 5-hole.<BR>
><BR>
> I'm fairly sure that it was 5-hole, plus a smaller hole for feeding the<BR>
> tape. Three holes on one side and two on the other.<BR>
<BR>
I know, I've got some around here, next to the 5 meg removable disk<BR>
pack and the core plane (really!).<BR>
<BR>
> We only had capital letters. Remember that Baudot has characters to<BR>
> let you escape out of the basic character set to additional ones, so that<BR>
> you really have more than 32 characters.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, and that escape (the LETTERS and FIGURES codes, which in later<BR>
character sets became SO and SI) was what contained the numbers and<BR>
punctuation. <BR>
<BR>
How many rows of keys were there? 3 or 4?<BR>
<BR>
> I want my cookie.<BR>
<BR>
Here's 1 Cr, buy yourself a box of them.<BR>
<BR>
And here's the usual Baudot set (as opposed to the weather version, or<BR>
the stock ticker version)<BR>
<BR>
hex<BR>
code    letters figures<BR>
00      NUL     NUL<BR>
01      E       3<BR>
02      LF      LF<BR>
03      A       -<BR>
04      SPACE   SPACE<BR>
05      S       BEL<BR>
06      I       8<BR>
07      U       7<BR>
08      CR      CR<BR>
09      D       +<BR>
0A      R       4<BR>
0B      J       '<BR>
0C      N       ,<BR>
0D      F       $<BR>
0E      C       :<BR>
0F      K       (<BR>
10      T       5<BR>
11      Z       "<BR>
12      L       )<BR>
13      W       2<BR>
14      H       #<BR>
15      Y       6<BR>
16      P       0<BR>
17      Q       1<BR>
18      O       9<BR>
19      B       ?<BR>
1A      G       &<BR>
1B      figures figures<BR>
1C      M       .<BR>
1D      X       /<BR>
1E      V       ;<BR>
1F      letters letters<BR>
<BR>
Looking over the set, I have to ask what you used for multiplaction,<BR>
since there's no "*". <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 18:52:19 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 05:36 PM 5/1/2000 +1200, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>It was re-released in 1980 ?<BR>
><BR>
> For a few months before the release of ESB.  I clearly recall seeing it,<BR>
> with the "Episode IV: A New Hope" at the top of the scroll.<BR>
><BR>
> I also seem to recall that they showed the ESB trailer *after* the movie.<BR>
<BR>
I ought to see if I can find a photo of the Westgate's Marquee with the<BR>
"Exclusive North American Engagement" notice on it in the local<BR>
newspaper's morgue and get it scanned...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 18:56:58 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I remember 2 distinct theatrical runs in and around 1977-78, probably<BR>
> because no theater contracted for long enough to satisfy demand the first<BR>
> time.<BR>
<BR>
The Westgate, out in Beaverton didn't think it'd do well, so they and<BR>
studio finally came up with a contract that said they needed the<BR>
studio's permission to quit showing it as long as it was bringing in X<BR>
dollars a week... But it lacked a clause *allowing* the studio to pull<BR>
it while it was still making that much. <BR>
<BR>
It never, *ever* dropped that low. The studio *pleaded* with them to<BR>
pull it. But since they were *still* showing it to reasonably filled<BR>
auditoriums, they weren't all that interested. Especially when it got<BR>
to the point where they were the *only* theatre in North America<BR>
showing it. Folks would fly in from the East Coast and from Canada,<BR>
just to see the movie!<BR>
<BR>
Finally, the studio got down to the point of making a deal involving<BR>
ESB... So they showed ESB and SW together for a few days, then<BR>
(finally) quit showing SW. <BR>
<BR>
I've always kicked myself for picking up a book in the SF section in<BR>
1976, and deciding not to buy it. A silly thing called "Star Wars".<BR>
Yes, the book was out *before* the trailers ever hit the theaters.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 18:36:18 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> And, my God, but weren't those 80 column card punch machines a<BR>
> finger-twisting, wrist-wrenching utter pain to use. Better than<BR>
> creasing up the end of your paper tape though.<BR>
<BR>
Keypunches weren't any worse (or better) than a typical electric<BR>
typewriter of the era. <BR>
<BR>
I''ve never had the opportunity to use the old hand punches, just seen<BR>
pictures. <BR>
<BR>
But I have "edited" paper tape by cutting out a bad section, typing the<BR>
replacement section on a new piece of tape, then carefully feeding the<BR>
chunks to the reader in order.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 19:08:34 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Computer use in jumpspace<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>     In the campaign I'm running the player characters have a need to harness<BR>
> shipboard computing power to chug through a rather large dataset.  As best I<BR>
> can tell traditional craft have three computer systems: primary, backup, and<BR>
> a dedicated jump computer (note: I do not have a copy of DGP's starship<BR>
> operation's manual).  If one of the onboard computers is used primariliy for<BR>
> jump calculations, does it cease to be needed when the ship enters jumpspace<BR>
> (freeing it up for other tasks)?<BR>
<BR>
It may not be *capable* of helping with the database work. There's no<BR>
reason why the computers *have* to be general purpose computers rather<BR>
than specialized units.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 19:04:38 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I remember it from the first showing...It defintiely said 'Episode IV A<BR>
> New Hope'. Of course we were looking for it, since some of the details<BR>
> about that had slipped out by then. <BR>
<BR>
*Which* "first showing"? It most definitely said no such thing in 1977.<BR>
And if you dig into news stories around the time of the release of "The<BR>
Empire Strikes Back"(1980) you'll find comments about that text being<BR>
*added* for the re-release (they had *both* films in the theatres for a<BR>
few weeks).<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 00:19:08 -0400<BR>
From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
Did you ever use one of those old machines that looked like a cross between<BR>
a reel-to-reel and a typewriter, only it used spools of paper that it<BR>
punched holes in?  I used to have one of those.<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
 J-Man<BR>
 ICQ# 2843475<BR>
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
 Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
 Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Leonard Erickson" <shadow@krypton.rain.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2000 10:36 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> > And, my God, but weren't those 80 column card punch machines a<BR>
> > finger-twisting, wrist-wrenching utter pain to use. Better than<BR>
> > creasing up the end of your paper tape though.<BR>
><BR>
> Keypunches weren't any worse (or better) than a typical electric<BR>
> typewriter of the era.<BR>
><BR>
> I''ve never had the opportunity to use the old hand punches, just seen<BR>
> pictures.<BR>
><BR>
> But I have "edited" paper tape by cutting out a bad section, typing the<BR>
> replacement section on a new piece of tape, then carefully feeding the<BR>
> chunks to the reader in order.<BR>
><BR>
> --<BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
>  shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
> leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 20:11:49 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I propose we add another member to the Spofulam clan, since Jesse has<BR>
> already drawn her. Rename the "older Ditzie" picture and viola!<BR>
> Pennie Spofulam. A teenaged cousin who figured out the young genius<BR>
> scheme when it was her turn, and managed to supress the<BR>
> characteristics that worry Uncle Hengie so much.  He is only now<BR>
> learning of his mistake in allowing her to reach 15...<BR>
><BR>
>  Why the similar clothing styles? Either Pennie invented the look and<BR>
> Ditzie is imitating by way of hero worship, or both get their look<BR>
> from the Spofulam Family Creche (Morticia Adams, Headmistress).<BR>
><BR>
>  Oh yes. Pennie is the short form of the names of a pair of ancient<BR>
> Terran saints of mostly controlled mayhem. Her full name is<BR>
> Penanteller Spofulam...<BR>
<BR>
Nonsense. Careful research shows that she must be named after a 20th<BR>
century gadget-mistress supreme... Penny (lastname unkown) who is<BR>
always riding herd on the Infamous Inspector Gadget! And "his" gadgets<BR>
are ample proof that they are proper ancestors to the Spofulam<BR>
dynasty...<BR>
<BR>
:-) :-) :-) :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 21:33:43 -0700<BR>
From: Kristian Miller <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Road To Space Is..Asphalt?<BR>
<BR>
> dust particles seem to be more like large organic<BR>
> molecules, rather than mainly mineral-based...<BR>
> <BR>
> ..."They rather resemble tar-like substances," said Dr.<BR>
> Franz R. Krueger and Dr. Jochen Kissel of the Max<BR>
<BR>
Other organic components found in space dust include the basic<BR>
components for making fiberglass resin.  Hmm.<BR>
<BR>
Kristian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 21:33:43 -0700<BR>
From: Kristian Miller <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Road To Space Is..Asphalt?<BR>
<BR>
> dust particles seem to be more like large organic<BR>
> molecules, rather than mainly mineral-based...<BR>
> <BR>
> ..."They rather resemble tar-like substances," said Dr.<BR>
> Franz R. Krueger and Dr. Jochen Kissel of the Max<BR>
<BR>
Other organic components found in space dust include the basic<BR>
components for making fiberglass resin.  Hmm.<BR>
<BR>
Kristian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 14:23:40 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
How about trying to use the machines of this era to run starships?<BR>
<BR>
Captain: Computer, prepare jump calculations...<BR>
Computer Officer: Sorry Cap'n, the punchcards are all on the floor and the<BR>
tubes are blowing left and right...I have a pencil and some paper...'twould<BR>
probably be faster...<BR>
Captain:<<translator failure: 3 words>><BR>
Translator: Captain! I'm shocked!<BR>
<BR>
At least they are (probably) virus proof.<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
J-Man wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Did you ever use one of those old machines that looked like a cross between<BR>
> a reel-to-reel and a typewriter, only it used spools of paper that it<BR>
> punched holes in?  I used to have one of those.<BR>
> ___________________________________________________________<BR>
>  J-Man<BR>
>  ICQ# 2843475<BR>
>  New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
>  Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
>  Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
> ___________________________________________________________<BR>
><BR>
> ----- Original Message -----<BR>
> From: "Leonard Erickson" <shadow@krypton.rain.com><BR>
> To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
> Sent: Monday, May 01, 2000 10:36 PM<BR>
> Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
><BR>
> > In mail you write:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > > And, my God, but weren't those 80 column card punch machines a<BR>
> > > finger-twisting, wrist-wrenching utter pain to use. Better than<BR>
> > > creasing up the end of your paper tape though.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Keypunches weren't any worse (or better) than a typical electric<BR>
> > typewriter of the era.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > I''ve never had the opportunity to use the old hand punches, just seen<BR>
> > pictures.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > But I have "edited" paper tape by cutting out a bad section, typing the<BR>
> > replacement section on a new piece of tape, then carefully feeding the<BR>
> > chunks to the reader in order.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > --<BR>
> > Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
> >  shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
> > leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
> ><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 21:42:46 -0700<BR>
From: Kristian Miller <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Any Mandarin experts?<BR>
<BR>
JFZeigler@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> As a piece of flavor text for Rim of Fire, I need a Chinese word that<BR>
> can translate as something like "in accordance with Heaven" or "in<BR>
> harmony with the universe."  The nearest I can come up with is<BR>
> either "tianzhao" or "zhouzhao," but I have a tin ear for Mandarin and<BR>
> I have no idea if either of those would sound plausible.<BR>
<BR>
I had an in depth discussion about this with a native Mandarin speaker<BR>
that has a real interest in language. <BR>
<BR>
Hi first response was that you need to know what is in accordance with<BR>
Heaven.  The two questions he came up with were: Is it a person?  Or is<BR>
it a dynasty?<BR>
<BR>
Also you need to know if this is an adjective.  I wasn't clear what the<BR>
alternative was (an adverb?).  He thought that all four phrases (English<BR>
and Chinese) would confuse a Mandarin speaker.  So you might just want<BR>
to wing it from suggestions on the list.<BR>
<BR>
By the way, what is "Rim of Fire?"<BR>
<BR>
Kristian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 14:57:38 +1000<BR>
From: "The Roc" <roc@kewl.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: <Qstor@aol.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 1:00 AM<BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> In a message dated 5/1/00 10:58:41 AM Eastern Daylight Time,<BR>
> rhoughto@one.net.au writes:<BR>
><BR>
> << I'd be happy just see the d#% thing...they are running teasers out the<BR>
> wazoo<BR>
>  down here...driving me not-so-slowly nuts!<BR>
>   >><BR>
> That's funny that some of the Australian tv stations don't have it<BR>
> on...because of their role in production...<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Don't worry, down here it's coming... soon...<BR>
<BR>
As for production, they make a plethora of movies and series Downunder, many<BR>
we will never see as they are not made for local consumption and not worth<BR>
the cost to pick-up by local TV (cable is another story).<BR>
<BR>
- -- The Roc<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 21:45:52 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> And here's the usual Baudot set (as opposed to the weather version, or<BR>
> the stock ticker version)<BR>
><BR>
> hex<BR>
> code    letters figures<BR>
> 00      NUL     NUL<BR>
> 01      E       3<BR>
> 02      LF      LF<BR>
> 03      A       -<BR>
> 04      SPACE   SPACE<BR>
> 05      S       BEL<BR>
> 06      I       8<BR>
> 07      U       7<BR>
> 08      CR      CR<BR>
> 09      D       +<BR>
> 0A      R       4<BR>
> 0B      J       '<BR>
> 0C      N       ,<BR>
> 0D      F       $<BR>
> 0E      C       :<BR>
> 0F      K       (<BR>
> 10      T       5<BR>
> 11      Z       "<BR>
> 12      L       )<BR>
> 13      W       2<BR>
> 14      H       #<BR>
> 15      Y       6<BR>
> 16      P       0<BR>
> 17      Q       1<BR>
> 18      O       9<BR>
> 19      B       ?<BR>
> 1A      G       &<BR>
> 1B      figures figures<BR>
> 1C      M       .<BR>
> 1D      X       /<BR>
> 1E      V       ;<BR>
> 1F      letters letters<BR>
><BR>
> Looking over the set, I have to ask what you used for multiplaction,<BR>
> since there's no "*".<BR>
<BR>
The "*" was the figures shift of G, or 1B 1A. I don't remember if there was<BR>
a following letters shift to get you back to the letter set. I don't think<BR>
that there was a "^" in the figures set, however. This may be why FORTRAN<BR>
used "**" for exponentiation.<BR>
<BR>
Now just imagine a group of middle-aged TL15 computer people talking about<BR>
the old days when they used TL14 and TL13 equipment. "Kids today have it<BR>
easy..."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 15:15:08 +1000<BR>
From: "The Roc" <roc@kewl.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 6:50 AM<BR>
Subject: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> BTW if you're looking for a film which does court politics quite well <BR>
> (maybe applicable to Civil War Era Traveller) then have a look at <BR>
> 'Elizabeth', a recent release (last year) about the consolidation of <BR>
> power by Queen Elizabeth 1st in the 1500's. I suspect chunks of it <BR>
> could be stolen for a court campaign.<BR>
> <BR>
> Dom<BR>
<BR>
Bewdy, 'Elizabeth' is coming to cable here this month I believe :^)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 00:25:00 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: OT: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
How OT is this! <g><BR>
<BR>
On 05/01/00 at 10:25 AM,  Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> said:<BR>
<BR>
>I remember it from the first showing...It defintiely said 'Episode IV A<BR>
>New Hope'. Of course we were looking for it, since some of the details<BR>
>about that had slipped out by then. <BR>
<BR>
I think it was there the first time I saw it too, and that was the first day it was in town. If I recall correctly I laughed when I saw the Episode IV...it got me in the mood for a "Saturday Afternoon Serial", and I wasn't disappointed.<BR>
<BR>
You don't suppose there were some first run prints *with* and some *without* do you?<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
- -- <BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net    using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>
http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>
- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 22:27:25 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow) wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Since gold isn't a "monetary metal" in the Imperium, the price won't<BR>
>drop *that* far.<BR>
<BR>
Gold may not be a "monetary metal" on an Imperium-wide level, but <BR>
that does not mean it is not used as such on a planetary or <BR>
system-wide level.  Value is subjective, and localized (to whatever <BR>
degree).  If the planet Ahab uses whale oil as it's currency, a large <BR>
amount of same released into that economy will devalue it.  Same goes <BR>
for gold.  Or beaver pelts.<BR>
<BR>
Besides, it would take one hell of a lot of whatever to cause any <BR>
real change in the economy on the scale of the Imperium as a whole.<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2384<BR>
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Traveller-digest        Tuesday, May 2 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2385<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
More design questions...<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2384<BR>
Re: Looking for Info<BR>
re: Powerkill (was Re: Morality of "Heros")<BR>
RE: The trinity homepage<BR>
Re: The trinity homepage<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
GT-REQ: Starport Construction Equipment<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: Looking for info...<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
Re: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
Re: MacCaffery<BR>
Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: PNG<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 22:55:26 -0700<BR>
From: Kristian Miller <travellerne@3rd-imperium.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
<BR>
Sword-Worlder wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> the innards.  I should write a supplement: 101 Uses for Punched Card<BR>
> Confetti.  <BR>
<BR>
I could write the book on "101 Uses for Punch Cards."  My favorite punch<BR>
card story:<BR>
<BR>
Vanderbilt University got a great deal on ordering punch cards with the<BR>
university logo on the front...in bulk.  So the physics department<BR>
ordered ten tons!  This was in the seventies.  Well they used up one ton<BR>
of punch cards before they went out of style.  So that left me, the poor<BR>
grad student in 1993, to get rid of the other nine tons.  They made<BR>
furniture, notepads, bookmarks, doorstops, insulators...<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav:  Too bad I couldn't have found some poor free trader to unload<BR>
them on a low tech world.<BR>
<BR>
Kristian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 20:00:42 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
1) Would a plasma cannon running on batteries need an accumulator? Would<BR>
the discharge rate matter?<BR>
<BR>
2) How does the OTU model explosions in confined spaces? Say, in a crew<BR>
compartment, or in a person? Or as a more extreme example, an explosion<BR>
within the armor plating of a vehicle?<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 23:12:38 -0700<BR>
From: william wheeler <wuffa@inetarena.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2384<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 00:25:00 -0500<BR>
From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>
Subject: OT: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
How OT is this! <g><BR>
<BR>
On 05/01/00 at 10:25 AM,  Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> said:<BR>
<BR>
>I remember it from the first showing...It defintiely said 'Episode IV A<BR>
>New Hope'. Of course we were looking for it, since some of the details<BR>
>about that had slipped out by then.<BR>
<BR>
I think it was there the first time I saw it too, and that was the first day it was in town. If I recall correctly I laughed when I saw the Episode IV...it got me in the mood for a "Saturday Afternoon Serial", and I wasn't disappointed.<BR>
<BR>
You don't suppose there were some first run prints *with* and some *without* do you?<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
<BR>
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
here in Portland it ran for 3 years as HDS has said and it did not have "a new hope" in it in77 but in 79 it did.<BR>
i know my roommates worked the westgate and in Jan when the new Rolls of film came in there was 4 min more on it and the title was not the same<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 16:38:11 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for Info<BR>
<BR>
> From: red@europa.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
><BR>
> Gold may not be a "monetary metal" on an Imperium-wide level, but<BR>
> that does not mean it is not used as such on a planetary or<BR>
> system-wide level.  Value is subjective, and localized (to whatever<BR>
> degree).  If the planet Ahab uses whale oil as it's currency, a large<BR>
> amount of same released into that economy will devalue it.  Same goes<BR>
> for gold.  Or beaver pelts.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
The bad news of such is that you run an awful risk of someone else dumping<BR>
lots of "forged" currency onto your world. This is one of the big reason<BR>
cowrie shells stopped being used as currency - they had quite a few<BR>
advantages, until Europeans started exporting them in bulk.<BR>
<BR>
It is pretty easy to loot a small world in this way.<BR>
<BR>
I imagine that the Imperium would take a pretty dim view of high-tech crooks<BR>
getting into the business of forging local currency. It is a lot easier to<BR>
trash an economy than to put one back together.<BR>
<BR>
Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 01:09:02 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Powerkill (was Re: Morality of "Heros")<BR>
<BR>
At 19:46 -0400 1/5/00,  "Walt Smith" <smithw@hartwick.edu> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Take anything the players do, alter the settings,<BR>
>participants and actions until you've managed to<BR>
>retell an entertaining evening of usual gameplay<BR>
>as the worst kind of real-crime sleazeballs and<BR>
>psychos exploitation video.  Is "Powerkill" some kind<BR>
>of moral relatavism propaganda piece?<BR>
<BR>
Yes, IMO. Doesn't stop it being thought provoking though...<BR>
<BR>
Look what we accept in films - extremely violence - quite happily. <BR>
Stories that seem to interest us (as a culture) are limited...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 20:01:28 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: The trinity homepage<BR>
<BR>
>On Behalf Of Robert Houghton<BR>
<BR>
To the list: <BR>
    The trinity homepage is up an limping have a look if you like: <BR>
http://web.one.net.au/~rhoughto/trinity.html <BR>
<BR>
My first comment is that you'd better watch out for White Wolf's lawyers<BR>
<grin><BR>
<BR>
Second, that background gif is damn annoying when you try to read the text.<BR>
<BR>
Other than that, it's quite interesting.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 18:44:45 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: The trinity homepage<BR>
<BR>
"Frank G. Pitt" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >On Behalf Of Robert Houghton<BR>
><BR>
> To the list:<BR>
>     The trinity homepage is up an limping have a look if you like:<BR>
> http://web.one.net.au/~rhoughto/trinity.html<BR>
><BR>
> My first comment is that you'd better watch out for White Wolf's lawyers<BR>
> <grin><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
yeah...well I need to find something better. Trinity has been the working title<BR>
for 5 years now.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Second, that background gif is damn annoying when you try to read the text.<BR>
><BR>
> Other than that, it's quite interesting.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 18:47:04 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
Veskrashen wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> 1) Would a plasma cannon running on batteries need an accumulator? Would<BR>
> the discharge rate matter?<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Probably...batteries and HPG's/Capacators are two different things.<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> 2) How does the OTU model explosions in confined spaces? Say, in a crew<BR>
> compartment, or in a person? Or as a more extreme example, an explosion<BR>
> within the armor plating of a vehicle?<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Say SPLAT and roll up new chracters.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 04:48:03 -0400 (EDT)<BR>
From: Dalton Spence <dalton.spence@hwcn.org><BR>
Subject: GT-REQ: Starport Construction Equipment<BR>
<BR>
This reply has also been sent to the newsgroups.<BR>
Ever since I first downloaded the sample pages of GT: Starports from<BR>
the sjgames website, I've been curious about what kind of equipment<BR>
the SPA would choose to build downport facilities. On worlds with a<BR>
GURPS TL of 5 or more, powered heavy equipment might be rented from<BR>
(and operated by) the locals for basic earth-moving, surfacing and<BR>
construction, but on lower tech worlds or ones where such equipment<BR>
was unavailable for economic or political reasons both equipment and<BR>
labour would have to be imported.<BR>
<BR>
Being a chronic gearhead I checked the GURPSnet-l archives for<BR>
likely equipment, but there were very few candidates among the GT or<BR>
straight GURPS vehicles listed. So far the only one I've seen was<BR>
the "Harvey Mudd Engineering Sled" in the GT:Ground Forces playtest<BR>
files. (BTW, the name *IS* usable; it was *HARRY* Mudd who was the<BR>
ST con man.) I guess vehicular "working stiffs" weren't considered<BR>
sexy enough to bother running up any designs for unless they were<BR>
explicitly intended for combat situations. IMHO a starport under<BR>
construction would be a very interesting setting for an adventure.<BR>
(Dozer demo-derby anyone?)<BR>
<BR>
CHALLENGE: I would like to see some GT designs for the following<BR>
*civilian* vehicles at various TLs; bulldozer, front end loader,<BR>
power shovel, surface compactor, dump truck, collapsible crane,<BR>
cement (or equivalent) mixer, pile driver, etc. (There must be more,<BR>
but I can't think of them right now.) The only restrictions are:<BR>
<BR>
1.) No single vehicle may be larger than 7 dtons (3500 cf) so it may<BR>
    fit in a cutter module with a 14 dton spacedock (see GT p.143),<BR>
2.) No built-in weapons that aren't intrinsically tools, and<BR>
3.) The power plant must either be nuclear, a rechargable energy<BR>
    bank (perhaps charged by a solar array), or able to use locally<BR>
    available fuels.<BR>
<BR>
(NOTE to "GT: Ground Forces" playtesters: This would be an excellent<BR>
opportunity to playtest the "Modular Grav Vehicle Design System" in<BR>
Chapter 7. Just remember to convert your design into GURPS Vehicle<BR>
terms before you post it to the lists/newsgroup.)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
              @==================================================@<BR>
              | Dalton S. Spence, B.Sc. <dalton.spence@hwcn.org> |<BR>
              | Home Page: http://www.hwcn.org/~ag775/home.html  |<BR>
              |      Family Motto: Virtute Acquiritur Honos      |<BR>
              |    "Trade is the lifeblood of the Imperium."     |<BR>
              |   Cleon I, First Emperor of the Third Imperium   |<BR>
              |     San Francisco is smoking and the lamp is     |<BR>
              |                 squamous. FNORD!                 |<BR>
              @==================================================@<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 21:52:19 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
On 2 May 00, at 14:57, The Roc wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> ----- Original Message -----<BR>
> From: <Qstor@aol.com><BR>
> To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 1:00 AM<BR>
> Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> > In a message dated 5/1/00 10:58:41 AM Eastern Daylight Time,<BR>
> > rhoughto@one.net.au writes:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > << I'd be happy just see the d#% thing...they are running teasers out<BR>
> > the wazoo<BR>
> >  down here...driving me not-so-slowly nuts!<BR>
> >   >><BR>
> > That's funny that some of the Australian tv stations don't have it<BR>
> > on...because of their role in production...<BR>
> ><BR>
> <BR>
> Don't worry, down here it's coming... soon...<BR>
> <BR>
> As for production, they make a plethora of movies and series Downunder,<BR>
> many we will never see as they are not made for local consumption and not<BR>
> worth the cost to pick-up by local TV (cable is another story).<BR>
<BR>
I understand the first season's been and gone here in NZ. As I don't <BR>
have a VCR and work at night I missed it :(<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 21:26:29 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Looking for info...<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Dumping a large enough amount of anything on the market affects the value,<BR>
> albeit at a local level. If someone parked a small metallic asteroid in<BR>
> orbit tomorrow, found a way of getting it down to the surface without deep<BR>
> impacting it what would the effect be (apart from worried looks from all<BR>
> the world powers) on local metal prices? Gold may not be a monetary metal<BR>
> but the demand can't be that high that 140 m^3 dropped on the local market<BR>
> would dissappear without a trace...If it did...it wouldn't be worth<BR>
> shipping costs. If it doesn't have rarity/money value...what's the point of<BR>
> shipping it.<BR>
<BR>
Do keep in mind that there are metals whose value is determined by the<BR>
*demand* to such an extent that truly *enormous* amounts would have to<BR>
be dumped on the market to cause a large price drop. Silver is a good<BR>
example. The photo industry uses *so* much of the production that<BR>
their "reserve" for production fluctuations constitutes most of the<BR>
world supply!<BR>
<BR>
I suspect that in some TUs lathanum would be in such a situation.<BR>
Demand would keep the cost up. but it couldn't get to extreme levels,<BR>
because of a combination of the demand being self-limiting (ie there's<BR>
a limit to how much you can charge for a jump grid), and and high<BR>
prices causing increased recycling production. <BR>
<BR>
BTW, this means that you can expect that the jump coils/jump grids<BR>
*will* have been stripped from really old ships in "junkyard" type<BR>
situations. <BR>
 <BR>
> Case in point... one of H. Beam Pipers "When in the Course-" from the<BR>
> Federation collection ( I have it but my books are in the milk crates<BR>
> holding up my bed). The protaginists are trying to decide what to ship<BR>
> where to make a profit...can't remember just wht they do but the story is a<BR>
> great example for running a TNE upift adventure/campaign ( I think I saw<BR>
> it, with the numbers filed off somewhere in PoT.)<BR>
<BR>
They needed saltpeter *badly*, mostly to make gunpowder, but also for<BR>
fertilizer. They sent a ship loaded with (among other things) *meat*,<BR>
to a nearby colony whose major resource was a continent size pile of<BR>
guano. <BR>
<BR>
They lucked out. Some native organism infected that colony's<BR>
carniculture setup, despite their best precautions. The result was<BR>
edible, but tasted pretty sad.<BR>
<BR>
So the cargo of *delicious* meat was *greatly* appreciated.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 21:05:54 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Dose anyone know if there is a use for salt in any industrial processes<BR>
> ? I'm doing a write up for a system which has a load of spear salt and<BR>
> I'd like to have them put it to good use.<BR>
<BR>
"spear salt"?<BR>
<BR>
Sodium Chloride is actually a *major* industrial chemical. <BR>
<BR>
Electrolyze a salt solution, and you get hydrogen at the positive<BR>
electrode and chlorine at the negative electrode. This is where we get<BR>
"industrial quantities" of chlorine (which is stored at normal temp and<BR>
moderate pressure, giving a liquid.<BR>
<BR>
Or you can allow the hydrogen and chlorine to react, giving hydrogen<BR>
chloride (aka anhydrous hydrochloric acid). This is also usually<BR>
pressurized and shipped as a liquid.<BR>
<BR>
The solution that remains is sodium hydroxide (aka lye aka caustic<BR>
soda). <BR>
<BR>
Or, you can melt the salt in high temp crucibles (graphite?) and run a<BR>
current thru it. You get chlorine, and sodium metal. The metal is drawn<BR>
off from the bottom of the crucible (being careful not to expose it to<BR>
oxygen!), and add more salt to the crucible.<BR>
<BR>
Chlorine is very important in the production of hyper-pure silicon, and<BR>
for producing a few metals. It's also extensively used in water<BR>
purification. <BR>
<BR>
I'm not sure what the uses of the others are. But the plant next to the<BR>
one I worked out sent out *dozens* of railroad tank cars of Chlorine,<BR>
HCl, and caustic soda every day. I don't recall if they shipped the<BR>
sodium that way or not.<BR>
<BR>
I think sulfur is the only "basic chemical" that's more important than<BR>
salt.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 01:20:39 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> If it was added then it would explain why I recall it being there - <BR>
> because the UK releases are delayed because we get the US prints sent <BR>
> over as the films are finishing in the US... Saves money.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, it smooths out the cashflow. Prints don't last all *that*<BR>
long, so most UK prints would be fairly new copies anyway.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 01:21:47 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> BTW if you're looking for a film which does court politics quite well <BR>
> (maybe applicable to Civil War Era Traveller) then have a look at <BR>
> 'Elizabeth', a recent release (last year) about the consolidation of <BR>
> power by Queen Elizabeth 1st in the 1500's. I suspect chunks of it <BR>
> could be stolen for a court campaign.<BR>
<BR>
"Cromwell" (from back in the late 60s early 70s) has its poiints as well.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 01:24:38 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: MacCaffery<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Actually, I found the ender-cycle, once one gets away from the first two,<BR>
> is wonderful. And, aside from pern, McCaffree's novels present wonderful<BR>
> characters and a consistant (if technologically unexplained) set of sci-fi<BR>
> settings.<BR>
<BR>
MacCaffrey seems to have several settings:<BR>
<BR>
The ship/brawn universe (which *may* include Pern)<BR>
The recent "Freedom's XXX" series<BR>
The Rowan series (which seems to grow out her her old "Talent" stories<BR>
the Doona series<BR>
the one Restoree is set in<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 01:28:18 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Of course, this is the same universe that features psionic mass detectors,<BR>
> indestructable starship hulls constructed from a single artificial molecule,<BR>
> artificial gravity, reactionless thrusters, time-retardation fields,<BR>
> teleportation, hyperdrive, impact armor, forcefields, perfect anagathics,<BR>
> total conversion power sources (in certain tnuctipun relics), the equipment<BR>
> to move quantum black holes, and artificial structures as large as the<BR>
> Earth's orbit.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, the gear for moving the Quantum black hole wasn't far out at<BR>
all. Perfectly feasible, if you found one. Of course there *is* the<BR>
matter of radiation shielding... :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 02:30:10 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> ObTrav: Has anyone come up with a world in the OTU where Babbage's designs<BR>
> were actually put into full use at (and I'm guessing here) a TL 4 or 5<BR>
> setting, not to mention the entire society changes as a result of the<BR>
> discovery?<BR>
><BR>
> Refer to the novel "The Difference Engine" by Gibson & Sterling. Imagine<BR>
> 19th-century Commies! :) :)<BR>
<BR>
What's to imagine? Marx wrote in the mid 1800s!<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 22:31:48 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Luther Martin<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> > > Kids today. When I first wrote BASIC, it was on a teletype which had a<BR>
> > > maximum speed of 110 bps. We would save our programs on paper 5-hole<BR>
> > > teletype tape.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Bet you a cookie it was *8*-hole, with the 8-th hole being parity.<BR>
> > 5-hole (Baudot) code doesn't have all the characters required by even<BR>
> > the most *primitive* BASIC.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > And if you could print lowercase, it *definitely* wasn't 5-hole.<BR>
><BR>
> I'm fairly sure that it was 5-hole, plus a smaller hole for feeding the<BR>
> tape. Three holes on one side and two on the other. We only had capital<BR>
> letters. Remember that Baudot has characters to<BR>
> let you escape out of the basic character set to additional ones, so that<BR>
> you really have more than 32 characters.<BR>
><BR>
> I want my cookie.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, I'll back up Luther in this one, Baudot is five bit and has an escape<BR>
character meaning you could definitely handle enough characters to print out<BR>
BASIC programs, especially at the beginning because some BASIC's didn't<BR>
accept lower case characters either.<BR>
<BR>
I used to service and maintain electro-mechanical teleprinters that used<BR>
Baudot (Creed 444s if anyone remembers them ) when I was in the airforce.<BR>
<BR>
Used an old one as a line-printer for my TRS-80 when they retired them,<BR>
after writing a machine code driver to translate ASCII to Baudot.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 20:18:35 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <BR>
> D&D was a conversion of miniature wargames. <BR>
<BR>
Specifically miniature wargame _campaigns_.<BR>
<BR>
> When playing a wargame, board or miniatures, the system contains a<BR>
> structure for equipping and refitting units, likewise RPGs. <BR>
> But does either need a system to regulate sitting around after and going<BR>
> over after action reports? Or deciding what next week's battle will be?<BR>
> Of course not! <BR>
<BR>
Umm.  Miniatures campaigns consist precisely of systems to decide what next<BR>
week's battle will be.  So do at least some boardgames.<BR>
<BR>
In actual fact, there were miniatures campaigns being played before D&D was<BR>
developed that featured significant role-playing elements.  This was simply<BR>
an extension of the diplomatic relationships between the "rulers" of the<BR>
different "countries" in the games.<BR>
<BR>
In fact, there was no obviously good reason why the first roleplaying game<BR>
had to have been a Tolkienoid fantasy game.  The elements were already<BR>
there:  semi-roleplaying miniatures campaigns, plus interesting<BR>
developments in historical skirmish games.  <BR>
<BR>
Pseudo-historical medieval games (without magic), dark ages, pirate and<BR>
Wild West games could all have appeared instead.  Whether or not they could<BR>
have achieved the same popularity is another question.  Probably they<BR>
couldn't.<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
"al enemigo que se retira, puente de oro." <BR>
(For the enemy that withdraws, a bridge of gold.) <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 20:18:23 +1000<BR>
From: "Alan Bradley" <alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au><BR>
Subject: Re: PNG<BR>
<BR>
> From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
> I had an uncle that visited for a couple of years in the early 40s. He's<BR>
> in no hurry to return, even if we can guarantee no one will shoot at him<BR>
> this time.<BR>
<BR>
I can see that.<BR>
<BR>
My time there as a civilian was, of course, much more pleasant.  Port<BR>
Moresby is actually a lot like a sleepy town from the northern bits of<BR>
Australia, with the added joy of actually being in another country, and one<BR>
that's about as "not-European" as you can get.<BR>
<BR>
I exaggerated my description of the terrain a bit, of course.  Basically I<BR>
stuck a bunch of other people's descriptions of various different places<BR>
together, in order to build a nightmare for player characters.  But PNG is<BR>
still, in reality one of the worst places in the world to try to fight a<BR>
war.  And I didn't even bother to mention malaria.<BR>
<BR>
OBTRAV:<BR>
As far as nightmare war zones in the OTU goes, one of my favourites would<BR>
be the Tanglewald on Tarsus.  Are the player characters hunting the ihatei<BR>
assassins, or are the assassins hunting them?  <BR>
<BR>
Watch Predator before trying to run this scenario.  Other good things would<BR>
include Apocalypse Now, and, of course, The Wizard of Oz (lions and tigers<BR>
and bears, oh my!)<BR>
<BR>
Alan Bradley<BR>
alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>
<BR>
"al enemigo que se retira, puente de oro." <BR>
(For the enemy that withdraws, a bridge of gold.) <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 11:42:26 +0100<BR>
From: Ewan Quibell <E.D.Quibell@bton.ac.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> > Dose anyone know if there is a use for salt in any industrial processes<BR>
> > ? I'm doing a write up for a system which has a load of spear salt and<BR>
> > I'd like to have them put it to good use.<BR>
> <BR>
> "spear salt"?<BR>
<BR>
See sig<BR>
<BR>
> Sodium Chloride is actually a *major* industrial chemical.<BR>
<BR>
Great stuff sniped<BR>
<BR>
> I think sulfur is the only "basic chemical" that's more important than<BR>
> salt.<BR>
<BR>
So if you are a water world with a sulphur taint you are going to be<BR>
making money like you were growing it ....<BR>
<BR>
Thanks Leonard, seems they might have a use for it after all, although<BR>
it might make the image of the backwater world I'm writing up seem a<BR>
little odd as they would probably be exporting it as fast as they can to<BR>
the nearest industrial world.<BR>
<BR>
This list is great :-)<BR>
<BR>
Now is it possible to have a desalination plant at TL 5 or 6 ?<BR>
<BR>
Cheers<BR>
<BR>
Ewan<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
   Ewan Quibell                       Their's not to make reply,<BR>
   Senior Communications Engineer     Their's not to reason why,<BR>
   Computer Centre                    Their's but to do and die:<BR>
   University of Brighton             Into the valley of Death<BR>
                                      Rode the six hundred.<BR>
   E.D.Quibell@brighton.ac.uk              Alfred, Lord Tennyson<BR>
<BR>
   #include<stddisclaimer.h><BR>
<BR>
   My spelling is entirerly due to dyslexia, typos, and poetic license<BR>
<BR>
   University of Brighton - Sunday Times' University of the Year<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 22:50:58 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
>On Behalf Of Leonard Erickson<BR>
><BR>
> Looking over the set, I have to ask what you used for multiplaction,<BR>
> since there's no "*".<BR>
<BR>
He probably used what everyone else did, and what mathematicians have always<BR>
used : 'x'<BR>
<BR>
Using '*' for nmultiplication is a much later innovation.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 07:50:08 -0300<BR>
From: Michel Vaillancourt <misha@empire.atlantic-online.ns.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
At 07:42 AM 5/2/00, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
         [snip]<BR>
<BR>
>This list is great :-)<BR>
<BR>
         Ana amazing resource indeed!<BR>
<BR>
>Now is it possible to have a desalination plant at TL 5 or 6 ?<BR>
<BR>
         Its called a boiler.  <g><BR>
         The Navy has been making fresh water from salt by distillation for <BR>
decades if not centuries.<BR>
<BR>
>Cheers<BR>
><BR>
>Ewan<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
	<BR>
	-- Michel R. Vaillancourt	<BR>
	   (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2385<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2386</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest        Tuesday, May 2 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2386<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Light Plasma Weapons<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
Re: GT-REQ: Starport Construction Equipment<BR>
Re: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
From Salt??<BR>
Jump Capacitors and Jump Dimming<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
RE: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2380<BR>
Re: OT: Re: Episode IV<BR>
Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
Off list for a while<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 20:55:13 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
Ewan Quibell wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > In mail you write:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > > Dose anyone know if there is a use for salt in any industrial processes<BR>
> > > ? I'm doing a write up for a system which has a load of spear salt and<BR>
> > > I'd like to have them put it to good use.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > "spear salt"?<BR>
><BR>
> See sig<BR>
><BR>
> > Sodium Chloride is actually a *major* industrial chemical.<BR>
><BR>
> Great stuff sniped<BR>
><BR>
> > I think sulfur is the only "basic chemical" that's more important than<BR>
> > salt.<BR>
><BR>
> So if you are a water world with a sulphur taint you are going to be<BR>
> making money like you were growing it ....<BR>
><BR>
> Thanks Leonard, seems they might have a use for it after all, although<BR>
> it might make the image of the backwater world I'm writing up seem a<BR>
> little odd as they would probably be exporting it as fast as they can to<BR>
> the nearest industrial world.<BR>
><BR>
> This list is great :-)<BR>
><BR>
> Now is it possible to have a desalination plant at TL 5 or 6 ?<BR>
><BR>
> Cheers<BR>
<BR>
The only problem with htis process is lots and I mean LOTS of toxic waste.<BR>
Organochlorides...deadly stuff...worse than Agent Orange. see the Neal<BR>
Stephenson book Zodiac<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 12:18:10 +0100<BR>
From: Ewan Quibell <E.D.Quibell@bton.ac.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
Michel Vaillancourt wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >Now is it possible to have a desalination plant at TL 5 or 6 ?<BR>
> <BR>
>          Its called a boiler.  <g><BR>
>          The Navy has been making fresh water from salt by distillation for<BR>
> decades if not centuries.<BR>
<BR>
Should have thought of this. I must remember to engage my brain before<BR>
posting stupid questions.<BR>
<BR>
>         -- Michel R. Vaillancourt<BR>
>            (ICQ # 31172292)<BR>
<BR>
Cheers<BR>
<BR>
Ewan<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
   Ewan Quibell                       Their's not to make reply,<BR>
   Senior Communications Engineer     Their's not to reason why,<BR>
   Computer Centre                    Their's but to do and die:<BR>
   University of Brighton             Into the valley of Death<BR>
                                      Rode the six hundred.<BR>
   E.D.Quibell@brighton.ac.uk              Alfred, Lord Tennyson<BR>
<BR>
   #include<stddisclaimer.h><BR>
<BR>
   My spelling is entirerly due to dyslexia, typos, and poetic license<BR>
<BR>
   University of Brighton - Sunday Times' University of the Year<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 23:40:56 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
On 1 May 00, at 21:05, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I think sulfur is the only "basic chemical" that's more important than<BR>
> salt.<BR>
<BR>
If sulfur/sulphur is so important why is the waste sulphur form coal <BR>
plants just left in huge piles?<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 23:40:56 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
On 2 May 00, at 20:18, Alan Bradley wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In fact, there was no obviously good reason why the first roleplaying game<BR>
> had to have been a Tolkienoid fantasy game.  The elements were already<BR>
> there:  semi-roleplaying miniatures campaigns, plus interesting<BR>
> developments in historical skirmish games.  <BR>
> <BR>
> Pseudo-historical medieval games (without magic), dark ages, pirate and<BR>
> Wild West games could all have appeared instead.  Whether or not they<BR>
> could have achieved the same popularity is another question.  Probably<BR>
> they couldn't.<BR>
<BR>
So could rpgs based on modern/WWII skirmish rules, for that matter.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue May 02 07:56:05 2000<BR>
From: TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Light Plasma Weapons<BR>
<BR>
And yes, as long as you attribute this nightmare to me (and give me the<BR>
link so I can look too!), I don't mind this being added to any webpage.<BR>
And I would be honored for it to be included in the FS2K catalouge.<BR>
<BR>
- - -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I have to say I like the design. I've been using things like this in my campaigns for years, but I never actually sat down and DESIGNED it in such detail.<BR>
In the Imperial Legion (IMTU), they call them "HELL GUNS". <BR>
There is even a pistol version at TL 15, but that does require personal body protection and eye wear to avoid flash burns...<BR>
<BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
Just a tidbit for thought...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 13:06:42 +0100<BR>
From: Ewan Quibell <E.D.Quibell@bton.ac.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
> > Now is it possible to have a desalination plant at TL 5 or 6 ?<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Cheers<BR>
> <BR>
> The only problem with htis process is lots and I mean LOTS of toxic waste.<BR>
> Organochlorides...deadly stuff...worse than Agent Orange. see the Neal<BR>
> Stephenson book Zodiac<BR>
> <BR>
> Rob<BR>
<BR>
From the desalination process ? I don't have Zodiac, could you give me a<BR>
rundown of the process ?<BR>
<BR>
Cheers<BR>
<BR>
Ewan<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
   Ewan Quibell                       Their's not to make reply,<BR>
   Senior Communications Engineer     Their's not to reason why,<BR>
   Computer Centre                    Their's but to do and die:<BR>
   University of Brighton             Into the valley of Death<BR>
                                      Rode the six hundred.<BR>
   E.D.Quibell@brighton.ac.uk              Alfred, Lord Tennyson<BR>
<BR>
   #include<stddisclaimer.h><BR>
<BR>
   My spelling is entirerly due to dyslexia, typos, and poetic license<BR>
<BR>
   University of Brighton - Sunday Times' University of the Year<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 07:01:24 -0500<BR>
From: Bolie Williams IV <bolie@io.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
At 6:47 PM +1000 5/2/00, Robert Houghton wrote:<BR>
>Veskrashen wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>  1) Would a plasma cannon running on batteries need an accumulator? Would<BR>
>>  the discharge rate matter?<BR>
>><BR>
><BR>
>Probably...batteries and HPG's/Capacators are two different things.<BR>
<BR>
Hell, HPG's and capacitors are two different things, too.<BR>
<BR>
Battery = chemical storage<BR>
HPG = kinetic energy storage<BR>
Capacitor = electric field storage<BR>
<BR>
You can actually fire a decent sized railgun using a bunch of car batteries<BR>
hooked up in parallel (you need current, not voltage).  You can only do<BR>
this if you carefully drain them and then very carefully recharge them.<BR>
Use new batteries.<BR>
<BR>
Current realistic railgun designs don't use HPGs, they use compulsators,<BR>
which are like HPGs, but with built in current pulsing to avoid that<BR>
attention-getting and barrel destroying arc at the end of the shot as<BR>
the projectile leaves the barrel.  Compulsators deliver a series of<BR>
rapid pulses are so are good for any energy using weapon.<BR>
<BR>
Bolie IV<BR>
- -- <BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Bolie Williams IV<BR>
bolie@io.com<BR>
http://www.io.com/~bolie/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 07:03:47 -0500<BR>
From: Bolie Williams IV <bolie@io.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-REQ: Starport Construction Equipment<BR>
<BR>
At 4:48 AM -0400 5/2/00, Dalton Spence wrote:<BR>
>the "Harvey Mudd Engineering Sled" in the GT:Ground Forces playtest<BR>
>files. (BTW, the name *IS* usable; it was *HARRY* Mudd who was the<BR>
>ST con man.)<BR>
<BR>
It was *HARVEY* Mudd who the college was named after, though.<BR>
<BR>
Bolie IV<BR>
- -- <BR>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>
Bolie Williams IV<BR>
bolie@io.com<BR>
http://www.io.com/~bolie/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 13:12:16 +0100<BR>
From: Phil Kitching <postmark.design@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow) wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Nonsense. Careful research shows that she must be named after a 20th<BR>
>century gadget-mistress supreme... Penny (lastname unkown) who is<BR>
>always riding herd on the Infamous Inspector Gadget! And "his" gadgets<BR>
>are ample proof that they are proper ancestors to the Spofulam<BR>
>dynasty...<BR>
<BR>
Not forgetting Miss Penelope Pitstop, another famous gadget lady.<BR>
<BR>
However, I think *Lady* Penelope's FAB 1 (that pink Rolls Royce)<BR>
is more the sort of over the top performance, style, size and<BR>
firepower that I'd expect from the insiration for FS.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching<BR>
- --<BR>
  http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>
  Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>
 "Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 22:16:40 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
Ewan Quibell wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> > > Now is it possible to have a desalination plant at TL 5 or 6 ?<BR>
> > ><BR>
> > > Cheers<BR>
> ><BR>
> > The only problem with htis process is lots and I mean LOTS of toxic waste.<BR>
> > Organochlorides...deadly stuff...worse than Agent Orange. see the Neal<BR>
> > Stephenson book Zodiac<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Rob<BR>
><BR>
> >From the desalination process ? I don't have Zodiac, could you give me a<BR>
> rundown of the process ?<BR>
><BR>
> Cheers<BR>
<BR>
I think I may have the wrong end of the stick...give me 12 hours to sleep and re<BR>
read the book. I'll get back to you shortly. I know that the production of some<BR>
industrial chemicals involves a)seawater and b) electricity...the producs are<BR>
some chemicals (I forget which) and toxic waste...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 13:25:13 +0100<BR>
From: Phil Kitching <postmark.design@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com> wrote:<BR>
>1) Would a plasma cannon running on batteries need an accumulator? Would<BR>
>the discharge rate matter?<BR>
<BR>
IIRC and without the aid of an FF&S safety net:<BR>
<BR>
You mean the HPG (homo polar generator)?<BR>
<BR>
Yes. The idea is that the batteries can charge the HPG but only the HPG<BR>
can deliver the power in the fraction of a second required for the plasma<BR>
cannon to work.<BR>
<BR>
The batteries need to discharge fast enough to recharge the HPG in the time<BR>
between pulses.<BR>
<BR>
Note that if the battery has enough stored energy for 60 pulses, to fire<BR>
one pulse per minute, it would need a discharge time of 1 hour.<BR>
<BR>
To fire once per second you would need to be able to discharge the battery<BR>
in one minute...except that you might have to allow for time spent firing<BR>
and recovering when the HPG couldn't be charged, so that time might actually<BR>
be 30 seconds but I can't recall if the book covers this.<BR>
<BR>
>2) How does the OTU model explosions in confined spaces? Say, in a crew<BR>
>compartment, or in a person? Or as a more extreme example, an explosion<BR>
>within the armor plating of a vehicle?<BR>
<BR>
The referee rolls lots of dice, looks at them, shakes their head slowly,<BR>
passes the players 2D6 and says "can you each roll these six times, then<BR>
turn to page..."<BR>
<BR>
[actually I don't know]<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching<BR>
- --<BR>
  http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>
  Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>
 "Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 15:04:39 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
Veskrashen wrote:<BR>
> 1) Would a plasma cannon running on batteries need an accumulator? Would<BR>
> the discharge rate matter?<BR>
<BR>
An accumulator would be needed, since batteries don't give you the energy you<BR>
require quickly enough.<BR>
<BR>
The discharge rate doesn't matter. Providing the required energy for one shot<BR>
every sixth second does *not* mean that you can give that energy over a period<BR>
of six (or five, or four) seconds and get the same result as if all the energy<BR>
was given "at once."<BR>
<BR>
> 2) How does the OTU model explosions in confined spaces? Say, in a crew<BR>
> compartment, or in a person? Or as a more extreme example, an explosion<BR>
> within the armor plating of a vehicle?<BR>
<BR>
Explosions in confined spaces are generally very dangerous to everyone inside.<BR>
An explosion inside you is either very small (but still harmful, HE-ammo in an<BR>
example for this) or larger (*SPLAT*).<BR>
<BR>
Twilight 2000 has the following to say about explosions inside armored<BR>
vehicles: All occupants die.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 15:14:01 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> Now is it possible to have a desalination plant at TL 5 or 6 ?<BR>
<BR>
Yes !<BR>
<BR>
All you need is salt water and sunlight. Pour the water on a rock and let the<BR>
sunlight remove the water.<BR>
<BR>
If you don't have sunlight, boil salt water until the water is gone. The salt<BR>
remains.<BR>
<BR>
In other words, TL-0 (or more) is required.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 09:24:09 -0400<BR>
From: Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
"Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> Riiiight... So all carmakers own steelmills and Iron ore mines, and coal<BR>
> mines and chemical plants, and refineries.<BR>
<BR>
It's called "vertical integration" and yes, it does happen in some<BR>
industries. Some steelmakers do do basic forming. Some manufacturers<BR>
do own their sales outlets.<BR>
<BR>
> And all software shops are owned by Microsoft.<BR>
<BR>
Microsoft specs the PC (but leaves it someone else to build), creates<BR>
the OS, creates the applications, provides the 3rd-party books (via MS<BR>
Press), does training and certification. It's as close to vertical<BR>
integration as you get in the software industry. Oh, and now they sell<BR>
direct to the consumer over their web site too.<BR>
<BR>
> And there are no wholesalers or distributors.<BR>
<BR>
being a distributor is different from being a shipper, which is the<BR>
business that most cargo ship owners are in, like it or not. FedEx, <BR>
the USPS, railways and truckers are not wholesalers or distributors.<BR>
That is the situation most ship owners are in by default, unless they<BR>
want to be distributors who just happen to own a great big starship.<BR>
<BR>
> Similarly, If I am buying several dton of goods on the speculative trade<BR>
> markets in traveller, the seller doesn't care that I'm going to (hopefully)<BR>
> make a profit when I sell them. He's made his profit, and it isn't worth his<BR>
> while arranging for transportation and sale at my destination to sell the<BR>
> good there himself. The manufacturers who *are* doing this are the ones<BR>
> shipping goods at Cr1000 per dton in your hold.<BR>
<BR>
But even they don't all pay Cr1,000/dTon. Someone shipping grain won't<BR>
pay that much and someone shipping rare manufactured goods (TL 15 FGMPs)<BR>
is getting a real steal, relative to the value of the product.<BR>
<BR>
(of course, if PCs are involved, "a real steal" describes the shipment of<BR>
FGMPs much better than the patron probably knows...)<BR>
<BR>
Then someone else wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>     Speculative trade will exist where (a) the seller *cannot* make a<BR>
> significant enough profit to justify personally arranging for shipping goods and<BR>
> selling them elsewhere, or (b) the seller does not yet *know* that such a profit<BR>
> can be made.  <plus lots more><BR>
<BR>
Exactly. It's possible to float your boat on speculative trade, but<BR>
it's a whole different beast from shuttling stuff back and forth.<BR>
<BR>
Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> No it's not. Managing cash flow is crucial to the success of<BR>
> any business. Many manufacturers can not afford to engage in<BR>
> speculative trade, they need to be sure of getting payment<BR>
> of a certain amount now. <BR>
<BR>
But this is the Third Imperium, where surveying a planet's population <BR>
and governmental structure every few hundred years is considered an<BR>
accurate way to do things... every manufactured good you can probably<BR>
imagine has probably had its interplanetary distribution channels set<BR>
up for several centuries at least. It seems pretty reasonable to imagine <BR>
that there are distributors who handle the distribution of good across<BR>
multiple systems without the uncertainty of looking for someone to <BR>
carry the cargo speculatively.<BR>
<BR>
> When a ship owner sells goods they<BR>
> get paid right away. When a business owner has their goods sold<BR>
> on another planet they have to wait for the money to be jumped<BR>
> back. In the meantime they've got suppliers to pay, rent to pay,<BR>
> employee's to pay. Letting these payments wait while they wait<BR>
> for a speculative return on another planet is not an ideal<BR>
> business plan.<BR>
<BR>
In the steady state, sure it is. Here on Earth, we have 30, 60 or 120 day<BR>
(or what have you) terms of payment. In the Third Imperium, maybe it's<BR>
4 week, 6 week or 8 week terms - 8 week is 4 jumps by Xboat both ways, <BR>
or 8 jumps one way, which handles direct payments for a fairly wide <BR>
area of space. The Imperium is probably quite used to the slow pace of <BR>
communications, but that only affects latency, not the total throughput <BR>
of communication, commerce, etc. After the nearly 3 (4?) thousand years <BR>
of the combined 3 Imperia, I feel pretty sure they'd have worked out<BR>
something better than speculative trade for the bulk of their commerce.<BR>
<BR>
Ethan<BR>
- --<BR>
Ethan Henry                                         egh@klg.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 13:12:07 +0100<BR>
From: "MJ Dougherty" <martinjd@globalnet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: From Salt??<BR>
<BR>
Fresh water from salt??? Now THAT is clever!!<BR>
<BR>
Oh.<BR>
<BR>
Fresh water from salt *water*.<BR>
<BR>
I see.....<BR>
<BR>
(Grin)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 09:45:31 -0700<BR>
From: "Antony Farrell" <Skaran@bigpond.com><BR>
Subject: Jump Capacitors and Jump Dimming<BR>
<BR>
Using FFS1<BR>
While taking apart a series of jump-1 drives of tech levels 9 through 15 in<BR>
order to determine the energy required for alternative power sources the<BR>
following figures emerged;<BR>
<BR>
For a 100 ton displacement hull a jump-1 drive displaces 2 tons (28kl) and<BR>
FFS1 states that 35% is jump capacitor or 9.8kl<BR>
<BR>
At TL9 Jump Capacitor capacity is 98 Mj<BR>
At TL10 122.5 Mj<BR>
At TL11 163.3 Mj<BR>
At TL12 196 Mj<BR>
At TL13 217.8 Mj<BR>
At TL14 245 Mj and<BR>
At TL15 280 Mj<BR>
<BR>
This raises a number of questions<BR>
1. Why do the higher tech level drives require more energy for the jump?<BR>
2. Why did the Vilani need to practice jump dimming since the energy for the<BR>
jump came from a capacitor bank?<BR>
3. Why do jump drives not get smaller at higher tech levels since the volume<BR>
required by capacitors for a given amount of energy gets smaller?<BR>
<BR>
For example a jump-1 drive at TL12 would need only half the capacitor volume<BR>
of the equivalent TL9 model. Any comments?<BR>
<BR>
Antony<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 06:53:30 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
on 5/2/00 6:14 AM, Jens Rydholm at jenry023@student.liu.se wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
>> Now is it possible to have a desalination plant at TL 5 or 6 ?<BR>
> <BR>
> Yes !<BR>
> <BR>
> All you need is salt water and sunlight. Pour the water on a rock and let the<BR>
> sunlight remove the water.<BR>
> <BR>
> If you don't have sunlight, boil salt water until the water is gone. The salt<BR>
> remains.<BR>
> <BR>
> In other words, TL-0 (or more) is required.<BR>
<BR>
That would be a dehydrator, since it is water being being removed.<BR>
Desalinization involved capturing the water vapor--salt is a waste product.<BR>
Distillation, at least is required.  Any culture that can make brandy can<BR>
desalinate if required.  And of course, let's not forget those handy ice<BR>
bergs.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Everything I need to know, I learned from<BR>
killing smart people and eating their brains."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 14:58:02 +0100 <BR>
From: Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Jens Rydholm [mailto:jenry023@student.liu.se]<BR>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 2:14 PM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> > Now is it possible to have a desalination plant at TL 5 or 6 ?<BR>
> <BR>
> Yes !<BR>
> <BR>
> All you need is salt water and sunlight. Pour the water on a <BR>
> rock and let the<BR>
> sunlight remove the water.<BR>
> <BR>
> If you don't have sunlight, boil salt water until the water <BR>
> is gone. The salt<BR>
> remains.<BR>
> <BR>
> In other words, TL-0 (or more) is required.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, that is a saltpan and is indeed TL-0+. But far from being a<BR>
desalination process, it is a dehydration one. You do not end up with<BR>
separated potable water and salt (as you do in a desalination plant) as<BR>
the water evaporates leaving just the salt. Fine if you only wanted the<BR>
salt, but not so good if you are thirsty <g>.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 14:01:01 GMT<BR>
From: "will richards" <willrichards@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2380<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:30:29 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Hivers<BR>
<BR>
>In a message dated 00-04-30 23:23:15 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
><< Since Hiver mouthparts are on their undersides, they haven't been<BR>
>depicted in Traveller artwork.  What if they are very strong, (the<BR>
>jaws, that is) and Hivers like to grapple in HTH (when they must)<BR>
>and bite away with powerful, multi-toothed jaws (like the business<BR>
>end of a leech)? >><BR>
><BR>
>No jaws. No radula/beak/proboscis.<BR>
><BR>
>Sorry.<BR>
><BR>
>LKW<BR>
<BR>
Ok, well how about a really really nasty hicky!!<BR>
  Kill'em with love!<BR>
<BR>
I could see that as a deterrent for most non hiver's,  a reason not to go <BR>
HTH with them.<BR>
<BR>
Will<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________________________<BR>
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 07:51:39 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> How OT is this! <g><BR>
> <BR>
> On 05/01/00 at 10:25 AM,  Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> said:<BR>
> <BR>
> >I remember it from the first showing...It defintiely said 'Episode IV A<BR>
> >New Hope'. Of course we were looking for it, since some of the details<BR>
> >about that had slipped out by then.<BR>
> <BR>
> I think it was there the first time I saw it too, and that was the first day it was in town. If I recall correctly I laughed when I saw the Episode IV...it got me in the mood for a "Saturday Afternoon Serial", and I wasn't disappointed.<BR>
> <BR>
> You don't suppose there were some first run prints *with* and some *without* do you?<BR>
<BR>
I'm beginning to suspect either that or CT Syndrome eating our brains...;-)<BR>
<BR>
Hmmm...Star Wars comes out in '77, Traveller in '77...Hmmmm...maybe CT<BR>
'Syndrome' is only a spurious correlation, since a lot of people who I know<BR>
don't play Traveller, but DID see Star Wars in first release are suffering the<BR>
same symptoms...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 10:57:46 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Dixon" <cdixon@airfoiltech.com><BR>
Subject: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
Greetings Travellers,<BR>
<BR>
I'm wondering about the proto-humans that the ancients dispersed to the<BR>
stars in 300,000 BC.<BR>
<BR>
Would these humans even be recognizable as "earth" humans after that<BR>
many years of evolution on alien worlds?<BR>
<BR>
They would be subject to very different environmental challenges than we<BR>
would and varying levels of radiation or evolution due to weird<BR>
environments could cause them to evolve quite differently than we did.<BR>
<BR>
Does anyone with more knowledge of the subject than I have any input?<BR>
I'm running a First Imperium scenario and my Terran players are meeting<BR>
the Vilani for the first time.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks!<BR>
<BR>
Chris<BR>
<BR>
(P.S.  I know the books say that all branches of Humaniti look like<BR>
earth humans but is that realistic?)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 11:03:04 EDT<BR>
From: Qstor@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Off list for a while<BR>
<BR>
I'm getting married this Sat then heading to my honeymoon so I'll be gone for <BR>
10 days....I'll be unsubscribing for a while....Hope everyone is well and I <BR>
look forward to talk of Classic traveller reprints and GT: A3 when I <BR>
return...OH...and Lesbian Aslan Pirates ;)<BR>
<BR>
Mike<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 05:01:28 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Veskrashen wrote:<BR>
> > 1) Would a plasma cannon running on batteries need an accumulator? Would<BR>
> > the discharge rate matter?<BR>
> An accumulator would be needed, since batteries don't give you the energy you<BR>
> require quickly enough.<BR>
> The discharge rate doesn't matter. Providing the required energy for one shot<BR>
> every sixth second does *not* mean that you can give that energy over a period<BR>
> of six (or five, or four) seconds and get the same result as if all the energy<BR>
> was given "at once."<BR>
<BR>
Yes, but starting at TL9 you can build a battery with a discharge rate<BR>
of .0036 seconds. How much more istantaneous do you need to get? And how<BR>
much slower is this than the combustion rate of an EPC (which doesn't<BR>
require an accumulator)? At least in the playtest PDF of FFS2 that I'm<BR>
using doesn't require them for either version, DEI or EPG. Which is<BR>
good, because an accumulator for the 62.5KJ carbine I designed would<BR>
weigh 8.75kg for the DEI model, 6.75kg for the EPG. On the other hand, a<BR>
.0036sec discharge rate battery of .0875MW capacity only weighs 5.6g. A<BR>
magazine containing 100 of these, with a 200pin connector as an<BR>
interface, could use each battery individually to produce 100 shots of<BR>
.0625MJ intensity, with no real limitation on rate of fire (other than<BR>
recoil). The feul required would only be .00125m3, weighing 87.5g. <BR>
 <BR>
> > 2) How does the OTU model explosions in confined spaces? Say, in a crew<BR>
> > compartment, or in a person? Or as a more extreme example, an explosion<BR>
> > within the armor plating of a vehicle?<BR>
> <BR>
> Explosions in confined spaces are generally very dangerous to everyone inside.<BR>
> An explosion inside you is either very small (but still harmful, HE-ammo in an<BR>
> example for this) or larger (*SPLAT*).<BR>
> Twilight 2000 has the following to say about explosions inside armored<BR>
> vehicles: All occupants die.<BR>
<BR>
Sounds good to me. Picture this, then:<BR>
<BR>
Unit of grav tanks moving through a city in support of a unit of<BR>
augmented battle dress infantry. Defenders have "spotters" carrying EMF<BR>
or optic designators (something unobtrusive). The designators carry<BR>
ranging and speed estimation software. They also have an altimiter, GPS<BR>
type inertial locator, and a gyro to determine azimuth and angle of<BR>
where it's pointed. The spotter presses a button on the side of the<BR>
unit, painting the target. He the states how much range to add, anywhere<BR>
from 1cm to 10m if he needs to. He presses the trigger, all the info is<BR>
packeted as a fire request and transmitted to a transceiver which<BR>
carries it via landline to a 1MJ Meson gun with a 2m accelerator tunnel.<BR>
The meson gun takes the data, converts all the ranges, positions and<BR>
angles involved into a firing solution, traverses, and fires. This<BR>
delivers a 1MJ meson explosion inside of any target within 2km of the<BR>
meson gun. Crew compartments, ammo bins, fusion plants, inside battle<BR>
dress, behind walls; it doesn't matter. You get a DV 5 explosion in your<BR>
lap (or chest). And the cost could be recovered relatively quickly from<BR>
captured high-tech equipment (ok, probably not the battle dress...).<BR>
Better still, if the transmissions were tightbeam, the designator<BR>
non-detectable (or difficult to detect), and the meson gun in a Farraday<BR>
cage, it would be extremely difficult to pinpoint and neutralize the<BR>
threat.<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2386<BR>
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Traveller-digest        Tuesday, May 2 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2387<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
Re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
Re: Hivers<BR>
Real Turret Mounted Lasers [slightly OT]<BR>
Re: Jump Capacitors and Jump Dimming<BR>
Re: GT-REQ: Starport Construction Equipment<BR>
Re: OT: Re: Episode IV<BR>
Re: OT: Re: Episode IV<BR>
Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
Charismatic Governments<BR>
RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #2380<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
[OT]  Batman & Evil Bill<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
re: evolution and diaspora<BR>
RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
RE: Re: Episode IV<BR>
RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 16:26:40 +0100 <BR>
From: Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Chris Dixon [mailto:cdixon@airfoiltech.com]<BR>
> <BR>
> Greetings Travellers,<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm wondering about the proto-humans that the ancients <BR>
> dispersed to the<BR>
> stars in 300,000 BC.<BR>
> <BR>
> Would these humans even be recognizable as "earth" humans after that<BR>
> many years of evolution on alien worlds?<BR>
> <BR>
> They would be subject to very different environmental <BR>
> challenges than we<BR>
> would and varying levels of radiation or evolution due to weird<BR>
> environments could cause them to evolve quite differently than we did.<BR>
> <BR>
> Does anyone with more knowledge of the subject than I have any input?<BR>
> I'm running a First Imperium scenario and my Terran players <BR>
> are meeting<BR>
> the Vilani for the first time.<BR>
> <BR>
> Thanks!<BR>
> <BR>
> Chris<BR>
> <BR>
> (P.S.  I know the books say that all branches of Humaniti look like<BR>
> earth humans but is that realistic?)<BR>
<BR>
Well, They will certainly be recognised as humanoid, but the variations<BR>
may cause them to be seen as 'less' than human. Think of the reactions<BR>
of European explorers on meeting Australian aborigines, African pygmies,<BR>
Kalahari Bushmen, Masai, Inuit, Chinese, Japanese, Indian (as in India),<BR>
Native American, etc etc. Yes they are all recognisable as 'human', but<BR>
attitude towards them were not on an equal basis.<BR>
<BR>
Also, there is now considerable debate over the differences and<BR>
interbreeding between Hom. Sap and Neanderthal (see Scientific American,<BR>
April 2000 [I think, it's at home right now...])<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 10:39:22 -0500 <BR>
From: Bill Dunn <bdunn@epicsystems.com><BR>
Subject: re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
But the books don't actually say that all branches of humaniti look EXACTLY<BR>
like earth humans. The Darrian's have a slightly different bone structure<BR>
and skin coloration. Vilani tend to have different builds.<BR>
The question about the effects of evolution depends on the state of human<BR>
development 300,000 years ago. Had humans, by that point, learned to<BR>
transform their surroundings enough to reduce the effects of natural<BR>
selection and slow evolution? I think the game designers decided that they<BR>
had. Take a look at humans today, we're masters at thwarting natural<BR>
selection because we can change our surroundings, force nature to adapt to<BR>
us rather than the other way around. Sure, there are still some evolutionary<BR>
forces at work on us (our environmental adjustments creating their own<BR>
natural selection forces) but I suspect we've slowed evolution substantially<BR>
in our species.<BR>
In Traveller, I think that assumption explains why humaniti throughout the<BR>
area aren't all that different except in fairly subtle ways. Predominance of<BR>
certain blood types, skin tones, builds, etc. and not major morphological<BR>
changes.<BR>
When you also consider that human servant populations that survived could<BR>
not have been put on planets terribly hostile to human life (Vland sounding<BR>
like one of the more extreme cases), I think evolutionary pressures wouldn't<BR>
have been too severe.<BR>
At least that's my take on it.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ------------------------------<BR>
><BR>
>Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 10:57:46 -0400<BR>
>From: "Chris Dixon" <cdixon@airfoiltech.com><BR>
>Subject: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
><BR>
>Greetings Travellers,<BR>
><BR>
>I'm wondering about the proto-humans that the ancients dispersed to the<BR>
>stars in 300,000 BC.<BR>
><BR>
>Would these humans even be recognizable as "earth" humans after that<BR>
>many years of evolution on alien worlds?<BR>
<snip><BR>
>(P.S.  I know the books say that all branches of Humaniti look like<BR>
>earth humans but is that realistic?)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 11:42:15 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: "Chris Dixon" <cdixon@airfoiltech.com><BR>
> Would these humans even be recognizable as "earth" humans after that<BR>
> many years of evolution on alien worlds?<BR>
<BR>
Just one more proof that evolution is a hoax!<BR>
<BR>
:-p<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 10:46:31 -0500 <BR>
From: "Smart, David J (David)" <dasmart@lucent.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Hivers<BR>
<BR>
will richards posted:<BR>
><<<BR>
>>In a message dated 00-04-30 23:23:15 EDT, you write:<BR>
><BR>
>><< Since Hiver mouthparts are on their undersides, they haven't been<BR>
>>depicted in Traveller artwork.  What if they are very strong, (the<BR>
>>jaws, that is) and Hivers like to grapple in HTH (when they must)<BR>
>>and bite away with powerful, multi-toothed jaws (like the business<BR>
>>end of a leech)? >><BR>
>><BR>
>>No jaws. No radula/beak/proboscis.<BR>
>><BR>
>>Sorry.<BR>
>><BR>
>>LKW<BR>
><BR>
>Ok, well how about a really really nasty hicky!!<BR>
>  Kill'em with love!<BR>
><BR>
>I could see that as a deterrent for most non hiver's,  a reason not to go <BR>
>HTH with them.><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I can just see the First Contact meetings:<BR>
<BR>
IISS Contact Specialist: "We humans use a hand gesture for greeting. It's<BR>
                          called 'shaking hands'. Here, let me show you."<BR>
<BR>
Hiver: <What the ..? OH, BAYBEE!><BR>
<BR>
IISS ConSpec:  "Eeeewwww!"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
"Going hand-to-hand" with Hivers is probably the basis of a number of<BR>
dirty jokes in the Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
David Smart<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 12:01:42 -0400<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
Subject: Real Turret Mounted Lasers [slightly OT]<BR>
<BR>
I don't know if anyone's seen this yet, but the US Air Force, in <BR>
conjunction with about a million other companies is developing it's first <BR>
turret laser.  Info on the complete system can be found at:<BR>
<BR>
www.airbornelaser.com<BR>
<BR>
Additional info on the laser itself is at:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.staff.uiuc.edu/~carroll/cutting.html<BR>
<BR>
It turns out two of my friends that have just graduated Cornell are working <BR>
on this thing at two totally different companies.  Apparently nearly every <BR>
major Air Force contractor is doing something for this.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
                          			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
for PGP public-key and<BR>
more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/                <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 17:57:22 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Re: Jump Capacitors and Jump Dimming<BR>
<BR>
Antony Farrell schrieb:<BR>
> <BR>
> Using FFS1<BR>
[snip]<BR>
> At TL10 122.5 Mj<BR>
> At TL11 163.3 Mj<BR>
> At TL12 196 Mj<BR>
> At TL13 217.8 Mj<BR>
> At TL14 245 Mj and<BR>
> At TL15 280 Mj<BR>
> <BR>
> This raises a number of questions<BR>
> 1. Why do the higher tech level drives require more energy for the jump?<BR>
<BR>
Isn't that for higher jump numbers, too?<BR>
<BR>
> 2. Why did the Vilani need to practice jump dimming since the energy for the<BR>
> jump came from a capacitor bank?<BR>
<BR>
Well, that was IMHO a relic from the *very* early days of Vilani jump<BR>
drive use; the first six or so vessels didn't use capacitor banks (fewer<BR>
parts in a ship, so fewer parts that can fail). And later on, it had<BR>
become a ...<BR>
<BR>
You guessed it.<BR>
<BR>
A tradition.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, YMMV.<BR>
<BR>
> 3. Why do jump drives not get smaller at higher tech levels since the volume<BR>
> required by capacitors for a given amount of energy gets smaller?<BR>
<BR>
So that is a very good question. All I can say is that using GT rules, a<BR>
jump drive module does not decrease in size or mass by TL, but only<BR>
slightly in cost and rather dramatically in crew requirements (basic<BR>
rules, that is). <BR>
 <BR>
> For example a jump-1 drive at TL12 would need only half the capacitor volume<BR>
> of the equivalent TL9 model. Any comments?<BR>
<BR>
But maybe this is, again, for the higher jump numbers.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 07:17:48<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-REQ: Starport Construction Equipment<BR>
<BR>
At 04:48 AM 5/2/2000 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>straight GURPS vehicles listed. So far the only one I've seen was<BR>
>the "Harvey Mudd Engineering Sled" in the GT:Ground Forces playtest<BR>
>files. (BTW, the name *IS* usable; it was *HARRY* Mudd who was the<BR>
>ST con man.)<BR>
<BR>
The sled was named after Craig's old school, which frankly has more insane<BR>
scientists per square meter than Gotham City's Arkham Asylum.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 07:22:09<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
At 12:25 AM 5/2/2000 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>You don't suppose there were some first run prints *with* and some<BR>
*without* do you?<BR>
<BR>
No.  None of the original release prints had Episode 4.  The scroll started<BR>
with "It is a time of Civil War in the Galaxy..."<BR>
<BR>
When SW was reissued in 1980, there were articles in Time and Newsweek<BR>
commenting on the revised credits.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 10:12:09 -0600<BR>
From: Erwin Fritz <efritz@glja.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> No.  None of the original release prints had Episode 4.  The scroll started<BR>
> with "It is a time of Civil War in the Galaxy..."<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
Okay, okay, I must correct. It's "It is a period of civil war."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Erwin Fritz<BR>
Gilbert Laustsen Jung Associates Ltd.<BR>
http://www.glja.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 12:22:15 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
<BR>
Chris Dixon writes:<BR>
>Greetings Travellers,<BR>
>I'm wondering about the proto-humans that the ancients dispersed to the<BR>
>stars in 300,000 BC.<BR>
>Would these humans even be recognizable as "earth" humans after that<BR>
>many years of evolution on alien worlds?<BR>
>They would be subject to very different environmental challenges than we<BR>
>would and varying levels of radiation or evolution due to weird<BR>
>environments could cause them to evolve quite differently than we did.<BR>
>Does anyone with more knowledge of the subject than I have any input?<BR>
>I'm running a First Imperium scenario and my Terran players are meeting<BR>
>the Vilani for the first time.<BR>
>Thanks!<BR>
>Chris<BR>
>(P.S.  I know the books say that all branches of Humaniti look like<BR>
>earth humans but is that realistic?)<BR>
<BR>
	Some background: /Homo sapiens/ (modern man) has been around for<BR>
	about 300,000 years.  The earlier members of this species are<BR>
	sometimes called 'archaic' /H. sapiens/.  Neanderthals were one<BR>
	population of archaic /H. sapiens/ (some authors treat them as a<BR>
	separate species, /H. neanderthalensis/).  'Modern' /H. sapiens/<BR>
	virtually indistinguishable from today's humans have been around<BR>
	for about 170,000 years.  /H. erectus/, very likely the predicessor<BR>
	of /H. sapiens/, was just disappearing around 300,000 years ago.<BR>
	There was no sudden switch from /H. erectus/ to /H. sapiens/, but<BR>
	the humans extant on Terra at that time were probably somewhere in<BR>
	between these two groups.<BR>
<BR>
	Although /H. erectus/ is thought to have spread across Africa, Asia,<BR>
	and Europe, there are some authors who believe that the 'races' of<BR>
	Terran humans have actually been derived from more recent migrations<BR>
	of /H. sapiens/.  In either case, there has been a great deal of<BR>
	'gene flow' among these populations, that is they have not been <BR>
	isolated.  The differences among groups of people living in different<BR>
	areas on Terra are a good place to start in considering the different<BR>
	races of Humaniti among the planets, but the planets were completely<BR>
	isolated for thousands of generations.<BR>
<BR>
	I would expect that humans living on worlds with generally Terran<BR>
	features would not generally draw undue attention walking (wearing<BR>
	locally unremarkable clothing) in downtown Montreal.  On the other<BR>
	hand, sexual selection (the tendency for certain traits to confer<BR>
	better mating opportunities) can push evolution in unpredictable<BR>
	directions.  At most, humans scattered across terran worlds 300,000<BR>
	years ago might be as different looking as some Star Trek aliens<BR>
	(such as Vulcans or even Klingons).  They might just be indistinguishable<BR>
	from some Terran group.<BR>
<BR>
	If the human stock transfered from Terra 300,000 years managed to thrive<BR>
	on a substantially different world, there might be more changes.  Perhaps<BR>
	the chest might be 20% bigger in a Thin atmosphere, the limbs 10% shorter<BR>
	on a cold world, maybe even a full coat of fur.  No huge changes, but<BR>
	many smaller ones (keep in mind that sexual selection may oppose certain<BR>
	traits, perhaps furry men survive better but nobody wants them).  A<BR>
	number of invisible changes will probably take place such as haemoglobin<BR>
	structure and abundance, retina pigmentation, and digestive enzymes.<BR>
<BR>
	So, it is possible to have some branches of Humaniti in the OTU looking<BR>
	quite different (and you can use Klingons, if you want to!), but I would<BR>
	say that it is not unrealistic to portray at least some of these races as<BR>
	looking very much like Terran humans.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
Evolutionary Biologist<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 13:04:44 -0400<BR>
From: "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu><BR>
Subject: Charismatic Governments<BR>
<BR>
Hi, I wrote an article called "Charismatic Governments" which appeared in this<BR>
week's<BR>
JTAS. (It's funny, I didn't even know the article was accepted until I logged<BR>
on...)<BR>
<BR>
I was wondering whether to write other articles on governments in the Traveller<BR>
universe, but first I thought I'd ask for your feedback. Did you find the CG<BR>
article<BR>
a crashing bore? Were there parts that really annoyed you? Would you have<BR>
prefered a different approach, or do you find the topic a waste of time? (Don't<BR>
worry, I can take criticism.)<BR>
<BR>
Thanks,<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 10:11:18 -0700<BR>
From: "Tod Glenn" <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #2380<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of will<BR>
> richards<BR>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 7:01 AM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2380<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 23:30:29 EDT<BR>
> From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Hivers<BR>
><BR>
> >In a message dated 00-04-30 23:23:15 EDT, you write:<BR>
><BR>
> ><< Since Hiver mouthparts are on their undersides, they haven't been<BR>
> >depicted in Traveller artwork.  What if they are very strong, (the<BR>
> >jaws, that is) and Hivers like to grapple in HTH (when they must)<BR>
> >and bite away with powerful, multi-toothed jaws (like the business<BR>
> >end of a leech)? >><BR>
> ><BR>
> >No jaws. No radula/beak/proboscis.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Sorry.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >LKW<BR>
><BR>
> Ok, well how about a really really nasty hicky!!<BR>
>   Kill'em with love!<BR>
><BR>
Who know what their breath is like? As I recall, it's both a mouth-part and<BR>
waste orifice.  You could get partially digested fore being defecated on.<BR>
Maybe not lethal, but I'll pass.<BR>
<BR>
Tod<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 10:15:04 -0700<BR>
From: "Tod Glenn" <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
> I'm wondering about the proto-humans that the ancients dispersed to the<BR>
> stars in 300,000 BC.<BR>
><BR>
> Would these humans even be recognizable as "earth" humans after that<BR>
> many years of evolution on alien worlds?<BR>
><BR>
> They would be subject to very different environmental challenges than we<BR>
> would and varying levels of radiation or evolution due to weird<BR>
> environments could cause them to evolve quite differently than we did.<BR>
><BR>
> Does anyone with more knowledge of the subject than I have any input?<BR>
> I'm running a First Imperium scenario and my Terran players are meeting<BR>
> the Vilani for the first time.<BR>
><BR>
> Thanks!<BR>
><BR>
> Chris<BR>
<BR>
All one need do is look at the racial differenced of earth bound humans, all<BR>
evolving in a very similar environment. Now imagine changing the gravity,<BR>
temperature, atmosphere, etc.  While the outlander would probably be<BR>
identifiable as human, they could be very different from us.<BR>
<BR>
Tod<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 18:31:06 +0100<BR>
From: Phil Kitching <postmark.design@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Sounds good to me. Picture this, then:<BR>
><BR>
>Unit of grav tanks moving through a city in support of a unit of<BR>
>augmented battle dress infantry. Defenders have "spotters" carrying EMF<BR>
>or optic designators (something unobtrusive). The designators carry<BR>
>ranging and speed estimation software. They also have an altimiter, GPS<BR>
>type inertial locator, and a gyro to determine azimuth and angle of<BR>
<BR>
Call it a beam pointer or passive target designator. Your GPS satellites<BR>
died before the bad guys achieved orbit and a laser designator is a big<BR>
"over here" sign.<BR>
<BR>
>where it's pointed. The spotter presses a button on the side of the<BR>
>unit, painting the target. He the states how much range to add, anywhere<BR>
>from 1cm to 10m if he needs to. He presses the trigger, all the info is<BR>
>packeted as a fire request and transmitted to a transceiver which<BR>
>carries it via landline to a 1MJ Meson gun with a 2m accelerator tunnel.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
Now do you realise why some people on the TML have campaigned for minimum<BR>
sizes for Meson Guns?<BR>
<BR>
;-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In actual fact, your target designator is probably pretty detectable<BR>
unless it's of comparable tech to the target.<BR>
<BR>
Your landline is very vulnerable to indirect fire. You could (of course)<BR>
always use a Meson Comm.<BR>
<BR>
Then there's the question of just how accurate it is possible to be<BR>
with a Meson Gun (and how small the explosion centre can be.)<BR>
<BR>
But, even a 20 or 100 Mj Meson Gun is cheap if you get to use it lots.<BR>
<BR>
So, at worst you're trading light infantry for grav tanks at<BR>
about one for one.<BR>
<BR>
Not good.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, the attackers can return the favour:<BR>
<BR>
FO: "Ortillery, there's movement in the sewer 10m below me"<BR>
<BR>
Ort: "Not any more"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Conclusion:<BR>
<BR>
Taking cities against determined opposition, especially those with<BR>
decent technology, cost lots and lots of casualties.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching<BR>
- --<BR>
  http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>
  Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>
 "Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 12:33:28 -0500<BR>
From: Pete <j_pete@bellsouth.net><BR>
Subject: [OT]  Batman & Evil Bill<BR>
<BR>
I figured Doug and others would appreciate this. ;-)<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 1 May 2000 19:30:01 PDT, in rec.humor.funny<BR>
funny-request@netfunny.com (Funny Guy) wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>>From: johnl@iecc.com (John R Levine)<BR>
>>Subject: Life as a superhero<BR>
><BR>
>Q. What's the difference between Batman and Bill Gates?<BR>
><BR>
>A. When Batman fought the Penguin, he won.<BR>
><BR>
>[Loosely translated from a version found in a spam "newsletter" in French,<BR>
>only the French version had to explain who Batman, the Penguin, and Bill<BR>
>Gates were.]<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under heaven."<BR>
                                               -Ecclesiastes 3:1<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 10:45:44 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching writes:<BR>
<BR>
> <snip><BR>
> <BR>
> Now do you realise why some people on the TML have campaigned for minimum<BR>
> sizes for Meson Guns?<BR>
<BR>
Related to why the minimum size for meson guns in GT was changed from 100 MJ<BR>
(which allowed 350 lb GTL-10 truck-mounted meson guns if you were careful in<BR>
your design) to 10 GJ at GTL 12, more at lower TL ;)  It was that or put meson<BR>
screens on grav tanks, which didn't get a good reception when I suggested it...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 14:21:22 -0700<BR>
From: "Joe Lachance" <Lachance@nc.rr.com><BR>
Subject: re: evolution and diaspora<BR>
<BR>
Chris writes:<BR>
>I'm wondering about the proto-humans that the ancients dispersed to the<BR>
>stars in 300,000 BC.<BR>
><BR>
>Would these humans even be recognizable as "earth" humans after that<BR>
>many years of evolution on alien worlds?<BR>
><BR>
>They would be subject to very different environmental challenges than we<BR>
>would and varying levels of radiation or evolution due to weird<BR>
>environments could cause them to evolve quite differently than we did.<BR>
><BR>
>Does anyone with more knowledge of the subject than I have any input?<BR>
>I'm running a First Imperium scenario and my Terran players are meeting<BR>
>the Vilani for the first time.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
    My background is in evolutionary genetics, and I'm basing my info on<BR>
that rather than what might be considered 'canon' in Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
    In evolutionary time what matters more is number of generations and<BR>
300,000 years translates to roughly 15000 generations.  Needless to say this<BR>
is a sizeable amount of time; however, the amount that a relatively slow<BR>
breeding species like homo sapiens can evolve in 300,000 years is less than<BR>
say...fruit flies.  Physical anthropology indicates that over the last<BR>
1Myears brain size has slowly but steadily increased among hominids.<BR>
Without getting into the evolutionary advantages of intelligence the bottom<BR>
line is that one can expect a decent amount of variance among each of the<BR>
different humaniti populations in Traveller, and this applies to a great<BR>
many traits.<BR>
<BR>
    The concept that best answers your question is that of "population<BR>
bottlenecks".  When a region is settled by a relatively small number of<BR>
colonists the genetic (and phenotypic) variance within that population drops<BR>
a great deal.  One example of the result of a population bottleneck is the<BR>
relatively limited traits exhibited by Hutterites in north america.  Under<BR>
the solomani hypothesis in traveller we can expect each of the races planted<BR>
by Grandfather to start with a good deal less variety. However, over time<BR>
new mutations will have arisen and one could as a result expect to find a<BR>
good deal of variety within the Vilani by the time the Terrans contacted<BR>
first imperium.  It should be noted that most of the variety found among<BR>
vilani need not be found on solomani.<BR>
<BR>
    Would they look human?  That all depends on how you define human =).<BR>
Vilani would clearly be identifiable as hominids.  As a matter of<BR>
perspective Homo sapiens neanderthalensis (the neanderthals) were first<BR>
found 150,000 to 200,000 years ago (disappearing around 30-40,000 years<BR>
ago).  So..it wouldn't be totally unlikely for the Vilani to be as different<BR>
as modern man as the neanderthals were.<BR>
<BR>
    One side effect of such long divergence is that even if viable offspring<BR>
are able to produced from a Solomani-Vilani coupling the rate of aborted<BR>
pregnancies would be quite high.  Even if nominally the same "species"<BR>
300,000 years of divergence is likely to cause many hidden barriers to<BR>
reproduction when various branches of humaniti come into contact with one<BR>
another.<BR>
<BR>
hope this helps,<BR>
Joe Lachance<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 15:00:43 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Bill Dunn<BR>
Sent: Monday, May 01, 2000 11:43 AM<BR>
To: 'traveller@lists.imagiconline.com'<BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>If any of you feel that a lot of early 'canon' Traveller adventures are<BR>
just<BR>
>dungeon crawls with spaceship trappings, you're pretty much right.<BR>
<BR>
Yeah, that's probably why they actually sold. :)<BR>
<BR>
>But we should all cut the early authors some slack. RPGs were still pretty<BR>
>new and the concepts of story-telling, interaction, and the 'higher'<BR>
aspects<BR>
>of role-playing were still being developed.<BR>
<BR>
I don't think we should cut them any slack, nor do I buy into this garbage<BR>
that they were good "for their day", or anything like that. A lot of them<BR>
are just damned good adventures, any day of the week.<BR>
<BR>
People forget that cliches become cliches for a reason. "Dungeon crawls", in<BR>
all their forms (despite the hoity toity opinions of some) have a number of<BR>
aspects which make them superior when compared with other sorts of<BR>
adventures.<BR>
<BR>
1.) What's deeper in the "complex" (dungeon, starship, whatever) remains<BR>
unknown to the players until they uncover it. This means that there are no<BR>
grey areas about what the player characters might know.<BR>
<BR>
2.) Very nearly *all* skills within a given game can be used in such an<BR>
adventure, with the exception of some social skills. This means that they're<BR>
flexible with respect to the screen time given to the individual characters<BR>
(which keeps the characters happy).<BR>
<BR>
3.) Exploring the unknown resonates like few other concepts in roleplaying<BR>
games. When the players' curiosities are piqued, it gets their creative<BR>
juices flowing, and when their creative juices are flowing, they're usually<BR>
at their best.<BR>
<BR>
4.) Dungeon crawls usually have a clear "obstacle / reward" quasi-Romantic<BR>
emplotment (as do most adventure stories, movies, whatever). It's usually<BR>
tough for a bad GM or player to screw this up in a "dungeon crawl". The<BR>
whole effect is heightened if there's some secret, or cool bit at the end<BR>
which rewards the player characters for their hard work up to that point.<BR>
<BR>
Good for their day, indeed! Hah! :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 15:09:31 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
>The fact that many of us saw the movie in its original release.  Several<BR>
>times.  In theaters, I have seen the Rocky Horror Picture Show over 700<BR>
>times.  Star Wars a bit over 100.  Trust me.  The original release did not<BR>
>have the "New Hope" bit at the top of the scroll.<BR>
<BR>
With all due respect, Doug, I see Bruce Johnson who appears to be saying the<BR>
exact opposite thing, so I'm not sure why I should trust you on it (or<BR>
Bruce). I was wondering if there was some basis other than the personal<BR>
recollections of others on this list (which have sometimes been quite off).<BR>
<BR>
I don't remember the first time I saw it (I was two, at the oldest). I do<BR>
remember the only other time I saw it, which must have been between the time<BR>
that I was 4 and 6. I don't remember either way, which is why I wanted to<BR>
see if there was some evidence.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 15:17:42 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Re: Episode IV<BR>
<BR>
>I think it was there the first time I saw it too, and that was the first<BR>
day it was in<BR>
>town. If I recall correctly I laughed when I saw the Episode IV...it got me<BR>
in the mood for >a "Saturday Afternoon Serial", and I wasn't disappointed.<BR>
><BR>
>You don't suppose there were some first run prints *with* and some<BR>
*without* do you?<BR>
<BR>
This is certainly possible, Eris, as the film distribution network was<BR>
*very* different back in 1977 than it is now.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 14:44:12 -0500<BR>
From: tim@premier.net<BR>
Subject: RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
 <BR>
> <BR>
Chris Spouts words of wisdom<BR>
> <BR>
> I don't think we should cut them any slack, nor do I buy into this garbage<BR>
> that they were good "for their day", or anything like that. A lot of them<BR>
> are just damned good adventures, any day of the week.<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> 1.) What's deeper in the "complex" (dungeon, starship, whatever) remains<BR>
> unknown to the players until they uncover it. This means that there are no<BR>
> grey areas about what the player characters might know.<BR>
<BR>
Right here, I run both old fashion AD&D adventures and the new <BR>
Story Teller stories, and you know what players like this balck and <BR>
white contrast.  They often dont have the time to truely enjoy the <BR>
gray areas od the story telling system.  Lets face it we all only get <BR>
about six hours of RPG time a week. This inclueded this list and <BR>
other outside the game nite but related activites.  This means <BR>
game nite needs to be simple (lack of better word) and Dungon <BR>
Crawls fit the bill.<BR>
> <BR>
> 2.) Very nearly *all* skills within a given game can be used in such an<BR>
> adventure, with the exception of some social skills. This means that they're<BR>
> flexible with respect to the screen time given to the individual characters<BR>
> (which keeps the characters happy).<BR>
> <BR>
Very true and we all know what happans if you leave one player let <BR>
alone two players out of the action.  What little social skills the <BR>
characters have let alone the players have go out the window.<BR>
snip #3<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> 4.) Dungeon crawls usually have a clear "obstacle / reward" quasi-Romantic<BR>
> emplotment (as do most adventure stories, movies, whatever). It's usually<BR>
> tough for a bad GM or player to screw this up in a "dungeon crawl". The<BR>
> whole effect is heightened if there's some secret, or cool bit at the end<BR>
> which rewards the player characters for their hard work up to that point.<BR>
> <BR>
> Good for their day, indeed! Hah! :)<BR>
> <BR>
So I second you Seamans<BR>
<BR>
Indeed I have been runing a Mage game TM on and off for 5 years, <BR>
and the palyers still go on the dungon crawl.  All in order to find <BR>
location and powers of the Holy Grail, let alone to defeate the bad <BR>
guy.  <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Tim Reynolds<BR>
tim@premier.net <BR>
225-334-5063<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable <BR>
sexual disease.  It made you unsuitable for <BR>
a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.<BR>
<BR>
Terry Pratchett <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2387<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2388</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	5/2/00 3:12:07 PM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
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Traveller-digest        Tuesday, May 2 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2388<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
RE: The trinity homepage<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
RE: Jump Capacitors and Jump Dimming<BR>
The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
one of the duh questions<BR>
Re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
re: evolution and diaspora<BR>
Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
re: Charismatic Governments<BR>
re: Real Turret Mounted Lasers [slightly OT]<BR>
Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
RE: Computer use in jumpspace<BR>
RE: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 16:16:46 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Dixon" <cdixon@airfoiltech.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
Thanks to the TML for some good ideas and a couple of Biology lessons.<BR>
<BR>
(Thar's sum reaal smaart folks on the list!!) - Me feeling grossly<BR>
undereducated.<BR>
<BR>
To focus the topic more on the Vilani -<BR>
<BR>
On a world that's pretty hostile towards humans, what Might those<BR>
proto-humans develop like?<BR>
<BR>
Using Galactic -<BR>
<BR>
Terra UWP is 867<BR>
Vland UWP is 967<BR>
<BR>
Both have standard atmosphere and the same percentage of water.<BR>
<BR>
Would the Vilani be larger/stronger than "earthers" because of the<BR>
larger world size?<BR>
<BR>
What traits are good when just about everything can't be processed by<BR>
your digestive system without being heavily refined first?<BR>
<BR>
Would the type of star Vland orbits have an effect on evolution?<BR>
<BR>
Food for thought - Ideas & Speculation are always welcome.<BR>
<BR>
Chris<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 18:50:26 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: RE: The trinity homepage<BR>
<BR>
At 6:51 -0400 2/5/00,  "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz> wrote:<BR>
>To the list:<BR>
>    The trinity homepage is up an limping have a look if you like:<BR>
>http://web.one.net.au/~rhoughto/trinity.html<BR>
><BR>
>My first comment is that you'd better watch out for White Wolf's lawyers<BR>
><grin><BR>
<BR>
I'm sure the Vatican would chip in to help the defense ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 14:47:04 -0600 <BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
<BR>
So, since there _aren't_ any major morphological differences between the<BR>
major races of humaniti, does this mean that some force must have acted to<BR>
keep their evolution along the same general lines (the Ancients again)?<BR>
As I recall, the biggest difference between Solomani and Zhodani, for<BR>
instance, is that the Zhodani don't have wisdom teeth (aside from different<BR>
blood types being prevelant).  Darrians have pointed ears, of course, but<BR>
most minor human races don't appear all that different from Solomani either,<BR>
and Solomani and Vilani are definitely interfertile (Cleon was of mixed<BR>
Solomani/Vilani linneage).<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson [mailto:ian@vax2.concordia.ca]<BR>
<BR>
Chris Dixon writes:<BR>
>Greetings Travellers,<BR>
>I'm wondering about the proto-humans that the ancients dispersed to the<BR>
>stars in 300,000 BC.<BR>
>Would these humans even be recognizable as "earth" humans after that<BR>
>many years of evolution on alien worlds?<BR>
>They would be subject to very different environmental challenges than we<BR>
>would and varying levels of radiation or evolution due to weird<BR>
>environments could cause them to evolve quite differently than we did.<BR>
>Does anyone with more knowledge of the subject than I have any input?<BR>
>I'm running a First Imperium scenario and my Terran players are meeting<BR>
>the Vilani for the first time.<BR>
>Thanks!<BR>
>Chris<BR>
>(P.S.  I know the books say that all branches of Humaniti look like<BR>
>earth humans but is that realistic?)<BR>
<BR>
	Some background: /Homo sapiens/ (modern man) has been around for<BR>
	about 300,000 years. *snip*<BR>
<BR>
	So, it is possible to have some branches of Humaniti in the OTU<BR>
looking<BR>
	quite different (and you can use Klingons, if you want to!), but I<BR>
would<BR>
	say that it is not unrealistic to portray at least some of these<BR>
races as<BR>
	looking very much like Terran humans.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
Evolutionary Biologist<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 14:55:41 -0600 <BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Jump Capacitors and Jump Dimming<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher [mailto:Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de]<BR>
<BR>
Antony Farrell schrieb:<BR>
> <BR>
> Using FFS1<BR>
[snip]<BR>
> At TL10 122.5 Mj<BR>
> At TL11 163.3 Mj<BR>
> At TL12 196 Mj<BR>
> At TL13 217.8 Mj<BR>
> At TL14 245 Mj and<BR>
> At TL15 280 Mj<BR>
> <BR>
> This raises a number of questions<BR>
> 1. Why do the higher tech level drives require more energy for the jump?<BR>
<BR>
>Isn't that for higher jump numbers, too?><BR>
<BR>
No, his example is all with Jump-1 drives.  Is it possible that using more<BR>
power for lower jumps gives a safer jump transition?  If that's the case,<BR>
the higher tech drives (designed to take advantage of better power<BR>
production and storage technology) could have been designed to be safer by<BR>
using more power.<BR>
<BR>
> 2. Why did the Vilani need to practice jump dimming since the energy for<BR>
the<BR>
> jump came from a capacitor bank?<BR>
>Well, that was IMHO a relic from the *very* early days of Vilani jump<BR>
drive use; the first six or so vessels didn't use capacitor banks (fewer<BR>
parts in a ship, so fewer parts that can fail). And later on, it had<BR>
become a ...You guessed it.<BR>
A tradition.><BR>
<BR>
Maybe only the greater portion of the energy for a jump came from a<BR>
capacitor - the power plant still acted to provide some portion of the power<BR>
for the jump.  A ship could presumably be designed this way - since you<BR>
don't need the thrusters or weapons powered when you go to jump, you could<BR>
save a lot of space on jump capacitors by having the plant provide the power<BR>
that would normally go to such systems to the j-drive.<BR>
<BR>
> 3. Why do jump drives not get smaller at higher tech levels since the<BR>
volume<BR>
> required by capacitors for a given amount of energy gets smaller?<BR>
So that is a very good question. All I can say is that using GT rules, a<BR>
jump drive module does not decrease in size or mass by TL, but only<BR>
slightly in cost and rather dramatically in crew requirements (basic<BR>
rules, that is).><BR>
<BR>
More accurate and safe drives might require more equipment and thus more<BR>
space.  A TL10 drive, for instance, might end your jump millions of miles<BR>
from it's plotted exit point while a TL15 drive lands you within a few<BR>
meters and will probably have more backups and more advanced damage control.<BR>
<BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 13:55:42 -0700<BR>
From: Russell Bornschlegel <kaleja@estarcion.com><BR>
Subject: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
I did some checking with some other disreputable sources about this Episode <BR>
IV thing. While these references are not necessarily conclusive, I think we <BR>
should all keep in mind the fallibility of our 20-year-old memories of the <BR>
original theatrical release...<BR>
<BR>
From the rec.arts.sf.movies FAQ:<BR>
> (And by the way, the first STAR WARS film was originally released as<BR>
> just "STAR WARS"; it was only in re-release that it was entitled "STAR<BR>
> WARS EPISODE IV: A NEW HOPE", although it is subject to many a<BR>
> heated discussion when exactly the title was amended. The other two<BR>
> were always labeled "EPISODE  V" and "EPISODE VI.")<BR>
<BR>
From the Internet Movie Database Trivia List:<BR>
> - The episode number and subtitle ``A New Hope'' did not originally appear in <BR>
>   the film's opening crawl. These were added in a later re-release to be <BR>
>   consistent with those seen in _The Empire Strikes Back (1980)_ (qv).<BR>
<BR>
From the Star Wars FAQ at http://home.swipnet.se/~w-22083/base/faq.htm<BR>
> Q 001:   Why does it say Episode IV in the scroll-text at the beginning<BR>
>          of Star Wars, Episode V in The Empire Strikes Back and Episode<BR>
>          VI in Return of the Jedi?  Did the Episode IV sub-head appear<BR>
>          in the original theatrical release or was it added at a later<BR>
>          date?<BR>
> <BR>
> Answer:  The Star Wars saga as originally conceived by Lucas was much<BR>
>          too large to be made into a single film or even a single<BR>
>          trilogy so Lucas structured his ideas into three trilogies.<BR>
>          He decided to make the middle trilogy (Episodes IV, V and VI)<BR>
>          first because he believed it had the greatest chance of being<BR>
>          a theatrical success.<BR>
> <BR>
>          An interesting point is that the "Chapter IV: A New Hope"<BR>
>          sub-title did not appear until the 1979 re-release of the movie. <BR>
>          Randal Schwartz (merlyn@romulus.reed.edu) says the following<BR>
>          about the '79 release:<BR>
> <BR>
>             That was the one with the extended trailer for ESB, which<BR>
>             came out the following summer.  So the order was:<BR>
> <BR>
>                     summer of '77: SW [no IV]<BR>
>                     summer of '78: re-release of SW [no IV]<BR>
>                                    (but Westgate was still playing it)<BR>
>                     summer of '79: retitled SW IV, with ESB trailer<BR>
>                     summer of '80: ESB<BR>
> <BR>
>             The reference to "Westgate" was that the Westgate theatre<BR>
>             (just a few blocks from where I am typing this) was *still*<BR>
>             playing it.  They set the record worldwide for the longest<BR>
>             continuous run for SW [sans IV], something like 79 weeks. <BR>
>             So, naturally, it wasn't a "re-release" for summer of '78. <BR>
>             (We web-footed Oregonians see a *lot* of movies. :-)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 15:59:25 -0500<BR>
From: "heath" <mandor@inx.net><BR>
Subject: one of the duh questions<BR>
<BR>
can someone point me to the list faq<BR>
i need to unsubscribe this address and subscribe another<BR>
sorry for the interuption<BR>
<BR>
thanks for any help!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 17:04:50 -0400<BR>
From: Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
<BR>
Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca> wrote:<BR>
>         I would expect that humans living on worlds with generally Terran<BR>
>         features would not generally draw undue attention walking (wearing<BR>
>         locally unremarkable clothing) in downtown Montreal.  <BR>
<BR>
A poor analogy at best - as long as they adhered to Bill 101 and <BR>
spoke French, a pack of Vargr would raise few eyebrows walking<BR>
through downtown Montreal. Heck, put 'em behind the wheel and they <BR>
would improve the average driver competency.<BR>
<BR>
ObOnTopic: Actually, there are canon examples of "minor" human races<BR>
that would draw considerable attention. The Suerrat (sp?) have a nearly<BR>
full covering of body hair, the Genoee from their high-g homeworld<BR>
are at the extreme end of what we consider "short and stocky" and lots<BR>
of other minor human races from lower-g planets would be tall enough<BR>
to merit notice even in Montreal. Plus, none of them smoke.<BR>
<BR>
Ethan, from that other city in Canada.<BR>
- --<BR>
Ethan Henry                                         egh@klg.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 17:13:27 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
Bill Dunn writes:<BR>
<snipped><BR>
>The question about the effects of evolution depends on the state of human<BR>
>development 300,000 years ago. Had humans, by that point, learned to<BR>
>transform their surroundings enough to reduce the effects of natural<BR>
>selection and slow evolution? I think the game designers decided that they<BR>
>had. Take a look at humans today, we're masters at thwarting natural<BR>
>selection because we can change our surroundings, force nature to adapt to<BR>
>us rather than the other way around. Sure, there are still some evolutionary<BR>
>forces at work on us (our environmental adjustments creating their own<BR>
>natural selection forces) but I suspect we've slowed evolution substantially<BR>
>in our species.<BR>
<snipped><BR>
<BR>
	Without going into a long dissertation on natural selection and evolution,<BR>
	it is not clear that humans are 'thwarting' natural selection, or that<BR>
	evolution has 'slowed.'  I'm not saying that evolution has not slowed, but<BR>
	I have seen no evidence to that effect.  If it has slowed, this may have<BR>
	to do with factors unrelated to technological development.  In any event,<BR>
	I don't think that humans had much control over their environment 300,000<BR>
	years ago.  On the other hand, evolution has probably been slower here than<BR>
	it would be for some transplanted humans on another world, particularly if<BR>
	that world is substantially different.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 17:20:03 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: re: evolution and diaspora<BR>
<BR>
Joe Lachance writes:<BR>
>My background is in evolutionary genetics, and I'm basing my info on<BR>
>that rather than what might be considered 'canon' in Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
	Just don't post any variance-covariance matrices for the Vilani!<BR>
	:)<BR>
<BR>
<excellent stuff snipped><BR>
>Would they look human?  That all depends on how you define human =).<BR>
>Vilani would clearly be identifiable as hominids.  As a matter of<BR>
>perspective Homo sapiens neanderthalensis (the neanderthals) were first<BR>
>found 150,000 to 200,000 years ago (disappearing around 30-40,000 years<BR>
>ago).  So..it wouldn't be totally unlikely for the Vilani to be as different<BR>
>as modern man as the neanderthals were.<BR>
<more good stuff snipped><BR>
<BR>
	I would just add that the neanderthals were probably pretty similar to<BR>
	modern humans.  They had heavier bones and prominant brows, but they<BR>
	apparently walked upright as we do.  With a suit, shades, and a shave,<BR>
	they might just look like an ugly business executive.<BR>
	:-(|)<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 16:32:07 -0500<BR>
From: "Brian T. Simmons" <brian_t_simmons@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
I know that I cannot lay this to rest but I have to give my input.  I was<BR>
twelve was I finely convinced my Dad that the lines for Star Wars were not<BR>
to long to go see the movie. At the time, it was showing at only one theater<BR>
in the Dallas area, but finely I saw it.<BR>
<BR>
The reason I know I did not see Episode IV is because a time later when<BR>
another theater, (closer to my house) got the film, I went again.  This time<BR>
as the music climaxed and the text started its crawl up the screen I was<BR>
saying to myself, "Episode IV, where did that come from?  That was not there<BR>
before."  Many of my friend and I talked about this in school, wondering<BR>
where 1-3 where and if they where going to be released.<BR>
<BR>
I have a friend that says he saw a showing where it had Luke watching the<BR>
battle in space through his binoculars (for a lack of a name).  I never saw<BR>
that release but there was an image on my "Star Wars Story" album from what<BR>
had to be that scene.  If he did see it then it makes you wonder how long<BR>
that release was being shown.<BR>
<BR>
- -Brian T. Simmons<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Russell Bornschlegel <kaleja@estarcion.com><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 15:55<BR>
Subject: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> I did some checking with some other disreputable sources about this<BR>
Episode<BR>
> IV thing. While these references are not necessarily conclusive, I think<BR>
we<BR>
> should all keep in mind the fallibility of our 20-year-old memories of the<BR>
> original theatrical release...<BR>
><BR>
> From the rec.arts.sf.movies FAQ:<BR>
> > (And by the way, the first STAR WARS film was originally released as<BR>
> > just "STAR WARS"; it was only in re-release that it was entitled "STAR<BR>
> > WARS EPISODE IV: A NEW HOPE", although it is subject to many a<BR>
> > heated discussion when exactly the title was amended. The other two<BR>
> > were always labeled "EPISODE  V" and "EPISODE VI.")<BR>
><BR>
> From the Internet Movie Database Trivia List:<BR>
> > - The episode number and subtitle ``A New Hope'' did not originally<BR>
appear in<BR>
> >   the film's opening crawl. These were added in a later re-release to be<BR>
> >   consistent with those seen in _The Empire Strikes Back (1980)_ (qv).<BR>
><BR>
> From the Star Wars FAQ at http://home.swipnet.se/~w-22083/base/faq.htm<BR>
> > Q 001:   Why does it say Episode IV in the scroll-text at the beginning<BR>
> >          of Star Wars, Episode V in The Empire Strikes Back and Episode<BR>
> >          VI in Return of the Jedi?  Did the Episode IV sub-head appear<BR>
> >          in the original theatrical release or was it added at a later<BR>
> >          date?<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Answer:  The Star Wars saga as originally conceived by Lucas was much<BR>
> >          too large to be made into a single film or even a single<BR>
> >          trilogy so Lucas structured his ideas into three trilogies.<BR>
> >          He decided to make the middle trilogy (Episodes IV, V and VI)<BR>
> >          first because he believed it had the greatest chance of being<BR>
> >          a theatrical success.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >          An interesting point is that the "Chapter IV: A New Hope"<BR>
> >          sub-title did not appear until the 1979 re-release of the<BR>
movie.<BR>
> >          Randal Schwartz (merlyn@romulus.reed.edu) says the following<BR>
> >          about the '79 release:<BR>
> ><BR>
> >             That was the one with the extended trailer for ESB, which<BR>
> >             came out the following summer.  So the order was:<BR>
> ><BR>
> >                     summer of '77: SW [no IV]<BR>
> >                     summer of '78: re-release of SW [no IV]<BR>
> >                                    (but Westgate was still playing it)<BR>
> >                     summer of '79: retitled SW IV, with ESB trailer<BR>
> >                     summer of '80: ESB<BR>
> ><BR>
> >             The reference to "Westgate" was that the Westgate theatre<BR>
> >             (just a few blocks from where I am typing this) was *still*<BR>
> >             playing it.  They set the record worldwide for the longest<BR>
> >             continuous run for SW [sans IV], something like 79 weeks.<BR>
> >             So, naturally, it wasn't a "re-release" for summer of '78.<BR>
> >             (We web-footed Oregonians see a *lot* of movies. :-)<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 21:45:05 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Charismatic Governments<BR>
<BR>
At 15:39 -0400 2/5/00, "Matt Stevens" <mfs10@columbia.edu> wrote:<BR>
>Hi, I wrote an article called "Charismatic Governments" which appeared in this<BR>
>week's<BR>
>JTAS. (It's funny, I didn't even know the article was accepted until I logged<BR>
>on...)<BR>
<BR>
That's the usual way! ;-)<BR>
<BR>
>I was wondering whether to write other articles on governments in <BR>
>the Traveller<BR>
>universe, but first I thought I'd ask for your feedback. Did you find the CG<BR>
>article<BR>
>a crashing bore? Were there parts that really annoyed you? Would you have<BR>
>prefered a different approach, or do you find the topic a waste of <BR>
>time? (Don't<BR>
>worry, I can take criticism.)<BR>
<BR>
I liked it (and the fact it was CT/MT/T4/TNE genus not GT made it <BR>
more enjoyable because I wasn't reading it in a foreign language).<BR>
<BR>
It's a shame we didn't have space for some stuff like this in 101 <BR>
Governments - I read it and learnt a little more...<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 21:42:02 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: re: Real Turret Mounted Lasers [slightly OT]<BR>
<BR>
At 15:39 -0400 2/5/00, Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu> wrote:<BR>
>It turns out two of my friends that have just graduated Cornell are working<BR>
>on this thing at two totally different companies.  Apparently nearly every<BR>
>major Air Force contractor is doing something for this.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Spending money?<BR>
<BR>
;-)<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 13:54:57 -0800<BR>
From: Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: More Far Trader Type stuff<BR>
<BR>
Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com> wrote<BR>
<BR>
> Peter Newman <pnewman@gci.net> wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > No it's not. Managing cash flow is crucial to the success of<BR>
> > any business. Many manufacturers can not afford to engage in<BR>
> > speculative trade, they need to be sure of getting payment<BR>
> > of a certain amount now. <BR>
> <BR>
> But this is the Third Imperium, where surveying a planet's population <BR>
> and governmental structure every few hundred years is considered an<BR>
> accurate way to do things... every manufactured good you can probably<BR>
> imagine has probably had its interplanetary distribution channels set<BR>
> up for several centuries at least. It seems pretty reasonable to imagine <BR>
> that there are distributors who handle the distribution of good across<BR>
> multiple systems without the uncertainty of looking for someone to <BR>
> carry the cargo speculatively.<BR>
<BR>
Why is this a reasonable assumption? Economic realities haven't<BR>
really changed only the details have changed. One of those realities<BR>
is the time value of money: Some money now may be better than more<BR>
money later - how much depends on  the value of money.<BR>
<BR>
> > When a ship owner sells goods they<BR>
> > get paid right away. When a business owner has their goods sold<BR>
> > on another planet they have to wait for the money to be jumped<BR>
> > back. In the meantime they've got suppliers to pay, rent to pay,<BR>
> > employee's to pay. Letting these payments wait while they wait<BR>
> > for a speculative return on another planet is not an ideal<BR>
> > business plan.<BR>
> <BR>
> In the steady state, sure it is. Here on Earth, we have 30, 60 or 120 day<BR>
> (or what have you) terms of payment. <BR>
<BR>
Maybe for products but mortgages, rent and wages here (and in <BR>
the OTU at least for starships and starship crew) are typically<BR>
paid monthly. Say you make some widgets and decide to ship them<BR>
to another planet as cargo, have them sold their, and have the <BR>
money shipped back to you.<BR>
<BR>
Moreover to maximize profit the question of longest terms <BR>
is irrelevant the question is what the short term is and <BR>
how much of a discount you get for it. To use a real RPG <BR>
industry example suppose our company has to pay on terms of <BR>
56/60 + 9/13. This means that their base discount is 56% off <BR>
(paid within 60 day) and they offer a further (9% (off of the <BR>
56% not off of 100%) on invoices paid within 13 days. Say one <BR>
of this companies game sells for $22.95 US retail. <BR>
<BR>
The distributor pays 10.10 per copy (actually they<BR>
pay 10.098 per copy but we'll ignore the extra 0.2 cent) <BR>
(22.95 * (1 - 0.56)) = 10.098) If they choose to pay on 13 day<BR>
terms they pay (22.95 * (1 - 0.56) * (1 - 0.09)) = 9.189<BR>
(rounds up to 9.19) per copy.<BR>
By paying on shortest terms our distributor has just saved<BR>
(10.10 - 9.19) $0.91 per copy. If our distributor could make<BR>
a 5% annual profit before when they paid 10.10 per copy and sold<BR>
the product for 13.77 (a 40% discount to retailers, which is <BR>
also a common practice) then their total costs were <BR>
(13.77 * (1 - 0.05)) = 13.08 per copy sold. Profits per game<BR>
sold are $0.69<BR>
13.08 - 10.10 (cost of goods) = $2.98 in total costs per game sold. <BR>
Now when our firm chooses to start paying within 13 days costs <BR>
may go up slightly (since they have to hustle to get the check <BR>
in on time, or do a wire transfer, or send payment UPS Red Label, <BR>
etc) We will say costs go up 5%. Costs per unit sold are not<BR>
( 2.98 * 1.05) = 3.13 per unit.<BR>
<BR>
They are now paying 9.19 per copy and their costs to sell it are<BR>
3.13. They are still selling each copy for 13.77. Therefore<BR>
the profit per game sold has gone up to $ 1.45 per copy.<BR>
(13.77 - (9.19 + 3.13)) = 1.45<BR>
<BR>
By paying on best terms our companies profits have gone up <BR>
over 110% to 10.5% per year. Assuming our distributorship sells<BR>
$500,000 (wholesale) worth of games per year profits have <BR>
just rose $27,500 per year. All from paying on best terms.<BR>
<BR>
Rounding all times to (my perception of) the nearest day that<BR>
is likely to be probable.<BR>
<BR>
Scenario One: Cargo<BR>
Day 1 Goods roll off of assembly line or arrive from<BR>
the manufacturer<BR>
Day 2 Goods arrive on board starship, starship departs<BR>
Day 3 Starship makes its way to jump point<BR>
Day 4 - 10 (maybe 9 or 11) Starship in Jump<BR>
Day 11 Starship makes its way from jump point to market<BR>
Day 12-17 Goods are sold<BR>
(We will go with day 15 as a simplifying assumption.)<BR>
Day 16 payment is put on another starship, starship departs<BR>
Day 17 Starship makes its way to jump point<BR>
Day 18 - 24 (maybe 23 or 25) Starship in Jump<BR>
Day 25 Starship makes its way from jump point to planet<BR>
Day 26 Owner is paid.<BR>
<BR>
While we may be able to trim a day or three off of this<BR>
scenario it is more likely to take more than 26 days <BR>
than less.<BR>
<BR>
Scenario Two: Speculative Trade<BR>
Day 1 Goods roll off of assembly line or arrive from the manufacturer.<BR>
Day 2 - 7 Goods are sold and payment is received.<BR>
(We will say Day 5).<BR>
<BR>
In scenario two you can pay on best terms. In scenario<BR>
one you can not. Therefore you have to be sure that speculative<BR>
trade will (after deducting all costs such as brokers fees)<BR>
at least double your money or you are better off simply selling<BR>
your goods to the ship owner and letting her make the speculative<BR>
trade.<BR>
<BR>
> In the Third Imperium, maybe it's<BR>
> 4 week, 6 week or 8 week terms - 8 week is 4 jumps by Xboat both ways, <BR>
> or 8 jumps one way, which handles direct payments for a fairly wide <BR>
> area of space. The Imperium is probably quite used to the slow pace of <BR>
> communications, but that only affects latency, not the total throughput <BR>
> of communication, commerce, etc. After the nearly 3 (4?) thousand years <BR>
> of the combined 3 Imperia, I feel pretty sure they'd have worked out<BR>
> something better than speculative trade for the bulk of their commerce.<BR>
<BR>
If your theory is that since the Imperium has a more languid<BR>
economy than is typical here the typical terms they offer might<BR>
be different you may be right. If typical terms in the Imperium<BR>
were say 56/120 + 1/30 then the analysis would be quite different.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 09:56:27 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
On 2 May 00, at 5:01, Veskrashen wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
> > <BR>
> > Veskrashen wrote:<BR>
> > > 1) Would a plasma cannon running on batteries need an accumulator?<BR>
> > > Would the discharge rate matter?<BR>
> > An accumulator would be needed, since batteries don't give you the<BR>
> > energy you require quickly enough. The discharge rate doesn't matter.<BR>
> > Providing the required energy for one shot every sixth second does *not*<BR>
> > mean that you can give that energy over a period of six (or five, or<BR>
> > four) seconds and get the same result as if all the energy was given "at<BR>
> > once."<BR>
> <BR>
> Yes, but starting at TL9 you can build a battery with a discharge rate of<BR>
> .0036 seconds. How much more istantaneous do you need to get? And how much<BR>
> slower is this than the combustion rate of an EPC (which doesn't require<BR>
> an accumulator)? <BR>
<BR>
In FFS1 they do, and it costs a bit more than a normal one.<BR>
<BR>
At least in the playtest PDF of FFS2 that I'm using<BR>
> doesn't require them for either version, DEI or EPG. Which is good,<BR>
> because an accumulator for the 62.5KJ carbine I designed would weigh<BR>
> 8.75kg for the DEI model, 6.75kg for the EPG. On the other hand, a<BR>
> .0036sec discharge rate battery of .0875MW capacity only weighs 5.6g. A<BR>
> magazine containing 100 of these, with a 200pin connector as an interface,<BR>
> could use each battery individually to produce 100 shots of .0625MJ<BR>
> intensity, with no real limitation on rate of fire (other than recoil).<BR>
> The feul required would only be .00125m3, weighing 87.5g. <BR>
<BR>
For lasers and High Energy Weapons the EPGs don't need accumulators <BR>
because they are lasing or discharging plasma directly, not producing <BR>
electricity.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 10:03:03 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
On 2 May 00, at 16:32, Brian T. Simmons wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I know that I cannot lay this to rest but I have to give my input.  I was<BR>
> twelve was I finely convinced my Dad that the lines for Star Wars were not<BR>
> to long to go see the movie. At the time, it was showing at only one<BR>
> theater in the Dallas area, but finely I saw it.<BR>
> <BR>
> The reason I know I did not see Episode IV is because a time later when<BR>
> another theater, (closer to my house) got the film, I went again.  This<BR>
> time as the music climaxed and the text started its crawl up the screen I<BR>
> was saying to myself, "Episode IV, where did that come from?  That was not<BR>
> there before."  Many of my friend and I talked about this in school,<BR>
> wondering where 1-3 where and if they where going to be released.<BR>
> <BR>
> I have a friend that says he saw a showing where it had Luke watching the<BR>
> battle in space through his binoculars (for a lack of a name).  I never<BR>
> saw that release but there was an image on my "Star Wars Story" album from<BR>
> what had to be that scene.  If he did see it then it makes you wonder how<BR>
> long that release was being shown.<BR>
<BR>
I seem to recall that scene from when I first saw it, too. I was almort <BR>
7 and I managed to con my parents into taking me with them, and was the <BR>
first person in my school to see it. I saw it again about 3 weeks later <BR>
on my birthday. And no I can't tell you whether it had "Episode IV" or <BR>
not, but it was the initial release.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 16:01:41 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Computer use in jumpspace<BR>
<BR>
IMTU, computers come in four main types - handheld personal systems,<BR>
larger dedicated systems such as machine control, guidance or security<BR>
systems, ship-standard systems and the really big planetary systems<BR>
that things like the subsector library data normally sit on. Costings<BR>
go (in order) cheap, pricey, expensive and extortionate.<BR>
<BR>
Normally, that means a ship will have one computer - usually only just<BR>
big enough to run the ship. It should have enough spares to keep it<BR>
going, but never enough for extra processing power. Once I've dumped<BR>
Navigation and Jumpdrive programs from the system, I usually load an<BR>
Anti-Hijack, Astrogation and (if I'm lucky) have enough space left for<BR>
Gunnery control. Yeah - I like the CT computer rules and have more or<BR>
less stuck with them.<BR>
<BR>
What that means is that if I wanted to do something like data<BR>
processing I would either get a dedicated system to run it on, link up<BR>
a lot of pocket computers or - if I was really desperate - dump some<BR>
of my ship systems out of the computer for it. Either way, it is no<BR>
trivial task and carries a fair amount of risk (especially if its my<BR>
ship and I'm carrying passengers who could go for a hijack...).<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of<BR>
> Joe Lachance<BR>
> Sent: 01 May 2000 18:38<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Computer use in jumpspace<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> In the campaign I'm running the player characters have<BR>
> a need to harness shipboard computing power to chug<BR>
> through a rather large dataset. As best I can tell traditional<BR>
> craft have three computer systems: primary, backup, and<BR>
> a dedicated jump computer (note: I do not have a copy of<BR>
[snip]<BR>
> This opens up the question of how jump engines interact with the<BR>
> manifold of jumpspace in in Traveller.  My gut feeling is that<BR>
> once a ship's jump grid is energized and it enters jump-space<BR>
> the 'trajectory' of the next week is one that is not actively<BR>
> changed (by computer use or astrogation).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 15:18:12 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
<BR>
I'm missing two early ones (already on order) and the last two.<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Frank G.<BR>
> Pitt<BR>
> Sent: 01 May 2000 06:46<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: RE: The Winds of Gath, Chapter 1, Section 1.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> > On Behalf Of Mark Preston<BR>
> > Well, I have *most* of the series - yes, I admit to being<BR>
> one of those<BR>
> > SF buffs that buy whole collections by particular authors<BR>
> - but if I<BR>
> > wrote any more of it down, I'd risk cramp in an essential wrist as<BR>
> > well as being sued for infringement of copyright. But the<BR>
> books are<BR>
> > very good (except possibly for the four I'm missing...)<BR>
><BR>
> What are ya missing Mark ?<BR>
> I'll keep an eye out for ya.<BR>
><BR>
> Frankly, I find them the SF equivalent of the "Nick Carter"<BR>
>  or "Punisher",.<BR>
> er sorry "Executioner" novels.<BR>
><BR>
> Plot of all of them is basically :<BR>
> "Amazingly good guy gets laid in every planet/country/town<BR>
> he visits while<BR>
> slightly furthering meta-plot and surviving danger d'jpour"<BR>
><BR>
> That being said, they are still fun and great sources for Traveller<BR>
> inspiration.<BR>
><BR>
> Heck, my first Trav game included the baddies from<BR>
> Dumarest, except I<BR>
> decided that there was no way such a secret could have been<BR>
> kept away from<BR>
> the Impies, so I decided the CyClan(?) were the<BR>
> intelligence arm of the<BR>
> Zhodani on the Fringes.<BR>
><BR>
> Frankie<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2388<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2389</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
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Traveller-digest        Tuesday, May 2 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2389<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
RE: Piloting Skill<BR>
Re: more design questions<BR>
Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
Re: Early Authors<BR>
RE: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Writing duty (was Re: Off list for a while)<BR>
Re: Piloting Skill<BR>
The Traveller Adventure Available<BR>
Re: Lanth<BR>
Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military <BR>
Re: more design questions<BR>
Fuel Cells (drafty gearhead stuff v1.x, longish)<BR>
Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
Request assistance.<BR>
Re: McCaffery<BR>
Star Wars<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 16:11:15 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
<BR>
Oh yes, there was fun to be had with the card chads (the little<BR>
square-ish bits of card that got punched out, for the information of<BR>
you poor young things out there). But nothing quite matches the fun of<BR>
frisbying write-rings from the tape reels at each other across the<BR>
machine room. I do remember one embarassing incident when I pulled out<BR>
a pack of 12" Winchesters from the drive before they had spun down to<BR>
a stop though. Nearly got me fired, that did, and boy did it make<BR>
everyone duck for cover!<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of<BR>
> Sword-Worlder<BR>
> Sent: 01 May 2000 15:16<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> ----- Original Message -----<BR>
> From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
> > And, my God, but weren't those 80 column card punch machines a<BR>
> > finger-twisting, wrist-wrenching utter pain to use. Better than<BR>
> > creasing up the end of your paper tape though.<BR>
><BR>
> The embedded numeric keypad was a bear to learn, but worked<BR>
> well once you<BR>
> got the hang of it.  I'm just glad to have had machines that allowed<BR>
> corrections before punching the cards.  I was forever<BR>
> double clicking the<BR>
> spacebar.  Another thing I remember; since I was a junior<BR>
> enlisted guy in my<BR>
> shop, I got the priviledge of emptying the confetti drawers<BR>
> and vacuuming<BR>
> the innards.  I should write a supplement: 101 Uses for Punched Card<BR>
> Confetti.  My personal favorite was tossing a handful onto<BR>
> some poor slob as<BR>
> he stepped out of the shower or down the back of a sweaty<BR>
> person.  They<BR>
> stick like glue and jab you with their little, pointy corners :-><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> ObTrav: What do his shipmates do to the practical joker who<BR>
> puts itching<BR>
> powder in the low berths?<BR>
><BR>
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
> Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
> www.downport.com<BR>
> The Traveller Domain<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 16:07:32 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Piloting Skill<BR>
<BR>
Consider this though Alex. Chances are you can drive a car. You may be<BR>
able to ride a motorbike as well, like me, but doing the one does not<BR>
teach you how to do the other (though it might help). You probably<BR>
can't drive a small truck, even less likely an 18-gear heavy goods<BR>
truck and I doubt very much you can drive a 30-foot high quarry-stone<BR>
wagon. Pilot skill is equivalent to the quarry truck, Ship's Boat to<BR>
the HGV truck, Grav. Vehicles to the light truck and so on. One may<BR>
help at the other, but does not count as the other.<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of<BR>
> Alex Ingram<BR>
> Sent: 01 May 2000 18:42<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Piloting Skill<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> I can understand that 'Ship's Boat' refers to the piloting<BR>
[snip about ship types and flying them]<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 08:07:17 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
<BR>
> From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
> Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
> Yes, but starting at TL9 you can build a battery with a discharge rate<BR>
> of .0036 seconds. How much more istantaneous do you need to get? And how<BR>
> much slower is this than the combustion rate of an EPC (which doesn't<BR>
> require an accumulator)? At least in the playtest PDF of FFS2 that I'm<BR>
> using doesn't require them for either version, DEI or EPG. Which is<BR>
> good, because an accumulator for the 62.5KJ carbine I designed would<BR>
> weigh 8.75kg for the DEI model, 6.75kg for the EPG.<BR>
<BR>
Dont think of it as extra mass, think of it as an investment in recoil<BR>
reduction.<BR>
<BR>
You've hit some of the problems with portable energy weapons under FFS2 - I<BR>
couldnt get them to work better than kinetic energy weapons at stellar tech<BR>
levels, and I dont like the idea of a universe of starships and 200 mm<BR>
cannon.<BR>
<BR>
You might want my completely unofficial rules for High Performance<BR>
Accumulators.<BR>
<BR>
Basically, FFS2 never got playtested - there was about a 3 week window<BR>
between the playtest release and the manuscript hitting the publisher (which<BR>
resulted in some really funky things, like really weird type arrows<BR>
replacing all the multiplication signs).<BR>
<BR>
> Sounds good to me. Picture this, then:<BR>
><BR>
> Unit of grav tanks moving through a city in support of a unit of<BR>
> augmented battle dress infantry. Defenders have "spotters" carrying EMF<BR>
> or optic designators (something unobtrusive). The designators carry<BR>
> ranging and speed estimation software. They also have an altimiter, GPS<BR>
> type inertial locator, and a gyro to determine azimuth and angle of<BR>
> where it's pointed. The spotter presses a button on the side of the<BR>
> unit, painting the target. He the states how much range to add, anywhere<BR>
> from 1cm to 10m if he needs to. He presses the trigger, all the info is<BR>
> packeted as a fire request and transmitted to a transceiver which<BR>
> carries it via landline to a 1MJ Meson gun with a 2m accelerator tunnel.<BR>
<BR>
I did this a while ago - it's the "Solution" class Battlefield Meson Gun.<BR>
Designed to solve things like grav tanks. You want bigger than a MJ btw -<BR>
something that small could be contained by fairly flimsy internal<BR>
partitions.<BR>
<BR>
The good news is that the design has absolutely no technological problems.<BR>
<BR>
The bad news is that it is so un-canon it isn't funny - battlefield meson<BR>
guns are TL15 in Striker, and 50 dton Meson Gun bays are likewise only<BR>
available at TL15 in High Guard.<BR>
<BR>
Such weapons would radically reshape the Traveller universe, and we dont<BR>
want that (for example, Marines would get Forward Observer skill rather than<BR>
Gun Combat etc).<BR>
<BR>
It's neat, but it isnt Traveller. I have suggested that a minimum limit of<BR>
50m for meson guns exist at TL11, reducing by 10m per TL.<BR>
<BR>
Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 17:23:28 -0700<BR>
From: "Matthew W. Helton" <mwhelton@cox-internet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
Let's hope Old George will give us those lost scenes from A New Hope in the<BR>
DVD release...The Spacebattle viewed by Luke, the parting conversation with<BR>
Biggs Darklighter, as well as the "longer" cantina scene.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 3:03 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> On 2 May 00, at 16:32, Brian T. Simmons wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> > I know that I cannot lay this to rest but I have to give my input.  I<BR>
was<BR>
> > twelve was I finely convinced my Dad that the lines for Star Wars were<BR>
not<BR>
> > to long to go see the movie. At the time, it was showing at only one<BR>
> > theater in the Dallas area, but finely I saw it.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > The reason I know I did not see Episode IV is because a time later when<BR>
> > another theater, (closer to my house) got the film, I went again.  This<BR>
> > time as the music climaxed and the text started its crawl up the screen<BR>
I<BR>
> > was saying to myself, "Episode IV, where did that come from?  That was<BR>
not<BR>
> > there before."  Many of my friend and I talked about this in school,<BR>
> > wondering where 1-3 where and if they where going to be released.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > I have a friend that says he saw a showing where it had Luke watching<BR>
the<BR>
> > battle in space through his binoculars (for a lack of a name).  I never<BR>
> > saw that release but there was an image on my "Star Wars Story" album<BR>
from<BR>
> > what had to be that scene.  If he did see it then it makes you wonder<BR>
how<BR>
> > long that release was being shown.<BR>
><BR>
> I seem to recall that scene from when I first saw it, too. I was almort<BR>
> 7 and I managed to con my parents into taking me with them, and was the<BR>
> first person in my school to see it. I saw it again about 3 weeks later<BR>
> on my birthday. And no I can't tell you whether it had "Episode IV" or<BR>
> not, but it was the initial release.<BR>
><BR>
> --<BR>
> "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
><BR>
> An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 18:32:52 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Early Authors<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-05-02 15:49:13 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< >But we should all cut the early authors some slack.  >><BR>
<BR>
As an early (and current) RPG author, I agree completely. :  )<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 16:46:47 -0600 <BR>
From: Jason Postma <JasonP@i-link.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
The stuff with the tugs seemed pretty kosher, but the 'scoop' on the<BR>
observatory made use of stasis fields to reinforce the major structural<BR>
members.  That involves the temporal retardation fields again.  <BR>
I believe radiation is mentioned as a hazard when the black hole drifts in<BR>
through the dome.  Beowulf Shaeffer wonders if he'll be able to have<BR>
children afterwards (of course, his girl's a Flatlander, and he isn't<BR>
cleared by Earth's Fertility boards anyway).<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com [mailto:shadow@krypton.rain.com]<BR>
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 3:28 AM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Anti Laser Loatings (was Re: surface area & heat radiation)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Of course, this is the same universe that features psionic mass detectors,<BR>
> indestructable starship hulls constructed from a single artificial<BR>
molecule,<BR>
> artificial gravity, reactionless thrusters, time-retardation fields,<BR>
> teleportation, hyperdrive, impact armor, forcefields, perfect anagathics,<BR>
> total conversion power sources (in certain tnuctipun relics), the<BR>
equipment<BR>
> to move quantum black holes, and artificial structures as large as the<BR>
> Earth's orbit.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, the gear for moving the Quantum black hole wasn't far out at<BR>
all. Perfectly feasible, if you found one. Of course there *is* the<BR>
matter of radiation shielding... :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 19:35:50 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
tim wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> Good for their day, indeed! Hah! :)<BR>
>> <BR>
>So I second you Seamans<BR>
<BR>
Thank you. At least every once in awhile somebody agrees with me. :)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 09:37:13 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Writing duty (was Re: Off list for a while)<BR>
<BR>
Qstor@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm getting married this Sat then heading to my honeymoon so I'll be gone for<BR>
> 10 days....I'll be unsubscribing for a while....Hope everyone is well and I<BR>
> look forward to talk of Classic traveller reprints and GT: A3 when I<BR>
> return...OH...and Lesbian Aslan Pirates ;)<BR>
<BR>
Hands up anyone who wants to write this one? Let's not see the same hands all the<BR>
time.<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 18:42:20 -0500<BR>
From: Alex Ingram <ingram@airmail.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Piloting Skill<BR>
<BR>
Mark Preston wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Chances are you can drive a car. You may be<BR>
> able to ride a motorbike as well, like me, but doing the one does not<BR>
> teach you how to do the other (though it might help). You probably<BR>
> can't drive a small truck, even less likely an 18-gear heavy goods<BR>
> truck and I doubt very much you can drive a 30-foot high quarry-stone<BR>
> wagon. Pilot skill is equivalent to the quarry truck, Ship's Boat to<BR>
> the HGV truck, Grav. Vehicles to the light truck and so on. One may<BR>
> help at the other, but does not count as the other.<BR>
<BR>
Your point is well taken - knowledge of one vehicle type can give you a<BR>
leg up on<BR>
learning the other since many of the same tasks are simular. My question<BR>
relates to<BR>
the degree of dissimular tasks involved in flying a jet aircraft and<BR>
controlling a<BR>
space craft in a vacuum. Pilot astronauts are selected because they have<BR>
mastered<BR>
the complexities of atmospheric flight and their skills adaptation to the<BR>
mastery<BR>
of space manuever. These are two dissimular tasks so why not separate them<BR>
for<BR>
skills purposes. Is this unreasonable?<BR>
<BR>
Alex Ingram<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 18:57:20 -0500<BR>
From: William Barnett-Lewis <wlewis@mailbag.com><BR>
Subject: The Traveller Adventure Available<BR>
<BR>
Just in case anyone is looking for a copy - my FLUGS has a copy of the<BR>
Traveller Adventure in what I'd consider near mint condition for $15.00. If<BR>
you are interested the store is Alternate Realities in Madison, WI and can<BR>
be reached at altreal@chorus.net<BR>
<BR>
William <BR>
- -- <BR>
Live without fear; your Creator loves you     | William Barnett-Lewis<BR>
as a mother. Go in peace to follow the good   | mailto://wlewis@mailbag.com<BR>
road and may God's blessing be with           |<BR>
you always.                                   |<BR>
St. Claire                                    |<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 01:58:35 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: Lanth<BR>
<BR>
Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella writes:<BR>
<BR>
>At what date were the Sword Worlds at the heighth of power? A little more<BR>
>specifically, when did they hold the most systems? <BR>
<BR>
 -200           Most of the worlds within 4 parsecs of Gram have been settled<BR>
                by expeditions from Gram. [D:12]<BR>
   "            Tyrfing, Beater, Sacnoth, Excalibur, Hofud, Sting, Biter,<BR>
                Orcrist, Anduril, Durendal, Narsil, and Dyrnwyn settled. <BR>
                [JTAS18:17]<BR>
 -200           Gram, Joyeuse, Colada, Tizon, Hrunting, Tyrfing, Beater, <BR>
                Sacnoth, Excalibur, Hofud, Sting, Biter, Orcrist, Anduril, <BR>
                Durendal, Narsil and Dyrnwyn has been settled. [RS:32]<BR>
  300           Sword Worlds are divided into five interstellar realms:<BR>
                Cunnonic, Tizon, Hrunting, Margesi, Gungnir, Mjolnir, and<BR>
                Colada; Joyeuse, Gram, Tyrfing, Beater, Orcrist, Sacnoth, <BR>
                and Excalibur; Narsil and Anduril; Dyrnwyn, Durandal, and<BR>
                Hofud; and Sting, Biter, Iron, Bronze, Mithril, Wardn,<BR>
                Olympia, and Smoug. [TA:15]<BR>
  400           Imperial border touches Sword Worlds border. [T:11]<BR>
   "            Sword Worlds are divided into nine interstellar states:<BR>
                Cunnonic, Tizon, Hrunting, and Margesi; Mjolnir, Colada,<BR>
                Joyeuse, and Gram; Gungnir; Narsil and Anduril; Orcrist and<BR>
                Excalibur; Sacnoth and Tyrfing; Dyrnwyn and Durendal; <BR>
                Beater, Hofud, and Sting; and Biter, Iron, Bronze, Mithril,<BR>
                and Steel. [TA:15]<BR>
  500           Sword Worlds are divided into eight interstellar states:<BR>
                Cunnonic and Tizon; Hrunting, Margesi, Mjolnir and Gungnir;<BR>
                Colada and Joyeuse; Gram, Tyrfing, Beater, and Excalibur;<BR>
                Narsil, Anduril, and Orcrist; Sacnoth; Dyrnwyn, Durendal, <BR>
                Hofud, Sting, and Biter; and Iron, Bronze, Mithril, and <BR>
                Steel. [TA:15]<BR>
<BR>
  589           Sword Worlds are divided into five interstellar states:<BR>
                Cunnonic, Tizon, Hrunting, Margesi, Mjolnir, and Gungnir;<BR>
                Colada, Joyeuse, Gram, and Tyrfing; Narsil, Anduril, <BR>
                Orcrist, Excalibur, Sacnoth, and Beater; Dyrnwyn, Durendal,<BR>
                and Hofud; and Sting, Biter, Iron, Bronze, Mithril, and<BR>
                Steel. [SMC:14]<BR>
   "            When 1FW begins Sword Worlds unite to create one ruling<BR>
                government under the control of the Sword Worlds Navy. [D:14]<BR>
  593           Sword Worlds invade Entropic Worlds. [RS:30, D:14]<BR>
  604           Sword Worlds plus the Entropic worlds are one state. [SMC:14] <BR>
   "            Sacnoth dominate restablished as the Second Dominate. [RS:32]<BR>
   "            Reestablishment of Sacnoth Dominate, called by historians the<BR>
                Second Dominate. This government incorporates the conquered<BR>
                Darrian worlds. [JTAS18:17]<BR>
<BR>
  620           2FW ends. [RS:22]<BR>
   "            Hrunting, Tizon, Colada, Mjolnir, Joyeuse, Gungnir, Dyrnwyn,<BR>
                Durendal, Hofud, and Biter temporarily occupied by the <BR>
                Imperium. [RS:32,45]<BR>
   "            Margesi, Hrunting, Tizon, Colada, Mjolnir, Joyeuse, Gungnir, <BR>
                Dyrnwyn, Durendal, Hofud, and Biter temporarily occupied by <BR>
                the Imperium. Occupation lasts for 5 years. [JTAS18:13-14]<BR>
   "            Imperial military forces occupy 12 worlds of Second Dominate.<BR>
                [JTAS18:17]<BR>
621-626         Imperial military forces occupy 12 worlds of Second Dominate.<BR>
                [JTAS18:17]<BR>
  621           Imperial troops occupy selected Sword Worlds. [T:16]<BR>
  625           Imperial occupation of occupied Sword Worlds ends. [JTAS18:14]<BR>
  698           Second Dominate overthrown by Gram coalition. <BR>
                [RS:32; JTAS18:17]<BR>
  788           War between Darrians and Sword Worlds. Darrians retake <BR>
                Entropic Worlds. Gram Coalition falls, is replaced by Tri-<BR>
                lateral Alliance of Narsil, Sacnoth and Durendal. [RS:30,32]<BR>
   "            War between Darrians and Sword Worlds. Darrians retake <BR>
                Terant 340, Torment, Trifuge and Cunnonic. Gram Coalition <BR>
                falls, is replaced by Trilateral Alliance of Narsil, Sacnoth <BR>
                and Durendal. [LDNZ:23]<BR>
   "            Darrian War results in loss of the 4 Darrian worlds gained in<BR>
                604. Because of this, the Gram Coalition is replaced by the<BR>
                Trilateral Alliance of Narsil, Sacnoth and Durendal. <BR>
                [JTAS18:17]<BR>
  848           Trilateral Alliance breaks up. [RS:32] Interstellar anarchy<BR>
                returns (to the Sword Worlds). [JTAS18:17]<BR>
  852           Current Sword World government formed with capital at Gram.<BR>
                [RS:32; JTAS18:17] <BR>
   "            Sword Worlds Confederation formed with its capital at<BR>
                Joyeuse. [SMC:19]<BR>
  950           The Sword World government on Gram appoints a government for<BR>
                Enos. [TD17:21]<BR>
  979           Sword Worlds are split into two states [Civil War?]: Cunnonic,<BR>
                Tizon, Hrunting, Mjolnir, Gungnir, Colada, Joyeuse, Gram,<BR>
                Narsil, Anduril, Orcrist, and Excalibur; and Sacnoth, Tyrfing,<BR>
                Beater, Dyrnwyn, Durendal, Hofud, Sting, Biter, and the<BR>
                four metal worlds. [SMC:15]<BR>
  986           Gram seizes control of Sword World Confederation. [TD18:27]<BR>
   "            Sword Worlds plus Cunnonic, Margesi and Tavonni are one <BR>
                state. [SMC:15]<BR>
<BR>
  986           Coup by an anti-Imperial faction transfers capital of Sword<BR>
                Worlds Confederation from Joyeuse to Gram. [SMC:19]<BR>
 1082           Sword Worlds plus Cunnonic, Margesi, and Tavonni are one<BR>
                state. [SMC:15]<BR>
 1084           Sword Worlds retake Entropic Worlds. [RS:30]<BR>
   "            Sword worlds have lost Cunnonic, Margesi, and Tavonni, but <BR>
                has taken Winston, Entrope, and Anselhome. [SMC:15]<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 17:22:01 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: French Foreign Legion and other Military <BR>
<BR>
>From: j_pete@bellsouth.net (Pete)<BR>
<BR>
>Ah yes, that's the book. Was I right about the picture? <BR>
>It's been something like ten years since I saw it at the <BR>
>library.<BR>
<BR>
You're right about the picture.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
http://im.yahoo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 20:53:19 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
><BR>
> Dont think of it as extra mass, think of it as an investment in recoil<BR>
> reduction.<BR>
<BR>
I tried that line on my wife, but she says I have invested too much in one<BR>
area, which over-exposes my assets.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 11:01:59 +1000<BR>
From: "Robert O'Connor" <robocon@ozemail.com.au><BR>
Subject: Fuel Cells (drafty gearhead stuff v1.x, longish)<BR>
<BR>
* Overview (how they work, sorta)<BR>
Fuel cells convert the energy of oxidation of a fuel directly to<BR>
electricity. Theoretically, such devices can be the most efficient<BR>
chemical power plants possible.<BR>
<BR>
They are similar in structure to a battery, with positive and negative<BR>
electrodes separated by an electrolyte solution.<BR>
Gaseous fuel is passed over the positive electrode, where it is ionised.<BR>
The positive ions move through the electrolyte to the negative<BR>
electrode. The electrons move through an external circuit and generate<BR>
a current.<BR>
At the negative terminal, fuel ions, oxygen and electrodes combine to<BR>
form water, carbon dioxide, or both, depending on the fuel :-<BR>
<BR>
Reaction   Maximum Theoretical Efficiency<BR>
H2 -> H2O          83%<BR>
CO -> CO2          91%<BR>
CH4 -> CO2 + H2O   93%<BR>
<BR>
The big problems in recent RW fuel cell research have been/are :-<BR>
- - developing fuel processors to efficiently convert larger hydrocarbons<BR>
and alcohols to methane, carbon monoxide and hydrogen ;<BR>
- - devising cheaper catalysts that will not be poisoned by activated<BR>
carbon species or impurities in the fuel (e.g. sulphur).<BR>
<BR>
* Developments by Tech Level<BR>
Fuel cells become possible at the same time as the battery (discovery<BR>
TTL 4 [e.g. William Groves, 1839AD], utilisation TTL 3 - limits are the<BR>
ability to isolate and work platinum, make carbon black, and prepare and<BR>
store hydrogen).<BR>
<BR>
These early devices are alkaline fuel cells, relying on an electrolyte<BR>
of concentrated sodium or potassium hydroxide, and were used in the US<BR>
space program.<BR>
<BR>
Regenerative systems, where some external power source<BR>
(e.g. solar or nuclear) is used to electrolyse water back to hydrogen<BR>
and oxygen, are investigated for use in long-duration space missions or<BR>
other isolated facilities.<BR>
<BR>
With developments in materials science, improved electrodes and<BR>
catalysts become available, leading to increases in power density.<BR>
Cells are initially classified according to electrolyte type :-<BR>
<BR>
Electrolyte         Operating temperature  Comments<BR>
Polymer electrolyte 60-100C                High power density possible<BR>
Alkaline            90-100C                "<BR>
Phosphoric Acid     170-200C               Low specific power, but<BR>
                                           up to 85% efficiency with<BR>
                                           steam cogeneration<BR>
Molten Carbonate    600-1000C              Best candidate for burning<BR>
                                           hydrocarbons (e.g. gasoline)<BR>
Solid Oxide         600-1000C              Theoretical efficiency 60%<BR>
<BR>
A breakthrough at TTL 8 is the development of cells that directly use<BR>
methanol and methane. These are initially about 40% efficient,<BR>
comparable to heat engines ; but they are very expensive to construct.<BR>
<BR>
By the late TTL 9 period, advances in catalysis technology and chemical<BR>
engineering lead to the development of fuel cells that can use<BR>
reformulated gasoline (aka high-grade hydrocarbon distillates) with<BR>
the same efficiency as methanol/methane cells.<BR>
'Multifuel' systems, capable of using any of the commonly available<BR>
liquid fuels, are available by TTL 10.<BR>
<BR>
Further advancements in the technology aim mainly at increasing cell<BR>
energy density (power out per unit volume).<BR>
<BR>
* Charts for FF&S<BR>
TTL  Power  MinSize  Fuel (efficiency, type, L/MW-h)<BR>
4    0.05   0.2      0.25, H2, 1028572<BR>
5    0.08   0.2      0.4, LH2, 107142.5   <BR>
6    0.1    0.1      0.6, LH2, 71428.3<BR>
7    0.2    0.03     0.65, LH2, 65933.8<BR>
8    0.4    0.01     0.65, LH2, 65933.8 ; 0.4, MeOH/CH4, 5770/8450<BR>
9    0.6    0.01     0.7, LH2, 61224.3, 0.5 ; MeOH/CH4, 4616/6760 ;<BR>
                     0.4, HGHCD, 2500<BR>
10   1.0    0.01     0.8, LH2, 53571.25 ; 0.6, MeOH/CH4, 3846.7/5633.3; <BR>
                     0.5, HGHCD, 2000<BR>
12   1.2    0.01     LH2, 0.65, MeOH/CH4, 3550.8/5200 ; <BR>
                     0.6, HGHCD, 1666.7<BR>
14   1.5    0.001    LH2, 0.7, MeOH/CH4, 3297.1/4828.6 ; <BR>
                     0.65, HGHCD, 1538.5<BR>
16   2.0    0.001    LH2, 0.8, MeOH/CH4, 2885/4225 ; 0.8, HGHCD, 1250<BR>
<BR>
Power MW/m3, min size in m3 (below this volume, power density is 0.1<BR>
that stated). All units have a density of 1 tonne/m3 and cost<BR>
0.02MCr/m3.<BR>
Efficiency : % of fuel chemical energy converted to electricity<BR>
MeOH = methanol, CH4 = methane, see tables below.<BR>
HGHCD = high grade hydrocarbon distillate (assumed to be equivalent to<BR>
diesel fuel in energy density).<BR>
<BR>
Oxidiser multiplier<BR>
For each volume of fuel, the minimum volume of LOX required is :-<BR>
Fuel    Multiplier<BR>
LH2     0.5<BR>
MeOH    1.22<BR>
CH4     1.13<BR>
EtOH    1.8<BR>
HGHCD   3.5*<BR>
<BR>
The density of LOX is 1.15g/cc. EtOH = ethanol.<BR>
* Assumes high grade hydrocarbon distillate has an average chain<BR>
length of 9, and is fully saturated.<BR>
<BR>
Energy densities for some fuels :-<BR>
Type     MJ/kg MJ/L   density   Fuel Rate (L/MW-h, 100% eff)<BR>
Diesel    40    36     0.9       1000<BR>
EtOH      27    21.3   0.8       1690<BR>
MeOH      19.7  15.6   0.8       2308<BR>
CH4       24.2  10.6   0.436     3380    <BR>
Hydrogen* 1.6	0.14   0.0875    257143<BR>
LH2	  12	0.84   0.07      42857<BR>
<BR>
density in g/cc<BR>
*gas at zero C<BR>
<BR>
Constructive criticism (including "We don't need this stuff on this list<BR>
as vehicle design is a sorted issue, so there!") welcome.<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor<BR>
Medico, Gamer<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 21:05:03 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
<BR>
Now you've done it!  Giving me flashbacks.  Ever do any degaussing?  (run<BR>
the mag tape on the magnet machine a half-dozen times, yippee)  Afterward I<BR>
had the fun of stripping the tape off of the reels and cutting it up.  Now<BR>
_that_ was fun.  If you spun the reel and tossed it across the lab it would<BR>
roll back to you, all the while leaving tape everywhere.  One time I was<BR>
working with two at once, throwing one then the other and trying to keep up.<BR>
About then my Chief walked in.  He just shook his head and left.  There was<BR>
about two thousand feet of mag tape all over the floor, so he could tell<BR>
that I was doing my job :-)<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
> Oh yes, there was fun to be had with the card chads (the little<BR>
> square-ish bits of card that got punched out, for the information of<BR>
> you poor young things out there). But nothing quite matches the fun of<BR>
> frisbying write-rings from the tape reels at each other across the<BR>
> machine room. I do remember one embarassing incident when I pulled out<BR>
> a pack of 12" Winchesters from the drive before they had spun down to<BR>
> a stop though. Nearly got me fired, that did, and boy did it make<BR>
> everyone duck for cover!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 18:31:33 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Request assistance.<BR>
<BR>
>From: red@europa.com<BR>
><BR>
>If any one knows of any canon information on the planet<BR>
>Jenghe/Regina (or just any info period), could you PLEASE <BR>
>drop me a line (on or off  list)?  I have been trying to<BR>
>find information other than the UWP to no avail, and I've <BR>
>looked in CT, MT, and Gurps as well.  The only thing I <BR>
>haven't been able to get my hands on (other than Journal <BR>
>articles and the like) is the Grand Survey, but I'm not <BR>
>sure even  that has anything on Jenghe.<BR>
<BR>
The two Megatraveller computer games -- both written,<BR>
though not coded, by Marc Miller, as I recall -- mention<BR>
Jenghe.  I don't recall how much detail they provide.  The<BR>
manuals for the games are full of background stuff like<BR>
names of worlds in the various systems, cities, etc.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 19:42:47 -0500<BR>
From: Jimmy Simpson <nimrod@santech.com><BR>
Subject: Re: McCaffery<BR>
<BR>
At 01:24 AM 5/2/00 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
>In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> > Actually, I found the ender-cycle, once one gets away from the first two,<BR>
> > is wonderful. And, aside from pern, McCaffree's novels present wonderful<BR>
> > characters and a consistant (if technologically unexplained) set of sci-fi<BR>
> > settings.<BR>
><BR>
>MacCaffrey seems to have several settings:<BR>
><BR>
>The ship/brawn universe (which *may* include Pern)<BR>
>The recent "Freedom's XXX" series<BR>
>The Rowan series (which seems to grow out her her old "Talent" stories<BR>
>the Doona series<BR>
>the one Restoree is set in<BR>
><BR>
>--<BR>
>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
>  shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
I believe that she has attempted to merge the Ship/Brawn series with the <BR>
Dinosaur Planet/Planet Pirate series.  At least I believe that they all <BR>
take place within the same Federation.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Jimmy Simpson<BR>
	nimrodd@fastlane.net<BR>
"Cannot say.<BR>
  Saying, I would know.<BR>
  Do not know.<BR>
  So cannot say."<BR>
		-Zathras (Babylon 5)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 21:47:15 EDT<BR>
From: GaryBartz@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Star Wars<BR>
<BR>
According to Newsweek, May 19, 1980,<BR>
Star Wars will be retitled in the credits as episode IV with the release of <BR>
Empire as number V<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2389<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Wednesday, May 3 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2390<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re SW Ep IV<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
archiving/old designs<BR>
Re: more design questions<BR>
Re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: more design questions<BR>
Re: more design questions<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
Re: McAffery<BR>
Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
RE: Salt in industry ?<BR>
RE: Off list for a while<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 18:58:12 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
>From: Ewan Quibell <E.D.Quibell@bton.ac.uk><BR>
>G'day y'allDose anyone know if there is a use for salt in<BR>
>any industrial processes? I'm doing a write up for a <BR>
>system which has a load of spear salt andI'd like to have <BR>
>them put it to good use.<BR>
<BR>
Do you mean Sodium Chloride?  That chemical is almost as<BR>
dangerous as Dihydrogen Monoxide!<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 19:11:10 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
<BR>
>From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
<BR>
>BTW if you're looking for a film which does court politics<BR>
<BR>
>quite well  (maybe applicable to Civil War Era Traveller) <BR>
>then have a look at  'Elizabeth', a recent release (last <BR>
>year) about the consolidation of  power by Queen Elizabeth<BR>
<BR>
>1st in the 1500's. I suspect chunks of it could be stolen<BR>
>for a court campaign.<BR>
<BR>
I just saw that last weekend with my girlfriend and her 14<BR>
year old daughter.  They were afraid that it would be too<BR>
much of a "girls' movie" for me, but I, having been a<BR>
history major (and having seen the Masterpiece Theater<BR>
miniseries with Glenda Jackson when I was a teenager) was<BR>
afraid that it would be too much of a "boyz' movie" for<BR>
them!  Anyway, I heartily second Dom's comment, and would<BR>
add (1) steal freely from history; that what it's for and<BR>
(2) remember that you don't have to limit court adventures<BR>
to the Imperial court -- every duke and baron has a court<BR>
and court politics.<BR>
<BR>
Did anyone else find that Elizabeth reminded them of The<BR>
Godfather?<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 22:01:36 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
>Umm.  Miniatures campaigns consist precisely of systems to decide what next<BR>
week's battle will be.  So do at least some boardgames.<<BR>
<BR>
But they don't need them to function. You can play miniatures week to week<BR>
without any campaign concern.<BR>
<BR>
>In fact, there was no obviously good reason why the first roleplaying game<BR>
had to have been a Tolkienoid fantasy game.  The elements were already<BR>
there:  semi-roleplaying miniatures campaigns, plus interesting<BR>
developments in historical skirmish games.  <<BR>
<BR>
There was the best reason for it: the creators wanted to play wizards! :-P<BR>
But actually this is correct, the first RPG could have been any genre, it<BR>
just happened to be fantasy.<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 19:17:44 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Ewan Quibell wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
>> ><BR>
>> > In mail you write:<BR>
>> ><BR>
>> > I think sulfur is the only "basic chemical" that's more important than<BR>
>> > salt.<BR>
>><BR>
>> So if you are a water world with a sulphur taint you are going to be<BR>
>> making money like you were growing it ....<BR>
>><BR>
>> Thanks Leonard, seems they might have a use for it after all, although<BR>
>> it might make the image of the backwater world I'm writing up seem a<BR>
>> little odd as they would probably be exporting it as fast as they can to<BR>
>> the nearest industrial world.<BR>
>><BR>
>> This list is great :-)<BR>
>><BR>
>> Now is it possible to have a desalination plant at TL 5 or 6 ?<BR>
>><BR>
>> Cheers<BR>
><BR>
> The only problem with htis process is lots and I mean LOTS of toxic waste.<BR>
> Organochlorides...deadly stuff...worse than Agent Orange. see the Neal<BR>
> Stephenson book Zodiac<BR>
<BR>
Problem with *what* process? <BR>
<BR>
The processing of salt I described has *no* "waste products". Or<BR>
rather, the "waste" products are actually valuable. You make HCl, and<BR>
the "waste product" is caustic soda. You make chlorine and the "waste<BR>
product" is sodium metal. <BR>
<BR>
And their "feedstock" is a small mountain of salt piled up next to the<BR>
plant. <BR>
<BR>
So either you are thinking of some other process, or the author of the<BR>
book you mention didn't do any research. <BR>
<BR>
Organo-chlorides are waste products from some *uses* of chlorine, not<BR>
from *producing* it. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 19:33:18 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> How about trying to use the machines of this era to run starships?<BR>
><BR>
> Captain: Computer, prepare jump calculations...<BR>
> Computer Officer: Sorry Cap'n, the punchcards are all on the floor and the<BR>
> tubes are blowing left and right...I have a pencil and some paper...'twould<BR>
> probably be faster...<BR>
> Captain:<<translator failure: 3 words>><BR>
> Translator: Captain! I'm shocked!<BR>
><BR>
> At least they are (probably) virus proof.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, I wouldn't be surprised to find out that electronic (or even<BR>
mechanical) analog computers may be better for some things of this<BR>
sort. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 19:34:57 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... (Was: Re: Looking for info)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>> -----Original Message-----<BR>
>> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
>>On Behalf Of Leonard Erickson<BR>
>><BR>
>> Looking over the set, I have to ask what you used for multiplaction,<BR>
>> since there's no "*".<BR>
><BR>
> He probably used what everyone else did, and what mathematicians have always<BR>
> used : 'x'<BR>
><BR>
> Using '*' for nmultiplication is a much later innovation.<BR>
<BR>
You can't. Operands can't be letters. Letters are identifiers.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 19:38:23 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Sword-Worlder wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> the innards.  I should write a supplement: 101 Uses for Punched Card<BR>
>> Confetti.  <BR>
><BR>
> I could write the book on "101 Uses for Punch Cards."  My favorite punch<BR>
> card story:<BR>
><BR>
> Vanderbilt University got a great deal on ordering punch cards with the<BR>
> university logo on the front...in bulk.  So the physics department<BR>
> ordered ten tons!  This was in the seventies.  Well they used up one ton<BR>
> of punch cards before they went out of style.  So that left me, the poor<BR>
> grad student in 1993, to get rid of the other nine tons.  They made<BR>
> furniture, notepads, bookmarks, doorstops, insulators...<BR>
><BR>
> ObTrav:  Too bad I couldn't have found some poor free trader to unload<BR>
> them on a low tech world.<BR>
<BR>
Ever see an IBM 96 column punchcard? They are about the size of a 3.5"<BR>
floppy, but more rectangular. I had a laugh when my bank put in ATMN<BR>
machines. They printed the receipts on 96 column punchcard stock! IBM<BR>
had "recycled" the paper handling tech. <BR>
<BR>
BTW, 80-column cards are the size they are because US *currency* used<BR>
to be that size, and thus they made the cards that size so they could<BR>
store them in cash drawers and the like. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 19:23:40 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>> The only problem with htis process is lots and I mean LOTS of toxic<BR>
>>> waste.  Organochlorides...deadly stuff...worse than Agent Orange.<BR>
>>> see the Neal Stephenson book Zodiac<BR>
<BR>
>> From the desalination process ? I don't have Zodiac, could you give<BR>
>> me a rundown of the process ?<BR>
<BR>
> I think I may have the wrong end of the stick...give me 12 hours to<BR>
> sleep and re read the book. I'll get back to you shortly. I know that<BR>
> the production of some industrial chemicals involves a)seawater and<BR>
> b) electricity...the producs are some chemicals (I forget which) and<BR>
> toxic waste...<BR>
<BR>
Sounds like magnesium production. But I don't see why that would<BR>
produce toxic waste either. <BR>
<BR>
Most of the nasty stuff comes from things like *producing*<BR>
organo-chlorides (mostly in oldstyle "bleaching" processes). <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 19:27:36 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> On 1 May 00, at 21:05, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> I think sulfur is the only "basic chemical" that's more important than<BR>
>> salt.<BR>
><BR>
> If sulfur/sulphur is so important why is the waste sulphur form coal <BR>
> plants just left in huge piles?<BR>
<BR>
I seriously doubt that it is. You sure that isn't slag piles? Sulfur is<BR>
*bright* yellow. Of course, it's also pretty cheap. <BR>
<BR>
Sulphur is motsly important for making sulphuric acid, which is used in<BR>
many processes, and is also used for making nitric acid (from<BR>
saltpeter). <BR>
<BR>
Getting back to the coal plants, the sulfur usually gets removed<BR>
*after* burning, by stack gas scrubbers. And the resulting sludge has<BR>
lots of really toxic crud in it, but not all that much *useful* sulfur.<BR>
(as opposed to sulfates and sulfides)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 19:36:31 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Oh yes, there was fun to be had with the card chads (the little<BR>
> square-ish bits of card that got punched out, for the information of<BR>
> you poor young things out there). But nothing quite matches the fun of<BR>
> frisbying write-rings from the tape reels at each other across the<BR>
> machine room. I do remember one embarassing incident when I pulled out<BR>
> a pack of 12" Winchesters from the drive before they had spun down to<BR>
> a stop though. Nearly got me fired, that did, and boy did it make<BR>
> everyone duck for cover!<BR>
<BR>
I'm the proud owner of a pair of 5 meg disk packs for an IBM 2311<BR>
drive. 14" diameter, 6 platters...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 20:23:00 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: healyzh@aracnet.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
<BR>
> I'm the proud owner of a pair of 5 meg disk packs for an IBM 2311<BR>
> drive. 14" diameter, 6 platters...<BR>
> -- <BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
<BR>
But are you using them?  I've got a 'home' computer that has DEC RL01 and<BR>
RL02 drives, with a bunch of diskpacks for each.  The RL01's are 5MB and the<BR>
RL02's are 10MB.  I trust them more than I'll trust a brand new 50GB HD from<BR>
the local computer store!  Though these are 14" single plater packs so<BR>
you've got me beat on the number of platters.<BR>
<BR>
And yes, I run the computer at home.<BR>
<BR>
				Zane<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 20:50:35 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: archiving/old designs<BR>
<BR>
I've definitely lost my old designs for TL8-9 surface-to-orbit craft.<BR>
So, (a) does any kind soul out there have copies?<BR>
(b) could someone provide more detail about TML archives? (I was sent a<BR>
ftp reference, but it doesn't work...and what I really need is a<BR>
partially-searchable<BR>
archive.)<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 21:00:58 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
<BR>
>You've hit some of the problems with portable energy weapons under FFS2 - I<BR>
>couldnt get them to work better than kinetic energy weapons at stellar tech<BR>
>levels, and I dont like the idea of a universe of starships and 200 mm<BR>
>cannon.<BR>
<BR>
This is inherited from FFS1, I should note; FFS2 didn't fix it, but didn't<BR>
really<BR>
make it worse. In both versions KEAP weapons beat fusion hands-down, portable<BR>
or vehicular.<BR>
<BR>
A couple of solutions occur to me. The fundamental mathematical problem is<BR>
that<BR>
KEAP damage is basically lineary with energy while energy weapon is<BR>
square root of energy, so eventually KEAP always wins. The only way to change<BR>
this<BR>
would be to change the equations.<BR>
<BR>
Alternatively, which I like, we could redefine fusion weapons so their exit<BR>
velocity is ~1000 km/s or so rather than 10km/s. This would make fusion<BR>
weapons<BR>
much better against rapidly-moving targets (like grav tanks) than KEAP<BR>
weapons,<BR>
which would explain their battlefield roll. It would even make them useful as<BR>
extreme-short-range spacecraft weapons. The velocity isn't ludicrous for a<BR>
plasma<BR>
at fusion temperatures...<BR>
<BR>
(In addition, one could change the scalings for fusion weapons a little;<BR>
almost by<BR>
definition, they produce more energy than went into them, so they should do<BR>
significantly more damage than plasma.)<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 20:35:55 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm wondering about the proto-humans that the ancients dispersed to the<BR>
> stars in 300,000 BC.<BR>
><BR>
> Would these humans even be recognizable as "earth" humans after that<BR>
> many years of evolution on alien worlds?<BR>
<BR>
Hit your local library and go to the Periodicals section. You want a<BR>
Scientific American from a few months back. The cover has a couple of<BR>
"caveman" types  on it and the caption "We were not alone". It covers<BR>
the current best estimates of how many species of "human" (and our<BR>
"ancestor" species) there were at various times.<BR>
<BR>
It turns out that 300,000 is only a *bit* early for the earliest<BR>
possible homo sapiens! So whatever Grandfather grabbed it *could* be<BR>
fairly close to us. also, not as much "evolution" as you might think<BR>
has happened since then.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 16:04:00 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
On 2 May 00, at 19:27, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> ><BR>
> ><BR>
> > On 1 May 00, at 21:05, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> >> I think sulfur is the only "basic chemical" that's more important than<BR>
> >> salt.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > If sulfur/sulphur is so important why is the waste sulphur form coal<BR>
> > plants just left in huge piles?<BR>
> <BR>
> I seriously doubt that it is. You sure that isn't slag piles? Sulfur is<BR>
> *bright* yellow. Of course, it's also pretty cheap. <BR>
> <BR>
> Sulphur is motsly important for making sulphuric acid, which is used in<BR>
> many processes, and is also used for making nitric acid (from saltpeter). <BR>
> <BR>
> Getting back to the coal plants, the sulfur usually gets removed<BR>
> *after* burning, by stack gas scrubbers. And the resulting sludge has lots<BR>
> of really toxic crud in it, but not all that much *useful* sulfur. (as<BR>
> opposed to sulfates and sulfides)<BR>
<BR>
I'm fairly sure that they're sulphur piles, though if it's cheap it <BR>
probably wouldn't take much in the way of impurities to make it <BR>
uneconomic to clean it up.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 16:09:45 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
<BR>
On 2 May 00, at 21:00, Bruce Macintosh wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >You've hit some of the problems with portable energy weapons under FFS2 -<BR>
> >I couldnt get them to work better than kinetic energy weapons at stellar<BR>
> >tech levels, and I dont like the idea of a universe of starships and 200<BR>
> >mm cannon.<BR>
> <BR>
> This is inherited from FFS1, I should note; FFS2 didn't fix it, but didn't<BR>
> really make it worse. In both versions KEAP weapons beat fusion<BR>
> hands-down, portable or vehicular.<BR>
> <BR>
> A couple of solutions occur to me. The fundamental mathematical problem is<BR>
> that KEAP damage is basically lineary with energy while energy weapon is<BR>
> square root of energy, so eventually KEAP always wins. The only way to<BR>
> change this would be to change the equations.<BR>
<BR>
I've got an altered FFS1 KEAP chart based on KE^1/2 if anyone wants it. <BR>
I did it up after deciding that 15cm mass drivers made fixed <BR>
fortifications too good.<BR>
<BR>
While we're at it the laser formula really should be fixed, too. I <BR>
never really liked the TL cap on discharge energy, and it would make <BR>
more sense to make all weapon penetrations work off the same system - <BR>
in this case energy^1/2.<BR>
<BR>
> Alternatively, which I like, we could redefine fusion weapons so their<BR>
> exit velocity is ~1000 km/s or so rather than 10km/s. This would make<BR>
> fusion weapons much better against rapidly-moving targets (like grav<BR>
> tanks) than KEAP weapons, which would explain their battlefield roll. It<BR>
> would even make them useful as extreme-short-range spacecraft weapons. The<BR>
> velocity isn't ludicrous for a plasma at fusion temperatures...<BR>
> <BR>
> (In addition, one could change the scalings for fusion weapons a little;<BR>
> almost by definition, they produce more energy than went into them, so<BR>
> they should do significantly more damage than plasma.)<BR>
<BR>
Before the errata they used to in FFS1. However they still sucked <BR>
compared to grenade launchers.<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 18:21:53 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
<BR>
Katharine Whitchurch wrote:<BR>
> You might want my completely unofficial rules for High Performance<BR>
> Accumulators.<BR>
> <BR>
> Basically, FFS2 never got playtested - there was about a 3 week window<BR>
> between the playtest release and the manuscript hitting the publisher (which<BR>
> resulted in some really funky things, like really weird type arrows<BR>
> replacing all the multiplication signs).<BR>
<BR>
I remember that FFS1 used HPGs and capacitors for nearly every DEI<BR>
energy weapon, and they were fairly light. I think even gauss weapons<BR>
included them. Of course, having lost most of my TNE stuff in a move, I<BR>
don't have the old HPG tables anymore. Any way to get a copy? Or at<BR>
least an older version of the design spreadsheets so I can come up with<BR>
the figures when I need them?<BR>
<BR>
<SNIP Meson Gun><BR>
<BR>
> It's neat, but it isnt Traveller. I have suggested that a minimum limit of<BR>
> 50m for meson guns exist at TL11, reducing by 10m per TL.<BR>
<BR>
That's pretty much what I'd figured. Got the same feeling when I<BR>
designed a meson sniper rifle under FFS1. <BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 18:26:57 -1000<BR>
From: Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching wrote:<BR>
> Call it a beam pointer or passive target designator. Your GPS satellites<BR>
> died before the bad guys achieved orbit and a laser designator is a big<BR>
> "over here" sign.<BR>
<BR>
Could it be done via optical recognition of a straight passive optical<BR>
image? I.E., the tank is this long, and takes up this ammount of the<BR>
viewable area, therefore...<BR>
<BR>
> Now do you realise why some people on the TML have campaigned for minimum<BR>
> sizes for Meson Guns?<BR>
<BR>
Didn't realize they had, though it makes sense.<BR>
<BR>
> Conclusion:<BR>
> Taking cities against determined opposition, especially those with<BR>
> decent technology, cost lots and lots of casualties.<BR>
<BR>
And unfortunately they generally have to be taken even if the cost has<BR>
to be paid. Worse still, collateral damage concerns make it difficult to<BR>
use traditional casualty limiters like arty. The point of my current<BR>
exercise is to get an idea of what sort of weapons and tactics would be<BR>
best in such an environment, both on the defense and on the offense. The<BR>
RFPC is one of the designs to come out of that.<BR>
<BR>
- -Ves.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 01:07:56 EDT<BR>
From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: McAffery<BR>
<BR>
>>MacCaffrey seems to have several settings:<BR>
>><BR>
>>The ship/brawn universe (which *may* include Pern)<BR>
>>The recent "Freedom's XXX" series<BR>
>>The Rowan series (which seems to grow out her her old "Talent" stories<BR>
>>the Doona series<BR>
>>the one Restoree is set in<BR>
>><BR>
>>--<BR>
><BR>
>I believe that she has attempted to merge the Ship/Brawn series with the <BR>
>Dinosaur Planet/Planet Pirate series.  At least I believe that they all <BR>
>take place within the same Federation.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
 Not that I recall, though the Crystal Singer books are, I believe, in common <BR>
with the Ship/Brawn and Pern stuff. One of the Pern prequels uses a <BR>
Ship/Brawn pair, as does either the second or third Crystal Singer book. I <BR>
haven't read the two (or is it now three?) most recent Ship/Brawn books, so I <BR>
don't know if more interconnects have been established...<BR>
<BR>
GC<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 22:46:39 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Tim Tow <t_pz_t@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
<BR>
Both of these megatraveller adventures are available<BR>
at the following link along with downloads of the text<BR>
documentation:<BR>
<BR>
http://underdogs.gamingdepot.com/Paragon.htm<BR>
<BR>
Has anyone played them through to the end?<BR>
<BR>
Tim<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
http://im.yahoo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 18:22:45 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Matt Bond<BR>
> > From: Jens Rydholm [mailto:jenry023@student.liu.se]<BR>
> ><BR>
> > All you need is salt water and sunlight. Pour the water on a<BR>
> > rock and let the<BR>
> > sunlight remove the water.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > If you don't have sunlight, boil salt water until the water<BR>
> > is gone. The salt<BR>
> > remains.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > In other words, TL-0 (or more) is required.<BR>
><BR>
> Actually, that is a saltpan and is indeed TL-0+. But far from being a<BR>
> desalination process, it is a dehydration one. You do not end up with<BR>
> separated potable water and salt (as you do in a desalination plant) as<BR>
> the water evaporates leaving just the salt. Fine if you only wanted the<BR>
> salt, but not so good if you are thirsty <g>.<BR>
<BR>
This is true, but it's easy to capture and condense the evapourated water.<BR>
You can do it, if neccessary, with just a piece of cloth held over the<BR>
water.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 18:24:40 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: Off list for a while<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Qstor@aol.com<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm getting married this Sat then heading to my honeymoon <BR>
<BR>
Congrats, have a good one !<BR>
<BR>
May your marriage last as long as Traveller !<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 09:59:03 +0100<BR>
From: Phil Kitching <postmark.design@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com> wrote:<BR>
>Phil Kitching wrote:<BR>
>> Call it a beam pointer or passive target designator. Your GPS satellites<BR>
>> died before the bad guys achieved orbit and a laser designator is a big<BR>
>> "over here" sign.<BR>
><BR>
>Could it be done via optical recognition of a straight passive optical<BR>
>image? I.E., the tank is this long, and takes up this ammount of the<BR>
>viewable area, therefore...<BR>
<BR>
or a pair of periscopes, placed so that the ends facing you are adjacent<BR>
and the<BR>
ends facing the target are far apart, then rotate the mirrors until the<BR>
images align.<BR>
<BR>
These have been around for years and are reasonably accurate over short<BR>
distances,<BR>
if a bit bulky. It might be possible to use some electronics to improve<BR>
accuracy<BR>
and reduce bulk.<BR>
<BR>
>> Now do you realise why some people on the TML have campaigned for minimum<BR>
>> sizes for Meson Guns?<BR>
><BR>
>Didn't realize they had, though it makes sense.<BR>
><BR>
>> Conclusion:<BR>
>> Taking cities against determined opposition, especially those with<BR>
>> decent technology, cost lots and lots of casualties.<BR>
><BR>
>And unfortunately they generally have to be taken even if the cost has<BR>
>to be paid. Worse still, collateral damage concerns make it difficult to<BR>
>use traditional casualty limiters like arty. The point of my current<BR>
>exercise is to get an idea of what sort of weapons and tactics would be<BR>
>best in such an environment, both on the defense and on the offense. The<BR>
>RFPC is one of the designs to come out of that.<BR>
<BR>
The simplest solution to a city is to blockade it and wait a year or two.<BR>
(Assuming near c rocks and nukes aren't available.)<BR>
<BR>
The collateral damage from street fighting is going to wreck your city anyway.<BR>
<BR>
It all depends on what you're trying to achieve.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching<BR>
- --<BR>
  http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>
  Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>
 "Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2390<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2391</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Wednesday, May 3 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2391<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Off list for a while<BR>
Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
Re: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Fuel Cells (drafty gearhead stuff v1.x, longish)<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: more design questions<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: more design questions<BR>
The Traveller Font<BR>
RE:Piloting Skills<BR>
Re: More design questions...<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Congrats!<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
Re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 04:31:51 -0500<BR>
From: Pete <j_pete@bellsouth.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Off list for a while<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 3 May 2000 18:24:40 +1200, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> On Behalf Of Qstor@aol.com<BR>
>> <BR>
>> I'm getting married this Sat then heading to my honeymoon <BR>
><BR>
>Congrats, have a good one !<BR>
><BR>
>May your marriage last as long as Traveller !<BR>
><BR>
>Frankie<BR>
<BR>
May Traveller outlive us all!!<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under heaven."<BR>
                                               -Ecclesiastes 3:1<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 23:52:32 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Salt in industry ?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>From: Ewan Quibell <E.D.Quibell@bton.ac.uk><BR>
>>G'day y'allDose anyone know if there is a use for salt in<BR>
>>any industrial processes? I'm doing a write up for a <BR>
>>system which has a load of spear salt andI'd like to have <BR>
>>them put it to good use.<BR>
><BR>
> Do you mean Sodium Chloride?  That chemical is almost as<BR>
> dangerous as Dihydrogen Monoxide!<BR>
<BR>
Nowhere near as bad as Oxygen. That stuff is *so* addictive that the<BR>
withdrawal symptoms will kill you in *minutes*.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 23:54:34 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>> I'm the proud owner of a pair of 5 meg disk packs for an IBM 2311<BR>
>> drive. 14" diameter, 6 platters...<BR>
<BR>
> But are you using them?  I've got a 'home' computer that has DEC RL01 and<BR>
> RL02 drives, with a bunch of diskpacks for each.  The RL01's are 5MB and the<BR>
> RL02's are 10MB.  I trust them more than I'll trust a brand new 50GB HD from<BR>
> the local computer store!  Though these are 14" single plater packs so<BR>
> you've got me beat on the number of platters.<BR>
><BR>
> And yes, I run the computer at home.<BR>
<BR>
Let me put it to you this way... I used to own the *drive* they went<BR>
in. It was the size of a washing machine. The heads were<BR>
*hydraulicaly* activated...<BR>
<BR>
I never got around to biulding an interface for it. The fact it<BR>
required 220v didn't help. Though looking back thru the manuals, I<BR>
noted that the data density was *probably* low enough that I could have<BR>
used a *floppy* controller chip!<BR>
<BR>
I originally bought the drive, manuals, and disk packs at a swap meet,<BR>
with the intent of trying to interface it with my old TRS-80...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 23:59:53 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Did anyone else find that Elizabeth reminded them of The<BR>
> Godfather?<BR>
<BR>
I haven't seen it yet. But even so, I feel safe in saying that the<BR>
"Virgin Queen" has a lot more class! And probably more chutzpah.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 00:01:20 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>Umm.  Miniatures campaigns consist precisely of systems to decide what next<BR>
> week's battle will be.  So do at least some boardgames.<<BR>
><BR>
> But they don't need them to function. You can play miniatures week to week<BR>
> without any campaign concern.<BR>
<BR>
Maybeso, but the one time one of my players who was a member of a<BR>
miniatures group invited a few of us over, they had the maps from some<BR>
SPI Napoleonic game tacked up on the wall, with magnetic unit markers<BR>
on it. <BR>
<BR>
As he explained it, they'd play at the strategic level unit units got<BR>
close enough, then they'd play at steadily more tactical levels until<BR>
either the units were going to contact, or definitely miss each other.<BR>
When contact came, they'd note the location and set up the sand table<BR>
to fight the battle later. <BR>
<BR>
They'd rented a small *house* for this. Members had keys and they'd<BR>
drop by to set stuff up between the announcement of the battle and the<BR>
night it was to be played out. Troop deployments were "secret" until<BR>
the night of the game, when they were placed on the sand table<BR>
according to sealed orders.<BR>
<BR>
If I recall correctly, they'd been doing this for *years*...<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 00:08:35 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Fuel Cells (drafty gearhead stuff v1.x, longish)<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> * Charts for FF&S<BR>
> TTL  Power  MinSize  Fuel (efficiency, type, L/MW-h)<BR>
> 4    0.05   0.2      0.25, H2, 1028572<BR>
> 5    0.08   0.2      0.4, LH2, 107142.5   <BR>
> 6    0.1    0.1      0.6, LH2, 71428.3<BR>
> 7    0.2    0.03     0.65, LH2, 65933.8<BR>
> 8    0.4    0.01     0.65, LH2, 65933.8 ; 0.4, MeOH/CH4, 5770/8450<BR>
> 9    0.6    0.01     0.7, LH2, 61224.3, 0.5 ; MeOH/CH4, 4616/6760 ;<BR>
>                      0.4, HGHCD, 2500<BR>
> 10   1.0    0.01     0.8, LH2, 53571.25 ; 0.6, MeOH/CH4, 3846.7/5633.3; <BR>
>                      0.5, HGHCD, 2000<BR>
> 12   1.2    0.01     LH2, 0.65, MeOH/CH4, 3550.8/5200 ; <BR>
>                      0.6, HGHCD, 1666.7<BR>
> 14   1.5    0.001    LH2, 0.7, MeOH/CH4, 3297.1/4828.6 ; <BR>
>                      0.65, HGHCD, 1538.5<BR>
> 16   2.0    0.001    LH2, 0.8, MeOH/CH4, 2885/4225 ; 0.8, HGHCD, 1250<BR>
><BR>
> Power MW/m3, min size in m3 (below this volume, power density is 0.1<BR>
> that stated). All units have a density of 1 tonne/m3 and cost<BR>
> 0.02MCr/m3.<BR>
<BR>
A friend just mailed me reference to an article on making fuel cells<BR>
using micromachining techinques from chip production. This will shoot<BR>
the minimum size figures all to hell...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 20:26:15 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> >>Umm.  Miniatures campaigns consist precisely of systems to decide what next<BR>
> > week's battle will be.  So do at least some boardgames.<<BR>
> ><BR>
> > But they don't need them to function. You can play miniatures week to week<BR>
> > without any campaign concern.<BR>
><BR>
> Maybeso, but the one time one of my players who was a member of a<BR>
> miniatures group invited a few of us over, they had the maps from some<BR>
> SPI Napoleonic game tacked up on the wall, with magnetic unit markers<BR>
> on it.<BR>
><BR>
> As he explained it, they'd play at the strategic level unit units got<BR>
> close enough, then they'd play at steadily more tactical levels until<BR>
> either the units were going to contact, or definitely miss each other.<BR>
> When contact came, they'd note the location and set up the sand table<BR>
> to fight the battle later.<BR>
><BR>
> They'd rented a small *house* for this. Members had keys and they'd<BR>
> drop by to set stuff up between the announcement of the battle and the<BR>
> night it was to be played out. Troop deployments were "secret" until<BR>
> the night of the game, when they were placed on the sand table<BR>
> according to sealed orders.<BR>
><BR>
> If I recall correctly, they'd been doing this for *years*...<BR>
><BR>
> --<BR>
<BR>
NOI but... *I* thought *I* needed to get a life.<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:40:51 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
<BR>
On 2 May 00, at 18:21, Veskrashen wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Katharine Whitchurch wrote:<BR>
> > You might want my completely unofficial rules for High Performance<BR>
> > Accumulators.<BR>
> > <BR>
> > Basically, FFS2 never got playtested - there was about a 3 week window<BR>
> > between the playtest release and the manuscript hitting the publisher<BR>
> > (which resulted in some really funky things, like really weird type<BR>
> > arrows replacing all the multiplication signs).<BR>
> <BR>
> I remember that FFS1 used HPGs and capacitors for nearly every DEI<BR>
> energy weapon, and they were fairly light. I think even gauss weapons<BR>
> included them. Of course, having lost most of my TNE stuff in a move, I<BR>
> don't have the old HPG tables anymore. Any way to get a copy? Or at least<BR>
> an older version of the design spreadsheets so I can come up with the<BR>
> figures when I need them?<BR>
<BR>
FFS1 HPGs aren't very light when you compare them to batteries that <BR>
store the same energy. If it wasn't for the fact that FFS requires <BR>
instant and not in 0.0036s discharge rates to power energy weapons/mass <BR>
drivers high tech weapons'd be a lot lighter. Actually can anyone think <BR>
of a good reason why those batteries couldn't be used to power a guass <BR>
rifle or mass driver? OK, I just answered my own question WRT gauss <BR>
weapons - even at TL10 it only takes 0.00032s for the projectile to <BR>
leave the muzzle. There's no barrel length listed for Mass Drivers, but <BR>
I imagine they would be longer, so some of them might be able to use <BR>
batteries. However for MDs the majority of the weight is in the power <BR>
supply, anyway.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:40:51 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
On 3 May 00, at 9:59, Phil Kitching wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com> wrote:<BR>
> >Phil Kitching wrote:<BR>
> >> Call it a beam pointer or passive target designator. Your GPS<BR>
> >> satellites died before the bad guys achieved orbit and a laser<BR>
> >> designator is a big "over here" sign.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Could it be done via optical recognition of a straight passive optical<BR>
> >image? I.E., the tank is this long, and takes up this ammount of the<BR>
> >viewable area, therefore...<BR>
> <BR>
> or a pair of periscopes, placed so that the ends facing you are adjacent<BR>
> and the ends facing the target are far apart, then rotate the mirrors<BR>
> until the images align.<BR>
> <BR>
> These have been around for years and are reasonably accurate over short<BR>
> distances, if a bit bulky. It might be possible to use some electronics to<BR>
> improve accuracy and reduce bulk.<BR>
<BR>
Heh. Try "well over a century". And they're not that bulky - one person <BR>
can carry a 3' version form 100 years ago. Plenty accurate, too. I <BR>
imagine that with modern materials and optics they'd be darned <BR>
effective, and quite light.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:40:50 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
<BR>
On 2 May 00, at 22:46, Tim Tow wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Both of these megatraveller adventures are available<BR>
> at the following link along with downloads of the text<BR>
> documentation:<BR>
> <BR>
> http://underdogs.gamingdepot.com/Paragon.htm<BR>
> <BR>
> Has anyone played them through to the end?<BR>
<BR>
I played the first one through several times on my old Amiga 500. Got a <BR>
PC version recently and found it almost unplayable in comparision - <BR>
worse graphics & sound and crappy interface.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 20:43:17 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
One series that has caught my interest recently is "Space Island One" ...set<BR>
in a TL:7M (8?) orbital that looks a lot like freedom with a grav wheel<BR>
attached (more  for ease of production I think). It's no B5 or DS9 but SI1<BR>
(What's with htese numbers?) has it's moments, a recent episode dealt withe<BR>
psych effects of a long duration deep space (to the asteroids. In a TL7/8<BR>
ship). My only gripe is the timeslot...0130 (or 0200 depending on<BR>
programmming) means I have a hard time staying awake.<BR>
<BR>
As for Australian program production...I was surprised to find 6 months after<BR>
it finished showing that Space:Above and Beyond was  filmed in Aus. I saw<BR>
their full size interface/space fighter mockup in a magazine sitting on the<BR>
tarmac at a Gold Coast Airport.<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
Qstor@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In a message dated 5/1/00 10:58:41 AM Eastern Daylight Time,<BR>
> rhoughto@one.net.au writes:<BR>
><BR>
> << I'd be happy just see the d#% thing...they are running teasers out the<BR>
> wazoo<BR>
>  down here...driving me not-so-slowly nuts!<BR>
>   >><BR>
> That's funny that some of the Australian tv stations don't have it<BR>
> on...because of their role in production...<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 21:06:15 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
> Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
> This is inherited from FFS1, I should note; FFS2 didn't fix it, but didn't<BR>
> really<BR>
> make it worse. In both versions KEAP weapons beat fusion hands-down,<BR>
portable<BR>
> or vehicular.<BR>
><BR>
> A couple of solutions occur to me.<BR>
<BR>
<good suggestions snipped><BR>
<BR>
My other suggestion is to make KEAP weapons vulnerable to point-defense<BR>
counterfire by Tl11 or so - yes, your 200mm CPR gun can crack the front of a<BR>
grav tank, but on a modern battlefield the round will never get there ...<BR>
<BR>
My thinking is that weapons are in this order ...<BR>
<BR>
PAWs - wimpy but long range. Good anti-infantry sniping weapons, and for<BR>
long-range PD<BR>
Lasers - similar to the above. Vulnerable to sand and aerosols<BR>
Plasma/Fusion - short range but chunky<BR>
Missiles/KEAP - good range and very chunky, but vulnerable to counterfire<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> (In addition, one could change the scalings for fusion weapons a little;<BR>
> almost by<BR>
> definition, they produce more energy than went into them, so they should<BR>
do<BR>
> significantly more damage than plasma.)<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Doesnt this already happen with their damage multiple ?<BR>
<BR>
> Bruce<BR>
><BR>
> From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
> Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
><BR>
> On 2 May 00, at 21:00, Bruce Macintosh wrote:<BR>
> While we're at it the laser formula really should be fixed, too. I<BR>
> never really liked the TL cap on discharge energy, and it would make<BR>
> more sense to make all weapon penetrations work off the same system -<BR>
> in this case energy^1/2.<BR>
<BR>
IMO you need the TL cap, otherwise you get spinal lasers dominating PAWs for<BR>
starship combat.<BR>
<BR>
> Before the errata they used to in FFS1. However they still sucked<BR>
> compared to grenade launchers.<BR>
<BR>
My draft Improved Point Defense Rules allowed for helmet-mounted PD by about<BR>
TL12.<BR>
<BR>
Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 12:27:53 +0100<BR>
From: CGS <michael@carrickfergus.schoolzone.co.uk><BR>
Subject: The Traveller Font<BR>
<BR>
Stupid Question Time Again<BR>
<BR>
Can anyone tell me what font was used for 1st ed. (Black Book)<BR>
Traveller? (A source where it can be dowmloaded for free would be nice<BR>
as well but I think that might be getting a bit cheesy.)<BR>
<BR>
(Personal E-Mail by preference)<BR>
<BR>
I am sure I have seen this on a web page somewhere but I cannot find it<BR>
as I was going to up some crib sheets for T1.<BR>
<BR>
Michael<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed May 03 07:42:24 2000<BR>
From: TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
Subject: RE:Piloting Skills<BR>
<BR>
The piloting skill does expand to Ship's BOat in MT, as we all know. I have used the skill to expand even further to Grav Craft on two conditions:<BR>
1 - The Pilot has a skill high enough to handle the modifiers, meaning Pilot 2, equals Ship's Boat 1, equals Grav Craft 0.<BR>
2 - The pilot has a Jack of All Trades skill of at least 1, and has Pilot of at least 1, which I would then allow a Grav Craft skill of 0. (To me, JOAT allows a person to stretch a skill to cover something that might be somewhat related to another skill they have, the GM deciding the Somewhat part...)<BR>
<BR>
On a side note: I have also been willing to give Scout characters a skill of Air/Raft 0 simply for service in the Scouts. I simply cannot imagine a scout that received a Pilot skill on a Scout/Courier and yet wasn't trained even remotely on the Air/Raft in the back...<BR>
<BR>
Roger Barr<BR>
travelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 16:07:32 +0100<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Piloting Skill<BR>
<BR>
Consider this though Alex. Chances are you can drive a car. You may be<BR>
able to ride a motorbike as well, like me, but doing the one does not<BR>
teach you how to do the other (though it might help). You probably<BR>
can't drive a small truck, even less likely an 18-gear heavy goods<BR>
truck and I doubt very much you can drive a 30-foot high quarry-stone<BR>
wagon. Pilot skill is equivalent to the quarry truck, Ship's Boat to<BR>
the HGV truck, Grav. Vehicles to the light truck and so on. One may<BR>
help at the other, but does not count as the other.<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of<BR>
> Alex Ingram<BR>
> Sent: 01 May 2000 18:42<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Piloting Skill<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> I can understand that 'Ship's Boat' refers to the piloting<BR>
[snip about ship types and flying them]<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 04:41:33 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: More design questions...<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> On 3 May 00, at 9:59, Phil Kitching wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> Veskrashen <veskrashen@sprynet.com> wrote:<BR>
>> >Phil Kitching wrote:<BR>
>> >> Call it a beam pointer or passive target designator. Your GPS<BR>
>> >> satellites died before the bad guys achieved orbit and a laser<BR>
>> >> designator is a big "over here" sign.<BR>
>> ><BR>
>> >Could it be done via optical recognition of a straight passive optical<BR>
>> >image? I.E., the tank is this long, and takes up this ammount of the<BR>
>> >viewable area, therefore...<BR>
>> <BR>
>> or a pair of periscopes, placed so that the ends facing you are adjacent<BR>
>> and the ends facing the target are far apart, then rotate the mirrors<BR>
>> until the images align.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> These have been around for years and are reasonably accurate over short<BR>
>> distances, if a bit bulky. It might be possible to use some electronics to<BR>
>> improve accuracy and reduce bulk.<BR>
><BR>
> Heh. Try "well over a century". And they're not that bulky - one person <BR>
> can carry a 3' version form 100 years ago. Plenty accurate, too. I <BR>
> imagine that with modern materials and optics they'd be darned <BR>
> effective, and quite light.<BR>
<BR>
Set up a series of observation posts, and use laser rangefinders to<BR>
establish distance and angle between them. Then use fiber optic cable<BR>
to link them to "fire control". This lets you use *any* pair of<BR>
posts as a rangefinder. And since they are passive, lots of luck<BR>
finding them.<BR>
<BR>
Hell, for stuff in orbit that's emitting much light, you could use the<BR>
"skycams" that are so popular with TV stations and other steerable<BR>
"webcams" to establish a good "first approximation" position. <BR>
<BR>
Extrapolate what such gear will be like several TLs from now, and all<BR>
you need is the position data. Planetary defense can offer a special<BR>
deal to anyone who let's them survey the position of the camera mount<BR>
and install a remote override on the steering. Heck, they can offer the<BR>
camera *free* to folks in the "right" locations...<BR>
<BR>
Instead of using the web for "distributed computing" use it for<BR>
distributed observation.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 04:48:46 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> One series that has caught my interest recently is "Space Island One" ...set<BR>
> in a TL:7M (8?) orbital that looks a lot like freedom with a grav wheel<BR>
> attached (more  for ease of production I think). It's no B5 or DS9 but SI1<BR>
> (What's with htese numbers?) has it's moments, a recent episode dealt withe<BR>
> psych effects of a long duration deep space (to the asteroids. In a TL7/8<BR>
> ship). My only gripe is the timeslot...0130 (or 0200 depending on<BR>
> programmming) means I have a hard time staying awake.<BR>
<BR>
Pity that it's unlike to reach the states... There was a British(?) "Space<BR>
Cop" (or some such) series that I managed to see a few episodes of very<BR>
late at night. It seemed to have been done fairly well. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed May 03 08:04:42 2000<BR>
From: TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Congrats!<BR>
<BR>
Great ObTrav!!!!!<BR>
Yes, congrats and may it indeed last a long time. Perhaps we might even add the blessing of "And may you have as many supplements around the house?"<BR>
;)<BR>
Roger <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Qstor@aol.com<BR>
> <BR>
> I'm getting married this Sat then heading to my honeymoon <BR>
<BR>
Congrats, have a good one !<BR>
<BR>
May your marriage last as long as Traveller !<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 22:58:10 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
I remember that one...the alien prosthetics were *very* well done. IMO I think a<BR>
lot of the work was done by the guy wo did Thunderbirds ( the original, not the<BR>
anime) interesting premise...SSTO cop cars...multi-species world...imagine NYPD<BR>
Blue with a Vargr from the vice/drugs squad (who needs sniffer dogs?)...hiver<BR>
detectives (get that curiosity working!) and perhaps a K'Kree mounted<BR>
division?<lol> . Of course having Zhodani cops would take all the fun out of it.<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> > One series that has caught my interest recently is "Space Island One" ...set<BR>
> > in a TL:7M (8?) orbital that looks a lot like freedom with a grav wheel<BR>
> > attached (more  for ease of production I think). It's no B5 or DS9 but SI1<BR>
> > (What's with htese numbers?) has it's moments, a recent episode dealt withe<BR>
> > psych effects of a long duration deep space (to the asteroids. In a TL7/8<BR>
> > ship). My only gripe is the timeslot...0130 (or 0200 depending on<BR>
> > programmming) means I have a hard time staying awake.<BR>
><BR>
> Pity that it's unlike to reach the states... There was a British(?) "Space<BR>
> Cop" (or some such) series that I managed to see a few episodes of very<BR>
> late at night. It seemed to have been done fairly well.<BR>
><BR>
> --<BR>
> Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
>  shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
> leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 09:16:26 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
<BR>
Jason Postma writes:<BR>
>So, since there _aren't_ any major morphological differences between the<BR>
>major races of humaniti, does this mean that some force must have acted to<BR>
>keep their evolution along the same general lines (the Ancients again)?<BR>
<BR>
	Not necessarily, though one could postulate that.  Without a<BR>
	significant change in conditions, I would't automatically expect<BR>
	any major morphological differences to evolve among human<BR>
	populations in 300,000 years.<BR>
<BR>
>As I recall, the biggest difference between Solomani and Zhodani, for<BR>
>instance, is that the Zhodani don't have wisdom teeth (aside from different<BR>
>blood types being prevelant).  Darrians have pointed ears, of course, but<BR>
>most minor human races don't appear all that different from Solomani either,<BR>
>and Solomani and Vilani are definitely interfertile (Cleon was of mixed<BR>
>Solomani/Vilani linneage).<BR>
<BR>
	It would surprise me if human populations (living under similar<BR>
	conditions) separated for 300,000 years were not interfertile, but<BR>
	perhaps Joe Lachance has a better handle on this.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 09:47:50 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
Chris Dixon writes:<BR>
<snipped><BR>
>Terra UWP is 867<BR>
>Vland UWP is 967<BR>
>Both have standard atmosphere and the same percentage of water.<BR>
>Would the Vilani be larger/stronger than "earthers" because of the<BR>
>larger world size?<BR>
<BR>
	I would guess that the Vilani might be smaller and stronger<BR>
	(for their size), though probably not by a lot.  Perhaps 20%<BR>
	shorter (and 33% lighter) with similar Str.<BR>
<BR>
>What traits are good when just about everything can't be processed by<BR>
>your digestive system without being heavily refined first?<BR>
<BR>
	Perhaps a slightly enlarged abdomen, with longer intestines.<BR>
	This might make them look awkward, with 'odd' (to us) relative<BR>
	body dimensions.  Perhaps shorter legs relative to body size,<BR>
	which would make them slower runners (and their chairs might be<BR>
	rather uncomfortable to others).  Perhaps heavier teeth and a<BR>
	more robust face (check out /Australopithecus robustus/ and its<BR>
	close relatives).  On the other hand, maybe they adopt a more<BR>
	carnivorous diet, if meat is easier to digest.  This might<BR>
	lead to a smaller (or possibly thinner) abdomen, a change in<BR>
	dentition (reduced chewing teeth, increased cutting teeth, but<BR>
	probably no big canines as these are more important for catching<BR>
	and killing prey, something that the humans would tend to use<BR>
	hands and/or tools to do), and a loss of ability to digest<BR>
	veggies.<BR>
<BR>
>Would the type of star Vland orbits have an effect on evolution?<BR>
<snipped><BR>
<BR>
	The wavelengths of light available might lead to evolution of<BR>
	different pigments in the retina (loss or reduction of sensitivity<BR>
	to certain colours, perhaps seeing farther into the infrared or<BR>
	ultraviolet regions).  Skin pigmentation may be affected,<BR>
	particularly if it is very bright.  Of course, the general climate<BR>
	would depend to some extent on the star and the world's orbit, and<BR>
	the climate would influence natural selection in many ways.  Given<BR>
	that the transplanted humans are likely starting at TL 0, I would<BR>
	expect Grandfather to have placed them somewhere on the planet<BR>
	that is pretty similar to where they came from (i.e. he would not<BR>
	pick them up in North Africa and drop them on frozen tundra).  If<BR>
	the world is relatively cold, for example, a population in Northern<BR>
	Europe might have been picked up and introduced in a warmer area of<BR>
	Vland.  Much of the world might be completely uninhabited until<BR>
	technology progresses considerably (like the antarctic).<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 09:57:06 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
Ethan Henry writes:<BR>
>Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca> wrote:<BR>
>>         I would expect that humans living on worlds with generally Terran<BR>
>>         features would not generally draw undue attention walking (wearing<BR>
>>         locally unremarkable clothing) in downtown Montreal.  <BR>
>A poor analogy at best - as long as they adhered to Bill 101 and <BR>
>spoke French, a pack of Vargr would raise few eyebrows walking<BR>
>through downtown Montreal. Heck, put 'em behind the wheel and they <BR>
>would improve the average driver competency.<BR>
<BR>
	LOL!  You've been here, I see.  It has been said that although<BR>
	turning right on a red light is not permitted in Quebec, you can<BR>
	drive straight through...<BR>
<BR>
>ObOnTopic: Actually, there are canon examples of "minor" human races<BR>
>that would draw considerable attention. The Suerrat (sp?) have a nearly<BR>
>full covering of body hair, the Genoee from their high-g homeworld<BR>
>are at the extreme end of what we consider "short and stocky" and lots<BR>
>of other minor human races from lower-g planets would be tall enough<BR>
>to merit notice even in Montreal. Plus, none of them smoke.<BR>
<BR>
	The smoking thing would definitely give them away.  As one<BR>
	Maritimer said: "In Quebec they smoke like it's a CURE for<BR>
	cancer!"  This brings up social evolution, and the interaction<BR>
	with the local environment.  If you can eat the vegitation,<BR>
	then you can almost certainly make alcoholic beverages, so they<BR>
	are likely universal.  What about cigarettes?<BR>
<BR>
>Ethan, from that other city in Canada.<BR>
<BR>
	I forgive you.<BR>
	;^)<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2391<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Wednesday, May 3 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2392<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: Piloting Skill<BR>
Re: Fuel Cells (drafty gearhead stuff v1.x, longish)<BR>
SEC: UUNCLASS - Re: Piloting skill<BR>
Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
Re: GT-REQ: Starport Construction Equipment<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Vs: Opinions Sought<BR>
Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
Vs: X-TEK Excalibur Sword<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
Re: The Traveller Font<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
Re: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
RE: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... <BR>
Re: Piloting Skill<BR>
Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 10:29:51 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: Piloting Skill<BR>
<BR>
Mark Preston writes:<BR>
>Consider this though Alex. Chances are you can drive a car. You may be<BR>
>able to ride a motorbike as well, like me, but doing the one does not<BR>
>teach you how to do the other (though it might help). You probably<BR>
>can't drive a small truck, even less likely an 18-gear heavy goods<BR>
>truck and I doubt very much you can drive a 30-foot high quarry-stone<BR>
>wagon. Pilot skill is equivalent to the quarry truck, Ship's Boat to<BR>
>the HGV truck, Grav. Vehicles to the light truck and so on. One may<BR>
>help at the other, but does not count as the other.<BR>
<BR>
	I'm going to jump in here without having followed this thread<BR>
	before (always a dangerous thing to do).  Anyone who can drive<BR>
	a 1 ton car can drive a 5 ton truck, though not very well.<BR>
	Both involve a steering wheel, a gas petal, and a break petal.<BR>
	They both are pushed forward by tires driven by engines.  They<BR>
	do handle differently, but not much differently compared to <BR>
	a car and a hovercraft.  A motorcycle or semi-trailer are<BR>
	somewhat more different to drive than a light truck, but you<BR>
	must decide how detailed you want your skills to be.<BR>
<BR>
	IMTU starships and big craft (which require Pilot skill) have<BR>
	controls of the type depicted in Star Trek: the pilot pushes<BR>
	buttons and pulls knobs to do her job.  Small craft (which<BR>
	require Ship's Boat skill) have controls more similar to those<BR>
	in Star Wars: some sort of joy stick operated with one hand<BR>
	and plenty of bottons for the other hand.  Grav vehicles have<BR>
	controls not unlike a car: a stearing wheel (which may be moved<BR>
	in and out to adjust altitude), two petals (forward and<BR>
	backward thrust), and a lever to adjust side-to-side thrust.<BR>
	Thus, Pilot and Ship's Boat skills employ different controls,<BR>
	but the vessel's machinery (maneuver drive, attitude thrusters,<BR>
	etc.) are very similar.  Air/Raft skill employs controls<BR>
	somewhat different than Ship's Boat plus the vehicle's machinery<BR>
	and handling characteristics are very different.  Various other<BR>
	vehicles (planes, helicopters, hovercraft, etc.) are even more<BR>
	different.<BR>
<BR>
	This allows me a reason to let Pilot be used as Ship's Boat -1,<BR>
	but not be so generous with the other skills.  Still, a jet<BR>
	aircraft pilot is likely to be better than I at controlling a<BR>
	small craft.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
(licensed to drive cars, trucks up to 4,500 kg, buses up to 24 passengers,<BR>
and emergency vehicles)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 07:34:24 -0700 (MST)<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU><BR>
Subject: Re: Fuel Cells (drafty gearhead stuff v1.x, longish)<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 3 May 2000, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
 <BR>
> A friend just mailed me reference to an article on making fuel cells<BR>
> using micromachining techinques from chip production. This will shoot<BR>
> the minimum size figures all to hell...<BR>
<BR>
Yes, I also saw an article in (I think) Popuar Science, about two years<BR>
ago (and it was in a doctors office, so who knows how old it was ;-) where<BR>
someone had developed a methanol-fueled fuel cell that operated at room<BR>
temp, could be molded from plastic in just about any shape, and had<BR>
reasonably high power densities, enough to run small electronic devices,<BR>
anyway. <BR>
<BR>
They were envisioning applications like molding the 'battery' into the<BR>
case of cell phones, laptop computers, PDA's etc, and all you would have<BR>
to do is 'gas' up your stuff with 15 or 20 mls of methanol every week or<BR>
so.<BR>
<BR>
The article left the impression that what was left to develop were mass<BR>
production techniques for the membranes involved, and engineering the<BR>
cells into device designs.<BR>
<BR>
Of course, PopSci has this tendency to be a little more than wildly<BR>
optomistic about such predictions.<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 00:32:52 +1000<BR>
From: "David Healey" <David.Healey@dcb.defence.gov.au><BR>
Subject: SEC: UUNCLASS - Re: Piloting skill<BR>
<BR>
On 2 May 200, Mark Preston said :<BR>
<BR>
<Mark><BR>
Consider this though Alex. Chances are you can drive a car. You may be<BR>
able to ride a motorbike as well, like me, but doing the one does not<BR>
teach you how to do the other (though it might help). You probably<BR>
can't drive a small truck, even less likely an 18-gear heavy goods<BR>
truck and I doubt very much you can drive a 30-foot high quarry-stone<BR>
wagon. Pilot skill is equivalent to the quarry truck, Ship's Boat to<BR>
the HGV truck, Grav. Vehicles to the light truck and so on. One may<BR>
help at the other, but does not count as the other.<BR>
<BR>
</Mark><BR>
<BR>
Cool !  This means I can pilot a starship !!!  Ever driven a mine truck ?  Takes about fifteen minutes to learn and an hour to master.  D10 dozers aren't much harder.<BR>
<BR>
Good point tho' - knowing how to drive a Landcruiser doesn't mean you can drive Cat 777D.<BR>
<BR>
Dave<BR>
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             !<BR>
                                                                                                                                                                 <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 07:53:24 -0700 (MST)<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU><BR>
Subject: Re: Punched cards (was: You Know You're a Gearhead When)<BR>
<BR>
On Tue, 2 May 2000 healyzh@aracnet.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> > I'm the proud owner of a pair of 5 meg disk packs for an IBM 2311<BR>
> > drive. 14" diameter, 6 platters...<BR>
> <BR>
> But are you using them?  I've got a 'home' computer that has DEC RL01 and<BR>
> RL02 drives, with a bunch of diskpacks for each.  The RL01's are 5MB and the<BR>
> RL02's are 10MB.  I trust them more than I'll trust a brand new 50GB HD from<BR>
> the local computer store!  Though these are 14" single plater packs so<BR>
> you've got me beat on the number of platters.<BR>
> <BR>
> And yes, I run the computer at home.<BR>
<BR>
Mainly because the old boat anchor, non switching power supplies on those<BR>
things can probably keep 'em running through a ten minute power outage...<BR>
<BR>
Put your modern 50 gb drive, and system on a UPS, and they'll be<BR>
(electronically) stable as all get out. Notice, I'm not saying anything at<BR>
all about software here ;-)<BR>
<BR>
But I have another rarity...an IBM Mag card, it is essentially a large<BR>
magnetic media card, the size and shape of a punch card, but looks and<BR>
feels like it's made of really thick magnetic tape (it's a stiff as a<BR>
punch card, and about as thick as two cardboard punch cards). It was stuck<BR>
in an ancient IBM 'Programming the (I think) 1650' book I got from my<BR>
father-in-law. (actually, dug out of the garbage when my mother in law<BR>
threw out the stuff he left behind after the divorce, but that's _another_<BR>
kettle of fish) Both the card and the book are at work, so I can look at<BR>
anything printed on it when I get there today.<BR>
<BR>
Beyond that, though, I know nothing about it...anyone else here do?<BR>
<BR>
obTrav: The characters are scrounging in a parts junk store and find a<BR>
weird computer component from 4 TL's ago...<BR>
<BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 01:02:24 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: GT-REQ: Starport Construction Equipment<BR>
<BR>
Dalton Spence wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> This reply has also been sent to the newsgroups.<BR>
> Ever since I first downloaded the sample pages of GT: Starports from<BR>
> the sjgames website, I've been curious about what kind of equipment<BR>
> the SPA would choose to build downport facilities.<BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> CHALLENGE: I would like to see some GT designs for the following<BR>
> *civilian* vehicles at various TLs;<BR>
<BR>
> bulldozer,<BR>
<BR>
At all TL's This is going to have tracks.<BR>
<BR>
> front end loader, power shovel,<BR>
<BR>
> surface compactor, dump truck, cement (or equivalent) mixer<BR>
<BR>
powerhead attachments. the dumptruck could be a skip(stackable) wth<BR>
liftpoints.<BR>
<BR>
> collapsible crane,<BR>
<BR>
I remember a collapseable gravcrane from one of the TNE<BR>
supplements...veriable field strength gravmodules, a grav powerhead with<BR>
attachment padeyes...<BR>
<BR>
> pile driver<BR>
<BR>
something gravtic? If you put a grav generator on top of the pile and<BR>
switch it on and off that pile is going in. if not...a crane attachment.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> , etc. (There must be more,<BR>
> but I can't think of them right now.) The only restrictions are:<BR>
<BR>
> 1.) No single vehicle may be larger than 7 dtons (3500 cf) so it may<BR>
> fit in a cutter module with a 14 dton spacedock (see GT p.143),<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
perhaps a modular system...a vehicle hull with attachment points for<BR>
various equipment. make them approx 3 to 3.5 dtons ea and pack two<BR>
powerheads (you can use this name if you like) in one cutter module, all<BR>
the attachments (plus materials) in a cargo module...crew in the cutter.<BR>
the powerheads are probably remote controlled or robotic, for work on<BR>
hazardous environments (vacuum etc). One power head is probably tracked<BR>
for jobs recquireing traction (bulldozer...front end loader...etc) the<BR>
other can be grav for lifting jobs (crane...dumptruck...transport<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> 2.) No built-in weapons that aren't intrinsically tools, and<BR>
<BR>
define weapon. define tool.<BR>
<BR>
> 3.) The power plant must either be nuclear, a rechargable energy<BR>
>     bank (perhaps charged by a solar array), or able to use locally<BR>
>     available fuels.<BR>
><BR>
> (NOTE to "GT: Ground Forces" playtesters: This would be an excellent<BR>
> opportunity to playtest the "Modular Grav Vehicle Design System" in<BR>
> Chapter 7. Just remember to convert your design into GURPS Vehicle<BR>
> terms before you post it to the lists/newsgroup.)<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 15:02:48 +0100<BR>
From: "Greg Aldridge" <Greg.Aldridge@marconicomms.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
> I remember that one...the alien prosthetics were *very* well done. IMO I think<BR>
a<BR>
> lot of the work was done by the guy wo did Thunderbirds ( the original, not<BR>
the<BR>
> anime) interesting premise...SSTO cop cars...multi-species world...<BR>
<BR>
And it was called "Space Precinct".<BR>
<BR>
Greg.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 01:23:39 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
I still think NYPD Blue woule would be improved by a couple of Vargr from the Drugs<BR>
squad.<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
Greg Aldridge wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> > I remember that one...the alien prosthetics were *very* well done. IMO I think<BR>
> a<BR>
> > lot of the work was done by the guy wo did Thunderbirds ( the original, not<BR>
> the<BR>
> > anime) interesting premise...SSTO cop cars...multi-species world...<BR>
><BR>
> And it was called "Space Precinct".<BR>
><BR>
> Greg.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 11:34:34 -0400<BR>
From: "Samuel D. Weiss" <samwise1@email.msn.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Morality of "Heros"<BR>
<BR>
>If I recall correctly, they'd been doing this for *years*...<<BR>
<BR>
Ummmm.....<BR>
(Both knowing people who have done so and having done similar with strategic<BR>
to operational or operational to tactical games myself, but fortunately not<BR>
for years.)<BR>
No comment?<BR>
:)<BR>
<BR>
Sam<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 09:34:12<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
<BR>
At 10:46 PM 5/2/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>Both of these megatraveller adventures are available<BR>
>at the following link along with downloads of the text<BR>
>documentation:<BR>
><BR>
>http://underdogs.gamingdepot.com/Paragon.htm<BR>
<BR>
I'd down;oad them, but I have no idea what a .rar file extension is.  Any<BR>
help here?<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 18:15:29 +0100<BR>
From: Martin Hardgrave <martin@deira.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
In message <00430.202435.5l8.rnr.w165w@krypton.rain.com>, Leonard<BR>
Erickson <shadow@krypton.rain.com> writes<BR>
>There's an English phrase with a similar meaning. alas, too many people<BR>
>don't "get" it.<BR>
><BR>
>"Better is the enemy of 'good enough'."<BR>
<BR>
I've only heard French people quote it (in French).  Never heard it in<BR>
English.<BR>
- -- <BR>
Martin Hardgrave<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 18:10:15 +0100<BR>
From: Martin Hardgrave <martin@deira.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
In message <00050100112500.05930@m227.ryd.student.liu.se>, Jens Rydholm<BR>
<jenry023@student.liu.se> writes<BR>
>Most of the Nordic languages have one such example: the word/concept "lagom"<BR>
             ^^^^^^<BR>
ITYM Swedish HTH HAND<BR>
- -- <BR>
Martin Hardgrave<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 19:30:08 +0300<BR>
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jussi_Kenkkil=E4?= <Jussi.Kenkkila@helsinki.fi><BR>
Subject: Vs: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com><BR>
To: <traveller@mpgn.com><BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2000 7:21 PM<BR>
Subject: Opinions Sought<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Gentlebeings,<BR>
> <BR>
> How many of you would like to see a GT Lite?<BR>
> <BR>
As I'm introducing G:T to quite a lot of new players, and this would be very useful.<BR>
<BR>
- -J2K<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 13:33:10 -0400<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
<BR>
At 09:34 AM 5/3/00 +0000, you wrote:<BR>
>At 10:46 PM 5/2/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
> >Both of these megatraveller adventures are available<BR>
> >at the following link along with downloads of the text<BR>
> >documentation:<BR>
> ><BR>
> >http://underdogs.gamingdepot.com/Paragon.htm<BR>
><BR>
>I'd down;oad them, but I have no idea what a .rar file extension is.  Any<BR>
>help here?<BR>
>--<BR>
<BR>
It's yet another standard compression format, like .zip or .arc  The de <BR>
facto standard tool for it under Windows is WinRAR, you can grab that from <BR>
www.winfiles.com.  I'm not sure what's available on other platforms.<BR>
<BR>
           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
                          			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
for PGP public-key and<BR>
more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/                <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 20:35:40 +0300<BR>
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jussi_Kenkkil=E4?= <Jussi.Kenkkila@helsinki.fi><BR>
Subject: Vs: X-TEK Excalibur Sword<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>
From: William Prankard <cmdrx@magicnet.net><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Cc: <cmdrx@magicnet.net><BR>
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2000 7:32 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: X-TEK Excalibur Sword<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Why did I do this?  I wanted to create a Clarkesian world where 'magic' is<BR>
> realy high technology.  Magic swords are like the Excalibur above,<BR>
> fireball staves are realy plasma guns, etc... That, and I have a<BR>
> reputation of an evil mad scientist/heretic to uphold! ;-><BR>
> <BR>
If you're going to go all the way, why not add neural-induction-linked skill-chips to the package to give it some "magic bonus".<BR>
<BR>
- -J2K <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 09:40:15 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
>On a world that's pretty hostile towards humans, what Might those<BR>
>proto-humans develop like?<BR>
><BR>
>Using Galactic -<BR>
><BR>
>Terra UWP is 867<BR>
>Vland UWP is 967<BR>
><BR>
>Both have standard atmosphere and the same percentage of water.<BR>
<BR>
and different surface pressures, too, most likely. Yeah, within "Standard".<BR>
<BR>
>Would the Vilani be larger/stronger than "earthers" because of the<BR>
>larger world size?<BR>
<BR>
Smaller and stronger: the higher the gravity (assuming gravity and size<BR>
correlate, which in reallity they do but only moderately strongly so), the<BR>
less advantage to height, due to the higher impact from falls of x distance.<BR>
<BR>
>What traits are good when just about everything can't be processed by<BR>
>your digestive system without being heavily refined first?<BR>
<BR>
intelligence, longevity, ability to host local organic microbes which can<BR>
break the native foods down into useable amino acids and protiens (which we<BR>
know isn't the case for the vilani), resistance to deprivation (so<BR>
typically fat cells and water retention)<BR>
<BR>
>Would the type of star Vland orbits have an effect on evolution?<BR>
<BR>
H*ll YES! Differences in eye and skin coloration are fast on the<BR>
evolutionary track, and if there is enough difference in insolation and<BR>
radiation spectrum, it will shape epidermal coloration, elasticicty,<BR>
weathering patterns, and cancer and mutation rates.<BR>
<BR>
>Food for thought - Ideas & Speculation are always welcome.<BR>
<BR>
call the above informed speculation<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 11:17:18 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: The Traveller Font<BR>
<BR>
Loren or Marc answered this definitively once, they were not fonts that<BR>
I recognized the name of.<BR>
<BR>
However, the titling font on the cover and title page (the 'Traveller'<BR>
bit) is very similar to Adobe's Optima font, and there are a number of<BR>
clones out there; istr one is called Ottowa.<BR>
<BR>
The body text is something I haven't run across, though Geneva or<BR>
Helvetica come close to matching it. (Helvetica == Arial on the PC, and<BR>
there's no analogue for Geneva)<BR>
<BR>
CGS wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Stupid Question Time Again<BR>
> <BR>
> Can anyone tell me what font was used for 1st ed. (Black Book)<BR>
> Traveller? (A source where it can be dowmloaded for free would be nice<BR>
> as well but I think that might be getting a bit cheesy.)<BR>
> <BR>
> (Personal E-Mail by preference)<BR>
> <BR>
> I am sure I have seen this on a web page somewhere but I cannot find it<BR>
> as I was going to up some crib sheets for T1.<BR>
> <BR>
> Michael<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 11:29:35 -0700<BR>
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
Any sword that is to heavy to pick up without contragrav is going<BR>
to have more inertia than it needs.  There is a diminishing<BR>
return on damage and intertia and this blade is going to<BR>
be easier to parry (since it will be slow).  (I've never<BR>
really seen much use in hyperdense either, you can make<BR>
swords just as heavy as you want now).<BR>
______________________________<BR>
summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>
(This is the net.  My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 11:36:37 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
David P. Summers writes:<BR>
> Any sword that is to heavy to pick up without contragrav is going<BR>
> to have more inertia than it needs.  There is a diminishing<BR>
> return on damage and intertia and this blade is going to<BR>
> be easier to parry (since it will be slow).  (I've never<BR>
> really seen much use in hyperdense either, you can make<BR>
> swords just as heavy as you want now).<BR>
<BR>
The point of hyperdense is that you can make a blade which is super-thin and<BR>
super-sharp.  Weight is just a side effect.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 13:47:32 -0500<BR>
From: Pete <j_pete@bellsouth.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 03 May 2000 13:33:10 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>At 09:34 AM 5/3/00 +0000, you wrote:<BR>
>>At 10:46 PM 5/2/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>> >Both of these megatraveller adventures are available<BR>
>> >at the following link along with downloads of the text<BR>
>> >documentation:<BR>
>> ><BR>
>> >http://underdogs.gamingdepot.com/Paragon.htm<BR>
>><BR>
>>I'd down;oad them, but I have no idea what a .rar file extension is.  Any<BR>
>>help here?<BR>
>>--<BR>
><BR>
>It's yet another standard compression format, like .zip or .arc  The de <BR>
>facto standard tool for it under Windows is WinRAR, you can grab that from <BR>
>www.winfiles.com.  I'm not sure what's available on other platforms.<BR>
><BR>
>           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
I beliee Powerzip will uncompress them. It's freeware for<BR>
noncommercial users. Freezip may work also, I haven't tried it yet.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- - Jeff Peterson (j_pete@bellsouth.net)<BR>
"There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under heaven."<BR>
                                               -Ecclesiastes 3:1<BR>
Pete 0609 D258A85-3 S kk- hi++ as+ va++ dr++ so zh- vi+ da++ A833<BR>
NOG #74  AirStar Nova 700<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 11:53:32 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net><BR>
<BR>
>She also did a stint with a Retro Terran rock band called<BR>
>the Hong Kong Cavaliers under the name of Pretty Penny<BR>
<BR>
I thought that was Penny Priddy.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 13:01:26 -0600 <BR>
From: Steve Deemer <stedee@AUTO-TROL.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Jesse's artwork and the Spofulam clan<BR>
<BR>
>From Glenn Goffin<BR>
<BR>
> >>From: "Shadowcat" <meow@advancenet.net><BR>
> <BR>
> >>She also did a stint with a Retro Terran rock band called<BR>
> >>the Hong Kong Cavaliers under the name of Pretty Penny<BR>
> <BR>
	>I thought that was Penny Priddy.<BR>
<BR>
Did you say "Peggy"?<BR>
<BR>
Steve Deemer<BR>
Blue Blaze Irregular #3819<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 12:08:11 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... <BR>
<BR>
>From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
><BR>
>How about trying to use the machines of this era to run<BR>
>starships?<BR>
>Captain: Computer, prepare jump calculations...<BR>
>Computer Officer: Sorry Cap'n, the punchcards are all on<BR>
>the floor and the tubes are blowing left and right...I<BR>
>have a pencil and some paper...'twould probably be <BR>
>faster...<BR>
<BR>
This reminds me of two books, We All Died at Breakaway<BR>
Station (by Meredith?) and Starman Jones.  We All Died has<BR>
the classic line, "A slide rule! A goddamned slide rule for<BR>
navigation!" which is all the crew of a small craft have<BR>
for computing power after being mauled by the enemy. <BR>
Starman Jones has the astrogation department sitting down<BR>
with paper and pencils and logarithmic tables and<BR>
calculating the jump vectors, then seeing if everybody<BR>
agrees on the calculations.  I'm not sure that these were<BR>
not meant as satire even when written.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 14:17:08 -0500<BR>
From: Eris Reddoch <eris@pcola.gulf.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Piloting Skill<BR>
<BR>
Ian Ferguson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> IMTU starships and big craft (which require Pilot skill) have<BR>
> controls of the type depicted in Star Trek: the pilot pushes<BR>
> buttons and pulls knobs to do her job.  Small craft (which<BR>
> require Ship's Boat skill) have controls more similar to those<BR>
> in Star Wars: some sort of joy stick operated with one hand<BR>
> and plenty of bottons for the other hand.  Grav vehicles have<BR>
> controls not unlike a car: a stearing wheel (which may be moved<BR>
> in and out to adjust altitude), two petals (forward and<BR>
> backward thrust), and a lever to adjust side-to-side thrust.<BR>
> Thus, Pilot and Ship's Boat skills employ different controls,<BR>
> but the vessel's machinery (maneuver drive, attitude thrusters,<BR>
> etc.) are very similar.  Air/Raft skill employs controls<BR>
> somewhat different than Ship's Boat plus the vehicle's machinery<BR>
> and handling characteristics are very different.  Various other<BR>
> vehicles (planes, helicopters, hovercraft, etc.) are even more<BR>
> different.<BR>
> <BR>
> This allows me a reason to let Pilot be used as Ship's Boat -1,<BR>
> but not be so generous with the other skills.  Still, a jet<BR>
> aircraft pilot is likely to be better than I at controlling a<BR>
> small craft.<BR>
<BR>
Hum, IYTU, then would we see something like this?<BR>
<BR>
To "Drive" a Starship.<BR>
  Routine, Pilot or Ship's Boat-1,...<BR>
<BR>
To "Drive" a Ship's Boat.<BR>
  Routine, Ship's Boat or Pilot-1 or Air/raft-1,...<BR>
<BR>
To "Drive" an Air/raft.<BR>
  Routine, Air/raft or Ship's Boat-1,...<BR>
<BR>
That looks reasonable to me, and gives a good reason to learn Ship's<BR>
Boat as it defaults both up and down.<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 12:29:59 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Chris Dixon" <cdixon@airfoiltech.com><BR>
<BR>
>I'm wondering about the proto-humans that the ancients <BR>
>dispersed to the stars in 300,000 BC.Would these humans <BR>
>even be recognizable as "earth" humans after thatmany <BR>
>years of evolution on alien worlds?<BR>
<BR>
This is one of our recurring discussions.  There was an<BR>
interesting article in, I think, Scientific American last<BR>
fall or winter about what intelligent primates were around<BR>
a long time ago.  It seems to me that by 300,000 years ago,<BR>
there were still a few different groups; whether they were<BR>
interfertile is not known.  It's possible that the Ancients<BR>
just took Homo sapiens sapiens for servants, but maybe they<BR>
took neanderthals as well.  So the first step in your<BR>
inquiry is, what were the intelligent primates on the<BR>
different worlds?<BR>
<BR>
The next step is to ask what might have happened over<BR>
300,000 years on that world.  On Earth, that's not a very<BR>
long time for changes in appearance.  On other worlds --<BR>
radiation is a factor you mentioned -- it might not be.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2392<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2393</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Wednesday, May 3 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2393<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Hivers<BR>
Re: The Traveller Font<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
unsubscribe<BR>
Re SW Ep IV<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2392<BR>
Re: Font<BR>
Re: The Traveller Font<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: more design questions<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Copyright question<BR>
Re: weird mag cards<BR>
Requesting old digests from archives<BR>
Re: Copyright question<BR>
Re: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
RE: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
TL9 surface-to-orbit craft (long) <BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 12:34:42 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Hivers<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Smart, David J (David)" <dasmart@lucent.com><BR>
<BR>
>"Going hand-to-hand" with Hivers is probably the basis of <BR>
>a number of dirty jokes in the Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
Maybe like this?<BR>
<BR>
The fleshpots of Efate it is again, sophs, and after five<BR>
weeks of jumps without disembarcation I'm crazy for it<BR>
enough to go hand to hand with a Hiver!<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 15:45:39 -0700<BR>
From: Keith Johnson <keithalanjohnson@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Traveller Font<BR>
<BR>
At 03:30 PM 5/3/00 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>However, the titling font on the cover and title page (the 'Traveller'<BR>
>bit) is very similar to Adobe's Optima font, and there are a number of<BR>
>clones out there; istr one is called Ottowa.<BR>
<BR>
SJ Games is using Optima for GURPS Traveller.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
_________________________________________________________<BR>
Rev. Keith Johnson      /\     keith@sjgames.com<BR>
Assistant Webmaster    /()\    keithalanjohnson@home.com<BR>
Steve Jackson Games   /____\   reverendkeith@hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
  IMTU tm++@ t4+@ tg++$ ru- ge-@ st+ pi+ he+ dr+ hi-@ zh+<BR>
_________________________________________________________ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 00:00:35 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
Martin Hardgrave replied to my post:<BR>
> >Most of the Nordic languages have one such example: the word/concept "lagom"<BR>
>              ^^^^^^<BR>
> ITYM Swedish HTH HAND<BR>
<BR>
I am sorry, but I do not understand your reply. Too many weird abbrevations for<BR>
my taste ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Could you please repeat, but in layman's terms? Or English?<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 15:07:00 PDT<BR>
From: "jim clem" <travmind@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Reply-To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 11:36:37 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
<BR>
David P. Summers writes:<BR>
<BR>
The point of hyperdense is that you can make a blade which is super-thin and<BR>
super-sharp.  Weight is just a side effect.<BR>
===<BR>
<BR>
Hmmmmm, just because something is dense does not mean its structurally <BR>
strong.  Your thin hyperdense blade might be dense, but soft, or brittle as <BR>
well.  Take lead as a case.<BR>
<BR>
Jim C<BR>
<BR>
Damn it Jim?  I'm an engineer, not a train driver!<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________________________<BR>
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 15:16:55 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
jim clem writes:<BR>
<BR>
> Hmmmmm, just because something is dense does not mean its structurally <BR>
> strong.  Your thin hyperdense blade might be dense, but soft, or brittle as<BR>
>  well.  Take lead as a case.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, but the hyperdense we're talking about is an ultra-high-tech super-<BR>
material, so yes, its strong ;)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 15:15:00 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: "Tim C. K." <suptk@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: unsubscribe<BR>
<BR>
unsubscribe traveller<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
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<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 17:48:48 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
<BR>
At 4:59 -0400 3/5/00, Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com> wrote:<BR>
>Did anyone else find that Elizabeth reminded them of The<BR>
>Godfather?<BR>
<BR>
Slightly,<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 18:32:56 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2392<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-05-03 15:34:07 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< Beyond that, though, I know nothing about it...anyone else here do?<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
Many of the LBBs were typeset on an IBM mag card typesetting system, and <BR>
recorded on those very cards. <BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 18:38:56 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Font<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-05-03 15:34:07 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<<  Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
 Subject: Re: The Traveller Font<BR>
 <BR>
 Loren or Marc answered this definitively once, they were not fonts that<BR>
 I recognized the name of.<BR>
 <BR>
 However, the titling font on the cover and title page (the 'Traveller'<BR>
 bit) is very similar to Adobe's Optima font, and there are a number of<BR>
 clones out there; istr one is called Ottowa.<BR>
 <BR>
 The body text is something I haven't run across, though Geneva or<BR>
 Helvetica come close to matching it. (Helvetica == Arial on the PC, and<BR>
 there's no analogue for Geneva)<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
Spot on on both. Cover title is Optima, interior set in Helvetica medium, <BR>
bold and italic. Many of them using the aforementioned IBM Selectric <BR>
"golfballs" on the mag card typsetter.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 23:28:52 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Traveller Font<BR>
<BR>
At 15:30 -0400 3/5/00, Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu> wrote:<BR>
>Loren or Marc answered this definitively once, they were not fonts that<BR>
>I recognized the name of.<BR>
<BR>
I'm going to have to mount the HIWG CD on my Mac, Index it with <BR>
Sherlock for Context searches and re-burn it to help with things like <BR>
this..<BR>
<BR>
>However, the titling font on the cover and title page (the 'Traveller'<BR>
>bit) is very similar to Adobe's Optima font, and there are a number of<BR>
>clones out there; istr one is called Ottowa.<BR>
<BR>
Omni is the name I recall - again, Adobe ship it and I use that for <BR>
BITS stuff with Traveller logos on it.<BR>
<BR>
A while ago someone gave the correct URL for the Uncle Bear site with <BR>
the font - and the Vilani one - on.<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 00:00:02 +0100<BR>
From: "Matthew Bond" <mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: 03 May 2000 23:04<BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Martin Hardgrave replied to my post:<BR>
>> >Most of the Nordic languages have one such example: the word/concept<BR>
"lagom"<BR>
>>              ^^^^^^<BR>
>> ITYM Swedish HTH HAND<BR>
><BR>
>I am sorry, but I do not understand your reply. Too many weird abbrevations<BR>
for<BR>
>my taste ;-)<BR>
><BR>
>Could you please repeat, but in layman's terms? Or English?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I Think You Mean Swedish. Hope This Helps. Have A Nice Day.<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 11:16:43 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
<BR>
On 3 May 00, at 21:06, Katharine Whitchurch wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> My other suggestion is to make KEAP weapons vulnerable to point-defense<BR>
> counterfire by Tl11 or so - yes, your 200mm CPR gun can crack the front of<BR>
> a grav tank, but on a modern battlefield the round will never get there<BR>
> ...<BR>
<BR>
How good is your PD going to be vs a 6000 m/s gauss KEAP penetrator? <BR>
That's the top end for MDs in FFS1, and I imagine that most anti tank <BR>
weapons will have muzzle velocities up around there.<BR>
<BR>
> > On 2 May 00, at 21:00, Bruce Macintosh wrote:<BR>
> > While we're at it the laser formula really should be fixed, too. I<BR>
> > never really liked the TL cap on discharge energy, and it would make<BR>
> > more sense to make all weapon penetrations work off the same system - in<BR>
> > this case energy^1/2.<BR>
> <BR>
> IMO you need the TL cap, otherwise you get spinal lasers dominating PAWs<BR>
> for starship combat.<BR>
<BR>
If they work off a similar damage scale to other weapons that may not <BR>
happen to the same degree, but seeing as Traveller has never had lasers <BR>
bigger than 6DT, I agree.<BR>
<BR>
> > Before the errata they used to in FFS1. However they still sucked<BR>
> > compared to grenade launchers.<BR>
> <BR>
> My draft Improved Point Defense Rules allowed for helmet-mounted PD by<BR>
> about TL12.<BR>
<BR>
BTW what effect do your improved energy storage rules have on ESA <BR>
armour? It works on High Energy Weapons, and might be small enough to <BR>
fit on battledress, especially if the HPGs, etc can be made lighter.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 01:55:56 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
> I Think You Mean Swedish. Hope This Helps. Have A Nice Day.<BR>
<BR>
I am pretty sure I mean Swedish (check my e-mail address and realize why), but<BR>
the concept exists at least in Norweigan as well.  ;-)<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 01:59:33 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
I have a delicate problem...<BR>
<BR>
FF&S2 is, as we all know, full of errors. I became more than irritated, and<BR>
decided to straighten out the problems I have with it once and for all. Using<BR>
LaTeX, I have now rewritten parts of the book in a corrected, more readable<BR>
format.<BR>
<BR>
Sounds great, doesn't it?  :-)<BR>
<BR>
The problem is that I am not sure if I can share this with you. Since Imperium<BR>
Games folded, I do not know who to ask. Mr Miller himself? If so, at what<BR>
e-mail address?<BR>
<BR>
If I am allowed to share this with people, I would like help with locating<BR>
errors and misinterpretations on my part. In other words, I need someone who<BR>
has used FF&S2 a lot to read through the document, and mail me comments.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 17:16:40 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: weird mag cards<BR>
<BR>
GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> In a message dated 00-05-03 15:34:07 EDT, you write:<BR>
> <BR>
> << Beyond that, though, I know nothing about it...anyone else here do?<BR>
>   >><BR>
> <BR>
> Many of the LBBs were typeset on an IBM mag card typesetting system, and<BR>
> recorded on those very cards.<BR>
<BR>
Well paint me blue and call me a Terran Skinmonkey...Now I wonder what<BR>
the heck is _on_ this thing! How much data fit on a card?<BR>
<BR>
(actually you can call me Cory then, too ...;-P<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 11:02:51 +1000<BR>
From: Graeme_Batho@agd.nsw.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Requesting old digests from archives<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 5/1/00 10:12:42 PM Eastern Daylight Time,<BR>
bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< I hate to say this, but I can't find the damn things. Is the TML archived<BR>
 anywhere?<BR>
<BR>
 Bruce<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
You can request recent issues of the TML digest from the listserver.<BR>
Simply send an email to:<BR>
<BR>
majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
<BR>
and in the text of the message (NOT THE SUBJECT LINE) say:<BR>
<BR>
get traveller-digest v1999.n2256<BR>
<BR>
(substituting the volume and issue you require).<BR>
<BR>
The listserver then sends the requested archive to you as an email.<BR>
<BR>
There are other archives of the TML on the web, but I find this to be more<BR>
      convenient as I have limited web access.<BR>
<BR>
Graeme<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
<BR>
Things are always darkest before they go completely black.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 21:11:31 EDT<BR>
From: RvKsword@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
I'm certainly no copyright lawyer, but my understanding on the matter is as <BR>
long as you aren't trying to make money on it, not taking credit for it (with <BR>
the exception of what you've added) and you're not trying to give away entire <BR>
copies of the book (god forbid you infringe on anyone's profits, thems hangin <BR>
offenses pardner) then i think its ok.<BR>
<BR>
THen of course, I may just be rationalizing the fact I'd like to see your <BR>
work for myself! LOL<BR>
<BR>
but anyway thats my entirely incomplete and most likely wrong understanding <BR>
of the subject.   If no one else on the list knows, my advice would be to <BR>
email to one of the WoC boys, theyre great with this sort of stuff, esp Jim <BR>
Butler (the brand manager for Alternity) he and a few others helps us with <BR>
stuff like this on the Alternity list all the time - I can get a hold of some <BR>
of their email address for u if u like<BR>
<BR>
RvK<BR>
v^v^v  "Oh god, aliens!!!  Oh well, I suppose you want to probe me now huh?"<BR>
"No human, we have reached the limits of what rectal probing can teach us.  <BR>
Now open wide and say ahhhh...."  v^v^v<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 5/3/00 7:10:49 PM Central Daylight Time, <BR>
jenry023@student.liu.se writes:<BR>
<BR>
> I have a delicate problem...<BR>
>  <BR>
>  FF&S2 is, as we all know, full of errors. I became more than irritated, and<BR>
>  decided to straighten out the problems I have with it once and for all. <BR>
> Using<BR>
>  LaTeX, I have now rewritten parts of the book in a corrected, more readable<BR>
>  format.<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Sounds great, doesn't it?  :-)<BR>
>  <BR>
>  The problem is that I am not sure if I can share this with you. Since <BR>
> Imperium<BR>
>  Games folded, I do not know who to ask. Mr Miller himself? If so, at what<BR>
>  e-mail address?<BR>
>  <BR>
>  If I am allowed to share this with people, I would like help with locating<BR>
>  errors and misinterpretations on my part. In other words, I need someone <BR>
who<BR>
>  has used FF&S2 a lot to read through the document, and mail me comments.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 18:17:59 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Re SW Ep IV<BR>
<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
<BR>
>I had written:<BR>
>> Did anyone else find that Elizabeth reminded them of The<BR>
>> Godfather?<BR>
<BR>
You replied:<BR>
>I haven't seen it yet. But even so, I feel safe in saying<BR>
>that the "Virgin Queen" has a lot more class! And probably<BR>
<BR>
>more chutzpah.<BR>
<BR>
I was referring to the movies themselves, not the<BR>
characters.  Both movies concern the development of a<BR>
relatively innocent person into someone who can handle<BR>
politics and intrigue by whatever means are necessary.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Send instant messages & get email alerts with Yahoo! Messenger.<BR>
http://im.yahoo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 11:47:37 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
<BR>
Interesing news..<BR>
    Just saw on ET that Jason Alexander (Seinfeld co-star and voice of<BR>
Duckman) is going to star in the pilot for a Star Trek (looks to be TOS)<BR>
send-up called Star Patrol. The publicity shot I saw was a torso shot of<BR>
him in what appeared to be an Original Series polyester uniform. Scarey<BR>
neh?<BR>
<BR>
I wonder if he'll make it past the pilot?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 19:01:22 -0700<BR>
From: "Tsykoduk" <Tsykoduk@bigfoot.com><BR>
Subject: RE: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
I see Space Island One on my local PBS station (a rather british station)..<BR>
It is pretty good.. got some Trav ideas from it<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Leonard<BR>
Erickson<BR>
Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2000 5:49 AM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> One series that has caught my interest recently is "Space Island One"<BR>
...set<BR>
> in a TL:7M (8?) orbital that looks a lot like freedom with a grav wheel<BR>
> attached (more  for ease of production I think). It's no B5 or DS9 but SI1<BR>
> (What's with htese numbers?) has it's moments, a recent episode dealt<BR>
withe<BR>
> psych effects of a long duration deep space (to the asteroids. In a TL7/8<BR>
> ship). My only gripe is the timeslot...0130 (or 0200 depending on<BR>
> programmming) means I have a hard time staying awake.<BR>
<BR>
Pity that it's unlike to reach the states... There was a British(?) "Space<BR>
Cop" (or some such) series that I managed to see a few episodes of very<BR>
late at night. It seemed to have been done fairly well.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 04:49:00 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin writes:<BR>
<BR>
>It's possible that the Ancients just took Homo sapiens sapiens for<BR>
>servants, <BR>
<BR>
Not Homo sapiens sapiens. Just Homo [something] sapiens[*]. Nobody argues<BR>
that the various human races in the TU are the same SUBspecies. Just the same<BR>
species.<BR>
<BR>
[*] IMTU I use 'Homo antiquitus sapiens', which I hope will one day work its<BR>
    way into canon.<BR>
<BR>
>So the first step in your inquiry is, what were the intelligent primates<BR>
>on the different worlds?<BR>
<BR>
Since the Darrians, Zhodani, and Vilani are all canonically members of<BR>
Homo sapiens, they at least must originally have been H [something] sapiens.<BR>
There are no evidence that all 100-odd human settlements were H. sapiens,<BR>
but my personal belief is that they were. Well, maybe not every single one,<BR>
but most of them.<BR>
<BR>
>The next step is to ask what might have happened over<BR>
>300,000 years on that world.  On Earth, that's not a very<BR>
>long time for changes in appearance.  On other worlds --<BR>
>radiation is a factor you mentioned -- it might not be.<BR>
 <BR>
We have canonical evidence that for the Darrians, Vilani, and Zhodani the<BR>
changes were not enough to make them a different species. Differents<BR>
subspecies, yes, but not different species.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 20:32:51 -0700<BR>
From: "Bruce Macintosh" <bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net><BR>
Subject: TL9 surface-to-orbit craft (long) <BR>
<BR>
The illustrious Mr. Hudson sent me a copy of my old FFS1 TL9 interface craft<BR>
designs, so here they are for the benefit of the original requester. These are<BR>
for a<BR>
TL-9 no contra-grav universe, designed with FFS1 (which had somewhat<BR>
unrealistic<BR>
low-tech thrusters, I might note.)<BR>
<BR>
Somewhere out there are two TL9 fisson-rocket-powered FFS2 designs I once<BR>
did - if anyone has those, it would also be appreciated.<BR>
<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
- ---------------------<BR>
  As an exercise (and to go with some starship designs I'm working on) I<BR>
tried to design TL 9- (TL 9 without contragrav) ground-to-orbit shuttles.<BR>
It mostly worked, without breaking the FFS rules more than slightly.<BR>
The only major difference in fact was that I used the real delta-V<BR>
formula rather than the simplified FFS one<BR>
(see http://www.missouri.edu/~ccjoe/traveller/thrusters.html, especially the<BR>
article from cyhiggin@usa.pipeline.com, though her transfer orbit<BR>
formula looks wrong to me.) I did use FFS engines (see below.)<BR>
Ways in which the design changes with alternative rules, or CG, are also<BR>
discussed at the end.<BR>
<BR>
TL-8 versions of these designs would look almost identical; if anyone is<BR>
really interested in the subtle differences I can post them.<BR>
<BR>
The one major difference to published TNE rules is of course the delta-V<BR>
to orbit. The TNE rule-book number-of-G-hours to orbit, as has been noted,<BR>
are completely wrong. Delta V from earth's surface to a 150km orbit<BR>
is 8.00 km/s. (Not 0.64 G-hours, which is 22.5 km/s.) Getting back<BR>
from orbit requires much less delta-V, too; all you have to do is<BR>
change your orbit so it scrapes the atmosphere more, and then aerobrake<BR>
(like the Space Shuttle does.) This raises total delta-V to 8.04 km/s.<BR>
If you start near the equator delta-V goes down; 7.64 km/s is the figure<BR>
I used, appropriate for a 30-degree inclination takeoff.<BR>
For a size 9 world of normal density delta-V is 8.52 km/s, for a size 7, 6.72<BR>
km/s.<BR>
<BR>
These are delta-V in a vacuum and assuming very high instantaneous<BR>
acceleration. Real atmosphere and gravity complicate this somewhat.<BR>
FFS talks about non-CG spacecraft using 1-g of their thrust to negate<BR>
gravity until they reach orbit, which is spectacularly nonsensical, even by<BR>
GDW<BR>
standards. *Anything* that's moving is in an orbit; a thrown baseball is<BR>
in an orbit - just a *very* long and skinny elliptical orbit that<BR>
happens to intersect the Earth's surface. The trick for a rocket is to<BR>
make sure your orbit never actually reaches the ground. For finite<BR>
accelerations this means some amount of delta-V is spent going upwards as the<BR>
spacecraft lifts off, which is less efficient than a pure Hohmann<BR>
transfer orbit. In addition, you lose delta-V due to atmospheric friction.<BR>
Together these add about 1.5 km/s to the delta-V requirements for a classical<BR>
rocket, and require that the takeoff acceleration be significantly higher<BR>
than 1G.<BR>
<BR>
The shuttle designs below are horizontal-takeoff designs which use their<BR>
airbreathing AZHRAE engines for takeoff and to climb to high altitudes<BR>
(and, in the case of the first design, for some extra delta-V.) This is<BR>
similar<BR>
to the (now-cancelled) X-30 Aerospace Plane. This approach has been pretty<BR>
much abandoned in the real world, but FFS makes it easier to design than<BR>
most other single-stage-to-orbit designs (see below.) It also means that<BR>
the acceleration required of the engine is only 1G (or even less.) I've<BR>
allowed 0.6 km/s delta-V for remaining atmosphere drag (8.1 km/s round trip<BR>
to 150-km orbit from 30 degrees latitude), which is typical for the Pegasus<BR>
air-launched rocket. There's a huge range of operational parameter space for<BR>
these vehicles depending on the atmosphere, density and diameter of the world<BR>
they're operating on; I've designed for an Earthlike world.<BR>
<BR>
Terminology for those who don't have FFS: AZHRAE is the acronym<BR>
for a combination turbojet/ramjet/rocket engine. HRF is hydrogen<BR>
rocket fuel. HCD is hydrocarbon distillates (petrochemical fuels.)<BR>
EAPlaC is the incredibly efficient solid-rocket-like TL-9 engine in FFS,<BR>
normally used in missiles.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
TL-9 commercial single-stage-to-orbit airbreathing shuttle.<BR>
<BR>
General:<BR>
Displacement: 100 tons                  Hull Armor:1 (Internals stressed to<BR>
1G)<BR>
Length: 28m                             Volume: 1400 m^3<BR>
Price: MCr 32.39                        Target Size: S<BR>
Configuration: Cyl AF                   Tech Level: 9-<BR>
Mass: Loaded/Empty: 577.32/88.02<BR>
<BR>
Engineering Data:<BR>
Power Plant: 0.34 MW fuel cell (0.34 MW/hit), 8 hour duration at full power<BR>
G-rating: 1 (AZHRAE rocket mode), 0.66 (AZHRAE ramjet), 0.4 (AZHRAE turbojet)<BR>
          (gives maximum speed 1400 km/h with turbojet,  2324 km/h ramjet)<BR>
<BR>
G-turns: 7.36 km/s delta-V from rockets. 8 minutes turbojet flight<BR>
         2.2 minutes ramjet flight (0.64 km/s delta V, limited by maximum<BR>
         ramjet speed.) Total=8.0 km/s delta-V loaded, 12.5 km/s with no<BR>
cargo.<BR>
Fuel:    43.44 m^3 of HCD, 1086.18 m^3 of HRF<BR>
Maint:   141<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Electronics:<BR>
Computer: 2xTL-9 Mod Flt Computer (0.03 MW each)<BR>
Commo: 3000km radio (0.1 MW)<BR>
Avionics: TL-8 avionics (0.1 MW)<BR>
Sensors: Radar (3 km; 0.02 MW)<BR>
ECM/ECCM: None<BR>
Controls: 2xopen crewstations<BR>
<BR>
Armament: None<BR>
<BR>
Accommodations:<BR>
Life Support: Basic (0.02 MW), not covering fuel or engines<BR>
<BR>
Crew: 2 (1x Maneuver, 1xElectronics)<BR>
Crew Accommodations: none other than crewstations<BR>
Passenger Accommodations: 14 adequate seats<BR>
Cargo: 140 m^3 (120 tonnes)with one large cargo hatch<BR>
<BR>
Notes/operating mode:<BR>
  The shuttle takes off and lands like an aircraft. It uses 4 minutes of<BR>
turbojet fuel to take off and climb, then fires the ramjets for 2.2<BR>
minutes, accelerating to 0.64 km/s and punching through most of the<BR>
atmosphere, then firing the rockets for the rest of the trip to orbit.<BR>
It de-orbits with a brief rocket burn (0.05 km/s), aerobrakes like the<BR>
shuttle, glides most of the way to its landing sight, then activates<BR>
the turbojets for the last part of the landing. Enough turbojet fuel<BR>
is available for four minutes of full thrust at landing, but since it<BR>
weighs much less while landing and doesn't need to run the engines at<BR>
full thrust it can run for more than half an hour at 350km/h during<BR>
landing, a comfortable safety margin.<BR>
<BR>
  Operating costs are dominated by fuel (HRF costs Cr 1000<BR>
per m3.) Cost to orbit for commercial service would therefore be around<BR>
Cr 10,000 per tonne of cargo and 2,000 per passenger (possibly somewhat<BR>
less if there is enough traffic that shuttles always fly full both to<BR>
and from orbit.) Compare to the EAPlaC disposable discussed below -<BR>
shuttles would probably only be used for people and fragile/urgent cargoes.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
TL-9 exploration single-stage-to-orbit shuttle<BR>
<BR>
General:<BR>
Displacement: 100 tons                  Hull Armor:1 (stressed to 1.5 G)<BR>
Length: 28m                             Volume: 1400 m^3<BR>
Price: MCr 31.78                        Target Size: S<BR>
Configuration: Cyl AF/VTOL              Tech Level: 9-<BR>
Mass: Loaded/Empty: 445.94/92.17<BR>
<BR>
Engineering Data:<BR>
Power Plant: 0.94 MW MHD turbine (0.34 MW/hit), 8 hour fuel including oxygen<BR>
G-rating: 1.25 (AZHRAE rocket mode), 0.83 (AZHRAE ramjet)<BR>
          0.5 (AZHRAE turbojet)<BR>
          (gives maximum speed 1750 km/h with turbojet,  2920 km/h ramjet)<BR>
<BR>
G-turns: 8.17 km/s delta-V from rockets. 12.5 minutes turbojet flight.<BR>
         0 minutes ramjet flight. 8.17 km/s total delta-V fully loaded,<BR>
         11.0 with no cargo<BR>
<BR>
Fuel:    332.14 m^3 of LHyd for AZHRAE, 901.72 m^3 of HRF<BR>
Maint:   108<BR>
<BR>
Electronics:<BR>
Computer: 2xTL-9 Mod Flt Computer (0.03 MW each)<BR>
Commo: 3000km radio (0.1 MW), 1000 AU maser (0.6 MW)<BR>
Avionics: TL-8 avionics (0.1 MW)<BR>
Sensors: Radar (3 km; 0.02 MW), HRT (30 km)<BR>
ECM/ECCM: None<BR>
Controls: 2xopen crewstations<BR>
<BR>
Armament: None<BR>
<BR>
Accommodations:<BR>
Life Support: Basic (0.02 MW), not covering fuel or engines<BR>
Crew: 2 (1x Maneuver, 1xElectronics)<BR>
Crew Accommodations: none other than crewstations<BR>
Passenger Accommodations: 6 cramped seats<BR>
Cargo: 70 m^3 (60 tonnes) with one large cargo hatch<BR>
<BR>
Notes:<BR>
This version is designed for field operations on unexplored worlds.<BR>
It's VTOL-capable (Using the VTOL aircraft rules, this adds 10% to the hull<BR>
material volume, and requires a minimum acceleration of 0.5G, which the<BR>
turbojets satisfy.)<BR>
The AZHRAE engine burns hydrogen in its airbreathing modes rather than<BR>
hydrocarbons. Since hydrogen is so bulky, it's no longer efficient to use<BR>
the AZHRAE engine for any delta-V beyond that needed for takeoff and landing,<BR>
but this makes the shuttle completely field-refuellable.<BR>
<BR>
The shuttle normally starts in orbit, carried by a starship. It de-orbits<BR>
(0.05 km/s delta-V) and aerobrakes, then glides towards a carefully pre-<BR>
selected landing site. It activates the turbojets for 5 minutes at<BR>
0.1 G (350 km/h) to find the landing site, then 3 minutes of hovering at<BR>
0.5 G for landing. Vertical takeoff uses another 2 minutes of 0.5 G, then 5.5<BR>
minutes of full thrust are left to climb to altitude before firing the<BR>
rockets.<BR>
<BR>
For field refueling the shuttle would carry down a fission reactor<BR>
(60 tons) and then a fuel refining plant, modified to refine both<BR>
liquid hydrogen and liquid oxygen, and several fuel storage tanks.<BR>
Using some of its HRF tanks, and the cargo hold, for  plain liquid hydrogen<BR>
the shuttle can carry 295 m^3 to a 150-km orbit.<BR>
<BR>
Operating purely as an aircraft (with the HRF tanks full of hydrogen<BR>
for the turbojet) it has an endurance of about one hour, plus a margin for<BR>
vertical takeoff and landing.<BR>
<BR>
Since it only has one electronics operator, it can only operate a total of<BR>
two sensors or communicators at any time.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Notes:<BR>
<BR>
FFS engines have low thrust-to-weight but also lower fuel consumption than<BR>
the Real World. This is actually an advantage for craft like this one which<BR>
have quite low accelerations. Using more realistic engines (see the URL<BR>
above) bites heavily into the payload; designs are available if anyone is<BR>
really interested.<BR>
<BR>
One can argue that craft that aerobrake should have higher armor values<BR>
than normal craft, but one can also argue that AV=1 and especially the<BR>
internal structure is far heavier than real world craft needed, so I've<BR>
just left it at AV=1.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
EAPlaC:<BR>
<BR>
   These designs don't use EAPlaC for a variety of reasons:<BR>
(1) I started with the exploration shuttle, which needed to be completely<BR>
field-refuellable.<BR>
(2) I wanted them to be basically practical at TL-8<BR>
(3) I wanted the commercial shuttle to emphasize rapid turnaround, thinking<BR>
that this would decrease operations costs. (I was wrong.)<BR>
(4) Even though the rules implicitly assume EAPlaC rockets can be turned off<BR>
and re-ignited (unlike solid rockets in the real world), they're still a<BR>
type of solid, and no-one in their right mind uses solid rockets on a<BR>
manned vehicle. (The NASA Space Shuttle is a case in point.)<BR>
(5) EAPlaC is poorly-explained magic, not extrapolated technology.<BR>
<BR>
   However, EAPlaC has an *incredible* ISP. It's very tempting. If the safety<BR>
considerations don't apply, TL-9 shuttles would probably at least use<BR>
expendable strap-on EAPlaC boosters. A shuttle that gets part of its delta-V<BR>
4 ton (28 m^3) strap-on EAPlaC boosters can carry 390 tonnes into orbit at a<BR>
fuel cost of MCr 1; commercial shipping charges would be about Cr 2500 per<BR>
tonne.<BR>
<BR>
   Additionally, pure EAPlaC unmanned rockets would almost certainly dominate<BR>
the bulk cargo market, where safety is irrelevant. A 100-ton unmanned<BR>
disposable EAPlaC cargo carrier can carry 1280 tonnes into orbit, and costs<BR>
MCr 0.42! It's so cheap - dominated by fuel costs - that it's not even worth<BR>
reusing. Commercial cost to orbit would be about Cr 500 per tonne.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
The Real World:<BR>
<BR>
   In the real world, SSTO's are unlikely to look like this. Partially this<BR>
is because we don't know how to make an AZHRAE engine, and partially it's<BR>
because of various details like landing gear that FFS doesn't model.<BR>
Without AZHRAE engines horizontal takeoff has no advantages and in fact<BR>
is a net disadvantage, because you have to design the wings and landing<BR>
gear to lift the whole loaded weight of the spacecraft, not the empty weight.<BR>
<BR>
   Current SSTO paper designs are either VTHL (vertical-takeoff/horizontal<BR>
landing) rocket takeoff/glide-landers, kind of like the Space Shuttle with no<BR>
external  tank or boosters, or VTVL (vertical-takeoff/vertical landing) craft<BR>
which look a lot like 1950s science fiction and hover/land using thrust from<BR>
rocket engines (the DC-X and proposed follow-ons.) See sci.space.policy<BR>
and s.s.tech for perpetual debates as to which approach is better.<BR>
Neither works well with FFS engines. Also, a VTVL doesn't work very well<BR>
for a shuttle that starts in orbit - it has to land/hover while carrying<BR>
all the (heavy) fuel it needs to get back into orbit. Realistic rather than<BR>
FFS engines are better for these high thrust-to-weight designs, but they're<BR>
still very hard to do (I suspect because the interior structure mass in FFS is<BR>
too high for small craft.)<BR>
<BR>
Bruce<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2393<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Thursday, May 4 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2394<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Request assistance.<BR>
Re: Requesting old digests from archives<BR>
Re: Fuel Cells (drafty gearhead stuff v1.x, longish)<BR>
Re : Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When...<BR>
Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
SolSec Website<BR>
Re: Copyright question<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: SolSec Website<BR>
GT playtesting.<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: more design questions <BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: GT playtesting.<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: more design questions <BR>
Re: SolSec Website<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 20:30:50 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Request assistance.<BR>
<BR>
Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>
>The two Megatraveller computer games -- both written,<BR>
>though not coded, by Marc Miller, as I recall -- mention<BR>
>Jenghe.  I don't recall how much detail they provide.  The<BR>
>manuals for the games are full of background stuff like<BR>
>names of worlds in the various systems, cities, etc.<BR>
><BR>
>--Glenn<BR>
<BR>
Bless you!  I've tracked down the games and one of the manuals (the <BR>
other has a broken link problem) at Underdog.org.  Thanks for the <BR>
help, now I can at least get a start on the canon stuff for the site. <BR>
(www.europa.com/~raller/jenghe.html)<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
(aka Cheryl)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 22:38:17 -0500<BR>
From: tim@premier.net<BR>
Subject: Re: Requesting old digests from archives<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> << I hate to say this, but I can't find the damn things. Is the TML archived<BR>
>  anywhere?<BR>
> <BR>
>  Bruce<BR>
>   >><BR>
> <BR>
> You can request recent issues of the TML digest from the listserver.<BR>
> Simply send an email to:<BR>
> <BR>
> majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> <BR>
> and in the text of the message (NOT THE SUBJECT LINE) say:<BR>
> <BR>
> get traveller-digest v1999.n2256<BR>
> <BR>
> (substituting the volume and issue you require).<BR>
> <BR>
> The listserver then sends the requested archive to you as an email.<BR>
> <BR>
> There are other archives of the TML on the web, but I find this to be more<BR>
>       convenient as I have limited web access.<BR>
> <BR>
About the internet archives where are they and how organized are <BR>
they?<BR>
Tim Reynolds<BR>
tim@premier.net <BR>
225-334-5063<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable <BR>
sexual disease.  It made you unsuitable for <BR>
a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.<BR>
<BR>
Terry Pratchett <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 13:39:31 +1000<BR>
From: "Robert O'Connor" <robocon@ozemail.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Fuel Cells (drafty gearhead stuff v1.x, longish)<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote :-<BR>
> A friend just mailed me reference to an article on making fuel cells<BR>
> using micromachining techinques from chip production. This will shoot<BR>
> the minimum size figures all to hell...<BR>
<BR>
Please send me a copy of the reference ; this sounds *very* interesting.<BR>
<BR>
I should have been a little more explicit ; I wrote :-<BR>
> min size in m3 (below this volume, power density is 0.1 that stated).<BR>
<BR>
A mesoscale or microscale fuel cell is certainly possible, but it's not<BR>
all that energetic.<BR>
[FWIW, I think that having 'absolute' and 'diminishing returns' minimum<BR>
sizes for components is the way to go for some hypothetical future<BR>
design system]. <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor<BR>
Medico, Gamer<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 13:41:21 +1000<BR>
From: "Robert O'Connor" <robocon@ozemail.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re : Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
<BR>
Over on the Trav-Culture list (sadly dormant), the working model for<BR>
Vland was as follows :-<BR>
<BR>
Star: Urakkalan<BR>
  Type: F8V                             Inner edge : 0.242AU<BR>
  Temperature: 6160 K                   Life zone : 1.396 to 1.911AU<BR>
  Luminosity: 2.16 sols                 Snow line : 7.348 AU<BR>
  Mass: 1.21 sols                       Outer edge : 48.4 AU<BR>
  Age: 4 billion years<BR>
  Stable life: 5.28 billion years<BR>
<BR>
* Vland<BR>
- - Planetary Data :-<BR>
Solar Tidal effect: 0.29878<BR>
Mean orbital distance : 1.276 AU<BR>
Orbital period : 478.72 standard days<BR>
Orbital eccentricity : 0.05<BR>
Rotation period : 22.93 standard hours <BR>
(local day 22.975 standard hours)<BR>
Axial tilt : 30 degrees<BR>
Diameter: 14,400 km<BR>
Density: 5.5g/cm3<BR>
Mass: 1.458 earth<BR>
Surface Gravity: 1.1322G<BR>
Atmospheric pressure: 0.90576 atmospheres<BR>
Atmosphere type: Oxygen/Nitrogen (16% O, 83% N, 1% other)<BR>
Hydrosphere: 74%, water oceans<BR>
Albedo: 0.34<BR>
Greenhouse effect: 8%<BR>
Average surface temp: 17.43 C<BR>
<BR>
Moons: 1 Small, 2 Large<BR>
Alaag: 320 km Dia, orbit 50,400 km, density 4.8g/cm3, mass 0.000014<BR>
       Tidal force nil orbital period 1.08 standard days<BR>
Zakig: 1600 km Dia, orbit 288,000 km, density 4.3g/cm3, mass 0.00156<BR>
       Tidal force 0.03745 orbital period 14.79 standard days<BR>
Pamli: 4000 km Dia, orbit 504,000 km, density 5.8g/cm3, mass 0.03295<BR>
       Tidal force 1.29716 orbital period 33.88 standard days<BR>
<BR>
The conclusion reached was that gravitational and atmospheric pressure<BR>
effects would almost balance each other out, so Vilani would be a little<BR>
shorter and stockier on the average, but the slightly larger chest<BR>
size would tend to restore 'familiar' proportions.<BR>
<BR>
The weather on this version of Vland would be somewhat more dynamic than<BR>
Earth's due to the greater insolation and axial tilt. <BR>
The big obstacle to the development and continued survival of life was<BR>
felt to be increased levels of [primarily] ultraviolet radiation (the<BR>
geological background being roughly the same). <BR>
<BR>
A provisional workaround for this was local life being partly based on<BR>
peptide-backed nucleic acids (PNAs) and an alternate genetic code,<BR>
leading to the canonical idea that local viruses couldn't infect the<BR>
Vilani. Bacterial colonisation (as opposed to infection) is still<BR>
possible, however, so I disagree with William Hostman on that point. <BR>
<BR>
> if there is enough difference in insolation and<BR>
> radiation spectrum, it will shape epidermal coloration, elasticicty,<BR>
> weathering patterns, and cancer and mutation rates.<BR>
> <BR>
Agreed. More melanin, more rapid development of wrinkling and loss of<BR>
elasticity, far more skin cancers until everyone is deeply pigmented<BR>
(at which stage the incidence falls dramatically, but remains well<BR>
above zero).<BR>
<BR>
There could be an environmental link between ultraviolet flux and the<BR>
development of other malignancies (e.g. perhaps some of the [protective]<BR>
pigments in local plant life are carcinogenic [via direct mechanisms or<BR>
free radical formation or immunosuppression], leading to tumours of<BR>
the gastrointestinal tract, etc).<BR>
<BR>
My back-of-the-envelope calculation would lead me to increase Vland's<BR>
average radiation background to 200 millirems a year, double that of<BR>
Earth's.<BR>
<BR>
It was felt that local life's mutation rate would be slowed because of<BR>
the stability of PNA. IMHO, the mutation rate of the Vilani would _not_<BR>
appreciably increase on account of radiation alone (the natives of the<BR>
Mato Grosso, the Andes and the Himalayas are not significantly different<BR>
biologically to the rest of us, despite background radiation levels<BR>
approaching the "reactor worker's limit" of 400 millirems per year).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor<BR>
Medico, Gamer<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 20:33:26 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I remember that one...the alien prosthetics were *very* well done.<BR>
> IMO I think a lot of the work was done by the guy wo did Thunderbirds<BR>
> ( the original, not the anime) interesting premise...SSTO cop<BR>
> cars... multi-species world... imagine NYPD Blue with a Vargr from<BR>
> the vice/drugs squad (who needs sniffer dogs?)...hiver detectives<BR>
> (get that curiosity working!) and perhaps a K'Kree mounted<BR>
> division?<lol> .  Of course having Zhodani cops would take all the<BR>
> fun out of it.<BR>
<BR>
Keep the Vargr (btw, the nose helps with vice as well as drugs) and the<BR>
Hiver. And add Aslan SWAT teams. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 20:43:52 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When...<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
>><BR>
>>How about trying to use the machines of this era to run<BR>
>>starships?<BR>
>>Captain: Computer, prepare jump calculations...<BR>
>>Computer Officer: Sorry Cap'n, the punchcards are all on<BR>
>>the floor and the tubes are blowing left and right...I<BR>
>>have a pencil and some paper...'twould probably be <BR>
>>faster...<BR>
><BR>
> This reminds me of two books, We All Died at Breakaway<BR>
> Station (by Meredith?) and Starman Jones.  We All Died has<BR>
> the classic line, "A slide rule! A goddamned slide rule for<BR>
> navigation!" which is all the crew of a small craft have<BR>
> for computing power after being mauled by the enemy. <BR>
> Starman Jones has the astrogation department sitting down<BR>
> with paper and pencils and logarithmic tables and<BR>
> calculating the jump vectors, then seeing if everybody<BR>
> agrees on the calculations.  I'm not sure that these were<BR>
> not meant as satire even when written.<BR>
<BR>
Nope, Heinlein was quite serious about that. Remember *when* that was<BR>
written. The ship's computer was based on then current systems, which<BR>
were *before* they came up with the idea of *assemblers*, much less<BR>
*languages*. You programmed the things with plug boards and pure<BR>
machine code, punched in in *octal*.<BR>
<BR>
So losing the computer  wasn't *quite* as unrecoverable as it was then.<BR>
<BR>
The method he described was how he and his with did all the required<BR>
orbital calcs for some of his earlier books, such as Space Cadet. They<BR>
spent 3 *days* calculating the transfer orbit for the shuttle flight<BR>
from the testing area to the station that housed the Academy.<BR>
<BR>
Before *electronic* computers became generally available (mid to late<BR>
50s) a "computer" was a *person* who made their living doing (or<BR>
supervising) that sort of complicated math for engineering firms and<BR>
theoreticians. <BR>
<BR>
The "supervising" involved breaking the problem down into a series of<BR>
arithmetical operations that could be assigned to groups of clerks with<BR>
adding machines or mechanical calculators (motor driven, 10 place<BR>
input, 10 place "register", 20 place "output"). They'd do each set of<BR>
calcs 3 times, with seperate groups of clerks, and repeat if all three<BR>
didn't agree.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 20:39:43 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 10:46 PM 5/2/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>>Both of these megatraveller adventures are available<BR>
>>at the following link along with downloads of the text<BR>
>>documentation:<BR>
>><BR>
>>http://underdogs.gamingdepot.com/Paragon.htm<BR>
><BR>
> I'd down;oad them, but I have no idea what a .rar file extension is.  Any<BR>
> help here?<BR>
<BR>
RAR is a popular archive program. Do you need the DOS version, Windows<BR>
version or OS/2 version?<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 14:08:20 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> In mail you write:<BR>
><BR>
> > I remember that one...the alien prosthetics were *very* well done.<BR>
> > IMO I think a lot of the work was done by the guy wo did Thunderbirds<BR>
> > ( the original, not the anime) interesting premise...SSTO cop<BR>
> > cars... multi-species world... imagine NYPD Blue with a Vargr from<BR>
> > the vice/drugs squad (who needs sniffer dogs?)...hiver detectives<BR>
> > (get that curiosity working!) and perhaps a K'Kree mounted<BR>
> > division?<lol> .  Of course having Zhodani cops would take all the<BR>
> > fun out of it.<BR>
><BR>
> Keep the Vargr (btw, the nose helps with vice as well as drugs) and the<BR>
> Hiver. And add Aslan SWAT teams.<BR>
<BR>
Who would we get for Internal Affairs?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 21:36:28 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: SolSec Website<BR>
<BR>
Greetings all,<BR>
<BR>
I just turned on the SolSec website <http://solsec.org>.<BR>
<BR>
There is only a bit posted so far, with lots of material that needs to be<BR>
converted to html.  I'm interested in getting input from any Rim players out<BR>
there.  I'm also looking for other Canon material besides The Solomani alien<BR>
module.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks<BR>
<BR>
Tod<BR>
- --<BR>
"Everything I need to know, I learned from<BR>
killing smart people and eating their brains."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 20:55:24 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm certainly no copyright lawyer, but my understanding on the matter is as <BR>
> long as you aren't trying to make money on it, not taking credit for it <BR>
> (with <BR>
> the exception of what you've added) and you're not trying to give away <BR>
> entire <BR>
> copies of the book (god forbid you infringe on anyone's profits, thems <BR>
> hangin <BR>
> offenses pardner) then i think its ok.<BR>
<BR>
Nope. Merely making a copy for a third party is illegal, whether or not<BR>
any money is involved. Penalties *start* at around $100 *per copy*. And<BR>
can go as high as $10k!<BR>
<BR>
Making copies for your *own* use is legal (in spite of what many<BR>
software and recording companies would like you to believe). <BR>
<BR>
Partial copies have to be *very* partial, and used only in certain ways<BR>
(mostly for reviews). <BR>
<BR>
Making stuff *based* on someone's copyrighted work is also illegal. <BR>
<BR>
As an example of this, way back when someone on the Borland forum on<BR>
Compuserve worked out a set of patches for the Borland Grafix Toolbox<BR>
to make it use BGI files instead of hard coded drivers. The only way he<BR>
was able to distribute it was as a script to be fed to EDLIN (think of<BR>
it as a set of Macros telling the editor what lines to replace, delete<BR>
or insert). All the other methods involved distributing portions of the<BR>
code to be changed.  Which wasn't legal.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 00:46:32 -0400<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
At 02:08 PM 5/4/00 +1000, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> > In mail you write:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > > I remember that one...the alien prosthetics were *very* well done.<BR>
> > > IMO I think a lot of the work was done by the guy wo did Thunderbirds<BR>
> > > ( the original, not the anime) interesting premise...SSTO cop<BR>
> > > cars... multi-species world... imagine NYPD Blue with a Vargr from<BR>
> > > the vice/drugs squad (who needs sniffer dogs?)...hiver detectives<BR>
> > > (get that curiosity working!) and perhaps a K'Kree mounted<BR>
> > > division?<lol> .  Of course having Zhodani cops would take all the<BR>
> > > fun out of it.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Keep the Vargr (btw, the nose helps with vice as well as drugs) and the<BR>
> > Hiver. And add Aslan SWAT teams.<BR>
><BR>
>Who would we get for Internal Affairs?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Make Zho IA, and we'd get honest cops!  What a concept!<BR>
<BR>
(No slight intended on any actual LEO out there.  Just pandering to the <BR>
popular media images.)<BR>
<BR>
           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
	     Gearhead-in-Training<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Gerfalcon Enterprises - GURPS Traveller Ironmongery for the 5th Millenium<BR>
IMTU tc  t4+ tg++ tt? ru ge++ 3i+ c+ jt au@ st+ ls+ pi-(+)<BR>
	ta- he+ kk-- hi+ as++ va++ dr+ so+ zh++ vi+ 0601<BR>
jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
                          			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
for PGP public-key and<BR>
more quotes,  http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
Traveller WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/Traveller/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 00:47:32 -0400<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: SolSec Website<BR>
<BR>
At 09:36 PM 5/3/00 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>Greetings all,<BR>
><BR>
>I just turned on the SolSec website <http://solsec.org>.<BR>
><BR>
>There is only a bit posted so far, with lots of material that needs to be<BR>
>converted to html.  I'm interested in getting input from any Rim players out<BR>
>there.  I'm also looking for other Canon material besides The Solomani alien<BR>
>module.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
The Rim sourcebook for GT is coming soon (it's in playtest now)<BR>
<BR>
           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
                          			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
for PGP public-key and<BR>
more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/                <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 14:55:35 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: GT playtesting.<BR>
<BR>
How do I get on the GT playtest list?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 09:36:02 +0100<BR>
From: Timothy.Collinson@solent.ac.uk<BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se> wrote about 'Nordic' and the word<BR>
'lagom'.<BR>
(I missed the original post being on holiday so forgive me I've<BR>
misunderstood).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
> I Think You Mean Swedish. Hope This Helps. Have A Nice Day.<BR>
<BR>
Jens replied:<BR>
>I am pretty sure I mean Swedish (check my e-mail address and realize why),<BR>
but<BR>
>the concept exists at least in Norweigan as well.  ;-)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I don't know if this helps but I presume, Jens, that Matt was politely<BR>
objecting to the use of describing the word 'lagom' as coming from 'Nordic'<BR>
languages.  As I understand it, 'Nordic' includes Finland as well as other<BR>
Scandinavian countries - and by extension their languages.  (I have it on<BR>
good authority - several Finns - that Finland is NOT part part of<BR>
Scandinavia).  I'm fairly sure that Finnish *doesn't* have the word 'lagom'<BR>
or similar and thus it could be described as Scandinavian but not Nordic.<BR>
<BR>
Does that help any?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
OB TRAV: one world on the edge of a loose confederation of worlds is often<BR>
mistaken by those from elsewhere as being part of the confedaration.<BR>
However, culturally and linguistically they are very different and resent<BR>
the 'confusion'.<BR>
<BR>
The PCs make the mistake of describing a passenger's origin slightly<BR>
incorrectly and receiving a half hour lecture on just what their error is.<BR>
<BR>
tc<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:06:39 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: more design questions <BR>
<BR>
> From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
> Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
> How good is your PD going to be vs a 6000 m/s gauss KEAP penetrator?<BR>
> That's the top end for MDs in FFS1, and I imagine that most anti tank<BR>
> weapons will have muzzle velocities up around there.<BR>
<BR>
By TL12, not too bad. Note that this is 4-5 TLs from it's initial<BR>
introduction on wet navy ships to knock out slow missiles.<BR>
<BR>
> > My draft Improved Point Defense Rules allowed for helmet-mounted PD by<BR>
> > about TL12.<BR>
><BR>
> BTW what effect do your improved energy storage rules have on ESA<BR>
> armour? It works on High Energy Weapons, and might be small enough to<BR>
> fit on battledress, especially if the HPGs, etc can be made lighter.<BR>
<BR>
High-Performance Accumulators have a limit of 0.5*(TL^2) kilojoules, so they<BR>
arent really useful for ESA - ESA tends to be measured in megajoules.<BR>
<BR>
Do people want me to re-post the HPA and Improved Point Defense rules ?<BR>
<BR>
Ian<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 00:25:54 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>> In mail you write:<BR>
>><BR>
>> > I remember that one...the alien prosthetics were *very* well done.<BR>
>> > IMO I think a lot of the work was done by the guy wo did Thunderbirds<BR>
>> > ( the original, not the anime) interesting premise...SSTO cop<BR>
>> > cars... multi-species world... imagine NYPD Blue with a Vargr from<BR>
>> > the vice/drugs squad (who needs sniffer dogs?)...hiver detectives<BR>
>> > (get that curiosity working!) and perhaps a K'Kree mounted<BR>
>> > division?<lol> .  Of course having Zhodani cops would take all the<BR>
>> > fun out of it.<BR>
>><BR>
>> Keep the Vargr (btw, the nose helps with vice as well as drugs) and the<BR>
>> Hiver. And add Aslan SWAT teams.<BR>
><BR>
> Who would we get for Internal Affairs?<BR>
<BR>
Vilani. Damn Bureaucrats....<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:04:01 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: GT playtesting.<BR>
<BR>
Robert Houghton wrote:<BR>
> How do I get on the GT playtest list?<BR>
<BR>
You become a pyramid subscriber.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.sjgames.com/pyramid/<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:11:52 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
Timothy.Collinson@solent.ac.uk wrote:<BR>
> I don't know if this helps but I presume, Jens, that Matt was politely<BR>
> objecting to the use of describing the word 'lagom' as coming from 'Nordic'<BR>
> languages.  As I understand it, 'Nordic' includes Finland as well as other<BR>
> Scandinavian countries - and by extension their languages.  (I have it on<BR>
> good authority - several Finns - that Finland is NOT part part of<BR>
> Scandinavia).  I'm fairly sure that Finnish *doesn't* have the word 'lagom'<BR>
> or similar and thus it could be described as Scandinavian but not Nordic.<BR>
<BR>
Duh!<BR>
<BR>
I should have written "Scandinavian languages." Silly me.<BR>
<BR>
> OB TRAV: one world on the edge of a loose confederation of worlds is often<BR>
> mistaken by those from elsewhere as being part of the confedaration.<BR>
> However, culturally and linguistically they are very different and resent<BR>
> the 'confusion'.<BR>
<BR>
This would apply to most citizens of the various client states, who are<BR>
probably very protective about the parts of their own cultural identity that<BR>
remain. Assuming that they are Imperial citizens would not be a Good Thing.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 23:13:16 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: more design questions <BR>
<BR>
On 4 May 00, at 18:06, Katharine Whitchurch wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> > From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
> > Subject: Re: more design questions<BR>
> > How good is your PD going to be vs a 6000 m/s gauss KEAP penetrator?<BR>
> > That's the top end for MDs in FFS1, and I imagine that most anti tank<BR>
> > weapons will have muzzle velocities up around there.<BR>
> <BR>
> By TL12, not too bad. Note that this is 4-5 TLs from it's initial<BR>
> introduction on wet navy ships to knock out slow missiles.<BR>
> <BR>
> > > My draft Improved Point Defense Rules allowed for helmet-mounted PD by<BR>
> > > about TL12.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > BTW what effect do your improved energy storage rules have on ESA<BR>
> > armour? It works on High Energy Weapons, and might be small enough to<BR>
> > fit on battledress, especially if the HPGs, etc can be made lighter.<BR>
> <BR>
> High-Performance Accumulators have a limit of 0.5*(TL^2) kilojoules, so<BR>
> they arent really useful for ESA - ESA tends to be measured in megajoules.<BR>
> <BR>
> Do people want me to re-post the HPA and Improved Point Defense rules ?<BR>
<BR>
Please. I think I may have missed at least the HPA rules, and I can't <BR>
recall what you were using for your PD systems. <BR>
<BR>
Hmm. I wonder how much power it'd take to break up a plasma slug. <BR>
Hitting it should be any problem, as they only go at about 10km/s - not <BR>
a lot faster than a MD shell.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:19:11 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: SolSec Website<BR>
<BR>
Tod Glenn wrote:<BR>
> I just turned on the SolSec website <http://solsec.org>.<BR>
> <BR>
> There is only a bit posted so far, with lots of material that needs to be<BR>
> converted to html.  I'm interested in getting input from any Rim players out<BR>
> there.  I'm also looking for other Canon material besides The Solomani alien<BR>
> module.<BR>
<BR>
Nice layout. Clean AND beautiful. Rather rare these days...<BR>
<BR>
Just curious... is that the canon logo for the Confederation and/or SolSec ?<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 12:38:08 +0100<BR>
From: Phil Kitching <postmark.design@btinternet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
"Greg Aldridge" <Greg.Aldridge@marconicomms.com> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>> I remember that one...the alien prosthetics were *very* well done. IMO I<BR>
think<BR>
>a<BR>
>> lot of the work was done by the guy wo did Thunderbirds ( the original, not<BR>
>the<BR>
>> anime) interesting premise...SSTO cop cars...multi-species world...<BR>
><BR>
>And it was called "Space Precinct".<BR>
<BR>
Space Precinct was Gerry Anderson's recent live action thing. I can't<BR>
remember if<BR>
they made series 2.<BR>
<BR>
Space Cop was a BBC production many years before, far less effects (far<BR>
less budget)<BR>
and I think it was near future (no aliens). There were only a couple of<BR>
episodes - <BR>
possibly only a single multipart story. <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching<BR>
- --<BR>
  http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>
  Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>
 "Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2394<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2395</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Thursday, May 4 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2395<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: GT playtesting.<BR>
alien cops<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
Thanks etc.<BR>
RE: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: Thanks etc.<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
Re: Piloting Skill<BR>
Re: SolSec Website<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
The Creature from Aliens...<BR>
When's the next BFB compilation coming out?<BR>
Re: When's the next BFB compilation coming out?<BR>
Re: GT playtesting.<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
RE: Thanks etc.<BR>
Re: SolSec Website<BR>
Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
RE: Thanks etc.<BR>
Re: Copyright question<BR>
OT: UK vs US SFTV (was Re: Thanks etc.)<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 21:48:50 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: GT playtesting.<BR>
<BR>
I used to have a life suscription to ADQ...when Everything Changed this was<BR>
transferred to Pyramid...moved a few times and lost track (this was mid 90's...to<BR>
change address I had to fax them) and they lost track of me. I wonder if I could<BR>
reconnect with them?<BR>
<BR>
rob<BR>
<BR>
Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Robert Houghton wrote:<BR>
> > How do I get on the GT playtest list?<BR>
><BR>
> You become a pyramid subscriber.<BR>
><BR>
> http://www.sjgames.com/pyramid/<BR>
><BR>
> +--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
> |                                      |                                       |<BR>
> | Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
> | Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
> | Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
> | ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
> |                                      |                                       |<BR>
> +--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 08:04:24 EDT<BR>
From: TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
Subject: alien cops<BR>
<BR>
> Keep the Vargr (btw, the nose helps with vice as well as drugs) and the<BR>
> Hiver. And add Aslan SWAT teams.<BR>
<BR>
Who would we get for Internal Affairs?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
The Zhodani, of course...<BR>
;)<BR>
Roger<BR>
TravelerGM@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:08:08 +0100 <BR>
From: Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Hans Rancke-Madsen [mailto:rancke@diku.dk]<BR>
> Sent: Thursday, May 04, 2000 3:49 AM<BR>
> To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
> Subject: Re: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> Glenn Goffin writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> >It's possible that the Ancients just took Homo sapiens sapiens for<BR>
> >servants, <BR>
> <BR>
> Not Homo sapiens sapiens. Just Homo [something] sapiens[*]. <BR>
<BR>
I thought it was Genus Species Subspecies, i.e. Homo sapiens [something]<BR>
<BR>
We are Homo sapiens sapiens, Neanderthals used to be called Homo<BR>
neanderthalensis, but are now often reclassified as Homo sapiens<BR>
neanderthalensis<BR>
<BR>
> Nobody argues<BR>
> that the various human races in the TU are the same <BR>
> SUBspecies. Just the same<BR>
> species.<BR>
> <BR>
> [*] IMTU I use 'Homo antiquitus sapiens', which I hope will <BR>
> one day work its<BR>
>     way into canon.<BR>
<BR>
Call it Homo sapiens antiquitus and I'll support it <g><BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:23:05 +0100<BR>
From: CGS <michael@carrickfergus.schoolzone.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Thanks etc.<BR>
<BR>
Many thanks for the font suggestions, I now have an Optima clone<BR>
installed and a few new font sites bookmarked.<BR>
<BR>
Spacecops was made by the BBC, it ran for one season, but remember a<BR>
British season seems to be much shorter than an American one so they<BR>
might only have been six episodes or so. I liked it as well, nice low<BR>
tech SF.<BR>
<BR>
Blake's 7 is being rerun by the BBC on Saturdays, usuallly in a rotten,<BR>
and variable, slot (11.45 on the 6th I believe). Sometimes very clever,<BR>
but often awful, but still the Liberator and the pursuit ships are<BR>
lovely.<BR>
<BR>
Michael<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:35:37 +0100 <BR>
From: Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Timothy.Collinson@solent.ac.uk<BR>
><BR>
> Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se> wrote about 'Nordic' <BR>
> and the word<BR>
> 'lagom'.<BR>
> (I missed the original post being on holiday so forgive me I've<BR>
> misunderstood).<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
> > I Think You Mean Swedish. Hope This Helps. Have A Nice Day.<BR>
> <BR>
> Jens replied:<BR>
> >I am pretty sure I mean Swedish (check my e-mail address and <BR>
> realize why),<BR>
> but<BR>
> >the concept exists at least in Norweigan as well.  ;-)<BR>
> <BR>
> <BR>
> I don't know if this helps but I presume, Jens, that Matt was politely<BR>
> objecting to the use of describing the word 'lagom' as coming <BR>
> from 'Nordic'<BR>
<BR>
actually I was replying to a post from Jens querying the abbreviations<BR>
used by Martin Hardgrave in an earlier reply to Jens in the same thread.<BR>
<BR>
Jens wrote:<BR>
> Martin Hardgrave replied to my post:<BR>
> > >Most of the Nordic languages have one such example: the<BR>
word/concept "lagom"<BR>
> >              ^^^^^^<BR>
> > ITYM Swedish HTH HAND<BR>
> I am sorry, but I do not understand your reply. Too many weird<BR>
abbreviations for my taste ;-)<BR>
> Could you please repeat, but in layman's terms? Or English?<BR>
<BR>
I then replied with my interpretation of *Martins* abbreviations... <BR>
<BR>
> I Think You Mean Swedish. Hope This Helps. Have A Nice Day.<BR>
<BR>
<snip Finland being Nordic, but not Scandinavian><BR>
<BR>
I don't personally think of Finland when I think of Nordic, but I<BR>
suppose it depends on how you define Nordic and what context you use it<BR>
in. If using it to refer to racial appearance (i.e. tall, slim, fine<BR>
blond hair, blue eyes etc) then yes, I suppose many Finns may be<BR>
"Nordic". If you are using Nordic in a Linguistic sense, to me that<BR>
defines the places/people who spoke Norse or a descendent thereof. In<BR>
which case Finns aren't "Nordic"...<BR>
<BR>
YMMV<BR>
<BR>
Matt<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 22:35:08 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Thanks etc.<BR>
<BR>
CGS wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Many thanks for the font suggestions, I now have an Optima clone<BR>
> installed and a few new font sites bookmarked.<BR>
><BR>
> Spacecops was made by the BBC, it ran for one season, but remember a<BR>
> British season seems to be much shorter than an American one so they<BR>
> might only have been six episodes or so. I liked it as well, nice low<BR>
> tech SF.<BR>
><BR>
> Blake's 7 is being rerun by the BBC on Saturdays, usuallly in a rotten,<BR>
> and variable, slot (11.45 on the 6th I believe). Sometimes very clever,<BR>
> but often awful, but still the Liberator and the pursuit ships are<BR>
> lovely.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
By the gods I wish the A(ustralian)BC had rerun rights to this. I was too<BR>
young to appreciate it when it first came on.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
BTW...what are the major differences (in your opinion)  between European<BR>
and American SF shows?<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 09:06:38 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman writes:<BR>
<snipped><BR>
>>What traits are good when just about everything can't be processed by<BR>
>>your digestive system without being heavily refined first?<BR>
>intelligence, longevity, ability to host local organic microbes which can<BR>
>break the native foods down into useable amino acids and protiens (which we<BR>
>know isn't the case for the vilani), resistance to deprivation (so<BR>
>typically fat cells and water retention)<BR>
<BR>
	I'm not sure that intelligence would be any more advantageous on<BR>
	Vland than on Terra, but I suppose that it might be.  With restricted<BR>
	levels of food availability, that power-intensive central nervous<BR>
	system is going to be a serious drain on your body.  What advantage do<BR>
	you propose for longevity?  Having local microbes do your digestive<BR>
	work for you is a definite possibility, perhaps done outside of the<BR>
	body (imagine stinking vats of something between wood pulp and yoghurt).<BR>
	Resistence to deprivation is not something that I would have included.<BR>
	This is something that might be associated with 'feast and famine'<BR>
	situations rather than generally low food availability.<BR>
<BR>
>>Would the type of star Vland orbits have an effect on evolution?<BR>
>H*ll YES! Differences in eye and skin coloration are fast on the<BR>
>evolutionary track, and if there is enough difference in insolation and<BR>
>radiation spectrum, it will shape epidermal coloration, elasticicty,<BR>
>weathering patterns, and cancer and mutation rates.<BR>
<snipped><BR>
<BR>
	All true, but the increased mutation rate may not be all that important.<BR>
	Even under strong selection in the laboratory, ample 'mutations' are<BR>
	available in species here on Terra.  I would guess that an increased<BR>
	mutation rate would not appreciably change the rate of human evolution<BR>
	on Vland.  Increased cancer rates might put a premium on early<BR>
	maturation and reproduction, and possibly decreased lifespan.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 09:28:43 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Piloting Skill<BR>
<BR>
Eris Reddoch writes:<BR>
>Ian Ferguson wrote:<BR>
>>This allows me a reason to let Pilot be used as Ship's Boat -1,<BR>
>>but not be so generous with the other skills.  Still, a jet<BR>
>>aircraft pilot is likely to be better than I at controlling a<BR>
>>small craft.<BR>
>Hum, IYTU, then would we see something like this?<BR>
>To "Drive" a Starship.<BR>
>  Routine, Pilot or Ship's Boat-1,...<BR>
<BR>
	I treat Pilot skill as more difficult to learn, so I would<BR>
	allow Pilot or Ship's Boat-2 (not including using the jump<BR>
	drive, of course)<BR>
<BR>
>To "Drive" a Ship's Boat.<BR>
>  Routine, Ship's Boat or Pilot-1 or Air/raft-1,...<BR>
<BR>
	Again, I treat Ship's Boat as more difficult to learn than<BR>
	Air/raft, and I also see the difference between Air/raft<BR>
	and Ship's Boat skill being bigger than the difference<BR>
	between Ship's Boat and Pilot.  I guess that I would give<BR>
	a character with Air/raft skill (regardless of level) a<BR>
	'skill' of -3 in Ship's Boat.<BR>
<BR>
>To "Drive" an Air/raft.<BR>
>  Routine, Air/raft or Ship's Boat-1,...<BR>
<BR>
	As above, someone with Ship's Boat skill might have a 'skill'<BR>
	of -2 in Air/raft.<BR>
<BR>
>That looks reasonable to me, and gives a good reason to learn Ship's<BR>
>Boat as it defaults both up and down.<BR>
<BR>
	I think that either interpretation is reasonable.  My take is<BR>
	that not all skills are created equal.  Sophonts learn Ship's<BR>
	Boat because that's all they need, that's all they can afford,<BR>
	that's all they have time for, that's all they have access to,<BR>
	or that's what they are good at (I have required/advantageous<BR>
	Dex for Ship's Boat, Int for Pilot).  If I had to ascribe point<BR>
	values to these skills, Pilot would be worth more.<BR>
<BR>
	Of course, small DMs can be nasty when piloting a space vehicle.<BR>
	I figure that a character would have to roll 3+ on 2D+Pilot to<BR>
	avoid crashing a starship into the starport when docking.  This<BR>
	means that someone with Ship's Boat 1 has a 1 in 12 chance of<BR>
	doing serious damage to his ship and the dock every time that he<BR>
	tries to dock.  You might attempt this in an emergency, but I<BR>
	wouldn't recomend it as standard procedure.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 06:36:02 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: SolSec Website<BR>
<BR>
on 5/4/00 4:19 AM, Jens Rydholm at jenry023@student.liu.se wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Tod Glenn wrote:<BR>
>> I just turned on the SolSec website <http://solsec.org>.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> There is only a bit posted so far, with lots of material that needs to be<BR>
>> converted to html.  I'm interested in getting input from any Rim players out<BR>
>> there.  I'm also looking for other Canon material besides The Solomani alien<BR>
>> module.<BR>
> <BR>
> Nice layout. Clean AND beautiful. Rather rare these days...<BR>
> <BR>
> Just curious... is that the canon logo for the Confederation and/or SolSec ?<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
Confederation logo is from the Solomani Alien module.  I built the SolSec<BR>
Logo.  I don't know if there is a 'canon' logo for SolSec.  Data seems a bit<BR>
lean (which is OK, since I have a ton of generated stuff to post).<BR>
<BR>
Tod<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Everything I need to know, I learned from<BR>
killing smart people and eating their brains."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 09:39:44 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
<BR>
Hans Rancke-Madsen writes:<BR>
>>It's possible that the Ancients just took Homo sapiens sapiens for<BR>
>>servants, <BR>
>Not Homo sapiens sapiens. Just Homo [something] sapiens[*]. Nobody argues<BR>
>that the various human races in the TU are the same SUBspecies. Just the same<BR>
>species.<BR>
>[*] IMTU I use 'Homo antiquitus sapiens', which I hope will one day work its<BR>
>    way into canon.<BR>
<snipped><BR>
<BR>
	I presume that you mean /Homo sapiens [something]/, as the subspecies<BR>
	designation should come after the species.  Distinguishing between<BR>
	species can be difficult, and between subspecies even more so.  I am<BR>
	not trying to discourage this sort of characterization, but people<BR>
	should be aware that there are shades of grey involved.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 09:40:57 -0500 (CDT)<BR>
From: "Jason Kemp" <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: The Creature from Aliens...<BR>
<BR>
Greetings, All,<BR>
<BR>
I know this question has been answered a number of times previously, <BR>
and I apologize for asking this, but it came up in conversation with <BR>
a fellow Traveller fan, and I didn't know the answer. Okay, here <BR>
goes:<BR>
<BR>
I remember that someone created stats for the Aliens creatures from <BR>
the Alien, Aliens, etc. movies for the Traveller milieu. It was <BR>
probably for a JTAS article, but I don't know for certain. So, what <BR>
is the creature called in Traveller terms? Also, where can I find the <BR>
stats, and any Traveller-specific background info on this creature?<BR>
<BR>
Thanks in advance for your help, everyone,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
=============================<BR>
Jason Kemp, ADS Programmer IV<BR>
(512)458-7111 ext. 1+3375<BR>
Internet Address:  jason.kemp@tdh.state.tx.us<BR>
<BR>
Most computer virus and email alerts are hoaxes.  For more info, check out:<BR>
http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/culture/beliefs/urbanlegends/library/blhoax.htm<BR>
==============================<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 09:43:11 -0500 (CDT)<BR>
From: "Jason Kemp" <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
Subject: When's the next BFB compilation coming out?<BR>
<BR>
Greetings, All,<BR>
<BR>
I may have missed an announcement or someone may have inside <BR>
information, (then again, no one may know yet,) but I was wondering <BR>
when the next compilation of CT books is going to be released? I <BR>
really love my CT collection of Books 0-8, and am eagerly awaiting <BR>
the other sets as they come out.<BR>
<BR>
Thanks for your assistance,<BR>
Jason<BR>
<BR>
=============================<BR>
Jason Kemp, ADS Programmer IV<BR>
(512)458-7111 ext. 1+3375<BR>
Internet Address:  jason.kemp@tdh.state.tx.us<BR>
<BR>
Most computer virus and email alerts are hoaxes.  For more info, check out:<BR>
http://urbanlegends.miningco.com/culture/beliefs/urbanlegends/library/blhoax.htm<BR>
==============================<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 11:01:09 -0400<BR>
From: "Sword-Worlder" <swordworlder@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: When's the next BFB compilation coming out?<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Jason Kemp" <Jason.Kemp@tdh.state.tx.us><BR>
> I may have missed an announcement or someone may have inside<BR>
> information, (then again, no one may know yet,) but I was wondering<BR>
> when the next compilation of CT books is going to be released? I<BR>
> really love my CT collection of Books 0-8, and am eagerly awaiting<BR>
> the other sets as they come out.<BR>
<BR>
Marc said that the Supplements BFB will be out (a little late) before the<BR>
end of this month, and that Adventures should be on time for a July 15th<BR>
release.  Ain't this fun :-)<BR>
<BR>
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>
Colin Michael, WebDev<BR>
www.downport.com<BR>
The Traveller Domain<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 08:28:43<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: GT playtesting.<BR>
<BR>
At 02:55 PM 5/4/2000 +1000, you wrote:<BR>
>How do I get on the GT playtest list?<BR>
<BR>
Subscribe to Pyramid.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 11:36:45 -0400<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
At 09:36 AM 5/4/00 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>OB TRAV: one world on the edge of a loose confederation of worlds is often<BR>
>mistaken by those from elsewhere as being part of the confedaration.<BR>
>However, culturally and linguistically they are very different and resent<BR>
>the 'confusion'.<BR>
><BR>
>The PCs make the mistake of describing a passenger's origin slightly<BR>
>incorrectly and receiving a half hour lecture on just what their error is.<BR>
<BR>
Or vice-versa.  My girlfriend (who is from Washington DC) once got really <BR>
annoyed at someone who claimed that West Virigina (about a 4 hour drive <BR>
from DC) was a suburb of DC...<BR>
<BR>
           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
                          			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
for PGP public-key and<BR>
more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/                <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 15:34:58 +0100 <BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Thanks etc.<BR>
<BR>
Michael wrote:<BR>
> Spacecops was made by the BBC, it ran for one season, but remember a<BR>
> British season seems to be much shorter than an American one so they<BR>
> might only have been six episodes or so. I liked it as well, nice low<BR>
> tech SF.<BR>
<BR>
If you're talking about what I think you're  talking  about  then<BR>
you mean "Star Cops".  It had 9 episodes but was supposed  to  be<BR>
10.  The last one (to be set on Mars) was cancelled due to strike<BR>
action at the BBC at the time.<BR>
<BR>
FYI: British TV (BBC and the commercial  channels)  don't  really<BR>
have 'seasons' like the US system.  A series can be of any length<BR>
and start at any time of the year.<BR>
<BR>
Also, it is the norm to make a short run of episodes (usually  6)<BR>
rather than make a pilot.  The advantage is  that  a  series  can<BR>
survive a mediocre first episode, the  disadvantage  is  that  US<BR>
buyers are not interested unless then  have  enough  episodes  to<BR>
make a full US season.  The result is that many British TV series<BR>
either go to PBS or, more commonly, get  remade  in  the  US  and<BR>
'sold' as American.  Many British TV series are only intended  to<BR>
run one season even if popular.  Most British TV production falls<BR>
half way between the US  concept  of  a  "series"  and  a  "mini-<BR>
series".   (For  example:  Ultraviolet  was  6  episodes  with  a<BR>
mediocre 1st episode.  Its creator intends no  more  despite  its<BR>
success.  Last I heard a US version is  planned  ...  padded  out<BR>
with additional episodes.  A US version of Red  Dwarf  was  tried<BR>
but it flopped.)<BR>
<BR>
Finally, British TV scheduling uses 5  minute  intervals  whereas<BR>
the US uses 30 minute intervals ... thus there is more  variation<BR>
on  running  times.  Also  less  advertising.  (For  example:  an<BR>
episode of Star Trek (any series) is designed for a 1  hour  time<BR>
slot but is actually only 44 minutes long, an episode of  Blake's<BR>
Seven is 50 minutes.)<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 09:02:35<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: SolSec Website<BR>
<BR>
At 09:36 PM 5/3/2000 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>Greetings all,<BR>
><BR>
>I just turned on the SolSec website <http://solsec.org>.<BR>
<BR>
Very nice!  Two nits: You could combine the two entry screens into one, and<BR>
the text color is a bit dark.<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 09:04:23<BR>
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Zhodani Conspiracy and Quest for the Ancients / Jenghe<BR>
<BR>
At 08:39 PM 5/3/2000 PST, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>RAR is a popular archive program. Do you need the DOS version, Windows<BR>
>version or OS/2 version?<BR>
<BR>
Win3.1 or DOS<BR>
- -- <BR>
<BR>
Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 15:55:59 +0100 <BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Thanks etc.<BR>
<BR>
Robert Houghton wrote:<BR>
> By the gods I wish the A(ustralian)BC had rerun rights to this.<BR>
> I was too young to appreciate it when it first came on.<BR>
<BR>
The whole series is available on VHS tape (26 tapes in all).  You<BR>
have to have a multi-format TV/VCR system capable of playing  the<BR>
European  PAL  encoding  (as  opposed  to  the  US/Japanese  NTSC<BR>
encoding).<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> BTW...what are the major differences (in your opinion) between<BR>
> European and American SF shows?<BR>
<BR>
American SF shows use a certain rock formation in California  for<BR>
(non-urban) outside  location  shots,  British  SF  shows  use  a<BR>
disused quarry for (non-urban) outside location shots.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 12:40:32 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
Disclaimer:  I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer.  If you<BR>
have a real need for a lawyer, go find one.  You can't<BR>
actually rely on what I say, which is only for informational<BR>
purposes.<BR>
<BR>
IIRC, the IG copyrights reverted to MM on the dissolution<BR>
of that company.  You have essentially created a "derivative"<BR>
work, and copied directly whatever portions haven't been<BR>
modified.  That is an infringement of the copyright.<BR>
<BR>
Contact MM.  You want to ask for permission in writing<BR>
to distribute the work you have created.<BR>
<BR>
Don't step into the trap of rationalizing your infringements.<BR>
Especially with the current popularity of Traveller products<BR>
(GT).  It makes it more likely that ab FFS3 might be<BR>
published one day, which makes your infringement potentially<BR>
much more serious.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I have a delicate problem...<BR>
><BR>
> FF&S2 is, as we all know, full of errors. I became more than irritated, and<BR>
> decided to straighten out the problems I have with it once and for all. Using<BR>
> LaTeX, I have now rewritten parts of the book in a corrected, more readable<BR>
> format.<BR>
><BR>
> Sounds great, doesn't it?  :-)<BR>
><BR>
> The problem is that I am not sure if I can share this with you. Since Imperium<BR>
> Games folded, I do not know who to ask. Mr Miller himself? If so, at what<BR>
> e-mail address?<BR>
><BR>
> If I am allowed to share this with people, I would like help with locating<BR>
> errors and misinterpretations on my part. In other words, I need someone who<BR>
> has used FF&S2 a lot to read through the document, and mail me comments.<BR>
><BR>
> +--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
> |                                      |                                       |<BR>
> | Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
> | Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
> | Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
> | ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
> |                                      |                                       |<BR>
> +--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 02:11:35 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: OT: UK vs US SFTV (was Re: Thanks etc.)<BR>
<BR>
"Trevor, Peter" wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Michael wrote:<BR>
> > Spacecops was made by the BBC, it ran for one season, but remember a<BR>
> > British season seems to be much shorter than an American one so they<BR>
> > might only have been six episodes or so. I liked it as well, nice low<BR>
> > tech SF.<BR>
><BR>
> If you're talking about what I think you're  talking  about  then<BR>
> you mean "Star Cops".  It had 9 episodes but was supposed  to  be<BR>
> 10.  The last one (to be set on Mars) was cancelled due to strike<BR>
> action at the BBC at the time.<BR>
><BR>
> FYI: British TV (BBC and the commercial  channels)  don't  really<BR>
> have 'seasons' like the US system.  A series can be of any length<BR>
> and start at any time of the year.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
<snip><BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>    (For  example:  Ultraviolet  was  6  episodes  with  a<BR>
> mediocre 1st episode.  Its creator intends no  more  despite  its<BR>
> success.  Last I heard a US version is  planned  ...  padded  out<BR>
> with additional episodes.  A US version of Red  Dwarf  was  tried<BR>
> but it flopped.)<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
I remember Ultraviolet...saw the promo's and thought "British<BR>
banking/stockbroking drama" Halfway through the timeslot for the first<BR>
Episode my friends started ringing me. There was no mention of Vamp's in<BR>
the promo (this was strange as Buffy was getting big at the time) watched<BR>
and was hooked.<BR>
<BR>
I don't think a US version would be half as good. However the UK couldn't<BR>
do Buffy if it tried. (Giles: the British influence!)<BR>
<BR>
Ob Trav: Buffy the Virus slayer?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
> Finally, British TV scheduling uses 5  minute  intervals  whereas<BR>
> the US uses 30 minute intervals ... thus there is more  variation<BR>
> on  running  times.  Also  less  advertising.  (For  example:  an<BR>
> episode of Star Trek (any series) is designed for a 1  hour  time<BR>
> slot but is actually only 44 minutes long, an episode of  Blake's<BR>
> Seven is 50 minutes.)<BR>
><BR>
> Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 12:18:35 EDT<BR>
From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
various quotes:<BR>
<BR>
>"Greg Aldridge" <Greg.Aldridge@marconicomms.com> wrote:<BR>
>><BR>
>><BR>
>>> I remember that one...the alien prosthetics were *very* well done. IMO I<BR>
>think<BR>
>>a<BR>
>>> lot of the work was done by the guy wo did Thunderbirds ( the original, <BR>
not<BR>
>>the<BR>
>>> anime) interesting premise...SSTO cop cars...multi-species world...<BR>
>><BR>
>>And it was called "Space Precinct".<BR>
><BR>
>Space Precinct was Gerry Anderson's recent live action thing. I can't<BR>
>remember if<BR>
>they made series 2.<BR>
><BR>
>Space Cop was a BBC production many years before, far less effects (far<BR>
>less budget)<BR>
>and I think it was near future (no aliens). There were only a couple of<BR>
>episodes - <BR>
>possibly only a single multipart story. <BR>
<BR>
 Then there was "Space Rangers." Aside from the "pilot-killer" chair on the <BR>
bridge of their cutter, a wonderful show that got the short end of the stick <BR>
due to being premiered the same WEEK as ST:DS9 AND Babylon-5...<BR>
<BR>
GC<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2395<BR>
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From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
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Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #2395<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2396</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	5/4/00 3:46:21 PM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
Sender:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
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Traveller-digest       Thursday, May 4 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2396<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Thanks etc.<BR>
Re: Copyright question<BR>
RE: Thanks etc.<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
Re: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
Re:Alien Creature TML  #2395<BR>
SJG's TNS, redux<BR>
RE: The Creature from Aliens...<BR>
Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
Re: The Traveller Font<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: Copyright question<BR>
Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Re: Font<BR>
KEAP penetration (was Design Questions)<BR>
Expanded Point Defense rules (repost)<BR>
Making energy weapons work in FFS2 (repost)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 09:45:02 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Thanks etc.<BR>
<BR>
Trevor, Peter wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Robert Houghton wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> > BTW...what are the major differences (in your opinion) between<BR>
> > European and American SF shows?<BR>
> <BR>
> American SF shows use a certain rock formation in California  for<BR>
> (non-urban) outside  location  shots,  British  SF  shows  use  a<BR>
> disused quarry for (non-urban) outside location shots.<BR>
<BR>
Except for shows like Stargate, where every planet looks just like<BR>
British Columbia..;-)<BR>
<BR>
("In the future, ALL restaurants are Taco Bell.") <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:50:54 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
Steve Daniels wrote:<BR>
> IIRC, the IG copyrights reverted to MM on the dissolution<BR>
> of that company.  You have essentially created a "derivative"<BR>
> work, and copied directly whatever portions haven't been<BR>
> modified.  That is an infringement of the copyright.<BR>
> <BR>
> Contact MM.  You want to ask for permission in writing<BR>
> to distribute the work you have created.<BR>
> <BR>
> Don't step into the trap of rationalizing your infringements.<BR>
> Especially with the current popularity of Traveller products<BR>
> (GT).  It makes it more likely that ab FFS3 might be<BR>
> published one day, which makes your infringement potentially<BR>
> much more serious.<BR>
<BR>
Well, since I only have the file for my own personal use right now, that is not<BR>
an infringement (I hope).<BR>
<BR>
I would like to ask MM, but I don't have his e-mail address...<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 17:49:38 +0100<BR>
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Thanks etc.<BR>
<BR>
At 12:19 -0400 4/5/00, "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com> wrote:<BR>
>(For  example:  Ultraviolet  was  6  episodes  with  a<BR>
>mediocre 1st episode.  Its creator intends no  more  despite  its<BR>
>success.  Last I heard a US version is  planned  ...  padded  out<BR>
>with additional episodes.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I thought the issue with Ultraviolet was not that World Productions <BR>
didn't want to do another series, rather Channel 4 didn't want to <BR>
commission another?<BR>
<BR>
Dom<BR>
<BR>
- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------<BR>
"We tell the tales of heroes to remind ourselves that we too<BR>
can be great" - John Wick, 7th Sea<BR>
http://www.cybergoths.u-net.com   http://www.bits.org.uk/ <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:26:17 +0100<BR>
From: Paul Campbell <paul@kemitix.uklinux.net><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
On Thu, 04 May 2000, Juliean Galak wrote:<BR>
> At 09:36 AM 5/4/00 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
> >OB TRAV: one world on the edge of a loose confederation of worlds is often<BR>
> >mistaken by those from elsewhere as being part of the confedaration.<BR>
> >However, culturally and linguistically they are very different and resent<BR>
> >the 'confusion'.<BR>
> ><BR>
> >The PCs make the mistake of describing a passenger's origin slightly<BR>
> >incorrectly and receiving a half hour lecture on just what their error is.<BR>
> <BR>
> Or vice-versa.  My girlfriend (who is from Washington DC) once got really <BR>
> annoyed at someone who claimed that West Virigina (about a 4 hour drive <BR>
> from DC) was a suburb of DC...<BR>
<BR>
Or refering to Scotland as if it was a part of England, as opposed to a part<BR>
of the United Kingdom.<g><BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Paul Campbell <paul@kemitix.uklinux.net><BR>
6:26pm up 19 days, 1:30, 1 user, load average: 0.04, 0.02, 0.00<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:53:54 -0400<BR>
From: "J-Man" <j-man@iname.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
<BR>
Supposedly there will be a new Trek series taking place on the Enterprise,<BR>
BEFORE Kirk got a hold of it, in the early days of the Federation.<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
 J-Man<BR>
 ICQ# 2843475<BR>
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
 Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
 Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
___________________________________________________________<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Robert Houghton" <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2000 9:47 PM<BR>
Subject: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Interesing news..<BR>
>     Just saw on ET that Jason Alexander (Seinfeld co-star and voice of<BR>
> Duckman) is going to star in the pilot for a Star Trek (looks to be TOS)<BR>
> send-up called Star Patrol. The publicity shot I saw was a torso shot of<BR>
> him in what appeared to be an Original Series polyester uniform. Scarey<BR>
> neh?<BR>
><BR>
> I wonder if he'll make it past the pilot?<BR>
><BR>
> Rob<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 08:31:39 -0600<BR>
From: "Eric T. Holmes" <eholmes@lanl.gov><BR>
Subject: Re:Alien Creature TML  #2395<BR>
<BR>
Gentle Beings:<BR>
<BR>
I don't have the article in front of me, but......<BR>
<BR>
She was called the Reticulan Parasite....and she came to us from JTAS #3 or<BR>
4 IIRC.<BR>
<BR>
The article only described what I call the "soldier," "newt,"<BR>
"face-hugger," and "egg."<BR>
<BR>
The "queen" had yet to be discovered or described.<BR>
<BR>
I beleive she was from, "Zeta 2" Reticulae.........<BR>
<BR>
Eric<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 14:45:33 -0500 (CDT)<BR>
From: Steven Bonneville <bonnevil@ima.umn.edu><BR>
Subject: SJG's TNS, redux<BR>
<BR>
I think I've mentioned this before, but the FTL ansible that the Imperium<BR>
has been using lately to cut the six month (by jump-6) travel time between<BR>
Capital and the Solomani Rim is stu-- er, stupendous....  <BR>
<BR>
  http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/oldnews.html <BR>
  (affected messages: 119-1117/120-1117 and 137-1117/138-1117/140-1117)<BR>
<BR>
  -- Steve Bonneville<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 16:29:46 -0400<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: RE: The Creature from Aliens...<BR>
<BR>
>I remember that someone created stats for the Aliens creatures from<BR>
>the Alien, Aliens, etc. movies for the Traveller milieu. It was<BR>
>probably for a JTAS article, but I don't know for certain. So, what<BR>
>is the creature called in Traveller terms? Also, where can I find the<BR>
>stats, and any Traveller-specific background info on this creature?<BR>
<BR>
The Alien appeared in an issue of JTAS, and an alternate version appeared in<BR>
The Space Gamer. I don't have the JTAS issue in question, so I'm not sure<BR>
which one the creature appeared in. The Space Gamer, however, had stats for<BR>
the various stages of the beast's life cycle in Traveller, AD&D and The<BR>
Fantasy Trip terms.<BR>
<BR>
Unfortunately, this issue is packed away. If you need more info, tell me,<BR>
and next time I poke around I'll try to find it.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 15:03:36 +0200<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
At 02:23 03.05.00, you wrote:<BR>
>Let's hope Old George will give us those lost scenes from A New Hope in the<BR>
>DVD release...The Spacebattle viewed by Luke, the parting conversation with<BR>
>Biggs Darklighter, as well as the "longer" cantina scene.<BR>
<BR>
Dream on :-(<BR>
- ---<BR>
Volker A. Greimann<BR>
greimann@geocities.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 13:43:23 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 5/2/00 2:32 PM, brian_t_simmons@hotmail.com issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> I have a friend that says he saw a showing where it had Luke watching the<BR>
> battle in space through his binoculars (for a lack of a name).  I never saw<BR>
> that release but there was an image on my "Star Wars Story" album from what<BR>
> had to be that scene.  If he did see it then it makes you wonder how long<BR>
> that release was being shown.<BR>
<BR>
Really? I am not completely crazy? There was such a scene? Was there also a<BR>
scene where he is talking to Biggs Darklighter? I had begun to think I was<BR>
mixing up the comic or book series with the movie, but it seemed so clear<BR>
and /visual/ in my memories. Of course I have an awful memory, but I swore I<BR>
saw Luke watching the battle with macro-binoculars (that's the name, don't<BR>
blame me) and another scene with Biggs. I was letting them fade from my<BR>
memory as I thought they were constructed from my imagination. I have done<BR>
that with many movies, but this is the only time I couldn't recall doing<BR>
that. It is usually intentional, I write in (or out) scenes to increase my<BR>
enjoyment of the movie. I was 8 or 9 when I saw SW4, and I don't think I was<BR>
doing that yet. It was my first movie ever, and one of the reasons I fell in<BR>
love with Traveller. Every other sci-fi RPG had crap for starship<BR>
construction rules if any, and when I saw High Guard, I was hooked. Non of<BR>
this turbo-laser/blaster quad/double damage inconsistency as in SW the RPG.<BR>
<BR>
I don't mind Jar-Jar as much as everyone else seems to, it's Watto I can't<BR>
stand. Not that I like Jar-Jar, but I find him easier to edit in my mind.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 17:05:03 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The Traveller Font<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 3 May 2000 09:56:39 -0400 (EDT), CGS<BR>
<michael@carrickfergus.schoolzone.co.uk> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>Stupid Question Time Again<BR>
<BR>
>Can anyone tell me what font was used for 1st ed. (Black Book)<BR>
>Traveller? (A source where it can be dowmloaded for free would be nice<BR>
>as well but I think that might be getting a bit cheesy.)<BR>
<BR>
>(Personal E-Mail by preference)<BR>
<BR>
>I am sure I have seen this on a web page somewhere but I cannot find it<BR>
>as I was going to up some crib sheets for T1.<BR>
<BR>
If you are talking about the font used for the word "Traveller"<BR>
on the cover, use "Optima" or a close clone - names that I have<BR>
encountered for clones are "Opta", "Optim", and "ZapfHumanist".<BR>
<BR>
If you are talking about the font used for body text in the<BR>
books, use "Akzidenz Grotesk" or a close clone - names that I<BR>
have encountered for clones are "Standard", and a few others that<BR>
aren't quite available to memory.<BR>
<BR>
Note that fonts named with the "clone" names don't guarantee that<BR>
they'll look like the "real" font - but the real font names refer<BR>
to copyrighted material, which means that you will probably pay<BR>
through the nose to use them.<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 17:05:07 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 3 May 2000 15:30:02 -0400 (EDT), Robert Houghton<BR>
<rhoughto@one.net.au> wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>I still think NYPD Blue woule would be improved by a couple of Vargr from the Drugs<BR>
>squad.<BR>
<BR>
(From a NYPD recruiting brochure, approximately 5500AD)<BR>
<BR>
The New York City Police Department is always hiring.<BR>
<BR>
We are an Equal Opportunity Employer, committed to keeping New<BR>
York's Finest the Finest anywhere. This requires a multicultural<BR>
force capable of tailoring response to the needs of the specific<BR>
community.  Extra-Terrestrial origin is no bar to employment with<BR>
the NYPD, although all members of the service are required to<BR>
have Terran citizenship and reside within the New York City<BR>
Consolidated Economic District.<BR>
<BR>
Extraterrestrials are encouraged to apply for the following<BR>
units:<BR>
<BR>
_Vargr:_  Because of documented abilities in regard to location<BR>
and identification of chemicals, Vargr applicants are encouraged<BR>
to orient their careers in the NYPD toward drug interdiction ("K9<BR>
unit") and the Police Labs.  <BR>
<BR>
_Aslan:_  Your general physical advantages make you an imposing<BR>
figure in a NYPD uniform.  This will be put to best advantage in<BR>
patrol in some of our most widely known neighborhoods, where your<BR>
mere appearance is likely to disturb or frighten potential<BR>
criminals.  A strong sense of honor, innate to all Aslan, also<BR>
make Aslan good candidates for Internal Affairs Division, charged<BR>
with watching the watchers, and making sure they hew to the<BR>
straight and narrow.  Aslan females can also find a place within<BR>
the NYPD; technical and administrative positions throughout the<BR>
department are open.<BR>
<BR>
_Zhodani:_  Zhodani Noble and Intendant expatriates will find<BR>
their niche in the NYPD Domestic Violence, Victim Services, and<BR>
Psychological Services units.  You may also make exceptional<BR>
detectives and investigators.  Tavrchedl' experience a plus.<BR>
<BR>
_K'kree:_  Your best fit is into our Mounted unit, which includes<BR>
in its duties patrolling the City's parks.  Tolerance for the<BR>
scent of meat and for crowds _is_ absolutely essential, as you<BR>
may be occasionally called upon for crowd control.<BR>
<BR>
_Hivers:_  Your unique talents don't fit into the traditional<BR>
table of organization in the NYPD.  Nevertheless, we have created<BR>
a special unit where your talent will really shine, combining<BR>
aspects of Crime Analysis, Detective Services, and Planning.<BR>
<BR>
...<trimmed for space><BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 17:02:05 -0400<BR>
From: "Eric & Diane Freitas" <ericfrei@gte.net><BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
I am unsure about Biggs, but I definitely remember Luke watching an orbital<BR>
battle through the binoculars.<BR>
<BR>
I have an old copy of the movie around here somewhere, I'll rewatch it to<BR>
find out..<BR>
<BR>
Eric<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: Thursday, May 04, 2000 4:51 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Via electronic medium on 5/2/00 2:32 PM, brian_t_simmons@hotmail.com issued<BR>
>forth:<BR>
><BR>
>> I have a friend that says he saw a showing where it had Luke watching the<BR>
>> battle in space through his binoculars (for a lack of a name).  I never<BR>
saw<BR>
>> that release but there was an image on my "Star Wars Story" album from<BR>
what<BR>
>> had to be that scene.  If he did see it then it makes you wonder how long<BR>
>> that release was being shown.<BR>
><BR>
>Really? I am not completely crazy? There was such a scene? Was there also a<BR>
>scene where he is talking to Biggs Darklighter? I had begun to think I was<BR>
>mixing up the comic or book series with the movie, but it seemed so clear<BR>
>and /visual/ in my memories. Of course I have an awful memory, but I swore<BR>
I<BR>
>saw Luke watching the battle with macro-binoculars (that's the name, don't<BR>
>blame me) and another scene with Biggs. I was letting them fade from my<BR>
>memory as I thought they were constructed from my imagination. I have done<BR>
>that with many movies, but this is the only time I couldn't recall doing<BR>
>that. It is usually intentional, I write in (or out) scenes to increase my<BR>
>enjoyment of the movie. I was 8 or 9 when I saw SW4, and I don't think I<BR>
was<BR>
>doing that yet. It was my first movie ever, and one of the reasons I fell<BR>
in<BR>
>love with Traveller. Every other sci-fi RPG had crap for starship<BR>
>construction rules if any, and when I saw High Guard, I was hooked. Non of<BR>
>this turbo-laser/blaster quad/double damage inconsistency as in SW the RPG.<BR>
><BR>
>I don't mind Jar-Jar as much as everyone else seems to, it's Watto I can't<BR>
>stand. Not that I like Jar-Jar, but I find him easier to edit in my mind.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 22:59:13 +0200<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
At 15:03 04.05.00, you wrote:<BR>
>At 02:23 03.05.00, you wrote:<BR>
>>Let's hope Old George will give us those lost scenes from A New Hope in the<BR>
>>DVD release...The Spacebattle viewed by Luke, the parting conversation with<BR>
>>Biggs Darklighter, as well as the "longer" cantina scene.<BR>
><BR>
>Dream on :-(<BR>
<BR>
Last I heard the DVD release isnt going to be anytime soon...<BR>
Maybe when George Lucas is once again in need of a larger swimming pool <BR>
.... ;-)<BR>
<BR>
- ---<BR>
Volker A. Greimann<BR>
greimann@geocities.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 14:31:17 PDT<BR>
From: "jim clem" <travmind@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Reply-To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 15:16:55 -0700 (PDT)<BR>
<BR>
jim clem writes:<BR>
<BR>
 > Hmmmmm, just because something is dense does not mean its structurally<BR>
 > strong.  Your thin hyperdense blade might be dense, but soft, or brittle <BR>
as<BR>
 >  well.  Take lead as a case.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, but the hyperdense we're talking about is an ultra-high-tech super-<BR>
material, so yes, its strong ;)<BR>
<BR>
===============<BR>
<BR>
Ahhhh, I see.  The dangers of entering in the middle of a conversation.<BR>
<BR>
*grin*<BR>
<BR>
Jim C<BR>
My motto in life is simple.  Give me chocolate and no one gets hurt.<BR>
<BR>
________________________________________________________________________<BR>
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 23:33:55 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
I wrote:<BR>
> I would like to ask MM, but I don't have his e-mail address...<BR>
<BR>
I have now mailed him the question. Now all we can do is wait and hope :-)<BR>
<BR>
Thanks to the people who mailed me MM's address.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 16:39:05 -0500<BR>
From: "Brian T. Simmons" <brian_t_simmons@hotmail.com><BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
Don't give up so soon.  Every day I have stuff loaded in to my Palm V and<BR>
SCIFI.COM is one of my favorite thing I get.  Anyway May 3rd, (I load it in<BR>
the evening for the next day) they say, "Lucasfilm confirmed for Wired<BR>
Magazine that it will produce a DVD version of Star Wars: Episode I, while<BR>
DVDs of the other Star Wars films are in the works."<BR>
<BR>
You can read the little story at the location below.<BR>
<BR>
http://www.scifi.com/scifiwire/art-main.html?2000-05/03/13.00.film<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Thursday, May 04, 2000 15:59<BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
At 15:03 04.05.00, you wrote:<BR>
>At 02:23 03.05.00, you wrote:<BR>
>>Let's hope Old George will give us those lost scenes from A New Hope in<BR>
the<BR>
>>DVD release...The Spacebattle viewed by Luke, the parting conversation<BR>
with<BR>
>>Biggs Darklighter, as well as the "longer" cantina scene.<BR>
><BR>
>Dream on :-(<BR>
<BR>
Last I heard the DVD release isnt going to be anytime soon...<BR>
Maybe when George Lucas is once again in need of a larger swimming pool<BR>
.... ;-)<BR>
<BR>
- ---<BR>
Volker A. Greimann<BR>
greimann@geocities.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 14:45:08 -0700<BR>
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Light Sabre<BR>
<BR>
At 11:36 AM -0700 5/3/00, Anthony Jackson wrote:<BR>
>David P. Summers writes:<BR>
>  > Any sword that is to heavy to pick up without contragrav is going<BR>
>  > to have more inertia than it needs.  There is a diminishing<BR>
>  > return on damage and intertia and this blade is going to<BR>
>  > be easier to parry (since it will be slow).  (I've never<BR>
>  > really seen much use in hyperdense either, you can make<BR>
>  > swords just as heavy as you want now).<BR>
><BR>
>The point of hyperdense is that you can make a blade which is super-thin and<BR>
>super-sharp.  Weight is just a side effect.<BR>
<BR>
That isn't going to make that much of a difference, but I think<BR>
we have had this conversation....<BR>
<BR>
______________________________<BR>
summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>
(This is the net.  My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 18:17:02 -0400<BR>
From: Jeff Zeitlin <jzeitlin@cyburban.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Font<BR>
<BR>
On Wed, 3 May 2000 23:29:26 -0400 (EDT), GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>In a message dated 00-05-03 15:34:07 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
><<  Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
> Subject: Re: The Traveller Font<BR>
 <BR>
> Loren or Marc answered this definitively once, they were not fonts that<BR>
> I recognized the name of.<BR>
 <BR>
> However, the titling font on the cover and title page (the 'Traveller'<BR>
> bit) is very similar to Adobe's Optima font, and there are a number of<BR>
> clones out there; istr one is called Ottowa.<BR>
 <BR>
> The body text is something I haven't run across, though Geneva or<BR>
> Helvetica come close to matching it. (Helvetica == Arial on the PC, and<BR>
> there's no analogue for Geneva)<BR>
>  >><BR>
<BR>
>Spot on on both. Cover title is Optima, interior set in Helvetica medium, <BR>
>bold and italic. Many of them using the aforementioned IBM Selectric <BR>
>"golfballs" on the mag card typsetter.<BR>
<BR>
Huh?  _Helvetica_?  I'd have _sworn_ Akzidenz Grotesk or close<BR>
clone; some of the letters - most notably the cap S and lower a -<BR>
just don't look right for Helvetica.  Maybe it's just the small<BR>
point size that's fooling me - what is it, 9 point body?<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:19:23 EDT<BR>
From: Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
Subject: KEAP penetration (was Design Questions)<BR>
<BR>
Rupert Boleyn wrote:<BR>
<BR>
 >I've got an altered FFS1 KEAP chart based on KE^1/2 if anyone wants it.<BR>
 ><BR>
 >I did it up after deciding that 15cm mass drivers made fixed <BR>
 >fortifications too good.<BR>
<BR>
Please email me the KEAP penetration chart.<BR>
<BR>
_Warship International_ magazine printed a series of articles called "Armor<BR>
and its Application to Warships" in issues 2/76, 2/77, & 4/78, with notes & <BR>
errata in 2/79.  The articles had penetration equations actually used by <BR>
navies in the 19th & early 20th centuries to estimate the effectiveness of<BR>
naval guns.  The equations were derived mostly from repeated test firings <BR>
of sample weapons & armor plate.  The author of the articles was Nathan Okun.<BR>
<BR>
If anyone wants, I could post the equations to the TML.  They were meant to<BR>
model penetration of naval AP shells (say 15cm to 46cm) and may be off for <BR>
smaller weapons (7cm to 13cm tank guns e.g.).  They are also a bit dated --<BR>
IIRC none are from later than the 1930s.  They give lower penetration <BR>
values than FFS2 (which would give energy weapons a boost), and seem to <BR>
match published gun data more closely.<BR>
<BR>
Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 08:39:41 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Expanded Point Defense rules (repost)<BR>
<BR>
Warning : some Ditzie speak present <in these brackets><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
 A basic PD system is 60 kilos, 0.06 m3 and Cr 200 000 at TL9, plus the<BR>
 sensor system and the weapon.<BR>
<BR>
 There are 3 basic classes of threats point defense can defend against -<BR>
 missiles/RAM grenades, artillery/RR rounds and CPR/Gauss rounds.<BR>
<BR>
 Minimum tracked trajectory is measured from when the PD system picks up the<BR>
 threat, to when it impacts.<BR>
<BR>
 The first <slooow an an an delicate have a minimum tracked trajectory of<BR>
 100m, and need 10 kJ of weapon output to effectivly hit them.<BR>
<BR>
 The second class <meeedium have a minimum tracked distance of 500m, and<BR>
 need 100 kJ of weapon output to terminate them as a threat.<BR>
<BR>
 The third class <fast an an an tough an uuuusually real hurty if you miss<BR>
 have a minimum tracked distance of 1500m, and need 1 MJ of weapon output to<BR>
 prevent their effective impact.<BR>
<BR>
 Minimum ranges fall by 20% for TL 10 PD systems, 40% for TL11 systems, up<BR>
to<BR>
 a maximum of 80% for TL13 systems.<BR>
<BR>
 Class one targets are a Hard task at TL9, Average at TL10 and Easy at TL11.<BR>
<BR>
 Class two targets are an Impossible task at TL9, Hard at TL10, Average at<BR>
 TL11 etc<BR>
<BR>
 Class Three targets are You-just-cant-do-it at TL9, Impossible at TL10,<BR>
Hard<BR>
 at TL11 etc.<BR>
<BR>
 A PD system equivalent to that of a lower TL can be built at higher TLs for<BR>
 2/3rds the cost and half the mass and volume per TL (eg a TL9-equivalent<BR>
 system built at TL13 is 1/64th the mass and volume <1 kg and 16/81 the<BR>
 price (KCr 40) <weeeee alwaaaaaays put oneie-one of theeese on our Haaaapy<BR>
 Funnie-wunnie Suuuits so so so you can zappity zap zap zap those RAAAAAAM<BR>
 gwenades). Note that systems built at a lower TL get the minimum tracked<BR>
 trajectory of the lower TL, not the TL of construction.<BR>
<BR>
 *******************************************************************<BR>
<BR>
 OK, that should do over the CPR jockeys good and proper. Sure, a 200 mm<BR>
KEAP<BR>
 round will punch through virtually anything ... but with these rules, it<BR>
 will never get there.<BR>
<BR>
 This implies that TL8-9 will be dominated by missiles (especially if you<BR>
 allow TL8 missiles to top attack), TL 10-11 by CPR guns and from TL12 and<BR>
up<BR>
 it's energy weapons of various types that dominate.<BR>
<BR>
 Ian Whitchurch<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 08:41:17 +1000<BR>
From: "Katharine Whitchurch" <katts@globalfreeway.com.au><BR>
Subject: Making energy weapons work in FFS2 (repost)<BR>
<BR>
 One of my biggest beefs with FFS2 is that man (or even small girl) portable<BR>
 energy weapons cannot be effectively built, and I dont like the idea of<BR>
 gunpowder weapons dominating the Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
 Starting with the objective that the Striker weapons should be able to be<BR>
 built under a modified FFS2, I started tweaking things until it works. And<BR>
 you know what ... it works.<BR>
<BR>
 One new invention - almost certainly from (drum roll with haunting flute<BR>
 music) the Sayat. High Performance Accumulators.<BR>
<BR>
 High Performance Accumulators<BR>
<BR>
 HPAs can be used for weapons with input of up to (1/2) TL^2 kilojoules of<BR>
 input energy (eg 40 kJ at TL9, 50 kJ at TL10 etc).<BR>
<BR>
 Weapons with HPAs can fire 3 shots in 20 seconds, then are stuck at one<BR>
shot<BR>
 per 30 seconds until a cool-down period of 3 minutes without fire has taken<BR>
 place. If you have a weapon with a smaller HPA than the maximum available<BR>
at<BR>
 that TL, then the number of shots in the initial burst is increased and the<BR>
 cool-down period is decreased by the ratio of the size of the HPA to the<BR>
 maximum size of an HPA at that TL (eg a TL10 weapon with 25 kJ of input can<BR>
 fire 6 shots in 30 seconds, then has to have a cool-down period of 90<BR>
 seconds).<BR>
<BR>
 You can push HPAs beyond these limits, but they dont call it SAY-Boom for<BR>
 nothing.<BR>
<BR>
 TL HPA storage capacity Cost<BR>
<BR>
 9 6.25 kJ per kilo Cr 500 per kilo<BR>
 10 12.5 kJ per kilo Cr 750 per kilo<BR>
 11 15.0 kJ per kilo Cr 1000 per kilo<BR>
 12 22.5 kJ per kilo Cr 1250 per kilo<BR>
 13 30.0 kJ per kilo Cr 2000 per kilo<BR>
 14 37.5 kJ per kilo Cr 2500 per kilo<BR>
 15 45.0 kJ per kilo Cr 3750 per kilo<BR>
<BR>
 New Light Laser Focal Array rules<BR>
<BR>
 Frankly, I cant understand the way the rules in FFS2 are supposed to work.<BR>
 Here are Ditzie's amendments.<BR>
<BR>
 Volume is done in cubic centimeters.<BR>
<BR>
 A = pi * r^2<BR>
<BR>
 The length of the focal array (the lasing tube) is 1 cm per kJ of input (nb<BR>
 input, not output).<BR>
<BR>
 Volume equals area times length.<BR>
<BR>
 Light lasers mass 3g per cubic centimeter, and cost Cr 1 per cubic<BR>
 centimeter.<BR>
<BR>
 Remember to add a plastic stock (0.5 kg, Cr 50).<BR>
<BR>
 Range is same as FFS2.<BR>
<BR>
 Revised Damage for FFS2<BR>
<BR>
 These damage values are in Striker terms.<BR>
<BR>
 Damage Value = (2*Sqrt(Output in Kilojoules *2 * Mod))-1, rounding up for<BR>
 0.5 and up<BR>
<BR>
 Mod is 1 for KEAP (CPRs and Gauss Guns), 2 for Lasers, 3 for PAWs and 8 for<BR>
 Plasma or Fusion weapons<BR>
<BR>
 Examples : A M16 bullet is 1800 joules of KEAP, so it's (2*Sqrt(1.8*2*1))-1<BR>
 or 3<BR>
 A 9 mm Parabellum is 500 joules of KEAP so it's<BR>
 (2*Sqrt(0.5*2*1))-1 or 1<BR>
 A 10 kJ Laser is 10 000 joules of laser so it's<BR>
 (2*Sqrt(10*2*2))-1 or 12<BR>
 A 10 kJ PAW is 10 000 joules of PAW so it's<BR>
 (2*Sqrt(10*2*3))-1 or 14<BR>
 A 10 kJ PGMP is 10 000 joules of Plasma so it's<BR>
 (2*Sqrt(10*2*8))-1 or 25<BR>
<BR>
 Note that these correspond to Striker values for M16s, 9mm pistols, TL9<BR>
 Laser Rifles and PGMP-13s.<BR>
<BR>
 For those of you wanting to convert values for other systems, in Striker a<BR>
 cm of hard steel is Factor 4, then 2cm is fac 8, then 3 cm is fac 12, then<BR>
 5cm is fac 18 then every doubling adds 8 factors.<BR>
<BR>
 Thus our Laser Rifle will penetrate 3 cm of hard steel.<BR>
<BR>
 Cloth armour (Cr 250, TL7) is fac 5, a flak jacket(Cr 100, TL7) fac 3,<BR>
Ablat<BR>
 (Cr 75, TL9) is fac 1/fac 6 vs lasers, reflec (Cr 1500, tl10) is fac 0/fac<BR>
 10 vs lasers, Combat Environment suits (Cr1000, TL10) is fac 6, TL 11<BR>
combat<BR>
 armour is Cr 20 000 and fac 8, TL12 combat armour is Cr 30 000 and fac 10,<BR>
 TL13 battle dress is Cr 200 000 and fac 10, TL14 combat armour is Cr 60 000<BR>
 and fac 18, and TL14 battle dress is Cr 350 000 and fac 18.<BR>
<BR>
 I attribute the higher factors for personal armour than one would expect to<BR>
 be due to more expensive higher-quality materials.<BR>
<BR>
 Sample Weapon<BR>
<BR>
 TL9 Laser Rifle<BR>
<BR>
 5 cm diameter FA. 32 kJ input, 10 kJ output<BR>
<BR>
 Area is pi * (2.5)^2, or 16.5 cm^2, thus volume is 528 cubic centimeters<BR>
and<BR>
 a length of 32 cm. Mass of the lasing tube is 1.6 kilos.<BR>
<BR>
 Add a plastic stock (0.5 kg), Cooler (0.6 kg) and iron sights (0.1 kg) for<BR>
a<BR>
 total of 2.8 kg.<BR>
<BR>
 32 kJ of input at TL9 needs 5 kilos of High Performance Accumulator, while<BR>
5<BR>
 kilos of 6 minute discharge TL9 batteries puts out 5000 watts, so it's a<BR>
 theoretical shot every 7 seconds (until the HPA needs to cool down). The<BR>
 backpack has 60 shots in it.<BR>
<BR>
 The backpack itself masses 1.5 kilos, so thats 2.8 kg for the weapon and<BR>
 11.5 kilos for the backpack.<BR>
<BR>
 Range is 0.05 * 33 (FUV laser) * 0.1 (Std Atmosphere), or 160 m in a<BR>
 standard atmosphere (20m short of the Striker version).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2396<BR>
***********************************<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2397</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest       Thursday, May 4 2000       Volume 1999 : Number 2397<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
Re: Copyright question<BR>
WARNING<BR>
Re: Copyright question<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Re: Copyright question<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2396<BR>
Re: Mag Cards<BR>
Re: Species . . . schmecies<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
RE: Thanks etc.<BR>
Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
[none]<BR>
RE:Charismatic Governments<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Re: KEAP Penetration <BR>
Re: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Why FRPG's?<BR>
Re McCaffree<BR>
[none]<BR>
Re : Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 16:26:24 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 5/4/00 6:39 AM, ian@vax2.concordia.ca issued forth:<BR>
<BR>
> I presume that you mean /Homo sapiens [something]/, as the subspecies<BR>
> designation should come after the species.  Distinguishing between<BR>
> species can be difficult, and between subspecies even more so.  I am<BR>
> not trying to discourage this sort of characterization, but people<BR>
> should be aware that there are shades of grey involved.<BR>
<BR>
I've heard an analogy to software versions, such as v1.1 is more compatible<BR>
to v1.2 than v1.3, although this still is using discrete increments, which<BR>
doesn't apply in genetics so much.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 16:42:16 -0700<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 5/4/00 9:50 AM, jenry023@student.liu.se issued<BR>
forth:<BR>
<BR>
> I would like to ask MM, but I don't have his e-mail address...<BR>
<BR>
I'd think he's heard through the grapevine by now, perhaps by way of Loren.<BR>
If not, I'd like to say that he should indeed be contacted, though what I am<BR>
thinking is I hope all your work might go towards the production of a FF&S3<BR>
or such. I have been toying with getting FF&S 1 or 2, as I want something<BR>
High Guard like, but more inclusive of alternate technologies, and perhaps a<BR>
little more detailed. The errata is annoying though, and if another book<BR>
like the previous FF&S books came out, but was better edited, I would most<BR>
definitely buy it. I think others would too. If it was "cross-platform" it<BR>
would likely become a must-have. Please pursue this with Marc.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 01:41:48 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
Another RPG mailing list (the Rolemaster mailing list) that I subscribe to had<BR>
an e-mail virus appearing in it today. I am about 99% sure this is not a hoax.<BR>
<BR>
The virus takes the form of a loveletter. It is a worm-type virus, spreading<BR>
itself if you open in in Micro$oft Outlook. It mails itself to all persons in<BR>
your address book.<BR>
<BR>
One person on the list apparently got infected. The virus got posted to the<BR>
list, and at least one person opened the attached file before warnings got out.<BR>
The virus mailed itself to the list once more from that person's address.<BR>
<BR>
IF YOU GET AN E-MAIL WITH THE SUBJECT  "ILOVEYOU", DON'T OPEN THE ATTACHED FILE<BR>
<BR>
The attached file is called LOVE-LETTER-FOR-YOU.TXT.vbs<BR>
<BR>
Note: If I am wrong (which I doubt), I apologize for spreading the hoax. I do<BR>
not think this apology is necessary, however.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 19:01:54 -0500<BR>
From: ehenry@newberlin.org (Eric Henry)<BR>
Subject: Re: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
I totally agree.  If you build it Marc, I will come.  Provided it's not in<BR>
silly english units that GURPS uses < sigh >.<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
...If another book<BR>
> like the previous FF&S books came out, but was better edited, I would most<BR>
> definitely buy it. I think others would too. If it was "cross-platform" it<BR>
> would likely become a must-have. Please pursue this with Marc.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 20:00:40 -0400<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
At 01:41 AM 5/5/00 +0200, you wrote:<BR>
>Another RPG mailing list (the Rolemaster mailing list) that I subscribe to had<BR>
>an e-mail virus appearing in it today. I am about 99% sure this is not a hoax.<BR>
><BR>
>The virus takes the form of a loveletter. It is a worm-type virus, spreading<BR>
>itself if you open in in Micro$oft Outlook. It mails itself to all persons in<BR>
>your address book.<BR>
><BR>
>One person on the list apparently got infected. The virus got posted to the<BR>
>list, and at least one person opened the attached file before warnings got <BR>
>out.<BR>
>The virus mailed itself to the list once more from that person's address.<BR>
><BR>
>IF YOU GET AN E-MAIL WITH THE SUBJECT  "ILOVEYOU", DON'T OPEN THE ATTACHED <BR>
>FILE<BR>
><BR>
>The attached file is called LOVE-LETTER-FOR-YOU.TXT.vbs<BR>
><BR>
>Note: If I am wrong (which I doubt), I apologize for spreading the hoax. I do<BR>
>not think this apology is necessary, however.<BR>
<BR>
I initially discounted this as a hoax, but it most assuredly <BR>
not!  Something like 10% of all PCs in the UK are reported to be <BR>
infected.  Take this one very seriously....   Norton Antivirus has info on <BR>
this, as does thepope (I can't recall if that's a .com or a .org).  Also <BR>
look at slashdot.org for info.<BR>
<BR>
           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
                          			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
for PGP public-key and<BR>
more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/                <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 02:10:35 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
Eric Henry wrote:<BR>
> I totally agree.  If you build it Marc, I will come.  Provided it's not in<BR>
> silly english units that GURPS uses < sigh >.<BR>
<BR>
I am both raised in the metric system and a technical student, so I use the<BR>
metric system as often as possible. I dislike the Imperial measurement system,<BR>
since the conversions between different units are not mathematically logical.<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 12:38:05 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
On 5 May 00, at 1:41, Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Another RPG mailing list (the Rolemaster mailing list) that I subscribe to<BR>
> had an e-mail virus appearing in it today. I am about 99% sure this is not<BR>
> a hoax.<BR>
> <BR>
> The virus takes the form of a loveletter. It is a worm-type virus,<BR>
> spreading itself if you open in in Micro$oft Outlook. It mails itself to<BR>
> all persons in your address book.<BR>
<BR>
Apparently it's making quite a mess. I have an answer, though - don't <BR>
use MS Outlook, etc. If your emailer doesn't use anything but text the <BR>
virus can't do anything.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:05:13 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #2396<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-05-04 18:46:21 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< <BR>
 I would like to ask MM, but I don't have his e-mail address...<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
FarFuture@aol.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:19:57 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Mag Cards<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 00-05-03 23:33:55 EDT, you write:<BR>
<BR>
<< > Many of the LBBs were typeset on an IBM mag card typesetting system, and<BR>
 > recorded on those very cards.<BR>
 <BR>
 Well paint me blue and call me a Terran Skinmonkey...Now I wonder what<BR>
 the heck is _on_ this thing! How much data fit on a card?<BR>
 <BR>
 (actually you can call me Cory then, too ...;-P<BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
Dunno. When GDW upgraded to a MCS, we sold the mag card machine to . . .<BR>
<BR>
Drum roll please . . .<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
FASA.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:19:58 EDT<BR>
From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Species . . . schmecies<BR>
<BR>
Peez wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<< Distinguishing between<BR>
    species can be difficult, and between subspecies even more so.  I am<BR>
    not trying to discourage this sort of characterization, but people<BR>
    should be aware that there are shades of grey involved.   >><BR>
<BR>
Not to mention the clumpers and splitters syndrome, depending on who needs to <BR>
publish this year.<BR>
<BR>
LKW<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 20:04:02 -0500<BR>
From: Richard Wilson <rtwilson@rollanet.org><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
At 12:38 PM 5/4/00 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>"Greg Aldridge" <Greg.Aldridge@marconicomms.com> wrote:<BR>
> ><BR>
> ><BR>
> >> I remember that one...the alien prosthetics were *very* well done. IMO I<BR>
>think<BR>
> >a<BR>
> >> lot of the work was done by the guy wo did Thunderbirds ( the <BR>
> original, not<BR>
> >the<BR>
> >> anime) interesting premise...SSTO cop cars...multi-species world...<BR>
> ><BR>
> >And it was called "Space Precinct".<BR>
><BR>
>Space Precinct was Gerry Anderson's recent live action thing. I can't<BR>
>remember if<BR>
>they made series 2.<BR>
><BR>
>Space Cop was a BBC production many years before, far less effects (far<BR>
>less budget)<BR>
>and I think it was near future (no aliens). There were only a couple of<BR>
>episodes -<BR>
>possibly only a single multipart story.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I think it was about one season or so.  It was pretty good. One full time <BR>
cop and some part-timers trying to enforce the law with conflicting nations <BR>
and multi national corps plus the ocasional smuggler all trying to ignore <BR>
the law.<BR>
<BR>
>Phil Kitching<BR>
>--<BR>
>   http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>
>   Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>
>  "Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Richard Wilson<BR>
<BR>
rtwilson@rollanet.org<BR>
<BR>
========================================================================<BR>
Humanity is not something we should aspire to. It is something we should<BR>
strive to overcome.<BR>
========================================================================<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 20:09:26 -0500<BR>
From: Richard Wilson <rtwilson@rollanet.org><BR>
Subject: RE: Thanks etc.<BR>
<BR>
At 03:55 PM 5/4/00 +0100, you wrote:<BR>
>Robert Houghton wrote:<BR>
> > By the gods I wish the A(ustralian)BC had rerun rights to this.<BR>
> > I was too young to appreciate it when it first came on.<BR>
><BR>
>The whole series is available on VHS tape (26 tapes in all).  You<BR>
>have to have a multi-format TV/VCR system capable of playing  the<BR>
>European  PAL  encoding  (as  opposed  to  the  US/Japanese  NTSC<BR>
>encoding).<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> > BTW...what are the major differences (in your opinion) between<BR>
> > European and American SF shows?<BR>
><BR>
>American SF shows use a certain rock formation in California  for<BR>
>(non-urban) outside  location  shots,  British  SF  shows  use  a<BR>
>disused quarry for (non-urban) outside location shots.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
If the show has a limted budget, American shows will spend it on special <BR>
effects, a British show on writing.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Regards PLST<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Richard Wilson<BR>
<BR>
rtwilson@rollanet.org<BR>
<BR>
========================================================================<BR>
Humanity is not something we should aspire to. It is something we should<BR>
strive to overcome.<BR>
========================================================================<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 20:13:11 -0500<BR>
From: Richard Wilson <rtwilson@rollanet.org><BR>
Subject: Re: OT: Farscape RPG?<BR>
<BR>
At 12:18 PM 5/4/00 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>various quotes:<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>  Then there was "Space Rangers." Aside from the "pilot-killer" chair on the<BR>
>bridge of their cutter, a wonderful show that got the short end of the stick<BR>
>due to being premiered the same WEEK as ST:DS9 AND Babylon-5...<BR>
<BR>
Was there another Space Rangers that I missed? ST:DS9 came out in 92-93. B5 <BR>
came out in 93. The Space Rangers show that I remember came out in 88-89. <BR>
IIRC :)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>GC<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Richard Wilson<BR>
<BR>
rtwilson@rollanet.org<BR>
<BR>
========================================================================<BR>
Humanity is not something we should aspire to. It is something we should<BR>
strive to overcome.<BR>
========================================================================<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 20:19:16 -0500<BR>
From: Richard Wilson <rtwilson@rollanet.org><BR>
Subject: Re: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
At 01:43 PM 5/4/00 -0700, you wrote:<BR>
>Via electronic medium on 5/2/00 2:32 PM, brian_t_simmons@hotmail.com issued<BR>
>forth:<BR>
><BR>
> > I have a friend that says he saw a showing where it had Luke watching the<BR>
> > battle in space through his binoculars (for a lack of a name).  I never saw<BR>
> > that release but there was an image on my "Star Wars Story" album from what<BR>
> > had to be that scene.  If he did see it then it makes you wonder how long<BR>
> > that release was being shown.<BR>
><BR>
>Really? I am not completely crazy? There was such a scene? Was there also a<BR>
>scene where he is talking to Biggs Darklighter? I had begun to think I was<BR>
>mixing up the comic or book series with the movie, but it seemed so clear<BR>
>and /visual/ in my memories. Of course I have an awful memory, but I swore I<BR>
>saw Luke watching the battle with macro-binoculars (that's the name, don't<BR>
>blame me) and another scene with Biggs. I was letting them fade from my<BR>
>memory as I thought they were constructed from my imagination. I have done<BR>
>that with many movies, but this is the only time I couldn't recall doing<BR>
>that. It is usually intentional, I write in (or out) scenes to increase my<BR>
>enjoyment of the movie. I was 8 or 9 when I saw SW4, and I don't think I was<BR>
>doing that yet. It was my first movie ever, and one of the reasons I fell in<BR>
>love with Traveller. Every other sci-fi RPG had crap for starship<BR>
>construction rules if any, and when I saw High Guard, I was hooked. Non of<BR>
>this turbo-laser/blaster quad/double damage inconsistency as in SW the RPG.<BR>
<BR>
I don't remember the scenes in the movie. However, both are in the novel. <BR>
Also, there was a young readers type Star Wars storybook that was <BR>
illustrated. Both scenes were in it also, complete with stills from the movie.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Richard Wilson<BR>
<BR>
rtwilson@rollanet.org<BR>
<BR>
========================================================================<BR>
Humanity is not something we should aspire to. It is something we should<BR>
strive to overcome.<BR>
========================================================================<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 17:37:16 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: [none]<BR>
<BR>
[sorry this comes a bit late, but I've been at a conference]<BR>
>Consider this though Alex. Chances are you can drive a car. You may be<BR>
>able to ride a motorbike as well, like me, but doing the one does not<BR>
>teach you how to do the other (though it might help). You probably<BR>
>can't drive a small truck, even less likely an 18-gear heavy goods<BR>
>truck and I doubt very much you can drive a 30-foot high quarry-stone<BR>
>wagon. Pilot skill is equivalent to the quarry truck, Ship's Boat to<BR>
>the HGV truck, Grav. Vehicles to the light truck and so on. One may<BR>
>help at the other, but does not count as the other.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, under CT and MT: Pilot skill SERVES AS Ship's Boar at one level<BR>
less skill. Not "helps with", but "Serves as". so you use the higher of<BR>
Pilot -1 or SShip's Boat.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 22:04:45 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: RE:Charismatic Governments<BR>
<BR>
>Hi, I wrote an article called "Charismatic Governments" which appeared in<BR>
this<BR>
>week's JTAS. (It's funny, I didn't even know the article was accepted until<BR>
I >logged on...)<BR>
><BR>
>I was wondering whether to write other articles on governments in the<BR>
Traveller<BR>
>universe, but first I thought I'd ask for your feedback. Did you find the<BR>
CG<BR>
>article a crashing bore? Were there parts that really annoyed you? Would<BR>
you have<BR>
>prefered a different approach, or do you find the topic a waste of time?<BR>
(Don't<BR>
>worry, I can take criticism.)<BR>
<BR>
I rated it as highly useful. I, for one, would love to see more stuff along<BR>
this line.<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 22:08:26 -0400<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
At 12:38 PM 5/5/00 +1200, you wrote:<BR>
>Apparently it's making quite a mess. I have an answer, though - don't<BR>
>use MS Outlook, etc. If your emailer doesn't use anything but text the<BR>
>virus can't do anything.<BR>
<BR>
you don't even need to restrict yourself to just text.  All you need is no <BR>
Outlook... :)<BR>
<BR>
Happily using Eudora,<BR>
<BR>
           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
                          			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
for PGP public-key and<BR>
more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/                <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 22:08:09 EDT<BR>
From: Ludowick@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: KEAP Penetration <BR>
<BR>
I just found out that Nathan Okun has his armor penetration equations online <BR>
at:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.warships1.com/W-Nathan/<BR>
<BR>
No need to post 'em here.  Gearheads should check out the articles (naval <BR>
history<BR>
buffs, too). <BR>
<BR>
<btw, thanks to Rupert Boleyn for the modified KEAP PV tables><BR>
<BR>
Ludowick@aol.com <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 11:42:33 +1000<BR>
From: Robert Houghton <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
Subject: Re: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
<BR>
There are at least 3 maybe 4 trek varients beeing booted around by<BR>
Paramount...<BR>
<BR>
1: The Sulu Voyages (mainly fan pushed)<BR>
2: Star Trek Acadamy (NCC-90210/Dawsons Trek)<BR>
3 Star Trek: Special Operations... the adventures od a Trek "Prime Team"<BR>
(using SFB terminology)<BR>
        -this one could be vey good. Imagine a cross between DS9 and Stargate:<BR>
SG1<BR>
<BR>
there is (I think) a fourth but it doesen't come to mind...<BR>
<BR>
Rob<BR>
<BR>
J-Man wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Supposedly there will be a new Trek series taking place on the Enterprise,<BR>
> BEFORE Kirk got a hold of it, in the early days of the Federation.<BR>
> ___________________________________________________________<BR>
>  J-Man<BR>
>  ICQ# 2843475<BR>
>  New Hampshire - U.S.A.<BR>
>  Email : j-man@iname.com<BR>
>  Home Page : http://www.gocsystems.com/<BR>
> ___________________________________________________________<BR>
><BR>
> ----- Original Message -----<BR>
> From: "Robert Houghton" <rhoughto@one.net.au><BR>
> To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2000 9:47 PM<BR>
> Subject: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
><BR>
> > Interesing news..<BR>
> >     Just saw on ET that Jason Alexander (Seinfeld co-star and voice of<BR>
> > Duckman) is going to star in the pilot for a Star Trek (looks to be TOS)<BR>
> > send-up called Star Patrol. The publicity shot I saw was a torso shot of<BR>
> > him in what appeared to be an Original Series polyester uniform. Scarey<BR>
> > neh?<BR>
> ><BR>
> > I wonder if he'll make it past the pilot?<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Rob<BR>
> ><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 19:20:55 -0700<BR>
From: Bill <beast@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
Yet another reason why I use a Mac<BR>
<BR>
>At 12:38 PM 5/5/00 +1200, you wrote:<BR>
>>Apparently it's making quite a mess. I have an answer, though - don't<BR>
>>use MS Outlook, etc. If your emailer doesn't use anything but text the<BR>
>>virus can't do anything.<BR>
><BR>
>you don't even need to restrict yourself to just text.  All you need <BR>
>is no Outlook... :)<BR>
><BR>
>Happily using Eudora,<BR>
><BR>
>          -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
><BR>
>--<BR>
>jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
>                         defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
>                                             -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
>#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
>                         			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
>for PGP public-key and<BR>
>more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
>WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:00:41 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Why FRPG's?<BR>
<BR>
>>Umm.  Miniatures campaigns consist precisely of systems to decide what next<BR>
>week's battle will be.  So do at least some boardgames.<<BR>
><BR>
>But they don't need them to function. You can play miniatures week to week<BR>
>without any campaign concern.<BR>
><BR>
>>In fact, there was no obviously good reason why the first roleplaying game<BR>
>had to have been a Tolkienoid fantasy game.  The elements were already<BR>
>there:  semi-roleplaying miniatures campaigns, plus interesting<BR>
>developments in historical skirmish games.  <<BR>
><BR>
>There was the best reason for it: the creators wanted to play wizards! :-P<BR>
>But actually this is correct, the first RPG could have been any genre, it<BR>
>just happened to be fantasy.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
But there is a good reason why tolkeinesqe miniatures were in increasing<BR>
poularity: There was a sudden "Conflagration" of interest in Tolkein's<BR>
settings. And, since minis games boil down to Historical, Modern Military,<BR>
and fantasy (Essentially, most Sci-Fi minis sets are either Moders with a<BR>
few high tech items, or nearly fantasy). Now, the moderns were part of many<BR>
ROTC curriculae, and historicals tend to be non-campaign or structured<BR>
campaign (IE, only surviving units go to the next battle), so historicals<BR>
tend to have fewer campaign rules in the rules, but more in the<BR>
scenarios...<BR>
<BR>
ROTC's tend to be doing stuff with both paper and maps, and counters and<BR>
maps, plus some minis gaming (Like the Naval Acadamy Combat Simulation<BR>
Rules... I've played them, in 86, and they are harpoon with 4 decimal place<BR>
accuracy rather than 2 place...) Again, they tend to be gamemastered, but<BR>
they focus on purely military actions... scope too limited.<BR>
<BR>
Fantasy minis, however, had both the advantage of not re-creating specific<BR>
battles or campaigns, and tolkein was popular in the late 60's and early<BR>
70's, so that's what was being written for. Vance's magic with tolkeinian<BR>
races seems to have been fairly popular, based upon what's been written<BR>
about the period, and also had campaign rules, and more opportunities for<BR>
"Small Scale" (1player=1figure) scenarios to make sense, so it is the<BR>
logical starting point.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:06:35 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re McCaffree<BR>
<BR>
>>I believe that she has attempted to merge the Ship/Brawn series with the<BR>
>>Dinosaur Planet/Planet Pirate series.  At least I believe that they all<BR>
>>take place within the same Federation.<BR>
>><BR>
><BR>
> Not that I recall, though the Crystal Singer books are, I believe, in common<BR>
>with the Ship/Brawn and Pern stuff. One of the Pern prequels uses a<BR>
>Ship/Brawn pair, as does either the second or third Crystal Singer book. I<BR>
>haven't read the two (or is it now three?) most recent Ship/Brawn books, so I<BR>
>don't know if more interconnects have been established...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
I've seriously considered that the Dinosaur Planet/Planet Pirates series<BR>
are too close to not be the same as the BB ships setting. Including the<BR>
legal systems.<BR>
<BR>
The Powers that Be Trillogy (Quadrology now?) seems to be a different<BR>
universe...<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:13:33 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: [none]<BR>
<BR>
>>http://underdogs.gamingdepot.com/Paragon.htm<BR>
><BR>
>I'd down;oad them, but I have no idea what a .rar file extension is.  Any<BR>
>help here?<BR>
<BR>
.rar is a specific form of compressed file. Wintell and Vax/VMS are the<BR>
only two OS's I've found .rar programs for.<BR>
<BR>
About as obscure as .zoo<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:26:21 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re : Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
<BR>
>A provisional workaround for this was local life being partly based on<BR>
>peptide-backed nucleic acids (PNAs) and an alternate genetic code,<BR>
>leading to the canonical idea that local viruses couldn't infect the<BR>
>Vilani. Bacterial colonisation (as opposed to infection) is still<BR>
>possible, however, so I disagree with William Hostman on that point.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Well, my concerns are:<BR>
	1) can PNA derived xeno-microbes utilize the same amino acids (in<BR>
the handedness used for those with handedness) as H Spaiens vilani?<BR>
	2) will they be too toxic for non-resistant H Sapiens v to survive<BR>
if colonized?<BR>
	3) will HSv be too toxic for them?<BR>
	4) will they be able to form symbiotic relationships in the<BR>
ailiamentary system?<BR>
<BR>
Canonically, infection was an unknown on vland, so obviously, H Sapiens<BR>
vilani was not tasty to Vland's microbials, or those microbials didn't<BR>
interfere with HSv's metabolism...<BR>
<BR>
I am also reminded of the Shaggies. Not quite an alien race, but a<BR>
symbiotic human and local mossoid pairing... unfortunately, it's effect<BR>
reduces higher functions in the brain.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2397<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2398</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
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Traveller-digest        Friday, May 5 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2398<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Luke and the Space Battle Scene<BR>
Tranq<BR>
Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... <BR>
Re: Requesting old digests from archives<BR>
Re: SJG's TNS, redux<BR>
Pyramid and JTAS<BR>
Re: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Re: SJG's TNS, redux<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Re : Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
RE: WARNING<BR>
RE: Re : Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
Space Rangers (was Re: OT: Farscape RPG?)<BR>
[none]<BR>
RE: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
[none]<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Re: Space Rangers (was Re: OT: Farscape RPG?)<BR>
Re: Space Rangers (was Re: OT: Farscape RPG?)<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 00:45:12 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: Luke and the Space Battle Scene<BR>
<BR>
RE: Scene with Luke watching the space battle and talking to Biggs.<BR>
<BR>
I'm pretty sure it was in the book. I find that images you create when<BR>
reading a novel are often stronger than that of a movie - esp. if you were a<BR>
teenager, so maybe that's it.<BR>
<BR>
M<BR>
<BR>
<Bond, we need you to go to the Bahamas and sleep with lots of women><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 00:48:56 +1000<BR>
From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
Subject: Tranq<BR>
<BR>
What happens if someone is struck by a Tranq needle or is sprayed with Tranq<BR>
Gas - would a filter mask prevent it and if shot, if the Tranq Needle's<BR>
Penetration is less than armour - does it even penetrate to inflict the<BR>
toxin?<BR>
<BR>
I had an idea that it would be an End or Str check to resist effects.<BR>
<BR>
M<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 22:56:32 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: You Know You're a Gearhead When... <BR>
<BR>
>Starman Jones has the astrogation department sitting down<BR>
>with paper and pencils and logarithmic tables and<BR>
>calculating the jump vectors, then seeing if everybody<BR>
>agrees on the calculations.  I'm not sure that these were<BR>
>not meant as satire even when written.<BR>
><BR>
>- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
The Starman Jones thing was because Astrogators belong to a guild and<BR>
astrogation charts were *Guild Secrets*. If you had a computer to do the job<BR>
then you wouldn't need a guild member to astrogate. The point was to show<BR>
why unions were a bad thing.<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 13:10:22 +1000<BR>
From: Graeme_Batho@agd.nsw.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Re: Requesting old digests from archives<BR>
<BR>
<<<BR>
> There are other archives of the TML on the web, but I find this to be more<BR>
>       convenient as I have limited web access.<BR>
><BR>
About the internet archives where are they and how organized are<BR>
they?<BR>
Tim Reynolds<BR>
tim@premier.net<BR>
225-334-5063<BR>
>><BR>
I think there are a few places on the net. None I know of have a subject index,<BR>
they are all organised by issue.<BR>
<BR>
One of the places you can get old archives on the net is:<BR>
ftp.mpgn.com<BR>
<BR>
I know there are others, but I don't have an address for them.<BR>
Graeme<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 05:32:54 +0200<BR>
From: Ingo Heinscher <Ingo.Heinscher@germanynet.de><BR>
Subject: Re: SJG's TNS, redux<BR>
<BR>
Steven Bonneville schrieb:<BR>
> <BR>
> I think I've mentioned this before, but the FTL ansible that the Imperium<BR>
> has been using lately to cut the six month (by jump-6) travel time between<BR>
> Capital and the Solomani Rim is stu-- er, stupendous....<BR>
> <BR>
>   http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/oldnews.html<BR>
>   (affected messages: 119-1117/120-1117 and 137-1117/138-1117/140-1117)<BR>
> <BR>
>   -- Steve Bonneville<BR>
<BR>
Thi is all part of a greater scheme; the Solomani are preparing an<BR>
attack against the Imerium in the Kuculcan subsector, but the Imperial<BR>
Navy already knows. Unfortunateyl, the Imperial Navy PR office is not<BR>
very good at estimating communications times...<BR>
<BR>
Or it is just that they will say soon "TNS apologizes for the<BR>
inconvenience- we had some dating problem with some of our recent news".<BR>
<BR>
Wer Nase-<BR>
Who nose?<BR>
<BR>
;-)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 23:37:25 -0400<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Pyramid and JTAS<BR>
<BR>
I just gotta put in a plug here. Subscriptions to Pyramid are US$15 a year.<BR>
There is a new issue every week that's 52 issues a year plus access to the<BR>
SJGames playtest files and discussion boards. Do the math. That's 29 cents<BR>
an issue. JTAS is the same and includes Brubek's. You can subscribe to both<BR>
for less than 60 cents a week.<BR>
<BR>
The amount of usable game related material is equal to many game<BR>
supplements. There are interviews with game designers and stuff for all the<BR>
various Traveller games.<BR>
<BR>
Why am I plugging them here? Because (besides the fact that I hope to sell<BR>
more material to Loren and Steven) I know there are a few holdouts on the<BR>
TML. I just want to say, "People you shouldn't be denying yourselves. It's a<BR>
better investment that that color block shirt or Columbia PFG Bahama Hat you<BR>
were going to buy this month. It will enhance your gaming experience, even<BR>
if you *never* play GURPS.<BR>
<BR>
Pitch over.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 23:30:12 -0400<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
<BR>
At 11:42 AM 5/5/00 +1000, you wrote:<BR>
>There are at least 3 maybe 4 trek varients beeing booted around by<BR>
>Paramount...<BR>
><BR>
>1: The Sulu Voyages (mainly fan pushed)<BR>
>2: Star Trek Acadamy (NCC-90210/Dawsons Trek)<BR>
>3 Star Trek: Special Operations... the adventures od a Trek "Prime Team"<BR>
>(using SFB terminology)<BR>
>         -this one could be vey good. Imagine a cross between DS9 and <BR>
> Stargate:<BR>
>SG1<BR>
><BR>
>there is (I think) a fourth but it doesen't come to mind...<BR>
<BR>
early history of ST: Enterprise before Kirk<BR>
pre-history of Trek: Either just before or just after (I'm not sure) the <BR>
founding of the Federation.<BR>
<BR>
           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
                          			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
for PGP public-key and<BR>
more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/                <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 23:51:41 -0400<BR>
From: "Jeffrey D. Greenly" <jgreenly@intelos.net><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
<decloaking><BR>
Absolutely NOT A HOAX!!!! There are actually two variants. One is ILOVEYOU<BR>
and the other says something like A Joke for You. The virus attacks jpg and<BR>
mp3 files as well as a host of other stuff. It deletes or garbles or changes<BR>
extensions, and it also mails itself out to your entire address book, then<BR>
deletes the address book! It specifically targets Outlook on Windows<BR>
machines ONLY. The hospital I work at channels most intrahospital data<BR>
communications through Outlook Exchange Server. It is a nightmare there<BR>
right now. Be very, very careful; this is like Melissa on steroids. It's<BR>
being recommended that you avoid opening any attachments. Oh, another note:<BR>
This thing can also transfer through mIRC! Whoever wrote this, IMHO needs to<BR>
get his/her head put in a vice!<BR>
<BR>
Sorry about the OT post, but we're all in this together...<BR>
<BR>
Jeff<BR>
jgreenly@intelos.net<BR>
<cloaking><BR>
<BR>
- ----- Original Message -----<BR>
From: "Jens Rydholm" <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
To: "TML" <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Sent: Thursday, May 04, 2000 7:41 PM<BR>
Subject: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Another RPG mailing list (the Rolemaster mailing list) that I subscribe to<BR>
had<BR>
> an e-mail virus appearing in it today. I am about 99% sure this is not a<BR>
hoax.<BR>
><BR>
> The virus takes the form of a loveletter. It is a worm-type virus,<BR>
spreading<BR>
> itself if you open in in Micro$oft Outlook. It mails itself to all persons<BR>
in<BR>
> your address book.<BR>
><BR>
> One person on the list apparently got infected. The virus got posted to<BR>
the<BR>
> list, and at least one person opened the attached file before warnings got<BR>
out.<BR>
> The virus mailed itself to the list once more from that person's address.<BR>
><BR>
> IF YOU GET AN E-MAIL WITH THE SUBJECT  "ILOVEYOU", DON'T OPEN THE ATTACHED<BR>
FILE<BR>
><BR>
> The attached file is called LOVE-LETTER-FOR-YOU.TXT.vbs<BR>
><BR>
> Note: If I am wrong (which I doubt), I apologize for spreading the hoax. I<BR>
do<BR>
> not think this apology is necessary, however.<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
+--------------------------------------+------------------------------------<BR>
- ---+<BR>
> |                                      |<BR>
|<BR>
> | Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do<BR>
NOT |<BR>
> | Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my<BR>
address   |<BR>
> | Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing<BR>
so  |<BR>
> | ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public<BR>
flogging.  |<BR>
> |                                      |<BR>
|<BR>
><BR>
+--------------------------------------+------------------------------------<BR>
- ---+<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 23:49:06 -0400<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: SJG's TNS, redux<BR>
<BR>
At 05:32 AM 5/5/00 +0200, you wrote:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>Steven Bonneville schrieb:<BR>
> ><BR>
> > I think I've mentioned this before, but the FTL ansible that the Imperium<BR>
> > has been using lately to cut the six month (by jump-6) travel time between<BR>
> > Capital and the Solomani Rim is stu-- er, stupendous....<BR>
> ><BR>
> >   http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/oldnews.html<BR>
> >   (affected messages: 119-1117/120-1117 and 137-1117/138-1117/140-1117)<BR>
> ><BR>
> >   -- Steve Bonneville<BR>
><BR>
>Thi is all part of a greater scheme; the Solomani are preparing an<BR>
>attack against the Imerium in the Kuculcan subsector, but the Imperial<BR>
>Navy already knows. Unfortunateyl, the Imperial Navy PR office is not<BR>
>very good at estimating communications times...<BR>
><BR>
>Or it is just that they will say soon "TNS apologizes for the<BR>
>inconvenience- we had some dating problem with some of our recent news".<BR>
><BR>
>Wer Nase-<BR>
>Who nose?<BR>
<BR>
Personally, me feeling is that the message are dated when they arrive at <BR>
Capital/Core, not when they originate wherever.  But that takes all the fun <BR>
out of the FTL ansibles...<BR>
<BR>
           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
                          			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
for PGP public-key and<BR>
more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/                <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 00:02:38 -0400<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
At 11:51 PM 5/4/00 -0400, you wrote:<BR>
>Absolutely NOT A HOAX!!!! There are actually two variants. One is ILOVEYOU<BR>
>and the other says something like A Joke for You. The virus attacks jpg and<BR>
>mp3 files as well as a host of other stuff. It deletes or garbles or changes<BR>
>extensions, and it also mails itself out to your entire address book, then<BR>
>deletes the address book! It specifically targets Outlook on Windows<BR>
>machines ONLY.<BR>
<BR>
I've also had from a somewhat reliable source that Netscape Mail is <BR>
vulnerable to it.  I'm not sure that's true though...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
                          			     -- Albert Einstein<BR>
for PGP public-key and<BR>
more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/                <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:12:32 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
Jeff <jgreenly@intelos.net> wrote:<BR>
><decloaking><BR>
>Absolutely NOT A HOAX!!!! There are actually two variants. One is ILOVEYOU<BR>
>and the other says something like A Joke for You. The virus attacks jpg and<BR>
>mp3 files as well as a host of other stuff. It deletes or garbles or changes<BR>
>extensions, and it also mails itself out to your entire address book, then<BR>
>deletes the address book! It specifically targets Outlook on Windows<BR>
>machines ONLY. The hospital I work at channels most intrahospital data<BR>
>communications through Outlook Exchange Server. It is a nightmare there<BR>
>right now. Be very, very careful; this is like Melissa on steroids. It's<BR>
>being recommended that you avoid opening any attachments. Oh, another note:<BR>
>This thing can also transfer through mIRC! Whoever wrote this, IMHO needs to<BR>
>get his/her head put in a vice!<BR>
<BR>
Why anyone would still be using Exchange or Outlook after all the <BR>
problems with e-mail viruses is beyond me.  The programs are <BR>
certainly not worth it.<BR>
<BR>
>Sorry about the OT post, but we're all in this together...<BR>
<BR>
Except for those of us who are using Macs.  (Not that we don't sympathize.)<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
'Shiny objects are good.' - the Tick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 14:10:23 +1000<BR>
From: "Robert O'Connor" <robocon@ozemail.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re : Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
<BR>
William Hostman wrote :-<BR>
> Well, my concerns are:<BR>
>         1) can PNA derived xeno-microbes utilize the same amino acids (in<BR>
> the handedness used for those with handedness) as H Spaiens vilani?<BR>
<BR>
If the proteins of Vland native life were made up of D-isomer amino<BR>
acids instead of L-isomers, the Vilani could not have survived.<BR>
D-isomers are very difficult to absorb, lack nutritional value and<BR>
require a lot of effort to 'invert' [Spontaneous inversion takes years<BR>
and forms the basis of an archaeological dating technique].<BR>
<BR>
(I note that D-serine was found to be a neurotransmitter in mammalian<BR>
nervous systems, however - check 'Nature' in December '99).<BR>
<BR>
The assumption was that there were many amino acids in common between<BR>
Vland and Terran life. Essential amino acids or analogues thereof,<BR>
could be found in Vland life or produced by modified commensal bacteria.<BR>
<BR>
>         2) will they be too toxic for non-resistant H Sapiens v to survive<BR>
> if colonized?<BR>
<BR>
It depends on what the bacteria produce. I would be concerned that<BR>
some of the alternate amino acids could be very toxic (have amphetamine<BR>
or gamma-hydroxybutyrate like effects, for example).<BR>
IMHO, over time, 'symbiotic' relationships would be favoured, similar<BR>
to our gut bugs forming vitamin K for us.<BR>
<BR>
>         3) will HSv be too toxic for them?<BR>
No. Bacteria are masters of adaptation. Our alimentary tracts and skin<BR>
are zoos. It's been estimated that there are more species of bacterium<BR>
in our guts than have actually been described yet ; at a minimum, over<BR>
half the bacterial fauna hasn't been described.<BR>
<BR>
The converse question, "Is Vland too toxic for Earthly bacteria?" has<BR>
a similar answer. The gut organisms the proto-Vilani brought with them<BR>
have had an effect on the Vland environment. 'Slime cities' made up<BR>
of massive colonies of these bacteria can be occasionally found on<BR>
Vland, for example.<BR>
<BR>
>         4) will they be able to form symbiotic relationships in the<BR>
> ailiamentary system?<BR>
<BR>
Yes. They have to as it's in the best interest of both organisms.<BR>
Especially virulent/pathogenic Vland bugs would be selected out - if the<BR>
host dies, their comfy habitat goes too.<BR>
This doesn't exclude the sporadic occurrence of nasty mutants, but...<BR>
<BR>
> Canonically, infection was an unknown on vland, so obviously, H Sapiens<BR>
> vilani was not tasty to Vland's microbials, or those microbials didn't<BR>
> interfere with HSv's metabolism...<BR>
<BR>
The occasional virulent microbes may not have been recognisable as such,<BR>
or have very low infectivity (so the host perished and that was it).<BR>
<BR>
I prefer the latter explanation. Microbes are tough, as recent posters<BR>
have pointed out (extreme environments w.r.t. radiation, acidity,<BR>
temperature have distinctive microfauna) and will 'eat' most anything.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor<BR>
Medico, Gamer<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:27:47 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
> Why anyone would still be using Exchange or Outlook after all the<BR>
> problems with e-mail viruses is beyond me.  The programs are<BR>
> certainly not worth it.<BR>
<BR>
Outlook is actually one of the most advanced e-mail programs in the world<BR>
when it comes to using cryptography. Can you think of any other e-mail<BR>
program which supports dual key pairs (one for signature and another for<BR>
encryption)? This feature makes it very attractive to corporate customers<BR>
who want to easily and cheaply push stuff off of an expensive yet secure<BR>
proprietary network and onto the Internet. You can immediately do useful<BR>
things like EDI over your e-mail, but securely, and with the non-repudiation<BR>
you want from the digital signature. And with the dual key pair support, you<BR>
can do key backup of encryption keys without compromising the integrity of<BR>
your digital signatures.<BR>
<BR>
I personally hate Outlook, but corporate customers love it.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:36:46 -0700<BR>
From: "Luther Martin" <martin@ksarul.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Re : Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans (longish)<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> If the proteins of Vland native life were made up of D-isomer amino<BR>
> acids instead of L-isomers, the Vilani could not have survived.<BR>
> D-isomers are very difficult to absorb, lack nutritional value and<BR>
> require a lot of effort to 'invert' [Spontaneous inversion takes years<BR>
> and forms the basis of an archaeological dating technique].<BR>
> Medico, Gamer<BR>
<BR>
Is there any reason why life could not evolve which can metabolize both<BR>
stereoisomers?<BR>
<BR>
You can certainly see why the use of both might evolve on one world, but by<BR>
different life forms. Using the D-isomer would be a good defense against<BR>
being eaten by your L-isomer based predators, and vice-versa. You would then<BR>
have essentially two separate yet parallel food chains.<BR>
<BR>
So if you have two different food sources based on the different<BR>
stereoisomers, it would certainly be in your best interest to be able to<BR>
metabolize both.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 01:18:59 EDT<BR>
From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Space Rangers (was Re: OT: Farscape RPG?)<BR>
<BR>
>><BR>
>>  Then there was "Space Rangers." Aside from the "pilot-killer" chair on the<BR>
>>bridge of their cutter, a wonderful show that got the short end of the stick<BR>
>>due to being premiered the same WEEK as ST:DS9 AND Babylon-5...<BR>
><BR>
>Was there another Space Rangers that I missed? ST:DS9 came out in 92-93. B5 <BR>
>came out in 93. The Space Rangers show that I remember came out in 88-89. <BR>
>IIRC :)<BR>
<BR>
 Live action. Captain going through a divorce, engineer mostly second- or <BR>
third-rate cybernetic replacements, alien gunner, amazon pilot in a <BR>
face-forward couch. Dealing with smuggling, search-and-rescue, and <BR>
"Spacewraiths" (the punchline for which I will NOT ruin here). Cheesy fun.<BR>
 I'll pull out the videotapes and check copyright dates (assuming I got them) <BR>
but I'm reasonably certain the show hit (or missed) at the same time as the <BR>
B:5 pilot, went to six episodes or so, then vanished.<BR>
<BR>
GC<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:34:05 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: [none]<BR>
<BR>
>> Interesing news..<BR>
>>     Just saw on ET that Jason Alexander (Seinfeld co-star and voice of<BR>
>> Duckman) is going to star in the pilot for a Star Trek (looks to be TOS)<BR>
>> send-up called Star Patrol. The publicity shot I saw was a torso shot of<BR>
>> him in what appeared to be an Original Series polyester uniform. Scarey<BR>
>> neh?<BR>
>><BR>
>> I wonder if he'll make it past the pilot?<BR>
>><BR>
>> Rob<BR>
<BR>
Well, Jason Alexander in TOS uniform is no big thing: he did a special this<BR>
year where he wore it in downtown are near Paramount...<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 17:41:07 +1200<BR>
From: "Frank G. Pitt" <frankie@mundens.gen.nz><BR>
Subject: RE: The "Episode IV debate"<BR>
<BR>
> On Behalf Of Brian T. Simmons<BR>
><BR>
> Don't give up so soon.  Every day I have stuff loaded in to my Palm V and<BR>
> SCIFI.COM is one of my favorite thing I get.  Anyway May 3rd, (I<BR>
> load it in<BR>
> the evening for the next day) they say, "Lucasfilm confirmed for Wired<BR>
> Magazine that it will produce a DVD version of Star Wars: Episode I, while<BR>
> DVDs of the other Star Wars films are in the works."<BR>
<BR>
They sort of _have_ to do this, otherwise it gives more profits to the<BR>
people who don't care about copyright in Asia.<BR>
<BR>
Frankie<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:49:00 -0800<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: [none]<BR>
<BR>
>There are at least 3 maybe 4 trek varients beeing booted around by<BR>
>Paramount...<BR>
><BR>
>1: The Sulu Voyages (mainly fan pushed)<BR>
>2: Star Trek Acadamy (NCC-90210/Dawsons Trek)<BR>
>3 Star Trek: Special Operations... the adventures od a Trek "Prime Team"<BR>
>(using SFB terminology)<BR>
>        -this one could be vey good. Imagine a cross between DS9 and Stargate:<BR>
>SG1<BR>
><BR>
>there is (I think) a fourth but it doesen't come to mind...<BR>
><BR>
>Rob<BR>
><BR>
Several (shortly after paramount got a web site) years ago, I hit their<BR>
website, and a few years later, got an email survey from paramount.com.<BR>
Voyager was already on the air when the survey went up. There were several<BR>
proposed "New Trek Series" for which comments were elicited:<BR>
<BR>
Star Trek - The Missing Years (Sulu and the Excelsior)<BR>
A show about a Klingon ship (To have been dialoged in Klingonaase with<BR>
english subtitles)<BR>
A show much like voyager, but NOT elsewere in the galaxy, sort of a<BR>
Shipboard Soap opera.<BR>
<BR>
The local UPN Affiliate has NO information on the new trek series except<BR>
that there will be a new one.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis Vilani: uilamaanamti sirohbrankilin<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 22:58:55 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----<BR>
Hash: SHA1<BR>
<BR>
on 5/4/00 9:27 PM, Luther Martin at martin@ksarul.com wrote:<BR>
> Outlook is actually one of the most advanced e-mail programs in the<BR>
> world when it comes to using cryptography. Can you think of any<BR>
> other e-mail program which supports dual key pairs (one for<BR>
> signature and another for encryption)? This feature makes it very<BR>
> attractive to corporate customers who want to easily and cheaply<BR>
> push stuff off of an expensive yet secure proprietary network and<BR>
> onto the Internet. You can immediately do useful things like EDI<BR>
> over your e-mail, but securely, and with the non-repudiation you<BR>
> want from the digital signature. And with the dual key pair<BR>
> support, you can do key backup of encryption keys without<BR>
> compromising the integrity of your digital signatures.<BR>
<BR>
Speaking as a consultant in the computer industry, former corporate<BR>
IS manager and general IS geek; I have yet to see a corporate<BR>
implementation of secure email.  Users won't use it.  Most can barely<BR>
run email.  Power users run whatever email package they like, and use<BR>
PGP for security.<BR>
<BR>
Corporate installs like Outlook because it is FREE with office.  As<BR>
an email client/organizer is is rather underpowered.  We have done<BR>
many conversions of Outlook to Goldmine for corporate mail.<BR>
- - --<BR>
"Everything I need to know, I learned from<BR>
killing smart people and eating their brains."<BR>
- - -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 23:00:51 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Space Rangers (was Re: OT: Farscape RPG?)<BR>
<BR>
on 5/4/00 10:18 PM, GypsyComet@aol.com at GypsyComet@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>>> <BR>
>>> Then there was "Space Rangers." Aside from the "pilot-killer" chair on the<BR>
>>> bridge of their cutter, a wonderful show that got the short end of the stick<BR>
>>> due to being premiered the same WEEK as ST:DS9 AND Babylon-5...<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Was there another Space Rangers that I missed? ST:DS9 came out in 92-93. B5<BR>
>> came out in 93. The Space Rangers show that I remember came out in 88-89.<BR>
>> IIRC :)<BR>
> <BR>
> Live action. Captain going through a divorce, engineer mostly second- or<BR>
> third-rate cybernetic replacements, alien gunner, amazon pilot in a<BR>
> face-forward couch. Dealing with smuggling, search-and-rescue, and<BR>
> "Spacewraiths" (the punchline for which I will NOT ruin here). Cheesy fun.<BR>
> I'll pull out the videotapes and check copyright dates (assuming I got them)<BR>
> but I'm reasonably certain the show hit (or missed) at the same time as the<BR>
> B:5 pilot, went to six episodes or so, then vanished.<BR>
> <BR>
> GC<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
The amazonian pilot showed up later in B:5 as one of the Martian freedom<BR>
fighters, who eventually replaced Garabaldi, as I recall.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Everything I need to know, I learned from<BR>
killing smart people and eating their brains."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 23:14:56 -0700<BR>
From: red@europa.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Space Rangers (was Re: OT: Farscape RPG?)<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>The amazonian pilot showed up later in B:5 as one of the Martian freedom<BR>
>fighters, who eventually replaced Garabaldi, as I recall.<BR>
><BR>
>Tod Glenn<BR>
<BR>
Yes, the same actress played the head of the Martian resistance cell <BR>
that Garibaldi, Stephen, and Marcus interacted with on Mars.  But, <BR>
replaced Garibaldi in what way???  I'm a tad confused here.<BR>
<BR>
Red<BR>
<BR>
'Shiny objects are good.' - the Tick<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2398<BR>
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<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #2399</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	5/5/00 8:11:25 AM Pacific Daylight Time<BR>
From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
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Traveller-digest        Friday, May 5 2000        Volume 1999 : Number 2399<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Space Rangers (was Re: OT: Farscape RPG?)<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Re: SJG's TNS, redux<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
[OT] Television Series<BR>
Re: Copyright question<BR>
Re: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
Just go to mcafee.com -nt (was Re: WARNING)<BR>
Re: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
Re: Luke and the Space Battle Scene<BR>
RE: Luke and the Space Battle Scene<BR>
Re: WARNING<BR>
Re: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
B5 stuff<BR>
Faster and faster<BR>
Re: SJG's TNS, redux<BR>
Re: KEAP penetration (was Design Questions)<BR>
Re: KEAP penetration (was Design Questions)<BR>
Re : Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
Re: Luke and the Space Battle Scene<BR>
RE: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 23:31:06 -0700<BR>
From: Tod Glenn <webmaster@travellercentral.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Space Rangers (was Re: OT: Farscape RPG?)<BR>
<BR>
on 5/4/00 11:14 PM, red@europa.com at red@europa.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>> <BR>
>> The amazonian pilot showed up later in B:5 as one of the Martian freedom<BR>
>> fighters, who eventually replaced Garabaldi, as I recall.<BR>
>> <BR>
>> Tod Glenn<BR>
> <BR>
> Yes, the same actress played the head of the Martian resistance cell<BR>
> that Garibaldi, Stephen, and Marcus interacted with on Mars.  But,<BR>
> replaced Garibaldi in what way???  I'm a tad confused here.<BR>
> <BR>
> Red<BR>
<BR>
In one of the last episodes, did not Sheridan make her his security chief?<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Everything I need to know, I learned from<BR>
killing smart people and eating their brains."<BR>
- -- <BR>
Tod Glenn<BR>
mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>
http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 08:08:38 +0200<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
At 01:41 05.05.00, you wrote:<BR>
>The virus takes the form of a loveletter. It is a worm-type virus, spreading<BR>
>itself if you open in in Micro$oft Outlook. It mails itself to all persons in<BR>
>your address book.<BR>
And what does that teach us?<BR>
<BR>
...Dont use Micro$oft$ Outlook...<BR>
- ---<BR>
Volker A. Greimann<BR>
greimann@geocities.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 23:38:30 -0700<BR>
From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
Subject: Re: SJG's TNS, redux<BR>
<BR>
...<BR>
>> I think I've mentioned this before, but the FTL ansible that the Imperium<BR>
>> has been using lately to cut the six month (by jump-6) travel time between<BR>
>> Capital and the Solomani Rim is stu-- er, stupendous....<BR>
...<BR>
>Thi is all part of a greater scheme; the Solomani are preparing an<BR>
>attack against the Imerium in the Kuculcan subsector, but the Imperial<BR>
>Navy already knows. Unfortunateyl, the Imperial Navy PR office is not<BR>
>very good at estimating communications times...<BR>
<BR>
  ISTR an old SF short story where the good guys had the tremendous<BR>
advantage that their FTL (/instantaneous) comm tech ("Dirac transmitter",<BR>
IIRC?) wasn't very biased against causality - the system could actually<BR>
be mined for all of the transmissions that would _ever_ be made...<BR>
<BR>
  A better than average short on such things, IMHO. (was in the second<BR>
volume of the "Galactic Empires" anthology?).<BR>
<BR>
        Steven Hudson<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 10:16:02 +0200<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
red@europa.com wrote:<BR>
> Why anyone would still be using Exchange or Outlook after all the <BR>
> problems with e-mail viruses is beyond me.  The programs are <BR>
> certainly not worth it.<BR>
<BR>
Agree. Don't use those programs.<BR>
<BR>
> >Sorry about the OT post, but we're all in this together...<BR>
> <BR>
> Except for those of us who are using Macs.  (Not that we don't sympathize.)<BR>
<BR>
Or those of us using Linux (the penguin saves us)   ;-)<BR>
<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
| Name: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm       | By receiving this message, you do NOT |<BR>
| Mail: jenry023@student.liu.se        | receive the right to use my address   |<BR>
| Home: http://m227.ryd.student.liu.se | for advertisement purposes. Doing so  |<BR>
| ICQ#: 3844745                        | will be punished by public flogging.  |<BR>
|                                      |                                       |<BR>
+--------------------------------------+---------------------------------------+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 01:26:13 -0700<BR>
From: "Kiri Aradia Morgan" <tiamat@tsoft.com><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
From: Jens Rydholm <jenry023@student.liu.se><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>red@europa.com wrote:<BR>
>> Why anyone would still be using Exchange or Outlook after all the<BR>
problems with e-mail viruses is beyond me.  The programs are certainly not<BR>
worth it.<BR>
>><BR>
>Agree. Don't use those programs.<BR>
><BR>
sorry, they make it possible for me to do emails in Japanese and English...<BR>
<BR>
Kiri  =)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 10:00:54 +0100<BR>
From: CGS <michael@carrickfergus.schoolzone.co.uk><BR>
Subject: [OT] Television Series<BR>
<BR>
Ultraviolet was very good, clever and well thought out even if you<BR>
disagreed with their interpretation of vampires it was good to see a<BR>
modern, non-religious interpretation of them though I am still unsure<BR>
about the mirrors and I am really unsure about carbon bullets.<BR>
I really liked the soundtrack but I have not seen it for sale yet. My<BR>
brother has recently bought the series on tape so I can rewatch it.<BR>
<BR>
American series usually look better but can be a little bit more<BR>
predictable. However there are far more of them so we can expect more<BR>
'hits'.<BR>
Either can be utter rubbish.<BR>
<BR>
Current Favourites include:<BR>
Stargate (the more I see it the more impresed I am)<BR>
Something about a new species of humanity (A nice idea)<BR>
B5<BR>
<BR>
I loathe ST:TNG. I was really excited until I saw the first episode.<BR>
Three problems: Q, the whole feel of the Federation, it is to 'nice' and<BR>
children on a warship (possible excusable if the ship was going to be<BR>
away for years but it is not).<BR>
DS9 is better, I can watch that but I hate the technobabble. At least<BR>
Traveller tries to make it logical.<BR>
<BR>
Michael<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 05:44:42 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Copyright question<BR>
<BR>
Jens Rydholm wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Well, since I only have the file for my own personal use right now, that is not<BR>
> an infringement (I hope).<BR>
<BR>
Actually, it is, for US copyright law anyway.  But, because you<BR>
of the limited use it is almost certainly permitted under the "Fair Use"<BR>
doctrine. The "fair use" determination is always a judgment call.<BR>
One British case I've studied suggested that copying someone<BR>
else's table of contents could conceivably be infringement in the<BR>
right circumstances.<BR>
<BR>
> I would like to ask MM, but I don't have his e-mail address...<BR>
<BR>
cardsharks@aol.com is the address he uses on this list.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 05:57:33 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: OT! Waaaay OT! For all the trek watchers<BR>
<BR>
"Star Trek: Birth of the Federation"<BR>
<BR>
Boring!<BR>
<BR>
Apparently, there were two other proposals that were rejected:<BR>
<BR>
ST: Starfleet Academy (called Star Trek 90210 by some)<BR>
ST: Mission Impossible (or something like that)<BR>
<BR>
I hope the Excelsior campaign convinces them otherwise.<BR>
Captain Sulu on the Excelsior, after Kirk's death.  Ensign<BR>
Tuvok on board.  Spock, Uhura, Scotty and Chekov<BR>
available for plausible and age-appropriate cameos.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
J-Man wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Supposedly there will be a new Trek series taking place on the Enterprise,<BR>
> BEFORE Kirk got a hold of it, in the early days of the Federation.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 06:02:32 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Just go to mcafee.com -nt (was Re: WARNING)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 11:35:48 +0200 (METDST)<BR>
From: Hans Rancke-Madsen <rancke@diku.dk><BR>
Subject: Re: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
<BR>
Matt Bond writes:<BR>
<BR>
>>From: Hans Rancke-Madsen [mailto:rancke@diku.dk]<BR>
<BR>
>> Glenn Goffin writes:<BR>
>> <BR>
>>>It's possible that the Ancients just took Homo sapiens sapiens for<BR>
>>>servants, <BR>
>> <BR>
>>Not Homo sapiens sapiens. Just Homo [something] sapiens[*]. <BR>
> <BR>
>I thought it was Genus Species Subspecies, i.e. Homo sapiens [something]<BR>
<BR>
Yes, you're quite right. I don't know whare my mind was when I wrote that.<BR>
Sorry.<BR>
<BR>
>>[*] IMTU I use 'Homo antiquitus sapiens', which I hope will <BR>
>>    one day work its way into canon.<BR>
><BR>
>Call it Homo sapiens antiquitus and I'll support it <g><BR>
 <BR>
Will do ;-).<BR>
<BR>
Ian Ferguson writes:<BR>
<BR>
>I presume that you mean /Homo sapiens [something]/, as the subspecies<BR>
>designation should come after the species.  <BR>
<BR>
Yes indeed.<BR>
<BR>
>Distinguishing between species can be difficult, and between subspecies<BR>
>even more so. I am not trying to discourage this sort of characterization,<BR>
>but people should be aware that there are shades of grey involved.<BR>
<BR>
Yes, but my main point is that in the TU they have evidence that we do not<BR>
have in the Real Universe. To wit, that various descendants of hominids<BR>
taken from Earth 300,000 years ago are still interfertile, which proves<BR>
that they are the same species, which further proves that their closest<BR>
common ancestor was also the same species (two descendants must of<BR>
necessity have diverged less from their common ancestor than from each<BR>
other.<BR>
<BR>
In the RU Homo sapiens may not have evolved already 300,000 years ago, and<BR>
even if he had there's no way to prove it. In the TU he had and it is a<BR>
proven fact. So in the TU there are less shades of grey than in the RU.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
      Hans Rancke<BR>
University of Copenhagen<BR>
     rancke@diku.dk<BR>
- ------------<BR>
        "The referee should determine the nature of subsequent<BR>
         events based on the individual situation."<BR>
                                _76 Patrons_, p. 8<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 06:08:40 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Luke and the Space Battle Scene<BR>
<BR>
Karen and Michael Hughes wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> I'm pretty sure it was in the book. I find that images you create when<BR>
> reading a novel are often stronger than that of a movie<BR>
<BR>
That isn't true for me.  I'm always the hero in the movie in my head<BR>
when reading a good novel.<BR>
<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 09:29:02 +0100 <BR>
From: Matt Bond <MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Luke and the Space Battle Scene<BR>
<BR>
> -----Original Message-----<BR>
> From: Karen and Michael Hughes [mailto:kmhughes@dynamite.com.au]<BR>
> M<BR>
> <BR>
> <Bond, we need you to go to the Bahamas and sleep with lots of women><BR>
<BR>
Ooooh! If you insist!<g><BR>
<BR>
Matt (Bond)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 07:08:42 -0400<BR>
From: "Eric & Diane Freitas" <ericfrei@gte.net><BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
Not a hoax!  It shut down our email system at work yesterday.  Evidently<BR>
someone<BR>
got it, then everyone else got a copy!<BR>
<BR>
IMNSHO, I believe this to be the work of the Music Recording industry, since<BR>
it<BR>
kills all mp3 and mp2 files on your computer, among other things.<BR>
<BR>
Eric<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Juliean Galak <jg42@cornell.edu><BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Date: Thursday, May 04, 2000 8:07 PM<BR>
Subject: Re: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>At 01:41 AM 5/5/00 +0200, you wrote:<BR>
>>Another RPG mailing list (the Rolemaster mailing list) that I subscribe to<BR>
had<BR>
>>an e-mail virus appearing in it today. I am about 99% sure this is not a<BR>
hoax.<BR>
>><BR>
>>The virus takes the form of a loveletter. It is a worm-type virus,<BR>
spreading<BR>
>>itself if you open in in Micro$oft Outlook. It mails itself to all persons<BR>
in<BR>
>>your address book.<BR>
>><BR>
>>One person on the list apparently got infected. The virus got posted to<BR>
the<BR>
>>list, and at least one person opened the attached file before warnings got<BR>
>>out.<BR>
>>The virus mailed itself to the list once more from that person's address.<BR>
>><BR>
>>IF YOU GET AN E-MAIL WITH THE SUBJECT  "ILOVEYOU", DON'T OPEN THE ATTACHED<BR>
>>FILE<BR>
>><BR>
>>The attached file is called LOVE-LETTER-FOR-YOU.TXT.vbs<BR>
>><BR>
>>Note: If I am wrong (which I doubt), I apologize for spreading the hoax. I<BR>
do<BR>
>>not think this apology is necessary, however.<BR>
><BR>
>I initially discounted this as a hoax, but it most assuredly<BR>
>not!  Something like 10% of all PCs in the UK are reported to be<BR>
>infected.  Take this one very seriously....   Norton Antivirus has info on<BR>
>this, as does thepope (I can't recall if that's a .com or a .org).  Also<BR>
>look at slashdot.org for info.<BR>
><BR>
>           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
><BR>
>--<BR>
>jg42@cornell.edu        "I do not agree with a word you say, but I will<BR>
>                          defend to the death your right to say it."<BR>
>                                              -- Francois Marie Voltaire<BR>
>#include <disclaimer.h> "Imagination is more important than knowledge"<BR>
>                               -- Albert Einstein<BR>
>for PGP public-key and<BR>
>more quotes, http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/plan.htm<BR>
>WWW Page: http://gerfalcon.tzo.com/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 07:38:55 -0400<BR>
From: Steve Daniels <stevedaniels@portcaddo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Evolution and the Ancient diaspora of humans<BR>
<BR>
Hans Rancke-Madsen wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >I thought it was Genus Species Subspecies, i.e. Homo sapiens [something]<BR>
><BR>
> Yes, you're quite right. I don't know whare my mind was when I wrote that.<BR>
> Sorry.<BR>
<BR>
But it isn't always that way.  I looked at several discussions<BR>
of this recently.  From my somewhat cursory look into, it<BR>
seems clear to me that the usage of these classifications<BR>
has changed over time.  The "genus species subspecies"<BR>
is the ideal, but there are many exceptions.  I think,<BR>
though someone else might actually know, that the<BR>
many, many exceptions are older, less-uniform classifications.<BR>
<BR>
Most exceptions that I observed involved inserting a term<BR>
between the genus and species to identify all sorts of<BR>
different things:<BR>
geographical region<BR>
minor differences in coloration, physiology, etc.<BR>
primary significant populations vs. small, isolated ones.<BR>
<BR>
For example:  Zebras.<BR>
Family Equidae<BR>
Genus Equus<BR>
<BR>
Several types are specified:<BR>
E. quagga<BR>
E. quagga quagga (extinct)<BR>
E. grevyi<BR>
E. zebra<BR>
<BR>
The primary difference between these 'species' is the location of<BR>
their habitat, though there are some differences in striping and<BR>
size.  Apparently, they can interbreed, which means they are<BR>
the same species by definition.<BR>
<BR>
This is true also of the ass (donkey) and the "half-asses", the latter having<BR>
long, slender legs, shorter ears, bigger hooves and only a one-tone bray,<BR>
not the two-tone Hee-Haw/Eey-Or bray.<BR>
<BR>
Equidae equus assinus (also Equus africanus)<BR>
Equidae equus hemionus (Asiatic asses, aka "half-asses")<BR>
Equidae equus hemionus hemionus (Mongolia)<BR>
Equidae equus hemionus kiang (Tibet)<BR>
Equidae equus hemionus onager (Iran, Turkmenistan)<BR>
Equidae equus hemionus khur (India, Pakistan)<BR>
Equidae equus hemionus hemippus (Syria)<BR>
Equidae equus assinus africanus (Nubian ass)<BR>
<BR>
Then there are horses and donkeys (Ob. Trav, mules and<BR>
crossbreeding between Zhodani and other Humaniti):<BR>
<BR>
Horse: Equidae equus caballus<BR>
Donkey: Equidae equus assinus<BR>
Different species names but these two *can* produce<BR>
offspring:<BR>
Mule [mare (female horse) + jack (male donkey)] and<BR>
Hinney [jenny (female donkey) + stallion (male horse)]<BR>
<BR>
These are the most commonly encountered hybrids of the<BR>
Equidae familty, certainly, but some of the other genus can<BR>
interbreed as well.  In fact, three different species within<BR>
the Equus genus can interbreed:<BR>
equus caballus, equus assinus, equus hemionus<BR>
<BR>
Ob. Trav.:  If Zhodani, Vilani, Solomani, and whatever<BR>
else you have are capable of interbreeding, even if the<BR>
probability is a rare as that of female mules producing<BR>
offspring (which does happen), IMO, they should<BR>
be considered the same species and the classification<BR>
used should reflect that, Solomani non-uniform classification<BR>
methods notwithstanding.<BR>
<BR>
I would even go so far to say this for hybrids produced<BR>
with the assistance of some level of genetic modification.<BR>
<BR>
bloo<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 07:17:24 -0400<BR>
From: Mark Urbin <urbin@bigfoot.com><BR>
Subject: B5 stuff<BR>
<BR>
> >The amazonian pilot showed up later in B:5 as one of the Martian freedom<BR>
> >fighters, who eventually replaced Garabaldi, as I recall.<BR>
> >Tod Glenn<BR>
>Yes, the same actress played the head of the Martian resistance cell<BR>
>that Garibaldi, Stephen, and Marcus interacted with on Mars.  But,<BR>
>replaced Garibaldi in what way???  I'm a tad confused here.<BR>
<BR>
As head of covert ops for the Alliance.<BR>
<BR>
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
urbin@bigfoot.com -- These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>
Joan of Arc: the patron saint of welders http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 07:58:28 EDT<BR>
From: Diespamer@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Faster and faster<BR>
<BR>
Greetings All:<BR>
<BR>
Long time no type. To be quite honest with you, while I still receive TML, I <BR>
have not fooled around with Traveller in quite a long time and have not read <BR>
the TML for nearly a year. (I've got to find a job with less hours!)<BR>
<BR>
A silly question: I was at a conference in mid-town NYC this week and stopped <BR>
in at the Compleat Strategist to pick up a copy of SJG's "Starports". While I <BR>
was there, I also snagged (despite the fact that I've got the <BR>
originals...something about helping to pay back Marc Miller for all the <BR>
enjoyment he gave me over the years...) the "classic books 1-8 collection".<BR>
<BR>
Anybody know if the adventures, double adventures, etc. will be released in a <BR>
similar format?<BR>
<BR>
Take care! While I'm not doing much Traveller anymore, on those clear nights <BR>
I drag out my 15" reflecting telescope. Oftentimes I'll come across something <BR>
and say to myself "now that would make a dramatic backdrop for a Traveller <BR>
game!"<BR>
<BR>
Fred Kiesche<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 09:49:44 EDT<BR>
From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: SJG's TNS, redux<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 5/5/00 2:43:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time, <BR>
shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca writes:<BR>
<BR>
>   ISTR an old SF short story where the good guys had the tremendous<BR>
>  advantage that their FTL (/instantaneous) comm tech ("Dirac transmitter",<BR>
>  IIRC?) wasn't very biased against causality - the system could actually<BR>
>  be mined for all of the transmissions that would _ever_ be made...<BR>
>  <BR>
>    A better than average short on such things, IMHO. (was in the second<BR>
>  volume of the "Galactic Empires" anthology?).<BR>
<BR>
James Blish, "Beep."<BR>
<BR>
It may have been in the Galactic Empires anthologies, but I first read it<BR>
in a collection of Blish stories.<BR>
<BR>
- ----------<BR>
Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>
writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>
"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>
set of people who will take offense at it."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 12:33:06 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: KEAP penetration (was Design Questions)<BR>
<BR>
On 4 May 00, at 18:19, Ludowick@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> <BR>
> Rupert Boleyn wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
>  >I've got an altered FFS1 KEAP chart based on KE^1/2 if anyone wants it.<BR>
>  > >I did it up after deciding that 15cm mass drivers made fixed<BR>
>  >fortifications too good.<BR>
> <BR>
> Please email me the KEAP penetration chart.<BR>
<BR>
Here it is:<BR>
<BR>
ME   PV            Max PV<BR>
12+  ME^0.5 x 14   <BR>
<12  ME^0.5 x 15   48<BR>
<9   ME^0.5 x 16   45<BR>
<7   ME^0.5 x 17.5 43<BR>
<5   ME^0.5 x 18   35<BR>
<1.5 ME^0.5 x 10   12<BR>
<1   ME x 12       10<BR>
<0.5 ME x 16       6<BR>
<0.3 ME x 22       5<BR>
<BR>
This table is designed to fit into FFS1 in place of the current one <BR>
with as little fuss as possible, and thus is probably too kind to HEAP <BR>
rounds of under 12MJ muzzle energy, however at least it stops really <BR>
powerful ones going through rediculous amounts of SD armour. For <BR>
example a TL12 10cm Mass Driver can have a ME of 706.86MJ. With a <BR>
superdense penetrator its PV according to FFS1 is 14,147 at SR, enough <BR>
to go through over 10 metres of SD! With my table this drops to a PV of <BR>
1871, which will "only" go through 1.34 metres. Mind you the semi-auto <BR>
version fires once per 30 seconds, using 47.124MW, and the autocannon <BR>
version with its RoF of 1 per second uses 1413.72MW, but with <BR>
unmodified FFS1 rules it'll slaughter anything that comes within about <BR>
8km of it.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 12:33:06 +1200<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: KEAP penetration (was Design Questions)<BR>
<BR>
On 4 May 00, at 18:19, Ludowick@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> _Warship International_ magazine printed a series of articles called<BR>
> "Armor and its Application to Warships" in issues 2/76, 2/77, & 4/78, with<BR>
> notes & errata in 2/79.  The articles had penetration equations actually<BR>
> used by navies in the 19th & early 20th centuries to estimate the<BR>
> effectiveness of naval guns.  The equations were derived mostly from<BR>
> repeated test firings of sample weapons & armor plate.  The author of the<BR>
> articles was Nathan Okun.<BR>
> <BR>
> If anyone wants, I could post the equations to the TML.  They were meant<BR>
> to model penetration of naval AP shells (say 15cm to 46cm) and may be off<BR>
> for smaller weapons (7cm to 13cm tank guns e.g.).  They are also a bit<BR>
> dated -- IIRC none are from later than the 1930s.  They give lower<BR>
> penetration values than FFS2 (which would give energy weapons a boost),<BR>
> and seem to match published gun data more closely.<BR>
<BR>
That would be cool.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
"Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
<BR>
An pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 10:41:44 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: Re : Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
William Hostman writes:<BR>
<snipped><BR>
>Canonically, infection was an unknown on vland, so obviously, H Sapiens<BR>
>vilani was not tasty to Vland's microbials, or those microbials didn't<BR>
>interfere with HSv's metabolism...<BR>
<snipped><BR>
<BR>
	Nit-picking mode:<BR>
		By convention, Genus is always capitalized (Homo, or H.),<BR>
		species and subspecies are always lowercase (sapiens,<BR>
		vilani).  Genus, species, and subspecies should also be<BR>
		in italics or underlined, though this is obviously<BR>
		clumbersome in ASCII text.<BR>
	This nit-picking has been provided on the off chance that someone<BR>
	might care how those goofy biologists print their jargon.<BR>
<BR>
:)<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 17:19:06 +0100<BR>
From: Martin Hardgrave <martin@deira.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: Re: The Rubber Suit Problem<BR>
<BR>
In message <00050401570102.01303@m227.ryd.student.liu.se>, Jens Rydholm<BR>
<jenry023@student.liu.se> writes<BR>
>Matthew Bond wrote:<BR>
>> I Think You Mean Swedish. Hope This Helps. Have A Nice Day.<BR>
><BR>
>I am pretty sure I mean Swedish (check my e-mail address and realize why), but<BR>
>the concept exists at least in Norweigan as well.  ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Men desvaerre ik' paa dansk.  Dunno about Finnish.<BR>
- -- <BR>
Martin Hardgrave<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 10:52:29 -0400<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: Evolution and the Ancient Diaspora of Humans<BR>
<BR>
Robert O'Connor writes:<BR>
<snipped><BR>
>>4) will they be able to form symbiotic relationships in the<BR>
>>ailiamentary system?<BR>
>Yes. They have to as it's in the best interest of both organisms.<BR>
>Especially virulent/pathogenic Vland bugs would be selected out - if the<BR>
>host dies, their comfy habitat goes too.<BR>
>This doesn't exclude the sporadic occurrence of nasty mutants, but...<BR>
<snipped><BR>
<BR>
	The dynamics of such evolution is poorly understood.  Current<BR>
	theory suggests that selection would favour the bugs that reproduce<BR>
	the fastest in your gut, regardless of whether you survive or not.<BR>
	There are 'group selection' models that predict bugs that keep you<BR>
	alive, but there are problems with them.  If such group selection<BR>
	does operate, it would tend to result in lower rates of evolution<BR>
	because one 'generation' would be effectively each time that a new<BR>
	gut was infected rather than each time that the bugs reproduced.<BR>
	This does not mean that a symbiotic relationship cannot form, as<BR>
	the bugs may be kept from overrunning the host by competition from<BR>
	other bugs, lack of genetic variation, or the physiology of the host.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 10:01:58 -0500 <BR>
From: Bill Dunn <bdunn@epicsystems.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Luke and the Space Battle Scene<BR>
<BR>
This is one of those things that has had me confused for years. I didn't<BR>
read the book for quite a while after seeing the movie and I read the comics<BR>
well after the movie too. But I seem to remember Luke watching the space<BR>
battle scene too and the stills show up in the trading cards. I DON'T<BR>
remember Luke meeting up with Biggs in Anchorhead right after that though.<BR>
That I remember from the comic book (which also had the Han meeting with<BR>
Jabba outside the Falcon). Does this mean that the comic book guys had<BR>
access to a different version of the movie, perhaps one that was shown to a<BR>
test audience and edited down? Access to the screenplay, surely.<BR>
I was kind of hoping both scenes would show up in the 20th anniversary<BR>
version, but no such luck.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
	Date: Sat, 6 May 2000 00:45:12 +1000<BR>
	From: "Karen and Michael Hughes" <kmhughes@dynamite.com.au><BR>
	Subject: Luke and the Space Battle Scene<BR>
<BR>
	RE: Scene with Luke watching the space battle and talking to Biggs.<BR>
<BR>
	I'm pretty sure it was in the book. I find that images you create<BR>
when<BR>
	reading a novel are often stronger than that of a movie - esp. if<BR>
you were a<BR>
	teenager, so maybe that's it.<BR>
<BR>
	M<BR>
<BR>
	<Bond, we need you to go to the Bahamas and sleep with lots of<BR>
women><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 10:07:49 -0500 <BR>
From: Bill Dunn <bdunn@epicsystems.com><BR>
Subject: RE: WARNING<BR>
<BR>
I have also heard that from a reliable source. Eudora too. But, what may be<BR>
happening here is the worm doing its work though Outlook Express which is<BR>
pretty much embedded in any version of Windows since Win95 even if you use<BR>
something else as your primary emailer. Makes my Mac look better all the<BR>
time.<BR>
The funny thing about how it has affected where I work (which is on Windows)<BR>
is that people who should have known better got burned. Makes me wonder if<BR>
they thought that by using Netscape or Eudora they were invulnerable or if<BR>
Outlook somehow launches the file when it does some other operations, like<BR>
applying some rules to it. It's just kind of fishy.<BR>
It certainly has been more malicious than Melissa.<BR>
<BR>
	I've also had from a somewhat reliable source that Netscape Mail is <BR>
	vulnerable to it.  I'm not sure that's true though...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
	           -- Juliean Galak (a.k.a. Falcon)<BR>
<BR>
Bill Dunn<BR>
bdunn@epicsystems.com<BR>
<BR>
"Why is American beer served cold? So you can tell it from urine."   --David<BR>
Moulton<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #2399<BR>
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